Speaker 1: Pushkin. When it comes to raising kids, most of us
Speaker 1: are familiar with the traditional reward and punishment podel. Your
Speaker 1: toddler throws a tantrum, time out, your teenager breaks curfew,
Speaker 1: They're grounded. But is this really the best way to
Speaker 1: raise happy, healthy adults. On today's episode of our special
Speaker 1: series on Happier Parenting, le'll meet an expert who's convinced
Speaker 1: we can do better.
Speaker 2: I'm doctor Becky Kennedy. I'm a clinical psychologist, i am
Speaker 2: a mom of three, and i am the founder of
Speaker 2: Good Inside.
Speaker 1: Good Inside is a company that offers simple, actionable strategies
Speaker 1: for parents struggling with their kids challenging behavior. It's also
Speaker 1: the title of doctor Becky's best selling book and the
Speaker 1: name of her popular parenting podcast.
Speaker 2: Doctor Becky's work.
Speaker 1: Is rooted in the belief that every child is quote
Speaker 1: good inside, even when they're acting out. And while our
Speaker 1: instinct might be to lecture, yell, or take away privileges
Speaker 1: when our child acts out, doctor Becky thinks we need
Speaker 1: to be a little bit grateful in those moments because
Speaker 1: she sees meltdowns and rule breaking as signals important clues
Speaker 1: that point to an underlying problem, which needs to be understood,
Speaker 1: not punished. Now does that mean that doctor Becky wants
Speaker 1: us to condone bad behavior. No, but she does believe
Speaker 1: there's a better way to respond.
Speaker 2: When a kid hits, when they're whining, when they never listen.
Speaker 2: No part of me is like, oh, that's amazing, that's
Speaker 2: your kid's natural expression of their feelings. We should celebrate.
Speaker 1: No.
Speaker 2: I always say the right answer is often between two extremes.
Speaker 2: And if one extreme is you see behavior that's bad,
Speaker 2: and then what we do is we kind of unconsciously
Speaker 2: assume our child is bad. That is why we send
Speaker 2: them away. That would bring a punishment based approach. I'm
Speaker 2: not such a fan. What I think is really powerful
Speaker 2: is if we see our kid's bad behavior as a
Speaker 2: sign of what they need. And again, that doesn't mean
Speaker 2: behavior is okay. But if I always drop my phone
Speaker 2: and it shattered, that might be a sign I need
Speaker 2: a phone protector. Case. That doesn't mean it's okay that
Speaker 2: I drop my phone. It actually means I have a
Speaker 2: way of fixing the problem. So if you see your
Speaker 2: kids hitting a sibling, for example, as a sign of
Speaker 2: what they might need, you're gonna activate curiosity. You're gonna
Speaker 2: end up asking yourself different questions. Instead of saying, what
Speaker 2: is wrong with my kid, we'd say to ourselves instead,
Speaker 2: I wonder what was going on for my kid right
Speaker 2: before they hit? I wonder what skill my kid would
Speaker 2: need to manage the frustration of sharing a toy with
Speaker 2: their sibling, but not have that frustration come out as
Speaker 2: a hit. Makes me think about the difference in a
Speaker 2: basketball code saying why is my player missing all their layups? Why?
Speaker 2: You know what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna send them
Speaker 2: to their.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna make them do laps around the court over
Speaker 1: and over again till they figure out yeah.
Speaker 2: Versus a coach that says, wait a second, what is
Speaker 2: getting in my player's way of making a layup? What
Speaker 2: skill would they need? And then when can we practice?
Speaker 2: Ooh tomorrow, I'm going to get them in the gym
Speaker 2: and I'm gonna really look at their form, and I'm saying, oh,
Speaker 2: I figured it out. Okay, I'm going to teach them
Speaker 2: something new, and then I'm going to practice something new.
Speaker 2: And I don't think any of us would say, oh
Speaker 2: my goodness, Becky, what a permissive basketball coach. I mean
Speaker 2: that coach is basically saying it's okay to misshots. It's
Speaker 2: so crazy. No, we would say, what a great coach.
Speaker 2: They're using quote bad behavior as a sign of what
Speaker 2: might be going on. Then they can understand what's going on.
Speaker 2: Then they can build a new skill and practice and boom,
Speaker 2: the behavior actually improves. So that's what the good side
Speaker 2: approach is all about. But not for basketball, but for kids' behavior.
Speaker 2: I love this approach for two reasons.
Speaker 1: What is it really touches on something that we talk
Speaker 1: about a lot, which is this idea of growth mindset? Right,
Speaker 1: Your kid is not fixed, their behavior is not fixed.
Speaker 1: The goal is skills learning. But it's also kind of
Speaker 1: putting the parent's role into kind of like the light.
Speaker 1: In some ways, you are kind of coaching your kids,
Speaker 1: hopefully towards skills, building towards better emotional regulation, towards better
Speaker 1: behavior over time. And I know this is something that
Speaker 1: you've talked about a lot, right, this idea that parents
Speaker 1: need to know what their role is. From your perspective,
Speaker 1: what's the parent's role and how should they be thinking
Speaker 1: about it?
Speaker 2: I love you for so many reasons, but I love
Speaker 2: you for asking that question. No, this whole thing about
Speaker 2: what is a parent's role? What is a parent's job.
Speaker 2: It came from years in private practice where parents would
Speaker 2: come to me about a variety of things, the tantrums,
Speaker 2: the rudeness, the clinging, even though they know everyone at
Speaker 2: the birthday party, whatever it is. And I'd always say
Speaker 2: to a parent, what is your job in that tricky situation?
Speaker 2: And they'd always say the same thing, I don't know,
Speaker 2: just tell me what to do. That's why I'm big
Speaker 2: on metaphors like imagine going to an office on the
Speaker 2: first day of your job and your boss saying, do
Speaker 2: your job well, and then you look and you realize
Speaker 2: I don't have a job description. And by the way,
Speaker 2: I don't know what that person next to me does
Speaker 2: and where their job starts and ends and my job
Speaker 2: starts and ends. I feel like in that position, that
Speaker 2: person would say, how could I do my job well
Speaker 2: if I don't know what my job is. Knowing what
Speaker 2: your job is with complete clarity is a precondition to
Speaker 2: doing any job well. And so when it comes to parenting,
Speaker 2: we have to change our first question to what is
Speaker 2: my job? And I'll give you a definition that actually
Speaker 2: works for any situation. In my mind, a parent always
Speaker 2: has two jobs. One is setting boundaries and the second
Speaker 2: is connecting to your kid's lived experience, which is another
Speaker 2: way of saying validating their feelings. And let me explain both.
Speaker 2: Because these jobs work in tandem, Let's start with boundaries.
Speaker 2: Boundaries are key decisions we make, their limits we set,
Speaker 2: and boundaries really ensure that we keep our kids safe.
Speaker 2: The reason we set a boundary around TV time is
Speaker 2: because we don't think it's great or safe for a
Speaker 2: kid to watch TV three hours after their bedtime. The
Speaker 2: reason I hold my kid when they're crossing the street,
Speaker 2: when they're flailing and saying let me go, isn't because
Speaker 2: I want to have control over my kid. It's because
Speaker 2: I want to keep them safe and they're not exactly
Speaker 2: in the right mind streets to be crossing the street.
Speaker 2: Those are boundaries. Now, to be clear, kids have one
Speaker 2: reaction to boundaries. Not happy.
Speaker 1: To be fair, it's not kids right like when people
Speaker 1: set boundaries to me, I'm not like super thrilled about
Speaker 1: that either.
Speaker 2: One hundred percent. A boundary is really a way of
Speaker 2: saying to someone else, you want something, and I'm saying no.
Speaker 2: Nobody likes having their desires thwarted, nobody does well. So
Speaker 2: when you set a boundary, and this is so important
Speaker 2: because we have some unconscious belief in me too that
Speaker 2: like I'm going to set some really good boundary for
Speaker 2: my kid, my kid's going to be like that is
Speaker 2: amazing parenting mom. Thank you, I do need to go
Speaker 2: to bed. Thank you for turning on the TV. Never,
Speaker 2: no child in my house or any child I know
Speaker 2: who's normal, has ever said that when you set a boundary,
Speaker 2: which is part one of your job, your kid actually
Speaker 2: does their job. They feel their feelings. And I know
Speaker 2: that's an inconvenient truth, but the reason that's our kid's
Speaker 2: job is kids can't develop skills to manage feelings they
Speaker 2: don't allow themselves to have. And so if you want
Speaker 2: your kid to be an adult who can manage frustration
Speaker 2: and anger and not be a thirty year old who
Speaker 2: acts like a two year old, then you want your
Speaker 2: kid to feel all the feelings when they're two and
Speaker 2: not three. I say TV time's over, I turn it off.
Speaker 2: My kid does not say thank you. They say why
Speaker 2: and all my friends get more screen time and you're
Speaker 2: the worst, YadA YadA yadda, And now it's actually amazing.
Speaker 2: I can do part two of my job. I validate
Speaker 2: the feelings they have, which would sound like this, Oh,
Speaker 2: you really wish you could watch TV, or oh, it's
Speaker 2: the worst when you're watching a show and you can't
Speaker 2: finish it because TV time is up, or oh I
Speaker 2: really eat when my TV time is over too. I
Speaker 2: get it. What I'm doing, and this is really important
Speaker 2: is I'm seeing my kid's feelings as real. I don't
Speaker 2: have to agree with them. I don't have to think
Speaker 2: the extent or intensity of the feeling is right or wrong.
Speaker 2: It just is. I'm seeing it as real. And there's
Speaker 2: a wash rinse for pea. I set a boundary. I
Speaker 2: think this is right. My kid gets upset, I validate
Speaker 2: the feeling. And then this is important because parents say,
Speaker 2: oh so, then just because my kid's upset, they get
Speaker 2: to watch another show.
Speaker 1: No.
Speaker 2: Validating feelings goes hand in hand with holding your boundaries.
Speaker 2: So another example, hay sweety, it's time to leave the park.
Speaker 2: My kid is gonna say no, I want to stay
Speaker 2: in the park. I might say something of them like, look,
Speaker 2: if it's too hard to walk to the car, I
Speaker 2: will pick you up and carry you because it's really
Speaker 2: time to go. Okay, maybe your kid listens, then maybe
Speaker 2: they don't. If they don't pick them up, what is
Speaker 2: a kid gonna do. They're gonna kick and scream. And
Speaker 2: as I carry my kid to the car, I'm going
Speaker 2: to the other part of my job. Oh it stinks
Speaker 2: to leave before you want. You probably wish you were
Speaker 2: an adult and can make all your own decisions. I
Speaker 2: get that leaving the park is so hard, but I
Speaker 2: am not bringing them back to the park. I am
Speaker 2: saying that while I'm carrying them in a sturdy way
Speaker 2: to the car. And that job boundaries validation. That's always
Speaker 2: an orienting principle. I come back to.
Speaker 1: There's something else you said about the boundaries that I
Speaker 1: think is really important, because I think sometimes when parents
Speaker 1: said a boundary, they think it's like they're telling their
Speaker 1: kid what to do, like stop with the TV. But
Speaker 1: you've algae that a boundary works a little bit differently.
Speaker 1: It has that part, but it's actually something else. What
Speaker 1: is the something else?
Speaker 2: All the time I hear from parents, and honestly I
Speaker 2: hear from nonparents, just adults. My mother in law does
Speaker 2: not respect my boundaries. My kid does not listen to
Speaker 2: my boundaries. Let me share my definition of boundaries and
Speaker 2: then we can hear together why those things don't really
Speaker 2: make sense. First, a boundary is something I tell someone
Speaker 2: I will do and it requires the other person to
Speaker 2: do nothing. So over and over I hear frustration from
Speaker 2: parents my kids don't respect my boundaries. And I'll say,
Speaker 2: tell me about a boundary you set and they say, oh, no,
Speaker 2: jumping on the couch. My kid is jumping on the couch.
Speaker 2: And I look at them and I say, stop jumping
Speaker 2: on the couch. We don't do that. And then we
Speaker 2: look at that kind of definition. Did you tell your
Speaker 2: kids something you will do? And they say no? Does
Speaker 2: the success of your boundary require your kid to do nothing? No?
Speaker 2: And this is like an aha moment where they're like,
Speaker 2: am I not setting a boundary? But there's no, You're not.
Speaker 2: You're making a request and we have to make requests
Speaker 2: all the time. But requests are boundaries. This is a boundary.
Speaker 2: And this is why I always say good inside parenting.
Speaker 2: It's sturdy. It's not gentle. And I don't mind the
Speaker 2: word gentle. Everyone's like, is it gentle? I just think
Speaker 2: the words we use have a power to evoke different
Speaker 2: parts of us. I know, for me, I'm not really
Speaker 2: accessing being gentle. I'm not accessing being harsh. I'm doing
Speaker 2: the thing in the middle. I'm being sturdy. Here's a boundary. Hey, sweetie,
Speaker 2: I need to get off the cat. They look at
Speaker 2: me and keep jumping because I have one of those
Speaker 2: kids too. This is a boundary. I'm gonna walk over
Speaker 2: to you, and if by the time I get there
Speaker 2: it's still too hard to get off the couch, I
Speaker 2: will put my arms around you. I will place you
Speaker 2: on the ground and I'll show you a safer place
Speaker 2: to jump that's not right in front of our class table. Okay,
Speaker 2: to be clear, when I go to pick up my kid,
Speaker 2: would you better bet I'm gonna do again. My kid's
Speaker 2: gonna say, give me one more chance, two more jumps.
Speaker 2: I don't want to get off. You're so mean. Does
Speaker 2: it matter? My boundary is what I do. It's an
Speaker 2: embodiment of my authority. My kid's gonna probably try to
Speaker 2: make a dodge back to the couch. What they're saying is,
Speaker 2: am I more powerful than you are? You gonna let
Speaker 2: me override the cockpit and be in charge. And they
Speaker 2: need to test that because actually they need to know
Speaker 2: that we are the sturdy pilot who will not let
Speaker 2: them pilot complain, especially not when they're in that state.
Speaker 2: And then I would block my kid. And then that
Speaker 2: other part, Oh, it's no fun to jump on the floor.
Speaker 2: You wish you could jump on the couch. Oh, I
Speaker 2: get that. That is absolutely not an option. Ugh, And
Speaker 2: I guess those are your choices. No jumping anywhere or
Speaker 2: jump somewhere less fun. That's so tricky. I have a
Speaker 2: feeling you're going to figure it out. That to me
Speaker 2: is the essence of boundary setting, and that, to me
Speaker 2: is the essence of real sturdiness. And so when parents
Speaker 2: say you're not punishing your kids, you're just raising snowflakes,
Speaker 2: I'm like, go watch me in action. You are sorely,
Speaker 2: sorely mistaken.
Speaker 1: But this gets to I think another misconception parents have
Speaker 1: about the kind of second part, the sort of validating
Speaker 1: the emotion's part, because I think sometimes parents think that
Speaker 1: that requires them to be the kind of so called
Speaker 1: happiness police, that something about managing kids' safety requires managing
Speaker 1: emotional safety. But you've sort of pushed back against the
Speaker 1: happiest police idea. Why is it that we have to
Speaker 1: kind of allow our.
Speaker 2: Kids to go through these moments of discomfort? Oh? Yes,
Speaker 2: you know. These are one of these moments where I'll
Speaker 2: be out with friends, totally social dinner and someone will
Speaker 2: make some offhand common like you don't you just want
Speaker 2: your kids to be happy? It's all we want, right,
Speaker 2: And I feel like my husband will look at me like, Becky, please,
Speaker 2: just like he knows where's coming next, Just not and
Speaker 2: move on. But I can't because I'll be like, no,
Speaker 2: that's not what I want, And it's so interesting. How again,
Speaker 2: then people go to the other extreme. People will say
Speaker 2: to me, you want your kids to be unhappy? WHOA Like? No,
Speaker 2: I'm not like wishing unhappiness on the humans I love
Speaker 2: the most. But the idea of wanting our kids to
Speaker 2: be happy, I think is a well intentioned but widely
Speaker 2: misguided wish that actually has the complete opposite impact on kids.
Speaker 2: They're developing circuitry in their body for what range of
Speaker 2: emotions am I set up to cope with? How capable
Speaker 2: am I of dealing with uncomfortable experiences? I'm talking about
Speaker 2: things like, mom, I'm the only one in my class
Speaker 2: who can't read and as a parent, let me to
Speaker 2: say it's painful when your kid says that, because we
Speaker 2: love our kids so much, right, I think what we're
Speaker 2: often tempted to say is something like that can't be true,
Speaker 2: or everybody reads at their own pace, or okay, but
Speaker 2: you are the only kid who can do multiplication. So
Speaker 2: what we have the urge to do is we see
Speaker 2: our kid disappointed, sad, frustrated, mad, jealous, some version of uncomfortable,
Speaker 2: and to some degree we think our job in the
Speaker 2: moment is to pluck them out of that feeling and
Speaker 2: bring them to a happy feeling. Another metaphor I like
Speaker 2: to think of is like we find them on a bench,
Speaker 2: and this is the bench if I can't read books
Speaker 2: yet I'm noticing people around me can do things I can't, which,
Speaker 2: by the way, will happen for the rest of your life.
Speaker 2: Or people have things I don't have, or I just
Speaker 2: feel less than. And when we see our kid on
Speaker 2: that bench, we see a sunnier bench and we're like,
Speaker 2: just like, come with me there, it's so sunny there.
Speaker 2: Why is this not ideal? Because resilience in adulthood is
Speaker 2: actually based on our ability to kind of proverbially like
Speaker 2: sit on all the benches we come across in life.
Speaker 2: I know my kid when they're older, at some point,
Speaker 2: they're going to I don't know, be in a class
Speaker 2: in college where they're intimidated by people. They're going to
Speaker 2: get a bad grade. They're not going to be invited
Speaker 2: to someone's birthday party. They're going to get fired for
Speaker 2: a job. They're going to think they're going to get
Speaker 2: a job and not get it. They're not going to
Speaker 2: get a promotion. They're going to be embarrassed in public.
Speaker 2: All of the things that happen in childhood won't happen
Speaker 2: in the exact form in adulthood, but they will happen
Speaker 2: with the same set of feelings in adulthood. And if
Speaker 2: when my kid is an adult, what they've learned is
Speaker 2: when I feel jealous, sad, nervous, mad, less than, I
Speaker 2: look around for the happy, where is the happy? All
Speaker 2: that sets my kid up for is anxiety and fragility.
Speaker 2: So what's the alternative? And this is going to sound
Speaker 2: so counterintuitive, but I'll explain it. Let me go back
Speaker 2: to that example. My kids on this bench are feeling
Speaker 2: less than, which sounds like I'm the only one who
Speaker 2: can't read now again, we don't have to go together extremes.
Speaker 2: I say, it's so true, you're so stupid. Duh, No,
Speaker 2: do not recommend. Okay, but if you think about your
Speaker 2: kid on that bench, what would it mean to just
Speaker 2: sit on the bench with them in some ways to
Speaker 2: say to your kid, you're on this bench and you're uncomfortable.
Speaker 2: I'm not scared of this bench. I don't need to
Speaker 2: pluck you off the bench. The only reason I would
Speaker 2: need to do this if this bench was like going
Speaker 2: to eat you alive. It's just a bench, by the way,
Speaker 2: you'll sit here a million times. So let me just
Speaker 2: PLoP down next to you. And then what you're doing
Speaker 2: is the most profound thing we can do as parents,
Speaker 2: is you're making sure your kid is no longer alone.
Speaker 2: Feelings don't overwhelm kids. Feeling alone in feelings overwhelm kids.
Speaker 2: And it's actually the experience of repeated aloneness in a
Speaker 2: feeling that leads to adult anxiety because you get encoded
Speaker 2: in the overwhelm of being alone. So I just want
Speaker 2: to give you a few lines because I wanted to
Speaker 2: make things concrete. First thing you can say to your
Speaker 2: kid when they say anything they're upset about I'm so
Speaker 2: glad you're talking to me about this.
Speaker 1: Not just parenting advice, is just out of general relationship advice.
Speaker 2: I was talking about this on a podcast a little
Speaker 2: while ago, and my husband, who doesn't usually listen, was like,
Speaker 2: you know, those three lines just saying when I talk
Speaker 2: to you about stuff that's hard at work, like I
Speaker 2: would like those lines. And so first line is just
Speaker 2: I'm so glad you're talking to me about this. The
Speaker 2: second line is saying to a kid, I believe you,
Speaker 2: and then the third line is just tell me more,
Speaker 2: because what you're really doing is you're saying to your
Speaker 2: kid in this powerful way, I am not afraid of
Speaker 2: your feelings. They will not swallow anyone. And because I
Speaker 2: can tolerate this feeling in you, you will be able
Speaker 2: to tolerate this feeling in you now. Ironically, Laurie, when
Speaker 2: it comes to happiness, regulating difficult emotions is a prerequisite.
Speaker 2: So really, if we quote want our kid to be happy,
Speaker 2: what we should really focus on is not fixing their unhappiness,
Speaker 2: but really helping them sit with it and cope with it.
Speaker 1: Leting your kids work through their own disappointment is hard
Speaker 1: it's painful to watch someone you love struggle, especially when
Speaker 1: your impulse is to step in and fix everything. But
Speaker 1: just like adults, children need to learn how to tolerate
Speaker 1: discomfort in order to feel more at ease with themselves.
Speaker 1: Doctor Becky believes that raising resilient kids involves holding both
Speaker 1: of these truths at the same time. That we need
Speaker 1: to let our kids experience discomfort even though it sucks.
Speaker 1: After the break, we'll explore this idea of multiplicity and
Speaker 1: dive deeper into how optimizing for long term happiness often
Speaker 1: means learning to sit with short term distress. For both
Speaker 1: children and adults. That happiness lab will be right back.
Speaker 1: From an evolutionary perspective, our most important goal in life
Speaker 1: is to make sure our kids survive so they can
Speaker 1: get their genes into the next generation. It therefore makes
Speaker 1: sense that parents have a built in motivation to do
Speaker 1: everything in their power to protect their children. If your
Speaker 1: kid wanders near a saber tooth tiger, it's your evolutionary
Speaker 1: duty to step in and keep them safe. But in
Speaker 1: modern society, that instinct to protect at all costs often
Speaker 1: leads to overparenting. The tendency to take over for your
Speaker 1: kid in nearly every tricky situation. Study after study shows
Speaker 1: that overparenting can inadvertently hurt the people we love. Most
Speaker 1: research shows that overparenting can inhibit a child's capacity for autonomy,
Speaker 1: problem solving, and even emotional resilience. So, when your son
Speaker 1: or daughter finds themselves in a sticky situation, when should
Speaker 1: you let them face the consequences and figure things out alone?
Speaker 1: And when should you offer a helping hand. Clinical psychologist
Speaker 1: doctor Becky Kennedy says that parents need to choose their
Speaker 1: moments of intervention very carefully.
Speaker 2: There are times you should swoop in. If your toddler
Speaker 2: is about to run across the street of New York City,
Speaker 2: swoop in.
Speaker 1: If they're sleeping in on the day of the sat
Speaker 1: you know, maybe give them a little nudge.
Speaker 2: Swoop in, right, swoop in. But swooping in and it
Speaker 2: has a more surprising impact on kids than we think,
Speaker 2: especially as they get older, because kids know someone swoops
Speaker 2: in because something's in emergency, or because someone doesn't see
Speaker 2: me as capable. And where are kids mirrors?
Speaker 1: To me?
Speaker 2: This is one of the most powerful things to think
Speaker 2: about as a parent. If I'm my kid's mirror, then
Speaker 2: I reflect to them the version of who they are.
Speaker 2: And so if I'm often reflecting my kid's lack of capability,
Speaker 2: which I don't think i'm doing, but I might unintentionally
Speaker 2: be doing by fixing so many things, it can't be
Speaker 2: surprised that as my kid gets older, I keep saying
Speaker 2: to friends, why can they figure things out? Why can't
Speaker 2: they even remember their water bottle? Shouldn't they be able
Speaker 2: to do this at age sixteen? Age doesn't bring skills.
Speaker 2: This is what I always tell parents. People say, at
Speaker 2: what age will my kids stop having these meltdowns? I
Speaker 2: feel like it's like someone saying, at what age will
Speaker 2: my kid be able to swim? And I say, well,
Speaker 2: are they learning how to swim? No, I'd be like,
Speaker 2: I'm not blaming you, but like at a certain age,
Speaker 2: no one's like gifted swimming. No one is gifted competence
Speaker 2: and capability and confidence and regulation. It's not years, it's
Speaker 2: what you do in the years. And so reflecting capability
Speaker 2: is a really big part of the good inside approach.
Speaker 2: It's deeply uncomfortable because reflecting capability of your kid has
Speaker 2: to go hand in hand in recognizing potential discomfort in
Speaker 2: your kid. And just letting it. That's the way I
Speaker 2: would say, let it right. And again, am I gonna
Speaker 2: let my kid miss their sat? No, I'm a reasonable human.
Speaker 2: Am I gonna let my kid forget their water bottle? When,
Speaker 2: by the way, we've been talking about remembering your own
Speaker 2: water bottle. Yes, here's actually a really important difference. Too
Speaker 2: often in those situations we do it from a place
Speaker 2: of frustration and punishment. So I'll say I'm not bringing
Speaker 2: you your water bottle. You can deal with that. Nobody
Speaker 2: finds that inspirational. This is very different, Swede. I'm not
Speaker 2: going to bring you your water bottle. You're a strong kid,
Speaker 2: You'll figure it out. And when you get home, let's
Speaker 2: figure out it. Just a better system to remember it.
Speaker 2: All the different things that happened that are hard. I
Speaker 2: really do say to myself, this is amazing. This is
Speaker 2: amazing learning that one of my kids waited so long
Speaker 2: and has to stay up late to work hard on
Speaker 2: a paper that they're now not going to be able
Speaker 2: to review with their teacher before, even though their teacher
Speaker 2: said they'll do that and they probably won't receive a
Speaker 2: great pan. What amazing warning. I love this.
Speaker 1: This is a gift, right, Like you know, how much
Speaker 1: are they going to get better over time? Like they're
Speaker 1: never going to put things off again because look at
Speaker 1: the terrible consequences they got, which is so important. But
Speaker 1: the problem as a parent, though, is that to hold
Speaker 1: I'm doing this wonderful thing I'm giving my kid learning
Speaker 1: it's a gift. You have to hold that at the
Speaker 1: same time as but I love my kid, I'm supposed
Speaker 1: to be a good parent. I'm allowing discomfort in a
Speaker 1: way that I could swoop in and fix and I've
Speaker 1: committed to that. And that gets to something else that
Speaker 1: I know you talk about a lot, this idea of
Speaker 1: needing to hold psychologically, this multiplicity as you've called it,
Speaker 1: that like you can be a really good parent and
Speaker 1: you can also let your kid forget their water bottle.
Speaker 1: You can be a really good parent and you could
Speaker 1: not remind them about the homework, and that might cause
Speaker 1: them to get a bad grade or cause them to
Speaker 1: kind of have a really tough night when they're pulling
Speaker 1: it all nighter. Talk to me about this multiplicity. How
Speaker 1: do we hold both of these things at once? And
Speaker 1: why is it so important to get good at doing this?
Speaker 2: So important? And again, this is where it skills for life.
Speaker 2: So holding multiplicity is important with your kids, so important
Speaker 2: with yourself at work in everything. A couple things I
Speaker 2: want to say about that. Number one, I just want
Speaker 2: to be on a bashed saying I'm very long term
Speaker 2: greedy in my parenting approach. Like if I had to
Speaker 2: choose between short term benefit and long term benefit, by
Speaker 2: the way, I think we often can get both, but
Speaker 2: I would choose long term. So when you do, let
Speaker 2: your kid experience life, by the way, assuming again, you
Speaker 2: can't say to your kid and expect it to be effective, See,
Speaker 2: you stayed up late and you got a bad grade. Again,
Speaker 2: it's not that it's like, huh, I wonder what happened?
Speaker 2: What do you to do differently next time? Oh, you'd
Speaker 2: have to start sooner. I wonder if you have a
Speaker 2: paper coming up that you would think, Oh, you do what?
Speaker 2: Oh it's due to wednesdays from now. I wonder when
Speaker 2: you'd have to start? Oh, be the Wednesday before. Oh
Speaker 2: my goodness, that's such a good idea. I wonder how
Speaker 2: you'll remembered do that? How would I? Oh, what, you're
Speaker 2: gonna put it in your calendar? Right? Leaving my kid
Speaker 2: to the well. That is really important. But I think
Speaker 2: the operating principle around kind of multiplicity that lets me
Speaker 2: do that is Okay. I see my kid's distress here,
Speaker 2: but I'm not optimizing for their short term happiness. I
Speaker 2: am optimizing for their long term resilience. Those are very
Speaker 2: different things. I mean, this morning, I hadn't gone to
Speaker 2: the gym in weeks, and I was like, Today's day.
Speaker 2: I knew today was the day, just for twenty minutes.
Speaker 2: I just wanted to get that post of energy in
Speaker 2: the morning. If I was optimizing for my short term happiness,
Speaker 2: you better bet I'm staying in bet you would be
Speaker 2: a bed. And so for being long term greed having
Speaker 2: that two things are true. My kid is having a
Speaker 2: hard time today and I can support them and use
Speaker 2: this moment to build resilience for the future. We need
Speaker 2: support for us as parents to be able to do that.
Speaker 2: Scripts a group of parents are saying, yeah, I'm doing
Speaker 2: that too. We don't have a culture of supporting parents.
Speaker 2: We do when you're pregnant. It's actually so interesting to me.
Speaker 2: When you're pregnant, people buy books, they take CPR courses,
Speaker 2: they invest a lot of money and time, and we're
Speaker 2: told in a societal way, that's what we should do
Speaker 2: as soon as you have a kid. We've really internalized
Speaker 2: this idea of maternal instinct. People say, is, madam, it's
Speaker 2: something I should be able to figure out on my own.
Speaker 2: I shouldn't need help because of this lack of what
Speaker 2: we are living with, like all of these fires. It's
Speaker 2: like whack a mole. And so that's a big picture
Speaker 2: of my mission is just to change that idea is
Speaker 2: to say, hey, my guess is, of all of your values,
Speaker 2: parenting in your kid's mental health probably towards the top
Speaker 2: of your list. My guess is if you look at
Speaker 2: your even expenses and the way you spend your energy,
Speaker 2: actually investing in the support a parent we need is
Speaker 2: probably low on the list. It's so out of alignment.
Speaker 2: Once we have that, it's a lot easier without that.
Speaker 2: When we're alone, you just spiral.
Speaker 1: And this is why I love your work so much,
Speaker 1: because you're kind of helping parents get these tools, and
Speaker 1: sometimes using those tools themselves can be really good for
Speaker 1: parents well being. I mean, one of my favorite tools
Speaker 1: that I know is one of your go tos is
Speaker 1: the idea of getting curious, especially when you're dealing with
Speaker 1: a bad behavior or a failure or a screw up.
Speaker 1: Why is curiosity such a superpower when you're dealing with failure.
Speaker 2: I think curiosity is the opposite of like judgment, and
Speaker 2: I think so often when we struggle as adults, we
Speaker 2: just judge ourselves right away. I think that's because when
Speaker 2: we had hard moments when we were kids, when we
Speaker 2: had bad behavior, guess what most of us were probably
Speaker 2: met with judgement. Go to your room. Why would you
Speaker 2: do that? You're so selfish, you're crying. I'll give you
Speaker 2: something to cry about. And so we've wired in our
Speaker 2: body struggle next to harsh judgment. And even though the
Speaker 2: harsh judgment part was initially someone else's voice, we've internalized
Speaker 2: it so much. This is so sad to me. It's
Speaker 2: become our own voice. And then we're hard on ourselves
Speaker 2: when we're triggered, and we're reactive to our kids. But
Speaker 2: the truth is we react to them based on our
Speaker 2: own circuitry. We can't do something with our kids that
Speaker 2: we're not working on with ourselves. If I have wired
Speaker 2: my struggles next to judgment, then it makes sense. I'm
Speaker 2: going to say to my kid, what's wrong with you?
Speaker 2: You're so dramatic, you always ruin things, even though later
Speaker 2: at night I'm thinking, why did I say that? I
Speaker 2: promise myself I wouldn't say that. What is the answer
Speaker 2: to this? Change starts by changing your interaction with yourself,
Speaker 2: which is why I care so deeply about all the
Speaker 2: reparenting work we do. That is the most powerful thing
Speaker 2: to be able to be the parent you want to be,
Speaker 2: and curiosity is the key. So let's say, as an adult,
Speaker 2: I just yelled at my kid. I think judgment activates
Speaker 2: so quickly. I'm such a monster. I messed up my
Speaker 2: kid forever. If anyone ever saw me, they wouldn't even
Speaker 2: believe the type my mother I am. I've said this
Speaker 2: to myself. I'm like doctor Becky, like I'm yelling at
Speaker 2: my kid? What is wrong with me? But I think
Speaker 2: I wonder what was going on for me at that moment,
Speaker 2: what led me to yell at my kid when they
Speaker 2: complained about dinner? And this is powerful what actually happened
Speaker 2: earlier in my day or a week that probably put
Speaker 2: me in the up to the brim place I was in.
Speaker 2: So then complaining about dinner is just a straw that
Speaker 2: broke the camel's back, and I yelled, this is curiosity.
Speaker 2: And I think one of the things again that we
Speaker 2: have to reparent ourselves about, is we mistakenly think being
Speaker 2: curious about bad behavior means you're condoning bad behavior. But again,
Speaker 2: like I always think about other areas, like if I'm
Speaker 2: curious about why my star football quarterback keeps throwing interceptions,
Speaker 2: why are they doing that? Is it they're positioning, is
Speaker 2: it they're timing. If a coach was saying that, I
Speaker 2: just can't imagine another coach would be like, oh, so
Speaker 2: you're condoning all these interceptions. It's just like, actually, so weird.
Speaker 2: Curiosity is the key to change. Judgment is actually the
Speaker 2: key to being stuck and never changing, just ineffective. So curiosity,
Speaker 2: I wonder why I did that to me? Another phrase
Speaker 2: that such beautiful, compassionate curiosity is I'm a good person.
Speaker 2: I was having a hard time. I wonder what came
Speaker 2: up for me at that moment, because usually that's what happens,
Speaker 2: like something comes up. I have a fear about my kid.
Speaker 2: I worry people think I'm a bad parent. I worry
Speaker 2: my kid's a sociopath. Well, as long as I'm thinking
Speaker 2: about my four year old as a sociopath, I guess
Speaker 2: it makes sense that I'm yelling at that. Okay, how
Speaker 2: else would I have to interpret their behavior to have
Speaker 2: a different thought and therefore probably be more able to
Speaker 2: stay calm. See now, curiosity allows me to make positive change.
Speaker 1: And these are all cases where you're using that curiosity
Speaker 1: yourself as a parent, or maybe you did a behavior
Speaker 1: that you know wasn't so awesome. You've argued that we
Speaker 1: can use the same kind of technique when we're dealing
Speaker 1: with a kid's bad behavior. Let's say you know, you
Speaker 1: find out your teenager lied to you they went to
Speaker 1: some party that they weren't supposed to go. To walk
Speaker 1: me through how you would use curiosity in that way,
Speaker 1: and maybe your our boundary setting and our kind of
Speaker 1: validating feelings job as well.
Speaker 2: So let's say you have a teenager who lied to you.
Speaker 2: Lying to me is one of the best things to
Speaker 2: start with, because lying there's an outlying that is so
Speaker 2: triggering to us as parents, and we interpret it so
Speaker 2: personally my teenager doesn't respect me, or we kind of
Speaker 2: like center ourselves. Whenever I work with parents from the
Speaker 2: things I say is okay, Let's say you have someone
Speaker 2: in your life you love, why would you lie to them?
Speaker 2: So interesting, Moore, I have never had anyone say I
Speaker 2: would never.
Speaker 1: We know that this is a behavior that comes up occasionally, right, right,
Speaker 1: I mean, why would you lie to someone that you
Speaker 1: love and respect?
Speaker 2: Why do you think you would?
Speaker 1: You were going through something terrible, you were really scared,
Speaker 1: something else was off that was like making this either
Speaker 1: so scary or so overwhelming that you had no choice.
Speaker 2: You know, I'll add to it for me, and I
Speaker 2: think I would lie because I was scared of someone's reaction.
Speaker 2: I think I would also lie because on some level
Speaker 2: I was so ashamed or embarrassed about something I did
Speaker 2: that if I had to like share the truth, it's
Speaker 2: almost like I'd have to like relive it again, like
Speaker 2: I'd have to face it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the lies are off in the doubling down on
Speaker 1: just being avoidant of what we've done and the shame
Speaker 1: of what we've done.
Speaker 2: Right. People think kids who lie, like, again, you're so sociopathic. Actually,
Speaker 2: there's something so vulnerable in that moment. They're like, I
Speaker 2: actually feel so guilty that it's so consuming me that
Speaker 2: I have to almost pretend this thing didn't happen to
Speaker 2: survive the moment. Okay, so you have this kid who
Speaker 2: lies right, and again, let's say we can maintain calm
Speaker 2: and not be triggered and not make it about us.
Speaker 2: How could you use curiosity? And I'm gonna model this
Speaker 2: exactly because it's gonna create controversy because it's different, and
Speaker 2: parents are gonna say, isn't that just letting them get
Speaker 2: away with it? We're so used to this adversarial control mindset.
Speaker 2: So let's say my kids like, no, I didn't take
Speaker 2: money from your durer. Meanwhile, I have some like ness
Speaker 2: cam like seeing my son like take it so obvious.
Speaker 2: Leading with curiosity would sound like this, this is actually
Speaker 2: important in the moment, I probably wouldn't even ask. I
Speaker 2: would actually say is a life lesson? Never ask someone
Speaker 2: a question you know the answer to. All you're doing
Speaker 2: is setting yourself up to get more frustrated with your
Speaker 2: kid and say, look, I know you took that money
Speaker 2: from the drawer, and like, I don't even want to
Speaker 2: get into I just know it. I saw it on
Speaker 2: the video. I'm not going to lead with the punishment.
Speaker 2: I'm not going to lead with a lecture. There must
Speaker 2: have been something about going out to dinner with your
Speaker 2: friends that felt so important that you also feel like
Speaker 2: I really didn't understand that you can be honest with
Speaker 2: me about and that's not my way of saying, it's okay,
Speaker 2: but we can deal with the okay not okay part later,
Speaker 2: And I'm pretty sure you know it's not okay to
Speaker 2: steal her lie. What's actually really more important to me
Speaker 2: is our relationship and figuring out what actually I could
Speaker 2: do to make it easier to tell me the truth.
Speaker 2: I know parents listening are like, w tf.
Speaker 3: You are going to make me raise a child who
Speaker 3: will lie to me forever. I would bet one hundred
Speaker 3: dollars your child will lie to you less because your
Speaker 3: kid will tell you the truth when they believe they
Speaker 3: can maintain.
Speaker 2: A connection with you when they tell you the truth.
Speaker 2: Kids are oriented by attachment from toddlers through teens, all
Speaker 2: of us are. They are primed to notice what will
Speaker 2: I tell my parent that will make them distance themselves
Speaker 2: from me? And what can I tell my parent that
Speaker 2: can still be held in love and safety and in
Speaker 2: a way when your kid lies to you. Ironically, they're
Speaker 2: doing that to temporarily preserve attachment because on some level
Speaker 2: that thinking, as long as I don't tell my parent
Speaker 2: the truth, we're still connected. As soon as I tell
Speaker 2: my parent the truth, we're broken. And so anything we
Speaker 2: do to further that pattern threat and if you do
Speaker 2: that again next time, you're grounded. All we're doing, ironically,
Speaker 2: is making a kid even more predispositioned to lie because
Speaker 2: they can't beat the evolutionary system that just wants to
Speaker 2: be connected to you. When you lead instead with curiosity,
Speaker 2: you actually strengthen your relationship and you develop a wider
Speaker 2: range of topics your teen feels comfortable telling you about.
Speaker 1: You're also modeling a great path for them to figure
Speaker 1: out their own behavior, right. I mean, even as an adult,
Speaker 1: sometimes when I do stuff and I screw stuff up
Speaker 1: or I you know, lie or whatever, it's hard for
Speaker 1: me to uncover the reasons behind that. I have to
Speaker 1: get curious with myself. So if you're kind of modeling
Speaker 1: curiosity with them, it also seems like a great strategy
Speaker 1: to get them to realize, like, oh, this is the
Speaker 1: same thing I can use when I screw up or
Speaker 1: what I fail, or when I'm like not pleased with
Speaker 1: my own behavior.
Speaker 2: It's exactly right. I mean, a parent's words becomes a
Speaker 2: child's self talk. That's also the long term greedy nature
Speaker 2: of good side. So there's going to be a time
Speaker 2: when our teen is in their twenties and thirties and
Speaker 2: they're going to do something that they're not proud of, right,
Speaker 2: whatever it is. They lied to their spouse, or they
Speaker 2: told their friends they couldn't go to dinner because they're sick,
Speaker 2: but then their friends saw on Instagram they're actually just
Speaker 2: with other friends, right, And you want your kid to
Speaker 2: be able to pause and to say, I wonder why
Speaker 2: I did that. If your kid can do that, which
Speaker 2: by the way, comes from your curiosity in the face
Speaker 2: of their struggle, they are going to be a much
Speaker 2: more successful, resilient th though.
Speaker 1: So when you feel that impulse to get all judgmental,
Speaker 1: whether it's about your child or yourself, take a pause
Speaker 1: and get curious. Not only is that eagerness to learn
Speaker 1: more pleasant than feeling judgy, it also has the added
Speaker 1: bonus of fostering personal growth. But can parents do more
Speaker 1: than just get curious when a child is acting out?
Speaker 1: Could we turn these unpleasant moments into positive experiences? What
Speaker 1: if we could make these times fun even joyful. After
Speaker 1: the break, doctor Becky will share a tool that she
Speaker 1: keeps in her back pocket to make tough parenting moments
Speaker 1: more playful. The Happiness Lab will be back in a moment.
Speaker 1: Clinical psychologist doctor Becky Kennedy believes that the traditional reward
Speaker 1: punishment model of parenting is not just ineffective, it can
Speaker 1: also cause parents to miss out on important opportunities to
Speaker 1: connect with their kids. Like adults, children learn best not
Speaker 1: when they're feeling threatened or bribed, but when they feel
Speaker 1: safe and supported and when they're having fun. In fact,
Speaker 1: doctor Becky thinks we need to bring way more humor
Speaker 1: and goofiness into parenting than most caregivers usually think.
Speaker 2: Playfulness is so important and I just want to name here.
Speaker 2: It's one of the hardest parts.
Speaker 1: For parents because parenting doesn't often feel playful. It just
Speaker 1: feels like a grind one hundred percent all the time.
Speaker 1: And so getting back to your hey, it's just funzie
Speaker 1: time mode can just be really tough.
Speaker 2: I think there's that, and I would say I don't
Speaker 2: think most parents experienced a lot of playfulness from their parents,
Speaker 2: true totally. People will say, why is it so hard
Speaker 2: for me to do pretend play when my kid is young,
Speaker 2: or just joke around with my teen when they're older,
Speaker 2: and they my parents hold a lot of guilt, like
Speaker 2: is something wrong with me? If play is hard for you,
Speaker 2: and if play feels awkward, all that's a sign of
Speaker 2: is play was likely not modeled to you by the
Speaker 2: adults in your life. And so any effort you make
Speaker 2: to be a little more playful, first all it will
Speaker 2: be awkward. Anything new feels awkward. But I really want
Speaker 2: anyone here just to tell themselves that's like a cycle
Speaker 2: breaking act. I'm pretty brave and amazing to do something
Speaker 2: with my kids that no one did with me. And
Speaker 2: so why is playfulness important? I'll give a couple examples.
Speaker 2: My kid's towel. Their towels are just always on the floor,
Speaker 2: and like, I don't know why it drives me not
Speaker 2: It's like I don't it's probably something inherited from my childhood,
Speaker 2: Like of all the things, okay, the towels on the floor.
Speaker 2: It's not like fine that you don't respect me, like
Speaker 2: you know, but it does bother me. And for so
Speaker 2: many years I feel like I've said, hey, have you
Speaker 2: noticed the towel on the floor a couple of weeks ago.
Speaker 2: This is what I said, because my kids always joked
Speaker 2: that I'm so old and I'm over the hill. That's
Speaker 2: what they like to say to me, you know, And
Speaker 2: I'll say, this is so weird. I feel like, I
Speaker 2: see your towel on the floor, but like my eyes
Speaker 2: at my forties, like they're kind of going and like
Speaker 2: I don't know. My kids like, yeah, mom, I think
Speaker 2: you're over the hill, you know, and I don't think
Speaker 2: there's a towel. Then I'm like really, because I'm gonna
Speaker 2: like walk over there slowly. I'm gonna get on my
Speaker 2: knees and just feel. And then while I do that,
Speaker 2: guess what my kid does? They go get their towel.
Speaker 2: And then I go and I touch the floor, and
Speaker 2: I'm like, oh my goodness, that is so weird.
Speaker 1: My eyes are so bad. I meet by bifocals.
Speaker 2: How terrible. Yeah, I just think about how that could
Speaker 2: go pick up your towel. I'm not picking up I'm
Speaker 2: doing homework. If you don't pick up your towel, now,
Speaker 2: no dessert. And then I'm like, why did I say that?
Speaker 2: I don't want to withhold dessert, and then I'm like, Okay,
Speaker 2: I guess you can have fruit and whip cream. That's
Speaker 2: not really dessert. I'm making stuff up. I'm getting in
Speaker 2: a fight. So what's the hardest part here? I actually
Speaker 2: think a lot of the moments to choose joy and
Speaker 2: to choose play, the alternative is in calm. Often the
Speaker 2: alternative is control and anger. The moments when you want
Speaker 2: to lead with control and anger are actual the best
Speaker 2: moments to try to infuse some play. Another example of this,
Speaker 2: and this is something I've done with younger kids for
Speaker 2: a while, but I've adapted to an old or kid version.
Speaker 2: Who is a kid who likes to clean up? Okay, look,
Speaker 2: no one's raising their hand. Cool, nobody likes to clean up.
Speaker 2: So what do you do when you have to get
Speaker 2: your kid to clean up? Often you lead with anger
Speaker 2: and control. If you don't clean up your toys, they're
Speaker 2: all going to be in the garbage tomorrow. My kid's like, well,
Speaker 2: I've heard that empty threat before. I have something I
Speaker 2: called to close your eyesact. That's how it goes. I'm
Speaker 2: just going to close dance and all I'm saying is
Speaker 2: if when I open my eyes, all the red blocks
Speaker 2: are in the bin and you can see I'm talking
Speaker 2: slowly because guess what my kid is doing. They're doing it.
Speaker 2: I might I might fall on the ground. I might
Speaker 2: do when I was gonna say you're I might do
Speaker 2: a butt dance and I might slap my butt. I
Speaker 2: just think about like a boss at work being like,
Speaker 2: oh my goodness, if your project is done, I might
Speaker 2: fall to the ground and do a butt dance. I
Speaker 2: feel like I'm like, I'm gonna finish my project. I
Speaker 2: want to see that.
Speaker 1: You know, if all you need to do to get
Speaker 1: the house clean is the butt dance, like bring it,
Speaker 1: you know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, here's what I think. I also want to empower
Speaker 2: parents with people will say that won't work with my
Speaker 2: sixteen year old. Whenever you say that won't work, it's
Speaker 2: really limiting. Why does the close your eyes hack work? Okay?
Speaker 2: Number one, you lead with trust and not control. If
Speaker 2: you think about saying to a kid, clean up and
Speaker 2: then you just stare at them again, imagine trying to
Speaker 2: do a report with your boss watching you at the computer.
Speaker 2: You'd freeze. If your boss at work says I trust
Speaker 2: you to do this and walks away, You're gonna do
Speaker 2: it and then add something silly and ridiculous. Trust silly ridiculous.
Speaker 2: So for your sixteen year old, you could say, look,
Speaker 2: one of your chores is to clear the table, or
Speaker 2: you know, to make your bed. I'm gonna go check
Speaker 2: on your sibling. If when I get back here that
Speaker 2: that is made, I don't even know what I might do,
Speaker 2: And I might just like delt into a ridiculous song
Speaker 2: that like, all you guys are singing and you're gonna
Speaker 2: tell me, Mom, you're so annoying. This is so cringe.
Speaker 2: I just might do this and my sixteen year old
Speaker 2: will roll their eyes, but they'll probably have a smile
Speaker 2: on their face and I walk out. They feel more
Speaker 2: connected to me, there's a little more joy, and I
Speaker 2: bet the likelihood of that bed being made just skyrocketed.
Speaker 1: I love this because you're able to get stuff done
Speaker 1: without the negative emotion, right, And I feel like, if
Speaker 1: only we can make parenting a little bit more goofy,
Speaker 1: a little bit more joyful and fun, a little bit
Speaker 1: more connected, parents would just feel so much better all
Speaker 1: the time.
Speaker 2: I think that's right, and I think pushback I get
Speaker 2: is when I said, so everything has to be a
Speaker 2: game can't my kids just listen? But I think we
Speaker 2: underestimate how much as adults we kind of cooperate with
Speaker 2: other people for the same reasons, like for fun. At
Speaker 2: the end of the day, cooperation and listening just means
Speaker 2: I'm doing something you want me to do that I
Speaker 2: don't want to do. Because anytime you say to a
Speaker 2: sixteen year old, hey, you can be on your phone
Speaker 2: for two hours, I don't know anyone who's like, I'm
Speaker 2: not dealing it. When we're talking about cooperation, we really
Speaker 2: mean I want my kid to do something and they
Speaker 2: don't want to do it. So as an adult, if
Speaker 2: you think I don't want to do something but someone
Speaker 2: else wants me to do it, why would I listen
Speaker 2: to them? Like if I'm having lunch with you, Louri
Speaker 2: and one of my friends walks by and it's like,
Speaker 2: can you guys both come help me pack up my
Speaker 2: apartment and I'm like no, and they're like, well, if
Speaker 2: you don't do it, I'm never going to be friends
Speaker 2: into it. I'm like, yeah, not doing it. If they
Speaker 2: say I have, it's like amazing, I don't know music
Speaker 2: to play and I'm going to get some like ice
Speaker 2: cream deliver or what do you think I feel like
Speaker 2: you and I might be like, okay, yeah, lay in
Speaker 2: levity is always a motivator to do things you don't
Speaker 2: want to do. And so it's not do I have
Speaker 2: to play games? Why can't my kid just listen? It's
Speaker 2: actually kids operate based on the same principles adults operate
Speaker 2: based on. I think this final insight is so important.
Speaker 2: Kids are motivated by the same principles that adults are.
Speaker 2: They prefer connection and validation to anger and judgment, and
Speaker 2: they respond way more favorably to humor and fun than
Speaker 2: they do to being forced. I'm so thrilled that doctor
Speaker 2: Becky was able to share all her insights with us today.
Speaker 2: Her good inside approach is a reminder that if we
Speaker 2: respond to our kids defiance as a signal of unmet
Speaker 2: needs or lagging skills, we can some and the curiosity
Speaker 2: needed to discover what's really going on and react a
Speaker 2: bit more happily. But let's do a quick recap of
Speaker 2: the tips doctor Becky shared today. First, we need to
Speaker 2: remember that the job description of being a parent involves
Speaker 2: two separate but important roles. We need to set boundaries,
Speaker 2: but we also need to validate. The boundary part keeps
Speaker 2: children safe and grounded, while a validation part helps us
Speaker 2: build trust and connection. But validation doesn't mean giving in
Speaker 2: saying I.
Speaker 1: Get how hard this is while holding the line, We'll
Speaker 1: teach your child that their emotions are real and manageable
Speaker 1: without rewarding that not so great behavior. Second, parents do
Speaker 1: not need to fix a child's feelings, They just need
Speaker 1: to make space for them, So challenge that happiness police mentality.
Speaker 1: Your goal is not to make your kids happy all
Speaker 1: the time, but to teach them that they can feel
Speaker 1: safe sitting with this comfort, a lesson that's super important
Speaker 1: for handling real life adversity. Later on Tip number three
Speaker 1: one end out shoot for long term greedy parenting, Try
Speaker 1: to avoid going for the kinds of short term comforts
Speaker 1: that prevent resilience in the future. But give yourself some
Speaker 1: grace while doing this, because parenting for the future is
Speaker 1: not easy, which gets to tip number four multiplicity. Remember
Speaker 1: that you need to hold two truths at once. I
Speaker 1: love my kid deeply, and I'm okay letting them face
Speaker 1: a tough moment. Tip number five summon curiosity. Curiosity leads
Speaker 1: to understanding and change, but judgment usually keeps us and
Speaker 1: our kids stuck. Tip number six is to choose playfulness
Speaker 1: over control. Bringing the fun back to tough situations can
Speaker 1: lead to connection and motivation without all the power struggles.
Speaker 1: So the next time you're tempted to lay down the law,
Speaker 1: maybe try a butt dance instead. Because play doesn't just
Speaker 1: make parenting easier, it actually makes it more joyful too.
Speaker 1: And today's final tip number seven, always give yourself and
Speaker 1: your child the benefit of the doubt. As doctor Becky
Speaker 1: often says, even when we're not at our best on
Speaker 1: the outside, we're still good inside. Next week on the
Speaker 1: Happiness Lab, we'll continue our deep dive into strategies for
Speaker 1: happier parenting. We'll be asking what can we do to
Speaker 1: better motivate our kids. We'll learn about the power of
Speaker 1: developing what's called a mentor mindset. We'll see that there
Speaker 1: are ways to hold our kids to high standards while
Speaker 1: validating their agency and independence. We'll also hear how these
Speaker 1: same strategies for collaborative troubleshooting can help you on the
Speaker 1: job and in your relationships too. That's all next time
Speaker 1: in our special season on Happier Parenting. On the Happiness
Speaker 1: lab with me, Doctor Laurie Santos