1
00:00:00,680 --> 00:00:05,360
Speaker 1: I know that if we don't do this, we're flirting

2
00:00:05,400 --> 00:00:08,760
Speaker 1: with disaster. But what I really think we should focus

3
00:00:08,840 --> 00:00:13,280
Speaker 1: on is we can build the most beautiful future that

4
00:00:13,400 --> 00:00:16,160
Speaker 1: anyone can imagine too. Yeah, of course we're trying to

5
00:00:16,200 --> 00:00:19,360
Speaker 1: avoid this huge problem, but really what we're trying to

6
00:00:19,440 --> 00:00:24,760
Speaker 1: do is build this incredible future better than anybody's ever lived,

7
00:00:25,280 --> 00:00:27,800
Speaker 1: than humans have ever had it in the history of

8
00:00:27,800 --> 00:00:30,000
Speaker 1: the planet. That's what we're really trying to create is

9
00:00:30,040 --> 00:00:31,280
Speaker 1: a fantastic future.

10
00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:34,239
Speaker 2: Oh fucked.

11
00:00:38,280 --> 00:00:38,440
Speaker 1: Hi.

12
00:00:39,200 --> 00:00:42,280
Speaker 3: I'm Chris Turney and this is I'm Fucking the Future,

13
00:00:42,920 --> 00:00:45,720
Speaker 3: a show about a climate crisis and what we can

14
00:00:45,760 --> 00:00:50,159
Speaker 3: do about it. The future can sometimes seem bleak, so

15
00:00:50,280 --> 00:00:53,159
Speaker 3: every episode we'll talk to someone with a big idea

16
00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:56,720
Speaker 3: for turning things around. I believe it. Together, we really

17
00:00:56,880 --> 00:00:59,480
Speaker 3: can on fuck this. Let's get started.

18
00:01:00,720 --> 00:01:04,000
Speaker 2: We fucking the future.

19
00:01:06,080 --> 00:01:08,600
Speaker 3: There are a lot of ways you can fight global heating.

20
00:01:09,160 --> 00:01:12,280
Speaker 3: You can eat less meat, you can drive an electric car,

21
00:01:13,160 --> 00:01:16,160
Speaker 3: or you can try to become president of the United States.

22
00:01:16,840 --> 00:01:20,119
Speaker 3: That's what our guest today decides to do. His name

23
00:01:20,200 --> 00:01:21,200
Speaker 3: is Tom Steyer.

24
00:01:21,800 --> 00:01:22,000
Speaker 1: Here.

25
00:01:22,040 --> 00:01:24,560
Speaker 3: He is one of the Democratic primary debates Back in

26
00:01:24,640 --> 00:01:25,760
Speaker 3: twenty twenty.

27
00:01:26,000 --> 00:01:28,440
Speaker 4: Rachel I'm the only person on this stage who will

28
00:01:28,440 --> 00:01:31,480
Speaker 4: say that climate is the number one priority for me.

29
00:01:31,959 --> 00:01:36,800
Speaker 4: Vice President Biden wrong say it. Senator Warren won't say it.

30
00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:39,679
Speaker 4: It's a state of emergency, and I would declare a

31
00:01:39,720 --> 00:01:43,480
Speaker 4: state of emergency on day one. I've spent a decade

32
00:01:43,720 --> 00:01:49,080
Speaker 4: fighting and beating oil companies, stopping pipelines, stopping fossil fuel plants,

33
00:01:49,400 --> 00:01:51,360
Speaker 4: ensuring clean energy across the country.

34
00:01:51,840 --> 00:01:54,600
Speaker 1: I know that we have to do this. I also

35
00:01:54,760 --> 00:01:56,520
Speaker 1: know that we can do this.

36
00:01:57,120 --> 00:02:00,720
Speaker 3: Tom doesn't fit a profile of your typical climate activists,

37
00:02:00,920 --> 00:02:04,440
Speaker 3: because Tom is a wildly successful businessman who made his

38
00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:08,880
Speaker 3: fortune in part by investing in fossil fuel companies. Here's

39
00:02:08,919 --> 00:02:11,960
Speaker 3: Tom on CNN talking about his time in the private sector.

40
00:02:12,320 --> 00:02:15,680
Speaker 1: Our company invested in every part of the American economy,

41
00:02:15,760 --> 00:02:19,639
Speaker 1: including oil and gas and coal, and I realized as

42
00:02:19,639 --> 00:02:22,399
Speaker 1: we were doing it, I basically thought, the American government works.

43
00:02:22,440 --> 00:02:25,320
Speaker 1: If there's a big problem, the American government will solve it.

44
00:02:25,600 --> 00:02:29,200
Speaker 1: And somewhere around fourteen or fifteen years ago, I thought,

45
00:02:29,440 --> 00:02:32,760
Speaker 1: this doesn't seem to be working. There's this huge, unintended

46
00:02:32,760 --> 00:02:35,639
Speaker 1: consequence of having a fossil fuel economy, which is climate

47
00:02:35,720 --> 00:02:39,920
Speaker 1: change and I started to do whatever I could to

48
00:02:40,080 --> 00:02:41,800
Speaker 1: try and solve this problem.

49
00:02:41,880 --> 00:02:47,840
Speaker 3: Then the climate crisis is a direct result of industrialization

50
00:02:48,600 --> 00:02:52,600
Speaker 3: of runaway business development. But Tom has come to believe

51
00:02:52,760 --> 00:02:56,120
Speaker 3: that one way we can fight against global heating is

52
00:02:56,200 --> 00:03:00,240
Speaker 3: through the power of business and industry. In twenty twenty one,

53
00:03:00,560 --> 00:03:05,080
Speaker 3: Tom founded Galvanized Climate Solutions. It's a financial firm but

54
00:03:05,320 --> 00:03:09,600
Speaker 3: only invests in companies making a positive climate impact. How

55
00:03:09,639 --> 00:03:13,800
Speaker 3: did Tom go from fossil fuel investor to climate advocate,

56
00:03:14,440 --> 00:03:18,120
Speaker 3: I asked him. So, I think a lot of people

57
00:03:18,120 --> 00:03:22,320
Speaker 3: are having their are harr moment, that oh fuck climate

58
00:03:22,400 --> 00:03:25,480
Speaker 3: change is real moment for me. I remember I was

59
00:03:25,520 --> 00:03:27,760
Speaker 3: a nerdy teenager. It was back in nineteen eighty seven

60
00:03:27,800 --> 00:03:30,400
Speaker 3: at the weather station and a hurricane hit London, and

61
00:03:30,520 --> 00:03:33,320
Speaker 3: just a year later British Prime Minister Margret Factor was

62
00:03:33,360 --> 00:03:36,040
Speaker 3: given these powerful speeches about climate change and we're going

63
00:03:36,120 --> 00:03:39,000
Speaker 3: to do something about it. So what is your aha,

64
00:03:39,120 --> 00:03:40,120
Speaker 3: oh fuck moment?

65
00:03:40,680 --> 00:03:45,720
Speaker 1: Basically I had spent a summer when I was twenty

66
00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:49,040
Speaker 1: four up in Alaska. I had an office job, but

67
00:03:49,080 --> 00:03:55,080
Speaker 1: I basically spent every weekend out in the woods, climbing, fishing, canoeing,

68
00:03:55,640 --> 00:03:58,200
Speaker 1: everything I could think of to get as far deep

69
00:03:58,240 --> 00:04:00,960
Speaker 1: into the woods as I could. Incredible summer. And then

70
00:04:01,520 --> 00:04:05,480
Speaker 1: I went back with my family, including four kids, to

71
00:04:05,560 --> 00:04:08,640
Speaker 1: give them the same appreciation that i'd have show them

72
00:04:09,120 --> 00:04:14,200
Speaker 1: how incredibly fertile and wild America was, you know, the

73
00:04:14,400 --> 00:04:19,440
Speaker 1: huge fish, the incredible animals, the birds, just how incredibly

74
00:04:19,560 --> 00:04:22,920
Speaker 1: rich the country is. And basically we got up there

75
00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:25,920
Speaker 1: and we did see that, But what we also saw

76
00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:29,080
Speaker 1: inescapably was well, this place is melting.

77
00:04:29,880 --> 00:04:33,039
Speaker 3: Okay, let's pause here for a segment we like to

78
00:04:33,080 --> 00:04:34,839
Speaker 3: call holy fuck.

79
00:04:36,720 --> 00:04:37,200
Speaker 1: Fuck.

80
00:04:41,680 --> 00:04:46,640
Speaker 3: When Tom says for Alaska is melting, he means literally melting.

81
00:04:47,120 --> 00:04:50,360
Speaker 3: The average temperature across Alaska has increased by up to

82
00:04:50,520 --> 00:04:54,080
Speaker 3: six degrees fahrenheit over the last forty years. That's more

83
00:04:54,160 --> 00:04:56,960
Speaker 3: than three times for warming of the rest of the country.

84
00:04:57,600 --> 00:05:00,480
Speaker 3: This has led to a dramatic melting of glacier across

85
00:05:00,520 --> 00:05:03,760
Speaker 3: the state. It's a trend that's set to continue, with

86
00:05:03,839 --> 00:05:07,200
Speaker 3: at least half of Alaska's remaining ice expected to disappear

87
00:05:07,440 --> 00:05:11,920
Speaker 3: in the coming years. This matters for two reasons. First,

88
00:05:12,120 --> 00:05:14,839
Speaker 3: the melting of glaciers in Alaska and across the Arctic

89
00:05:15,080 --> 00:05:19,240
Speaker 3: are one of the biggest causes of rising sea levels today. Second,

90
00:05:19,640 --> 00:05:23,159
Speaker 3: this heating is also melting Arctic sea ice, which you

91
00:05:23,200 --> 00:05:26,279
Speaker 3: can think of as a world's air conditioner. This is

92
00:05:26,279 --> 00:05:30,000
Speaker 3: a thin layer of the Earth's surface that's totally frozen,

93
00:05:30,520 --> 00:05:34,120
Speaker 3: and since sea ice is mostly white, it reflects sunlight,

94
00:05:34,520 --> 00:05:37,679
Speaker 3: which pushes at heat off the Earth's surface and back

95
00:05:37,680 --> 00:05:41,160
Speaker 3: into space. And if that ice isn't there, then the

96
00:05:41,200 --> 00:05:45,400
Speaker 3: sunlight gets absorbed into the ocean, warming the waters and

97
00:05:45,440 --> 00:05:49,839
Speaker 3: melting more ice. It's a vicious cycle, and it's one

98
00:05:49,880 --> 00:05:52,359
Speaker 3: of those facts that just stops in your tracks and

99
00:05:52,480 --> 00:05:54,719
Speaker 3: makes you say, holy fuck.

100
00:05:56,320 --> 00:05:56,680
Speaker 1: Fuck.

101
00:06:00,480 --> 00:06:04,400
Speaker 3: Okay, back to Tom, seeing all this change in Alaska change,

102
00:06:04,400 --> 00:06:06,760
Speaker 3: what was happening so fast, was shocking to him.

103
00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:10,120
Speaker 1: And you know, we had as a family, both my

104
00:06:10,240 --> 00:06:12,200
Speaker 1: wife's side of the family and my side of the family,

105
00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:15,919
Speaker 1: hundreds of years of going into the woods in North America.

106
00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:18,720
Speaker 1: And so it wasn't like going to Disneyland. It was

107
00:06:18,800 --> 00:06:23,839
Speaker 1: going to this place that Americans have gone, well Native

108
00:06:23,839 --> 00:06:29,839
Speaker 1: Americans for thousands of years and immigrants like us for

109
00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:36,039
Speaker 1: hundreds of years to find meaning and spirituality and beauty

110
00:06:36,200 --> 00:06:38,800
Speaker 1: and incredible natural wealth.

111
00:06:39,560 --> 00:06:44,000
Speaker 3: Tom saw how in just one generation, so much of

112
00:06:44,040 --> 00:06:47,600
Speaker 3: Alaska's landscape had changed, and like a lot of people,

113
00:06:48,040 --> 00:06:50,120
Speaker 3: Tom at first looked to the government to solve a

114
00:06:50,160 --> 00:06:54,720
Speaker 3: climate crisis. He supported politicians and causes that were pro climate,

115
00:06:55,279 --> 00:06:58,600
Speaker 3: and eventually he took a stab at running for office himself.

116
00:06:58,920 --> 00:07:03,400
Speaker 3: Tom's presidential platform was heavily focused on climate action. Here's

117
00:07:03,400 --> 00:07:04,200
Speaker 3: one of his ads.

118
00:07:04,600 --> 00:07:07,760
Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Tom Steyer. I'm running for president, and I'm

119
00:07:07,760 --> 00:07:12,600
Speaker 1: committed to creating a sustainable future for all Americans. Our

120
00:07:12,720 --> 00:07:16,800
Speaker 1: planet is at a crossroads. Wildfires are taking lives and

121
00:07:16,840 --> 00:07:21,800
Speaker 1: destroying communities. Prolonged heat waves and extreme storms are putting

122
00:07:21,800 --> 00:07:25,760
Speaker 1: the vulnerable at risk. We can't continue to deny science

123
00:07:26,200 --> 00:07:29,880
Speaker 1: and roll back environmental protections. We must treat the climate

124
00:07:29,920 --> 00:07:34,760
Speaker 1: crisis with the urgency it demands. That's why, on day

125
00:07:34,880 --> 00:07:38,440
Speaker 1: one of my presidency, I will declare the climate crisis

126
00:07:38,520 --> 00:07:39,680
Speaker 1: a National Emergency.

127
00:07:40,760 --> 00:07:44,040
Speaker 3: Tom helped make climate a more central focus in the election,

128
00:07:44,520 --> 00:07:48,360
Speaker 3: but ultimately he didn't manage to win the presidency, and

129
00:07:48,440 --> 00:07:51,680
Speaker 3: so he decides to shift gears. Tom had spent a

130
00:07:51,760 --> 00:07:54,600
Speaker 3: lot of time trying to convince people that fighting the

131
00:07:54,640 --> 00:07:58,000
Speaker 3: climate crisis was for riving to do, but he thought,

132
00:07:58,600 --> 00:08:02,320
Speaker 3: what if he could appeal to people more pragmatic interests.

133
00:08:02,880 --> 00:08:05,480
Speaker 3: What if doing the right thing for the climate was

134
00:08:05,520 --> 00:08:08,680
Speaker 3: also the right thing for their bank accounts. It's an

135
00:08:08,720 --> 00:08:11,120
Speaker 3: idea Tom calls movement capitalism.

136
00:08:11,360 --> 00:08:20,440
Speaker 1: Well, you know, capitalism scales, profitability scales. It's somewhat cynical

137
00:08:20,440 --> 00:08:22,760
Speaker 1: of me to say, but unfortunately, I think it's realistic

138
00:08:23,440 --> 00:08:26,040
Speaker 1: for me to also say altruism doesn't scale.

139
00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:28,960
Speaker 3: Right, or it scales less. I mean, we see more

140
00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:32,120
Speaker 3: and more consumers choosing to buy from climate conscious companies,

141
00:08:32,360 --> 00:08:34,120
Speaker 3: but it's not moving a needle in the way that

142
00:08:34,160 --> 00:08:36,520
Speaker 3: would incentivize other companies to do the same.

143
00:08:36,640 --> 00:08:42,400
Speaker 1: Right, we need to have these changes be profitable so

144
00:08:42,440 --> 00:08:45,840
Speaker 1: that people can make the decisions in their own self interest.

145
00:08:46,640 --> 00:08:51,079
Speaker 1: And so it's not that I think capitalism is by

146
00:08:51,200 --> 00:08:57,640
Speaker 1: definition good, it's capitalism can be good. Capitalism is basically,

147
00:08:57,720 --> 00:09:00,280
Speaker 1: we're going to produce what you want, so you pay

148
00:09:00,360 --> 00:09:04,760
Speaker 1: us money. That's capitalism. Like, you tell us what you

149
00:09:04,800 --> 00:09:08,319
Speaker 1: want and we'll produce it if you'll pay us for it. Okay,

150
00:09:08,400 --> 00:09:11,680
Speaker 1: And the idea is okay, So my self interest is

151
00:09:11,720 --> 00:09:14,199
Speaker 1: to produce something you want yours. You're just going to

152
00:09:14,240 --> 00:09:16,400
Speaker 1: get whatever you want, you tell me, and I'll make it.

153
00:09:16,440 --> 00:09:21,160
Speaker 1: And so in this if society decides we need to

154
00:09:21,240 --> 00:09:24,959
Speaker 1: do things that take into account the cost of pollution,

155
00:09:25,440 --> 00:09:27,240
Speaker 1: then we're just going to say we're going to produce

156
00:09:27,280 --> 00:09:30,400
Speaker 1: all the things you want, but we're not going to pollute.

157
00:09:31,120 --> 00:09:33,280
Speaker 1: And if you think about it, there's nothing wrong with oil.

158
00:09:33,400 --> 00:09:38,760
Speaker 1: Oil is this incredibly powerful energy source. People did it

159
00:09:38,800 --> 00:09:41,880
Speaker 1: as a way of moving cars, moving ships, moving planes.

160
00:09:41,920 --> 00:09:44,120
Speaker 1: They weren't trying to destroy the world. They were basically

161
00:09:44,160 --> 00:09:49,079
Speaker 1: giving people exactly what they wanted energy. It just turned

162
00:09:49,080 --> 00:09:52,080
Speaker 1: out there was this unintended consequence that in burning the

163
00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:54,800
Speaker 1: oil and burning the natural gas and burning the coal,

164
00:09:55,120 --> 00:09:57,360
Speaker 1: we were going to basically heat up the planet in

165
00:09:57,400 --> 00:10:01,200
Speaker 1: a way that was going to cause all kinds of

166
00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:04,080
Speaker 1: problems for human beings and all the other eight million

167
00:10:04,080 --> 00:10:08,680
Speaker 1: species on the planet Earth. And so all we're saying is, okay,

168
00:10:08,840 --> 00:10:12,040
Speaker 1: let's give people what they really want, which is all

169
00:10:12,120 --> 00:10:15,280
Speaker 1: of that capability for them to move around and to

170
00:10:15,800 --> 00:10:18,360
Speaker 1: fuel the things that they like in a way that

171
00:10:18,440 --> 00:10:22,000
Speaker 1: doesn't have this unintended consequence that basically burns clean And

172
00:10:22,040 --> 00:10:25,200
Speaker 1: if we can do that, then we're basically producing what

173
00:10:25,240 --> 00:10:28,040
Speaker 1: people want. And for that to really happen in a

174
00:10:28,040 --> 00:10:30,800
Speaker 1: big way, then we need to build big businesses that

175
00:10:30,920 --> 00:10:34,480
Speaker 1: hire people and paying them competitive wages and really give

176
00:10:34,480 --> 00:10:36,200
Speaker 1: an incentive for this thing to grow.

177
00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:45,320
Speaker 2: Weird fucking the future. Weird fucking the future.

178
00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:53,240
Speaker 3: For years, a big obstacle in getting people to switch

179
00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:57,320
Speaker 3: to renewable energy sources was cost. Solar and wind was

180
00:10:57,400 --> 00:11:00,760
Speaker 3: just too expensive compared to oil and coal. But in

181
00:11:00,800 --> 00:11:04,800
Speaker 3: the past few years that's all changed. Clean energy is

182
00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:08,240
Speaker 3: now far cheaper than fossil fuels. Fa'st creates a lot

183
00:11:08,280 --> 00:11:11,200
Speaker 3: of demand, and that in turn is to an explosion

184
00:11:11,280 --> 00:11:14,760
Speaker 3: of investment by the private sector. It's one example of

185
00:11:14,800 --> 00:11:18,520
Speaker 3: a positive alignment of business interests and climate interests.

186
00:11:19,040 --> 00:11:21,480
Speaker 1: Well, a ton of things have changed in terms of

187
00:11:21,520 --> 00:11:24,040
Speaker 1: making it possible for the private sector and step up.

188
00:11:24,320 --> 00:11:27,960
Speaker 1: If you just look at the amount of money that's

189
00:11:28,040 --> 00:11:31,640
Speaker 1: being invested in climate solutions, that's being invested in clean

190
00:11:31,760 --> 00:11:34,440
Speaker 1: energy versus fossil fuel for the first time. Last year,

191
00:11:34,440 --> 00:11:36,280
Speaker 1: I think more money was invested in clean energy to

192
00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:41,200
Speaker 1: possi fuels. So there's no question that relatively the private

193
00:11:41,240 --> 00:11:44,360
Speaker 1: sector is stepping up. I think the costs have crossed

194
00:11:44,400 --> 00:11:48,360
Speaker 1: in terms of electricity generation, whether it be solar or

195
00:11:48,520 --> 00:11:53,840
Speaker 1: wind or batteries. I think the costs of evs electrical vehicles, Yeah, yeah,

196
00:11:54,240 --> 00:11:57,000
Speaker 1: are going to be a lot lower, both in terms

197
00:11:57,040 --> 00:11:58,679
Speaker 1: of how much it cost to buy, but how much

198
00:11:58,679 --> 00:12:01,120
Speaker 1: it cost to maintained much it cost to fill up

199
00:12:01,480 --> 00:12:06,360
Speaker 1: than internal combustion engines. You know, we're seeing really the

200
00:12:06,520 --> 00:12:11,680
Speaker 1: tipping points in multiple technologies where basically you're not asking

201
00:12:11,720 --> 00:12:14,720
Speaker 1: someone to make a sacrifice, that we're in this place

202
00:12:14,760 --> 00:12:16,920
Speaker 1: where it's like, this is just the smart thing to do.

203
00:12:17,600 --> 00:12:21,600
Speaker 1: And you know, as we see that those really rapid

204
00:12:21,760 --> 00:12:26,120
Speaker 1: adoptions around the world, we're going to see that be

205
00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:31,640
Speaker 1: the dominant technologies and that really we're going to see

206
00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:33,559
Speaker 1: the end of the fossil fuel layer.

207
00:12:34,440 --> 00:12:36,840
Speaker 3: Oh no, I can't wait for that. I mean, that's

208
00:12:36,920 --> 00:12:40,200
Speaker 3: just an amazing headline, isn't it. The amount of investment

209
00:12:40,200 --> 00:12:44,240
Speaker 3: in this space is extraordinary, and just seeing the changing costs.

210
00:12:44,480 --> 00:12:46,960
Speaker 3: But why things got so much cheaper, Tom, I mean,

211
00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:48,640
Speaker 3: what's actually driving out change?

212
00:12:48,720 --> 00:12:51,800
Speaker 1: If you think about when I first went to work

213
00:12:52,720 --> 00:12:57,640
Speaker 1: forty years ago, the computer that would fill a room

214
00:12:58,440 --> 00:13:02,640
Speaker 1: now would have a tiny fraction of the capability of

215
00:13:02,679 --> 00:13:09,160
Speaker 1: your iPhone because that multiplication of capabilities every single year.

216
00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:12,840
Speaker 1: And so we see that kind of technological advancement, which

217
00:13:12,880 --> 00:13:18,360
Speaker 1: is increasing productivity and reduced cost in every one of

218
00:13:18,400 --> 00:13:22,360
Speaker 1: these technologies, whether it's solar or wind, or batteries or evs. So,

219
00:13:22,440 --> 00:13:25,120
Speaker 1: for instance, in solar, I think the way that people

220
00:13:25,120 --> 00:13:30,520
Speaker 1: think about it is that every doubling of solar capacity

221
00:13:31,080 --> 00:13:34,520
Speaker 1: in the world leads to a twenty four percent drop

222
00:13:34,679 --> 00:13:38,280
Speaker 1: in price for the equivalent amount of energy. So as

223
00:13:38,320 --> 00:13:42,359
Speaker 1: that goes on, it's like it just goes down inexorably.

224
00:13:43,080 --> 00:13:46,360
Speaker 1: And so if you're selling oil and gas, like there's

225
00:13:46,400 --> 00:13:49,760
Speaker 1: no doubt next year your competitor is going to be

226
00:13:49,760 --> 00:13:52,440
Speaker 1: a lot cheaper, and the year after that, by the way,

227
00:13:52,480 --> 00:13:54,000
Speaker 1: they're going to be a lot cheaper.

228
00:13:54,000 --> 00:13:55,480
Speaker 3: A game change, isn't it.

229
00:13:55,520 --> 00:13:59,240
Speaker 1: And so that's not true of fossil fuels. You know,

230
00:13:59,400 --> 00:14:05,200
Speaker 1: fossil fue mules become harder to find, more remote, more

231
00:14:05,320 --> 00:14:08,320
Speaker 1: difficult to reach. The price of oil has gone up

232
00:14:08,360 --> 00:14:12,199
Speaker 1: about two percent a year, you know, forever. So in fact,

233
00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:16,760
Speaker 1: you've got one technology that's going up very gradually but continuously,

234
00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:20,160
Speaker 1: and one that's going down very steeply. If you look

235
00:14:20,200 --> 00:14:23,880
Speaker 1: at the cost of a kilowatt hour of energy, and

236
00:14:23,960 --> 00:14:28,640
Speaker 1: whether you look at coal or natural gas or wind

237
00:14:28,720 --> 00:14:30,320
Speaker 1: or solar wind and solar by farther too.

238
00:14:30,400 --> 00:14:33,880
Speaker 3: Cheapness, fast, incredible change for world, and you see it happen.

239
00:14:33,920 --> 00:14:36,440
Speaker 3: This speed is scale, that's just amazing.

240
00:14:36,840 --> 00:14:39,960
Speaker 1: You know, China is the biggest car market in the world.

241
00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:46,160
Speaker 1: China is scheduled to have eighty percent car sales be

242
00:14:46,360 --> 00:14:51,120
Speaker 1: evs by twenty thirty. Eighty percent eight zero percent. Those

243
00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:54,560
Speaker 1: cars do not need to fill up. So when this happens,

244
00:14:55,360 --> 00:14:58,080
Speaker 1: Once the sales move like that, then the percentages of

245
00:14:58,120 --> 00:15:01,560
Speaker 1: the fleet just in egg changed and you can see

246
00:15:01,560 --> 00:15:03,240
Speaker 1: the end of the fossil fuel era.

247
00:15:03,720 --> 00:15:07,320
Speaker 3: We're already seeing this happening around the world. Here's a

248
00:15:07,360 --> 00:15:09,440
Speaker 3: news clip from a recent cast show in China.

249
00:15:09,800 --> 00:15:13,520
Speaker 5: Foreign automakers, including American brands, are now playing attention to

250
00:15:13,600 --> 00:15:16,600
Speaker 5: Chinese players like bud It's number one in China and

251
00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:19,600
Speaker 5: the competition is now so intense it sparked an EV

252
00:15:19,800 --> 00:15:20,760
Speaker 5: price war. Here.

253
00:15:21,080 --> 00:15:24,760
Speaker 3: From a climate perspective, an EV price war is exactly

254
00:15:24,760 --> 00:15:28,200
Speaker 3: what we want to see. As EV's become more affordable

255
00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:32,760
Speaker 3: to buy, it incentivizes consumers to buy greener cars, which

256
00:15:32,760 --> 00:15:37,080
Speaker 3: in turn incentivizes companies to build more and better electric vehicles.

257
00:15:38,000 --> 00:15:40,320
Speaker 3: It's the power of capitalism.

258
00:15:40,560 --> 00:15:45,040
Speaker 1: I drive electric Mustang and so you know, did I

259
00:15:45,080 --> 00:15:47,720
Speaker 1: buy it because I wanted to have no emissions? Yeah?

260
00:15:47,760 --> 00:15:49,840
Speaker 1: I really only considered an electric car last time time

261
00:15:49,840 --> 00:15:53,720
Speaker 1: before I a plug in hybrid. But honestly, it has

262
00:15:53,800 --> 00:15:59,240
Speaker 1: amazing pickup. It has way better pickup than any car

263
00:15:59,320 --> 00:16:01,320
Speaker 1: I've ever done drive. I mean, it's like being in

264
00:16:01,360 --> 00:16:03,720
Speaker 1: a rocket, you know. I think we're going to see

265
00:16:04,120 --> 00:16:06,280
Speaker 1: this is going to enable a lot of things where

266
00:16:06,280 --> 00:16:10,920
Speaker 1: you go. It's not just that we have clean air,

267
00:16:11,720 --> 00:16:17,760
Speaker 1: safe water, normal temperatures, normal seasons. It's also a great ribe.

268
00:16:19,200 --> 00:16:22,600
Speaker 3: In twenty twenty one, Tom took this concept of movement

269
00:16:22,720 --> 00:16:26,280
Speaker 3: capitalism a step further. He found in a business called

270
00:16:26,320 --> 00:16:30,560
Speaker 3: Galvanized Climate Solutions. It's an investment firm with two goals.

271
00:16:31,240 --> 00:16:35,360
Speaker 3: Make a positive climate impact and make investors a lot

272
00:16:35,400 --> 00:16:39,400
Speaker 3: of money. So you're helping investors find those opportunities, those

273
00:16:39,440 --> 00:16:44,960
Speaker 3: amazing opportunities to decarbonize economy, builviss and our cities, our communities.

274
00:16:45,800 --> 00:16:48,280
Speaker 3: But I'm curioused to know are they really aware of

275
00:16:48,320 --> 00:16:50,720
Speaker 3: what they're doing? I mean, are the investors aware of

276
00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:53,480
Speaker 3: the rest of economic system if they don't take action

277
00:16:53,560 --> 00:16:56,600
Speaker 3: on global heating and is that a motivator for them.

278
00:16:56,800 --> 00:17:02,560
Speaker 1: So I think that our investor have two motivations. One

279
00:17:02,600 --> 00:17:06,800
Speaker 1: is they want to get and we must deliver good returns.

280
00:17:07,240 --> 00:17:09,200
Speaker 1: Market returns are better. Our goal is to have the

281
00:17:09,280 --> 00:17:12,199
Speaker 1: highest returns in the world. And we believe that the

282
00:17:12,320 --> 00:17:16,720
Speaker 1: need for this change is a really huge demand generator

283
00:17:16,800 --> 00:17:21,480
Speaker 1: revenue generator for these businesses. But I think everybody who's

284
00:17:21,520 --> 00:17:28,520
Speaker 1: investing explicitly in galvanized climate solutions knows we will only

285
00:17:28,560 --> 00:17:30,720
Speaker 1: invest in things that have positive climate impact.

286
00:17:33,400 --> 00:17:36,840
Speaker 3: So what kind of investments can actually have a positive

287
00:17:36,920 --> 00:17:40,040
Speaker 3: climate impact. We're going to spend a few minutes talking

288
00:17:40,040 --> 00:17:45,600
Speaker 3: about free areas where Toms's opportunity, real estate, information technology,

289
00:17:45,960 --> 00:17:49,960
Speaker 3: and something called sequestration. Let's start with the first one,

290
00:17:50,600 --> 00:17:54,119
Speaker 3: real estate. How can investing in real estate have a

291
00:17:54,160 --> 00:17:55,080
Speaker 3: climate impact?

292
00:17:55,359 --> 00:17:58,200
Speaker 1: We're doing a fund to do net zero real estate

293
00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:03,000
Speaker 1: and basically what is mean? That means generating electricity differently

294
00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:08,119
Speaker 1: reskinning the building using heat pumps, and to do this

295
00:18:08,160 --> 00:18:10,800
Speaker 1: in a way that gets better returns. And why is

296
00:18:10,800 --> 00:18:13,919
Speaker 1: it important to do this? Eighty percent of the buildings

297
00:18:13,960 --> 00:18:17,320
Speaker 1: in the US that exist right now will still be

298
00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:18,600
Speaker 1: in use in twenty fifty.

299
00:18:19,040 --> 00:18:23,119
Speaker 3: Those buildings are carbon super producers. A lot of the

300
00:18:23,160 --> 00:18:26,000
Speaker 3: infrastructure around us today was built at a time when

301
00:18:26,040 --> 00:18:30,080
Speaker 3: sustainable architecture wasn't at the top of people's minds. The

302
00:18:30,160 --> 00:18:34,240
Speaker 3: result is pretty astounding. Across the world, buildings makeup as

303
00:18:34,320 --> 00:18:38,800
Speaker 3: staggering thirty nine percent of all greenhouse gas emissions thirty

304
00:18:38,880 --> 00:18:42,520
Speaker 3: nine percent. Most of that comes from what we do

305
00:18:42,600 --> 00:18:46,679
Speaker 3: in those buildings, think heating and cooling the units we

306
00:18:46,720 --> 00:18:49,879
Speaker 3: live and work in. So yes, some of it is

307
00:18:49,960 --> 00:18:52,040
Speaker 3: due to how much energy we used to build them,

308
00:18:52,440 --> 00:18:55,280
Speaker 3: but these emissions could be greatly reduced if we made

309
00:18:55,320 --> 00:18:58,600
Speaker 3: small changes to how we run them. So all of

310
00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:01,840
Speaker 3: that is to say, of these buildings are powered matters

311
00:19:01,880 --> 00:19:04,960
Speaker 3: a lot in our fights to combat the climate crisis.

312
00:19:05,280 --> 00:19:08,439
Speaker 1: We have to reformat these buildings, and we have to

313
00:19:08,480 --> 00:19:11,600
Speaker 1: do it in a way that makes the landlord's richer,

314
00:19:12,320 --> 00:19:16,040
Speaker 1: because if that isn't true, they ain't going to do it.

315
00:19:16,760 --> 00:19:19,639
Speaker 1: So we have to do it and prove it and

316
00:19:19,760 --> 00:19:24,320
Speaker 1: develop the kind of you know, the recipe to do it,

317
00:19:24,359 --> 00:19:27,600
Speaker 1: so everybody goes like wall, Chris is doing it. If

318
00:19:27,680 --> 00:19:29,080
Speaker 1: Chris is doing it, I can do it.

319
00:19:29,640 --> 00:19:32,520
Speaker 3: For Tom and his partners. It's not just enough to

320
00:19:32,560 --> 00:19:35,680
Speaker 3: find companies that have an innovative business plan or a

321
00:19:35,680 --> 00:19:38,879
Speaker 3: cool new technology, it has to be something that works

322
00:19:38,880 --> 00:19:42,800
Speaker 3: in the real world. Sometimes when we imagine a green future,

323
00:19:42,960 --> 00:19:44,879
Speaker 3: we think of a world in which all the old

324
00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:48,800
Speaker 3: polluting technology has been wiped away and replaced with something

325
00:19:49,119 --> 00:19:52,800
Speaker 3: shiny and new. But real estate is a perfect example

326
00:19:52,920 --> 00:19:56,440
Speaker 3: of why that doesn't work. We can't tear down every

327
00:19:56,480 --> 00:19:58,520
Speaker 3: home in the world and replace it with a most

328
00:19:58,560 --> 00:20:02,800
Speaker 3: climate friendly alternative. It would take decades and cost an

329
00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:07,320
Speaker 3: absolute fortune, not to mention, of course, construction itself has

330
00:20:07,359 --> 00:20:08,520
Speaker 3: a climate impact.

331
00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:10,600
Speaker 1: I mean, two of the things I'd say about this

332
00:20:10,640 --> 00:20:13,119
Speaker 1: are one is we're not going to be able to

333
00:20:13,200 --> 00:20:16,760
Speaker 1: rebuild all the industry, the industrial plants, manufacturing plants either

334
00:20:17,640 --> 00:20:19,639
Speaker 1: one of the questions, and this is a real question

335
00:20:19,720 --> 00:20:22,280
Speaker 1: for technology. Let's say you have a cool technology, but

336
00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:25,960
Speaker 1: it means we have to rebuild every plant in the world. Okay, sorry,

337
00:20:26,240 --> 00:20:28,480
Speaker 1: We're going to have to take your technology and figure

338
00:20:28,480 --> 00:20:31,639
Speaker 1: out how to do it within the footprints of the

339
00:20:31,680 --> 00:20:35,560
Speaker 1: existing plants in a way that makes those owners richer,

340
00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:38,439
Speaker 1: because that's why they're going to do it. And you know,

341
00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:42,480
Speaker 1: we're looking at some technologies which just from an efficiency standpoint,

342
00:20:42,520 --> 00:20:45,280
Speaker 1: if they had no CO two impact at all, make

343
00:20:45,359 --> 00:20:49,720
Speaker 1: people multiples of their money in the first year. That's

344
00:20:49,800 --> 00:20:50,520
Speaker 1: what we need.

345
00:20:50,600 --> 00:20:52,320
Speaker 3: That's a complete noe brainer.

346
00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:54,000
Speaker 1: Isn't it. Yees. So it's like you sit here and

347
00:20:54,040 --> 00:20:56,920
Speaker 1: go like, Okay, I'll do that. I'm glad it does

348
00:20:56,960 --> 00:21:00,280
Speaker 1: the CO two thing, but I'm doing it for the money.

349
00:21:00,920 --> 00:21:04,119
Speaker 1: That's one thing that's really true is within the footprint

350
00:21:04,200 --> 00:21:07,320
Speaker 1: of the existing building or situation.

351
00:21:09,160 --> 00:21:13,960
Speaker 3: Okay, let's move on to Tom's second big investment opportunity,

352
00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:18,200
Speaker 3: information technology. As he sees it, one of the big

353
00:21:18,320 --> 00:21:21,240
Speaker 3: challenges in creating a cleaner future is that we don't

354
00:21:21,280 --> 00:21:23,840
Speaker 3: actually know how much we're actually polluting.

355
00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:26,280
Speaker 1: And when we think about how we're going to solve

356
00:21:26,320 --> 00:21:30,840
Speaker 1: this problem, people think about all of these gadgets, solar

357
00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:39,720
Speaker 1: wind batteries, electric vehicles, things you can touch. But if

358
00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:42,600
Speaker 1: you're going to manage that, you have to know the information.

359
00:21:43,119 --> 00:21:47,199
Speaker 1: If you're going to change your carbon footprint, you have

360
00:21:47,240 --> 00:21:49,960
Speaker 1: to know what your carbon footprint is, you have to

361
00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:51,920
Speaker 1: know where it's going to come from. So I always

362
00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:55,359
Speaker 1: say to people, Okay, what's the carbon footprint of my sweater?

363
00:21:56,520 --> 00:21:59,960
Speaker 1: I don't know, and neither does anyone else. But until

364
00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:02,560
Speaker 1: the people making the sweater know, and until I know,

365
00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:04,679
Speaker 1: how are we going to change our carbon foot right?

366
00:22:04,760 --> 00:22:06,919
Speaker 1: How do I not buy the sweater that's made the

367
00:22:06,920 --> 00:22:09,520
Speaker 1: wrong way if I don't know how they're made. So

368
00:22:09,680 --> 00:22:12,879
Speaker 1: a lot of this is going to be about information,

369
00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:16,920
Speaker 1: transparency and holding people accountable to what they're doing.

370
00:22:21,320 --> 00:22:24,040
Speaker 3: Do you know the climate impact of all the choices

371
00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:27,760
Speaker 3: you make? Can you tell if one sweater is better

372
00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:31,280
Speaker 3: for the environment than another? In most cases, the answer

373
00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:34,520
Speaker 3: is probably no, And that's in part because measure the

374
00:22:34,560 --> 00:22:37,640
Speaker 3: climate impact of something is a lot more complicated than

375
00:22:37,680 --> 00:22:40,440
Speaker 3: you might think. It brings us to a concept known

376
00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:43,800
Speaker 3: as scope free and a segment we like to call

377
00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:45,639
Speaker 3: what the fuck are you talking about?

378
00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:49,160
Speaker 1: What the fuck are you talking about?

379
00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:55,240
Speaker 3: When businesses want to measure their environmental impact, they use

380
00:22:55,280 --> 00:23:00,320
Speaker 3: something called the Greenhouse Gas Protocol. This piffy title is

381
00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:03,879
Speaker 3: an international standard for how we classify where emissions are

382
00:23:03,920 --> 00:23:09,040
Speaker 3: coming from, and, confusingly, these classifications are known as scopes.

383
00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:13,680
Speaker 3: Scope one emissions are the direct pollution produced by a company.

384
00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:17,639
Speaker 3: To stick with Tom's sweater example, imagine you run a

385
00:23:17,680 --> 00:23:22,200
Speaker 3: sweater making factory. The emissions from your company vehicles transporting

386
00:23:22,240 --> 00:23:26,159
Speaker 3: the sweaters are scope one Scope two emissions are created

387
00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:29,240
Speaker 3: by the power your factory uses, So these are the

388
00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:32,760
Speaker 3: emissions from a secondary source. The power plant that supplies

389
00:23:32,760 --> 00:23:36,240
Speaker 3: your electricity is your sweater factory run by a coal

390
00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:40,199
Speaker 3: powered plant or by a wind farm. And finally, scope

391
00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:42,960
Speaker 3: free emissions are all the other pollution linked with a

392
00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:47,320
Speaker 3: company's activities. Your sweater factory uses yarn that you bought

393
00:23:47,359 --> 00:23:50,800
Speaker 3: from somewhere. How much pollution did the yarn factory create?

394
00:23:51,600 --> 00:23:54,880
Speaker 3: Your employees are commuting to work each day? Are they

395
00:23:54,920 --> 00:23:59,000
Speaker 3: driving bicycles or monster trucks? When you try to add

396
00:23:59,040 --> 00:24:02,399
Speaker 3: all these up, enough to make your head spin. And

397
00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:05,439
Speaker 3: it's why scope free emissions are the hardest to measure

398
00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:08,639
Speaker 3: and why they're almost always for biggest source of emissions

399
00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:12,000
Speaker 3: for a business. But if we really want to understand

400
00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:14,679
Speaker 3: our climate impact, we have to be able to measure

401
00:24:14,800 --> 00:24:18,120
Speaker 3: scope free emissions. And this is something that Tom can

402
00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:22,720
Speaker 3: help with by investing in information technology. And that's what

403
00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:29,880
Speaker 3: the fuck we're talking about? What the fuck? Okay, back

404
00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:34,159
Speaker 3: to Tom. You'll be shocked to hear most businesses hate

405
00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:38,040
Speaker 3: the idea of measuring scope free emissions. It shows that

406
00:24:38,119 --> 00:24:41,119
Speaker 3: their products are much dirtier. But if they just measured

407
00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:42,400
Speaker 3: scopes one and two.

408
00:24:42,600 --> 00:24:45,199
Speaker 1: You know, the Chamber of Commerce is dramatically opposed to

409
00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:47,919
Speaker 1: it would be a huge problem for companies, and I

410
00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:51,440
Speaker 1: believe once people know what's going on, that's going to

411
00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:55,240
Speaker 1: put immense pressure on those companies to get their emissions

412
00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:58,440
Speaker 1: under control. As long as you don't know what you're doing,

413
00:24:59,080 --> 00:25:04,080
Speaker 1: you have plausible deniability and you can't be expected your honor.

414
00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:06,159
Speaker 1: I had no idea it was true. As soon as

415
00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:08,760
Speaker 1: I found out it was true, I acted on it.

416
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:11,840
Speaker 1: So the longer I don't know it's true, the longer

417
00:25:11,840 --> 00:25:15,400
Speaker 1: I have plausible deniability and you know, and no one

418
00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:19,560
Speaker 1: can really come after you. So that's why the truth

419
00:25:19,600 --> 00:25:23,520
Speaker 1: in this and the measurement of this is so important,

420
00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:27,400
Speaker 1: because basically, people are polluting for free and they love

421
00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:30,480
Speaker 1: it because, you know what, who wants to pay for

422
00:25:30,520 --> 00:25:35,280
Speaker 1: their pollution? Nobody. So they're like, we've never paid for it,

423
00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:38,280
Speaker 1: it's free. Why should we suddenly have to pay for

424
00:25:38,320 --> 00:25:41,119
Speaker 1: our pollution just because that pollution might ruin the world.

425
00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:43,679
Speaker 1: It's like, well, that seems like a pretty good reason.

426
00:25:44,280 --> 00:25:47,280
Speaker 3: Given all of this, why would any business measure its

427
00:25:47,280 --> 00:25:51,480
Speaker 3: scope free emissions? Simply put, the government is going to

428
00:25:51,600 --> 00:25:54,720
Speaker 3: make them do it. They have are multiple laws and

429
00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:58,200
Speaker 3: policies being debated as we speak that would have this effect.

430
00:25:58,920 --> 00:26:03,199
Speaker 3: The big business is it's already allure in California. So

431
00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:06,439
Speaker 3: if every company is suddenly required to measure their scope

432
00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:09,520
Speaker 3: free emissions and you are in the technology that does

433
00:26:09,600 --> 00:26:12,879
Speaker 3: for measurement, that seems like a pretty good business to me.

434
00:26:15,520 --> 00:26:19,600
Speaker 3: But besides being a cool business idea, Tom thinks the

435
00:26:19,680 --> 00:26:25,240
Speaker 3: environmental impact could be huge because given the choice, people

436
00:26:25,280 --> 00:26:28,160
Speaker 3: prefer to buy stuff that doesn't destroy the planet.

437
00:26:28,760 --> 00:26:30,879
Speaker 1: That's been polled just you know, Chris, if you go

438
00:26:30,960 --> 00:26:36,720
Speaker 1: around the world, seventy six percent of consumer's claim that

439
00:26:36,800 --> 00:26:42,640
Speaker 1: they would take environmentalism into account when making consumer decisions. Now,

440
00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:46,200
Speaker 1: do I believe that mostly No, Most people by the

441
00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:49,399
Speaker 1: cheapest best thing they can find, regardless of how it

442
00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:54,160
Speaker 1: was produced. But in the United States of America, the

443
00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:58,720
Speaker 1: estimate is from also detailed polling data that's something like

444
00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:01,119
Speaker 1: eighteen to twenty percent the people really will take it

445
00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:04,960
Speaker 1: into account? I would, but I believe if twenty percent

446
00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:08,879
Speaker 1: of Americans are willing to take it into account in

447
00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:14,119
Speaker 1: making their purchase decisions, that is a huge companies.

448
00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:27,000
Speaker 2: We're fucking the future. We're fucking the future.

449
00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:33,320
Speaker 3: That brings us to Tom's third and final investment idea

450
00:27:33,359 --> 00:27:36,760
Speaker 3: for today. It's something called sequestration.

451
00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:39,520
Speaker 1: One of the big verticals which is going to be

452
00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:43,280
Speaker 1: a trillion dollar industry that doesn't exist right now is sequestration.

453
00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:50,879
Speaker 1: And sequestration is simply somehow taking CO two or methane

454
00:27:50,920 --> 00:27:55,160
Speaker 1: out of the atmosphere and somehow sequestering it or sticking

455
00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:56,760
Speaker 1: at someplace where it's going to stay.

456
00:27:57,280 --> 00:28:00,639
Speaker 3: Obviously, the reason we have global heating is burning a

457
00:28:00,640 --> 00:28:04,040
Speaker 3: lot of dirty fossil fuels, and the emissions are floating

458
00:28:04,080 --> 00:28:09,080
Speaker 3: around in our atmosphere. Sequestration companies pull the carbon out

459
00:28:09,119 --> 00:28:12,640
Speaker 3: of the air and pump it underground or store it somewhere.

460
00:28:13,119 --> 00:28:16,919
Speaker 3: And here's the thing, it doesn't matter where you store it,

461
00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:20,200
Speaker 3: as long as that carbon is out of the atmosphere.

462
00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:23,000
Speaker 3: And that's where Tom sees big opportunity.

463
00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:27,239
Speaker 1: One of the points that's true about that is a

464
00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:31,879
Speaker 1: ton of CO two sequestered in Kenya is worth every

465
00:28:31,920 --> 00:28:35,399
Speaker 1: bit as much as a ton of two that's sequestered

466
00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:41,440
Speaker 1: in Brisbane or Berlin or Iowa. And so if it

467
00:28:41,480 --> 00:28:48,080
Speaker 1: can be done less expensively, in Kenya, and if the

468
00:28:48,200 --> 00:28:50,920
Speaker 1: money that's paid for it is exactly the same as

469
00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:53,240
Speaker 1: in any of those other three spots around the world,

470
00:28:53,920 --> 00:28:57,560
Speaker 1: but that money means a lot more relative to the

471
00:28:58,080 --> 00:29:02,000
Speaker 1: annual average income in Kenya than it does in Germany,

472
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:07,160
Speaker 1: Australia or the US, then that's a gigantic opportunity for

473
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:10,040
Speaker 1: the people of the world. It's a gigantic opportunity for

474
00:29:10,080 --> 00:29:12,720
Speaker 1: the people of Kenya, and it's a real way to

475
00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:18,400
Speaker 1: redistribute and build capability around the world and reallocate money

476
00:29:18,600 --> 00:29:20,400
Speaker 1: to the tune of at least a trillion dollars year.

477
00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:22,520
Speaker 3: At trillion dollars.

478
00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:23,680
Speaker 1: Wow.

479
00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:27,560
Speaker 3: So these are some of the opportunities that Tom believes

480
00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:30,080
Speaker 3: are out there. We're doing the right thing for the

481
00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:32,240
Speaker 3: climate can be big business.

482
00:29:33,640 --> 00:29:37,960
Speaker 1: I mean, if we're producing goods and services that are cheaper, better,

483
00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:41,720
Speaker 1: faster and cleaner, they're going to get adopted. I mean,

484
00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:46,120
Speaker 1: for hundreds of years, new technologies have come in and

485
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:49,480
Speaker 1: replaced old technologies, and they've done it in the form

486
00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:52,360
Speaker 1: of an s where that takes a long time to

487
00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:57,080
Speaker 1: develop them, the costs finally change and then there's rapid

488
00:29:57,120 --> 00:30:00,800
Speaker 1: adoption over a period of time. So that's happened. I mean,

489
00:30:00,920 --> 00:30:03,480
Speaker 1: I doubt Chris that you've been using that much whale

490
00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:04,440
Speaker 1: oil recently.

491
00:30:04,640 --> 00:30:06,520
Speaker 3: No, that is true.

492
00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:10,120
Speaker 1: But if private sector can prove that doing the right

493
00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:13,520
Speaker 1: thing is cheaper and easy to adopt, than governments can

494
00:30:13,560 --> 00:30:17,320
Speaker 1: do other things to support it and make it ubiquitous. Yeah. Absolutely,

495
00:30:17,480 --> 00:30:20,560
Speaker 1: So it's this interactive thing of Okay, we need to

496
00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:22,880
Speaker 1: do this. How can we make it possible for the

497
00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:25,720
Speaker 1: private sector to do it and to scale? Okay, now

498
00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:28,080
Speaker 1: that they've proved it's cheaper and better, how do we

499
00:30:28,120 --> 00:30:32,200
Speaker 1: make it not a good solution but basically ubiquitous solution,

500
00:30:32,520 --> 00:30:34,920
Speaker 1: so that we just move all the way. If you

501
00:30:35,040 --> 00:30:36,920
Speaker 1: miss this, you're missing the boat.

502
00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:40,760
Speaker 3: It's so important for people to have that vision that's

503
00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:44,120
Speaker 3: positive for the future, something that's actually really empowering.

504
00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:46,600
Speaker 1: Look, I think that this is just a huge tailwind

505
00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:50,720
Speaker 1: for companies that are are behind this change, and it's

506
00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:53,440
Speaker 1: going to be that if you go back and look

507
00:30:53,440 --> 00:30:56,640
Speaker 1: over the last ten or twenty years, people have dramatically

508
00:30:56,920 --> 00:31:01,840
Speaker 1: underestimated the speed and size of this change, and they

509
00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:03,680
Speaker 1: are going to continue to underestimate it.

510
00:31:05,160 --> 00:31:08,400
Speaker 3: I'm completely inspired. I'm sure our listeners are too.

511
00:31:08,720 --> 00:31:11,400
Speaker 1: Thanks so much, Chris, Thank you very much, really enjoyed

512
00:31:11,400 --> 00:31:12,280
Speaker 1: it so much fun.

513
00:31:13,560 --> 00:31:16,200
Speaker 3: I have to say I didn't expect to feel so

514
00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:20,600
Speaker 3: inspired by a conversation about real estate investing. But Tom

515
00:31:20,680 --> 00:31:23,040
Speaker 3: is pointing a way towards something we in the environmental

516
00:31:23,040 --> 00:31:26,960
Speaker 3: community we often overlook. We sometimes think about businesses and

517
00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:31,000
Speaker 3: corporations as our adversaries. I mean, after all, industrialization is

518
00:31:31,000 --> 00:31:34,480
Speaker 3: what has caused this climate crisis, but harnessed in the

519
00:31:34,520 --> 00:31:37,840
Speaker 3: right way, these same forces can also be our partners

520
00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:41,040
Speaker 3: in the fight against global heating. And the truth is,

521
00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:44,720
Speaker 3: if we're going to unfucked things, we're really going to

522
00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:50,680
Speaker 3: need their help. So in this episode, we've talked a

523
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:54,080
Speaker 3: lot about climate friendly investments, but what can you do

524
00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:58,000
Speaker 3: if you're not a venture capitalist? To answer that question,

525
00:31:58,120 --> 00:32:00,120
Speaker 3: I'd like to bring in my friend Maggie bed for

526
00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:03,640
Speaker 3: a final segment this week, something we call what the

527
00:32:03,680 --> 00:32:04,480
Speaker 3: fuck can I Do?

528
00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:07,160
Speaker 2: What the fuck can I do?

529
00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:11,920
Speaker 3: Hey, Maggie, Well, Tom Stad's interview was all about using

530
00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:15,360
Speaker 3: a power of capitalism to fight global heating, but not

531
00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:18,720
Speaker 3: all of us are billionaire venture capitalists, So what can

532
00:32:18,760 --> 00:32:19,120
Speaker 3: we do?

533
00:32:19,400 --> 00:32:22,680
Speaker 6: Well, you may not be a billionaire yet, but you

534
00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:26,120
Speaker 6: might have, say a savings account, maybe you have a

535
00:32:26,160 --> 00:32:29,200
Speaker 6: retirement account through your work or something, and so one

536
00:32:29,280 --> 00:32:32,480
Speaker 6: thing you can do is make sure that whatever money

537
00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:36,560
Speaker 6: you have, it's not going to support the burning.

538
00:32:36,280 --> 00:32:37,400
Speaker 1: Of fossil fuels.

539
00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:41,800
Speaker 7: It's a strategy that is known as devestment. So make

540
00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:46,200
Speaker 7: sure that you don't own any stocks in fossil fuel companies,

541
00:32:46,320 --> 00:32:50,760
Speaker 7: either directly or through any mutual funds or other funds

542
00:32:50,800 --> 00:32:54,280
Speaker 7: you might have in a retirement account or or something similar.

543
00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:57,240
Speaker 7: And there are lots of funds from big banks like

544
00:32:57,280 --> 00:33:02,120
Speaker 7: Fidelity that anyone can invest in instead that are specifically

545
00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:07,040
Speaker 7: pro climate. So check with your financial advisor or whomever

546
00:33:07,200 --> 00:33:10,840
Speaker 7: you really trust for financial advice, but tell them that

547
00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:15,040
Speaker 7: this matters to you. And lastly, make sure that your

548
00:33:15,200 --> 00:33:19,120
Speaker 7: bank is climate friendly. We've put a link in the

549
00:33:19,160 --> 00:33:22,320
Speaker 7: show notes to a site that has great lists of

550
00:33:22,520 --> 00:33:26,560
Speaker 7: pro climate banks. Take a look and make sure your

551
00:33:26,720 --> 00:33:29,840
Speaker 7: bank isn't propping up fossil fuel companies.

552
00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:34,200
Speaker 3: Thanks Maggie, that is so important, isn't it.

553
00:33:34,520 --> 00:33:34,959
Speaker 7: Thank you?

554
00:33:35,720 --> 00:33:38,200
Speaker 3: And for everyone listening out there. That's what the fuck

555
00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:39,320
Speaker 3: you can do to help?

556
00:33:39,920 --> 00:33:42,240
Speaker 2: What fuck can I do?

557
00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:46,320
Speaker 1: Oh? We're fucked.

558
00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:52,920
Speaker 3: That's all for this episode. Next time on the Fucking

559
00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:56,520
Speaker 3: the Future, psychologist, doctor Lisa van Susteren will talk to

560
00:33:56,600 --> 00:33:59,640
Speaker 3: us about how climate is impacting our mental health and

561
00:33:59,720 --> 00:34:01,120
Speaker 3: what we can do about it.

562
00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:06,520
Speaker 8: Oh, it's even desirable, frankly to be outraged and angry.

563
00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:10,680
Speaker 8: Many studies show that that is the prelude to taking action,

564
00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:15,839
Speaker 8: that it is protective to be angry and outraged. They

565
00:34:15,960 --> 00:34:19,560
Speaker 8: are healthy emotions to an unhealthy.

566
00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:23,720
Speaker 3: Condition until then, I'm Chris Turney signing off from Sydney, Australia.

567
00:34:23,880 --> 00:34:26,680
Speaker 3: Thanks for joining me in I'm Fucking the Future.

568
00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:29,840
Speaker 2: Weird Fucking the Future.

569
00:34:34,560 --> 00:34:37,319
Speaker 3: I'm Fucking the Future is produced by Imagine Audio and

570
00:34:37,440 --> 00:34:41,400
Speaker 3: Awfully Nice for iHeart Podcasts and hosted by me Chris Turney.

571
00:34:41,920 --> 00:34:45,239
Speaker 3: The show is written by Meredith Bryan. I'm Fucking the

572
00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:48,440
Speaker 3: Future is produced by Amber von Schassen and Rene Colvert.

573
00:34:48,840 --> 00:34:53,000
Speaker 3: Ron Howard, Brian Grazer, Carl Welker and Nathan Chloke are

574
00:34:53,040 --> 00:34:56,760
Speaker 3: the executive producers from Imagine Audio. Jesse Burton and Katie

575
00:34:56,760 --> 00:35:00,800
Speaker 3: Hodges are the executive producers from Awfully Nice. Sound design

576
00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:04,840
Speaker 3: and mixing by Evan Arnette, original music by Lily Hayden

577
00:35:04,960 --> 00:35:09,640
Speaker 3: and producing services by Peter McGuigan. Sam Swinnerton wrote our theme,

578
00:35:09,719 --> 00:35:13,200
Speaker 3: and all those fun jingles. If you enjoyed this episode,

579
00:35:13,360 --> 00:35:16,080
Speaker 3: be sure to rate and review Unfucking the Future on

580
00:35:16,200 --> 00:35:19,080
Speaker 3: Apple Podcasts or whether you get your podcasts