Speaker 1: Worrying. This episode contains no spoilers. Really, there's no spoilers
Speaker 1: in this.
Speaker 2: Hello.
Speaker 1: My name is Jason Concepcion and I'm Rosie Knight and
Speaker 1: welcome back to Extra edition.
Speaker 2: In the podcast Where We Dive Deep, it's your.
Speaker 1: Favorite shows, movies, comics of pop, Closer Company, Your My
Speaker 1: Heart or you Three of Us is week.
Speaker 2: Listeners. In today's episode, we're gonna zoom out like we're
Speaker 2: Superman flying above Earth, looking down, taking stock of James
Speaker 2: Gunn's DCU so far and what we can look ahead
Speaker 2: to as Matt Reeves Batman Universe, how does that factor
Speaker 2: into all of it? Are we gonna see the Andy
Speaker 2: Mauschetti Batman ever? Like where do we stand? We're gonna
Speaker 2: be talking about it, So we'll be talking about that
Speaker 2: Tale of two Batman, super Girl? Where do you stand?
Speaker 2: Are you read? Are you excited? Is it enough to
Speaker 2: keep it going? Then we'll look at some upcoming projects
Speaker 2: like Lanton's Clay Face Man of Tomorrow and just give
Speaker 2: you on laya the land of where we think DC's
Speaker 2: headed halfway into twenty twenty six bomb.
Speaker 1: Yes, since the DC Deep Dive, there's things to be
Speaker 1: excited about. There's things to be worried about. Let's start
Speaker 1: something that we are unabashedly excited about that I think
Speaker 1: is a stategic hedge on the part of DC should correct.
Speaker 1: Should the gun Averse falter, we have a parallel path
Speaker 1: that perhaps that we can we can build upon, and
Speaker 1: that is Matt Reeves and the Batman Part two, his
Speaker 1: parallel universe Batman not involved in the gun Averse versions
Speaker 1: of the characters, or so we think, right it certainly
Speaker 1: seems that way right now.
Speaker 2: It's connected kind of an elseworld situation to the main
Speaker 2: gun of us. But there has been rumors that that
Speaker 2: could change, I think.
Speaker 1: Especial I'm sure they've been talking about.
Speaker 2: It exactly so, probably having that conversation as we speak.
Speaker 1: So the Baman Part two h slated for in October first,
Speaker 1: twenty twenty seven release, which feels like it's that's maybe
Speaker 1: you know, it's not that far away eating along.
Speaker 2: This is the thing that I think has changed since
Speaker 2: the last time we talked about this. Most where we
Speaker 2: expected James Gunn's universe to be and the motion we
Speaker 2: expected it to have by this point that many people
Speaker 2: worried would leave the Batman two in the dust has
Speaker 2: not necessarily materialized in the way we expected. Instead, the
Speaker 2: Batman Part two, you know, Matt Reeves was releasing one image,
Speaker 2: one gift, and it was kind of running all over
Speaker 2: the gun of us like a batmobile, like it took
Speaker 2: over the Internet. And I think that switch in motion
Speaker 2: is one of the things why we like. Okay, I
Speaker 2: think we got to talk about where we're at.
Speaker 1: So let's let's talk about the casting first, because there's
Speaker 1: a lot of exciting news there. I will note that
Speaker 1: that the casting has not officially been confirmed by DC,
Speaker 1: but it's very interesting, which is very interesting. I'm not
Speaker 1: sure what the strategy is there. But here's who we
Speaker 1: have thus far. Of course, Robert Pattinson returning as the
Speaker 1: young and Emo Bruce Wayne. We have Jeffrey Wright returning
Speaker 1: as Jim Gordon, Andy serkuses Alfred the kind of buff Zaddie,
Speaker 1: Alfred Pennyworth. Colin Farrell, of course is very important in
Speaker 1: this universe as Oskob the Penguin, Jamie Lawson as Mayor Bella,
Speaker 1: Real gilpras Abraham's Offers and Martinez. And here are your
Speaker 1: new editions. We have Sebastian stan as Harvey Dent.
Speaker 2: Love it. Yeah, still allegedly not officially confirmed, but we
Speaker 2: it kind of seems officially confirmed, but.
Speaker 1: He's talking about it at Cannes.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's talking about it, so it's like it's confirmed.
Speaker 1: He said it can that. He plays quote many roles
Speaker 1: in this one, so obviously that seems like a Harvey
Speaker 1: Dent little two faced above situation right, also double dipping
Speaker 1: in the MC universe. Scarlett Johansson as rumored rumored to
Speaker 1: be Gilded Dent crazy.
Speaker 2: But also makes sense if you know who she is
Speaker 2: and what Matt has adapted before we can get into that. Marris,
Speaker 2: we talk about it. Brian Yvee Henry no rumors and
Speaker 2: that night to know who's that is?
Speaker 1: We will I. I don't know. We have Charles Dance
Speaker 1: The Great Dance, Oh, that would be awesome, Taiwan Lanister
Speaker 1: himself as Christopher Dent, the father Christopher Dent and which
Speaker 1: I love that casting, and then Sebastian Koke. We have
Speaker 1: also no rumors about this. So the setting certainly seems
Speaker 1: like it takes place in winter based on Reeves's kind
Speaker 1: of first look material that he released on.
Speaker 2: This it's seen some snowy Gotham.
Speaker 1: Yes, This has kind of sparked some mister Freeze speculations.
Speaker 2: A little bit of mister I would love to see
Speaker 2: Brian Tyree Henry as mister Freeze. I think that would incredible.
Speaker 2: I also think Sebastian Coach could be mister Freeze. I
Speaker 2: also think it could not be mister Freeze. When I
Speaker 2: interviewed Matt Reeves years ago before The Batman came out
Speaker 2: about an Amazon TV show he adapted from a photo book,
Speaker 2: which was actually really interesting. We just kind of were vibing,
Speaker 2: started talking about Batman, and he gave me a bunch
Speaker 2: of scoops, and one of the things he shared was
Speaker 2: his favorite Batman movie is Batman Returns, which I think
Speaker 2: actually comes through a lot in the first Batman. But
Speaker 2: I think here that kind of potential of it being
Speaker 2: a Christmas movie, the wintery iciness of it all, that
Speaker 2: a modernized version of that really does feel like it
Speaker 2: would be adapting Heart of Ice or something like that.
Speaker 2: So I'm excited. Interesting also in the comics, So put
Speaker 2: your ears spoiler ears on now, guys, if you do
Speaker 2: not want to be spoiled for what could potentially happen
Speaker 2: in the comics. Gilda Dent is Harvey Dent's wife, so
Speaker 2: very interesting to do a little MCU pairing there. But
Speaker 2: she's also a serial killer, and depending on the canon,
Speaker 2: she is the serial killer that we know that Falcone was,
Speaker 2: Sophia was maybe potentially blamed for being. So there is
Speaker 2: some really interesting connections to the Penguin and.
Speaker 1: That's where they're going.
Speaker 2: I think that's where they're going to. And it makes
Speaker 2: me so excited, because guys, the Penguin is so good.
Speaker 2: You might forget it, but it's so good and it's
Speaker 2: so scary and it's so sad, and the Batman is
Speaker 2: so good too, and I know people are having this
Speaker 2: kind of revisionist feeling that it's not that good now,
Speaker 2: and if that's how you feel, I totally respect it.
Speaker 2: But I think this is such a dark, interesting space
Speaker 2: in the DC universe. It reminds me of Batman, the
Speaker 2: animated series. And if they're really going to continue the
Speaker 2: Holiday killer stuff, the long Halloween stuff with this two
Speaker 2: female serial killer potential, I just think that's so interesting.
Speaker 2: I'm just I want to know more.
Speaker 1: So principal photography is go underway in Glasgow, with some
Speaker 1: second unit stuff going on in Liverpool. It does, so
Speaker 1: Reeves used a really interesting gift of Scarlett Johansson gilded
Speaker 1: dent in that storyline that there's some Long Halloween mm
Speaker 1: hmmm kind of reflections as well. I wonder, I do
Speaker 1: wonder which way they're gonna go. But that does make
Speaker 1: a lot of sense that you would use Gilda as
Speaker 1: the serial killer go pull from Long Halloween. Now here's
Speaker 1: the question. The end of the first Batman, we saw
Speaker 1: Barry Kiyogan as the Joker. We have no information about him,
Speaker 1: which leads me to believe that either he is a
Speaker 1: big part of the movie or not in the movie.
Speaker 1: There's tween.
Speaker 2: I I agree completely one hundred. I do think his
Speaker 2: star was more on the rise. It was pre fumbling
Speaker 2: Sabrina Koppana, which to kind of change his cultural cachet
Speaker 2: with young people.
Speaker 1: But I think I think there's I will let me
Speaker 1: say one thing about that. I get, Yes, he fumbled
Speaker 1: Sabrina Carpenter, and he should and and that's star culture,
Speaker 1: and that's pop culture, and that's absolutely fine. Be making
Speaker 1: fun of myself for fumbling Sabrina. It's fantastic. And it's
Speaker 1: of course like the juice, the juiciness of the fact
Speaker 1: that she's written songs about like that.
Speaker 2: Too, and how it was when they went together and stuff.
Speaker 2: You can't help me make it's front of.
Speaker 1: The guy because you think he's ugly. I just think
Speaker 1: it's no. I think that's fucked up. We've gone to
Speaker 1: it's it's gone too far. And when he said when
Speaker 1: he said, like I forget where on the red carpet
Speaker 1: somewhere or some interview where it's like he actually had
Speaker 1: to go offline and he feels like he can't go
Speaker 1: outside because people are just like taking pictures of him
Speaker 1: in order to post how ugly he is. I think
Speaker 1: that's just crazy.
Speaker 2: No, that shit's great.
Speaker 1: That's how you crash somebody's psyche to the point that
Speaker 1: they end up like on meds like don't do that.
Speaker 2: Actually, glad that you brought that up, because totally agree
Speaker 2: and also very fucked up because the same people will
Speaker 2: be online talking about everyone looks the same as them
Speaker 2: pick blah blah blah blah blah. But they're also like
Speaker 2: not embracing somebody who's actually a great character actor who
Speaker 2: looks a certain way because they don't like the way
Speaker 2: he looks or they don't think he's conventionally attractive.
Speaker 1: That shit's corny. It's it's corny. It's very bad. I
Speaker 1: will also add one more thing that all those photos
Speaker 1: like he is Ringo star in the upcoming videos movie,
Speaker 1: and so all the videos and photos are him with
Speaker 1: like I don't love the haircut either, and it does
Speaker 1: not maybe doesn't frame his face in the most like
Speaker 1: a flattering way, but like he's playing star, he's playing
Speaker 1: a beetle, and it used it. I just found it,
Speaker 1: like I just found it over the social media's turn.
Speaker 1: But I felt really at that point, I'm like, guys
Speaker 1: lit up.
Speaker 2: But also as well, if you want to criticize somebody
Speaker 2: because they treated somebody else badly, the best way to
Speaker 2: do it is not by treating them badly, you know
Speaker 2: what I mean, Like, come on, guys, and especially not
Speaker 2: on a global platform. But I will say all of
Speaker 2: that to say leading into my point, which I actually
Speaker 2: think is you're right. He's either not in it because
Speaker 2: he said I don't want to high profile thing like
Speaker 2: that I'm pulling out, or or he absolutely is the
Speaker 2: main villain and we're gonna get this really scary kind
Speaker 2: of comeback performance for him from him that's gonna make
Speaker 2: everyone go, oh shit. That's why we were excited because also,
Speaker 2: if you're smart and you're Matt Reeves, you were able
Speaker 2: to do something really terrifying with the Riddler, really different,
Speaker 2: and you were able to kind of lay that out
Speaker 2: and not act like there were many surprises, and it
Speaker 2: was more about the characters. If they do the same
Speaker 2: where they're like, look at this Sebastian Stan kind of
Speaker 2: Noari take Gilda Dad, but in the background is this
Speaker 2: kind of monstrous joke. I think that is could be
Speaker 2: a really cool take and again, something we haven't seen
Speaker 2: for a while, something the Gun of Us has not
Speaker 2: done yet, so it would be a pretty big deal.
Speaker 1: Well, speaking of the Gun of Verse, let's now transition
Speaker 1: to a property. So we're very excited obviously about The
Speaker 1: Batman per two. We are I think it to carry
Speaker 1: you know, to speak for extra Vision as a whole.
Speaker 1: I think we are hopefully excited about The Brave and
Speaker 1: the Bold, slated for release in late twenty twenty eight,
Speaker 1: directed by Any Musquetti, script by Christina Hodson, who did
Speaker 1: The Flash and bubble Bee.
Speaker 2: Well, I want to say, let's not I don't want
Speaker 2: to blame her for The Flash because I had like
Speaker 2: fifty right as by the end, the Flash.
Speaker 1: Was a very very particular.
Speaker 3: Yes wit that I want to read the book on
Speaker 3: the Flash when we get the book about what that
Speaker 3: was about, the push, the media swing.
Speaker 1: The star of the film was like an active fugure.
Speaker 3: It was Tom Cruise is like being shown the movie
Speaker 3: in his house. It was crazy, like I need to
Speaker 3: see the Argo style movie about that rollout, Like what
Speaker 3: the fuck? But Christina Hodson did write Bumblebee fucking incredible
Speaker 3: for that.
Speaker 1: A wonderful Transformers movie.
Speaker 2: Uh. She wrote Harlequin and the Birds of Prey, which
Speaker 2: we know is also a fantastic movie, really enjoyable, great writing.
Speaker 2: So I think there's a lot to be excited about here,
Speaker 2: especially because it kind of seemed like from what they
Speaker 2: were saying, James Gunn was saying, this would be introduced,
Speaker 2: this would be based on Grant Morrison's stuff, and it
Speaker 2: would be very much about Damian Wayne and Batman's relationship
Speaker 2: with him, which seemed very exciting right when it was
Speaker 2: announced two or three years ago. Does it feel realistic
Speaker 2: now that that movie will come out?
Speaker 1: Question Mark, Here's what I have to say. So Gunn
Speaker 1: has stated that there'll be no casting and certainly no
Speaker 1: casting news until there's an actionable script. So there's probably
Speaker 1: no actionable script here is what I think. I think
Speaker 1: that this is where I believe the gun of her
Speaker 1: side of DC is hoping that they can co opt
Speaker 1: the Batman, and Matt Reeves is the Batman in some way.
Speaker 1: I think the late twenty twenty eight right allows this
Speaker 1: kind of leap frog thing. It has been reported that
Speaker 1: the script is complete. Obviously, the Damian Wayne part of
Speaker 1: it is in flux. There's a lot of casting here
Speaker 1: to do. But I do think that the hope is
Speaker 1: to link the Reeves elseworld verse and the standard DC
Speaker 1: universe worlds with this Brave in the Bold in particular,
Speaker 1: because you know the Brave in the Bold it's not
Speaker 1: a it's like it's a it's a team up.
Speaker 3: It's that so you're on this side. As soon as
Speaker 3: it's talking about this, I.
Speaker 1: Was like, yes, Like it.
Speaker 2: Can mean a lot to make a break from the
Speaker 2: Bold movie. You can have different universes. You can have
Speaker 2: music Master as a villain, right, you can have you know,
Speaker 2: it can be weird and silly, and also I think
Speaker 2: what's very interesting about this choice is. I saw Robert
Speaker 2: Pattinson at the Batman screening at on the Warner Brothers
Speaker 2: lot just before the movie came out, like a press screening.
Speaker 2: He was doing a Q and A. Somebody asked him
Speaker 2: what his dream would be, and he said it would
Speaker 2: be to do Batman and Robin. And obviously, this is
Speaker 2: Robert Pattinson, so he says a lot of silly things,
Speaker 2: and he said, but I'd only do it if it
Speaker 2: was a kid. He's like, I want to do Batman,
Speaker 2: but the kid is twelve, and I think I love it.
Speaker 2: I love it, fucking love it. And he's right. And
Speaker 2: at the scuse he's beginning, people kind of laughed, but
Speaker 2: he actually expounded on it and was like, how do
Speaker 2: you take care of a kid? Who's the kind of
Speaker 2: person who would put a kid in this situation? So
Speaker 2: interesting and so when and obviously you cast older and
Speaker 2: the kid is, you know, seventeen eighteen, but they're playing
Speaker 2: thirteen or whatever, but they've never done it. Chris O'Donnell
Speaker 2: is like, thirty Batman and.
Speaker 1: Six I think is the closest attempt. But then again,
Speaker 1: you know, we were casting older and pretending to be younger,
Speaker 1: but I think really casting it kid would be very much.
Speaker 2: As soon as James Gunn said, oh, we want to
Speaker 2: do Batman and Robin like the Morrison version, I sort
Speaker 2: of went, well, that's really what Robert pitched. So I
Speaker 2: always thought it was interesting. I don't know if they're
Speaker 2: going to go as crazy as to actually have Rob
Speaker 2: be the Batman, but I will say once you get
Speaker 2: into the later part of that arc, there is some
Speaker 2: really and we've talked about this right there is a
Speaker 2: version where the Brave and the Bold is Dick Grayson
Speaker 2: as Batman and Damian Wayne as Robin, and the reason
Speaker 2: that they have to do it is because Robert Pattinson's
Speaker 2: Batman is not there or has disappeared or blah blah blah.
Speaker 2: You know. So there is a version where you can
Speaker 2: do a comics accurate version where Dick essentially is Batman
Speaker 2: and it's about his relationship with Damien while still having
Speaker 2: a Bruce Wayne in Robert Pattinson, but without ever having
Speaker 2: to have him be Batman.
Speaker 1: I believe, and I think we both believe that the
Speaker 1: hope of the Gunner verse is to get Pattinson's being
Speaker 1: a Batman in this world. Here's why I think that. Obviously,
Speaker 1: there's there's no casting on the Batman for the Brave
Speaker 1: and the Bold yet, right, And there's been a lot
Speaker 1: of names that have been thrown around Jensen Acles which
Speaker 1: I think would be interesting but probably won't have.
Speaker 2: And he's done voice acting.
Speaker 1: He's done voice acting before, right, Obviously this is a
Speaker 1: huge casting call. Now, Superman came out July eleventh, twenty
Speaker 1: twenty five, we knew that it was corn Sweat, and
Speaker 1: oh my god, we knew two years or earlier June
Speaker 1: twenty conversations, and we knew in LA we were actually
Speaker 1: hearing about that for like six months before we knew
Speaker 1: who the Yes, I knew who the three were, right,
Speaker 1: we knew who the top three were.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 1: The fact that there is nothing and this is slated
Speaker 1: for twenty twenty eight release.
Speaker 2: When twenty that's what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: I think they're hoping it's Pattinson because there would be
Speaker 1: something by now, there'd be something. That's my That's what
Speaker 1: I ask.
Speaker 2: I agree. I think that there is sixty percent of
Speaker 2: whatever side at Warner Brothers is going for that and
Speaker 2: is doing every negotiation, and I think Matt and Rob
Speaker 2: are probably pushing back or wanting some kind of creat
Speaker 2: grief say so over it, like they would want to
Speaker 2: have at.
Speaker 1: Least epa exactly.
Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely, and also like Matt Reeves having some kind
Speaker 2: of like you know, Kevin Feige esque like roll on
Speaker 2: the back, almost as if how the comics are where
Speaker 2: there's about there's a Metropolis office, there's a Gotham office,
Speaker 2: you know, sort of like that. I think that would
Speaker 2: be a really interesting approach. I also think that there's
Speaker 2: probably forty percent or a little team at least who
Speaker 2: job is to be fucking looking at every single self
Speaker 2: tape in the world trying to find a Batman who
Speaker 2: says interesting and weird and talkative casting, because the problem
Speaker 2: with casting a different Batman to Robert Pattinson is that
Speaker 2: his casting that shouldn't have worked. It had the Michael Keaton,
Speaker 2: oh no, don't do this, but it also had its
Speaker 2: immediate cult following. Like, guys, let me tell you about
Speaker 2: the day that they announced Robert Pattinson got cast as Batman.
Speaker 2: If you were in this space, and this was back
Speaker 2: when we were getting paid to write a lot of articles.
Speaker 3: They're paying me articles to write about like why they
Speaker 3: didn't show the top of the ears on the mask,
Speaker 3: and I'm writing an article about how it could because
Speaker 3: they're six inches long.
Speaker 2: Because that's like the crazy Gothic version. You know. People
Speaker 2: were so excited and talking and angry and everything you
Speaker 2: want from a casting, and then Rob delivered on it.
Speaker 2: And not only just that, but the movie made eight
Speaker 2: hundred million dollars. So they need something that can do that, right,
Speaker 2: That's the thing, and I think Rosie was.
Speaker 1: If you are in Warner Brothers marketing, mm hmm, I'm sorry,
Speaker 1: but it's a disaster to have two different actors playing
Speaker 1: Batman and you're trying to sell that. You're trying to
Speaker 1: tell audiences why that. Okay, well one is in elsewhere.
Speaker 1: Obviously people like us and people who listen to Extra
Speaker 1: Vision get it, but the why your audience will be confused.
Speaker 1: And so I have to imagine that there's a significant push,
Speaker 1: just institutionally, non creatively, to be like, why would we
Speaker 1: we have Robert Pattinson? Why would we do this? So
Speaker 1: the question is at good point, it happens or it
Speaker 1: doesn't happen.
Speaker 2: This is a really great thing that I think is
Speaker 2: going to lead into our next topic. Well, well yes, before,
Speaker 2: but like, but the one thing is as well, Rob
Speaker 2: is kind of like a loose cannon on a press
Speaker 2: tour and they know that and they like it, but
Speaker 2: he will be saying crazy stuff, right, So imagine if
Speaker 2: you're like young, sweet upcoming actor who gets picked as
Speaker 2: the Batman at Warner Brothers and one day Robert Pattinson's
Speaker 2: talking about like, oh, Batman's a top, Batman's like a
Speaker 2: selfish cop or something. And the next day this poor kid,
Speaker 2: they're like, do you think Batman's a top or a bottom?
Speaker 2: Like them is asking them, and this kid is just like,
Speaker 2: what is going on? That is what could happen? So
Speaker 2: I think just like, you've either got to have someone
Speaker 2: who can compete like cars Zendeya as Batman. That's the
Speaker 2: one person I've ever seen Rob go toe to Toto
Speaker 2: on a press tour. Otherwise it's gonna be a problem.
Speaker 1: Let's take a break and return to talk about film
Speaker 1: property that we are a little worried about.
Speaker 2: Probably know what it is.
Speaker 1: If you listening to the show, Yeah, and we're at okay.
Speaker 1: Supergirl coming out June twenty sixth, twenty twenty six mm hmmm,
Speaker 1: directed by Craig Gillespie, Screenwrider, and an Aguera. Are we worried?
Speaker 1: Here are some numbers. Here is some context. First of all,
Speaker 1: tracking early obviously early tracking right now, but box office
Speaker 1: theory projects a domestico but of between forty seven and
Speaker 1: sixty five. Yeah, which is the Marvels and Black Adam.
Speaker 1: That's the low and the high. That's bad. The budget.
Speaker 1: We don't know the budget of this movie us. That's
Speaker 1: another red flag.
Speaker 2: Bad.
Speaker 1: That's a big red flag. But Puck estimates that it's
Speaker 1: about one seventy, which is honest.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 3: If I was one of brothers, I'd be boasting about that.
Speaker 1: I would be boasting about that.
Speaker 2: It was one of the funny things Disney did that
Speaker 2: was really small. In the lead up to Mandalorian. They went,
Speaker 2: this is cheap. You might say it looks like three
Speaker 2: episodes put together because it's cheap, and everyone went for cheap.
Speaker 2: It looks kind of good.
Speaker 1: More numbers rumor is and I believe this rumor to
Speaker 1: be true based on everything I hear as a person
Speaker 1: living in the Angela's the dude's work that we do
Speaker 1: that there have been more than ten test screening.
Speaker 2: Oh god, I'd heard eight, but this ten, I believe
Speaker 2: it because eight was.
Speaker 1: A fun I believe it. I believe it. I believe
Speaker 1: it as well. Sadly, I believe it.
Speaker 2: And unfortunately it's struggling to fight. It's not like they
Speaker 2: did ten and now they found the banger gem version.
Speaker 2: It's like they did ten, and every single time you
Speaker 2: know that the cool edge is getting fucking sounded off,
Speaker 2: like That's how it feels to me.
Speaker 1: Ten is a tremendous amount. I will also say that
Speaker 1: there is a new TV trailer that's been airing, like
Speaker 1: during the NBA playoffs and stuff, and the newest, the
Speaker 1: latest one, is noticeably of a different tone than the
Speaker 1: previous marketing, more action based, less story based. The dog
Speaker 1: is not in it and at all. Lobo is much
Speaker 1: more front and center, and he was kind of front
Speaker 1: and center in the previous versions, which says to me
Speaker 1: that they are at the eleventh hour look for a
Speaker 1: different way to position this movie for an audience. All
Speaker 1: of which is to say and the fact that even
Speaker 1: at this late date, there has been very very little
Speaker 1: Milli Alcock selling this movie or Milli Alcock friendly interviews.
Speaker 1: There was a uh recent podcast appearance what's the name of.
Speaker 2: Them, VC Studios Showcase. It's the official DC podcast. They
Speaker 2: just relaunched for season two, and it looks like it
Speaker 2: was very much to bring Milly out to the public
Speaker 2: and stuff. Yes, but it's really the first thing, Like,
Speaker 2: we haven't seen Milly on hot ones. I thought that
Speaker 2: was like an absolute shoe in. We haven't seen that
Speaker 2: Brosnahan corn sweat out on the town doing every press tour,
Speaker 2: doing puppy interviews. She has not been given that treatment,
Speaker 2: or she's not wanted it, whichever way round. But it
Speaker 2: does feel odd.
Speaker 1: No, no chicken date. No, Oh my gosh, Yes, I
Speaker 1: would have known. Sharing shop day. You're right, I'm officially concerned.
Speaker 1: I'm worried. And it's not just like the it's everything.
Speaker 1: It's the screenings. It's the fact that Alcock, who is
Speaker 1: a very talented actor. It seems like Warner Brothers is struggling.
Speaker 2: To help her find her like vibe and voice. Yeah,
Speaker 2: find an angle, I know, yeah, please. Common made a
Speaker 2: great point, right, this I think was This is a
Speaker 2: great Common By the way, if you didn't know this,
Speaker 2: our superduced comment is like a fashion maven. Right, she's
Speaker 2: got the eye so she will catch like a jompul
Speaker 2: got a piece you didn't even see in a film,
Speaker 2: and she'll tell you and she'll be right. So she
Speaker 2: made a great point where even the styling for Millie,
Speaker 2: this is meant to be punk, this is meant to
Speaker 2: be bad ass, Like why don't they have her in
Speaker 2: vintage Vivian Westward at every interview, like what or even
Speaker 2: just like a little ripped shirt, Like it doesn't feel
Speaker 2: like the tone of the movie or the character is
Speaker 2: getting even in this all details. Whereas I feel like
Speaker 2: every time you saw David Korn sweat, he looked like
Speaker 2: he could rip off his shirt and Superman would be
Speaker 2: underneath it, right, same with Lois Lane. Every single outfit
Speaker 2: was a beautifully put together, kind of seventies inspired workspace.
Speaker 2: I don't know anything about Millie or the character, and
Speaker 2: it's actually okay to not know anything about Millie, but
Speaker 2: then you have to make it about Kara, And I
Speaker 2: think what I've been always worried about. I actually was
Speaker 2: worried about this when they announced the movie, and if
Speaker 2: you remember, guys, I think this is the biggest thing
Speaker 2: that was always going to be a problem. When they
Speaker 2: announced this movie. There was a lot of conversation about
Speaker 2: whether it would be R rated because of the nature
Speaker 2: of the book. Right, So you take something that's that edgy,
Speaker 2: that dark, that fantastical, and suddenly it's gone from is
Speaker 2: this going to be an R rated DC female led
Speaker 2: badass revenge movie to this is a PG thirteen female
Speaker 2: led movie where just before it starts to come out,
Speaker 2: nobody's promoting it's it's giving the original super movie. And
Speaker 2: that's not to say it's not gonna be a good movie.
Speaker 2: It's to say that once again, I think a studio
Speaker 2: has found themselves where they don't know how to position
Speaker 2: a female lead movie. And I also do think I
Speaker 2: think that's part of it, right, And I think that
Speaker 2: part of that if you if we go back to
Speaker 2: looking at what DC's done recently, you know, I just
Speaker 2: spoke about Harlequin and the fantabulous emancipation of the birds
Speaker 2: prey and all that kind of stuff. I love that movie.
Speaker 2: I got to go on the set. They did kill
Speaker 2: a promo for that movie. They had us fly out
Speaker 2: for the premiere to London to do the junkit. That's
Speaker 2: where I got to do my question about Arlene and
Speaker 2: the inspiration of Harlequin and that kind of easter egg.
Speaker 2: They had to that and it's really was such a
Speaker 2: cool energy And it was February twenty twenty and COVID
Speaker 2: shut down the world. The movie didn't make very much money,
Speaker 2: and the next movie they released that was female led
Speaker 2: at DC was Wonder Woman Too, which was an immense flop,
Speaker 2: Wonder Woman nineteen eighty seven. It was part of the
Speaker 2: platform same day, same date release. The movie did not
Speaker 2: get good reviews, it did not hit, not get the
Speaker 2: numbers they wanted, and I think they are still struggling
Speaker 2: post Birds of Prey, which I think was a good
Speaker 2: step in the right direction, unfortunately hindered by you know,
Speaker 2: the world and also bias media coverage because if you
Speaker 2: look at how other movies with men are covered that
Speaker 2: made similar routs money and if you look at what
Speaker 2: super movies are making now, they'd probably have been happy
Speaker 2: with it. But I do think they still don't know
Speaker 2: what to do. Like the saddest thing for me, and
Speaker 2: this is normal, Like I am in my room which
Speaker 2: is full of branded stuff. I have Star Wars tattos,
Speaker 2: like I'm not averse to IP and the marketing aspect
Speaker 2: of it all. But I get more promoted ads for Supergirl,
Speaker 2: like makeup and socks, then I see of videos of
Speaker 2: merely talking about the movie. And that's a problem. You've
Speaker 2: got to have it the other way around. You've got
Speaker 2: to make people so excited that when they see a
Speaker 2: little Supergirl sock or a crypto popcorn bucket, they go, actually,
Speaker 2: I want a little bit more of what I've been getting.
Speaker 2: I love how much I want to purchase that, not
Speaker 2: this thing, and maybe you'll like the movie. And unfortunately,
Speaker 2: I just feel like every press is negative. I feel
Speaker 2: like all of Millie's comments are getting picked up in
Speaker 2: this way that feels so twenty sixteen, this kind of
Speaker 2: like she's, oh she doesn't like men or ever. It's
Speaker 2: just like what I.
Speaker 1: Want to say, because okay, so you know, there was
Speaker 1: a there's a piece in Variety from May twentieth that leans,
Speaker 1: you know, very heavily on or the aggregation leans very
Speaker 1: heavily on like Alcock calling out burner accounts that are
Speaker 1: criticizing her and the kind of typical right wing screeds
Speaker 1: that you yeah.
Speaker 2: And she's getting picked up on the daily wire and
Speaker 2: it's just like very and.
Speaker 1: Which by the way like that was always gonna happen.
Speaker 1: It didn't matter it was Millie Alcock.
Speaker 2: Who No, it could have been whoever like this is.
Speaker 2: It doesn't matter. It's just the fact it's a female
Speaker 2: led supera movie. They don't care what it's about. They
Speaker 2: don't care that it's based on true grit. They don't
Speaker 2: care it's actually very messy. They don't care.
Speaker 1: But the fact that we don't have a strategy to
Speaker 1: make to counterbalance that aggregation that's gonna happen from the
Speaker 1: right leaning.
Speaker 2: That you know it's gonna happen. It's gonna have brothers
Speaker 2: know this because of the Snyder cart they know, yes,
Speaker 2: more than.
Speaker 1: So, why don't we have other things ready to pop
Speaker 1: to counterbalance that. The fact that we don't have, you know.
Speaker 2: Even just like her unboxing a video, unboxing a toy
Speaker 2: or something like that South.
Speaker 1: The Hot Ones type of thing, or the Chicken Chop
Speaker 1: date sort of approach. It doesn't even need to be
Speaker 1: talking about the movie. It's just like, here is this,
Speaker 1: here's million Alcock, who's a fun person exactly.
Speaker 2: And I will say, like, so, this is obviously comparing
Speaker 2: to a movie that also might not do financially well.
Speaker 2: So I can't say if this is a better marketing
Speaker 2: campaign or not. But look at the difference between like
Speaker 2: Cami Mendes for he Man Masters of the Universe. She
Speaker 2: is everywhere for that movie, and it's just silly little
Speaker 2: bits like she will be walking down the street and
Speaker 2: there'll be a Teler poster and she'll do like a
Speaker 2: funny dance in front of the Teler poster and then
Speaker 2: like strike a blue teal. But that goes people share them.
Speaker 2: They're like, oh, this is a person who's excited to
Speaker 2: be in the movie. I feel like Warner Brothers and
Speaker 2: DC should have enough of a press mechanism that they
Speaker 2: could be pumping out like cool stories about Millie at
Speaker 2: the same time as these stories are coming out that
Speaker 2: basically just paint her as exactly what these men think
Speaker 2: she is. And I like that, like be unlikable, don't
Speaker 2: play the game. But as Warner Brothers, you should be
Speaker 2: protecting her. That's my opinion, Like why isn't you. I
Speaker 2: know that they have somebody whose job, like they've got
Speaker 2: to have someone whose job is to just tell James
Speaker 2: Gunnwott comics to read right, And I love that that's great.
Speaker 2: I love the amount of hope and kind of inspiration
Speaker 2: that gives to young artists that your stories can shape
Speaker 2: these billion dollar movies they should have. Why don't they?
Speaker 2: Why isn't there just the video of her reading Supergirl
Speaker 2: Women of Tomorrow, Like there's just I could pitch so
Speaker 2: many little ideas that I feel like they are just
Speaker 2: not putting the juice behind. Why is Jason Momoa doing
Speaker 2: more press stops? Actually I sadly know the answer because
Speaker 2: if you read the reports, and I think there was
Speaker 2: a Hollywood Reporter article about after about eight screenings where
Speaker 2: a lot of the feedback that was positive was should
Speaker 2: have been more Lobo, which I said from the beginning,
Speaker 2: don't put him in the movie because you're immediately doing
Speaker 2: a disservice to the story and to the characters who
Speaker 2: are the main characters, which are her and Ruthie. If
Speaker 2: you put Lobo in, people are gonna want to more
Speaker 2: Lobo unless you make her and Ruthie equally engaging.
Speaker 1: I'll just say this that I think that I think
Speaker 1: there's several things going on. If I had to guess,
Speaker 1: I think one that Millie is not She's not ready
Speaker 1: for this level of media attention and the media training
Speaker 1: if it's working, is not caught caught up with her
Speaker 1: and maybe she doesn't like doing it. I get it.
Speaker 1: This is you know, to cast someone in a movie
Speaker 1: like this is about It's not just about the on
Speaker 1: camera performance, it's the full package. Can you go out
Speaker 1: and sell this movie? Can you go out and appear
Speaker 1: in all the outlets, do the red carpet walk, do
Speaker 1: the appearance on the view and make this make the
Speaker 1: audience excited to see this movie. And I think, like
Speaker 1: reading this Variety article, there's so many parts, like a
Speaker 1: huge part of this article hinges on how much Milly
Speaker 1: was unsure if she really wanted to do the role,
Speaker 1: like it was right, And I get the framing of like,
Speaker 1: oh this is a challenge, but a lot of it
Speaker 1: it reads as like I wasn't sure I wanted to
Speaker 1: do it and sure I'll do it. And that's the
Speaker 1: kind of thing where we just need to reframe, guys,
Speaker 1: like we need to we need to reframe this in
Speaker 1: a different way. And I feel that if anything, if
Speaker 1: there is a failure here, it is DC failing to
Speaker 1: position million Alcock for success. One agree after investing in
Speaker 1: her to cast her and maybe first of all, casting
Speaker 1: someone who is maybe not ready for this, like if
Speaker 1: if there's a failure, it's in the gun Saffron like
Speaker 1: side of the fuel. I agree, and that is unfortunate.
Speaker 1: That's unfortunate. Now we will see, but the but the
Speaker 1: signs right now are bad.
Speaker 2: I want it. I want it to come out and
Speaker 2: have the absolute insane impact that her performance had in
Speaker 2: House of the Dragon, where we were just begging for
Speaker 2: more even though we knew they were only going to
Speaker 2: be in a certain amount of episodes. I'm hoping that's it.
Speaker 2: But also from the very beginning, I do feel like
Speaker 2: they set her up for failure by it doesn't seem
Speaker 2: like they really gave her the tools to prepare for
Speaker 2: how a role like this is gonna be received. It
Speaker 2: also raises an interesting question about fandom. Just before we finished,
Speaker 2: because I was talking to another friend, an incredible colleague
Speaker 2: called Noela Williams, who's a great journalist and activist, and
Speaker 2: we were talking about how there is a worrying trend
Speaker 2: where studios are basically casting people. This was like the
Speaker 2: new Game from the Last of Us Guys. It came
Speaker 2: up around that with Tati Gabrielle being the main character,
Speaker 2: and they basically had to boot camp her through what
Speaker 2: it would be like to be trolled. And it's just
Speaker 2: like that's where we're at, and it fucking sucked. But
Speaker 2: at least they had to go in. They went about
Speaker 2: it in a fucked up but proactive way. I feel
Speaker 2: like Warner Brothers didn't do anything, and it just seems
Speaker 2: like from the moment Millie started to get insulted, she
Speaker 2: was like, fuck this, like it's not worth my time,
Speaker 2: which I received, which is a human Yeah, but they
Speaker 2: should have prepared her, like I've seen the I saw
Speaker 2: the Riverdale kids on set from season one to season like,
Speaker 2: I think it was like three for change through the
Speaker 2: incredible like media training, learn to protect themselves, learn to
Speaker 2: share what they wanted to share, learn to be vibrant
Speaker 2: when they did and hold back when they needed to.
Speaker 2: I want Milly to have that level of care. I
Speaker 2: don't think they gave it to and I worry that
Speaker 2: she will be blamed for this when it's actually like
Speaker 2: a lot.
Speaker 1: Of people, well, she will be blamed and that's not fair.
Speaker 1: I also think that, you know, with regards to the
Speaker 1: misogynistic criticism that is frankly part of the landscape and
Speaker 1: will come her way and the way of other women
Speaker 1: who are cast in roles that are this prominent. I
Speaker 1: think the.
Speaker 2: Move is.
Speaker 1: If you give that side any fuel, they're just gonna
Speaker 1: run with it, Like even making the comments which I
Speaker 1: think are right where she's like, you know, just existing
Speaker 1: as a woman, blah blah blah, the unhealthy relationship with
Speaker 1: fans and people like that. I'm being controlled by someone
Speaker 1: who's like profile, says dad of foreign Christian. Oh, it's
Speaker 1: so that's like, just say fuck them?
Speaker 2: Who cares?
Speaker 1: Exactly?
Speaker 2: The problem is that's what she hasn't been taught and
Speaker 2: that is so relatable as a young person and an
Speaker 2: online person. Right when I was a kid and game
Speaker 2: and Gate was going on Comicsgate, we used to get
Speaker 2: the emotional hit of coming back saying something. But now
Speaker 2: the barrage of it is so impersonal. And it's also
Speaker 2: a lot of bots. It's a lot of mechanized bullshit,
Speaker 2: like you have to essentially learn how to go okay, loser,
Speaker 2: I got the job. I'm fucking supergirl. Like sadly, you
Speaker 2: have to do it. You have to have be able
Speaker 2: to let it water off. A docs back, as we
Speaker 2: used to say, you got to have your block finger strong,
Speaker 2: you got to just block them and move on. And
Speaker 2: I think sadly they have allowed that to become the
Speaker 2: conversation and it is making and it is like, really
Speaker 2: sad because also that is a conversation we were having
Speaker 2: ten years ago that didn't get resolved and it hasn't changed,
Speaker 2: and I feel like she's still saying the same stuff
Speaker 2: from ten years ago, and no one around her was like, hey,
Speaker 2: here's how you approach it in a way that's going
Speaker 2: to get you who you are as a person.
Speaker 1: It just means not feeding the fire. Here's the comment.
Speaker 1: Like she's talks about her inability to not engage and
Speaker 1: in the Variety piece she quoted as saying, quote, it's
Speaker 1: something I'm trying to get better at. I'm gen z,
Speaker 1: I grew up online. I'm actively trying not to engage.
Speaker 1: Although how could you not? You just kind of have
Speaker 1: to not.
Speaker 2: I know that's the kind of stuff and it's hard,
Speaker 2: Like you need to have somebody whose job it is
Speaker 2: to tell her to not engage. You need a.
Speaker 1: Mental health someone needs to run your socials. You don't
Speaker 1: need to be doing at that level.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, Okay, I just wish, I wish that we were
Speaker 2: in a better time and space for this movie. I
Speaker 2: hope it comes out. I hope some cool shit is
Speaker 2: left in it, and I hope it does well or
Speaker 2: becomes a cult hit. But sadly, I don't think this
Speaker 2: is going to be a Captain Marvel for them, though
Speaker 2: that was not a movie I was particularly fond of,
Speaker 2: and ironically had a lot of similar issues early on
Speaker 2: in the press tour until they kind of reframed it.
Speaker 2: But yeah, like I just I'm really bummed about this one.
Speaker 2: But I also did try and tell people that the
Speaker 2: original book had many issues they would have to adapt
Speaker 2: away from, and I think that is also part of
Speaker 2: the problem.
Speaker 1: Let's take a quick break and we will do a
Speaker 1: speed run through the rest of the future of the DCU,
Speaker 1: and we are back. All right. Let's just quick quick
Speaker 1: hit some of the upcoming Slate Lanterns coming out August sixteenth.
Speaker 1: We've talked a lot about it. This looks great. Damon
Speaker 1: linlf adapting, Tom King, Aaron Pires, John Stewart, Kyle Chandler,
Speaker 1: is Hal Jordan, murder investigation in the American Heartland. Very
Speaker 1: excited the pitch is a buddy cop superhero show. Great
Speaker 1: love it. I think we're both very excited. Any other
Speaker 1: thoughts since the last time we talked about.
Speaker 2: It, Ben, it looks great. I'm really excited see how
Speaker 2: they bring in John Stewart's history as a lantern. I
Speaker 2: want to see it. Is it gonna be good? Is
Speaker 2: it gonna be bad? I don't know, but I'm excited
Speaker 2: to see where it goes. Also interesting because it was
Speaker 2: not one of the shows I thought would get made.
Speaker 2: They've been trying to make a green Land and show
Speaker 2: at Warner Brothers since the CW. I did not think
Speaker 2: this would be one that got made. The stuff that
Speaker 2: actually has got made and hasn't got made is very interesting.
Speaker 1: Let me ask you this, HM quickly. If Gun Saffron
Speaker 1: are more successful on TV than they are in the movies,
Speaker 1: consistently successful, well, will Warner Brothers view that as a positive,
Speaker 1: as a success or not.
Speaker 2: I think Warner Brothers will view it as leverage to
Speaker 2: offer them a different kind of deal. Hey, do you
Speaker 2: guys want to be in charge of our HBO superhero slate?
Speaker 2: You'll get an equivalent amount of money. It won't look
Speaker 2: like we're firing you, but also you are not in
Speaker 2: charge of movies, and I wonder if they're gonna let
Speaker 2: I don't know if this whole shared universe thing is
Speaker 2: going to keep continuing, because I do think every studio
Speaker 2: has struggled with it since Marvel. But I think that
Speaker 2: if they can bring ad revenue and subscribers, which I
Speaker 2: know has happened with previous James Gun stuff on TV,
Speaker 2: I do think an Emmy's like with the Penguin and stuff,
Speaker 2: I do think there's a potential for them there where
Speaker 2: it will be seen overall as a net positive. Even
Speaker 2: if the movies don't continue past what we already have,
Speaker 2: I think past Man of Tomorrow, everything's a question.
Speaker 1: I agree, Clayface.
Speaker 2: I want to see it.
Speaker 1: Very excited by the trailer forty million budget, forty million
Speaker 1: dollar budget, which is cheap for DC. Directed by James
Speaker 1: Watkins of Speak No Evil. It really feels like they're
Speaker 1: going for that kind of gritty horror type of the training,
Speaker 1: low budget type of movie that is, you know, very
Speaker 1: honestly one of the mainstays of the current box office reality.
Speaker 1: I'm I think I have nothing but excitement for this.
Speaker 2: Me too. The first poster they released, I thought I
Speaker 2: looked a bit CW, a little bit chintzy, but then
Speaker 2: that terrifying image that they chose to make the cover
Speaker 2: image and would pop up over social when the trailer
Speaker 2: came out and it was the bandaged face of Clayface
Speaker 2: was so haunting that I clicked on the trailer and
Speaker 2: was actually really surprised and personally, me and you have
Speaker 2: been asking for more movies like this where they just
Speaker 2: give them a more moderate budget and let them do
Speaker 2: something that they just try and throw at the wall
Speaker 2: and see if it sticks. And that's what DC used
Speaker 2: to do well. Moderate budget not so much, but I
Speaker 2: love that Sony just did this with Spider No Wirle,
Speaker 2: we saw something a little different. This looks like a
Speaker 2: total tone shift. I think this is where James Gun's
Speaker 2: Gun of Us has always been the best creature, Commando's Peacemaker,
Speaker 2: the weird shit. So I think Clayface is going to
Speaker 2: fit into that.
Speaker 1: Man of Tomorrow. July ninth, twenty twenty seven, James Gunn
Speaker 1: returns Rainy production.
Speaker 2: It looks like we've seen some.
Speaker 1: Pictures he's quoted as saying as much a lex movie
Speaker 1: as a Superman movie confirmed that a Rainiac played by
Speaker 1: Lars Eldinger is going to be in this, Rick Flagg Senior,
Speaker 1: Frank Grillo because graduating to the big time, and of
Speaker 1: course Corn Sweat, Nicholas Holt, Rachel Brosnahan returning, Millie Alcock
Speaker 1: as Supergirl will be in this. It appears filming is
Speaker 1: underway as of April twenty twenty six in Atlanta. So
Speaker 1: thoughts about this.
Speaker 2: Aaron Pier also going to be in it. I would
Speaker 2: love to see it. Thoughts about this? I thought so
Speaker 2: that was a good movie, but it is not. It
Speaker 2: does not inspire with me the same fuel and fire
Speaker 2: and passion of talking about say The Batman. I worry
Speaker 2: this will have a similar issue for me, where I'll
Speaker 2: enjoy it and be happy it exists, but doesn't hit
Speaker 2: in a masterpiece way. Though I will say we were
Speaker 2: right we called this that it was going to be
Speaker 2: a Lex and Superman having to team up kind of movie.
Speaker 2: I think we'll see Lex in the Power Suit. I
Speaker 2: loved Holt as Lex. I also think they have fun
Speaker 2: chemistry as a trio. If they want to also bring
Speaker 2: some Lowis into this, like is she interested in Lex's
Speaker 2: insane intelligence? Even though he's, you know, a dangerous man.
Speaker 2: Can they really trust lex? I do think one of
Speaker 2: James Gunn's issues with the first Superman movie a little
Speaker 2: bit too ambitious, too many characters. I worry it's gonna
Speaker 2: have the same issue. But I do think it's gonna
Speaker 2: be interesting, and who knows, maybe it will be a
Speaker 2: great sendoff for the gun of verse by that point,
Speaker 2: and if not, maybe it will be. If Supergirl pops
Speaker 2: and Lantern's pops. Maybe it's actually gonna be kind of
Speaker 2: the Phase two where it really pops off and could
Speaker 2: be the I think if if it goes badly, that
Speaker 2: will be the end. If it goes well, that's gonna
Speaker 2: be the launch pad for the next phase basically. But
Speaker 2: it feels fifty to fifty.
Speaker 1: Finally, I think we need to just I think we
Speaker 1: need to talk about the Paramount Skydance side of this
Speaker 1: Paramount skuyd Dance. I went by the Ellisons. David Ellison
Speaker 1: and his very rich father won the Warner Brothers bidding
Speaker 1: war Right eleven billion plus a bid deal close late
Speaker 1: twenty twenty six. Ellison says that he wants to keep
Speaker 1: creative teams. He didn't mention Gun and Saffaran a DC specifically,
Speaker 1: but we assume that that means them that you would
Speaker 1: include them in that. Puck has reported that Paramount may
Speaker 1: already be eyeing its own projects on top of what
Speaker 1: were slated by Warner Brothers in DC, which suggests that
Speaker 1: they may rest some control from the DCEU. And to
Speaker 1: our point, to our the point of our previous conversation
Speaker 1: about whether success on TV would equal success, I think
Speaker 1: that for Ellison, no, I think Ellison wants more movies.
Speaker 1: And what does that mean for James Gun. I think
Speaker 1: reading the tea leaves here mm hmm. Gun and Saffaran
Speaker 1: need hits.
Speaker 2: I'm saying they need big hits because also, I mean
Speaker 2: they need they need big hits. The Allison's aren't a
Speaker 2: medium thriller, like mid budget kind of hit family. They're
Speaker 2: a make us a billion dollars or will fire you family. Also,
Speaker 2: if we look at the history of Paramount, CBS, CBS
Speaker 2: all Access, you know, all the different stuff that they've
Speaker 2: done in that space. They have been desperate to expand
Speaker 2: out any popular ip they've had for their streaming services.
Speaker 2: So I do think the ability to have DC is huge.
Speaker 2: I also, I mean there was reports that came out
Speaker 2: a couple of months ago that David Ellison went and
Speaker 2: had a meeting at Warner Brothers, but it went so
Speaker 2: badly that all the execs like freaked out and it
Speaker 2: just was not a good fit. And I think that
Speaker 2: is the big question going forwards is can a corporate
Speaker 2: exec like David Ellison insinuate himself into a Hollywood studio
Speaker 2: like Warner Brothers that also encompasses things like comic book
Speaker 2: publishing and book publishing and you know, video games and
Speaker 2: all the shit. Or are they just gonna basically get
Speaker 2: swallowed up by the paramount machine and that legacy doesn't matter.
Speaker 2: That's what I think the issue is is like at
Speaker 2: some point now Allison's if the deal goes through, they're
Speaker 2: just gonna say do it our way. Right now, they
Speaker 2: have to play nice because the deal hasn't gone through.
Speaker 2: But I think we'll really see when the deal goes
Speaker 2: through what they want to do.
Speaker 1: I agree, And I think that to add on, there's
Speaker 1: been some reporting then in that first big Ellison meeting
Speaker 1: with the DC heads that that gun was not there.
Speaker 1: It's only Saffron. So you know, if that's the key,
Speaker 1: you know, there may be scheduling things.
Speaker 2: There may be and obviously Saffron is meant to be
Speaker 2: the business side.
Speaker 1: But still, yes, that said, I don't know that that's
Speaker 1: like a one hundred great harbinger for the future. And
Speaker 1: I think when you add to the fact that Ellison
Speaker 1: has said that he wants to put out like thirty
Speaker 1: films a year with obviously that's not all DC, but
Speaker 1: DC would be a huge cog of that. I think
Speaker 1: when you add that all with Superman that we loved.
Speaker 1: We loved it so much and the reviews were so
Speaker 1: good that I think we paper over that it didn't
Speaker 1: make that much money.
Speaker 2: And also it was just like we were so happy
Speaker 2: to have a little hopeful movie. Yeah, but it's not
Speaker 2: necessarily standing. I think even the cult like, even though
Speaker 2: I think it had a lot of interesting political things
Speaker 2: to say, James Gunn does not like to make concrete
Speaker 2: statements outside of the movie. He lets them speak for himself.
Speaker 2: I think that can sometimes dull a conversation or the impact.
Speaker 2: I would also say another we were right, guys, and
Speaker 2: this is why you know. I think you listened to
Speaker 2: Extra Vision, but when they announced this slate, please go
Speaker 2: back and listen to me and Jason tell you that
Speaker 2: like ninety percent of this shit was not gonna fucking
Speaker 2: get made. Like they announced this ten year slate and
Speaker 2: we knew Booster Gold was probably not gonna get made,
Speaker 2: though I've heard some very interesting rumors about who they
Speaker 2: were trying to cast for Booster Gold. Fingers crossed that
Speaker 2: still happens, Waller, that was supposed to be a TV show,
Speaker 2: We still haven't seen that. Paradise Lost still haven't seen
Speaker 2: that we had. There was gonna be a Blue Beetle
Speaker 2: animated series, a Teen Titans film, a Bane and Death
Speaker 2: Stroke film. There was gonna be the Jimmy Olsen spinoff series.
Speaker 2: We also had swamp thing that obviously I wanted to see,
Speaker 2: which was the James Mangold kind of dark southern one.
Speaker 2: We know that Tom King has allegedly been working on
Speaker 2: a Mister Miracle animated series, but I did see him
Speaker 2: give a very vague comment about that recently that made
Speaker 2: it sound like maybe that wasn't happening anymore. There was
Speaker 2: going to be a Wonder Woman movie like all of
Speaker 2: this stuff. Paradise Lost I heard, is still in production,
Speaker 2: which was meant to be their game of Thrones esque
Speaker 2: Thermoscaren thing. But so much of this stuff, guys, has
Speaker 2: not even kind of emerged. I think that's a problem
Speaker 2: because I think if they'd have been able to get
Speaker 2: more stuff into pre production, into production, names attached, get
Speaker 2: the excitement, that might have been able to keep the
Speaker 2: motion going to get some more of this stuff made.
Speaker 2: I wouldn't be surprise if the Ellisons are like, well,
Speaker 2: we could just bring in a bunch of people to
Speaker 2: make a bunch of cheap TV shows. You know. They,
Speaker 2: as Ian pointed out, they fumbled the streaming rights to
Speaker 2: Yellowstone when they gave them to Peacock, and they've kind
Speaker 2: of always been trying to make up for it. I
Speaker 2: feel like dc is just too much of an ip
Speaker 2: mind for them to not try and explode out of
Speaker 2: this really controlled vision of the DCU.
Speaker 1: One more thought experiment. So I think that h with
Speaker 1: all that we've laid out, I think Supergirl is a
Speaker 1: pivotal movie for Gun and Sea agree. I think if
Speaker 1: it's if it comes out soft, that's a disaster, not
Speaker 1: just from a wasted opportunity standpoint, but for the administration
Speaker 1: of Gun and Saffron. I think that could be not
Speaker 1: the end of them, but a significant hobbling of their vision.
Speaker 1: If you combine a soft opening of Super Supergirl with
Speaker 1: Batman two.
Speaker 2: Being huge, That's what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: I then wonder what happens to gun Saffarn going for.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because also as Ian, I just want to shout
Speaker 2: out as well did like absolutely stunning job on getting
Speaker 2: us just like a ton of facts and dates and stuff.
Speaker 2: He pointed out something that I didn't even find out,
Speaker 2: which is they And I think this is if I
Speaker 2: was James Gunn and Peter Saffred, I would never have
Speaker 2: signed this extension. I think get bodes that you are
Speaker 2: getting fired. I think it's very stressed. They extended them
Speaker 2: from November twenty twenty six, which is when it was
Speaker 2: meant to end the two year deal, to Spring twenty
Speaker 2: twenty seven.
Speaker 3: That's like a six month extension that basically is saying
Speaker 3: like that's like, does Supergirl make money?
Speaker 2: That's basically what's that's asking. And maybe the extension is
Speaker 2: does Supergirl make money for us when it goes on
Speaker 2: HBO Max at the end of the year, Because to me,
Speaker 2: that says, well, our extension is before or Batman comes out.
Speaker 2: So if the Batman too is ride and high. If
Speaker 2: I was Matt Reeves, I'm pushing to get a Batman
Speaker 2: two trailer played at San Diego Comic Con this year,
Speaker 2: like no question, even just a teaser.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: If that motion overtakes Superman all this other stuff, then
Speaker 2: I think in spring you're having a tough conversation. Now. Obviously,
Speaker 2: James Gun's fine that. I'm sure Marvel would be happy
Speaker 2: to invite him back, like they were happy to invite
Speaker 2: back the Russo's also Peter Saffran, a legendary producer. I'm
Speaker 2: sure he's still gonna be on there. These guys are rich,
Speaker 2: beyond the wildest dreams. They're gonna be fine. I think
Speaker 2: that it was an interesting thing to try, but so
Speaker 2: far I do not think the experiment is is proven
Speaker 2: to be successful.
Speaker 1: I agree, and I have one more. I have a prediction.
Speaker 2: Okay, I love it.
Speaker 1: I think this is what David Ellison will do and
Speaker 1: what he wants to do. I think he looks at
Speaker 1: this is a guy who loves big at movies, big director,
Speaker 1: big star, big box office. I think he looks at
Speaker 1: the Nolan Batman's and he says, there, I want Quentin Tarantino,
Speaker 1: you're doing a Green Lantern movie. I want Christopher Nolan
Speaker 1: back in the fold. You know who?
Speaker 2: How much do I want st Yes?
Speaker 1: I want Steven Spielberg doing a Justice League movie. This
Speaker 1: is how this guy will think, yes, and I think
Speaker 1: that is the way he's gonna go. I think that's
Speaker 1: what he's gonna do. Scott, you know, doing Hawkman exactly,
Speaker 1: and it's gonna be really racist because he hates hates
Speaker 1: people called Mohammad no I.
Speaker 2: I think you're one hundred percent right. I think post
Speaker 2: Disclosure Day, which you are going to be talking about
Speaker 2: a lot, the screenings have just started to come out.
Speaker 2: People saw the premiere Social Embargo is allowed. It's getting
Speaker 2: pure five stars. I think that's your most legit and
Speaker 2: out there but could come true prediction. I think if
Speaker 2: Disclosure makes five hundred mill or more, Ellison is going
Speaker 2: for Spielbug to do uh Spielbug's Superman. I mean it's
Speaker 2: meant to be like it's it's it's simple, it's ambling,
Speaker 2: it's everything. I think you're right, he's gonna go for
Speaker 2: those big bucks guys. How much money do you have
Speaker 2: to get Christopher Nolan to come back and do.
Speaker 3: A full faint. I don't fucking want it. I don't
Speaker 3: think it's that much.
Speaker 1: I don't think there's a number. Actually, I think that
Speaker 1: Christopher Nolan would not come I think that I would
Speaker 1: unless the Ellison's buy all the other studios. Like I
Speaker 1: was gonna say, I don't know that Nolan would willingly
Speaker 1: come back. Okay, well, DC, we are are, We're hopefully things.
Speaker 1: We're rooting for you. This is I think we both agree,
Speaker 1: as you put it, an ip mind that has not
Speaker 1: been successfully or efficiently mined in the past, and we
Speaker 1: hope that can change because there's so many great stories
Speaker 1: and great characters and great things here. Mm hmm, and
Speaker 1: we're rooting for you. On the next episode of Extra Vision,
Speaker 1: we're diving into Disclosure Day and news. That's it for
Speaker 1: this episode. Next for listening. X ray Vision is hosted
Speaker 1: by Jason steps Young and Rosie Night and is a
Speaker 1: production of iHeart Podcasts.
Speaker 2: Our executive producers are Joel Monique and Aaron Kaufman.
Speaker 1: Our supervising producer is Abu Zafar.
Speaker 2: Our producers are Common Laurent Dean Jonathan, and Bay wag.
Speaker 1: Our theme song is by Brian Vasquez with alternate theme
Speaker 1: songs by Aaron Kaufman.
Speaker 2: Special thanks to Soul Rubin, Chris Lord, Kenny Goodman, and
Speaker 2: Heidi our discord moderator,