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Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,

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Speaker 1: where we discussed the top political headlines with some of

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Speaker 1: today's best minds, and Republican Congresswoman Nancy Mace says, we

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Speaker 1: cannot be assholes to women.

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Speaker 2: All right, Well, that's something.

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Speaker 1: We have such a great show for you today, the Atlantics,

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Speaker 1: Franklin Fower talks about his new book, The Last Politician,

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Speaker 1: Inside Joe Biden's White House and the struggle for America's future.

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Speaker 2: Then we'll talk to Hanafried.

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Speaker 1: Executive director of All Voting as Local, about how we

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Speaker 1: keep our elections fair. But first we have MSNBC Daily

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Speaker 1: Editor James Downey.

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Speaker 2: Welcome back to Fast Politics. Jim Downey, thank you for

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Speaker 2: having me back. We're delighted.

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Speaker 1: So let's talk about this last slow week of summer.

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Speaker 1: This comes out on Monday, so we're kind of catching

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Speaker 1: up to the kind of it was the best of times,

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Speaker 1: it was the worst of times. It was vacmenttum it

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Speaker 1: was discuss vic everywhere.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. I tend to subscribe to the theory that a

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Speaker 3: large part of this is that the GOP race is

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Speaker 3: so boring. You've got the santisis top strategists saying we

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Speaker 3: need fifty million dollars.

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Speaker 2: I feel like the top line is they back down.

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Speaker 3: Like somehow he needs It's almost like he's facing a

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Speaker 3: hur or he's dealing with the fall from a hurricane,

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Speaker 3: and he needs more help with the collapse of his

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Speaker 3: political campaign. Like that's how bad this is. So I

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Speaker 3: think it's you all, yeah, you see this a lot

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Speaker 3: of times. My personal comparison with Vivic is Herman Kane

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Speaker 3: in a lot of right, where it's the guy who

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Speaker 3: comes in with all of these slogans that don't pass

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Speaker 3: the left test, spell test, that whatever test you want

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Speaker 3: to run on them. But you get to September October

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Speaker 3: and all of the regular stories have been written by

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Speaker 3: the political press, and they're like, well, who else is here?

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Speaker 4: Oh?

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Speaker 3: This guy nine guys, yeah, yeah, have a nine nine

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Speaker 3: nine fag He's just it's remarkable where somebody decided to

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Speaker 3: take everything that's much of the worst of Donald Trump

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Speaker 3: and all of the worst of Ted Cruz and this

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Speaker 3: sockety that that was a winning strategy for politics.

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Speaker 1: All of the worst of Ted Cruz, and also Jeff

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Speaker 1: row who worked on Ted Cruz too.

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Speaker 3: Yes, that's right, yes, and in ours, yeah it.

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Speaker 1: Is now making money on yet another uncharismatic candidate. So

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Speaker 1: I want to talk to you about this idea of boringness, right,

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Speaker 1: and the political mainstream media, which is us, right, that's us.

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Speaker 1: I mean I hate it when people are like criticizing

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Speaker 1: the mainstream media and I'm like, that's you, bitch. I'm sorry, Like, well,

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Speaker 1: like this is us. But there is some pressure to

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Speaker 1: write things that people want to read.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it can be difficult sometimes. As I said,

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Speaker 3: I hit September October, and I think in this situation

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Speaker 3: in particular, where we all know where this Republican race

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Speaker 3: is going, absence some remarkable event, we know who's going

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Speaker 3: to be the nominee, it's one of the least suspenseful,

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Speaker 3: so to speak, primaries in decades, maybe.

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Speaker 2: Maybe in maybe in even more.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm trying to think back to I mean when

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Speaker 3: George W. Bush won the two thousand race, I mean

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Speaker 3: that was people McCain for a little bit there Al

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Speaker 3: wore on the other side, but he was an incumbent

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Speaker 3: vice president.

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Speaker 2: I mean that was pretty boring.

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Speaker 3: That was pretty boring.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, that was.

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Speaker 1: The birth of the Naomi Wolf being brought in to

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Speaker 1: tell him to wear more feminine suits discourse, which was

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Speaker 1: in fact one of the dumber moments.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and it's only looked dumber in hindsight as she's

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Speaker 3: done made.

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Speaker 2: Her her career is an anti vaccer.

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Speaker 3: Yes, yes, Well, when you've completely embarrassed yourself on the BBC,

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Speaker 3: your book has been pulp literally pulp taken out a

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Speaker 3: circulation because an error you made. What's left but to

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Speaker 3: become a.

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Speaker 2: Grifter, right exactly.

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Speaker 3: But yeah, I think it's tough. I have a lot

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Speaker 3: of some of you. I think when you work at

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Speaker 3: a place like I mean, I'm an MSNBC and we

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Speaker 3: have a lot our colleagues and NBC News, we have

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Speaker 3: people who are on the road every day with these

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Speaker 3: candidates or will be on the road every day with

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Speaker 3: this candidates soon, and you've got to say new stuff.

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Speaker 3: I think that that's something that can be very And yes,

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Speaker 3: people will say you need to be substantive, and you should,

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Speaker 3: you should cover the substantive stuff. But also, first of all,

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Speaker 3: if you're covering a parent like Vivic, how much substantive

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Speaker 3: stuff is? I mean you can be like, what was it?

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Speaker 3: We need a physical fitness test for colleges, right, I mean,

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Speaker 3: like at a certain point, you know, I mean, how

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Speaker 3: many times can you write that story? Again? If he

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Speaker 3: comes out with a new substance of new policy, you

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Speaker 3: write that story and you write reactions to it, and

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Speaker 3: hopefully you write about how dumb that is. But sometimes

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Speaker 3: that may get you one to two stories, but it

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Speaker 3: may not. It's not going to be it's not going

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Speaker 3: to do a whole month of reporting for you.

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Speaker 2: So right, exactly.

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Speaker 1: I mean, the pressure to file copy is real, right,

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Speaker 1: and the pressure to make these stories interesting. The American

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Speaker 1: public israel And I again, I don't like where we

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Speaker 1: are in American democracy, and I don't think anyone does.

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Speaker 1: But we have the kind of civic engagement that we

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Speaker 1: haven't had in a long time, right like these I

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Speaker 1: mean I remember news cycles filled with like why don't

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Speaker 1: people vote?

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Speaker 2: How do we get people to vote?

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Speaker 3: Right?

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Speaker 4: People?

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Speaker 1: We have these turnouts that are like knocking the doors off.

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Speaker 1: I mean, think about that Ohio. We had a special

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Speaker 1: election in Ohio and August that was set up in

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Speaker 1: the hopes of not getting a lot of people there,

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Speaker 1: and the numbers were insane.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, And I think that's a great example of much

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Speaker 3: as we've bemow the many faults of sort of the

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Speaker 3: age of the Internet and the age of and the

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Speaker 3: difficulties with disinformation and privacy issues and so forth. I

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Speaker 3: think about how much more difficult it would have been

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Speaker 3: to get out the word about those sorts of things,

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Speaker 3: particularly maybe not so much inside the state. And in

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Speaker 3: terms of it might have been a little bit easier

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Speaker 3: and the turnout wouldn't have been a huge drop off,

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Speaker 3: but in terms of the funding and in terms of

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Speaker 3: the national attention, you look at from Ohio with the

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Speaker 3: abortion referenda to all of the anti trans efforts in

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Speaker 3: various states across the country, and you think about how

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Speaker 3: quickly this news moves and how quickly people are able

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Speaker 3: to be aware of it. We're undeniably in that situation,

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Speaker 3: in a better situation under in the Internet era than

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Speaker 3: we were twenty or fifty years ago. I mean, you

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Speaker 3: go back and look at when you had just three

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Speaker 3: major broadcast networks in your local newspaper, and obviously the

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Speaker 3: death of local news is a huge problem, but.

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Speaker 2: The gatekeeping was insane.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I come from nineties world because I published

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Speaker 1: my first book when I was twenty ish and so,

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Speaker 1: which was of course in twenty twenty one no the

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Speaker 1: in nineteen ninety whatever, and so the gatekeeping like if

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Speaker 1: you didn't get a review somewhere, you were fucked. Like

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Speaker 1: there was no If Ana let you write for Vogue, great,

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Speaker 1: but if not, there were like three choices and it wasn't.

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Speaker 1: So I do feel like what's been incredible about this

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Speaker 1: Internet world, and I've been a huge beneficiary of it myself,

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Speaker 1: is that you can really if people think you're funny,

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Speaker 1: they'll sort of and there's a much different kind of people.

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Speaker 1: Can I mean again, like I feel like this is

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Speaker 1: a conversation like everything bad for you is actually good

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Speaker 1: for you. But I want to like sort of just

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Speaker 1: talk about kind of what is coming up this week

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Speaker 1: because the House is coming back. They have the GOP House,

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Speaker 1: which has barely five seats and has all of these

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Speaker 1: very vulnerable House Republicans is planning on doing a lot

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Speaker 1: of crazy shit.

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Speaker 2: Can you talk to us about that?

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Speaker 3: Absolutely? Well, it starts with the fact that Kevin McCarthy

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Speaker 3: is still very bad at his job. That's much of

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Speaker 3: voice is happy in the House.

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Speaker 2: We will talk. That's because he's very stupid.

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Speaker 3: At the very least, he's very good at fundraising and

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Speaker 3: he's very bad at keeping his mouth shut, because they're

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Speaker 3: moving forward. It looks like he's moving forward with this

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Speaker 3: impeachment effort, even though GOP congressman aids they'll admit off

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Speaker 3: the record, I mean, in every other story on this

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Speaker 3: movement to impeach him has a quote from an aid

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Speaker 3: or a congressman off the record, of course, because God forbid,

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Speaker 3: they put their names behind it, but saying that, like,

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Speaker 3: we just don't have the evidence to do this. We

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Speaker 3: don't have the evidence to this. And actually the fact

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Speaker 3: that they have him move forward with this impeachment investigation

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Speaker 3: is in and of itself a sign that they don't

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Speaker 3: have the evidence, because the fact that they didn't move

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Speaker 3: forward with it in April, say, because there's such pressure

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Speaker 3: from the right right, as you mentioned, they have such

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Speaker 3: a narrow majority, and they have enough moderate quote unquote

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Speaker 3: moderate let's say, representing Biden's endangered congressmen and women who

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Speaker 3: look at this, look at what the so called evidence,

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Speaker 3: and say, this isn't there and it's only going to

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Speaker 3: hurt me. This is not going to help me, because

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Speaker 3: we mean, you look at the Democrats. The Democrats did

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Speaker 3: not suffer at the ballot box for pursuing impeachment. I

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Speaker 3: think that's pretty indisputable, right whereas here Republicans themselves, there's

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Speaker 3: enough of them who look at this and say this

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Speaker 3: is a bad idea. And McCarthy's doing this in part

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Speaker 3: not just because he's trying to protect himself just overall

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Speaker 3: this sess am now a majority, but also because he

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Speaker 3: made that error where he didn't immediately when he was asked.

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Speaker 3: I believe on CNBC that whether Trump was the strongest candidate,

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Speaker 3: he didn't say yes right away. He didn't doff his

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Speaker 3: cap and scrape and bow, and this is his way

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Speaker 3: of covering for it. And now we're just going to

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Speaker 3: be headed back towards an impeachment inquiry is going to

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Speaker 3: be a wasteerer when it's time, and a shut down,

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Speaker 3: that possible shutdown, which is again going to be a

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Speaker 3: wastewaary West Simon will and if it goes through, will

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Speaker 3: hurt the economy and it's ridiculous.

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Speaker 2: And I want to talk about shut down for a minute.

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Speaker 1: So basically Republicans are mad that they're debt ceiling, so

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Speaker 1: they had caused a debt ceiling fracas. The dead ceiling

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Speaker 1: is not Republicans if a Republican president off in office,

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Speaker 1: Republicans agree to lift the debt ceiling. If a Democratic

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Speaker 1: president's office, Republicans agree to not lift the debt ceiling

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Speaker 1: because they hate Democrats, or because they want to be obstreppers,

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Speaker 1: or because they think they can get something from it.

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Speaker 1: Republicans did not get anything from it. The MAGA Caucus,

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Speaker 1: which includes Marjorie Tayler Green and Matt Gates and that

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Speaker 1: crew furious. So now they want to do a government

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Speaker 1: shutdown to stick it to the Libs.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, And the pathetic part of this is that there

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Speaker 3: was an argument to be made, and there was some

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Speaker 3: polling to suggest that a debt default could hurt both parties,

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Speaker 3: that that was a materially different situation, could crush the economy. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: that could have been such a shock that both sides

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Speaker 3: would have been blamed. Whereas the shutdown. We've been through

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Speaker 3: several of these in the last decade. We know how

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Speaker 3: this ends, we know and McCarthy knows how this sends, right,

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Speaker 3: And you had you have Marjorie Taller Green, who it's

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Speaker 3: worth noting Marjorie Taylor Green, and I believe gets as well.

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Speaker 3: But certainly Green has she underperformed a lot of similar

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Speaker 3: Republicans in nearby districts or or similar kinds of districts.

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Speaker 3: She is not good at politics. It's kind of funny

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Speaker 3: to me that the people talk about her as a

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Speaker 3: potential VP. And I mean, who knows what Jeff does

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Speaker 3: god to do, but she even among a roster of

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Speaker 3: very bad choices, she would be particularly awful.

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Speaker 1: I would like to add in to take this moment

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Speaker 1: to talk for a minute about Jadie Vance, who has

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Speaker 1: also drunk the Maga kool aid. Though obviously he's a

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Speaker 1: little smarter than Marjorie Tayler Green and has this very

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Speaker 1: fancy pedigree. But he is another one who well underperformed

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Speaker 1: right Like had he been running in Pennsylvania, he would

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Speaker 1: have lost, but because he was running in such a

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Speaker 1: deeply read state, he was able to win. But he's

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Speaker 1: still underperformed, like by a larger margin than most Republicans

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Speaker 1: in Ohio. And I think it is worth realizing that

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Speaker 1: these Maga celebrities is and Ted Cruz is another one

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Speaker 1: who is up for re election now again Texas seems

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Speaker 1: like a hard nut to crack, but these Maga celebrities,

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Speaker 1: they really only serve a very small part of this

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Speaker 1: very kind of galvanized dug in base.

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Speaker 3: Absolutely, and I've thrown Lauren Bobert there as well, of course.

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Speaker 3: I mean we remember that there was suspense for she

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Speaker 3: couldn't claim victory in her race until a couple days

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Speaker 3: after the midterms. Last year, her race came right down

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Speaker 3: to the warne at the election was so close that

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Speaker 3: it triggered her recount.

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Speaker 2: She only won by five hundred votes.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I think Cruise is sort of the er example,

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Speaker 3: the original example of this. I mean, obviously Democrats would

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Speaker 3: love to flip texts, and as you said, it's a

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Speaker 3: tough nut to crack, but a lot of the most

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Speaker 3: sort of promising signs have been less about Texas changing

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Speaker 3: and more about Ted Cruz being a uniquely bad, terrible candle.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it is also worth talking about the gubernatorial

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Speaker 1: races of twenty twenty three, of which there are a

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Speaker 1: few that are like Andy Burscher in Kentucky. I think

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Speaker 1: he's term limited, but there's another Democrat running for that seat.

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Speaker 1: And then Mississippi has a Democrat running for Elvis Presley's cousin, right,

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Speaker 1: who was the highest elected Democrat in the state. And

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Speaker 1: then there are like a sort of spate of these

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Speaker 1: red states with blue governors or where a blue governor

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Speaker 1: has a real shot.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and obviously that's going to say that people are

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Speaker 3: going to be watching really closely, because you recall that

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Speaker 3: in twenty twenty one with Glenn Youngkin in Virginia and

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Speaker 3: the Republican near Flip Jersey as well, which actually, compared

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Speaker 3: to the fundamentals, was in some ways more of a

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Speaker 3: Republican of a performance than in Virginia that basically determined

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Speaker 3: the narrative for the whole year running up, and that

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Speaker 3: that was the reason why people thought there was going

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Speaker 3: to be a red wave and also materialize. Yeah, well right, yes,

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Speaker 3: and I think here this is gonna be sathing that

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Speaker 3: people are gonna be watching very closely and as much

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Speaker 3: as anything, even though because I believe it's in Louisiana,

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Speaker 3: Mississippi and Kentucky. Yes, even obviously not exactly. Basher has

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Speaker 3: done a tremendous job in Kentucky in terms of electoral

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Speaker 3: track record, and John Bell Edwards and then John Bell

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Speaker 3: Edwards and Louisiana exactly so, but these are usually difficult

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Speaker 3: states for Democrats to succeed in state well stay wide

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Speaker 3: or district lost both paying in the district. I think

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Speaker 3: Edwards and Basher would sort issue. I think it's Cameron

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Speaker 3: who is right.

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Speaker 2: Cameron is running Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, the ag But no, they would tell you, of

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Speaker 3: course that they are always looking uphill on it.

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Speaker 1: But the thinking there is that these Democrats are the

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Speaker 1: bulwark against crazy Republican state legislatures.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think in terms of the national the narrative,

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Speaker 3: no one's the people who want to say, oh, this

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Speaker 3: is if Edward's and or Cameron Lewis it's I think

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Speaker 3: you're going to see people who have been waiting since

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Speaker 3: last fall to argue against anything Biden does and points

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Speaker 3: at any electional proof. They're going to try and use

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Speaker 3: this as evidence if things do go badly.

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Speaker 1: So, will you talk for two seconds about this prescription

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Speaker 1: drug pricing negotiation. It's the slowest week of the year.

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Speaker 1: This is a very big fucking deal. Can you talk

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Speaker 1: about it and explain why it's so important?

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Speaker 3: Well, prescription me lowering position drug prices is one of

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Speaker 3: those issues that let's start with the politics. Lower prescription

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Speaker 3: drug prices is one of those issues that pulls well

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Speaker 3: across the board. It's something that even Donald Trump was

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Speaker 3: talking about doing, but until he met with pharmaceutical obvious

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Speaker 3: and then all of a sudden he just forgot about it.

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Speaker 3: But also it's something that has made through Congress at

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Speaker 3: different points. It's gotten fairly close and then sort of

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Speaker 3: mysteriously died as it gets closer to being turned into law.

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Speaker 3: And so this announcement earlier this week from President Biden,

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Speaker 3: which they announced the first ten drugs that Medicare will

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Speaker 3: be able to negotiate.

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Speaker 1: Prike will like request blood dinners, Ye, cancer drugs.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, cancer drugs, And they went basically as I understand it,

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Speaker 3: by usage. These are all widely used, These are all

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Speaker 3: going to save people a lot of money, and so

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Speaker 3: more important in a lot of ways than the politics

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Speaker 3: is the policy. This is going to save people tons

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Speaker 3: of money. As Ernie Sanders and others are fond of saying,

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Speaker 3: America pays higher prices for worse healthcare outcomes, and prescription

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Speaker 3: drugs are a big part of that. And I mean,

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Speaker 3: this is going to be something I think you're going

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Speaker 3: to hear this again and again and again and again

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Speaker 3: between now and next fall well and really through the

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Speaker 3: rest of the rest of Biden's Simon office, because this

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Speaker 3: is something that Biden can point to and say, I'm

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Speaker 3: lowering prescription drugs for you. And obviously these first ten

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Speaker 3: drugs are only the start. There will be more each

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Speaker 3: year added to the list. And even though the lowering

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Speaker 3: of prices they only snap into place a couple of

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Speaker 3: years from now, that doesn't mean that it won't affect

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Speaker 3: the drug price market before that. And so this is

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Speaker 3: going to make a big difference in people's lives, and

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Speaker 3: I think also is going to be a big winner

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Speaker 3: at the polls.

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Speaker 1: One last question, the Biden underperformed with older voters.

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Speaker 2: Could this help him?

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Speaker 3: I mean, undoubtedly. I don't see how it can hurt him.

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Speaker 3: Something that anybody who has an older relative, whether they

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Speaker 3: hear it from the relative or they just are taking

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Speaker 3: care of it relative, you get sticker shock at the

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Speaker 3: prices for some of these strokes, and just putting more

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Speaker 3: money in people's pockets can only help. Thank you so much, Jim,

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Speaker 3: Thank you for having me.

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Speaker 1: Franklin Foer is a writer at the Atlantic an author

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Speaker 1: of the Last Politician, Inside Joe Biden's White House and

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Speaker 1: the Struggle for America's Future.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to Fast Politics.

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Speaker 1: Franklin Foer. He do a great introduction. So it's called

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Speaker 1: The Last Politician, and it's a book.

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Speaker 2: Give us the elevator, pitch go.

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Speaker 5: Joe Biden is somebody who people think of as being

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Speaker 5: as boring as cardboard, and for some strange reason, I

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Speaker 5: think of failing in our media culture, perhaps a failing

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Speaker 5: in Joe Biden's administration's part. His accomplishments and the man

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Speaker 5: himself have not been marketed to the country as the important, consequential,

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Speaker 5: engaging residency that they have been. And this presidency has

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Speaker 5: arguably got more accomplishments on its side of the Ledger

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Speaker 5: than Eddie and recent memory, everything from the vaccine rollout,

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Speaker 5: which everybody seems to forget, to saving the economy from

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Speaker 5: the brink of collapse, to all the pieces of transformational

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Speaker 5: legislation that will cut carbon emissions, that will for American manufacturing,

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Speaker 5: et cetera, et cetera. And some of this has been

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Speaker 5: done without any drama. Like all these events that are

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Speaker 5: usually catacuismic, like a banking crisis or a dead sealing negotiation,

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Speaker 5: he's managed to dispose of without them getting to the break.

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Speaker 5: And so he's actually a totally fascinating. Guy Fox is

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Speaker 5: like created this persona this corpse who is stalking I'm

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Speaker 5: going to get.

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Speaker 1: To the corpse because I want to talk about that

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Speaker 1: right wing depiction of him, because it's super fascinating. But

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Speaker 1: I want to stop first and roll back and talk

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Speaker 1: about the accomplishments piece because that is such a really

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Speaker 1: good point. And I have a lot of people in

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Speaker 1: my life who say things like, Okay, hot take, Joe

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Speaker 1: Biden is the most transformative president of our lifetime. And

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Speaker 1: I was listening this morning to one of my political

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Speaker 1: podcasts and they were talking about the prescription drug pricing situation,

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Speaker 1: which has never happened under any president, and they've been

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Speaker 1: trying to do it since even before Reagan.

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Speaker 2: Just continue down that road.

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Speaker 5: So you take two big buckets of policy. With economic policy,

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Speaker 5: for a couple generations, we've been stuck in a paradigm

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Speaker 5: that Democrats Republicans alike that was kind of skeptical of unions,

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Speaker 5: inclined to give the benefit of the doubt to markets,

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Speaker 5: that was pro globalization. And he's gone this other way

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Speaker 5: where he's given the state this new and totally different

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Speaker 5: and ultimately progressive way of managing the economy, so that

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Speaker 5: the state begins to make these consequential investments in industries

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Speaker 5: that we have deemed to be of national important. So

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Speaker 5: we need semiconductors because they go into everything, and because

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Speaker 5: there's this possibility that China might someday invade Taiwan a

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Speaker 5: realistic possibility, or all the green energy investments because the

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Speaker 5: market is moving in this direction to invest in solar,

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Speaker 5: to invest in when, to invest in electric vehicles, but

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Speaker 5: we're never going to get there in time to satisfy

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Speaker 5: our emissions goals, and so it just needed the government

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Speaker 5: to come in and give the market this huge shove.

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Speaker 5: And the shove has turned out to be so much

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Speaker 5: bigger than anybody expected because when they negotiated the bill

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Speaker 5: with Joe Manchin, they didn't cap the tax credits and subsidies.

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Speaker 5: Mansion was a little bit caught off by this fact

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Speaker 5: and now hates it. But the result is is that

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Speaker 5: when Congress initially said there would be three hundred and

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Speaker 5: seventy billion dollars investment in clean energy, it's going to

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Speaker 5: end up being something closer to one zero point one

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Speaker 5: trillion dollars of investment in clean energy, and it's going

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Speaker 5: to really make the transition happen so much quicker than

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Speaker 5: anybody had anticipated. Or you take foreign policy, and he

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Speaker 5: actually has a grand strategy. You look at something like

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Speaker 5: the Asia Pacific and I know this is like kind

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Speaker 5: of maybe two in the weeds, but when you listen

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Speaker 5: to him describe what he wants to do, it's like, Okay,

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Speaker 5: I'm going to broker a relationship between Korea and South

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Speaker 5: Korea and Japan that they've been fighting for all these

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Speaker 5: decades because we need them.

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Speaker 3: To get along.

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Speaker 5: We're going to create a new military alliance with the

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Speaker 5: Australians in the British. We're going to take Modi, who

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Speaker 5: maybe an odious character, and we're going to woo him

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Speaker 5: so that he flips out of China's camp and he's

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Speaker 5: more neutral and more favorably inclined to us. And he's

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Speaker 5: got a vision for competing with the Belton Road initiative.

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Speaker 5: And when you listen to him talk about this, it's

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Speaker 5: at a level of sophistication that the country doesn't see.

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Speaker 5: It's not something that he really can talk eloquently about,

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Speaker 5: but his path breaking. He's transforming not just American strategy

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Speaker 5: and priorities, but he's actually remaking the geostrategic map.

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Speaker 2: So really interesting.

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Speaker 1: I was thinking about that that meeting and Camp David

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Speaker 1: that Biden recently had with Japan and Korea, which was

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Speaker 1: the first time anyone's been in Camp David, or at

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Speaker 1: least anyone who's not like one of the Trump kids

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Speaker 1: that where they've had foreign leaders there since twenty fifteen.

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Speaker 3: Right.

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Speaker 5: One of the interesting things about Joe Biden as a

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Speaker 5: politician is that he's got a sense of stagecraft, which

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Speaker 5: unfortunately doesn't translate always to his public messaging, but he

439
00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:27,960
Speaker 5: understands the ways when he's dealing with the congressional leader

440
00:22:28,040 --> 00:22:31,399
Speaker 5: or foreign leader, how if he conducts the meeting in

441
00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:33,879
Speaker 5: the rate setting, he can use the majesty of the

442
00:22:33,920 --> 00:22:37,720
Speaker 5: presidency to become this home court advantage. So Camp David's

443
00:22:37,720 --> 00:22:40,320
Speaker 5: a good example of that. Another example of that is

444
00:22:40,520 --> 00:22:43,440
Speaker 5: he took Joe Manchin once to his house in Delaware,

445
00:22:43,480 --> 00:22:45,480
Speaker 5: which he never does. He never takes, but he's a

446
00:22:45,520 --> 00:22:48,440
Speaker 5: super proud guy about his real estate. It's like there's

447
00:22:48,640 --> 00:22:52,159
Speaker 5: a lot of status anxiety and interesting psychological dynamics at

448
00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:52,680
Speaker 5: work there.

449
00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:55,120
Speaker 3: But he cares a lot about his house in Delaware.

450
00:22:55,160 --> 00:22:57,560
Speaker 5: And so when you give somebody the tour of your

451
00:22:57,560 --> 00:23:00,359
Speaker 5: private abode and you haven't done that for anybody else.

452
00:23:00,520 --> 00:23:03,680
Speaker 5: It's a meaningful thing. Or you take the Oval Office itself,

453
00:23:03,760 --> 00:23:06,760
Speaker 5: which with the help of the historian John Meachum, he

454
00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:09,280
Speaker 5: decorated it so that there are all these set pieces

455
00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:12,680
Speaker 5: in the Oval Office from American history that have been

456
00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:16,199
Speaker 5: designed to tell specific stories, Like there's a picture of

457
00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:19,440
Speaker 5: Hamilton next to Jefferson, which he can point to and say,

458
00:23:19,480 --> 00:23:22,040
Speaker 5: you know, we've had all these disagreements in our past

459
00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:24,280
Speaker 5: and we've been able to get by them. You know,

460
00:23:24,320 --> 00:23:27,680
Speaker 5: he's got FDR sitting there across the desk from him,

461
00:23:27,760 --> 00:23:31,119
Speaker 5: and that's there for very specific, maybe obvious, but a

462
00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:34,760
Speaker 5: narrative purpose that he calls on repeatedly. That goes to

463
00:23:34,800 --> 00:23:37,520
Speaker 5: the title of the book, The Last Politician, that all

464
00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:39,320
Speaker 5: these things that we kind of think of is like

465
00:23:39,480 --> 00:23:43,959
Speaker 5: maybe cheesy or antiquated that he engages in and that

466
00:23:44,040 --> 00:23:47,719
Speaker 5: he deploys as tactics are actually at the core of

467
00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:51,760
Speaker 5: his persona and kind of a lost to American art

468
00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:54,600
Speaker 5: and we've lost faith in it as a people. And

469
00:23:54,680 --> 00:23:57,840
Speaker 5: his thesis is that he can prove that politics is

470
00:23:57,880 --> 00:24:01,719
Speaker 5: still an effective way of get people who disagree with

471
00:24:01,760 --> 00:24:04,640
Speaker 5: one another vociferously to coexist in this nation.

472
00:24:04,840 --> 00:24:08,199
Speaker 1: Right, I mean, and if he can't, we're all completely fucked.

473
00:24:08,359 --> 00:24:11,120
Speaker 1: But I do think that's a really good point. I mean,

474
00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:15,320
Speaker 1: you hear that from the Biden administration all the time,

475
00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:19,280
Speaker 1: like Trump got so much credit and hopefully doesn't again,

476
00:24:19,560 --> 00:24:23,120
Speaker 1: got so much credit for things like declaring it Infrastructure Week,

477
00:24:23,160 --> 00:24:27,160
Speaker 1: but then not ever passing any infrastructure, whereas Biden has gone.

478
00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:31,160
Speaker 1: I mean, I feel like Chips is an amazing piece

479
00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:35,320
Speaker 1: of legislation, and then the prescription drugs which is part

480
00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:40,080
Speaker 1: of this larger climate package, And then can we talk

481
00:24:40,119 --> 00:24:42,680
Speaker 1: about the trains? Is that okay? Is that too weird?

482
00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:43,880
Speaker 3: We can talk about trains.

483
00:24:44,160 --> 00:24:46,560
Speaker 5: Joe Biden would probably tune into this podcast as a

484
00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:49,320
Speaker 5: train fanatic himself if we talk about trains. But one

485
00:24:49,320 --> 00:24:53,040
Speaker 5: thing that's super interesting to me about the way that

486
00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:57,240
Speaker 5: they think about the legislative accomplishments that they don't talk

487
00:24:57,280 --> 00:25:01,000
Speaker 5: about is that the Chips Bill, the infrastructure Bill, the

488
00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:05,520
Speaker 5: Clean Energy Bill all interact because they've made them interact.

489
00:25:05,600 --> 00:25:07,520
Speaker 5: So you have people in the White House who are

490
00:25:07,520 --> 00:25:11,960
Speaker 5: in charge of implementation and coordinating the spending of all

491
00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:15,239
Speaker 5: of these trillions of dollars, and the idea is you

492
00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:18,560
Speaker 5: can take a place and you can transform it, whether

493
00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:22,159
Speaker 5: it is someplace in upstate New York that's struggling that

494
00:25:22,240 --> 00:25:26,680
Speaker 5: you can suddenly get broadband piped into in subsidized ways

495
00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:31,480
Speaker 5: via the Infrastructure Bill, that suddenly will have a solar

496
00:25:31,600 --> 00:25:35,119
Speaker 5: factory in there, and then other spending on other parts

497
00:25:35,119 --> 00:25:37,919
Speaker 5: of the supply chain for that that are embedded in

498
00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:41,800
Speaker 5: other pieces of legislation, and it has the possibility of

499
00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:45,639
Speaker 5: actually transforming the political geography of this country in a

500
00:25:45,680 --> 00:25:48,639
Speaker 5: totally interesting sort of way. Because you build a plant

501
00:25:48,680 --> 00:25:51,480
Speaker 5: in Georgia, which they've built a lot of, like in fact,

502
00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:54,160
Speaker 5: they've built one of a solar plant is getting built

503
00:25:54,160 --> 00:25:58,639
Speaker 5: in Marjorie Tailer Greens District, or you build one in Phoenix.

504
00:25:59,280 --> 00:26:03,480
Speaker 5: You don't just have have manufacturing jobs coming into those places,

505
00:26:03,520 --> 00:26:07,280
Speaker 5: but you also have a lot of engineers and managers

506
00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:10,399
Speaker 5: and kind of white collar workers who were college educated

507
00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:13,840
Speaker 5: white collar workers who were migrating to those places in

508
00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:18,080
Speaker 5: order to take those specialized jobs. And it's going to

509
00:26:18,160 --> 00:26:21,320
Speaker 5: have a political effect where maybe to some extent, workers

510
00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:24,280
Speaker 5: kind of appreciate the role that the Biden administration played

511
00:26:24,320 --> 00:26:26,879
Speaker 5: in the creation of these centers. But you also, just

512
00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:28,800
Speaker 5: as like a matter of math, you have people who

513
00:26:29,040 --> 00:26:32,560
Speaker 5: tend to be Democratic voters having to move to work

514
00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:36,400
Speaker 5: in these jobs, and in a tightly divided electorate, if

515
00:26:36,440 --> 00:26:40,480
Speaker 5: you have five ten thousand workers moved to Phoenix or

516
00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:45,040
Speaker 5: to the excerbs of Atlanta, that could make a difference

517
00:26:45,080 --> 00:26:46,119
Speaker 5: in a tight election.

518
00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:49,680
Speaker 1: Speaking of that, one of the situations here with the

519
00:26:50,200 --> 00:26:54,520
Speaker 1: prescription drug So this prescription drug negotiation, which I think

520
00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:57,680
Speaker 1: is actually quite quite a big deal, right. I mean

521
00:26:57,880 --> 00:27:00,960
Speaker 1: it's funny because I actually was listening to NPR podcast

522
00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:03,360
Speaker 1: and they were talking about like how no president has

523
00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:06,080
Speaker 1: done it, it's so amazing. And then they were like,

524
00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:08,960
Speaker 1: but could this fail? If this fails, could that be

525
00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:12,000
Speaker 1: bad for Joe Biden? And I was like, Jesus Christ,

526
00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:15,960
Speaker 1: you guys, but I want to ask you a we

527
00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:18,919
Speaker 1: are a country where we are just at the mercy

528
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:22,040
Speaker 1: of prescription drug pricing. I mean, a great example is

529
00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:25,600
Speaker 1: Joe Manchin's daughter who was involved in this EpiPen. I mean,

530
00:27:25,680 --> 00:27:29,280
Speaker 1: I have a kid who has anaphylactic food allergies. Yeah,

531
00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:32,920
Speaker 1: and so like I remember, we went from like these

532
00:27:32,960 --> 00:27:36,520
Speaker 1: EpiPens are twenty bucks to these EpiPens are one hundred

533
00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:41,000
Speaker 1: and thirty dollars and you know they expire. They're not forever,

534
00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:43,160
Speaker 1: you know, they're for three years or something or maybe

535
00:27:43,280 --> 00:27:46,439
Speaker 1: less of my existence. Yeah, I could probably do a

536
00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:48,399
Speaker 1: fact check on that, and you cannot. You know, if

537
00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:50,560
Speaker 1: you have a kid with anaphylactic food allergies and I've

538
00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:52,880
Speaker 1: given an EpiPen a bunch of times, like they can't

539
00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:55,360
Speaker 1: go out of the house without it, they can die.

540
00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:57,719
Speaker 1: And so I mean, we really are at the mercy

541
00:27:57,840 --> 00:27:59,960
Speaker 1: of our drug companies for pricing, and that I think

542
00:28:00,119 --> 00:28:03,600
Speaker 1: is a really good example. But with this negotiation, it

543
00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:07,360
Speaker 1: might actually have Biden do better with older voters if

544
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:10,360
Speaker 1: they if somehow Trump can't claim credit for it.

545
00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:13,960
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, absolutely, And just to step back, I mean,

546
00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:18,080
Speaker 5: I think you were talking about the administration the NPR podcast,

547
00:28:18,200 --> 00:28:22,200
Speaker 5: where the administration's accomplishment was maybe being compouter. There was

548
00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:24,439
Speaker 5: this skepticism in it. And I think that there's a

549
00:28:24,520 --> 00:28:28,399
Speaker 5: really interesting dynamic at play with the press as it

550
00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:32,720
Speaker 5: relates to Biden, which is press went so all in

551
00:28:32,920 --> 00:28:36,280
Speaker 5: on opposing Trump, yet we're kind of still stuck within

552
00:28:36,320 --> 00:28:39,880
Speaker 5: the structures of objectivity, and so I think there's almost

553
00:28:39,880 --> 00:28:45,080
Speaker 5: this subconscious desire to treat Biden with like some of

554
00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:48,600
Speaker 5: the same sorts of skepticism or the same kind of

555
00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:51,160
Speaker 5: even at the Ledger, in some sort of way to

556
00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:55,640
Speaker 5: preserve authority and credibility. And it's a conscients solving thing.

557
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:58,200
Speaker 5: But sometimes I think that the press maybe has gone

558
00:28:58,320 --> 00:29:01,920
Speaker 5: overboard and self correct there, and that there's this kind

559
00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:06,960
Speaker 5: of tendency to downplay or deny accomplishments that I think

560
00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:09,280
Speaker 5: comes out of something that has nothing to do with Biden,

561
00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:12,160
Speaker 5: but that has everything to do with the psychodrama of

562
00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:14,160
Speaker 5: the last decade.

563
00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:17,160
Speaker 1: Right, No, for sure, And I think it really is

564
00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:21,040
Speaker 1: these institutions like the press and the federal government. I'm

565
00:29:21,120 --> 00:29:24,440
Speaker 1: thinking about, you know that Heritage News story about how

566
00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:27,800
Speaker 1: Heritage has a plan for if they can get Trump reelected,

567
00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:32,080
Speaker 1: which would involve basically just completely dismantling the federal government as.

568
00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:32,480
Speaker 2: We know it.

569
00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:36,400
Speaker 1: And there is a feeling that these institutions have been

570
00:29:36,440 --> 00:29:40,280
Speaker 1: through so much that they are forever changed.

571
00:29:40,280 --> 00:29:41,400
Speaker 4: Right exactly.

572
00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:44,480
Speaker 5: And so what's so interesting about this is Biden is

573
00:29:44,520 --> 00:29:47,200
Speaker 5: kind of an institutionalist to his core. I mean, he

574
00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:50,000
Speaker 5: was this guy who served in the Senate forever and ever.

575
00:29:50,520 --> 00:29:55,120
Speaker 5: He's got faith in institutions that comes from another generation.

576
00:29:55,800 --> 00:29:58,360
Speaker 5: And you know, on the one hand, it's hard not

577
00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:02,040
Speaker 5: to see the shortcomings in that analysis when you have

578
00:30:02,520 --> 00:30:05,520
Speaker 5: the heritage. Fedition is Trump bes kind of bent on

579
00:30:06,400 --> 00:30:11,040
Speaker 5: just shredding these institutions and politicizing them, and so the

580
00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:14,040
Speaker 5: natural response is to say, well, the only way to

581
00:30:14,080 --> 00:30:18,200
Speaker 5: fight fires with fire and to politicize the institutions for ourselves.

582
00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:23,719
Speaker 5: I think in Biden's view, protecting and preserving institutions means

583
00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:27,320
Speaker 5: that you're protecting and preserving this buffer the next time

584
00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:30,680
Speaker 5: the authoritarian comes to power, and so you have to

585
00:30:30,760 --> 00:30:34,240
Speaker 5: steward them as well as you can to the next time,

586
00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:38,120
Speaker 5: so that the Justice Department, civil service feels like they

587
00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:41,160
Speaker 5: can resist some of the worst orders that will come

588
00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:45,760
Speaker 5: their way. There is probably some naivete to that worldview.

589
00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:47,600
Speaker 5: I've thought about this as long in our and I

590
00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:50,959
Speaker 5: can't really come up with a much better alternative to

591
00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:52,960
Speaker 5: that other than the one, which is to just kind

592
00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:55,680
Speaker 5: of throw up your arms and say, like, it's all politics.

593
00:30:56,200 --> 00:31:00,240
Speaker 5: Our institutions shouldn't be neutral, they should just be ours

594
00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:02,840
Speaker 5: of the state. But I think that that's a far

595
00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:06,200
Speaker 5: more dangerous set of circumstances.

596
00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:09,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, you have this problem of Democrats coming back into

597
00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:15,920
Speaker 1: power after an authoritarian and trying to get us back

598
00:31:15,960 --> 00:31:19,440
Speaker 1: to normal. I think that's been a real problem. And

599
00:31:19,560 --> 00:31:21,320
Speaker 1: I think one of the things that I've been really

600
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:25,200
Speaker 1: interested in is we've seen the right wing media and

601
00:31:25,320 --> 00:31:29,720
Speaker 1: so they message about Biden the same way the mainstream

602
00:31:29,800 --> 00:31:33,800
Speaker 1: media messaged about Trump. Right So they say Biden is

603
00:31:33,840 --> 00:31:38,040
Speaker 1: an authoritarian, Biden is a dictator, Biden is just throwing norms,

604
00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:41,200
Speaker 1: which is not true on the face of it, but

605
00:31:41,680 --> 00:31:45,280
Speaker 1: I think it has been very powerful for in this

606
00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:47,000
Speaker 1: right wing media eco chamber.

607
00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:49,920
Speaker 5: Oh my god, I've just been dealing with this. So

608
00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:53,320
Speaker 5: when we're talking today, my book has yet to come out.

609
00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:57,520
Speaker 5: It was embargo until next Tuesday, and some guy at

610
00:31:57,520 --> 00:31:59,360
Speaker 5: The Guardian managed to get a hold of a copy

611
00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:00,440
Speaker 5: of my book game store.

612
00:32:01,040 --> 00:32:02,160
Speaker 2: I know that guy.

613
00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:05,720
Speaker 5: Okay, Martin Martin, I'm not speaking ill. Martin Martin is

614
00:32:05,760 --> 00:32:11,680
Speaker 5: a very industrious reporter. Martin found one line in the

615
00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:14,840
Speaker 5: end of my book where I'm talking about Joe Biden's age,

616
00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:19,560
Speaker 5: and I mentioned that Joe Biden on occasion would say

617
00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:22,320
Speaker 5: that he felt tired, like as I'm sure you do

618
00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:25,000
Speaker 5: about five times a day, as we all do like,

619
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:28,440
Speaker 5: if that's the worst man about Joe Biden's age, then like,

620
00:32:28,520 --> 00:32:30,600
Speaker 5: you know, God bless. But then the next thing, you know,

621
00:32:30,800 --> 00:32:33,920
Speaker 5: it's like, you know, five shows on Fox take this

622
00:32:34,040 --> 00:32:39,520
Speaker 5: little chard of truth and then inflated into this absurd

623
00:32:39,560 --> 00:32:43,080
Speaker 5: story that they twist into the demagogically to serve their

624
00:32:43,160 --> 00:32:48,200
Speaker 5: narrative purposes. This guy, Jess Waters, did something hilarious yesterday.

625
00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:51,040
Speaker 5: Kind of scary, but it's like it's hilarious. He took

626
00:32:51,080 --> 00:32:54,880
Speaker 5: my excerpt about Afghanistan and I had an anecdote. Well,

627
00:32:55,040 --> 00:32:58,920
Speaker 5: he starts ranting about how I had reported that Joe

628
00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:01,720
Speaker 5: Biden wanted to build parking lots and cobble in the

629
00:33:01,760 --> 00:33:05,160
Speaker 5: middle of the withdrawal crisis, and he starts laughing about

630
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:08,400
Speaker 5: it and how absurd this idea is and how all

631
00:33:08,440 --> 00:33:12,080
Speaker 5: of Biden's age were mocking him for his declining mental acuity,

632
00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:15,200
Speaker 5: when in fact, what I wrote was Biden, who threw

633
00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:18,600
Speaker 5: himself into the details of the Afghan crisis, was studying

634
00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:21,360
Speaker 5: maps of Kabble and he pointed out a parking lot

635
00:33:21,440 --> 00:33:23,280
Speaker 5: where he said it might be a convenient place for

636
00:33:23,360 --> 00:33:26,720
Speaker 5: refugees to gather so that they could be militarily escortated

637
00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:29,440
Speaker 5: to the airport, and Waters is like going on and

638
00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:33,400
Speaker 5: on about this terrible misreading of my piece. That's like

639
00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:37,160
Speaker 5: probably a willful misreading or he just doesn't actually care.

640
00:33:37,560 --> 00:33:41,160
Speaker 2: In Jesse waters defense, it is possible that he can't read.

641
00:33:41,200 --> 00:33:43,840
Speaker 5: Yes, yes, well, which is the perfect reason to give

642
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:44,840
Speaker 5: him a prime time show.

643
00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:48,000
Speaker 1: Right, well, it is the perfect reason to give him

644
00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:49,719
Speaker 1: a prime time show on Fox.

645
00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:53,320
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, Franklin, I hope you will come back.

646
00:33:53,520 --> 00:33:55,360
Speaker 3: It would be my immense pleasure.

647
00:33:55,480 --> 00:33:55,840
Speaker 6: Thank you.

648
00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:02,280
Speaker 1: Hanna Fried is a quote rights attorney and executive director

649
00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:03,560
Speaker 1: of All Voting is Local.

650
00:34:04,240 --> 00:34:08,520
Speaker 2: Welcome to Fast Politics.

651
00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:10,640
Speaker 4: Hannah, thank you. Fun to be here.

652
00:34:10,920 --> 00:34:13,200
Speaker 2: Well, it hasn't happened yet. Let's see.

653
00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:15,719
Speaker 4: It's a bud life.

654
00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:16,879
Speaker 2: That's right.

655
00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:20,400
Speaker 1: First, let's start with what your organization is and what

656
00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:20,839
Speaker 1: it does.

657
00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:26,120
Speaker 4: Sure All the Any Local is a non partisan, multi

658
00:34:26,160 --> 00:34:29,120
Speaker 4: state voting rights organization, and the work that we do

659
00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:34,960
Speaker 4: Probalyground and eight States focuses on the power that state

660
00:34:35,040 --> 00:34:39,799
Speaker 4: and particularly local election officials have over the right and

661
00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:43,400
Speaker 4: ability of people to register to guest a ballot and

662
00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:46,040
Speaker 4: to cast a ballot that's going to get counted. And

663
00:34:46,440 --> 00:34:49,840
Speaker 4: we work especially in communities of color communities that have

664
00:34:49,920 --> 00:34:54,759
Speaker 4: been long disenfranchised, and we advocate, We say, you have

665
00:34:54,800 --> 00:34:56,719
Speaker 4: to run your elections in a way that makes it

666
00:34:56,760 --> 00:34:59,640
Speaker 4: easier for people to vote. Have processed these rules systems

667
00:34:59,680 --> 00:35:01,799
Speaker 4: and are more fair. And that's the work that we do.

668
00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:04,560
Speaker 4: We've been doing it for about five years and it

669
00:35:04,600 --> 00:35:07,640
Speaker 4: is a really it is an exciting and interesting time

670
00:35:07,680 --> 00:35:08,560
Speaker 4: to be doing this work.

671
00:35:08,719 --> 00:35:12,120
Speaker 1: Give us an example of a community where you have

672
00:35:12,239 --> 00:35:15,680
Speaker 1: helped voters get enfranchised and how you've done it.

673
00:35:15,840 --> 00:35:18,799
Speaker 4: Yeah, I can give some examples from this past month.

674
00:35:18,880 --> 00:35:22,960
Speaker 4: We have long advocated in Florida, in Duval County, which

675
00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:24,279
Speaker 4: is the county in the north part of the state,

676
00:35:24,440 --> 00:35:28,960
Speaker 4: for voters to have more access to in person early voting.

677
00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:31,719
Speaker 4: Early voting has been really popular in Florida for a

678
00:35:31,719 --> 00:35:35,440
Speaker 4: long long time, particularly popular among black voters. And we

679
00:35:35,480 --> 00:35:39,320
Speaker 4: want to make sure that when election officials are selecting

680
00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:42,240
Speaker 4: their early voting locations that they're putting them in places

681
00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:44,399
Speaker 4: that people can actually get to. Can people get there

682
00:35:44,400 --> 00:35:47,960
Speaker 4: easily on foot? Can they get there easily through public transportation?

683
00:35:48,320 --> 00:35:51,080
Speaker 4: Are these locations near to where people work or go

684
00:35:51,120 --> 00:35:54,799
Speaker 4: to school? And one great piece of news from just

685
00:35:55,160 --> 00:35:58,040
Speaker 4: the last couple of weeks has been that the Supervisor

686
00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:00,360
Speaker 4: of Elections, the top elections of the Shore Douvall County,

687
00:36:00,400 --> 00:36:02,480
Speaker 4: has just announced that they're going to open five more

688
00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:05,800
Speaker 4: early voting sites, including one on the campus of Edward

689
00:36:05,800 --> 00:36:09,360
Speaker 4: Waters University, which is a historically black college. They're in

690
00:36:09,440 --> 00:36:12,480
Speaker 4: Duval County, and this matters because we know when people

691
00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:15,200
Speaker 4: can get easily to their polling place, they are more

692
00:36:15,360 --> 00:36:19,080
Speaker 4: likely to build. And so we are delighted, particularly for

693
00:36:19,320 --> 00:36:22,239
Speaker 4: the black community in Duval County, particularly for the students

694
00:36:22,360 --> 00:36:26,240
Speaker 4: at and Waters, to have once again access to voting

695
00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:27,680
Speaker 4: in a way that makes sense for them.

696
00:36:27,840 --> 00:36:28,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, that sounds great.

697
00:36:28,960 --> 00:36:33,880
Speaker 1: And again we've seen a lot of times Republicans have

698
00:36:34,960 --> 00:36:43,720
Speaker 1: been really against college kids voting. I can't imagine why.

699
00:36:44,680 --> 00:36:47,239
Speaker 4: But that said, you know, I take the point of

700
00:36:47,239 --> 00:36:49,600
Speaker 4: your question about you know, there is certainly a lot

701
00:36:49,640 --> 00:36:52,319
Speaker 4: of energy of say in the states where we work,

702
00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:55,200
Speaker 4: there's energy on the part of students, but there's also

703
00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:58,759
Speaker 4: energy on the fire folks who want to pass laws

704
00:36:58,840 --> 00:37:02,239
Speaker 4: and make it harder for people to vote. I mean,

705
00:37:02,880 --> 00:37:08,080
Speaker 4: state legislators have passed or tried to pass record numbers

706
00:37:08,120 --> 00:37:11,360
Speaker 4: of anti voter laws across the country. Last count I

707
00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:13,920
Speaker 4: saw was north of three hundred laws that have been introduced, right,

708
00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:16,799
Speaker 4: that make it harder for people to register, that make

709
00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:19,600
Speaker 4: it harder for groups that do vote registration drives. That's

710
00:37:19,600 --> 00:37:21,840
Speaker 4: actually along on the topic of Florida top of minds

711
00:37:22,040 --> 00:37:25,600
Speaker 4: that they faced a hurricane just recently. Right, state legislature

712
00:37:25,840 --> 00:37:28,680
Speaker 4: just passed a law earlier this year that would have

713
00:37:29,040 --> 00:37:34,520
Speaker 4: issued multiple fifty thousand dollars fines to voter registration organizations.

714
00:37:34,520 --> 00:37:37,640
Speaker 4: I mean, that is devastating to an organization that's trying

715
00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:40,560
Speaker 4: to register voters in communities of color, particularly which is

716
00:37:40,560 --> 00:37:42,880
Speaker 4: where a lot of voter registration drives are doing their

717
00:37:42,920 --> 00:37:46,319
Speaker 4: work to try and make up for historical gaps in

718
00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:50,200
Speaker 4: registration among black voters Latino voters. And you know that's

719
00:37:50,280 --> 00:37:52,480
Speaker 4: just registration, right. I mean, there have been efforts in

720
00:37:52,560 --> 00:37:56,680
Speaker 4: Georgia to get rid of every single ballot dropbox. Why

721
00:37:56,719 --> 00:37:59,720
Speaker 4: would you do that, right, Voters showed up in twenty twenty.

722
00:38:00,120 --> 00:38:02,600
Speaker 4: They love to have options for voting.

723
00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:02,839
Speaker 1: Right.

724
00:38:02,920 --> 00:38:04,719
Speaker 4: That was true in the pandemic. But it's not just

725
00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:07,799
Speaker 4: about that. So without question, there is a ton of

726
00:38:07,880 --> 00:38:11,160
Speaker 4: momentum right now on the part of folks who want

727
00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:15,120
Speaker 4: to stop voters from voting and stop their votes from county.

728
00:38:15,560 --> 00:38:19,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is such an incredible bumber.

729
00:38:21,640 --> 00:38:24,840
Speaker 2: It is the goal here is to get people to vote.

730
00:38:24,880 --> 00:38:29,640
Speaker 1: So let's talk about this fake electors scheme implicating a

731
00:38:30,239 --> 00:38:33,759
Speaker 1: sitting state senator. Yeah, I would love you to, like

732
00:38:34,200 --> 00:38:36,719
Speaker 1: just give us the TLDR on this, even though I

733
00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:38,960
Speaker 1: know it some of our listeners might not.

734
00:38:39,280 --> 00:38:41,080
Speaker 2: And then what you're doing there.

735
00:38:41,040 --> 00:38:44,000
Speaker 4: In Georgia, in Michigan and a bunch of other plaphans,

736
00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:47,280
Speaker 4: they know that there were activities around the twenty twenty election,

737
00:38:47,600 --> 00:38:49,600
Speaker 4: and there are now charges being brown a couple of

738
00:38:49,600 --> 00:38:52,800
Speaker 4: these states against people who allegedly served as fake electors.

739
00:38:52,840 --> 00:38:55,760
Speaker 4: These are people who were put forward as a false

740
00:38:56,080 --> 00:38:59,600
Speaker 4: flight of electors to elect somebody who had not actually

741
00:38:59,600 --> 00:39:03,920
Speaker 4: been elected by the people of fair state. And there

742
00:39:03,920 --> 00:39:08,080
Speaker 4: are charges being brought against them in Michigan and in Georgia,

743
00:39:08,120 --> 00:39:12,319
Speaker 4: including a sitting state senator. And there are sitting officials

744
00:39:12,360 --> 00:39:16,799
Speaker 4: in Michigan also mayor member of a city council. I

745
00:39:16,880 --> 00:39:20,120
Speaker 4: believe we're not fans of that. If I've heard people say,

746
00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:22,480
Speaker 4: you know, if you're going to be a firefighter, you

747
00:39:22,520 --> 00:39:25,359
Speaker 4: should not be trying to set things on fire. And

748
00:39:25,440 --> 00:39:29,080
Speaker 4: I think same can be said here about public officials.

749
00:39:29,120 --> 00:39:32,600
Speaker 4: Election officials certainly should not be people who've also served

750
00:39:32,600 --> 00:39:35,239
Speaker 4: as fake electors. Public officials, whether it's the mayor, a

751
00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:38,560
Speaker 4: member of a city council, a sitting state senator, these

752
00:39:38,600 --> 00:39:43,240
Speaker 4: are people who have demonstrated that they do not believe

753
00:39:43,440 --> 00:39:46,120
Speaker 4: in the fair systems of elections that we have in

754
00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:48,920
Speaker 4: this country. These democratic values, and I use that with

755
00:39:49,040 --> 00:39:51,279
Speaker 4: a very small d these are the systems that we

756
00:39:51,320 --> 00:39:53,319
Speaker 4: have in place. These are how people get elected in

757
00:39:53,320 --> 00:39:55,800
Speaker 4: this country. And I think at a bare minimum, we

758
00:39:55,840 --> 00:39:57,680
Speaker 4: should all be able to have faith in our public

759
00:39:57,680 --> 00:40:02,480
Speaker 4: officials that they are going to uphold the norms and

760
00:40:02,560 --> 00:40:05,920
Speaker 4: democratic values of this country and the laws of this country, right.

761
00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:07,680
Speaker 4: I mean, the allegations here are that these folks have

762
00:40:07,719 --> 00:40:08,759
Speaker 4: actually broken the law.

763
00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:15,280
Speaker 1: I think so much about how during that twenty twenty

764
00:40:15,320 --> 00:40:18,680
Speaker 1: election there was so much pressure on secretaries of state

765
00:40:18,800 --> 00:40:21,799
Speaker 1: from MAGA world to do the wrong thing.

766
00:40:22,120 --> 00:40:24,160
Speaker 2: And I really did think.

767
00:40:23,840 --> 00:40:28,520
Speaker 1: If Carrie Lake were elected governor of Arizona or some

768
00:40:28,640 --> 00:40:32,799
Speaker 1: of these swing state governors were put in there, that

769
00:40:32,920 --> 00:40:36,200
Speaker 1: we really could see refusals to certify.

770
00:40:36,520 --> 00:40:39,640
Speaker 4: We have seen refusals to certify. I mean in twenty

771
00:40:39,719 --> 00:40:43,640
Speaker 4: twenty two, there was a county in Pennsylvania, Luzern County

772
00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:48,480
Speaker 4: that did not certify. In Arizona, Coachees County officials tried

773
00:40:48,520 --> 00:40:52,440
Speaker 4: to delay certification through a last minute change to process

774
00:40:52,440 --> 00:40:54,879
Speaker 4: of hand counting every single ballot. And you know, look,

775
00:40:54,920 --> 00:40:58,600
Speaker 4: I mean don't want to terrify anyone, but it doesn't

776
00:40:58,640 --> 00:41:02,200
Speaker 4: take a lot gum up the works on this front. Right, Like,

777
00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:05,000
Speaker 4: you can have a county, couple of county officials who

778
00:41:05,000 --> 00:41:07,920
Speaker 4: can cause a lot of trouble by refusing to follow

779
00:41:07,920 --> 00:41:11,600
Speaker 4: the law and follow their obligations to the voters that

780
00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:14,239
Speaker 4: they're supposed to serve. So that threat is real.

781
00:41:14,520 --> 00:41:18,160
Speaker 1: So let's talk about these anti voter tactics and how

782
00:41:18,680 --> 00:41:22,640
Speaker 1: we certainly seen a number of times people on the

783
00:41:22,719 --> 00:41:27,399
Speaker 1: right wing media spreading conspiracies about votes coming from Hong

784
00:41:27,560 --> 00:41:32,520
Speaker 1: Kong and Ruby freedmen having a hard drive which turned

785
00:41:32,560 --> 00:41:35,200
Speaker 1: out to be a ginger mint, and this sort of

786
00:41:35,400 --> 00:41:39,520
Speaker 1: want for a handcount of ballots and dealing certification.

787
00:41:39,840 --> 00:41:40,759
Speaker 2: Let's talk about that.

788
00:41:41,200 --> 00:41:45,719
Speaker 4: Yeah, let's where even to a start. So I think, well,

789
00:41:46,520 --> 00:41:49,520
Speaker 4: perhaps the place to start is the sort of underlying

790
00:41:49,640 --> 00:41:53,720
Speaker 4: theme that connects all this stuff which is taking power

791
00:41:53,800 --> 00:41:57,640
Speaker 4: from the people, taking power from voters. That is the

792
00:41:58,320 --> 00:42:02,600
Speaker 4: sort of unifying thread among all these efforts is that

793
00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:05,840
Speaker 4: some people want to grab power and they will do

794
00:42:05,920 --> 00:42:10,000
Speaker 4: it at any cost. And you know, whether it is

795
00:42:10,120 --> 00:42:14,520
Speaker 4: the intimidation and threats made against election workers that you

796
00:42:14,680 --> 00:42:19,120
Speaker 4: just referenced, right, whether it is you know, storming the

797
00:42:19,160 --> 00:42:22,440
Speaker 4: capital on January sixth, right, it all comes down to

798
00:42:22,480 --> 00:42:24,759
Speaker 4: the very same thing, which is that the people get

799
00:42:24,800 --> 00:42:28,080
Speaker 4: to vote and they get to decide they're elected officials

800
00:42:28,160 --> 00:42:30,040
Speaker 4: and not the other way around. And there are some

801
00:42:30,080 --> 00:42:33,560
Speaker 4: people who just cannot abide that, they will not accept

802
00:42:33,560 --> 00:42:35,399
Speaker 4: that that is the way this country works. And I'll

803
00:42:35,440 --> 00:42:37,560
Speaker 4: say two, Look, I mean we started all voting as

804
00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:42,719
Speaker 4: local five years ago, where what we still this organization

805
00:42:42,920 --> 00:42:47,239
Speaker 4: to do was to fight against voter suppression. And people

806
00:42:47,280 --> 00:42:49,080
Speaker 4: ask me a lot. You know, you've been doing this

807
00:42:49,080 --> 00:42:50,759
Speaker 4: work for a long time, off and on for about

808
00:42:50,800 --> 00:42:53,400
Speaker 4: fifteen years. House things in the wall, and they have,

809
00:42:53,840 --> 00:42:56,160
Speaker 4: without question, right, the threats that we're talking about right now,

810
00:42:56,520 --> 00:42:58,440
Speaker 4: refusal the sort of by election results. You and I

811
00:42:58,440 --> 00:43:00,799
Speaker 4: would not have been having this conversation you years ago,

812
00:43:00,880 --> 00:43:03,560
Speaker 4: well a few years ago actually now, but five years ago, no, right,

813
00:43:03,680 --> 00:43:06,719
Speaker 4: not you know, just no voter suppression comes from the

814
00:43:06,800 --> 00:43:10,640
Speaker 4: same place. It's the same impulse. Right, It's all about

815
00:43:10,719 --> 00:43:13,399
Speaker 4: taking power from the people. It's just dressed up differently. Right.

816
00:43:13,640 --> 00:43:17,399
Speaker 4: You've goss the strict photo ID law, you cut early voting, right,

817
00:43:17,520 --> 00:43:20,320
Speaker 4: you put polling locations away from public transit.

818
00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:20,960
Speaker 3: Right.

819
00:43:21,160 --> 00:43:23,560
Speaker 4: Why are you doing those things? Right? Why are you

820
00:43:23,640 --> 00:43:26,440
Speaker 4: passing those laws? Why are you making those policies? It

821
00:43:26,520 --> 00:43:28,880
Speaker 4: is because people want to use the systems we have

822
00:43:29,320 --> 00:43:31,640
Speaker 4: to their own advantage, to the advantage of you know,

823
00:43:32,120 --> 00:43:35,279
Speaker 4: the political party or the candidate that they want to win.

824
00:43:35,400 --> 00:43:37,640
Speaker 4: They want power for themselves, and they will use what

825
00:43:37,680 --> 00:43:39,680
Speaker 4: they can to get it done. And just so happens

826
00:43:39,680 --> 00:43:41,560
Speaker 4: that right now, we're in a moment where one of

827
00:43:41,600 --> 00:43:44,239
Speaker 4: the tools some folks are using to achieve that end

828
00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:48,440
Speaker 4: is questioning our election results, lying about our election results,

829
00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:52,759
Speaker 4: and building as we're learning, whole conspiracies around that.

830
00:43:53,400 --> 00:43:55,960
Speaker 2: Very idea. So interesting.

831
00:43:56,360 --> 00:44:00,560
Speaker 1: I'm a listener here, I'm listening to you. I want

832
00:44:00,719 --> 00:44:05,760
Speaker 1: to help people to vote. I want how can people

833
00:44:05,840 --> 00:44:06,720
Speaker 1: support you guys?

834
00:44:07,239 --> 00:44:07,799
Speaker 3: Oh?

835
00:44:08,120 --> 00:44:11,560
Speaker 4: Really a lovely question. And I although I feel I

836
00:44:11,600 --> 00:44:13,960
Speaker 4: haven't been going pretty dark, there actually is a lot

837
00:44:14,080 --> 00:44:15,080
Speaker 4: to be done right.

838
00:44:15,400 --> 00:44:18,319
Speaker 1: Well, that's why I wanted to pull back and talk

839
00:44:18,360 --> 00:44:18,839
Speaker 1: about that.

840
00:44:19,040 --> 00:44:19,279
Speaker 2: Yes.

841
00:44:19,560 --> 00:44:23,000
Speaker 4: Yeah, so one thing that people can do if they

842
00:44:23,040 --> 00:44:25,720
Speaker 4: really want to help voters is become a poll worker.

843
00:44:26,040 --> 00:44:29,000
Speaker 4: I really mean that, that is a real that question.

844
00:44:29,640 --> 00:44:33,520
Speaker 4: We know that there are shortages of the people who

845
00:44:33,520 --> 00:44:35,880
Speaker 4: make our polling places run. Right. A poll worker is

846
00:44:35,920 --> 00:44:37,880
Speaker 4: the person who you know all of us have probably

847
00:44:37,880 --> 00:44:39,359
Speaker 4: at one time or another voted in person.

848
00:44:39,440 --> 00:44:39,560
Speaker 3: Right.

849
00:44:39,600 --> 00:44:41,799
Speaker 4: That's the person who greets you, the person who gives

850
00:44:41,840 --> 00:44:44,239
Speaker 4: you your ballot. Right. If the person who helps you

851
00:44:44,320 --> 00:44:46,840
Speaker 4: if you have a question, you didn't bring the idea

852
00:44:46,880 --> 00:44:48,680
Speaker 4: you needed, They're going to help you figure out what

853
00:44:48,719 --> 00:44:55,600
Speaker 4: your options are. They are the essential backbone of our democracy.

854
00:44:55,640 --> 00:44:57,480
Speaker 4: And that is not lip service. If we do not

855
00:44:57,560 --> 00:44:59,719
Speaker 4: have pull workers, our democracy doesn't function. And this was

856
00:44:59,719 --> 00:45:02,719
Speaker 4: a cour a huge concern in twenty twenty because of

857
00:45:02,760 --> 00:45:07,799
Speaker 4: the pandemic. But pollworker shortages have always impacted particular communities

858
00:45:08,080 --> 00:45:12,640
Speaker 4: that generally deal with underresourcing around elections. And so if

859
00:45:12,880 --> 00:45:15,120
Speaker 4: as a you know, on election day, I'm usually pretty

860
00:45:15,120 --> 00:45:16,920
Speaker 4: goodgee because I do mooting rights work. If that's a

861
00:45:16,920 --> 00:45:19,080
Speaker 4: big day for our you know the work of organizations

862
00:45:19,120 --> 00:45:21,239
Speaker 4: like mine. But if I were not doing that, I

863
00:45:21,239 --> 00:45:23,480
Speaker 4: would become a pullworker. That is number one. I think

864
00:45:23,719 --> 00:45:27,480
Speaker 4: the second thing is that I mean, you know, probably

865
00:45:27,520 --> 00:45:32,880
Speaker 4: your listeners are hearing or aware of really entrenched problems

866
00:45:32,880 --> 00:45:35,160
Speaker 4: of disinformation that we have in this moment. And again

867
00:45:35,200 --> 00:45:37,920
Speaker 4: not a new problem, but at scale, right, I mean,

868
00:45:38,120 --> 00:45:40,560
Speaker 4: social media has made it so much easier. Right, And

869
00:45:40,600 --> 00:45:42,719
Speaker 4: then we you know't whatever we are, I think, all well,

870
00:45:42,760 --> 00:45:44,440
Speaker 4: pretty well burst in kind of what's going on the

871
00:45:44,520 --> 00:45:47,520
Speaker 4: front idioms. It is really a problem of scale right now.

872
00:45:47,600 --> 00:45:49,440
Speaker 4: And so I think, you know, one thing that we

873
00:45:49,560 --> 00:45:53,680
Speaker 4: know is that people trust their friends and their family

874
00:45:54,160 --> 00:45:56,359
Speaker 4: for advice, and so I think one thing I would

875
00:45:56,360 --> 00:45:59,480
Speaker 4: offer to a listener is shake it back. Right. There's

876
00:45:59,520 --> 00:46:02,319
Speaker 4: a lot us bloating around out there, whether it's about

877
00:46:02,360 --> 00:46:05,399
Speaker 4: the hours of voting or about the systems we used

878
00:46:05,440 --> 00:46:10,160
Speaker 4: to count ballots, about who is influencing our elections, right,

879
00:46:10,400 --> 00:46:13,839
Speaker 4: it is worth spending a little time before you repost

880
00:46:13,920 --> 00:46:16,320
Speaker 4: reshare is this good information?

881
00:46:16,600 --> 00:46:16,799
Speaker 3: Right?

882
00:46:16,960 --> 00:46:21,040
Speaker 1: Don't spread misinformation that seems like a really good.

883
00:46:21,080 --> 00:46:23,400
Speaker 4: You are a trusted messenger to somebody in your life.

884
00:46:23,480 --> 00:46:25,800
Speaker 4: You should take that responsibility seriously.

885
00:46:26,000 --> 00:46:27,200
Speaker 2: I think that's really important.

886
00:46:27,239 --> 00:46:29,960
Speaker 1: But also that you shouldn't you know, you should make

887
00:46:30,000 --> 00:46:33,400
Speaker 1: sure that the information you're getting to vote is credible.

888
00:46:33,800 --> 00:46:34,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's true.

889
00:46:35,080 --> 00:46:39,719
Speaker 1: So interesting. What states are you particularly worried about. We've

890
00:46:39,760 --> 00:46:43,000
Speaker 1: had James Carvell on this podcast a lot. James Carpal

891
00:46:43,560 --> 00:46:48,800
Speaker 1: is a creature of the South, and he is very

892
00:46:49,520 --> 00:46:54,680
Speaker 1: bullish on Mississippi maybe electing a Democratic governor for the

893
00:46:54,680 --> 00:46:59,080
Speaker 1: first time. Mississippi is a state where if there wasn't

894
00:46:59,239 --> 00:47:04,240
Speaker 1: such criminal disenfranchisemant it would probably be a blue state.

895
00:47:04,440 --> 00:47:08,920
Speaker 1: But these voters are really targeted and kept from voting.

896
00:47:09,320 --> 00:47:12,560
Speaker 1: Could you talk a little bit about how you fix

897
00:47:12,600 --> 00:47:13,839
Speaker 1: a state like Mississippi.

898
00:47:14,160 --> 00:47:15,600
Speaker 4: One of the things I'll say, you know, when we

899
00:47:16,000 --> 00:47:18,560
Speaker 4: started thinking about where did we want to do this work,

900
00:47:18,560 --> 00:47:19,960
Speaker 4: which states we want to work in, and I'll say,

901
00:47:19,960 --> 00:47:22,040
Speaker 4: you know, Mississippi isn't one of them.

902
00:47:22,120 --> 00:47:23,480
Speaker 2: Because it's just too hard.

903
00:47:23,600 --> 00:47:25,840
Speaker 4: We had to make some decisions, but one way or another.

904
00:47:25,880 --> 00:47:28,480
Speaker 4: But I will say about Mississippi and some of the

905
00:47:28,520 --> 00:47:31,080
Speaker 4: other states in the Deep South, that part of what

906
00:47:31,200 --> 00:47:34,600
Speaker 4: has made these states. And we work in Florida and Georgia,

907
00:47:34,640 --> 00:47:37,680
Speaker 4: we work in other places that had some federal protections previously.

908
00:47:37,760 --> 00:47:40,560
Speaker 4: What's made these states tough is that they don't have

909
00:47:40,640 --> 00:47:42,560
Speaker 4: the full protections of the voting right seck that they

910
00:47:42,600 --> 00:47:44,960
Speaker 4: once did. I don't want to act too Rosie. Things

911
00:47:45,040 --> 00:47:49,359
Speaker 4: were tough even when we had those protections. But until

912
00:47:49,640 --> 00:47:53,120
Speaker 4: the Supreme Court not evenven about a decade ago now

913
00:47:53,320 --> 00:47:57,719
Speaker 4: gutted the core protection of Section five O Vuilting Rights Act.

914
00:47:58,000 --> 00:48:00,839
Speaker 4: There were special protections for these states had deep, deep,

915
00:48:00,920 --> 00:48:03,880
Speaker 4: deep histories of disenfranchisement. And it became a free for

916
00:48:03,960 --> 00:48:07,160
Speaker 4: all after that, and so then there was no bottom right,

917
00:48:07,280 --> 00:48:09,520
Speaker 4: It just you It was like a free fall. And

918
00:48:09,680 --> 00:48:11,719
Speaker 4: we've seen that in some of our states that used

919
00:48:11,719 --> 00:48:15,400
Speaker 4: to have these protections. And so I think that, you know,

920
00:48:15,520 --> 00:48:18,240
Speaker 4: our theory of change is so premised on the power

921
00:48:18,320 --> 00:48:21,680
Speaker 4: of local election officials and the power that communities have

922
00:48:22,239 --> 00:48:24,440
Speaker 4: to make change. I mean, I use this example of

923
00:48:24,840 --> 00:48:28,759
Speaker 4: this county in Florida, Duval County. That is because communities

924
00:48:28,920 --> 00:48:33,120
Speaker 4: there are coming together and demanding change. And sometimes you

925
00:48:33,239 --> 00:48:36,120
Speaker 4: have a legislature or a governor who isn't going to

926
00:48:36,120 --> 00:48:38,600
Speaker 4: step up and actually helpfulders, and sometimes they very intentionally

927
00:48:38,640 --> 00:48:42,640
Speaker 4: are not helping burners. But communities can actually overcome and

928
00:48:42,840 --> 00:48:46,120
Speaker 4: push and demand and I think that is what we

929
00:48:46,239 --> 00:48:49,480
Speaker 4: have seen when when things seem hopeless. That is the

930
00:48:49,600 --> 00:48:53,520
Speaker 4: thing that we have found is what moves the needle

931
00:48:53,560 --> 00:48:56,960
Speaker 4: Coaches County Arizona. When these election officials are saying, hey,

932
00:48:56,960 --> 00:48:58,480
Speaker 4: we're not going to count these you know, we're gon

933
00:48:58,600 --> 00:49:00,319
Speaker 4: we're going to handcout all these balls. Were even sure

934
00:49:00,360 --> 00:49:03,280
Speaker 4: the elections can be trusted, people showed up at public

935
00:49:03,320 --> 00:49:05,560
Speaker 4: meetings there and said you have to count these roots. Right.

936
00:49:06,040 --> 00:49:08,360
Speaker 4: This has been a largely dark conversation with most of

937
00:49:08,400 --> 00:49:11,760
Speaker 4: my conversations about this topic are But in these states,

938
00:49:11,840 --> 00:49:14,480
Speaker 4: what we see is these communities turn out and they

939
00:49:14,640 --> 00:49:16,680
Speaker 4: just say enough is enough. Voter said it in Ohio

940
00:49:17,280 --> 00:49:20,800
Speaker 4: in August about Issue one. You know about this legislature

941
00:49:20,840 --> 00:49:23,239
Speaker 4: basically trying to end democracy as we know it in

942
00:49:23,280 --> 00:49:25,040
Speaker 4: the state of Ohio. Letters just said we've had enough,

943
00:49:25,200 --> 00:49:27,920
Speaker 4: and they set it through their advocacy. They said it

944
00:49:27,960 --> 00:49:30,080
Speaker 4: by signing up as poll workers, as I mentioned, and

945
00:49:30,160 --> 00:49:31,200
Speaker 4: they send it in their vote.

946
00:49:31,360 --> 00:49:32,399
Speaker 2: Thank you so much.

947
00:49:32,480 --> 00:49:35,800
Speaker 1: I hope you'll come back. And also everyone needs to

948
00:49:35,920 --> 00:49:37,280
Speaker 1: sign up to be a poll worker.

949
00:49:37,760 --> 00:49:38,480
Speaker 4: That's the message.

950
00:49:38,800 --> 00:49:39,120
Speaker 3: Thank you.

951
00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:47,960
Speaker 6: All moments Jesse Cannon, Molly Jung Fast that Ron de

952
00:49:48,120 --> 00:49:51,680
Speaker 6: Santis I think he has nightmares every night of that

953
00:49:51,960 --> 00:49:55,120
Speaker 6: Chris Christy embrace of Obama and now he is really

954
00:49:55,200 --> 00:49:57,120
Speaker 6: doing some dumb, dumb stuff.

955
00:49:57,520 --> 00:50:02,800
Speaker 1: This weekend was they pos hurricane recovery in Florida. It

956
00:50:02,920 --> 00:50:04,920
Speaker 1: was a very bad hurricane, but not with a ton

957
00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:08,040
Speaker 1: I mean, some damage, but not as much damage as

958
00:50:08,080 --> 00:50:10,800
Speaker 1: they were worried about. Joe Biden flew down to Florida

959
00:50:11,360 --> 00:50:15,760
Speaker 1: to meet with local Floridians to talk about the situation,

960
00:50:16,239 --> 00:50:21,000
Speaker 1: and believe it or not, the governor of Florida, the

961
00:50:21,160 --> 00:50:24,680
Speaker 1: man who has basically treated his governorship as an audition

962
00:50:24,800 --> 00:50:28,120
Speaker 1: to primary Donald Trump, refused to meet with Joe Biden,

963
00:50:28,640 --> 00:50:32,480
Speaker 1: thus looking small and petty, and instead Joe Biden met

964
00:50:32,560 --> 00:50:36,399
Speaker 1: with the man who was trying to get Mitch McConnell's job,

965
00:50:37,040 --> 00:50:41,920
Speaker 1: the one the only Mars attack, Senator Rick Scott. I

966
00:50:42,000 --> 00:50:46,360
Speaker 1: don't think anyone is surprised that Ron DeSantis is politicizing

967
00:50:46,440 --> 00:50:50,160
Speaker 1: this and refusing to meet with Biden. That said, one

968
00:50:50,239 --> 00:50:53,920
Speaker 1: of the times when Biden came down to meet with DeSantis,

969
00:50:54,160 --> 00:50:57,040
Speaker 1: there were lots of pictures where DeSantis looked like he

970
00:50:57,200 --> 00:51:00,160
Speaker 1: wasn't relating to other humans, and Biden did so. I

971
00:51:00,239 --> 00:51:03,120
Speaker 1: could see where the campaign might have a little anxiety

972
00:51:03,160 --> 00:51:07,040
Speaker 1: about this. Either way, I think it makes DeSantis look

973
00:51:07,200 --> 00:51:11,120
Speaker 1: terrible like he did in those boots exactly.

974
00:51:10,760 --> 00:51:14,200
Speaker 2: And for that, those boots were made for doing your

975
00:51:14,239 --> 00:51:18,080
Speaker 2: goddamn job. And that is our moment of fuckery.

976
00:51:19,560 --> 00:51:22,840
Speaker 1: That's it for this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in

977
00:51:22,920 --> 00:51:26,120
Speaker 1: every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday to hear the best minds

978
00:51:26,160 --> 00:51:29,360
Speaker 1: in politics makes sense of all this chaos. If you

979
00:51:29,520 --> 00:51:32,160
Speaker 1: enjoyed what you've heard, please send it to a friend

980
00:51:32,239 --> 00:51:35,760
Speaker 1: and keep the conversation going. And again, thanks for listening.