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Speaker 1: Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: George nor back with theoretical physicists Sky Nelson Isaac's book

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Speaker 1: Leap to Holdness Sky. When we deal with synchronicity, If

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Speaker 1: you're thinking about somebody and the phone rings and it's them,

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Speaker 1: is that just luck? Is that synchronicity? What would you

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Speaker 1: call it? I don't differentiate between synchronicity and non synchronicity, really.

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Speaker 1: I think there's the spectrum of meaningfulness. How likely is

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Speaker 1: this something to happen? I think we need to back

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Speaker 1: away from being amazed by synchronicity and see it as

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Speaker 1: a normal phenomenon that happens all the time. Sure. I

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Speaker 1: give an example. My wife received a call that was

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Speaker 1: from our Pacific Gas and Electric, our electric company, and

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Speaker 1: she picked it up and it was almost suspicious. So

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Speaker 1: she thought, maybe to someone who was fishing to get

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Speaker 1: her information. So she hung up the phone and she

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Speaker 1: called the electric company herself directly and waited on the

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Speaker 1: phone for like twenty minutes. Finally got somebody, and the

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Speaker 1: person said, yeah, it's true that the people have our number.

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Speaker 1: They're acting like they're us, and they're trying to get

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Speaker 1: But while we're on the phone with you, let's just

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Speaker 1: check your account. And she checked our account and it

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Speaker 1: turns out our electricity was to be shut off the

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Speaker 1: next day. Oh my god, mixed up in the payments.

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Speaker 1: So this, this spam caller actually helped us address then

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Speaker 1: reality that we're about to lose power. You know, I've

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Speaker 1: I've talked with an expert about the fishing. That's a

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Speaker 1: different topic altogether, but they really do steal other phone

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Speaker 1: numbers to trick you. It's frustrating. And when you can

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Speaker 1: see that, you know, you have your own filter, your

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Speaker 1: own frustration, your own fear about that. But then you

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Speaker 1: see it actually helped me solve my problem. That's when

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Speaker 1: you start to really live in flow, start to see

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Speaker 1: other people not as obstacles but as you know, clues

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Speaker 1: along the path to help you know, live your own

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Speaker 1: life into the best optimal state that you can well.

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Speaker 1: And it happens all the time. We hear stories of

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Speaker 1: people being delayed on some car trip at all of us.

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Speaker 1: Had they been in the car at that time, they

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Speaker 1: might have been hit by a car right at that

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Speaker 1: special moment where there was an accident. It could have

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Speaker 1: been them all kinds of things happen like that, But

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Speaker 1: what creates it? What are we doing it as individuals,

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Speaker 1: or is there that higher power out there in the

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Speaker 1: universe that's making these things happen for us. I don't

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Speaker 1: think we can control the circumstances well enough to do

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Speaker 1: a scientific study of each instance, and so I don't

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Speaker 1: think we should, you know, decide for ourselves whether each

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Speaker 1: instance is a synchronicity or not. But it forces us

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Speaker 1: to be a little bit humble and say, you know,

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Speaker 1: I think it's a process by which we are anticipating

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Speaker 1: our circumstances, where we have a certain intention of what

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Speaker 1: we want to do and we take action in that regard.

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Speaker 1: It's it's when we have an intention and we act

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Speaker 1: upon it, we start to create momentum in that direction.

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Speaker 1: We'll start to experience synchronicities or meaningful moments that help

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Speaker 1: us along that journey. But it doesn't mean that everything

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Speaker 1: that happens is meaningful. You know, when we get sick,

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Speaker 1: or when we experience like racism or anything like that,

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Speaker 1: these are things that are not necessarily in our control

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Speaker 1: and shouldn't be considered like our fault. We shouldn't take

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Speaker 1: a responsibility for every single thing as if it's meaningful.

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Speaker 1: Some things we just have to deal with at face value.

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Speaker 1: Do you tie in intelligent design with any of this

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Speaker 1: or not. I believe in evolution theory for sure, that

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Speaker 1: we've evolved through evolution. I think that there is a

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Speaker 1: possibility that the process of synchronicity does influence the likelihood

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Speaker 1: for well being. Right, So if a synchronicity occurs, which

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Speaker 1: is beneficial, and synchronicity, by the way, as a neutral process,

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Speaker 1: it's not there to help us, but it's a responsive

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Speaker 1: process that's responding to our choices, and if it responds

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Speaker 1: in a way that helps us survive, then it does

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Speaker 1: influence the course of evolution. But it's sort of an

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Speaker 1: internal intelligence design. It's not intelligence design from an external

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Speaker 1: creator or anything like that. There's an ongoing argument over

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Speaker 1: whether we have free will or not, or whether things

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Speaker 1: are already predetermined. I think we have free will. What

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Speaker 1: do you think? I think we have free will? And

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Speaker 1: this is this is consistent with what we know about

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Speaker 1: quantum mechanics, that there is a quantum mechanics. There's a

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Speaker 1: branching tree of all the possible outcomes of an experiment,

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Speaker 1: and we have when we when we measure the experiment,

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Speaker 1: we have choice over what kind of measurement we make,

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Speaker 1: and the system then gives us an answer to that

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Speaker 1: is that experimental question? Um, so we do have choice,

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Speaker 1: and then the system collapses into one state or another

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Speaker 1: randomly based on probability. But I think within the structure

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Speaker 1: of the deterministic evolution of what's called the wave function,

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Speaker 1: you know that is deterministic. There's there's no choice involved.

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Speaker 1: But the choice comes in at the point where we

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Speaker 1: make a free choice over what we measure, and then

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Speaker 1: the system collapses into one state or another basis upon that.

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Speaker 1: It's remarkable how it works, how it happens, and can

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Speaker 1: we control synchronicity or does it just happen randomly. Well,

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Speaker 1: that's why I write about flow, because we can act

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Speaker 1: in certain ways that enhance the synchronicities in our lives.

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Speaker 1: We can pay attention to them, we can make note

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Speaker 1: of them. I think the better listeners we are, the

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Speaker 1: more we listen to people, the more we get our

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Speaker 1: filters out of the way, The more we start to see,

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Speaker 1: oh yeah, my friend doesn't want to go to the

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Speaker 1: movie I want to go to, so maybe I need

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Speaker 1: to drop my own assumption about whether I'm going to

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Speaker 1: like their movie or not and go with their flow,

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Speaker 1: and in doing so, I might have an experience that's

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Speaker 1: really meaningful, a movie that I thought I wasn't going

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Speaker 1: to like that I end up loving, or that gives

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Speaker 1: me some idea about a problem with having at work.

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Speaker 1: You know, we can get informed about one area of

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Speaker 1: our life from something that happens in a totally different

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Speaker 1: area of our life. So I think open mindedness and

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Speaker 1: deep listening and compassion for other people's perspectives can help

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Speaker 1: us experience more synchronicity and more flow, which is not

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Speaker 1: controlled by us, but we sort of surrender to that

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Speaker 1: process and it's a give and take with the cosmos.

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Speaker 1: Tell me about the holistic cosmos. So we talked about

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Speaker 1: time being a line rather than a point, and what

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Speaker 1: this implies is that you know, there's a there's a

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Speaker 1: connection between the past and the future in some sense,

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Speaker 1: you can't break apart this sense of a line, like

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Speaker 1: the light traveling from the Sun to the Earth, exists

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Speaker 1: as a whole. What that means is, you know, I

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Speaker 1: think about this like a virtual world. In a virtual world,

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Speaker 1: you have systems, you know, have nonplayer characters. Right, you

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Speaker 1: have NPCs like in the Matrix, you have all the

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Speaker 1: agents that are out to kill Neo, and they don't

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Speaker 1: have an actual history, right, They're just bits in the machine.

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Speaker 1: So when you make a choice to go one way

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Speaker 1: versus to go the other way, the bits in the

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Speaker 1: machine can jostle and change to make the NPCs go

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Speaker 1: a different direction. So history is flexible in a video

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Speaker 1: game or in a virtual world, and I think that

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Speaker 1: that is possibly the way our physical world works. History

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Speaker 1: is flexible of things that we haven't observed, and that

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Speaker 1: allows for the physical world to adjust to our choices

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Speaker 1: and to become responsive in this way. Sky Are we

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Speaker 1: real because others have talked about a virtual reality world? Two?

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Speaker 1: I mean, is this really happening to us or are

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Speaker 1: we created like that? Yeah? I think it's really important

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Speaker 1: to see that the world is real. You know, we

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Speaker 1: have real problems. We have systemic racism in the world.

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Speaker 1: We have conspiracy theories that are miscommunication that that's happening.

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Speaker 1: We have people suffering around the globe in different ways.

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Speaker 1: That's all real stuff that we've got to deal with.

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Speaker 1: But it doesn't mean that we we understand completely what

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Speaker 1: objective reality is I use the word virtual like reality

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Speaker 1: because it's it's got this element of um flexible histories

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Speaker 1: where where the world can respond to us and adapt

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Speaker 1: to us, but it is still a real world where

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Speaker 1: we have real consequences. Well, do you talk about the

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Speaker 1: cosmos being programmed? So what do you mean by that?

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Speaker 1: I mean that synchronicity is the programming that when we

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Speaker 1: make a choice to go out and you know, get

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Speaker 1: a job, and we start to fill out a resume

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Speaker 1: and we start to inquire with other people about job opportunities,

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Speaker 1: that the response of this of the world around us

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Speaker 1: is to bring us some of those opportunities to start

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Speaker 1: showing us like here's a person that comes across your

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Speaker 1: path at the grocery store that has an idea for

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Speaker 1: you or has a job opening for you. But if

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Speaker 1: we if we do it differently, if we don't have

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Speaker 1: the confidence to you know, the approach that person for instance,

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Speaker 1: we'll have a different experience. And so the programming is

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Speaker 1: like based on what we choose to do, based on

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Speaker 1: whether we choose to have the confidence to proceed or

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Speaker 1: we don't. There was the synchronicity will will occur differently

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Speaker 1: and either happen or not happen, and this is this

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Speaker 1: is sort of a way that the universe is programmed

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Speaker 1: to help us heal, help us grow, and really be

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Speaker 1: a reflection of who we are that we can learn from.

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Speaker 1: You have high praise from the book from a lot

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Speaker 1: of people, And what would you say is the most

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Speaker 1: important aspect of leap to wholeness? I think that you know,

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Speaker 1: we're dealing with some really big issues in the world,

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Speaker 1: and I mentioned a couple of them. I think climate

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Speaker 1: change is a really fundamental issue we have to deal with.

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Speaker 1: I think systemic racism is a big issue. I think

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Speaker 1: misinformation and the way that we communicate across a political

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Speaker 1: barrier is important. And all of these things, I think

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Speaker 1: come down to a sense ultimately of people and how

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Speaker 1: they relate to each other. And this is really based

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Speaker 1: on our filters, based on our own past experiences, what

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Speaker 1: information we've taken to believe and what information we don't believe.

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Speaker 1: And those filters are thoughts and emotions in our own

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Speaker 1: heads that influence what we see and what we hear

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Speaker 1: and what we make of the information we get. So

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Speaker 1: you and I can listen to the same information from

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Speaker 1: a politician and maybe hear it differently based upon what

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Speaker 1: our preconceived biases are. So that's a really important thing

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Speaker 1: to know so that we don't get too serious when

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Speaker 1: we disagree with somebody, because we might find that our

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Speaker 1: disagreements are at the surface and underneath that there's a

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Speaker 1: real common commonality that we share. Can we use synchronicity

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Speaker 1: to our advantage? Yeah, we can. Every time we successfully

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Speaker 1: move towards some goal, we are implementing these tools because

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Speaker 1: I think everyone has experiences where they can say, you know,

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Speaker 1: I decided I was going to get a job, or

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Speaker 1: I decided I was going to start a business, or

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Speaker 1: decided I was going to meet somebody romantically and lo

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Speaker 1: and behold, two weeks later, I ran into this person

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Speaker 1: that led me in the right direction. So when we

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Speaker 1: have clarity on our goals and we act upon them,

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Speaker 1: we are implementing the same phenomenon that I think brings

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Speaker 1: synchronicity around this expectation that we set. So I think

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Speaker 1: it's calling us to become more confident but also more receptive.

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Speaker 1: At the same time, we're not just barreling over people,

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Speaker 1: but actually listening to our life, listening to other people,

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Speaker 1: and listening to the things that happened to us. How

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Speaker 1: important is intuitiveness to this kind of mix? I mean,

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Speaker 1: is that part of synchronicity or is an outside of it.

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Speaker 1: I don't think a person has to consider themselves intuitive.

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Speaker 1: I think that intuition can play a big role if

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Speaker 1: you can notice, you know, the thing's happening to you,

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Speaker 1: not just at the surface, but how you feel about

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Speaker 1: a situation or you know what somebody might mean. If

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Speaker 1: somebody tells you they're happy, but you kind of sense

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Speaker 1: that they're not happy with the decision, you know that

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Speaker 1: that's a good clue to help. It's just one of

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Speaker 1: the pieces of the puzzle that you can weave together

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Speaker 1: to say, what do I really need to do here?

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Speaker 1: If my whole team at work is not really happy

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Speaker 1: with the decision but they're telling me I'm not they're happy,

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Speaker 1: you know, maybe that's a clue that I need to

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Speaker 1: reconsider what the direction we're going. Is it synchronicity or

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Speaker 1: is it just gut intelligence to make a decision. Let's

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Speaker 1: say a financial decision, and you made the right move,

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Speaker 1: you know, maybe you decided I'm not going to buy

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Speaker 1: bitcoin this week and it plummets. Is that is that

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Speaker 1: just having some financial knowledge, or is there some synchronicity

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Speaker 1: tied to that. I think that there's a relationship that

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Speaker 1: gets established when you start living in flow. It's it's

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Speaker 1: it's not that the future is predicted. You know, the

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Speaker 1: future is unknown. We have free will, and what I'm

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Speaker 1: suggesting is the circumstances outside of us adapt to the

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Speaker 1: choices we make, So it's not it's not clear in

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Speaker 1: advance whether the stock will go up or down. I think,

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Speaker 1: you know, my experience, what I'm led to is focusing

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Speaker 1: more on the inner things that I'm learning, like why

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Speaker 1: am I attached to the stock going up or down?

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Speaker 1: What is the feeling that that generates in me? What

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Speaker 1: is you know, the fearful attachment I might have to

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Speaker 1: one outcome or another. The more I can let go

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Speaker 1: of the fearful attachments, the more I can get into

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Speaker 1: flow with what I'm doing and be more successful at

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Speaker 1: whatever it is. What can go wrong with synchronicity, sky Well,

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Speaker 1: I think that I think we can get kind of

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Speaker 1: overly obsessed with trying to analyze synchronicity in our lives,

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Speaker 1: and I think, backing away from the analysis, what I'm

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Speaker 1: trying to point to with the focus on wholism is

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Speaker 1: a whole different part of who we are, not just

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Speaker 1: the analytical selves, but the heartfelt you know, what do

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Speaker 1: we feel? What does our gut to us? Right? Integrative

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Speaker 1: awareness of you know, everything that people are thinking and

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Speaker 1: feeling in a group, and not just our own perspective.

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Speaker 1: So I think what can go wrong is sort of

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Speaker 1: a focus and over focus on what you think the

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Speaker 1: meaning is without really feeling into what the broader underlying experiences.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I keep wondering if we're the ones that

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Speaker 1: make synchronicity happen, that we do it because of our

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Speaker 1: own innate abilities. Well, again, I think that we are

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Speaker 1: the first move and the cosmos makes the second move.

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Speaker 1: So we make a choice to go in a certain

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Speaker 1: direction to start looking for a job, and the cosmos

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Speaker 1: sort of says to us in some way like, okay,

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Speaker 1: that's what you're doing. Well, here's the first step I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna you know, give you a link that helps you

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Speaker 1: find a resume template, you know, and you find that

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Speaker 1: link and then you fill that out. And so it's

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Speaker 1: this back and forth. It's not just a divine doing

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Speaker 1: it for us, and it's not just us doing it

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Speaker 1: from scratch. But this is the idea of wholeness, that

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Speaker 1: all the possibilities exist, and what we're doing is really

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Speaker 1: carving away from those possible abilities, not creating from scratch ourselves.

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Speaker 1: So it's a it's am. It's a collaboration between us

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Speaker 1: and the cosmos itself. Listen to more Coast to Coast

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Speaker 1: AM every weeknight at one a m. Eastern and go

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Speaker 1: to Coast to Coast am dot com for more