Speaker 1: The volume.
Speaker 2: We're this close to crowning and NBA champion. I like
Speaker 2: the Celtics, by the way. In six, Jalen Brown's going
Speaker 2: to be my MVP, and I love the Celtics in
Speaker 2: game one. But sign up ninety seconds put in the
Speaker 2: code Colins co l I N DraftKings sports book and
Speaker 2: official sports betting partner of the NBA. If you're a
Speaker 2: new customer, bet five bucks.
Speaker 1: That's it.
Speaker 2: Just bet five bucks and you'll get one hundred and
Speaker 2: fifty bucks instantly in bonus bets. The code Colins co
Speaker 2: l I N shows them that you're a new customer
Speaker 2: to get one hundred and fifty bucks in bonus bets
Speaker 2: only on DraftKings. The crown is yours. I'm leaning Celtics
Speaker 2: in six.
Speaker 3: Baby gambling problem called one eight hundred gambler or in
Speaker 3: West Virginia, visit one eight hundred gambler dot net. In
Speaker 3: New York call eight seven seven eight open wired text
Speaker 3: ope and y four six seven three six nine. In Connecticut,
Speaker 3: help is available for problem gambling. Call eight eight eight
Speaker 3: seven eight nine seven seven seven seven or visit CCPG
Speaker 3: dot org. Please play responsibly on behalf of boothill Casinomen
Speaker 3: resorting Kansas twenty one and over age varies by jurisdiction,
Speaker 3: Void and Ontario. Bonus bets expire one hundred and sixty
Speaker 3: eight hours after issuans. See DKG dot co slash bball
Speaker 3: for eligibility and depositive restrictions terms and responsible gaming resources.
Speaker 4: What's up, everybody? Welcome back to the Draymond Green Show.
Speaker 4: We are back with another episode of Champs Only, and
Speaker 4: today we have a five time champion, so I'll just
Speaker 4: shut up. Like as levels, you know, Shack always talk
Speaker 4: about the G fourteen classification and it being levels to
Speaker 4: different things, and.
Speaker 1: Quite frankly, this isn't a level I can really speak on.
Speaker 4: However, we got five time NBA champion, Los Angeles Laker legend,
Speaker 4: no other than the one and only Derek Fisher.
Speaker 1: D Fish. What's going on? My brother, man?
Speaker 5: Dre appreciate you you man, you are You are closer
Speaker 5: than most so and you're still ticking, so keep going
Speaker 5: and keep.
Speaker 6: Striving for it. Man, I'm you spoke of Shack.
Speaker 5: I wouldn't have three of mine without him, so it's
Speaker 5: definitely levels to it.
Speaker 1: Absolutely no, I appreciate you man. Number one.
Speaker 4: I appreciate you coming on the show. Uh, it's an
Speaker 4: honor for me. You know, I grew up I always
Speaker 4: tell people, I grew up as a Shakille O'Neill fan,
Speaker 4: Like I was my first my first jersey basketball jersey
Speaker 4: was an Orlando Magic Shaquille jersey. I had the Orlando
Speaker 4: Magic nightlight. I had to zip up Onesie Orlando Magic,
Speaker 4: like I was a Shaquille fan. Obviously, Shaq and left
Speaker 4: and joined the Lakers. And so I feel like I've
Speaker 4: watched your entire career, like career because when Shaq went
Speaker 4: to the Lakers, like I'm cheering for the Lakers, I'm
Speaker 4: everything like like Shack so And I feel like I've
Speaker 4: watched your entire career.
Speaker 1: And as number, I just want to say, as.
Speaker 4: A kid who didn't know, have a clue of what
Speaker 4: I was really watching you and we watched the game,
Speaker 4: and you love the game, right like you love Shocking,
Speaker 4: you love Kobe, and like when I think back to
Speaker 4: being that young kid watching y'all play, what I knew
Speaker 4: was just like fish make big shots, Like I don't
Speaker 4: care what else you talking.
Speaker 1: Fish make big shots. And when I go back and
Speaker 1: I watch.
Speaker 4: As an adult, as someone who actually understands the game
Speaker 4: of basketball. What you provided for that team from a
Speaker 4: leadership person, like actually going through the grind and like
Speaker 4: knowing what it takes and then like to look back.
Speaker 4: But the leadership you provided for that team, the selflessness
Speaker 4: you provided, the defense, the toughness you you were so
Speaker 4: much to that team that the I call myself the
Speaker 4: naked eye who really didn't know what was going on,
Speaker 4: Like you didn't have a clue, You're stupid, like me,
Speaker 4: like man deficient big shots, like because that's what you
Speaker 4: can see and like to look.
Speaker 1: Back and understand and know your impact on the game.
Speaker 4: Number one, I just want to say thank you for
Speaker 4: being who you are to the game of basketball. But
Speaker 4: number two, as somebody in your position, what what what
Speaker 4: was it like for you going through those championship runs?
Speaker 4: And when you're going through those championship runs, you know
Speaker 4: you don't quite get the credit for all the things
Speaker 4: that you're actually doing for that team.
Speaker 5: Yeah yeah, Now, well, first of all, thank you for
Speaker 5: breaking that down. I did not know the history of
Speaker 5: like how much you are really respecting and follow Shack
Speaker 5: and then followed him from Orlando to l A And
Speaker 5: I followed him from Little Rock.
Speaker 6: To to La myself. You know, him coming in.
Speaker 5: Free agency a couple of weeks after the draft changed
Speaker 5: my life forever, man, And so I appreciate you saying
Speaker 5: those things, and you know, honestly, for me, I think
Speaker 5: as a kid, like as you mentioned, like when you're
Speaker 5: watching the players that you love and respect the most,
Speaker 5: you start to internalize and visualize, like what success looks
Speaker 5: like for that person or the team that he plays on.
Speaker 5: And I was a Magic Johnson fan growing up, my
Speaker 5: all time favorite. But I knew I wasn't sixty nine.
Speaker 5: I knew I wasn't going to be Magic Johnson. But
Speaker 5: winning was like that was going to be my superpower.
Speaker 5: I knew I wasn't going to be the guy with
Speaker 5: the longest wingspan, the most height. I wasn't the most
Speaker 5: talented or skilled guy. But in those moments when my
Speaker 5: ego wanted to tell me to try to do more myself.
Speaker 6: I would have to try to pull.
Speaker 5: Myself back as a man and say, but bro, you
Speaker 5: want to win more than anything, because that's the only
Speaker 5: way you're actually going to get.
Speaker 6: The recognition that you feel like you do deserve.
Speaker 5: It's people got to look back like you said, and
Speaker 5: really see the impact that you provided that was not
Speaker 5: just statistical. And I mean those are real time conversations
Speaker 5: throughout the season, because there were nights where as you know,
Speaker 5: it's like, bro, don't play me.
Speaker 6: You don't think I can't do more.
Speaker 5: It's just just you're choosing not to do more in
Speaker 5: order to best allow for the team to be successful.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, And I know I know for me.
Speaker 4: Having stuff having a clay where it's like if nobody
Speaker 4: else appreciate you.
Speaker 1: Those guys like go to bat for me, those.
Speaker 4: Guys appreciate me, and so on those nights where it's like, man,
Speaker 4: I know I did way more than anybody's ever going
Speaker 4: to say than anybody's ever going to give.
Speaker 1: Me credit for.
Speaker 4: On those nights where you feel like it don't matter,
Speaker 4: it's the support and the love from those guys for
Speaker 4: me that kept me going.
Speaker 1: What was that like for you?
Speaker 4: From shock from cold Like on those nights that it's like, yo,
Speaker 4: I know the impact I just had, But nobody out
Speaker 4: there is going to say what was shock and cold
Speaker 4: like from that aspect?
Speaker 6: Yeah, No, that's a great question.
Speaker 5: I think they had, you know, two different perspectives on that,
Speaker 5: like Cobe and I came in as rookies the same year,
Speaker 5: and our relationship was forged on those stay ready days.
Speaker 5: You know, were playing four quart one on one. You know,
Speaker 5: we lifting weights together, We're doing conditioning together, and we
Speaker 5: really built that sweat equity with each other, and he
Speaker 5: saw where I came from. He didn't play a lot
Speaker 5: his first year. I didn't play a lot my first year,
Speaker 5: So there was that commonality we had that by the
Speaker 5: time we got to those championship years, he had seen
Speaker 5: my grind, so he appreciated all the little things that
Speaker 5: I had done along the way. He knew I could
Speaker 5: do more because every now and then I would score
Speaker 5: when when we played one on one, so he knew.
Speaker 5: I knew I could do a little more than I
Speaker 5: showed in the game at times. But he respected the
Speaker 5: impact that I had in all the intangible ways. And
Speaker 5: then I think for Shaq like I started to earn
Speaker 5: that trust from him. In my second season, Nick van
Speaker 5: Exell had had some knet issues and he was out
Speaker 5: for a couple of weeks and we went out on
Speaker 5: a big road trip Pacers Knicks at the Garden, kind
Speaker 5: of like an East Coast swing, and you know shot
Speaker 5: got double teamed against everybody we played basically, and in
Speaker 5: my first game as a starter, I remember an interview
Speaker 5: before the game with Brian Burdwell, who worked with TBS
Speaker 5: at the time, and he interviewed me, you know, he
Speaker 5: knows I'm nervous my first time started in the NBA,
Speaker 5: and I was like, Brian, look me, I don't care
Speaker 5: if I have two points in twenty assists.
Speaker 1: I just hope we win.
Speaker 6: I ended up having twenty points tis.
Speaker 5: Because Shaq was kicking it out when he was getting
Speaker 5: double team and that's when I started trusting that I
Speaker 5: could make big shots in the fourth quarter. I knew
Speaker 5: Shaq trusted me after that experience, and then that just
Speaker 5: carried throughout the rest of our career. But on nights
Speaker 5: when I didn't make big shots because he knew I could,
Speaker 5: he appreciated the fact that I didn't try to do
Speaker 5: too much and I always made sure the big dog
Speaker 5: got fed so that he would protect the house. And
Speaker 5: that that was that was our relationship the whole time.
Speaker 4: That's incredible, man, that's it just brings so many similarities
Speaker 4: for me because, like I said, the confidence, what Steph
Speaker 4: say to me, like yo, shoot like, let that one go.
Speaker 4: It's like all right, like that, Like it takes the
Speaker 4: confidence that much higher, knowing that the guy like Clay like, yo,
Speaker 4: why you ain't shoot that one? Like yeah, the guy
Speaker 4: They're like, yo, we want you shooting the basketball. What
Speaker 4: that does for the confidence is absolutely incredible. But this
Speaker 4: is champs only, so we must talk about, uh some
Speaker 4: about obviously a team that you played for, Dallas Mavericks
Speaker 4: and briefly, very brief, very very breed had a cup
Speaker 4: of coffee. I'd like to say Game four that uh,
Speaker 4: Dallas stays alive shocks me. I must say, you expect
Speaker 4: them to come out and play.
Speaker 1: Hard like they did.
Speaker 4: Uh, did not expect them to come out and get
Speaker 4: up fit, which crazy to see, but just getting into it,
Speaker 4: just straight into it, Like what was your what did
Speaker 4: you take away from that game? Very lopsided? But what
Speaker 4: was your initial takeaway? And just seeing game four?
Speaker 5: I mean, I did feel like Dallas could possibly win
Speaker 5: the game tonight, but not by fifty. You know, there's
Speaker 5: no way that I anticipated it would be that lopsided
Speaker 5: of a victory. I was asked by one of our
Speaker 5: parents on my high school team that I coached like,
Speaker 5: what did I think about the game, And I said,
Speaker 5: you know what, like, I do think Boston will struggle
Speaker 5: in this fourth game because they haven't been at that doorstep.
Speaker 5: They haven't been at three wins, and they see that
Speaker 5: fourth win right over the finish line, but it's still
Speaker 5: so far away, bro. As you know, like getting that
Speaker 5: fourth win is oftentimes be literally the hardest one that
Speaker 5: you've ever played in, and so I thought they would
Speaker 5: struggle with that. You know, mentally wouldn't necessarily understand how
Speaker 5: to play in that type of game. But I definitely
Speaker 5: didn't see Dallas smacking them up like that. My biggest
Speaker 5: takeaways thought that they played faster, and that to me
Speaker 5: was the biggest difference. I remember watching because sometimes faster
Speaker 5: can also equal greater force, right, And I remember watching
Speaker 5: last year when you talked to Steve and how you
Speaker 5: talk about how he always goes forces first, like X
Speaker 5: and OS is cool, but it's a fight, and whoever
Speaker 5: brings the force to the fight first normally is able
Speaker 5: to impose their will. And Dallas did that basically tonight,
Speaker 5: and Boston thought that they could ease into that and
Speaker 5: it was too late, man, But it was over before
Speaker 5: it really got started.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was that was very interesting.
Speaker 4: Like you said, Steve is always like yo, our number
Speaker 4: one adjustment is our.
Speaker 1: Force, and that was Dallas.
Speaker 4: Like, yeah, they played faster, but the points in the paint,
Speaker 4: like you looked up at halftime, I think Dallas was
Speaker 4: five for fifteen from three. Boston Celsius was five for
Speaker 4: nineteen from three, But if you looked at the points
Speaker 4: in the pain, it was like thirty four to twelve.
Speaker 4: I think at that point Dallas was out rebounding them
Speaker 4: by maybe fifteen or sixteen rebounds.
Speaker 1: That's all a force thing.
Speaker 4: Now my question to you, I have a question because
Speaker 4: obviously we've both been in the position when you look
Speaker 4: at that game and you say they beat them by
Speaker 4: forty eight points when you're Boston, are you coming back
Speaker 4: into that game now like we know that.
Speaker 1: Was a fluke, let's go ahead and close this out.
Speaker 4: Or are you a little shaky, like, man, I ain't
Speaker 4: know they can do that to us, like almost like
Speaker 4: you took a big hit of you boxing, Like what's
Speaker 4: your mindset now if you're Boston?
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think psychologically, I know it's talked about a
Speaker 5: lot like you when it's it's a blowout like that,
Speaker 5: it's almost easier to kind of get over and flush
Speaker 5: and move on from than like a close one. I
Speaker 5: do agree with that in theory, but I do think
Speaker 5: sometimes what happens, not that Boston didn't anticipate that Dallas
Speaker 5: was capable of beating them, but I think sometimes what happens,
Speaker 5: and you tell me what you think. In a blowout
Speaker 5: game like tonight, Tim Hardaway starts seeing the ball go
Speaker 5: in the basket. And when that starts to happen, now
Speaker 5: when you go to Boston and you need a fourth
Speaker 5: or fifth guy, Kyrie Luca, Dereck Jones Junior, PJ. Lively,
Speaker 5: and then all of a sudden, Tim Hardaway can run
Speaker 5: on nine ten points in one minute. That starts to
Speaker 5: change the situation a little bit. So I'm not saying
Speaker 5: I think the Celtics will obviously bring the records are
Speaker 5: forced to Game five, but Dallas for sure is a
Speaker 5: little more confident and they feel like, well, we're definitely
Speaker 5: gonna bring the force as well. And we got Tim
Speaker 5: Hardaway Junior feeling a little better. Dante ExHAM saw the
Speaker 5: ball going the basket a little bit. He's starting to
Speaker 5: feel more comfortable in the series. I think Boston is
Speaker 5: still close it out, but Dallas definitely Dallas feels better.
Speaker 5: I don't know if Boston feels surprised that they couldn't
Speaker 5: beat them, but I do think Dallas found some things
Speaker 5: that they might be able to take to the garden.
Speaker 6: That's just me.
Speaker 1: That's why this is Champs Only.
Speaker 4: Because listen, if you have not won a championship, I
Speaker 4: don't want to hear you talk about winning the championship
Speaker 4: or what happens in championship games. I quite frankly don't
Speaker 4: have the time for it. But this is the whole
Speaker 4: reason for Champs Only because when I'm watching that game, Fish,
Speaker 4: I'm sitting there watching that game, and I'm like, everybody's
Speaker 4: probably turned their TV off and you know, on about
Speaker 4: their day, like oh it's a blowout, And I'm sitting
Speaker 4: there watching that game, and I'm like, yo, Tim Hardaway
Speaker 4: and got going. This could be trouble for Boston because now,
Speaker 4: in true fashion, Jake Kid going to go to Tim
Speaker 4: Hardaway probably first second guy off the bench, just to
Speaker 4: see if it's something there, like to see if like
Speaker 4: oh if we found something, did Tim find this jump shot?
Speaker 4: If Tim found this jump shot? That's one more guy
Speaker 4: that can pull that defense outside. They're not plugging, they're
Speaker 4: not playing boxing elbows. When we got Luke and Kyrie
Speaker 4: trying to drive, he can extend that defense un And
Speaker 4: I'm sitting there watching that game, and I'm like, yo,
Speaker 4: this is a big mistake. They let Tim Hardaway get going,
Speaker 4: and sure enough there are forty five points.
Speaker 1: What play does ja here? Run out of the time? Out?
Speaker 4: Backscreen, downscreen, Tim Hardaway thrill and as you know, and
Speaker 4: then on the flip side, Peyton Pritcher was out there bombing,
Speaker 4: you know, And so the like, I don't people do
Speaker 4: not understand the mindset. Like I always tell our guys
Speaker 4: if there's ever a blowout, I go to our guys
Speaker 4: who's going in the game, and I say, listen, let
Speaker 4: anybody score, But you cannot let one or two guys
Speaker 4: that you know, like, oh, that guy's good enough to
Speaker 4: actually change the like, let those other three guys score,
Speaker 4: because if they score, those guys can't come to anything
Speaker 4: in the cities. But there's two guys out there right
Speaker 4: now that if they score a few buckets, they're going
Speaker 4: to feel better about them They're going to feel good
Speaker 4: about themselves. And now we're going to have to put
Speaker 4: that fire us and we don't want to have to
Speaker 4: put a fire out that we haven't had to put
Speaker 4: out all of this time.
Speaker 1: And they let Tim Hardaway get going. And man, I
Speaker 1: think that's true.
Speaker 5: I mean, and you know, sometimes people wonder, like, Okay,
Speaker 5: the other team took their starters out, why isn't coach
Speaker 5: taking his starters out out of there? Yes, and if
Speaker 5: Steve does it, there's other coaches that do it, Like
Speaker 5: He'll leave y'all in for another two three minutes. Because no, bro,
Speaker 5: we don't just like sprinkle some water on this fire.
Speaker 5: We're putting this fire all the way out. We're not
Speaker 5: gonna let it get going because we don't want them
Speaker 5: taking that psychology, that mindset into the next game. We
Speaker 5: want them thinking they have no shot of winning the
Speaker 5: next game, even if they are, you know, going to
Speaker 5: come out with the greatest forts or whatever. So it's
Speaker 5: it is part of the chess match for sure.
Speaker 6: In the series.
Speaker 4: That's gold right there, chefs only goal. There's been a
Speaker 4: lot of talk over the last two days about Lucas defense,
Speaker 4: and quite frankly, I think it's bullshit because he's not
Speaker 4: defending any differently than he has for And if I'm honest,
Speaker 4: I've seen in pockets of this playoff like run for
Speaker 4: them and pockets him defend at at the highest level
Speaker 4: i've ever seen them defense before, correct, And it's always like, oh,
Speaker 4: they're down three to zero, here's our chance to attack him,
Speaker 4: here's our chance to attack his defense. And I hate
Speaker 4: shit like that, Like y'all ain't attack him when he
Speaker 4: had forty twenty and fifteen on somebody, don't attack his
Speaker 4: defense now because it's the obvious thing that your little
Speaker 4: basketball brains can talk about. Be Like, I don't like that,
Speaker 4: And like I said, I think at times throughout this
Speaker 4: playoffs he's been at an elite level defensively by his standards.
Speaker 4: What number one, what do you think of what they've
Speaker 4: made of his defense over the last couple of days.
Speaker 4: But number two also where you need Luca to be
Speaker 4: from from a player standpoint obviously you've played with championship players,
Speaker 4: but also from a coach standpoint where you need him
Speaker 4: to be on that side of.
Speaker 5: Yeah, no, I understand exactly what you mean about the
Speaker 5: larger kind of narrative around, Like let's single something out
Speaker 5: that has always been there, maybe, but we're going to
Speaker 5: make a big deal about it now. Luca's never been
Speaker 5: all the NBA defense, so it's not something that we're
Speaker 5: surprised about that he isn't consistently elite. But to the
Speaker 5: point you made in this playoff run, you have seen
Speaker 5: him take two three steps forward in putting the effort
Speaker 5: into that end of the floor that we had never
Speaker 5: seen in the past ever. And I think in one
Speaker 5: of his postgame interviews maybe against the Clippers or okay, see,
Speaker 5: he actually jokingly said because they talked about his defense
Speaker 5: was pretty good in that game, and he was like, hey,
Speaker 5: I mean, it's the playoffs and I want to win,
Speaker 5: so I am gonna put a bit more into it
Speaker 5: now than I normally would. So I think he has improved.
Speaker 5: But of course, in order to win it all right, Like,
Speaker 5: there are times where you have to become something that
Speaker 5: maybe you haven't been as much before, and he and
Speaker 5: he's showing a willingness to try and be that. But
Speaker 5: you can't ask him to go forty fifteen nine and
Speaker 5: guard the other team's best players and rebound and take
Speaker 5: charge it. It doesn't work that way. There's a reason
Speaker 5: why Steph has always been a better defender than people
Speaker 5: have given him credit for. But he can't guard the
Speaker 5: other team's best player for thirty minutes a game. Absolutely,
Speaker 5: that's not in alignment with the role that he actually
Speaker 5: needs to play best. So I think Luca has improved.
Speaker 5: It's something I think he'll continue to learn and grow from.
Speaker 5: I think this experience, assuming they still come up short.
Speaker 5: As you know, once you kind of get a little
Speaker 5: taste of it and you kind of start to understand, Damn,
Speaker 5: I thought I had enough, but I really don't. I
Speaker 5: thought I was given enough, but I really wasn't. I
Speaker 5: thought I would slide to my feet, but the tape
Speaker 5: don't lie.
Speaker 6: Like now, I got to live with this until next season.
Speaker 5: My guess is he'll be a better defender throughout the
Speaker 5: regular season next year to continue to show that commitment
Speaker 5: that he's willing to do it, because he's probably going
Speaker 5: to feel like we have a legit chance to win
Speaker 5: the NBA Championship if we keep this group together. So
Speaker 5: as a teammate, I would of course want him to
Speaker 5: be better in situations, timely defensive effort and energy, and
Speaker 5: the same thing to me as a coach, for my
Speaker 5: best players that I know, they carry the water so far, bro, Like,
Speaker 5: you can't ask them to also pour everybody cup and
Speaker 5: serve them and make sure that the other people are
Speaker 5: never uncomfortable, Like we have to also have his back.
Speaker 6: So that means if Luca.
Speaker 5: Is Kobe and I'm Kyrie, like, I have to do
Speaker 5: more on defense to actually make up for the fact
Speaker 5: that I can't ask Kobe to chase ray Allen off
Speaker 5: staggers baseline screens, screen the screener actions, and go play
Speaker 5: offense the way we need him to play offense in
Speaker 5: order to beat the Celtics, I have to take the
Speaker 5: challenge of chasing ray Allen. So that's that's almost more
Speaker 5: on me than it is Cole And so that's for Dallas.
Speaker 6: PJ.
Speaker 5: Washington and Dear Jones Jr. Have been playing that role.
Speaker 5: So now, okay, can Kyrie play better defense? Can Tim
Speaker 5: Hardaway Junior play better defense? Can other guys do more
Speaker 5: to cover up for the fact that we can't ask
Speaker 5: Luca to be the MVP on defense too? Man, he
Speaker 5: basically third in the league in MVP overall. Like that's
Speaker 5: not really fair all the way around in my in
Speaker 5: my opinion, So that's a long way of saying I
Speaker 5: would expect him to be able to give us more
Speaker 5: when necessary, but there's no way I'm asking him to
Speaker 5: become all NBA defense when that's not really who he
Speaker 5: is and we don't necessary they need him to be
Speaker 5: in order to win.
Speaker 1: I agree one hundred percent.
Speaker 4: I think it's garbage that the lazy folks on TV
Speaker 4: try to pinpoint it out all of a sudden, like, oh,
Speaker 4: it's his defense, Like it's his defense the reason they're
Speaker 4: losing the game. And it's like, bro, he's playing more
Speaker 4: defense than the ever player. Why did they get here
Speaker 4: all of a sudden and now it's his defense that's
Speaker 4: losing them the game. Like, I think that's lazy. I
Speaker 4: think that's garbage. His defense hadn't been great, that's cool,
Speaker 4: But come on with that.
Speaker 5: Narrat so you can say free throws more so than
Speaker 5: the defense, Like yeah, he and but he historically at
Speaker 5: times in late games, maybe due to fatigue or you know,
Speaker 5: just from a mindset perspective, like just a missive free thrower.
Speaker 5: Two that not because he's not a great shooter. He
Speaker 5: just happens to miss him. He missed one late in
Speaker 5: the Okase game that almost cost.
Speaker 6: Him a game. So you can point to that even.
Speaker 5: More so than the defense to say it, you know,
Speaker 5: as something you want to point out.
Speaker 6: But anyway, I know we could go on forever for sure.
Speaker 4: No I And you know what I always tell my guys,
Speaker 4: Like for any guy that's a little less of a defender, right, like, yo,
Speaker 4: just don't give up a straight line drive. Like if
Speaker 4: you can make him literally just take a small veer
Speaker 4: off the path that he's trying to go on, just
Speaker 4: a small vear, I can get there and help and
Speaker 4: cover it up for you.
Speaker 1: Like if you just give him a straight line drive.
Speaker 4: It's hard for me to not overhelp and give up
Speaker 4: something crazy over here because I overhelped.
Speaker 1: So like, just give me one slide. Like, if you
Speaker 1: give me one slide that you're still in front and
Speaker 1: he get past you on the second slide, great, no problem.
Speaker 1: I'll be there. I'll cover my man and I'll cover
Speaker 1: him to like don't like not for you to worry.
Speaker 5: You have to know about your teammates, like you understanding
Speaker 5: your teammate strengths and weaknesses and how to cover up
Speaker 5: for those things. And so Phil Jackson was one of
Speaker 5: the guys that he would talk about Tony Kuk coach
Speaker 5: when they were in Chicago, and how like they started
Speaker 5: to understand like if they saw Tony on the island
Speaker 5: with some of the greatest players to ever play the game,
Speaker 5: they weren't going to just leave him over there slide,
Speaker 5: make them turn, you know, make them use a change
Speaker 5: of direction, and then now we can provide some support.
Speaker 5: I personally think, yeah, Luca could be better, but he
Speaker 5: has put way more possessions together on the defensive end,
Speaker 5: where he's at least turned the guy a couple of
Speaker 5: times or at least forced him to change direction a
Speaker 5: little bit to still get downhill.
Speaker 6: You know, Yeah, we could definitely point it out, how brake.
Speaker 1: And how much more can you ask for that? Then
Speaker 1: at that point, if he does that, if Lucas slides
Speaker 1: his feet once, slides his feet twice, make a guy
Speaker 1: turn direction and y'all not there to help. That's on
Speaker 1: their defense.
Speaker 4: That ain't on Luca, Like, that's that's on your defense
Speaker 4: because you're supposed to be there to cover for him anyway,
Speaker 4: you know, the way I look at it, why could
Speaker 4: and like Steph got so much better defensively now Steph
Speaker 4: actually became one of the better defenders on our team,
Speaker 4: which if you watched him in twenty and fifteen, you
Speaker 4: would have never thought by twenty twenty two he's one
Speaker 4: of the best defenders, or twenty one, he's one of
Speaker 4: the best defenders.
Speaker 1: On our team, and he became that.
Speaker 4: But my thing is the way I've view for anyone
Speaker 4: that needs some help on how you should view this.
Speaker 1: This man covers up for me, for me.
Speaker 4: On some some things offensively, then I better be there
Speaker 4: to cover up for him some.
Speaker 1: Things defensively, like because that's how this thing works. Where
Speaker 1: I may fall a little.
Speaker 4: Short of the glory, you pick me up there, and
Speaker 4: where you may fall a little bit shorter of the glory,
Speaker 4: I'm gonna pick you up there. So it's definitely on
Speaker 4: they guys to protect Luca more Luca. That does not
Speaker 4: That does not say, Luca, you don't have to try. No,
Speaker 4: you everyone must give effort. And if you give a
Speaker 4: little bit of effort, those guys for sure better.
Speaker 5: Be And in Game five, he probably going to have
Speaker 5: the best defensive game he's ever played in order for
Speaker 5: them to have a chance to win.
Speaker 6: That's gonna be real. He will be tested on that
Speaker 6: end of the floor for sure.
Speaker 1: Absolutely.
Speaker 4: Do you think I thought, uh, Dallas were great defensively,
Speaker 4: all the rotation was there, even had Luke on a
Speaker 4: couple of chopped the boxes and going vertical.
Speaker 1: I thought the defense was great. Do you think it's
Speaker 1: possible for.
Speaker 4: Dallas to repeat the defensive performers that they had tonight?
Speaker 5: Yes, because I believe, you know, there are times where
Speaker 5: when there's no other choice, right like you feel like
Speaker 5: you've been doing it. But I'm sure the coaches put
Speaker 5: on tape. The close outs just weren't good enough in
Speaker 5: game three. Yes, you know, the rotations weren't sharp enough.
Speaker 5: You didn't give your body up in that situation. You
Speaker 5: missed a box out, you missed a communication opportunity to
Speaker 5: make sure that your teammate understood what you needed him
Speaker 5: to do. And so they internalized those things and went
Speaker 5: out and executed. Obviously, at home, there's also a greater
Speaker 5: sense of pride, you know, in making sure certain things
Speaker 5: happen in front of your home fans, family, etc. But
Speaker 5: I think they can take they will take that same
Speaker 5: mentality to Boston. I think the question will be more, uh,
Speaker 5: will Boston be better? And you know, what we all
Speaker 5: want is for both teams to be the best of
Speaker 5: themselves on Monday Night. Yes, and we have an epic game,
Speaker 5: and whoever wins is it wins. But both teams at
Speaker 5: their best. Dallas taking their defense to Boston effort, force, energy,
Speaker 5: uh and then Boston at the Garden shooting the ball better,
Speaker 5: their defense will probably be better. Porzingis is still going
Speaker 5: to be missed. I mean that the Celtics were able
Speaker 5: to win Game three without him, but as the series
Speaker 5: goes on, when you're missing a player of that caliber,
Speaker 5: it will start to catch up at some point. For
Speaker 5: foul trouble changes everything you know without poison is available.
Speaker 5: So there's still some interesting storylines. But I think Dallas
Speaker 5: will bring their best selves to the game. I just
Speaker 5: I think we all feel though that when Boston is
Speaker 5: at their best, there's there's still there's still a gap there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they're better. Is definitely better uh than than Dallas
Speaker 1: for sure.
Speaker 4: Uh So with that being said, uh and would love
Speaker 4: to hit a couple more topics with you.
Speaker 1: Will, With that being said, give us your prediction for game.
Speaker 5: Man, it's a tough one. I don't think Boston feels
Speaker 5: that you know, you have. We have we played in
Speaker 5: some games like home games where you're up maybe three
Speaker 5: to two mm hmm, and you feel a little bit
Speaker 5: more pressure and anxiety that doesn't allow you to quite
Speaker 5: come out and play as relaxed and and free as
Speaker 5: you need to be able to play. And that's sometimes
Speaker 5: leads to a slow start by the home team. And
Speaker 5: that then if Tim hardaway so seeing quick and makes
Speaker 5: two three threes, Luca is aggressive, you know, right at
Speaker 5: the start, and all of a sudden, Boston, after losing
Speaker 5: by forty eight, is down by ten in the first
Speaker 5: five minutes. You know, that cycle can start to some degree.
Speaker 5: With that being said, I think Boston will close it out.
Speaker 6: On Monday night. I don't know what it'll look like.
Speaker 5: I don't know if it'll be a Boston avalanche of
Speaker 5: thirteen out of twenty six from three or I mean
Speaker 5: for them, they're going to attend forty three, so that
Speaker 5: I don't know if it'll be an eighteen out of
Speaker 5: forty type of three point night. Oftentimes, man trying to
Speaker 5: win that last one, it's going to be ugly and
Speaker 5: you're gonna have to get it out there.
Speaker 4: It's never going to BEng just never what No, I
Speaker 4: don't know why it doesn't work doesn't, but it never doesn't.
Speaker 5: It just doesn't. It could happen on the road, like
Speaker 5: when Steph Wood drop fifty in Sacramento. That's more likely
Speaker 5: to happen on the road than at home. It's just different.
Speaker 1: That's a fact.
Speaker 5: It really is, like those great, great performances oftentimes, you know,
Speaker 5: Michael Jordan with the flu game, Lebron in Detroit.
Speaker 4: Game seven, Lebron in Game seven versus us Kyrie Lebron.
Speaker 6: It's more likely to happen on the road than at home.
Speaker 5: So I do think, you know, if Boston starts a
Speaker 5: little clunky, you know, they could start to feel a
Speaker 5: little something.
Speaker 6: But I think they'll throw this one.
Speaker 5: Away to night. I think they'll close it out on Monday.
Speaker 5: I have no idea what the score will be, but
Speaker 5: I just feel like Boston is better and they'll win Monday.
Speaker 1: I love that. I think.
Speaker 4: You know, it's interesting because say we get to a
Speaker 4: spot where during the series it's like, oh, we got
Speaker 4: them figured out now, like we're good, like we got it.
Speaker 4: And Derek Lively said today he said, we think we
Speaker 4: got them figured out now, And he said this before
Speaker 4: them like, wait, well before to winning the game, like
Speaker 4: in the first quarter, he's like, yeah, we actually think
Speaker 4: we got them figured out now, and then to go
Speaker 4: on and win.
Speaker 1: For your rookie to say that means.
Speaker 4: Y'all been discussing this and then y'all go on and
Speaker 4: win by forty eight points? Do I think you're even
Speaker 4: if you gotta figure it out, you're gonna win by
Speaker 4: forty They didn't win by forty eight, but they got
Speaker 4: by four. But that you're getting up about forty eight
Speaker 4: and even if you have something figured out. I don't
Speaker 4: necessarily believe that, but I do think there is something
Speaker 4: to say for Lively saying no, we got them figured
Speaker 4: out in the first quarter.
Speaker 1: And then the game that happened happened.
Speaker 4: So in saying that, I expected more of this Dallas
Speaker 4: team anyway than the Dallas team that we definitely saw
Speaker 4: in the first couple of games. But it is tough
Speaker 4: going back for Game five down three to one, where
Speaker 4: they're like, yo, they were supposed to do that.
Speaker 1: We went and did what we were supposed to do.
Speaker 4: We won our one on the road. They did what
Speaker 4: they we supposed to do. Now let's go close it out.
Speaker 4: Because and the reason it's tough because.
Speaker 1: Boston is the better team.
Speaker 4: Like I don't think there's anyone in the world that
Speaker 4: doesn't think Boston is the better team. And like you said,
Speaker 4: if they play their best and Dallas play their best,
Speaker 4: Boston wins. However, for a team like Boston that's gotten
Speaker 4: close and not being able to get over the hump
Speaker 4: you you can, you.
Speaker 1: Can't ship the bad you can.
Speaker 4: And so with that being said.
Speaker 6: Go ahead.
Speaker 4: I think this was a little like I think this
Speaker 4: was a little more like Minnesota versus Dallas, where we
Speaker 4: all thought Minnesota was done and then Dallas, Uh, you know,
Speaker 4: they men in Minnesota had a big game. I'm gonna
Speaker 4: say this is a lot like that. We thought Dallas
Speaker 4: was in the can. They're a prideful team. You don't
Speaker 4: get to the NBA Finals without being a pride for team.
Speaker 4: And they came out and played the way they're supposed
Speaker 4: to play. But Tim Hardaway now got to go on
Speaker 4: the road and hit them shots a little bit different,
Speaker 4: hit them shots on the road. So, uh, you know,
Speaker 4: I think it's something to say for them going inside
Speaker 4: throwing the ball, the gaffer making it a point saying
Speaker 4: we're going to out physical, y'all. I just don't know
Speaker 4: if the our physical are going to work in Boston
Speaker 4: in front of that crowd, And I gotta go with
Speaker 4: Boston closing it out there five.
Speaker 5: They in game three, they you could tell they made
Speaker 5: a concerted effort to activate jt defensively. Yes, so instead
Speaker 5: of instead of hiding, not hiding because he can't defend,
Speaker 5: but essentially like conserving his energy and having him guard
Speaker 5: Gafford so that they could switch pick and roll Dallas.
Speaker 5: What's going away from that the first couple of games
Speaker 5: because Boston is so effective in there switching. But then
Speaker 5: there was an adjustment made where they decided, you know what,
Speaker 5: let's actually bring Jason Tatum into the action and attack
Speaker 5: him and force him to have to work on the
Speaker 5: defensive end. I thought that took some of his legs
Speaker 5: a little bit. They did it a little bit in
Speaker 5: game two, some in game three. They still obviously close
Speaker 5: the game out, but I think that's something they feel
Speaker 5: like they may have figured out. And so when he
Speaker 5: is guarding Gafford, they're gonna post him and dip into
Speaker 5: his legs a little bit, burn that energy and try
Speaker 5: to wear him down over the course of the game.
Speaker 6: But I agree with you. I somehow this is just
Speaker 6: you know, me and us talking like that.
Speaker 5: If they don't remember you guys closing them out in
Speaker 5: twenty two at home and like literally tell themselves on
Speaker 5: Monday night, I don't care what happens tonight.
Speaker 1: Bro.
Speaker 5: We are not walking off this court without a victory.
Speaker 5: There is no way they are beating us on our
Speaker 5: home court. And we have to go back to Dallas
Speaker 5: and play game six. It's not happening. And then whatever
Speaker 5: they do from there, it may not look pretty or whatever,
Speaker 5: but it just has to be a decision. And you
Speaker 5: would think that this is the year. You know, they've
Speaker 5: been close. It had some opportunities, you know, you guys
Speaker 5: experience and ability to understand those moments in that series
Speaker 5: and take advantage of them, like they're that team now
Speaker 5: against a team that hasn't.
Speaker 1: Been there, you know. And so I.
Speaker 5: One with tell you they should finish it off on
Speaker 5: Monday night. But these young guys are different, you know,
Speaker 5: so magical happen Kyrie special you never know.
Speaker 1: That's a fact. That's a fact.
Speaker 4: By the way, That's why this is chefs only again,
Speaker 4: because you all just wouldn't have never known, You would
Speaker 4: have never noticed how they were going away from Jason
Speaker 4: Tatum and bringing them in. And you know, when you've
Speaker 4: been through these series and like you understand how important
Speaker 4: the adjustments is. Like I love having these conversations because
Speaker 4: for me, as someone who thinks I know a bunch
Speaker 4: about the game, like I continue to learn and having
Speaker 4: these conversations, so it's always fun for me. So number one,
Speaker 4: I just want to say thank you for the education
Speaker 4: that you just gave out on the Drey Money Show
Speaker 4: because myself, for me, I just learned some things and
Speaker 4: I am excited about it.
Speaker 1: Check this out. Though. I was recently on the Big
Speaker 1: Fellow podcast.
Speaker 4: Uh shackstra Domins Shotts are the big the Big Shack
Speaker 4: this you name it, the Big Aristyle I was on
Speaker 4: this podcast. He was on the show and we discussed
Speaker 4: the old one Lakers versus seventeen Warriors.
Speaker 1: Not quite.
Speaker 4: Frankly, if I'm honest, I hate when people had these
Speaker 4: discussions because it's like you, these people people had these
Speaker 4: discussions and it's no merit to the conversation or anything.
Speaker 1: A bunch of hypotheticals of what is.
Speaker 4: However, I hypothetically love fucking having these conversations with guys.
Speaker 1: That's been a part of it, and so let's discuss this.
Speaker 4: Like me and Shaq obviously disagreed on who will win
Speaker 4: the series. I quite frankly got us beating y All
Speaker 4: in five. But like how you see this series going fish.
Speaker 5: Yeah, no, I mean, obviously you know it's champs only.
Speaker 5: You have to respect champions, So I absolutely, you know,
Speaker 5: in five I think is you know, I don't know
Speaker 5: if you've got the Lobos in there with you or
Speaker 5: what's going on. But in five, I don't know about that.
Speaker 5: I mean, Champs against champs. It should be a battle.
Speaker 5: You know, it should go to game seven. It's like
Speaker 5: you said, it's always fun, even though it's not real
Speaker 5: right to just talk about the possibilities and the matchups.
Speaker 5: And you know, you obviously always should think your team
Speaker 5: is better than anybody else's team that you know that
Speaker 5: got it done in that way. You know, it's hard
Speaker 5: to explain to people how physically dominant Shock really was.
Speaker 5: Like I think people see the videos, they see the
Speaker 5: backboard smash and all of that, but I don't know
Speaker 5: if there's a recognition of like the way we now
Speaker 5: run pick and roll to put pressure on the rim
Speaker 5: to create threes. Shaq literally was every pick and roll
Speaker 5: you ever try to run, you could just throw it
Speaker 5: to him to get the ball to the rim.
Speaker 6: Like it.
Speaker 5: And the most Christian shots in basketball are at the rim,
Speaker 5: corner threes, free throws, and we got all of that
Speaker 5: because of him in theory. And then obviously Kobe was
Speaker 5: able to do a lot. But am I naive to
Speaker 5: think that, like who's garden Kevin Durant? You know what
Speaker 5: I'm saying, Like, like, like Rick Fox was amazing defensively,
Speaker 5: Maybe that's a cover that he could figure out because
Speaker 5: Rick was physical, and you know, but KD was KD
Speaker 5: obviously Stephan his prime. How elite you guys were defensively,
Speaker 5: you know, like we were Wish with our one team,
Speaker 5: we were fairly predictable because.
Speaker 6: Of shock shocks dominance, so you know what I mean.
Speaker 5: So so defensively, you know, you guys definitely would have
Speaker 5: been able to scheme some things and try to you know,
Speaker 5: maybe front and back them and send a guy over
Speaker 5: on the baseline side on if he was fronted as
Speaker 5: the ball was in the air.
Speaker 1: But you know, shot.
Speaker 5: Literally has changed people's dinner work bro like that. Just
Speaker 5: no double team, triple team, anything could could bad them.
Speaker 6: So all of that to say.
Speaker 5: To me, when you talk about like the greatest teams ever,
Speaker 5: it's gotta be a coin toss, and it probably would
Speaker 5: depend on who has home court help, and it depends
Speaker 5: on what rules are we playing. That's true to the
Speaker 5: way I can play defense. We might have a chance
Speaker 5: because I'm beating him up if I can hold the
Speaker 5: ground like we could hold one compared to what we
Speaker 5: might be to guardian.
Speaker 1: Fish.
Speaker 4: I may have to get thrown out of one of
Speaker 4: the games because I gotta come get you off my
Speaker 4: man with a crazy screen one of these games, like
Speaker 4: I can't just let you grab my man, you know.
Speaker 4: But honestly, for me, like you know, y'all, y'all were
Speaker 4: to y'all were the golden standard, Like we grew up
Speaker 4: watching y'all, and the Spurs dominate everything for me as
Speaker 4: a kid growing up in the state of Michigan. Obviously,
Speaker 4: you know, seeing the Detroit Pistons and their dominance, and
Speaker 4: I know they were able to win one championship, but
Speaker 4: they were going to conference finals each and every year,
Speaker 4: couple of finals like and that was kind of the standard.
Speaker 4: And like the brand of basketball that y'all played inn
Speaker 4: is obviously totally different than the brand of basketball that's
Speaker 4: played now. And you know, when I look at like
Speaker 4: the rules that y'all played by, quite frankly, if I'm honest,
Speaker 4: I don't think we could have beat all at those rules,
Speaker 4: like no chance, Like we play a totally different game. However,
Speaker 4: if the rules are how they are today, Like, I
Speaker 4: don't think there's a chance y'all could keep up with
Speaker 4: us because you can't grab like so now guys just
Speaker 4: moving around his speed. It's a bunch of and with
Speaker 4: those rules, sides becomes less important because you're almost protected
Speaker 4: from the size, you know, And so it's a very
Speaker 4: interesting thing none the less.
Speaker 1: Man, I think, uh, you know, just.
Speaker 4: Just to be in that for me to be in
Speaker 4: a conversation of the teams like I grew up watching
Speaker 4: like the Lakers, the Bulls, like the Pistons, the Spur,
Speaker 4: Like to be in the conversation with those teams, to me,
Speaker 4: it's always mind blowing because those are the teams like
Speaker 4: as a basket, Like I was a kid that went
Speaker 4: to sleep with my TV on I slept the whole
Speaker 4: night with it on, and it's on ESPN All Night
Speaker 4: Sports Center, Like I'm I eight breathed, and you know
Speaker 4: what else basketball like NBA basketball, and so just.
Speaker 1: To be mentioned with those teams, for me, it's more
Speaker 1: of an honor.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 6: Same here.
Speaker 5: That's why I like, I refuse to kind of try
Speaker 5: to fall into the like, oh yeah, well we would
Speaker 5: have and this and that is just to even be
Speaker 5: in the conversation is amazing to begin with, and like
Speaker 5: you have to show respect man to teams that have
Speaker 5: got Like I got asked about how I'm gonna feel
Speaker 5: if the Celtics and or when the Celtics do win
Speaker 5: the title as a former Laker, and I'm like, well, yeah,
Speaker 5: of course, you know, I would want the Lakers to
Speaker 5: win as much as possible. But the way that I watch,
Speaker 5: I mean, I had two years ago to state but
Speaker 5: I'm not part of the Warriors fabric in the way
Speaker 5: that you guys are. But I can watch it and
Speaker 5: respect it and cherish greatness and teams that win. Idols
Speaker 5: found a level of greatness in that season that nobody
Speaker 5: else did, and I can't hate on that. I might
Speaker 5: not love it, but I'm not hating facts?
Speaker 4: Are you always got a respect the chanlenge? I always
Speaker 4: say that. Uh, before we get out of here. I
Speaker 4: know you're a w NBA basketball fan obviously, Uh. With
Speaker 4: the being the coach in the w n B A
Speaker 4: and knowing some of the some of the great talent
Speaker 4: that's in the w n B A, what do you
Speaker 4: make of this massive rise in the popularity of the
Speaker 4: w n B A. And I think we're starting to
Speaker 4: know more and more of the players, which I think
Speaker 4: is huge. Uh, but what do you make of this
Speaker 4: current rise in the popularity of the game.
Speaker 5: I mean, I think it's amazing. Man, I don't I
Speaker 5: don't even want to say long overdue. Like every everything,
Speaker 5: it's about timing, you know, it's about different variables aligning
Speaker 5: in certain ways. And similar to the men's game, it
Speaker 5: takes specific players, not just great players, but specific players
Speaker 5: at specific times that create a level of interest and
Speaker 5: intrigue and greatness in their performance that brings people to
Speaker 5: the game in a way that not because Doctor j
Speaker 5: was amazing, George Gervin was outstanding, Oscar Robertson was that dude.
Speaker 5: George Miken was crazy. Have the check, Bill Walton, We
Speaker 5: just lost Bill Walton. We just lost Jerry West. Like
Speaker 5: those guys were as good as it gets. But the
Speaker 5: timing of Magic Johnson and Larry Bird coming into the
Speaker 5: league after playing in the NCAA title game, some of
Speaker 5: the underlying social things around a white player and a
Speaker 5: black player, like you're seeing a little bit of that
Speaker 5: andur Reese and Caveen Clark, and so it brings forth
Speaker 5: this conversation around like there was a lot of discomfort
Speaker 5: in the eighties and there was a lot of assumption
Speaker 5: that white people were fans of the Celtics and black
Speaker 5: people and minorities were fans of the Lakers, and there
Speaker 5: was this divide that was created as though it was
Speaker 5: black against white when it really.
Speaker 6: Was Lakers fans against Celtics fans. And that's okay.
Speaker 5: And so I think the popularity of the game, it
Speaker 5: deserves it. We all need to continue to invest in it.
Speaker 5: I think as men, we have to continue to do
Speaker 5: more with our platforms, with our time, whatever we can do.
Speaker 6: To not just talk about it, but like.
Speaker 5: Try to positively influence it and impact it so that
Speaker 5: our daughters and our nieces and all the little girls
Speaker 5: that are watching this generation. The player grow up with
Speaker 5: the same way we watched our greats before us and
Speaker 5: start to see themselves in those situations. So we we
Speaker 5: have to prop this league up and make sure it
Speaker 5: continues to grow. Of course, Caven Clark deserves a ton
Speaker 5: of the credit because of who she is. But but
Speaker 5: even when you turn the game on to watch her,
Speaker 5: you better you better watch what Asia Wilson is doing.
Speaker 5: Oh my god, you better watch what she's doing. You know,
Speaker 5: if you've watched in the past. I mean, Kennis Parker
Speaker 5: just retired, but goat right if you know Lisa Leslie, like,
Speaker 5: the history of this game is littered with great women
Speaker 5: basketball players, and so the rise will also bring a
Speaker 5: rise to the respect that they deserve that they didn't
Speaker 5: get just because they came a little earlier, you know
Speaker 5: what I mean. But but we got to show them
Speaker 5: love too. So I love it, man. I enjoyed my
Speaker 5: time in the W.
Speaker 6: I would do it again. It's a great league.
Speaker 5: And I'm so happy that there's gonna be a team
Speaker 5: in the Bay Area now that the fans can support
Speaker 5: up there. And you know that that team will have
Speaker 5: my support too, for sure.
Speaker 1: Man.
Speaker 4: Most definitely, I think the W and just watching the
Speaker 4: growth of it. It has been incredible because I think,
Speaker 4: you know, for us, we've always appreciated their talent, you know,
Speaker 4: like we've always appreciated what those women bring to the sport,
Speaker 4: to the game of basketball, and I think for them
Speaker 4: to start getting their due, and like, it's not where
Speaker 4: it's going to go, you know, like I think it
Speaker 4: will continue to grow and grow and grow. And the
Speaker 4: reality is, I think there's so much discourse around the
Speaker 4: topic because I do think the women do themselves a
Speaker 4: disservice at times of comparing it to us. And the
Speaker 4: reason I think they're due to sales of disservices totally
Speaker 4: actually has nothing to do with the game of basketball,
Speaker 4: but everything to do with the w is now I
Speaker 4: think in year twenty seven, yes, and the NBA is
Speaker 4: in year now, maybe seventy seven. The difference in between
Speaker 4: fifty years for a company.
Speaker 6: Is drastic, for sure.
Speaker 1: It's like I night and day. It's like General Motors
Speaker 1: and Tesla. Like the difference in between the companies are drastic.
Speaker 1: Now Tesla may be worth more now, I don't know,
Speaker 1: I don't know the numbers or whatever, but point being
Speaker 1: like drastic difference, and I think you know, when you
Speaker 1: start to play the comparison game, you're comparing like strictly
Speaker 1: from a time standpoint, a baby to like a grandfather,
Speaker 1: Like just strictly from a time standpoint, literally like fifty years.
Speaker 4: It's a long time. It's and not as the hand
Speaker 4: start that the NBA has on the dump. Yeah, and nonetheless,
Speaker 4: like I said, the CDs ladies getting the some of
Speaker 4: the credit that they deserve. The notoriety is coming and
Speaker 4: it's happening, and I think it's great. Two young stars
Speaker 4: I think definitely. Now with the Sparks, what's your thoughts
Speaker 4: on Rakia Jackson and caraeron Brink the new young stars
Speaker 4: of the Sparks.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean when you think about the turnover of
Speaker 5: the roster and you know, going from Hall of Famers
Speaker 5: and all time greats and Cannis Parker and Coom Makay.
Speaker 5: You know, Chelsea Gray obviously becoming a Hall of Famers.
Speaker 5: I can't wait for her to get back on the
Speaker 5: court for Vegas. And so you think about the way
Speaker 5: the Sparks have now gone through that process. You know,
Speaker 5: we tried to stay away from the rebuilt as long
Speaker 5: as we but now that's you have to go through
Speaker 5: it at some point once that window closes. And so
Speaker 5: I think Cameron Brink and Rakia Jackson are not just
Speaker 5: great players, but they have the size, the length, the
Speaker 5: versatility that similar to what's happened in the men's game,
Speaker 5: you need that on the women's side too. Now, like
Speaker 5: you have to be able to defend multiple positions, you
Speaker 5: have to be able to play face in the basket,
Speaker 5: you have to be able to shoot the three, if
Speaker 5: you can operate and pick and roll, and both of
Speaker 5: those players can do those things. And from what I
Speaker 5: can tell, they're high character young women. So those are
Speaker 5: great pieces that the Sparks have added.
Speaker 6: You know.
Speaker 5: The hard part is, as you know, when you've been
Speaker 5: winning championships and there's that legacy there, there's that feeling
Speaker 5: that it has to quickly get back to what it
Speaker 5: was and instead of understanding, like what you guys have,
Speaker 5: what great teams have has been built over time and
Speaker 5: you can't rush that always and so hopefully, you know,
Speaker 5: the ladies will get some time and get a few
Speaker 5: years together. But those two players, specifically, you surround them
Speaker 5: with the right pieces, some good veteran pieces at the
Speaker 5: right time.
Speaker 6: I think there's a right future in LA for the Sparks.
Speaker 1: One thousand percent.
Speaker 4: Before we get out of here, last question, you know,
Speaker 4: we have to talk about, like you mentioned her player,
Speaker 4: one of the players who's brought out this notoriety, because
Speaker 4: I think Angel has definitely done her share in bringing
Speaker 4: that notoriety as well, but less about the notoriety and
Speaker 4: more about the just the discourse around Caitlin Clark. You
Speaker 4: got like a lot of people kind of talking for
Speaker 4: and you know, she's not that she's hiding, but these
Speaker 4: narratives just get pushed. What do you make around the discourse? Yeah, no,
Speaker 4: I think.
Speaker 5: You know, sometimes people say all publicity is good publicity, right,
Speaker 5: I don't completely agree with that. I do think there
Speaker 5: are times where the discourse doesn't need to be completely
Speaker 5: what it is, you know, And so I think some
Speaker 5: of that has happened with Caitlin Clark, where we've we've
Speaker 5: kind of gotten away at times from appreciating who she
Speaker 5: is and what she is without us like it's almost
Speaker 5: like people are trying to find reasons to kind of
Speaker 5: dislike or almost like attach it to her, when in reality,
Speaker 5: she's literally never said any of the stuff that other
Speaker 5: people have to say. While also I think those narratives
Speaker 5: in that discourse, which is why you see such strong
Speaker 5: reactions from current players in the W, is that it
Speaker 5: almost kind of starts to create this thing as though
Speaker 5: they aren't able to have a feeling or an opinion
Speaker 5: or an emotion around what's going on, like they're supposed
Speaker 5: to just kind of shut up and be thankful for
Speaker 5: Kaitlin's rival to the league, like she's saving your life.
Speaker 5: And while from a business perspective, yeah, we probably would
Speaker 5: be able to point to twenty twenty four in her
Speaker 5: arrival as a launching pad new media rights deal a
Speaker 5: lot of the positive things that are going to come
Speaker 5: to the W from this moment. But to you know,
Speaker 5: if I'm Asia Wilson, if I'm Neckagoomak, if I'm Diana Tarazi,
Speaker 5: if I'm one of the all time greats, you can't
Speaker 5: tell me that just this one young lady alone should
Speaker 5: get all of the credit for like I should be
Speaker 5: thankful to her that, you know, I don't have to
Speaker 5: take a commercial flight anymore, as though all the work
Speaker 5: I've done in this league the last six, seven, twelve,
Speaker 5: fifteen years doesn't count.
Speaker 6: Like that's what it sounds like.
Speaker 5: When we try to make it seem like they're hating
Speaker 5: or jealous per se and competitive maybe yeah, I mean, look, bro,
Speaker 5: I was and still am. I couldn't hold a freaking
Speaker 5: candle to Michael Jordan. But even when I was young
Speaker 5: and played in the league, I refuse to wear air
Speaker 5: Jordan's by just generationally, where like growing up, just from
Speaker 5: a competitive standpoint, it was different, the same way a
Speaker 5: lot of older guys complain about how respectful and how
Speaker 5: you guys show each other love and give each other flowers. Like,
Speaker 5: just because we didn't do that doesn't mean it's wrong,
Speaker 5: because we should have probably been doing more of that
Speaker 5: as men to show love and respect. But still I
Speaker 5: want to kick you when we get out there on
Speaker 5: the court. And so I think a this course says
Speaker 5: gotten off track at times.
Speaker 6: My hope is that at some.
Speaker 5: Point it'll quiet down around some of the negative things
Speaker 5: that have nothing to do with basketball, and we'll really
Speaker 5: start to like like with Whmy for example, like all
Speaker 5: of that was about basketball everything. He's a generation of talent.
Speaker 5: We knew it, we saw it. He struggled at times.
Speaker 5: We were okay with it because he's a rookie. He's
Speaker 5: not on a great team. He's coached by a great coach,
Speaker 5: but that it's not their time to be great right now.
Speaker 5: But we allowed him to go through his ups and downs.
Speaker 5: We followed his journey, and we have to respect her
Speaker 5: journey the same way, regardless of her color. Allow her
Speaker 5: to go through her struggles. Don't try to make it
Speaker 5: out to be a bunch of other stuff. But don't
Speaker 5: also try to make it seem like the ladies that's
Speaker 5: been in a w and been building this thing and
Speaker 5: brick by brick by brick for the last twenty seven years,
Speaker 5: just like they don't count all of a sudden because
Speaker 5: she's here, even if she's great. So I know that
Speaker 5: was that was a long answer, bro, But I just
Speaker 5: I get passionate about it, you know, because we got
Speaker 5: to protect that women, bro. Like, we just can't allow
Speaker 5: people to just kind of make it seem like it's
Speaker 5: whatever and it's just jealousy and envy when in reality
Speaker 5: you don't think they want what's best for the league,
Speaker 5: which she is. She is great for the league, and
Speaker 5: the ladies understand that too, But like, don't make it
Speaker 5: seem like I'm nobody, you know, in the way, Like.
Speaker 1: I owe herself.
Speaker 6: Yeah, other than competitive respect.
Speaker 5: I mean that was literally the Jordan rules, right, since
Speaker 5: I brought up Michael Jordan, the Detroit Pistons literally did
Speaker 5: the same thing. So Michael Jordan, yes, which elevated his
Speaker 5: level of play to what we now know as the
Speaker 5: goals the go He had not won championships before that. Yeah,
Speaker 5: he started taking notes, bigger, stronger, understand what they're trying
Speaker 5: to do, the type of system I need to play
Speaker 5: in the way I need to be able to move
Speaker 5: without the ball, all of that. So anyway, man, I could,
Speaker 5: I could go forever talking hoops on the men and
Speaker 5: women sat up.
Speaker 4: I love it, bro, I love I love that answer too,
Speaker 4: because I think, like you said, Kaitlyn's been great. But
Speaker 4: I've heard no one say Caitlyn got the opportunity to
Speaker 4: beat this because all the sweat of these women that
Speaker 4: came before her, you know.
Speaker 1: So like it goes, it goes both ways.
Speaker 4: Like Caitlyn has one thousand percent broad uptaking popularity to league,
Speaker 4: which is great, the league is not where it's at
Speaker 4: today to where Caitlin can bring that up to if
Speaker 4: these women back to Ryl Swoops and Cynthia Cooper's and
Speaker 4: Lisa Leslie's like Rebecca Lobos like, I mean, you go
Speaker 4: down the list like onto DT, Sue Cannas Parker, Sylvia Foxx,
Speaker 4: Samon Augustus right like without without their work, then it
Speaker 4: also doesn't get to this point either. So I'm happy
Speaker 4: for what she's brought to the league. I'm happy to
Speaker 4: see them competing the way they competing. Uh Like, keep
Speaker 4: competing like that because at the end of the day,
Speaker 4: that's what people playing to see. They're not paying to
Speaker 4: see a soft game a week game, They're paying to
Speaker 4: see competitive basketball. So keep competing that way. I absolutely
Speaker 4: love it. But man, I can't thank you enough for
Speaker 4: coming on the show. Absolutely incredible to have this conversation,
Speaker 4: to learn from you your brain, hear your thoughts. This
Speaker 4: was a long one. Yeah, and I shout out to
Speaker 4: everybody who stayed and stayed tuned in. I hope you
Speaker 4: appreciated this conversation as much as I have. So again,
Speaker 4: d Fish, I want to say thank you for coming
Speaker 4: on the show.
Speaker 6: Man.
Speaker 1: We appreciate it.
Speaker 6: Ah, Dre, I appreciate you.
Speaker 1: Man.
Speaker 5: I have to give you your flowers back where you
Speaker 5: started the show. You know, when I watch basketball Now,
Speaker 5: like I watched the game from the lens, that wore
Speaker 5: the most right as a guy that provides impact and
Speaker 5: value in ways that sometimes people don't see. But you
Speaker 5: know it that your guys in your locker room know it,
Speaker 5: your coaches know it. The people that have spent time
Speaker 5: with you and been in the bunker with you.
Speaker 6: They know it.
Speaker 5: But there's a lot of people out here that know
Speaker 5: it too. And whether we always agree with okay, well yeah,
Speaker 5: I wouldn't have said that. I wouldn't have handled it
Speaker 5: like that. Well I'm not you. I don't go through
Speaker 5: what you have gone through. My life experiences are completely
Speaker 5: different than yours, So yeah, we are going to handle
Speaker 5: situations different because we're two different people. But I want
Speaker 5: to say congratulations to what you have done, meaning there's
Speaker 5: still more to go, not just on the court.
Speaker 6: Obviously, you have a beautiful family. You continue to learn.
Speaker 5: And grow and evolve as a man, as a player,
Speaker 5: as a person that is also showing how to build
Speaker 5: something off the court that can also last a lifetime.
Speaker 5: So whenever your time is up and you decide to
Speaker 5: do something else, you're already on that path.
Speaker 6: And a lot of guys are going to follow your lead.
Speaker 5: The same way we saw Magic Johnson and like, oh man,
Speaker 5: I could hoop and like one day be a CEO.
Speaker 5: I could one day like there are generation of high
Speaker 5: school players.
Speaker 6: Like seeing what you're doing and saying.
Speaker 5: Not only can I win championships and be a key
Speaker 5: piece to greatness, but I also can create a platform
Speaker 5: and talk about basketball and talk about life and share
Speaker 5: positive things with other people. And that's something to be
Speaker 5: valued and respected as well. Man, So keep going, keep growing.
Speaker 5: I'm a fan. I respect you. I love what you
Speaker 5: guys have built.
Speaker 6: I hate it.
Speaker 5: I hate to see you guys not go all the
Speaker 5: way because it I try to tell people all the time,
Speaker 5: like the team that passes the most has been the
Speaker 5: most successful in the NBA over the last So y'all
Speaker 5: can keep trying to dribble through everything if you want to.
Speaker 6: Past is amazing. It does a lot of great things.
Speaker 5: So I appreciate the opportunity to be here, man, on
Speaker 5: your platform. I appreciate you guys, And it's been a
Speaker 5: truth to be on Champ something. Man, It's it's been enjoyable.
Speaker 1: Thank you. That's Champs only.
Speaker 4: That's a rapp And I know all of you are
Speaker 4: probably looking forward to me talking about Clay and following
Speaker 4: the Warriors and deleting some ig posts or something. I
Speaker 4: had no idea that happened. I think it's hilarious. Just
Speaker 4: so y'all know. I laugh when Jackson I logged on
Speaker 4: here and Jackson's like, Yo, so what about Clay. I'm like, what, Like,
Speaker 4: what happened? It's like, oh, here, i'n followed the Warriors.
Speaker 4: I think that's comical. I know you all be one
Speaker 4: like somebody feelings to be heard of something. It ain't
Speaker 4: that ain't never going to be that. That's hilarious. Until
Speaker 4: next time, Champs Only, baby shout out to the five
Speaker 4: time champion Derrek Fisher much love, we appreciate you.
Speaker 1: Until next time, folks. That's a rap peece the volume