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Speaker 1: Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray.

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Speaker 1: It's ready. Are you welcome to Stump Mom never told you?

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Speaker 1: From House Step Works dot Com. Hello, and welcome to

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Speaker 1: the podcast. I'm Kristen and I'm Molly and Molly. Today

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Speaker 1: is a very special day. The Day of recordments the dayners. Today.

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Speaker 1: We gotta wish happy birthday to a very special news anchor.

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Speaker 1: And I'm not talking about Silver Fox Anderson Cooper. I

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Speaker 1: see three six day. It's Brian Williams's birthday. Brian Williams.

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Speaker 1: I gotta say, is my favorite. I know you're supposed

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Speaker 1: to be objective and due hid your biases that I

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Speaker 1: want to hang out with Brian Williams. I just want

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Speaker 1: to like, drink a beer and do the Crossford with them,

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Speaker 1: is what I told Kristin Earlio and thirty Rock with him. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'll wait in the green room. Why does the Daily Show? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean I just want to hang out. Let's go

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Speaker 1: get Chinese food Brian Williams. But what about what if

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Speaker 1: Katie Kirk was like, Hey, I'll hang out with you instead.

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Speaker 1: I make so much money, we can do lots of

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Speaker 1: things that money to people do. I mean, I wouldn't

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Speaker 1: turn down an opportunity like that, but I gotta say

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Speaker 1: Brian Wims is where it's at for me. And I've

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Speaker 1: kind of been grappling with that because today is the

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Speaker 1: second part of our Women in Journalism Spectacular, and today

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Speaker 1: we're talking about anchors and all the news about anchors,

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Speaker 1: and particularly in UH six pm, six at pm depending

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Speaker 1: on where you live UH national news time slot, all

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Speaker 1: the nieces about Katie KERRK. Yeah. I feel like someone there.

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Speaker 1: There reporters out there who are as signed to a

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Speaker 1: Katie Kirk beat any any change in any contract clause.

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Speaker 1: This woman has somehow makes it to the top of

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Speaker 1: the news feed and I find it fascinating. Um because

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Speaker 1: she broke a significant barrier. She became of the first

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Speaker 1: woman to solo host Yes UH the National News, as

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Speaker 1: opposed to Connie Chung, who did a duel hosting with

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Speaker 1: Peter Jennings. Walters also did co host YES from nine

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Speaker 1: to nine b walt b Well be Waltz, she co hosted,

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Speaker 1: but Katie was solo, flying solo, and if you remember

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Speaker 1: those months before she took the anchor chair, the speculation

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Speaker 1: was at a fever pitch. I mean, what is she

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Speaker 1: going to do with that? I don't want to overstate it, Kristen,

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Speaker 1: but it kind of remember reminded me of some royal

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Speaker 1: wedding coverage. It was like, what is she gonna wear?

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Speaker 1: Will be able to see her legs? Is she gonna

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Speaker 1: be as perky as she is on the Today shore?

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Speaker 1: Will she be more sober when she's reporting really sad news?

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Speaker 1: You know? Will she do interviews? Well? We will she

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Speaker 1: make pancakes? Yeah? It was crazy because people were just saying,

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Speaker 1: this is an iconic moment for women as a whole.

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Speaker 1: I didn't realize it was until the papers told me

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Speaker 1: that this woman, for the first time was taking on

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Speaker 1: a position that was very male, very white, and fairly old.

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Speaker 1: And you know, Katie Kirk, you know, related some of

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Speaker 1: the other people, not Brian Williams, of course, it was

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Speaker 1: much younger and other people who told the chair so was.

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Speaker 1: You know, she became the symbol that everyone had to

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Speaker 1: project everything onto. And now that the news has come

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Speaker 1: that she's stepping down, everyone's in it tizzy like what

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Speaker 1: does this mean for women? Sure, we've had Diane Sawyer

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Speaker 1: take the start and take the chair in the meantime.

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Speaker 1: But what does it mean that Katie Kurtt couldn't make

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Speaker 1: this work and that she was the third rated newscast

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Speaker 1: And what does it all mean from women? And who's

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Speaker 1: taking over? A man? Scott Scott Pelleys. How you say

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Speaker 1: his last name, Pelly? I think so, um, yeah, he's

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Speaker 1: he's taking over and and a fine gent at that.

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Speaker 1: Nothing nothing Scotty. But I just want to know why

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Speaker 1: we get so in in such a tizzy, in such

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Speaker 1: a whirligig about who's sitting at the news desk at NBC,

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Speaker 1: ABC and CBS. Because when it comes to local news stations,

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Speaker 1: the question we posted with this podcast episode is where

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Speaker 1: the women anchors? Answer? Everywhere? Yeah, they're everywhere where except

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Speaker 1: those three chairs, and now they were in two of

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Speaker 1: them probably a long time. But yeah, in Atlanta, I

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Speaker 1: mean we've got Monica Kaufman, Javita More, they're just women

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Speaker 1: coming out the wazoo. I grew up with a female

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Speaker 1: news anchor like this wouldn't have if you had had

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Speaker 1: me list off the you know, top five professions I

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Speaker 1: could think of where women were always there local news reporter,

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Speaker 1: news anchor and and so yeah, and and that's what

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Speaker 1: The Washington Post highlighted in a two thousand six pieces

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Speaker 1: that every audition tape that network managers get for on

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Speaker 1: air talent, it's all women. It's a lot of ladies.

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Speaker 1: And I got some more stats to throw at you.

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Speaker 1: Here we go where the women anchors locally, they're there

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Speaker 1: because fifty seven percent of the positions UM in nationwide survey,

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Speaker 1: it's all women. Women account for more than half of

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Speaker 1: TV reporters, half of middle managers and executive producers, news producers,

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Speaker 1: and news writers. Now when we come to news directors,

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Speaker 1: then we get a little more male skewed. But it's

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Speaker 1: a lot of gals out there. And it might be

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Speaker 1: because two thirds of the bachelor's degrees in journalism and

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Speaker 1: mass com are going to the ladies well. And it

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Speaker 1: also might be, according to The Washington Post, that news

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Speaker 1: anchor is not the um, you know, landmark job that

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Speaker 1: it used to be. UM. If you're local, you may

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Speaker 1: not be paid very much. People are saying thousand dollars,

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Speaker 1: people are saying. The men are just kind of saying

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Speaker 1: that this is not the career path to choose. There

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Speaker 1: are better and more lucrative ways to make money in journalism.

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Speaker 1: But and that, and that's try on the local thing.

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Speaker 1: I mean maybe that's why the local men are opting out.

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Speaker 1: But on the national scale, it's just you can't get

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Speaker 1: away from these big three seats and and why women

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Speaker 1: are in them are not in them. Yeah, And obviously,

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Speaker 1: since we talked about money the main networks, obviously we'll

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Speaker 1: bring you a lot more cash. For instance, Mss Barbara

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Speaker 1: Walters the Waltz made broadcast history in nineteen seventy six

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Speaker 1: when she inked a million dollar deal with ABC. And

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Speaker 1: you know, to bring up Barbara Walters, you still see

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Speaker 1: Barbara Walters everywhere on television. She's on the view, she sewenty.

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Speaker 1: People might be confused about why this is an issue

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Speaker 1: because if you watch you know, sixty minutes, you watch

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Speaker 1: um MSNBC, Good Morning Fox or a morning show, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you see women everywhere. There's always a co host whose

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Speaker 1: female or UM they anchor their own shows like the

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Speaker 1: Rachel Matt aw Show. UM And some people are like, oh,

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Speaker 1: you see plenty of women reading the news, but people

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Speaker 1: keep separating out this thirty minute national news slot. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: in terms of like news magazine's morning shows, and those

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Speaker 1: things make more money for the networks than the national

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Speaker 1: news do. In terms of those, I think women are

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Speaker 1: still representable and making some pretty cool strides. There was

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Speaker 1: a good article by Rebecca Tracer about how the two

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Speaker 1: thousand and eight election in which we had Hillary Clinton

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Speaker 1: and Sarah Palin really allowed women to shine because, um,

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Speaker 1: you know, sometimes they talk about how when Charlie Gibson

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Speaker 1: interviewed Sarah Palin, for example, it came across as very

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Speaker 1: condescending and male bullying a woman, whereas when it was

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Speaker 1: Katie Kirk, they're saying that, you know, while the outcome

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Speaker 1: may not have been very good for Sarah Palin, that

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Speaker 1: was the famous um what newspaper do you read interview? Um,

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Speaker 1: you know it didn't. It came across as two women

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Speaker 1: talking and sparring, as opposed to like a sexist battle.

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Speaker 1: So saying that, you know, having women in the election

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Speaker 1: gave these female replayers a chance to shine on television,

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Speaker 1: Or when Campbell Brown said, hey, we need to stop

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Speaker 1: talking about what Hillary Clinton Sarah Palin are wearing, because

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Speaker 1: we're not talking about how much you know Barack Obama's suits,

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Speaker 1: got right. But this issue with women in the anchor

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Speaker 1: seat in the networks not. We We've answered a question

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Speaker 1: of where they are, and they're all in the local

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Speaker 1: seats and that seems a okay. But in the network seats,

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Speaker 1: this G word comes up over and over and over again.

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Speaker 1: And I did not have time to go back and

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Speaker 1: trace the history of it. But Molly, can you please

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Speaker 1: let our fair listeners know what women don't have that

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Speaker 1: they need in order to anchor CBS, NBC or ABC

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Speaker 1: Evening News. The G word is garve TOAs And Uh,

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Speaker 1: this was the big question that came across when kay

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Speaker 1: Kirk was going to take over CBS. Katie Kirk had

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Speaker 1: done The Today Show and was known for being perky.

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Speaker 1: You know, someone who could wake you up at seven

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Speaker 1: am with you know you guys, little cup, a cup

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Speaker 1: of coffee, a little java. But they're saying that be

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Speaker 1: in that anchor seat, you've got to have gravy tasks.

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Speaker 1: You've got to have this ability to be solemn and

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Speaker 1: serious and to command authority. Uh. When new strikes, people

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Speaker 1: often talk about, like that Walter Cronkite moment where he

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Speaker 1: announced that JFK was dead, that that person you can

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Speaker 1: turn to when the world turns upside down. People are

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Speaker 1: saying that women don't have that authority yet, that they

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Speaker 1: do not have the gravy TOAs to anchor you know,

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Speaker 1: a nine eleven or you know, just this past week

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Speaker 1: we had the death of theo some of Bi Laton,

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Speaker 1: and they're saying that if people turn on the television,

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Speaker 1: you know, you think back in the old days, you

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Speaker 1: turn on the television. Peter Jenks was there and that

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Speaker 1: was reassuring. It was reassuring to me last week when

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Speaker 1: I saw Brian Williams talking about of Samon bin Laden.

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Speaker 1: But they're saying that people by and large are not

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Speaker 1: ready to have a woman tell them that we've gone

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Speaker 1: to war or you know, we've been attacked or something

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Speaker 1: like that, and that'll be and we can't answer the question.

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Speaker 1: But that's what tons of analysts tried to do. But see,

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Speaker 1: that's such bunk because in our last episode on women Reporters,

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Speaker 1: we pointed out how editors broadcast especially love to have

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Speaker 1: women out in the field in combat zones. A pretty woman,

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Speaker 1: a pretty woman in a flak jacket. Yeah, great for ratings. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: In fact, you know, kind of on a side note,

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Speaker 1: they did this really funny study about sexy anchors and uh,

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Speaker 1: Fox news. Um. It was this study where they had

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Speaker 1: a really beautiful anchor in a really tight uh you

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Speaker 1: jacket and a really low cut, like you know, top

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Speaker 1: reading the news versus one who was very buttoned up

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Speaker 1: and um, no skin showing or whatsoever. And they asked

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Speaker 1: the men, uh, recall questions about what they've just heard

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Speaker 1: on the news, and when the when the sexy anchor

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Speaker 1: read the news, the men remember none of it. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And when the plane Jane read the news, they were

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Speaker 1: all like, I remember everything she said. So yeah. I

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Speaker 1: mean a lot of people probably locally too. That's probably

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Speaker 1: why they've gotten you know, so so ingrained in our

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Speaker 1: in our news uh fabric is you know, pretty women

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Speaker 1: get viewers except the national news. Yeah. And one interesting

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Speaker 1: story we haven't talked about yet is Diane Sawyer, who

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Speaker 1: is often overshadowed by Katie Kirk. I don't understand why

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Speaker 1: that is. Way. It was great, um, and I know

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Speaker 1: I'm not the only one who feels that way, but

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Speaker 1: she she had an interesting story because she was um

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Speaker 1: looked over for the ABC chair and her Good Morning

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Speaker 1: America co host Earles Gibson got it instead. Yeah. But

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Speaker 1: you know, we found this really interesting New York Times

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Speaker 1: are well from two thousand two. Um, it was right

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Speaker 1: after they named Brian Williams to take over her Tom Brokaw,

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Speaker 1: And there are a few quotes in there from Diane

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Speaker 1: Sawyer where she kind of makes it sound like she

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Speaker 1: doesn't want the job. She's very demure, like you know.

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Speaker 1: It kind of brings up other issues about women in

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Speaker 1: the workplace and whether they bargained hard enough for that promotion,

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Speaker 1: because reading these quotes, it was sort of like, Oh,

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Speaker 1: you don't really want this, do you, Diane, or do

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Speaker 1: you like you know, I feel like she was someone

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Speaker 1: who just kind of waited her turn, whereas I think

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Speaker 1: Katie went forward and said, I'm going to break this barrier. So,

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Speaker 1: I mean, that's the question I have to ask in

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Speaker 1: I do think Diane's kind of an interesting case because

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Speaker 1: even though she too was coming from Good Morning America

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Speaker 1: a morning show. Uh. Now, speaking of breaking barriers, Molly,

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Speaker 1: we've been talking about a lot of white people. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the news is very white. It's extremely why on broadcast news, well,

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Speaker 1: at least network wise. I think when you get down

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Speaker 1: to the local level, you get some more diversity. But um,

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Speaker 1: when we were going over all of this, I thought

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Speaker 1: it was it was almost comical to a point where

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Speaker 1: Because the question isn't necessarily where all these women? But

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Speaker 1: what's up with all these white people? It's a sea

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Speaker 1: of white people. And in terms of breaking barriers. The

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Speaker 1: one historical anecdote that I would like to share, um,

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Speaker 1: an ABC news show and she took over for a

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Speaker 1: during the time. They brought in Melba. And I just

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Speaker 1: love the story because the name of the news show

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Speaker 1: that she anchored was called News with a Woman's Touch.

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Speaker 1: Oh man, I can't believe that title is taken. I

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Speaker 1: could have made magic with that title. I try to

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Speaker 1: find it on YouTube. If anyone can find a clip

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Speaker 1: from News with a Woman's Touch, please send it our way,

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Speaker 1: Moms of the House of Works dot com, because I

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Speaker 1: really want to see it. But yeah, Melboe Tolliver, she's

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Speaker 1: breaking some barriers, all right. So you know, if we've

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Speaker 1: got diversity to some degree on the local scale, and

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Speaker 1: we definitely have women representing on the local scale, I

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Speaker 1: do think it'll be interesting to see what happens on

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Speaker 1: the national scale in like a generation, because one point

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Speaker 1: that was made in the two thousand two New York

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Speaker 1: Times piece is that when they're looking for these male

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Speaker 1: anchors to take on the national news, the men are

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Speaker 1: the ones who've been there for generation, for decades. You know,

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Speaker 1: women are a little bit behind in the broadcast news

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Speaker 1: because there was a big stereotype in like the seventies

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Speaker 1: and sixties that a woman just couldn't read the news,

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Speaker 1: and we overcame that where now they're on the local.

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Speaker 1: So it'll be interesting to see it happens in a generation.

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Speaker 1: But the question has to be asked, will it matter

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Speaker 1: in a generation? And not even in a generation? Well

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Speaker 1: right now, is it even mad Utter who is anchoring

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Speaker 1: our network news at night? Because here we go, kids,

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Speaker 1: here's here's the bad news, all right? The and this

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Speaker 1: is from Slate and I believe this is from this year.

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Speaker 1: This was on the news set that Kirk was leaving

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Speaker 1: CBS Evening News, the evening news programs that the three

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Speaker 1: commercial broadcast networks have lost. Here it is kids fifty

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Speaker 1: five point five percent of their audience since nineteen uh

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Speaker 1: so's gonna have it? Yeah? Who? I mean, who watches it?

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Speaker 1: With the internet? If you can get your news right there,

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Speaker 1: are you going to make an appointment to be in

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Speaker 1: front of your TV at six or six thirty or

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Speaker 1: seven or we just look on the internet. Well, and

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Speaker 1: it's not just the Internet, it's it's also I think

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Speaker 1: eyeballs have shifted from maybe the evening news test to

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Speaker 1: more primetime news magazines like the Rachel Maddow Show or

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Speaker 1: John Stewart or John Stewart comedy show. It's technically comedy,

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Speaker 1: but a lot of people consider their news source. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: it'll be interesting to see if these shows eventually die out.

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Speaker 1: But I mean, every time you talk about them dying out,

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Speaker 1: someone does show that clip of Walter Cronkite as this

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Speaker 1: epitome of what a country needs when something goes down.

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Speaker 1: So I think it'll be interesting to see because you know,

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Speaker 1: the question was raised if these shows will disappear um

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Speaker 1: or if they have lost their entire prestige as something

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Speaker 1: that is must must see viewing every day. You know,

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Speaker 1: doesn't matter if a woman gets the job or well

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Speaker 1: women finally you know, anchor all three seats, but no

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Speaker 1: one will care because we don't watch the evening news.

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Speaker 1: So it's something to watch, Yeah, to watch indeed, So

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Speaker 1: let us know what you think doesn't doesn't matter. Um,

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Speaker 1: would you rather hang out with Kenny Kirker Brian Williams.

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Speaker 1: I don't know, really anything, you know, it comes down

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Speaker 1: to person. I mean, you know, we make generalizations, but

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Speaker 1: it's not that I am a bad feminist. I just

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Speaker 1: prefer brann And and I don't think it's because he's

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Speaker 1: a man. It's because he's so funny. It's okay, just

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Speaker 1: get a little worked up in here. So in the meantime,

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Speaker 1: let's read a couple of letters. I have one hair

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Speaker 1: from Michael and it's on an oldie but goodie uh

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Speaker 1: episode on female superheroes and it's never too late to

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Speaker 1: send in a thought. On some of our episodes, people

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Speaker 1: sometimes start up their emails like, hope this isn't too late.

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Speaker 1: It's never too late about superheroes, and Michael writes the

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Speaker 1: one superheroine slash of villain you didn't talk about was

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Speaker 1: Marvel's Embra Frost or White Queen. She started out as

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Speaker 1: a villain and she used her looks and telepathy to

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Speaker 1: get head in life because she knew she had power

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Speaker 1: over males and she felt no qualms and using it

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Speaker 1: as such. She's very self assured, and she even managed

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Speaker 1: to work her way to the chap of an elite,

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Speaker 1: mostly male dominated club. Eventually she ended up getting another superpower.

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Speaker 1: She can turn her body into a flexible organic diamond.

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Speaker 1: Emma is nearly nearly always shown a self assured and

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Speaker 1: she really doesn't need a man, but she likes to

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Speaker 1: keep them around. Now, I'm not saying she should be

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Speaker 1: a role model for young girls because she's notorious savain

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Speaker 1: and she all just so dresses and lauentree and plauts

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Speaker 1: her body and receives criticisms because of it. But all

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Speaker 1: too often she's overlooked. But she's a interesting character with

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Speaker 1: a very deep struggle about being good. She often tries,

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Speaker 1: but every time she does, she stays with her evil demons.

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Speaker 1: And she's extremely fun because she has a very sharp

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Speaker 1: and often binding wit. And I just will say myself.

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Speaker 1: This is what Michael wrote. But I don't think that's

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Speaker 1: the first email we've we've read about Emma Frost. But

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Speaker 1: I would say that since that episode came out, she's

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Speaker 1: the number one lady cited in terms of the female

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Speaker 1: super Pow podcast. Today. Well, I've got an email here,

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Speaker 1: also from an older episode. This was on our female

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Speaker 1: screenwriters and playwrights and Oscar episodes, a lot of episodes actually.

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Speaker 1: So this is from Sasha and she is an aspiring

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Speaker 1: screenwriter moving up the ranks. She says that the lack

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Speaker 1: of representation of women in the industry, especially for kids,

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Speaker 1: really is appalling, and she shares a couple of anecdotes.

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Speaker 1: After college, I was interviewed for a job at a

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Speaker 1: production company that focuses on developing kids TV shows. I

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Speaker 1: was so excited because I'm really interested in all that

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Speaker 1: wonderful stuff. And in my interview, though, the head of

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Speaker 1: their development department laid it out on the table, no

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Speaker 1: one wants TV shows for girls. Girls don't watch shows

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Speaker 1: for girls, boys don't watch shows for for girls. The

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Speaker 1: channels that only only by shows that are either gender

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Speaker 1: neutral or for boys. He blamed it on young girls

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Speaker 1: watching shows above their age groups because they mature so early.

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Speaker 1: But I don't buy it. I think it's easier to

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Speaker 1: buy and sell shows for boys, and so they do that,

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Speaker 1: perpetuating disbelief that girls don't watch age oriented TV, which

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Speaker 1: is just ridiculous. And she also shares that I've had

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Speaker 1: two writing jobs where the producer asked to read one

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Speaker 1: of my scripts. While they both enjoyed my script and

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Speaker 1: thought it was real written, they both told me the

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Speaker 1: same thing. No one is going to want to buy

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Speaker 1: a script about a mom and a daughter and it's good,

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Speaker 1: but there are too many women in it. The script

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Speaker 1: is a comedy and has at fifty women men ratio

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Speaker 1: in terms of characters. Both the producers were men, And

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Speaker 1: it's tough hear in comments like that when you're first

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Speaker 1: starting out, and I have no doubt that some lady

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Speaker 1: writers came to that kind of pressure. No worries, though,

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Speaker 1: I'm going to keep using on ladies need a voice

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Speaker 1: and I'm going to write with it. And three cheers

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Speaker 1: for you, Sasha and all of our other aspiring professionals

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Speaker 1: both male and female, out in the audience. So if

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Speaker 1: you have any thoughts to send our way again. Our

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Speaker 1: email addresses mom stuff at how stuff works dot com.

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Speaker 1: We'd love for you to like us on Facebook and

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Speaker 1: follow us on Twitter. Our handle there is at mom

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Speaker 1: stuff podcast. And finally, why don't you read what we're

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Speaker 1: doing during the week on our blog It's stuff Mom

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Speaker 1: Never told You from how stuff works dot com. Be

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Speaker 1: sure to check out our new video podcast, Stuff from

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Speaker 1: the Future. Join how Stuff Work staff as we explore

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Speaker 1: the most promising and perplexing possibilities of tomorrow. The How

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Speaker 1: Stuff Works iPhone app has arrived. Download it today on iTunes,

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