1 00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:06,240 Speaker 1: Now from our nation's capital. This is Bloomberg sound On 2 00:00:08,119 --> 00:00:13,400 Speaker 1: and Sweden make NATO stronger Together. We are taking historis 3 00:00:13,440 --> 00:00:16,560 Speaker 1: that the yea's are eighty six and a's are eleven, 4 00:00:16,680 --> 00:00:20,760 Speaker 1: and the bill is Pat Bloomberg sound on Politics, Policy 5 00:00:20,760 --> 00:00:24,639 Speaker 1: and Perspective from DC's top name. We are dealing with 6 00:00:24,720 --> 00:00:29,560 Speaker 1: an infant formula emergency. In this natal the organization was compromised. 7 00:00:29,560 --> 00:00:32,360 Speaker 1: That is a dereliction of doing. Back to the kitchen 8 00:00:32,400 --> 00:00:36,400 Speaker 1: table for where the babies, Where the children? Bloomberg sound 9 00:00:36,440 --> 00:00:41,600 Speaker 1: On with Joe Matthew on Bloomberg Radio. The U. S 10 00:00:41,600 --> 00:00:45,879 Speaker 1: Senate clears forty billion dollars more for Ukraine, has Finland 11 00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:48,440 Speaker 1: and Sweden visit the White House in their bid to 12 00:00:48,560 --> 00:00:51,960 Speaker 1: join NATO. Welcome to the fastest hour in politics. We 13 00:00:52,040 --> 00:00:55,480 Speaker 1: have breaking news from both ends of Pennsylvania Avenue and 14 00:00:55,520 --> 00:00:58,760 Speaker 1: a conversation ahead with Senator Tim Kane, Democrat from Virginia, 15 00:00:58,800 --> 00:01:02,440 Speaker 1: on the Arms Services and Foreign Relations committees, with some 16 00:01:02,760 --> 00:01:05,920 Speaker 1: very determined thoughts about how this should all be conducted. 17 00:01:05,959 --> 00:01:09,360 Speaker 1: The baby formula shortage becomes a crisis, we'll have details 18 00:01:09,360 --> 00:01:11,600 Speaker 1: on efforts to fix it in Washington and discussed with 19 00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:15,039 Speaker 1: Congresswoman Abigail span Berger, who was out with legislation to 20 00:01:15,080 --> 00:01:19,000 Speaker 1: help analysis from the panel. Today, Bluebird Politics contributors Jeanie 21 00:01:19,080 --> 00:01:21,160 Speaker 1: Chanzano and Rick Davis are with us for the hour 22 00:01:21,200 --> 00:01:24,080 Speaker 1: and the money for Ukraine clears the Senate happened a 23 00:01:24,120 --> 00:01:27,080 Speaker 1: short time ago, more than forty billion dollars, even more 24 00:01:27,160 --> 00:01:32,039 Speaker 1: than President Biden requested. The yea's are eight six and 25 00:01:32,160 --> 00:01:36,200 Speaker 1: as are eleven, and the bill is past Senator Angus King, 26 00:01:36,240 --> 00:01:40,240 Speaker 1: the Independent from Maine with the tally. This sends the bill, 27 00:01:40,360 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 1: of course to President Biden, who wants to sign it. 28 00:01:43,080 --> 00:01:45,760 Speaker 1: And today hosted the leaders of Finland and Sweden at 29 00:01:45,760 --> 00:01:49,200 Speaker 1: the White House the show support for their bid to 30 00:01:49,440 --> 00:01:52,880 Speaker 1: join NATO. To day, I'm proud to welcome and offer 31 00:01:52,960 --> 00:01:57,640 Speaker 1: the strong support of the United States for the applications 32 00:01:57,720 --> 00:02:03,400 Speaker 1: of two great democracies and two close, highly capable partners 33 00:02:03,920 --> 00:02:08,960 Speaker 1: to join the strongest, most powerful, defensive allies in the 34 00:02:09,040 --> 00:02:11,800 Speaker 1: history of the world. Gathered in a sunny rose garden 35 00:02:11,960 --> 00:02:15,600 Speaker 1: with the media on hand, and I discussed all of 36 00:02:15,639 --> 00:02:18,440 Speaker 1: this earlier today on Capitol Hill with Senator Tim Kane, 37 00:02:18,480 --> 00:02:21,360 Speaker 1: as I mentioned the Democrat from Virginia who serves on 38 00:02:21,400 --> 00:02:24,400 Speaker 1: the Armed Services and Foreign Relations committees, of course, Hillary 39 00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:27,600 Speaker 1: Clinton's one time running mate. I started by asking him 40 00:02:27,639 --> 00:02:30,880 Speaker 1: if he was a yes on aid for Ukraine. I 41 00:02:31,000 --> 00:02:35,840 Speaker 1: am to continue the real uptick in military humanitarian support 42 00:02:35,880 --> 00:02:39,120 Speaker 1: for Ukraine. We need to help them beat this illegal 43 00:02:39,160 --> 00:02:42,440 Speaker 1: invasion of of their country by Vladimir Putin. The President, 44 00:02:42,480 --> 00:02:44,639 Speaker 1: of course, made the call an urgent call a couple 45 00:02:44,680 --> 00:02:47,440 Speaker 1: of weeks ago. At this point thirty three billion. It's 46 00:02:47,480 --> 00:02:49,720 Speaker 1: crept up to about forty billion. And this this bill 47 00:02:49,840 --> 00:02:51,720 Speaker 1: was held up, as I'm sure you well know, by 48 00:02:51,800 --> 00:02:55,640 Speaker 1: Senator Ran Paul, who had concerns about oversight. And I 49 00:02:55,680 --> 00:02:57,560 Speaker 1: know that you specifically were not in favor of the 50 00:02:57,560 --> 00:03:00,120 Speaker 1: individual he was talking to. Even went further to talk 51 00:03:00,160 --> 00:03:04,239 Speaker 1: about the impact on inflation through deficit spending. Right in principle, 52 00:03:04,280 --> 00:03:06,799 Speaker 1: why is he wrong, Well, he's not wrong on oversight. 53 00:03:06,880 --> 00:03:10,800 Speaker 1: So he had a fairly vanilla oversight amendment that all 54 00:03:10,840 --> 00:03:12,400 Speaker 1: of us said, you're right, there ought to be oversighting 55 00:03:12,440 --> 00:03:15,760 Speaker 1: these moneys. But then he started to dictate the terms 56 00:03:15,760 --> 00:03:17,840 Speaker 1: of who the oversight should be done by, and we 57 00:03:17,880 --> 00:03:21,280 Speaker 1: don't do that in oversight bills. Oversight, yes, but letting 58 00:03:21,320 --> 00:03:24,760 Speaker 1: one senator pick who the oversight uh official will be 59 00:03:24,919 --> 00:03:26,440 Speaker 1: that's not the way we do it. But on the 60 00:03:26,480 --> 00:03:29,320 Speaker 1: oversight we need to and we will. We will provide oversight. 61 00:03:29,680 --> 00:03:32,640 Speaker 1: Will the president be allowed to to appoint a watchdog? 62 00:03:32,639 --> 00:03:34,960 Speaker 1: How do you see it best fit for this use? Well, 63 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:38,280 Speaker 1: I I think the there are traditional ways that you 64 00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:40,640 Speaker 1: set up inspector generals, and you set them up as 65 00:03:40,720 --> 00:03:44,680 Speaker 1: independent of the agency, and so they are executive appointed, 66 00:03:45,040 --> 00:03:48,000 Speaker 1: but they are not sort of embedded within the the 67 00:03:48,080 --> 00:03:51,360 Speaker 1: agency performing the function so that they can have true independence. 68 00:03:51,640 --> 00:03:54,120 Speaker 1: You worry about the inflationary component or is the senator 69 00:03:54,120 --> 00:03:55,880 Speaker 1: from Kentucky making too much out of that? Well, I 70 00:03:56,120 --> 00:03:58,080 Speaker 1: actually think the best thing, one of the best things 71 00:03:58,120 --> 00:04:00,920 Speaker 1: in the world for inflation, would be if this war 72 00:04:01,040 --> 00:04:05,040 Speaker 1: is over, because the Russian invasion of Ukraine is causing 73 00:04:05,120 --> 00:04:09,040 Speaker 1: massive disruption in energy markets, which is leading to inflation. 74 00:04:09,560 --> 00:04:14,680 Speaker 1: So allowing Russia to succeed um would make things worth winning. 75 00:04:14,680 --> 00:04:17,120 Speaker 1: The war is how you beat inflation? Is there there's 76 00:04:17,120 --> 00:04:19,840 Speaker 1: other strategies to for beating inflation, but certainly in the 77 00:04:19,960 --> 00:04:22,800 Speaker 1: energy sector and also in the food sector. Ukraine is 78 00:04:22,839 --> 00:04:25,280 Speaker 1: a is a huge food producer, and when they are 79 00:04:25,320 --> 00:04:28,040 Speaker 1: not able to export to other parts of the world, 80 00:04:28,080 --> 00:04:31,520 Speaker 1: it creates hunger and also has an impact on food prizes. Again, 81 00:04:31,560 --> 00:04:34,120 Speaker 1: if we help them beat this illegal invasion, it will 82 00:04:34,160 --> 00:04:36,400 Speaker 1: help bring prices down. So Senator, the bill goes to 83 00:04:36,400 --> 00:04:38,720 Speaker 1: the President, he signs it. What happens after that? How 84 00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:41,640 Speaker 1: will this work in conjunction with len Lease Act? And 85 00:04:41,680 --> 00:04:44,120 Speaker 1: what will it buy for Ukraine? So what what what 86 00:04:44,200 --> 00:04:46,599 Speaker 1: you see right now? We did the thirteen point six 87 00:04:46,640 --> 00:04:48,760 Speaker 1: billion dollar aid package a couple of months ago, and 88 00:04:48,760 --> 00:04:51,719 Speaker 1: then about every week you see President Binary leases three 89 00:04:51,760 --> 00:04:55,360 Speaker 1: hundred million or five million. What we do is, once 90 00:04:55,440 --> 00:04:58,919 Speaker 1: we know what the scope is, our military is in 91 00:04:59,080 --> 00:05:01,720 Speaker 1: very close touch with Ukrainian Defense Forces and also with 92 00:05:02,240 --> 00:05:05,000 Speaker 1: the other allies who are providing defense support, and we 93 00:05:05,040 --> 00:05:07,040 Speaker 1: are in dialogue every day what do you need and 94 00:05:07,080 --> 00:05:08,800 Speaker 1: where do you need it and when do you need it? 95 00:05:09,160 --> 00:05:12,520 Speaker 1: And then we release tranches of aid based on those discussions, 96 00:05:12,520 --> 00:05:14,800 Speaker 1: and and each week they need is a little bit different, 97 00:05:14,839 --> 00:05:19,279 Speaker 1: but the communication and the intelligent sharing. The Ukrainian Defense 98 00:05:19,360 --> 00:05:21,760 Speaker 1: Forces have been heavily trained by the US and NATO 99 00:05:22,240 --> 00:05:26,719 Speaker 1: since after the invasion of Crimea were dramatically um increase 100 00:05:26,800 --> 00:05:29,680 Speaker 1: the pace of training with the Ukrainian Defense Forces. So 101 00:05:29,720 --> 00:05:32,960 Speaker 1: we have been very cooperative for the last eight years, 102 00:05:33,200 --> 00:05:35,880 Speaker 1: and that turns makes it easy to make real time 103 00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:38,080 Speaker 1: decisions with them about what they need. As we speak 104 00:05:38,120 --> 00:05:40,640 Speaker 1: here today, Senator, the leaders of Finland and Sweden are 105 00:05:40,680 --> 00:05:43,320 Speaker 1: with President Biden talking about their bid to join NATO. 106 00:05:43,680 --> 00:05:46,359 Speaker 1: I'm sure you support that bid, but do you worry 107 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:48,960 Speaker 1: about Vladimir Putin seeing this as an escalation, that this 108 00:05:49,000 --> 00:05:51,640 Speaker 1: could be in fact a dangerous development, You know, Vladimir 109 00:05:51,680 --> 00:05:54,680 Speaker 1: Putin worrying about what will provoke Putin. I think the 110 00:05:54,720 --> 00:05:57,520 Speaker 1: guy was born provoked. I mean, just listen to this 111 00:05:57,640 --> 00:06:01,120 Speaker 1: language he uses. I'm I'm invading you Krane because they 112 00:06:01,160 --> 00:06:04,240 Speaker 1: need to be denazified. When Vladimer Zolenski is one of 113 00:06:04,320 --> 00:06:07,360 Speaker 1: three heads of state in the world who's Jewish, I mean, 114 00:06:07,400 --> 00:06:10,400 Speaker 1: this guy lives in an alternate reality. He was born provoked. 115 00:06:10,440 --> 00:06:12,520 Speaker 1: I don't think there's anything that we can do right 116 00:06:12,520 --> 00:06:15,799 Speaker 1: now that will provoke him. Sweden and Finland have maintained 117 00:06:15,880 --> 00:06:18,760 Speaker 1: neutrality because they felt like they needed to have good 118 00:06:18,800 --> 00:06:22,120 Speaker 1: relations with this sizeable nation right on their border. But 119 00:06:22,240 --> 00:06:26,080 Speaker 1: now they see Russia as a dangerous and destabilizing force 120 00:06:26,480 --> 00:06:29,120 Speaker 1: and any even dangerous to their own national security, and 121 00:06:29,120 --> 00:06:33,480 Speaker 1: they want to link arms with other democracies to protect 122 00:06:33,480 --> 00:06:36,600 Speaker 1: ourselves and be an ally with democracies around the globe. 123 00:06:36,600 --> 00:06:38,160 Speaker 1: I think it's very post from your view, though a 124 00:06:38,240 --> 00:06:41,480 Speaker 1: unique view on armed services and foreign relations. Does that 125 00:06:41,520 --> 00:06:44,240 Speaker 1: potentially add to the chances this creeps beyond the borders 126 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:48,760 Speaker 1: of Ukraine. Um, I I would argue it probably look 127 00:06:48,839 --> 00:06:50,760 Speaker 1: Vladimir Putin is hard to predict. It might have the 128 00:06:50,800 --> 00:06:55,160 Speaker 1: opposite effect. He clearly had an expectation he could go 129 00:06:55,279 --> 00:06:58,039 Speaker 1: into Ukraine top of the government, take it over to 130 00:06:58,160 --> 00:07:03,039 Speaker 1: pose Zelinski. Um he's realized his ambitions were wrong. The 131 00:07:03,200 --> 00:07:06,720 Speaker 1: Ukrainians don't want to be part of Russia, even even 132 00:07:06,760 --> 00:07:10,480 Speaker 1: the most pro Russian parts of Ukraine on the Russian boarder, 133 00:07:10,560 --> 00:07:15,360 Speaker 1: Russian speakers, Russian national Ukrainians. They've seen what Vladimir Putin 134 00:07:15,400 --> 00:07:18,200 Speaker 1: has done in Daynetska little Hanska said we don't want 135 00:07:18,240 --> 00:07:20,840 Speaker 1: any part of it. And so this is backfired. And 136 00:07:20,840 --> 00:07:24,800 Speaker 1: when he sees Sweden and Finland abandoning decades of neutrality 137 00:07:24,840 --> 00:07:27,840 Speaker 1: to join NATO, you know he or somebody else in 138 00:07:27,920 --> 00:07:30,520 Speaker 1: Russia needs to come to their senses about what a 139 00:07:30,560 --> 00:07:34,080 Speaker 1: disaster this illegal war is. Senator approved our new U 140 00:07:34,120 --> 00:07:37,160 Speaker 1: S ambassador to Ukraine last evening. What does ambassador bring 141 00:07:37,280 --> 00:07:40,160 Speaker 1: bring to the table, What will that change in the war? EPs? Well, 142 00:07:40,280 --> 00:07:43,480 Speaker 1: its first, it just sends a powerful symbol to the 143 00:07:43,520 --> 00:07:47,400 Speaker 1: Ukrainian people when we reopen our embassy in Keith. The 144 00:07:47,400 --> 00:07:50,600 Speaker 1: European nations have done that in recent weeks. This is 145 00:07:50,600 --> 00:07:54,120 Speaker 1: a time when communication at all levels between the US 146 00:07:54,160 --> 00:07:57,280 Speaker 1: and Ukraine, at the political level, at the military level, 147 00:07:57,320 --> 00:08:02,560 Speaker 1: at Congress, people in parliamentary and more communication helps um 148 00:08:02,600 --> 00:08:06,080 Speaker 1: and having a U s embassy, flagship embassy there in Kiev, 149 00:08:06,200 --> 00:08:08,520 Speaker 1: that will um. That will send a powerful signal and 150 00:08:08,560 --> 00:08:11,000 Speaker 1: improve the communication that we do every day. China's of 151 00:08:11,000 --> 00:08:14,240 Speaker 1: course watching and making some noise as the president prepares 152 00:08:14,280 --> 00:08:16,520 Speaker 1: for his trip to Asia, suggesting that it that we're 153 00:08:16,560 --> 00:08:19,320 Speaker 1: taking a dangerous road I think was the quote from 154 00:08:19,400 --> 00:08:22,560 Speaker 1: China's Foreign minister with regard to Taiwan. As the president 155 00:08:22,600 --> 00:08:25,440 Speaker 1: prepares to engage with South Korea Japan. What is it 156 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:27,360 Speaker 1: that keeps you up at night? The threat from North 157 00:08:27,440 --> 00:08:30,600 Speaker 1: Korea as they prepare another NWKE test or China Um, 158 00:08:30,680 --> 00:08:32,800 Speaker 1: China is the one that I'm worried more about nor 159 00:08:32,880 --> 00:08:35,880 Speaker 1: North Korea. Sadly, if they feel like they're being ignored, 160 00:08:35,960 --> 00:08:38,080 Speaker 1: then they want to do something to get everybody's attention back. 161 00:08:38,160 --> 00:08:39,760 Speaker 1: I mean, it's which is which is kind of a 162 00:08:39,800 --> 00:08:43,640 Speaker 1: sad statement about the leadership of that country. I have 163 00:08:43,840 --> 00:08:47,040 Speaker 1: complete trust in our defensive capacities to deal with a 164 00:08:47,120 --> 00:08:51,520 Speaker 1: threat from North Korea. That China threat is a multi 165 00:08:51,640 --> 00:08:55,280 Speaker 1: level threat. It's military, it's economic, it's diplomatic. China is 166 00:08:55,280 --> 00:08:59,480 Speaker 1: an adversary across many many domains and in some instances 167 00:08:59,520 --> 00:09:02,600 Speaker 1: a competed editor and in some instances we even cooperate together. 168 00:09:02,600 --> 00:09:07,000 Speaker 1: So it's a complex relationship. UM. I think it's important 169 00:09:07,160 --> 00:09:10,880 Speaker 1: that we are providing, together with others, Taiwan with the 170 00:09:10,920 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 1: ability to defend their own country, and that's what they want, 171 00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:17,600 Speaker 1: and we ought to be providing them with that. And 172 00:09:17,640 --> 00:09:20,559 Speaker 1: what China has seen that you know, they pledged forever 173 00:09:20,600 --> 00:09:23,960 Speaker 1: friendship with Russia right before the Beijing Winter Olympics. I 174 00:09:23,960 --> 00:09:26,360 Speaker 1: don't know that they were meaning to pledge forever friendship 175 00:09:26,400 --> 00:09:29,680 Speaker 1: with a war criminal. And I have reason to believe 176 00:09:29,720 --> 00:09:32,480 Speaker 1: they're now questioning the degree they want to completely link 177 00:09:32,679 --> 00:09:36,200 Speaker 1: arms with a Russia that's committing war crimes. But they've 178 00:09:36,360 --> 00:09:38,960 Speaker 1: what that China has also seen is They've not only been, 179 00:09:40,040 --> 00:09:42,640 Speaker 1: you know, gotten a vision into wh Vladimir Putin is 180 00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:46,720 Speaker 1: there forever friend. They've also seen how quickly the democracies 181 00:09:46,760 --> 00:09:49,000 Speaker 1: of the world will link arms and stand up against 182 00:09:49,320 --> 00:09:53,160 Speaker 1: an illegal invasion of somebody else's country. Um. And they 183 00:09:53,200 --> 00:09:57,160 Speaker 1: see the the impact that sanctions and military and humanitarian 184 00:09:57,200 --> 00:10:00,840 Speaker 1: aid can have. So we're not embarked on a dangerous 185 00:10:00,920 --> 00:10:03,679 Speaker 1: road with Taiwan. We're trying to do the kinds of 186 00:10:03,679 --> 00:10:06,880 Speaker 1: things that will enable them to defend themselves. And that 187 00:10:07,000 --> 00:10:09,760 Speaker 1: China Wood view that is dangerous. I think that's that's 188 00:10:09,800 --> 00:10:12,480 Speaker 1: a language that they're using. I I they don't. They 189 00:10:12,520 --> 00:10:15,960 Speaker 1: don't think we have any designs on Taiwan. Um. But 190 00:10:15,960 --> 00:10:18,720 Speaker 1: but the fact that Taiwan has more ability to defend itself, 191 00:10:18,720 --> 00:10:21,160 Speaker 1: I guess is troubling to them. These are dangerous times 192 00:10:21,160 --> 00:10:22,480 Speaker 1: and we have a lot to talk about. But I'll 193 00:10:22,480 --> 00:10:25,240 Speaker 1: ask you lastly about this baby formula story. The House 194 00:10:25,240 --> 00:10:28,360 Speaker 1: has acted on this, as there a legislative solution in 195 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:30,760 Speaker 1: the Senate. I'm I'm reading that it may not pass 196 00:10:30,840 --> 00:10:32,400 Speaker 1: the Senate. Is there more that can be done than 197 00:10:32,400 --> 00:10:34,280 Speaker 1: with the White Houses? I think you'll see us take 198 00:10:34,280 --> 00:10:35,959 Speaker 1: this bill up in the Senate next week and vote, 199 00:10:35,960 --> 00:10:37,880 Speaker 1: and I would say you're gonna see every Democrat I 200 00:10:37,880 --> 00:10:40,720 Speaker 1: believe vote for it. There's got to be ten Republicans. 201 00:10:40,800 --> 00:10:43,760 Speaker 1: As much as they've been out bashing Joe Biden for this, 202 00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:46,080 Speaker 1: and I want to come back to how inaccurate that is. 203 00:10:46,320 --> 00:10:48,199 Speaker 1: As much as they've been out bashing him about it, 204 00:10:48,200 --> 00:10:50,080 Speaker 1: you would think they would vote to solve it. And 205 00:10:50,080 --> 00:10:52,040 Speaker 1: I hope we'll see that. I mean, look, this is 206 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:56,040 Speaker 1: a challenge that was driven by the largest manufacturing facility 207 00:10:56,080 --> 00:10:59,880 Speaker 1: for infant form in the United States had serious safety problems. 208 00:11:00,240 --> 00:11:02,480 Speaker 1: The last thing we want is for people to be 209 00:11:02,520 --> 00:11:04,880 Speaker 1: buying formula off shells and have it be tainted, have 210 00:11:04,960 --> 00:11:07,880 Speaker 1: it be dangerous to their kids. So the safety problems 211 00:11:07,920 --> 00:11:10,160 Speaker 1: were so serious that that plan had to be shut down. 212 00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:13,480 Speaker 1: We're now going to use the Defense Production Act to 213 00:11:13,600 --> 00:11:17,640 Speaker 1: increase production. We're allowing importation of formula that's safe from 214 00:11:17,679 --> 00:11:21,160 Speaker 1: other countries. The company that closed its plant down has 215 00:11:21,160 --> 00:11:23,920 Speaker 1: reached an agreement to do some fixes. They should be 216 00:11:23,960 --> 00:11:26,920 Speaker 1: reopened within two weeks and starting to produce again, so 217 00:11:27,000 --> 00:11:29,840 Speaker 1: we will solve this problem. I think you'll see that 218 00:11:29,920 --> 00:11:33,040 Speaker 1: be bipartisan, but we'll have to have that vote next week, 219 00:11:33,080 --> 00:11:36,880 Speaker 1: and see Senator Tim Caine earlier today talking with us 220 00:11:36,880 --> 00:11:38,679 Speaker 1: in the halls of Congress. Just to get back to 221 00:11:38,720 --> 00:11:40,920 Speaker 1: the Ukraine vote today, as we told you, was eighty 222 00:11:41,000 --> 00:11:46,120 Speaker 1: six to eleven. Hey, Eleven Republicans voted no for the 223 00:11:46,160 --> 00:11:49,280 Speaker 1: additional funding for Ukraine, starting with Rand Paul, who of 224 00:11:49,360 --> 00:11:52,360 Speaker 1: course already expressed issues. We talked about that with Senator Kane. 225 00:11:52,679 --> 00:11:56,960 Speaker 1: The other no votes Senators Marsha Blackburn of Tennessee, John 226 00:11:56,960 --> 00:12:02,000 Speaker 1: Boozman Arkansas, Mike Braun Indiana, Like Creepe, Idaho, Bill Haggerty 227 00:12:02,080 --> 00:12:04,960 Speaker 1: of Tennessee, Josh Holly of Missouri, Mike Lee of Utah, 228 00:12:05,240 --> 00:12:09,480 Speaker 1: Roger Marshall of Kansas, Cynthia Lammis of Wyoming, and Tommy 229 00:12:09,520 --> 00:12:14,400 Speaker 1: Tubberville of Alabama, all coming out against the legislation, despite 230 00:12:14,400 --> 00:12:18,760 Speaker 1: cries from Republicans and criticism the President Biden was not 231 00:12:18,880 --> 00:12:22,080 Speaker 1: doing enough to enrich the Ukrainians in their war effort. 232 00:12:22,360 --> 00:12:24,600 Speaker 1: Will assemble the panel next, Rick and Jeanie for their 233 00:12:24,640 --> 00:12:31,120 Speaker 1: take on this. This is Bloomberg. This is Bloomberg sound 234 00:12:31,200 --> 00:12:37,000 Speaker 1: on on Bloomberg Radio. The money is moving to Ukraine, 235 00:12:37,040 --> 00:12:40,160 Speaker 1: more than forty billion dollars clearing the Senate, even as 236 00:12:40,240 --> 00:12:43,880 Speaker 1: eleven Republicans vote no. Thanks for being with us. On 237 00:12:43,920 --> 00:12:46,440 Speaker 1: the Thursday edition of Sound On, I'm Joe Matthew in 238 00:12:46,520 --> 00:12:49,839 Speaker 1: Washington as we assemble the panel. Bloomberg Politics contributors Jeannie 239 00:12:49,960 --> 00:12:53,120 Speaker 1: chantay No and Rick Davis are with us with a 240 00:12:53,120 --> 00:12:55,640 Speaker 1: couple of moving parts today. It's not just the funding 241 00:12:55,640 --> 00:12:58,520 Speaker 1: for Ukraine. But of course, before President Biden left for 242 00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:00,720 Speaker 1: his trip to Asia, which will be talking more about 243 00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:03,880 Speaker 1: in the days ahead, he hosted the leaders of Finland 244 00:13:03,880 --> 00:13:05,840 Speaker 1: and Sweden at the White House. They held an event, 245 00:13:05,840 --> 00:13:08,439 Speaker 1: as you might have heard earlier this hour, to support 246 00:13:08,520 --> 00:13:11,440 Speaker 1: their bids to join NATO, which appears to be on 247 00:13:11,480 --> 00:13:15,200 Speaker 1: the fast track right now. So things are happening, and Genie, 248 00:13:15,240 --> 00:13:19,520 Speaker 1: I'd like to start with the bill on Ukraine. This 249 00:13:20,480 --> 00:13:24,120 Speaker 1: comes after Republicans told the President he was not doing enough, 250 00:13:24,160 --> 00:13:26,920 Speaker 1: that we had to send more, more MiGs, more missiles, 251 00:13:26,920 --> 00:13:31,240 Speaker 1: more everything. And I read the statement here uh from 252 00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:34,760 Speaker 1: Senator Haggerty. Bill Haggerty of Tennessee says the size of 253 00:13:34,760 --> 00:13:37,120 Speaker 1: this bill is the size of my state's annual budget, 254 00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:40,040 Speaker 1: when a much more obvious answer is we should stop 255 00:13:40,080 --> 00:13:43,600 Speaker 1: the war on American energy right now. As the President 256 00:13:43,679 --> 00:13:47,520 Speaker 1: lost some Republicans when it comes to this war effort, 257 00:13:47,640 --> 00:13:51,040 Speaker 1: there is, obviously, as Mitch McConnell himself said, a growing 258 00:13:51,120 --> 00:13:54,079 Speaker 1: isolationist trend. And I'm not even so sure it's growing. 259 00:13:54,120 --> 00:13:56,320 Speaker 1: It's always been there at least for some time in 260 00:13:56,360 --> 00:13:59,800 Speaker 1: the Republican side. Likewise, there's there is that in the 261 00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:03,360 Speaker 1: Democratic side as well. But the reality is, and for 262 00:14:03,400 --> 00:14:06,200 Speaker 1: people like Josh Holly and Rand Paul and Marsia Blackburn 263 00:14:06,240 --> 00:14:08,319 Speaker 1: and all these people, these eleven in the Senate now 264 00:14:08,320 --> 00:14:09,960 Speaker 1: on top of the fifties seven in the House who 265 00:14:10,040 --> 00:14:14,079 Speaker 1: voted against this bill, is what is it they are 266 00:14:14,160 --> 00:14:17,240 Speaker 1: proposing to do. The President is right now heading to 267 00:14:17,360 --> 00:14:20,760 Speaker 1: Asia for this first big trip. If the United States 268 00:14:20,840 --> 00:14:24,560 Speaker 1: takes no action of substantial proportion to allow Ukraine to 269 00:14:24,600 --> 00:14:27,800 Speaker 1: defend itself, we are going to then be in a 270 00:14:27,960 --> 00:14:31,320 Speaker 1: challenge at visa e. Taiwan and China. This is very 271 00:14:31,400 --> 00:14:34,920 Speaker 1: much like Ronald Reagan's idea in the nineteen eighties. You 272 00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:38,320 Speaker 1: support people who want to defend themselves in that case 273 00:14:38,480 --> 00:14:41,760 Speaker 1: with communism. In this case, if we don't do this, 274 00:14:42,280 --> 00:14:44,720 Speaker 1: we then will be entering because we have a NATO 275 00:14:44,800 --> 00:14:49,160 Speaker 1: obligation when putin enters our NATO allies. So Ukraine wants 276 00:14:49,200 --> 00:14:52,560 Speaker 1: to defend itself, let's allow them to do that. Does 277 00:14:52,600 --> 00:14:54,720 Speaker 1: this come down to oversight? Rick? Was this the Rand 278 00:14:54,760 --> 00:14:59,400 Speaker 1: Paul complained that we're spending too much without oversight, without accountability, 279 00:14:59,440 --> 00:15:02,560 Speaker 1: and potential lee adding to inflation with deficit spending, which 280 00:15:02,560 --> 00:15:05,760 Speaker 1: of course Senator Tim Kane kind of dismissed earlier this 281 00:15:05,840 --> 00:15:08,320 Speaker 1: hour when we were talking with him, I realized, Ran 282 00:15:08,400 --> 00:15:11,160 Speaker 1: Paul is one thing, But are these other senators are 283 00:15:11,200 --> 00:15:14,080 Speaker 1: going to be called out for this? Or I'm assuming 284 00:15:14,160 --> 00:15:16,360 Speaker 1: that they wanted to send more money to Ukraine? What 285 00:15:16,440 --> 00:15:19,040 Speaker 1: made them say? No? Well, I don't think you can 286 00:15:19,080 --> 00:15:21,200 Speaker 1: assume they want to send more money to Ukraine. I 287 00:15:21,240 --> 00:15:24,000 Speaker 1: think that they follow along different fault lines. I mean, obviously, 288 00:15:24,080 --> 00:15:27,360 Speaker 1: Rand Paul most notably is the anti deficit hawk uh 289 00:15:27,360 --> 00:15:29,960 Speaker 1: in the caucus and and and so you know, he 290 00:15:30,040 --> 00:15:33,480 Speaker 1: usually complains about any kind of spending, and especially deficit spending. 291 00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:36,080 Speaker 1: UH so, so that's his grind, and a few of 292 00:15:36,080 --> 00:15:38,200 Speaker 1: them have that that point of view, But they also 293 00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:41,120 Speaker 1: fall on the non interventionist line, which, regardless of spending, 294 00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:44,640 Speaker 1: they don't want to have US activity in a war 295 00:15:44,720 --> 00:15:46,960 Speaker 1: zone outside the United States. And that could be in Syria, 296 00:15:47,000 --> 00:15:49,080 Speaker 1: that could be an Afghanistan, that could be anywhere else. 297 00:15:49,280 --> 00:15:51,360 Speaker 1: In this case, it just happens to be in the Ukraine. 298 00:15:51,640 --> 00:15:53,600 Speaker 1: And then there are those like Josh Holly who are 299 00:15:53,640 --> 00:15:56,400 Speaker 1: really nationalists, right, They don't even want to talk about 300 00:15:56,400 --> 00:15:58,360 Speaker 1: what's going on outside our borders. They just want to 301 00:15:58,360 --> 00:16:01,320 Speaker 1: focus in on what's happening here and and and believe 302 00:16:01,480 --> 00:16:05,560 Speaker 1: that a strong country, you know, pursuing his nationalist goals, 303 00:16:06,080 --> 00:16:08,840 Speaker 1: UH is strong enough to ward off any other kind 304 00:16:08,880 --> 00:16:11,280 Speaker 1: of threats from around the world. UM. You know, Look, 305 00:16:11,320 --> 00:16:13,920 Speaker 1: these are doves at the core of it. UH in 306 00:16:13,960 --> 00:16:17,240 Speaker 1: a hawk um party and UH. And yet there are 307 00:16:17,240 --> 00:16:18,680 Speaker 1: a lot more of them now than there used to be. 308 00:16:18,720 --> 00:16:21,480 Speaker 1: I remember Lindsay Graham specifically told me that he ran 309 00:16:21,520 --> 00:16:24,480 Speaker 1: against UH for a president in two thousand and sixteen 310 00:16:24,520 --> 00:16:27,440 Speaker 1: to to to be a contrast to Rand Paul, who 311 00:16:27,480 --> 00:16:30,200 Speaker 1: was many of us have forgotten actually running for president 312 00:16:30,240 --> 00:16:34,160 Speaker 1: into six didn't last very long. Here does this become 313 00:16:34,160 --> 00:16:37,560 Speaker 1: an issue for them though? On on the campaign trail, 314 00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:40,120 Speaker 1: those that will be up for re election, Rick, you voted, notice, 315 00:16:40,120 --> 00:16:42,960 Speaker 1: send more money to Ukraine. It was a Republican principle 316 00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:45,160 Speaker 1: to send as much as we could to Ukraine. You know. 317 00:16:45,240 --> 00:16:50,360 Speaker 1: I mean they're coming from pretty conservative states, you know, Alabama, Tennessee, Indiana, Idaho, 318 00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:54,960 Speaker 1: but they also have incredibly high numbers of military and 319 00:16:55,000 --> 00:16:58,400 Speaker 1: military veterans in their states, and I think ultimately this 320 00:16:58,480 --> 00:17:01,160 Speaker 1: kind of activity which is just politics, right, They knew 321 00:17:01,160 --> 00:17:02,520 Speaker 1: this bill was going to pass, and it took a 322 00:17:02,560 --> 00:17:05,240 Speaker 1: walk on it to try and make a political point, 323 00:17:05,359 --> 00:17:08,119 Speaker 1: and at some point I do think that backfires on you. 324 00:17:08,440 --> 00:17:11,760 Speaker 1: But they have voted yes if it was a Trump bill, Genie, 325 00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:15,080 Speaker 1: I'm not so sure about that. You know. You look 326 00:17:15,080 --> 00:17:17,399 Speaker 1: at the polls and Morning consult shows. The number of 327 00:17:17,400 --> 00:17:20,280 Speaker 1: Republicans who are saying the US is doing too much 328 00:17:20,320 --> 00:17:23,719 Speaker 1: in Ukraine has doubled since March. So, you know, I 329 00:17:23,760 --> 00:17:26,840 Speaker 1: don't know if if even Donald Trump himself, as much 330 00:17:26,840 --> 00:17:28,879 Speaker 1: control as he has over his wing of the party, 331 00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:31,000 Speaker 1: could have could have made that case. But of course 332 00:17:31,040 --> 00:17:34,320 Speaker 1: Donald Trump has gone along with this isolationist trend as 333 00:17:34,359 --> 00:17:37,439 Speaker 1: it pertains to Ukraine. He's been criticizing this spending as well. 334 00:17:38,200 --> 00:17:42,120 Speaker 1: So there are shades of bipartisanship here. Rick. As far 335 00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:45,399 Speaker 1: as Finland and Sweden are concerned, I'm assuming that is 336 00:17:45,440 --> 00:17:49,439 Speaker 1: a bipartisan Uh move here. Republicans and Democrats want to 337 00:17:49,480 --> 00:17:53,320 Speaker 1: see the allidance the alliance expanded here in this case, 338 00:17:53,440 --> 00:17:56,760 Speaker 1: and to protect our allies in Europe. Tim Caine, who 339 00:17:56,760 --> 00:18:00,040 Speaker 1: of course serves on Armed Services and Foreign Relations and 340 00:18:00,080 --> 00:18:02,600 Speaker 1: has told us earlier, he thinks that will actually have 341 00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:06,040 Speaker 1: the opposite effect on Vladimir Putin. This will not be escalatory, 342 00:18:06,040 --> 00:18:08,280 Speaker 1: but in fact might contain the war to Ukraine. Is 343 00:18:08,320 --> 00:18:10,840 Speaker 1: he right? Well, I hope he's right. Um. You know, 344 00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:13,840 Speaker 1: you don't want to do things that is going to needlessly, 345 00:18:14,160 --> 00:18:19,680 Speaker 1: um accelerate the Russian war machine, although I'll comment him 346 00:18:19,680 --> 00:18:21,800 Speaker 1: once again that the Russian war machine may not be 347 00:18:21,920 --> 00:18:25,080 Speaker 1: able to escalate even if he wanted to. But at 348 00:18:25,080 --> 00:18:27,480 Speaker 1: the end of the day, Uh, it's good policy, right. 349 00:18:27,520 --> 00:18:30,920 Speaker 1: I mean, the more we have other economies involved, other 350 00:18:31,000 --> 00:18:34,640 Speaker 1: militaries involved, it shores up the capability, but it also 351 00:18:34,680 --> 00:18:37,000 Speaker 1: spreads the risk, and I think that's a good thing 352 00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:40,200 Speaker 1: for the United States and in most of Europe. So uh, 353 00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:43,479 Speaker 1: this is a very good propaganda tool to show that 354 00:18:43,520 --> 00:18:46,480 Speaker 1: other Western nations are pulling together, exactly the opposite of 355 00:18:46,520 --> 00:18:49,159 Speaker 1: what Vladimir Putin thought he was going to achieve. And 356 00:18:49,200 --> 00:18:52,400 Speaker 1: so it's a huge strategic gain for us in a 357 00:18:52,440 --> 00:18:56,800 Speaker 1: horrible strategic loss for putin a wise move, Jennie, it is, 358 00:18:56,880 --> 00:18:58,720 Speaker 1: and hopefully they get Turkey in or had gone to 359 00:18:58,720 --> 00:19:02,159 Speaker 1: go along with it, because that's right now. That is 360 00:19:02,200 --> 00:19:04,800 Speaker 1: a question. As we spend time with Rick and Genie 361 00:19:04,920 --> 00:19:07,120 Speaker 1: today on sound On, they'll be back in a bit 362 00:19:07,560 --> 00:19:09,480 Speaker 1: with us for the hour. As we turned to the 363 00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:13,639 Speaker 1: baby formula crisis, Abbott f d A formula deal stirs 364 00:19:13,680 --> 00:19:16,560 Speaker 1: Democrats are they were upset today and we have it 365 00:19:16,640 --> 00:19:20,720 Speaker 1: next on sound On. This is Bloomberg filling over baby formula. 366 00:19:21,440 --> 00:19:24,600 Speaker 1: The FDH chair answering questions on Capitol Hill today about 367 00:19:24,600 --> 00:19:26,879 Speaker 1: the shortage. We're gonna talk about it next with Congresswoman 368 00:19:26,920 --> 00:19:31,240 Speaker 1: Abigail Spanburger, Democrat from Virginia, has been urging the administration 369 00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:33,639 Speaker 1: to act. Will get her take next with an eye 370 00:19:33,640 --> 00:19:36,520 Speaker 1: on Capitol Hill once again, not for Ukraine this time, 371 00:19:36,520 --> 00:19:42,000 Speaker 1: but the baby formula shortage, which House Appropriations Committee Chair 372 00:19:42,119 --> 00:19:45,080 Speaker 1: Rosa de Lauro, the Democrat from Connecticut, calls a crisis. 373 00:19:45,960 --> 00:19:49,919 Speaker 1: He wants to know why it took so long and 374 00:19:49,960 --> 00:19:52,560 Speaker 1: why the f d A entered an agreement that will 375 00:19:52,560 --> 00:19:56,720 Speaker 1: allow production to resume at the Abbot Labs plant in Sturgis, Michigan. 376 00:19:57,440 --> 00:20:02,040 Speaker 1: As Abbott deals with the fallout from four babies becoming sick, 377 00:20:03,119 --> 00:20:07,399 Speaker 1: we're given infant formula. In recent months, there were two fatalities. 378 00:20:07,880 --> 00:20:10,400 Speaker 1: The Laura concerned the agency, the f d A has 379 00:20:10,480 --> 00:20:15,440 Speaker 1: not dealt with the whistleblowers claims. Seriously. Remember looked at 380 00:20:15,440 --> 00:20:19,159 Speaker 1: that report, felt that there was no need to respond 381 00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:23,680 Speaker 1: at all from October to February until there was a record. 382 00:20:23,920 --> 00:20:27,640 Speaker 1: That is a dereliction of duty in my view. And 383 00:20:27,760 --> 00:20:30,960 Speaker 1: in addition to which you have the person who was 384 00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:33,920 Speaker 1: the acting commissioner should have done that. Now it would 385 00:20:33,920 --> 00:20:37,640 Speaker 1: appear that that person is going to oversee this effort. 386 00:20:37,920 --> 00:20:41,560 Speaker 1: That is the fox in the henhouse. We're joined for 387 00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:45,160 Speaker 1: more on this by Congresswoman Abigail Spanburger, Democrat from Virginia, who, 388 00:20:45,160 --> 00:20:47,760 Speaker 1: as I mentioned, has been urging the administration to act 389 00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:50,679 Speaker 1: in as out with legislation of her own. Congresswoman, welcome 390 00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:53,360 Speaker 1: back to Bloomberg. Thank you for having me. I could 391 00:20:53,400 --> 00:20:55,320 Speaker 1: not help but to notice the President's chief of staff 392 00:20:55,359 --> 00:20:57,760 Speaker 1: retweeted you last night a tweet that you posted with 393 00:20:57,800 --> 00:21:01,600 Speaker 1: a red siren referring to the administration's decisions to invoke 394 00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:04,800 Speaker 1: the Defense Production Act. You write quote, I've been pressing 395 00:21:04,840 --> 00:21:06,879 Speaker 1: the Chief of Staff and the President to take this step, 396 00:21:06,880 --> 00:21:09,720 Speaker 1: and I'm glad they're listening. Why Congresswoman, did the White 397 00:21:09,720 --> 00:21:13,439 Speaker 1: House wait until they heard from lawmakers like you? Well, 398 00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:16,240 Speaker 1: in my conversations with the White House Chief of Staff 399 00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:19,840 Speaker 1: UM last week, UM, we were going back and forth 400 00:21:19,880 --> 00:21:23,960 Speaker 1: about how the circumstances of actually putting the Defense Production 401 00:21:24,000 --> 00:21:27,879 Speaker 1: Act into place, how that would be instituted, what the 402 00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:31,440 Speaker 1: would be the results, and how to go about moving 403 00:21:31,480 --> 00:21:34,120 Speaker 1: forward on that. So I've been pressing them since last 404 00:21:34,119 --> 00:21:38,200 Speaker 1: week to do this UM aggressively, I suppose I am 405 00:21:38,359 --> 00:21:39,800 Speaker 1: known to be a bit of a squeaky wheel on 406 00:21:39,840 --> 00:21:43,160 Speaker 1: Capitol Hill, UM aggressively to take this action, and also 407 00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:46,840 Speaker 1: recognizing that the result of invoking the Defense Production Act 408 00:21:46,920 --> 00:21:49,800 Speaker 1: wouldn't be immediate immediate, that in the interim it would 409 00:21:49,800 --> 00:21:52,720 Speaker 1: be important to get baby formula on the shelves, and 410 00:21:52,840 --> 00:21:55,240 Speaker 1: to do so by bringing it in from other countries. Certainly, 411 00:21:55,240 --> 00:21:57,679 Speaker 1: as a mother of three girls, UH and I relied 412 00:21:57,720 --> 00:22:01,280 Speaker 1: on on baby formula throughout their infant see and including 413 00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:04,600 Speaker 1: when I lived overseas where my middle daughter was born uh. 414 00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:07,080 Speaker 1: Knowing that foreign formula can meet all of our same 415 00:22:07,119 --> 00:22:09,720 Speaker 1: standards and be on Shell's fast is something that I 416 00:22:09,840 --> 00:22:11,919 Speaker 1: urged the White House to take action on. A lot 417 00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:14,840 Speaker 1: of people are, of course, asking what took so long, 418 00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:18,320 Speaker 1: and your colleague, Representative Rosa Deloro, today, in a hearing 419 00:22:18,359 --> 00:22:21,360 Speaker 1: with the FDA, share called this a dereliction of duty 420 00:22:21,520 --> 00:22:23,040 Speaker 1: on the part of the f d A and that 421 00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:27,160 Speaker 1: Abbott Labs was not being honest about the problems at 422 00:22:27,200 --> 00:22:29,560 Speaker 1: its facility. Here's what she said, quickly. I'd love to 423 00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:32,840 Speaker 1: have you respond. If the allegations are true, the company 424 00:22:32,880 --> 00:22:36,840 Speaker 1: has lied, cut corners, falsified records to cover up their 425 00:22:36,920 --> 00:22:41,159 Speaker 1: misdoings at the risk of instant health, and retaliated against 426 00:22:41,240 --> 00:22:45,240 Speaker 1: employees who tried to correct the problems they were seen. Congresswoman, 427 00:22:45,240 --> 00:22:47,879 Speaker 1: should the FDA allow that Abbot plan to reopen without 428 00:22:47,880 --> 00:22:51,760 Speaker 1: further investigation? Well, I think there should be absolutely further 429 00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:55,400 Speaker 1: investigation into what happened, how it happened, when it happened, 430 00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:58,240 Speaker 1: when people had any idea that we were on the 431 00:22:58,320 --> 00:23:02,040 Speaker 1: trajectory towards the shortage um. But as to whether or 432 00:23:02,040 --> 00:23:05,280 Speaker 1: not that particular plant should be stopped from opening, I 433 00:23:05,280 --> 00:23:10,199 Speaker 1: mean it's about safely having the capacity of production to 434 00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:12,560 Speaker 1: put baby formula on the shelves in the quantity that 435 00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:16,480 Speaker 1: we needed nationwide. UM. I have a piece of legislation 436 00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:20,200 Speaker 1: that I'm working on with Dusty Johnson, Republican from South Dakota, 437 00:23:20,320 --> 00:23:23,879 Speaker 1: focused on ensuring that legally there is a requirement on 438 00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:28,160 Speaker 1: the shoulders of baby formula manufacturers that when it looks 439 00:23:28,200 --> 00:23:30,240 Speaker 1: like there might be a potential for a shortage, that 440 00:23:30,280 --> 00:23:33,720 Speaker 1: they have the requirement to report that to the f 441 00:23:33,840 --> 00:23:36,919 Speaker 1: d A so that there's no guessing, there's no questions 442 00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:38,560 Speaker 1: about what that looks like. And we're going to be 443 00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:42,520 Speaker 1: introducing that legislation should be tomorrow UM, so that there's 444 00:23:42,520 --> 00:23:45,359 Speaker 1: a legal requirement that they know their business best and 445 00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:47,679 Speaker 1: when they are on paths towards the potential shortage like 446 00:23:47,720 --> 00:23:49,800 Speaker 1: this not being able to meet the demands of their 447 00:23:49,880 --> 00:23:53,080 Speaker 1: their purchasers and and ultimately the consumers who rely on 448 00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:55,800 Speaker 1: that baby formula to keep their kids fed, that they 449 00:23:55,840 --> 00:23:58,320 Speaker 1: are raising the alarm bills and the red flags as 450 00:23:58,320 --> 00:24:01,160 Speaker 1: early as possible. The Commissioner says the FDA has reached 451 00:24:01,160 --> 00:24:05,840 Speaker 1: a deal with manufacturers to resume production while streamlining regulations 452 00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:09,280 Speaker 1: that will allow apparently additional companies to sell baby formula. 453 00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:12,000 Speaker 1: We need, we need more to do this. Should we 454 00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:16,360 Speaker 1: trust the FDA in streamlining regulations after what's already happened. Well, 455 00:24:16,359 --> 00:24:17,919 Speaker 1: so I think it's it's important to look at what 456 00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:21,240 Speaker 1: the what the regulations are. So there's regulations related to 457 00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:24,000 Speaker 1: for example, WICK, which is a program that that some 458 00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:26,480 Speaker 1: families rely on to be able to purchase baby formula 459 00:24:27,160 --> 00:24:31,680 Speaker 1: for their families, but that currently has allowed for formula 460 00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:35,080 Speaker 1: manufacturers to have unique contracts state to state, So basically 461 00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:38,080 Speaker 1: in in trining some what what some may consider anti 462 00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:42,480 Speaker 1: competitive behavior state to state and further reducing competition within 463 00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:45,399 Speaker 1: the marketplace. Of course, we only have just a few 464 00:24:45,480 --> 00:24:49,920 Speaker 1: baby formula manufacturers across the country, which means when there 465 00:24:50,119 --> 00:24:53,960 Speaker 1: is such a crisis as what we've seen with the 466 00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:58,280 Speaker 1: Abbott production plants, that it can throttle our nation's ability. 467 00:24:58,520 --> 00:25:01,240 Speaker 1: I guess the the overriding question, and here, Congresswoman, is 468 00:25:01,240 --> 00:25:03,119 Speaker 1: the is the FDA the weak link? Here? Is it 469 00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:05,760 Speaker 1: the agency's fault that it got this far? They could 470 00:25:05,800 --> 00:25:08,960 Speaker 1: have acted months ago? I mean, I think right right now, 471 00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:12,160 Speaker 1: and certainly I'm not defending the FDA in any way, 472 00:25:12,240 --> 00:25:14,800 Speaker 1: but I think right now the blame needs to be 473 00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:19,560 Speaker 1: squarely with Abbott. Uh. They are the producer of baby formula. 474 00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:21,920 Speaker 1: They have been in this industry for years upon years 475 00:25:22,000 --> 00:25:24,560 Speaker 1: upon years. UH. They are the ones that saw their 476 00:25:24,560 --> 00:25:27,560 Speaker 1: production levels declining. They are the ones that, because of 477 00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:31,400 Speaker 1: the death of two infants, UM ultimately had to shut 478 00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:35,159 Speaker 1: down a factory. And so, yes, I want to have oversight. 479 00:25:35,240 --> 00:25:38,160 Speaker 1: I want to ensure that the FDA is doing everything 480 00:25:38,200 --> 00:25:40,800 Speaker 1: necessary and possible to ensure the health and safety of 481 00:25:40,800 --> 00:25:45,160 Speaker 1: the American public, as is their mandate. But ultimately, UH, 482 00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:49,120 Speaker 1: Abbott was should have been well aware of the trajectory 483 00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:51,720 Speaker 1: that we were on and their potential and ability to 484 00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:54,280 Speaker 1: meet market demand. Well for to believe the whistleblower report, 485 00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:57,320 Speaker 1: Abbott did know. And you know what, people have very 486 00:25:57,320 --> 00:25:59,840 Speaker 1: basic questions, and you understand this as a parent. They 487 00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:01,560 Speaker 1: it back like, I don't know what's going on here. 488 00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:04,280 Speaker 1: I just can't get baby formula. Where's the White House 489 00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:05,760 Speaker 1: on this? You know, we've been through a number of 490 00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:07,840 Speaker 1: different shortages. What would you tell people who want to 491 00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:12,640 Speaker 1: blame President Biden? I would say, as a as a parent, UM, 492 00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:17,560 Speaker 1: I absolutely understand people's frustration. As an American, I am 493 00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:21,440 Speaker 1: just tired of the continued challenges that we faced supply 494 00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:25,520 Speaker 1: chain related uh, and it it feels uh and I 495 00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:28,159 Speaker 1: understand this. It feels like it is one thing after another. 496 00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:31,120 Speaker 1: I'm a former CIA officer. I always do it after 497 00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:34,280 Speaker 1: action report. You should always understand a problem, how something occurred. 498 00:26:34,440 --> 00:26:36,720 Speaker 1: You know what could have been done differently or better. 499 00:26:37,280 --> 00:26:40,760 Speaker 1: But the reality is in this moment um and moving forward. Yeah, 500 00:26:40,800 --> 00:26:43,720 Speaker 1: we want to understand the disruptions within our supply chain, 501 00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:47,120 Speaker 1: be at meat, be it gas, be it uh baby formula. 502 00:26:47,160 --> 00:26:49,480 Speaker 1: But these issues shouldn't be part of the punching bags. 503 00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:51,919 Speaker 1: And I think every American should be asking themselves, like 504 00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:56,240 Speaker 1: which legislators are actually trying to fix these problems and 505 00:26:56,280 --> 00:26:59,159 Speaker 1: trying to address them head on the view from Virginia's 506 00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:02,879 Speaker 1: seventh Congress Final Districts Representative Abigail Spanburger. Thanks for your 507 00:27:02,880 --> 00:27:05,960 Speaker 1: insights today on Bloomberg. Thanks for having me appreciate it. 508 00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:08,040 Speaker 1: We hand this one to the panel. Next. Rick and 509 00:27:08,119 --> 00:27:11,360 Speaker 1: Genie's take on the baby formula shortage. What's the next 510 00:27:11,400 --> 00:27:14,760 Speaker 1: shortage after this one? I'm Joe Matthew. This is Bloomberg. 511 00:27:17,560 --> 00:27:24,200 Speaker 1: You're listening to Bloomberg sound On on Bloomberg Radio. Headline 512 00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:27,880 Speaker 1: on the terminal. House passes f d A baby formula bill, 513 00:27:27,960 --> 00:27:30,840 Speaker 1: but Senate fate uncertain. We've talked about this a couple 514 00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:33,800 Speaker 1: of times this hour, but the House did pass twenty 515 00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:36,439 Speaker 1: eight million dollars in emergency funding for the FDA. They 516 00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:40,400 Speaker 1: say it the dress the shortage of infant formula. House 517 00:27:40,400 --> 00:27:43,640 Speaker 1: Speaker Nancy Pelosi spoke about it today at her weekly 518 00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:46,600 Speaker 1: briefing Back to the Kitchen Table for the Babies, for 519 00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:50,680 Speaker 1: the Children. We were pleased yesterday that we were able 520 00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:54,640 Speaker 1: to pass two bills that address the baby formula shortage. 521 00:27:55,880 --> 00:27:59,479 Speaker 1: Republicans not interested. The House bill, opposed by Republicans who 522 00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:01,679 Speaker 1: says that a first a blank check to the f 523 00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:03,719 Speaker 1: d A, as I read on the terminal without securing 524 00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:07,280 Speaker 1: an immediate boost in formula supply, looks like it does 525 00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:10,760 Speaker 1: not have enough support in the Senate to pass, and 526 00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:13,640 Speaker 1: so we're likely left with what the administration has already 527 00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:16,720 Speaker 1: done here, of course, invoking the Defense Production Act to 528 00:28:16,760 --> 00:28:20,800 Speaker 1: step up production of baby formula. We reassemble the panel 529 00:28:20,920 --> 00:28:25,520 Speaker 1: in the midst of the shortage now crisis with Rick Davis, 530 00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:29,159 Speaker 1: Jeanie Schanzano Bloomberg Politics contributors. Rick We've gotten to this 531 00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:31,360 Speaker 1: a couple of times on the program. Now this has 532 00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:34,560 Speaker 1: become a screaming headline. President Biden says it is his 533 00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:38,080 Speaker 1: top priority right now. Speaker Pelosi likes to say, the 534 00:28:38,120 --> 00:28:41,120 Speaker 1: baby is crying now, but are any of these gonna 535 00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:44,239 Speaker 1: help now? Well, it's kind of like putting Genie back 536 00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:46,280 Speaker 1: in the bottle. Uh. This has been going on for 537 00:28:46,360 --> 00:28:49,960 Speaker 1: quite some time. The public has already felt the pain 538 00:28:50,120 --> 00:28:54,520 Speaker 1: of not being able to access a commodity that's critical 539 00:28:54,560 --> 00:28:58,040 Speaker 1: to families all over the country. And why it has 540 00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:01,120 Speaker 1: taken this long for the administration react, And you could 541 00:29:01,160 --> 00:29:05,280 Speaker 1: argue almost overreact. Right now, we're using military assets to 542 00:29:05,360 --> 00:29:07,959 Speaker 1: fly baby formula and from all around the world so 543 00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:10,640 Speaker 1: that we can restock the shelves. But where was this 544 00:29:10,720 --> 00:29:13,960 Speaker 1: administration when this was already emerging. I mean, it was 545 00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:17,040 Speaker 1: sort of blind and the FDA was out there, you know, 546 00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:21,640 Speaker 1: basically making it harder to produce a supply um with 547 00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:25,680 Speaker 1: Abbott Labs betting, getting Abbot facility getting shut down, and 548 00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:27,600 Speaker 1: and and with no plan to reopen it. Now all 549 00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:30,120 Speaker 1: of a sudden, there's a plan to reopen it. So 550 00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:33,520 Speaker 1: you know, it's it's honestly, it's it's reminiscent of the 551 00:29:33,640 --> 00:29:37,480 Speaker 1: energy problem where we were short on supply, prices started 552 00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:40,360 Speaker 1: going up, and then you know, once again the administration 553 00:29:40,400 --> 00:29:42,040 Speaker 1: tries to put their finger in the dike and and 554 00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:44,240 Speaker 1: keep it all together. But it's all after the fact. 555 00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:47,040 Speaker 1: Well that's just it's a genie that this could have 556 00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:50,080 Speaker 1: been handled months ago. Should the FDA not be faulted 557 00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:52,480 Speaker 1: for this or this something we're just gonna all blame 558 00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:55,840 Speaker 1: Abott Labs for, you know, it should have been handled 559 00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:58,400 Speaker 1: months ago. But we also need to step back and 560 00:29:58,480 --> 00:30:01,320 Speaker 1: say that this has very little to do with the 561 00:30:01,320 --> 00:30:05,640 Speaker 1: Biden administration. We need to recognize this is a government 562 00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:09,000 Speaker 1: created problem. Explain why though, because people want to blame 563 00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:11,400 Speaker 1: the Biden ministry, Well, because they happen to be in 564 00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:14,400 Speaker 1: control of the government right now, and I am critical 565 00:30:14,520 --> 00:30:16,360 Speaker 1: of the speed at which they've done this. And of 566 00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:18,960 Speaker 1: course the President's you know, operation what did he call 567 00:30:19,200 --> 00:30:22,360 Speaker 1: Operation fly formula and the you know, Defense Production Act 568 00:30:22,600 --> 00:30:24,680 Speaker 1: that's gonna do very little to solve it. The real 569 00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:28,000 Speaker 1: problem here is number one, we have one supplier with 570 00:30:28,120 --> 00:30:31,320 Speaker 1: fort Share that gets shut down, and that is the 571 00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:34,480 Speaker 1: same supplier. Fifty of the children born in this country 572 00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:39,120 Speaker 1: fall under Wick that one supplier has contracts with forty 573 00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:42,840 Speaker 1: nine states, and then you add to that me Johnson, 574 00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:45,800 Speaker 1: which has the other fifteen. Because there's more than just states, 575 00:30:45,920 --> 00:30:50,200 Speaker 1: you have almost of the babies in the Wick program 576 00:30:50,240 --> 00:30:53,480 Speaker 1: they are being served by these two companies. So we 577 00:30:53,560 --> 00:30:57,120 Speaker 1: have a problem number one again, government created with this contracts. 578 00:30:57,160 --> 00:30:59,280 Speaker 1: Everything is then on top of that being sourced in 579 00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:01,640 Speaker 1: the US. I thought it was really interesting in your 580 00:31:01,640 --> 00:31:05,200 Speaker 1: discussion with the representative she said she had a baby overseas. 581 00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:08,760 Speaker 1: We can trust the formula there. We absolutely can, and 582 00:31:08,840 --> 00:31:11,360 Speaker 1: you can't be stopping that from coming in. You know, 583 00:31:11,400 --> 00:31:14,000 Speaker 1: the President wants to fly planes and bring formula back. 584 00:31:14,040 --> 00:31:16,840 Speaker 1: Our problem is not, you know, transport to Europe. Our 585 00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:20,200 Speaker 1: problem is is that we haven't posed these enormous you know, 586 00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:24,080 Speaker 1: boundaries and obstacles to getting formula into this country. So 587 00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:27,480 Speaker 1: this is a government imposed mess. It extends well beyond 588 00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:29,840 Speaker 1: the Biden administration. But of course they've got to solve 589 00:31:29,880 --> 00:31:32,760 Speaker 1: it now. And you know, their plan right now is 590 00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:35,760 Speaker 1: not going to do that much to address the problem 591 00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:38,840 Speaker 1: of this. Apparently not. But you know a couple of 592 00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:41,120 Speaker 1: things here, Rick. The f d A is part of 593 00:31:41,160 --> 00:31:44,320 Speaker 1: the Biden administration, and could have dealt with this months ago. Right. Also, 594 00:31:44,600 --> 00:31:47,240 Speaker 1: the FDA has not had a chair until just a 595 00:31:47,240 --> 00:31:49,440 Speaker 1: couple of weeks ago. I mean there's been an acting chair. 596 00:31:49,920 --> 00:31:52,880 Speaker 1: Uh and and all of this through COVID. It's this 597 00:31:52,880 --> 00:31:56,760 Speaker 1: This does date back through the beginnings of the year. 598 00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:58,920 Speaker 1: This goes back to last September. As we heard from 599 00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:01,840 Speaker 1: Rosa D. Lauo, is it Is it not, in your view, 600 00:32:02,040 --> 00:32:06,040 Speaker 1: the Biden administration's problem. Yeah, absolutely, the Biden administration is 601 00:32:06,040 --> 00:32:09,120 Speaker 1: on point here. They've had time to make these kinds 602 00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:11,760 Speaker 1: of changes if they had been focused on it. And 603 00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:15,040 Speaker 1: this is part of what we're seeing emerge, is this 604 00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:17,440 Speaker 1: lack of competency. You know, we talked a lot about 605 00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:21,360 Speaker 1: it last summer over a year ago. The competency issue 606 00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:24,520 Speaker 1: came up with the really haphazard withdrawal that lost lives 607 00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:28,320 Speaker 1: in Afghanistan, started to raise questions amongst the electorate. Is 608 00:32:28,360 --> 00:32:31,200 Speaker 1: this really the administration that we had hoped for? You know, 609 00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:33,800 Speaker 1: we were tired of all of the drama around Trump 610 00:32:33,800 --> 00:32:36,479 Speaker 1: and all we wanted was competency. We didn't want drama, 611 00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:39,120 Speaker 1: and now here we have drama again. And it's not 612 00:32:39,240 --> 00:32:42,360 Speaker 1: just this, it's in the housing markets. And the automobile markets. 613 00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:46,720 Speaker 1: It's in the labor markets. This administration really needs to 614 00:32:46,760 --> 00:32:49,360 Speaker 1: be able to articulate plans for how to get these 615 00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:53,760 Speaker 1: post COVID transition into this new economy, UH and not 616 00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:57,840 Speaker 1: have these levels of shortages in all these different categories. Jennie, 617 00:32:57,840 --> 00:33:01,320 Speaker 1: should we be taking formula from China? Um? You know, 618 00:33:01,440 --> 00:33:03,960 Speaker 1: if it's safe, we absolutely should be. You know, we 619 00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:08,160 Speaker 1: we it's unconscionable that the United States have has babies 620 00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:10,840 Speaker 1: that are going hungry because we can't source formula from 621 00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:15,000 Speaker 1: overseas and we have you know, basically one production that 622 00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:19,000 Speaker 1: has capacity. I mean, that's unconscionable. So if it's safe, 623 00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:22,360 Speaker 1: it absolutely should be. You know, Democrats are attempting right 624 00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:24,720 Speaker 1: now to say that, you know, they are going to 625 00:33:24,800 --> 00:33:28,000 Speaker 1: pass these bills. That's also a big source of frustration. 626 00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:30,360 Speaker 1: If a bill doesn't have sixty votes in the Senate, 627 00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:33,040 Speaker 1: no reason to pass it at this point except for 628 00:33:33,120 --> 00:33:36,440 Speaker 1: political reasons. And that's also what frustrates people in the 629 00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:39,080 Speaker 1: in the constituency and voters. There's a lot of that 630 00:33:39,120 --> 00:33:41,680 Speaker 1: going on lately. As we spend time with our panel, 631 00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:44,040 Speaker 1: Rick and Genie here on Bloomberg Sound On, I'm Joe 632 00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:47,840 Speaker 1: Matthew and Washington. I have to ask you both about 633 00:33:47,880 --> 00:33:53,280 Speaker 1: George W. Bush. You probably heard his comments from Dallas. Uh. 634 00:33:53,320 --> 00:33:56,640 Speaker 1: This was at an event on election integrity at his 635 00:33:57,040 --> 00:34:01,400 Speaker 1: presidential library, the George W. Bush Presidential Center in Dallas. 636 00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:05,800 Speaker 1: He was talking about election integrity and turning to Russia 637 00:34:06,040 --> 00:34:10,120 Speaker 1: as an example of a place where elections are rigged. 638 00:34:10,680 --> 00:34:14,920 Speaker 1: His remark about the war in Ukraine where he misstated 639 00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:18,920 Speaker 1: something turned into a joke. You might also argue it 640 00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:22,040 Speaker 1: turned into an admission. And this has a lot of 641 00:34:22,080 --> 00:34:24,680 Speaker 1: people talking and writing. Listen to what the former president, 642 00:34:24,680 --> 00:34:26,799 Speaker 1: George W. Bush said, and we'll talk about it. The 643 00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:30,840 Speaker 1: result is an absence of checks and balances in Russia 644 00:34:31,280 --> 00:34:36,040 Speaker 1: and the decision of one man to launch a wholly 645 00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:41,200 Speaker 1: unjustified and brutal invasion of Iraq, I mean of Ukraine. 646 00:34:43,000 --> 00:34:50,840 Speaker 1: Right anyway, Okay, a couple of things there. He said 647 00:34:50,880 --> 00:34:53,719 Speaker 1: seventy five of these, referring to his age. But right 648 00:34:53,719 --> 00:34:57,440 Speaker 1: before that he said Iraq too. So we had a 649 00:34:57,520 --> 00:34:59,759 Speaker 1: slip up, maybe a Freudian slip. But then was it 650 00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:04,680 Speaker 1: allowed Rick by an admission. I'm sure it's on his mind, right, 651 00:35:04,719 --> 00:35:07,800 Speaker 1: I mean, he's done a better job than any president 652 00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:11,640 Speaker 1: in memory of disappearing after his two terms of office, 653 00:35:11,719 --> 00:35:14,360 Speaker 1: and and and he was very unpopular because of the 654 00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:17,800 Speaker 1: war in Iraq. And I would say, I'm just wondering. 655 00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:20,200 Speaker 1: You have to scratch your head and say, was he 656 00:35:20,239 --> 00:35:23,080 Speaker 1: actually thinking of Dick Cheney, who I think he thinks 657 00:35:23,200 --> 00:35:27,280 Speaker 1: was the one who actually designed and executed the invasion 658 00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:30,160 Speaker 1: of Iraq? So I mean, like, it's a Freudian moment 659 00:35:30,200 --> 00:35:32,719 Speaker 1: by any stretch of the imagination. I want to just 660 00:35:32,719 --> 00:35:34,759 Speaker 1: to have everyone here it again, because not everyone is 661 00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:38,600 Speaker 1: writing up the Iraq to part. You have him correct himself. 662 00:35:38,719 --> 00:35:40,680 Speaker 1: I mean Ukraine. But listen to what he said after 663 00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:44,160 Speaker 1: that again, Genie, and brutal invasion of Iraq, I mean 664 00:35:44,160 --> 00:35:49,480 Speaker 1: of Ukraine right here anyway, Iraq too, And it got 665 00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:51,600 Speaker 1: a laugh from the crowd. Genie, what did he mean 666 00:35:51,600 --> 00:35:54,680 Speaker 1: by that? You know, it sounds like it was a 667 00:35:54,719 --> 00:35:57,839 Speaker 1: slip up, But it was a slip up that speaks volumes. 668 00:35:57,960 --> 00:36:00,520 Speaker 1: And you know, I happened to agree with Rick on 669 00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:03,719 Speaker 1: this that I think there is a chance that President 670 00:36:03,800 --> 00:36:07,239 Speaker 1: Bush feels that he was misled by Dick Cheney and 671 00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:11,120 Speaker 1: others in the administration pushed him into an invasion and 672 00:36:11,160 --> 00:36:14,080 Speaker 1: of course, this is not a laughing matter at all. 673 00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:18,040 Speaker 1: This is something that profoundly changed the trajectory of the 674 00:36:18,160 --> 00:36:20,200 Speaker 1: United States. I mean, we could just start with the 675 00:36:20,239 --> 00:36:23,240 Speaker 1: fact that this was one of the main talking points 676 00:36:23,239 --> 00:36:27,160 Speaker 1: for somebody like Donald Trump, like Barack Obama and others. 677 00:36:27,160 --> 00:36:31,080 Speaker 1: So you know, when I do wonder if he could 678 00:36:31,080 --> 00:36:34,400 Speaker 1: have been more honest and said something more profound about 679 00:36:34,840 --> 00:36:37,200 Speaker 1: how that would have been something. Yeah, and so you know, 680 00:36:37,280 --> 00:36:39,640 Speaker 1: a slip up is one thing, but it sounds like 681 00:36:39,719 --> 00:36:43,440 Speaker 1: he has real regrets and he should quite frankly, well 682 00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:46,200 Speaker 1: just imagine to your point you need this is funny 683 00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:48,920 Speaker 1: in a way, it's really not funny when you consider 684 00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:53,160 Speaker 1: parents of fallen service members hearing that. Does he need 685 00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:55,080 Speaker 1: to follow up on this? Does he need to answer 686 00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:58,720 Speaker 1: some questions? Rick, you know, I'm sure he'll be asked 687 00:36:59,120 --> 00:37:02,000 Speaker 1: quite a few, and I think he will um do 688 00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:05,160 Speaker 1: what every politician does after a sort of live Mike 689 00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:09,040 Speaker 1: moment like that, and uh and and probably just dismiss 690 00:37:09,080 --> 00:37:13,200 Speaker 1: it as a lame attempt at a humor. And so 691 00:37:13,840 --> 00:37:17,279 Speaker 1: I can't imagine anybody wants to reopen that chapter right now. 692 00:37:17,440 --> 00:37:21,400 Speaker 1: Is a painful, harsh lesson of American adventurism in a 693 00:37:21,440 --> 00:37:25,439 Speaker 1: foreign country, and I doubt if there was anything other 694 00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:28,800 Speaker 1: than h a slip up on his part and probably 695 00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:31,279 Speaker 1: somewhat of an admission. But I doubt if it will 696 00:37:31,320 --> 00:37:33,440 Speaker 1: go much beyond this. Well, for those of us who 697 00:37:33,440 --> 00:37:36,360 Speaker 1: lived through that debate, I mean, that's that's pretty seismic stuff. 698 00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:38,520 Speaker 1: It seems to me and Genie. While we're talking about 699 00:37:39,160 --> 00:37:43,040 Speaker 1: oversight here with this next forty billion we're handing over 700 00:37:43,040 --> 00:37:45,200 Speaker 1: to Ukraine, there are lessons that were learned in that 701 00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:48,120 Speaker 1: war about oversight, the use of contractors. You remember the 702 00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:50,719 Speaker 1: no bid contracts. I mean, this stuff, well, that brings 703 00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:53,480 Speaker 1: back a lot of memories. It does. And you know, 704 00:37:53,680 --> 00:37:55,960 Speaker 1: when we think about it and you're talking about the 705 00:37:56,040 --> 00:37:59,759 Speaker 1: number of people killed, both you know, military and some 706 00:38:00,000 --> 00:38:03,520 Speaker 1: billions by some accounts, we're talking two hundred thousand people, 707 00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:06,239 Speaker 1: many of them civilians, and also, of course then you 708 00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:09,320 Speaker 1: have the military depths. So this is not a laughing matter. 709 00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:11,560 Speaker 1: I doubt he's going to come out and say something, 710 00:38:11,600 --> 00:38:14,360 Speaker 1: but you don't think so. I doubt it, But he 711 00:38:14,560 --> 00:38:18,040 Speaker 1: actually should because there is a responsibility there that hasn't 712 00:38:18,040 --> 00:38:22,040 Speaker 1: been accepted. Rick and Jennie with us are sound on 713 00:38:22,160 --> 00:38:26,360 Speaker 1: signature panel, Rick Davis, Genie Chanzanol, Bloomberg Politics contributors and 714 00:38:26,440 --> 00:38:30,040 Speaker 1: always an informative and inscifle conversation. That's why you're here 715 00:38:30,120 --> 00:38:33,080 Speaker 1: on the fastest hour in politics. If you showed up late, 716 00:38:33,080 --> 00:38:36,640 Speaker 1: subscribe to the podcast sound on wherever you get your podcasts. 717 00:38:37,000 --> 00:38:37,800 Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg.