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Speaker 1: Welcome to stuff to Blow your Mind from how Stuff

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Speaker 1: Works dot com. Hey, welcome to stuff to Blow your mind.

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Speaker 1: My name is Robert Lamb and my name is Julie Douglas. Camouflage.

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Speaker 1: We've all seen it right A couple of years back, um,

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Speaker 1: when with my wife up into the rural hills of Georgia,

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Speaker 1: she had a photo assignment where she had to take

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Speaker 1: a picture of this, uh, this lawyer's um like rich

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Speaker 1: game room, like this big basketball sized room just filled

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Speaker 1: with uh safari animals that he bagged on trips. Did

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Speaker 1: you call it his man cave? No, I forget what

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Speaker 1: he called it. It was just his u or something. No,

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Speaker 1: it was it's just his trophy room. You know. It

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Speaker 1: was enormous and it was like the center of the house.

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Speaker 1: It was the center of his life clearly. And I

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Speaker 1: mean he even there were there were dictys there, you know,

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Speaker 1: a little the little antelope type creatures with a little

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Speaker 1: bitty horns and they jumped yeah yeah yeah, and uh,

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Speaker 1: I mean they're so cute. But he'd like bagged like

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Speaker 1: three of these things, like who goes in safari and

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Speaker 1: bags addicted. It's just there a giant panda head for

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Speaker 1: it because where you go after that, you know, I

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Speaker 1: mean just about some of these animals were kind of tiny,

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Speaker 1: you know, they were the larger. It never like the

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Speaker 1: you know, the big what is it the Big five?

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Speaker 1: I think it is. You know, he had all those,

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Speaker 1: but then all these other animals and small diptics. But

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Speaker 1: that's that's not really this podcast is not about small ditics. No,

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Speaker 1: it is about camouflage. And on the way up there,

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Speaker 1: we had stopped. We had to stop and get a

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Speaker 1: bite to eat, and they're your options are limited once

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Speaker 1: you leave Atlanta and uh and venture out into the wild.

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Speaker 1: So we ended up going to like a what was it.

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Speaker 1: It wasn't like it was like a long Horn steakhouse.

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Speaker 1: I think it was. It was. It was the best

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Speaker 1: option that we had at the time. And so we

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Speaker 1: go there and there's a there's a family there and

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Speaker 1: they have a baby dressed in camouflage, and they're you know,

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Speaker 1: passing the baby back and forth, and it seemed just

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Speaker 1: really reckless because what if that baby, uh touches the

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Speaker 1: ground and then walks a little ways off into the woods,

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Speaker 1: you'd never see it again. Like it just completely blend in.

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Speaker 1: Even if you set the baby down on the grass

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Speaker 1: and it goes still on you. Where'd it go? But yeah,

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Speaker 1: but you know what, maybe that baby has been trained

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Speaker 1: and that baby would climb a tree and then jump

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Speaker 1: on you. That's yes, everybody has different parenting um agendas.

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Speaker 1: You know in first rule of parenting, you do not

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Speaker 1: judge other parents. All right, well, I won't judge their

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Speaker 1: their camouflaging with their infant. I just hope that he

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Speaker 1: or she didn't get away into that. I agree, is

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Speaker 1: that it's a concern. I can see that. I can

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Speaker 1: see how you guys were like, whoa, But okay, so

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Speaker 1: it was like a camouflage jumper. How much can you

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Speaker 1: conceivably spending a camouflage jumper? It's like what five dollars,

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Speaker 1: ten dollars maybe twenty tops? Right, Um, Yet if you're

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Speaker 1: the U. S. Military, you can spend a phenomenal amount

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Speaker 1: of money on camouflage, about five billion. Yeah. This is this, Uh.

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Speaker 1: I think you called it the camo fail. Yeah, the

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Speaker 1: cameo fail. Uh. Specifically, it involves something called Universal Camouflage Pattern,

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Speaker 1: which came out in two thousand four. Yeah, and any

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Speaker 1: military listeners will probably be, well, you are familiar with

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Speaker 1: this obviously intimately, Um, this is the pattern that has

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Speaker 1: been out since two thousand and four, and the U. S.

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Speaker 1: Army finally made the admission this year that this pattern

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Speaker 1: is not really effective at doing its job, namely camouflaging

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Speaker 1: the soldier. This is about how it went down in

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Speaker 1: terms of modern US camouflage history. What was the predominant

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Speaker 1: fashion there? What shoulder pads and uh yeah, big shoulder pads,

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Speaker 1: I don't know, big hair there, right, And if you

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Speaker 1: were in the US military in the U. S. Army,

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Speaker 1: woodland camouflage was the classic pattern of the day. Um,

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Speaker 1: we're talking black, brown, green, and tan all of this

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Speaker 1: and smudges and a meepal like shapes. All right, you know,

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Speaker 1: good stuff for the woods. Roll on new fashions. What's

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Speaker 1: what's fashionable in the nineties, Well, this is the this

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Speaker 1: is the grunge period, right yeah, yeah, okay, so maybe

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Speaker 1: this would translate to the Gulf War as being what

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Speaker 1: they called the cookie pattern, right yeah. This is the

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Speaker 1: six colored desert camo pattern, also known as chocolate chips

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Speaker 1: because it's tan, it's brown. You've got some of those

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Speaker 1: ambo type shapes of both colors going on there with

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Speaker 1: flecks of this black chocolate chips stuff throughout. So and

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Speaker 1: we're spending started spending a lot of time in the

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Speaker 1: desert in the nineties. So there you go. Then two

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Speaker 1: thousand three, three Colored Desert comes out nineteen, actually came

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Speaker 1: out two, but we used it on up through two

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Speaker 1: thousand three. UM, and in two thousand three it saw

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Speaker 1: wide US in the U S. And it's desert operations.

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Speaker 1: And this is a tan with a chocolate topped green

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Speaker 1: blotch kind of thing going on. Yeah, it's kind of

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Speaker 1: pale green and just a teeny bit of black in it.

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Speaker 1: And then comes Universal cameo two thousand four, and we're

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Speaker 1: gonna explain just a little bit about where this one

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Speaker 1: came from. But um, they rolled this out in Iraq, Afghanistan,

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Speaker 1: and then it also used as a default throughout the

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Speaker 1: rest of the military. And it's it's pixelated. It looks

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Speaker 1: like something from an eight bit video game, and it's

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Speaker 1: kind of different shades of gray. Yeah, and it does

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Speaker 1: not really prove all that effective, and yet it's been

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Speaker 1: in use for eight years. Yeah. This goes back to

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Speaker 1: problems that we ran into when we UM, when we

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Speaker 1: first started getting really heavily invested again in a desert

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Speaker 1: combat environments. Okay, so we were we were using the

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Speaker 1: three colored desert, but we didn't have enough stuff to

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Speaker 1: go around it was. It was decked out in that

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Speaker 1: particular particular camera. So you'd have guys who were given

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Speaker 1: this three three colored desert camo, but then they had

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Speaker 1: dark packs strapped on top of that, and it was

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Speaker 1: a uh essentially supposedly like like a bull bull's eye

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Speaker 1: because mismatch pieces, right, mismatch pieces, and it makes you vulnerable.

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Speaker 1: So US Army says, all right, let's do this. Let's

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Speaker 1: let's let's get this going. Let's invest some funds, let's

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Speaker 1: test some patterns, and that's how it's generally, it generally

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Speaker 1: goes at this point. Um, you don't just pick something

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Speaker 1: off a wall at the home depot. Though an article

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Speaker 1: I read did involved some soldiers to the home depot

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Speaker 1: and having them look at colors. I believe that was

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Speaker 1: the Marines uniform and they took a swatch from Ralph

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Speaker 1: Laurence collection. It was a brown shade and they said, okay,

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Speaker 1: let's see this in this But of course there was

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Speaker 1: tons of research done and you know, this was just

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Speaker 1: one piece of it. Yeah, the marine one that you

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Speaker 1: mentioned was called mar pat and it first appeared in

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Speaker 1: two thousand two and and you had, you know, dozens

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Speaker 1: of candidates that were considered for this role. The Marines

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Speaker 1: from the sniper school at Quantico were involved in picking

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Speaker 1: out things for it. And it did have a pixelated

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Speaker 1: look to it. It had this kind of eight bit

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Speaker 1: sixteen bit kind of pixelated thing going on, and this

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Speaker 1: like pretty nifty to some people over at the U. S. Army, Right,

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Speaker 1: And as you said, there was a process that was

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Speaker 1: going on and they were testing a ton of patterns.

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Speaker 1: But the problem here, and this isn't an interview with

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Speaker 1: the Daily UM which talked about the story. I guess

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Speaker 1: about a week ago or so. Here in June UM

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Speaker 1: several Army researchers said Army Brass interfered in selection process

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Speaker 1: during the last round, letting looks in politics get in

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Speaker 1: the way of science. Yes, soups like something called desert

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Speaker 1: Brush was was actually um making its way to the top.

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Speaker 1: That was that was the one that people were leaning

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Speaker 1: to towards that was performing well in test. But then

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Speaker 1: Program Executive Officers Soldier, which is a program that that's

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Speaker 1: in charge of actually making the decisions here. They they

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Speaker 1: allegedly jumped the gun and picked UCP, that universal color

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Speaker 1: pattern that we mentioned earlier, and put it into production.

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Speaker 1: And this is what has been really troublesome for a

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Speaker 1: lot of military Um yeah, because what they essentially did

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Speaker 1: was that they actually I say, they picked you u CP,

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Speaker 1: but actually what they did is they said, well, let's

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Speaker 1: take the colors from Desert Brush, where you know you've done,

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Speaker 1: You've tested these colors. That's great, but we really like

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Speaker 1: this pixelated things. So take those colors, dump them into

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Speaker 1: this pixelated format and let's go with that. That way,

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Speaker 1: we'll we'll have your research, but we also have the

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Speaker 1: thing that I like and then that'll that'll be the

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Speaker 1: finished product, which kind of sounds to I mean, they're

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Speaker 1: they're giving into a trend. They're combining two different things.

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Speaker 1: Um It kind of strikes me as kind of a

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Speaker 1: pride and prejudice with zombies kind of factor where if you,

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Speaker 1: you know, take take two distinct elements combined it together,

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Speaker 1: it sounds good on paper, but in reality it wasn't

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Speaker 1: very rigorous and at least in the last steps, right,

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Speaker 1: and so they kind of shortcut the process and it

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Speaker 1: was some noncommissioned officers who complained to um UH, the

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Speaker 1: Representative John Murtha who took up the issue in two

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Speaker 1: thousand and nine. And finally today we have something else

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Speaker 1: that's come into play, and this is the multi CAAM.

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Speaker 1: This is I don't know if you could call it

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Speaker 1: a band aid fix, but in the interim, this is

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Speaker 1: a new pattern that's been introduced to try to fix

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Speaker 1: this problem that the u C p UM. It's kind

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Speaker 1: of a placeholder. Yeah, it's like, let's get U C

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Speaker 1: p out of here because it sucks. Let's get let's

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Speaker 1: get something usable. So multi caam is here until we

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Speaker 1: can actually finish up deciding and h implementing the camouflage

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Speaker 1: we actually want. Multicam is um. It's in keeping with

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Speaker 1: the previous brown green, tan designs, but with the kind

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Speaker 1: of a hint of Jackson Pollock to it. Yeah. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so I'm glad you brought up Pollock because here's the deal.

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Speaker 1: You know, we're not just talking about this five billion

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Speaker 1: dollar issue of this one uniform. We're actually talking about

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Speaker 1: the whole culture of camouflage and how it came into play.

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Speaker 1: And it turns out that artists are very much and

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Speaker 1: In fact, Cubism is very much responsible for camouflage patterns.

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Speaker 1: And if we go all the way back to the nine,

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Speaker 1: you'll see that the US created the American camouflage Corpse,

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Speaker 1: and and that enlisted rather core and listened to the

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Speaker 1: creative talents of renowned painter, sculptors and designers because they

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Speaker 1: realized that these artists were onto something in terms of cubism,

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Speaker 1: which you know, takes these scenes from real life and

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Speaker 1: then kind of breaks them apart in patterns, right, and

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Speaker 1: then reassembles them. That is essentially what these camouflage patterns

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Speaker 1: are doing as well. Camouflage, as the name implies, camouflage

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Speaker 1: of course, begins with the French. I believe it's French

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Speaker 1: for hidden cheese, is right, Uh, I don't know, I

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Speaker 1: may be wrong on that, but but no camouflage comes.

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Speaker 1: I wouldn't that made chemoa but that the French stuff

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Speaker 1: first adapted camouflage in ninet And I mean that alone's

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Speaker 1: kind of sounds surprising because animals, of course have been

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Speaker 1: doing it forever. I mean, camouflage is part of evolved

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Speaker 1: natural defense techniques. And certainly you can point to various

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Speaker 1: things in history in ancient history even where you can say, oh,

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Speaker 1: well this this particular force was using camouflage to some degree,

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Speaker 1: but certainly as far as modern armies go. I mean

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Speaker 1: this was modern armies were uniformed ordeals. It was it

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Speaker 1: was about knowing who was who on the battlefield. It

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Speaker 1: wasn't as much about about blending in and beIN disguising yourself.

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Speaker 1: M it was about looking sharp prior to that. And

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Speaker 1: when the French started using camouflage, they were really more

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Speaker 1: concerned with camouflaging equipped. They're like, all right, let's keep

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Speaker 1: this is an important piece of equipment. Let's make sure

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Speaker 1: the enemy doesn't see it. And then it spreads out

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Speaker 1: from there to say, hey, we could actually camouflage ourselves

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Speaker 1: and that would be beneficial as well. Yeah. Actually, there's

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Speaker 1: a woman named Claudia T. Covert. Claudia T. Covert, like

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Speaker 1: this is the best name for this. She is a

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Speaker 1: librarian and expert on the history of military camouflage at

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Speaker 1: the Rhode Island School of Design and Providence, and she

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Speaker 1: says that they were they're actually using camouflage to decoy

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Speaker 1: log so that snipers could line them, or painting decorative

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Speaker 1: sheets of canvas to look like roads so they're using

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Speaker 1: it for that type of such refuge, but not necessarily

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Speaker 1: on their person, right, And so you know in NT

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Speaker 1: nine you have the artist and naturalist Abbot there and

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Speaker 1: he wrote the Father of Modern Camouflage. Yeah, he wrote

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Speaker 1: Concealing Coloration in the Animal Kingdom, and he observed two

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Speaker 1: ways that animals camouflaged themselves in wild blend and dazzle.

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Speaker 1: And we'll talk about dazzle a bit more, but that's

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Speaker 1: kind of a disruptive pattern that creates confusion. Like it

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Speaker 1: basically comes down to you have animals that have dark

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Speaker 1: backs and white underbellies. Which it's when I think of that,

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Speaker 1: I can't help but think of of the of the

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Speaker 1: prospect of of soldiers running around the battlefield essentially in

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Speaker 1: uh like bunny costumes you know, where they're painted up,

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Speaker 1: Like what if they had actually taken that literally they're like, Wow,

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Speaker 1: these rabbits have figured out, let's get some rabbit costumes

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Speaker 1: on that on that battlefield. But maybe that was the

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Speaker 1: first idea. You know, Well, their notices that you know,

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Speaker 1: when they used this in this way, it's not just

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Speaker 1: so that their deli is cute and it looks like

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Speaker 1: it needs to be scratched at all. But it's because

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Speaker 1: when the when the sun hits their backs and the

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Speaker 1: darkness hits the underbelly, the animals become flat and they

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Speaker 1: will end in by counterbalancing shadows. So this is uh,

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Speaker 1: this is dazzling in action. Yeah, and again we'll talk

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Speaker 1: about that in a little bit, but um, you know

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Speaker 1: that's the idea though, of camouflage really didn't come into

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Speaker 1: play until General um Douglas MacArthur, who decided that he

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Speaker 1: wanted a hundred fifty thousand jungle kits um, including some

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Speaker 1: still experimental uniforms. So previous to that it was used.

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Speaker 1: But you know, World War two is when we really

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Speaker 1: saw it come into play. Yeah, avoided whatever. I mean.

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Speaker 1: The the camouflage of of the Second World War is

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Speaker 1: pretty amazing. Um My, my father was a huge World

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Speaker 1: War Two junkie, I guess, and uh, and so I

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Speaker 1: grew up always looking at these various various drawings and

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Speaker 1: illustrations of especially a German and US infantry camouflage designs,

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Speaker 1: and it it just it's crazy to so much of it,

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Speaker 1: and some of it is that kind of dazzling effect

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Speaker 1: where it's it's all about like like lightning bolt kind

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Speaker 1: of shapes that kind of break up to sorrient your eyes,

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Speaker 1: sorient your eyes, and just break up the continuity of

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Speaker 1: the human form um. So so just like any when

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Speaker 1: you actually start looking at CAMA, it's easily to just

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Speaker 1: sort of think of camera and be like camouflage. But

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Speaker 1: when you really start looking at all the patterns, even

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Speaker 1: if you don't know anything about it, you quickly realize,

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Speaker 1: you know, there's something going on here, like a lot

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Speaker 1: of people are putting a lot of thoughts into the

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Speaker 1: creation of these various textiles. Yeah, and let's let's take

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Speaker 1: a quick break and when we come back, let's talk

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Speaker 1: about a bit more about camera basics, um and this

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Speaker 1: thing that we call it dazzle. All right, so we're back,

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Speaker 1: and yeah, we're gonna talk a little bit aboutdazzling. Not

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Speaker 1: to be confused with the dazzling, because you don't want

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Speaker 1: to be dazzle of battleship. I mean, it might be

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Speaker 1: partially effective, but it's although like if you are a

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Speaker 1: contestant on you know, like pubblers and tierras, that might well,

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Speaker 1: actually that's don't really that's the opposite of camouflage, right, Bedazzling. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm trying to think of how you can bedazzle yourself.

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Speaker 1: I guess the opposite of bedazzling would be when you

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Speaker 1: take tiny shells and you glue them to something, you know,

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Speaker 1: like you encounter at the gift shops on the Gulf coast. Right,

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Speaker 1: there's some sort of rustic bedazzling. Yeah. Yeah, thebably could

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Speaker 1: do that to a battleship, to be like, oh, it's

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Speaker 1: a battleship. No, it's a it's a bunch of shells,

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Speaker 1: it's a giant shell. Often you'll see the Google eyes

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Speaker 1: to what you've been used in that Google e blew

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Speaker 1: a bunch of shells something some Google eyes on it,

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Speaker 1: and you've got yourself nicknack. But but when we're talking

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Speaker 1: about we're talking about dazzling, which you really need to

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Speaker 1: see an image of this, and I'll make sure that

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Speaker 1: we have an image of this on the blog post

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Speaker 1: that goes up with this episode. But the easiest way

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Speaker 1: to describe it is imagine getting yourself some blacks, some whites,

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Speaker 1: some dark, some light colors and painting a battleship up

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Speaker 1: like a lightning bolt zebra. Yeah yeah, yeah, yes, that's

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Speaker 1: very good. That kind of design description um. Yeah. And

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Speaker 1: the reason for this is because you can't hide a

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Speaker 1: hulking piece of metal floating on the horizon. Right. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: It's one thing to kmo a tank, to Camo and jacket. Um.

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Speaker 1: Even to Cammo an airplane is a simpler experiment that

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Speaker 1: make it recede into the background. Yeah. But but a ship,

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Speaker 1: there's not a lot you can do. People are gonna

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Speaker 1: see it. So what you could But what you can

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Speaker 1: do is by adding this to these dazzle elements, you can,

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Speaker 1: for instance, make it difficult for U boat to tell

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Speaker 1: which direction it's going in. Yeah, and this is really

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Speaker 1: important too. I'm glad you brought up the U boat.

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Speaker 1: This is really the impetus for Dazzle because in y

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Speaker 1: five British ships were sunk by German U boats over

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Speaker 1: an eight month period, and so they realized that they

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Speaker 1: needed to do something. Um and naval officer and artist

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Speaker 1: Norman Wilkinson convinced the British government to use the principles

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Speaker 1: of Cubism and Dazzle to try to at least throw

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Speaker 1: off the direction that the torpedo might be heading at

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Speaker 1: least by a couple of degrees, which you know, would

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Speaker 1: save lives. Yeah, all you have to do is get

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Speaker 1: it a little little off. And uh well, first of all,

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Speaker 1: the morale boosted on the ships, which which should come

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Speaker 1: as no surprised because you just turned this dreary, drab

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Speaker 1: ship into uh, I mean, it looks like a party vessel. Now,

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Speaker 1: it looks like a piece of abstract art. It's taken

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Speaker 1: to the high seas under the command of you know,

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Speaker 1: Commander Dolly or something. But well, yeah, and you're harnessing

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Speaker 1: the lightning and zebras, the power of both of them. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but more importantly, after they started using the dazzling effects,

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Speaker 1: fewer than one percent of American merchant ships that were

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Speaker 1: dazzled were lost. So that's pretty impressive. Yeah. And so

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Speaker 1: the cool thing about that is paint is cheap. That's

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Speaker 1: the other thing to my mind. I mean, it takes

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Speaker 1: a little time to paint up a ship, but in

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Speaker 1: the grand scheme of things, that is a really cheap

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Speaker 1: method of defense. And this dazzle effect, again is disorienting

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Speaker 1: the eye, so if you're you're aiming at it, you

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Speaker 1: can't quite figure out if it's heading east or west.

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Speaker 1: And again this is the key to its success. Um

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Speaker 1: let's talk about something called component part and this is

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Speaker 1: from Tom Harris's article How Camouflage Works. He's talking about

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Speaker 1: one of the reasons why it works really well is

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Speaker 1: that when you look at a scene, you're gathering a

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Speaker 1: huge amount of information with your eyes, and so in

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Speaker 1: order for your conscious mind to make any sense of this,

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Speaker 1: your brain has to basically break it down into component parts. Um. So,

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Speaker 1: when your brain perceives a long vertical area of brown

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Speaker 1: with green blotches connected to you see a tree. And

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Speaker 1: when your brain sees many, many, many individual trees, you

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Speaker 1: see a forest. And I thought this is a great example. Um.

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Speaker 1: He also talks about this idea of continuity. So if

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Speaker 1: you see a stack of twelve blocks and they're all red,

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Speaker 1: you perceive that as one unit. Break up the colors,

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Speaker 1: you know, the bottom is blue, the top is red.

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Speaker 1: Then you see two units then begin to vary alternate

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Speaker 1: those colors, and you begin to see a whole bunch

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Speaker 1: of different units. And this is when you see that

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Speaker 1: pattern of camouflaged doing the same thing. Yeah, the difference

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Speaker 1: between seeing even a you know, I'm discolored, say human head,

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Speaker 1: human torso legs, are you know, the basic human form

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Speaker 1: break that up even a little bit, and it takes

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Speaker 1: a little more time for us to assemble that into

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Speaker 1: something sensible. I mean, we've all had those moments where

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Speaker 1: you see something a little strange and you end up

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Speaker 1: doing like a double take, even a triple take, or

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Speaker 1: it just takes you a second to realize what is

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Speaker 1: that person doing? Is that a person is that you

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Speaker 1: know what's going on there? And that's kind of the

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Speaker 1: same effect. It uh creates a little lag time, um

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Speaker 1: in figuring out exactly what you're looking at. And the

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Speaker 1: reason for this is because when we've talked about this

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Speaker 1: a million times, our brains are so well trained at

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Speaker 1: creating patterns, seeking out patterns, so breaking up patterns is

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Speaker 1: really important. And then also um this idea of contour

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Speaker 1: of following the pattern too, So that's another thing that

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Speaker 1: these modeled effects from camera does really well. So if

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Speaker 1: you are a soldier out in a field, what you

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Speaker 1: want is the curve of your body line to then

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Speaker 1: mimic the curve of the landscapes, and that's what that

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Speaker 1: that modeled pattern is doing. Yeah, I mean, and of

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Speaker 1: course the obvious your chain in colors to fit the

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Speaker 1: colors of the environment. In some cases you're you know,

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Speaker 1: you even see like snipers that use bits of of

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Speaker 1: the flora on their their their outfit. Maybe the fine

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Speaker 1: up too. I don't know if they get get a

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Speaker 1: little super clue happy there, but no, that would that

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Speaker 1: would be a terrible idea. But but also it's important

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Speaker 1: that you have elements of Cubism going on here as well. Um,

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Speaker 1: early twentieth century you have guys like Pablo Picasto, uh,

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Speaker 1: and they're going around in there breaking things down into

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Speaker 1: tiny cubes. You know, they're they're they're pixelating it all out,

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Speaker 1: smashing it together, and and that is uh, that's basically

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Speaker 1: what's going on in some of these camouflage patterns there,

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Speaker 1: attempting to do that to something without actually taking the

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Speaker 1: human body and breaking into a bunch of piece. Well,

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Speaker 1: and we've talked about this too, that that one of

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Speaker 1: the reasons why art moves us so much is that

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Speaker 1: it takes something that's familiar to us and makes it

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Speaker 1: unfamiliar and then yet understood again. Um. And so it's

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Speaker 1: that that idea where you're breaking apart something that you

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Speaker 1: don't expect um and it works really well. And in

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Speaker 1: in this scenario of warfare, to an extent, you're turning

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Speaker 1: soldiers into art on the battlefield, you're turning ships into

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Speaker 1: art in a way. Yeah. Um, I want to so

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Speaker 1: what do you do when you can't camo? When camo

404
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Speaker 1: is not enough? Right, Well, I mean certainly you can

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Speaker 1: use decoys in this direction. Um. I mean we we

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Speaker 1: saw that in uh Normandy. I mean where we you know,

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Speaker 1: we actually have uh actually forcing the enemy to look

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Speaker 1: in the wrong direction through the use of of a

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Speaker 1: false preparations for invasion. Um. Are these the cities that

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Speaker 1: they created the sort of like the flimsy structures? Yeah? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know, you create fake tanks even in circumstances, you know,

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Speaker 1: or or fake ships, something to force the enemy to

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Speaker 1: look look away from the thing that is most important. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I read something like in the Battle of Britain, Allied

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Speaker 1: forces that have more than five hundred false cities, um, bases,

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Speaker 1: airfields and shipyards. And this this is brilliant, right because,

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Speaker 1: as you say, it redirects um the enemy and the

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Speaker 1: enemies using their resources, perhaps even bombing these false cities. Um.

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Speaker 1: But the problem is these days, in our modern times,

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Speaker 1: is that now we have um, very telltale signs of

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Speaker 1: our presence, right, we have signatures exactly. There are more

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Speaker 1: ways to see something than to see it. We can

423
00:22:33,520 --> 00:22:36,639
Speaker 1: use thermal imaging to detect the heat heat source of something.

424
00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:40,400
Speaker 1: We can use a sonar to use sound to see

425
00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:45,240
Speaker 1: something for us. Radar sees thing of you basically feels

426
00:22:45,280 --> 00:22:47,439
Speaker 1: things in the air for us and let us know

427
00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:51,399
Speaker 1: that they are present. And you have enhanced imaging to um.

428
00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:53,080
Speaker 1: But you know, we can try to thwart this to

429
00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:56,680
Speaker 1: some degree, like smoke screens or fog, and yet there's

430
00:22:56,680 --> 00:22:59,160
Speaker 1: always going to be some sort of movement that indicates

431
00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:01,760
Speaker 1: our presence. I also read a little bit about people

432
00:23:01,840 --> 00:23:06,600
Speaker 1: using basically dazzling techniques as face paint to mess with

433
00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:12,199
Speaker 1: facial recognition software. So that's interesting, like urban cammo of

434
00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:14,520
Speaker 1: the future. Yeah, exactly, because I mean it's kind of

435
00:23:14,560 --> 00:23:17,960
Speaker 1: like think of what do you call the disguise letters

436
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:21,000
Speaker 1: the capture stuff on the internet. You know, it has

437
00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:23,000
Speaker 1: that that's sort of missed in front of it, and

438
00:23:23,040 --> 00:23:24,879
Speaker 1: they're sort of confused a little bit to keep a

439
00:23:24,960 --> 00:23:28,160
Speaker 1: eyes from eating it. Uh So it's that in a way,

440
00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:30,960
Speaker 1: it's kind of camouflaged well to break up what the

441
00:23:30,960 --> 00:23:34,760
Speaker 1: AI can see. We always talk about these dystopian futures.

442
00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:36,719
Speaker 1: And I can see that in terms of you know,

443
00:23:36,760 --> 00:23:41,439
Speaker 1: if if if privacy issues went completely awry and you

444
00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:43,920
Speaker 1: wanted to, you know, have some sort of modicum of

445
00:23:44,040 --> 00:23:45,960
Speaker 1: privacy that you might do that you might paint up

446
00:23:45,960 --> 00:23:48,960
Speaker 1: your face. What's you're thinking about? Pattern recognition? You know,

447
00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:51,560
Speaker 1: I'm talking again and again about how that is core

448
00:23:51,680 --> 00:23:54,840
Speaker 1: to how humans behave and and and then we're talking

449
00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:58,320
Speaker 1: about taking that knowledge and using it to ensure survival.

450
00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:00,720
Speaker 1: So we know that you're the predator or is out there,

451
00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:03,920
Speaker 1: and then it's using um pattern recognition to see where

452
00:24:03,960 --> 00:24:08,000
Speaker 1: we are and then attacks. You also read accounts when

453
00:24:08,119 --> 00:24:11,159
Speaker 1: when people are being advised about public safety, say someone's

454
00:24:11,280 --> 00:24:15,680
Speaker 1: a diplomat in a in a hostile city. Uh, they

455
00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:19,080
Speaker 1: often advised them, you know, don't don't get patterns going,

456
00:24:19,160 --> 00:24:23,760
Speaker 1: you know, because that's if if every day at eight

457
00:24:23,760 --> 00:24:26,879
Speaker 1: o'clock exactly and you're forming a pattern, you're you're opening

458
00:24:26,920 --> 00:24:29,680
Speaker 1: yourself up to to attack that way of potential kidnapping

459
00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:33,720
Speaker 1: or what have you. UM. So if to whatever extent

460
00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:37,320
Speaker 1: you can, you can jam that pattern recognition on the

461
00:24:37,320 --> 00:24:40,000
Speaker 1: part of your enemies, Uh, the better off you are

462
00:24:40,040 --> 00:24:43,560
Speaker 1: in terms of survival. Now, the other interesting thing is

463
00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:46,960
Speaker 1: that the human brain can train itself, or we can

464
00:24:46,960 --> 00:24:51,520
Speaker 1: train our brains to to see through some of these ruses.

465
00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:54,440
Speaker 1: Right are you talking m R. I, Yeah, yeah, I'm

466
00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:57,600
Speaker 1: talking about This is something that's apparently going on here

467
00:24:57,600 --> 00:25:00,600
Speaker 1: in Georgia at the Medical College of Georgia at Georgia

468
00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:09,280
Speaker 1: Haill Sciences University. And this involves breaking camouflage. The idea

469
00:25:09,359 --> 00:25:11,800
Speaker 1: that and this is something that people have done for

470
00:25:11,800 --> 00:25:13,439
Speaker 1: a while, the military has done for a while. You

471
00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:16,080
Speaker 1: get snipers or whoever out there. You you get them

472
00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:17,639
Speaker 1: out in the field and you start showing them some

473
00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:20,760
Speaker 1: camouflage things and it forces them to actually you get

474
00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:22,320
Speaker 1: used to it. You begin to see through it a

475
00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:25,200
Speaker 1: little more. So you see the trick enough times you

476
00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:28,520
Speaker 1: you know how it works, right, and you cut down

477
00:25:28,520 --> 00:25:31,080
Speaker 1: on the amount of processing time required to see through

478
00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:35,560
Speaker 1: the misdirection and the and the breaking of continuity. Um.

479
00:25:35,720 --> 00:25:39,280
Speaker 1: So in this uh, this particular study, though, they flash

480
00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:42,280
Speaker 1: a series of camouflage pictures on a computer screen, providing

481
00:25:42,280 --> 00:25:45,560
Speaker 1: about half a second after each spot um to see

482
00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:48,359
Speaker 1: things like like a face and a sea of mushrooms,

483
00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:49,960
Speaker 1: things like that. So some of it's a little you know,

484
00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:53,399
Speaker 1: it's not just a camou pattern. And then then they

485
00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:55,200
Speaker 1: do this deal with like a green light signals a

486
00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:59,240
Speaker 1: correct answer, red light signals and incorrect answer, and they

487
00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:02,160
Speaker 1: the person is learning, yeah, the first learning as they're going.

488
00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:05,320
Speaker 1: And they find that an hour of daily training in

489
00:26:05,359 --> 00:26:08,720
Speaker 1: this kind of computer environment versus a field environment, um

490
00:26:08,760 --> 00:26:11,119
Speaker 1: in as little as two weeks results in proficiency for

491
00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:15,560
Speaker 1: six of the mostly college and graduate school students that

492
00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:19,600
Speaker 1: signed after this training. So um, So that's interesting. The

493
00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:22,880
Speaker 1: idea that then in the future, the future soldier will

494
00:26:22,920 --> 00:26:28,679
Speaker 1: have had virtual training in breaking camouflage. But presumably this

495
00:26:28,760 --> 00:26:32,320
Speaker 1: is useful for sniper, right, yes, especially for sniper or

496
00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:35,640
Speaker 1: special forces kind of scenario. But but where it gets

497
00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:38,159
Speaker 1: gets interesting here is that you know, obviously it's a

498
00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:41,240
Speaker 1: we're gonna lab, we're studying how people were breaking camouflage.

499
00:26:41,560 --> 00:26:43,320
Speaker 1: Let's go ahead and get some fm R eyes in there,

500
00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:46,600
Speaker 1: look into the brain and watch some fluids flow around. Right,

501
00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:51,240
Speaker 1: So they they were able to corner it to a

502
00:26:51,280 --> 00:26:53,560
Speaker 1: Two regions of the temporal lobe found on either side

503
00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:56,720
Speaker 1: of the brain, and there are areas that are involved

504
00:26:56,800 --> 00:26:59,920
Speaker 1: in speech and vision. One region is called the feast

505
00:26:59,920 --> 00:27:02,679
Speaker 1: of form gyrus and This plays a role in facial

506
00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:07,560
Speaker 1: recognition and lights up when people become experts at recognizing

507
00:27:08,119 --> 00:27:12,240
Speaker 1: certain objects such as a particular bird species or you

508
00:27:12,240 --> 00:27:14,960
Speaker 1: know somebody that's an expert on knots or flags, cars,

509
00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:17,719
Speaker 1: car make Yeah. Yeah, the kind of person that can

510
00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:19,960
Speaker 1: look at me like, uh, she was in such and

511
00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:22,760
Speaker 1: such a movie and she directed, you know, whatever your

512
00:27:22,800 --> 00:27:24,760
Speaker 1: thing is. That's the area of the brain that that

513
00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:28,120
Speaker 1: maybe lighting up. Um. The parts of the brain involved

514
00:27:28,760 --> 00:27:31,960
Speaker 1: in camera recognition, though they vary with the object of

515
00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:36,000
Speaker 1: the attention. For example, your ability to easily recognize the

516
00:27:36,080 --> 00:27:39,200
Speaker 1: car doesn't necessarily mean that you're going to be great

517
00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:42,960
Speaker 1: at understanding camouflage. But but they do see some correlation

518
00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:45,800
Speaker 1: there between between those parts of the grant and the

519
00:27:45,840 --> 00:27:49,000
Speaker 1: brain and breaking the camouflage. Also, doesn't it wasn't there

520
00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:51,160
Speaker 1: some sort of mentioned that even if you're a really

521
00:27:51,160 --> 00:27:53,959
Speaker 1: good game hunter, that doesn't mean that you would necessarily

522
00:27:54,040 --> 00:27:57,879
Speaker 1: be great at being a military slick. Yeah, skills don't

523
00:27:57,880 --> 00:28:03,320
Speaker 1: often overlap perfectly, so it's very specialized. So that's the

524
00:28:03,560 --> 00:28:06,879
Speaker 1: that'll be interesting to see what is extrapolated from that

525
00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:09,720
Speaker 1: study in the long run, you know, what they can

526
00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:12,560
Speaker 1: learn about that sort of specialization. It's interesting in speaking

527
00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:16,000
Speaker 1: of you know, the fact that that that expert snipers

528
00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:18,480
Speaker 1: are not always good at a hunting game. I remember

529
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:23,040
Speaker 1: reading that like tail gunners and uh ball tret gunners

530
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:26,480
Speaker 1: in World War two Arab bombers, and they're training people

531
00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:28,680
Speaker 1: for that. They found that the game hunters were often

532
00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:32,240
Speaker 1: better at that because they they had grown accustomed to

533
00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:35,320
Speaker 1: leading a target, and so they were better to shoot

534
00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:39,040
Speaker 1: at like say, you know it's a loofwoff up airplane,

535
00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:42,040
Speaker 1: a mattressment or something moving across the sky because I

536
00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:44,320
Speaker 1: having to lead it slightly to hit it with those

537
00:28:44,400 --> 00:28:51,080
Speaker 1: uh those those bullets. Okay, interesting, Okay, So of course

538
00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:53,520
Speaker 1: there's going to be a future of CAMA. Yes, um,

539
00:28:53,560 --> 00:28:55,880
Speaker 1: you know, like you say, we're in an age where

540
00:28:55,880 --> 00:28:59,520
Speaker 1: our technology allows us to see things in these various ways.

541
00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:01,920
Speaker 1: We can you can we can use thermal imaging to

542
00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:03,560
Speaker 1: detect the heat of a person or the heat of

543
00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:06,640
Speaker 1: an engine. So we're we're already working on cooling methods,

544
00:29:06,760 --> 00:29:09,400
Speaker 1: and we're already employing cooling methods to to make say

545
00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:13,640
Speaker 1: a ship appear less hot out on the sea. And

546
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:15,960
Speaker 1: and interestingly enough, you also see the same thing and

547
00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:18,600
Speaker 1: grow houses, Um right, because you don't want to see

548
00:29:18,600 --> 00:29:20,520
Speaker 1: the smoke, you don't want to see the exhaust coming

549
00:29:20,520 --> 00:29:23,479
Speaker 1: out right. Um yeah, I wrote an article on grow houses.

550
00:29:23,680 --> 00:29:26,160
Speaker 1: Did we do a podcast on this? Maybe that was

551
00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:30,040
Speaker 1: the olden days? But um, but you have situation, you know,

552
00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:32,920
Speaker 1: you have situations where individuals and groups of individuals are

553
00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:36,520
Speaker 1: putting all this money into growing marijuana in an enclosed environment,

554
00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:40,520
Speaker 1: and they often become like spaceships because they're they're you know,

555
00:29:40,560 --> 00:29:44,120
Speaker 1: they're they're adjusting the atmosphere inside of this house. Uh,

556
00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:47,080
Speaker 1: They're they're powering up with lights so that these things grow,

557
00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:51,480
Speaker 1: you know, twenty four hour daylight, and then they're having

558
00:29:51,480 --> 00:29:54,760
Speaker 1: to worry about outsiders finding it. Um to a certain degree,

559
00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:57,520
Speaker 1: other criminals but especially law enforcement, and law enforcement just

560
00:29:57,560 --> 00:30:00,200
Speaker 1: gets smarter and smarter. They're looking into how much hour

561
00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:03,600
Speaker 1: is a grow house consuming, um, you know, who's coming,

562
00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:07,920
Speaker 1: who's going. But also thermal imaging, because you're gonna you're

563
00:30:07,920 --> 00:30:10,760
Speaker 1: gonna have a lot of heat going on in that

564
00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:15,120
Speaker 1: house from all those lights. So you have seen situations

565
00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:18,640
Speaker 1: where the criminals that are trying to grow this marilina

566
00:30:18,840 --> 00:30:21,560
Speaker 1: in a grow house will use sort of double walls,

567
00:30:21,760 --> 00:30:24,000
Speaker 1: so they'll have UM, they'll have their they'll have their

568
00:30:24,080 --> 00:30:26,920
Speaker 1: room that has the plants in an elevated heat, and

569
00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:31,640
Speaker 1: then you'll have this chamber that is cooled, and then

570
00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:34,120
Speaker 1: you'll have the wall so that that will disrupt the

571
00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:37,360
Speaker 1: ability to to see all the thermal activity inside the house.

572
00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:41,080
Speaker 1: So with a ship, they're basically taking that exhaust um

573
00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:42,960
Speaker 1: and then running it through the steawater to cool it

574
00:30:42,960 --> 00:30:46,640
Speaker 1: off so you don't see that to exhaust plume of

575
00:30:46,760 --> 00:30:49,760
Speaker 1: thermal heat. Yeah, and I've also heard about the materials

576
00:30:49,800 --> 00:30:53,320
Speaker 1: too that UM will actually help to keep excess heat

577
00:30:53,680 --> 00:30:59,280
Speaker 1: from escaping UM. And presumably this is used in clothing,

578
00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:02,200
Speaker 1: but also on tanks. I've seen them us on tanks

579
00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:04,760
Speaker 1: as well. So it really is now a game of

580
00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:07,560
Speaker 1: you know, these these sort of biometric measures that we're

581
00:31:07,560 --> 00:31:10,440
Speaker 1: trying to control. Yeah, at least in terms of not

582
00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:14,160
Speaker 1: trying to give ourselves away. UM. I like this idea

583
00:31:14,200 --> 00:31:17,920
Speaker 1: of smart camouflage, the outer coverings there that will at

584
00:31:18,000 --> 00:31:21,760
Speaker 1: least at some point alter themselves based on computer analysis

585
00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:25,920
Speaker 1: of changing surroundings. It sounds very futuristic. I'm loving it.

586
00:31:26,120 --> 00:31:28,120
Speaker 1: I just wonder when it's going to come into play

587
00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:31,120
Speaker 1: and what exactly it will be. Yeah, I mean it's

588
00:31:31,120 --> 00:31:33,880
Speaker 1: gonna be something similar to I mean the idea that

589
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:36,640
Speaker 1: you could change the color of your car at any moment. Uh,

590
00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:38,280
Speaker 1: you know, push a button, you want it red, you

591
00:31:38,280 --> 00:31:40,520
Speaker 1: want it green, you want it blue, and you just

592
00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:43,600
Speaker 1: you just pus a button and it changes. Um, it's

593
00:31:43,640 --> 00:31:45,520
Speaker 1: gonna be something like that, except it's going to be

594
00:31:45,520 --> 00:31:48,840
Speaker 1: tied into smart technology, so that essentially, like even if

595
00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:50,800
Speaker 1: you were limited to those some of those designs we

596
00:31:50,840 --> 00:31:53,320
Speaker 1: talked about at the start of the program, Uh, it

597
00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:55,760
Speaker 1: might be said something as simple as, um, you know,

598
00:31:55,800 --> 00:31:59,479
Speaker 1: imagine you have a little sensor on your clothing and

599
00:31:59,520 --> 00:32:02,520
Speaker 1: it x whether this is an environment that is more

600
00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:06,000
Speaker 1: of a woodland camouflage environment or a six colored desert environment,

601
00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:11,160
Speaker 1: and then it'll shift accordingly. Now, the more outlandish examples

602
00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:14,800
Speaker 1: of future camouflage, of course, involved bending light, and they

603
00:32:14,840 --> 00:32:18,880
Speaker 1: involved invisibility or the insility cloak that's come up before

604
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:20,680
Speaker 1: a lot in the medium. And we have an article

605
00:32:20,680 --> 00:32:23,160
Speaker 1: on this that I've I've worked on along with at

606
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:26,200
Speaker 1: least one other rider, have tinkered with it because we're

607
00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:28,880
Speaker 1: constantly updating it because there's always some sort of new

608
00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:32,560
Speaker 1: quote unquote invisibility cloak technology coming around, and the article

609
00:32:32,600 --> 00:32:36,360
Speaker 1: is called how the invisibility the invisibility cloaks work. The

610
00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:39,400
Speaker 1: schemes for this very there's there are some very sort

611
00:32:39,400 --> 00:32:43,160
Speaker 1: of crude schemes that involve using a video camera and

612
00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:46,240
Speaker 1: projecting what's behind you on the front of you, which

613
00:32:46,320 --> 00:32:50,360
Speaker 1: is is very limited and clunky, but could potentially be

614
00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:54,000
Speaker 1: used especially with especially with with like theay of building

615
00:32:54,080 --> 00:32:58,280
Speaker 1: or something, you know, something stationary, something stationary. Likewise, you

616
00:32:58,360 --> 00:33:01,680
Speaker 1: have a number of experiments that involve the bending of

617
00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:06,040
Speaker 1: light um sometimes you know, using nanomaterials to recreate what

618
00:33:06,120 --> 00:33:09,400
Speaker 1: happens in a mirage to hide an object, basically making

619
00:33:09,440 --> 00:33:12,400
Speaker 1: to where light waves move around it so that you

620
00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:17,000
Speaker 1: you end up seeing, uh, maybe a distortion of what

621
00:33:17,200 --> 00:33:19,640
Speaker 1: is behind the object rather than the object itself. And

622
00:33:19,680 --> 00:33:23,080
Speaker 1: they're also nanoparticle um experiments that have have tested this

623
00:33:23,160 --> 00:33:25,920
Speaker 1: ability to bend a sound as well, so that you

624
00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:30,280
Speaker 1: won't hear the object. But these these tests um are

625
00:33:30,320 --> 00:33:32,680
Speaker 1: all taking place at a very small scale, often not

626
00:33:32,840 --> 00:33:37,320
Speaker 1: only two dimensions, so it's not something that's uh that's

627
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:40,640
Speaker 1: necessarily feel ready right now, and it's certainly something we

628
00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:42,760
Speaker 1: could talk about for a whole other podcast too, so

629
00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:46,040
Speaker 1: you're only you're only getting your toes wet in invisibility

630
00:33:46,040 --> 00:33:49,880
Speaker 1: cloak here, but suffice to say that we're working on it.

631
00:33:50,280 --> 00:33:53,280
Speaker 1: There's also something that I recently read. Researchers from the

632
00:33:53,360 --> 00:33:56,320
Speaker 1: University of Bristol have created artificial muscles that can be

633
00:33:56,360 --> 00:33:58,680
Speaker 1: transformed at a flick of a switch to mimic the

634
00:33:59,160 --> 00:34:05,560
Speaker 1: camouflaging ability ease of creatures like squid and zebrafish. Yeah,

635
00:34:05,560 --> 00:34:09,719
Speaker 1: cuttlefish right. This this you know, near automatic, complete transformation

636
00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:12,799
Speaker 1: of the color of the skin and the texture. Researchers

637
00:34:12,800 --> 00:34:16,000
Speaker 1: are trying to reproduce these techniques in smart clothing to

638
00:34:16,080 --> 00:34:19,640
Speaker 1: trigger these same tricks, and this is interesting. The smart

639
00:34:19,640 --> 00:34:22,440
Speaker 1: clothing is made of soft, stretchy artificial muscles and are

640
00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:27,319
Speaker 1: based on specialist cells called chroma chromato force that are

641
00:34:27,320 --> 00:34:32,280
Speaker 1: found in amphibians, fish, reptiles, um and the color changes

642
00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:35,360
Speaker 1: and these guys, these organisms can be triggered by changes

643
00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:37,759
Speaker 1: in mood and temperatures, so they're trying to create the

644
00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:41,520
Speaker 1: same such of circumstances for this clothing. And the fast

645
00:34:41,560 --> 00:34:48,120
Speaker 1: expansion of squids muscles is mimicked by using dia electric elastomers.

646
00:34:48,600 --> 00:34:51,839
Speaker 1: Smart materials made of polymer which are connected to an

647
00:34:51,840 --> 00:34:56,200
Speaker 1: electric circuit and then expand when voltage is applied, and

648
00:34:56,239 --> 00:34:59,320
Speaker 1: then they returned through original shape when they're short circuited.

649
00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:02,439
Speaker 1: So of course this is dependent on having some sort

650
00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:06,400
Speaker 1: of motherboarder, so something that's going to trigger this. But

651
00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:09,160
Speaker 1: it's an intriguing idea that the material that you're wearing

652
00:35:09,200 --> 00:35:14,279
Speaker 1: could actually expand and to a certain extent and sound

653
00:35:14,360 --> 00:35:19,359
Speaker 1: like a weird biomechanical HRG. You're kind of a suit that. Yeah,

654
00:35:19,360 --> 00:35:21,800
Speaker 1: I wish you get second skin that that could monitor

655
00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:25,759
Speaker 1: the environment and then change accordingly. Um. I think that's

656
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:29,640
Speaker 1: really cool. Um. But I think is most important here

657
00:35:29,800 --> 00:35:34,120
Speaker 1: is that actually the camouflage snaf foo that we talked

658
00:35:34,120 --> 00:35:38,719
Speaker 1: about at the beginning is being addressed. This five billion

659
00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:44,279
Speaker 1: dollar snaf foo that that wasn't really effective, but it does, Boy,

660
00:35:44,360 --> 00:35:47,240
Speaker 1: it does underline. You know, that story raises the question

661
00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:50,080
Speaker 1: how can you spend five billion dollars on camouflage? And

662
00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:52,680
Speaker 1: it's important to note that five billion wasn't only the

663
00:35:52,719 --> 00:35:55,319
Speaker 1: design of it, but also the physical production on it. Right,

664
00:35:55,680 --> 00:35:58,000
Speaker 1: So it's so it wasn't just let's pay these guys

665
00:35:58,000 --> 00:36:02,120
Speaker 1: five billion dollars design, No, they're also um rolling it out.

666
00:36:02,480 --> 00:36:04,480
Speaker 1: But but still a lot of money goes into this

667
00:36:04,520 --> 00:36:06,000
Speaker 1: because a lot of thought goes into it, a lot

668
00:36:06,040 --> 00:36:08,600
Speaker 1: of science goes into it, and uh, and a lot

669
00:36:08,600 --> 00:36:10,839
Speaker 1: of skill. It's not just a situation of hey, give

670
00:36:10,840 --> 00:36:12,520
Speaker 1: me some green and some brown, because these guys are

671
00:36:12,560 --> 00:36:14,920
Speaker 1: fighting in a green and brown world. Well, I was

672
00:36:14,920 --> 00:36:18,120
Speaker 1: thinking that you know, um, nearly a hundred years ago

673
00:36:18,840 --> 00:36:23,000
Speaker 1: this camouflage was revolutionized or actually created, so it's sort

674
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:26,640
Speaker 1: of you know, past due time here to actually have

675
00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:33,359
Speaker 1: another sort of revolution in terms of the materials camlution. Uh,

676
00:36:33,680 --> 00:36:36,719
Speaker 1: knowing everything that we have available to us, you do

677
00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:39,160
Speaker 1: I think that you know, these sort of smart skins

678
00:36:39,280 --> 00:36:42,799
Speaker 1: um are going to happen tomorrow. Probably not because the

679
00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:45,840
Speaker 1: technology is so new, But I'm glad that there is

680
00:36:45,920 --> 00:36:49,040
Speaker 1: some focus now at least on what we currently have

681
00:36:49,120 --> 00:36:52,200
Speaker 1: available for soldiers. I think it's really important that people

682
00:36:52,239 --> 00:36:54,799
Speaker 1: start thinking about the future of that and what could

683
00:36:54,840 --> 00:36:57,680
Speaker 1: make them safer. Yeah, we should probably mention the Predator

684
00:36:57,719 --> 00:36:59,239
Speaker 1: movie real quick. Did you ever see any of this?

685
00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:02,279
Speaker 1: Is the Predator? Is this sort of like sees this

686
00:37:02,480 --> 00:37:05,399
Speaker 1: creature in my head and it's it's got crazy long

687
00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:08,480
Speaker 1: tangled hair. Yeah, he's got like dreadlocks and crab face.

688
00:37:08,680 --> 00:37:12,400
Speaker 1: And in the first film he fought Arnold Swartzenegger and

689
00:37:12,480 --> 00:37:16,279
Speaker 1: his muscled up friends. Yes, okay, and uh, and there

690
00:37:16,360 --> 00:37:19,279
Speaker 1: was an interesting It was always a fun film to

691
00:37:19,640 --> 00:37:22,040
Speaker 1: watch when you're a kid, even though it's not really

692
00:37:22,040 --> 00:37:24,360
Speaker 1: a kids movie. But I certainly watched it when I

693
00:37:24,400 --> 00:37:28,120
Speaker 1: was younger and and was really into it. Um, but

694
00:37:28,280 --> 00:37:29,920
Speaker 1: it's uh, it's you know, it's a film where you

695
00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:33,600
Speaker 1: have an alien that's using advanced camouflage technology to you know,

696
00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:36,440
Speaker 1: so one of these light bending sort of technologies that

697
00:37:36,480 --> 00:37:39,720
Speaker 1: we were talking about, you know, looming in our future.

698
00:37:40,239 --> 00:37:42,840
Speaker 1: And then there is a scene where it's using thermal

699
00:37:42,880 --> 00:37:47,960
Speaker 1: imaging to hunt Arnold. And then Arnold accidentally survives an

700
00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:50,760
Speaker 1: encounter with a creature by coating himself in mud, which

701
00:37:51,320 --> 00:37:54,799
Speaker 1: at least in the film, is effective to mask his

702
00:37:54,880 --> 00:37:58,600
Speaker 1: thermal signature. So the creature ends up looking right at

703
00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:00,520
Speaker 1: him but doesn't see him because he can't see the

704
00:38:00,520 --> 00:38:03,840
Speaker 1: heat that he's admitting, which seems unlikely if he was

705
00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:07,719
Speaker 1: such a sophisticated alien. Well, talk about unlikely. Then the

706
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:10,040
Speaker 1: next thing Arnold does is he gets some sticks together

707
00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:14,960
Speaker 1: and makes an extremely powerful longbow out of them. So well, yeah,

708
00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:18,160
Speaker 1: it's because he's Arnold. Yeah, that's still it's one of

709
00:38:18,200 --> 00:38:20,680
Speaker 1: those films where Arnold does get his butt kicked the

710
00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:25,000
Speaker 1: entire film, and I forget of your survives or not.

711
00:38:25,080 --> 00:38:27,200
Speaker 1: He sort of survives, I think, but it's it's kind

712
00:38:27,239 --> 00:38:30,160
Speaker 1: of a it's not it's not one of these Bruce

713
00:38:30,239 --> 00:38:33,080
Speaker 1: Lee situations where Bruce Lee just kicks about the entire

714
00:38:33,120 --> 00:38:35,279
Speaker 1: time and you're like, wow, there's not really any thrill

715
00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:37,080
Speaker 1: going on here at all. You know. It would be

716
00:38:37,160 --> 00:38:40,239
Speaker 1: great is if every Arnold sourceing of film at the end,

717
00:38:40,600 --> 00:38:42,560
Speaker 1: that would the last scene would always be like a

718
00:38:42,600 --> 00:38:44,719
Speaker 1: part of his face peeling off and then like, you know,

719
00:38:44,840 --> 00:38:48,480
Speaker 1: the machinery underneath, because someone could just fix that for

720
00:38:48,560 --> 00:38:56,359
Speaker 1: every single film. Okay, I mean especially figured in in comedies. Yeah, yeah, yes,

721
00:38:56,640 --> 00:39:00,239
Speaker 1: his next Danny de Vito picture. Well, hey, us, so

722
00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:04,760
Speaker 1: that's that's camouflage for you. Um, I should probably Carl,

723
00:39:04,960 --> 00:39:11,680
Speaker 1: our actual robot over here. Carl, Carl, his name is Arnold.

724
00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:13,880
Speaker 1: I thought you just called him. You said call him

725
00:39:14,160 --> 00:39:15,839
Speaker 1: him over and I was like, did you rename our

726
00:39:15,920 --> 00:39:19,719
Speaker 1: robot without talking to I just transformed formed Carl into

727
00:39:19,760 --> 00:39:22,359
Speaker 1: it kind of like Carl, I gotta say, all right, well,

728
00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:25,440
Speaker 1: we received a lot of cool emails regarding some of

729
00:39:25,440 --> 00:39:29,040
Speaker 1: our more movie based stuff recently. Um, we'll not really

730
00:39:29,080 --> 00:39:31,360
Speaker 1: well some of this movie, Like our horror episode, we're

731
00:39:31,360 --> 00:39:33,440
Speaker 1: talking about what horror does to the brain, how we

732
00:39:33,520 --> 00:39:36,080
Speaker 1: perceive a horror movie, and how it affects us. And

733
00:39:36,280 --> 00:39:39,000
Speaker 1: this was a great little Facebook share here from a

734
00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:41,040
Speaker 1: listener by the name of Terra. Tera writes and it says,

735
00:39:41,760 --> 00:39:43,920
Speaker 1: just listen to the episode on horror and loved it.

736
00:39:44,160 --> 00:39:45,799
Speaker 1: I've been a horror fan for as long as I

737
00:39:45,800 --> 00:39:48,879
Speaker 1: can remember, and like you, Julie, when my son was born,

738
00:39:49,000 --> 00:39:51,239
Speaker 1: I went off at a bit and uh and sort

739
00:39:51,280 --> 00:39:54,120
Speaker 1: of felt like, we MG, that could be my son

740
00:39:54,360 --> 00:39:57,279
Speaker 1: being ripped apart growing up. This is where the email

741
00:39:57,320 --> 00:40:01,280
Speaker 1: gets offen though. Growing up I befriended Freddie if that's possible,

742
00:40:01,520 --> 00:40:04,160
Speaker 1: and would go to sleep watching Elm Street and would

743
00:40:04,160 --> 00:40:06,960
Speaker 1: put on my Freddie glove if I had nightmares. Oddly

744
00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:10,960
Speaker 1: not about Freddie. You have another quote unquote monster was

745
00:40:11,000 --> 00:40:14,120
Speaker 1: in my dream, Like Jason, Freddie would come and kill

746
00:40:14,239 --> 00:40:17,359
Speaker 1: him and then we'd go hang out. Um. Another time

747
00:40:17,400 --> 00:40:19,239
Speaker 1: I went to an into a haunted house and there

748
00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:21,400
Speaker 1: was a Freddie in there, and I stood and started

749
00:40:21,440 --> 00:40:25,000
Speaker 1: talking to the guy. Uh, and as another group came through,

750
00:40:25,160 --> 00:40:27,520
Speaker 1: he grabbed me up onto his stage as a prop

751
00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:30,840
Speaker 1: while they went past. Sadly, nothing in film scares me anymore.

752
00:40:31,040 --> 00:40:33,080
Speaker 1: It's all been done. It's all predictable. The only thing

753
00:40:33,080 --> 00:40:34,919
Speaker 1: that it scared me in the last past fifteen years

754
00:40:34,920 --> 00:40:37,880
Speaker 1: has been Blair Witch because it was all left to

755
00:40:37,880 --> 00:40:41,200
Speaker 1: your imagination as I read the book with all the

756
00:40:41,200 --> 00:40:45,400
Speaker 1: police reports, et cetera before it came out. Anyway, great podcast,

757
00:40:46,360 --> 00:40:49,160
Speaker 1: and that's a phenomenal little account there. I love that

758
00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:54,360
Speaker 1: Freddie was frutalism, yeah, you know, yeah against other evil.

759
00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:57,719
Speaker 1: That's uh, that's that's pretty neat. I mean, it's it's

760
00:40:57,840 --> 00:40:59,920
Speaker 1: also interesting when you think of when you're thinking in

761
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:05,200
Speaker 1: terms of dreams and and just sort of tinkering with

762
00:41:05,400 --> 00:41:08,399
Speaker 1: your mind a bit in terms of how you think

763
00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:13,520
Speaker 1: about things. Um okay, because you essentially she's turning turning

764
00:41:13,520 --> 00:41:16,120
Speaker 1: Freddy into this, uh, this point of strength, this kind

765
00:41:16,120 --> 00:41:20,400
Speaker 1: of totem, you know, this kind of a spirit animal,

766
00:41:20,440 --> 00:41:24,120
Speaker 1: really like her spirit animals, Freddy Krueger. Um. And if

767
00:41:24,160 --> 00:41:27,000
Speaker 1: if she were in a Freddie Krueger movie, if her character,

768
00:41:27,080 --> 00:41:30,000
Speaker 1: she would essentially use Freddy Krueger against Freddy Krueger, which

769
00:41:30,040 --> 00:41:33,200
Speaker 1: is which is kind of okay. Well, so now, of

770
00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:35,520
Speaker 1: course we need to know from people what their spirited

771
00:41:35,719 --> 00:41:41,000
Speaker 1: animals are in terms of horror figures. Yeah, what is yours? Oh?

772
00:41:41,040 --> 00:41:44,759
Speaker 1: In terms of horror figures? Um? Oh, I don't know.

773
00:41:44,920 --> 00:41:46,840
Speaker 1: I had a dream other that where really Scott wasn't it.

774
00:41:46,920 --> 00:41:51,200
Speaker 1: He's not really a correct creature per se. But there's

775
00:41:51,280 --> 00:41:55,719
Speaker 1: is there like one creature some sort of um, I

776
00:41:55,760 --> 00:41:58,360
Speaker 1: don't know, is there there's there someone who's much like

777
00:41:58,400 --> 00:42:00,319
Speaker 1: Freddie that you would be like, hey, you can with me,

778
00:42:00,320 --> 00:42:02,560
Speaker 1: you can be my my wing man. I don't Gammer

779
00:42:02,640 --> 00:42:04,719
Speaker 1: I guess I love camera. He's on my desk. He's

780
00:42:04,760 --> 00:42:07,359
Speaker 1: a giant, you know, giant Japanese turtle. He's a friend

781
00:42:07,400 --> 00:42:09,879
Speaker 1: of children. He shoots fire out of his mouth. It's

782
00:42:09,880 --> 00:42:13,080
Speaker 1: a good guy. So, and I'm pretty confident in Gammera's

783
00:42:13,080 --> 00:42:16,160
Speaker 1: ability that's in me against most things. And he's kind

784
00:42:16,160 --> 00:42:17,920
Speaker 1: of like he's also like he's the great turtle you

785
00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:24,680
Speaker 1: know on the back he carries the world kind of thing. Boy,

786
00:42:25,280 --> 00:42:27,799
Speaker 1: are you go being deep again? Well, you think about it,

787
00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:29,879
Speaker 1: and you can come back with one too the next time.

788
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:33,919
Speaker 1: When someone writes us in with their horror movie Spirit Animals, Okay,

789
00:42:33,960 --> 00:42:35,480
Speaker 1: we should probably go with that. I have a whole

790
00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:37,840
Speaker 1: stack of emails, but I'll get to some more in

791
00:42:37,840 --> 00:42:40,399
Speaker 1: the next episode. Um. But anyway, if you guys want

792
00:42:40,400 --> 00:42:42,000
Speaker 1: to share something with us, if you want to share

793
00:42:42,040 --> 00:42:45,480
Speaker 1: your horror movie, um, spirit animal If you have some

794
00:42:45,520 --> 00:42:47,440
Speaker 1: thoughts about CAMO. I know we have some listeners in

795
00:42:47,440 --> 00:42:50,239
Speaker 1: the military, um, and then and other listeners who are

796
00:42:50,239 --> 00:42:55,000
Speaker 1: at least you know, really into military themes and military subjects. Uh,

797
00:42:55,160 --> 00:42:56,759
Speaker 1: let us know what you think. What's your tech on

798
00:42:56,760 --> 00:43:00,839
Speaker 1: on on CAMO, and what's your favorite Camo from either

799
00:43:00,920 --> 00:43:04,959
Speaker 1: modern or historical armed forces. We'd love to hear from you.

800
00:43:04,960 --> 00:43:07,120
Speaker 1: You can find us on Facebook where we are Stuff

801
00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:09,279
Speaker 1: to Blow Your Mind, and you can also find us

802
00:43:09,280 --> 00:43:11,440
Speaker 1: on Twitter where we are blow the Mind. And you

803
00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:13,479
Speaker 1: can always drop us a line at Blew the Mind

804
00:43:13,520 --> 00:43:20,480
Speaker 1: at Discovery dot com. Be sure to check out our

805
00:43:20,520 --> 00:43:24,040
Speaker 1: new video podcast, Stuff from the Future. Join how Stuffwork

806
00:43:24,120 --> 00:43:27,680
Speaker 1: staff as we explore the most promising and perplexing possibilities

807
00:43:27,719 --> 00:43:28,360
Speaker 1: of tomorrow.