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Speaker 1: This is Alec Baldwin and you're listening to Here's the thing,

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Speaker 1: My chance to talk with artists and writers, policymakers and performers,

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Speaker 1: to hear their stories, what inspired their creations, what decisions

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Speaker 1: changed their careers, and what relationships influenced their work. Here's

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Speaker 1: the thing. Both of my guests today were successful early

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Speaker 1: in their careers. Herb Albert and the Tijuana Brass sold

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Speaker 1: over thirteen million albums in nineteen sixty six, out selling

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Speaker 1: even the Beatles. After leaving Saturday Night Live, Chris Rock

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Speaker 1: created two comedy specials, the second of which one too Emmys.

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Speaker 1: Who's more racist? Black people? Of white people? Black people?

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Speaker 1: You know what? We hate black people too. Now. Usually

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Speaker 1: when an entertainer finds success at something, it guarantees you'll

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Speaker 1: see them do that same thing over and over again.

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Speaker 1: But both Curb Albert and Chris Rock have taken their

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Speaker 1: careers well beyond they expected. Albert started what became the

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Speaker 1: largest independent music label of its time, and recently, Chris

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Speaker 1: Rock starred in his first play ever on Broadway. You

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Speaker 1: want to press if this is something beautiful, come and

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Speaker 1: stay with me and Vicky Man get on a nutritional

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Speaker 1: beverage program man, come out to rock away man. I

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Speaker 1: wanted my acting to grow, So I'm actually figuring out

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Speaker 1: how to add lib every night without saying words, how

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Speaker 1: to work eat, seeing a little different in each line,

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Speaker 1: and try to find laughs and places that I didn't find.

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Speaker 1: One a night before something, the play was The Mothercker

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Speaker 1: with the Hat. I met up with Chris in his

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Speaker 1: attic a dressing room at the Schonefeld Theater after a

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Speaker 1: Wednesday matinee. Broadway is not where you'd expect to find

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Speaker 1: Chris Rock. He sells out stay mediums. His stand up

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Speaker 1: routines are merciless. He leaves no time for recovery. Your

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Speaker 1: sides ache with laughter from both shock and recognition. Married

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Speaker 1: and bad are single and lonely. That's right, that's right.

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Speaker 1: Marriages are boring because once you get married, you gotta

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Speaker 1: hang around other married people, and that's just disgusting. You

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Speaker 1: have a gone to dinner with six newtered adults, a

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Speaker 1: bunch of women talking about diaper genies and hair coloring.

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Speaker 1: You know, if you're leaving in too long, it's staying

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Speaker 1: Shut up. God. You have obviously a huge following black

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Speaker 1: and white in your concerts, and yet when you go

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Speaker 1: out in this audience. How black is the audience? Well,

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Speaker 1: I mean put this way. In the old days, they

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Speaker 1: used to have signs up whites only, whites only. Now

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Speaker 1: they have a new thing. It's called prices. You know,

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Speaker 1: some nights is darker than other nights. I buy tickets

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Speaker 1: every night when this play is a were would spend

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Speaker 1: spent almost a whole weekly paycheck on tickets as gifts

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Speaker 1: for friends otherwise couldn't come see the show, otherwise, could

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Speaker 1: not afford to see this show. I tour and I'm

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Speaker 1: normally you know, at the garden or whatever, like sixty

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Speaker 1: thousand seats to give away what I'm normally on tour,

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Speaker 1: and people have gotten used to this. My man takes

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Speaker 1: care of us, and you know I don't. I can't

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Speaker 1: take that away from friends and family. You haven't done

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Speaker 1: a lot of theater. Correct, This is the first play

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Speaker 1: I've ever done. This is the first play you've ever done.

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Speaker 1: I didn't do a play in high school. I didn't

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Speaker 1: go to high school. So so not only your Broadway debut,

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Speaker 1: but your first play period. You're with a pretty cool

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Speaker 1: group of people, a lot of experience, you know what,

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Speaker 1: and they have held me up. No one ever got

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Speaker 1: frustrated at what I didn't know. You know, this is

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Speaker 1: a bunch of little thing that people take for gret

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Speaker 1: I have no idea. You're never supposed to walk straight

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Speaker 1: at somebody, supposed to loop. Just all these weird little things.

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Speaker 1: And my favorite is that you don't give information to

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Speaker 1: the person. So if you're standing here telling them something,

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Speaker 1: you tell it out. You sit there and go open,

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Speaker 1: open to the audience as much as all that open, open, open,

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Speaker 1: open open stuff. Yes, even today, I'm working on it.

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Speaker 1: The Chris Rock that I know from your live shows,

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Speaker 1: I don't see much of him in this show because

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Speaker 1: that Chris Rock is like marauding the stage and as

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Speaker 1: complete control over the audience. This is a different Chris

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Speaker 1: I see in the play. I'm really trying to act here,

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Speaker 1: you know. Have you enjoyed it? I'm enjoying it a lot,

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Speaker 1: A lot. A lot. Is the hardest thing I've ever

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Speaker 1: gone through in my life. I always tell people it's

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Speaker 1: like having the Empire State Building shoved up your one

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Speaker 1: brick at a time. And to learn the play. Can't

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Speaker 1: believe there's ever gonna be a day when you know

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Speaker 1: what's been the surprise about doing this for you. Honestly,

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Speaker 1: I'm surprised I'm doing it. I mean, I'm surprised that

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Speaker 1: I'm not bored with it already. Are you afraid of that?

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Speaker 1: I'm really that that's the that's the biggest fear, to

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Speaker 1: actually be stuck doing anything. Well, what I love about

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Speaker 1: this plant by the way, everybody has loved someone, and

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Speaker 1: not too far into the relationship, you say to yourself,

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Speaker 1: not only is this probably wrong, this is definitely wrong,

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Speaker 1: but you can't get out of it. How does this

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Speaker 1: play resonate with you in your personal life? I've been

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Speaker 1: every person in this place, everything, everything, and it's the

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Speaker 1: one who the other person in response to the betrayal,

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Speaker 1: the revenge, every person, every person. It's the kind of

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Speaker 1: play you can't watch without putting yourself in it. When

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Speaker 1: you write your material for stand up, how do the

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Speaker 1: people in your life react to how you fill at

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Speaker 1: them on stage? If you you know what, I'm like

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Speaker 1: a lawyer in a sense. I mean, it's it's almost

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Speaker 1: like a legal document. It's a word. It like it's

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Speaker 1: all our wives and all our you know what I mean.

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Speaker 1: It's like like if you if I gave you the transcript.

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Speaker 1: You'd be like, he hasn't talked about anybody, that's about you, baby,

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Speaker 1: It would all hold up in court, but you do.

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Speaker 1: But you never have anybody in your life. No, No,

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Speaker 1: everybody's uncomfortable. I remember I read a quote Tarantino said,

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Speaker 1: if people in your life aren't uncomfortable, you're not really writing,

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Speaker 1: you're not really hitting it. You know, somebody better be uncomfortable.

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Speaker 1: Did you grow up in a situation that was remotely

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Speaker 1: like this and then emotionally turbulent? My parents place way,

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Speaker 1: My mother cursed a lot, screamed a lot. You know

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Speaker 1: my father, my mother beat us with a curtain rock. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: well we got beatens with curtain row odds and brooms

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Speaker 1: and brushes, niers or whatever. But I mean my father,

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Speaker 1: it's weird. My father, his temper towards my mother was

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Speaker 1: always controlled well else he could lose it. Why do

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Speaker 1: you think it was he wanted to protect that? I

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Speaker 1: don't know. I mean, first of all, I mean, guys

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Speaker 1: from that era did not view women as their equals.

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Speaker 1: They did, and they were loving and blah blah blah

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Speaker 1: blah blah, but they did not view women as their equals. Therefore,

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Speaker 1: they could actually deal with the woman's emotional whatever swings

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Speaker 1: way easier than a guy in my age, because I

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Speaker 1: view a woman as my equal. So if I'm with

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Speaker 1: a woman and she starts crying, I look at her

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Speaker 1: like I'm with you when you start crying, don't go

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Speaker 1: female on me. I'm like something, I look at her life.

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Speaker 1: I would look at a guy that gets emotional. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I thought, if we were equal, then you can't play

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Speaker 1: that car. Don't play the female. So I'll just say

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Speaker 1: my father and my grandfather's both of them were really

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Speaker 1: delicate with their wives. You know, not a child, but

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Speaker 1: close to a child. That wasn't different for you. My

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Speaker 1: wife's my equal, and you know, you know any budding

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Speaker 1: of heads is because I I want I'm dealing with

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Speaker 1: you the same way I would deal with myself, where

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Speaker 1: I deal with any guy and we're both wrong. What

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Speaker 1: are gonna do when this is over? Do you know?

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Speaker 1: I'm much sure? I think I'm gonna direct a movie.

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Speaker 1: That's what I'm feeling. So this is the time in

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Speaker 1: your life when you do all the things you told

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Speaker 1: yourself you'd never do. Play on Broadway, direct a movie?

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Speaker 1: Why do you want to direct a movie? I don't know.

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Speaker 1: It's your Warren Batty face that Yeah, I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I put this away. If I can get a great

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Speaker 1: director to direct me, I'll do it. But once you yeah,

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Speaker 1: once you get to the sea list, you I still

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Speaker 1: do it yourself. That's what I say. Yeah, how picky

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Speaker 1: are you about the films you do? Because you don't

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Speaker 1: do a lot of films. Um, I don't know. I

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Speaker 1: mean I turned out a lot, but I don't have

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Speaker 1: a list of great films I've turned down. You turned down,

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Speaker 1: regardless of whether they're great or not. Do you turn

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Speaker 1: them down? Because for you, you always have the stand

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Speaker 1: up thing in your pocket and the concert thing in

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Speaker 1: your pocket. You're not in any hurry to go out

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Speaker 1: and make a living. Most movies suck man early suck. See.

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Speaker 1: I'm I'm messed up because I like to see something

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Speaker 1: I haven't seen or haven't seen with a black person.

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Speaker 1: Black people in film is still at its really at

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Speaker 1: its infant stage. And why do you think that? I

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Speaker 1: don't know? You know what, here's the thing. You know,

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Speaker 1: you hand a studio person to script, and sometimes the

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Speaker 1: studio people are good at a time when you hand

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Speaker 1: somebody as script, they pick a person in the movie

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Speaker 1: that they identify I with. So if you hand the

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Speaker 1: woman a script, if the woman's got nine lines in

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Speaker 1: the movie, the first person who gives you notes about

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Speaker 1: is the woman. And if you hand the boss the script,

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Speaker 1: he's gonna give you notes about the main character. And

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Speaker 1: if you hand his assistant the script is gonna give

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Speaker 1: you notes about some other everybody figures out who they

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Speaker 1: are in the movie. Now, when you hand somebody a

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Speaker 1: black script, they don't relate to anybody in this It's

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Speaker 1: a very good point. I'm serious, even when it's you

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Speaker 1: secutive who does relate to a black person's script. What

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Speaker 1: does that mean to you? You You struck gold happen? They

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Speaker 1: just they're making a product all of a sudden, That's

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Speaker 1: what I've experienced. And when you do that, because I mean,

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Speaker 1: there's no black studios or whatever, so you end up

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Speaker 1: you always end up with just a person trying to

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Speaker 1: make a piece of product. They might as well, they

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Speaker 1: might as well be making an iPad business. But you

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Speaker 1: seem to me, because you're so smart and so clever,

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Speaker 1: that you have as much of a white audience as

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Speaker 1: you do with black ondies, don't you think so? In

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Speaker 1: spite of the fact your stand up can be pretty

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Speaker 1: tough on white people. Yeah, but I always say my

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Speaker 1: stand ups like Chinese food and what's Chinese food? Well,

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Speaker 1: Chinese food is one of the most popular foods in

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Speaker 1: all of America, and they don't put Americans on their menus.

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Speaker 1: People really want Chinese food. They don't put friese grilled

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Speaker 1: cheese on the menu of the most popular Chinese food

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Speaker 1: of people. I'm just saying when people see people come

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Speaker 1: to Christ's restaurant, think Christmas menu. They want Christmas menue.

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Speaker 1: It's the guy that tries to cross over that gets

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Speaker 1: less white people I find. Do you think the app

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Speaker 1: to you with a black audience is how much you

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Speaker 1: have fun with white commentary? Do you think your black

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Speaker 1: audience expects you to do that when they come see you,

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Speaker 1: they expect me to do it? Yeah? What am I

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Speaker 1: trying to say? First of all, all the materials run

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Speaker 1: by run through black. It's actually it's run through black.

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Speaker 1: Actually first is run through Jews. I always work out

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Speaker 1: the material in West Palm Beach, get out of here,

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Speaker 1: I go to West Palm Bease and guess what they

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Speaker 1: show up. I play a little club so I figured,

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Speaker 1: I'm in front of these people, they're a little older.

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Speaker 1: If I can get them to laugh at this one.

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Speaker 1: I get in front of the black people, they're gonna

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Speaker 1: go zirk. And then I get in front of the

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Speaker 1: black people, make some adjustments here and there. And this

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Speaker 1: is all before I put like the garden or something

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Speaker 1: on sales. So it's these two very different groups. So

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Speaker 1: work it out in front of how I'm sixty six man,

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Speaker 1: which means and you started, and you started. I started

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Speaker 1: probably five seven years before I got on. But I

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Speaker 1: always I haven't been you know, I haven't been poor

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Speaker 1: day since I met Laura Michaels, and I never been broke.

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Speaker 1: A lot of his stuff sticks with me. What thing

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Speaker 1: he said to me is like everybody loses their first money. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: now if you're talented, you'll make some. You're sure he's

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Speaker 1: start right. He knows more about Let's take a moment

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Speaker 1: to talk about the wisdom of Laurd Michaels. He's always

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Speaker 1: there to remind you how you can lose perspective about

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Speaker 1: this business, at least in my case. He's very good.

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Speaker 1: But how much of things changed in your mind? And

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Speaker 1: not just for you, but for you specifically. But in

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Speaker 1: the business, I don't know about you. I find a

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Speaker 1: business a lot smaller, less movies, less, I mean less

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Speaker 1: stuff that relates to me, you know what, less stuff

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Speaker 1: that relates to me. I'll say that for the young people.

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Speaker 1: You know, this whole reality thing, I'm not gonna dismiss it.

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Speaker 1: You know, sound like I'm some old person talking about

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Speaker 1: rap Music's not gonna last, you know what I mean?

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Speaker 1: But do you the same time? I don't get it.

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Speaker 1: Do you think you'd make it today if you came

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Speaker 1: in today. Yeah, me and Sana, Well that's our little

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Speaker 1: tests with each other, we kinda we assessed. The stand

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Speaker 1: ups were, Yeah, you still got it. I still got it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I keep the weight off a little bit. You know.

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Speaker 1: That's what I'm trying to do. Dude, bon Jovi, doing it,

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Speaker 1: still doing it, still doing it. Man. Just look hot.

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Speaker 1: Just try to look hot to somebody. How many kids

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Speaker 1: you have done? I got to what are you worried

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Speaker 1: about raising your kids in this world? I care that

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Speaker 1: they're good with money. I don't even care for When

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Speaker 1: I say good with money, I just mean you've got

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Speaker 1: two dollars and you spend one and you put a dollar.

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Speaker 1: But I don't mean that they run Microsoft or they

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Speaker 1: flip money and buy a house. I just mean, does

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Speaker 1: that come from your childhood? Yes, it comes from my childhood.

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Speaker 1: I just mean can they handle their own That's it.

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Speaker 1: Because it's a tough hole to get out of, and

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Speaker 1: it's a weird hole for a pretty woman to get

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Speaker 1: out of, and they end up in relationships with guys

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Speaker 1: they wouldn't have relationship with. There's a great line that

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Speaker 1: Anthony Quinn has in Lawrence of Arabia where he says,

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Speaker 1: I am a river to my people, and I'm getting

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Speaker 1: a lot of that. Now. Well, here's the thing. You

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Speaker 1: can only help, Like, I got some family right now,

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Speaker 1: guy would ever losing his house whatever, I'm gonna help

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Speaker 1: him move in to wherever he's gonna move into. I'm

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Speaker 1: not buying his house because he's never gonna be able

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Speaker 1: to afford the house. So yeah, I my I'm a river.

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Speaker 1: But it's a little river. It's a little river because

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Speaker 1: when you turn down somebody and they know you have

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Speaker 1: the money, this is one thing to go. These kids

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Speaker 1: are kicking or whatever and you don't have the money.

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Speaker 1: They know you have the money. So it's almost like

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Speaker 1: a woman. It's like, I know you have vagina and

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Speaker 1: you have sex, you just don't want to have it

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Speaker 1: with me. I remember I used to do a movie

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Speaker 1: and they'd say to me in whatever way, what would

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Speaker 1: come back was, Uh, we don't have the money for that.

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Speaker 1: And what they really were saying was, we don't have

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Speaker 1: the money for that for you, For you, we don't

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Speaker 1: we have the exactly for Leo, we're gonna sell our houses. Remember,

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Speaker 1: for you, we don't have the money. And that's what

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Speaker 1: you're saying to people in your life is I don't

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Speaker 1: have the money for you. I don't have the money

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Speaker 1: for you. You're not going to be the reason I'm

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Speaker 1: doing some bad kung fu movie. I got one last

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Speaker 1: question for you. When you're home and you really want

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Speaker 1: to relax, what do you like to watch? Like? What's

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Speaker 1: entertainment to you? You know, it's probably just about any woody?

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Speaker 1: What gets me? Like? Yeah, me too, any woody? Just

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Speaker 1: about man? I mean, what is this way the average

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Speaker 1: great filmmaker great has about four good movies. What he

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Speaker 1: has about twelves like great, and then he probably has

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Speaker 1: about ten more really good finger. So that's the dream,

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Speaker 1: is to be a Woody. That is really really I

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Speaker 1: love the guy. It's not too late, and of course

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Speaker 1: it's not to us. Woody Allen is now in pre

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Speaker 1: production for his next movie. No word yet if Chris

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Speaker 1: Rock will be joining the cast. Dude, I just want

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Speaker 1: to hang on a set. I just want to like

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Speaker 1: what happens coming up. Legendary musician and record producer herb

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Speaker 1: Aubert in the sixties the Tijuana Brass We played some

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Speaker 1: college affairs in Upper California. Woody Allen opened the show

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Speaker 1: for us as a stand up comic. Hey, Chris. Eventually

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Speaker 1: everyone ends up working with Woody. So don't give up, Hope.

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Speaker 1: This is Alec Baldwin and you're listening to here's the thing.

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Speaker 1: If you were listening to the radio in nine six,

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Speaker 1: it was a true hodgepodge of what was then considered

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Speaker 1: popular music. And right up there with the Supremes and

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Speaker 1: Simon and Garf Uncle and Frank Sinatra and even the Beatles,

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Speaker 1: was this guy. Yes, that's ignature Tijuana Brass sound. Herb

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Speaker 1: Albert had no Latin roots, but wanted to recreate the

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Speaker 1: sound he'd heard at the bullfights in Tijuana when he

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Speaker 1: overdubbed his trumpet on two different tape machines. He captured it,

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Speaker 1: and he captured more than that. Whipped Cream and Other

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Speaker 1: Delights was the number one album in the country in nineteen,

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Speaker 1: remaining on the charts for three years. I started playing

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Speaker 1: when I was eight, and I was earning a living

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Speaker 1: on weekends playing. I love playing. What happened when you

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Speaker 1: were eight? Well, what had you seen or heard that

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Speaker 1: made you say I want to pick up a trumpets? Plan? Well? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I was really fortunate. In my elementary school they had

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Speaker 1: a band appreciation class and they had this table filled

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Speaker 1: with various instruments, and I was able to just pick

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Speaker 1: one up. And where were you going to school then?

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Speaker 1: Melrose Elementary School in Los Angeles. And what did your

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Speaker 1: dad do? Ladies coats and suits? Yeah, yeah, that was

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Speaker 1: he's a clothing business. He was in the clothing business.

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Speaker 1: He was a schneider. You know. My brother was a

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Speaker 1: professional drummer. My sister played the piano, mother violin, and

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Speaker 1: my dad played the mandolin by ear. So your parents

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Speaker 1: were musical, very musical. It wasn't their professional no, not

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Speaker 1: at all. What did your parents think about when you

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Speaker 1: were so devoted to music? Were they discouraging you of

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Speaker 1: doing that, or they encouraged Your dad wasn't so crazy

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Speaker 1: about it. He thought, what do you want to play

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Speaker 1: and sawdust pits the rest of your life? That was

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Speaker 1: his image of it everybody at the time. He didn't

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Speaker 1: know it, but Albert was only just beginning an extraordinary

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Speaker 1: career as a musician, eventually earning five number one hits,

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Speaker 1: eight Grammys, fourteen platinum albums, and fifteen gold However, those

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Speaker 1: achievements might be seen as a prelude to his later

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Speaker 1: career as a music producer. We've only just speak up.

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Speaker 1: In nineteen sixty two, with his friend Jerry Moss, Albert

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Speaker 1: founded what would become the world's largest independent record label,

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Speaker 1: A and M Records. They signed such artists as The Carpenters,

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Speaker 1: Cheryl Crow, Janet Jackson, and the Police. You don't have

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Speaker 1: to night those. Albert and Moss started the whole thing

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Speaker 1: with two hundred bucks and a handshake, ultimately selling A

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Speaker 1: and M to PolyGram Records in nineteen ninety for half

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Speaker 1: a billion dollars. Herb Albert is seventy eight now and

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Speaker 1: he's still as handsome as ever. But although he's always

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Speaker 1: had Matt May idol looks. He never took up acting.

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Speaker 1: Let me tell you something. When I was in high school,

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Speaker 1: I was working at a gym. This agent came up

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Speaker 1: to me and said, man, you look like he should

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Speaker 1: be in the movies. So I said, well, what can

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Speaker 1: you do for me? He set me up with the

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Speaker 1: people at Paramount. I auditioned. They said I was a

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Speaker 1: little green, so I started taking lessons. I studied with

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Speaker 1: Jeff Corey and also Leonard Nimoy, and I realized I

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Speaker 1: didn't have it. I'm passionate about playing the horn. What's

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Speaker 1: the music scene like in Los Angeles? Then? For a

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Speaker 1: young guy who wants to play, well, it was quite different.

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Speaker 1: It was Shah Boom, Shah boom, sixty minute Man, and

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Speaker 1: those type of songs that were kind of popular at

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Speaker 1: the time. I had a great experience, though. I was

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Speaker 1: partners with Lou Adler at the time. How did you

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Speaker 1: become partners with him? Well, he was dating my ex wife.

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Speaker 1: Oh Hollywood, yeah, I forgot. We're talking about l A.

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Speaker 1: Lou was writing poetry and I started writing some some

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Speaker 1: you know, music to his poetry. And he's kind of

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Speaker 1: a knock on every door type of guy and I'm

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Speaker 1: on the shy one. So we got this job at

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Speaker 1: Keen Records in Los Angeles and started working for Bumps Blackwell,

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Speaker 1: who was the producer for Sam Cook and Lou and

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Speaker 1: I became really close friends with Sam Cooke. We wrote

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Speaker 1: Wonderful World together with him. He was really special. He

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Speaker 1: had something very unusual. He's very unpretentious guy, but very elegant.

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Speaker 1: What did he teach you? Sam had this number one

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Speaker 1: records you sent me and his follow up was I

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Speaker 1: love you for sentimental reasons. And so the owner of

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Speaker 1: this company that I was working for was like an

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Speaker 1: amateur piano player. So Sam was recording, goes into the

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Speaker 1: control room and starts listening to a playback. I was

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Speaker 1: there with this owner, and the owner walks up to

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Speaker 1: Sam and says, Sam, you know, in bar twelve you

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Speaker 1: can put in a whoa, whoa, and in bar thirty

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Speaker 1: five you can put in another who You know. He

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Speaker 1: had the sheet music, and Sam looked at the guy

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Speaker 1: and says, it's Jack, just put in a man. You

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Speaker 1: gotta feel it. Yeah, he says, man, you're listening to

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Speaker 1: a cold piece of wax, and it either makes it

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Speaker 1: or it, don't you know? He broke it right down

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Speaker 1: to the nab. For me, what's interesting about your career

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Speaker 1: is not just virtuosic musicianship, and you go on to

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Speaker 1: become a very serious and like incredibly successful producer. Did

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Speaker 1: you feel when you met those people did you have

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Speaker 1: that skill as well? Oh? No, I didn't have any skills.

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Speaker 1: Didn't no in producing wise, I didn't even think about it.

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Speaker 1: I had an experience at a place, uh called the

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Speaker 1: Annex in Los Angeles, a recording studio, and I was

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Speaker 1: watching a reasonably famous producer producer record. So the musicians rehearsing.

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Speaker 1: Plas Johnson was a saxophone player. He was a saxophone

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Speaker 1: player that played on the Pink Panther. Yeah, they rehearsed.

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Speaker 1: Plas played this incredible solo. Producer gets on the horn

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Speaker 1: and said, okay, Plass, beautiful, just play the same thing again.

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Speaker 1: Plus what do you mean? He said, just play that

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Speaker 1: solo again. I love that. He says, did you record it?

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Speaker 1: He says no, But you know what, you know what

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Speaker 1: you did? Just play it again? I said, well I

408
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Speaker 1: can do this. This is always be rolling. Oh well,

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Speaker 1: I always do that. No. Great success for you with

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Speaker 1: Tawana Brass and great success for you recording albums, And

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Speaker 1: when does producing become something, if ever, that was as

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Speaker 1: important to you. I mean A and M is not

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Speaker 1: some mom and pop shop. You and Moss set up

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Speaker 1: a huge company that you sold to PolyGram for an

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Speaker 1: enormous amount of money. Becauld you strike me as a

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Speaker 1: guy that's as a real artist. You're painting and you're sculpting,

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Speaker 1: and you're playing music. When when does it start to

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Speaker 1: really take over the business side and A and M? Well,

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Speaker 1: you let Jerry do that well exactly. And I surround

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Speaker 1: myself with really quality people that people that can do

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Speaker 1: things that I can't. And I'm a right brain guy,

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Speaker 1: you know, I'm on the right side of my brain.

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Speaker 1: So businesses, uh, was always a little funny for me.

424
00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:15,399
Speaker 1: You know. Jerry and I always discussed the big broad

425
00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:19,160
Speaker 1: stroke of n M, but you know, the little incidental

426
00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:22,120
Speaker 1: things that happened on daily basis. I wasn't interested in

427
00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:24,919
Speaker 1: front of the house, back of the house. Yeah, exactly

428
00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:27,399
Speaker 1: what was it about Jerry that you think it lasted

429
00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:29,240
Speaker 1: so long? It was so successful. He's just a really

430
00:26:29,240 --> 00:26:31,840
Speaker 1: good guy. He's an honest he has a lot of integrity,

431
00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:34,880
Speaker 1: he doesn't lie It sounds strange, but we never had

432
00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:37,720
Speaker 1: a contract. Jerry and I had a n M on

433
00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:40,399
Speaker 1: a handshake and the only time we ever signed a

434
00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:44,879
Speaker 1: contract was when we sold to PolyGram. Now, during that

435
00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:49,320
Speaker 1: period when you're producing, I know nothing about how records

436
00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:54,040
Speaker 1: are made, which must be just completely unrecognizable now from

437
00:26:54,040 --> 00:26:58,320
Speaker 1: what it was back in technically completely I did an

438
00:26:58,359 --> 00:27:04,400
Speaker 1: album called Whip We Ripped, we whipped, you know, re whipped. Yeah,

439
00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:06,680
Speaker 1: thank you very much, I'm your pr man. Thank you.

440
00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:10,119
Speaker 1: The guy who got the concept for this album. You know,

441
00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:14,399
Speaker 1: got a bunch of young producers together to redo the

442
00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:19,159
Speaker 1: Whip prim and Other Delights album. So they sent me

443
00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:23,600
Speaker 1: music files on a c D or on a DVD

444
00:27:24,320 --> 00:27:27,239
Speaker 1: or through the net. I would put my trumpet on,

445
00:27:27,520 --> 00:27:31,080
Speaker 1: put the trumpet on a CD because it's all time coded,

446
00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:33,800
Speaker 1: send the c D back to them. They would slip

447
00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:36,480
Speaker 1: it right into their master recordings. And I never met

448
00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:39,840
Speaker 1: these guys. I spoke to one, but ultimate Internet dating.

449
00:27:40,040 --> 00:27:42,720
Speaker 1: These guys could have been in Afghanistan and it wasn't

450
00:27:42,880 --> 00:27:46,640
Speaker 1: worked the same way. My first recorder was a wire recorder.

451
00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:50,960
Speaker 1: I had a Whip Corps wire recorders. If you wanted to,

452
00:27:51,119 --> 00:27:54,840
Speaker 1: you know, inter cut somethings. You need a soldering irony.

453
00:27:55,960 --> 00:27:59,159
Speaker 1: Do you feel that all this technology and all of

454
00:27:59,880 --> 00:28:02,920
Speaker 1: the power that comes with that, has it made people lazy,

455
00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:04,520
Speaker 1: Like people can't get in a room and they just

456
00:28:04,560 --> 00:28:06,399
Speaker 1: can't play a song a little way through anymore. I don'

457
00:28:06,440 --> 00:28:08,159
Speaker 1: think it makes them lazy. I think it gives them

458
00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:12,119
Speaker 1: too many options. I think it takes some of the hardaway.

459
00:28:12,320 --> 00:28:15,520
Speaker 1: I mean, I also wonder people say, what's the difference

460
00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:19,160
Speaker 1: between you know, theater and film and more and more

461
00:28:19,560 --> 00:28:24,720
Speaker 1: the technical cost of these highly technical fields, whether it's filmmaking, television,

462
00:28:24,920 --> 00:28:29,480
Speaker 1: recorded music. It's expensive, and so they want everybody. It's

463
00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:31,240
Speaker 1: almost to the point now where they don't care how

464
00:28:31,320 --> 00:28:34,720
Speaker 1: you feel about the experience, because I'll stand there and

465
00:28:34,720 --> 00:28:36,240
Speaker 1: I'll say, well, I want to do another take, man,

466
00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:38,360
Speaker 1: and I want to feel it, you know, I want

467
00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:41,600
Speaker 1: to do this whole speech on page two all the

468
00:28:41,600 --> 00:28:43,200
Speaker 1: way to the bottom of page four. It's like a

469
00:28:43,280 --> 00:28:45,280
Speaker 1: ski run. I want to ski that hill all the

470
00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:48,360
Speaker 1: way to the bottom without falling. And everybody looks goes,

471
00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:51,160
Speaker 1: we don't have time for that, man, we gotta get

472
00:28:51,160 --> 00:28:53,440
Speaker 1: out of here. That's the way the music businesses now.

473
00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:55,720
Speaker 1: No I don't think so. I mean it depends on

474
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:58,680
Speaker 1: you know what artists you're talking about. Who's someone that

475
00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:01,640
Speaker 1: you recorded. You sat there and you were like, wow, man,

476
00:29:01,680 --> 00:29:03,240
Speaker 1: this is really a thrill for me as an artist

477
00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:05,480
Speaker 1: to watch this man or woman. Well, there are a

478
00:29:05,480 --> 00:29:08,920
Speaker 1: lot of incredible artist name a couple that you dug

479
00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:12,920
Speaker 1: with the most cast. Stevens was unusually special. Now I've

480
00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 1: been happy, lazy, thinking about the good things to come,

481
00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:24,640
Speaker 1: and believes it could be something good had begun, gotta

482
00:29:24,800 --> 00:29:28,200
Speaker 1: something magical. You guys signed him? Oh yeah, But I

483
00:29:28,240 --> 00:29:30,640
Speaker 1: mean he was so passionate and so you know, the

484
00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:33,960
Speaker 1: lyrics and so unusual. He had his own interpretation of

485
00:29:34,000 --> 00:29:36,120
Speaker 1: all these songs that it was. He was beautiful. I

486
00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:39,440
Speaker 1: remember those records, and of course you know the police,

487
00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:43,520
Speaker 1: Sting just writes a great song. And when we saw them,

488
00:29:43,560 --> 00:29:46,080
Speaker 1: you know, Sting was bouncing around the stage like he

489
00:29:46,160 --> 00:30:01,120
Speaker 1: was on a pogo stick. Yeah, they were great to watch.

490
00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:04,320
Speaker 1: And of course I had an unusual experience with the carpenters.

491
00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:10,720
Speaker 1: I signed the carpenters, and um on my iPod, I

492
00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:14,880
Speaker 1: have the carpenters, I have Sting, and then I have

493
00:30:15,080 --> 00:30:18,760
Speaker 1: a home. On a second I have Cat Stevens on

494
00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:22,680
Speaker 1: my iPhone. You got a lot of my money, man. Well,

495
00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:26,600
Speaker 1: you know, in nineteen sixty this is an interesting story

496
00:30:26,640 --> 00:30:30,840
Speaker 1: if you want to hear this. Joy. In nineteen sixty

497
00:30:31,120 --> 00:30:35,600
Speaker 1: uh six seven, I was doing a special for NBC.

498
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:39,160
Speaker 1: Jack Hayley Jr. Was directing. He said, why don't you

499
00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:43,040
Speaker 1: sing a song? I said, well, if if I can

500
00:30:43,040 --> 00:30:44,959
Speaker 1: find the right song, I'll give it a go. So,

501
00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:46,720
Speaker 1: you know, I go through my barrolla decks and I

502
00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:49,880
Speaker 1: called Bert backrack. I said, Bert, is there a song

503
00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:53,120
Speaker 1: that you have that do you think I could handle that?

504
00:30:53,280 --> 00:30:55,240
Speaker 1: You have tucked away in your drawer someplace where you

505
00:30:55,280 --> 00:30:58,920
Speaker 1: find yourself whistling in the morning, or you know a

506
00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:01,720
Speaker 1: tune that haunts you. Well. Three days later he sent

507
00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:07,440
Speaker 1: me this girl's in love with you? You see this guy?

508
00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:21,200
Speaker 1: This guy love with you? Yes? Uh love? Who looks

509
00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:28,160
Speaker 1: at you the way? When I watched the video this morning,

510
00:31:28,640 --> 00:31:33,240
Speaker 1: what have you singing the song? When he saw my

511
00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:38,960
Speaker 1: ex wife? Then that's your ex wife. Cute? Yeah, I

512
00:31:39,080 --> 00:31:41,680
Speaker 1: record the song. I go to I fly to New York.

513
00:31:41,760 --> 00:31:45,440
Speaker 1: So how David hell, David would change you know, the

514
00:31:45,760 --> 00:31:49,280
Speaker 1: lyric to suit me? As I'm marking out of Hall's door.

515
00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:50,840
Speaker 1: I said, how is there a song that do you

516
00:31:50,840 --> 00:31:53,520
Speaker 1: think I might be able to handle? Or the song

517
00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:55,000
Speaker 1: that you have talked away in the door In the

518
00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:58,360
Speaker 1: same yarn I gave Bert. Two days later, he sent

519
00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:01,320
Speaker 1: me close to You. I recorded it in the studio.

520
00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:04,320
Speaker 1: I'm listening to the playback and my engineer friend Larry

521
00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:07,200
Speaker 1: Levine rested so looked at me, says, man, you sound

522
00:32:07,320 --> 00:32:10,960
Speaker 1: terrible singing this. I don't forget it. I lost my confidence.

523
00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:13,320
Speaker 1: I put that thing in the drawer. When I signed

524
00:32:13,320 --> 00:32:18,840
Speaker 1: the Carpenters in nine, they had an album that didn't sell.

525
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:23,480
Speaker 1: I mean, the first album was zero and people have

526
00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:28,240
Speaker 1: described the first album to rely on Richard Carpenter. No, no,

527
00:32:28,400 --> 00:32:30,680
Speaker 1: it has had Karen. But it was very soft. It

528
00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:34,280
Speaker 1: was very delicate and very it wasn't really radio friendly.

529
00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:41,480
Speaker 1: Uh So a year later I gave him close to You.

530
00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:44,680
Speaker 1: They recorded it and it was really light. Again. I

531
00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:47,240
Speaker 1: said this, we need we need a little bit more

532
00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:49,760
Speaker 1: energy on this one. Because because Karen thought she was

533
00:32:49,800 --> 00:32:51,760
Speaker 1: a drummer, I mean she and she played drums and

534
00:32:51,800 --> 00:32:54,640
Speaker 1: she was good, but she wanted to record. And when

535
00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:56,520
Speaker 1: I listened to the recording, I said, no, it's a

536
00:32:56,520 --> 00:32:59,920
Speaker 1: little too too light. You know, we need some more umph.

537
00:33:00,480 --> 00:33:03,040
Speaker 1: They recorded again and it still wasn't quite there, and

538
00:33:03,080 --> 00:33:06,480
Speaker 1: so finally we got the Wrecking Crew. I don't know

539
00:33:06,520 --> 00:33:08,640
Speaker 1: if you know that name those these guys that did

540
00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:11,320
Speaker 1: most of the sessions in l A that held held

541
00:33:11,320 --> 00:33:15,160
Speaker 1: Blaine on drums and Tommy Tedesco on guitar and Carol Kaye.

542
00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:25,040
Speaker 1: The third recording was The Charm Why from every time

543
00:33:26,600 --> 00:33:39,880
Speaker 1: you want just like me? What's the difference? How do

544
00:33:39,920 --> 00:33:42,280
Speaker 1: they get there? For you? As a person who has

545
00:33:42,400 --> 00:33:47,040
Speaker 1: this ear, this gift, something happens for you like an

546
00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:49,640
Speaker 1: alchemy where you just go that's it. They got it? Well, yeah,

547
00:33:49,840 --> 00:33:51,200
Speaker 1: how do they get there? How do you help them

548
00:33:51,200 --> 00:33:53,160
Speaker 1: get there? Or do you you try to flag them

549
00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:55,040
Speaker 1: down to the runway? You know, That's what we did

550
00:33:55,080 --> 00:33:56,800
Speaker 1: with most of our artists. You know, we didn't try

551
00:33:56,840 --> 00:33:59,000
Speaker 1: to sign the beat of the week. We tried to

552
00:33:59,040 --> 00:34:02,280
Speaker 1: get you know, the like saying the Cat Stevens and

553
00:34:02,360 --> 00:34:04,800
Speaker 1: the artists we we chose were artists that just had

554
00:34:04,840 --> 00:34:08,839
Speaker 1: their own little identity which we loved, and the carpenters

555
00:34:08,880 --> 00:34:10,799
Speaker 1: had that. I mean I signed them because it wasn't

556
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:13,319
Speaker 1: a type of music that I normally listened to. But

557
00:34:13,400 --> 00:34:15,520
Speaker 1: they were so sincere about it, and they were so

558
00:34:15,560 --> 00:34:19,239
Speaker 1: passionate about the music. Apologetic, oh beautiful, one of the

559
00:34:19,239 --> 00:34:23,320
Speaker 1: most clarion voices. Well, when I heard the original tape,

560
00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:25,360
Speaker 1: you know they are, And the original tape was presented

561
00:34:25,400 --> 00:34:27,600
Speaker 1: to me like studied one. Here a tape, you know.

562
00:34:27,680 --> 00:34:30,200
Speaker 1: And that's when he handed me a tape through the

563
00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:32,800
Speaker 1: gates at A and M. And I sat down in

564
00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:36,400
Speaker 1: my couch at in my office at A M. And

565
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:38,480
Speaker 1: I did what I usually do, put on the tape.

566
00:34:39,040 --> 00:34:41,239
Speaker 1: The speakers were on the floor about ten feet in

567
00:34:41,239 --> 00:34:43,719
Speaker 1: front of me, closed my eyes and it felt like

568
00:34:43,920 --> 00:34:46,080
Speaker 1: Karen's voice was sitting right next to me on the

569
00:34:46,160 --> 00:34:49,000
Speaker 1: on the couch. So I was just really intrigued to

570
00:34:49,000 --> 00:34:51,080
Speaker 1: meet them. And when I did, I just realized this

571
00:34:51,120 --> 00:34:53,760
Speaker 1: is the real deal. So you build this big company,

572
00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:55,560
Speaker 1: you know, you gotta, you gotta, You've got a great

573
00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:58,920
Speaker 1: record company, you and Cherry, and then the time comes

574
00:34:58,960 --> 00:35:03,239
Speaker 1: and aside from uh deal making and aside from you know,

575
00:35:03,320 --> 00:35:06,560
Speaker 1: PolyGram making it well worth your while, what was it

576
00:35:06,640 --> 00:35:08,160
Speaker 1: like in terms of the decision to let it go

577
00:35:08,239 --> 00:35:10,640
Speaker 1: and to sell the company? Well, I felt something coming.

578
00:35:10,719 --> 00:35:13,799
Speaker 1: I felt the music file sharing, and something just just

579
00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:17,640
Speaker 1: felt like the time is right. It was well in

580
00:35:19,360 --> 00:35:22,960
Speaker 1: most of these companies were run by these big corporations,

581
00:35:23,160 --> 00:35:25,239
Speaker 1: and you know, they were throwing millions and millions and

582
00:35:25,280 --> 00:35:28,920
Speaker 1: dollars around for new artists, and we felt that, you know,

583
00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:31,520
Speaker 1: you you make one mistake at our size and then

584
00:35:31,560 --> 00:35:34,640
Speaker 1: you your your ship is sinking. So we just thought

585
00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:37,360
Speaker 1: it was it was time. And originally we were just

586
00:35:37,360 --> 00:35:42,440
Speaker 1: going to sell for which we held on too for

587
00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:44,759
Speaker 1: a long time. And then they said, well, we'd like

588
00:35:44,840 --> 00:35:47,799
Speaker 1: to gobble the whole thing. And I thought, what can

589
00:35:47,840 --> 00:35:49,600
Speaker 1: I do to throw in a little something. I'd like

590
00:35:49,719 --> 00:35:54,080
Speaker 1: my catalog back, her Bopera, Tijuana Brass and her Popera

591
00:35:54,520 --> 00:35:58,040
Speaker 1: single catalog plus Lonnie Hall's catalog. And I got it.

592
00:36:00,440 --> 00:36:02,880
Speaker 1: I mean, that's what all artists crave, right, is to

593
00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:05,560
Speaker 1: control their own music. I wanted it back, and they

594
00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:08,080
Speaker 1: agreed to it, and we signed the contract and you

595
00:36:08,160 --> 00:36:16,040
Speaker 1: made the deal and sold the company to them. Here

596
00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:19,600
Speaker 1: what Herb Alpert did next after this break. There's something

597
00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:22,319
Speaker 1: about being an artist, being a musician, being a band,

598
00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:25,200
Speaker 1: of being a sculpture. When you're doing it, you're in

599
00:36:25,239 --> 00:36:32,480
Speaker 1: the exact moment of your life. I'm Alec Baldwin and

600
00:36:32,520 --> 00:36:36,880
Speaker 1: you're listening to Here's the Thing. Real conversations with artists, writers,

601
00:36:36,920 --> 00:36:40,600
Speaker 1: policymakers and performers. That's where I find out why people

602
00:36:40,680 --> 00:36:44,640
Speaker 1: do what they do. Welcome to confession. I'm father al

603
00:36:45,120 --> 00:36:47,640
Speaker 1: I sign your mind, Kristen. I've done a lot of things.

604
00:36:48,160 --> 00:36:50,120
Speaker 1: Where would a person hear this? If a person wanted

605
00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:52,840
Speaker 1: to hear this, you can listen to other episodes that

606
00:36:53,000 --> 00:37:11,960
Speaker 1: Here's the Thing, dot Org. This is Alec Baldwin and

607
00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:15,040
Speaker 1: you're listening to Here's the Thing. Back with her Balbert.

608
00:37:15,560 --> 00:37:18,440
Speaker 1: Having sold A and M records for a staggering some

609
00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:22,759
Speaker 1: Herbalpert can pretty much do whatever he wants. You might

610
00:37:22,840 --> 00:37:24,880
Speaker 1: think this is the point of the story where this

611
00:37:24,960 --> 00:37:28,520
Speaker 1: former record producer takes his cut, finds a nice corner

612
00:37:28,560 --> 00:37:31,440
Speaker 1: of the world to build his castle, and relaxes with

613
00:37:31,520 --> 00:37:35,200
Speaker 1: some headphones on. Not her Albert. I started painting in nine.

614
00:37:36,520 --> 00:37:38,920
Speaker 1: I'm not a Sunday painter. I'm not a Sunday artist.

615
00:37:38,920 --> 00:37:42,480
Speaker 1: I do it every day, you know. Traveling in the

616
00:37:42,560 --> 00:37:44,799
Speaker 1: sixties with the two Wanter Brass around the world, I

617
00:37:44,840 --> 00:37:46,200
Speaker 1: used to go to museums and I go to the

618
00:37:46,239 --> 00:37:49,360
Speaker 1: modern arts section. For whatever reason, that just appealed to me.

619
00:37:49,400 --> 00:37:52,160
Speaker 1: And you know, I see these paintings, like a black

620
00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:54,680
Speaker 1: painting with a purple dot or something hanging on the wall,

621
00:37:54,719 --> 00:37:58,239
Speaker 1: and I think, let me try something like that. I

622
00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:00,799
Speaker 1: wasn't doing it to think some thing would come of it.

623
00:38:01,560 --> 00:38:03,960
Speaker 1: I'll tell you what's great. And I know, Alec you

624
00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:07,320
Speaker 1: know about this. It's just there's something about being an artist,

625
00:38:07,480 --> 00:38:09,840
Speaker 1: being a musician, being a paint or being a sculptor.

626
00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:13,839
Speaker 1: When you're doing it, you're in the exact moment of

627
00:38:13,880 --> 00:38:17,400
Speaker 1: your life, and that's rare. You know. When you're not

628
00:38:17,480 --> 00:38:20,360
Speaker 1: in that mode, you're you're thinking about yesterday or tomorrow

629
00:38:20,440 --> 00:38:22,640
Speaker 1: or some other house a rye. That really doesn't make

630
00:38:22,680 --> 00:38:25,440
Speaker 1: any sense. But when you're doing it, man, it just

631
00:38:25,520 --> 00:38:28,880
Speaker 1: feels so right on the moment. I feel that way.

632
00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:33,760
Speaker 1: Would I'm on my boat. Well, the I don't paint,

633
00:38:33,800 --> 00:38:35,960
Speaker 1: and I don't I wish I could take Well, I

634
00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:38,120
Speaker 1: should try it. I mean when I started painting, I

635
00:38:38,160 --> 00:38:40,120
Speaker 1: painted like a monkey, you know, I was just I

636
00:38:40,160 --> 00:38:42,400
Speaker 1: squeezed some paint on a canvas and moved it around

637
00:38:42,400 --> 00:38:46,120
Speaker 1: with Yeah, you have no training, no training. I didn't

638
00:38:46,120 --> 00:38:48,080
Speaker 1: know what I was doing. But I think there's an

639
00:38:48,080 --> 00:38:50,279
Speaker 1: advantage to that. I think when you're an amateur and

640
00:38:50,320 --> 00:38:55,040
Speaker 1: you're just fooling around, you have infinite possibilities. You know,

641
00:38:55,080 --> 00:38:56,840
Speaker 1: if you go to a professional, they'll tell you what

642
00:38:56,920 --> 00:38:58,480
Speaker 1: not to do and what to do and how to

643
00:38:58,520 --> 00:39:00,360
Speaker 1: do it and blah blah blah. And I didn't know

644
00:39:00,440 --> 00:39:03,480
Speaker 1: about that. I just did whatever. I'm always going for

645
00:39:03,520 --> 00:39:06,160
Speaker 1: a feel, you know. It's it's I do that in

646
00:39:06,280 --> 00:39:09,160
Speaker 1: music and sculpting and painting. It's like, I'm not looking

647
00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:13,560
Speaker 1: for something that's going to, you know, excite my eyes.

648
00:39:13,600 --> 00:39:16,200
Speaker 1: I wanted to something that's excites my soul, you know,

649
00:39:16,200 --> 00:39:19,480
Speaker 1: it's something that really resonates. I'm assuming there's no preference

650
00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:22,520
Speaker 1: between paint and canvas and sculpture for you. You enjoy

651
00:39:22,560 --> 00:39:27,160
Speaker 1: them both equally. I got a copy from your office

652
00:39:27,200 --> 00:39:29,799
Speaker 1: of the Black Totem's exhibit in the work you've done,

653
00:39:29,920 --> 00:39:36,480
Speaker 1: and these are obviously immense pieces in bronze, and these

654
00:39:36,520 --> 00:39:39,960
Speaker 1: exclusively for people who have cliff side homes in Malibu

655
00:39:40,000 --> 00:39:43,840
Speaker 1: with not really I'm not interested in really selling, you know.

656
00:39:43,880 --> 00:39:46,160
Speaker 1: I know, I'm just saying they're big. They're big, Yeah,

657
00:39:46,280 --> 00:39:48,919
Speaker 1: they're huge. I think of my homes in New York

658
00:39:48,960 --> 00:39:51,520
Speaker 1: and on Long Island. I would be interested in buying

659
00:39:51,560 --> 00:39:54,600
Speaker 1: the lower four feet of this one. If we could

660
00:39:54,600 --> 00:39:56,680
Speaker 1: cut this into sections. Actually, that would be kind of

661
00:39:56,719 --> 00:39:58,400
Speaker 1: that would work quite well for me. I don't have

662
00:39:58,480 --> 00:40:03,600
Speaker 1: eighteen feet in Manhattan, I'm but they're absolutely stunning. What

663
00:40:03,760 --> 00:40:06,320
Speaker 1: is music for you? Now, I know that's the ultimate

664
00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:09,520
Speaker 1: cliche question, but how do you how do you view

665
00:40:09,560 --> 00:40:11,880
Speaker 1: the music world now beyond zeros and ones in the

666
00:40:11,920 --> 00:40:14,760
Speaker 1: digital and everything. You must be sitting home and sometimes

667
00:40:14,760 --> 00:40:17,200
Speaker 1: you sit there and go, wow, that sounds great. I

668
00:40:17,239 --> 00:40:20,480
Speaker 1: really did that. Well, you know, I have really varied taste.

669
00:40:20,520 --> 00:40:23,720
Speaker 1: So I love classical music. I love you know, listening

670
00:40:23,719 --> 00:40:26,680
Speaker 1: to your favorite composer. Well, yeah, I love Revel. I

671
00:40:26,719 --> 00:40:29,560
Speaker 1: mean actually Ravel taught me the lesson. Actually, I was

672
00:40:29,640 --> 00:40:32,400
Speaker 1: going to sc for a few moments. I was in

673
00:40:32,400 --> 00:40:36,640
Speaker 1: the orchestra there and they were playing um Pictures at

674
00:40:36,680 --> 00:40:40,640
Speaker 1: an exhibition, you know. I was in the Yorkshire playing that. Yeah,

675
00:40:40,719 --> 00:40:44,480
Speaker 1: Massoursky wrote it, Bravel arranged arranged it. Good for you,

676
00:40:45,360 --> 00:40:47,560
Speaker 1: And they were playing the last month of Great Gate

677
00:40:47,600 --> 00:40:50,480
Speaker 1: of Kiev, you know, And I was like so intrigued

678
00:40:50,520 --> 00:40:52,880
Speaker 1: with the sound of the orchestra I was leaning forward

679
00:40:52,960 --> 00:40:55,880
Speaker 1: listening to everybody and sounded like wow, it's like natural stereo,

680
00:40:56,200 --> 00:40:58,640
Speaker 1: and I forgot to come in. I've had to come

681
00:40:58,680 --> 00:41:01,160
Speaker 1: in my parry that moment, I thought, Hey, you know,

682
00:41:01,560 --> 00:41:03,279
Speaker 1: this isn't for me. What I really want to do

683
00:41:03,320 --> 00:41:06,400
Speaker 1: is just close my eyes and play. I love Miles Davis,

684
00:41:06,440 --> 00:41:08,719
Speaker 1: I love Louis Armstrong. I love those guys that just,

685
00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:11,680
Speaker 1: you know, create. I want to try doing that. And

686
00:41:11,719 --> 00:41:14,000
Speaker 1: so I started, you know, working on jazz, which is

687
00:41:14,040 --> 00:41:17,480
Speaker 1: a very specific language. I mean, just because you want

688
00:41:17,520 --> 00:41:20,600
Speaker 1: to play jazz doesn't mean you can play jazz. Had

689
00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:22,600
Speaker 1: you've been asked to score a lot of film? Did

690
00:41:22,640 --> 00:41:24,360
Speaker 1: you pass up? And you must have been asked to score?

691
00:41:24,880 --> 00:41:28,879
Speaker 1: I did. I did the title song of y Out

692
00:41:28,960 --> 00:41:31,600
Speaker 1: with Bert Backreck, but that was about it. No, I

693
00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:34,600
Speaker 1: don't think that's my thing. I don't I don't think

694
00:41:34,640 --> 00:41:36,719
Speaker 1: I didn't feel it. I didn't feel it. You would

695
00:41:36,760 --> 00:41:40,480
Speaker 1: have been great that. Maybe my wife thinks I should

696
00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:43,160
Speaker 1: still pursue that, but you know, I had an experienced

697
00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:47,920
Speaker 1: this is like a little different aside. But I was

698
00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:53,440
Speaker 1: in the studio recording the Going Places album and the

699
00:41:53,480 --> 00:41:56,160
Speaker 1: brass was already going crazy. I mean we were selling.

700
00:41:57,320 --> 00:41:59,759
Speaker 1: You know, it was going well. Yeah, it was going well.

701
00:41:59,760 --> 00:42:01,480
Speaker 1: And I get a call from my partner, I said,

702
00:42:02,200 --> 00:42:05,040
Speaker 1: and the album wasn't finished yet. I get a call

703
00:42:05,120 --> 00:42:07,560
Speaker 1: from Chair and he says, we just have advanced orders

704
00:42:07,560 --> 00:42:11,799
Speaker 1: of a million, four hundred thousand, and I got depressed.

705
00:42:12,640 --> 00:42:16,000
Speaker 1: I felt like tea. You know, if people love the

706
00:42:16,040 --> 00:42:19,200
Speaker 1: album by it, if you don't, you know this. I

707
00:42:19,360 --> 00:42:23,840
Speaker 1: just it was a strange feeling. I I know it

708
00:42:23,880 --> 00:42:28,680
Speaker 1: sounds a little I just didn't want to be prejudged.

709
00:42:28,719 --> 00:42:30,880
Speaker 1: I mean, I wanted people to listen to the album

710
00:42:30,960 --> 00:42:33,480
Speaker 1: here and if they liked it by it, purity is

711
00:42:33,520 --> 00:42:38,160
Speaker 1: what you seem to be after I don't, but I mean, yeah,

712
00:42:38,200 --> 00:42:40,439
Speaker 1: I was looking for that real ride. Until we find

713
00:42:40,440 --> 00:42:43,000
Speaker 1: a better word, we'll say purity. Okay, you know I

714
00:42:43,040 --> 00:42:45,640
Speaker 1: was looking for that ride. You like it? By it?

715
00:42:46,760 --> 00:42:50,000
Speaker 1: Where did you meet your second wife? Okay, you're obviously

716
00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:53,160
Speaker 1: madly in love with Yeah, so you don't know that story, right,

717
00:42:53,320 --> 00:42:56,640
Speaker 1: let's hear it. This is good, So you know, musicians

718
00:42:56,680 --> 00:43:00,719
Speaker 1: in love is always a good ninety six I auditioned

719
00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:06,520
Speaker 1: Brazil sixty six. Brazil sixty six. Lonnie was the lead singer,

720
00:43:07,960 --> 00:43:11,440
Speaker 1: Jerry and I signed them to a long term contract.

721
00:43:11,680 --> 00:43:14,680
Speaker 1: This was when the Brass was really cooking, and we

722
00:43:14,800 --> 00:43:17,279
Speaker 1: hired them to open the show for us, so they

723
00:43:17,280 --> 00:43:20,520
Speaker 1: were playing for eighteen thousand people at a time. Lonnie

724
00:43:20,560 --> 00:43:22,960
Speaker 1: and I became friends. We were just really good friends.

725
00:43:22,960 --> 00:43:26,560
Speaker 1: She's very unusual. She's from Chicago. She can sing in

726
00:43:26,640 --> 00:43:32,080
Speaker 1: Portuguese like a like a native, beautiful voice. And she

727
00:43:32,160 --> 00:43:35,160
Speaker 1: loves music. Oh she have you have a similar kind

728
00:43:35,200 --> 00:43:37,320
Speaker 1: of I don't want to say passion for music, but

729
00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:40,200
Speaker 1: you have a similar ethic for music, is she? Oh? Completely?

730
00:43:40,239 --> 00:43:42,880
Speaker 1: She loves jazz, she loves you know, all kinds of music.

731
00:43:42,920 --> 00:43:47,160
Speaker 1: But we are really the opposite. You know, She's well,

732
00:43:48,040 --> 00:43:50,839
Speaker 1: I'm really quiet. I'm really kind of like a low

733
00:43:50,920 --> 00:43:54,120
Speaker 1: key type of guy. She's more, you know, has more

734
00:43:54,239 --> 00:43:59,040
Speaker 1: energy and more zip zap, Yeah, more outgoing. Who makes

735
00:43:59,040 --> 00:44:01,520
Speaker 1: the dinner reser faction is out there in California for you?

736
00:44:01,520 --> 00:44:05,120
Speaker 1: Who's who's picking the restaurants? Your wife? No, she does

737
00:44:05,200 --> 00:44:07,359
Speaker 1: not do that, do you really? Yeah? I just want

738
00:44:07,360 --> 00:44:08,480
Speaker 1: to look at my wife and I want to go

739
00:44:08,680 --> 00:44:10,279
Speaker 1: whatever you say, baby, what do you what do you

740
00:44:10,280 --> 00:44:13,080
Speaker 1: want to have? You want Indian food? You got it? Baby?

741
00:44:13,320 --> 00:44:15,040
Speaker 1: I don't want to have to make those decisions. I

742
00:44:15,080 --> 00:44:16,640
Speaker 1: got of this stuff. I gotta take about it now.

743
00:44:16,719 --> 00:44:20,680
Speaker 1: It's it's kind of mutual with us. I mean, she's um.

744
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:22,360
Speaker 1: You know. I met her at a time and we

745
00:44:22,480 --> 00:44:26,319
Speaker 1: became friendly and she was able to identify my neurosis,

746
00:44:27,640 --> 00:44:29,960
Speaker 1: which is what well, you know, at the time, I

747
00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:32,120
Speaker 1: was going through a divorce and I couldn't play the horn.

748
00:44:32,520 --> 00:44:35,080
Speaker 1: How did that manifest itself? Well, I took a trip

749
00:44:35,120 --> 00:44:38,120
Speaker 1: to Europe. We had a little time off. When I

750
00:44:38,160 --> 00:44:40,560
Speaker 1: got back, we had some obligations to go back to

751
00:44:40,600 --> 00:44:43,279
Speaker 1: Europe and do some concerts. And I had like two

752
00:44:43,440 --> 00:44:45,400
Speaker 1: or three weeks to get back in shape, and I

753
00:44:45,440 --> 00:44:48,239
Speaker 1: just couldn't do it. My tongue wouldn't go in the

754
00:44:48,320 --> 00:44:51,400
Speaker 1: right place. I was all bottled up. I was stiff,

755
00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:54,600
Speaker 1: my neck was tight. I couldn't make a sound out

756
00:44:54,600 --> 00:44:57,879
Speaker 1: of the horn. It was really painful, you know. I

757
00:44:57,920 --> 00:45:01,920
Speaker 1: was really upset about the divorce and I had, you know,

758
00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:06,360
Speaker 1: a bottle of Melanta at my side. There you were unhappy.

759
00:45:06,440 --> 00:45:08,080
Speaker 1: There was a hole in the stomach. You know, I

760
00:45:08,680 --> 00:45:11,960
Speaker 1: wasn't happening and I just couldn't execute. I couldn't play

761
00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:15,320
Speaker 1: that did that last? I lasted for years. Really, yeah,

762
00:45:15,360 --> 00:45:19,359
Speaker 1: it did it? I mean it finally wanted down well

763
00:45:19,520 --> 00:45:23,640
Speaker 1: nineteen sixty seventy. So right after you have this huge

764
00:45:23,760 --> 00:45:27,760
Speaker 1: crest of the greatest score as a as a performer

765
00:45:27,800 --> 00:45:30,160
Speaker 1: of your life, you kind of crashing and you know,

766
00:45:30,600 --> 00:45:33,160
Speaker 1: did you literally didn't play well? I played, but it

767
00:45:33,200 --> 00:45:35,719
Speaker 1: was painful. I had an experience in Germany. I did

768
00:45:35,880 --> 00:45:39,080
Speaker 1: you know I had this obligation to play these concerts

769
00:45:39,120 --> 00:45:42,360
Speaker 1: in Europe. I was in Germany in Frankfort, and I

770
00:45:42,400 --> 00:45:45,080
Speaker 1: was on the stage, painfully playing, and all of a

771
00:45:45,120 --> 00:45:47,239
Speaker 1: sudden I had this out of body experience. All of

772
00:45:47,239 --> 00:45:49,400
Speaker 1: a sudden, I was in the third row looking at me.

773
00:45:50,239 --> 00:45:51,880
Speaker 1: You know, I was thinking to myself, well, gee, this

774
00:45:51,920 --> 00:45:55,839
Speaker 1: guy is usually pretty comfortable on the stage. But when

775
00:45:55,840 --> 00:45:57,680
Speaker 1: he's you know, off the stage, and he's in a

776
00:45:57,920 --> 00:46:00,520
Speaker 1: in a room of you know, at a part already whatever,

777
00:46:00,520 --> 00:46:03,640
Speaker 1: he's totally out of control, which I felt I was

778
00:46:03,719 --> 00:46:06,880
Speaker 1: at the time. I said, when I get back to

779
00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:10,200
Speaker 1: Los Angeles after this series of concerts, I'm gonna either

780
00:46:10,320 --> 00:46:13,439
Speaker 1: throw this horn away, sell a and m do whatever.

781
00:46:13,600 --> 00:46:15,120
Speaker 1: I just want to find out who I am and

782
00:46:15,120 --> 00:46:17,640
Speaker 1: why I'm here. I mean, everybody's looking for the same thing.

783
00:46:17,680 --> 00:46:20,960
Speaker 1: I think a life of purpose and meaning without that,

784
00:46:21,040 --> 00:46:26,600
Speaker 1: what else is there? Luckily I met a teacher in

785
00:46:26,719 --> 00:46:30,720
Speaker 1: New York here. His name was Carmine Caruso. He played violin,

786
00:46:31,160 --> 00:46:33,879
Speaker 1: he played saxophone. He didn't play trumpet, but he taught

787
00:46:33,880 --> 00:46:36,719
Speaker 1: a lot of trumpet players. He likened the musician to

788
00:46:36,800 --> 00:46:40,160
Speaker 1: an athlete, and you had to sink your body muscles

789
00:46:40,160 --> 00:46:43,560
Speaker 1: to rhythm. And over a period of time, I just

790
00:46:43,680 --> 00:46:48,960
Speaker 1: kind of unwildness, terrible problem I had. How long did

791
00:46:48,960 --> 00:46:53,120
Speaker 1: it take? It took before I was really comfortable? Probably

792
00:46:54,000 --> 00:47:00,000
Speaker 1: eight years? Yeah, did you that when you started painting? Well,

793
00:47:01,040 --> 00:47:03,440
Speaker 1: that's interesting question. You know you said you started painting

794
00:47:03,440 --> 00:47:06,920
Speaker 1: it and you and you started to lose your mojo

795
00:47:07,120 --> 00:47:09,719
Speaker 1: horn wise and sixty nine? Did you did painting and

796
00:47:09,760 --> 00:47:11,680
Speaker 1: sculpting come into your life as you found you didn't

797
00:47:11,680 --> 00:47:13,919
Speaker 1: want to play the horn, Well, sculpting came in later.

798
00:47:14,000 --> 00:47:17,319
Speaker 1: Painting was a big relief you didn't have somewhere to

799
00:47:17,320 --> 00:47:22,920
Speaker 1: put that energy exactly. Um, it was a rough period

800
00:47:22,920 --> 00:47:25,960
Speaker 1: for me. I've been there, man, I've been not and

801
00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:27,880
Speaker 1: mine as a result of a divorce too, you know,

802
00:47:28,160 --> 00:47:30,680
Speaker 1: and not like I thought I needed to be to

803
00:47:30,800 --> 00:47:33,319
Speaker 1: stay in that marriage, but it was the way that

804
00:47:33,360 --> 00:47:35,799
Speaker 1: those things ends. Some time. You just sit there and go,

805
00:47:35,960 --> 00:47:39,160
Speaker 1: you know, like, this is not planned. It not what

806
00:47:39,200 --> 00:47:42,120
Speaker 1: I bargained for. Like we can let's hit rewind here

807
00:47:42,160 --> 00:47:44,680
Speaker 1: and go back and try to figure this out man

808
00:47:44,840 --> 00:47:47,200
Speaker 1: and hit delete. Yeah, let's we gotta, we gotta, we

809
00:47:47,239 --> 00:47:50,640
Speaker 1: gotta do this again. When did you marry your current wife?

810
00:47:50,640 --> 00:47:55,720
Speaker 1: What year? Seventy four? So during this time as years

811
00:47:55,719 --> 00:47:58,640
Speaker 1: have you not feeling great and then you meet her

812
00:47:58,680 --> 00:48:00,400
Speaker 1: and you meet this woman who's obviously the love of

813
00:48:00,440 --> 00:48:02,960
Speaker 1: your life. Right, but at the same time I was

814
00:48:02,960 --> 00:48:07,440
Speaker 1: still playing. I was I was forcing yourself, well, forcing myself.

815
00:48:07,480 --> 00:48:10,360
Speaker 1: And seventy four we had a command performance for the

816
00:48:10,440 --> 00:48:15,439
Speaker 1: Queen of England. We played, we played there and the bands, yeah,

817
00:48:15,600 --> 00:48:19,759
Speaker 1: the band sounded great. And then meet Prince Charles who said, oh,

818
00:48:19,880 --> 00:48:22,480
Speaker 1: heav a you records in the in the den. You know,

819
00:48:23,280 --> 00:48:27,080
Speaker 1: I couldn't picture the den. Met the Queen, very lovely,

820
00:48:27,360 --> 00:48:30,960
Speaker 1: nice smile. Uh. This was in nineteen seventy four. I

821
00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:33,279
Speaker 1: was feeling pretty puffed up. I felt good about that.

822
00:48:33,400 --> 00:48:36,320
Speaker 1: So go out the back door and there were hundreds

823
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:38,000
Speaker 1: and hundreds of people that are just waiting for the

824
00:48:38,080 --> 00:48:41,239
Speaker 1: various artists that were on this show. And this as

825
00:48:41,239 --> 00:48:43,120
Speaker 1: I'm walking through the crowd that I hear these two

826
00:48:43,200 --> 00:48:45,640
Speaker 1: ladies Tarry, I don't know that Chap, who was that Chap?

827
00:48:45,880 --> 00:48:52,080
Speaker 1: And for friends? And I think that Sergio Mendez after

828
00:48:52,200 --> 00:48:54,480
Speaker 1: feeling so good, I gotta get over here more often, man,

829
00:48:54,520 --> 00:48:56,880
Speaker 1: I gotta get these people straightened up. They don't know

830
00:48:56,960 --> 00:49:00,839
Speaker 1: me from Sergio. Well, well, I think that's a great

831
00:49:00,880 --> 00:49:03,359
Speaker 1: thing that you are someone who you weren't feeling all

832
00:49:03,400 --> 00:49:05,160
Speaker 1: that great at that time in your life, but you

833
00:49:05,200 --> 00:49:08,040
Speaker 1: fooled the King and the Queen of England. Man with

834
00:49:08,080 --> 00:49:10,080
Speaker 1: the band sounded no what I'm saying that you got

835
00:49:10,080 --> 00:49:12,600
Speaker 1: you got it done. Yeah, But you know there's something

836
00:49:12,640 --> 00:49:16,440
Speaker 1: about you know, when you're you good at something, you

837
00:49:16,480 --> 00:49:19,359
Speaker 1: can you can fake it and and nobody really knows

838
00:49:21,080 --> 00:49:25,080
Speaker 1: no Now for you, who's a horn player that you

839
00:49:25,280 --> 00:49:27,080
Speaker 1: take your head up? Whose one just giving one? You

840
00:49:27,200 --> 00:49:38,120
Speaker 1: just just really dug Listening to Miles Davis, I love Miles.

841
00:49:38,200 --> 00:49:41,200
Speaker 1: You know Miles was the real thing. Miles Why well,

842
00:49:41,280 --> 00:49:45,319
Speaker 1: because he was completely authentic. He was just playing the

843
00:49:45,400 --> 00:49:50,759
Speaker 1: music that was coming out of him, no compromise. He

844
00:49:51,239 --> 00:49:56,560
Speaker 1: understood space. You know that the the silence that happens

845
00:49:56,640 --> 00:49:59,400
Speaker 1: between the notes. You know, he understood that, and I

846
00:49:59,400 --> 00:50:03,000
Speaker 1: think he was sir, look key, you know, you know

847
00:50:03,800 --> 00:50:17,200
Speaker 1: jazz musician at the twentieth century. I've met some really

848
00:50:17,440 --> 00:50:22,040
Speaker 1: incredible jazz musicians in my day, and each one has

849
00:50:22,080 --> 00:50:24,319
Speaker 1: their own little take on how to do it. Stan

850
00:50:24,480 --> 00:50:27,960
Speaker 1: Guests was like a brother to me. I produced two

851
00:50:27,960 --> 00:50:31,040
Speaker 1: albums with Stan and he played this one song that

852
00:50:31,160 --> 00:50:33,640
Speaker 1: was just men. Goose bumps were flying up my back.

853
00:50:41,440 --> 00:50:43,920
Speaker 1: I said, man, what are you thinking when you're playing?

854
00:50:44,719 --> 00:50:48,480
Speaker 1: And he says, oh, I think it like I'm in

855
00:50:48,520 --> 00:50:55,520
Speaker 1: front of the whaling wall in Jerusalem and I'm dobvining. Oh.

856
00:50:55,560 --> 00:50:58,439
Speaker 1: He was great, man. I love the sky. He wore

857
00:50:58,480 --> 00:51:01,080
Speaker 1: his stuff right close to this if I had an

858
00:51:01,120 --> 00:51:03,920
Speaker 1: experience with gifts where you know, I did these ms

859
00:51:04,239 --> 00:51:06,359
Speaker 1: and he said, can I do anything for you? I said, yeah, man,

860
00:51:06,400 --> 00:51:09,360
Speaker 1: give me. How about giving me some bebop lessons? He

861
00:51:09,400 --> 00:51:11,560
Speaker 1: says sure. He says, how how honest you want me

862
00:51:11,600 --> 00:51:14,640
Speaker 1: to be? I said, just because I'm just trying to

863
00:51:14,640 --> 00:51:16,799
Speaker 1: get up to my own water level. I didn't play

864
00:51:16,800 --> 00:51:18,839
Speaker 1: with Charlie Parker like he did. I just wanted to

865
00:51:18,880 --> 00:51:21,560
Speaker 1: see how far I can take this thing. This is

866
00:51:21,600 --> 00:51:24,719
Speaker 1: fine in my studio at home. And he's sitting down.

867
00:51:24,920 --> 00:51:27,520
Speaker 1: I said, do you think, for one, I should work

868
00:51:27,560 --> 00:51:31,120
Speaker 1: on the two five one chords in every key, which

869
00:51:31,200 --> 00:51:34,400
Speaker 1: is page one if they teach at Berkeley. I mean

870
00:51:34,480 --> 00:51:36,160
Speaker 1: that's how they you know, they start this thing. To

871
00:51:36,360 --> 00:51:39,120
Speaker 1: five one is an all pop songs. It's just one

872
00:51:39,160 --> 00:51:41,400
Speaker 1: of those things. I said, do you think I should

873
00:51:41,520 --> 00:51:45,200
Speaker 1: work on this in every key chords? You know what

874
00:51:45,280 --> 00:51:51,600
Speaker 1: he said? What's that? He didn't think like that though.

875
00:51:51,600 --> 00:51:54,280
Speaker 1: I mean, those old timers didn't play off of that

876
00:51:54,280 --> 00:51:57,000
Speaker 1: that they're teaching at school. You know, who do you

877
00:51:57,040 --> 00:52:01,960
Speaker 1: think made Sinatra? Sinatra? Oh Man very musical? He really

878
00:52:02,080 --> 00:52:06,280
Speaker 1: was smart. He was grateful to the songwriters and the musicians,

879
00:52:06,280 --> 00:52:09,080
Speaker 1: and he knew they made him. He brought what he brought.

880
00:52:09,120 --> 00:52:11,400
Speaker 1: But he was a kind of man. The guy was.

881
00:52:11,640 --> 00:52:13,880
Speaker 1: He was magic and plus the sound in his voice

882
00:52:13,920 --> 00:52:17,120
Speaker 1: was beautiful, his timing. But I learned a great lesson.

883
00:52:17,200 --> 00:52:19,279
Speaker 1: You know, when things started happening for me. My ex

884
00:52:19,320 --> 00:52:22,720
Speaker 1: wife was friends with Nancy Sinatra, and I met Frank

885
00:52:22,800 --> 00:52:25,560
Speaker 1: and I stayed at his house and then we flew

886
00:52:25,680 --> 00:52:30,799
Speaker 1: to Las Vegas and the way after the show. Frank

887
00:52:30,840 --> 00:52:32,160
Speaker 1: comes up to me and says, you want to play

888
00:52:32,160 --> 00:52:34,040
Speaker 1: you some bakra. I said, I don't know how to play,

889
00:52:34,120 --> 00:52:36,440
Speaker 1: but I'll go with you. He says, down the Barbara.

890
00:52:36,920 --> 00:52:40,960
Speaker 1: I'm standing behind him, And in twenty minutes he must

891
00:52:41,000 --> 00:52:46,200
Speaker 1: have went around twenty seven thirty thousand dollars and Nancy

892
00:52:46,280 --> 00:52:48,360
Speaker 1: was standing right next to me. So every time he

893
00:52:48,400 --> 00:52:53,880
Speaker 1: won a party, throw off like ten bills to Nancy.

894
00:52:54,000 --> 00:52:56,200
Speaker 1: So she had this pile looked like a bowling ball

895
00:52:56,200 --> 00:52:59,800
Speaker 1: in her hands of a hundred dollar bills. And so

896
00:53:00,000 --> 00:53:02,799
Speaker 1: Frank gets up abruptly and he just leaves, you know,

897
00:53:02,840 --> 00:53:06,000
Speaker 1: and Nancy looks at me, says, I hear her, wee

898
00:53:06,120 --> 00:53:08,480
Speaker 1: go take some of this and go gamble. And I

899
00:53:08,480 --> 00:53:10,200
Speaker 1: looked at this pilot said, what do you mean takes?

900
00:53:10,440 --> 00:53:11,960
Speaker 1: You want me to take a half a pound you want?

901
00:53:12,040 --> 00:53:15,000
Speaker 1: What are you talking about? And I realized at that point, man,

902
00:53:15,239 --> 00:53:17,920
Speaker 1: I'm never going to treat money like that. I'm gonna,

903
00:53:18,280 --> 00:53:21,839
Speaker 1: you know, honor in a whole different ways. It can

904
00:53:21,920 --> 00:53:30,120
Speaker 1: be that frivolous. Herb Alpert established the Herbalbert Foundation in

905
00:53:30,160 --> 00:53:33,800
Speaker 1: the nineteen eighties and he's been getting away money ever since.

906
00:53:34,320 --> 00:53:37,600
Speaker 1: In two thousand seven, he gave thirty million dollars to

907
00:53:37,640 --> 00:53:40,279
Speaker 1: form the Herb Alpert's School of Music at U C

908
00:53:40,480 --> 00:53:45,000
Speaker 1: l A. I love music. I think music needs to survive.

909
00:53:45,040 --> 00:53:48,440
Speaker 1: I think jazz needs to survive. It's a great American legacy.

910
00:53:49,239 --> 00:53:51,719
Speaker 1: It's such an important ingredient for a kid's health, you know.

911
00:53:51,760 --> 00:53:53,960
Speaker 1: And I think through that they learned discipline and which

912
00:53:54,000 --> 00:53:57,160
Speaker 1: can help him in the academics. So it's just a natural.

913
00:53:57,360 --> 00:53:59,120
Speaker 1: It should be a core or subject. Do you teach

914
00:53:59,160 --> 00:54:01,160
Speaker 1: to you over there and us teach and stuff from No?

915
00:54:01,320 --> 00:54:04,399
Speaker 1: I don't, but I you know, I'm not. That's really

916
00:54:04,400 --> 00:54:06,279
Speaker 1: not my strongest I think they would be very happy

917
00:54:06,320 --> 00:54:08,839
Speaker 1: for you to show up, though, wouldn't. Isn't that your

918
00:54:08,920 --> 00:54:10,799
Speaker 1: great gift that you just have to play? So I

919
00:54:10,920 --> 00:54:13,160
Speaker 1: think my great gift is that I have my own

920
00:54:13,200 --> 00:54:16,000
Speaker 1: personality on the horn. A lot of musicians are trying

921
00:54:16,040 --> 00:54:18,920
Speaker 1: to track Miles Davis or try to check Charlie Parker,

922
00:54:19,040 --> 00:54:21,680
Speaker 1: try to play like you know. I'm just trying to

923
00:54:21,719 --> 00:54:25,680
Speaker 1: play like myself, and that's I think what everybody should

924
00:54:25,680 --> 00:54:29,680
Speaker 1: be going for their only unique voice. It's just it's

925
00:54:29,719 --> 00:54:34,480
Speaker 1: been a nice ride. I feel thankful. Herb Alpert continues

926
00:54:34,560 --> 00:54:38,279
Speaker 1: to paint, create sculptures, and of course make music. This

927
00:54:38,400 --> 00:54:42,840
Speaker 1: is Outpert and his wife singer Lonnie Hall. Just another

928
00:54:43,000 --> 00:54:51,360
Speaker 1: afternoon on the sidewalks of London. All the grey and

929
00:54:51,520 --> 00:55:02,840
Speaker 1: rainy days run together in the street. It's of stop. Suddenly,

930
00:55:03,640 --> 00:55:11,480
Speaker 1: I'm not alone. I feel you. I'm Alec Baldwin. Here's

931
00:55:11,520 --> 00:55:14,520
Speaker 1: the Thing is produced by Emily Botein named Cathy Russo,

932
00:55:14,600 --> 00:55:18,560
Speaker 1: with support from Jim Briggs, ed Herbstman, Melanie Hoops and

933
00:55:18,680 --> 00:55:24,240
Speaker 1: Monica Hopkins. Thanks to Trey Kay and Luokowski. Rob yourself around,

934
00:55:24,400 --> 00:55:32,200
Speaker 1: my heart, let me feed you. This is Alec Baldwin

935
00:55:32,280 --> 00:56:07,440
Speaker 1: and you're listening to Here's the Thing. Mm hmm. But

936
00:56:07,680 --> 00:56:16,080
Speaker 1: I didn't been a minute. The bon