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Speaker 1: All right, welcome to.
Speaker 2: You're at the volume heavy Friday. Everybody, Oh balth you
Speaker 2: guys are having a great week.
Speaker 1: Well.
Speaker 3: Game four. In a series like.
Speaker 2: This, when the team on the road steals, the home
Speaker 2: court advantage is typically where the series is decided the
Speaker 2: team that wins. If you're the home team and you win,
Speaker 2: you go up three to one, all of a sudden,
Speaker 2: it's just too big of a deficit for you to overcome.
Speaker 2: And then if you're the better team and you have
Speaker 2: home court advantage and you steal that game back in
Speaker 2: game four, it's two to two, but you have all
Speaker 2: the momentum. You only need two more wins, and two
Speaker 2: of the last three games are in your home building.
Speaker 2: And so this game is always the pivot point for
Speaker 2: most playoff series and the thunder when push comes to shove.
Speaker 2: Nobody seems to be able to score against this team,
Speaker 2: and that's what I will always remember about them. We're
Speaker 2: gonna break down this game from the perspective of both teams.
Speaker 2: At the tail end of the show, we're gonna have
Speaker 2: Jackson come on the show and we're gonna take questions
Speaker 2: from the chat so that you guys that have questions
Speaker 2: want to get into any specific details or angles on
Speaker 2: the series, you can bring them to the chat comments
Speaker 2: for the tail.
Speaker 3: End of the show.
Speaker 2: And then remember when we wrap up here tonight, we're
Speaker 2: gonna be heading over to Playback that's playback dot tv
Speaker 2: slash Hoops tonight and we'll be taking callers. We'll watch
Speaker 2: some film, we'll dig into what happened in that crazy
Speaker 2: game tonight. You guys know the drill before we get started.
Speaker 2: Subscribe to the Hoops and I YouTube channel. You don't
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Speaker 2: also super helpful if you leave a rating and a
Speaker 2: review on that front. Jackson's doing great work on our
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Speaker 2: you guys follow us there. Now that's spent at least,
Speaker 2: Like I mentioned earlier, drop those mail bag questions in
Speaker 2: the chat and we'll get to them at the tail
Speaker 2: end of the show. All right, let's talk some basketball.
Speaker 2: So I have been pretty consistent with this Thunder team
Speaker 2: in this postseason run that the true star of this team,
Speaker 2: the strength of this team. The thing that I will
Speaker 2: remember most about this team is their defense. I thought
Speaker 2: Jadubb had an awesome game tonight, especially relative to his
Speaker 2: age and experience, provided some pretty steady scoring for TEA
Speaker 2: that was struggling to score, especially throughout the middle portions
Speaker 2: of this game. But I thought Shay was a disaster
Speaker 2: the majority of the game. I thought he looked generally
Speaker 2: disengaged and extremely fatigued, to the point where like I
Speaker 2: was like starting to wonder if there was something bigger
Speaker 2: going on, like he was sick or something along those lines.
Speaker 2: And he made some plays late in the game, which
Speaker 2: we're going to discuss, But this team was dead in
Speaker 2: the water and unable to score when they needed to,
Speaker 2: even in that fourth quarter for the most part. But
Speaker 2: we saw a similar thing take place in the Denver
Speaker 2: series in the second round, where it's the fourth quarter,
Speaker 2: Denver's up, it's Game four, They're on the verge of
Speaker 2: taking a three to one lead in the series. But
Speaker 2: something happened from that point forward through the end of
Speaker 2: Game four against Denver. The Denver Nuggets led by the
Speaker 2: greatest offensive player I've ever personally watched in Nikole Jokic,
Speaker 2: and they couldn't score. They couldn't score. The series was
Speaker 2: on the line, it was hanging in the balance, and
Speaker 2: they couldn't score, even when Denver managed to pull out
Speaker 2: a Game six to send it back to Oklahoma City
Speaker 2: for Game seven. What happened in Game seven, the Nuggets
Speaker 2: couldn't score. They couldn't even get the ball to Jokics
Speaker 2: where they needed to get it to come into this series,
Speaker 2: the Pacers kind of methodically generating quality shots even throughout
Speaker 2: the game tonight, like they had at least twenty five.
Speaker 3: Points in every quarter through the first three quarters. Throughout
Speaker 3: the series.
Speaker 2: Have talked about how the Pacers have shown some ability
Speaker 2: to be able to break down the defense as long
Speaker 2: as they don't turn it over. And in this fourth quarter,
Speaker 2: when everything was hanging in the balance, I think the
Speaker 2: Pacers led by as much as seven or eight in
Speaker 2: the fourth quarter if I remember correctly, they couldn't score.
Speaker 2: When it came time to be able to pull this
Speaker 2: series into a three to one lead, in a situation
Speaker 2: where they would be probably favored in Vegas to win
Speaker 2: at that point, they couldn't score. And that's what I
Speaker 2: remember about this Thunder team. They can leverage them selves
Speaker 2: athletically in a way that Indiana can't match. They can
Speaker 2: leverage themselves athletically as a team defensively that nobody in
Speaker 2: the league can match, even the best and most reliable offenses.
Speaker 2: Denver had the best offensive player possibly in the history
Speaker 2: of the game.
Speaker 3: Couldn't score.
Speaker 2: Indiana has the second or third best offensive engine in
Speaker 2: the NBA, surrounded by a good amount of cumulative ball
Speaker 2: handling and shooting ability. Couldn't score. That's where it all
Speaker 2: comes down to. I talked a lot after Game three.
Speaker 2: If you guys remember, in all the content that we
Speaker 2: produced over the last few days, I explained to you
Speaker 2: guys why I still had Oklahoma City as the team
Speaker 2: I expected to win the series. I said, they win
Speaker 2: game four. I said they win Game five. I said
Speaker 2: they'd win one of game six or seven. So Oklahoma
Speaker 2: City and six or seven. And if you guys remember,
Speaker 2: the specific thing I said was that Oklahoma City had
Speaker 2: two semi reliable actions they could run to be able
Speaker 2: to generate offense when things really bogged down and everything's.
Speaker 3: On the line.
Speaker 2: I said, Shae attacking turner and pick and roll, which
Speaker 2: is not what they went to down the stretch of
Speaker 2: this game. And then Shae ISOs, which is exactly what
Speaker 2: they went to down the stretch of this game. Those
Speaker 2: were two actions that no matter what Indiana does, Oklahoma
Speaker 2: City can either get a good shot for Shay that
Speaker 2: he can make, or draw a double team that leads
Speaker 2: to some sort of quality look, and we saw an
Speaker 2: example of that where Nemhar dug down on Shae and
Speaker 2: got kicked to JDub. Jdubb drove the close out and
Speaker 2: ended up generating a wide open three for Shae on
Speaker 2: the right wing. But ultimately Oklahoma City, when things really
Speaker 2: bogged down, had a couple of things they could go
Speaker 2: to that were gonna generate good looks for Indiana. On
Speaker 2: the other end, Dort is flying over the top of
Speaker 2: screens and not allowing Tyres to free up. They finally
Speaker 2: get a good screen and he gets switched on to
Speaker 2: Chet and he's able to go to a step back three.
Speaker 2: But it's a step back three versus Chet. That's not
Speaker 2: a super high percentage look. The Pacers throughout this series
Speaker 2: have established a lot of cumulative success through their ball pressure,
Speaker 2: fatiguing Oklahoma City's ball handlers. I underrated. If there was
Speaker 2: one thing that I underrated in terms of Indiana's chances
Speaker 2: to win this series, it's that Oklahoma City is really
Speaker 2: light on ball handling, even though they're super talented roster.
Speaker 2: Their talent comes in the form of quickness, athleticism, defense,
Speaker 2: a lot of different things that aren't necessarily dribbling the
Speaker 2: basketball in high level playmaking, and so they've been more
Speaker 2: susceptible to Indiana's ball pressure.
Speaker 3: They've been more.
Speaker 2: Susceptible to fatigue as Indiana's ball pressure has worn them down.
Speaker 2: But that weakness made this series more competitive. But even
Speaker 2: throughout that, as Indiana had their moments, as they got
Speaker 2: their offense going in various ways at various points in
Speaker 2: the series, they never established one single action or play
Speaker 2: type that they could go to that's like, this is
Speaker 2: going to get us a good shot. Every single time
Speaker 2: the tyres ball screens, it's like, well, what if Dort
Speaker 2: just doesn't get screened, or if they switch. Now it's
Speaker 2: a Tyrese iso. We're not getting anything super reliable out
Speaker 2: of that. Siakim has had moments attacking out of the
Speaker 2: post in the series, it hasn't been something that has
Speaker 2: been super reliable generating great shots. They tried the Tyree
Speaker 2: Siakam two man game at various points they can.
Speaker 3: Switch it, there have not.
Speaker 2: There the Pacers never established anything that they could really
Speaker 2: really depend on. Down the stretch, we saw a steady
Speaker 2: diet of Shaye JDub two man game. One of the
Speaker 2: interesting subplots of the series is you know, we talked
Speaker 2: about going in how like we didn't really get any
Speaker 2: opportunity to see Nie Smith spend some extensive time on
Speaker 2: Shay and Carlisle ended up making the right decision in
Speaker 2: going with Nemhart in this series, and Nemhart has done
Speaker 2: an incredible job on Shae.
Speaker 3: Throughout the series.
Speaker 2: JDub has spent the majority excuse me, Nie Smith has
Speaker 2: spent the majority of the series on JDub, and JDub
Speaker 2: has cooked his ass, just cooked him and down the stretch,
Speaker 2: instead of having JDub go at Nie Smith, they just
Speaker 2: ran two man game to get Nie Smith switched on
Speaker 2: to Shay, and Shay cooked him. Now, I have some
Speaker 2: frustrations about the specific manner with which these situations led
Speaker 2: to points, which we'll go get to in a minute,
Speaker 2: but it wouldn't have mattered anyway. With how good Oklahoma
Speaker 2: City's defense was, they were gonna win this game. But
Speaker 2: they were able to get a triple threat ISO against
Speaker 2: Nie Smith where he had his arm on Shae's left arm,
Speaker 2: and so Shay took a non basketball shot and got
Speaker 2: rewarded with two points for it.
Speaker 3: Then they went to that.
Speaker 2: Another ISO off of the right wing, Nemhard pinches down
Speaker 2: and gets kicked back to jdb JDub drives to close out.
Speaker 3: Both guys react.
Speaker 2: It's a wide open three for Shay, but that wide
Speaker 2: open three was generated by Shay because of his ability
Speaker 2: to draw the second defender in an ISO against Nie
Speaker 2: Smith and then the pushoff there along the baseline once
Speaker 2: again a bucket against Nie Smith, and then the step
Speaker 2: through move. I actually thought Nie Smith played really good
Speaker 2: defense on this possession and kind of bailed Shay out
Speaker 2: about Shay also traveled on the possession, so it was
Speaker 2: again kind of a questionable call, but all of the
Speaker 2: buckets down the stretch were Shay going at Nie Smith.
Speaker 2: They had a reliable action, They had something they could run.
Speaker 2: Shay is capable of getting his one on one game
Speaker 2: off against the majority of the guys on this roster,
Speaker 2: but he found a specific matchup in Indy starting five
Speaker 2: in their closing five that he liked to attack, and
Speaker 2: he was able to get the buckets that he needed
Speaker 2: to put his team in position to win the game
Speaker 2: on the strength of their defense. Another huge element I
Speaker 2: thought in the fourth quarter of this game was the
Speaker 2: offensive rebounding of Chet Holmgren and Isaiah Hartenstein. We had
Speaker 2: a boatload of free throws down the stretch. So Oklahoma
Speaker 2: City ended up with thirty one points, but it wasn't
Speaker 2: at as easy breezy for them scoring throughout the majority
Speaker 2: of the fourth quarter. I thought Shaye and Jada was
Speaker 2: pretty good throughout the night, but I thought Shaye played
Speaker 2: pretty shitty half court offense the majority of the night,
Speaker 2: and there were a lot of misses in there. And
Speaker 2: in those misses, time and time again, Chet would just
Speaker 2: come flying and off that left wing for offensive rebound
Speaker 2: put backs. He had I think two that led to
Speaker 2: direct buckets, one where he taffed it out, in another
Speaker 2: Shaye ended up getting a bucket off of the tap out,
Speaker 2: and then Hartenstein had an offensive rebound put back just
Speaker 2: by my count, eight second chance points for the thunder
Speaker 2: in that fourth quarter that bolstered their offense when they
Speaker 2: needed it. So like when push comes to shove, when
Speaker 2: I think about this series, when I think about this team,
Speaker 2: when I think about them winning the championship, the best
Speaker 2: attribute to this team is their defense. When push comes
Speaker 2: to shove and it's time for them to win, team,
Speaker 2: they just tightened the screws and teams can't score, and
Speaker 2: they were able to dominate the margins. Those huge offensive
Speaker 2: rebounds from Chet and Isaiah Hartenstein in the fourth quarter,
Speaker 2: the steals at half court. Dork got another big one
Speaker 2: down the stretch where he drew a foul. How many
Speaker 2: times in this game, like four or five times where
Speaker 2: they ripped a pacer usually Halliburton right at half court.
Speaker 2: Almost every one of them led to buckets. We pulled
Speaker 2: the points off of turnovers here real quick. Yeah, we
Speaker 2: had on sixteen pacer turnovers twenty five points for the
Speaker 2: thunder going the other way. That's a huge margin there.
Speaker 2: The grifting drives me crazy, but it's a way to
Speaker 2: win basketball games in the modern NBA. Like we could
Speaker 2: talk all we want, it got rewarded in this game,
Speaker 2: and it's generally been rewarded. There have been a couple
Speaker 2: of like lane line bump fouls that Shay's gone for
Speaker 2: in the series that he hasn't gotten, but there's ultimately
Speaker 2: that's a margin. It's a competitive margin, and it's a
Speaker 2: margin that Shay's really good at, and that has been
Speaker 2: a big part of how they were able to overcome
Speaker 2: a lot of mediocre half court offense in this game.
Speaker 2: Looking forward, as we talk about how this series progresses,
Speaker 2: do I think this has a good chance to go seven? Yeah,
Speaker 2: because Indiana, especially in a non urgent situation for the
Speaker 2: Thunder where they're up three to two, Indiana at home
Speaker 2: is going to be tough to beat, like in that
Speaker 2: sort of situation. So I think the series has a
Speaker 2: decent chance to go seven. But whenever it happens, whether
Speaker 2: it's Game five and the Pacers play hard and keep
Speaker 2: things close, but there's five minutes left and the thunderneed
Speaker 2: to tighten the screws, or whether it's in Game six
Speaker 2: in the fourth quarter, it inevitably ends up in a
Speaker 2: Game seven in the fourth quarter when it really comes
Speaker 2: down to this next four to five minute stretch is
Speaker 2: going to determine who wins the finals. Oklahoma City is
Speaker 2: going to tighten the screws in Indiana is not gonna
Speaker 2: be able to score, and that ultimately is what is
Speaker 2: what makes them the champion when it's all and done,
Speaker 2: and that's ultimately why I think Oklahoma City's gonna win.
Speaker 2: It's the guards and their unwillingness to get screened, the
Speaker 2: physical switching. As bad as Shay was tonight. I thought
Speaker 2: he was very good defensively in the second half. Got
Speaker 2: a huge block on a step back three at the
Speaker 2: top of the key, had some steals and poke aways,
Speaker 2: like an over the top steal on a post entry.
Speaker 2: Even Shay gets involved in what they do defensively. Chet
Speaker 2: home grin Chet's ability to switch in ball screens and like, yeah,
Speaker 2: Halliburn's got him a few times in the series, got
Speaker 2: him with a little scoop shot there in the fourth quarter.
Speaker 2: But for the most part, Chet's ability to switch on
Speaker 2: to the perimeter and have success there makes their defense
Speaker 2: kind of impregnable in a lot of ways because their
Speaker 2: guards don't get screened, and if they happen to get screened,
Speaker 2: they can switch just about anything. And that's the foundational
Speaker 2: trait that makes this Thunder team a championship level team.
Speaker 2: Before we get to our mailbags, the grifty stuff at
Speaker 2: the end, I have to just speak up for just
Speaker 2: a second here to be clear, the Thunder won this
Speaker 2: game with their defense. The Thunder would have won this game.
Speaker 2: I believe even if these of one or two of
Speaker 2: these fouls didn't go Oklahoma City's direction. But one of
Speaker 2: the things I've talked about is with grifting. It's about
Speaker 2: the television product. I have no problem with Shake Gilders
Speaker 2: Alexander taking advantage of competitive advantages that are available to him. So,
Speaker 2: for instance, if you're standing in the NBA and the
Speaker 2: guy's got his hand on his shoulder, like like just
Speaker 2: sitting there on Shay's right shoulder, and you just go
Speaker 2: up and you like you're standing there in that position,
Speaker 2: you should just go up and throw your arms into
Speaker 2: his arm and try to shoot. Why because it's gonna
Speaker 2: get rewarded with points and so you're just taking advantage
Speaker 2: of a competitive advantage that's available to you. But it's
Speaker 2: not a good basketball shot. That shouldn't be a shot.
Speaker 2: It should just be a foul, Like if a guy's
Speaker 2: gonna put his hands on you like that. First of all,
Speaker 2: it's kind of ridiculous considering how much handsiness takes place
Speaker 2: in every single one of these possessions. Look it out, handsy.
Speaker 2: Oklahoma City was on defense in the fourth quarter. But like,
Speaker 2: we don't want to see the finals get decided on
Speaker 2: a non basketball shot at the elbow. We don't want
Speaker 2: to see the finals get decided by Nie Smith sliding
Speaker 2: his feet well, in his Super Bowl super physical possession
Speaker 2: that literally led to Shaye traveling and him going into
Speaker 2: like a step through floater and bailing him out over
Speaker 2: some light forearm contact. And by the way, if that's
Speaker 2: the one call, no one's gonna care. That sort of
Speaker 2: thing is gonna happen here or there throughout the Finals.
Speaker 2: But like that, in conjunction with the uh uh, with
Speaker 2: that little touch on the step through, I thought Halli
Speaker 2: Burton got fouled worse on his drive, the one that
Speaker 2: he went into the lane than shaded on his little
Speaker 2: hand on the shoulder thing, and then the push offf
Speaker 2: there right along the baseline. Like if Shae has iconic
Speaker 2: playoff moments where he hits big big shots getting separation
Speaker 2: from defenders, it'll go on historic playoff highlight reel that
Speaker 2: everyone will remember for all time. But when you see
Speaker 2: a guy like, straight up like doing the same grifty
Speaker 2: bullshit that he's been doing all season to win a
Speaker 2: finals game, it's not a fun television product. It's not
Speaker 2: fun to watch, and it just kind of was a buzzkill.
Speaker 2: You know, Jackson and I were talking in the middle
Speaker 2: of the fourth quarter. This was one of the most
Speaker 2: entertaining NBA Finals that we've ever seen. But my biggest
Speaker 2: fear in general with Oklahoma City and their success is
Speaker 2: just the that grifty bullshit and how it just makes
Speaker 2: for an ugly television product. And I wasn't a huge
Speaker 2: fan of that. Down the stretch. It just kind of
Speaker 2: just kind of felt like, like, guys don't like, you
Speaker 2: don't have to give them that call. Their defense is
Speaker 2: good enough, they're probably gonna win. Shay is a good player,
Speaker 2: he can knock down shots. He might make shots here
Speaker 2: there by the way, Like this is the thing with
Speaker 2: the pushot. I don't care about the push off. If
Speaker 2: you don't call the grifty bullshit, let Shay push off.
Speaker 2: Let the defenders use their hands. That's all I've ever
Speaker 2: asked for is consistency in that regard. You can't reward
Speaker 2: Shay with free throws for non basketball shots or bad
Speaker 2: basketball and then also let him get super physical with
Speaker 2: defenders and shove them off to get to his spots.
Speaker 2: That's straight up not fair, and I just thought that
Speaker 2: that was frustrating down the stretch of the game.
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Speaker 3: I'm off by soapbox Jackson.
Speaker 2: Let's get into some mailbad questions and if there yeah,
Speaker 2: if there's like a thunder fan out there that wants
Speaker 2: to cape for this shit, I.
Speaker 3: Want to hear it. I want to hear it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there are some thunderfins in the chat saying, you know,
Speaker 1: caping for the for the grift. But we got a
Speaker 1: couple of questions about the about the refereeing, so I
Speaker 1: don't know if you want to stay on that.
Speaker 3: For a minute's say on the restaurant, Hey, Jason.
Speaker 1: I thought the rest tonight called the game much differently
Speaker 1: in the differently than the rest of the playoffs, but
Speaker 1: at least it felt like it was happening both ways.
Speaker 1: What was your take on sort of the zoom out
Speaker 1: of the refereeing, like being definitely different than earlier in
Speaker 1: the playoffs. And then specifically it felt like Scott Foster
Speaker 1: was kind of trying to, you know, put his hands
Speaker 1: on the game a little bit.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Scott Foster is one of the most performative refs
Speaker 2: I've ever seen. You can always tell just by like
Speaker 2: the little extra flair that he puts on all the
Speaker 2: bs that he does. I I was frustrated in general
Speaker 2: throughout the flow of that game because it's it goes
Speaker 2: both ways. Because on the one hand, it's super physical,
Speaker 2: it's game four, the teams are starting to hate each other,
Speaker 2: they're starting to get a little chippy, so you got
Speaker 2: to kind of keep things on control. But at the
Speaker 2: same time, when the stoppages and the reviews just get
Speaker 2: so excessive, it really bothers the flow of the game.
Speaker 2: My thing is one of the most consistent trends that
Speaker 2: has been frustrating for me watching the Thunder in this postseason,
Speaker 2: and it's the Chris Finch quote. They foiled the shit
Speaker 2: out of you all game, and then the then you
Speaker 2: allow the grifty stuff to happen. I mean, I texted
Speaker 2: you before that Shay run when the Pacers built a
Speaker 2: little bit of a lead and then we had a
Speaker 2: lane line bump foul call for JDub on a on
Speaker 2: a on a drive and it's just like it just
Speaker 2: feels lame. It's like, here comes the Thunder run, We're
Speaker 2: headed to the foul line. Like it just it feels
Speaker 2: like that is the way with which they generated offense
Speaker 2: in a game like where they played bad offense. And
Speaker 2: that's the thing is, like, I'm a big believer in
Speaker 2: like I want good basketball to be rewarded and I
Speaker 2: want bad basketball to be punished. And I thought that
Speaker 2: the Thunder played a lot of bad offensive basketball in
Speaker 2: this game that got rewarded with points.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was.
Speaker 1: It's just it's tough. It's I understand the Thunder fans
Speaker 1: and the Shave fans saying like what do you want
Speaker 1: him to do? And it's at a certain point it's
Speaker 1: Shay's fault. Like I'm not saying it's he he's the
Speaker 1: one who's the problem here, but the ecosystem of the
Speaker 1: fouls and what is allowed on the other end, it's
Speaker 1: it's challenging a little bit.
Speaker 2: I think, do you agree with me that, Like the
Speaker 2: problem is you can't like like you gotta have one
Speaker 2: or the other, Like you gotta either let Shaye push
Speaker 2: off and let these defenders put their hands on him,
Speaker 2: or you got to call the offensive foul in addition
Speaker 2: to calling the griffy stuff.
Speaker 1: I think it's that combined with the the physicality of
Speaker 1: the contact that's allowed on the other record before, which
Speaker 1: is not to take away from the way the Thunder
Speaker 1: play defense. I don't have a problem with the way
Speaker 1: the Thunder play defense, just like I don't have a
Speaker 1: problem with the way that andrewn Emhard plays defense on
Speaker 1: Shady Gillen Tlexander for the most part, right like, and
Speaker 1: I don't have a problem with Tyre's Halliburton leaning into
Speaker 1: chet when there's and the bonus to get it, you know,
Speaker 1: Like that's fine, that's basketball. But there's a certain it
Speaker 1: becomes it becomes something else sometimes, I.
Speaker 2: Think, and it's just not fun to watch, is the
Speaker 2: bottom line. Like we like, we don't want to see
Speaker 2: a huge iconic playoff game get decided like that. We
Speaker 2: don't like we want to see the action with that
Speaker 2: they ran that generated Shaye the wide open three at
Speaker 2: the top of the key. That felt like a huge
Speaker 2: playoff shot. That felt like just a massive playoff shot
Speaker 2: for Shay in a game where he had been pretty rough.
Speaker 2: The other stuff just felt like him exploiting loopholes.
Speaker 1: All right, next question, we can move off the ref
Speaker 1: so everyone in the chat can take a breathing.
Speaker 3: Do you think love to the chat?
Speaker 1: Of course?
Speaker 3: Do you think Jason that the.
Speaker 1: Pacers now they have to win one game on the
Speaker 1: road if they want to win the NBA Finals, have
Speaker 1: a better chance in Game five or in game seven?
Speaker 3: Game five? For sure?
Speaker 2: I think there's always a natural kind of ebb and
Speaker 2: flow back and forth as the series kind of flow.
Speaker 2: I mean, we even saw Denver take a commanding nine
Speaker 2: point lead in the early fourth quarter of Game five.
Speaker 2: It just to me it just doesn't matter because the
Speaker 2: Thunder could be down by eleven with nine and a
Speaker 2: half minutes left of Game five, and I would just
Speaker 2: feel like they could tighten the screws and then Indiana
Speaker 2: would suddenly go life like this is legitimately crazy. It's
Speaker 2: a consistent trend, like they just completely shut your water off.
Speaker 2: They shut your water off, and there's nothing you can do.
Speaker 2: And again, I do believe their best chance to win
Speaker 2: is gonna be Game five. Like, if the Pacers are
Speaker 2: gonna win the series, they win the next two games.
Speaker 2: I just don't think. I think, when when all the
Speaker 2: stuff is on the line, I don't think anybody can
Speaker 2: score on this this Oklahoma City team the way they
Speaker 2: need to. I think Indiana's one chance as Oklahoma City
Speaker 2: comes out really flat in Game five and Indiana brings
Speaker 2: a ton of energy and all of a sudden it
Speaker 2: turns into a fourth quarter close game. But like somehow
Speaker 2: Oklahoma City goes colder than Indiana does. That would be
Speaker 2: their one chance.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the the the Dork Caruso combination, plus the switch
Speaker 1: ability and length of chat on the back end, like
Speaker 1: they have so many unbelievable athletes, unbelievable defenders, just a
Speaker 1: million ways to get stops in a million ways to
Speaker 1: create hapoic. It's it's really when they decide we're ratching
Speaker 1: it up right now, it is. It is startling to watch.
Speaker 2: They're the best defense that I've watched in my time
Speaker 2: covering the league. I just I can't remember a time
Speaker 2: where I saw a team consistently strangle.
Speaker 3: The life out of like truly elite offenses.
Speaker 2: There have been a lot of really great defenses that
Speaker 2: have come close, you know, like I think the twenty
Speaker 2: nineteen Raptors was a very good defense. I think the
Speaker 2: twenty twenty Lakers was a very good defense. Even the
Speaker 2: Warriors in twenty twenty two very good defense. But I
Speaker 2: don't think any of those defenses come close to just
Speaker 2: the overwhelming, like just physical, oppressive, ball pressure and unscreenable
Speaker 2: but still switchable. It's just they're frightening. I tweeted out
Speaker 2: right at the end of the third quarter, I was like,
Speaker 2: this is where Oklahoma City's gonna throw their best defensive
Speaker 2: punch and we're gonna find out if Indiana can score.
Speaker 2: And they couldn't score. Ultimately that we all knew it
Speaker 2: was coming.
Speaker 3: Everyone knew.
Speaker 2: It's like staring everybody right in the face. But it's
Speaker 2: just as an unconquerable demon.
Speaker 1: And credit to Shay. You said it earlier that he
Speaker 1: was bad most of the game offensively, but he was
Speaker 1: very good defensively. In the fourth quarter, he hit the
Speaker 1: block on Howie. I think he had two different poke
Speaker 1: like steals when they were trying to do a post entry.
Speaker 1: He was very active, and I think that is sort
Speaker 1: of what one of the things amongst the many things
Speaker 1: with their defense that contributes to them being an all
Speaker 1: time defense, is they their worst guy that you're picking
Speaker 1: on is competent at worst.
Speaker 2: Yeah, No, I totally agree. It's those last possessions in
Speaker 2: the game. It's like, those are makeable shots, Like the
Speaker 2: Tyree step back against Chedd. He got decent separation, but
Speaker 2: that's a really long defender. He shooting over the nemhard
Speaker 2: step back that he missed off the back round, like
Speaker 2: that was a really good contest, even though it was
Speaker 2: a decent look. Like, Yeah, I think the ones that
Speaker 2: you'll think back to if you're a pacer fan are
Speaker 2: the wide open looks that Nie Smith and Turner missed.
Speaker 2: There were there were a solid half dozen great three
Speaker 2: point looks that Nie Smith and Turner got in this game,
Speaker 2: and they just couldn't make them. Do you think Carlisle
Speaker 2: should have gone with like maybe Ben mather I mean,
Speaker 2: Mathern came in at the very end, but like mather
Speaker 2: In and and Top and more down the stretch.
Speaker 3: Of this game.
Speaker 1: It's it's a good question. It's one of our questions.
Speaker 1: Why is that we got in the chat? Why does
Speaker 1: Myles Turner get so many minutes when he has been
Speaker 1: pretty bad for most of the series and Topping has
Speaker 1: been so good. And it's it's hard because one of
Speaker 1: the things that they were getting killed on was the glass,
Speaker 1: and you know in theory Turners a better better player
Speaker 1: there on the glass and top of it, and Nie
Speaker 1: Smith had like nine rebounds, So it's it's tough to
Speaker 1: to to say who they should go with, but it
Speaker 1: does feel like the Top and Siakam front court minutes
Speaker 1: are the best ones for them. And I think Mathrin
Speaker 1: at least in at least in Game three, it felt
Speaker 1: like he was doing a better job staying attached to
Speaker 1: some of these guards Jane Williams and SGA specifically than
Speaker 1: Nie Smith. So I think if you're if you're a
Speaker 1: Pacers fan, if your carlis and you're looking for what
Speaker 1: do we have a desperation punch? Like, hopefully we're just
Speaker 1: in the game in general we don't have to do that,
Speaker 1: but if we need to for down seven with four minutes,
Speaker 1: what is our big swing? I think it's probably the
Speaker 1: Mathrin and Top and over Nie Smith and Turner.
Speaker 3: I agree.
Speaker 2: I mean Nie Smith like was fuck, he was hacking.
Speaker 2: He was hacking like on a bunch of like he
Speaker 2: hacked Chet on a play where and again it's all
Speaker 2: like it's good defense in principle until the very end,
Speaker 2: but it's like, especially with the way that game was
Speaker 2: getting officiated for Shay and and like you you can't
Speaker 2: be you can't be as handsy as he was, and
Speaker 2: it just it was frustrating. It felt felt very much
Speaker 2: like a missed opportunity for Indiana. But like the only
Speaker 2: reason why I like, even with the stuff with uh, like,
Speaker 2: let's say a couple more of those turner threes go
Speaker 2: down or something like that, and Indiana's up by like,
Speaker 2: you know, twelve going into the fourth quarter instead of
Speaker 2: seven or whatever it was.
Speaker 3: I still I still just feel like push comes to shove.
Speaker 2: This Oklahoma City team can tighten the screws and no
Speaker 2: one can score on him. And that really is That's
Speaker 2: the thing that I'm gonna remember the most about this team.
Speaker 1: Yeah. One one, we had a couple more questions, one
Speaker 1: from me and then one from a super tat question
Speaker 1: to end with, I was thinking about the Niemith problem
Speaker 1: and a lot of the switches that they got for
Speaker 1: Shay at the end of the game were guard guard
Speaker 1: screens where they were like, well, we can switch these.
Speaker 1: We don't need to chase over with that mark. We
Speaker 1: can switch these. How if they don't want to switch.
Speaker 1: If we're saying the Niemith is gonna get cooked by
Speaker 1: Shay or at least not every time, but you know
Speaker 1: the majority of the time, what's the move there? Do
Speaker 1: you just chase over the top and hedge and hope
Speaker 1: that Jalen Williams isn't good enough on the back end
Speaker 1: to beat you?
Speaker 4: Like, what's this?
Speaker 1: What do you do if you're the pacers that worked
Speaker 1: really well down the stretch to get switches?
Speaker 2: Yeah, all you can do is blitzer hedge. Those are
Speaker 2: really your only two options. And I mean there are
Speaker 2: variations of hedges you can like you can do. You
Speaker 2: can do like a really soft like catch hedge where
Speaker 2: you're primarily just functioning to take away a drive if
Speaker 2: he turns the corner. But even then, like if you
Speaker 2: linger at all on the ball and j Deb slips out.
Speaker 2: We talk about baked in driving lanes a lot on
Speaker 2: this show. Basically to make a long story short, if
Speaker 2: you slip out of a screen or even if you're
Speaker 2: just in in spot up a spot up situation on
Speaker 2: the opposite wing. So like balls on the right wing,
Speaker 2: you're standing on the left wing, or you're slipping out
Speaker 2: of a guard guard screen to the left wing, if
Speaker 2: that defender is in nail help, or if he's lingering
Speaker 2: in a hedge or doing anything along those lines, all
Speaker 2: you have to do is throw a swing pass and
Speaker 2: then rip to the left and then and then you're
Speaker 2: in good shape. I think, honestly, like if there was
Speaker 2: a if there was a mistake made down the stretch
Speaker 2: from Indiana in terms of their defensive execution, it's the
Speaker 2: lack of double teams. Like they had a lot of
Speaker 2: success double teaming Shay throughout the game. I mean it's
Speaker 2: zero sists and then down the stretch they let him
Speaker 2: play one on one and they did dig down to
Speaker 2: the nail, but it's like you end up giving up
Speaker 2: closeouts anyway. Like it's just I would have liked to
Speaker 2: have seen a little bit more aggression thrown directly at Shay,
Speaker 2: but none if it matters if Indiana can't score on
Speaker 2: the other end, And that's what I keep coming back to.
Speaker 2: Last question.
Speaker 1: This one was a super Chat question from jam shout
Speaker 1: out to you JM. Every game this series. It feels
Speaker 1: very similar to the OKAC Denver series. Okay, see blows
Speaker 1: a fourth quarter leading Game one, they won Game two
Speaker 1: by a lot, it was a close Game three, and
Speaker 1: then actually make the comeback to win its Game four.
Speaker 1: What is your take on that doesn't feel similar to you?
Speaker 1: And then does that mean that we're going to get seven.
Speaker 4: In this series?
Speaker 2: So it's it's I don't think it feels similar in
Speaker 2: terms of like the basketball because the basketball dynamic in
Speaker 2: the two series is so different. You know, obviously, Jokic
Speaker 2: was just straight up and dominable at times. Denver their
Speaker 2: defense was much more of like a pack to paint.
Speaker 2: We're mixing, mixing in a lot of zone, more passive,
Speaker 2: more contain that kind of thing. Indiana's applying a ton
Speaker 2: of ball pressures. There's a lot of like differences in
Speaker 2: the schematics. The reason why it feels like the Denver
Speaker 2: series is that this is actually a very common series
Speaker 2: progression that we see in the history of the NBA,
Speaker 2: which is you have a massive favorite, or not even
Speaker 2: a massive favorite, just a favorite. Because I think we
Speaker 2: can all agree that Oklahoma City probably shouldn't have been
Speaker 2: favored by as much as they were now, like and
Speaker 2: again my big misjudgment there was just Oklahoma City's lack
Speaker 2: of ball handling and not properly accounting for that with
Speaker 2: Indiana's ball pressure. But you have this per that takes
Speaker 2: place where the underdog steals a game on the road,
Speaker 2: whether it's game one or game two, it really don't matter.
Speaker 2: And then they come home and they're super excited, and
Speaker 2: game three has this like buzzsaw feel. And then you
Speaker 2: also have to keep in mind like even for the
Speaker 2: road team, it's still not really that desperate. It's just
Speaker 2: a one to one series, you know, and so they
Speaker 2: end up getting Game three. But game four always feels
Speaker 2: like the pivot point. The underdog always knows like, if
Speaker 2: we do not win this game, we're probably not winning
Speaker 2: this series, and so it brings a level of urgency
Speaker 2: in Game four kind of takes the feel of a
Speaker 2: Game seven in terms of like both teams know they
Speaker 2: desperately need that one, and the better team usually wins
Speaker 2: that type of game, like especially in the pros, like
Speaker 2: in college, there's a little bit more variance, and that's
Speaker 2: why the NCAA Tournament is the way that it is,
Speaker 2: but in the pros there's a little less variance, and
Speaker 2: so it kind of feels like the better team tends
Speaker 2: to win that Game four And you know, from here
Speaker 2: it just comes down to whether or not Indiana has
Speaker 2: the pride to win one more of these games, especially
Speaker 2: Game six at home, and we've seen teams that don't.
Speaker 2: You know, we've seen teams that come home in game
Speaker 2: six and just get rolled. I don't think the Pacers
Speaker 2: will get rolled. I think that'll be a good competitive game.
Speaker 2: But like it just to me, Oklahoma City was the
Speaker 2: better team and they got punched in the mouth by Indiana.
Speaker 2: And it's definitely been more precarious than it looked on
Speaker 2: the surface because of the reasons we've discussed. But ultimately,
Speaker 2: Oklahoma City is the better team, and when the shit
Speaker 2: hits the fan and they need to win a game,
Speaker 2: they're gonna be able to win a game against this team.
Speaker 2: All right, guys, that's all we have for YouTube tonight.
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Speaker 3: We'll see you guys over there in a few minutes.
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