Speaker 1: Welcome to Ruthie's Table four, a production of iHeartRadio and
Speaker 1: Adamized Studios.
Speaker 2: In September, the River Cafe will be thirty six years old,
Speaker 2: and one of the great joys of having a restaurant
Speaker 2: for so long is watching the second generation and now
Speaker 2: even a third generation of her early customers grow up.
Speaker 2: Adwa's parents, Charles Boa and Camilla Luther, have been part
Speaker 2: of the River Cafe family since reopened, and ad was
Speaker 2: gone from being a young child ordering pasta, butter and
Speaker 2: cheese and then playing in the garden space outside with
Speaker 2: her friends to a formidable woman focused on the political
Speaker 2: and social issues relevant today. After her own struggles with
Speaker 2: mental health and to support young women's wellbeing, she founded
Speaker 2: the organization Girls Talk, providing a safe space for girls
Speaker 2: to access resources, share experiences, create community, and feel less alone,
Speaker 2: a place to escape the chaos of the every day.
Speaker 2: I think a beautiful phrase today. Ed was just come
Speaker 2: from the kitchen grilling scallops and frying zucchini, and she's
Speaker 2: going to tell us what she learned and read the
Speaker 2: recipe so you can cook this at home. It's both
Speaker 2: moving and exciting for me to have ed. We're here oh, oh,
Speaker 2: so nice. So you've been in the kitchen then in
Speaker 2: the River Cafee kitchen, which do you remember coming here.
Speaker 3: All the time all the time Ronnie and Johnathan? Yeah,
Speaker 3: they used to take us all the time.
Speaker 2: And you've just been in the kitchen, and so you
Speaker 2: watched your request for the recipe with scallops grilled scallops
Speaker 2: with chili and zucchini.
Speaker 4: My name's Adriana and I'm a chepher at the River
Speaker 4: Cafe and today I'm cooking some scallops on the grilling.
Speaker 3: That now, Joan, I'm not cooking anything.
Speaker 4: You can cook it with me if you want.
Speaker 5: Okay, cool.
Speaker 4: We put them in the center of the grill because
Speaker 4: that's the hardest place.
Speaker 5: How long do you have to leave them on forard Not.
Speaker 4: Very long at all. So you just keep them, don't
Speaker 4: move them around, keep them where they are, and then
Speaker 4: they'll start kind.
Speaker 3: Of coming off.
Speaker 4: You can kind of look at the bottom and see
Speaker 4: how they're cooking, because if you move them too quickly
Speaker 4: then they'll stick.
Speaker 3: Oh wow, and.
Speaker 4: Then we're gonna get some pretty may I think, Harry,
Speaker 4: you're doing pretty right? Can you drop some pretty for us?
Speaker 2: So we have two recipes one. I think it's really
Speaker 2: for the batter for the zucchini, and then quite simple the.
Speaker 3: Scales scallops and zucchini pretty four ripe zucchini, one litera
Speaker 3: sunflower oil for the batter. One cup all purpose flour,
Speaker 3: three tablespoons extra virgin olive oil. Get always get really
Speaker 3: confused that the tablespoon and teaspoon.
Speaker 2: There is a difference, like.
Speaker 5: The way it's written.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because it's tablespoon tsp.
Speaker 3: Is three tablespoons extra virgin olive oil, three tablespoons warm water,
Speaker 3: three egg whites, scallops, sixteen shells sea scallops, two lemons,
Speaker 3: extra virgin olival Cut the zucchini into ovals, then into
Speaker 3: thick matchsticks for the batter. Sift the flour into a bowl,
Speaker 3: making a well in the center.
Speaker 5: Pour in the olive oil and stuff.
Speaker 3: Loosen the paste by slowly adding enough warm water to
Speaker 3: make a batter the consistency of heavy cream.
Speaker 5: Leave for thirty minutes.
Speaker 3: Heat the oil in a high sided pan to three
Speaker 3: hundred and seventy five degrees. Beat the egg whites until
Speaker 3: stiff and fold into the batter. Dip zucchini, then fry
Speaker 3: in batches in hot oil until golden and crisp. Serve
Speaker 3: immediately scallops. Heat the grill. Season the scallops very generously
Speaker 3: on both sides with salt and pepper. Actually she said
Speaker 3: only salt and then pepper at the end.
Speaker 2: Don't put the pepper on, Yeah, don't, Okay.
Speaker 3: It burns quickly, so put the pepper on after place
Speaker 3: on the grill until lightly brown and crisp. Then turn
Speaker 3: over the grill. On the other side. The scallop should
Speaker 3: be tender on the inside and crisp on the surface.
Speaker 3: Serve with lemon and a drizzle of olive oil. And
Speaker 3: I had some chili online, so.
Speaker 5: If you have to place it all up.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's the really fun part about working here is
Speaker 4: that you get to plate all of your.
Speaker 5: Food because well, who would usually do.
Speaker 4: That in like another so you bring it up to
Speaker 4: the past, and maybe someone on the past would plate it,
Speaker 4: but here you get to do it and it gives
Speaker 4: you I mean, for me, it's really satisfying.
Speaker 2: Water.
Speaker 5: Wow, I'm coming here for dinner.
Speaker 2: Tell me about going to Vogue with Edward, because we did.
Speaker 2: When Edward Nfl became the editor, we did the party.
Speaker 2: Remember that we had a party for him. I was
Speaker 2: a great party. You were the cover for his first year.
Speaker 3: That was mad, that Vogue party. I remember that like
Speaker 3: it was yesterday. I remember us driving here and I,
Speaker 3: you know, Edward, and I still laugh about it now.
Speaker 5: It's like it wasn't naivety.
Speaker 3: I think it was just this we were just doing
Speaker 3: something that felt very special to both of us. It
Speaker 3: was like this, we were embarking on this new journey,
Speaker 3: and it wasn't necessarily that we were. We were completely
Speaker 3: naive to how the world was going to embrace it,
Speaker 3: you know, not only just people in fashion but worldwide.
Speaker 3: You know, it really went you know what I mean, I think.
Speaker 3: And so as we kind of pulled up. I pulled up,
Speaker 3: I can't remember who I was in the car with me.
Speaker 3: It was like my mom and dad and system. We
Speaker 3: pulled up the Shepherd's Bush roundabout and it was projected
Speaker 3: on Shepherd's Bush round about.
Speaker 5: What the hell is going on?
Speaker 3: And I looked on my phone and it was just
Speaker 3: like going mad and I actually like broke out into hives.
Speaker 3: I was like, oh my god, this is so much.
Speaker 3: I don't even know how to deal with this situation.
Speaker 3: I pulled up the River Cafe and Edwin and I
Speaker 3: just giggled.
Speaker 5: We could not stop laughing.
Speaker 3: I think we were both so overwhelmed by what had
Speaker 3: happened that we kind of just like could not stop laughing.
Speaker 5: It was mad. It still feels really mad.
Speaker 2: We all had Ravioli. We had this long discussion before
Speaker 2: whether all the Vogue people, the models and the actresses
Speaker 2: and the young beauties of today would actually have gluten carbs,
Speaker 2: cheese butter, and whether we would serve it. And we did,
Speaker 2: and bo was actually really cool because we said, do
Speaker 2: you want to find out what people won't do they get?
Speaker 2: Now we're done with that. We're done with you know,
Speaker 2: if you have a food preference, we're just going to
Speaker 2: do the menu and what they eat. They and everybody
Speaker 2: had reveally, and everybody, a lot of people had seconds
Speaker 2: of REVIALI and yet the whole issue with the being
Speaker 2: a model about your body, talk about being a woman
Speaker 2: in a profession that requires you to be a certain shape.
Speaker 3: Beside, I think I don't remember being worried. I think
Speaker 3: there were moments when I was at school where I
Speaker 3: was kind of worried about what I looked like. Sometimes
Speaker 3: I didn't I wasn't at a girls' school. But you know,
Speaker 3: I lived in a house full of women, so sometimes
Speaker 3: when someone would get a bit like weird with food
Speaker 3: or they'd have you know, issues, it kind of sometimes
Speaker 3: bleeds into everyone else within the community, do you know
Speaker 3: what I mean?
Speaker 5: We see that all the time.
Speaker 3: And I think when I started modeling, I don't again
Speaker 3: remember feeling that pressured about it. I think I just
Speaker 3: felt like incredibly painful in my own body in general,
Speaker 3: So it wasn't necessarily like kind of weight related. I
Speaker 3: think there's always been like parts of my body that
Speaker 3: I haven't like loved, you know what I mean, And
Speaker 3: I've had to grow to love the.
Speaker 2: Are you the kind of person that can eat but
Speaker 2: not gain weight, Yeah, because I've always done lots and
Speaker 2: lots of sports. But were other models that you were with?
Speaker 2: What did you feel that to be a model you
Speaker 2: had to be a Yeah.
Speaker 3: I got weird with food for a period of time
Speaker 3: actually when I got sober, and they call it that transference,
Speaker 3: you know, I think I was just trying to control
Speaker 3: something else.
Speaker 5: In my life.
Speaker 3: So I got a bit weird with food when I
Speaker 3: was about twenty two. I think it was just control,
Speaker 3: to be quite honest, and I think, wait for me,
Speaker 3: you know, if I'm myself ale with anxiety, you know,
Speaker 3: and so when I'm anxious, it just falls off. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I'm not the type of person sometimes I am eating,
Speaker 3: but it literally just falls off all the time. So
Speaker 3: sometimes I haven't even been like aware of like dropping way.
Speaker 5: I think.
Speaker 3: I've always done a lot of exercise and a kind
Speaker 3: of now do pilates, So I used to build a
Speaker 3: lot of muscle. So my body has changed, like you know,
Speaker 3: over the course of like many years, I think, And
Speaker 3: so I think, I think when I got started modeling properly,
Speaker 3: I decided there was a part of me that had
Speaker 3: that to do it, to really kind of walk into
Speaker 3: it again, I had to take on. It was almost
Speaker 3: like a It wasn't necessarily that I felt like that,
Speaker 3: but I had to be like, this is who I am,
Speaker 3: do you know what I mean?
Speaker 5: Like take it or leave it, you know what I mean.
Speaker 3: I'm not going to be sucked into this idea that
Speaker 3: I should be thinner or look a different sort of
Speaker 3: way for you to kind of appreciate me or want me.
Speaker 5: So I had to and that's.
Speaker 3: Not exactly how I felt all the time, but I
Speaker 3: had to sort of fake it to make it so
Speaker 3: it wasn't necessarily I think I've always I don't know.
Speaker 3: I was speaking on my own podcast about this the
Speaker 3: other day. I think I wonder if my relationship with
Speaker 3: myself will ever be.
Speaker 5: What I wanted to be.
Speaker 3: Whilst I model, I don't know if my I have
Speaker 3: a to a certain extent a healthy relationship with myself,
Speaker 3: but I wonder if my relationship with my body will
Speaker 3: ever be what I wanted to be as long as
Speaker 3: I'm kind of within the industry. And yes, it has
Speaker 3: changed like drastically, do you know what I mean? The
Speaker 3: likes of amazing people spearheading different sorts of movements. But
Speaker 3: you know, we only have to kind of look at
Speaker 3: certain photos or fashion shows and we see the kind
Speaker 3: of the pressure that's.
Speaker 2: Playing, and I almost find it painful. I haven't been
Speaker 2: to that many catwalk shows. I think it probably when
Speaker 2: you see, you know how and kind of serious and
Speaker 2: all that. You know, I know, it's there to just
Speaker 2: showcase the clothes, and so it's opening at a hanger,
Speaker 2: but there is something as a woman to see women
Speaker 2: doing that job is a little bit.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And also when you know that someone's like kind
Speaker 3: of unwell, yeah, whatever that looks like for different people.
Speaker 3: When you know someone's kind of suffering with and you know,
Speaker 3: disordered eating, but they are praised and celebrated within the
Speaker 3: industry and they work even more. It's that in itself
Speaker 3: is an uncomfortable thing to get your head around. I
Speaker 3: think that's where sometimes the pressure for me lies. It
Speaker 3: isn't that I want to be onwell, it's just the
Speaker 3: fact that I see people doing well because of it,
Speaker 3: do you know what I mean? And that's a that's
Speaker 3: that's a mad thing to get your head around, you
Speaker 3: know what I mean. And it's and I don't think
Speaker 3: that kind of breeds healthy ways of looking yourself. You know,
Speaker 3: if you're being told that you are better for being thin, and.
Speaker 2: I suppose the other you know, we haven't talked about
Speaker 2: We've talked about body image and modeling. We haven't talked
Speaker 2: about race. And I think that there is also the
Speaker 2: issue of what it was like to be or what
Speaker 2: it is like to be a woman of color in
Speaker 2: very What was it thanks to Edward? It's it's not
Speaker 2: so much and people like Edward, but how that affected you.
Speaker 3: I think that's something that I'm really delving into at
Speaker 3: the moment is how a lack of understanding about my
Speaker 3: own identity has really kind of hindered certain aspects of
Speaker 3: my growth, do you know what I mean? And having
Speaker 3: been brought up in a predominantly white space, that how
Speaker 3: that has affected me, How the things that I've tolerated,
Speaker 3: the things that I've kind of brushed off. And I
Speaker 3: think because of the resurgence of Black Lives Matter, the
Speaker 3: conversations that they were having it kind of it really
Speaker 3: kind of shook people's core. It wasn't that we were
Speaker 3: just talking about slavery something that happened, you know, years
Speaker 3: and years ago when people were I know, but for
Speaker 3: certain people, like they weren't around where they happened when
Speaker 3: that happened, so they were like, oh, I wasn't part
Speaker 3: of that.
Speaker 5: I mean I would, I didn't do anything like that.
Speaker 3: And I think Black Lives Matter kind of brought it,
Speaker 3: made it current and suddenly you were kind of they
Speaker 3: were speaking about things that you had to check yourself
Speaker 3: on and I had to suddenly was I think validated
Speaker 3: in a lot of experiences and feelings that I had
Speaker 3: surrounding my own race and how I'd had to kind
Speaker 3: of navigate certain situations.
Speaker 5: And also I think I was also my privilege.
Speaker 3: You know, we talk about colorism within the community as
Speaker 3: being someone who's like mixed race and lighter skin.
Speaker 5: The way that I was treated compared to.
Speaker 3: My cousins who are you know, who were a lot
Speaker 3: darker skinned than me. You know, I think that's a
Speaker 3: conversation that we don't have enough either. But for me,
Speaker 3: I think it was great. You know, when Edward started
Speaker 3: doing what he was doing, what he does and continues
Speaker 3: to do and sets the bar so high continuously.
Speaker 5: I think for me.
Speaker 3: It had always been unspoken how uncomfortable I'd felt in
Speaker 3: certain situations. It was almost that I didn't want to
Speaker 3: give it a name. It's like I felt that there
Speaker 3: were certain reasons why my career hadn't taken off, you know,
Speaker 3: when I'd started with certain people, you know, who look
Speaker 3: very different to me, I think I still was searching
Speaker 3: for something that was completely unattainable. Different different body shape,
Speaker 3: you know, sometimes even like you know, different colored skin,
Speaker 3: you know, And so I think I didn't want to
Speaker 3: blame it on something like that. I was like, why,
Speaker 3: you know, I started at the same time as car
Speaker 3: I started at the same time as so many girls,
Speaker 3: and they kind of reached such great heights and I.
Speaker 5: Was like, why is that? Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 5: I think it was quite nice when Edward.
Speaker 3: There was many things that were beautiful about it, but
Speaker 3: like having him come in and be like, we got
Speaker 3: to change that.
Speaker 5: This is what is going on, you know what I mean?
Speaker 2: Were you born here? Yeah?
Speaker 3: Yeah, born in London and your father's yeah gone in
Speaker 3: he was born in Akras.
Speaker 2: So going back was part of your childhood.
Speaker 5: Yeah, very much. So it was always something that we did.
Speaker 3: Sometimes my mum came and sometimes it was just the
Speaker 3: three of us, and.
Speaker 5: I think it felt quite alien at that time.
Speaker 3: And as I grew older and kind of my career changed,
Speaker 3: and obviously I became like a grown up, my relationship
Speaker 3: Ghana very much changed. I felt like kind of instead
Speaker 3: of just the kind of traveler someone who'd like been
Speaker 3: born in London and who'd come back to Ghana, I
Speaker 3: felt like they really claimed me, which was really like
Speaker 3: a kind of beautiful experience, you know. I think especially
Speaker 3: after the British Vogue cover. You know, it was like
Speaker 3: they call you a Brunei, which means like a kind
Speaker 3: of traveler because I'm obviously a little like paler skin
Speaker 3: than most garn Ears, And I think after that, I
Speaker 3: felt very much like kind of claimed by the people there,
Speaker 3: which was really really amazing. But I have the most
Speaker 3: amazing memories of Ghana.
Speaker 5: We always used to stay at my grandma and granddads.
Speaker 3: It's just a modest house next to a nursery, so
Speaker 3: there were always like kids playing outside. My grandma has
Speaker 3: always had a little kind of like corner shop, so
Speaker 3: we go in there get all like cold bottles of like.
Speaker 5: Coke and like biscuits. Then we'd sit.
Speaker 3: There and watch her and my aunt Mary, all three
Speaker 3: of them live together, so we'd watch them.
Speaker 2: Did you cook? Did she cook for you?
Speaker 5: Yeah?
Speaker 3: She cooked, and then she had a woman who also
Speaker 3: helped her comfort.
Speaker 2: What is gonna and food?
Speaker 5: Like, it's amazing.
Speaker 3: I mean, you've got the joll Off rice, You've got
Speaker 3: lots of different kind of fish, You've got food food,
Speaker 3: so it's like a kind of dough that you dip
Speaker 3: into a soup. The spice there is kind of like
Speaker 3: it's like an oily one.
Speaker 5: It's amazing.
Speaker 2: And chili, yeah, a lot of chili.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, yeah, really, Spike yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, did you go to the market.
Speaker 3: To the markets are mad, mad, like insane, just like
Speaker 3: bustling food, clothes, people wandering around. It's like mental but amazing.
Speaker 3: And how long would you stay? We'd stay for like
Speaker 3: two weeks. I have some cousins who usually stay there
Speaker 3: a bit longer. Dad and my sister were there this year.
Speaker 3: My dad goes back all the day, all the time.
Speaker 3: My granddad's not alive anymore. My aunt Mary, she's not
Speaker 3: alive anymore, but my grandma very much still there and
Speaker 3: my aunt Tina lives with her.
Speaker 2: So yeah, that's what was it like growing up in
Speaker 2: your house. You have memories of meals, you know, for cooked.
Speaker 3: My house has always been a place that is kind of.
Speaker 5: People are in and out at all times.
Speaker 3: You know, I very much grew up with Maybe it
Speaker 3: was someone who had to move in for a bit,
Speaker 3: you know, my godfather would move in, or someone in
Speaker 3: you know, distress would be upstairs living in the upstairs room.
Speaker 3: There were always parties and dinner parties and lots of
Speaker 3: different people kind of in and out of the house.
Speaker 3: You know. My mom has always been like an entertainer,
Speaker 3: my dad as well.
Speaker 5: The home has always.
Speaker 3: Been one that kind of it feels like sacred, but
Speaker 3: they're not precious about it. You know, a place that
Speaker 3: people want to geah, the carpets are rolled up when
Speaker 3: a party happens. But you know, they've never been kind
Speaker 3: of like prim and Popper, prim and roper about their
Speaker 3: their places.
Speaker 2: But were kids part of it? You kind of you
Speaker 2: weren't sitting on the steps watching the party. We were
Speaker 2: down there.
Speaker 5: We do like things like.
Speaker 3: Co check yeah yeah, and we like charge everyone money
Speaker 3: and then they find all their coats just piled off
Speaker 3: on one bed, pretending like we'd organized them. Or we'd
Speaker 3: be like sat on the staircase watching everyone get up
Speaker 3: to whatever mischief they were getting up to. And then
Speaker 3: later on we were just joining in.
Speaker 2: Would you go out a lot? Would you go out? Yeah?
Speaker 5: We do such amazing things, you know.
Speaker 3: That's the thing about growing up in London is like,
Speaker 3: I mean, I wouldn't want to bring my children out
Speaker 3: anywhere else.
Speaker 5: I loved it.
Speaker 3: Galleries and restaurants and they took us everywhere. It was
Speaker 3: never about separation. It was like you want to sit
Speaker 3: with the grown ups. You learn how to sit with
Speaker 3: the grown ups. You you know, learn how to converse
Speaker 3: and listen and talk to whoever might be next to
Speaker 3: you or in front of you. But it was never
Speaker 3: like my parents were never into the idea of like
Speaker 3: putting you on the kids say, yeah, you know, if
Speaker 3: we were younger, it was like, come out, enjoy yourself.
Speaker 3: When you get tired, just sleep under the table, do
Speaker 3: you know what I mean? And then we'll go out.
Speaker 2: And then you went to way to boarding school. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: what was that? Like?
Speaker 5: The food yeah, horrible.
Speaker 2: Horrible and Milfield was Millfield, Yeah, to be rather proud
Speaker 2: of it.
Speaker 3: It was you know what, maybe this is my snobby side.
Speaker 3: I'm not great with a buffet. I think school kind
Speaker 3: of like traumatized me from that. I mean some days
Speaker 3: it would be good, like the salad station was like banging,
Speaker 3: like that was good. But to be quite honest, I
Speaker 3: lived off dominoes for like five years.
Speaker 5: Oh no, you weren't.
Speaker 3: We weren't allowed, but we'd like sneak it in and
Speaker 3: then in prep we'd like run out and get the
Speaker 3: pizza and like bring it back in and all share it.
Speaker 3: On Fridays we were allowed like to order in Indian
Speaker 3: or a Chinese Yeah.
Speaker 2: Interesting, So that must have been quite shocking to go
Speaker 2: from a house that was full of people and friends
Speaker 2: and good food.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it was also. I mean there were
Speaker 3: certain days where it was good. Chinese day wasn't that bad.
Speaker 3: Indian neighbor wasn't that bad?
Speaker 2: How old were you thirteen to eighteen five years?
Speaker 5: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Yeah, then you'd come back weekends or would youday?
Speaker 3: Well, you were only allowed what do they call it?
Speaker 3: I can't remember what they used to call xax. Yeah,
Speaker 3: you were only allowed a certain amount of exacts. But
Speaker 3: I had the best house mistress on the face of
Speaker 3: the planet, missus Orton, and she I was really homesick. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I mean I kind of got over it, but it
Speaker 3: wasn't my favorite of years being at that school. I
Speaker 3: had some great friends, but I was just desperate to
Speaker 3: come back to London.
Speaker 2: Then from Millfield you went to university, went to what
Speaker 2: was that like, Brunell?
Speaker 5: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Where is Brunel?
Speaker 3: That's an Oxbridge. I mean I tried to get into Goldsmiths.
Speaker 3: I've failed my English exam. I can't remember which one
Speaker 3: it was. Because you realize that it really doesn't matter.
Speaker 5: I mean, try your best, do all the things, but.
Speaker 2: For listen, we're here We're here with a friend of
Speaker 2: mine's daughter and the Hedge head executive chef's daughter, Pearl.
Speaker 2: Helena Pearl joined us today because she's a fifteen year
Speaker 2: old aspiring actor. She's an enormous admirer of your work
Speaker 2: and so.
Speaker 5: There.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and so we were talking about whether you were matters.
Speaker 2: So what was that like.
Speaker 5: Obviously wanted to save money so that home.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I had the best time because I think it
Speaker 3: was just I was back home.
Speaker 5: I was back in London. I was back.
Speaker 3: It was more it was predominantly I mean, Millfield was
Speaker 3: very kind of like intersectional, do I mean in many ways,
Speaker 3: but it was predominantly white. And I think coming back
Speaker 3: to London, it wasn't just the kind of necessarily race.
Speaker 3: It was also a boiling pot of people who've grown
Speaker 3: up differently, you know what I mean. It was like
Speaker 3: I'd grown up completely different to a lot of the
Speaker 3: people in my kind of class. But I was I
Speaker 3: just felt I felt like that was just more me.
Speaker 3: I just wanted to be amongst that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, living at home, did it come come back, did
Speaker 2: it feel like before you went to it.
Speaker 5: Was very weird.
Speaker 3: I wouldn't say it was a great time. For my
Speaker 3: mine and my parents' relationship. I think, you know, I
Speaker 3: think they thought sending me to Bailing school there would
Speaker 3: be more rules. But actually, when someone doesn't know you,
Speaker 3: like a teacher, you can get around them, do what
Speaker 3: I mean? Like, actually, you've kind of weirdly got more
Speaker 3: space to Rome, and so coming back to London, obviously
Speaker 3: there were certain rules. But I think if I was
Speaker 3: honest and I've you know, I've spoken to about this anyway,
Speaker 3: I think coming back home after five years, I was
Speaker 3: a bit like, you can't really tell me what to.
Speaker 5: Do, do you know what I mean?
Speaker 3: Like, we haven't lived together for five years, so I
Speaker 3: think that dynamic was quite hard on our relationship. I
Speaker 3: think I probably regressed. I think I wasn't used to
Speaker 3: the fact that I was back living under their roof,
Speaker 3: and I was like very much a different person.
Speaker 2: I remember once saying to my father I might have said.
Speaker 2: This was before saying to my father when I was
Speaker 2: thirty or twenty eight or whatever, and I've been living
Speaker 2: in London and working, and my parents lived in the
Speaker 2: New York and would stalk and I once went home
Speaker 2: and I was said to my dad, Oh, I'm going
Speaker 2: to leave the baby and going to New York tomorrow.
Speaker 2: And he said, I don't think you should do that.
Speaker 2: And I said, you know what, I live in London
Speaker 2: and I work and I don't have to ask anybody's
Speaker 2: you know, nice ways in permission. But it's interesting that
Speaker 2: when you know, I go home, I don't know whether
Speaker 2: I'm a child or I'm an adult. And he said,
Speaker 2: I'll make it really easy for you with the minute
Speaker 2: you walk in that door, you're a child. And it
Speaker 2: was actually quite nice because I thought, that's kind of
Speaker 2: why I like going home, you know, is it suddenly
Speaker 2: somebody's saying, you know, no one you stay here or whatever.
Speaker 2: It was just interesting.
Speaker 3: It's like a dance, isn't it. You have to learn
Speaker 3: how to live with each other again.
Speaker 2: When you went to Brunow, what would you think of majoring?
Speaker 2: What was your dat?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 5: That's why I finished. That's why I major.
Speaker 2: Yeah did you eat out a lot? Did you party?
Speaker 2: Did you?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 5: Out all the time? To do all the time?
Speaker 3: I mean we were so I was eighteen, yeah, and
Speaker 3: we were born in nineteen nineteen ninety two.
Speaker 5: Yeah, so what did I finish school? Twenty ten?
Speaker 3: So?
Speaker 5: Yeah, Yeah, we had the best time.
Speaker 3: I worked as soon as I kind of finished school modeling.
Speaker 3: There were bits of modeling, but it wasn't there was
Speaker 3: like a different time, do you know what I mean?
Speaker 3: So I worked in the shop, I worked as a nanny.
Speaker 3: But we were so we had so much fun, do
Speaker 3: you know what I mean? We was like, I don't
Speaker 3: know how it is for you, pearl, but we just
Speaker 3: we were so carefree and mad and doing our thing.
Speaker 3: And we were probably eighteen. Yeah, and we all pile
Speaker 3: our money. Yeah, I mean just going but I just
Speaker 3: mean being young, do you know what I mean. It's
Speaker 3: like we weren't bothered about kind of what clothes we
Speaker 3: were wearing or anything like that. We didn't have the
Speaker 3: pressure of like social media or anything like that. It
Speaker 3: was just about being in a gang, do you know
Speaker 3: what I mean, and roaming the streets and mostly girls
Speaker 3: was it. Yeah?
Speaker 5: Mostly I've always been a girls girl.
Speaker 3: And we'd all put our money together and like share
Speaker 3: one meal, like poor restaurants where we just sit for
Speaker 3: hours and hours and hours outside kind of coffee shop,
Speaker 3: sharing one coffee between like five of us, and they're like,
Speaker 3: can you leave if you're not going to buy anything,
Speaker 3: can you leave? Or we go to like kind of
Speaker 3: my friend Josh Delissa, who might as well be my brother.
Speaker 3: He had a restaurant called Boomberger. We'd go in there
Speaker 3: get cheap prices. We had some Mexican restaurants around the area,
Speaker 3: and we'd all put our money together to share like
Speaker 3: kind of one plate of food because I mean we
Speaker 3: were quite naughty. We were spending our money on like
Speaker 3: alcohol and going out, so we didn't really have a
Speaker 3: massive interest in spending our money on food.
Speaker 2: So modeling, when did that happen? I mean, how did
Speaker 2: that happen?
Speaker 3: I mean I've been modeling on and off since I
Speaker 3: was probably since I left school, so since I was eighteen.
Speaker 3: I did a few bits and pieces like before, but
Speaker 3: my mom was very strict about and my dad as
Speaker 3: well about finishing school. Modeling kind of took quite a
Speaker 3: long time to kind of take off, so that's why
Speaker 3: I kind of worked.
Speaker 2: Did you enjoy it, Yeah, I did.
Speaker 5: I think I've learned to like it more.
Speaker 3: I learned to like it when I as cheesy as
Speaker 3: this sounds, when I started to like myself, to be
Speaker 3: quite honest, you know, I mean that's when it became
Speaker 3: more fun and yes, there are days when I'm on
Speaker 3: my period or I'm a bit exhausted, when I'm like,
Speaker 3: this is literally the last thing I want to do,
Speaker 3: you know what I mean.
Speaker 5: There's be like kind of.
Speaker 3: Showcased in front of a bunch of people, and then
Speaker 3: kind of it's like Instagram have to kind of and
Speaker 3: then I start picking apart my kind of who I am,
Speaker 3: you know what I mean, face value, not who I
Speaker 3: am as a person actually, But I can.
Speaker 5: Ask questions it what made you want to do a podcast?
Speaker 3: I think it goes back to this this idea of storytelling,
Speaker 3: I think, and the information out there on what lived
Speaker 3: experience does in regards to stigma reduction and suicide reduction,
Speaker 3: and so I couldn't think of a better place. There's
Speaker 3: something about an honest conversation and honest chat. Yeah, there's
Speaker 3: so much like intimacy within that and to just listen
Speaker 3: to someone. And I think it really was that it's
Speaker 3: like to talk to someone, to hear their side of
Speaker 3: a story, to hear where they've come from and where
Speaker 3: they're at and where they hope to be. I think
Speaker 3: that's definitely the essence of having the podcast. Is that
Speaker 3: idea that when we hear someone else's story, We're going
Speaker 3: to feel less alone.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so you will be talking about Girls Talk. Tell
Speaker 2: me when the next series that you're so excited about
Speaker 2: is coming out?
Speaker 3: So podcast, I'd say, just keep a lookout. It will
Speaker 3: be towards the end of the year. Keep a look
Speaker 3: out for September.
Speaker 2: How do we look for it?
Speaker 5: Yeah?
Speaker 3: So just ground handles girls talk, how my girls talk?
Speaker 3: Gu are ls talk.
Speaker 2: Do you listen to girls Talk?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 6: I have, but to you, like, I love listening to
Speaker 6: things that say, like, you know, I love this things
Speaker 6: that's just like, yeah, that so should be said, that
Speaker 6: so should be spoken about more.
Speaker 2: You know what I mean.
Speaker 6: People sphere of speaking out stops them from sins like
Speaker 6: saying the truth, you know, as I really like about it,
Speaker 6: you know, like speaking about grievouses or trauma or like
Speaker 6: mental health, like all those type of things are just
Speaker 6: not talked about enough.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think I can't wait for the new
Speaker 3: season to come out. I feel more grown up and
Speaker 3: even more opinionated and even more confident. I find, and
Speaker 3: I don't know if this is because of social media
Speaker 3: or cancel culture, that sometimes we're quite agreeable with each
Speaker 3: other and I want to have conversations that aren't always
Speaker 3: with people that I agree with. I want to also
Speaker 3: learn about things that I have no idea about, and
Speaker 3: I want to sometimes have those uncomfortable conversations where I'm
Speaker 3: not only kind of not necessarily agreeing with the other person,
Speaker 3: but I'm also being checked about what I don't know
Speaker 3: and the ways that I think about things.
Speaker 5: Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 3: And so we've kind of changed that and it's going
Speaker 3: to be really cool. We've got some mega people on
Speaker 3: the podcast. Yeah.
Speaker 5: I love hearing people's stories, you know.
Speaker 3: I love meeting people, you know who different backgrounds exactly.
Speaker 2: Everybody comes in with a story. Look around it. I've
Speaker 2: had people come in and say, ah, you know, look
Speaker 2: how this fabulous restaurant and I've had such a hard
Speaker 2: time lately, And I gave if you went to every table,
Speaker 2: everybody would have a story a story about Yeah. But
Speaker 2: you know people, you know, we all think that you
Speaker 2: see all these people and their lives are perfect, and
Speaker 2: then you find out one that's just been divorced, or
Speaker 2: they've had a kid with addiction, or they have everybody
Speaker 2: has a story and so those smiling, happy faces whether
Speaker 2: you see them on Instagram or here. You know that
Speaker 2: everybody has a story, and as you say, I love
Speaker 2: walking around and just hearing a bit of the story
Speaker 2: of saying hello. Do you think prayl that. Do you
Speaker 2: think that's when when Edward talked about social media pressure,
Speaker 2: do you think that exists now?
Speaker 6: I think especially hearing about what you were saying about
Speaker 6: how when you were a kids and used to like
Speaker 6: it used to be much different to its now because
Speaker 6: you don't have social media, and I think it really
Speaker 6: affects more how people look at themselves because you're Instagram
Speaker 6: and you've got TikTok and you've got all these things.
Speaker 6: And if you don't have it, you're like not in
Speaker 6: with the times. But if you do, then you're just
Speaker 6: making yourself feel worse by yourself. But you can't be
Speaker 6: like like for example, and people are like, oh, I
Speaker 6: don't want social media.
Speaker 2: It's bad. People are down.
Speaker 6: On you for it. But reality, it's much better if
Speaker 6: you didn't have it, Like for you're probably happier in
Speaker 6: those times than that kids are.
Speaker 3: Now because it's there's one thing, you know, getting to
Speaker 3: know yourself and figuring out who you are.
Speaker 5: Over those like thirteen to eighteen and then onwards. Do
Speaker 5: you know what I mean?
Speaker 3: It was like such a confusing time and that that's
Speaker 3: already like, you know, I was talking to these girls
Speaker 3: the other day, like thirteen to fourteen, and that was
Speaker 3: a question like what would you say to your younger self?
Speaker 5: And I would be, like I.
Speaker 3: Used to scrutinize every single thing I did, the shoes
Speaker 3: I wore, the way I wore my eyeliner, the way
Speaker 3: my hair was, the way I carried my bag, the
Speaker 3: way I walked, you know what I mean. I was
Speaker 3: like always on my case about every single movement, and
Speaker 3: I think I would tell everyone that you don't need
Speaker 3: to do that. I wish I'd stop putting so much
Speaker 3: pressure on myself, because you realize when your world gets
Speaker 3: bigger than none of them truly matters, do you know
Speaker 3: what I mean? And I think to add in the
Speaker 3: pressure of having to kind of be perceived by other people,
Speaker 3: it's like I already was kind of self conscious, so
Speaker 3: to then have to kind of portray a person that
Speaker 3: I maybe wasn't hadn't become yet, do you know what
Speaker 3: I mean?
Speaker 5: Something that was.
Speaker 3: Maybe just kind of performative would have been like an
Speaker 3: added pressure at that time.
Speaker 2: And you know it happen is at any age, you know,
Speaker 2: I can you know, we're talking to women's. My husband
Speaker 2: died a year and a half ago, And sometimes I
Speaker 2: just look on Instagram, go, you know, another happy family,
Speaker 2: you know, and the beach resorder, another grandparents with their
Speaker 2: grand char I mean, I have that life, but you know,
Speaker 2: it's very You can look at it in terms of
Speaker 2: whether you're thin enough, whether you're you know, whether your
Speaker 2: hair is as beautiful, whether you're a certain type with
Speaker 2: the clothes you're wearing, the way you carry handbag, or
Speaker 2: you can look at it in families and you can see,
Speaker 2: you know, it just feels that there's I really I
Speaker 2: never post from a vacation. I really, I knew that
Speaker 2: a long time. There's nothing worse than on a day
Speaker 2: like today working and then you see somebody on there.
Speaker 5: You know, it's just it's like.
Speaker 2: There's a is it acting what you wanted to do
Speaker 2: when you went to Brunel.
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's from thirteen until eighteen.
Speaker 3: I did that at school and then I went on
Speaker 3: to study that at Brunel, and then kind of life
Speaker 3: took a different direction, not only kind of personally and
Speaker 3: then it became something. You know, then I kind of
Speaker 3: fell into modeling and that started taking over. So I
Speaker 3: kind of jumped on that bandwagon, and that led me
Speaker 3: to where I am now. And then I think just
Speaker 3: before COVID, I made a kind of decision that I
Speaker 3: wanted to give it another go, you know, I wanted
Speaker 3: to put one hundred percent in it and see where
Speaker 3: it would take me.
Speaker 5: Because I think when I first left university.
Speaker 3: Had a different head of my shoulders and my priorities
Speaker 3: were warped, and I wasn't a very happy person. So
Speaker 3: I didn't, you know, have the capability or to give
Speaker 3: it one hundred percent.
Speaker 5: So that's where I'm at now.
Speaker 3: I'm on that journey and I absolutely love it.
Speaker 5: It's ridiculously hard, respect to all.
Speaker 3: I would love to do theater one day, but at
Speaker 3: the moment, it's it's TV infil Yeah.
Speaker 2: And now you're living in your own apartment. How is that?
Speaker 5: Oh, it's really nice.
Speaker 2: Do you have an open kitchen as well?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah?
Speaker 3: What's it like kitchen? It's my kitchen's yellow, blue and
Speaker 3: white tiles.
Speaker 5: I mean, describe it. It's very much open.
Speaker 3: I've got an island in the middle that has like
Speaker 3: a kind of heart boner engraved in it that my
Speaker 3: friend Jeff did. It's got a massive, big, like kind
Speaker 3: of teak table with matching chairs that I've posted in
Speaker 3: like Leopard Brint.
Speaker 2: How you like your parents? Do you like people coming
Speaker 2: to you.
Speaker 5: Instead of you going to Yeah? I love it.
Speaker 3: I mean I think to a certain extent, I grew
Speaker 3: up in an African household, so the idea that we
Speaker 3: were going to spend the night at other people's houses
Speaker 3: was like something that was like my dad just did
Speaker 3: not understand. He's like, you have a bed, you have
Speaker 3: a house, Like, why do you need to go and
Speaker 3: stay at someone else's house. There was certain people that
Speaker 3: we went to, but like eating at home and sleeping
Speaker 3: at home has always been like a kind of a priority.
Speaker 5: With a metal house, you know, it might be.
Speaker 3: I was talking to Pearl about it, actually, I mean
Speaker 3: I actually eating a lot. I now spend a lot
Speaker 3: of time between London and la and when I was
Speaker 3: working before COVID, I didn't really have the time to cook.
Speaker 5: It wasn't necessarily a priority of mine.
Speaker 3: So I used to order a lot of takeaway, and
Speaker 3: I think after COVID I started really prioritizing what was important.
Speaker 3: So I did have more time. And so my boyfriend's
Speaker 3: a really good cook. My sister lives with me, and
Speaker 3: she's an amazing cook. I like cooking if it's like
Speaker 3: family or people who are really close to me.
Speaker 5: I don't feel the pressure.
Speaker 3: I'm not the idea of cooking for like ten people
Speaker 3: or something that doesn't excite me. If I'm cooking for myself,
Speaker 3: it's like simple things like fish and vegetable or eggs, soup,
Speaker 3: you know, stuff like that. No I don't eat No, No,
Speaker 3: I haven't eaten. You're Weirdly, I've started, like I think
Speaker 3: I've just been listening to my body a bit more,
Speaker 3: and so like if it's the time of the month
Speaker 3: or something like that, I'm like, oh, I kind of
Speaker 3: really feel like so me and I've never had that before.
Speaker 5: So I kind of am listening to my body a
Speaker 5: bit more.
Speaker 3: But it's still very much like kind of in when
Speaker 3: I'm cooking at home, especially in LA we have like
Speaker 3: a tiny, tiny kitchen, so we're not gonna cook fish
Speaker 3: because it would just make the whole house smile, like fish.
Speaker 3: The little flat we have, so we cook a lot
Speaker 3: of vegetarian stuff in LA and then at home, you know,
Speaker 3: I have more space and so we cook lots of
Speaker 3: different things and have people around. I wish I I've
Speaker 3: grown up in a household full of amazing cooks. My
Speaker 3: cousins and amazing cook my aunt and my uncle everyone.
Speaker 3: You know, they have recipes that were handwritten by my
Speaker 3: grandma about certain things. Yeah. That and I think I
Speaker 3: remember my mom always say grandmother my mom's mom.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I always remember my mom, like I mean, there were
Speaker 3: there are many things that were kind of sad when
Speaker 3: her mom died. But I think she always thinks about,
Speaker 3: you know, when she needs answers on certain recipes. She
Speaker 3: always thinks about the idea of calling my grandma. And
Speaker 3: my dad is an amazing cook as well, and so
Speaker 3: I should be more interested in it.
Speaker 2: Well, I'm the cleaner.
Speaker 5: I'm the cleaner.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's fine. I think everybody figures out I do
Speaker 2: the dishes.
Speaker 5: Well, that's fine.
Speaker 2: Do you remember when when it became possible for you
Speaker 2: to go out to you to not think about how
Speaker 2: much it cost.
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's a really good question.
Speaker 3: I think. So I moved twenty seventeen. I moved to
Speaker 3: LA when I got sober, but I don't I wasn't
Speaker 3: eating out that much, to be quite honest, I didn't
Speaker 3: have the money I was. I'd kind of taken a
Speaker 3: year off and my mum and dad were supporting me
Speaker 3: for the first time in a long time, which I
Speaker 3: found like kind of incredibly uncomfortable. So I kind of
Speaker 3: was under a certain budget, do you know what I mean?
Speaker 3: And I think probably maybe when I really could just
Speaker 3: like go to the restaurants and come here and like
Speaker 3: pay for myself. I probably was about twenty five, twenty
Speaker 3: five and had.
Speaker 2: Come from modeling or we're acting.
Speaker 3: Or yeah, modeling, Yeah, yeah, yeah, that was a big change. Yeah,
Speaker 3: moving to New York. Yeah, So I moved to New
Speaker 3: York when I was twenty four. I had my twenty
Speaker 3: fifth birthday in New York, and that's probably when it
Speaker 3: started to change. You know. That's when I could like
Speaker 3: order a takeaway or like go to this restaurant called
Speaker 3: Lucienne and like we'll get my friend of meal or you're.
Speaker 2: Not alone in that, you know that. It was something
Speaker 2: that I was talked When I talked to David Beckham,
Speaker 2: he said he remembered when he took Victoria and they
Speaker 2: could actually, you know, I have to completely look at
Speaker 2: the prices on the right hand side. Or Paul McCartney
Speaker 2: saying that he thought wine was a horrible drink because
Speaker 2: he could only afford the cheapest, cheapest, cheapest wine because
Speaker 2: we know it is pretty. Wine was a horrible drink
Speaker 2: until he went out with Brian you know, Epstein, who
Speaker 2: was his manager, and they ordered a fantastic buddle of
Speaker 2: the feet and thought, oh, that's what wine is.
Speaker 3: So the main thing is is I've never tried a
Speaker 3: good glass of wine. Well never, yeah, no, but but
Speaker 3: I got sober when I was twenty I got sober
Speaker 3: when I was twenty two, so I wasn't like spending
Speaker 3: the money and like we were going to the corner
Speaker 3: shop and getting like a Casaillio dabble, you know what I.
Speaker 5: Mean, like a cheap bottle of tequila with a hat
Speaker 5: on it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And so I've never actually, you know, I've never
Speaker 3: had had a like stunning cocktail. I've never had a
Speaker 3: like beautiful glass of wine. And it's fine, but it
Speaker 3: is mad to think that I'm never actually because and
Speaker 3: to be honest, like that's why I could probably like
Speaker 3: go and eat out do you know. I mean, I've
Speaker 3: never had the expense of having to kind of buy alcohol, And.
Speaker 2: I suppose you know for me that is you know,
Speaker 2: we all have reasons why we eat the food we eat.
Speaker 2: Food can be something you have when you're hungry, be
Speaker 2: something that you have when you want to cook or
Speaker 2: you want to entertain. It can be food can be
Speaker 2: alleviation of pain or sadness. So I suppose that my
Speaker 2: last question to you is what would you turn to
Speaker 2: if you needed food for comfort?
Speaker 3: Hm, I go home, definitely. I don't know if it's
Speaker 3: anything in particular. I think it would just be something
Speaker 3: because by my mom and dad, anything that was put
Speaker 3: in front of me would feel comforting.
Speaker 2: That's beautiful and beautiful. Wait to end a wonderful.
Speaker 3: Thank you, Love you, love you, I love you, We
Speaker 3: love you.
Speaker 2: Thanks, thank you.
Speaker 1: The River Cafe Lookbook is now available in bookshops and online.
Speaker 1: It has over one hundred recipes beautifully illustrated with photographs
Speaker 1: from the renowned photographer Matthew Donaldson. The book has fifty
Speaker 1: delicious and easy to prepare recipes, including a host of
Speaker 1: River Cafe classics that have been specially adapted for new cooks.
Speaker 1: The River Cafe lookbook Recipes for cooks of all ages.
Speaker 1: Ruthie's Table four is a production of iHeart Radio and
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