WEBVTT - #thisleague UNCUT: What really happened in Milwaukee

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<v Speaker 1>A deep dive on the sudden coaching change in Milwaukee

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<v Speaker 1>Adrian Griffin, Doc Rivers, all things Bucks. We will get

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<v Speaker 1>into that, as well as some talk about the All

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<v Speaker 1>Star starters and pizza. All that to come next here

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<v Speaker 1>on this League Uncut.

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<v Speaker 2>Welcome to this League uncut.

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<v Speaker 1>Can you rule a twenty four hour NBA news?

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<v Speaker 2>This's you'll, Chris Haynes, it's time, Mark Stein, It's so time.

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<v Speaker 2>This League Uncut is underway and on fire.

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<v Speaker 1>This should be a good one. Hey, everyone, welcome into

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<v Speaker 1>the latest edition of This League Uncut. Mark Stein here

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<v Speaker 1>with Chris Haynes. We are recording on Thursday night. It's

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<v Speaker 1>our first chance to connect Chris and I a wild

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<v Speaker 1>Tuesday night in the Association. Tuesday, of course, Chris was

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<v Speaker 1>working the sidelines for Clippers at Lakers in the Los

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<v Speaker 1>Angeles Darby Except. Earlier Tuesday, the whole NBA was rocked

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<v Speaker 1>by the news that the Milwaukee Bucks abruptly dismissed first

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<v Speaker 1>year coach Adrian Griffin. It took them another day roughly

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<v Speaker 1>to hash out a deal with Doc Rivers to take

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<v Speaker 1>over as the Bucks' new coach. We've talked a ton

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<v Speaker 1>about the Bucks this season, but we really got to

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<v Speaker 1>get into this now because this one was again a

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<v Speaker 1>pretty seismic story in the NBA. We've since seen another

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<v Speaker 1>coaching change. On Thursday, Washington announced that Wes Unsel Junior

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<v Speaker 1>is going to be moving into a front office role.

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<v Speaker 1>Brian Keith has been handed the interim coaching title with

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<v Speaker 1>the Wizards, But the first coaching change of the season

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<v Speaker 1>happens with a team that was thirty and thirteen at

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<v Speaker 1>the time of the move, only the Cleveland Cavaliers with

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<v Speaker 1>David Blatt eight years and a day earlier. Who will

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<v Speaker 1>forget the Cavaliers ousting David Blatt and replacing him with

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<v Speaker 1>Tearan Lu halfway through a season that saw the Cavaliers

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<v Speaker 1>go all the way to the championship and from three

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<v Speaker 1>to one down in the finals, erase the Cleveland curse

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<v Speaker 1>that had lasted more than fifty years, the Cavs coming

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<v Speaker 1>from three to one down under Tylu to win the

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<v Speaker 1>first and only championship in franchise history in twenty sixteen.

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<v Speaker 1>Chris Haynes, you know the Bucks as well as anyone,

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<v Speaker 1>So gotta get your reaction, your insight here, because look,

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<v Speaker 1>we've talked about it a bazillion times on this show.

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<v Speaker 1>We've been talking about it since October, since Terry Stotts

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<v Speaker 1>abruptly left the coaching staff before we even got to

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<v Speaker 1>opening night. But even with all the tumult and as

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<v Speaker 1>often as we've talked about the Bucks and what they've

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<v Speaker 1>been going through this season, there was still a huge

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<v Speaker 1>part of me that I didn't think we were going

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<v Speaker 1>to see an in season coaching changed. Maybe I was

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<v Speaker 1>too naive. Tell me where I misread.

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<v Speaker 2>Things, Well, you weren't. You were not alone. I was

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<v Speaker 2>a little bit naive as well. But I will say

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<v Speaker 2>that I was here in the last couple of weeks.

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<v Speaker 2>I was hearing something could go down. I didn't take

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<v Speaker 2>it seriously. The reason I didn't take it seriously, and

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<v Speaker 2>maybe I should have. But listen, let me tell you

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<v Speaker 2>stein you brought up. Excuse me, Prince, my dog is

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<v Speaker 2>making an appearance. He's barking at somebody back there in

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<v Speaker 2>my yard.

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<v Speaker 1>Prince cannot believe we're talking about the Bucks again.

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<v Speaker 2>So Stott, I was covering that. I was the beat

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<v Speaker 2>writer for that Cass team when they ousted Black in January,

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<v Speaker 2>and they had a good record at the time too.

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<v Speaker 2>The Cass so this is similar, very similar. But I

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<v Speaker 2>will say yes, I was hearing things last few weeks

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<v Speaker 2>of Adrian Griffin's tenure with the Bucks, and I didn't

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<v Speaker 2>believe it. The reason why I didn't believe it or

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<v Speaker 2>take it seriously was they were already paying coach Bootonholzer,

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<v Speaker 2>who I think is making around eight million a year.

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<v Speaker 2>I think he has a few years left on his deal,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, then Adrian Griffin's salary. Then I was like,

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<v Speaker 2>they will, they would, they would hire I was thinking

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<v Speaker 2>to myself, they would hire another head coach, because I

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<v Speaker 2>was thinking like, if they did hire another head coach,

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<v Speaker 2>it would have to be a high profile coach. You're

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<v Speaker 2>not making a I'm not gonna say a mistake, but

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<v Speaker 2>you're not going in that same direction of hiring a

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<v Speaker 2>someone who's probably inexperience to high level players. So it

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<v Speaker 2>had to be another a high profile coach, and then

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<v Speaker 2>you have to pay him a high profile salary. So

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<v Speaker 2>I'm like, they would pay three head coaches at the

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<v Speaker 2>same time. I just didn't think that would happen. Well,

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<v Speaker 2>it happened, and what I was being told and all

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<v Speaker 2>the signs I would hear turned out to be accurate.

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<v Speaker 2>So I say all that to say this is that

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<v Speaker 2>it was explained to me because I didn't understand the move.

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<v Speaker 2>It was explained to me that when they hire Adrian

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<v Speaker 2>Griffin Stein, you can tell me what you heard as well.

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<v Speaker 2>When they hire Adrine Griffin. They didn't know at the time.

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<v Speaker 2>Remember that was a higher in June of twenty twenty three.

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<v Speaker 2>They did not know if they were going to bring

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<v Speaker 2>back Chris Middleton. He was going to be a free agent,

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<v Speaker 2>he had that option. They didn't know if brook Lopez

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<v Speaker 2>was going to resign. They didn't know what Giannis was

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<v Speaker 2>gonna do, you know, he they didn't know if he

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<v Speaker 2>was going to sign an extension. And then he remember

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<v Speaker 2>Gianni's making you know, he had some comments and certain

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<v Speaker 2>articles out there about you know, I could win here,

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<v Speaker 2>I could win elsewhere. It's like you just didn't know

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<v Speaker 2>where he was leaning towards, pretending to his future. So

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<v Speaker 2>they felt very comfortable at the time hiring asan Griffin,

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<v Speaker 2>somebody who hadn't been a head coach yet in the NBA.

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<v Speaker 2>And then when they had the opportunity to trade for

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<v Speaker 2>Dame and they did, they that you know, that changed

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<v Speaker 2>things now, so that That's the explanation that was told

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<v Speaker 2>to me. Things changed and they got Dame, and throughout

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<v Speaker 2>this four month's tenure that Griffin had as actually being

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<v Speaker 2>as actually coaching, there was just there was disconnect. There

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<v Speaker 2>was you know, I did go as far as to

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<v Speaker 2>say that I believe he lost the locker room at

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<v Speaker 2>one point. I think Griffin would be a really good coach.

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<v Speaker 2>He didn't sign up for. What he signed up for

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<v Speaker 2>is not what he had at the latter ends of

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<v Speaker 2>his tenure here with the Bucks, and so bestides hear

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<v Speaker 2>me out. So I told you how it was explained

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<v Speaker 2>to me as far as the rationale and what happened

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<v Speaker 2>along the way. But you can make the argument that

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<v Speaker 2>even if you didn't know what was going to happen

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<v Speaker 2>with all those players, you know, you still got Yiannis

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<v Speaker 2>locked up for a few years, and if you still

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<v Speaker 2>got Jans, you still got jew Holliday. You're still expected

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<v Speaker 2>to compete for a championship, right, So I get that

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<v Speaker 2>the team is probably a little bit more high profile now,

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<v Speaker 2>the expections are a little bit higher, but you're still

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<v Speaker 2>expected to compete for a championship. I'm just telling everybody,

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<v Speaker 2>how was explained to me as far as the rationale

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<v Speaker 2>of why they hired him, hired him and why they

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<v Speaker 2>fired them, and you can read it to it how

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<v Speaker 2>you feel. What's your tam, sir.

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<v Speaker 1>The David Blat Calves can could make that argument because

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<v Speaker 1>the David Black, you know, David Blatt got that job

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<v Speaker 1>before Lebron James said he was coming back to Cleveland,

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<v Speaker 1>before the Cleveland Cavaliers brought in Kevin Love to join

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<v Speaker 1>Lebron James and Kyrie Irving. In the David Blat scenario,

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<v Speaker 1>it really was a different team from what Blat was

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<v Speaker 1>hired to coach and what the Calves became. The Bucks,

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<v Speaker 1>to me, cannot make that argument. I'm sorry because you

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<v Speaker 1>said it. It doesn't matter if they didn't know Middleton

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<v Speaker 1>was resigning, if they didn't know brook Lopez was resigning,

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<v Speaker 1>if janis Antetokumpo is on the roster, you know, oh,

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<v Speaker 1>your season is judged as championship or bust, no matter what.

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<v Speaker 1>And you know it's funny you talked about the kind

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<v Speaker 1>of rumbles you've been hearing the last couple of weeks.

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<v Speaker 1>The same thing happened to me and I wrote about

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<v Speaker 1>this on my sub stack the other day one of

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<v Speaker 1>my most trusted NBA informants. I always believe this person

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<v Speaker 1>when they tell me something too. I look back in

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<v Speaker 1>my notes two weeks exactly before the Bucks announced that

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<v Speaker 1>Adrian Griffin was being dismissed, My informant said Terry Stotts

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<v Speaker 1>would be coaching this team right now if he was

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<v Speaker 1>still there. And I said, yep, I took it on board.

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<v Speaker 1>But I just thought to my you know, nah, I

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<v Speaker 1>mean the Bucks, they're not going to fire Adrian Griffin

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<v Speaker 1>halfway through the season after they hired him, after you

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<v Speaker 1>fire Mike Budenholzer in the wake of five re successful

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<v Speaker 1>seasons and a championship, and they're only gonna give Adrian

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<v Speaker 1>Griffin half a season. And I was proven right, But

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<v Speaker 1>there ain't no victory lap because I was right by

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<v Speaker 1>all of two games Game forty three. Two games passed

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<v Speaker 1>the midpoint, and the Bucks went through and did it

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<v Speaker 1>and validated all this noise. And you know, again, like

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<v Speaker 1>as I kind of talked about at the top on

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<v Speaker 1>this show, we've we've talked about Terry Stotts leaving the

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<v Speaker 1>staff before opening night, we talked about Jannis being clearly upset,

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<v Speaker 1>subbed out of a game against Boston, a national TV

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<v Speaker 1>game and basically checked back in. I remember there was

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<v Speaker 1>a reporter named Chris Haynes who reported about how Bucks

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<v Speaker 1>players went to Adrian Griffin and urged him to receive

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<v Speaker 1>store more of last season's defensive coverages because they didn't

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<v Speaker 1>like the coverages that Adrian Griffin wanted to bring in.

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<v Speaker 1>And I remember also that reporter, a certain Chris Haynes

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<v Speaker 1>telling us after the end season tournament about how Bobby

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<v Speaker 1>Portis registered some challenges to the first year coach after

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<v Speaker 1>the Bucks lost in the IST semifinals. It's been one, two, three, four.

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<v Speaker 1>It's just been one thing after another since this thing,

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<v Speaker 1>since since the season has started, really, and it just

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<v Speaker 1>it is clear that he struggled. Adrian Griffin struggled to

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<v Speaker 1>get buy in from this group as a first year coach.

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<v Speaker 1>And it's been happening really from the jump.

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<v Speaker 2>And I would say, Stein, you know, I was able

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<v Speaker 2>to speak with Coach Griff after he was let go.

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<v Speaker 2>Let me just read his quote. They didn't want I'll

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<v Speaker 2>tell you about something else that happened. I wrote about

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<v Speaker 2>it in my story, but this quote is from Griff.

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<v Speaker 2>He said, I appreciate the opportunity the Bucks gave me.

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<v Speaker 2>You can't control everything. I feel good about the job

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<v Speaker 2>we did. I appreciate I appreciate my coaching staff for

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<v Speaker 2>all their hard work. I always wanted to be a

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<v Speaker 2>head coach in this league. I couldn't have asked for

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<v Speaker 2>a better roster. I got to coach Giannis Dame Chris Brooke.

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<v Speaker 2>That's a dream come true. Hopefully I get another shot

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<v Speaker 2>at it, but overall, I'm just thankful that was Adrian Griffin.

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<v Speaker 1>We got to be one of the classiest things. It's

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<v Speaker 1>got to be one of the classiest responses to such

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<v Speaker 1>a tough situation that we've ever heard. It is really

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<v Speaker 1>hard not to feel for Adrian Griffin, who has been

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<v Speaker 1>an assistant coach for a long time and waiting for

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<v Speaker 1>an opportunity like this for a long time, and for

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<v Speaker 1>it to end so quickly and so unceremoniously, and for

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<v Speaker 1>him to handle it the way he did.

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<v Speaker 2>Man, Yeah, and that was that was pretty so after

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<v Speaker 2>he was fired. That when he when he asked the

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<v Speaker 2>phone and gave me that. Remember he told me he

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<v Speaker 2>interviewed for NBA head coaching job on fourteen different occasions.

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<v Speaker 2>Throughout a thirteen year period.

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<v Speaker 1>That's crazy. And remember we have Remember we had Darvin

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<v Speaker 1>ham On in the summer and it was ten, so

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<v Speaker 1>that's four more than Darvin.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's tough. Really, I really feel for him, but

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<v Speaker 2>I think he's look, man, they were thirty and thirteen.

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<v Speaker 2>Come on. Yeah. The way it was explained to me

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<v Speaker 2>as well as like that, the Bucks wanted to see

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<v Speaker 2>a little bit more convincing wins. You can give them that. Defensively,

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<v Speaker 2>they've been struggling throughout the whole season. Their offense has

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<v Speaker 2>really carried them. Transition d has been abysmal, but at

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<v Speaker 2>the end of the day, they've been getting the job done.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, the Indiana Patriers seemed that I've had their

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<v Speaker 2>number this season. But what I want to say is

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<v Speaker 2>after that n season tournament, I wrote about it that

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<v Speaker 2>story for Bleacher Report, Griff called a meeting, a meeting

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<v Speaker 2>with Jannis, Dame, Brooke, and Chris Middleton. And the way

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<v Speaker 2>it was told to me, Griff was challenging all of them,

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<v Speaker 2>no hols, bar challenging them, telling them, you know, one

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<v Speaker 2>of the challenges I can say is like getting on

0:14:21.320 --> 0:14:25.040
<v Speaker 2>Dame for making the right reads, Giet giving up the

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<v Speaker 2>ball early, getting on Janni's for not finding guys, taking

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<v Speaker 2>on three guys at a time and transitioning and guys

0:14:33.480 --> 0:14:36.520
<v Speaker 2>being open on the perimeter like he was, Like Griffin

0:14:36.680 --> 0:14:41.240
<v Speaker 2>was calling guys out, challenging them, and that that session

0:14:41.320 --> 0:14:44.120
<v Speaker 2>like it was, it was allowed to Well what that

0:14:44.160 --> 0:14:47.600
<v Speaker 2>session was, it was just an air and out session.

0:14:48.320 --> 0:14:51.400
<v Speaker 2>Say what's wrong, Say what's wrong with me, Say what's

0:14:51.400 --> 0:14:54.440
<v Speaker 2>wrong with your teammates. Let's get it all out clear,

0:14:54.520 --> 0:14:57.560
<v Speaker 2>Let's get it out now. And I was told that

0:14:57.560 --> 0:15:01.560
<v Speaker 2>that session lasts for about a few hours and it

0:15:01.680 --> 0:15:04.760
<v Speaker 2>was pretty productive. And you know, again the way it

0:15:04.800 --> 0:15:07.400
<v Speaker 2>was explained to me is Griff was really going at him,

0:15:07.640 --> 0:15:10.600
<v Speaker 2>like going out his star players, his core guys, those

0:15:10.680 --> 0:15:14.080
<v Speaker 2>four and after that nd season tournament loss when they

0:15:14.080 --> 0:15:16.680
<v Speaker 2>had that air and out session right after, they went

0:15:16.720 --> 0:15:20.280
<v Speaker 2>on to win seven in a row, and to extend

0:15:20.280 --> 0:15:23.120
<v Speaker 2>that a little bit further, they went on to win

0:15:23.840 --> 0:15:28.440
<v Speaker 2>nine of their last ten. So it was a very

0:15:28.480 --> 0:15:31.160
<v Speaker 2>productive session. Everybody got you know, it seemed like everybody

0:15:31.200 --> 0:15:33.360
<v Speaker 2>was buying in. But then it kind of went back

0:15:33.400 --> 0:15:36.040
<v Speaker 2>downhill from there. And so I give Griff and a

0:15:36.040 --> 0:15:39.240
<v Speaker 2>lot of credit. Man, he tried his best and you know,

0:15:39.320 --> 0:15:42.040
<v Speaker 2>I believe he believes that he needed more time. You know,

0:15:42.080 --> 0:15:45.240
<v Speaker 2>this is a new team. It takes time to to

0:15:45.320 --> 0:15:47.720
<v Speaker 2>get everybody on the same page to jail. Giannis has

0:15:47.760 --> 0:15:49.840
<v Speaker 2>never played with somebody like Dame. Dame's never played with

0:15:49.880 --> 0:15:52.680
<v Speaker 2>somebody like Giannis. He felt like he did a good

0:15:52.760 --> 0:15:55.360
<v Speaker 2>job considering all the factors that were in play.

0:15:55.640 --> 0:15:59.040
<v Speaker 1>And I think what's clear based on you know, we

0:15:59.080 --> 0:16:02.800
<v Speaker 1>can make this judge watching the way the Bucks have

0:16:02.880 --> 0:16:05.880
<v Speaker 1>handled this season. They clearly don't feel like they have time.

0:16:06.000 --> 0:16:10.480
<v Speaker 1>Even with Giannis after the Damian Lillard trade, even with

0:16:10.600 --> 0:16:15.080
<v Speaker 1>Yannas signing a new three year extension, the Bucks are

0:16:15.120 --> 0:16:20.880
<v Speaker 1>still operating in a manner that conveys that they don't

0:16:20.920 --> 0:16:24.720
<v Speaker 1>feel like they have time. Because, you know, in our

0:16:24.760 --> 0:16:27.200
<v Speaker 1>previous podcast, you know, a week ago, what did you

0:16:27.280 --> 0:16:32.080
<v Speaker 1>report last Friday? You reported that the Bucks were trying

0:16:32.080 --> 0:16:35.360
<v Speaker 1>to make their way into the trade chase for de

0:16:35.440 --> 0:16:38.960
<v Speaker 1>Jonte Murray. And my takeaway from that is, look, the

0:16:39.000 --> 0:16:42.440
<v Speaker 1>Bucks do not have many trade assets left after going

0:16:42.480 --> 0:16:46.120
<v Speaker 1>out and getting Dame. But to me, the big takeaway

0:16:46.600 --> 0:16:50.960
<v Speaker 1>from Milwaukee's interest in Dejonte Murray is just the desperation,

0:16:51.400 --> 0:16:55.480
<v Speaker 1>just the pressure that They clearly feel that they have

0:16:55.600 --> 0:17:00.440
<v Speaker 1>to make another move, even after bringing in Dame, because

0:17:00.480 --> 0:17:03.360
<v Speaker 1>of the defensive deficiencies that we've seen all season. This

0:17:03.400 --> 0:17:06.720
<v Speaker 1>team's been in the bottom third of the league defensively

0:17:06.880 --> 0:17:11.919
<v Speaker 1>and not again, realistically, can they trade for de Jontey Murray.

0:17:12.240 --> 0:17:13.960
<v Speaker 1>It's gonna be really hard for them to trade for

0:17:14.000 --> 0:17:16.800
<v Speaker 1>de Jontay Murray. But just the fact that they want

0:17:16.800 --> 0:17:20.440
<v Speaker 1>to give it a try shows you they realize that

0:17:20.480 --> 0:17:25.439
<v Speaker 1>things are not going the way they mapped it out.

0:17:25.800 --> 0:17:29.520
<v Speaker 1>And then when they make such an abrupt coaching change,

0:17:30.240 --> 0:17:36.959
<v Speaker 1>it slams home the idea that they realize this is

0:17:37.000 --> 0:17:41.199
<v Speaker 1>their big move. Realistically, they're not gonna be able to

0:17:41.200 --> 0:17:43.879
<v Speaker 1>make a major trade. We know they're gonna try to

0:17:43.880 --> 0:17:47.200
<v Speaker 1>do something. You've I know you've been characterizing the Bucks

0:17:47.240 --> 0:17:49.639
<v Speaker 1>as they're gonna be aggressive and trying to find anything

0:17:49.720 --> 0:17:53.400
<v Speaker 1>they can do, anything they can do before the deadline.

0:17:53.480 --> 0:17:56.520
<v Speaker 1>But this is the move they knew they could make,

0:17:57.040 --> 0:17:59.919
<v Speaker 1>as uncomfortable as it would be to make a coaching

0:18:00.119 --> 0:18:02.719
<v Speaker 1>change now, and they did it.

0:18:04.560 --> 0:18:07.720
<v Speaker 2>And that and that highlights an aspect of their how

0:18:07.720 --> 0:18:13.359
<v Speaker 2>aggressive they are. Again, they are paying three head coaching salaries.

0:18:14.680 --> 0:18:18.760
<v Speaker 2>That's pretty unprecedented right there. And these aren't three young,

0:18:19.040 --> 0:18:24.520
<v Speaker 2>inexperienced head coaching salaries. You know, Adrian Griffin is pretty sure,

0:18:24.600 --> 0:18:28.080
<v Speaker 2>you know, he wasn't making top flight NBA head coaching money.

0:18:28.480 --> 0:18:33.040
<v Speaker 2>But Mike Budenholzer and Doc Rivers, that's a pretty penny

0:18:33.119 --> 0:18:35.480
<v Speaker 2>right there. So it shows you, you know, it just

0:18:35.600 --> 0:18:43.280
<v Speaker 2>exactly how urgent they are right now. And then again

0:18:43.640 --> 0:18:46.840
<v Speaker 2>there's a window, be honest with dame, they have a window.

0:18:47.320 --> 0:18:52.400
<v Speaker 2>This is a three four year window, that's about it.

0:18:52.840 --> 0:18:56.399
<v Speaker 2>So you got to maximize that. And so again I

0:18:56.440 --> 0:18:59.160
<v Speaker 2>wish I wish coach Adrian Griffin all the best. I

0:18:59.200 --> 0:19:03.680
<v Speaker 2>hope he can get another job, I really do. That's

0:19:03.720 --> 0:19:07.439
<v Speaker 2>that's just a it's a sad situation to have to

0:19:07.440 --> 0:19:10.840
<v Speaker 2>wait that long and go through the coaching process that

0:19:11.000 --> 0:19:13.680
<v Speaker 2>many times before getting your first head job, and then

0:19:13.680 --> 0:19:19.440
<v Speaker 2>you get a prime gig and and then you're out

0:19:19.760 --> 0:19:23.320
<v Speaker 2>midway through a four year deal. That's pretty unpressed in

0:19:23.359 --> 0:19:27.720
<v Speaker 2>it's tin and yeahpe hopefully he could get another shot,

0:19:27.760 --> 0:19:28.040
<v Speaker 2>all right.

0:19:28.080 --> 0:19:30.720
<v Speaker 1>Well, before we move on to the Doc Rivers portion

0:19:30.800 --> 0:19:33.080
<v Speaker 1>of this, because I do want to highlight one other

0:19:33.119 --> 0:19:34.760
<v Speaker 1>thing I reported this week, because I.

0:19:34.720 --> 0:19:38.960
<v Speaker 2>Look, yes you did Stan, Yes, you did. I know

0:19:38.960 --> 0:19:39.600
<v Speaker 2>where you're going with.

0:19:40.560 --> 0:19:45.760
<v Speaker 1>Look, Jani Sontetokumpo, this is going to be something that.

0:19:45.800 --> 0:19:50.720
<v Speaker 2>You emptied the notebook clip. Stean, you emptied the note

0:19:50.720 --> 0:19:51.600
<v Speaker 2>book clip.

0:19:51.440 --> 0:19:55.720
<v Speaker 1>In the summer in May. I reported it. I know

0:19:55.840 --> 0:19:58.080
<v Speaker 1>you reported it. I know we both heard it. The

0:19:58.119 --> 0:20:04.560
<v Speaker 1>word started to emerge that Janis Antetokumpo, of the candidates

0:20:04.760 --> 0:20:07.879
<v Speaker 1>that Milwaukee was looking at, that he was most intrigued

0:20:07.920 --> 0:20:14.600
<v Speaker 1>with Adrian Griffin. And it was very curious because they

0:20:14.600 --> 0:20:18.800
<v Speaker 1>have never, to my knowledge, worked together before. Adrian Griffin

0:20:18.840 --> 0:20:21.440
<v Speaker 1>had been an assistant coach in a number of places

0:20:21.960 --> 0:20:25.600
<v Speaker 1>on his way to getting the Milwaukee job, but he

0:20:25.640 --> 0:20:29.760
<v Speaker 1>did not have a ton of previous working experience with

0:20:29.800 --> 0:20:33.480
<v Speaker 1>Janis on Tetokumpo. So the fact that Jannis liked the

0:20:33.560 --> 0:20:37.240
<v Speaker 1>idea of Milwaukee hiring Griffin, there were a lot of

0:20:37.240 --> 0:20:39.720
<v Speaker 1>people around the league at the time in late May

0:20:39.840 --> 0:20:43.760
<v Speaker 1>asking why, how where did this relationship come from? Well,

0:20:43.840 --> 0:20:47.199
<v Speaker 1>in the months since and as things have kind of

0:20:47.240 --> 0:20:49.960
<v Speaker 1>been rocky here in Milwaukee, the way it was described

0:20:49.960 --> 0:20:55.800
<v Speaker 1>to me was that it was really more that Yannis

0:20:55.920 --> 0:20:58.440
<v Speaker 1>did not want the Bucks to go in the direction

0:20:58.560 --> 0:21:03.359
<v Speaker 1>of hiring Nick Nurse, who was very available after he

0:21:03.440 --> 0:21:08.520
<v Speaker 1>left Toronto, and that rather than urged the Bucks to

0:21:08.640 --> 0:21:16.119
<v Speaker 1>hire Nick Nurse, Jannis began championing Adrian Griffin. The word

0:21:16.160 --> 0:21:19.240
<v Speaker 1>that was circulating at the time was he wanted a

0:21:19.320 --> 0:21:24.520
<v Speaker 1>former player, and Adrian Griffin was the most notable former

0:21:24.560 --> 0:21:29.040
<v Speaker 1>player who made the latter stages of the Bucks coaching search.

0:21:29.119 --> 0:21:32.320
<v Speaker 1>I think Kenny Atkinson from the Warriors was also in there.

0:21:33.119 --> 0:21:37.399
<v Speaker 1>But look, this is something, this is a storyline that

0:21:38.040 --> 0:21:43.119
<v Speaker 1>I don't think will be going away because Philadelphia remains

0:21:43.160 --> 0:21:48.320
<v Speaker 1>in contention for the Eastern Conference crown along with Milwaukee

0:21:48.480 --> 0:21:53.040
<v Speaker 1>and Miami and of course Boston. But the Bucks really

0:21:53.080 --> 0:21:59.800
<v Speaker 1>had the first lane toward hiring Nick Nurse and did not.

0:22:00.720 --> 0:22:04.680
<v Speaker 1>And Nick Nurse has since gone on to Philadelphia, and

0:22:04.800 --> 0:22:09.360
<v Speaker 1>you've seen the impact he's had on the Sixers as

0:22:09.359 --> 0:22:13.560
<v Speaker 1>a whole, but really on Joel Embiid, who's probably playing

0:22:13.600 --> 0:22:16.920
<v Speaker 1>the best basketball of his life. And this week, at

0:22:16.920 --> 0:22:19.960
<v Speaker 1>the time of the firing, the Sixers were in the

0:22:20.000 --> 0:22:25.560
<v Speaker 1>top five in both offense and defense, and the Bucks,

0:22:25.600 --> 0:22:31.439
<v Speaker 1>while number two in offense, have again they've been twenty

0:22:31.480 --> 0:22:37.000
<v Speaker 1>one twenty two range in defensive ratings. So look, hiring

0:22:37.040 --> 0:22:42.960
<v Speaker 1>Doc Rivers. Now, however they got there, does create the

0:22:43.000 --> 0:22:46.600
<v Speaker 1>possibility that the Bucks can fix this. Maybe now they

0:22:46.640 --> 0:22:50.399
<v Speaker 1>have the coach they feel is the right coach who

0:22:50.960 --> 0:22:55.920
<v Speaker 1>can steer this team into championship contention. And look, Doc

0:22:56.040 --> 0:22:58.760
<v Speaker 1>Rivers has no shortage of critics around the league because

0:22:58.800 --> 0:23:03.720
<v Speaker 1>of his player of shortcomings over the past decade plus.

0:23:03.720 --> 0:23:07.560
<v Speaker 1>But look, I think Doc Rivers is going to very

0:23:07.640 --> 0:23:10.760
<v Speaker 1>quickly get player buy in in Milwaukee, the player buy

0:23:10.800 --> 0:23:14.719
<v Speaker 1>in that Adrian Griffin did not get. But I mean,

0:23:14.760 --> 0:23:18.520
<v Speaker 1>this story just has so many layers. And like I said,

0:23:18.520 --> 0:23:21.520
<v Speaker 1>we've been going now for a good fifteen minutes maybe more,

0:23:21.560 --> 0:23:23.320
<v Speaker 1>and we've barely even talked about Doc.

0:23:23.680 --> 0:23:29.240
<v Speaker 2>And that's where that's where this gets all interesting, because again,

0:23:29.320 --> 0:23:32.800
<v Speaker 2>Philly has played some really good basketball. Boston plans some

0:23:32.800 --> 0:23:35.359
<v Speaker 2>really good basketball. And these are his old these are

0:23:35.359 --> 0:23:38.200
<v Speaker 2>two of his old stomping grounds, and now he's going

0:23:38.240 --> 0:23:41.800
<v Speaker 2>to be asked to lead the charge to take down,

0:23:42.720 --> 0:23:46.280
<v Speaker 2>potentially take down two of his two of his spots

0:23:47.119 --> 0:23:53.960
<v Speaker 2>in spots in previous time. I think I think you

0:23:54.000 --> 0:23:56.560
<v Speaker 2>know a bunch of players too. I'm gonna say it's

0:23:56.560 --> 0:23:58.840
<v Speaker 2>stein a bunch of players. I would say star players,

0:23:58.880 --> 0:24:00.800
<v Speaker 2>when I mean a bunch, I'll say it handful. So

0:24:01.080 --> 0:24:05.199
<v Speaker 2>about five players star players. They called me and they

0:24:05.280 --> 0:24:09.200
<v Speaker 2>asked me about Doc Rivers and they were like, man like, Doc,

0:24:09.240 --> 0:24:13.880
<v Speaker 2>get these jobs. And my response to him or to

0:24:13.920 --> 0:24:19.639
<v Speaker 2>them was who else would you hire? Because you have

0:24:19.720 --> 0:24:25.639
<v Speaker 2>to understand what this Bucks team they are. It is desperation,

0:24:26.680 --> 0:24:32.840
<v Speaker 2>it is urgent of the highest degree. You have to hire.

0:24:32.920 --> 0:24:35.679
<v Speaker 2>They just let go of Ad and Griffin, and I

0:24:35.720 --> 0:24:42.080
<v Speaker 2>think a large reason why was due to inexperience, regardless

0:24:42.119 --> 0:24:44.520
<v Speaker 2>of why they hired them in the first place, whatever,

0:24:45.520 --> 0:24:48.800
<v Speaker 2>But you have to bring in somebody with some cache,

0:24:49.240 --> 0:24:54.359
<v Speaker 2>with some experience, who's with some experience, who has spent

0:24:54.480 --> 0:25:01.240
<v Speaker 2>time coaching superstars, handling egos, handling personalities, handling depth because

0:25:01.280 --> 0:25:03.520
<v Speaker 2>when you when you're handling depth like that's why you

0:25:03.560 --> 0:25:06.040
<v Speaker 2>got to give ty Lou credit. Not only is he

0:25:06.080 --> 0:25:07.959
<v Speaker 2>one of the best exit and os coaches, but he

0:25:08.040 --> 0:25:11.160
<v Speaker 2>understands how to handle depth because then you're you're dealing

0:25:11.160 --> 0:25:14.520
<v Speaker 2>with personalities, You're dealing with egos because you're limiting their

0:25:15.320 --> 0:25:19.160
<v Speaker 2>minute distribution, and you have to you have to work

0:25:19.200 --> 0:25:22.800
<v Speaker 2>through all of that. So who else is out there? Like?

0:25:22.880 --> 0:25:25.120
<v Speaker 2>And that's why you know, and nobody could come up

0:25:25.240 --> 0:25:28.840
<v Speaker 2>with a name. And this is what I was told.

0:25:29.160 --> 0:25:33.080
<v Speaker 2>The Bucks were looking at, Doc Rivers, Jeff Van Gundy,

0:25:33.359 --> 0:25:37.880
<v Speaker 2>Nate McMillan. It was a very short list, very short list.

0:25:38.320 --> 0:25:41.320
<v Speaker 2>And if you're talking about those names, I know people

0:25:41.400 --> 0:25:45.120
<v Speaker 2>hate hearing about recycled coaches, But who else is out

0:25:45.119 --> 0:25:49.320
<v Speaker 2>there that's available with that experience that can come in

0:25:49.320 --> 0:25:51.679
<v Speaker 2>to the locker room from day one and command the

0:25:51.760 --> 0:25:56.199
<v Speaker 2>respect of these players? You know, you can talk about it,

0:25:56.240 --> 0:25:58.840
<v Speaker 2>but you could talk about not liking the move or

0:25:59.119 --> 0:26:02.280
<v Speaker 2>Doc's getting all these opportunities, But okay, who else is

0:26:02.320 --> 0:26:05.000
<v Speaker 2>out there? Nobody can give me a name? How do

0:26:05.040 --> 0:26:07.119
<v Speaker 2>you feel about that stund how you feel about like?

0:26:07.280 --> 0:26:08.280
<v Speaker 2>Who else is out look?

0:26:09.000 --> 0:26:11.040
<v Speaker 1>I mentioned it once and we will say it again.

0:26:11.160 --> 0:26:15.960
<v Speaker 1>Over the past decade plus the championship with Boston in

0:26:16.040 --> 0:26:18.560
<v Speaker 1>two thousand and eight, that was a long time ago,

0:26:19.440 --> 0:26:25.000
<v Speaker 1>there have been numerous playoff disappointments for Doc's various teams

0:26:25.000 --> 0:26:31.080
<v Speaker 1>in those intervening fifteen ish years, a lot of teams

0:26:31.119 --> 0:26:33.920
<v Speaker 1>that didn't get passed round two, a lot of Game

0:26:34.040 --> 0:26:41.679
<v Speaker 1>seven defeats, and Doc's gonna have to hear about that

0:26:41.840 --> 0:26:45.640
<v Speaker 1>and answer that talk. Until he takes a team into

0:26:45.640 --> 0:26:50.480
<v Speaker 1>the conference finals and beyond again. But to me, he

0:26:50.720 --> 0:26:53.399
<v Speaker 1>was the obvious choice. If you're going to do something

0:26:53.480 --> 0:26:57.160
<v Speaker 1>like this, I'm with you. I think he was really

0:26:57.200 --> 0:27:01.880
<v Speaker 1>the only choice at this point, because, look, he can't

0:27:02.000 --> 0:27:04.400
<v Speaker 1>change that personnel. The Bucks are still going to have

0:27:05.280 --> 0:27:09.720
<v Speaker 1>defensive issues with the roster they have. But can he

0:27:11.280 --> 0:27:14.199
<v Speaker 1>run more pick and roll with Giannis and Dame, something

0:27:14.200 --> 0:27:18.800
<v Speaker 1>we have not seen as much of as some pundits anticipated.

0:27:19.600 --> 0:27:21.919
<v Speaker 1>Can he, first of all, just get that group on

0:27:22.000 --> 0:27:27.000
<v Speaker 1>the same page. I think he can, and I think

0:27:27.080 --> 0:27:36.240
<v Speaker 1>he will. One more thing about the Bucks, at least

0:27:36.240 --> 0:27:38.760
<v Speaker 1>for now. We will underline for now, because I don't

0:27:38.760 --> 0:27:40.800
<v Speaker 1>think we're going to be done talking Bucks for a

0:27:40.880 --> 0:27:44.560
<v Speaker 1>while here as Doc Rivers gets settled in there. Certainly

0:27:44.600 --> 0:27:48.800
<v Speaker 1>the microscope will stay trained on the Bucks and how

0:27:48.840 --> 0:27:52.359
<v Speaker 1>they react to this coaching change. But Milwaukee as a

0:27:52.440 --> 0:27:57.560
<v Speaker 1>franchise has faced some additional criticism this week because it's

0:27:57.600 --> 0:28:02.120
<v Speaker 1>been reported that in the month or so before Adrian

0:28:02.160 --> 0:28:07.000
<v Speaker 1>Griffin's dismissal, the Bucks reached out to Doc Rivers to

0:28:07.119 --> 0:28:11.960
<v Speaker 1>ask him to serve as a coaching consultant to Adrian Griffin,

0:28:12.760 --> 0:28:16.720
<v Speaker 1>and that has certainly raised eyebrows. It has led to

0:28:16.880 --> 0:28:21.000
<v Speaker 1>suggestions that Doc was angling for this job before it

0:28:21.080 --> 0:28:24.920
<v Speaker 1>was open, and my issue with that is, I mean,

0:28:25.119 --> 0:28:29.960
<v Speaker 1>I I've heard repeatedly since the season started how much

0:28:30.000 --> 0:28:35.960
<v Speaker 1>Doc was enjoying the TV life, the media life. I

0:28:36.040 --> 0:28:40.600
<v Speaker 1>really don't think he was desperate to get back into

0:28:40.600 --> 0:28:45.680
<v Speaker 1>coaching this season. I felt like the consistent rumbles out

0:28:45.680 --> 0:28:48.320
<v Speaker 1>there were that, you know, Doc, of course he was

0:28:48.360 --> 0:28:51.840
<v Speaker 1>gonna come back and take a job eventually, but that

0:28:52.120 --> 0:28:55.640
<v Speaker 1>a year off to do TV, to play golf and

0:28:55.720 --> 0:28:59.640
<v Speaker 1>get some respite from the daily madness was not an

0:28:59.640 --> 0:29:03.600
<v Speaker 1>idea of it. He didn't love the sound of I

0:29:03.640 --> 0:29:05.760
<v Speaker 1>think he did love the sound of that, and now

0:29:05.800 --> 0:29:08.720
<v Speaker 1>he is back in the hot seat again. What's been

0:29:08.720 --> 0:29:10.120
<v Speaker 1>your take on all that chatter.

0:29:12.040 --> 0:29:19.200
<v Speaker 2>I think if Doc has asked about that consultant role,

0:29:19.400 --> 0:29:21.320
<v Speaker 2>I think if he's asked about it publicly, I think

0:29:21.360 --> 0:29:28.160
<v Speaker 2>he'll refute that about behind the scenes, I'm hearing that

0:29:28.160 --> 0:29:32.920
<v Speaker 2>that role was offered, but it sounds like he didn't

0:29:32.960 --> 0:29:37.000
<v Speaker 2>accept that role of consultant. Griff. Uh, That's that's what

0:29:37.120 --> 0:29:39.320
<v Speaker 2>I'll That's how it was.

0:29:39.600 --> 0:29:41.080
<v Speaker 1>We got to dig more into that one. Because I'm

0:29:41.080 --> 0:29:42.600
<v Speaker 1>with you I've heard the same thing. I heard that

0:29:42.640 --> 0:29:46.000
<v Speaker 1>he was offered the consultant role and didn't really want it.

0:29:46.080 --> 0:29:51.880
<v Speaker 1>So to what extent he was consulting Adrian Griffin, We're

0:29:51.880 --> 0:29:54.400
<v Speaker 1>gonna have to We're gonna have to dig into that

0:29:54.440 --> 0:29:56.120
<v Speaker 1>one a little bit more. And you know you said

0:29:56.160 --> 0:30:01.160
<v Speaker 1>it too. You know, it'll be very interesting too hear

0:30:01.240 --> 0:30:05.800
<v Speaker 1>from Doc Rivers when he is formally ushered in as

0:30:06.480 --> 0:30:09.840
<v Speaker 1>the bucks new coach. You know, we've John Horst held

0:30:09.840 --> 0:30:15.360
<v Speaker 1>a press conference on Wednesday after the Adrian Griffin dismissal

0:30:16.480 --> 0:30:20.320
<v Speaker 1>and Joe Prunty coaching the Bucks as the interim coach.

0:30:20.360 --> 0:30:23.360
<v Speaker 1>But we still have to hear from Doc Rivers, and

0:30:25.160 --> 0:30:29.040
<v Speaker 1>again we will rest assured. We are not done talking

0:30:29.080 --> 0:30:33.239
<v Speaker 1>about the Bucks of Milwaukee. They will remain very much

0:30:33.320 --> 0:30:35.200
<v Speaker 1>in the news, and as you've been saying, they will.

0:30:36.080 --> 0:30:38.080
<v Speaker 1>You know, they're a team that still wants to try

0:30:38.080 --> 0:30:41.240
<v Speaker 1>to do something at this deadline. So let's see if

0:30:42.320 --> 0:30:45.880
<v Speaker 1>they can still make a move of some sort to

0:30:45.920 --> 0:30:48.120
<v Speaker 1>try to spruce up the roster as well. All Right,

0:30:48.160 --> 0:30:51.520
<v Speaker 1>We're gonna move on now to some All Star discussion

0:30:51.640 --> 0:30:56.240
<v Speaker 1>because the All Star starters were announced on this Thursday night.

0:30:56.280 --> 0:30:58.920
<v Speaker 1>As Chris and I record, and look, we can go

0:30:59.080 --> 0:31:04.040
<v Speaker 1>in a zillion different directions. We've now officially passed the

0:31:04.080 --> 0:31:07.560
<v Speaker 1>midpoint of the twenty twenty three to twenty four regular season.

0:31:08.200 --> 0:31:12.400
<v Speaker 1>We will most certainly be getting back to trade season,

0:31:13.360 --> 0:31:16.880
<v Speaker 1>just under three weeks away from the trade buzzer promise

0:31:17.000 --> 0:31:21.120
<v Speaker 1>that upcoming episodes will have lots of trade talk and

0:31:21.440 --> 0:31:27.640
<v Speaker 1>almost anniversary time for US. January thirtieth, twenty twenty three

0:31:28.000 --> 0:31:33.320
<v Speaker 1>was the date of the first edition of this league, uncut,

0:31:33.440 --> 0:31:36.800
<v Speaker 1>and so we are getting very close to our one

0:31:36.880 --> 0:31:45.200
<v Speaker 1>year anniversary, which is a stunning development in itself that

0:31:45.280 --> 0:31:49.000
<v Speaker 1>we made it this far. But let's talk all stars.

0:31:49.000 --> 0:31:51.960
<v Speaker 1>All joking aside, let's talk all stars. The starters were

0:31:52.000 --> 0:31:58.760
<v Speaker 1>announced tonight. I mean, I wasn't terribly surprised by the results,

0:31:58.800 --> 0:32:02.000
<v Speaker 1>but I guess it to on how you want to

0:32:02.000 --> 0:32:06.120
<v Speaker 1>look at things in the Eastern Conference, zero surprise in

0:32:06.160 --> 0:32:10.640
<v Speaker 1>the East front court, janas Antetokumpo, Joe l Embiid Jason

0:32:10.680 --> 0:32:16.080
<v Speaker 1>Tatum are your three East starters. The backcourt Tyrese Halliburton

0:32:16.280 --> 0:32:20.200
<v Speaker 1>for the hometown Indiana Pacers hosts of the event. And

0:32:20.240 --> 0:32:23.120
<v Speaker 1>then I guess this is where the surprise element such

0:32:23.120 --> 0:32:28.160
<v Speaker 1>as it was, came in Damian Lillard, yanas Antokumpo's teammate

0:32:28.200 --> 0:32:33.560
<v Speaker 1>from the Milwaukee Bucks, he gets the other starting spot

0:32:33.680 --> 0:32:38.320
<v Speaker 1>in the East, ahead of New York's Jalen Brunson. I'm

0:32:38.360 --> 0:32:43.240
<v Speaker 1>sure Brunson is disappointed, but I think without question Brunson

0:32:43.320 --> 0:32:46.280
<v Speaker 1>will be selected by East coaches next week for his

0:32:46.400 --> 0:32:50.680
<v Speaker 1>first All Star appearance. And amazingly, for Damian Lillard, I

0:32:50.680 --> 0:32:53.000
<v Speaker 1>believe this will be the first time he ever starts

0:32:53.040 --> 0:32:56.400
<v Speaker 1>in the All Star YEP, which that did catch me

0:32:56.520 --> 0:33:00.560
<v Speaker 1>a bit off guard. In the West, your starters in

0:33:00.600 --> 0:33:04.160
<v Speaker 1>the front court Nikola Jokic, Kevin Durant and a certain

0:33:04.200 --> 0:33:07.680
<v Speaker 1>thirty nine year old named Lebron James. And then in

0:33:07.720 --> 0:33:12.720
<v Speaker 1>the backcourt. Again, I'm not shocked by this because remember

0:33:13.240 --> 0:33:17.240
<v Speaker 1>voting is now fifty percent fans, but also twenty five

0:33:17.280 --> 0:33:21.520
<v Speaker 1>percent media and twenty five percent players. For the All Stars.

0:33:21.760 --> 0:33:25.560
<v Speaker 1>Shay Gilgis Alexander joins Luka Doncic as a starter in

0:33:25.600 --> 0:33:29.040
<v Speaker 1>the West backcourt, which means Stephan Curry is not a starter,

0:33:29.760 --> 0:33:32.800
<v Speaker 1>and that's mostly down to the fact that Steph slipped

0:33:32.800 --> 0:33:36.160
<v Speaker 1>to number four in the media vote. But again I'm

0:33:36.160 --> 0:33:44.080
<v Speaker 1>not hugely surprised there because Golden State struggles at nineteen

0:33:44.120 --> 0:33:49.239
<v Speaker 1>and twenty two. Entering Thursday night's play again, not a

0:33:49.280 --> 0:33:52.080
<v Speaker 1>massive surprise to me at least that he would slip

0:33:52.120 --> 0:33:56.720
<v Speaker 1>some among media voters and open the door for SGA

0:33:56.880 --> 0:34:00.680
<v Speaker 1>to barge into the starting lineup. But you've heard me

0:34:01.040 --> 0:34:04.040
<v Speaker 1>prattle on enough. Chris Haynes, what was your reaction to

0:34:04.120 --> 0:34:06.800
<v Speaker 1>the East and West starters?

0:34:08.440 --> 0:34:11.680
<v Speaker 2>I was, I was surprised. We talked about this, what

0:34:11.920 --> 0:34:14.240
<v Speaker 2>was it last month, and I was I was saying, hey, Stein,

0:34:14.719 --> 0:34:22.000
<v Speaker 2>is there a scenario where Steph might not be the starter?

0:34:22.160 --> 0:34:24.120
<v Speaker 2>Because I was, you know, I was making a case

0:34:24.160 --> 0:34:26.720
<v Speaker 2>for SGA. I was making a case for Anthony Edwards,

0:34:26.800 --> 0:34:31.239
<v Speaker 2>being that Minnesota Timbolves are number one, and just with

0:34:31.360 --> 0:34:34.840
<v Speaker 2>the popularity is Steph. I still didn't see it. Even

0:34:34.920 --> 0:34:38.520
<v Speaker 2>to the current time, I didn't see it. I still

0:34:38.560 --> 0:34:41.520
<v Speaker 2>felt like, yes, when you're talking about the players in

0:34:41.600 --> 0:34:46.720
<v Speaker 2>the media, they're largely going to vote for who's playing

0:34:46.800 --> 0:34:52.560
<v Speaker 2>well that that season. You can bank on them. Media

0:34:52.719 --> 0:34:55.440
<v Speaker 2>more so probably could bank on them to kind of

0:34:55.480 --> 0:34:59.400
<v Speaker 2>get it right. Fan voting is fan voting. But I

0:34:59.560 --> 0:35:02.720
<v Speaker 2>still thought what the popular is Steph is popular among

0:35:02.800 --> 0:35:08.080
<v Speaker 2>his peers. I still thought Steph could get in via

0:35:08.200 --> 0:35:11.920
<v Speaker 2>the fan excuse me, via the player vote. I didn't

0:35:12.000 --> 0:35:16.160
<v Speaker 2>think media would. So as I look through this, excuse me,

0:35:16.200 --> 0:35:17.960
<v Speaker 2>I'm in the East right now. So as I look

0:35:18.000 --> 0:35:22.840
<v Speaker 2>through this, oh, you already said yes, Steph got and

0:35:23.040 --> 0:35:29.080
<v Speaker 2>player ranking. Player vote he was third, and media he

0:35:29.200 --> 0:35:29.680
<v Speaker 2>was fourth.

0:35:30.680 --> 0:35:34.560
<v Speaker 1>So that's that's really heard a starting spot slipped to

0:35:34.600 --> 0:35:39.120
<v Speaker 1>number four among the media. Look, I think if there's really,

0:35:39.200 --> 0:35:44.279
<v Speaker 1>if there's a curveball here, it's that Jalen Brunson. He

0:35:44.440 --> 0:35:49.160
<v Speaker 1>was number two among East guards in the media vote.

0:35:50.320 --> 0:35:54.240
<v Speaker 1>The media backed Jalen Brunson as an All Star starter

0:35:55.400 --> 0:36:00.799
<v Speaker 1>more than the fan vote. And that is because you

0:36:00.880 --> 0:36:05.480
<v Speaker 1>think the Knicks have such a huge fan base that

0:36:05.480 --> 0:36:10.759
<v Speaker 1>that's going to theoretically give Brunson an advantage. But I

0:36:10.760 --> 0:36:13.960
<v Speaker 1>think it speaks to the fact that Damian Lillard, no

0:36:14.040 --> 0:36:18.440
<v Speaker 1>matter what jersey he's wearing, Portland, Milwaukee, whatever, Damian Lillard

0:36:18.480 --> 0:36:21.839
<v Speaker 1>is still a very very popular player. And the fan

0:36:21.960 --> 0:36:23.000
<v Speaker 1>vote clearly proved that.

0:36:24.800 --> 0:36:31.399
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, the players selected Tyrese Halliburton and Tyrese Maxi one

0:36:31.520 --> 0:36:41.080
<v Speaker 2>two players, media selected Halliburton and Brunson. One thing that's

0:36:41.120 --> 0:36:48.040
<v Speaker 2>fascinating about this is like, where are we with the

0:36:48.080 --> 0:36:51.800
<v Speaker 2>so called big market teams having an advantage? Right, Jalen

0:36:51.840 --> 0:36:55.040
<v Speaker 2>Brunson is one of the biggest stars that Knicks have

0:36:56.040 --> 0:37:00.520
<v Speaker 2>had in a long time. Why in that market in

0:37:00.600 --> 0:37:04.320
<v Speaker 2>New York where they're winning. Jalen Brunson is a very

0:37:04.360 --> 0:37:10.080
<v Speaker 2>likable player, a young star on the rise. Why was

0:37:10.160 --> 0:37:15.439
<v Speaker 2>he only let me see fan voting he was? Why

0:37:15.600 --> 0:37:18.480
<v Speaker 2>is why was he fifth in fan voting in the

0:37:18.520 --> 0:37:23.520
<v Speaker 2>New York market? Why is that? Does market size mean anything?

0:37:23.760 --> 0:37:28.759
<v Speaker 1>I think it's become a global game, and you you know,

0:37:28.880 --> 0:37:33.759
<v Speaker 1>and that's it's it's not just if And I hope

0:37:33.760 --> 0:37:35.680
<v Speaker 1>I have my facts straight here, because look, I gotta

0:37:35.719 --> 0:37:39.480
<v Speaker 1>be honest. I typically do not get super worked up

0:37:39.600 --> 0:37:43.839
<v Speaker 1>about the starters because the fan vote element is such

0:37:43.880 --> 0:37:45.920
<v Speaker 1>a huge part of it and to me, the fans

0:37:45.960 --> 0:37:48.600
<v Speaker 1>should get to see who they want to see. And

0:37:48.640 --> 0:37:52.480
<v Speaker 1>so I what, you know, I'm always you know, supporting

0:37:53.080 --> 0:37:56.480
<v Speaker 1>various changes in tweaks to the NBA system and they

0:37:56.480 --> 0:37:58.560
<v Speaker 1>should change this, and they should change that, and they

0:37:58.600 --> 0:38:02.000
<v Speaker 1>said they should fix this, but you know, all stars starters.

0:38:02.000 --> 0:38:04.880
<v Speaker 1>To me, the fact that it is now fifty percent

0:38:04.960 --> 0:38:07.160
<v Speaker 1>fan vote instead of one hundred percent fan vote, Like,

0:38:07.239 --> 0:38:11.279
<v Speaker 1>that's not one that I was really clamoring for, just

0:38:11.320 --> 0:38:14.880
<v Speaker 1>speaking purely for myself, because to me, you know, the

0:38:14.960 --> 0:38:17.160
<v Speaker 1>fans want to see who they want to see, and

0:38:17.800 --> 0:38:20.920
<v Speaker 1>I don't typically tend to quibble with that. But because

0:38:20.960 --> 0:38:24.480
<v Speaker 1>it is fifty twenty five twenty five now instead of

0:38:24.520 --> 0:38:28.040
<v Speaker 1>just one hundred percent fan vote, we're able to dissect

0:38:28.120 --> 0:38:30.600
<v Speaker 1>these results even more and really put them under the

0:38:30.640 --> 0:38:35.640
<v Speaker 1>microscope and try to figure out what it all means. Yeah,

0:38:35.719 --> 0:38:39.319
<v Speaker 1>I mean, I'm you know again, neither one of these

0:38:39.440 --> 0:38:43.560
<v Speaker 1>floored me. But you would have thought if Brunson only

0:38:43.640 --> 0:38:48.280
<v Speaker 1>needed a higher fan vote placing to get that starting spot,

0:38:48.280 --> 0:38:49.239
<v Speaker 1>that he probably would have.

0:38:53.840 --> 0:38:59.240
<v Speaker 2>Okay, I have a question. This could be a controversial question,

0:39:00.000 --> 0:39:03.680
<v Speaker 2>all right. My question to you Stein since they went

0:39:03.719 --> 0:39:07.640
<v Speaker 2>to this format of picking starters by way of fans,

0:39:08.280 --> 0:39:13.600
<v Speaker 2>media and players. The fans are the fans, like you said,

0:39:13.640 --> 0:39:16.080
<v Speaker 2>it's about them. They want to see who they want

0:39:16.120 --> 0:39:21.600
<v Speaker 2>to see. Then it's the media's job to try to

0:39:21.960 --> 0:39:32.879
<v Speaker 2>uphold uphold the standards of which players are playing the

0:39:32.920 --> 0:39:36.520
<v Speaker 2>best that particular season. So it's our jobs as the

0:39:36.600 --> 0:39:40.680
<v Speaker 2>media to take away you know, we're not looking at popularity.

0:39:40.680 --> 0:39:45.439
<v Speaker 2>We're not looking at who is the who whose game

0:39:45.520 --> 0:39:49.000
<v Speaker 2>we like the best. It's about who's happened the best

0:39:49.040 --> 0:39:53.200
<v Speaker 2>season that particular year. And then you have the players

0:39:53.680 --> 0:40:00.200
<v Speaker 2>and put now Stein Ben Simmons has two votes by

0:40:00.200 --> 0:40:03.839
<v Speaker 2>the players, Josh Hart has four votes. I can go

0:40:03.960 --> 0:40:07.040
<v Speaker 2>on and on. I would encourage everybody to go look

0:40:07.360 --> 0:40:09.279
<v Speaker 2>at the results, look at.

0:40:10.960 --> 0:40:15.399
<v Speaker 1>Star votes through and compiles the list of amazing, it's

0:40:15.440 --> 0:40:20.000
<v Speaker 1>crazy votes from fellow players in the All Star process.

0:40:20.000 --> 0:40:22.200
<v Speaker 1>And yeah, that that bothers me, that you know.

0:40:22.320 --> 0:40:24.640
<v Speaker 2>And Stein. The reason why I bring this up because

0:40:24.680 --> 0:40:27.200
<v Speaker 2>it's funny every year. It really is funny every year.

0:40:27.760 --> 0:40:33.080
<v Speaker 2>But the problem is is that by not really voting

0:40:33.440 --> 0:40:36.319
<v Speaker 2>the right way, voting to who should really be an

0:40:36.360 --> 0:40:38.480
<v Speaker 2>All Star, whoever you think really should be an All

0:40:38.480 --> 0:40:43.080
<v Speaker 2>Star starter, you're taking votes away from guys who are

0:40:43.120 --> 0:40:47.640
<v Speaker 2>probably that vote will make the difference, that vote will

0:40:47.680 --> 0:40:52.680
<v Speaker 2>have them actually being a starter opposed to now having

0:40:52.719 --> 0:40:55.600
<v Speaker 2>to rely on being called as an All Star reserve

0:40:55.719 --> 0:41:00.000
<v Speaker 2>next week. And there's a lot like look at this list.

0:41:01.080 --> 0:41:04.680
<v Speaker 2>These votes are spread throughout the league of guys who

0:41:04.760 --> 0:41:08.680
<v Speaker 2>haven't played, guys that's not in the rotation. God, you know,

0:41:08.719 --> 0:41:11.239
<v Speaker 2>what I'm saying. So it's like, I know players talk

0:41:11.239 --> 0:41:15.680
<v Speaker 2>about having input in and listen, you can say it's

0:41:15.680 --> 0:41:21.080
<v Speaker 2>a small sample size because they still have you know,

0:41:21.120 --> 0:41:23.839
<v Speaker 2>they still had the right guys that overall they had

0:41:23.840 --> 0:41:27.000
<v Speaker 2>the right guys in as starters. But there's a lot

0:41:27.000 --> 0:41:29.640
<v Speaker 2>of votes just spread out and that you're just throwing

0:41:29.680 --> 0:41:34.920
<v Speaker 2>them away in which those votes could be difference makers.

0:41:35.280 --> 0:41:37.759
<v Speaker 2>And so I'm like, man, if y'all not gonna take

0:41:37.760 --> 0:41:43.279
<v Speaker 2>it seriously, ah, I don't know. I don't know, am

0:41:43.280 --> 0:41:44.759
<v Speaker 2>I making too big of a deal of.

0:41:44.719 --> 0:41:49.080
<v Speaker 1>It, because there's always the talk that you know, in

0:41:49.160 --> 0:41:51.160
<v Speaker 1>the media, we're dumb, we don't know what the hell

0:41:51.160 --> 0:41:53.080
<v Speaker 1>we're talking about. But I think, look, I don't have

0:41:53.160 --> 0:41:56.000
<v Speaker 1>the list in front of me, but if if I

0:41:56.080 --> 0:41:59.680
<v Speaker 1>heard Ernie Johnson correctly, and if I'm remembering what Ernie

0:41:59.719 --> 0:42:04.000
<v Speaker 1>Johnson and said during TNT's broadcast earlier tonight, I think

0:42:04.040 --> 0:42:09.879
<v Speaker 1>the media had Anthony Edwards and Jalen Brunson on its

0:42:09.920 --> 0:42:14.200
<v Speaker 1>respective All Star ballots as starters. And to me, that

0:42:14.280 --> 0:42:17.480
<v Speaker 1>looks like pretty smart analysis by the media as a

0:42:17.520 --> 0:42:21.440
<v Speaker 1>whole to recognize guys who played at a really, really,

0:42:21.600 --> 0:42:26.239
<v Speaker 1>really elite level. Obviously, the media is choosing starters, or

0:42:26.360 --> 0:42:30.439
<v Speaker 1>is theoretically at least choosing starters based on who they

0:42:30.480 --> 0:42:34.040
<v Speaker 1>think is playing the best and most impactful basketball in

0:42:34.040 --> 0:42:37.360
<v Speaker 1>the league. So yeah, you know, the media is constantly

0:42:37.400 --> 0:42:47.040
<v Speaker 1>branded as not the best judge of talent in these circumstances.

0:42:47.200 --> 0:42:50.440
<v Speaker 1>And I think when you see the voting results and

0:42:50.520 --> 0:42:54.600
<v Speaker 1>we get these various player names, various guys getting All

0:42:54.600 --> 0:42:58.560
<v Speaker 1>Star votes that clearly should not, it lets you know

0:42:58.640 --> 0:43:01.759
<v Speaker 1>why the league keeps asking the media to vote on

0:43:01.800 --> 0:43:05.000
<v Speaker 1>so many things, because nobody's going to do it perfect.

0:43:05.719 --> 0:43:08.799
<v Speaker 1>Whoever is voting, people are going to take issue with it.

0:43:08.800 --> 0:43:12.000
<v Speaker 1>If it was one hundred percent at fan vote, people

0:43:12.000 --> 0:43:15.120
<v Speaker 1>would sit here and complain about player A, B or

0:43:15.160 --> 0:43:18.200
<v Speaker 1>C being left off. When the coaches pick the reserves,

0:43:18.440 --> 0:43:21.080
<v Speaker 1>we're going to have a huge discussion about snubs. It's

0:43:21.120 --> 0:43:25.000
<v Speaker 1>the way it always is, no matter who's doing the voting.

0:43:25.080 --> 0:43:28.880
<v Speaker 1>But I think history shows that the media as a

0:43:28.880 --> 0:43:34.640
<v Speaker 1>collective is quite responsible and tries to bring the most

0:43:35.040 --> 0:43:38.960
<v Speaker 1>objective lens to this as you can, and of course

0:43:39.040 --> 0:43:41.400
<v Speaker 1>I'm saying it as biased as you possibly can as

0:43:41.400 --> 0:43:44.000
<v Speaker 1>a member of the media, but again, look at the results.

0:43:44.120 --> 0:43:47.600
<v Speaker 1>I think Anthony Edwards and Jalen Brunson do have very

0:43:47.640 --> 0:43:49.680
<v Speaker 1>strong cases to be All Star starters.

0:43:50.120 --> 0:43:55.200
<v Speaker 2>And again aside from not aside from these votes potentially

0:43:55.280 --> 0:43:58.000
<v Speaker 2>swing if you're a starter or not, you know it

0:43:58.080 --> 0:44:01.520
<v Speaker 2>has financial implications a well, you know, players have bonuses

0:44:01.560 --> 0:44:03.520
<v Speaker 2>for being an All Star starter, so you plan with

0:44:03.560 --> 0:44:06.280
<v Speaker 2>your money. So essentially, players, you're playing with your own money.

0:44:06.840 --> 0:44:09.879
<v Speaker 1>Like I said, I generally save most of my entergy

0:44:09.960 --> 0:44:12.520
<v Speaker 1>in terms of getting worked up about All Star matters.

0:44:12.560 --> 0:44:16.200
<v Speaker 1>I save most of my energy for the reserves because

0:44:16.239 --> 0:44:19.920
<v Speaker 1>that's where the coaches are doing it, and emotion is

0:44:19.920 --> 0:44:22.400
<v Speaker 1>supposed to be taken out of it completely, and they're

0:44:22.440 --> 0:44:27.200
<v Speaker 1>really supposed to be grading guys on performance, and then

0:44:27.200 --> 0:44:29.839
<v Speaker 1>the whole team's success comes into the equation and we're

0:44:29.880 --> 0:44:32.720
<v Speaker 1>going to have a great argument about who got snubbed.

0:44:33.400 --> 0:44:37.600
<v Speaker 1>But year after year with the players voting, we see

0:44:37.640 --> 0:44:41.880
<v Speaker 1>some wild votes cast let's.

0:44:41.640 --> 0:44:44.600
<v Speaker 2>Say, just throwing them away, That's what's happening.

0:44:44.719 --> 0:44:47.440
<v Speaker 1>Just throwing it away, all right, That is going to

0:44:47.560 --> 0:44:53.880
<v Speaker 1>do it for this edition of this league, uncut. And yeah,

0:44:54.040 --> 0:44:57.480
<v Speaker 1>I'm glad that that. I'm glad that that anniversary date

0:44:57.560 --> 0:45:00.239
<v Speaker 1>popped into my head before we signed off because next

0:45:00.280 --> 0:45:03.480
<v Speaker 1>week we will have two more episodes of This League Uncut.

0:45:03.840 --> 0:45:07.480
<v Speaker 1>I have not yet been apprized of Chris Haynes's travel

0:45:07.520 --> 0:45:09.919
<v Speaker 1>schedule for next week, whether he's working one or two

0:45:09.960 --> 0:45:13.360
<v Speaker 1>games on the TNT sidelines, but we're gonna work around

0:45:13.880 --> 0:45:19.000
<v Speaker 1>whatever travel is thrown his way to bring you two episodes.

0:45:19.080 --> 0:45:20.000
<v Speaker 2>Let me let me announce it.

0:45:20.080 --> 0:45:21.080
<v Speaker 1>Yes, please share this.

0:45:21.200 --> 0:45:24.520
<v Speaker 2>Let me announce it. So I have I have Philly

0:45:25.280 --> 0:45:30.080
<v Speaker 2>at Golden State on Tuesday. Golden State, Philly, Golden State

0:45:30.120 --> 0:45:34.200
<v Speaker 2>on Tuesday. That's for TNT Dan Sty Right after that,

0:45:34.840 --> 0:45:37.680
<v Speaker 2>it's not a TNT game. I'm hopping on a plane

0:45:37.680 --> 0:45:42.000
<v Speaker 2>early in the morning. I'm head to Portland the Bucks

0:45:42.280 --> 0:45:44.400
<v Speaker 2>Portland Dames return.

0:45:44.719 --> 0:45:49.880
<v Speaker 1>How did I forget that? January thirty first. January thirtieth

0:45:50.120 --> 0:45:53.280
<v Speaker 1>is the one year anniversary of this League Uncut. January

0:45:53.320 --> 0:45:58.920
<v Speaker 1>thirty first, Damian Lillard plays as a visitor at the

0:45:58.920 --> 0:46:02.240
<v Speaker 1>Moda Center the first time, and I knew you would

0:46:02.239 --> 0:46:05.920
<v Speaker 1>be there, so you know what. We will have at

0:46:06.000 --> 0:46:10.840
<v Speaker 1>least one pod before those two TV assignments, But something

0:46:10.880 --> 0:46:14.280
<v Speaker 1>tells me we will have to wait for the second

0:46:14.400 --> 0:46:19.399
<v Speaker 1>pod next week, the first official pod of year two

0:46:20.280 --> 0:46:24.040
<v Speaker 1>of this league uncut. We will wait till after you

0:46:25.480 --> 0:46:29.439
<v Speaker 1>cover that Bucks at Blazers game, because I know your

0:46:29.480 --> 0:46:35.120
<v Speaker 1>notebook will be bursting after that trip to the Pacific Northwest.

0:46:36.520 --> 0:46:39.719
<v Speaker 2>Looking very forward. Flying Pie Pizza, if you guys are

0:46:39.719 --> 0:46:43.320
<v Speaker 2>ever in Portland, the best pizza in the country, Flying

0:46:43.520 --> 0:46:44.560
<v Speaker 2>Pie for real.

0:46:44.880 --> 0:46:46.560
<v Speaker 1>I've never heard you bring that up before.

0:46:47.920 --> 0:46:49.760
<v Speaker 2>I want are you being outcast?

0:46:49.840 --> 0:46:51.839
<v Speaker 1>I'm being one hundred percent. I've never heard you bring

0:46:51.840 --> 0:46:55.680
<v Speaker 1>that up before. I want pictures and a full We're

0:46:55.680 --> 0:46:57.520
<v Speaker 1>gonna do ten we might have to do ten minutes

0:46:57.520 --> 0:46:59.640
<v Speaker 1>on We might have to do ten minutes on pizza

0:46:59.640 --> 0:47:03.399
<v Speaker 1>next week. If you're that you feel that strongly about it.

0:47:03.400 --> 0:47:06.560
<v Speaker 2>Hey, urinals and pizza.

0:47:06.920 --> 0:47:08.919
<v Speaker 1>So done with urinals. I don't even want to hear

0:47:08.960 --> 0:47:12.840
<v Speaker 1>the word until Steve Balmer is on this show. Pizza.

0:47:13.200 --> 0:47:16.279
<v Speaker 1>We can talk about that all day. We can do

0:47:16.320 --> 0:47:18.600
<v Speaker 1>a separate pizza pod. If you want to do a

0:47:18.640 --> 0:47:23.520
<v Speaker 1>best Pizza on the NBA Map Show, we can tackle that.

0:47:23.560 --> 0:47:26.440
<v Speaker 1>Because you're not mine, because my my pick is my

0:47:26.520 --> 0:47:28.160
<v Speaker 1>pick will surprise you, but I do not. I am

0:47:28.160 --> 0:47:30.759
<v Speaker 1>not aware. I am not aware of this pizza in

0:47:30.800 --> 0:47:32.560
<v Speaker 1>Portland that you're touting. So now I'm.

0:47:32.560 --> 0:47:36.520
<v Speaker 2>Flying pod I'm curious Stein. When we do this, I'm talking,

0:47:36.880 --> 0:47:40.160
<v Speaker 2>when we do talk about pizza, a certain region in

0:47:40.239 --> 0:47:43.839
<v Speaker 2>this great country of ours will be very pissed off

0:47:43.880 --> 0:47:46.479
<v Speaker 2>at me. And I mean, i'm gonna say it, the

0:47:46.520 --> 0:47:49.799
<v Speaker 2>Midwest don't mess with those pizza ste I don't mess

0:47:49.840 --> 0:47:50.480
<v Speaker 2>with it.

0:47:50.680 --> 0:47:53.080
<v Speaker 1>The whole Midwest. Get the whole Midwest.

0:47:54.440 --> 0:47:56.160
<v Speaker 2>I'm really talking about Chicago staff.

0:47:57.000 --> 0:47:58.160
<v Speaker 1>I'm not either. I'm with you.

0:47:58.239 --> 0:48:01.880
<v Speaker 2>I'm not. I'm not. It's bunch of cheese, just just cheese.

0:48:01.960 --> 0:48:05.359
<v Speaker 1>It's cheesy. I am a thin crust devote so I'm

0:48:05.360 --> 0:48:08.120
<v Speaker 1>with you on that. All right. That will do it

0:48:09.120 --> 0:48:12.799
<v Speaker 1>for this edition of This League Uncut. As always, we

0:48:12.920 --> 0:48:16.840
<v Speaker 1>remind you to please follow the show, rate the show,

0:48:17.480 --> 0:48:21.839
<v Speaker 1>review the show, Apple, Spotify, wherever you get your podcasts.

0:48:21.840 --> 0:48:26.000
<v Speaker 1>A five star review would be greatly appreciated. If you

0:48:26.120 --> 0:48:31.160
<v Speaker 1>have comments on anything we've discussed here today, including and

0:48:31.200 --> 0:48:35.120
<v Speaker 1>maybe especially pizza, we welcome those as well. We'll be

0:48:35.239 --> 0:48:39.040
<v Speaker 1>back with you next week with two more editions. Cannot

0:48:39.080 --> 0:48:43.799
<v Speaker 1>believe this humble little enterprise is turning two years old.

0:48:44.480 --> 0:48:48.319
<v Speaker 1>Thank you producer Ryan, Thank you mister Haynes for carrying me.

0:48:48.600 --> 0:48:55.280
<v Speaker 1>We'll all be back with you. Very soon, and that'll

0:48:55.280 --> 0:48:55.879
<v Speaker 1>do it for us.

0:48:56.160 --> 0:48:57.000
<v Speaker 2>See you next time.

0:48:58.640 --> 0:49:01.160
<v Speaker 1>This league Uncut is and Heart Radio Production.

0:49:02.800 --> 0:49:03.839
<v Speaker 2>P suck a lock up

0:49:05.680 --> 0:49:07.440
<v Speaker 1>Chris Hanes and Mark Stein