1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:03,240 Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Holly Fry and I'm Tracy Vie Wilson, and 2 00:00:03,279 --> 00:00:06,000 Speaker 1: we're the co host of Stuff You Missed in History Class. 3 00:00:06,280 --> 00:00:08,720 Speaker 1: We are a history podcast that tries to look at 4 00:00:08,760 --> 00:00:11,559 Speaker 1: the things that maybe we're overlooked in your history classes, 5 00:00:11,680 --> 00:00:14,800 Speaker 1: maybe not covered in as much detail, or frankly, maybe 6 00:00:14,840 --> 00:00:17,640 Speaker 1: covered in a way that was not accurate. New episodes 7 00:00:17,680 --> 00:00:22,360 Speaker 1: come out every Monday and Wednesday on iTunes, Google Play, Spotify, 8 00:00:22,480 --> 00:00:31,880 Speaker 1: or anywhere else that podcasts can be listened to. Welcome 9 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:34,720 Speaker 1: to Stuff Mom Never Told You from how stupp works 10 00:00:34,760 --> 00:00:42,720 Speaker 1: dot com. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Kristen 11 00:00:42,920 --> 00:00:45,959 Speaker 1: and I'm Caroline, and this is part four of our 12 00:00:46,040 --> 00:00:51,199 Speaker 1: series on romantic comedies, and today we're gonna bust a 13 00:00:51,320 --> 00:00:53,880 Speaker 1: rom com myth that only white people fall in love. 14 00:00:55,200 --> 00:01:01,040 Speaker 1: You know who knew. Yeah, we're looking at rom coms 15 00:01:01,080 --> 00:01:05,160 Speaker 1: of color you could call them, really focusing though on 16 00:01:05,400 --> 00:01:09,880 Speaker 1: black romantic comedies. And one of the most stunning things 17 00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:14,000 Speaker 1: to realize in reading for this episode, Caroline, is how 18 00:01:15,080 --> 00:01:19,959 Speaker 1: romantic comedies are one of, if not the most segregated 19 00:01:20,680 --> 00:01:26,880 Speaker 1: genres in Hollywood. Oh yeah, for sure, it's it's romantic 20 00:01:26,880 --> 00:01:32,160 Speaker 1: comedies starring black people are hardly marketed to the white 21 00:01:32,160 --> 00:01:36,520 Speaker 1: audience because so many people in Hollywood at the executive 22 00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:41,319 Speaker 1: level just assume that white audiences will not be interested. 23 00:01:41,360 --> 00:01:44,679 Speaker 1: But it creates that horrific loop of like, oh, well, 24 00:01:45,360 --> 00:01:48,080 Speaker 1: they're not marketing it to us, so I never developed 25 00:01:48,080 --> 00:01:50,160 Speaker 1: an interest in it, so I'm never gonna see it, 26 00:01:50,360 --> 00:01:53,440 Speaker 1: And that just reinforces the executives assumptions that, oh, we'll 27 00:01:53,480 --> 00:01:56,000 Speaker 1: see larger audiences aren't going to go see these quote 28 00:01:56,040 --> 00:02:01,440 Speaker 1: unquote black romantic comedies, whereas rom com starring white people, 29 00:02:01,480 --> 00:02:04,080 Speaker 1: of course, are not called white rom coms. They're called 30 00:02:04,120 --> 00:02:08,560 Speaker 1: mainstream right white people. Yes, white people are referred to 31 00:02:08,639 --> 00:02:12,000 Speaker 1: as mainstream audiences. Yeah, I mean even though, and this 32 00:02:12,080 --> 00:02:14,560 Speaker 1: is a whole other tangent that we don't really need 33 00:02:14,600 --> 00:02:16,720 Speaker 1: to get into, but if you just look at the 34 00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:21,480 Speaker 1: per capita ticket sales of who goes to see movies, 35 00:02:22,080 --> 00:02:28,760 Speaker 1: African Americans and Latinos per capita like by far more 36 00:02:29,280 --> 00:02:34,640 Speaker 1: movie tickets than so called mainstream audiences. So the whole 37 00:02:34,919 --> 00:02:38,280 Speaker 1: you know, all these marketing arguments I think are a 38 00:02:38,320 --> 00:02:41,320 Speaker 1: bit of a stretch sometimes. Um, but if we even 39 00:02:41,400 --> 00:02:46,000 Speaker 1: look at interracial rom comms or romances, because some of 40 00:02:46,000 --> 00:02:47,760 Speaker 1: these movies were going to talk about kind of straddle 41 00:02:47,800 --> 00:02:51,000 Speaker 1: that line between rom com or just straight up romance. Um. 42 00:02:51,120 --> 00:02:55,560 Speaker 1: But even today, inter racial films, inter racial romances, whether 43 00:02:55,680 --> 00:03:01,520 Speaker 1: comedic or not, are considered taboo. Yeah. Um. And I 44 00:03:01,520 --> 00:03:05,040 Speaker 1: think a good way to get into this conversation is 45 00:03:05,160 --> 00:03:09,400 Speaker 1: if we go to a Jet magazine piece from ninete 46 00:03:10,400 --> 00:03:13,440 Speaker 1: that really spelled out this issue. Um. It was called 47 00:03:13,760 --> 00:03:18,240 Speaker 1: why Blacks don't get romantic roles in movies? So it's 48 00:03:18,280 --> 00:03:21,359 Speaker 1: been years since I've seen guests Who's coming to dinner 49 00:03:21,440 --> 00:03:26,160 Speaker 1: with Sydney Portier. Also, I can't remember the lead actress's name, 50 00:03:26,200 --> 00:03:29,800 Speaker 1: but her parents are played by Katherine Hepburn and Spencer Tracy, 51 00:03:30,320 --> 00:03:34,120 Speaker 1: classic romcom couple. So it's such a great movie. But 52 00:03:34,960 --> 00:03:38,720 Speaker 1: Sydney Portier was not permitted. His character was not permitted 53 00:03:38,760 --> 00:03:43,920 Speaker 1: to kiss, touch, caress, hug anything his fiancee. Yeah. So 54 00:03:44,000 --> 00:03:47,119 Speaker 1: that goes all the way back to the Hollywood Code 55 00:03:47,120 --> 00:03:53,360 Speaker 1: I think enacted in four an anti missigenation rule, essentially 56 00:03:53,400 --> 00:03:56,560 Speaker 1: saying that people who do not have the same skin 57 00:03:56,600 --> 00:04:01,880 Speaker 1: color can not caress or kiss. Um. And this was 58 00:04:01,920 --> 00:04:05,760 Speaker 1: one reason, as we talked about in our episode on 59 00:04:06,040 --> 00:04:10,880 Speaker 1: the stereotyping and exotic sizing of Asian women. One reason 60 00:04:10,960 --> 00:04:16,000 Speaker 1: why a silver screen actress, Anime Wong was never really 61 00:04:16,040 --> 00:04:19,640 Speaker 1: able to break through and get all these leading roles 62 00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:24,080 Speaker 1: because per Hollywood rules, she could never kiss a white 63 00:04:24,080 --> 00:04:27,280 Speaker 1: man on screen. Yeah, so that was the Haze Code 64 00:04:27,520 --> 00:04:30,479 Speaker 1: that we talked about in our first episode. And the 65 00:04:30,680 --> 00:04:36,920 Speaker 1: reason that those uh like segregated couples rules ended up 66 00:04:37,080 --> 00:04:40,960 Speaker 1: embedded in the Haze Code was that the majority of 67 00:04:41,040 --> 00:04:44,520 Speaker 1: states in this country still had those antimsigenation laws, and 68 00:04:44,600 --> 00:04:48,200 Speaker 1: so they weren't going to have their movies breaking state laws, 69 00:04:48,480 --> 00:04:50,880 Speaker 1: i e. They wanted to make as much money as 70 00:04:50,920 --> 00:04:54,120 Speaker 1: they possibly could, and if they risked showing a movie 71 00:04:54,240 --> 00:04:57,359 Speaker 1: in a state that would be against that, then they'd 72 00:04:57,360 --> 00:05:00,640 Speaker 1: lose money. And it's for that reason that in the 73 00:05:01,839 --> 00:05:07,680 Speaker 1: film Fatal Beauty, Whoopie Goldberg claimed that love scene between 74 00:05:07,720 --> 00:05:11,719 Speaker 1: her and co star Sam Elliott was cut because of 75 00:05:11,760 --> 00:05:14,800 Speaker 1: studio racism because it would be too racy to show 76 00:05:14,839 --> 00:05:17,680 Speaker 1: those two having sex. But she made the great point 77 00:05:17,839 --> 00:05:20,000 Speaker 1: in that article. She was quoted in that Jet Magazine 78 00:05:20,080 --> 00:05:22,520 Speaker 1: article is saying if he had put money on the 79 00:05:22,560 --> 00:05:24,760 Speaker 1: table at the end of our sexual encounter, they would 80 00:05:24,800 --> 00:05:27,960 Speaker 1: have left the clip in which is such an indictment 81 00:05:28,400 --> 00:05:31,920 Speaker 1: of Hollywood racism, but so true, so accurate. To people 82 00:05:31,960 --> 00:05:35,400 Speaker 1: who just are attracted to each other having sex, that's 83 00:05:35,440 --> 00:05:37,480 Speaker 1: not okay if they're of a different race. But oh 84 00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:40,880 Speaker 1: if it were a prostitution scene, like we'll let a 85 00:05:40,880 --> 00:05:43,359 Speaker 1: black lady have sex with a white dude. Well and 86 00:05:43,440 --> 00:05:46,040 Speaker 1: even if it is, you know, two people of color 87 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:50,200 Speaker 1: having sex. Willis Edwards, who was the former president of 88 00:05:50,240 --> 00:05:53,400 Speaker 1: the Beverly Hills and a c P Chapter, told Jet 89 00:05:53,440 --> 00:05:57,080 Speaker 1: Magazine that Hollywood has never wanted us to have love interests. 90 00:05:57,520 --> 00:06:00,159 Speaker 1: They feel it won't sell em Peoria or in mississiy Be. 91 00:06:00,480 --> 00:06:03,680 Speaker 1: We're looked upon as comedians, not as people who have 92 00:06:03,839 --> 00:06:07,279 Speaker 1: families and intimacy. Yeah, and we saw that, you know, 93 00:06:07,360 --> 00:06:09,960 Speaker 1: in our last episode on Sidekicks, that you get the 94 00:06:09,960 --> 00:06:13,520 Speaker 1: token black character who's typically two dimensionals, some kind of 95 00:06:13,560 --> 00:06:18,640 Speaker 1: either sassy woman or spiritual guide of some kind, rather 96 00:06:18,760 --> 00:06:23,760 Speaker 1: than getting the actual three dimensional character treatment. Yeah. And 97 00:06:23,800 --> 00:06:27,880 Speaker 1: it was actually for that reason that Spike Lee made 98 00:06:27,920 --> 00:06:31,440 Speaker 1: the films Is She's Got to Have It in nine 99 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:37,080 Speaker 1: nineties Mobida Blues, because he figured that the only way 100 00:06:37,120 --> 00:06:40,480 Speaker 1: to change that situation was to just make the films 101 00:06:40,920 --> 00:06:46,200 Speaker 1: that he wanted to see. Um. And of course there 102 00:06:46,240 --> 00:06:51,760 Speaker 1: are black romantic comedies, there are black romances, um. But 103 00:06:52,240 --> 00:06:55,480 Speaker 1: the the segregation of the whole thing is really it's 104 00:06:55,520 --> 00:06:58,160 Speaker 1: just stunning to be over and over again because before 105 00:06:58,680 --> 00:07:02,280 Speaker 1: reading up for this episode, old and I am about 106 00:07:02,360 --> 00:07:05,560 Speaker 1: to show my whiteness. I'm even wearing a white button 107 00:07:05,600 --> 00:07:08,479 Speaker 1: down dress listeners, which is appropriate because I was not 108 00:07:08,600 --> 00:07:15,280 Speaker 1: aware of the depth and critical range of the black 109 00:07:15,400 --> 00:07:21,600 Speaker 1: rom com cannon that exists. And it's because when I 110 00:07:21,640 --> 00:07:24,080 Speaker 1: have been seeing, you know, showing those movies, it's like, oh, 111 00:07:24,080 --> 00:07:27,040 Speaker 1: well those that's a black rom com. Okay, It's like 112 00:07:27,120 --> 00:07:29,600 Speaker 1: we we grow up you and are white women, we 113 00:07:29,640 --> 00:07:33,840 Speaker 1: probably did not grow up watching black romantic comedies. Um. 114 00:07:33,880 --> 00:07:35,680 Speaker 1: In the same way, I have a feeling that there 115 00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:38,480 Speaker 1: are plenty of you know, women of color who are like, yeah, 116 00:07:38,520 --> 00:07:41,520 Speaker 1: I didn't grow up watching notting Hill and my best 117 00:07:41,560 --> 00:07:47,120 Speaker 1: friend's wedding. Um. But this episode for me was a 118 00:07:47,240 --> 00:07:52,120 Speaker 1: revelation in just how just how racist Hollywood is. Yeah. 119 00:07:52,280 --> 00:07:55,560 Speaker 1: I mean the only black romance I grew up watching 120 00:07:55,680 --> 00:07:58,080 Speaker 1: was hostelic At a Groove Back, which is I would 121 00:07:58,120 --> 00:08:01,880 Speaker 1: not classify that as a rom com. But but I 122 00:08:01,880 --> 00:08:04,760 Speaker 1: think romance in this convo, though, some romances are going 123 00:08:04,800 --> 00:08:09,680 Speaker 1: to count just because those kinds of movies are so significant, 124 00:08:09,680 --> 00:08:13,160 Speaker 1: Because how Stella Gotta Grew Back definitely crossed into quote 125 00:08:13,240 --> 00:08:18,160 Speaker 1: unquote mainstream audiences. Exactly, you're the mainstream, Caroline, Little Caroline. 126 00:08:18,240 --> 00:08:21,720 Speaker 1: You know I'm the mainstream now dog um, And so 127 00:08:21,800 --> 00:08:26,400 Speaker 1: it makes sense that the roots. Kelly Goff was super 128 00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:30,240 Speaker 1: not happy. But when she saw New York Magazine's list 129 00:08:30,440 --> 00:08:32,360 Speaker 1: of the top twenty five rom coms that had come 130 00:08:32,360 --> 00:08:34,880 Speaker 1: out since when Harry met Sally and saw that it 131 00:08:34,920 --> 00:08:38,360 Speaker 1: didn't contain a single black lead film. And not only 132 00:08:38,880 --> 00:08:43,280 Speaker 1: did it not contain a single black lead romantic comedy, 133 00:08:43,360 --> 00:08:46,560 Speaker 1: but the reasoning for that that was provided by the 134 00:08:46,600 --> 00:08:51,520 Speaker 1: two white guy critics who wrote the list is so ridiculous, 135 00:08:51,600 --> 00:08:56,280 Speaker 1: and and Goff appropriately skewers them for this. So they 136 00:08:56,320 --> 00:08:59,680 Speaker 1: basically said, or they did say, quote their movies, this 137 00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:02,840 Speaker 1: list needs. We have a couple of LGBT rom coms 138 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:04,520 Speaker 1: on there, but we wish there could be more. And 139 00:09:04,600 --> 00:09:07,720 Speaker 1: while African American rom coms, as exemplified in films like 140 00:09:07,760 --> 00:09:10,280 Speaker 1: The Best Man, in Waiting to Exhale and About Last 141 00:09:10,360 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 1: Night have thrived during this time. We couldn't agree on 142 00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:17,440 Speaker 1: any titles we felt were strong enough to warrant inclusion 143 00:09:17,480 --> 00:09:20,760 Speaker 1: on this list, and Golf is like, are you kidding me? 144 00:09:20,800 --> 00:09:24,480 Speaker 1: It never occurred to you, Uh, two white guys who 145 00:09:24,559 --> 00:09:26,480 Speaker 1: were like, I don't know how to pick a black 146 00:09:26,559 --> 00:09:28,200 Speaker 1: rom com, So I'm just not going to talk about 147 00:09:28,520 --> 00:09:31,760 Speaker 1: to maybe ask a woman or a person of color 148 00:09:33,120 --> 00:09:37,840 Speaker 1: for ideas. Yeah, um, or consider the fact that maybe 149 00:09:38,280 --> 00:09:42,440 Speaker 1: maybe just one Adam Sandler Drew Barrymore rom com is enough, 150 00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:45,200 Speaker 1: because No, fifty First States is not one of the 151 00:09:45,840 --> 00:09:48,120 Speaker 1: best rom coms that has come out ever since when 152 00:09:48,160 --> 00:09:50,840 Speaker 1: Harry Met maybe one of the worst movies. They also 153 00:09:50,920 --> 00:09:55,920 Speaker 1: listed Her, which feels like a stretch, and also I 154 00:09:55,960 --> 00:10:01,040 Speaker 1: Love You Philip Morris, which again it's like, okay, in 155 00:10:01,080 --> 00:10:07,720 Speaker 1: what way is her a better rom com than The 156 00:10:07,760 --> 00:10:11,760 Speaker 1: Best Man? Which, yes, listeners, I spent this weekend watching 157 00:10:11,840 --> 00:10:15,200 Speaker 1: The Best Man and The Best Man Holiday, and let 158 00:10:15,200 --> 00:10:18,920 Speaker 1: me tell you what a delight both of them more 159 00:10:19,480 --> 00:10:22,760 Speaker 1: because A. T. Diggs does follow stuff I've never told 160 00:10:22,800 --> 00:10:25,480 Speaker 1: you on Twitter, and I kept just wanting to tweet 161 00:10:25,559 --> 00:10:28,720 Speaker 1: him how much I was really enjoying his film, because 162 00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:31,760 Speaker 1: you just get to see Day Diggs shirtless a lot, 163 00:10:31,880 --> 00:10:37,640 Speaker 1: but also Morris Chestnut shirtless a lot. Um, there's just 164 00:10:37,679 --> 00:10:41,240 Speaker 1: a lot of really uh really handsome chests and jawlines 165 00:10:41,280 --> 00:10:48,920 Speaker 1: and those movies. But um, my objectifying, my sexual objectifying aside, 166 00:10:49,120 --> 00:10:54,120 Speaker 1: they were just really enjoyable ensemble films. Um. So yeah, 167 00:10:54,280 --> 00:10:59,920 Speaker 1: just seeing seeing that was I mean, the fact that 168 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:02,160 Speaker 1: there were no black lead rom coms in this list. 169 00:11:02,440 --> 00:11:06,040 Speaker 1: Like I said, it's bad enough, but to come out 170 00:11:06,120 --> 00:11:10,120 Speaker 1: and say, like, don't you hear yourself talking? Is my 171 00:11:10,280 --> 00:11:13,360 Speaker 1: question to these gentlemen, Like don't you hear the words 172 00:11:13,400 --> 00:11:16,000 Speaker 1: that you just said? Why don't you ask someone or 173 00:11:16,120 --> 00:11:21,000 Speaker 1: go watch them? Well, and it perpetuates the myth that 174 00:11:21,800 --> 00:11:24,679 Speaker 1: there are no good black rom comms. Yeah. Well, and 175 00:11:24,760 --> 00:11:28,679 Speaker 1: also it just perpetuates the point of view of the 176 00:11:28,720 --> 00:11:34,920 Speaker 1: white man being the norm, being the standard, because yeah, 177 00:11:34,960 --> 00:11:37,360 Speaker 1: like maybe they Okay, so maybe these guys did watch 178 00:11:37,400 --> 00:11:41,560 Speaker 1: a bunch of black lead romantic comedies. But if your 179 00:11:41,840 --> 00:11:46,319 Speaker 1: baseline for what is normal, good, funny, whatever, is only 180 00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:49,760 Speaker 1: ever going to be Matthew McConaughey and Kate Hudson like, 181 00:11:49,840 --> 00:11:52,760 Speaker 1: maybe maybe it's time to as critics and just as 182 00:11:52,800 --> 00:11:55,680 Speaker 1: consumers of media to broaden your horizons well, and a 183 00:11:55,679 --> 00:11:59,360 Speaker 1: lot of it speaks to just the marginalization of black 184 00:11:59,400 --> 00:12:02,000 Speaker 1: lead film, which is something that we've talked about before 185 00:12:02,200 --> 00:12:07,680 Speaker 1: in our episode on black female film directors. Shout out 186 00:12:07,720 --> 00:12:11,240 Speaker 1: to Gina Blythe Prince in Love and Basketball by the Way, 187 00:12:11,280 --> 00:12:13,640 Speaker 1: which I also watched, um And I will get to 188 00:12:13,679 --> 00:12:15,360 Speaker 1: it in a second, Caroline, because I have a lot 189 00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:18,320 Speaker 1: of thoughts, um, But I have a feeling there is 190 00:12:18,400 --> 00:12:25,000 Speaker 1: this mainstream notion that black comedy is exclusive only to 191 00:12:25,120 --> 00:12:30,400 Speaker 1: Tyler Perry today, and that it is comedy that is 192 00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:36,719 Speaker 1: inaccessible and unrelatable to white audiences and is um and 193 00:12:36,720 --> 00:12:39,480 Speaker 1: and that is as good as it gets, which really 194 00:12:39,520 --> 00:12:41,880 Speaker 1: couldn't be farther from the truth, especially when we're talking 195 00:12:41,920 --> 00:12:49,040 Speaker 1: about classic rom comms, because surprise, surprise, other white listeners. 196 00:12:49,400 --> 00:12:53,960 Speaker 1: If we look at the mainstream heyday, the white heyday 197 00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:58,760 Speaker 1: of rom comms, starting with when Harry met Sally and 198 00:12:58,840 --> 00:13:02,720 Speaker 1: into the nineties, you have a similar kind of heyday 199 00:13:02,760 --> 00:13:07,199 Speaker 1: happening in black lead rom coms as well, or just 200 00:13:07,240 --> 00:13:10,280 Speaker 1: the more rom with a little bit of calm, but 201 00:13:10,360 --> 00:13:13,360 Speaker 1: more rom Yeah. And so you know, when Harry met 202 00:13:13,360 --> 00:13:19,559 Speaker 1: Sally came out launches the nineties modern neo romantic comedy. 203 00:13:19,600 --> 00:13:22,040 Speaker 1: A year before that, though, you have one of my 204 00:13:22,200 --> 00:13:30,280 Speaker 1: favorite romantic comedies in the world, Nights Coming to America 205 00:13:30,920 --> 00:13:37,280 Speaker 1: with Eddie Murphy and his sidekick ar Cineo Hall. So good. 206 00:13:37,440 --> 00:13:39,000 Speaker 1: It's got the it's the full I mean, it's a 207 00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:41,560 Speaker 1: full romantic comedy. It's got the happy ending, it's got 208 00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:47,880 Speaker 1: the masquerade, the deception. Uh. And it's a it's absolutely 209 00:13:47,880 --> 00:13:51,040 Speaker 1: a black lead film. And see why then, is Coming 210 00:13:51,080 --> 00:13:55,040 Speaker 1: to America, which I agree is absolutely hilarious. Um, it's 211 00:13:55,080 --> 00:13:59,719 Speaker 1: peak Eddie Murphy. Um why is that not in the 212 00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:03,160 Speaker 1: those lists that are all over the internet, Because it's 213 00:14:03,160 --> 00:14:09,040 Speaker 1: literally it fulfills just about every trope for better worse 214 00:14:09,400 --> 00:14:13,400 Speaker 1: that there is that's discussed in all the rom com academia. 215 00:14:13,600 --> 00:14:15,920 Speaker 1: I think it's because we have this idea that a 216 00:14:16,040 --> 00:14:19,800 Speaker 1: romantic comedy is inherently a white film, I would agree. 217 00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:24,640 Speaker 1: And you can have a white comedian in a romantic 218 00:14:24,640 --> 00:14:28,800 Speaker 1: comedy leading role and it's still a mainstream romantic comedy. 219 00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:32,120 Speaker 1: But you have a black comedian leading a black lead 220 00:14:32,320 --> 00:14:35,760 Speaker 1: romantic comedy and it becomes like a black comedy or 221 00:14:35,840 --> 00:14:39,320 Speaker 1: just a just a comedy rather than what it is 222 00:14:39,360 --> 00:14:42,160 Speaker 1: which is a true romantic comedy. Well in one of 223 00:14:42,160 --> 00:14:47,200 Speaker 1: those classics of the black lead rom coms that I 224 00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:50,000 Speaker 1: could not find anywhere on the internet to watch, which 225 00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:54,160 Speaker 1: I'm really disappointed about, is Love Jones from because it's 226 00:14:54,160 --> 00:14:57,560 Speaker 1: sited over and over and over again as the holy 227 00:14:57,720 --> 00:15:03,000 Speaker 1: grail of black rom ms. Um, but I couldn't find it, listeners. 228 00:15:03,000 --> 00:15:04,400 Speaker 1: I have to be honest with you, so I have 229 00:15:04,480 --> 00:15:07,200 Speaker 1: not seen it. Um. But I did watch The Best Man, 230 00:15:07,440 --> 00:15:09,520 Speaker 1: and of course then I had to watch the follow up, 231 00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:13,160 Speaker 1: The Best Man Holiday. Um, and also watched Love and Basketball. 232 00:15:14,200 --> 00:15:20,200 Speaker 1: And with all of these you see this uh familiar 233 00:15:20,360 --> 00:15:24,040 Speaker 1: cast of romcom leads in the same way that you 234 00:15:24,160 --> 00:15:29,360 Speaker 1: see the uh Meg Ryan's and Julia Roberts and Hugh 235 00:15:29,400 --> 00:15:35,720 Speaker 1: Grants of White films with Sna Lathan, Nil Long, Gabrielle Union, 236 00:15:35,880 --> 00:15:41,520 Speaker 1: Morris Chestnut again, Ta Digs, Tay Diggs forever. Um, are 237 00:15:41,520 --> 00:15:44,160 Speaker 1: you gonna get that tattooed? H? Well? You know what 238 00:15:45,320 --> 00:15:48,800 Speaker 1: after watching The Best Man The Best Man Holiday? Um, 239 00:15:48,840 --> 00:15:53,440 Speaker 1: if I had to play um uh bang Mary Kill 240 00:15:53,680 --> 00:16:00,240 Speaker 1: with Morris Chestnuts, take Diggs and Terence Howard, Um, I 241 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:03,600 Speaker 1: I think I would, oh man, I would want to 242 00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:05,920 Speaker 1: look at Morris Chestnut for a really long time and 243 00:16:05,960 --> 00:16:07,840 Speaker 1: then but I did, I'd have to kill him and 244 00:16:07,880 --> 00:16:11,160 Speaker 1: then I would sleep with Teggs. But I would marry 245 00:16:11,240 --> 00:16:15,000 Speaker 1: Terence Howard. Yeah. I mean he's like, he's he's the 246 00:16:15,040 --> 00:16:19,560 Speaker 1: bad boy in both of those films. Um, but Chris 247 00:16:19,840 --> 00:16:22,680 Speaker 1: wants did you hear that? World, Kristen wants to marry 248 00:16:22,720 --> 00:16:24,560 Speaker 1: the bad boys. I mean, he's just like, he's just 249 00:16:24,600 --> 00:16:28,640 Speaker 1: got a certain charm um that that I really enjoyed. 250 00:16:28,760 --> 00:16:32,120 Speaker 1: And there was an interview over at Indie Wire with 251 00:16:32,280 --> 00:16:36,960 Speaker 1: the director of Um of the Best Man, who was 252 00:16:37,000 --> 00:16:39,640 Speaker 1: talking about how it's funny to him that it's always 253 00:16:39,680 --> 00:16:43,320 Speaker 1: categorized as a rom com, because he was like, no, 254 00:16:43,440 --> 00:16:45,200 Speaker 1: this isn't so much a rom com. It's just an 255 00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:51,320 Speaker 1: ensemble film for me. But simply because of how white Hollywood, 256 00:16:52,520 --> 00:16:58,400 Speaker 1: you know, so like narrowly interprets black film. Um, it's 257 00:16:58,440 --> 00:17:00,760 Speaker 1: it's got to be a romantic comedy because there is 258 00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:05,000 Speaker 1: some comedy in it and some rom and some rom 259 00:17:05,000 --> 00:17:08,720 Speaker 1: and plenty of calm remedy. Yes. Well, Kristen, the year 260 00:17:08,760 --> 00:17:11,359 Speaker 1: after The Best Man came out in two thousand, you 261 00:17:11,359 --> 00:17:13,440 Speaker 1: get Love and Basketball, and you said that there was 262 00:17:13,480 --> 00:17:15,399 Speaker 1: more you had to say about that? Oh, I got 263 00:17:15,480 --> 00:17:18,439 Speaker 1: so much to say. So Love and Basketball stars Sana 264 00:17:18,560 --> 00:17:24,200 Speaker 1: Lathan and also um Alfrey Woodard Omar Epps all star cast. 265 00:17:24,440 --> 00:17:28,040 Speaker 1: And it's a coming of age story, which I love. 266 00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:33,080 Speaker 1: And it's also Caroline one of the most feminist films 267 00:17:33,119 --> 00:17:37,000 Speaker 1: I have ever seen, hands down, from the get go. 268 00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:41,000 Speaker 1: It does play on some tropes of the sporty girl 269 00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:45,240 Speaker 1: gets a makeover from her sister and you know, catches 270 00:17:45,320 --> 00:17:47,600 Speaker 1: the neighbor boy's eye because suddenly it's like, you know, 271 00:17:47,680 --> 00:17:50,080 Speaker 1: the the librarian taking her hair down kind of moment. 272 00:17:50,800 --> 00:17:54,600 Speaker 1: But Monica sinal Athan's character is so self possessed from 273 00:17:54,640 --> 00:17:57,120 Speaker 1: the get go, knowing that not only is she good 274 00:17:57,119 --> 00:18:00,240 Speaker 1: at basketball, that she is better than the boy is 275 00:18:00,359 --> 00:18:05,600 Speaker 1: at basketball, and she's so singularly focused on her drive. 276 00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:09,359 Speaker 1: She doesn't care about looking pretty, she doesn't care about, 277 00:18:09,760 --> 00:18:12,520 Speaker 1: you know, all of these other girls who are trying to, 278 00:18:13,840 --> 00:18:16,760 Speaker 1: you know, hook up with her neighbor who she's secretly 279 00:18:16,760 --> 00:18:19,400 Speaker 1: in love with, played by Omar Epps Um. And there's 280 00:18:19,440 --> 00:18:24,080 Speaker 1: just all of these really fascinating relationships too, between Omar 281 00:18:24,200 --> 00:18:28,159 Speaker 1: Epps and his father, who is a retired professional basketball player, 282 00:18:28,359 --> 00:18:32,360 Speaker 1: but also Monica and her mother, who is a stay 283 00:18:32,359 --> 00:18:35,639 Speaker 1: at home mom, who have a lot of tension between 284 00:18:35,680 --> 00:18:40,520 Speaker 1: them because she's not conventionally like girly enough, you know, 285 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:43,600 Speaker 1: but her it turns out, her mom thinks that she 286 00:18:43,680 --> 00:18:47,320 Speaker 1: doesn't have respect for her, you know, as a stay 287 00:18:47,359 --> 00:18:49,159 Speaker 1: at home mother. And they're just like, I don't know, 288 00:18:49,200 --> 00:18:52,440 Speaker 1: they're they're all these feminist themes that come up, and 289 00:18:52,560 --> 00:18:56,919 Speaker 1: a lot of conversations that felt very familiar as just 290 00:18:57,000 --> 00:19:00,720 Speaker 1: a girl who has grown up, um, and a lot 291 00:19:00,760 --> 00:19:03,400 Speaker 1: of themes that we've talked about on stuff I've never 292 00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:06,399 Speaker 1: told you before, and it just so happened that it 293 00:19:06,520 --> 00:19:10,800 Speaker 1: started an all black cast. Yeah, feminist is not normally 294 00:19:10,800 --> 00:19:13,360 Speaker 1: a word you hear thrown around when people are discussing 295 00:19:13,440 --> 00:19:17,120 Speaker 1: romantic comedies. No, not at all, not at all, um. 296 00:19:17,160 --> 00:19:19,920 Speaker 1: And that's why I, honestly, Caroline, I wanted to call 297 00:19:19,960 --> 00:19:22,639 Speaker 1: you so many times as I was watching it, but 298 00:19:22,720 --> 00:19:26,359 Speaker 1: it was a Saturday, and uh, because because I wanted 299 00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:31,840 Speaker 1: that should be a movie that we perhaps live podcast 300 00:19:32,000 --> 00:19:35,840 Speaker 1: or tweet or Mystery Science Theater three thousand. It's somehow 301 00:19:36,160 --> 00:19:38,760 Speaker 1: because I want to watch it with you, to share 302 00:19:38,800 --> 00:19:42,120 Speaker 1: this movie with you, because I really love it so much. 303 00:19:42,240 --> 00:19:46,600 Speaker 1: We get some popcorn, hang out, some sodas, yes, some 304 00:19:46,760 --> 00:19:53,199 Speaker 1: sodas and checks yes. Um So. In addition to that, 305 00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:57,200 Speaker 1: of course you have classics like two thousand twos Black Sugar, 306 00:19:57,720 --> 00:20:00,639 Speaker 1: you have waiting to Exhale too, can play at that 307 00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:04,960 Speaker 1: game the wood. I also last night I tried to 308 00:20:04,960 --> 00:20:11,359 Speaker 1: watch Boomerang from Eddie Murphy also Eddie Murphy young Chris Brown, 309 00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:16,720 Speaker 1: young Halle Berry, and I could not. I couldn't. I 310 00:20:16,760 --> 00:20:20,359 Speaker 1: couldn't do it. I couldn't do it. Um I switched. 311 00:20:20,400 --> 00:20:24,199 Speaker 1: Actually quite definitely not a feminist film. I was going 312 00:20:24,280 --> 00:20:27,399 Speaker 1: to say, um it was. I bet it has a 313 00:20:27,400 --> 00:20:30,040 Speaker 1: little bit of payoff more towards the end, but there 314 00:20:30,119 --> 00:20:34,160 Speaker 1: is only so much of Eddie Murphy as a womanizer 315 00:20:34,160 --> 00:20:38,000 Speaker 1: that I could take. Although it also um co stars 316 00:20:38,560 --> 00:20:42,320 Speaker 1: Eartha kit who does do her signature Catwoman We're awl 317 00:20:42,440 --> 00:20:46,360 Speaker 1: at one point, which was enjoyable. But yeah, coming to America. 318 00:20:46,520 --> 00:20:50,160 Speaker 1: Much better than Boomerang, so much better. But the interesting 319 00:20:50,200 --> 00:20:54,240 Speaker 1: thing is, oh, speaking of our last rom com series 320 00:20:54,280 --> 00:20:57,919 Speaker 1: episode on Sidekicks, that's a movie where kind of like 321 00:20:57,960 --> 00:21:01,040 Speaker 1: when Harry met Sally two Sidekicks, David Allen Greer and 322 00:21:01,080 --> 00:21:07,919 Speaker 1: Hallie Berry end up getting together. Does that further the plot? Caroline, 323 00:21:07,960 --> 00:21:10,159 Speaker 1: I didn't get far enough. I couldn't. I couldn't tell you. 324 00:21:10,520 --> 00:21:14,199 Speaker 1: I've literally switched over to UH to white Ville on 325 00:21:14,240 --> 00:21:20,000 Speaker 1: Netflix watching Lady Dynamite starring white Ville. Isn't Lady Dynamite good? 326 00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:22,240 Speaker 1: It's pretty good so far. We'll have to do another 327 00:21:22,480 --> 00:21:24,520 Speaker 1: episode on that. We won't we won't be talking about that, 328 00:21:24,560 --> 00:21:30,119 Speaker 1: but uh. In our introductory episode to this summer series 329 00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:33,360 Speaker 1: Onnreamental Comedies, we did mention the film Meet the Patels, 330 00:21:33,400 --> 00:21:36,000 Speaker 1: which is it's more like of a documentary style. It's 331 00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:39,680 Speaker 1: it's not straight rom com but we bring that up 332 00:21:40,200 --> 00:21:45,439 Speaker 1: to illustrate that there are so few romantic comedy esque 333 00:21:45,840 --> 00:21:49,639 Speaker 1: films out there. I mean, let alone for a black audience, 334 00:21:49,720 --> 00:21:53,600 Speaker 1: but like, let's talk about how Indian audiences are not 335 00:21:53,680 --> 00:21:57,760 Speaker 1: exactly represented. Asian audiences in general are not very well 336 00:21:57,800 --> 00:22:00,880 Speaker 1: represented when it comes to romantic comedies. But I would 337 00:22:00,920 --> 00:22:03,879 Speaker 1: love to see Meet the Patel's. It's from Jada Patel 338 00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:08,919 Speaker 1: follows her brother Robbie on his exploits to find the 339 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:11,920 Speaker 1: love of his life, although it's more his parents finding 340 00:22:12,200 --> 00:22:17,400 Speaker 1: the life yes arranged marriage um in two thousand four, 341 00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:21,480 Speaker 1: there was sort of a Bollywood Hollywood mash up remake 342 00:22:21,680 --> 00:22:25,520 Speaker 1: of Pride and Prejudice called Bride and Prejudice, which also 343 00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:29,840 Speaker 1: sounds like something I need to watch immediately. Um, you 344 00:22:29,960 --> 00:22:33,760 Speaker 1: also have twenty thirteens for Is this the first Asian 345 00:22:33,800 --> 00:22:37,480 Speaker 1: American rom com? Yes? Uh, in in this country obviously, 346 00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:39,960 Speaker 1: and we should say that when we're talking about there 347 00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:42,520 Speaker 1: are like no other rom com starting people of color 348 00:22:43,080 --> 00:22:46,879 Speaker 1: made in Hollywood and right, right, yes, that is a 349 00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:50,560 Speaker 1: good thing to specify. Yes, this is very very Hollywood 350 00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:54,040 Speaker 1: and US specific, although I believe Bride and Prejudice was 351 00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:57,040 Speaker 1: made in the UK, but it's still counted in the 352 00:22:57,080 --> 00:23:01,800 Speaker 1: list because part of it took place in the US. Yes, 353 00:23:02,320 --> 00:23:04,440 Speaker 1: they travel to the US. They also travel to England, 354 00:23:04,600 --> 00:23:07,239 Speaker 1: so there's a lot of like globe hopping going on. 355 00:23:07,320 --> 00:23:13,919 Speaker 1: So I've traveling traveling yes, Um, but yeah the week 356 00:23:13,960 --> 00:23:17,080 Speaker 1: at the Wedding Palace which doesn't look great. But a 357 00:23:17,080 --> 00:23:19,560 Speaker 1: lot of the commenters on that website that we were 358 00:23:19,560 --> 00:23:23,919 Speaker 1: reading defended it, saying that the author, being a white person, 359 00:23:24,040 --> 00:23:28,440 Speaker 1: just didn't have the same like contextual information about Korean 360 00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:32,600 Speaker 1: rom coms and culture to appreciate it. Yeah, and for 361 00:23:32,720 --> 00:23:35,200 Speaker 1: fans of Margaret Show, she does have a cameo role 362 00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:39,480 Speaker 1: in that. Um. And you're right. It was critically panned, 363 00:23:39,720 --> 00:23:43,639 Speaker 1: which is a bummer because it was at least marketed 364 00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:47,520 Speaker 1: as the first Asian American rom com. And there are 365 00:23:47,520 --> 00:23:51,200 Speaker 1: parts of it look really enjoyable, um, but also parts 366 00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:54,320 Speaker 1: of it that make it look tough to get through. 367 00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:59,159 Speaker 1: They're like, almost one too many twists. It seems like, 368 00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:03,560 Speaker 1: well to m Night Shamalani, but romantic and funny exactly 369 00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:09,640 Speaker 1: a little too rom com shamalan Nice. We're coining all 370 00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:11,719 Speaker 1: sorts of things all over the place, But one thing 371 00:24:11,760 --> 00:24:16,840 Speaker 1: they jumped out in contemporary conversations around Hollywood and rom 372 00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:21,199 Speaker 1: coms is the question of whether the genre itself is dying. 373 00:24:22,080 --> 00:24:26,480 Speaker 1: For instance, in Vulture, over in New York Magazine wanted 374 00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:28,880 Speaker 1: to know whether the rom com could even be saved 375 00:24:29,000 --> 00:24:34,000 Speaker 1: from breaking up due to Hollywood financing more blockbusters instead 376 00:24:34,040 --> 00:24:39,560 Speaker 1: of one offs, because those big Michael Bay blockbusters end 377 00:24:39,640 --> 00:24:44,439 Speaker 1: up making more money internationally, so they're more enticing. You 378 00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:48,840 Speaker 1: also have just the formula itself being a little bit 379 00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:52,639 Speaker 1: stale because of the rising age of marriage, the dating 380 00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:59,920 Speaker 1: landscape being completely disrupted by technology, and millennials being argue, 381 00:25:00,080 --> 00:25:05,080 Speaker 1: be more concerned about ourselves than finding someone else to 382 00:25:05,119 --> 00:25:06,959 Speaker 1: make us happily ever after, because it's like, I mean, 383 00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:09,320 Speaker 1: if we can post the right thing on Instagram and 384 00:25:09,359 --> 00:25:12,359 Speaker 1: go viral, like, why why do we need someone else? 385 00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:18,159 Speaker 1: It's the era of self care. It's perfectly put. Yes, um, 386 00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:22,520 Speaker 1: but I mean certain certain things Kristen are being ignored 387 00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:26,159 Speaker 1: in the conversation about rom coms going bust, and that 388 00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:29,640 Speaker 1: is the fact. Well, it's related to what you said 389 00:25:29,640 --> 00:25:32,359 Speaker 1: at the top of the podcast, with black audiences and 390 00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:37,200 Speaker 1: Hispanic audiences in this country paying per capita a ton 391 00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:41,320 Speaker 1: to go to the theater. That Vulture piece from twelve 392 00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:45,320 Speaker 1: pointed out that that year's highest grossing romantic comedy was 393 00:25:45,440 --> 00:25:49,120 Speaker 1: Kevin Harts Think Like a Man, which raked in nine million, 394 00:25:49,280 --> 00:25:52,880 Speaker 1: but they said, quote never truly broke out beyond its 395 00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:57,159 Speaker 1: predominantly African American target audience. But that's one of the 396 00:25:57,200 --> 00:26:03,080 Speaker 1: most marginalizing statements you could make about Think Like a Man, which, yes, 397 00:26:03,359 --> 00:26:06,400 Speaker 1: was based on the Steve Harvey book Think Like a Man, 398 00:26:06,600 --> 00:26:12,320 Speaker 1: Take My Head, Um, because to brush it aside simply 399 00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:15,200 Speaker 1: because a lot of people of color came out to 400 00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:17,679 Speaker 1: the theater to see it says a lot about the 401 00:26:17,720 --> 00:26:20,320 Speaker 1: problem that Hollywood is in not the problem that the 402 00:26:20,440 --> 00:26:24,119 Speaker 1: rom com genre is, in my mind, because that ninety 403 00:26:24,119 --> 00:26:28,560 Speaker 1: one million dollar box office Caroline knocked Hunger Games off 404 00:26:28,600 --> 00:26:31,439 Speaker 1: its top spot. Yeah, So the fact that you have 405 00:26:32,280 --> 00:26:34,439 Speaker 1: a film that is bringing in so much money, it 406 00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:37,399 Speaker 1: is so successful, why do you care who's going to 407 00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:39,720 Speaker 1: see it? Like, you should just be noting how much 408 00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:43,359 Speaker 1: money it's bringing in, and it is therefore successful. But 409 00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:46,760 Speaker 1: somehow it's discounted because it's bringing in an audience that's 410 00:26:46,800 --> 00:26:49,200 Speaker 1: made made up largely with people of color. It doesn't 411 00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:53,600 Speaker 1: make any sense Hollywood. If we've learned anything doing this podcast. 412 00:26:53,720 --> 00:26:56,600 Speaker 1: One of the things that we've learned is that Hollywood 413 00:26:56,640 --> 00:27:00,399 Speaker 1: will fund the stuff that brings in money. But is 414 00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:04,120 Speaker 1: this an exception or I mean, the dynamics here are 415 00:27:04,119 --> 00:27:09,040 Speaker 1: so confusing. I mean, well, it's all part of cyclical 416 00:27:08,760 --> 00:27:14,200 Speaker 1: marginalization based on this Hollywood idea that and and and 417 00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:16,679 Speaker 1: true to some extent that white people will not go 418 00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:20,360 Speaker 1: to see movies with black people, like those stories are 419 00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:23,520 Speaker 1: not for us, you know. And also there's with that 420 00:27:23,640 --> 00:27:27,160 Speaker 1: the snobbery of like, I mean, those kinds of movies 421 00:27:27,240 --> 00:27:29,520 Speaker 1: those aren't Those aren't very good movies. Why would we 422 00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:32,000 Speaker 1: want to go see something like that? And this is 423 00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:38,160 Speaker 1: something that Indiana University telecom professor Andrew Jay Weaver explored 424 00:27:38,359 --> 00:27:41,840 Speaker 1: in the study the role of actors race in White 425 00:27:41,840 --> 00:27:47,320 Speaker 1: audiences selective exposure to movies. In other words, Dr Weaver 426 00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:50,040 Speaker 1: was looking at, you know, if if we see too 427 00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:53,720 Speaker 1: many people with dark skin on screen, will white people 428 00:27:53,800 --> 00:27:57,040 Speaker 1: just up and flee? And we were rights, it becomes 429 00:27:57,080 --> 00:28:00,919 Speaker 1: a vicious cycle. Producers are hesitant to cat minorities and 430 00:28:01,119 --> 00:28:04,080 Speaker 1: race neutral romantic roles because of a fear that the 431 00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:07,920 Speaker 1: white audience will perceive the films as not for them. 432 00:28:07,960 --> 00:28:12,640 Speaker 1: But white audiences perceived romantic films with minorities as not 433 00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:16,880 Speaker 1: for them because they seldom see minorities in race neutral 434 00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:21,800 Speaker 1: romantic roles. Yeah, and so then Hollywood get scared about 435 00:28:22,040 --> 00:28:27,840 Speaker 1: creating these, uh movies led by people of color, unless, 436 00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:31,400 Speaker 1: for instance, it's a known quantity, like a bankable star 437 00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:36,600 Speaker 1: Will Smith, a Whitney Houston. God. Whitney Houston in movies 438 00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:40,120 Speaker 1: is my favorite thing. I mean, I know The Bodyguard 439 00:28:40,200 --> 00:28:42,800 Speaker 1: is a rom dram, not a rom com, but I 440 00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:44,640 Speaker 1: mean you've got that, You've got waiting to exhale. You've 441 00:28:44,640 --> 00:28:47,440 Speaker 1: got the preacher's wife. Oh god, what about Denzel? Has 442 00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:52,800 Speaker 1: Denzel starred in a rom com opposite a white female? 443 00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:55,640 Speaker 1: I don't think so. I don't know, but I mean 444 00:28:55,680 --> 00:28:59,800 Speaker 1: he's definitely like a mega movie star. He had that 445 00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:02,320 Speaker 1: he was the star in that admittedly terrible and not 446 00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:05,680 Speaker 1: because of him, but that airplane movie where he was 447 00:29:05,720 --> 00:29:12,280 Speaker 1: like the drunk pilot where and that's what it was called. Yeah, 448 00:29:12,280 --> 00:29:14,920 Speaker 1: which is totally I mean a huge movie star role 449 00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:18,120 Speaker 1: for for anyone. But um yeah, I mean I when 450 00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:21,400 Speaker 1: Hollywood does finally step on that step out on that ledge, 451 00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:26,040 Speaker 1: it has to be with an actor actress who's proven 452 00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:28,719 Speaker 1: him or herself, usually in music. Because you've also got 453 00:29:28,800 --> 00:29:33,080 Speaker 1: Queen Latifa, who's who's been successful in films, but she's 454 00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:36,040 Speaker 1: also been successful in music. First. Same with Will Smith 455 00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:40,400 Speaker 1: saying with Whitney Houston well in j Lo Queen Yeah, yeah, yeah. 456 00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:42,640 Speaker 1: But there's so much more significance to this than just 457 00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:47,840 Speaker 1: Hollywood box office numbers, because this really is something we 458 00:29:47,840 --> 00:29:52,520 Speaker 1: should care about it because at their love and basketball best, 459 00:29:52,840 --> 00:29:57,440 Speaker 1: these are stories that we all of us need to see, 460 00:29:57,560 --> 00:30:00,360 Speaker 1: especially here in the United States. I would argue because 461 00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:04,040 Speaker 1: there are stories of how black people love. And that's 462 00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:09,000 Speaker 1: something that Chevandra Harris wrote about over at the Huffington's Post. Yeah, 463 00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:13,320 Speaker 1: I mean Harris refers to this as an overlooked aspect 464 00:30:13,320 --> 00:30:17,640 Speaker 1: of black culture. I mean, you know, Hunter Harris, writing 465 00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:22,040 Speaker 1: for Anywire In wrote that, you know, we've got slave 466 00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:24,800 Speaker 1: drama after slave drama coming out, and that's good. We 467 00:30:24,840 --> 00:30:27,920 Speaker 1: can't forget these things. We need the visibility of films 468 00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:31,280 Speaker 1: like Selma or Birth of a Nation absolutely, and that 469 00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:35,600 Speaker 1: gives roles to black actors. But like, where are the 470 00:30:35,640 --> 00:30:39,719 Speaker 1: films just showing us as as people, normal people who 471 00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:42,200 Speaker 1: live normal lives and fallen and out of love like 472 00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:46,120 Speaker 1: anyone else. Yeah. Um, Chavandra Harris and that Huffpoe piece 473 00:30:46,280 --> 00:30:49,720 Speaker 1: wrote with well rounded characters, big city backdrops, in the 474 00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:53,520 Speaker 1: perfect blend of drama, sex and comedy, they managed to 475 00:30:53,600 --> 00:30:57,320 Speaker 1: brilliantly capture the joyous pains and complexities and uniqueness of 476 00:30:57,320 --> 00:31:00,800 Speaker 1: black men and women falling in, out and over love. 477 00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:04,959 Speaker 1: And that's so much contrast the kinds of roles that 478 00:31:05,160 --> 00:31:09,000 Speaker 1: the Film Academy recognized as people of color for. And 479 00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:11,200 Speaker 1: I think it was Hunter Harris over at Indy Wier, 480 00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:15,880 Speaker 1: who tallied up that nine of the ten black women 481 00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:19,040 Speaker 1: ever nominated for an OSCAR played a character who was 482 00:31:19,080 --> 00:31:22,360 Speaker 1: either homeless or on the verge of homelessness, and that 483 00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:27,400 Speaker 1: the twenty black OSCAR nominated actors played characters who had 484 00:31:27,440 --> 00:31:31,240 Speaker 1: been arrested. And more recently, I remember, I think it 485 00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:34,520 Speaker 1: was right after Sun Dance, when maybe it was Birth 486 00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:38,880 Speaker 1: of a Nation whatever. The Nat Turner um biopic that's 487 00:31:38,920 --> 00:31:42,920 Speaker 1: coming out received all of these rave reviews, and the 488 00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:48,680 Speaker 1: sentiment on Twitter was ya, because it's like, Okay, yes, 489 00:31:48,720 --> 00:31:50,640 Speaker 1: these are stories that need to be told, but can 490 00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:58,360 Speaker 1: we be shown as more than slaves? Please? Um? And 491 00:31:58,800 --> 00:32:03,240 Speaker 1: a lot of this perpetuates the other ring of black 492 00:32:03,320 --> 00:32:09,000 Speaker 1: relationships and that kind of ordinary and extraordinary black love 493 00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:14,080 Speaker 1: that Hivandra Harris loves to see so much on screen. Um. 494 00:32:14,120 --> 00:32:16,880 Speaker 1: And this is going back to Hunter Harris at Indy 495 00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:20,600 Speaker 1: Wier who says that black relationships should be visible enough 496 00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:23,880 Speaker 1: to be ordinary and not always have happy endings. You 497 00:32:23,920 --> 00:32:26,480 Speaker 1: should be able to have a black Annie Hall or 498 00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:29,240 Speaker 1: a black five hundred Days of Summer. Um. That was 499 00:32:29,320 --> 00:32:32,480 Speaker 1: me adding that in there not Hunter Harris. Um. Although 500 00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:34,880 Speaker 1: who would the black Woody Allen be answer? I don't 501 00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:38,480 Speaker 1: want to know, because we don't need another Woody Allen Boom. 502 00:32:38,520 --> 00:32:41,520 Speaker 1: Harris goes on to say, there's no monolithic blackness, and 503 00:32:41,560 --> 00:32:44,280 Speaker 1: there ought to be more movies that appreciate that black 504 00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:48,680 Speaker 1: lives don't only matter, but contain multitudes. Black characters with 505 00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:52,080 Speaker 1: full romantic lives don't always need to end in a 506 00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:54,920 Speaker 1: punch line. And that's one of the reasons too, that 507 00:32:54,960 --> 00:32:58,280 Speaker 1: we are citing some more straight up ROMs than just 508 00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:02,040 Speaker 1: rom coms, uh in this episode. And we're gonna look 509 00:33:02,080 --> 00:33:06,320 Speaker 1: at more of these tropes and formulas and caricature outlines 510 00:33:06,600 --> 00:33:09,760 Speaker 1: that exist in these romantic comedies when we come right 511 00:33:09,760 --> 00:33:17,800 Speaker 1: back from a quick break, Caroline. This summer, I might 512 00:33:17,800 --> 00:33:20,320 Speaker 1: not be able to go on vacation all the time, 513 00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:24,000 Speaker 1: but I can treat myself every night if I want to. 514 00:33:24,680 --> 00:33:30,520 Speaker 1: To delicious sustainable meals from blue Apron dot Com because 515 00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:34,920 Speaker 1: Blue Apron's mission is to make incredible home cooking accessible 516 00:33:35,520 --> 00:33:39,200 Speaker 1: to everyone, and they've established partnerships with over one hundred 517 00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:44,360 Speaker 1: fifty local farms, fisheries, and ranchers across the US to 518 00:33:44,520 --> 00:33:49,479 Speaker 1: ensure things like free range chicken, humanely raised beef, and 519 00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:53,680 Speaker 1: sustainably sourced seafood. 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Blue Apron delivers seasonal recipes along with preproportioned 532 00:34:38,520 --> 00:34:43,919 Speaker 1: ingredients to make delicious home cooked meals. So to check 533 00:34:43,960 --> 00:34:47,080 Speaker 1: out this week's menu and get your first two meals 534 00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:51,000 Speaker 1: free with free shipping, head on over to blue Apron 535 00:34:51,080 --> 00:34:54,759 Speaker 1: dot com slash mom stuff. You'll love how good it 536 00:34:54,800 --> 00:34:58,399 Speaker 1: feels and taste to create incredible home cooked meals with 537 00:34:58,440 --> 00:35:00,919 Speaker 1: Blue Apron, so don't wait. Head on over to blue 538 00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:04,959 Speaker 1: Apron dot com slash mom stuff blue apron a better 539 00:35:04,960 --> 00:35:14,280 Speaker 1: way to cook. So, Caroline, before we crack open uh 540 00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:18,200 Speaker 1: this genre, I want to make a note that of 541 00:35:18,280 --> 00:35:22,200 Speaker 1: the rom com scholarship that you and I have been loving, 542 00:35:23,480 --> 00:35:28,439 Speaker 1: a lot of them completely gloss over black romantic comedies. Yeah. 543 00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:32,320 Speaker 1: There was one paper that I could find, No two papers, 544 00:35:32,360 --> 00:35:34,480 Speaker 1: excuse me, there was one paper and one thesis that 545 00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:39,279 Speaker 1: I could find really examining black lead romantic comedies, even 546 00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:42,680 Speaker 1: in in like the books the full the book, fully 547 00:35:42,719 --> 00:35:46,840 Speaker 1: published hundreds of pages books, searching through them for citations 548 00:35:47,160 --> 00:35:53,879 Speaker 1: and explorations of the black rom com genre. Because due 549 00:35:53,920 --> 00:35:57,320 Speaker 1: to the segregation of it, I would um describe it 550 00:35:57,360 --> 00:36:02,160 Speaker 1: as its own genre. There's nothing like no acknowledgement. It's like, yeah, 551 00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:07,040 Speaker 1: you get so much scholarship on the screwball era, the 552 00:36:07,080 --> 00:36:09,400 Speaker 1: sex comedy era, and then as we get into the 553 00:36:09,400 --> 00:36:14,040 Speaker 1: seventies and eighties, like the nervous romances and the like 554 00:36:14,200 --> 00:36:18,840 Speaker 1: neo romantic comedy all starring white people, completely ignoring that 555 00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:22,759 Speaker 1: there is the parallel existence and flourishing of black lead 556 00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:26,040 Speaker 1: romantic comedies. Yeah, and like no history that I could 557 00:36:26,080 --> 00:36:28,320 Speaker 1: find and listeners, if you, I know, we have a 558 00:36:28,320 --> 00:36:31,640 Speaker 1: lot of cinema buffs listening. If you do know of 559 00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:35,840 Speaker 1: a solid history of black rom coms, please send it 560 00:36:35,880 --> 00:36:39,400 Speaker 1: our way. I mean, you know, every every black character 561 00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:43,360 Speaker 1: that you had in the era of Screwball, for instance, 562 00:36:43,400 --> 00:36:47,040 Speaker 1: I mean the women were maids, the men were like, 563 00:36:47,120 --> 00:36:50,880 Speaker 1: if they were not some sort of servant role character, 564 00:36:51,520 --> 00:36:54,920 Speaker 1: they were going to be some like horrifically trophy racist 565 00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:59,920 Speaker 1: sidekick um who did nothing but allow the main white 566 00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:04,399 Speaker 1: character to make fun of him. So, yeah, I would 567 00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:07,400 Speaker 1: also be interested in a more academic take on African 568 00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:12,239 Speaker 1: Americans in romcom history. Yeah. One of the earliest black 569 00:37:12,320 --> 00:37:16,160 Speaker 1: lead rom coms that I could find discussed at any 570 00:37:16,239 --> 00:37:21,360 Speaker 1: length was nineteen seventy four's Claudine, starring Diane Carroll and 571 00:37:21,480 --> 00:37:26,160 Speaker 1: James Earl Jones Um, which people today take issue with 572 00:37:26,239 --> 00:37:30,920 Speaker 1: because very much perpetuates the welfare queen type of stereotype. 573 00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:36,920 Speaker 1: But I couldn't find, yeah, any any explanation or exposition 574 00:37:37,040 --> 00:37:40,600 Speaker 1: on how more of those came to be, because it 575 00:37:40,600 --> 00:37:43,239 Speaker 1: seems like then from there the nineteen seventy four from 576 00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:47,200 Speaker 1: there you get Eddie Murphy, who becomes so popular that 577 00:37:47,280 --> 00:37:49,560 Speaker 1: he can start making his own films, and then you 578 00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:51,600 Speaker 1: get Spike Lee, it's like, I guess maybe it is 579 00:37:51,600 --> 00:37:53,360 Speaker 1: the Spike Lee school of thought of like, well, we 580 00:37:53,440 --> 00:37:54,960 Speaker 1: just have to start making the films that we want 581 00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:58,279 Speaker 1: to see us in them. Yeah, And I mean you 582 00:37:58,320 --> 00:38:00,680 Speaker 1: do have Gregory Hines in there. You had that quote 583 00:38:00,680 --> 00:38:03,160 Speaker 1: from him that you sent me where he said, when 584 00:38:03,160 --> 00:38:05,040 Speaker 1: I got to be fifteen or sixteen years old, I 585 00:38:05,120 --> 00:38:07,720 Speaker 1: noticed that I wasn't represented. There weren't any black people 586 00:38:07,800 --> 00:38:11,840 Speaker 1: up there making love. That's from that Jet magazine article. 587 00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:15,520 Speaker 1: And I guess, yeah, I mean, I unless people can 588 00:38:15,719 --> 00:38:17,520 Speaker 1: can give us some more info, it does seem like 589 00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:20,600 Speaker 1: it's an issue of we've got to get these things 590 00:38:21,000 --> 00:38:24,960 Speaker 1: made ourselves. Well, it's very reflective of our conversation about 591 00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:31,600 Speaker 1: black female directors and filmmakers who are continually shut down 592 00:38:31,640 --> 00:38:35,239 Speaker 1: by the big machine Hollywood and just have to kind 593 00:38:35,239 --> 00:38:39,200 Speaker 1: of self fund um and indie make their films. But 594 00:38:39,320 --> 00:38:44,560 Speaker 1: thankfully we do have Karen Boudre of Indiana University, who 595 00:38:44,680 --> 00:38:49,520 Speaker 1: is a semiologist who has analyzed in depth the black 596 00:38:49,680 --> 00:38:52,240 Speaker 1: rom com genre, and she looked at how the typical 597 00:38:52,280 --> 00:38:55,480 Speaker 1: boy meats girl, boy loses girl, and then does everything 598 00:38:55,520 --> 00:38:59,120 Speaker 1: he can to regain the girl or girl regang guy 599 00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:04,440 Speaker 1: formula is often readjusted in black lead films, starting with 600 00:39:04,520 --> 00:39:07,880 Speaker 1: meat cutes. Those are not usually seen as much in 601 00:39:08,640 --> 00:39:11,280 Speaker 1: black rom coms because a lot of times the romantic 602 00:39:11,320 --> 00:39:15,960 Speaker 1: relationships are already established when we meet those leads, so 603 00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:20,240 Speaker 1: there isn't a ton of the development of the falling 604 00:39:20,239 --> 00:39:22,800 Speaker 1: in love necessarily and where so many of the romantic 605 00:39:22,800 --> 00:39:25,840 Speaker 1: comedy tropes that we've discussed previously have revolved around the 606 00:39:25,840 --> 00:39:29,960 Speaker 1: withholding of sex, sex being this abstract future thing that 607 00:39:30,000 --> 00:39:33,240 Speaker 1: we never see but that creates all of this delicious tension. 608 00:39:33,880 --> 00:39:38,440 Speaker 1: Bodre writes about how sex commonly either has already happened 609 00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:42,520 Speaker 1: in the black rom com couple's existence, or it's something 610 00:39:42,560 --> 00:39:45,120 Speaker 1: that happens like on the first date. We also tend 611 00:39:45,120 --> 00:39:50,680 Speaker 1: to see less emotional vulnerability from leading ladies, who are 612 00:39:50,800 --> 00:39:55,760 Speaker 1: often tougher than her white counterparts. And to that point, 613 00:39:56,120 --> 00:39:59,920 Speaker 1: Black Hollywood producer Rodney Barnes, who has made The Boondocks 614 00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:03,000 Speaker 1: and Everybody Hates Chris, told I believe it was the 615 00:40:03,120 --> 00:40:06,480 Speaker 1: l a times that quote. Women are painted as problematic 616 00:40:06,520 --> 00:40:11,240 Speaker 1: and undesirable characters only seeking helpmates to raise their child, 617 00:40:11,560 --> 00:40:14,120 Speaker 1: and all their male counterpart has to do is be 618 00:40:14,239 --> 00:40:17,480 Speaker 1: sexy with no intelligence or moral values. He simply has 619 00:40:17,520 --> 00:40:20,200 Speaker 1: to take his shirt off, glisten, and wait for the 620 00:40:20,360 --> 00:40:24,919 Speaker 1: end credits. So it sounds like we have some some 621 00:40:25,200 --> 00:40:30,440 Speaker 1: issues here with this kind of rom com formula, which 622 00:40:30,680 --> 00:40:36,520 Speaker 1: Professor Boadrey says is really the long shadow of racism 623 00:40:36,560 --> 00:40:40,440 Speaker 1: being reflected on screen because we have seen historically the 624 00:40:40,520 --> 00:40:46,399 Speaker 1: comical devaluing and hyper sexualizing of black bodies. So as 625 00:40:46,400 --> 00:40:49,320 Speaker 1: a result, Boadre writes that quote, black characters are denied 626 00:40:49,360 --> 00:40:53,160 Speaker 1: mature relationships that are culture revers and thus the access 627 00:40:53,160 --> 00:40:59,400 Speaker 1: such relationships bring to achieving heroic or human status. And 628 00:41:00,120 --> 00:41:03,879 Speaker 1: that's a pretty like grim portrayal of things. Um. There 629 00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:07,680 Speaker 1: are some who just think that this different type of 630 00:41:08,320 --> 00:41:10,879 Speaker 1: rom com formula that we're likelier to see in black 631 00:41:10,920 --> 00:41:14,160 Speaker 1: lad films just more accurately reflects how people of color 632 00:41:14,320 --> 00:41:19,239 Speaker 1: approach dating and love a little bit differently. Um. But 633 00:41:19,360 --> 00:41:24,799 Speaker 1: especially when you do look at, um, the stereotypes that 634 00:41:24,880 --> 00:41:28,080 Speaker 1: pop up in a lot of black rom comms and 635 00:41:28,160 --> 00:41:30,799 Speaker 1: the type of calm that you find in the rom 636 00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:36,480 Speaker 1: and the ratio of calm to rom to dram to dram. Uh, 637 00:41:36,840 --> 00:41:41,160 Speaker 1: it's hard to argue against, you know, bo boadres theory 638 00:41:41,200 --> 00:41:44,160 Speaker 1: that there is that long shadow of racism, as she 639 00:41:44,200 --> 00:41:48,000 Speaker 1: calls it, on the devaluing of black bodies right and 640 00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:53,839 Speaker 1: reinforcing stereotypes about hyper sexuality of black people or fill 641 00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:57,480 Speaker 1: in the stereotype type here, the Jezebel, the Sapphire, what 642 00:41:57,680 --> 00:42:01,320 Speaker 1: have you. That black women are either going to be sassy, 643 00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:04,160 Speaker 1: they're gonna be angry, they're going to be over sext 644 00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:07,480 Speaker 1: you know, the cold independent, the black version of the 645 00:42:07,520 --> 00:42:12,600 Speaker 1: cold independent. Sandra Bullock in like the proposal, and there 646 00:42:12,760 --> 00:42:16,560 Speaker 1: was a piece over at Bitch Media that was taking 647 00:42:16,640 --> 00:42:22,279 Speaker 1: issue with the stereotyping of women in black rom coms, 648 00:42:22,400 --> 00:42:25,520 Speaker 1: um and, like you said, putting them kind of into 649 00:42:25,560 --> 00:42:34,399 Speaker 1: those buckets of a Jezebel temptress or the angry, emasculating Sapphire. Um, 650 00:42:34,440 --> 00:42:39,200 Speaker 1: who Shelby in the Best Man franchise definitely embodies. Um. 651 00:42:39,400 --> 00:42:42,680 Speaker 1: You also have the matriarch who would also be Mia, 652 00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:46,840 Speaker 1: I would argue in the Best Man franchise, as well 653 00:42:46,920 --> 00:42:53,359 Speaker 1: as uh, the welfare queen. And while yes, those can 654 00:42:53,360 --> 00:42:59,000 Speaker 1: be problematic stereotypes, I do wonder if it's not also 655 00:42:59,080 --> 00:43:01,880 Speaker 1: just a product of just rom comes in general, because 656 00:43:01,880 --> 00:43:05,120 Speaker 1: there's so much so much stereotyping. We've super trophy, yeah 657 00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:09,200 Speaker 1: that we've talked about of white leading characters as well. Yeah, 658 00:43:09,239 --> 00:43:12,239 Speaker 1: and so much of rom comes in general, So much 659 00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:17,200 Speaker 1: of their formula is i mean literally being formulaic. It's 660 00:43:17,320 --> 00:43:22,279 Speaker 1: it's presenting you with these outlines that you can easily recognize, 661 00:43:22,280 --> 00:43:25,759 Speaker 1: so it doesn't require hours of backstory and exposition. You 662 00:43:25,880 --> 00:43:28,640 Speaker 1: just know, like, okay, so I'm supposed to think that 663 00:43:28,760 --> 00:43:32,279 Speaker 1: she's the slutty one and he's the player, and like 664 00:43:32,440 --> 00:43:35,920 Speaker 1: she's the cold career woman. And that allows you to 665 00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:38,600 Speaker 1: quickly move through the plot and not have to be 666 00:43:38,640 --> 00:43:40,960 Speaker 1: too confused about why these two people are falling in 667 00:43:41,000 --> 00:43:43,160 Speaker 1: love because you just know from the get go. Oh 668 00:43:43,200 --> 00:43:45,719 Speaker 1: well we just know they're supposed to end up together. Yeah, 669 00:43:45,880 --> 00:43:49,600 Speaker 1: I mean, and well I just said two seconds ago, well, like, 670 00:43:49,640 --> 00:43:53,040 Speaker 1: well kind of two wrongs make a right thing of like, well, 671 00:43:53,040 --> 00:43:57,520 Speaker 1: white ladies are stereotyped and ROM comes to but of 672 00:43:57,560 --> 00:44:00,719 Speaker 1: course they don't come with all of that racist and 673 00:44:00,840 --> 00:44:06,960 Speaker 1: hyper sexualized baggage like in white rom coms. Even an 674 00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:12,480 Speaker 1: ice queen is like tacitly permitted love. We still expect 675 00:44:12,480 --> 00:44:15,399 Speaker 1: to see Sandra Bullock in the Proposal who I feel 676 00:44:15,440 --> 00:44:17,640 Speaker 1: like we've talked about more than anybody else in this series. 677 00:44:18,480 --> 00:44:21,960 Speaker 1: We still are fine with her falling in love, whereas 678 00:44:21,960 --> 00:44:25,920 Speaker 1: it might not be quite the same when you're playing 679 00:44:25,920 --> 00:44:30,399 Speaker 1: around with these more racist stereotypes. Um. Because Boadre says 680 00:44:30,440 --> 00:44:36,080 Speaker 1: that compared to black female protagonists, UM, white ladies are 681 00:44:36,160 --> 00:44:41,000 Speaker 1: usually permitted more vulnerability, They're allowed to kind of evaluate 682 00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:45,480 Speaker 1: the qualities of their ideal mates and pick and choose more. Um. 683 00:44:45,560 --> 00:44:50,080 Speaker 1: She says, they're hedgemotic notions of black womanhood that portrayed 684 00:44:50,120 --> 00:44:54,959 Speaker 1: them as over sexualized and strong to the point of isolation. 685 00:44:55,560 --> 00:44:57,759 Speaker 1: Not to mention that some people are concerned that a 686 00:44:57,800 --> 00:45:00,600 Speaker 1: lot of the calm that you might see more of 687 00:45:00,640 --> 00:45:05,239 Speaker 1: a black lead rom com plays up the racist stereotypes 688 00:45:05,280 --> 00:45:08,359 Speaker 1: of just black foolishness as well. So it's like, well, 689 00:45:08,360 --> 00:45:12,000 Speaker 1: what are we really what are we really serving up here? Um? 690 00:45:12,040 --> 00:45:16,680 Speaker 1: Although again I would say that white lead rom coms 691 00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:20,880 Speaker 1: aren't flawless either. But again then you come back to 692 00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:28,239 Speaker 1: but racism, But racism, Well yeah, but racism and also taboos. 693 00:45:28,280 --> 00:45:34,400 Speaker 1: I mean we mentioned misgenation and people's misgivings about interracial romances. 694 00:45:34,400 --> 00:45:36,399 Speaker 1: I mean, take a movie like Hitch you know, we 695 00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:39,759 Speaker 1: we did mention this in our last episode, but you know, 696 00:45:39,840 --> 00:45:46,320 Speaker 1: Will Smith, a black man stars opposite even Mendez, and 697 00:45:47,040 --> 00:45:50,840 Speaker 1: that was rather on purpose because Will Smith broke it 698 00:45:50,880 --> 00:45:55,919 Speaker 1: down in an article in an interview where he basically said, uh, 699 00:45:55,960 --> 00:46:01,000 Speaker 1: you know, if I were to star opposite a black woman, 700 00:46:01,480 --> 00:46:03,520 Speaker 1: that would have been okay elsewhere in the world, but 701 00:46:03,600 --> 00:46:05,000 Speaker 1: not in the US, because then it would have been 702 00:46:05,000 --> 00:46:08,120 Speaker 1: a black comedy. If I had started opposite a white woman, 703 00:46:08,239 --> 00:46:10,480 Speaker 1: that also would have been okay in other parts of 704 00:46:10,520 --> 00:46:12,560 Speaker 1: the world, but not in the US because we're apparently 705 00:46:12,560 --> 00:46:16,120 Speaker 1: not there yet. So they got even Mendez, who's beautiful 706 00:46:16,520 --> 00:46:19,279 Speaker 1: brown but not too dark, and she's not black, and 707 00:46:19,320 --> 00:46:22,120 Speaker 1: hopefully this makes it universal, as all of the executives 708 00:46:22,160 --> 00:46:25,440 Speaker 1: were saying with their fingers crossed. Yes. Smith even went 709 00:46:25,480 --> 00:46:29,160 Speaker 1: on to say that quote ironically, Hollywood is happy to 710 00:46:29,160 --> 00:46:31,960 Speaker 1: do it, i e. Like pairing up a black man 711 00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:35,560 Speaker 1: and a woman romantically if the film is about racism, 712 00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:40,120 Speaker 1: but they won't simply do it and ignore it. So 713 00:46:40,160 --> 00:46:44,240 Speaker 1: it was actually a really big deal when the comedy 714 00:46:44,280 --> 00:46:47,960 Speaker 1: thriller Focus came out. Not necessarily a rom Crom rom 715 00:46:48,040 --> 00:46:50,480 Speaker 1: Crom maybe more of a rom Crom because they had 716 00:46:50,520 --> 00:46:57,560 Speaker 1: crime in it. Um. But it starred Will Smith opposite 717 00:46:57,960 --> 00:47:02,640 Speaker 1: Margot Roby and it was the the first time Will 718 00:47:02,680 --> 00:47:06,680 Speaker 1: Smith got sexy with a white lady on screen. And 719 00:47:07,440 --> 00:47:09,680 Speaker 1: there was a piece in the Daily Beast all about 720 00:47:09,760 --> 00:47:14,840 Speaker 1: how racists we're freaking out about the movies quote unquote 721 00:47:15,040 --> 00:47:21,120 Speaker 1: race mixing. Oh come on? That was from um so 722 00:47:21,840 --> 00:47:26,879 Speaker 1: uh and Spike Lee two has said that interracial relationships 723 00:47:26,880 --> 00:47:31,960 Speaker 1: on screen are still like the number one taboo in Hollywood. Um. 724 00:47:32,000 --> 00:47:34,960 Speaker 1: But in terms of this, like j Lo is a 725 00:47:35,000 --> 00:47:38,680 Speaker 1: really interesting character to look at, and one that Caitlin 726 00:47:38,760 --> 00:47:44,120 Speaker 1: Mortimer in her thesis Romantic Comedy examined, Yeah, j Loo 727 00:47:44,280 --> 00:47:47,200 Speaker 1: is interesting because she is allowed, so to speak, to 728 00:47:47,280 --> 00:47:52,000 Speaker 1: have interracial romances in Hollywood, but it's because she's like 729 00:47:52,360 --> 00:47:55,799 Speaker 1: safely ethnic. She's also one of those known quantities that 730 00:47:55,840 --> 00:47:59,280 Speaker 1: we mentioned earlier. She proved her popularity as a singer, 731 00:47:59,400 --> 00:48:03,200 Speaker 1: as a dance there, as a general entertainer, and so 732 00:48:03,280 --> 00:48:05,719 Speaker 1: people seem to have less of a problem with her 733 00:48:05,840 --> 00:48:09,840 Speaker 1: romancing people like Matthew McConaughey or refines. Oh. But also 734 00:48:11,680 --> 00:48:16,720 Speaker 1: considering the historic hyper sexualization and fear of black men 735 00:48:16,880 --> 00:48:20,840 Speaker 1: praying on white women is it any wonder that it 736 00:48:20,840 --> 00:48:24,480 Speaker 1: took until for one of the most bankable stars in Hollywood, 737 00:48:24,480 --> 00:48:28,960 Speaker 1: who also happens to be black, too, star romantically opposite 738 00:48:28,960 --> 00:48:31,640 Speaker 1: a white woman. I mean, that's how strong that racism is, 739 00:48:32,400 --> 00:48:37,280 Speaker 1: and that even even then there were concerns of race mixing. 740 00:48:37,280 --> 00:48:41,200 Speaker 1: I mean, I think that that taboo of a of 741 00:48:41,239 --> 00:48:46,799 Speaker 1: a black man opposite a white female romantic lead is 742 00:48:47,520 --> 00:48:51,000 Speaker 1: the biggest taboo of all because it confronts all of 743 00:48:51,040 --> 00:48:55,080 Speaker 1: those fears, which is shout out to the small screen. 744 00:48:55,760 --> 00:48:58,399 Speaker 1: One of the reasons why I really do love Broad 745 00:48:58,440 --> 00:49:04,160 Speaker 1: City oh so much for Alana and Lincoln's inter racial romance, 746 00:49:04,280 --> 00:49:07,360 Speaker 1: which I think Alana Glazer would like spittake if she 747 00:49:07,440 --> 00:49:10,759 Speaker 1: heard it described as an interracial romance um between her 748 00:49:10,800 --> 00:49:14,960 Speaker 1: and Hannibal Baris. But it's fantastic because it's just they 749 00:49:15,000 --> 00:49:17,000 Speaker 1: just like each other, like it is what it is. 750 00:49:17,040 --> 00:49:20,560 Speaker 1: There's no um, there doesn't have to be commentary or explanation, 751 00:49:21,080 --> 00:49:28,399 Speaker 1: exactly as I wish we would see from a rom com. Well, yeah, 752 00:49:28,440 --> 00:49:31,719 Speaker 1: because that's how real life is. Real life and real 753 00:49:31,800 --> 00:49:36,319 Speaker 1: love is. Sure, it's messy and complicated, but also once 754 00:49:36,400 --> 00:49:40,080 Speaker 1: you fall in love with somebody, it's really no, no 755 00:49:40,120 --> 00:49:42,200 Speaker 1: big deal. Well, in one movie I Want to see 756 00:49:42,239 --> 00:49:44,160 Speaker 1: that I do think is more rom than rom com. 757 00:49:44,640 --> 00:49:47,680 Speaker 1: That came up a lot in things we were reading 758 00:49:47,719 --> 00:49:52,600 Speaker 1: about interracial romances on screen was Something New starring sinal 759 00:49:52,719 --> 00:49:56,560 Speaker 1: Atham who falls in love with a white gardener. Um. 760 00:49:56,640 --> 00:50:00,000 Speaker 1: He played by some handsome guy with like scruffy blonde 761 00:50:00,040 --> 00:50:03,759 Speaker 1: hair and crinkly blue eyes. You'd recognize him if you 762 00:50:03,760 --> 00:50:07,000 Speaker 1: saw him. Um, but apparently it's really good. I remember 763 00:50:07,080 --> 00:50:10,680 Speaker 1: seeing the previous when it first came out and rolled 764 00:50:10,680 --> 00:50:14,120 Speaker 1: my eyes a little bit. But apparently it's actually a 765 00:50:14,160 --> 00:50:18,719 Speaker 1: good example of kind of confronting those taboos. It is 766 00:50:18,719 --> 00:50:22,480 Speaker 1: pretty crazy, and I think that what willis Edwards that 767 00:50:22,600 --> 00:50:25,360 Speaker 1: former president of the Beverly Hills in the a c 768 00:50:25,520 --> 00:50:29,719 Speaker 1: P Said in that Jet Magazine article still stands And 769 00:50:30,200 --> 00:50:34,759 Speaker 1: why can't Hollywood seem to catch up to so much 770 00:50:34,760 --> 00:50:36,920 Speaker 1: of the rest of the country because they do still 771 00:50:36,960 --> 00:50:40,400 Speaker 1: have to play too, As he said Peoria in Mississippi, 772 00:50:40,440 --> 00:50:44,080 Speaker 1: that you still have so many people who are going 773 00:50:44,160 --> 00:50:49,120 Speaker 1: to vote with their dollars or vote by being awful 774 00:50:49,200 --> 00:50:53,080 Speaker 1: on Twitter about how they will not go see plotlines 775 00:50:53,160 --> 00:50:57,280 Speaker 1: like that. Yeah, but yeah, and um, I think maybe 776 00:50:57,280 --> 00:51:01,480 Speaker 1: a sign of our true cultural progress will um, when 777 00:51:02,280 --> 00:51:05,680 Speaker 1: black rom coms are just rom coms. The first thing 778 00:51:05,680 --> 00:51:08,120 Speaker 1: that came to mind as you were also saying that 779 00:51:08,160 --> 00:51:12,040 Speaker 1: Caroline was the movie Dope, which so good you've only 780 00:51:12,040 --> 00:51:13,759 Speaker 1: seen bits and pieces of. But wouldn't it count as 781 00:51:13,760 --> 00:51:16,920 Speaker 1: a rom com kind of sort? I mean there's a 782 00:51:17,000 --> 00:51:20,000 Speaker 1: romantic interest, Yeah, I mean, but it's a great It's 783 00:51:20,040 --> 00:51:21,960 Speaker 1: just a great movie, and it was and it was 784 00:51:22,200 --> 00:51:26,360 Speaker 1: marketed as a mainstream movie even though it had a 785 00:51:26,400 --> 00:51:29,120 Speaker 1: black leading cast. Yeah. It's funny because I literally never 786 00:51:29,160 --> 00:51:31,799 Speaker 1: saw it marketed or advertised or anything. I just my 787 00:51:31,840 --> 00:51:35,880 Speaker 1: boyfriend and I watched it on HBO. See. Also, man, 788 00:51:35,920 --> 00:51:38,920 Speaker 1: technology is going to change things, because you're right, Caroline, 789 00:51:39,320 --> 00:51:43,879 Speaker 1: we advertising is even changing. I don't I don't see 790 00:51:43,920 --> 00:51:46,879 Speaker 1: commercials for movies ever anymore at all. So I don't 791 00:51:46,920 --> 00:51:49,360 Speaker 1: even know what's coming out. And that's funny because the 792 00:51:49,400 --> 00:51:53,319 Speaker 1: first time I became aware of Dope was because like 793 00:51:53,360 --> 00:51:57,440 Speaker 1: one of those uh posters um on a like an 794 00:51:57,440 --> 00:52:01,239 Speaker 1: abandoned building across the street a brunch place I was at, 795 00:52:01,719 --> 00:52:06,160 Speaker 1: which Hi, did I mention that I'm so white? Um? 796 00:52:06,200 --> 00:52:08,759 Speaker 1: But now, listeners, we really want to hear from you 797 00:52:08,840 --> 00:52:12,239 Speaker 1: on this because there there's so much in here to 798 00:52:12,280 --> 00:52:15,439 Speaker 1: talk about, and so many films that we didn't even 799 00:52:15,480 --> 00:52:17,839 Speaker 1: have time to mention. So we want to know your 800 00:52:17,920 --> 00:52:22,920 Speaker 1: favorites and curious to know your thoughts on the segregation 801 00:52:23,600 --> 00:52:28,560 Speaker 1: of rom comms and the marginalization of black rom comms 802 00:52:28,960 --> 00:52:31,680 Speaker 1: in particular, and whether we can ever kind of get 803 00:52:31,719 --> 00:52:35,080 Speaker 1: over that, or if we even should get over that. 804 00:52:35,520 --> 00:52:38,200 Speaker 1: Mom Stuff at how stuffworks dot com is our email address. 805 00:52:38,239 --> 00:52:41,000 Speaker 1: You can also tweet us at mom Stuff podcast or 806 00:52:41,120 --> 00:52:43,920 Speaker 1: messages on Facebook, and we've got a couple of messages 807 00:52:43,960 --> 00:52:50,640 Speaker 1: to share with you right now. I read I've got 808 00:52:50,680 --> 00:52:53,319 Speaker 1: a letter here from Mary Rose. She says, I'm a 809 00:52:53,360 --> 00:52:55,840 Speaker 1: huge fan of the podcast and especially loved your recent 810 00:52:55,840 --> 00:52:58,879 Speaker 1: episode on women in political campaigns. My first job out 811 00:52:58,880 --> 00:53:01,600 Speaker 1: of college was managing a state Senate race, and while 812 00:53:01,600 --> 00:53:03,560 Speaker 1: it remains one of my favorite jobs to date, it 813 00:53:03,600 --> 00:53:07,280 Speaker 1: was also an incredibly eye opening experience into everyday sexism. 814 00:53:07,320 --> 00:53:10,000 Speaker 1: As campaign manager, I worked more on political strategy and 815 00:53:10,000 --> 00:53:13,120 Speaker 1: press relations than on fundraising or field operations for which 816 00:53:13,120 --> 00:53:16,279 Speaker 1: I hired staff. Despite this, I was often confused for 817 00:53:16,320 --> 00:53:19,400 Speaker 1: either my boss's wife or his daughter when I attended 818 00:53:19,440 --> 00:53:21,200 Speaker 1: events with him. He was forty one at the time 819 00:53:21,239 --> 00:53:24,320 Speaker 1: and I was twenty two. Somebody even gave either drink 820 00:53:24,560 --> 00:53:27,680 Speaker 1: order at a campaign event once. As you discussed on 821 00:53:27,719 --> 00:53:30,840 Speaker 1: the podcast, there were also some misconceptions in general weirdness 822 00:53:30,920 --> 00:53:32,440 Speaker 1: due to the fact that I was a young woman 823 00:53:32,560 --> 00:53:36,000 Speaker 1: working for a middle aged male candidate, while my boss 824 00:53:36,120 --> 00:53:39,040 Speaker 1: was as appropriate and professional as they come. When I 825 00:53:39,080 --> 00:53:41,520 Speaker 1: was first offered the job, my boyfriend at the time 826 00:53:41,600 --> 00:53:44,680 Speaker 1: suggested it was because my boss had other intentions. Note 827 00:53:44,840 --> 00:53:47,799 Speaker 1: he didn't remain my boyfriend for long. I now work 828 00:53:47,840 --> 00:53:49,880 Speaker 1: on pay equity, and I've given a lot of thought 829 00:53:50,000 --> 00:53:53,560 Speaker 1: to compensation on political campaigns. I was fortunate to work 830 00:53:53,560 --> 00:53:56,080 Speaker 1: for two elected officials my first boss, as well as 831 00:53:56,080 --> 00:53:58,880 Speaker 1: a female candidate who paid me very fairly. But the 832 00:53:58,920 --> 00:54:01,400 Speaker 1: majority of my friends you have worked on campaigns have 833 00:54:01,560 --> 00:54:04,440 Speaker 1: done so for free or for next to nothing, especially 834 00:54:04,680 --> 00:54:07,799 Speaker 1: at the U S. Senate and presidential campaign levels. As 835 00:54:07,800 --> 00:54:10,480 Speaker 1: you pointed out during the episode, this hugely affects the 836 00:54:10,520 --> 00:54:14,280 Speaker 1: demographic makeup of campaigns and legislative offices, which in turn 837 00:54:14,800 --> 00:54:18,400 Speaker 1: makes for policies that don't represent the American electorate. The 838 00:54:18,480 --> 00:54:22,120 Speaker 1: gender disparity in campaign rules also exacerbates the wage gap 839 00:54:22,200 --> 00:54:25,320 Speaker 1: for years to come, considering that many of these campaign 840 00:54:25,360 --> 00:54:28,440 Speaker 1: staffers will go on to lateral positions in the Canada 841 00:54:28,480 --> 00:54:31,560 Speaker 1: the Legislative Office. Thank you for highlighting many of the 842 00:54:31,640 --> 00:54:34,680 Speaker 1: challenges facing women on political campaigns, and for discussing the 843 00:54:34,719 --> 00:54:38,560 Speaker 1: implications of pay inequality in politics. And well, thank you 844 00:54:38,680 --> 00:54:41,120 Speaker 1: for writing in Mary Rose. Well, I've got a letter 845 00:54:41,200 --> 00:54:43,799 Speaker 1: here from Ben, who says we can also refer to 846 00:54:43,880 --> 00:54:49,080 Speaker 1: him as Ben from Seattle. So Ben writes, longtime listener, 847 00:54:49,120 --> 00:54:51,080 Speaker 1: and I typically dig your work, but I have to 848 00:54:51,160 --> 00:54:54,000 Speaker 1: take you to task about the Hillary Clinton episode, and 849 00:54:54,000 --> 00:54:58,160 Speaker 1: specifically the comments made about the quote no room for fear. 850 00:54:59,600 --> 00:55:02,359 Speaker 1: One of you made a connection between that quote and 851 00:55:02,400 --> 00:55:05,480 Speaker 1: transphobic bathroom bills, and I'm sorry. I think that's entirely 852 00:55:05,560 --> 00:55:09,120 Speaker 1: unreasonable and and undermines the very real historical record which 853 00:55:09,120 --> 00:55:12,200 Speaker 1: shows her lack of leadership, especially when it comes to fear. 854 00:55:12,680 --> 00:55:15,640 Speaker 1: Please keep in mind that both Bill and Hillary's political 855 00:55:15,680 --> 00:55:19,520 Speaker 1: record on gay and trans rights. It's absolutely detestable, and 856 00:55:19,600 --> 00:55:23,400 Speaker 1: Hillary did not publicly support full equality for gay Americans 857 00:55:23,480 --> 00:55:26,719 Speaker 1: until very recently, and anything else but full equality would 858 00:55:26,719 --> 00:55:31,000 Speaker 1: be second class citizenship and unconstitutional right. More to the point, 859 00:55:31,160 --> 00:55:34,040 Speaker 1: fear is what drove this country to an unnecessary war 860 00:55:34,120 --> 00:55:36,799 Speaker 1: with Iraq, and Clinton voted in favor of that war. 861 00:55:37,160 --> 00:55:39,359 Speaker 1: Her voting record is the same for the Patriot Act, 862 00:55:39,560 --> 00:55:42,520 Speaker 1: another example of how she is perfectly comfortable making room 863 00:55:42,600 --> 00:55:47,000 Speaker 1: for fear to advance questionable domestic and international policy. Could 864 00:55:47,000 --> 00:55:50,040 Speaker 1: you please revisit this issue and address this point. Indeed, 865 00:55:50,160 --> 00:55:54,000 Speaker 1: Hillary Clinton's accomplishments are outstanding and very impressive, but let's 866 00:55:54,040 --> 00:55:56,319 Speaker 1: not pretend her life as a fairy tale. She has 867 00:55:56,360 --> 00:56:00,320 Speaker 1: made very serious mistakes and needs to be held accountable. Firstly, 868 00:56:00,320 --> 00:56:02,440 Speaker 1: I don't see her as a leader. Elizabeth Warren, on 869 00:56:02,440 --> 00:56:05,239 Speaker 1: the other hand, is definitely a textbook example of a leader. 870 00:56:05,239 --> 00:56:09,160 Speaker 1: Perhaps you should put a show together about her. So, Ben, 871 00:56:09,400 --> 00:56:13,000 Speaker 1: thank you for your thoughts. And Elizabeth Warren is a 872 00:56:13,040 --> 00:56:16,719 Speaker 1: total badass and she would be really fun to put 873 00:56:16,719 --> 00:56:19,600 Speaker 1: an episode on. I also think it's worth noting that 874 00:56:19,640 --> 00:56:26,120 Speaker 1: we stopped the episode so there is I agree Ben 875 00:56:26,200 --> 00:56:28,680 Speaker 1: that we we left out a lot and a lot 876 00:56:28,719 --> 00:56:30,719 Speaker 1: of people have written in you know, it's asking why 877 00:56:30,760 --> 00:56:33,480 Speaker 1: we didn't talk about Ben Gazzi and the emails, for instance, 878 00:56:34,040 --> 00:56:39,839 Speaker 1: But we made a very specific decision to address her. 879 00:56:41,200 --> 00:56:43,040 Speaker 1: For lack of a better word, her quote unquote young 880 00:56:43,040 --> 00:56:47,840 Speaker 1: life leading up to when she first landed in the 881 00:56:47,840 --> 00:56:51,360 Speaker 1: White House, which was in ninety two. So obviously a 882 00:56:51,440 --> 00:56:55,200 Speaker 1: lot has happened since then, including some questionable voting records 883 00:56:55,200 --> 00:57:00,399 Speaker 1: and some questionable support behind some policies, but that will 884 00:57:00,440 --> 00:57:02,879 Speaker 1: have to be for another episode. Yeah, I mean, uh 885 00:57:03,360 --> 00:57:07,319 Speaker 1: t L d R. There wasn't enough time, but Ben, 886 00:57:07,400 --> 00:57:11,839 Speaker 1: kudos to you for being informed and engaged, and thank 887 00:57:11,920 --> 00:57:14,960 Speaker 1: you for listening, Um and listeners. As always, if you 888 00:57:15,000 --> 00:57:16,840 Speaker 1: have thoughts to share with us mom Stuff to how 889 00:57:16,880 --> 00:57:19,040 Speaker 1: stuff Works dot com is where you can send your letters. 890 00:57:19,240 --> 00:57:21,320 Speaker 1: You can also tweet us at mom Stuff podcast or 891 00:57:21,360 --> 00:57:24,960 Speaker 1: messages on Facebook and for links all of our social 892 00:57:24,960 --> 00:57:26,960 Speaker 1: media as well as all of our blogs, videos, and 893 00:57:27,040 --> 00:57:30,720 Speaker 1: podcasts with our sources so you can learn more about 894 00:57:31,000 --> 00:57:33,680 Speaker 1: rom coms and people of color. Head on over to 895 00:57:33,800 --> 00:57:40,320 Speaker 1: stuff Mom Never Told You dot com for more on 896 00:57:40,400 --> 00:57:42,840 Speaker 1: this and thousands of other topics. Is it how stuff 897 00:57:42,880 --> 00:57:51,280 Speaker 1: Works dot com