1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:27,400 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of I Heart Radio. Welcome 2 00:00:27,440 --> 00:00:30,440 Speaker 1: back to the show Ridiculous Historians. As always, thank you 3 00:00:30,560 --> 00:00:33,879 Speaker 1: so much for tuning in. This is part two, an 4 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:39,040 Speaker 1: hour two part series on the self proclaimed hobo king 5 00:00:39,280 --> 00:00:42,680 Speaker 1: of not just the United States, but also believes in 6 00:00:42,760 --> 00:00:47,120 Speaker 1: Central America. He goes by two or three names. He 7 00:00:47,280 --> 00:00:51,440 Speaker 1: was born Leon Ray Livingston in eighteen seventy two. He 8 00:00:51,560 --> 00:00:54,560 Speaker 1: is perhaps better known on the roads and rails of 9 00:00:54,680 --> 00:00:59,440 Speaker 1: North America as a Number one. If you haven't heard 10 00:00:59,480 --> 00:01:04,319 Speaker 1: part one today's episode, please please please pause this listen 11 00:01:04,360 --> 00:01:07,520 Speaker 1: to that part and then tune into this episode, because 12 00:01:07,680 --> 00:01:12,680 Speaker 1: I promise you it will it will make way more sense. Uh. 13 00:01:12,720 --> 00:01:17,080 Speaker 1: My my name is Ben. I will not reveal my 14 00:01:17,160 --> 00:01:20,319 Speaker 1: hobo name on air. Yeah. I still go by the 15 00:01:20,400 --> 00:01:23,840 Speaker 1: squeaky chair. Um. That's my hobo name. Noel is my 16 00:01:23,840 --> 00:01:26,960 Speaker 1: my Christian name. Uh the name my mother gave me. 17 00:01:27,240 --> 00:01:30,039 Speaker 1: Is it your middle name? Christian? Yes, it actually is. 18 00:01:30,319 --> 00:01:33,680 Speaker 1: That's that's I didn't even think about that. Uh, Noel Christian, 19 00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:37,600 Speaker 1: squeaky chair Brown. That's what they call me on the rails. Um. 20 00:01:37,640 --> 00:01:39,840 Speaker 1: A number one is what they called our boy Livingston 21 00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:42,640 Speaker 1: on the rails. Uh. And it was after his return 22 00:01:43,760 --> 00:01:47,800 Speaker 1: from that time spent in Central America that he decided 23 00:01:47,840 --> 00:01:51,320 Speaker 1: to give himself this nickname that would really cement his legacy, 24 00:01:51,400 --> 00:01:54,800 Speaker 1: a number one. He wrote first about this in his 25 00:01:54,880 --> 00:01:59,040 Speaker 1: book Um. He said the Moniker was given to him 26 00:01:59,080 --> 00:02:02,080 Speaker 1: by a traveling hanging by the name of Frenchie. Um. 27 00:02:02,160 --> 00:02:05,480 Speaker 1: He said, every tramp gives his kid a nickname, a 28 00:02:05,560 --> 00:02:07,880 Speaker 1: name that will distinguish him from all other members of 29 00:02:07,920 --> 00:02:10,240 Speaker 1: the craft. I love that, referring to this life as 30 00:02:10,280 --> 00:02:13,920 Speaker 1: the craft. Um, you have been a good lad while 31 00:02:14,000 --> 00:02:16,560 Speaker 1: you have been with me, In fact, been always a 32 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:19,640 Speaker 1: number one and everything he had to do. And kid, 33 00:02:20,000 --> 00:02:22,640 Speaker 1: take my advice. If you have to be anything in life, 34 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:25,160 Speaker 1: even if a tramp, try to be a number one 35 00:02:25,480 --> 00:02:29,600 Speaker 1: all the time and in everything you undertake Um. He 36 00:02:29,680 --> 00:02:33,920 Speaker 1: also recommended that that he that that livingstone leave his 37 00:02:34,040 --> 00:02:37,960 Speaker 1: mark literally everywhere that he went by carving a number 38 00:02:37,960 --> 00:02:42,320 Speaker 1: one into mile markers UM as he passed them on 39 00:02:42,320 --> 00:02:45,520 Speaker 1: on his train travels. Uh, so people would know that 40 00:02:45,600 --> 00:02:49,560 Speaker 1: he'd been there. Um. And this really gets into our 41 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:54,200 Speaker 1: idea of hobo code and of a secret language of 42 00:02:54,280 --> 00:02:58,359 Speaker 1: symbols that were used by those in this kind of 43 00:02:58,440 --> 00:03:03,120 Speaker 1: freewheeling traveling lie to help communicate with one another non verbally. 44 00:03:03,600 --> 00:03:05,280 Speaker 1: And here's the thing been to your point in the 45 00:03:05,320 --> 00:03:09,560 Speaker 1: previous episode, Uh, today you can still find a number 46 00:03:09,600 --> 00:03:14,360 Speaker 1: one scribbles under bridges. In addition to this kind of 47 00:03:15,200 --> 00:03:20,919 Speaker 1: series of hieroglyphs that Livingston supposedly at the very least 48 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:25,639 Speaker 1: helped to proliferate and preserve and possibly even created. Um 49 00:03:25,800 --> 00:03:27,520 Speaker 1: something that I know you've been fascinated with for a 50 00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:31,000 Speaker 1: long time, Ben hobo code. Yeah, what a first off 51 00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:35,119 Speaker 1: shout out someone who has written their mark in all 52 00:03:35,160 --> 00:03:39,000 Speaker 1: of our hearts. I would say one of my favorite 53 00:03:39,080 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 1: off the grid travelers, Le Bush, who is a close 54 00:03:42,840 --> 00:03:49,080 Speaker 1: associate of our super producer Casey Pegram. You're right, Noel, 55 00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:55,760 Speaker 1: hobo code is a fascinating thing to the point about 56 00:03:56,160 --> 00:03:59,440 Speaker 1: a one I know a lot of us listening today 57 00:03:59,640 --> 00:04:04,400 Speaker 1: or one dream about the etymology of the phrase. We 58 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:08,440 Speaker 1: know that it traces at least back to eighteen thirty seven. 59 00:04:09,240 --> 00:04:15,120 Speaker 1: It was probably used in Lloyd's of London, the insurance 60 00:04:15,160 --> 00:04:21,720 Speaker 1: companies UH maritime system for rating of merchant vessels of 61 00:04:21,760 --> 00:04:29,680 Speaker 1: commercial watercraft, which actually jibes with Livingstone's story of you know, 62 00:04:29,839 --> 00:04:33,400 Speaker 1: hitting the ocean as well. As the rails, So perhaps 63 00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:38,800 Speaker 1: Frenchie himself had some sort of sailor stories in his background. 64 00:04:39,240 --> 00:04:42,719 Speaker 1: Also not a bad steak sauce. Hobo code is a 65 00:04:44,880 --> 00:04:48,320 Speaker 1: is a tricky thing, right you'll you know, one of 66 00:04:48,320 --> 00:04:54,480 Speaker 1: the big revelations that you can learn about hoboeing in general, 67 00:04:54,640 --> 00:04:58,320 Speaker 1: the tramp lifestyle, the vagabond lifestyle, is that it still 68 00:04:58,320 --> 00:05:01,760 Speaker 1: exists here in the United tod States, uh, and in 69 00:05:01,800 --> 00:05:07,440 Speaker 1: other parts of the world. But how how often was 70 00:05:07,480 --> 00:05:13,119 Speaker 1: hobo code used, how ubiquitous was it or how rare 71 00:05:13,520 --> 00:05:16,440 Speaker 1: was it. We know that you can find books dating 72 00:05:16,480 --> 00:05:20,159 Speaker 1: back to the early twenty century that show at least 73 00:05:20,400 --> 00:05:24,200 Speaker 1: some of these pictograms. There are the things that we 74 00:05:24,440 --> 00:05:28,880 Speaker 1: each described in episode one. Uh, you know, like a 75 00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:32,640 Speaker 1: circle with an arrow saying go this way or nol 76 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:37,640 Speaker 1: you mentioned the a frame tattoo that you're considering. Yeah, 77 00:05:37,720 --> 00:05:40,920 Speaker 1: it just means safe harbor, which is kind of broad. 78 00:05:41,000 --> 00:05:43,400 Speaker 1: I like that as a concept, just the idea of like, 79 00:05:43,760 --> 00:05:46,919 Speaker 1: you know, finding refuge somewhere. I think that's sort of 80 00:05:46,920 --> 00:05:49,440 Speaker 1: the idea. There would be ones that would indicate the 81 00:05:49,440 --> 00:05:51,440 Speaker 1: water is bad. They would be like you know, people 82 00:05:51,440 --> 00:05:53,520 Speaker 1: would draw it, maybe with a piece of chalk, on 83 00:05:53,560 --> 00:05:56,800 Speaker 1: a well, implying that the water was contaminated in some way. 84 00:05:57,320 --> 00:06:00,520 Speaker 1: There would be very specific ones like there's a kindly 85 00:06:00,760 --> 00:06:04,200 Speaker 1: old lady in this town that will give you free food, 86 00:06:04,640 --> 00:06:07,000 Speaker 1: you know, things like that. It really was interesting how 87 00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:09,560 Speaker 1: specific some of them would get when you look at 88 00:06:09,600 --> 00:06:11,919 Speaker 1: them pulled back like you can. You can google these. 89 00:06:12,080 --> 00:06:16,279 Speaker 1: They really do resemble hieroglyphics in a lot of ways. 90 00:06:16,360 --> 00:06:18,560 Speaker 1: Is the shape of them. Oh and by the way, 91 00:06:18,600 --> 00:06:21,200 Speaker 1: you can get a hobo code coffee mug from Society 92 00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:24,200 Speaker 1: six right now, um, which is pretty cool. There's one 93 00:06:24,360 --> 00:06:29,040 Speaker 1: that says, uh, yeah, kind lady lives here. Um. That 94 00:06:29,200 --> 00:06:33,520 Speaker 1: is actually a cute little kittie cat. Two lines next 95 00:06:33,520 --> 00:06:37,560 Speaker 1: to each other, parallel lines says the sky is the limit. 96 00:06:37,640 --> 00:06:40,119 Speaker 1: Not quite sure what that means. There's one that looks 97 00:06:40,160 --> 00:06:43,080 Speaker 1: like a fermata, which is a musical symbol that you 98 00:06:43,120 --> 00:06:46,600 Speaker 1: put over a note implying that you hold it indefinitely. Um. 99 00:06:46,640 --> 00:06:48,880 Speaker 1: So it's like an arc and a little dot in 100 00:06:48,920 --> 00:06:51,480 Speaker 1: the middle. And I do believe that one means that 101 00:06:52,000 --> 00:06:55,320 Speaker 1: the authorities in this town are hostile. And that would 102 00:06:55,320 --> 00:06:58,360 Speaker 1: be a lot of these, because you know, hoboes weren't 103 00:06:58,360 --> 00:07:01,560 Speaker 1: taken too kindly in some cities, in some towns, they 104 00:07:01,560 --> 00:07:04,240 Speaker 1: would be around a town on a rail where that 105 00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:08,080 Speaker 1: came from um and you know, so they these symbols 106 00:07:08,120 --> 00:07:12,160 Speaker 1: would be to kind of warren fellow travelers that maybe 107 00:07:12,320 --> 00:07:14,480 Speaker 1: your presence here would not be welcomed, that you'd be 108 00:07:14,560 --> 00:07:19,160 Speaker 1: met with hostility and even violence. Yeah, and it makes 109 00:07:19,200 --> 00:07:23,680 Speaker 1: sense that these sort of symbols would proliferate. They have 110 00:07:24,040 --> 00:07:29,440 Speaker 1: three very clever things about them. First, they function in 111 00:07:29,880 --> 00:07:35,440 Speaker 1: a camouflaged way. If you are not familiar with where 112 00:07:36,040 --> 00:07:39,280 Speaker 1: to look, if you are not familiar with what these 113 00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:45,040 Speaker 1: symbols mean, they could easily be taken as errant graffiti. Second, 114 00:07:45,120 --> 00:07:50,280 Speaker 1: they're very easy to make. There's nothing, you know, you 115 00:07:50,360 --> 00:07:54,240 Speaker 1: don't have to be a master artist to carve out 116 00:07:55,120 --> 00:07:59,760 Speaker 1: uh you know, straight lines, triangles and circles. But it's 117 00:07:59,760 --> 00:08:04,560 Speaker 1: still conveys the message. And Third, it functions as an 118 00:08:04,560 --> 00:08:10,320 Speaker 1: invisible language. It's it's a form of communication, right. That 119 00:08:10,480 --> 00:08:14,680 Speaker 1: is strictly for those in the know. It's not clear 120 00:08:14,960 --> 00:08:20,200 Speaker 1: yet whether Livingstone played a huge role in creating a 121 00:08:20,240 --> 00:08:26,720 Speaker 1: lot of hobo code, but he is credited with mainstreaming this. 122 00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:29,360 Speaker 1: I would say because for a lot of people in 123 00:08:29,400 --> 00:08:32,800 Speaker 1: the us, especially people who are well off enough to 124 00:08:33,040 --> 00:08:36,640 Speaker 1: buy books and to you know, have the leisure time 125 00:08:36,679 --> 00:08:40,720 Speaker 1: to read books. This is the moment they learn about 126 00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:45,640 Speaker 1: this secret language. They learn about it from the self 127 00:08:45,640 --> 00:08:50,760 Speaker 1: appointed hobo King Livingstone, and he is like, right now, 128 00:08:50,840 --> 00:08:53,720 Speaker 1: to put it in perspective, if if Livingstone were live 129 00:08:53,760 --> 00:08:58,320 Speaker 1: in he would be doing ted talks. He would be 130 00:08:58,360 --> 00:09:01,160 Speaker 1: the guy with a clicker in a really nice suit 131 00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:05,240 Speaker 1: talking about my thirty years as a hobo and what 132 00:09:05,400 --> 00:09:10,720 Speaker 1: that teaches us about America. Yeah, an entrepreneurial stick tuitiveness. 133 00:09:11,480 --> 00:09:15,760 Speaker 1: What I'm saying is he became more of a cultural 134 00:09:15,960 --> 00:09:21,080 Speaker 1: figure that like more of a media representation of a 135 00:09:21,080 --> 00:09:24,680 Speaker 1: hobo than an actual hobo. That's absolutely true. Band and 136 00:09:24,720 --> 00:09:26,280 Speaker 1: we mentioned the top of the show he had like 137 00:09:26,320 --> 00:09:29,240 Speaker 1: a forty dollar suit and he carried around a weird 138 00:09:29,320 --> 00:09:33,120 Speaker 1: collection of autograph pictures. Isn't that right then, that he 139 00:09:33,400 --> 00:09:36,440 Speaker 1: would use to impress people or I guess just you know, 140 00:09:36,600 --> 00:09:39,120 Speaker 1: how do you even have access to these? Who was it, Oh, 141 00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:45,400 Speaker 1: Thomas Anderson, William Howard taft Uh, Theodore Roosevelt, who is, 142 00:09:45,920 --> 00:09:50,880 Speaker 1: as everybody knows, most famous for his several appearances here 143 00:09:51,040 --> 00:09:58,760 Speaker 1: on Ridiculous History and Uh. Yeah, he's creating his own story, 144 00:09:59,160 --> 00:10:02,559 Speaker 1: you know. And and it's it's a snowball effect, right, 145 00:10:02,600 --> 00:10:08,840 Speaker 1: it's an aggregate process. He begins to influence the world 146 00:10:08,920 --> 00:10:13,880 Speaker 1: around him, and he is increasingly attempting to, at this 147 00:10:13,920 --> 00:10:17,959 Speaker 1: point in his life, lead people away from a life 148 00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:20,839 Speaker 1: on the road or a life on the rails. In fact, 149 00:10:20,960 --> 00:10:24,360 Speaker 1: how exciting is this If you are a reader in 150 00:10:24,400 --> 00:10:28,920 Speaker 1: the early twentieth century, you open a book and you 151 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:33,800 Speaker 1: see a disclaimer. First off, and this disclaimer says, wandering, 152 00:10:34,240 --> 00:10:38,120 Speaker 1: once it becomes a habit is almost incurable. So never 153 00:10:38,480 --> 00:10:42,400 Speaker 1: run away, but stay at home as a roving lad 154 00:10:42,640 --> 00:10:46,920 Speaker 1: usually ends in becoming a confirmed tramp, you know what 155 00:10:46,960 --> 00:10:48,600 Speaker 1: I mean. I don't know how you guys felt when 156 00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:50,920 Speaker 1: you were kids watching home movies and you would see 157 00:10:50,920 --> 00:10:54,040 Speaker 1: the FBI warning coming up. I always thought that made 158 00:10:54,080 --> 00:10:56,840 Speaker 1: something legit, you know what I mean. So that's how 159 00:10:56,880 --> 00:11:01,040 Speaker 1: people felt when they read these books. They saw the disclaimer. 160 00:11:01,120 --> 00:11:03,880 Speaker 1: It's a page turner. Uh. He said that it was 161 00:11:03,920 --> 00:11:08,280 Speaker 1: a pitiful existence that would end up leading people to 162 00:11:08,400 --> 00:11:14,000 Speaker 1: a popper's grave. It's illustrative of I don't know, like 163 00:11:14,040 --> 00:11:17,800 Speaker 1: ostensibly it's a warning, but I think it's more so 164 00:11:17,920 --> 00:11:20,640 Speaker 1: the barnum aspect I was talking about in episode one, 165 00:11:20,880 --> 00:11:24,400 Speaker 1: he is he's trying to entice in tantalize people. Yeah, 166 00:11:24,400 --> 00:11:26,200 Speaker 1: it reminds me of like that episode we did about 167 00:11:26,240 --> 00:11:28,680 Speaker 1: wanderlust and how it was like almost looked at it 168 00:11:28,720 --> 00:11:31,720 Speaker 1: as a as a disease, that kind of warning where 169 00:11:31,760 --> 00:11:34,719 Speaker 1: it's like stay put or else you're gonna become some 170 00:11:34,800 --> 00:11:38,560 Speaker 1: kind of pariah, some sort of the social you know, 171 00:11:38,880 --> 00:11:42,000 Speaker 1: like leper. Right. Yeah, I think that's I think that's 172 00:11:42,000 --> 00:11:45,800 Speaker 1: a good observation too. We have to remember that this 173 00:11:45,920 --> 00:11:50,840 Speaker 1: is happening during the during a massive expansionist phase right 174 00:11:51,120 --> 00:11:54,720 Speaker 1: in in the US or in North America, and so 175 00:11:55,080 --> 00:12:01,240 Speaker 1: people are, even if people aren't traveling widely there, fascinated 176 00:12:01,280 --> 00:12:04,360 Speaker 1: by the idea of doing so. I mean, it's a dream, 177 00:12:04,480 --> 00:12:08,160 Speaker 1: isn't it, to to travel without hindrance? Uh? And it's 178 00:12:08,200 --> 00:12:12,479 Speaker 1: a dream that Livingstone capitalizes on. He is making himself 179 00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:16,839 Speaker 1: a celebrity. To your earlier point, Noel, Uh. Not only 180 00:12:16,920 --> 00:12:21,600 Speaker 1: was he carrying around autographs from notable historical figures were 181 00:12:21,720 --> 00:12:26,640 Speaker 1: the Titans of the day, he also this is how 182 00:12:26,720 --> 00:12:32,760 Speaker 1: self aware he is. He's also seeking out local news 183 00:12:32,840 --> 00:12:37,400 Speaker 1: reporters in every city of note that he happens across. 184 00:12:37,720 --> 00:12:40,880 Speaker 1: So he's in St. Louis, you know, maybe he goes 185 00:12:40,920 --> 00:12:44,200 Speaker 1: back to Trucky, California. Who knows, he's in Poughkeepsie, He's 186 00:12:44,280 --> 00:12:47,920 Speaker 1: in Atlanta, wherever. I'm just we can make cities up. 187 00:12:47,920 --> 00:12:50,160 Speaker 1: At this point, one of the first things he does 188 00:12:50,720 --> 00:12:55,360 Speaker 1: is go to the local newspaper office and say, have 189 00:12:55,480 --> 00:12:59,240 Speaker 1: you heard of me may number one, the Hobo King, 190 00:12:59,640 --> 00:13:02,679 Speaker 1: And I'll do an interview with you. And it works. 191 00:13:02,800 --> 00:13:06,800 Speaker 1: People love these stories. They get published everywhere, and so 192 00:13:07,640 --> 00:13:13,800 Speaker 1: he becomes so well known that authors and artists start 193 00:13:13,920 --> 00:13:17,439 Speaker 1: picking up this idea. You know, he represents this concept. 194 00:13:17,760 --> 00:13:22,000 Speaker 1: Jack London, author of White Fang and The Call of 195 00:13:22,000 --> 00:13:25,560 Speaker 1: the Wild, and um, I think one of my favorite 196 00:13:25,559 --> 00:13:28,040 Speaker 1: stories from Jack London is a short story called to 197 00:13:28,120 --> 00:13:32,120 Speaker 1: Build a Fire. This guy, Jack London, he loves, he's 198 00:13:32,160 --> 00:13:37,160 Speaker 1: growing up and he loves a number one. He actually 199 00:13:37,240 --> 00:13:41,240 Speaker 1: he writes to Livingston and says, you know, tell me 200 00:13:41,280 --> 00:13:45,320 Speaker 1: about the hobo lifestyle in the late eighteen hundreds, and 201 00:13:45,360 --> 00:13:47,920 Speaker 1: they actually go on a trip together, I think, an 202 00:13:47,920 --> 00:13:52,679 Speaker 1: epic road trip, which, by the way, Livingstone also capitalizes 203 00:13:52,720 --> 00:13:56,720 Speaker 1: on in a later book called From Coast to Coast 204 00:13:57,120 --> 00:14:02,160 Speaker 1: with Jack London amazing zing title. It's Get This Little. 205 00:14:02,440 --> 00:14:07,600 Speaker 1: It comes out in v one year after Jack London 206 00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:12,640 Speaker 1: actually passes away. Oh yeah, that's a new ben. You 207 00:14:12,679 --> 00:14:17,000 Speaker 1: are spot on about Livingstone being like a proto ted 208 00:14:17,080 --> 00:14:20,000 Speaker 1: talk type. I mean, seriously, he really is kind of 209 00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:25,080 Speaker 1: cultivating this uh cult of personality. I guess for lack 210 00:14:25,120 --> 00:14:28,320 Speaker 1: of a better expression, not to be redundant with reusing 211 00:14:28,320 --> 00:14:31,960 Speaker 1: the cult sound twice, but it's true he's building like 212 00:14:32,160 --> 00:14:37,600 Speaker 1: a lifestyle um around this kind of hobo world um 213 00:14:37,720 --> 00:14:41,320 Speaker 1: and absolutely capitalizing on this uh, this sort of hobo 214 00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:45,000 Speaker 1: lifestyle um. And you know, considering you know, we we 215 00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:47,680 Speaker 1: we've talked about the romanticized version of it that he 216 00:14:47,800 --> 00:14:51,400 Speaker 1: certainly was the pioneer of. But this was not as 217 00:14:51,520 --> 00:14:54,440 Speaker 1: much of a choice at this point as we maybe 218 00:14:54,520 --> 00:14:57,520 Speaker 1: originally set it up to be. Uh. It really was 219 00:14:57,680 --> 00:15:00,680 Speaker 1: people that were in desperate need of income and would 220 00:15:00,720 --> 00:15:03,360 Speaker 1: do whatever it took and go whatever wherever they needed 221 00:15:03,400 --> 00:15:05,280 Speaker 1: to go in order to get it. And we're on 222 00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:08,960 Speaker 1: the heels of the Great Depression too, when this lifestyle 223 00:15:08,960 --> 00:15:13,960 Speaker 1: absolutely became critical for people to even survive and migrant 224 00:15:13,960 --> 00:15:16,880 Speaker 1: farm workers and we know how that went if you've 225 00:15:16,880 --> 00:15:20,560 Speaker 1: read Steinbeck's wonderful chronicle of of this time period, The 226 00:15:20,560 --> 00:15:23,320 Speaker 1: Grapes of Wrath, so a little problematic that he's sort 227 00:15:23,320 --> 00:15:26,480 Speaker 1: of capitalizing on this. He's almost sort of like a Phobo. 228 00:15:27,280 --> 00:15:31,320 Speaker 1: I just coined that. Sorry, it's okay, I like it, though, phobo. Uh, 229 00:15:31,360 --> 00:15:33,240 Speaker 1: you know, he really is sort of doing this for 230 00:15:33,320 --> 00:15:39,040 Speaker 1: his own big picture kind of publishing rights, kind of 231 00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:44,000 Speaker 1: residual return, kind of in the game. Right. Yeah, So 232 00:15:45,160 --> 00:15:50,120 Speaker 1: he predates the Great Depression, he anticipates it, and this 233 00:15:50,240 --> 00:15:57,160 Speaker 1: is still the romanticized version of the the vagabonds in 234 00:15:57,160 --> 00:16:01,720 Speaker 1: in US culture because a great Depression has not hit. 235 00:16:02,360 --> 00:16:05,600 Speaker 1: When it does, and when we get to the stuff 236 00:16:05,600 --> 00:16:10,520 Speaker 1: Steinbeck's writing about, you know, we're talking about thousands and 237 00:16:10,680 --> 00:16:14,920 Speaker 1: thousands of people who didn't want to travel for fun. 238 00:16:15,280 --> 00:16:17,640 Speaker 1: They wanted to stay at home, they wanted to keep 239 00:16:17,680 --> 00:16:22,680 Speaker 1: their house. Uh, this is not a spiritual journey for them. 240 00:16:23,200 --> 00:16:28,880 Speaker 1: Uh nowadays, And I do, like Phobo, No, I think that. 241 00:16:29,000 --> 00:16:32,640 Speaker 1: I think that's what written. But nowadays, Uh, the term 242 00:16:32,720 --> 00:16:37,000 Speaker 1: would be something like google with two os O O 243 00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:40,680 Speaker 1: g L E. I'm not sure if I'm pronouncing that correctly, 244 00:16:40,760 --> 00:16:43,760 Speaker 1: but you can learn more about it. That's the thing. 245 00:16:43,960 --> 00:16:48,720 Speaker 1: Livingston did not have to do this. He liked doing this. 246 00:16:49,240 --> 00:16:54,080 Speaker 1: He was he was primarily an author, a depict or, 247 00:16:54,400 --> 00:16:59,560 Speaker 1: a describer of this life. In fact, he had actually, 248 00:16:59,560 --> 00:17:03,280 Speaker 1: like many itinerant travelers of the time, he had a 249 00:17:03,320 --> 00:17:06,160 Speaker 1: couple of let's call him home basis, let's call him 250 00:17:06,200 --> 00:17:10,560 Speaker 1: stop ins. You know how, I don't know, Casey. Have 251 00:17:10,640 --> 00:17:13,359 Speaker 1: you guys ever had an outside cat as a friend 252 00:17:13,960 --> 00:17:16,960 Speaker 1: and and like, you know, the cats got somewhere that 253 00:17:17,040 --> 00:17:21,760 Speaker 1: it sleeps, but it stops by houses. Yes, absolutely. In fact, 254 00:17:21,760 --> 00:17:24,560 Speaker 1: there is a there's a gas station around the corner 255 00:17:24,600 --> 00:17:28,200 Speaker 1: from my old house where the the employees there would 256 00:17:28,200 --> 00:17:30,719 Speaker 1: actually put out food, and so that place was just 257 00:17:30,840 --> 00:17:37,399 Speaker 1: like a hub of of itinerant cat friends. What about you, Casey, Yeah, 258 00:17:37,480 --> 00:17:40,640 Speaker 1: my dad at his office had that sort of cat, 259 00:17:41,040 --> 00:17:43,480 Speaker 1: called him Tiger, and he hung around for years and 260 00:17:43,560 --> 00:17:45,879 Speaker 1: years just you know, coming to the back door and 261 00:17:45,960 --> 00:17:47,560 Speaker 1: getting a little bit of food, a little bit of milk, 262 00:17:47,640 --> 00:17:49,000 Speaker 1: that kind of thing, and kind of going on his 263 00:17:49,080 --> 00:17:52,480 Speaker 1: way and very friendly but at the same time assertive 264 00:17:52,520 --> 00:17:55,720 Speaker 1: and independent. You know. Yeah, they're making a circuit, right, 265 00:17:55,840 --> 00:18:00,240 Speaker 1: that's kind of that's kind of what Livingston a peers 266 00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:03,359 Speaker 1: to be doing. One of his home bases is a 267 00:18:03,359 --> 00:18:08,760 Speaker 1: place called Mrs Cunningham's boarding House in Cambridge Springs, Pennsylvania. 268 00:18:09,080 --> 00:18:12,280 Speaker 1: Mrs Cunningham's boarding House, by the way, it sounds like 269 00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:15,680 Speaker 1: something that Noel and Casey and I would make up 270 00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:21,080 Speaker 1: as a as a wholesome spot in our screenplay. Right. Oh, 271 00:18:21,280 --> 00:18:24,120 Speaker 1: let's go to Mrs Cunningham's boarding House. You know they 272 00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:28,960 Speaker 1: have a Sunday roast every oh Sunday. Look, we're still 273 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:32,159 Speaker 1: working out the script. But that's where he wrote a 274 00:18:32,160 --> 00:18:36,440 Speaker 1: lot of books, is indeed, including The Ways of the Hobo, 275 00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:41,119 Speaker 1: where he actually claimed that the house became a mecca 276 00:18:41,920 --> 00:18:45,199 Speaker 1: to other hobo's. Of of of his ilk, which he 277 00:18:45,240 --> 00:18:49,160 Speaker 1: referred to as chronic hobo's seems a little insulting, um, 278 00:18:49,200 --> 00:18:52,600 Speaker 1: but whatever. And he referred to his friends Hobo Mike 279 00:18:53,080 --> 00:18:56,320 Speaker 1: and Denver Johnny. I love Hobo Mike, just just get 280 00:18:56,400 --> 00:18:59,600 Speaker 1: right to it. Uh and uh. And they would come by, 281 00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:02,200 Speaker 1: you know, just to kind of wrap and and get 282 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:05,000 Speaker 1: some advice and um, you know, and just kind of 283 00:19:05,040 --> 00:19:08,840 Speaker 1: have someone to spend some time with a little companionship. Um. 284 00:19:08,840 --> 00:19:18,200 Speaker 1: When they when they when they passed through. Speaking of companionship, 285 00:19:18,359 --> 00:19:22,800 Speaker 1: ridiculous history. It's We've got a twist for you. This 286 00:19:22,840 --> 00:19:25,960 Speaker 1: story turns out to be a little bit of a 287 00:19:26,160 --> 00:19:31,679 Speaker 1: rom com because you see, Livingstone did not spend his 288 00:19:31,880 --> 00:19:35,280 Speaker 1: entire life on the road. He did not die on 289 00:19:35,320 --> 00:19:41,159 Speaker 1: the rails. In nineteen fourteen, he officially tied the knot 290 00:19:41,800 --> 00:19:47,439 Speaker 1: with a woman named Mary Troski. Uh And and he 291 00:19:47,520 --> 00:19:51,560 Speaker 1: tried to settle down in Erie, Pennsylvania, nol. What was 292 00:19:51,600 --> 00:19:55,200 Speaker 1: the what was the word that people were using as 293 00:19:55,240 --> 00:19:58,440 Speaker 1: the female equivalent of hobo? What what do you call it? 294 00:19:58,440 --> 00:20:05,560 Speaker 1: It was boat bo b b o E T t e. Uh. Yeah, 295 00:20:05,680 --> 00:20:08,320 Speaker 1: I don't know about that one, but it's interesting. Remember 296 00:20:08,359 --> 00:20:10,800 Speaker 1: remember in the wolf Whistle episode, how we were totally 297 00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:13,400 Speaker 1: taken for a ride for the idea of the female 298 00:20:13,400 --> 00:20:20,119 Speaker 1: equivalent of the wolf Whistle calls the slurp utter fallacy. 299 00:20:20,520 --> 00:20:22,320 Speaker 1: Uh loved it though that We took us all a 300 00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:24,960 Speaker 1: minute to kind of be like, wait a minute. Sometimes 301 00:20:25,040 --> 00:20:26,960 Speaker 1: it's again, there's a lot of a lot of similarities 302 00:20:27,000 --> 00:20:30,760 Speaker 1: in this story where, uh, sometimes you know, you can't 303 00:20:30,800 --> 00:20:33,439 Speaker 1: let the facts stand in the way of a good story, 304 00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:35,800 Speaker 1: as my mother would say. But yeah, he settled down 305 00:20:35,880 --> 00:20:41,480 Speaker 1: the Hobo king a number one himself settled down in Eerie, Pennsylvania. Uh, 306 00:20:41,520 --> 00:20:44,479 Speaker 1: and he spent time, you know, working various jobs, uh, 307 00:20:44,920 --> 00:20:49,679 Speaker 1: from electric companies to steal um all around the area. 308 00:20:49,960 --> 00:20:54,200 Speaker 1: And eventually, according to one source that we found, um, 309 00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:58,160 Speaker 1: he got into real estate. It's pretty lucrative, um compared 310 00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:00,280 Speaker 1: to all of these you know itinerant jobs that he'd 311 00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:02,040 Speaker 1: been doing over the years. And I don't know, I 312 00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:04,520 Speaker 1: we don't have a sense that he like made a 313 00:21:04,560 --> 00:21:07,399 Speaker 1: mint or anything off of his publishing. Ben what what 314 00:21:07,440 --> 00:21:11,159 Speaker 1: did you discover in that department, because he definitely was 315 00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:13,960 Speaker 1: sort of a minor celebrity at this point. You know, 316 00:21:14,080 --> 00:21:16,800 Speaker 1: he really did was kind of the most famous hobo 317 00:21:16,840 --> 00:21:19,920 Speaker 1: in America. Can't imagine they didn't get some some good 318 00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:24,480 Speaker 1: coin from all that stuff. Yeah, yeah, he was. He 319 00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:29,040 Speaker 1: was no uh man, some Musa or Jeff Bezos. Uh, 320 00:21:29,119 --> 00:21:33,000 Speaker 1: those are probably well mansa Musa is the richest person 321 00:21:33,240 --> 00:21:35,920 Speaker 1: in the history of civilization that we know of, and 322 00:21:36,560 --> 00:21:39,959 Speaker 1: Jeff Bezos is well on the way. But yeah, he 323 00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:44,920 Speaker 1: wasn't you know, he didn't buy an entire railroad for instance. 324 00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:48,960 Speaker 1: That's something that you would do if you liked railroads 325 00:21:48,960 --> 00:21:54,600 Speaker 1: and you were a billionaire. Multimillionaire. Uh, he probably was 326 00:21:54,760 --> 00:21:59,800 Speaker 1: traveling the lecture circuit for income. He probably needed to 327 00:21:59,840 --> 00:22:02,760 Speaker 1: do you that And and it was very common for 328 00:22:03,040 --> 00:22:09,359 Speaker 1: people of note too become orators later in life. And 329 00:22:10,040 --> 00:22:16,439 Speaker 1: interestingly enough, the majority of his lectures about this, uh, 330 00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:19,680 Speaker 1: this movable life, let's call it. Actually, I'm gonna write 331 00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:21,440 Speaker 1: that down. That's a great title for a story. I 332 00:22:21,520 --> 00:22:25,280 Speaker 1: love this, this movable life that he is into. Uh. 333 00:22:25,320 --> 00:22:30,040 Speaker 1: He he speaks against it in these lectures. You know, Mama, 334 00:22:30,080 --> 00:22:33,000 Speaker 1: don't let your babies grow up to be cowboys, except 335 00:22:33,040 --> 00:22:36,600 Speaker 1: switch out cowboys for hoboes. And at this point we 336 00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:39,520 Speaker 1: have arrived at the time in history when the Great 337 00:22:39,560 --> 00:22:49,480 Speaker 1: Depression does hit. Livingstone is alive. He is fighting against tramping. Unfortunately, 338 00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:54,440 Speaker 1: right now we know that he made these anti hobo, 339 00:22:54,560 --> 00:22:58,600 Speaker 1: anti vagabond lectures, but we don't have a copy of them, 340 00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:02,720 Speaker 1: so we don't know why he actually said. And once 341 00:23:02,760 --> 00:23:07,800 Speaker 1: again we find ourselves left with rumors. Right yeah, and 342 00:23:07,840 --> 00:23:12,879 Speaker 1: they ranged from the fantastic to the banal. Uh. My favorite, 343 00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:15,560 Speaker 1: which would just be like the poetic way uh for 344 00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:17,320 Speaker 1: him to end his life, is that he died in 345 00:23:17,320 --> 00:23:22,200 Speaker 1: a train wreck in Houston, Texas in nineteen forty four. UM, 346 00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:26,760 Speaker 1: but he apparently had impersonators because he had such a 347 00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:30,600 Speaker 1: you know, high profile, that he literally had hobo copycats 348 00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:34,119 Speaker 1: that were sort of biting his stick. And UM it's 349 00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:37,120 Speaker 1: possible if this was confused with a nineteen twelve train 350 00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:40,879 Speaker 1: wreck that killed one of these pretenders to the crown, 351 00:23:41,040 --> 00:23:47,800 Speaker 1: the hobo crown mainly Uh. The most reliable version of 352 00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:52,080 Speaker 1: his passing UM has him UM succumbing to heart failure 353 00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:56,040 Speaker 1: UH in his home on April five, at the right 354 00:23:56,119 --> 00:24:00,879 Speaker 1: old age of seventy one, with his wife standing by. UM. 355 00:24:01,200 --> 00:24:04,440 Speaker 1: So yeah, it's interesting, but makes a lot of sense. 356 00:24:04,480 --> 00:24:08,880 Speaker 1: I guess that, you know, somebody who was so invested 357 00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:13,280 Speaker 1: in mythologizing his his life and becoming this larger than 358 00:24:13,359 --> 00:24:15,840 Speaker 1: life kind of figure that there's still some mystery that 359 00:24:15,920 --> 00:24:21,400 Speaker 1: surrounds the way he left uh, this mortal coil UM. 360 00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:24,040 Speaker 1: And you know, he's not someone that I'd ever heard 361 00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:28,399 Speaker 1: of UM before, you know, gave hipped us to this topic. 362 00:24:29,600 --> 00:24:33,119 Speaker 1: But he was dramatized in a film. His relationship with 363 00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:36,720 Speaker 1: Jack London is probably the most enduring UM pop culture 364 00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:41,280 Speaker 1: kind of uh remnant of his story. UM. And Lee 365 00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:45,000 Speaker 1: Marvin actually played him in a film in nineteen seventy 366 00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:47,840 Speaker 1: three called The Emperor of the North, which was based 367 00:24:47,880 --> 00:24:51,600 Speaker 1: on Livingstone's time on the Road with Jack London and 368 00:24:51,760 --> 00:24:54,880 Speaker 1: London's book The Road. And then, of course we see 369 00:24:54,920 --> 00:25:00,440 Speaker 1: the thematic descendant there in Jack Caro Wax on The Road. 370 00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:05,720 Speaker 1: I I'm not gonna disparage one or the other. I'm 371 00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:08,399 Speaker 1: just gonna say Jack London wrote a book called The Road. 372 00:25:09,080 --> 00:25:12,280 Speaker 1: Jack Carroll act later wrote a book called On the Road, 373 00:25:13,200 --> 00:25:16,240 Speaker 1: sort of like Ghostbusters and the Real Ghostbusters. If you 374 00:25:16,280 --> 00:25:21,199 Speaker 1: guys remember that animated series. I have a I have 375 00:25:21,240 --> 00:25:23,760 Speaker 1: a book here that would be interesting for people who 376 00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:27,480 Speaker 1: want another opinion. You see, while Livingstone is the self 377 00:25:27,520 --> 00:25:33,159 Speaker 1: appointed hobo King, many people in that community did not 378 00:25:33,359 --> 00:25:37,320 Speaker 1: consider him necessarily the be all end all. He was 379 00:25:37,400 --> 00:25:43,359 Speaker 1: just the most mainstreamed version of people who were largely 380 00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:48,480 Speaker 1: ignored by American society. There's a book I found called 381 00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:52,880 Speaker 1: The Last Great American Hobo Case. You know, you guys 382 00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:56,480 Speaker 1: can see that this face here on the zoom. This 383 00:25:56,560 --> 00:26:01,080 Speaker 1: was published in and a Tree is what the author 384 00:26:01,160 --> 00:26:07,640 Speaker 1: calls the life of the oldest active hobo left. This 385 00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:12,480 Speaker 1: is strange because we see again the history doesn't ever 386 00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:15,480 Speaker 1: stop you know what I mean, it doesn't exist in 387 00:26:15,520 --> 00:26:18,280 Speaker 1: the past tense. There's so much more stuff we could 388 00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:24,200 Speaker 1: talk about with hoboes, though, you know, hobo code importantly 389 00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:27,959 Speaker 1: does actually exist to some degree. And for any of 390 00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:33,000 Speaker 1: our fellow ridiculous historians who are saying, hey, maybe this 391 00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:38,160 Speaker 1: hobo king didn't actually travel very much at all, we 392 00:26:38,280 --> 00:26:43,520 Speaker 1: do have to point out that Susan Phillips, an anthropologist 393 00:26:43,680 --> 00:26:48,080 Speaker 1: at Pitzer College, did not just find hobo code. She 394 00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:54,400 Speaker 1: saw actual marks, actual marks from a number one, which 395 00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:58,480 Speaker 1: means Leon Ray Livingston did at least hit the rails 396 00:26:59,560 --> 00:27:02,639 Speaker 1: to some degree. So so there is some truth to 397 00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:06,119 Speaker 1: his story. He's not completely lying, you know what I mean, Yeah, no, 398 00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:09,080 Speaker 1: totally Again, it's the devil's in the details, right, But 399 00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:12,400 Speaker 1: he wasn't the only one she found um references and 400 00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:14,440 Speaker 1: and kind of tags. I guess you think of graffiti 401 00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:16,520 Speaker 1: culture now and it's all about you know, having that 402 00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:18,520 Speaker 1: name and having that style, or like you know with 403 00:27:18,560 --> 00:27:21,320 Speaker 1: Boscuiati had the little crown, or it's all about people 404 00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:24,040 Speaker 1: knowing exactly who you are and leaving your mark. That 405 00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:26,960 Speaker 1: is largely where this came from. Is this kind of 406 00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:30,159 Speaker 1: trained culture and this hobo culture and folks like Oakland 407 00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:33,440 Speaker 1: Red and the Tucson Kid and what do we say 408 00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:36,800 Speaker 1: earlier there was hobo Steve. Uh no, it wasn't Steve, 409 00:27:36,800 --> 00:27:39,240 Speaker 1: but it was some hobo Mike. Hobo Mike, good old 410 00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:42,360 Speaker 1: hobo Mike. I love that. And uh, you know, if 411 00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:44,680 Speaker 1: I had been around in those days, I think Squeaky 412 00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:47,360 Speaker 1: Chair would have would have made a dent. I think 413 00:27:47,359 --> 00:27:50,080 Speaker 1: that would have been remembered fondly. Do you think people 414 00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:53,760 Speaker 1: would have just started calling you squeaky Squeaky's Ah, that's 415 00:27:53,800 --> 00:27:56,200 Speaker 1: way better. That's a way better hobo name. Ben. That's 416 00:27:56,200 --> 00:28:00,240 Speaker 1: a really good point, do you you know? The From 417 00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:03,560 Speaker 1: what I understood, the rule was in those days that 418 00:28:03,760 --> 00:28:06,440 Speaker 1: someone it was like the same with any nickname, someone 419 00:28:06,560 --> 00:28:09,399 Speaker 1: else had to give you the name. That's right. There's 420 00:28:09,440 --> 00:28:13,560 Speaker 1: another fact that I was dying to mention throughout part 421 00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:17,439 Speaker 1: one of this episode. Uh, we'll mention it now, but 422 00:28:18,760 --> 00:28:20,960 Speaker 1: I'm not going to give the full story because we 423 00:28:21,000 --> 00:28:24,720 Speaker 1: are a family show. You guys, remember the song Big 424 00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:27,560 Speaker 1: Rock Candy Mountain Noll. This is familiar to you from 425 00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:31,280 Speaker 1: stuff they don't want you to know totally. Big Rock 426 00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:36,479 Speaker 1: Candy Mountain is a relatively innocuous song. The version that 427 00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:41,840 Speaker 1: exists in the modern day. How Whoever, the original version 428 00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:47,720 Speaker 1: has an extra verse which is sinister and disturbing and 429 00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:52,720 Speaker 1: gives light to the realities of living without a home, 430 00:28:53,280 --> 00:28:56,800 Speaker 1: because you know, we we've mainly been focusing on in 431 00:28:56,840 --> 00:28:59,240 Speaker 1: this one, especially you know, with living to himself, him 432 00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:02,800 Speaker 1: having made this choice, uh, you know, very consciously because 433 00:29:02,840 --> 00:29:06,080 Speaker 1: he had family. He his family what didn't even disown him. 434 00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:08,600 Speaker 1: We have that part a little ways back where they 435 00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:10,520 Speaker 1: write to him and are pleased to hear of his 436 00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:13,680 Speaker 1: exploits and he probably could have gone home and you know, 437 00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:17,320 Speaker 1: lived off of their largesse anytime he wanted to. They 438 00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:20,560 Speaker 1: they seemed to do just fine. But we haven't even 439 00:29:20,600 --> 00:29:23,640 Speaker 1: talked about the idea of like kids that are, you know, 440 00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:27,040 Speaker 1: living this life because they have no parents, either their 441 00:29:27,080 --> 00:29:29,960 Speaker 1: parents have died or maybe they were abused and they 442 00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:33,280 Speaker 1: ran away. And yeah, the the lyric and Big Rock 443 00:29:33,320 --> 00:29:35,760 Speaker 1: Cany Mountains all about kind of almost selling those kids 444 00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:39,200 Speaker 1: into a type of slavery um and that is absolutely 445 00:29:39,240 --> 00:29:42,360 Speaker 1: a thing if you think about, like in Pinocchio for example, Uh, 446 00:29:42,440 --> 00:29:44,960 Speaker 1: the idea of those kids that are sort of these 447 00:29:45,000 --> 00:29:48,880 Speaker 1: like living under sort of a much less benevolent hobo 448 00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:52,480 Speaker 1: king who would you know, put these kids to work 449 00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:55,400 Speaker 1: and and have them running grifts for for him, like 450 00:29:55,440 --> 00:29:58,760 Speaker 1: an Oliver for example. UM, So there is absolutely a 451 00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:03,400 Speaker 1: dark side to we have largely characterized as kind of 452 00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:07,200 Speaker 1: like a freewheeling you know, sunny go where you want 453 00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:11,080 Speaker 1: kind of mentality. UM, can't forget that. But it's very 454 00:30:11,080 --> 00:30:17,640 Speaker 1: interesting how um this guy is essentially stood the test 455 00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:20,000 Speaker 1: of time, largely I think because of his relationship with 456 00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:22,920 Speaker 1: Jack London as being sort of one of the most 457 00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:27,280 Speaker 1: famous hoboes in the history of of the the life, 458 00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:30,840 Speaker 1: I guess. And he actually wrote twelve books on hobo 459 00:30:30,960 --> 00:30:34,440 Speaker 1: life and you can still see his mark. Uh you know, 460 00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:38,520 Speaker 1: etch gender Stone and underpasses. Because these train lines have 461 00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:41,680 Speaker 1: been around for a long time, it's very difficult to 462 00:30:41,760 --> 00:30:49,440 Speaker 1: just uproot that kind of infrastructure. I think. A great 463 00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:51,600 Speaker 1: place to end this two part series, which I have 464 00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:55,360 Speaker 1: absolutely enjoyed, is with just a couple of excerpts quite 465 00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:58,760 Speaker 1: long from a disclaimer that Livingston put at the beginning 466 00:30:58,760 --> 00:31:02,360 Speaker 1: of all twelve of his books. UM, where he kind 467 00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:04,680 Speaker 1: of sets up with his backstory a little bit and 468 00:31:04,680 --> 00:31:06,840 Speaker 1: sort of the choice he made, you know, to live 469 00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:10,120 Speaker 1: this life. Um. But then he also does acknowledge that 470 00:31:10,240 --> 00:31:12,960 Speaker 1: dark side that we talked about just a second ago. Yeah, 471 00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:17,360 Speaker 1: there's interesting language here that indicates showmanship, uh, and also 472 00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:21,560 Speaker 1: indicates a little bit of what I would call style 473 00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:24,600 Speaker 1: in on it in the parlance of our own day. 474 00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:28,720 Speaker 1: First off, he reveals his age. Perhaps some may think 475 00:31:28,800 --> 00:31:31,440 Speaker 1: that a man who has attained only the age of 476 00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:34,800 Speaker 1: thirty eight years has hardly enough a crewed experience to 477 00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:39,760 Speaker 1: justify him in writing and autobiography. Good point, right, But 478 00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:45,920 Speaker 1: then he uses pretty um academic language when later he says, 479 00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:48,960 Speaker 1: we're other men of my age to write their life story. 480 00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:53,520 Speaker 1: It could ordinarily be summed up with cesarean brevity. Really 481 00:31:53,880 --> 00:31:58,240 Speaker 1: cesarean brevity. Is that even even in the early nineteen 482 00:31:58,280 --> 00:32:00,920 Speaker 1: hundreds are people saying that, I don't know about that one. Ben. 483 00:32:01,000 --> 00:32:03,800 Speaker 1: It's but he's definitely got a got a gift in 484 00:32:03,920 --> 00:32:06,280 Speaker 1: terms of his colorful language and the way he paints 485 00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:09,640 Speaker 1: a picture. Um. He wraps it up with this this uh, 486 00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:11,880 Speaker 1: this description here that I think is a really good 487 00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:14,400 Speaker 1: job of characterizing kind of the ups and the downs 488 00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:17,520 Speaker 1: and all of the different pitfalls that can be associated 489 00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:20,520 Speaker 1: with the hobo life. Uh. Quote there's a dark side 490 00:32:20,520 --> 00:32:23,280 Speaker 1: to a tramp's life. For every mile stolen on trains, 491 00:32:23,320 --> 00:32:26,240 Speaker 1: there is one escape from a horrible death. For each 492 00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:29,239 Speaker 1: mile of beautiful scenery and food in plenty, there are 493 00:32:29,280 --> 00:32:32,320 Speaker 1: many weary miles of hard walking with no food or 494 00:32:32,360 --> 00:32:36,280 Speaker 1: even water, through mountain gorges and over parched deserts. For 495 00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:39,440 Speaker 1: each warm summer night, there are ten bitter cold, long 496 00:32:39,520 --> 00:32:42,720 Speaker 1: winter nights. For every kindness, there are a score of 497 00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:46,480 Speaker 1: unfriendly acts. A tramp is constantly hounded by the minions 498 00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:49,600 Speaker 1: of the law, is shunned by all humanity, and never 499 00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:52,880 Speaker 1: knows the meaning of home and friends. You can read 500 00:32:52,920 --> 00:33:00,360 Speaker 1: the entire disclaimer courtesy of Harvard University Online. Now just out, 501 00:33:00,640 --> 00:33:03,440 Speaker 1: you know, just find your search engine of choice and 502 00:33:03,600 --> 00:33:09,040 Speaker 1: check out Born to Ramble, Harvard University Hobo King Livingston. 503 00:33:09,320 --> 00:33:13,040 Speaker 1: We've got the keywords for you. I do have to see. 504 00:33:13,440 --> 00:33:18,080 Speaker 1: This guy is a fantastic writer, and it speaks very 505 00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:23,160 Speaker 1: highly of his craft that he is still so uh 506 00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:29,680 Speaker 1: compelling and enjoyable today. In fact, Livingstone plays a huge 507 00:33:29,800 --> 00:33:38,480 Speaker 1: part in the modern uh sort of archetype of the hobo. 508 00:33:38,560 --> 00:33:41,600 Speaker 1: I believe a lot of our fellow ridiculous historians are 509 00:33:41,600 --> 00:33:45,880 Speaker 1: probably familiar with the box Car Children book series. I 510 00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:48,719 Speaker 1: don't know about you. I never read it, always more 511 00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:50,800 Speaker 1: as scary stories to tell him the dark kind of guy. 512 00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:54,560 Speaker 1: When Scholastic rolled through. Yeah, I never heard those either, 513 00:33:54,560 --> 00:33:56,320 Speaker 1: but they were definitely on the shelf in my like, 514 00:33:56,800 --> 00:33:59,160 Speaker 1: I want to say, fifth grade class seems about right. 515 00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:01,920 Speaker 1: I was more to the more dark and depressing kind 516 00:34:01,920 --> 00:34:05,560 Speaker 1: of stuff and like the Bridges to Terribithia and uh, 517 00:34:05,600 --> 00:34:08,040 Speaker 1: you know, The Giver and all that stuff. But they 518 00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:13,440 Speaker 1: were definitely super popular, um and absolutely kind of dramatized, 519 00:34:13,880 --> 00:34:16,480 Speaker 1: made a little more palatable for a young adult audience 520 00:34:16,520 --> 00:34:18,920 Speaker 1: of this kind of hobo life. But I'm sure there 521 00:34:18,920 --> 00:34:21,560 Speaker 1: were some trials and tribulations in there. Again, having not 522 00:34:21,600 --> 00:34:23,560 Speaker 1: read the books, I can't really say for sure, but 523 00:34:23,640 --> 00:34:26,960 Speaker 1: I know they were very popular and absolutely influenced by 524 00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:30,879 Speaker 1: this gentleman's proliferation of this kind of culture. I think 525 00:34:30,920 --> 00:34:34,840 Speaker 1: the box I think maybe their parents passed away and 526 00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:39,200 Speaker 1: they had to live in a box car or yeah, 527 00:34:39,239 --> 00:34:41,160 Speaker 1: you know, I don't know if anybody is a fan 528 00:34:41,239 --> 00:34:43,840 Speaker 1: of box Car Shoulder and please please send us a 529 00:34:43,920 --> 00:34:49,720 Speaker 1: summation arguing arguing four or against us reading it. Casey, 530 00:34:49,760 --> 00:34:53,160 Speaker 1: I it looks like you're not You're not our big 531 00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:57,240 Speaker 1: box car kids champion here. No. I mean I remember 532 00:34:57,280 --> 00:34:59,799 Speaker 1: them from the Scholastic Books Fair, but I never picked 533 00:34:59,840 --> 00:35:02,680 Speaker 1: up a copy of that series. Scholastic Book Fair was 534 00:35:02,760 --> 00:35:05,640 Speaker 1: so awesome. I wish I wish we could have like 535 00:35:05,880 --> 00:35:08,919 Speaker 1: we don't have those as adults. We just have bookstores 536 00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:12,239 Speaker 1: and and Amazon. You know how cool would it be 537 00:35:13,040 --> 00:35:15,960 Speaker 1: if if one day we were all working in our 538 00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:21,680 Speaker 1: office and management just said, hey, everybody, stop everything, the 539 00:35:21,800 --> 00:35:24,960 Speaker 1: book fares coming. I would lose my mind. Yeah, that 540 00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:28,759 Speaker 1: sounds pretty perfect. Speaking of perfect, I gotta say this 541 00:35:28,840 --> 00:35:31,680 Speaker 1: is maybe my favorite two parter we've ever done. Um. 542 00:35:31,719 --> 00:35:34,680 Speaker 1: This one really had a lot of interesting twists and 543 00:35:34,719 --> 00:35:37,920 Speaker 1: turns to it. And uh I I gotta pat ourselves 544 00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:40,440 Speaker 1: on the back here, gentlemen. I'm really happy that we 545 00:35:40,440 --> 00:35:42,160 Speaker 1: we split this up the way we did and gave 546 00:35:42,600 --> 00:35:46,400 Speaker 1: Mr Livingston his do Yes, and we hope you enjoyed 547 00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:49,680 Speaker 1: this journey. We would love to hear from you. What 548 00:35:49,800 --> 00:35:55,040 Speaker 1: are your favorite tales of off the grid adventures? Have 549 00:35:55,280 --> 00:35:59,880 Speaker 1: you ever found yourself traveling in in a similar fashion. 550 00:36:00,360 --> 00:36:02,600 Speaker 1: If so, we want to hear your stories. You can 551 00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:05,080 Speaker 1: find us on the internet. We're all over it. We 552 00:36:05,120 --> 00:36:07,960 Speaker 1: are in Fact and Podcast. So we're on Facebook, We're 553 00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:10,719 Speaker 1: on Instagram, we're on Twitter. You can also find us 554 00:36:10,760 --> 00:36:13,200 Speaker 1: as individuals. Yeah, if you want to, you can hit 555 00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:15,480 Speaker 1: me up on Instagram. I am at how Now Noel 556 00:36:15,520 --> 00:36:19,200 Speaker 1: Brown and I am on Twitter as Ben Bolan hs W. 557 00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:26,840 Speaker 1: I am on Instagram as uh Casey pegram number one fan. No, sorry, Casey, 558 00:36:26,880 --> 00:36:30,080 Speaker 1: I don't I wasn't that creative. I'm just at them 559 00:36:30,080 --> 00:36:33,400 Speaker 1: bowling on Instagram And you can also find us on Facebook, 560 00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:36,680 Speaker 1: where we have a pretty cool group called Ridiculous Historians 561 00:36:36,800 --> 00:36:40,399 Speaker 1: where you can interact with your fellow listeners and get 562 00:36:40,400 --> 00:36:43,319 Speaker 1: into meme games and and lots of fun chat. Really 563 00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:45,720 Speaker 1: good folks. There are lots of fun, nice, light hearted 564 00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:48,759 Speaker 1: conversation on Ridiculous Histories on Facebook. You just have to 565 00:36:48,880 --> 00:36:51,640 Speaker 1: name one or both or all three of us, or 566 00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:53,400 Speaker 1: just say something that lets us know that you're a 567 00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:56,239 Speaker 1: human being that actually knows that the show is is 568 00:36:56,239 --> 00:36:59,400 Speaker 1: a thing and uh and you're in yes, send me, uh, 569 00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:03,160 Speaker 1: send me an image of your favorite hobo code. Uh, 570 00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:07,160 Speaker 1: here's a question too, if you could create hobo code 571 00:37:07,200 --> 00:37:11,680 Speaker 1: for the twenty century. Wait where the twenty one Century, Casey, 572 00:37:11,760 --> 00:37:13,640 Speaker 1: keep this part in. We'll just do it again. If 573 00:37:13,680 --> 00:37:17,440 Speaker 1: you could create hobo code for the twenty feet century, 574 00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:19,480 Speaker 1: what would it be. I imagine it would be like 575 00:37:19,680 --> 00:37:23,800 Speaker 1: WiFi availability maybe yeah, or like, you know, public restrooms. 576 00:37:23,840 --> 00:37:25,800 Speaker 1: That's a big thing, even if you're not a hobo. 577 00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:28,719 Speaker 1: I mean, god, New York City, a free public restroom 578 00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:32,280 Speaker 1: is like a unicorn. So yeah, Manhattan has a huge 579 00:37:32,360 --> 00:37:34,320 Speaker 1: problem with that. I think it's part of the reason 580 00:37:34,680 --> 00:37:38,040 Speaker 1: they could have so many Starbucks. They're functioning as the 581 00:37:38,080 --> 00:37:42,919 Speaker 1: public restrooms of that South. Oh my gosh, I'm sorry Starbucks. 582 00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:48,720 Speaker 1: But thanks as always to Christopher hassi Otis, to Casey Peckham, 583 00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:52,520 Speaker 1: to Alex Williams, who composed that slapping bob you here 584 00:37:52,560 --> 00:37:56,400 Speaker 1: at the beginning of every episode slapping Bop Bop and 585 00:37:56,480 --> 00:38:00,399 Speaker 1: slap love it Love Alex Williams, and please check out 586 00:38:00,440 --> 00:38:04,800 Speaker 1: his podcast Ephemera, available on the I Heart podcast network 587 00:38:04,920 --> 00:38:08,440 Speaker 1: as well. Um Hughes, thanks to Eve's Jeff coach, Christopher 588 00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:11,640 Speaker 1: Ostiotes here in spirit, Jonathan Strickland that devious question. We 589 00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:14,640 Speaker 1: hope to have him back very very soon. And as always, man, 590 00:38:14,680 --> 00:38:17,520 Speaker 1: thanks to you, Ben. This was a delightful romp back 591 00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:19,520 Speaker 1: at you KNOWL. I guess we'll see each other on 592 00:38:19,560 --> 00:38:28,480 Speaker 1: the road and we'll see you next time. For more 593 00:38:28,520 --> 00:38:31,040 Speaker 1: podcasts for my heart Radio, visit the I heart Radio app, 594 00:38:31,040 --> 00:38:34,160 Speaker 1: Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.