WEBVTT - Life Changing Lessons with Brené Brown 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:02.720 Hey, fam I'm Jada Pinkett Smith and this is the 0:00:02.759 --> 0:00:06.080 Red Table Talk Podcast, all your favorite episodes from the 0:00:06.120 --> 0:00:10.280 Facebook watch show in audio, produced by Westbrook Audio and 0:00:10.360 --> 0:00:13.360 I Heart Radio. Please don't forget to rate and review 0:00:13.680 --> 0:00:18.680 on Apple Podcast. The Smith household has been buzzing on 0:00:18.800 --> 0:00:21.000 this Red Table Talk. I'm with you in the pain 0:00:21.160 --> 0:00:24.360 up coming. Oh my god, like I never even saw 0:00:24.400 --> 0:00:27.320 it that way. I forgive you real talk with the 0:00:27.400 --> 0:00:30.520 brilliant Renee Brown. If you're not want to talk about this, 0:00:30.640 --> 0:00:36.920 I'm gonna piss you off. Afraid, five best selling books, 0:00:36.920 --> 0:00:40.560 over a hundred million views for her groundbreaking talks. That 0:00:41.200 --> 0:00:44.920 is it. My mind was blown. She has spent two 0:00:44.960 --> 0:00:50.320 decades studying shame, guilt, and vulnerability. Find out how they 0:00:50.360 --> 0:00:53.639 may be holding you back. This is about you, This 0:00:53.680 --> 0:00:57.160 is about who you want to be. This is what's 0:00:57.200 --> 0:00:59.880 so powerful about your show. You would never have talked 0:00:59.880 --> 0:01:11.240 to about this fifty years ago. All right, this is 0:01:11.240 --> 0:01:14.560 a special one, lady. I've got our girl, Renee Brown, 0:01:14.720 --> 0:01:17.360 finally coming. We've been trying to have Burnee forever. I'm 0:01:17.400 --> 0:01:22.000 so excited. Yeah, she's gonna be a good one. She's amazing. Yeah. 0:01:22.280 --> 0:01:27.480 For me, it's perfect timing. Yeah, that's perfect. Yeahs have 0:01:27.600 --> 0:01:31.560 been going on in game's life. You need a little 0:01:31.600 --> 0:01:35.959 assistance here. Okay, all right, let's walk to the same ladies. 0:01:37.160 --> 0:01:41.080 My whole household is buzzing. Okay. We have been looking 0:01:41.160 --> 0:01:44.000 forward to this red table for a long time. Our 0:01:44.080 --> 0:01:48.680 special guest is beloved and brilliant, and we've been writing 0:01:48.720 --> 0:01:56.240 our burning questions for her all weeking. Welcome, Berne, Welcome. 0:01:58.080 --> 0:02:02.880 First of all, thank you for coming. I cannot tell 0:02:02.960 --> 0:02:07.960 you the Smith household love has been buzzing. I think 0:02:08.000 --> 0:02:11.240 if let me tell you will get so excited. Last 0:02:11.320 --> 0:02:13.519 night when I told him that you were, I guess 0:02:13.520 --> 0:02:16.640 she's coming here. He wanted me to tell you that 0:02:16.720 --> 0:02:19.280 he's such a big fan and he loves the story 0:02:19.400 --> 0:02:23.840 that you tell about your husband at the lake. Yeah. Man, Yeah, 0:02:24.040 --> 0:02:27.480 this sentence that's been floating in my data for years 0:02:27.560 --> 0:02:30.200 kept coming to my head, which is the story I'm 0:02:30.200 --> 0:02:33.680 telling myself. Yes, my husband was being weird to me 0:02:33.720 --> 0:02:36.240 in the lake and it was really long. It was 0:02:36.280 --> 0:02:38.680 just kind of this long swim and I had on 0:02:38.720 --> 0:02:41.000 a speedo and we were working out and we're both 0:02:41.000 --> 0:02:43.720 ex competitive swimmers, and I hadn't worn a speedo in 0:02:43.760 --> 0:02:47.280 a lot of years, and I was trying to connect 0:02:47.280 --> 0:02:49.040 with him and he kept kind of blowing me off. 0:02:49.080 --> 0:02:51.640 And so the story I was making up is that 0:02:51.880 --> 0:02:53.680 it was either like, oh my god, she does not 0:02:53.760 --> 0:02:55.880 rock a speedo like she did twenty five years and 0:02:55.919 --> 0:03:00.840 two kids ago, or she's all And so I just 0:03:00.880 --> 0:03:02.280 looked at him and I said, look, the story I'm 0:03:02.320 --> 0:03:06.240 telling myself right now is that you think I look 0:03:06.240 --> 0:03:09.480 awful or you think I'm old. And it turned out 0:03:09.520 --> 0:03:11.560 that he was actually in the middle of a panic 0:03:11.600 --> 0:03:14.280 attack on the lake that day. He was having his 0:03:14.360 --> 0:03:17.600 own struggles. Appearance and body image are still the number 0:03:17.639 --> 0:03:20.200 one shame triggers for women, so when we make up stories, 0:03:20.680 --> 0:03:24.040 they're often about that. When I first heard that story, 0:03:24.120 --> 0:03:28.080 it was like wow, Like my mind was blown. We 0:03:28.200 --> 0:03:30.920 just can't see what the other person is feeling or thinking. 0:03:31.200 --> 0:03:33.320 We make up stories, and the stories we make up 0:03:33.639 --> 0:03:36.760 are self protective in nature, and that's that's the thing. 0:03:36.880 --> 0:03:39.880 That was the person that would have the story in 0:03:39.960 --> 0:03:45.040 my head and claim it as true and keep it right, 0:03:45.400 --> 0:03:49.320 and I'm making decisions based on it. When I got 0:03:49.320 --> 0:03:54.440 the courage to at least be vulnerable enough to talk 0:03:54.480 --> 0:03:57.560 about the story in my head. I got to see 0:03:58.280 --> 0:04:02.280 the power of vulnerability. We keep on talking about that word. 0:04:02.680 --> 0:04:05.480 Is there a simple way for you to just break 0:04:05.520 --> 0:04:10.840 down what that V word means? Yes, And there's a 0:04:10.920 --> 0:04:12.880 lot of complicated V words, and it's one of the 0:04:12.920 --> 0:04:17.520 most complicated words. Ye. So the definition of vulnerability is 0:04:17.800 --> 0:04:22.400 the emotion that we experience in times of uncertainty, risk, 0:04:22.640 --> 0:04:29.960 and emotional exposure. Examples vulnerability the first date after my divorce, 0:04:30.960 --> 0:04:34.960 saying I love you, first, trying to get pregnant after 0:04:35.000 --> 0:04:38.679 my second miscarriage. I knew early on in my work 0:04:38.760 --> 0:04:41.640 that vulnerability was the birthplace of courage. I knew that 0:04:41.720 --> 0:04:44.480 courage didn't exist without it. And so when you think 0:04:44.480 --> 0:04:49.400 about what y'all do at red table talk uncertain you 0:04:49.440 --> 0:04:51.200 don't know the way the conversation is going to go 0:04:51.600 --> 0:05:00.480 totally risk and emotional exposure. Yeah, got him all three, 0:05:01.680 --> 0:05:04.799 I'll tell you. But I we we definitely be trying 0:05:04.800 --> 0:05:08.960 to practice vulnerability over here. I definitely. I've definitely had 0:05:09.040 --> 0:05:12.000 some moments where I've been at this table going what 0:05:12.200 --> 0:05:14.800 do I say this? Do I say this? Do I 0:05:14.880 --> 0:05:17.120 say When was the last time that you felt like 0:05:17.200 --> 0:05:21.039 you were being most vulnerable definitely when I talked about 0:05:21.080 --> 0:05:24.520 my self harm. Honestly feel like I lost my sanity 0:05:24.520 --> 0:05:29.240 at one Okay, yeah, it was after that whole with 0:05:29.360 --> 0:05:32.440 my hair thing and I was kind of like just 0:05:32.480 --> 0:05:36.400 in this gray area of like who am I? Like 0:05:36.640 --> 0:05:38.760 is there? Like do I have a purpose? And I 0:05:38.839 --> 0:05:42.479 was just like plunged into this like black hole and 0:05:42.600 --> 0:05:47.560 I was like cutting myself? What cutting yourself? Wet on 0:05:47.640 --> 0:05:50.040 my wrist? I mean you can't even see it, but 0:05:50.120 --> 0:05:53.960 like there's still a little something there, but like totally 0:05:54.000 --> 0:05:58.839 lost my sanity for a moment there. Wow, looking back, 0:05:58.880 --> 0:06:01.520 it makes me feel even stronger because so many people 0:06:01.960 --> 0:06:04.160 d M me or or talk to me and we're 0:06:04.200 --> 0:06:06.920 like wow, like that really helped me about you game? 0:06:07.320 --> 0:06:11.760 For me? The one on addiction, there was a power 0:06:17.040 --> 0:06:23.560 that God had been thank God had been doing me 0:06:24.440 --> 0:06:31.800 through all it, and I just said let go and 0:06:31.920 --> 0:06:39.760 surrender so that I could see what he was people. 0:06:40.240 --> 0:06:44.000 I can't even get it up, you know. It was 0:06:44.080 --> 0:06:48.279 really one where I felt really exposed. Yeah, what about you? 0:06:48.320 --> 0:06:51.040 I would say for me, it would be the last 0:06:51.160 --> 0:06:55.960 r T we're gonna start with. This is a very 0:06:56.000 --> 0:07:03.720 personal journey that became very public. Yes, full blast no, 0:07:03.960 --> 0:07:09.760 I I was feeling and just the total breakdown of 0:07:09.800 --> 0:07:13.640 any masks that you know, But I was much courage. 0:07:13.680 --> 0:07:15.440 I want to put it on the table. Yes, yeah, 0:07:15.600 --> 0:07:18.560 I'm so proud of you to be able to see 0:07:18.600 --> 0:07:22.200 you and Dad do that. For me, that was like, Okay, 0:07:22.240 --> 0:07:25.240 that's real deal. That's real love. Like when you can 0:07:25.280 --> 0:07:27.080 be like I'm with you, I'm gonna stand by you 0:07:27.680 --> 0:07:31.040 and I'm gonna hold your hand because I love you. 0:07:31.640 --> 0:07:35.280 That's what we do and that that's really important. But then, 0:07:35.560 --> 0:07:38.160 you know, when I'm talking about all this brune, then 0:07:38.200 --> 0:07:41.120 I start thinking about I get real caught up and 0:07:41.160 --> 0:07:46.240 have always been kind of overly concerned with what other 0:07:46.360 --> 0:07:51.960 people think of me. I've been sober for twenty oh 0:07:52.000 --> 0:07:55.680 my god, twenty four years, and a lot of times 0:07:55.720 --> 0:08:00.000 I have to literally choose, am I going to choose 0:08:00.040 --> 0:08:02.480 use my recovery or am I going to choose making 0:08:02.520 --> 0:08:06.440 people I don't even know feel better? And then when 0:08:06.440 --> 0:08:08.400 you find a quote and it changes your life, that 0:08:08.480 --> 0:08:10.560 it really there was my life before that and my 0:08:10.640 --> 0:08:14.800 life after the quote is it's not the critic who counts. 0:08:15.280 --> 0:08:17.200 It's not the man who points out how the strong 0:08:17.240 --> 0:08:19.520 man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have 0:08:19.520 --> 0:08:22.880 done it better. The credit actually belongs to the man 0:08:22.960 --> 0:08:26.320 in the arena, whose face is marred with sweat and 0:08:26.440 --> 0:08:31.880 dust blood, who strives valiantly, who airs again and again 0:08:31.920 --> 0:08:36.080 and again, and who in the end, while I'll change this, 0:08:36.280 --> 0:08:40.600 she may know the triumph of high achievement. At least 0:08:40.600 --> 0:08:46.960 when she fails, she's daring greatly. That is so powerful, 0:08:47.320 --> 0:08:50.400 And it's to me. Three things happen. One, I'm going 0:08:50.440 --> 0:08:52.880 to live my life in the arena. I'm going to 0:08:52.960 --> 0:08:55.640 be brave with my life, and that means choosing courage 0:08:55.640 --> 0:08:58.720 over comfort and pissing some people off sometimes. But I'm 0:08:58.760 --> 0:09:02.280 just not here for your purpose. I'm here for mine too. 0:09:03.160 --> 0:09:06.240 That quote is everything I've ever learned in twenty years 0:09:06.240 --> 0:09:09.920 of research about vulnerability. Vulnerability is not weakness. It's the 0:09:10.000 --> 0:09:13.600 courage to show up and be real when you can't 0:09:13.640 --> 0:09:17.920 control the outcome or what people think. And then the 0:09:18.000 --> 0:09:22.480 last one that really, I think really set me free 0:09:22.640 --> 0:09:25.720 in almost a dangerous way. But I love it, I 0:09:25.800 --> 0:09:29.680 really love it. Is if you are not in the 0:09:29.720 --> 0:09:33.360 arena getting your ass kicked on occasion, I'm not interested 0:09:33.400 --> 0:09:39.240 in your feedback. That right there, it's like, don't you 0:09:39.200 --> 0:09:41.840 you're not even part of this conversation, because if you 0:09:41.960 --> 0:09:45.120 actually are standing in that arena, you would this would 0:09:45.160 --> 0:09:48.280 be a whole different One of the things I wanted 0:09:48.280 --> 0:09:50.839 to ask you to, Brennan. A lot of times, when 0:09:50.880 --> 0:09:58.400 we're getting acquainted with vulnerability, it tends to be daunting. 0:09:58.880 --> 0:10:01.800 What would be some of the lessons that you could 0:10:01.880 --> 0:10:05.240 offer to people in those moments? But number one thing 0:10:05.240 --> 0:10:09.160 I've learned is one, we don't share vulnerability with everyone, right. 0:10:09.400 --> 0:10:12.040 We share our stories with people who have earned the 0:10:12.120 --> 0:10:16.200 right to hear them. So our vulnerability is not for everybody, Right, 0:10:16.679 --> 0:10:22.040 That's a privilege to hear that, right. Number Two, always 0:10:22.280 --> 0:10:27.320 examine your intention for sharing because, and this is a 0:10:27.360 --> 0:10:32.480 big one for me, I never share something that's vulnerable 0:10:32.640 --> 0:10:39.240 to me looking for a response. My healing has to 0:10:39.320 --> 0:10:42.280 be in my sharing, not what I hear bout. Okay, 0:10:42.520 --> 0:10:47.679 let's stop right there, let's start right there, because that 0:10:48.600 --> 0:10:54.360 is it. That is it so that when one is 0:10:54.440 --> 0:10:59.880 sharing their vulnerability, it is towards one's own healing and 0:11:00.160 --> 0:11:04.600 personal growth. Period. So no matter what the response may be, 0:11:04.960 --> 0:11:08.840 no matter how people react, at the end of the day, 0:11:09.000 --> 0:11:13.679 you're saying the fact that you took. That step is 0:11:13.800 --> 0:11:18.160 the win, and that's the thing to hold onto. Got it. 0:11:19.120 --> 0:11:24.400 Never tie your growth or your win to an outcome 0:11:24.520 --> 0:11:28.280 you can't control. There it is. That's it. That's right, 0:11:28.840 --> 0:11:32.440 that's it. So I know, Willow you you were really 0:11:32.480 --> 0:11:36.640 interested in Renee's work around shame. We talked about guilt 0:11:36.679 --> 0:11:39.280 and shame. The difference between shame and guilt is the 0:11:39.280 --> 0:11:42.920 difference between I am bad and I did something bad. 0:11:43.280 --> 0:11:45.839 So you go out on Thursday night, you drink too much, 0:11:45.880 --> 0:11:48.880 you're hungover, and you miss a really important meeting at 0:11:48.920 --> 0:11:53.040 work Friday morning, and yourself talk is, God, I'm an idiot, 0:11:53.120 --> 0:11:56.559 I'm such a loser. I'm such I'm such a zero 0:11:57.240 --> 0:12:03.000 shame or guilt shame focused on self, I'm I'm an idiot, 0:12:03.040 --> 0:12:07.040 I'm a loser. The guilt self talk is I can't 0:12:07.080 --> 0:12:09.720 believe I did that. That was a stupid thing to do. 0:12:11.280 --> 0:12:14.040 Not I am stupid, but that was a stupid thing 0:12:14.080 --> 0:12:17.640 to do. And here's the reason why the difference is huge. 0:12:18.040 --> 0:12:27.560 Shame is positively correlated with violence, addiction, aggression, eating disorders, suicide, bullying. 0:12:28.160 --> 0:12:31.280 I mean, across the board. In my field, we call 0:12:31.320 --> 0:12:36.439 it the master emotion. Not only is guilt not correlated 0:12:36.440 --> 0:12:40.240 with those outcomes, guilt seems to be a protective factor 0:12:40.400 --> 0:12:45.440 against those outcomes. Meaning if I am able to separate 0:12:46.120 --> 0:12:50.040 myself from a behavior and say, you know, I get 0:12:50.040 --> 0:12:53.360 back at an f on a paper, I'm not stupid, 0:12:53.760 --> 0:12:58.400 but not studying last night was stupid. And so guilt 0:12:59.000 --> 0:13:03.880 versus shame is it's it's everything. This is so interesting 0:13:03.880 --> 0:13:08.320 because I just had an experience in my own personal 0:13:08.400 --> 0:13:12.440 life that I went through something exactly like that, and 0:13:12.480 --> 0:13:17.360 I didn't even realize that I was experiencing both shame 0:13:17.559 --> 0:13:23.080 and guilt, and Rodney actually was and I didn't even 0:13:23.080 --> 0:13:25.160 realize he was doing it at the time until you 0:13:25.640 --> 0:13:29.720 just described needs her husband my husband, and he was like, well, 0:13:30.600 --> 0:13:33.800 you did a bad thing. You're not a bad person. 0:13:35.600 --> 0:13:40.640 What Rodney did that intervention is life changing. One of 0:13:40.679 --> 0:13:43.920 the things we've learned in the last probably, let's say 0:13:43.920 --> 0:13:49.200 five years, the brain processes social pain exactly like it 0:13:49.280 --> 0:13:53.680 processes physical pain. So if you spill boiling coffee on 0:13:53.720 --> 0:13:57.079 your hand, the same part of your brain lights up. 0:13:57.200 --> 0:14:01.280 As if I shame you or humiliate you, We're not 0:14:01.520 --> 0:14:07.719 wired for it. It destroys us. Why do people like 0:14:07.880 --> 0:14:14.000 shaming other people so much because it feels great. Because 0:14:14.000 --> 0:14:18.679 when we're in pain, it is a very lethal weapon 0:14:18.880 --> 0:14:23.800 for discharging our own pain and suffering. Shame is a 0:14:23.840 --> 0:14:30.880 tool of oppression, belittling, humiliating, dehumanizing the problem. What we 0:14:30.920 --> 0:14:36.160 don't understand is shame doesn't just destroy the victim of it. 0:14:36.960 --> 0:14:39.920 Shame destroys the person who uses it home and I 0:14:40.000 --> 0:14:43.120 think even more so you know what I mean? Yes, 0:14:44.400 --> 0:14:47.960 I think, you know I think of I rarely ever 0:14:48.040 --> 0:14:51.120 talk about this without getting emotional, but I was raised 0:14:51.120 --> 0:14:53.680 in a very shame based family. Um that was a 0:14:53.760 --> 0:14:56.880 parenting tool because let me tell you something, you can 0:14:57.080 --> 0:15:03.080 change a child's behavior on a die with shame at 0:15:03.120 --> 0:15:06.960 you not how to look. That could just diminish your kids. 0:15:07.640 --> 0:15:11.920 I mean like this because for children, shame is the 0:15:12.000 --> 0:15:18.240 threat of being unlovable, and so for children from newborns 0:15:18.240 --> 0:15:23.560 through about fourth or fifth grade, being unlovable actually means dying. 0:15:24.560 --> 0:15:29.240 So shame is the threat of not being caregiving. I 0:15:29.280 --> 0:15:35.200 can think about the times when I have used shame 0:15:35.560 --> 0:15:39.239 with one of my children, and it's the most devastating 0:15:39.680 --> 0:15:43.000 thing I can think of. And we're most likely to 0:15:43.160 --> 0:15:46.400 shame our children or anyone around us that has less 0:15:46.400 --> 0:15:51.200 power than us when we are either scared or we're 0:15:51.240 --> 0:15:54.360 in our own shame. It's something we're taught. Like the 0:15:54.400 --> 0:15:57.080 way that you just expressed that and paranting, I'm like, 0:15:57.200 --> 0:16:01.240 oh my god, Like I never even saw it that way. 0:16:01.800 --> 0:16:06.160 But I did really try, especially in raising Willow and 0:16:06.600 --> 0:16:10.840 trying not to put shame around her social development, you know, 0:16:10.920 --> 0:16:13.400 trying to raise a young woman and when a young 0:16:13.440 --> 0:16:21.280 woman goes through but not recognizing how tremntal that using 0:16:21.440 --> 0:16:28.320 shame as a parenting tool. Yeah, yeah, igives you. Forgive me, 0:16:28.400 --> 0:16:30.960 I do because I I remember, but I forgive you. 0:16:32.200 --> 0:16:34.960 I do. Where was an example when I was younger, 0:16:35.040 --> 0:16:37.440 like I would just get super emotional, and like I 0:16:37.440 --> 0:16:39.880 still get super emotional now, but you would look at 0:16:39.880 --> 0:16:42.160 me and you would just be like, yeah, you can cry, 0:16:42.200 --> 0:16:43.840 but like do it over like go to your room 0:16:43.840 --> 0:16:46.480 and do it over there, like like you pushing me 0:16:46.560 --> 0:16:50.280 away for crying. Was like, yeah, I'm a bad person 0:16:50.320 --> 0:16:53.080 for crying that. I did have a lot of those 0:16:53.120 --> 0:16:55.480 moments when I was like oh no, no, no, oh no, 0:16:56.280 --> 0:16:58.840 we're not gonna do that. And then they had a 0:16:58.880 --> 0:17:01.160 lot to do with me being able to handle my 0:17:01.200 --> 0:17:03.840 own tears totally. Do you see that in something and 0:17:03.880 --> 0:17:06.840 how I raised you? Because I mean I definitely was 0:17:06.880 --> 0:17:10.040 the kind of parents. Again we had no vulnerability and 0:17:10.800 --> 0:17:13.880 well we couldn't though, you know just an hour. I mean, 0:17:13.880 --> 0:17:18.760 but I was. She was talking about the look. I 0:17:18.760 --> 0:17:21.520 don't know how we did that, but that's all it took. 0:17:22.000 --> 0:17:25.520 We were so good at that in our family, so good, 0:17:25.600 --> 0:17:28.520 like you know. She gave me that the other and 0:17:28.560 --> 0:17:31.800 I was like, I'm grown. Why is my heart calcitating? 0:17:32.240 --> 0:17:34.320 She gave me the look and I'm like looking at 0:17:34.359 --> 0:17:37.240 her and I'm like, but I'm grown, but I'm grown 0:17:37.240 --> 0:17:44.480 in my heart's like I am grown? I am I have, 0:17:45.000 --> 0:17:47.359 I have that look and I'm just gonna admit it 0:17:47.440 --> 0:17:52.200 here for everybody. I can be scary when I'm scared. Yeah, 0:17:52.760 --> 0:17:54.960 I had to check myself when I'm scared. I did 0:17:54.960 --> 0:17:59.240 a look the other day. My head said that makes 0:17:59.280 --> 0:18:02.040 my eye is water, like I'm afraid when you do 0:18:02.119 --> 0:18:04.080 that look, because it's like a look I had growing up, 0:18:04.200 --> 0:18:07.600 Like it's like they get your together or elsewhere? Why 0:18:07.640 --> 0:18:14.520 am now? Or else Dad's way was don't collapse. Would 0:18:14.560 --> 0:18:17.280 look at me and say, don't collapse and I would 0:18:17.280 --> 0:18:20.119 be looking at him like yeah and trying not to 0:18:20.280 --> 0:18:23.439 break down, like this is what's so powerful about your 0:18:23.480 --> 0:18:27.159 show that you would never have talked about this fifty 0:18:27.240 --> 0:18:31.240 years ago. Absolutely not right, I mean absolutely, And let 0:18:31.280 --> 0:18:35.120 me tell you something else. Had you not shamed your children, 0:18:35.520 --> 0:18:40.159 you would have been shamed by your friends. One of 0:18:40.200 --> 0:18:42.200 my favorite people in the world as my grandmother Ellen. 0:18:42.680 --> 0:18:45.040 She died, but I named my daughter after her, and 0:18:45.080 --> 0:18:46.800 there's a picture of her that I have that I 0:18:46.920 --> 0:18:50.520 keep very close by. She's nine months pregnant and she's 0:18:50.560 --> 0:18:53.160 got a cigarette in one hand and a melomine ashtray 0:18:53.240 --> 0:18:58.960 balancing on her big belly. It reminds me that don't 0:18:59.160 --> 0:19:04.800 hold people responsible for information they didn't have. People were 0:19:04.840 --> 0:19:07.880 mostly doing the very best they could, where some people 0:19:07.960 --> 0:19:11.760 just terrible people. Yes, but in this case, people you 0:19:12.000 --> 0:19:15.800 shame because it was how we parent. I'm actually glad though, 0:19:15.840 --> 0:19:18.159 because I was over the top at some points in 0:19:18.200 --> 0:19:22.400 my in my childhood career. I do recognize those moments, 0:19:22.960 --> 0:19:24.320 you know, and it just had a lot to do 0:19:24.440 --> 0:19:27.120 with me not being able to handle my own vulnerability 0:19:27.160 --> 0:19:29.679 at that time, just growing up in the environments we 0:19:29.720 --> 0:19:33.240 grew up, you know, and it's a different playing field now, Yeah, 0:19:33.240 --> 0:19:37.000 because I think we equated being vulnerable with being weak, 0:19:37.400 --> 0:19:41.520 and yeah, not just weak, dangerous. Yeah, we would be 0:19:41.640 --> 0:19:46.600 negligent not to talk about this safety as a prerequisite 0:19:46.640 --> 0:19:51.560 for vulnerability. Yeah, and so I can assure you that 0:19:51.960 --> 0:19:56.720 as a white woman, I have way more permission to 0:19:56.720 --> 0:20:01.080 be vulnerable than a black person any person of color. 0:20:01.720 --> 0:20:08.960 Privilege is real, and taking the armor off in this 0:20:09.080 --> 0:20:15.680 country for everyone is not safe. That's hugely important. Trauma 0:20:15.960 --> 0:20:21.800 kills vulnerability, whether that trauma is abuse or neglect, or racism, 0:20:22.000 --> 0:20:29.160 or poverty or homophobia. It makes vulnerability dangerous For me 0:20:29.240 --> 0:20:32.200 and my own personal experience, I've realized that I've had 0:20:32.280 --> 0:20:35.520 to learn how to create safety within If you could 0:20:35.560 --> 0:20:40.520 give just a little bit around how one can feel 0:20:41.440 --> 0:20:45.679 safe enough with themselves. This came up so much in 0:20:45.720 --> 0:20:49.640 our research on trust it kind of shocked me. What 0:20:49.680 --> 0:20:53.320 we know from the data is that when we experience 0:20:53.400 --> 0:20:57.560 a setback or failure or heartbreak, the first casualty of 0:20:57.600 --> 0:21:00.480 that is self trust. So we're like, I don't trust 0:21:00.520 --> 0:21:02.399 myself anymore to take care of myself to make the 0:21:02.480 --> 0:21:05.560 right decisions. I have a lot of that. Yeah, Yeah, 0:21:05.600 --> 0:21:08.359 it's hard and the biggest threat to self trust is 0:21:08.400 --> 0:21:12.879 do I choose to betray myself over making someone else 0:21:12.960 --> 0:21:20.760 feel uncomfortable or disappointed. So every time we choose ourselves, 0:21:21.720 --> 0:21:25.320 we have to stop and recognize it. Got it, Like 0:21:25.560 --> 0:21:30.080 I chose to take care of me right now, right, 0:21:30.200 --> 0:21:34.200 So you're saying every choice that you make and taking 0:21:34.240 --> 0:21:40.240 care of yourself slowly builds that internal self trust that 0:21:40.280 --> 0:21:42.399 makes all the sense and the word. But let me 0:21:42.440 --> 0:21:45.880 ask this though, it can if there ever a time 0:21:45.960 --> 0:21:49.800 where there's too much of that, because sometimes I think 0:21:49.840 --> 0:21:54.280 that you take on so much. Well, I think that's 0:21:54.320 --> 0:21:57.520 part of my codependency as well, because I don't want 0:21:57.520 --> 0:22:01.720 to burden anybody, right, you know, I'm I want to 0:22:01.720 --> 0:22:04.520 help everybody, but I damn sure don't want anybody to 0:22:04.520 --> 0:22:09.399 feel like they gotta help me. Right, So is it? Now? 0:22:09.480 --> 0:22:11.439 Let's talk about that because you just put your hand up. 0:22:11.920 --> 0:22:14.719 Let's talk about that for saying so is that or not? 0:22:14.840 --> 0:22:18.000 You do not want to talk about this? You do 0:22:18.080 --> 0:22:20.639 not want to talk about this? We should go on you. 0:22:20.720 --> 0:22:22.560 I'm gonna piss you off. You you should go the 0:22:22.600 --> 0:22:25.200 next topic. Next topic I'm gonna walk is all the 0:22:25.240 --> 0:22:29.879 way back to the uncomfortable part. All right, this is terrible. 0:22:29.920 --> 0:22:32.240 This is me. So I'm with you in the pain 0:22:32.280 --> 0:22:41.560 that's coming. So any strength out of whack can become 0:22:41.600 --> 0:22:51.000 a form of armor. Yeah, independence is great, but it's 0:22:51.000 --> 0:22:55.640 actually not neurobiologically how we're wired. We're actually wired for interdependence, 0:22:55.800 --> 0:22:59.280 not codependence, and not dependence, but interdependence. We need each other. 0:22:59.640 --> 0:23:01.640 We're not meant to do it alone. It's not how 0:23:01.680 --> 0:23:08.240 we're built. So the problem with the helpers, I'll just 0:23:08.320 --> 0:23:13.720 i'll talk about me is that if you can't receive 0:23:14.600 --> 0:23:19.520 help with an open heart, you're never really giving it 0:23:19.560 --> 0:23:26.320 with an open heart. So now I mean it is 0:23:26.400 --> 0:23:29.080 hard because what that means. So when I when that 0:23:29.240 --> 0:23:32.119 emerged from the data, I was like, f you, Like, 0:23:32.240 --> 0:23:35.760 I'm I'm out, Like like this is just it does 0:23:36.840 --> 0:23:40.320 because what happens is I was like, that's not true, 0:23:40.320 --> 0:23:44.480 because I'm the world's best helper. I help everybody. Then 0:23:44.520 --> 0:23:49.680 what I realized was I absolutely attached value to being 0:23:49.720 --> 0:23:54.879 the helper. Absolutely think there's more value in being the 0:23:54.920 --> 0:23:58.000 helper than being the help. There used to be like, 0:23:58.040 --> 0:24:01.000 if I'm not helping, what value you? I ask that 0:24:01.000 --> 0:24:04.600 that was me? Why is that my problem? Too, that's me. 0:24:05.000 --> 0:24:07.640 That has been a self worth issue. That's a that's 0:24:07.640 --> 0:24:10.720 a self worth issue. And so then I started asking 0:24:10.760 --> 0:24:13.880 for help. I'm the oldest of four and so I'm 0:24:13.920 --> 0:24:17.320 the one that anything. Anybody needs anything, until I fell 0:24:17.400 --> 0:24:19.440 apart and then I couldn't do it and I had 0:24:19.440 --> 0:24:21.760 to ask for help. And then I realized, Wow, I'm 0:24:21.760 --> 0:24:25.760 surrounded by loving capable, more capable than me and some 0:24:26.000 --> 0:24:29.879 and then I started receiving help and realized that takes 0:24:29.920 --> 0:24:33.879 a lot more vulnerability. Well, I got to start working 0:24:33.920 --> 0:24:35.960 on that thing. Because I don't I don't ask for help. 0:24:36.359 --> 0:24:41.879 I will definitely say in my relationship. I have to 0:24:41.880 --> 0:24:45.720 say that Will has just he just refuses not to help. 0:24:46.520 --> 0:24:49.640 He's just like, I don't care. I'm gonna be there 0:24:49.720 --> 0:24:52.760 because you need me, even if you don't know it. 0:24:53.920 --> 0:24:57.199 I'm going to inject myself in this because you need me. 0:24:57.200 --> 0:24:58.800 I'm like, no, no, no, no, I got this. I 0:24:58.800 --> 0:25:02.400 don't want you to doing anything. He's like, yeah, okay, yep, 0:25:02.560 --> 0:25:04.480 I'll be right there. Let me let me just let 0:25:04.480 --> 0:25:06.080 me just bring Beau. Steve's the same way. Let me 0:25:06.119 --> 0:25:08.600 just bring on Piste off Part two. Raise your hand 0:25:08.680 --> 0:25:10.840 if you're perpetually piste off because they're not doing enough 0:25:11.080 --> 0:25:13.760 and you're but you're not asking for anything, but like 0:25:13.359 --> 0:25:19.880 you like, yeah, the resentment this is, this is I'm 0:25:19.960 --> 0:25:25.159 so scared to yea, before we go Renee, I've got 0:25:25.240 --> 0:25:29.239 two family members really quick that we're like, there is 0:25:29.400 --> 0:25:33.720 no way that you are gonna have bnet come on, 0:25:34.760 --> 0:25:37.280 and we can't ask some questions. They have been here 0:25:37.359 --> 0:25:40.320 quarantining with us. So it's my sister in law and 0:25:40.400 --> 0:25:49.360 my niece Jay Trish. You guys here, what's that lady? 0:25:49.359 --> 0:25:52.760 This is my niece Jade and this is my sister 0:25:52.880 --> 0:25:57.000 in law Trish. So honored to meet you, so so 0:25:57.000 --> 0:26:00.240 so honored. I just love how transparent you are. So 0:26:00.480 --> 0:26:03.320 you want to go first? Yes. So I am a 0:26:03.359 --> 0:26:06.879 wife and a mother of three, and my entire life 0:26:06.920 --> 0:26:10.120 has been spent catering to the needs of my entire 0:26:10.160 --> 0:26:13.520 family and friends and everyone around, and I feel like 0:26:13.560 --> 0:26:18.080 I've always put everybody else before myself, and so now 0:26:18.240 --> 0:26:20.679 i feel like I'm low key going into like a 0:26:20.720 --> 0:26:25.320 midlife crisis because I'm finally seeing and understanding how I 0:26:25.400 --> 0:26:29.200 have to put myself first. I feel guilty sometimes because 0:26:30.000 --> 0:26:34.680 I feel like I'm being selfish and neglecting other feelings 0:26:34.720 --> 0:26:38.320 of my family. The journey that you're talking about was 0:26:38.440 --> 0:26:42.160 the hardest work maybe that I've ever done in my life. 0:26:42.240 --> 0:26:46.800 I have to agree. And Carl Young has this really 0:26:46.840 --> 0:26:50.800 powerful quote, the greatest tragedy for a child is the 0:26:50.880 --> 0:26:56.800