1 00:00:01,840 --> 00:00:04,200 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for joining us for this special 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:08,160 Speaker 1: edition of Bloomberg Daybreak. Happy New Year, everybody, Welcome to 3 00:00:08,200 --> 00:00:12,200 Speaker 1: twenty twenty five. Markets are closed for the holiday. I'm 4 00:00:12,280 --> 00:00:15,960 Speaker 1: Nathan Hager coming up this hour. They are back. It's 5 00:00:16,000 --> 00:00:17,840 Speaker 1: become a bit of a tradition here. Two of the 6 00:00:17,880 --> 00:00:20,880 Speaker 1: most prominent tech analysts on Wall Street are with us 7 00:00:20,880 --> 00:00:23,599 Speaker 1: for the entire hour, getting you ready for what's hot 8 00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:27,320 Speaker 1: in high tech in twenty twenty five. So, without further introduction, 9 00:00:27,760 --> 00:00:31,160 Speaker 1: we are pleased to welcome back Gene Monster, managing partner 10 00:00:31,160 --> 00:00:34,640 Speaker 1: in Deepwater Asset Management, and Dan Ives, global head of 11 00:00:34,640 --> 00:00:38,080 Speaker 1: Tech research at Webbush Security. So great to have the 12 00:00:38,120 --> 00:00:41,159 Speaker 1: both of you back with us on this holiday. And 13 00:00:41,240 --> 00:00:43,800 Speaker 1: let's kick this off if we can, with a look 14 00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:47,520 Speaker 1: at artificial intelligence, because obviously this has been the maybe 15 00:00:47,560 --> 00:00:51,000 Speaker 1: the biggest theme on Wall Street since chat GPT came 16 00:00:51,040 --> 00:00:54,480 Speaker 1: out two years ago. So, Gene, here's what you told 17 00:00:54,520 --> 00:00:57,120 Speaker 1: us this time last year about where you think we 18 00:00:57,160 --> 00:00:58,920 Speaker 1: are in the AI cycle. 19 00:00:59,120 --> 00:01:01,720 Speaker 2: Listen, we're in the early stages of a three to 20 00:01:01,760 --> 00:01:04,680 Speaker 2: five year bull market, and I don't I wouldn't. Don't 21 00:01:04,680 --> 00:01:07,080 Speaker 2: worry about the after, don't worry about the hangover At 22 00:01:07,080 --> 00:01:10,760 Speaker 2: this point, I think you just embrace that this is 23 00:01:10,959 --> 00:01:14,760 Speaker 2: as the substance will exceed the hype, and we've got 24 00:01:14,800 --> 00:01:16,720 Speaker 2: some great years ahead of us from the market. 25 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:19,440 Speaker 1: You told us it's the third inning of the AI 26 00:01:19,600 --> 00:01:22,399 Speaker 1: ball game, Jean, So where would you say we are now? 27 00:01:22,920 --> 00:01:26,880 Speaker 2: I think we're probably on the fourth inning. We're still early, 28 00:01:26,920 --> 00:01:30,520 Speaker 2: which seems out of touch with reality, but I think 29 00:01:30,560 --> 00:01:33,240 Speaker 2: that that is how significant this transformation is going to be, 30 00:01:33,319 --> 00:01:37,120 Speaker 2: and so we're definitely further along. But I still believe 31 00:01:37,480 --> 00:01:39,120 Speaker 2: I talked about three to five years. I think we've 32 00:01:39,120 --> 00:01:42,120 Speaker 2: still got another two good years left here. And I 33 00:01:42,160 --> 00:01:46,039 Speaker 2: think that as you know, this concept of the substance 34 00:01:46,080 --> 00:01:49,120 Speaker 2: exceeding the hype we are seen now with some of 35 00:01:49,160 --> 00:01:52,720 Speaker 2: the hardware companies, but we really haven't seen it beyond 36 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:54,600 Speaker 2: beyond a few companies. 37 00:01:54,600 --> 00:01:55,520 Speaker 3: And I just put this. 38 00:01:55,520 --> 00:01:58,680 Speaker 2: This is one of the more encouraging data points is 39 00:01:58,720 --> 00:02:02,280 Speaker 2: that opening up doesn't break out these numbers, but you 40 00:02:02,280 --> 00:02:06,840 Speaker 2: can back into them. They're daily active users for GPT 41 00:02:07,000 --> 00:02:09,840 Speaker 2: Global are around one hundred and fifty million, one hundred 42 00:02:09,840 --> 00:02:12,520 Speaker 2: and fifty million. Google's daily act A search uses are 43 00:02:12,560 --> 00:02:14,920 Speaker 2: two point five billion. In other words, even though we 44 00:02:15,000 --> 00:02:18,120 Speaker 2: talk a lot about this. The whole train really is 45 00:02:18,160 --> 00:02:19,120 Speaker 2: still in the station. 46 00:02:19,360 --> 00:02:23,200 Speaker 1: So it's still early innings for you. Let's turn to you, Dan, 47 00:02:23,320 --> 00:02:26,560 Speaker 1: because here's what you told us about where you think 48 00:02:26,639 --> 00:02:28,880 Speaker 1: the AI boom was this time last year. 49 00:02:29,000 --> 00:02:31,880 Speaker 4: I mean, I think there's a two year bull cycle. 50 00:02:32,400 --> 00:02:35,359 Speaker 4: I mean at points when we get towards three thirty 51 00:02:35,400 --> 00:02:39,640 Speaker 4: four am, there will be issues, especially for ones that 52 00:02:39,720 --> 00:02:44,280 Speaker 4: don't actually execute. But I see it. It's an auto bond. 53 00:02:44,520 --> 00:02:46,800 Speaker 1: Is it still an auto bond for you, Dan? Or 54 00:02:47,080 --> 00:02:48,720 Speaker 1: are we running into speed bumps? 55 00:02:49,400 --> 00:02:53,240 Speaker 5: Well, it's ten pm in this AI party that goes 56 00:02:53,280 --> 00:02:56,600 Speaker 5: to four am, and I think if you see how 57 00:02:56,680 --> 00:02:59,800 Speaker 5: this all played out, as Junie talked about, this is 58 00:02:59,840 --> 00:03:04,120 Speaker 5: just the first step in two trillion of AI capacs. 59 00:03:04,639 --> 00:03:08,480 Speaker 5: And I just went point to for every dollar spend 60 00:03:08,480 --> 00:03:11,040 Speaker 5: on a video chip, we believe there's an eight to 61 00:03:11,080 --> 00:03:14,320 Speaker 5: ten dollars multiplier across the rest of tech, and that 62 00:03:14,560 --> 00:03:17,880 Speaker 5: speech to why we believe this is a bull market 63 00:03:17,960 --> 00:03:20,400 Speaker 5: that continues to play out throughout twenty twenty five and 64 00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:24,040 Speaker 5: ultimately twenty twenty six because of where this spending is 65 00:03:24,440 --> 00:03:27,680 Speaker 5: and it just is starting. And that's why I always 66 00:03:27,680 --> 00:03:31,320 Speaker 5: say the bears when they're in their caves in hibernation 67 00:03:31,480 --> 00:03:34,480 Speaker 5: mode like the last two years, they can't find AI 68 00:03:34,600 --> 00:03:35,480 Speaker 5: in the spreadsheets. 69 00:03:35,760 --> 00:03:38,640 Speaker 1: But if it's still progressing, if we're still at the 70 00:03:38,680 --> 00:03:42,480 Speaker 1: early innings for both of you guys, when do these 71 00:03:42,520 --> 00:03:46,160 Speaker 1: companies need to show that they're getting past the early stages. 72 00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:47,280 Speaker 1: I'll start with you, Gene. 73 00:03:47,880 --> 00:03:50,960 Speaker 2: I think with the software company. So we've obviously seen 74 00:03:50,960 --> 00:03:53,280 Speaker 2: it in the hardware, and I love that eight x multiplier. 75 00:03:53,320 --> 00:03:56,320 Speaker 2: I think that you're framing in there, and I think 76 00:03:56,400 --> 00:03:58,960 Speaker 2: it just it paints the picture of the scope of 77 00:03:59,000 --> 00:04:03,680 Speaker 2: what's happening with hardware, and also that this year we're 78 00:04:03,680 --> 00:04:05,760 Speaker 2: going to have to see some improvement in some of 79 00:04:05,800 --> 00:04:08,480 Speaker 2: the software growth rates. And it doesn't need to be significant. 80 00:04:08,520 --> 00:04:11,200 Speaker 2: We're talking about acceleration. In the case of like Salesforce, 81 00:04:11,240 --> 00:04:13,880 Speaker 2: they grew booking this last quarter at ten percent. I 82 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:16,320 Speaker 2: thy can inch that up to twelve percent for example. 83 00:04:16,360 --> 00:04:19,200 Speaker 2: I think that that would be enough. All investors need 84 00:04:19,240 --> 00:04:22,240 Speaker 2: to see in twenty twenty five is just that the 85 00:04:22,720 --> 00:04:25,200 Speaker 2: numbers are starting to move higher. They don't need to 86 00:04:25,240 --> 00:04:28,560 Speaker 2: have These companies don't need to have breath taking breakout 87 00:04:28,640 --> 00:04:31,320 Speaker 2: like we've seen with Nvidio. We just need the tie 88 00:04:31,360 --> 00:04:34,560 Speaker 2: to slowly rise, and I think that the trade is 89 00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:35,560 Speaker 2: going to be intact. 90 00:04:36,400 --> 00:04:37,680 Speaker 1: Is that how you see it? 91 00:04:37,760 --> 00:04:38,000 Speaker 2: Dan? 92 00:04:38,160 --> 00:04:40,520 Speaker 1: I mean you were talking last year about an autobahn, 93 00:04:40,600 --> 00:04:46,000 Speaker 1: about this sort of breakneck speed at which AI could develop. 94 00:04:46,680 --> 00:04:49,680 Speaker 1: Is a slowdown going to be enough to keep investors 95 00:04:49,720 --> 00:04:50,080 Speaker 1: in this? 96 00:04:51,360 --> 00:04:54,240 Speaker 5: Look? I think? I mean to a Jean's talking about 97 00:04:55,600 --> 00:04:58,640 Speaker 5: it's about software now is at the AI party? I 98 00:04:58,640 --> 00:05:01,360 Speaker 5: mean they were behind the velvet ropes waiting to get 99 00:05:01,360 --> 00:05:03,599 Speaker 5: their name on the list, and now look who's there. 100 00:05:03,680 --> 00:05:07,160 Speaker 5: It's the messy of AI. Pound Teer, you you got 101 00:05:07,240 --> 00:05:10,240 Speaker 5: sales force, you got service now because the use cases 102 00:05:10,279 --> 00:05:13,840 Speaker 5: are happening. And that's how poll and Teer remember the 103 00:05:13,920 --> 00:05:18,719 Speaker 5: hater they hated as a teenager thirteen dollar stock, now 104 00:05:18,720 --> 00:05:22,119 Speaker 5: they hated as a senior citizen in eighty. Because it's 105 00:05:22,320 --> 00:05:25,760 Speaker 5: just starting to play out in terms of the second 106 00:05:25,960 --> 00:05:30,800 Speaker 5: third derivative, that software, that cybersecurity, that the AI infrastructure, 107 00:05:30,839 --> 00:05:35,240 Speaker 5: and Christmas came early to the bulls with con out 108 00:05:35,240 --> 00:05:39,040 Speaker 5: of the FTC. That means deal making finally is going 109 00:05:39,120 --> 00:05:41,120 Speaker 5: to start up. Because that was a nightmare on Elm 110 00:05:41,160 --> 00:05:44,720 Speaker 5: Street for tech Conn the FTC. That's over and the 111 00:05:44,800 --> 00:05:48,760 Speaker 5: Trump administration. It's a goldilock scenario for the bulls, specially 112 00:05:48,800 --> 00:05:52,719 Speaker 5: the AI revolution here, and it's still in nineteen ninety six. 113 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:56,200 Speaker 5: It's not nineteen ninety nine in terms of our vu 114 00:05:56,279 --> 00:05:57,640 Speaker 5: how this all plays out. 115 00:05:57,960 --> 00:05:59,880 Speaker 1: Talk to me a little bit, Gene about how you 116 00:06:00,040 --> 00:06:03,560 Speaker 1: see the regulatory environment playing out once we get into 117 00:06:03,600 --> 00:06:05,159 Speaker 1: the early days of twenty twenty five. 118 00:06:05,880 --> 00:06:08,159 Speaker 2: I want to add something to what Dan just talked 119 00:06:08,160 --> 00:06:10,840 Speaker 2: about in terms of the nineteen ninety six analogy, and 120 00:06:10,920 --> 00:06:13,800 Speaker 2: Dan and I were around there. We were covering tech 121 00:06:13,839 --> 00:06:17,600 Speaker 2: at that point and lived that just really special time 122 00:06:17,640 --> 00:06:21,960 Speaker 2: in investing, and I want to just mention there's an 123 00:06:21,960 --> 00:06:25,240 Speaker 2: important nuance to how the market I think plays out 124 00:06:25,240 --> 00:06:28,080 Speaker 2: in twenty twenty five is that during that run from 125 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:32,200 Speaker 2: ninety six to two thousand, there were during that period 126 00:06:32,200 --> 00:06:34,920 Speaker 2: there were ten pullbacks. There's twelve pullbacks from ninety five 127 00:06:34,960 --> 00:06:37,960 Speaker 2: to two thousand, so ten pullbacks, so about two per 128 00:06:38,080 --> 00:06:40,440 Speaker 2: year is what we saw of ten percent or greater 129 00:06:40,480 --> 00:06:47,400 Speaker 2: on the Nasdaq. And I just want to anticipate joining 130 00:06:47,520 --> 00:06:50,640 Speaker 2: Dan later on in twenty five and talk about this 131 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:53,200 Speaker 2: pullback in the market, like is this over? And I 132 00:06:53,200 --> 00:06:56,640 Speaker 2: would just say this is is really healthy for these 133 00:06:57,080 --> 00:07:01,200 Speaker 2: multi year runs to have these pullbacks, and so I'm anticipating, 134 00:07:01,200 --> 00:07:03,680 Speaker 2: as I said, a couple of those. And what's going 135 00:07:03,760 --> 00:07:07,000 Speaker 2: to be the piece that kind of what's the catalyst 136 00:07:07,080 --> 00:07:09,880 Speaker 2: that does that. It's always hard to predict, but we're 137 00:07:09,880 --> 00:07:12,239 Speaker 2: going to get those. And I still continue to believe 138 00:07:12,280 --> 00:07:14,480 Speaker 2: we're going to end twenty five much higher on the 139 00:07:14,520 --> 00:07:18,680 Speaker 2: NASZAQ than we started so and just quickly on the on. 140 00:07:18,640 --> 00:07:21,080 Speaker 3: The on the regulatory piece. 141 00:07:21,120 --> 00:07:25,040 Speaker 2: And I think that big tech has been you know, 142 00:07:25,200 --> 00:07:28,280 Speaker 2: largely in the penalty box when it comes to trying 143 00:07:28,280 --> 00:07:32,560 Speaker 2: to acquire and innovate around that, and my my hope, 144 00:07:32,640 --> 00:07:34,960 Speaker 2: my expectation is that I think that that's going to loosen. 145 00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:38,600 Speaker 2: I think we're going to see some some bigger acquisitions 146 00:07:38,680 --> 00:07:41,160 Speaker 2: in twenty five, and I think it's going to be 147 00:07:41,160 --> 00:07:43,600 Speaker 2: about bigger they're small companies, but they're going to have 148 00:07:43,640 --> 00:07:47,200 Speaker 2: high valuations that are in the private market today, and 149 00:07:47,400 --> 00:07:49,040 Speaker 2: we can talk more about those, but I think this 150 00:07:49,120 --> 00:07:51,080 Speaker 2: is going to be a good year for big tech 151 00:07:51,160 --> 00:07:53,239 Speaker 2: and that from that perspective, yeah. 152 00:07:53,120 --> 00:07:54,680 Speaker 1: We are going to get into some of that. We 153 00:07:54,720 --> 00:07:58,160 Speaker 1: are speaking with Gene Monster, the managing partner at deep 154 00:07:58,160 --> 00:08:01,520 Speaker 1: Water Asset Management and Dan, Global head of Tech Research 155 00:08:01,920 --> 00:08:06,840 Speaker 1: at Webbush Securities. Dan to Jean's point about the possibility 156 00:08:06,920 --> 00:08:10,200 Speaker 1: of pullbacks in big tech in twenty twenty five. I mean, 157 00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:13,640 Speaker 1: obviously we've seen the valuations where they are. They're sky 158 00:08:13,800 --> 00:08:16,400 Speaker 1: high for a lot of people. You say, they're justified. 159 00:08:16,680 --> 00:08:19,240 Speaker 1: What is the risk that we could see a little 160 00:08:19,240 --> 00:08:22,080 Speaker 1: bit of choppiness as we head into the next few years. 161 00:08:23,080 --> 00:08:26,000 Speaker 5: Look, and to that pointment came about this year Tokyo 162 00:08:26,080 --> 00:08:29,200 Speaker 5: Black Monday, Right, I mean you had five or six 163 00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:33,280 Speaker 5: other points. Some of the FED and the Bond Vijulanes 164 00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:35,960 Speaker 5: come out and those create the opportunities. And I think 165 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:39,520 Speaker 5: with Trump coming in there would definitely be be some 166 00:08:39,800 --> 00:08:44,600 Speaker 5: white knuckle moments with China tariff discussions, game of high 167 00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:46,839 Speaker 5: stakes poker going on. Right, So there's been a lot 168 00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:49,599 Speaker 5: of headline risk. But the Gene's point, that's what you 169 00:08:50,280 --> 00:08:53,360 Speaker 5: tune the noise down, You focus in the winners. And 170 00:08:53,440 --> 00:08:56,720 Speaker 5: again the bears that talk about valuation, that's how they 171 00:08:56,760 --> 00:08:59,560 Speaker 5: missed every transformational tech nam in the last twenty years, 172 00:09:00,120 --> 00:09:02,400 Speaker 5: because when you're in the right lane going thirty five 173 00:09:02,440 --> 00:09:06,200 Speaker 5: miles an hour, you're not focused on paying up to 174 00:09:06,280 --> 00:09:08,760 Speaker 5: the Ferrari going ninety miles an hour in the left lane. 175 00:09:08,760 --> 00:09:11,760 Speaker 5: But that is ai revolution. You will have those moments 176 00:09:12,200 --> 00:09:15,240 Speaker 5: and you just have your pencils writing just to play. 177 00:09:15,280 --> 00:09:18,320 Speaker 2: Tell me add something to the valuation, because you're right 178 00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:21,559 Speaker 2: on Dan another great point just about you know this, 179 00:09:21,720 --> 00:09:26,400 Speaker 2: the bears are looking at valuation not recognizing the significance valuation. 180 00:09:27,080 --> 00:09:28,840 Speaker 2: Let's just go back and use the example of what 181 00:09:28,880 --> 00:09:33,319 Speaker 2: happened from ninety five to two thousand. The Nasdaq peaked 182 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:37,000 Speaker 2: at one hundred times earnings on future Right now, where 183 00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:39,200 Speaker 2: what are we high twenties something like that. 184 00:09:40,280 --> 00:09:42,000 Speaker 3: We're not even close now. 185 00:09:42,280 --> 00:09:45,439 Speaker 2: Given the dynamic of the megacaps today that we didn't 186 00:09:45,440 --> 00:09:47,760 Speaker 2: have twenty five years ago, you're not going to get 187 00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:50,079 Speaker 2: one hundred multiple on the NASDAK, but you might get 188 00:09:50,080 --> 00:09:52,320 Speaker 2: a fifty multiple on it. And so I think that 189 00:09:52,840 --> 00:09:57,840 Speaker 2: the conversation about valuation, to me, misses the point when 190 00:09:57,920 --> 00:10:02,360 Speaker 2: a paradigm shift happens and you area kicks in. Really 191 00:10:02,360 --> 00:10:05,120 Speaker 2: impressive things can happen on multiple expansion. 192 00:10:06,280 --> 00:10:09,959 Speaker 5: I'd say, frame what Genior said, Print that out frame it. 193 00:10:10,040 --> 00:10:13,560 Speaker 5: We're going to be talking about that in a year, though. 194 00:10:13,400 --> 00:10:16,200 Speaker 1: I got to ask, I mean, it's the point that 195 00:10:16,800 --> 00:10:19,679 Speaker 1: I guess gets brought up every year around this when 196 00:10:19,720 --> 00:10:24,040 Speaker 1: you bring in the analogy of nineteen ninety five versus now, 197 00:10:24,400 --> 00:10:26,600 Speaker 1: it raises the question about whether this is going to 198 00:10:26,600 --> 00:10:28,520 Speaker 1: be a repeat of the dot com boom. I mean, 199 00:10:28,559 --> 00:10:32,360 Speaker 1: you both have talked about how artificial intelligence could potentially 200 00:10:32,400 --> 00:10:34,600 Speaker 1: be a paradigm shift. We've seen it play out in 201 00:10:34,679 --> 00:10:39,480 Speaker 1: certain ways, but other than chat GPT, cute chatbots, and 202 00:10:39,880 --> 00:10:44,120 Speaker 1: you know, changes in the way people search for things online. 203 00:10:44,520 --> 00:10:46,840 Speaker 1: How do we see that paradigm shift? When do we 204 00:10:46,840 --> 00:10:48,959 Speaker 1: get to the point that we're going to see the 205 00:10:49,040 --> 00:10:54,000 Speaker 1: kind of productivity improvements across the economy that so many 206 00:10:54,040 --> 00:10:57,600 Speaker 1: of the bulls around AI have been predicting. I'll start 207 00:10:57,600 --> 00:10:59,439 Speaker 1: with you, Dan, Look. 208 00:11:00,920 --> 00:11:04,000 Speaker 5: That's where it's happening. Consumer is not even gonna have 209 00:11:04,080 --> 00:11:06,680 Speaker 5: them for I'll say, second half twenty five, going to 210 00:11:06,720 --> 00:11:09,280 Speaker 5: down in twenty six. But look what's happened in the enterprise. 211 00:11:09,400 --> 00:11:12,920 Speaker 5: That's where you're seeing the cap back. That's why Jensen's 212 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:15,880 Speaker 5: the godfather of AI. That's what we're seeing across cloud. 213 00:11:16,360 --> 00:11:19,280 Speaker 5: You're gonna see the paradigm change. It's already happened with 214 00:11:19,360 --> 00:11:24,240 Speaker 5: the use case from the enterprise consumer that's coming still ahead. 215 00:11:24,640 --> 00:11:27,520 Speaker 5: It speaks this multi year run in terms of what 216 00:11:27,559 --> 00:11:30,839 Speaker 5: we're going to see in terms of Fourth Industrial Revolution, and. 217 00:11:30,840 --> 00:11:32,559 Speaker 1: Your thoughts just quickly, Jane. 218 00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:35,000 Speaker 3: I mean, I think it's it's starting. 219 00:11:35,040 --> 00:11:38,360 Speaker 2: If you look at enterprise piece that's you listen to 220 00:11:39,120 --> 00:11:43,400 Speaker 2: Benny Aff's comments from Salesforce about how he sees agents 221 00:11:43,440 --> 00:11:48,760 Speaker 2: basically taking over half of the humans works. It's in medicine, 222 00:11:48,840 --> 00:11:54,120 Speaker 2: we're doing experiments and projects and using AI and the 223 00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:59,400 Speaker 2: investment side too, and bottom line there's massive cost saving. 224 00:11:59,440 --> 00:12:01,920 Speaker 2: So I think it's actually happening more. It's just that 225 00:12:01,960 --> 00:12:04,360 Speaker 2: the consumer pieces Dan said hasn't kicked in yet. 226 00:12:04,600 --> 00:12:06,720 Speaker 1: And we're going to talk much more about this potential 227 00:12:06,840 --> 00:12:10,319 Speaker 1: use cases for artificial intelligence and more of the hot 228 00:12:10,360 --> 00:12:13,679 Speaker 1: tech trends coming into the new year as we continue 229 00:12:13,679 --> 00:12:18,319 Speaker 1: on this special edition of Bloomberg Daybreak focused on Tech 230 00:12:18,440 --> 00:12:22,439 Speaker 1: with Gene Munster, managing partner at Deepwater Asset Management, and 231 00:12:22,600 --> 00:12:25,920 Speaker 1: Dan Ives, the global head of Tech research at web 232 00:12:25,920 --> 00:12:29,120 Speaker 1: Bush Securities, with us for the full hour on this 233 00:12:29,280 --> 00:12:32,080 Speaker 1: New Year's day, so stay with us. It is twenty 234 00:12:32,120 --> 00:12:35,360 Speaker 1: minutes past the hour. I'm Nathan Hager, and this. 235 00:12:35,960 --> 00:12:37,240 Speaker 5: Is Bloomberg. 236 00:12:47,400 --> 00:12:50,199 Speaker 1: Welcome back to the special edition of Bloomberg Daybreak. I'm 237 00:12:50,240 --> 00:12:53,600 Speaker 1: Nathan Hager. Markets are closed for the New Year's holiday, 238 00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:56,520 Speaker 1: but it's a high tech power hour. We are speaking 239 00:12:56,520 --> 00:12:58,880 Speaker 1: for the entire hour with Dan Ives, global head of 240 00:12:58,880 --> 00:13:02,760 Speaker 1: Tech Research at web Securities, and Gene Munster, the managing 241 00:13:02,800 --> 00:13:06,280 Speaker 1: partner at Deepwater Asset Management. Of course, we've been focused 242 00:13:06,840 --> 00:13:09,160 Speaker 1: for most of the start of this show on the 243 00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:14,719 Speaker 1: promise for artificial intelligence, the continued potential for investment in 244 00:13:14,800 --> 00:13:17,880 Speaker 1: this sector. Want to ask you, guys, where you see 245 00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:21,040 Speaker 1: winners and losers now that we are at this stage 246 00:13:21,640 --> 00:13:24,920 Speaker 1: in AI development. So Dan, I'll start with you, who 247 00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:27,640 Speaker 1: do you see as some of the biggest winners in 248 00:13:27,760 --> 00:13:29,400 Speaker 1: AI heading into twenty five. 249 00:13:30,120 --> 00:13:33,000 Speaker 5: Look, I think winners are Software is going to be 250 00:13:33,040 --> 00:13:37,760 Speaker 5: a huge winner, and that's Pound Tier, That's Oracle at Salesforce, 251 00:13:37,840 --> 00:13:42,320 Speaker 5: dot Com, Mango, dB, Snowflake. I mean the point is 252 00:13:42,800 --> 00:13:46,360 Speaker 5: I think software is really going to be the beneficiary 253 00:13:46,360 --> 00:13:49,120 Speaker 5: in twenty twenty five is the use cases build out, 254 00:13:49,760 --> 00:13:52,440 Speaker 5: and I think more investors start to play second third 255 00:13:52,679 --> 00:13:56,120 Speaker 5: derivatives of AI. When you will do losers, I think 256 00:13:56,160 --> 00:13:59,240 Speaker 5: it's hardware. I mean, I think right now, no don't 257 00:13:59,280 --> 00:14:02,920 Speaker 5: try to do actussy like a Cisco review where Cisco 258 00:14:03,559 --> 00:14:07,800 Speaker 5: HP Dell. I think a lot of the core infrastructure 259 00:14:07,920 --> 00:14:10,920 Speaker 5: where they're set up, it's just not a good place. 260 00:14:10,960 --> 00:14:12,880 Speaker 5: They're gonna have to do M and A. But this 261 00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:17,120 Speaker 5: is trending much more to software driven and i'd even 262 00:14:17,160 --> 00:14:19,520 Speaker 5: say hyper scours. They're just going to try to gain 263 00:14:19,640 --> 00:14:23,840 Speaker 5: more and more market share, especially with ton and they 264 00:14:24,040 --> 00:14:25,040 Speaker 5: don't at the FTC. 265 00:14:25,800 --> 00:14:27,720 Speaker 1: What's your view on this gene? Who do you see 266 00:14:27,720 --> 00:14:29,680 Speaker 1: as the winners and losers at this stage? 267 00:14:30,760 --> 00:14:32,440 Speaker 2: I think the sweet spot I would agree with you. 268 00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:34,720 Speaker 2: I think the sweet spot is going to come from software. 269 00:14:35,120 --> 00:14:38,320 Speaker 2: I think the hardware piece is gonna last a little 270 00:14:38,360 --> 00:14:42,240 Speaker 2: bit longer. But the companies that Dan highlighted as in 271 00:14:42,280 --> 00:14:46,240 Speaker 2: a troubled direction, I think that they're going to continue 272 00:14:46,240 --> 00:14:47,280 Speaker 2: to be in a trouble. 273 00:14:47,360 --> 00:14:48,240 Speaker 3: Basically, if you don't. 274 00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:51,240 Speaker 2: Have a real hardware AI play, you're just you're just 275 00:14:51,240 --> 00:14:54,080 Speaker 2: gonna die in the vine. And so I think that 276 00:14:55,040 --> 00:14:58,720 Speaker 2: you know, there's still more room with UH Nvidia for example. 277 00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:01,640 Speaker 2: I think that UH some of the other micron a 278 00:15:01,880 --> 00:15:05,160 Speaker 2: big big sell off recently, and I think that these 279 00:15:05,160 --> 00:15:06,640 Speaker 2: companies are still going to be in a good place, 280 00:15:06,920 --> 00:15:09,160 Speaker 2: but the substance of the trade I think is going 281 00:15:09,200 --> 00:15:12,440 Speaker 2: to shift to software. Think there's another piece that probably 282 00:15:12,480 --> 00:15:14,840 Speaker 2: follows the fold. For a lot we do private investing 283 00:15:14,920 --> 00:15:18,400 Speaker 2: in a couple companies. Data Bricks is getting a ton 284 00:15:18,440 --> 00:15:19,760 Speaker 2: of share and you're going to hear a lot more 285 00:15:19,800 --> 00:15:23,080 Speaker 2: about them. They basically help organize unstructured data FREEI training 286 00:15:23,480 --> 00:15:26,520 Speaker 2: and then androll the defense tech company. I mean, if 287 00:15:26,520 --> 00:15:30,560 Speaker 2: this was the last valuation was at fifteen billion, if 288 00:15:30,560 --> 00:15:33,120 Speaker 2: this was a public company, it would be a Meme 289 00:15:33,200 --> 00:15:35,720 Speaker 2: stock of all Meme stocks. I don't know what the 290 00:15:35,800 --> 00:15:39,920 Speaker 2: valuation would be, but it would be exponentially higher. And 291 00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:41,800 Speaker 2: so I think there's some really exciting things going on 292 00:15:41,800 --> 00:15:43,640 Speaker 2: with those two private companies are going to be part 293 00:15:43,640 --> 00:15:45,760 Speaker 2: of our everyday conversation in the year or two. 294 00:15:46,480 --> 00:15:49,000 Speaker 1: In terms of the software plays, Dan, how do you 295 00:15:49,120 --> 00:15:52,920 Speaker 1: see AI playing out in terms of software in terms 296 00:15:52,960 --> 00:15:56,520 Speaker 1: of use cases in twenty twenty five, Look, I. 297 00:15:56,520 --> 00:15:59,360 Speaker 5: Think it's going to be about the install bases, because 298 00:16:00,120 --> 00:16:02,080 Speaker 5: as much as you know in video is going to 299 00:16:02,280 --> 00:16:06,360 Speaker 5: clearly be a winner. Continued, I think for trillion markap 300 00:16:06,400 --> 00:16:10,120 Speaker 5: along with Apple. So we get to twenty five, it's 301 00:16:10,160 --> 00:16:12,280 Speaker 5: going to be about the install basis. So when you 302 00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:17,440 Speaker 5: look at from Adobe to Oracle to service now to Benioff, 303 00:16:17,640 --> 00:16:21,240 Speaker 5: I think the masterpiece where I see for salesforce, dot 304 00:16:21,280 --> 00:16:24,000 Speaker 5: Com and of course names like Palunteer. I think the 305 00:16:24,160 --> 00:16:28,040 Speaker 5: use cases it's going to be agent force what we're 306 00:16:28,040 --> 00:16:30,680 Speaker 5: seeing with Salesforce, but it's going to move to marketing, 307 00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:36,200 Speaker 5: to analytics to ERP. We're going to see these use 308 00:16:36,280 --> 00:16:40,160 Speaker 5: cases go from spot to spot to spot, and I 309 00:16:40,200 --> 00:16:42,000 Speaker 5: think that is going to be a huge part of 310 00:16:42,040 --> 00:16:47,080 Speaker 5: the investing cycle as investors now focus on okay, where 311 00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:50,480 Speaker 5: skate to where the puck's going? And I think that's 312 00:16:50,480 --> 00:16:53,640 Speaker 5: going to create the opportunities is software. This is going 313 00:16:53,720 --> 00:16:58,480 Speaker 5: to be a golden age for software as well as cybersecurity, 314 00:16:59,120 --> 00:17:01,280 Speaker 5: you know, led by the Fourth Industrial Revolution. 315 00:17:02,600 --> 00:17:05,520 Speaker 1: Gene, do you see some of these software cases playing 316 00:17:05,560 --> 00:17:08,399 Speaker 1: out this year? Do you think that we'll see the 317 00:17:08,520 --> 00:17:11,800 Speaker 1: kind of use case for artificial intelligence that you guys 318 00:17:11,800 --> 00:17:14,800 Speaker 1: have been predicting over the last couple of years actually 319 00:17:14,840 --> 00:17:17,200 Speaker 1: starting to come to fruition in twenty twenty five. 320 00:17:18,680 --> 00:17:21,200 Speaker 2: Yes, I think that in the back half of this year, 321 00:17:21,359 --> 00:17:24,439 Speaker 2: this software piece, we're going to start to see a 322 00:17:24,440 --> 00:17:27,880 Speaker 2: slight increase in revenue. These tools are starting to get 323 00:17:27,920 --> 00:17:30,520 Speaker 2: rolled out, and look at companies like Service now, they're 324 00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:32,239 Speaker 2: already directly benefiting from this. 325 00:17:32,960 --> 00:17:35,720 Speaker 3: It's going to be this year. 326 00:17:35,720 --> 00:17:38,200 Speaker 2: In twenty five, it's probably going to come mostly from 327 00:17:38,359 --> 00:17:42,399 Speaker 2: the megacaps. And I think you know Dan's comment about Benioff, 328 00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:46,600 Speaker 2: I'll just emphasize listen to that his comments. You spoke 329 00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:50,080 Speaker 2: for twenty five minutes twenty two times. He gave some 330 00:17:50,119 --> 00:17:53,640 Speaker 2: statement about how transformative AI is going to be. If 331 00:17:53,680 --> 00:17:56,040 Speaker 2: you take that and divide it by five, it's still 332 00:17:56,040 --> 00:17:58,800 Speaker 2: going to be a I think this year is still 333 00:17:58,840 --> 00:18:02,560 Speaker 2: setting up to be an acceleration in growth, and so 334 00:18:03,440 --> 00:18:05,480 Speaker 2: I think we will see the substance this year. But 335 00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:08,080 Speaker 2: I would just also caution people that some of the 336 00:18:08,119 --> 00:18:10,399 Speaker 2: substance you're not going to see. It's not going to 337 00:18:10,440 --> 00:18:12,560 Speaker 2: be obvious. It's going to be behind the scenes. It's 338 00:18:12,560 --> 00:18:15,960 Speaker 2: going to be in things like improving margins as companies 339 00:18:15,960 --> 00:18:18,520 Speaker 2: start to implement these at the enterprise level and start 340 00:18:18,560 --> 00:18:25,280 Speaker 2: to implement just more efficient agents, and so I think 341 00:18:25,280 --> 00:18:27,359 Speaker 2: that that's a different Another piece that we're going to 342 00:18:27,400 --> 00:18:29,080 Speaker 2: start to see in the back half of twenty five 343 00:18:29,200 --> 00:18:30,120 Speaker 2: is improving margins. 344 00:18:30,720 --> 00:18:35,040 Speaker 1: Speaking with Gene Munster, the managing partner at Deepwater Asset Management, 345 00:18:35,080 --> 00:18:38,240 Speaker 1: along with Dan Ives, the global head of Tech Research 346 00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:43,760 Speaker 1: at Webbush Securities. With these kinds of changes, guys, there's 347 00:18:44,280 --> 00:18:48,600 Speaker 1: the continued need, I think for capital investment. We've seen 348 00:18:48,880 --> 00:18:51,440 Speaker 1: so much of that, particularly in some of the biggest 349 00:18:51,480 --> 00:18:56,399 Speaker 1: players whose market capitalizations have grown by such leaps and bounds, 350 00:18:56,440 --> 00:18:59,760 Speaker 1: not the least of which is in Nvidia. Dan, how 351 00:18:59,800 --> 00:19:03,119 Speaker 1: do you you see CAPEX playing out? Is it sustainable 352 00:19:03,480 --> 00:19:04,560 Speaker 1: for this kind of growth? 353 00:19:05,320 --> 00:19:07,359 Speaker 5: Look? I think, and it brings up a great point 354 00:19:07,560 --> 00:19:10,600 Speaker 5: and I'd be interested to hear Genes thoughts on this, 355 00:19:11,040 --> 00:19:14,679 Speaker 5: as always in terms of when you compare dot com 356 00:19:14,720 --> 00:19:19,760 Speaker 5: to here, because here the cat bacs, we're talking about 357 00:19:19,760 --> 00:19:25,400 Speaker 5: two trillion of AI capacs. And what's amazing eye popping 358 00:19:26,280 --> 00:19:30,520 Speaker 5: is sovereigns haven't even gotten into this yet. You haven't 359 00:19:30,560 --> 00:19:33,600 Speaker 5: even had the rest of Fortune five hundred, Global two thousand. 360 00:19:33,640 --> 00:19:36,960 Speaker 5: It's really only big tech today. So when you look 361 00:19:37,000 --> 00:19:39,879 Speaker 5: at this AI cappax, I can tell you follow the 362 00:19:39,960 --> 00:19:43,120 Speaker 5: yellow brick road, you follow the cap backs, because if 363 00:19:43,119 --> 00:19:45,840 Speaker 5: you follow the capax, you're gonna win on these stocks, 364 00:19:46,400 --> 00:19:52,119 Speaker 5: from semis to software to infrastructure, and then ultimately to 365 00:19:52,200 --> 00:19:56,400 Speaker 5: the consumer piece. And to this point, you have tech 366 00:19:56,400 --> 00:19:58,840 Speaker 5: companies at one point two trillion of cash in the 367 00:19:58,880 --> 00:20:01,920 Speaker 5: balance sheet generating three to four hundred billion a year, 368 00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:05,360 Speaker 5: as opposed when you go to dot Com and every 369 00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:08,760 Speaker 5: time someone to do the scary Cisco and video comparison 370 00:20:08,760 --> 00:20:12,480 Speaker 5: on the chart, those are funded by companies that were 371 00:20:12,520 --> 00:20:16,480 Speaker 5: basically levered, no business models, and it goes back to 372 00:20:16,520 --> 00:20:19,840 Speaker 5: that dot Com error. I'm just trying to say a 373 00:20:20,040 --> 00:20:25,000 Speaker 5: much different in apples to oranges comparison. You follow the 374 00:20:25,080 --> 00:20:27,320 Speaker 5: cap backs and I just want to hear Genes thoughts 375 00:20:27,320 --> 00:20:27,520 Speaker 5: on this. 376 00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:30,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the yell bigger road, Dan, you got a 377 00:20:30,800 --> 00:20:34,240 Speaker 2: great way of just illustrating things, and I'm I'm gonna 378 00:20:34,280 --> 00:20:35,440 Speaker 2: play on that yellow brick road. 379 00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:40,080 Speaker 3: Is that when this amount, this level of a capex happens. 380 00:20:41,359 --> 00:20:43,840 Speaker 2: That's one of the reasons why I'm so confident that 381 00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:46,000 Speaker 2: AI the substance is going to exceed the hype and 382 00:20:46,040 --> 00:20:47,919 Speaker 2: this is going to be bigger than the Internet. Is 383 00:20:47,960 --> 00:20:52,359 Speaker 2: that the just the this degree is multiple times bigger 384 00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:54,600 Speaker 2: than what we saw with the Internet build out. It 385 00:20:54,680 --> 00:20:57,199 Speaker 2: will be ten x, twelve x, fifteen x bigger. And 386 00:20:57,240 --> 00:20:59,800 Speaker 2: when you have that kind of infrastructure in place, there's 387 00:20:59,840 --> 00:21:04,760 Speaker 2: just a natural gravity that the theme starts to pull 388 00:21:04,800 --> 00:21:07,680 Speaker 2: in all these different applications, and so I think that 389 00:21:08,040 --> 00:21:11,640 Speaker 2: CAPEX is probably the most important factor to continue to. 390 00:21:12,280 --> 00:21:14,240 Speaker 3: Gauge how well this is. 391 00:21:15,359 --> 00:21:17,520 Speaker 2: Like is this going to play out at this point 392 00:21:18,280 --> 00:21:21,240 Speaker 2: For those who believe that this is just going to 393 00:21:21,280 --> 00:21:25,960 Speaker 2: be something more like mobile, the level of investment I 394 00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:28,320 Speaker 2: think is justification that this is going to have more 395 00:21:28,359 --> 00:21:29,080 Speaker 2: substance to it. 396 00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:33,760 Speaker 1: But Dan, you mentioned that sovereigns haven't really gotten in 397 00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:37,960 Speaker 1: on this as much as some of the bigger companies have. 398 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:43,280 Speaker 1: Raises the question about what kind of impact trade wars 399 00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:47,040 Speaker 1: could have on artificial intelligence. If we get into a 400 00:21:47,119 --> 00:21:51,919 Speaker 1: scenario where soon to be President Donald Trump starts putting 401 00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:55,359 Speaker 1: tariffs on many of these sovereigns, could that be a 402 00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:57,320 Speaker 1: hindrance to AI development? 403 00:21:57,800 --> 00:22:00,719 Speaker 5: See IV, the bar's going to be worse bite. I mean, 404 00:22:00,760 --> 00:22:03,480 Speaker 5: the point is, if you look at how this is 405 00:22:03,520 --> 00:22:08,520 Speaker 5: all going to play out, I think you're gonna ultimately 406 00:22:08,560 --> 00:22:11,919 Speaker 5: have carve outs for the likes of Tesla, Apple and 407 00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:15,640 Speaker 5: allow of the chips that an video makes. And look, 408 00:22:15,720 --> 00:22:17,320 Speaker 5: this is all going to be a game of high 409 00:22:17,359 --> 00:22:20,840 Speaker 5: stakes poker. But when it all comes down to it, 410 00:22:20,880 --> 00:22:24,760 Speaker 5: I don't think it disrupts supply chain dramatically, and I 411 00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:28,639 Speaker 5: don't think it disrupts the AI revolution because look, China 412 00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:31,639 Speaker 5: wants to benefit to the same extent that we're going 413 00:22:31,680 --> 00:22:33,840 Speaker 5: to see here in the US. But that's the other 414 00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:36,879 Speaker 5: thing when it comes to Trump administration. Trump administration is 415 00:22:36,920 --> 00:22:38,119 Speaker 5: bullish for AI. 416 00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:42,600 Speaker 2: The risk of these nations not investing in AI could 417 00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:46,960 Speaker 2: be the end of these countries. I mean ultimately countries 418 00:22:46,960 --> 00:22:50,000 Speaker 2: that are going to need an AI first approach. And 419 00:22:50,040 --> 00:22:52,800 Speaker 2: so anything that happens with tariffs or any sort of 420 00:22:52,840 --> 00:22:56,159 Speaker 2: economic slowdown that we may see across the globe is 421 00:22:56,200 --> 00:23:00,879 Speaker 2: a small impact as a small factor relative to what 422 00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:03,240 Speaker 2: needs to be invested. And so this is top of 423 00:23:03,359 --> 00:23:06,560 Speaker 2: mind spending. It hasn't started. As Dan said, there's another 424 00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:09,879 Speaker 2: piece that hasn't started as well, which is industrial AI, 425 00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:15,000 Speaker 2: the enterprise AI all this and the concept that this 426 00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:17,680 Speaker 2: is still largely big tech that's doing it. I think 427 00:23:18,040 --> 00:23:20,640 Speaker 2: that again is another piece that gives me so much confidence. 428 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:22,120 Speaker 3: And sovereign is going to be there as well. 429 00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:28,280 Speaker 5: So Gene Nathan say, Jane brought a great point because 430 00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:32,280 Speaker 5: me and Jane have seen over the decades and decades 431 00:23:32,760 --> 00:23:40,560 Speaker 5: cover an Apple China tariff supply chain retaliatory tesla. There 432 00:23:40,600 --> 00:23:44,360 Speaker 5: were so many moments over the years where you could 433 00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:48,520 Speaker 5: just hit in a little cave and just basically hit 434 00:23:48,560 --> 00:23:51,560 Speaker 5: the eggsit button on the stocks. The point is it 435 00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:54,880 Speaker 5: will create the opportunities when we sit here a year 436 00:23:54,960 --> 00:23:57,960 Speaker 5: from now, and I believe text up another twenty five percent. 437 00:23:58,640 --> 00:24:03,919 Speaker 5: I think sovereign's become more involved and the tariffs becomes 438 00:24:04,320 --> 00:24:06,680 Speaker 5: some white knuckles, but it doesn't ruin anything. 439 00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:10,840 Speaker 1: So Gene, how do you see sovereigns getting into this? 440 00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:15,159 Speaker 1: What's the catalyst for sovereigns to get into the AI story. 441 00:24:16,280 --> 00:24:20,280 Speaker 2: I think you have to have Notoriously governments are slow 442 00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:22,720 Speaker 2: to move, and I think the catalyst is going to 443 00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:26,600 Speaker 2: be when like the US and China are largely on 444 00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:29,760 Speaker 2: board with that. So I think there's a competitive piece 445 00:24:29,760 --> 00:24:32,840 Speaker 2: that needs to kick in as a catalyst, and I 446 00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:36,360 Speaker 2: think that that probably starts sometime this year. I think 447 00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:38,439 Speaker 2: that they were going to see that's one of the 448 00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:42,520 Speaker 2: reasons not just the sovereigny I the catalyst is the competition, 449 00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:45,919 Speaker 2: but also with industrial AI. I think that that's one 450 00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:47,840 Speaker 2: of the reasons why I think that the nvidity in 451 00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:51,520 Speaker 2: Nvidia trade is going to continue to be a good 452 00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:56,080 Speaker 2: place to be. So it's different than consumer and enterprise, 453 00:24:56,119 --> 00:24:58,200 Speaker 2: that's for sure when it comes to sovereign, but there's 454 00:24:58,280 --> 00:24:59,800 Speaker 2: a lot of money to be spent there. 455 00:25:00,080 --> 00:25:02,320 Speaker 3: They are just getting going. 456 00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:06,200 Speaker 1: And we're going to wrap up this hour long discussion 457 00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:11,160 Speaker 1: on high tech trends as this special edition of Bloomberg 458 00:25:11,280 --> 00:25:15,200 Speaker 1: Daybreak continues with Gene Munster, managing partner in deep Water 459 00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:18,800 Speaker 1: Asset Management and Dan Ives, the global head of Tech 460 00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:22,800 Speaker 1: Research at Wedbush Security. So stay with us. It's thirty 461 00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:26,160 Speaker 1: seven minutes past the hour. I'm Nathan Hager, and this 462 00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:38,960 Speaker 1: is Bloomberg. Thanks again for being with us on this 463 00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:43,000 Speaker 1: special holiday edition of Bloomberg Daybreak. All is quiet in 464 00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:46,399 Speaker 1: markets on this New Year's Day. I'm Nathan Hager, and 465 00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:49,520 Speaker 1: it's time to wrap up this special high tech roundtable. 466 00:25:49,560 --> 00:25:52,119 Speaker 1: We have been spending the entire hour with Gene Munster, 467 00:25:52,240 --> 00:25:55,760 Speaker 1: managing partner at deep Water Asset Management and Dan Ives, 468 00:25:55,760 --> 00:25:59,120 Speaker 1: the global head of Tech Research at Webbush Securities. It's 469 00:25:59,119 --> 00:26:02,159 Speaker 1: been a great discuss on where things could go with 470 00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:05,320 Speaker 1: artificial intelligence. But as we close this out, guys, I 471 00:26:05,320 --> 00:26:08,520 Speaker 1: want to focus in on some individual stocks, some of 472 00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:12,120 Speaker 1: the biggest names that you cover on Wall Street, and 473 00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:14,320 Speaker 1: I guess we'll start with one that fits the theme 474 00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:17,760 Speaker 1: in Vidio. Where do you see in Vidio going gene? 475 00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:20,679 Speaker 2: I think it's going higher, and I think that it 476 00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:24,919 Speaker 2: is like a surprisingly inexpensive stock when you think about 477 00:26:25,359 --> 00:26:29,840 Speaker 2: off of the twenty twenty six numbers. And Dan mentioned 478 00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:32,120 Speaker 2: the white knuckling, and I'll tell you what a lot 479 00:26:32,119 --> 00:26:35,000 Speaker 2: of investors and video investors are white knuckled over the 480 00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:35,560 Speaker 2: boom and. 481 00:26:35,560 --> 00:26:36,560 Speaker 3: Bust of hardware. 482 00:26:37,040 --> 00:26:39,920 Speaker 2: The business was about a twenty billion dollar business before 483 00:26:40,119 --> 00:26:43,040 Speaker 2: the AI training got going, and it's going to be 484 00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:45,439 Speaker 2: about one hundred and fifty billion dollars next year. So 485 00:26:46,600 --> 00:26:49,919 Speaker 2: I've never seen anything like this at this scale. And 486 00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:52,840 Speaker 2: because of that, it just creates this concern that it 487 00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:53,600 Speaker 2: can't go on. 488 00:26:54,280 --> 00:26:55,320 Speaker 3: And I want to. 489 00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:58,199 Speaker 2: Stress too, and video will have its day when the 490 00:26:58,200 --> 00:27:00,359 Speaker 2: second derivative kicks in and slows down a little bit 491 00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:02,320 Speaker 2: more than people think and the stock gets throttled. 492 00:27:02,560 --> 00:27:03,760 Speaker 3: I don't think that's this year. 493 00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:05,880 Speaker 2: I think this is the year where we start to 494 00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:08,520 Speaker 2: reach out and video starts to reach out beyond some 495 00:27:08,560 --> 00:27:10,800 Speaker 2: of the hyper scalers into some of these other markets 496 00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:13,719 Speaker 2: that we're talking about, and they're another piece that is 497 00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:14,719 Speaker 2: just getting kicked off. 498 00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:15,679 Speaker 3: What we're seeing. 499 00:27:15,760 --> 00:27:19,639 Speaker 2: Around this timescaling, this infancing time scaling that's going on 500 00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:22,359 Speaker 2: in these models starting to think more Jensen talked a 501 00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:24,119 Speaker 2: little bit about on their last call. But that's a 502 00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:28,600 Speaker 2: whole other wave in terms of the models needing more 503 00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:31,600 Speaker 2: compute capacity. And so when you put all this together, 504 00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:34,960 Speaker 2: I think in Vidia's setting up to have a good year, 505 00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:39,320 Speaker 2: a great year, because the expectations for calendar twenty six 506 00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:40,320 Speaker 2: are going to move higher. 507 00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:43,359 Speaker 1: There have been so many expectations built into this stock. 508 00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:45,920 Speaker 1: You mentioned some of the need to move beyond the 509 00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:48,720 Speaker 1: hyper scalers into the sovereigns. Those are things that we've 510 00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:51,119 Speaker 1: been talking about when it comes to Nvidia for the 511 00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:56,000 Speaker 1: last several quarters. Dan can in Nvidia sort of live 512 00:27:56,119 --> 00:27:58,600 Speaker 1: up to a lot of the expectation that's been built 513 00:27:58,600 --> 00:27:59,280 Speaker 1: into this stock. 514 00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:04,080 Speaker 5: Look our recent Asia trip demand the supply is fifteen 515 00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:08,000 Speaker 5: to one for in video chips. Three months ago it 516 00:28:08,040 --> 00:28:11,600 Speaker 5: was twelve to one. It's accelerating, and that's why there's 517 00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:14,280 Speaker 5: only one red phone. If you need an AI chip, 518 00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:17,440 Speaker 5: it's the godfather of AI. Jensen Nvidia. I mean, you 519 00:28:17,480 --> 00:28:21,320 Speaker 5: look at AMD, others that maybe you'll call it twelve 520 00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:24,919 Speaker 5: eighteen months now will be there, but that they continue 521 00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:28,240 Speaker 5: to be the only game in town. And I ultimately, look, 522 00:28:28,359 --> 00:28:31,240 Speaker 5: you look out here, could you get to six dollars earnings? 523 00:28:31,240 --> 00:28:33,399 Speaker 5: You look in one hundred and eighty two hundred dollars stock. 524 00:28:33,880 --> 00:28:36,200 Speaker 5: And that's why I think this is one where any 525 00:28:36,320 --> 00:28:39,600 Speaker 5: sell offs in in video. They're table pounders. You just 526 00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:40,720 Speaker 5: own them. 527 00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:43,600 Speaker 1: I think you've called for Nvidia to be one of 528 00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:47,840 Speaker 1: the first four trillion dollar market cap stocks, is that right? 529 00:28:48,920 --> 00:28:52,000 Speaker 5: Look, the first one will be Cooper Tino. They'll cut 530 00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:55,080 Speaker 5: the ribbon being the first four trillion and then that 531 00:28:55,240 --> 00:28:59,120 Speaker 5: exclusive club they're gonna welcome in Jensen and Video, that 532 00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:04,400 Speaker 5: four trillion dollar our club, and then followed by Microsoft. 533 00:29:03,760 --> 00:29:07,680 Speaker 1: Alluding to Apple with the reference to Coopertino. I know 534 00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:11,520 Speaker 1: another stock that you watch very closely, Gene, what are 535 00:29:11,520 --> 00:29:14,280 Speaker 1: your predictions for Apple heading into twenty twenty? 536 00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:16,520 Speaker 2: I want I want Dan to go first on this one. 537 00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:18,440 Speaker 3: I want to Okay again. 538 00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:23,720 Speaker 5: Look, i'd say Gene and I for decades, why I 539 00:29:23,760 --> 00:29:28,320 Speaker 5: respect him more than anyone on Wall Street. It's seen 540 00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:31,840 Speaker 5: the farest of the trees and apples. Another one, the 541 00:29:32,040 --> 00:29:37,200 Speaker 5: AI revolution, the consumer AI revolution, comes through Cooper Tina 542 00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:42,520 Speaker 5: because it starts with iPhone sixteen. Apple Intelligence just rolling out, 543 00:29:42,520 --> 00:29:45,440 Speaker 5: but it's a multi year China is not even going 544 00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:48,120 Speaker 5: to be rolled out till April, so you start to 545 00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:50,600 Speaker 5: look at this with three hundred million iPhones in a 546 00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:55,720 Speaker 5: window of an upgrade opportunity, this will be the renaissance 547 00:29:55,800 --> 00:29:58,960 Speaker 5: of growth for Apple. And that's why I think ultimately 548 00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:01,040 Speaker 5: a year from we're looking four and a half trillion 549 00:30:01,080 --> 00:30:04,720 Speaker 5: dollar mark CAAP. You know, as Apple goes through what 550 00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:06,880 Speaker 5: I believe, we start to look at three twenty five, 551 00:30:06,920 --> 00:30:10,120 Speaker 5: three fifty dollars. And I know Gene's talked about this 552 00:30:10,280 --> 00:30:15,840 Speaker 5: a lot, but this is the moment for cooking Coupe Tina, Gene. 553 00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:18,600 Speaker 2: You know, in terms of the numbers that back up 554 00:30:18,640 --> 00:30:22,160 Speaker 2: that theme is that the iPhone. As the iPhone goes, 555 00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:25,080 Speaker 2: so goes Apple, so goes the stock and iPhone in 556 00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:28,400 Speaker 2: twenty Fiscal twenty four was flat. Fiscal twenty five, the 557 00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:32,120 Speaker 2: streets looking for three percent growth. It was five percent 558 00:30:32,680 --> 00:30:36,240 Speaker 2: at the end of September, So analyst expectations actually come down. 559 00:30:36,680 --> 00:30:39,520 Speaker 2: And the reason they've come down is because the initial 560 00:30:40,000 --> 00:30:43,000 Speaker 2: rollout of Apple Intelligence in the US has been in 561 00:30:43,040 --> 00:30:46,080 Speaker 2: some eyes, underwhelming, and so the analysts bring their numbers down. 562 00:30:46,360 --> 00:30:49,240 Speaker 2: For fiscal twenty six it's eight percent, so it goes 563 00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:51,800 Speaker 2: zero three eight percent. They're going to beat those numbers, 564 00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:53,959 Speaker 2: and I think that I love dance take on this 565 00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:57,719 Speaker 2: mine is so for fiscal twenty five, the streets at 566 00:30:57,760 --> 00:31:00,720 Speaker 2: three percent, I think we're probably going to be closer 567 00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:03,800 Speaker 2: to five to eight percent for iPhone growth. And for 568 00:31:03,880 --> 00:31:06,680 Speaker 2: fiscal twenty six that eight percent, I think it's probably 569 00:31:06,760 --> 00:31:09,880 Speaker 2: closer to ten to twelve, which is like an order 570 00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:13,080 Speaker 2: of magnitude outside of where I think most investors are thinking. 571 00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:16,040 Speaker 2: But ultimately, I think that these features are going to 572 00:31:16,120 --> 00:31:17,040 Speaker 2: drive an upgrade cycle. 573 00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:20,680 Speaker 5: And I just add to gene two hundred forty million 574 00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:24,480 Speaker 5: units for I Phone, which will break, you know, break 575 00:31:24,520 --> 00:31:26,240 Speaker 5: a record. That's where I think they end up for 576 00:31:26,280 --> 00:31:29,200 Speaker 5: fiscal twenty five. And that's why the hater they hated 577 00:31:29,320 --> 00:31:33,920 Speaker 5: two trillion, despised three trillion. At four trillion, they'll be 578 00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:35,480 Speaker 5: yelling from the tree tops. 579 00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:39,480 Speaker 1: So does Apple get to look past vision pro some 580 00:31:39,560 --> 00:31:42,240 Speaker 1: of the other products that have had to fall by 581 00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:44,680 Speaker 1: the wayside, things like the Apple car Is it all 582 00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:47,080 Speaker 1: about the iPhone? Can it continue to be? 583 00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:51,400 Speaker 2: Gene definitely in fiscal twenty five, it's about how Apple 584 00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:55,040 Speaker 2: intelligence drives iPhone growth. And like Dan was talking about, 585 00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:57,320 Speaker 2: is there's also this pool from what happened in twenty 586 00:31:57,360 --> 00:31:59,680 Speaker 2: twenty one iPhone was up thirty seven percent. You get 587 00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:02,600 Speaker 2: that fact starting to kick in. That just boggles my 588 00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:06,360 Speaker 2: mind that investors just aren't tracking to that wave that's coming. 589 00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:08,280 Speaker 2: As much as Dan has talked about, its still like 590 00:32:08,280 --> 00:32:11,080 Speaker 2: that light still I think largely hasn't gone on, but 591 00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:13,680 Speaker 2: they get because of that opportunity. They do get a 592 00:32:13,720 --> 00:32:17,400 Speaker 2: pass on Vision Pro. It's been a disappointment, it is. 593 00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:21,040 Speaker 2: I think that the strategy. I think they just need 594 00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:24,160 Speaker 2: to shift to doing more smart glasses AI glasses. I 595 00:32:24,160 --> 00:32:27,760 Speaker 2: think that that seems that that's where the markets can evolve. 596 00:32:27,760 --> 00:32:29,760 Speaker 2: I don't think we're going to see any products this 597 00:32:29,840 --> 00:32:34,520 Speaker 2: year from that perspective, but I do ultimately think that 598 00:32:34,240 --> 00:32:37,200 Speaker 2: that is where Apple goes. So in the midst of 599 00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:40,560 Speaker 2: not having a new product category, it really is about 600 00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:45,320 Speaker 2: a hardware category. It's about the software, the AI product category. 601 00:32:45,320 --> 00:32:46,960 Speaker 3: In twenty twenty five, we're. 602 00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:50,600 Speaker 1: Speaking with Gene Munster Managing Director deep Water Asset Management 603 00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:54,320 Speaker 1: and web Bush Securities Global head of Tech Research, Dan Ives. 604 00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:56,640 Speaker 1: Let's shift gears to another stock, Dan, that I know 605 00:32:56,720 --> 00:33:00,960 Speaker 1: you watch very closely. Tesla. It's been on a tear 606 00:33:01,440 --> 00:33:04,960 Speaker 1: since the election of President like Donald Trump, Elon Musk 607 00:33:05,080 --> 00:33:09,160 Speaker 1: is very close to the President elect. Where does Tesla 608 00:33:09,240 --> 00:33:12,120 Speaker 1: go in twenty twenty five? Can it continue this break 609 00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:12,720 Speaker 1: neck pace? 610 00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:16,080 Speaker 5: Look, it was a bet for the ages in terms 611 00:33:16,160 --> 00:33:18,920 Speaker 5: of must bet on Trump, and I think it's your 612 00:33:18,920 --> 00:33:22,160 Speaker 5: start because the autonomous future, that's the goal at the 613 00:33:22,240 --> 00:33:25,000 Speaker 5: end of the rainbow for Tesla deliveries to be on 614 00:33:25,200 --> 00:33:27,320 Speaker 5: Right now, I think that's ten percent of the story, 615 00:33:27,760 --> 00:33:30,440 Speaker 5: the autonomous and AI future. I think it's worth a 616 00:33:30,520 --> 00:33:33,680 Speaker 5: trillion dollars a will into the Tesla story, which I 617 00:33:33,800 --> 00:33:35,440 Speaker 5: believe in a bulk case you can see a six 618 00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:39,080 Speaker 5: hundred and fifty dollars stock and you look now for 619 00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:41,960 Speaker 5: the cloudy kid fans a sweep the leg movement for 620 00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:46,160 Speaker 5: regulatory knit to and others, and now autonomous starts to 621 00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:49,520 Speaker 5: get I think a huge sort of catalyst with Trump 622 00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:53,200 Speaker 5: in there and Tesla is going to be the main beneficiary. 623 00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:56,120 Speaker 5: I could argue Tesla could be the best AI play 624 00:33:56,120 --> 00:33:56,560 Speaker 5: out there. 625 00:33:57,120 --> 00:33:59,880 Speaker 1: You agree with that Gene best Ay I play is Tesla. 626 00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:04,440 Speaker 2: We definitely like it's what that company is doing is 627 00:34:04,960 --> 00:34:07,320 Speaker 2: more exciting than I think the rest of the megacaps 628 00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:10,239 Speaker 2: all put together. When you look at whether it's autonomy, 629 00:34:10,360 --> 00:34:14,040 Speaker 2: whether they're changing how they produce vehicles, what's going on 630 00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:18,239 Speaker 2: with optimists, all this puts it in that category. So 631 00:34:18,719 --> 00:34:22,600 Speaker 2: super exciting, high valuation, but really exciting that I think 632 00:34:23,360 --> 00:34:26,840 Speaker 2: from my perspective is that they're just slowly checking the boxes. 633 00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:28,120 Speaker 2: I don't know what the stock is going to do 634 00:34:28,200 --> 00:34:30,520 Speaker 2: month to month on this. I do feel it's going 635 00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:34,240 Speaker 2: higher longer term because they are the most exciting company 636 00:34:34,239 --> 00:34:38,440 Speaker 2: in AI and I think the just kind of put 637 00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:41,000 Speaker 2: one other further point of how they turn the screws 638 00:34:41,040 --> 00:34:45,800 Speaker 2: down on these trends is we just had GM back 639 00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:49,600 Speaker 2: out of their autonomous program effectively, which is huge news. 640 00:34:49,840 --> 00:34:53,400 Speaker 2: And then separately what's going on with Honda and Nissan. 641 00:34:53,440 --> 00:34:56,760 Speaker 2: It's really noteworthy, and the car part of the business 642 00:34:56,800 --> 00:35:00,360 Speaker 2: doesn't give as much attention, but it's worth noting that 643 00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:05,000 Speaker 2: that relationship is evidence that the car industry is going 644 00:35:05,000 --> 00:35:07,400 Speaker 2: to get turned upside down in the next decade and 645 00:35:07,440 --> 00:35:09,439 Speaker 2: there are going to be brands that we've known for 646 00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:12,200 Speaker 2: a long time that aren't going to be around. And 647 00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:18,279 Speaker 2: my prediction is that this mashup between Nissan and Honda 648 00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:24,200 Speaker 2: is going to essentially be a slow decline to both 649 00:35:24,239 --> 00:35:26,880 Speaker 2: companies will be a fraction of what they are even today. 650 00:35:27,400 --> 00:35:30,319 Speaker 2: And the reason for that is for what Tesla's doing, 651 00:35:30,480 --> 00:35:33,279 Speaker 2: not just on the electrification side, but autonomy, and just 652 00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:36,759 Speaker 2: those two companies just haven't innovated. And if you're not 653 00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:40,239 Speaker 2: innovating at just a lightning speed, you're on your way 654 00:35:40,280 --> 00:35:41,719 Speaker 2: to being irrelevant. 655 00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:43,920 Speaker 1: In the time we have left. Guys, let's talk about 656 00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:46,880 Speaker 1: some of the stocks that we haven't talked about just 657 00:35:46,960 --> 00:35:49,960 Speaker 1: yet that need to be on investors radar, and I'll 658 00:35:50,000 --> 00:35:50,799 Speaker 1: start with you, Dan. 659 00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:54,640 Speaker 5: Look, I think it starts with Palnentier. I mean the 660 00:35:54,719 --> 00:35:57,520 Speaker 5: messy of AI. I think where Carbon Poundeer have done 661 00:35:57,960 --> 00:36:01,719 Speaker 5: that continues to sort of be the first piece of 662 00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:05,719 Speaker 5: this software layer, and I think this is really the 663 00:36:05,880 --> 00:36:08,000 Speaker 5: model that more and more companies are going to go down. 664 00:36:08,040 --> 00:36:10,960 Speaker 5: And the other thing is that the amount going to 665 00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:13,880 Speaker 5: be spent in the belly on AI is mind blowing. 666 00:36:14,520 --> 00:36:17,719 Speaker 5: Names like Palenteer are going to continue to benefit I 667 00:36:17,800 --> 00:36:21,400 Speaker 5: believe Palenteer could be the next oracle, and that's why 668 00:36:21,600 --> 00:36:24,719 Speaker 5: they haters well Hated is a teenager stock. They hate 669 00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:29,200 Speaker 5: is the seniorsites and continues to doing when we're topics. 670 00:36:28,760 --> 00:36:30,800 Speaker 1: Gene what should be on investors radar? 671 00:36:31,719 --> 00:36:36,560 Speaker 2: I think Google it's a company that is keeping up 672 00:36:36,680 --> 00:36:39,719 Speaker 2: investors up at night because they don't know how perplexity 673 00:36:40,520 --> 00:36:42,760 Speaker 2: or search for your GPT is going to be impacting 674 00:36:42,760 --> 00:36:45,839 Speaker 2: their business longer term. But search is just such an 675 00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:48,640 Speaker 2: habitual behavior. It's got to be tenex better. I don't 676 00:36:48,640 --> 00:36:51,560 Speaker 2: think these other players are ten x better yet. And separately, 677 00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:54,000 Speaker 2: is that Google's made a lot of progress. I think 678 00:36:54,000 --> 00:36:56,120 Speaker 2: that the company still needs a fire underm don't get 679 00:36:56,120 --> 00:36:56,479 Speaker 2: me wrong. 680 00:36:56,520 --> 00:36:57,240 Speaker 3: I mean they've been. 681 00:36:57,440 --> 00:36:59,600 Speaker 2: Asleep at the wheel here, but just in the past 682 00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:01,640 Speaker 2: year made a lot of progress. And the models that 683 00:37:01,640 --> 00:37:04,680 Speaker 2: they showed at the end of December, the new models 684 00:37:04,680 --> 00:37:09,440 Speaker 2: that they came out with horrible name Gemini to Flash thinking. 685 00:37:09,480 --> 00:37:12,040 Speaker 2: I mean, they couldn't have created a worse name for 686 00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:15,919 Speaker 2: the product, but it came it's out and available for developers, 687 00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:20,120 Speaker 2: and GPT is not there yet. They just announced that 688 00:37:20,200 --> 00:37:23,080 Speaker 2: it's coming just on the heels of Google and that's 689 00:37:23,120 --> 00:37:25,560 Speaker 2: a flip flop from a year ago. Now you see 690 00:37:25,600 --> 00:37:27,440 Speaker 2: Google ahead, and I think that that's going to start 691 00:37:27,440 --> 00:37:29,680 Speaker 2: to resonate with investors in twenty five. 692 00:37:30,080 --> 00:37:31,759 Speaker 1: This has been a real pleasure you guys, have you 693 00:37:31,800 --> 00:37:34,400 Speaker 1: on for the full hour to talk about tech trends 694 00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:37,439 Speaker 1: heading into the new year, and looking forward to doing 695 00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:40,960 Speaker 1: this again seeing how many pan out as we continue 696 00:37:41,400 --> 00:37:45,160 Speaker 1: tracking the trajectory of the artificial intelligence trend and how 697 00:37:45,160 --> 00:37:47,680 Speaker 1: it's going to play out on Wall Street. So thanks 698 00:37:47,800 --> 00:37:52,400 Speaker 1: again to Gene Munster, managing partner Deepwater Asset Management for 699 00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:56,160 Speaker 1: joining us on this high tech roundtable along with Dan Ives, 700 00:37:56,280 --> 00:37:59,799 Speaker 1: global head of Tech Research at Webbush Securities. And we'd 701 00:37:59,880 --> 00:38:02,319 Speaker 1: like to thank you as well for spending time with 702 00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:04,520 Speaker 1: us on this New Year's holiday. I hope it is 703 00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:09,160 Speaker 1: a healthy and prosperous twenty twenty five for all of you. 704 00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:13,279 Speaker 1: I'm Nathan Hager. Stay with us. Today's top stories and 705 00:38:13,520 --> 00:38:17,120 Speaker 1: global business headlines are coming up right now.