Speaker 1: It's Friday, ma I'm Oscar Ramrrors from the Daily Dive
Speaker 1: podcast in Los Angeles, and this is reopening America rebound COVID.
Speaker 1: It's an issue that's been popping up for some getting sick,
Speaker 1: but it's also happening to people that were treated with
Speaker 1: the anti viral packs LEAD. Some are getting better and
Speaker 1: testing negative, only to rebound with symptoms and test positive
Speaker 1: after the illness has dissipated. This caused the CDC to
Speaker 1: change its guidelines and tell people with rebound symptoms to
Speaker 1: isolate for another five days. Karen Weintroub, health reporter at
Speaker 1: USA Today, joins us for What to Know. Thanks for
Speaker 1: joining us, Karen, thanks for having me. Well, let's talk
Speaker 1: about some latest developments with the COVID treatment packs LEAD.
Speaker 1: This is a anti viral that is made by Fiser.
Speaker 1: We're seeing some interesting things, some changing CDC guidelines. So
Speaker 1: I guess they're calling it packs levid rebound where people
Speaker 1: are taking the medication, maybe testing negative for COVID, then
Speaker 1: feeling kind of crummy a few days later, and testing
Speaker 1: positive all over again. And this is causing a little
Speaker 1: bit of changes to some of the CDC guidelines, saying
Speaker 1: that people should start isolating again for five days, I
Speaker 1: think if they do start testing positive. So, Karen, what
Speaker 1: are we seeing with all of this? Right? What I
Speaker 1: actually didn't realize until I started reporting this is this
Speaker 1: post COVID rebound has been a thing all along. A
Speaker 1: small percentage of people have apparently recovered from COVID, even
Speaker 1: tested negative for a couple of days and then got
Speaker 1: symptoms again, and often tested positive. So doctor I spoke
Speaker 1: to said he's seen this and maybe two or three
Speaker 1: or four percent of his patients all along since. So
Speaker 1: what's not clear is whether what we're seeing with this
Speaker 1: drug is specific to the drug, if it's more people
Speaker 1: on the drugs who are getting this, or if it's
Speaker 1: just the same thing that we're seeing normally. But because
Speaker 1: people are tracking themselves more carefully that we're becoming more
Speaker 1: aware of it in connection with taxtlment. Yeah, it's pretty
Speaker 1: interesting because I mean, I went two and a half
Speaker 1: years not going right, without getting sick with anything or
Speaker 1: even getting COVID, and it recently caught up with me
Speaker 1: and they kind of keeped my butt, you know. But
Speaker 1: I was contemplating should I go to the doctor and
Speaker 1: maybe get some of course, of these anti vitals. I
Speaker 1: decided against it only because I wanted to tough it out.
Speaker 1: You know, I didn't think I needed it. It It wasn't
Speaker 1: that bad. But then, yeah, you go back and you
Speaker 1: start seeing these things. But so tell me about what
Speaker 1: the CDC said, because they're changing some of the guidelines,
Speaker 1: saying you should isolate again if if you get that
Speaker 1: rebound right. One of the open questions has been when
Speaker 1: you have COVID, should you test before you go back
Speaker 1: out into the world. So I recently had COVID. Also,
Speaker 1: I was testing positive on a rapid test for eleven
Speaker 1: days after I had COVID, and I was very careful
Speaker 1: in that time frame, even though after five I was
Speaker 1: allowed out in public. I was very vigilant about a
Speaker 1: mask and I really did try to avoid enclosed spaces
Speaker 1: for those eleven days. But in the past, the CDC
Speaker 1: has said five days of isolation is enough. Then wear
Speaker 1: your mask for another five and then you're good with
Speaker 1: pastuate it. Because people are testing so much, they're seeing
Speaker 1: that they are going negative and then positive again. CDC
Speaker 1: says if that happens, you should start the isolation period
Speaker 1: all over again. And but honestly, we just don't know.
Speaker 1: There's not enough data to really say. There's one study
Speaker 1: that found that somebody had this rebound infected their family members,
Speaker 1: So it's possible to be contagious with this rebound in
Speaker 1: most cases, I don't think that. I've asked several people.
Speaker 1: They said they've never heard of a hospitalization from a rebound.
Speaker 1: It seems to be sort of a lesser symptom, or
Speaker 1: your body is just getting rid of the last dregs
Speaker 1: of the virus. So it's just not clear how dangerous
Speaker 1: that period is. But in an abundance of caution, CDC
Speaker 1: is saying that you should isolate if you're positive, right,
Speaker 1: And that's one and that's one of the criticisms that
Speaker 1: comes out of it. Right, should we be changing public
Speaker 1: policy because of this? I guess, as you mentioned, right,
Speaker 1: the study that was cited by the CDC was really
Speaker 1: just a report of a single case of a rebounding
Speaker 1: patient passing on the virus. Is that enough to apply
Speaker 1: that to everybody? I guess when you're being super cautious, yes,
Speaker 1: But again the criticism is should that be changing public policy?
Speaker 1: And again, I mean some of it is common sense
Speaker 1: versus public policy. You know, if you're testing positive, there's
Speaker 1: a chance or contage us. If you can possibly stay
Speaker 1: home and avoid other people, it just seems like the
Speaker 1: sensible thing to do. Not everybody can afford the test
Speaker 1: or can afford to stay home. In those cases, people
Speaker 1: should be really vigilant about wearing a mask until they're
Speaker 1: sure they're not contagious. Yeah, one of the things when
Speaker 1: the paxel it it came out, obviously, right everybody is
Speaker 1: saying it was a huge breakthrough, miraculous that it was
Speaker 1: so effective, right, cutting the risk of hospitalizations and death
Speaker 1: by everybody was way on board. But you know, now
Speaker 1: we have the stories about the rebound. As you said,
Speaker 1: it's happening with people that aren't even taking paxilvid. But
Speaker 1: we're also I tell me, if you've heard of this,
Speaker 1: people are calling a pax leaved mouth, also complaining of
Speaker 1: a like a bitter, metallic taste. Somebody said it was
Speaker 1: like grapefruit mixed with soap that they're getting when when
Speaker 1: they're on the drug. I mean, those kinds of side
Speaker 1: effects are fairly typical with drugs, I think with certain drugs,
Speaker 1: so I'm not surprised by that. And everything you said
Speaker 1: about tax Levid is still true. It's very effective at
Speaker 1: preventing hospitalizations. The real world data seems to be holding
Speaker 1: to be exactly repeating what they saw on the trials,
Speaker 1: So all of that is true. It's still a great
Speaker 1: drug if you're at high risk. I think some of
Speaker 1: the differences that were now so many more people are
Speaker 1: taking it now. You know, it's not just the people
Speaker 1: who are you know, compromised or over or six five
Speaker 1: who are taking it, but even people like you, who
Speaker 1: are mostly healthy who are considering it. So I think
Speaker 1: that maybe some of the explanation is just that so
Speaker 1: many more people are taking it that we're seeing, you know,
Speaker 1: the variation that's typical with with any drug or any situation,
Speaker 1: right exactly, because the administration started those tests to treat
Speaker 1: programs right where you if you get to test any
Speaker 1: test positive, they might send you home immediately with that stuff.
Speaker 1: So you're right, a lot of people are, a lot
Speaker 1: more people are taking it, and we're starting to see
Speaker 1: a little bit more of the real world effects of
Speaker 1: what's going on. And again it's great. I don't want
Speaker 1: to be in a hospital, you know, I mean, I
Speaker 1: think it's terrific if it's saving people from from being
Speaker 1: in the hospital. But the more marginal benefit you get,
Speaker 1: the more of these side effects matter. You know, if
Speaker 1: you weren't gonna end up in a hospital anyway, then
Speaker 1: maybe having allows you taste in your mouth and having
Speaker 1: to isolate for an extra few days the bigger burden.
Speaker 1: And those are just things that we're learning as as
Speaker 1: we see this drug in app action. All right, well,
Speaker 1: we'll keep an eye out for how things develop with
Speaker 1: packs LVID. I know it's helping a lot of people
Speaker 1: still in the long run, as you mentioned. Karen Weintraub,
Speaker 1: health reporter at USA Today, thank you very much for
Speaker 1: joining us. Thank you so much. I'm Oscar Ramirez and
Speaker 1: this has been reopening America. Don't forget the effort. Today's
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