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Speaker 1: Hey, this is Sandy and Samantha and welcome to Steff.

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Speaker 1: I Never told you a production of iHeart Radio. And

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Speaker 1: as this comes out, we were in February, which is

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Speaker 1: Black History Months, and during Black History Months, we like

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Speaker 1: to bring back a lot of the stories that Eaves

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Speaker 1: is brought to us of amazing Black women in history

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Speaker 1: for Female First. So starting with that, we wanted to

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Speaker 1: bring back the story of Alice Ball. It is really

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Speaker 1: an amazing one, so please enjoy this classic episode.

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Speaker 2: Hey, this is Anny and Samantha and welcome to Steff.

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Speaker 2: I Never told you production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: And it is time for another edition of Female First,

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Speaker 1: which means we are once again joined by the wonderful,

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Speaker 1: wondrous Eves. Welcome Eves. Hi.

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Speaker 3: I'm excited to be here, as I am every time.

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Speaker 1: Yes, and this is kind of a special experimental thing

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Speaker 1: we're doing today because Sminty may or may not be

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Speaker 1: dipping our toes into TikTok. Maybe I know, I know

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Speaker 1: the horror, so we are kind of unexpectedly recording this.

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Speaker 2: Like videos.

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Speaker 4: I'll say when we say tiptoeing and to TikTok, we're

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Speaker 4: being told by our gen z or researcher that we

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Speaker 4: need to we need to get into the we need

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Speaker 4: to get into the social medias so they will be controlling.

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Speaker 2: This aspect makes look better.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but I'm also concerned that the youth, as you say,

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Speaker 1: eves are like, oh no, please, this is the end

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Speaker 1: of TikTok.

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Speaker 4: I have seen on TikTok. They're like, please, if you're

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Speaker 4: over thirty, stop it.

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Speaker 2: Well here, we gen zs.

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Speaker 4: Are like, this is ours And I'm like, oh, but

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Speaker 4: I like watching talk videos and such.

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Speaker 1: I think, you know, we can be sort of quarantined

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Speaker 1: to a certain area of TikTok.

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Speaker 2: I think that's okay.

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Speaker 5: Oh yeah, that's true.

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Speaker 4: They do have very specific algorithms. So for those who

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Speaker 4: are thirty.

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Speaker 3: We stop to address the fact that he wants to

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Speaker 3: go into another type of quarantine. Now you're putting this

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Speaker 3: into a virtual box.

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Speaker 2: Oh you're right. I'm sorry. I shouldn't do that to you.

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Speaker 2: Eaves are very valued.

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Speaker 5: Guessed this is a poor star for our TikTok career

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Speaker 5: into the mainstream. That sounds like something somebody was saying

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Speaker 5: in Dystopia.

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Speaker 4: Oh it is dystopian. Have you not seen the news?

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Speaker 2: It is well, Oh my gosh. Well, yeah, and we

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Speaker 2: were just talking about nightmares. We've had so a lot

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Speaker 2: of I would say, stress is.

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Speaker 1: Being felt by a lot of people.

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Speaker 4: Uh.

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Speaker 1: But you know, this story that you bought today is

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Speaker 1: equal parts inspiring and heartbreaking.

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Speaker 2: And I'm so again, I'm like stunned.

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Speaker 1: I didn't know about this, so I'm really really eager

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Speaker 1: to talk about it.

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Speaker 2: Who did you bring for us today, Eves?

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Speaker 5: So today we're talking about Alice Ball.

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Speaker 3: She was the first black American to graduate from the

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Speaker 3: University of Hawaii. She was also the first woman to

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Speaker 3: graduate from the University of Hawaii with a master's degree

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Speaker 3: in chemistry. She was also the first Black American female

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Speaker 3: chemistry instructor at the university and the first Black American

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Speaker 3: woman to be published twice in the Journal of the

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Speaker 3: American Chemical Society, and that was in nineteen fourteen and

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Speaker 3: in nineteen seventeen.

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Speaker 5: So she did all that work. And she was early.

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Speaker 3: On in the recent for leprosy, which is something that

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Speaker 3: has existed for a long time, which we'll talk about

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Speaker 3: also called Hansen's disease, but she was instrumental in developing

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Speaker 3: the first effective treatment against leprosy, which is tied to

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Speaker 3: something that people around the world were using in a

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Speaker 3: medicinal way long before Alice Ball was ever born, but

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Speaker 3: she was instrumental in doing some of the lap work

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Speaker 3: that was key to bringing it to a point where

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Speaker 3: people were able to use it as an injectable and

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Speaker 3: treatment of Hanson's disease.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and those are quite a lot of first and

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Speaker 1: she did it in such a short amount of time.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, we often see I feel like we often say

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Speaker 3: on here, Wow, they were so young, they did so

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Speaker 3: much in such a short period of time. And it's true.

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Speaker 3: It is true with her. She unfortunately lived a short life,

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Speaker 3: but accomplished a lot during it.

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Speaker 2: Yes, yes, so why don't get into it.

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Speaker 5: Let's do it. So.

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Speaker 3: She was born Alice Augusta Ball on July twenty fourth,

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Speaker 3: eighteen ninety two, in Seattle. Her grandfather was a photographer

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Speaker 3: in the nineteenth century, and her father's name was James

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Speaker 3: Presley Ball, and he was a newspaper editor, a lawyer,

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Speaker 3: and he was also a photographer. So it's been set

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Speaker 3: by some historians in the course of her story that

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Speaker 3: the chemicals they use in their photography, because they were

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Speaker 3: working with degerat types and things like that, that may

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Speaker 3: may have had some sort of influence on the work

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Speaker 3: that she did as a chemist. But her mother was

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Speaker 3: named Laura Luis Ball, and she Alice herself, was the

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Speaker 3: third of four children. Her older brothers were William and Robert,

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Speaker 3: and her younger sister was named Addie, and her family

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Speaker 3: was relatively well off. They were around middle class to

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Speaker 3: upper middle class, and they lived in Seattle until nineteen

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Speaker 3: oh two, but her grandfather was dealing with arthritis, so

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Speaker 3: the family then moved to Hawaii in hopes that the

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Speaker 3: better climate would help out with his health. They lived

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Speaker 3: in downtown Honolulu when they went to Hawaii, and Alice

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Speaker 3: went to school at a place called Central Grammar from

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Speaker 3: nineteen oh two to nineteen oh four. But around that

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Speaker 3: time her father died and then the family moved back

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Speaker 3: to Seattle and she went to Seattle High School and

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Speaker 3: she graduated in nineteen ten. She did really well in school,

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Speaker 3: and particularly in her science classes, so it makes sense

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Speaker 3: that she moved on to continue to work in science.

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Speaker 3: She then attended the University of Washington, where she got

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Speaker 3: two Bachelor of Science degrees.

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Speaker 5: She got one in pharmaceutical.

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Speaker 3: Chemistry in nineteen twelve, and she got another one in

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Speaker 3: pharmacy in nineteen fourteen. So these are things that were

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Speaker 3: not super common happening back then in terms of women

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Speaker 3: and specifically black women and the academic sciences and getting

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Speaker 3: their master's degrees and moving into fields as professors as

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Speaker 3: well in the sciences was something that was not at

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Speaker 3: the time. She published an article with her pharmacy teacher

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Speaker 3: in the Journal of the American Chemical Society called Benzolations

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Speaker 3: an ether Solution, and she chose to get her master's

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Speaker 3: degree from the College of Hawaii, and it was at

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Speaker 3: that point she graduated. That happened in June of nineteen fifteen.

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Speaker 3: Her thesis at the time was called the Chemical Constituents

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Speaker 3: of Piper Methysticum the chemical constituents of the active principle

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Speaker 3: of avarut, also known as kava root. She studied that

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Speaker 3: plant to see how it could be injected as a

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Speaker 3: treatment for medical condition, which ties into her later work.

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Speaker 3: Upon graduating from a College of Hawaii, she became the

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Speaker 3: first woman and the first black person to graduate from

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Speaker 3: the school with a master's degree. So from nineteen fifteen

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Speaker 3: to nineteen sixteen, she also taught chemistry at the college

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Speaker 3: and she became the first black woman professor in the

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Speaker 3: chemistry department, and while she was teaching at the school,

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Speaker 3: a man named doctor Harry T. Holman asked her to

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Speaker 3: research how to make chelmuughra oil better at treating people

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Speaker 3: with Hanson's disease, which was, like I mentioned earlier, also

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Speaker 3: known as leprosy. So Holman was an assistant surgeon at

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Speaker 3: a hospital in Hawaii called Kalihi and he worked with

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Speaker 3: patients with Hanson's disease. And so there's a long history

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Speaker 3: of leprosy and how it was treated across the world

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Speaker 3: over many centuries, but also in the US, and Hawaii

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Speaker 3: has his own specific history of leprosy.

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Speaker 5: I'm sure a.

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Speaker 3: Lot of people have heard the terminology leper colonies a

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Speaker 3: place that people who had leprosy were directed to. And

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Speaker 3: of course there's also a lot of stigma around the

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Speaker 3: actual condition of leprosy. And because of that, there's also

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Speaker 3: stigma around the word of leprosy that when people hear leprosy,

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Speaker 3: they may associate it with certain things. If they're not

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Speaker 3: they don't have a deep or even a surface understanding

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Speaker 3: of how leprosy actually affects people.

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Speaker 5: It causes discoloration of the skin.

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Speaker 3: It causes ulcers, muscle weakness or paralysis, and even things

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Speaker 3: like eye issues that may lead to blindness and other

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Speaker 3: symptoms that are related to the skin and to nerve damage.

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Speaker 5: And the bacteria that caused the disease.

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Speaker 3: Were identified in eighteen seventy three by a Norwegian physician,

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Speaker 3: but like I said, by that point it had the

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Speaker 3: condition had been around for a really long time. There's

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Speaker 3: evidence that it's existed for thousands of years, and in

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Speaker 3: the United States in the twentieth century, one way that

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Speaker 3: doctors commonly tried to handle leprosy patients was by isolating them.

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Speaker 5: It's just like, well, we think.

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Speaker 3: They're really contagious, and we don't we know what to

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Speaker 3: do with them. But if they're really contagious and it

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Speaker 3: spreads easily, we don't want everybody else to have it,

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Speaker 3: so we're going to just contain them to a specific area.

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Speaker 3: Based on the limited knowledge and also all of the

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Speaker 3: stereotypes that were happening around people who had Hans's disease

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Speaker 3: at the time, so they were sent to leprosy hospitals

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Speaker 3: and to still call it leper colonies and as what

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Speaker 3: often happens too. Of course, there are many other demographic

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Speaker 3: and sociological issues tied up into the way that people

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Speaker 3: were treated and isolated. So a lot of people who

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Speaker 3: were in Hawaii. Of course, most of those people who

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Speaker 3: were sent to this communities of people who had leprosy

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Speaker 3: were Native Hawaiians, but there were other ethnicities who were

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Speaker 3: there as well, And of course Hawaii is very isolated

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Speaker 3: and that made it the quote unquote perfect place to

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Speaker 3: isolate people who had leprosy. But anyway, one of these

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Speaker 3: kinds of communities existed in Hawaii called kalaile Papa, and

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Speaker 3: people with advanced cases of the disease were often forcibly

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Speaker 3: transferred there and they lived in exile basically and often

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Speaker 3: for their entire lives.

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Speaker 5: The stigma existed around.

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Speaker 3: Leprosy because of all the biases that people had, the

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Speaker 3: ignorance about how the disease worked, how the condition affected

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Speaker 3: people physically, because it did have physical effects, these things

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Speaker 3: that people saw and viewed people in a different way

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Speaker 3: morally because of it. The didn't understand how it spread.

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Speaker 3: They thought it was really contagious, which is not that contagious,

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Speaker 3: definitely not as contagious as people thought it was. Back

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Speaker 3: then they considered them unclean, morally inferior, or less lesser

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Speaker 3: than from a social status standpoint.

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Speaker 5: So all of these things.

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Speaker 3: Were wrapped up into why people were isolated who had

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Speaker 3: Hanson's disease, which at the time, but people had this

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Speaker 3: all over the world, so it wasn't just happening in Hawaii,

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Speaker 3: and that wasn't the case over all the time. Even

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Speaker 3: though it did migrate from Europe and Asia over to

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Speaker 3: the Americas, it didn't always exist in Americas. But isolation

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Speaker 3: wasn't the only way that doctors treated Hanson's for a while.

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Speaker 3: Like I said earlier, people around the world did use

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Speaker 3: taumuger oil from the Chaumuga tree. People in India and

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Speaker 3: China were using this medicinally and it was used to

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Speaker 3: treat Hansens as well as other skin conditions, and so

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Speaker 3: some of these trees at a point were planted in Hawaii,

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Speaker 3: but doctors in the US were having trouble treating it

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Speaker 3: effectively with that oil. The oil doses were nauseating and

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Speaker 3: injecting it could be painful and it could cause skin abscesses.

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Speaker 3: So therein there is a problem that needs a solution

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Speaker 3: that people realize, Hey, this taumuger oil has been used

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Speaker 3: for many, many years and other societies, so they already

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Speaker 3: clearly have medicinal knowledge of how it's used for this condition,

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Speaker 3: but it could be improved upon, and so that's where

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Speaker 3: Holman comes in, and then that's where Alice Ball comes

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Speaker 3: in as well.

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Speaker 5: So basically at that point, Ball was doing double duty.

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Speaker 3: She was doing all of her teaching work during the

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Speaker 3: day and on the side she was working on making

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Speaker 3: this ChIL mugra water soluble and able to be injected

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Speaker 3: into patients who had leprosy.

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Speaker 5: And Arthur L.

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Speaker 3: Dean, who was then a chemistry professor, helped her with

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Speaker 3: this work. She ended up being successful at creating that

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Speaker 3: injectible that was made with the active components of the oil.

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Speaker 3: She used freezing the oil to help her make that

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Speaker 3: injectible and then after that many people were released from

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Speaker 3: isolation in the wake of that discovery. But unfortunately, Alice

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Speaker 3: Ball did die very young in nineteen sixteen. She it

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Speaker 3: was reported that she inhaled chlorine gas in one of

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Speaker 3: the classes that she was teaching, but her death certificate

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Speaker 3: also set tuberculosis. So there is some debate over how

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Speaker 3: Alice Paul actually died. She got sick and couldn't publish

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Speaker 3: her finding, so she didn't publish her findings before she

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Speaker 3: passed away. She went back to Seattle from Hawaii in

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Speaker 3: October of nineteen sixteen and died in December thirty first

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Speaker 3: of that year, and she was only twenty four years old.

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Speaker 3: And Dean, Arthur Dean, he did continue her work after

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Speaker 3: she died, but he didn't credit her for her work

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Speaker 3: in this publication.

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Speaker 5: And here in.

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Speaker 3: Lies one of those stories that feels like it's apocryphal

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Speaker 3: or like some sort of odd, terrible archetype of things

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Speaker 3: happening in history, where it's like the man takes credit

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Speaker 3: for everything that the woman did.

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Speaker 5: But that is what happened in this case.

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Speaker 3: The method became known as the Dean method, which is

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Speaker 3: like throwing salt on the wound, and a bunch of

256
00:15:06,440 --> 00:15:10,560
Speaker 3: treatment was of the treatment was produced and used around

257
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Speaker 3: the world. That had a bunch of potential and people

258
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Speaker 3: were really hopeful that it would make a big difference.

259
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Speaker 5: But and then there were no Hansons.

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Speaker 3: Patients who had Hanson's disease who were sent to kloup

261
00:15:23,480 --> 00:15:27,560
Speaker 3: Papa between nineteen nineteen and nineteen twenty three and The

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Speaker 3: injection was used to treat people for years, but by

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Speaker 3: the end of the nineteen twenties, people realized that the

264
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Speaker 3: treatment wouldn't be a complete cure or help to completely

265
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Speaker 3: set clad Papa down. Shut it down till oil was

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Speaker 3: replaced by treatments that were more effective medications by the

267
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Speaker 3: time of the nineteen forties and beyond. So in the

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Speaker 3: work that Arthur Dean published in nineteen twenty two, he

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Speaker 3: mentioned Ball's work in researching the treatment. He rolled it

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Speaker 3: back and he was like, no, you know, Alice Ball

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Speaker 3: was the one who did this work. You know, she

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Speaker 3: was a pioneer in this research that was done in

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Speaker 3: order to create this treatment that helped people. And here's

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Speaker 3: a quote from that publication he said, quote about the

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Speaker 3: time that Rogers and Ghosh were starting their investigations in

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Speaker 3: India and Hawaii. I interested Miss Alice Ball, MS, an

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Speaker 3: instructress in chemistry at the College of Hawaii, in the

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Speaker 3: chemical problem of obtaining for me the active agents in

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Speaker 3: the oil of chaal mugra. After a great amount of

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Speaker 3: experimental work, Miss Ball solved the problem for me by

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Speaker 3: making the ethyl esters of the fatty acids found in

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Speaker 3: chalmugra oil employing the technique herewith described and he goes

283
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Speaker 3: on and he proceeds to describe what he calls Ball's method.

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Speaker 3: So reattribution is happening there. So there were people who

285
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Speaker 3: came across her work, Catherine Takara, I think it is

286
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Speaker 3: in Stanley Ali who came out across her work and

287
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Speaker 3: records in.

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Speaker 5: The nineteen seventies. And it was a long time.

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Speaker 3: It was a long time when her work just the

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Speaker 3: fact that she had done it and that, you know,

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Speaker 3: Dean did reattribute the work to her, but that didn't

292
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Speaker 3: really people still didn't.

293
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Speaker 5: Really know about it.

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Speaker 3: You know, it was still Dean's meant that he was

295
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Speaker 3: the one who had helped get this treatment out to everybody,

296
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Speaker 3: and Ball's contributions weren't specifically and deeply known. So they

297
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Speaker 3: brought that back to light and over time, over the

298
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Speaker 3: most the past few decades, her work has been more recognized.

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Speaker 3: In two thousand and seven, the University of Hawaii gave

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Speaker 3: her the Regent's Medal of Distinction, and back in two thousand,

301
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Speaker 3: Hawaii did proclaim February twenty ninth to be Alice bal Day.

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Speaker 3: But of course that is a day that only occurs

303
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Speaker 3: on leap years, so because it only happens every four years,

304
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Speaker 3: the governor Hawaii went ahead and said, okay, February twenty eight,

305
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Speaker 3: twenty twenty two, just this year, he said that that

306
00:17:58,600 --> 00:18:03,119
Speaker 3: was Alice Augusta all day. And in terms of leprosy overall,

307
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Speaker 3: many more advancements have been made since Alice Ball did

308
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Speaker 3: her work.

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Speaker 5: People with Hansen's disease do have a.

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Speaker 3: Cure that is available to them now, and it's largely

311
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Speaker 3: treated with antibiotics. So that's the story of Alice Ball

312
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Speaker 3: is she did a lot in her twenty four years,

313
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Speaker 3: and she accrued a lot of first as well. And

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Speaker 3: I'm just I'm really happy that her work is being

315
00:18:40,880 --> 00:18:46,719
Speaker 3: recognized now because it is one of those cases of

316
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Speaker 3: somebody else not only taking credit for her work, but

317
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Speaker 3: doing it in a very deep way where it's like, no.

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Speaker 5: This this is in my name.

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Speaker 3: Method is in my name, and that it was able

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Speaker 3: to be reattributed to her, it's a good thing.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I'm glad that. I'm glad about that too,

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Speaker 1: But it is kind of like you did it when

323
00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:14,920
Speaker 1: it was too late, Like everybody knows it as this now,

324
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Speaker 1: and it was sort of when all these other developments

325
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Speaker 1: were happening, So I am very glad it happened. Also,

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Speaker 1: I've never heard the word instructress before.

327
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Speaker 2: That was a new one for me. But yeah, I wish.

328
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Speaker 1: It's so tragic that she died so young, and she'd

329
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Speaker 1: already done so much, so who knows how much more

330
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Speaker 1: she could have accomplished, and she had such an impact,

331
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Speaker 1: And I yeah, it was a story I had never

332
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Speaker 1: heard of. I really didn't know much about leprosy, to

333
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Speaker 1: be honest. Yeah, so I'm so again. I'm so happy

334
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Speaker 1: that you bought this to our attention. I'm happy she's

335
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Speaker 1: getting the recognition she should serve. I'm very sad she

336
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Speaker 1: didn't get it in her life for earlier.

337
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Speaker 4: There's a lot like when you look at the context

338
00:20:02,680 --> 00:20:05,840
Speaker 4: of when this occurred, there's so many things to unpack

339
00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:08,720
Speaker 4: because even today we know that when it comes to

340
00:20:08,760 --> 00:20:12,159
Speaker 4: women and especially marginalists, women, especially black women, and stem

341
00:20:12,280 --> 00:20:14,920
Speaker 4: or steam is rare still like to the fact that

342
00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:18,280
Speaker 4: people are still questioning, you know, women being doctors, a

343
00:20:18,280 --> 00:20:20,879
Speaker 4: black woman being a doctor, or you know, anything in

344
00:20:20,920 --> 00:20:24,359
Speaker 4: the science field, engineering field. So it's lovely to see

345
00:20:24,440 --> 00:20:28,840
Speaker 4: that she broke down these walls. So early on. It's

346
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Speaker 4: awful to think that she didn't get that credit until

347
00:20:31,520 --> 00:20:35,919
Speaker 4: what late nineties slash early two thousands, and looking at

348
00:20:35,960 --> 00:20:40,000
Speaker 4: finally Hawaii, like, yeah, she definitely did these things, but

349
00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:44,200
Speaker 4: also like we understand it was in the late eighteen hundreds,

350
00:20:44,240 --> 00:20:46,720
Speaker 4: early nineteen hundreds, It had been in the process of

351
00:20:46,760 --> 00:20:49,159
Speaker 4: being colonized the entire time, and there was there was

352
00:20:49,200 --> 00:20:52,520
Speaker 4: battles happening for that land and that resources, even to

353
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Speaker 4: the point that today, hey, people don't recognize or don't

354
00:20:55,560 --> 00:20:57,919
Speaker 4: even know the history of Hawaii. Like it took me

355
00:20:58,440 --> 00:21:01,200
Speaker 4: to the last five years, I understand. Oh yeah, they

356
00:21:01,240 --> 00:21:05,240
Speaker 4: really were, really were like colonized and taken advantage of

357
00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:07,240
Speaker 4: it and still are to this day. Kind of saying

358
00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:10,639
Speaker 4: with Puerto Rico. Whole different episode, but these conversations of

359
00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:13,200
Speaker 4: like how this laid out and then having this deep

360
00:21:13,320 --> 00:21:16,040
Speaker 4: history trying to unearth and remember some of the amazing

361
00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:19,520
Speaker 4: things that did occur at the same time, as well

362
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Speaker 4: as the fact again yes, that she was a young

363
00:21:21,840 --> 00:21:24,960
Speaker 4: black woman coming into a field being an instructor, which

364
00:21:25,160 --> 00:21:29,040
Speaker 4: again amazes me, and it's like wow, I wonder again,

365
00:21:29,280 --> 00:21:31,639
Speaker 4: like the battles she had to go through Again, you

366
00:21:31,880 --> 00:21:35,720
Speaker 4: had said that she came from a pretty well to do.

367
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Speaker 5: That's the word I wanted.

368
00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:41,520
Speaker 4: To really Yeah, yeah, I'm like, how do I say this?

369
00:21:42,640 --> 00:21:45,160
Speaker 4: But still, you know, there were challenges, you know, there

370
00:21:45,160 --> 00:21:47,560
Speaker 4: were so many uphill battles for her and her family,

371
00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:50,000
Speaker 4: and the fact that she was an instructor and was

372
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Speaker 4: able to instruct other people in this field is phenomenal.

373
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Speaker 4: And maybe I'm blowing it out of proportion in that

374
00:21:59,440 --> 00:22:01,359
Speaker 4: I really wish it didn't have to be a big deal.

375
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Speaker 4: But of course, like I said, even today is still

376
00:22:03,760 --> 00:22:06,320
Speaker 4: kind of a big deal. Like seeking people who are

377
00:22:06,400 --> 00:22:10,520
Speaker 4: able to continue in this field and to thrive in

378
00:22:10,560 --> 00:22:12,800
Speaker 4: this field is difficult because of all the obstacles that

379
00:22:12,840 --> 00:22:16,440
Speaker 4: are placed in front of marginalized people in general. So

380
00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:19,800
Speaker 4: her story is beyond amazing. And even if she hadn't

381
00:22:19,800 --> 00:22:21,920
Speaker 4: done this metads, which she did, which is an amazing

382
00:22:22,280 --> 00:22:24,560
Speaker 4: feed and she should be credited for that work, the

383
00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:28,800
Speaker 4: things that she had already done is an accomplishment in itself. Again,

384
00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:33,520
Speaker 4: and for me as a person who has no understanding

385
00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:37,400
Speaker 4: of science hardly at all. And then like the things

386
00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:40,640
Speaker 4: I know of leprosy comes from like biblical to teachings,

387
00:22:40,680 --> 00:22:43,120
Speaker 4: which pretty much submit unclean that what we.

388
00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:45,440
Speaker 5: Know that is that's a lot of people's experience.

389
00:22:45,520 --> 00:22:50,160
Speaker 4: I'm sure, Samantha, I'm smart, it's fine, But like all

390
00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:52,920
Speaker 4: of these things come into play that you're like, wow,

391
00:22:52,960 --> 00:22:55,760
Speaker 4: this this information, this story. There's so many folds to

392
00:22:55,840 --> 00:22:58,880
Speaker 4: this that in her young life there again, as you said,

393
00:22:58,920 --> 00:23:01,439
Speaker 4: there's so many first that she should have been accredited with.

394
00:23:01,480 --> 00:23:04,359
Speaker 4: This we should be talking about, and how amazing this

395
00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:07,320
Speaker 4: individual and I hope her support system. So it seems

396
00:23:07,560 --> 00:23:09,680
Speaker 4: we're able to get her to this place for her

397
00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:12,720
Speaker 4: to work and fight for this place again, kind of

398
00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:14,760
Speaker 4: diminished by the fact that people try to take credit

399
00:23:14,800 --> 00:23:17,879
Speaker 4: for her work, of course, but at least we are

400
00:23:17,960 --> 00:23:20,679
Speaker 4: finally hearing about it. Like there's so many things to

401
00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:23,680
Speaker 4: this that I'm like fascinated, really want to dig deep into,

402
00:23:23,840 --> 00:23:26,880
Speaker 4: like who was this woman and how did she get there?

403
00:23:28,760 --> 00:23:32,560
Speaker 5: I'm done now, microphone down.

404
00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:38,480
Speaker 4: It's just my scattered mind to thinking about all the

405
00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:41,600
Speaker 4: processes of like how, wow, where did she come from?

406
00:23:41,640 --> 00:23:42,240
Speaker 2: How did this go?

407
00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:43,960
Speaker 5: Why haven't we talked about this more?

408
00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:45,720
Speaker 4: Why aren't we talking about this more?

409
00:23:45,800 --> 00:23:46,080
Speaker 5: Again?

410
00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:47,920
Speaker 4: I would have had no idea had you not brought

411
00:23:47,920 --> 00:23:50,360
Speaker 4: this to us, Like this woman would not have been

412
00:23:50,359 --> 00:23:51,720
Speaker 4: familiar to me at all.

413
00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:54,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, And it's one of those things where you wonder

414
00:23:54,680 --> 00:23:58,639
Speaker 3: if she would she have even ended up doing this

415
00:23:58,760 --> 00:24:02,800
Speaker 3: work if she didn't end up in Hawaii serendipitously, Like,

416
00:24:03,119 --> 00:24:06,919
Speaker 3: of course, it was for an unfortunate reason that she

417
00:24:06,960 --> 00:24:11,199
Speaker 3: did end up going to Hawaii for the illness in

418
00:24:11,240 --> 00:24:14,480
Speaker 3: her family, but because she ended up there, she ended

419
00:24:14,560 --> 00:24:17,840
Speaker 3: up there in proximity to a challenge that was happening

420
00:24:17,840 --> 00:24:19,320
Speaker 3: on the island at the time, which is that these

421
00:24:19,320 --> 00:24:22,439
Speaker 3: people were in isolation and she was there to help

422
00:24:23,080 --> 00:24:26,840
Speaker 3: come up with treatment for them. So it's one of

423
00:24:26,840 --> 00:24:30,280
Speaker 3: those things where it's like, clearly she ended up there

424
00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:33,960
Speaker 3: for a reason, she was able to help in the

425
00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:37,000
Speaker 3: work that she was doing there in the short amount

426
00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:39,320
Speaker 3: of time that she did have on this earth.

427
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Speaker 2: Yeah.

428
00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:46,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, And sometimes with these I get a little, you know,

429
00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:49,920
Speaker 1: almost scared of like what if this guy had never

430
00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:52,320
Speaker 1: said she didn't do this, and people don't do the

431
00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:54,600
Speaker 1: research and then they don't know. But I'm always hopeful

432
00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:55,959
Speaker 1: when you come on to Eaves because you're like, no

433
00:24:56,000 --> 00:24:57,280
Speaker 1: people are doing this research.

434
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Speaker 2: These people won't be forgotten.

435
00:25:00,520 --> 00:25:03,440
Speaker 1: So thank you, thank you, thank you for bringing these

436
00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:05,679
Speaker 1: people to us and these amazing stories to us.

437
00:25:06,119 --> 00:25:09,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm happy too, thank you, like thank goodness for

438
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:11,080
Speaker 3: all these people who are doing niche things.

439
00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:14,880
Speaker 2: Right, Yes, yes, honestly so much.

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Speaker 4: Yes, there are so many moments when you talk about

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00:25:18,480 --> 00:25:21,160
Speaker 4: this one person discovered this one name and then they

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00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:24,080
Speaker 4: went down this rabbit hole and discovered this whole new

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00:25:24,160 --> 00:25:26,640
Speaker 4: aspect of this that I'm like, oh my god.

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00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:27,960
Speaker 2: It literally was like.

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00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:31,399
Speaker 4: A detail that they got and they just like, this

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00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:32,200
Speaker 4: looks important.

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Speaker 5: Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 3: You have to be committed to the idea of something,

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00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:38,480
Speaker 3: to believe in something that maybe has never been combined

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00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:41,880
Speaker 3: in certain ways before that other people would may never

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00:25:41,920 --> 00:25:44,680
Speaker 3: think to work on. So I think that's really admirable

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00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:46,160
Speaker 3: in some of these people's stories too.

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Speaker 4: So to those people who continue to dig deep, thank you,

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00:25:50,280 --> 00:25:51,680
Speaker 4: and that includes you, Eves.

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Speaker 5: Thank you. And if people call you weird, it's okay.

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00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:59,240
Speaker 3: It's okay because people probably will call you weird for

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00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:02,120
Speaker 3: doing so many things, but I just know that greatness

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00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:03,119
Speaker 3: is in the future for you.

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Speaker 1: We would never because we really really appreciate all of you.

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00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:11,920
Speaker 2: Yes, well, thanks to some always ease for coming on.

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00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:15,000
Speaker 2: Where can the good listeners find you?

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00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:17,920
Speaker 3: You can find me on many and many other episodes

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00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:22,000
Speaker 3: of Stuff Mom Never Told You doing other female firsts

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00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:27,359
Speaker 3: in history, about other amazing women who had innovations, breakthroughs,

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00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:31,080
Speaker 3: and first You can also find me on a line

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00:26:31,080 --> 00:26:34,480
Speaker 3: on Instagram at not Apologizing. You can also find me

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00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:38,080
Speaker 3: on Twitter at Eve's Jeffcoat and if all else fails,

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00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:40,360
Speaker 3: just go to Eves Jeffcoat dot com.

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00:26:40,359 --> 00:26:41,359
Speaker 2: That's y v E.

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00:26:41,560 --> 00:26:45,120
Speaker 5: S j E F F C O A T dot com.

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00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:47,680
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, yes, so that.

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00:26:47,760 --> 00:26:50,040
Speaker 1: I were just talking about the stress of spelling things

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00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:50,720
Speaker 1: on podcasts.

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00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:52,480
Speaker 2: I don't know why it's so stressful it is.

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00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:54,520
Speaker 5: I'm like, nope, I'm I'm gonna do it because I'm

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00:26:54,520 --> 00:26:55,199
Speaker 5: gonna mess it up.

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Speaker 2: It's like a panic moment. It's interesting.

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00:26:59,359 --> 00:27:03,960
Speaker 1: Well, go check eves out listeners if you haven't already online.

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00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:06,199
Speaker 1: If you want to cotton tact us, you can. Our

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00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:08,520
Speaker 1: email is Stepanie mom Stuff at iHeartMedia dot com.

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00:27:08,560 --> 00:27:09,159
Speaker 2: You can find us on.

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00:27:09,119 --> 00:27:11,160
Speaker 1: Twitter at mom Stuff podcast or on Instagram at stuff

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00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:13,440
Speaker 1: I've Never Told You. Thanks as always to our super

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00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:17,119
Speaker 1: producer Christina, thank you, Thanks to you for listening, and

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00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:19,680
Speaker 1: also Eves, thanks for being part of this TikTok experiment.

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00:27:19,720 --> 00:27:21,960
Speaker 2: You may or may not see it. Listeners, I don't.

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00:27:21,760 --> 00:27:24,320
Speaker 4: Know, and thanks well Joey, who is ahead of the

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00:27:24,400 --> 00:27:26,080
Speaker 4: show whenever they start this.

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Speaker 1: Thank you, yes, thank you, and we're sorry Steff I've

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00:27:31,200 --> 00:27:33,000
Speaker 1: never told you his production of iHeart Radio. For more

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00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:34,600
Speaker 1: podcast from my Heart Radio, you can check out the

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00:27:34,600 --> 00:27:36,560
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen

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00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:37,600
Speaker 1: to your favorite shows.