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Speaker 1: Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan in Vino Veritas. In

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Speaker 1: wine there's truth. I don't necessarily know if there's truth,

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Speaker 1: but I think that consumption of a nice bottle of

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Speaker 1: wine may loosen you up to speak of things that

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Speaker 1: otherwise might not be said in any other circumstance. And

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Speaker 1: as a vessel, there are not too many other things

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Speaker 1: out there that function that are quite as exquisite as

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Speaker 1: a nice wine bottle. And there's all kinds now that

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Speaker 1: are out there in different colors and shapes. Certainly they

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Speaker 1: all retain kind of a basic they're on basic anatomy.

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Speaker 1: But today I want to talk about a case that

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Speaker 1: you're not going to believe, where a wine bottle actually

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Speaker 1: is used as a weapon to take the life of

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Speaker 1: an elderly woman. I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and this is

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Speaker 1: Body Bags talk about the Grapes of Wrath, Dave. This

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Speaker 1: case that we've got today is I'm really not trying

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Speaker 1: to be funny, but it is quite striking. It's something

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Speaker 1: that I haven't come across. I've worked a number of

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Speaker 1: bludgeonings over the course of my career with heavy objects

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Speaker 1: and this sort of thing, but you generally don't think

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Speaker 1: of a wine bottle as being resilient enough to impact

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Speaker 1: someone to bring about a death. And it's not just

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Speaker 1: a single blow, and it is not just a single injury,

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Speaker 1: it is multiple injuries. In today's case.

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Speaker 2: I wanted to add one more thing too, Joe. The

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Speaker 2: idea is that the wine bottles are empty. I don't

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Speaker 2: know if that means anything to you, but it makes

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Speaker 2: a difference to me because I thought if you were

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Speaker 2: hitting somebody with a bottle, if it had something in it,

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Speaker 2: it would be more deadly than it would be if

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Speaker 2: it was empty. It seems like it would be more

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Speaker 2: app to crack and be useless if it was empty,

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Speaker 2: just a shattered glass. But that's the TV and movie

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Speaker 2: person watching that the breakaway glass. In real life glass

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Speaker 2: doesn't break away and go on to people. It's kind

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Speaker 2: of if you've ever been hit in the head in

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Speaker 2: a fight, you don't get up and take three more.

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Speaker 2: If you get a good hit to the face, I'm

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Speaker 2: telling you the fight's pretty much over.

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Speaker 1: Particularly with a head strike and with an object in particular,

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Speaker 1: it'll take you to your knees. I mean, you might

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Speaker 1: get back up, but you're not going to be the

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Speaker 1: same person as when you went down, or at least

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Speaker 1: for that moment. Tom.

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Speaker 2: Now, in this particular case, we have a thirty six

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Speaker 2: year old man, Sean Questa, and we have his sixty

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Speaker 2: four year old mother, Connie Questa, And according to a neighbor,

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Speaker 2: there had been arguments and loud arguments in the past,

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Speaker 2: so much so that a couple of weeks prior to

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Speaker 2: the we're talking about, this same neighbor went next door

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Speaker 2: and actually stopped the two of them from arguing. So

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Speaker 2: it hadn't gotten violent yet, but it had gotten loud

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Speaker 2: enough and enough noises being made that the neighbor was worried.

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Speaker 2: But when it got really bad this time Sean Questa,

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Speaker 2: the thirty six year old son of Connie Questa. According

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Speaker 2: to police and according to the neighbor, there was at

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Speaker 2: first a verbal argument. That verbal argument became physical and

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Speaker 2: at first it was throwing objects. There are several different

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Speaker 2: objects that were apparently thrown. It was when they got

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Speaker 2: they Obviously it's a fight, it's not just one sided.

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Speaker 2: It's not just the son throwing things at the mother

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Speaker 2: who's dodging them. She actually was fighting back. She had to.

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Speaker 2: When the son got to the wine bottles. That's when

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Speaker 2: he decided this is the weapon. According to a neighbor,

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Speaker 2: it sounded like they were tearing the building down by

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Speaker 2: the time the neighbor got there. And you and I

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Speaker 2: were talking about this before, because there's been some mention

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Speaker 2: of Connie Questa's spouse not naming him, and I don't

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Speaker 2: know why that is, but they've named the son who's

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Speaker 2: been arrested, but they haven't named the spouse. They call

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Speaker 2: him the spouse anyway. When he got he wasn't home

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Speaker 2: when all this is going on. A neighbor told him, hey, man,

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Speaker 2: this is it's bad. That's when they went in and

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Speaker 2: found Connie Questa on the floor in the master bedroom.

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Speaker 2: When they found her shirt was off and her panties

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Speaker 2: were down to her knees, and the police found blood

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Speaker 2: in the living room, substantial blood in the living room,

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Speaker 2: and of course in the master bedroom where they found

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Speaker 2: her body faced down.

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Speaker 1: A lot of dynamics here. Let's go back to the

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Speaker 1: bottles real quick, because this is significant when you're talking

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Speaker 1: about kind of this impassioned and you see it a

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Speaker 1: lot with familial cases. People are always terrified of stranger

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Speaker 1: on stranger crime that's not what terrifies me. And it

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Speaker 1: is scary. You know, if you're walking down a darkened street,

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Speaker 1: you come across an alley, the hair on the back

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Speaker 1: of your neck stands up. You don't know what's down

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Speaker 1: the alley. Who's down the alley in more danger with

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Speaker 1: the people that are in your intimate circle then you

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Speaker 1: ever will be out on the street in most cases.

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Speaker 1: And when you're talking about an intimate environment, when something

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Speaker 1: as odd as a wine bottle is retrieved and is

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Speaker 1: used as a weapon in investigations, that's something that we

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Speaker 1: call a weapon of opportunity.

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Speaker 2: We know the arguing started early in the day, around

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Speaker 2: ten am and continued all day long, enough so that

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Speaker 2: the neighbor was bothered by it. And when the victim's

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Speaker 2: spouse came home, the neighbor went out and got him

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Speaker 2: and said, there's something bad that's been going on all

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Speaker 2: day now. According to police, the investigation reveals that apparently

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Speaker 2: Sean Questa was throwing stuff at Connie, first his stepmother

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Speaker 2: or mother, and then started beating her in the head

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Speaker 2: with the wine bottles. I'm going to use plural because

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Speaker 2: I gotta assume a bottle is going to break Joe,

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Speaker 2: the head is not soft tissue, is it. Have you

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Speaker 2: ever dealt with this, Joe, a wine bottle?

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Speaker 1: I have had No. I have not had a wine bottle.

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Speaker 1: I have had a whiskey bottle, several whiskey bottles, one

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Speaker 1: in particular, where it was in fact broken and the

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Speaker 1: remainder of the bottle was used to cut with and

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Speaker 1: that was a very brutal case. But where you're talking

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Speaker 1: about someone utilizing a wine bottle, which I have to say,

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Speaker 1: you were talking about kind of the robust nature of glass.

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Speaker 1: It seems to me, at least wine bottles tend to

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Speaker 1: be again, and I know that it's going to be

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Speaker 1: heavily depended upon manufacturer, they tend to be a bit

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Speaker 1: more robust than say a standard whiskey bottle. For me,

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Speaker 1: they do. Now you can have decorative whiskey bottles that

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Speaker 1: sort of thing. I'm sure they are more robust, but

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Speaker 1: on the whole they are. All of these bottles have

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Speaker 1: a very specific anatomy. You have the mouth or the opening,

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Speaker 1: and then the neck, which is generally used if you're

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Speaker 1: going to use it as something that weaponize it. It's

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Speaker 1: going to be used as a handle to grip it with.

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Speaker 1: But as the neck descends down into the bottle itself,

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Speaker 1: it turns into what's referred to as the shoulders, and

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Speaker 1: then you have this kind of cylindrical area that makes

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Speaker 1: up what's referred to as the label field on these things.

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Speaker 1: As it curves down the base of it is called

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Speaker 1: the heel, and around the heel, if you'll notice there

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Speaker 1: are these little many times these little ridges. And when

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Speaker 1: we talk about pattern injuries, we talk about pattern injuries,

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Speaker 1: you can actually with something like this, particularly if it's

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Speaker 1: used on the long end, you can see a pattern.

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Speaker 1: And here's a little unknown factoid. The indented part at

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Speaker 1: the base of the bottle is actually referred to as

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Speaker 1: the punt punt, and it's the glass appears to be thicker.

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Speaker 1: I think that that probably in the manufacture of the

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Speaker 1: thing is that's probably where they close it off. More

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Speaker 1: than likely. So the bottle itself has a very unique

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Speaker 1: form to it, and it's certainly in wine circles it

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Speaker 1: has a very unique function to it. They talk about

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Speaker 1: things about like the poor and all these sorts of things.

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Speaker 1: These people that are wine fishionados, not casting dispersions. It's

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Speaker 1: just it's all part and parcel of what they do

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Speaker 1: in this world when it's weaponized. If we look at

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Speaker 1: the design of a bottle like this, it's not too dissimilar,

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Speaker 1: I think in certain forms, as the form of a

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Speaker 1: baseball bat, how the tapering kind of increases. It expands

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Speaker 1: out as you move away from the handle, so you

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Speaker 1: can probably leverage it in the same manner and deliver

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Speaker 1: the same amount of injury. But I do know this, Dave.

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Speaker 1: In this particular case, a woman's life ended because of

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Speaker 1: an impact from a wine bottle when ms Quest's husband

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Speaker 1: found her. It's often hard for me, even though I've

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Speaker 1: seen so many of these cases, to try to put

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Speaker 1: myself into what we refer to in depth investigation as

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Speaker 1: the finder's position. On a little asside, I still remember

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Speaker 1: the first time I ever found a body. I was

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Speaker 1: never the finder. I was always the person that would

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Speaker 1: come out to the scene because someone else was the finder.

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Speaker 1: And I actually discovered a body in a house subsequent

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Speaker 1: to an ongoing investigation into another death. And I entered

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Speaker 1: a bedroom and found a guy wrapped in a carpet

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Speaker 1: that had been beaten to death with a crowbar. And

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Speaker 1: what a way to start off with the first one

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Speaker 1: you ever find is a guy that, interestingly enough, was

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Speaker 1: bludgeoned death. So it's really hard for me to put

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Speaker 1: myself in the position of the finder to think about

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Speaker 1: what they're experiencing in their mind. When you walk into

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Speaker 1: the home in which you've occupied with your wife and

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Speaker 1: your family all these years, and you look around and

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Speaker 1: you know that there's a lot of destruction in here.

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Speaker 1: We're talking about a fight. And the reason I know

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Speaker 1: this is that police have said that you've got blood

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Speaker 1: that is essentially in the living room, and we know

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Speaker 1: her body was found in the master bedroom, so you've

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Speaker 1: got a fight that initiated somewhere and continued on. That's

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Speaker 1: one of the reasons when you hear us talk on

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Speaker 1: television in particular, and reporters talk to people like me

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Speaker 1: or police officers, they'll say, well, was there any sign

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Speaker 1: of a struggle? Our standard format is, well, there was

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Speaker 1: no signs of forced entry and struggle, And it's almost

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Speaker 1: boiler plate we say that all the time. It either

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Speaker 1: is or it isn't. In this particular case, there was

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Speaker 1: a sign of a struggle here day.

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Speaker 2: Right, and oddly enough, we have a backup just a

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Speaker 2: little bit to the neighbor, the neighbor who he's feeling

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Speaker 2: a lot of guilt. I saw an interview that he did,

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Speaker 2: and because he's the neighbor who actually broke up an

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Speaker 2: argument between the mother and the son weeks before this happened,

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Speaker 2: and was aware there was an ongoing stressor here the

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Speaker 2: sons that he had lived with the mom on and

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Speaker 2: off of the last several years. Now in this particular case,

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Speaker 2: the neighbor told police that they heard arguing and noises

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Speaker 2: all throughout the day, starting here about ten o'clock that

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Speaker 2: morning until early in the evening. By the time police

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Speaker 2: were there, it was nine o'clock at night. So you've

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Speaker 2: got a fight that began an argument at ten am

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Speaker 2: roughly and continued all the way and kept escalating to

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Speaker 2: the point where we know it went from verbal to

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Speaker 2: physical where the wine bottles came into play, and we

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Speaker 2: know that it was actually finished off. The day was

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Speaker 2: not finished off with a wine bottle. It was finished

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Speaker 2: off with something else. But before we get to that,

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Speaker 2: according to the neighbor, they hard arguments from ten o'clock

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Speaker 2: in the morning. They heard loud banging and yelling coming

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Speaker 2: from the apartment. When the victims spouse arrived at the scene,

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Speaker 2: the concerned neighbor informed him about the commotion. The commotion

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Speaker 2: had been going on for some time and immediately called

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Speaker 2: nine to one one. Then now that spouse then goes

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Speaker 2: into the apartment where he finds his wife on the

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Speaker 2: floor of the master bedroom, face down and she's cold

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Speaker 2: to the touch. Then called nine one one, sends the fireman, paramedics,

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Speaker 2: whoever else shows up, and they declared her dead on

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Speaker 2: the scene. Is that a situation where the coroner somebody

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Speaker 2: in your position would then come out to the scene

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Speaker 2: because you do have a death scene here. They're not

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Speaker 2: taking her to the hospital to see if they can

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Speaker 2: save her life. They've tried, they know she's gone, and

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Speaker 2: that way you can get a look at the whole

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Speaker 2: scene to try to figure out where these injuries came from.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it is in most jurisdictions. Here's a little unknown

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Speaker 1: fact that people might not be aware of the corner

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Speaker 1: where you still have corner systems in place. Florida is

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Speaker 1: not one of those states. They have district medical examiners

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Speaker 1: down there well, and even in city in Miami Day

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Speaker 1: they have their own medical examiner. But where you have

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Speaker 1: a corner do you know that if there is a

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Speaker 1: body on the scene, the corner is actually in charge

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Speaker 1: of the scene until that body leaves.

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Speaker 2: Didn't know that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, the presence of a body trumps everything else that's

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Speaker 1: going on. Now, look, you can take that kind of

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Speaker 1: power and you can be a real jerk about it.

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Speaker 1: That's not good. You need to play nice with everybody.

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Speaker 1: And generally the corner will acquiesce and say, yeah, you guys,

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Speaker 1: do what you need to do, but let me know

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Speaker 1: what you're going to do, because I have to still

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Speaker 1: take this body back and have it examined, and I

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Speaker 1: need it. I need all of the context of the

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Speaker 1: body there.

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Speaker 2: Now that makes sense. That's the whole thing about to

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Speaker 2: whom much is given, much is required. And yeah, you've

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Speaker 2: got all this power, but you better darnwell know exactly

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Speaker 2: what happened.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, precisely, And so you have to have kind of

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Speaker 1: an understanding of that. You have to sit back and

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Speaker 1: just kind of understand how the rattling hum of a

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Speaker 1: scene goes. But in this case, the corner or the

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Speaker 1: medical examiner down there, it would have been an emmy

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Speaker 1: investigator more than likely that had shown up at the scene.

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Speaker 1: Here's something else I know, and this is quite critical

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Speaker 1: when her body was observed at the scene. One of

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Speaker 1: the key things that stood out to me about this

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Speaker 1: case is the fact that they stated her body was

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Speaker 1: cold to the touch. And when somebody says the body

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Speaker 1: is cold to the touch, first off, that's not vernacular

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Speaker 1: that the public generally uses. Again, that goes back to

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Speaker 1: boiler plate. When we in the medical legal field make

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Speaker 1: an assessment of the body, we're not going to give

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Speaker 1: an actual body temperature. We'll say the body is cold

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Speaker 1: or cool to the touch, and it's just something that

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Speaker 1: it sounds like that. Whoever wrote that for the news

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Speaker 1: media got that information from the police more than likely

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Speaker 1: and that was the origin of that. And so you

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Speaker 1: would have to work the scene bit by bit. And

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Speaker 1: because there's so much what I would think, at least

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Speaker 1: what I would refer to as particulate evidence here, we've

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Speaker 1: probably understated this. This isn't just one wine bottle. There

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Speaker 1: were multiple wine bottles that were found at the scene

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Speaker 1: and utilized. And I'm with you, Dave. When I hear

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Speaker 1: about an empty wine bottle, I'm thinking, well, why would

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Speaker 1: you have empty wine bottles? Well, let's consider the probability

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Speaker 1: here because this plays into the investigation. Had there been

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Speaker 1: a big party, you had mentioned a critical piece of information.

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Speaker 1: This fight had been going on for some time well,

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Speaker 1: where the parties involved drinking with one another, because as

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Speaker 1: you know, and I know, liquor many times as devil's fuel,

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Speaker 1: and so the more you consume, the more dicey things

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Speaker 1: can get. And then it comes to this horrible crescendo

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Speaker 1: at the end of the day. Or did somebody like

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Speaker 1: to collect wine bottles? And some of these wine bottles

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Speaker 1: look like art. You see lights made out of them,

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Speaker 1: all kinds of stuff, and they have beautiful labels. And

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Speaker 1: I've got friends that collect one. Do they just have

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Speaker 1: a collection of wand bottles? Because to the eye aesthetically

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Speaker 1: they're pleasing. So you think about all of these things.

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Speaker 1: And when the sun is looking for something to utilize

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Speaker 1: as a weapon, this is the first thing he's seen

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Speaker 1: after he's allegedly being assaulted. In all of this, they're

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Speaker 1: throwing something. That's the whole point is it went from

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Speaker 1: a verbal altercation. The verbal was loud enough that neighbors

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Speaker 1: heard it. The neighbors heard the arguing at ten in

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Speaker 1: the morning. Then it escalated to the throwing of things,

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Speaker 1: and that's where I wonder if there were other things

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Speaker 1: thrown first, and if it was mom and son. Now,

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Speaker 1: you and I both have noted there have been a

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Speaker 1: couple of reports here saying that this was that Connie

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Speaker 1: Questa is the stepmother. It was reported that in the headline, Now, Joe,

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Speaker 1: when you have a victim who is found without a

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Speaker 1: shirt and with panties pulled down to her knees, does

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Speaker 1: that immediately tell you there was a sexual assault? Or

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Speaker 1: do you look at it as maybe she was down

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Speaker 1: in the living room and the suspect drug her into

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Speaker 1: the master bedroom and in the process of dragging her

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Speaker 1: the shirt pulled up and the panties pulled down. That

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00:16:14,560 --> 00:16:18,200
Speaker 1: is a possibility. But from an investigative perspective, I'm treating

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Speaker 1: this like a sexual assault anytime I see a female

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Speaker 1: while male for that matter, with their pants down around

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Speaker 1: their knees and their genitalia is exposed, and with women

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Speaker 1: in particular, where a shirt is pulled up and their

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Speaker 1: breasts are exposed. Look, if I don't treat this as

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Speaker 1: a sexual assault, I'm falling down the job as an

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Speaker 1: investigator because I'm going to lose fragile evidence. If I

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Speaker 1: have like seminal deposition on a body and I just

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Speaker 1: go ahead and just kind of treat the body carelessly

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Speaker 1: when I'm moving it and all those sorts of things,

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Speaker 1: there's a probability that I can lose evidence. Also, if

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Speaker 1: it's a sexual assault, there could be very intimate transfer

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Speaker 1: to that's going on here with touch DNA from the

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Speaker 1: perpetrator onto the victim's body. And conversely, in addition to that,

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Speaker 1: you can have hair transfer. And think about this, what

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Speaker 1: kind of surface was she found on? What she found

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Speaker 1: on a carpeted surface. Let's say that she's got carpet

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Speaker 1: fibers on the front the anterior aspect of her legs,

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Speaker 1: and then she's found in the bedroom and she's got

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Speaker 1: carpet fibers on the posterior surface of the legs. And

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Speaker 1: there's a different carpet in the living room than there

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Speaker 1: is in the Mastard bedroom. So you get an idea

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Speaker 1: maybe she's being assaulted all over the place. Maybe it's

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Speaker 1: an ongoing thing. We're talking about hours that ellapse here day,

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Speaker 1: so you've got a big gap in information here and

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Speaker 1: you're kind of trying to understand what the body is

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Speaker 1: going to reveal to you in this period of time.

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Speaker 1: When they did finally track him down, they found this knife.

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Speaker 1: That weapon in particular, will tell a tale. At the

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Speaker 1: end of the day, when you examine that knife in

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Speaker 1: the crime lab, you will find all that remains of

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Speaker 1: this poor victim. So, come to find out this knife

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Speaker 1: which is eventually found on the alleged perpetrator's person in

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Speaker 1: his backpack, nonetheless, and it's going to be covered in

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Speaker 1: blood and I think to a certain degree probably bone.

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Speaker 1: Once this thing's taken back to the state crime lab,

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Speaker 1: you're in the circumstance. You know that you've just beaten

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Speaker 1: and stabbed in the skull. Nonetheless, these injuries were in

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Speaker 1: her temple, the knife wounds. What do you do? Where

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Speaker 1: do you go? Where does your mind go at this

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Speaker 1: point where you're going to say, Okay, I'm going to leave.

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Speaker 1: I've got my backpack and I'm taking it on the road.

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Speaker 2: And before he did that, he tried to clean up.

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Speaker 2: He actually did try to clean up the bloody scene.

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Speaker 2: They actually said that he used a towel and a

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Speaker 2: green rag to try to clean up the scene and

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Speaker 2: then gave up through the right down at her next

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Speaker 2: to his mother, and he left with his backpack. And

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Speaker 2: this is before they recovered the knife or anything else.

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Speaker 2: He took off, Sean Questa took off and went to

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Speaker 2: his aunt's house in Hialiah. It was there that he

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Speaker 2: allegedly admitted I killed my mom and was acting really weird.

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Speaker 2: He was acting weird enough that the family, even though

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Speaker 2: they couldn't confirm what he was saying, they called police.

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Speaker 2: They were worried, so they called police. The police show

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Speaker 2: up and they did what they call a Baker Act.

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Speaker 1: What's the Baker Act?

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Speaker 2: It is, bottom line, a seventy two hour mental health hold.

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Speaker 2: Okay cycled, Yeah, it's a cycle. And when they say

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Speaker 2: the Baker acted him, that means that they can hold

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Speaker 2: him for up to seventy two hours about any charges.

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Speaker 2: And that's what they did, and then they were able

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Speaker 2: to find the knife in the backpack and go back

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Speaker 2: to the crime scene and figure everything out.

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Speaker 1: I came across something in this case that I don't

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Speaker 1: know that I have ever heard the police or medical

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Speaker 1: examiner state before. Now, I gotta tell you that's saying

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Speaker 1: something you never hear everything. But when I heard this

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Speaker 1: first off, I knew that this victim had not been

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Speaker 1: in a car accident. I knew that this was a

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Speaker 1: person on person attack. I knew that there were wine

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00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:15,200
Speaker 1: bottles that were being used to strike her multiple times

381
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Speaker 1: blunt force trauma. But Dave, according to the reports this victim,

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Speaker 1: they said not some, they said every Now I wasn't there.

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Speaker 1: I can't verify it, but they said that every organ

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Speaker 1: in this woman's body sustained a laceration. Now, we've talked

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Speaker 1: about lacerations, I think recently on an episode, the difference

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Speaker 1: between in sized wounds and lacerations. Here is a perfect example,

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Speaker 1: because you know, with lacerations, that's something that only arises

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Speaker 1: from blunt force trauma. And let's consider very briefly. Let's

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Speaker 1: just consider the organs that we're talking about. When you

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Speaker 1: say organs now, and you say every organ, all internal organs,

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Speaker 1: so we're talking, we're probably are they saying the bowel,

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Speaker 1: the small bowel, and the large bowel, I don't know,

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Speaker 1: and all organs were lacerated. We do know that we

394
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Speaker 1: have a liver is the largest organ in the body.

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Speaker 1: And if you'll feel just beneath the base of your

396
00:21:07,800 --> 00:21:11,240
Speaker 1: right ribcage, it's right there. You slide on over on

397
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Speaker 1: the other side, and you've got your pancreas and your

398
00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:16,919
Speaker 1: spleen right down there. Spleens sustain. And there's a lot

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Speaker 1: of people that have splenectomies over the year, in years,

400
00:21:19,560 --> 00:21:23,080
Speaker 1: and many times those arise from motivehicle accidents. They're very fragile,

401
00:21:23,119 --> 00:21:25,400
Speaker 1: and they sit on the left aspect of the abdomen,

402
00:21:25,480 --> 00:21:27,919
Speaker 1: the upper abdomen. I can understand that. But then you

403
00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:31,160
Speaker 1: have the pancreas that stems off of the spleen. I'm thinking,

404
00:21:31,600 --> 00:21:35,160
Speaker 1: was the pancreas also? Last ray, you're saying all organs now,

405
00:21:35,440 --> 00:21:38,560
Speaker 1: and yeah, I've seen lacerated pancreases, but again, most of

406
00:21:38,600 --> 00:21:42,119
Speaker 1: the time it comes from a fall from a great

407
00:21:42,200 --> 00:21:45,000
Speaker 1: height or comes from a motiveicle accent. Then we go

408
00:21:45,560 --> 00:21:49,080
Speaker 1: superior to the diaphragm. We've got both lungs. Are we

409
00:21:49,080 --> 00:21:52,320
Speaker 1: talking about both lungs are lacerated? Then we go to

410
00:21:52,480 --> 00:21:55,600
Speaker 1: the heart. Has the heart been last? You're talking about

411
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Speaker 1: all organs?

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Speaker 2: All right, all internal organs.

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Speaker 1: And then it brings us to the brain. I think

414
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Speaker 1: that we can probably explain the brain pretty easily, and

415
00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:06,800
Speaker 1: yet blunt force trauma will in fact a lacrate of brain.

416
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Speaker 1: It has to be pretty significant. Most of the time,

417
00:22:09,440 --> 00:22:12,320
Speaker 1: you're going to get evidence of what's called coup or

418
00:22:12,320 --> 00:22:15,240
Speaker 1: concert coup injuries, where you'll get these big hemorrhagic areas

419
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Speaker 1: where the brain kind of slashes back and forth. I'm

420
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Speaker 1: taking it at face value when they're saying all, I'm

421
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Speaker 1: including the brain in this as well. To have this

422
00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:27,879
Speaker 1: level of trauma on a body where every organ is

423
00:22:27,920 --> 00:22:31,800
Speaker 1: in fact impacted, it would take first off time. Then

424
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Speaker 1: you would have to have an instrument that is so

425
00:22:34,480 --> 00:22:37,280
Speaker 1: very resilient. You'd have to be able to put it

426
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Speaker 1: into the hands of someone that could wield it with

427
00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:42,679
Speaker 1: the appropriate amount of force or the needed force in

428
00:22:42,800 --> 00:22:46,440
Speaker 1: order to direct that energy at that specific organ system,

429
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Speaker 1: and you would in the case of utilizing a bottle,

430
00:22:50,680 --> 00:22:52,000
Speaker 1: you're going to have to have more than one.

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Speaker 2: Dave Well, you mentioned the other day when we were

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Speaker 2: talking about this, and I didn't know the laceration term

433
00:22:58,520 --> 00:23:00,919
Speaker 2: and blunt force trauma. That was all new to me.

434
00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:03,879
Speaker 2: And this actually says, I'm reading the report says the

435
00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:07,520
Speaker 2: victim died of internal bleeding resulting from all internal organs

436
00:23:07,560 --> 00:23:11,600
Speaker 2: being lacerated from blunt force trauma. Now, if the victim

437
00:23:12,040 --> 00:23:15,879
Speaker 2: had one lump force injury that caused an internal organ

438
00:23:16,119 --> 00:23:19,720
Speaker 2: to be lacerated. Wouldn't that pretty much debilitate a sixty

439
00:23:19,720 --> 00:23:21,480
Speaker 2: four year old woman just one?

440
00:23:21,960 --> 00:23:25,399
Speaker 1: Yeah, any one of those organs would be sufficient to

441
00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:29,040
Speaker 1: bring about death. And here's another thing. We go back

442
00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:31,080
Speaker 1: to what we had said in an earlier segment where

443
00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:33,679
Speaker 1: her body was cold to the touch. I really have

444
00:23:33,760 --> 00:23:37,080
Speaker 1: to think here that when they're doing the examination on her,

445
00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:41,280
Speaker 1: how many of these lacerations took place anti mortem and

446
00:23:41,320 --> 00:23:43,760
Speaker 1: how many took place post mortem. You've got two things

447
00:23:43,800 --> 00:23:45,879
Speaker 1: that are going on here if this was in fact

448
00:23:45,920 --> 00:23:49,719
Speaker 1: a sexual assault. Because when you have a body demonstrated

449
00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:52,959
Speaker 1: with no shirt on, pants pulled down, for any investigator

450
00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:56,159
Speaker 1: worth their salt out there, they're going to that's the

451
00:23:56,200 --> 00:23:58,000
Speaker 1: first thing they're going to think of, that this is

452
00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:02,440
Speaker 1: some kind of sexually motivated assault that has occurred, and

453
00:24:02,800 --> 00:24:05,199
Speaker 1: is that something that took place post mortem? And then

454
00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:09,000
Speaker 1: on top of that, you begin to think about a knife. Now,

455
00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:13,520
Speaker 1: this knife was not driven once, not twice, not three times,

456
00:24:13,600 --> 00:24:18,119
Speaker 1: but four times into her temporal bone, actually the left

457
00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:20,119
Speaker 1: temple bone. So if you take your left hand and

458
00:24:20,160 --> 00:24:23,640
Speaker 1: put it up just posterior to your left eye. That's

459
00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:25,560
Speaker 1: going to be your temporal bone, and it's one of

460
00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:28,800
Speaker 1: the thinner bones of the skull. It's not impossible to

461
00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:30,800
Speaker 1: have a knife driven through there. And as a matter

462
00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:33,200
Speaker 1: of fact, even though it is, and we've talked about

463
00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:37,320
Speaker 1: sharp force injury versus blunt force depended upon the knife

464
00:24:37,560 --> 00:24:40,719
Speaker 1: that was utilized in this case, and it's passing through bone.

465
00:24:41,240 --> 00:24:44,000
Speaker 1: You could make an argument that if he buries the

466
00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:46,680
Speaker 1: scene down to the hilt of the knife or the

467
00:24:46,760 --> 00:24:50,199
Speaker 1: hilt guard, or if it's like a flip knife, like

468
00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:53,000
Speaker 1: a buck style knife, to the body of the knife,

469
00:24:53,119 --> 00:24:55,320
Speaker 1: that the body of the knife or the hilt and

470
00:24:55,359 --> 00:24:58,520
Speaker 1: the hand protector can actually work as a blunt instrument,

471
00:24:58,520 --> 00:25:01,480
Speaker 1: so you can get underlining fracture there. But either way,

472
00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:03,959
Speaker 1: you would be looking for hemorrhage in that area, and

473
00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:06,720
Speaker 1: if it's absent hemorrhage day, this means that this was

474
00:25:06,760 --> 00:25:10,720
Speaker 1: done post mortem. So they've got so many injuries to

475
00:25:10,840 --> 00:25:14,080
Speaker 1: kind of analyze and assess throughout this saying they're trying

476
00:25:14,080 --> 00:25:17,679
Speaker 1: to determine order, and order is you can't determine actual

477
00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:21,080
Speaker 1: order like ABCD like that. The order I'm talking about

478
00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:25,080
Speaker 1: is post mortem versus anti mortem and our perry mortem,

479
00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:27,520
Speaker 1: which means in the throes of death. It's kind of

480
00:25:27,520 --> 00:25:30,640
Speaker 1: that middle milky ground. So that's the order that you're

481
00:25:30,680 --> 00:25:33,040
Speaker 1: looking at here. And then they're going to have to

482
00:25:33,040 --> 00:25:34,679
Speaker 1: and I can tell you for a fact that they

483
00:25:34,720 --> 00:25:36,760
Speaker 1: will have done a rape kit on this lady as well.

484
00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:40,320
Speaker 2: We haven't heard anything about that, but we are just

485
00:25:40,440 --> 00:25:44,159
Speaker 2: now hearing all of the details. But Joe to stab

486
00:25:44,200 --> 00:25:47,280
Speaker 2: somebody in the temple with a knife four times, what

487
00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:49,080
Speaker 2: are we talking about? In terms of force? You have

488
00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:50,760
Speaker 2: to be closed up the other ones. You could be

489
00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:52,480
Speaker 2: a little bit far away. I mean, you can strike

490
00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:54,600
Speaker 2: somebody with the bottle at arm's length, but I'm thinking

491
00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:57,160
Speaker 2: to actually put a knife into the temple of somebody

492
00:25:57,200 --> 00:25:57,600
Speaker 2: you love.

493
00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:00,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's very personal. And again you're you know, you're

494
00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:04,440
Speaker 1: getting into that area where a person's identity is tied

495
00:26:04,520 --> 00:26:07,800
Speaker 1: up in their appearance and it goes to a tremendous

496
00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:10,399
Speaker 1: amount of anger. I'm fascinated by the fact that the

497
00:26:10,520 --> 00:26:14,000
Speaker 1: father was not present in the house when this had occurred.

498
00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:18,439
Speaker 1: And also in order to shore the head up to

499
00:26:18,520 --> 00:26:20,880
Speaker 1: the point where you could drive a knife through it,

500
00:26:21,040 --> 00:26:23,000
Speaker 1: you would literally have to be on top of this

501
00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:25,239
Speaker 1: person in order to do it with let me get

502
00:26:25,280 --> 00:26:27,760
Speaker 1: my orientation right here with the head or the face,

503
00:26:27,840 --> 00:26:30,680
Speaker 1: if you imagine the face turned to the right, so

504
00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:34,120
Speaker 1: that the underside or the right cheek is actually shored

505
00:26:34,280 --> 00:26:38,080
Speaker 1: what they call shoring against the surface, the harder surface

506
00:26:38,200 --> 00:26:42,359
Speaker 1: underlying that, so that you can position yourself over the body,

507
00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:46,680
Speaker 1: and you're driving this knife down into the temple multiple tips,

508
00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:50,639
Speaker 1: not just one time, but over and over and over

509
00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:54,239
Speaker 1: and over again until you're done. Now, obviously that in

510
00:26:54,280 --> 00:26:56,840
Speaker 1: and of itself would have been enough to have killed somebody.

511
00:26:56,880 --> 00:27:00,280
Speaker 1: It sounds like there's a lot I have to police

512
00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:03,960
Speaker 1: propose the thought that there was a lot of anger

513
00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:06,440
Speaker 1: that was being taken out on this woman's body, perhaps

514
00:27:06,440 --> 00:27:08,639
Speaker 1: in a post mortem state. But I also think that

515
00:27:08,720 --> 00:27:12,119
Speaker 1: it's important that we remember that to this date, Sean

516
00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:15,840
Speaker 1: Questa is innocent. He has not been taken to trial,

517
00:27:16,160 --> 00:27:23,520
Speaker 1: but he has been charged with second degree homicide. I'm

518
00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:27,359
Speaker 1: Joseph Scott Morgan, and this is bodybags