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Speaker 1: Too Much Information is a production of I Heart Radio,

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Speaker 1: Sparkle Baby, Let's make make it Sparkle Crockle Neely. Hello,

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Speaker 1: ladies and gentlemen, Welcome to Too Much Information, the show

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Speaker 1: that brings you the secret history, a little loan, facts

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Speaker 1: behind your favorite music, movies, TV shows and more. We

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Speaker 1: are your two step brothers of study. My name's Jordan

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Speaker 1: runtag No. Do that again, Write something better and come

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Speaker 1: back to me. I'm Alex Cycle. And today we are

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Speaker 1: talking about what's perhaps the most twisted of anything that

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Speaker 1: came out of the nineties teen movie Boom, a movie

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Speaker 1: about deception, seduction, borderline incest, and cocaine stuffed in a crucifix.

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Speaker 1: We can only be talking, of course, about cruel intentions.

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Speaker 1: For those of you not familiar with the plot, it

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Speaker 1: centers around a pair of obscenely rich Upper east Side teens,

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Speaker 1: the icy and sociopathic Catherine Murtu played by Sarah Michelle Gellar,

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Speaker 1: and are equally ruthless stepbrothers Bastian Valmont and to pass

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Speaker 1: the time on summer, these step siblings decide to set

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Speaker 1: a little wager ken Sebastian bed the headmaster's daughter if

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Speaker 1: he fails, Sebastian has to give Katherine his beloved vantage Jaguar.

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Speaker 1: If he succeeds, Katherine will give him what he's always

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Speaker 1: wanted since their parents got married. That's right, go less

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Speaker 1: tell him what he's won. He gets to put it

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Speaker 1: wherever he wants with his step sister. Yes, that's yes.

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Speaker 1: Truly reads like a no Henry short story. Um, I'm

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Speaker 1: sorry to the oh Henry estate. Yeah, we were talking

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Speaker 1: earlier and I said that I feel like this episode

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Speaker 1: will provide an unsettling insight into both of our psychological makeup,

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Speaker 1: to which you very sweetly responded by saying, oh, we're

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Speaker 1: way past that. Um. Yeah, I just love Sarah Michelle

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Speaker 1: Geller in this. The older I get, the more I

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Speaker 1: realize I sort of love evil. Maybe it's a counterbalance

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Speaker 1: to my own personality. I don't know why. I basically

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Speaker 1: feel like I'm drawn to two general arc at types,

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Speaker 1: the sweet Winnie Cooper from The Wonder Years types and

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Speaker 1: Sarah Michelle Gellar in cruel intentions, a woman who wouldn't

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Speaker 1: hesitate to step on my neck and her stilettos. So

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Speaker 1: I don't know anyway, What do you think about this movie? High,

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Speaker 1: but that's tough about me. Oh it's a great film.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's just so tightly constructed and everybody is

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Speaker 1: playing their respective archetypes perfectly. Writing is really sharp, it's

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Speaker 1: got a great look. Yeah. Man, it's just it's a

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Speaker 1: perfect little gem of a movie. And it is so

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Speaker 1: mean and nasty and frankly, it's like I don't really

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Speaker 1: love watching like the Tales of the Idle Rich, Like

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Speaker 1: it just usually infuriates me, but like, this is kind

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Speaker 1: of what I actually think they're up to. It's just

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Speaker 1: like people. Yeah, and so for that reason, I'm like, yeah, yeah, Okay,

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Speaker 1: I'm in. I mean, I'm I'm on board. And that's

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Speaker 1: why I'm so excited to talk about this movie. I mean,

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Speaker 1: it is so compelling, from taboo relationships to the nature

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Speaker 1: of how sex and powers intertwined and the question of

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Speaker 1: personal redemption. You know, it's a rich text. Some of

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Speaker 1: us them on and you'll learn about how Ryan Philippi

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Speaker 1: threw up on the set, how they got Reese Witherspoon

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Speaker 1: drunk to get her to sign on, and why Katie

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Speaker 1: Holmes got the boot from the cast. You also hear

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Speaker 1: how a pornographic actress created a stir on the set,

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Speaker 1: how Selma Blair prepped for that famous kissing scene with

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Speaker 1: Sarah Michelle Geller, and why Ross Geller from Friends is

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Speaker 1: partially responsible for making this all happen. Plus will talk

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Speaker 1: all about the ill fated attempts to bring the story

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Speaker 1: to television and why to fake cocaine on the set

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Speaker 1: gave Sarah Michelle Geller an allergic reaction. So, without further ado,

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Speaker 1: here is everything you never knew about Cruel Intentions. We

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Speaker 1: have a writer director named Roger Cumbelt to thank for

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Speaker 1: Cruel Intentions. We also have him to thank for the

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Speaker 1: Less Good two thousand to rom com The Sweetest Thing

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Speaker 1: with Selma Blair, Cameron Diaz and Crisina Applegate, but also

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Speaker 1: the severely underrated Just Friends with Ryan Reynolds and Amy Smart.

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Speaker 1: I don't know, did you like this movie? Maybe it

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Speaker 1: was just underrated to me because when it came out,

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Speaker 1: I was in high school and the whole being friend

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Speaker 1: zoned with your best friend concept deeply resonated with me.

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Speaker 1: But we all were at your combo Cruel Intentions. Up

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Speaker 1: to this point, his career had been in the theater.

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Speaker 1: Cruel Intentions was his first movie which is like the

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Speaker 1: director of Greece that was his first like big budget

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Speaker 1: major movie too, so incredible first time out for him.

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Speaker 1: And Cruel Intentions. It comes from two key sources. As

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Speaker 1: with all good tales of romantic perversity, we got to

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Speaker 1: take it over to nineteenth century France. The most obvious

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Speaker 1: inspiration for Cruel Intentions is the French novel Li liaisone

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Speaker 1: dangerous You're You're thank you that was published by who's

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Speaker 1: the published by Heigel who's the author? I'm not even

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Speaker 1: reading that one, Pierre Chandeleros de lack Close in seventeen

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Speaker 1: eighty two. Uh. Funnily enough. Sarah Michelle Geller is a

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Speaker 1: big book collector and reportedly has an antique copy of

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Speaker 1: one of the first printings of Dangerous Liaisons in its

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Speaker 1: original French. The plot of this book is similar to

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Speaker 1: the movie We Know and Love as Cruel Intentions. It

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Speaker 1: follows two exes who seduce others for power and influence.

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Speaker 1: Is there any other reason why you seduce? Really? The

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Speaker 1: book Dangerous Liaisons has been adapted into film a number

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Speaker 1: of times over the years. Uh, most notably in nineteen

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Speaker 1: fifty nine, the French director Roger Vadim later of Barbarella

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Speaker 1: Fame did a version that was set in the modern day,

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Speaker 1: and director Stephen Frears made probably the most famous version

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Speaker 1: in night Dangerous Liaisons with John Malkovich, Glen Close, Shell

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Speaker 1: Feiffer and Uma Thurman, which was later nominated for seven Oscars,

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Speaker 1: winning three. And then just a year later, director Milos Foreman,

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Speaker 1: who did One flu of the Cuckoo's Nest, very famous director,

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Speaker 1: made the film of Valmont with Colin Firth, Net Benning,

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Speaker 1: Meg Tilly and for Who's a Bulk of the Craft

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Speaker 1: and the water Boy fame. So the source material for

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Speaker 1: the plot of cruel intentions, It's been around for a

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Speaker 1: very long time. You Alan Rickman made the role of

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Speaker 1: val Mont famous on London and Broadway. No that ah,

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Speaker 1: that makes sense though he was not even considered for

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Speaker 1: the ninety eight movie because he was such an unknown,

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Speaker 1: but he ended up starting Hiss, Hans Gruber and die

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Speaker 1: Hard his first Hollywood role that year. So he came

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Speaker 1: out of worked out far. I'm good, he deserves it.

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Speaker 1: They were the two competing versions of that. You know

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Speaker 1: we mentioned um Dangerous Liaisons was AD eight and then

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Speaker 1: Valmont was eighty nine, right, yeah, and so Christopher Hampton

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Speaker 1: directed the play version of Valmont, and he said he

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Speaker 1: was supposed to have a meeting with Milos Foreman to

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Speaker 1: talk about making this film adaptation after Foreman attended several

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Speaker 1: stagings of the play and Foreman ghosted him, so he

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Speaker 1: was like, I guess not involved in the movie that much.

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Speaker 1: And then um, the studio ended up rushing. They found

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Speaker 1: it was like the Zantad thing where they found out

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Speaker 1: that there were competing dangerous the Asians adaptation being made,

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Speaker 1: so they rushed. Uh, the Stephen Fears went to the

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Speaker 1: box office, ended up burying the Milos Foreman on. So

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Speaker 1: Holly weird, bad place. And the second and much lesser

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Speaker 1: known influence on Cruel Intentions was indie movie called Welcome

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Speaker 1: to the Dollhouse and it was written and directed by

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Speaker 1: Todd Salance and it was this extremely extremely black comedy

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Speaker 1: about a teenager desperately vying for popularity at her school.

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Speaker 1: And it was dark and mean. There was a scene

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Speaker 1: I think where the main character like holes a hammer

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Speaker 1: over her little sister's head while she sleeps, and then

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Speaker 1: somebody like their neighbor who's a pedophile, ab ducks the

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Speaker 1: young girl and takes her to New York City, and

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Speaker 1: all of his films are so so his stock and trade,

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Speaker 1: dark and mean, and Roger Comboll absolutely loved it. He

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Speaker 1: said he'd never seen something set in school that was

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Speaker 1: so dark. I guess I don't know. I'm thinking of Heathers,

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Speaker 1: but this is probably darker than that. Um. So, the

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Speaker 1: fusion of these two ideas, dangerous liaisons and an extremely

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Speaker 1: dark high school store, this Welcome to the Dollhouse movie

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Speaker 1: led to Roger Humbell's big Aha moment, the moment when

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Speaker 1: the idea called out and said take on me, take

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Speaker 1: me on, I'll be gone. Can you do it in

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Speaker 1: a day? I can to that moment. Yes. Um. He

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Speaker 1: wanted to use the plot of dangerous liaisons with a

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Speaker 1: fantastically bitchy high school story, and instead of the aristocracy,

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Speaker 1: it would be wealthy Upper east Side brats at a

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Speaker 1: fancy Manhattan prep school. Roger Vadims nine adaptation have been

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Speaker 1: set in modern day, so Kumble was confident that it

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Speaker 1: could be done, and in interview with Cosmo, he said, quote,

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Speaker 1: it was one of those moments when you're just walking

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Speaker 1: across the street and the idea popped into my head

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Speaker 1: to do dangerous liaison set in high school and I

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Speaker 1: molded over for a year and it was a busy year.

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Speaker 1: Roger Kumble, as I said earlier, had a background in theater,

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Speaker 1: and he launched a play called D Girl, which is

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Speaker 1: short for development girl, or a person who goes through

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Speaker 1: movie pitches at a studio. And it's not surprising that

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Speaker 1: this was the mind who created Cruel Intentions because D

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Speaker 1: Girls about a screenwriter seducing a younger woman, the titular

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Speaker 1: D Girl. It's a star. They got David Swimmer, who

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Speaker 1: was at the peak of his world, conquering friends, fame,

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Speaker 1: and Kamba said that casting Swimmer it was a game

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Speaker 1: changer for me, and when the play was a hit,

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Speaker 1: he started to get attention in industry circles and figured

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Speaker 1: that this was his shot at making a movie project.

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Speaker 1: As he later said, I had some heat and I

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Speaker 1: didn't want to lose it. Literally the day the play

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Speaker 1: went down, I went to Mexico and I wrote Cruel

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Speaker 1: Intentions in twelve days twelve So thank you, Ross Keller.

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Speaker 1: Kumble originally planned to make his directoral movie debut as

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Speaker 1: a tiny indie movie with just a million dollar budget.

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Speaker 1: Then it got the attention of a producer by the

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Speaker 1: name of Neil Moritz. It was just about to become

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Speaker 1: huge thanks to the success of I Know as You

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Speaker 1: did Last Summer and it's sequel, I know what you

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Speaker 1: did last summer too, No harder back in the habit

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Speaker 1: A good day to know what you did last summer,

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Speaker 1: last summer. There's gotta be another There's gotta be another

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Speaker 1: sequel and we can we can get in there. I

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Speaker 1: know what you did last summer to the Two Towers. Uh.

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Speaker 1: He would also do Fast and Furious Jump Street, I

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Speaker 1: am Legend, the sonic of the Hedgehog movies. So once

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Speaker 1: he signed onto this things escalated. Kamba was originally considering

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Speaker 1: getting Jonathan Myers to play the part of Sebastian Valmart

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Speaker 1: but then Maurice was like, hey, I just made this movie.

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Speaker 1: I know what you did last Yeah, with Sarah Michelle

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Speaker 1: Geller and Ryan Philippi. Why you checked them out? He

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Speaker 1: knew of Sarah Michelle Geller mostly through Buffy the Vampire Slayer,

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Speaker 1: and he was just not super familiar with Ryan Phillippy,

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Speaker 1: but he liked him because he had just that kind

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Speaker 1: of Valmont air about him. Why he's punchable. Yes. Sarah

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Speaker 1: Michelle Geller was pumped to take this role because she

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Speaker 1: was ready for a different kind of movie. Um. She

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Speaker 1: had done the two seasons to date on Buffy, but

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Speaker 1: she had then played back to back murder victims in

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Speaker 1: Scream Too, and I know she did last summer, so

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Speaker 1: she was ready to take on something a little bit

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Speaker 1: different and give herself some distance from Buffy. Uh. It

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Speaker 1: was her idea to die her trademark blonde hair dark,

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Speaker 1: and she strongly resisted any attempts from humbold to make

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Speaker 1: that character sympathetic. Sarah Michelle Geller herself grew up on

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Speaker 1: the Upper East Side, so she knew that world and

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Speaker 1: um brought a lot of nuance to the uh bitchiness

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Speaker 1: for lack of a term. Yeah, and she you know,

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Speaker 1: did have a bit of this in her CV. I

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Speaker 1: mean she was on the she was on All My

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Speaker 1: Children for a while, she playing the villainous Kendall. So

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Speaker 1: you just know that woman was bad bad news. Apologies

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Speaker 1: to any Kendall's who may be listening to this show. Uh.

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Speaker 1: Talking to Premier Magazine in Sarah Michelle Geller said, we

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Speaker 1: had long talks about her history Roger used to always say,

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Speaker 1: don't you think she was abused? And I'd say no,

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Speaker 1: I think she had a perfect upbringing. I think her

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Speaker 1: mother adored her and her father sent her amazing gifts.

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Speaker 1: She just wanted more. Um and Sarah Schelle Geller's extremely

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Speaker 1: proud of this role. She later told Huffington Post that

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Speaker 1: was one of her two best film experiences. What would

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Speaker 1: the other one? Do you think maybe Scooby Doo? Because

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Speaker 1: I assume that's wished. She met Freddie press Jr. Oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: I guess that's true. Scooby Doo. Anybody's favorite film experience? Um? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but she never got she met Freddie Britten's so very cute. Uh.

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Speaker 1: She said, we just knew we were making something that

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Speaker 1: was so different, and we were also passionate and so excited,

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Speaker 1: and we were all friends. It was just a great

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Speaker 1: time making that and letting it go as far as

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Speaker 1: it did. One person who was not impressed with cruel

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Speaker 1: intentions was Buffy creator Joss Weeden, who dismissed the film

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Speaker 1: as a porny. That's not a type of that's not

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Speaker 1: that's what he said. I think he's at a porny.

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Speaker 1: That's weird. Grown man calling pornography a porny that's weird

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Speaker 1: and gross at a Television Critics Association press conference. Sara

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Speaker 1: Michael Geller was less than pleased with this assessment, and

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Speaker 1: she told Premiere At magazine at the time that she said,

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Speaker 1: I did what I think is my best work to

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Speaker 1: date in that movie. Brushing it off by calling it

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Speaker 1: a porny is unbelievably hurtful to me. He owes me flowers,

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Speaker 1: and that's on the record. She uh, you know, came

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Speaker 1: out on top in when U Charisma Carpenter from Buffy

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Speaker 1: made allegations of abuse against Joss Weeden. After those allegations

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Speaker 1: were public uh, Sarah Michelle Geller issued a statement saying, well,

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Speaker 1: I'm proud to have my name associated with Buffy Summers.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to be forever associated with the name

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Speaker 1: Josh Weeden. The only thing she didn't like about playing

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Speaker 1: the quote Marcia Brady of the Upper east Side was

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Speaker 1: the fake coke that she had to snort, which was

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Speaker 1: made of ground up camel meal. I did not know

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Speaker 1: that that's what they use in movies for fake It's

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Speaker 1: what they've used on this movie at least interesting. Well,

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Speaker 1: she was allergic. U. Yeah, and she said my nose

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Speaker 1: and throat had it rough for a while, which, sure,

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Speaker 1: it's not supposed to have that kind of stuff put

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Speaker 1: up in it. Yeah, I'll do it. Do you know

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Speaker 1: that Buffy was produced by Dolly Parton's production company. Dolly

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Speaker 1: Parton has like credits on Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Dolly

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Speaker 1: Parton is like the Forrest Gumbo. That means she's semi

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Speaker 1: indirectly funded the vaccine, the COVID vaccine. She like has

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Speaker 1: just made so many different beloved things. Ah, Dolly. Well,

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Speaker 1: the roles of brother and sister Katherine and Sebastian were

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Speaker 1: cast fairly easily. You got Ryan Phillippi and Sarah Michelle Galler,

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Speaker 1: but the search for the headmaster's sweet virginal daughter was

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Speaker 1: a bit trickier. The studio really wanted Katie Holmes, who

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Speaker 1: was appearing as Joey on Dawson's Creek at the time,

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Speaker 1: but director Roger Kumbell disagreed, later telling Cosmo that the

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Speaker 1: part quote needed someone with a little more strength of character,

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Speaker 1: which Ouch. The situation reached the stalemate one night when

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Speaker 1: he was hanging out with Ryan Phillippi and said, Hey,

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Speaker 1: what about your girlfriend, meaning Witherspoon front of the pod

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Speaker 1: Reese Witherspoon. The couple began dating in seven, when Philippie

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Speaker 1: crashed Witherspoon's twenty first birthday party. Now, Reese was a

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Speaker 1: rising star at this point, having already made pleasant Phil

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Speaker 1: and Fear and plus you also had the real life

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Speaker 1: chemistry with her boyfriend, so it seemed like a good fit.

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Speaker 1: But Witherspoon required some convincing to take the role because

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Speaker 1: she felt like a Net was just a typical boring,

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Speaker 1: you know in quotes good girl, a k A. Too

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Speaker 1: close to some of the roles she'd played in the past.

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Speaker 1: So director Roger Kumbell took Reese and Ryan to Le

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Speaker 1: Petite Bistro, which was this fancy French place that was

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Speaker 1: an industry staple in l A at the time, and

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Speaker 1: proceeded to literally wine and dine her under Cumbell told Cosmo,

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Speaker 1: so basically, we took Reese out to dinner to get

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Speaker 1: her drunk, and we ended up getting her drunk, and

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Speaker 1: I literally got down on my knees and begged her, please,

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Speaker 1: It'll be fifteen days. You'll be great. Not especially dignified,

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Speaker 1: but it did the trick, though she had some terms.

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Speaker 1: Rees agreed to take the part, but insisted on tweaking

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Speaker 1: the character so she was stronger. And if you remember

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Speaker 1: Michelle Peiffer's character and dangerous liaisons Madame de Trouvel, her

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Speaker 1: entire personality was essentially being as pure as the driven snow.

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Speaker 1: I mean, there was not really much else there. Roger

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Speaker 1: Kumbel later said, Reese and I got together and we

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Speaker 1: gave a net more bite. So she wasn't a doormat

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Speaker 1: as opposed to her, you know, corresponding character and dangerous

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Speaker 1: liaisons and a very grateful day for that, kumble said.

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Speaker 1: So that's why Katie Holmes didn't make it into cruel intentions.

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Speaker 1: But there is another. Dawson's Creek veteran Joshua Jackson appeared

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Speaker 1: in the film as Blame Tuttle, Sebastian's partner in crime,

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Speaker 1: the kid with the truly Awful for Us A Tips

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Speaker 1: died job. I'm waiting for the Zoomers to pick up

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Speaker 1: Frosted Tips Man. Yeah, that's I mean, we got Jake

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Speaker 1: and everything else. They're grabbing everything else from late nineties.

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Speaker 1: Come on, you guys, gotta you wanta go Hohle Hog

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Speaker 1: on this you commit, you get the frosted tips. There's

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Speaker 1: also a pre American pie Tara Reid in the film.

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Speaker 1: She's Marcy Green bamb who calls her Si Kaiatrist mother

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Speaker 1: after Sebastian Leak's nude photos of her. Uh. But Reese

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Speaker 1: Wetherspoon wasn't the only cast member who needed convincing to

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Speaker 1: sign on to cruel intentions. Christine Baranski, who played Cecil's

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Speaker 1: strict mother Bunny, called well said that she was going

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Speaker 1: to pass on the role. Once again, Roger Kumble got

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Speaker 1: down on his knees, though perhaps not literally this time.

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Speaker 1: Baranski later told The l a times, I had to

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Speaker 1: be talked into doing that one. It was gonna be

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Speaker 1: shot during my first year hiatus from the TV show

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Speaker 1: Sybil Sybil Shepherd, and I was anxious to go home

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Speaker 1: and be with my kids. The director begged and begged

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Speaker 1: me and said, it's only a few scenes. I think

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Speaker 1: she only need to work for like three days. And

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Speaker 1: also her daughters were massive Buffy the Vampire Slayer fans,

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Speaker 1: so when they found out Sarah Michelle Geller was involved,

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Speaker 1: they pestered their mother to take the role, and it

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Speaker 1: ended up paying off artistically and financially. She said, I'm

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Speaker 1: still making residual money off cruel intentions. It might be

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Speaker 1: the movie that's maybe the most in residuals because it's

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Speaker 1: such a hint. I didn't do much in that movie,

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Speaker 1: and yet will come up to me and quote my lines.

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Speaker 1: Just not that for three days work. And speaking of

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Speaker 1: the cowdbull family, we have to talk about Cecile, the

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Speaker 1: true stand out in a film packed with memorable characters.

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Speaker 1: She was played, of course, in inimitable fashion by some

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Speaker 1: of Blair, and some of Blair showed it up to

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Speaker 1: the audition basically ready to tape. Uh cumbolto Cosmo, it

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Speaker 1: was the smartest audition I've ever seen in my career.

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Speaker 1: For legal reasons, he had to ask all of the

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Speaker 1: actors auditioning for the role how old they were, because

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Speaker 1: there's a graphic sex scene with Sebastian in the movie

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Speaker 1: and the character is supposed to be fifteen. Uh Kumble said,

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Speaker 1: So we're bringing in all these people and they were

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Speaker 1: all good, but I'm selma come in and I said

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Speaker 1: how old are you? And she goes, in Cecil's brady voice,

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Speaker 1: how old are you? Had the impression was incredible. Thank

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Speaker 1: you for that. And she was so obnoxious and I

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Speaker 1: couldn't get it out of my head. Um, and this

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Speaker 1: is now. This is of course, where we get into

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Speaker 1: classic nineties tri up of having people in their twenties

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Speaker 1: play high schoolers. Someone plays one of the youngest characters

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Speaker 1: in the movie. As a fifteen year old, she was

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Speaker 1: one of the oldest actors in the main cast. She

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Speaker 1: turned twenty six during the shoot. Sean Patrick Thomas, who

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Speaker 1: played her love interest, was thirty. He looks at yeah,

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Speaker 1: he does. He looks kind of rough. Ryan Philippe was

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Speaker 1: twenty five recent this room is twenty three, and Sara

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Speaker 1: Michael Geller, the youngest of the bunch, was only twenty

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Speaker 1: two years old, so she was conceivably with thin spitting distance.

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Speaker 1: We're going to take a quick break, but we'll be

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Speaker 1: right back with more too much information in just a moment.

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Speaker 1: Another important character in the film is, of course, Sebastian's car,

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Speaker 1: which is plays a central role in the famous bet

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Speaker 1: is a nineteen fifty six Jaguar x K one forty roadster,

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Speaker 1: or at least that is what they would have you believe,

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Speaker 1: but it's actually a replica built by a company called

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Speaker 1: Cinema Cars, which builds replicas of these super expensive collectible

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Speaker 1: cars that would not otherwise be loaned out to film shoots.

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Speaker 1: For example, Cameron's dad's Ferrari in Ferris Bueller's Day Off

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Speaker 1: was a replica built by this company on a Corvette

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Speaker 1: chassis was built by this company. But these types of companies,

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Speaker 1: which I didn't realize existed until searching this. I'm an

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Speaker 1: old car buff guy. I had no idea, and yeah,

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Speaker 1: I was gonna say, uh, Sebastian's jag regularly retails for

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Speaker 1: upwards of a hundred grand. Rather than risk it, they

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Speaker 1: went with the dummy. Speaking of the set direction in

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Speaker 1: production design of this movie, it's also well done. I mean.

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Speaker 1: The costume designer Denise Wingate, in an interview with Days,

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Speaker 1: talked about putting some of Blair in that red hoodie

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Speaker 1: when she goes to leave to see Sebastian, thus making

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Speaker 1: her look like quote a contemporary little red riding hood

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Speaker 1: going to see the Big Bad Wolf. Wingate also wanted

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Speaker 1: Catherine and Sebastian's wardrobe to basically play up the darkness

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Speaker 1: of their characters, which is why they're often dressed in black,

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Speaker 1: whereas Net is usually dressed in these brighter, more angelic colors,

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Speaker 1: Um saying when he gets hit by a car and

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Speaker 1: sees her, it's almost as if she's an angel. At

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Speaker 1: the time, Brian Phillippe said this dichotomy very much mirrored

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Speaker 1: their own personalities. He said, there's a definite balance. There

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Speaker 1: is a happy, lighthearted person, but she's also incredibly intelligent.

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Speaker 1: I tend to be considerably darker. She keeps me from

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Speaker 1: getting too dark and depressed, and that's essential in a

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Speaker 1: business that's based on uncertainty and insecurity. This darkness was

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Speaker 1: also played up in the literal sets of the film.

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Speaker 1: Designer John Gary Steele ensured that all of the locations

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Speaker 1: that they were allowed to paint were painted in dark colors.

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Speaker 1: This is because he said, I see the movie is

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Speaker 1: very much a tragedy. Since we were using a young cast,

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Speaker 1: I didn't want it to feel like a young, bright

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Speaker 1: teen film because it's not. It's very trad Jake, everyone

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Speaker 1: basically loses. I just like to pause for a moment

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Speaker 1: and reflect on just how dark this movie actually is.

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Speaker 1: This really savor it. The director tells this funny story

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Speaker 1: of Ryan Phillippi coming up to him at one point

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Speaker 1: during the shoot and saying, when you really break down

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Speaker 1: this movie, it's really about me wanting to have animal

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Speaker 1: sex with my sister. Roger Kumbel said, well, yeah, that's

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Speaker 1: it's an interesting way of looking at it and never

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Speaker 1: thought about that, but yeah, sure like there's some good

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Speaker 1: textual analysis. Ryan, thank you for that. Because Roger Humble

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Speaker 1: had more of a background in comedy, he was able

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Speaker 1: to temper the darkness slightly with jokes to make it

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Speaker 1: more palatable. But he later described the way that Sarah

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Speaker 1: Michelle Geller could just deliver these devastating lines. He said,

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Speaker 1: she didn't even have to lean into the dialogue. The

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Speaker 1: dialogue carried the weight, so she could say the most

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Speaker 1: horrible things as if she was just ordering food. It's

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Speaker 1: a great way to describe it. Amazing. The German version

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Speaker 1: of cruel intentions is called I scouta and thank you yes,

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Speaker 1: which translates to ice cold angels, which rules, um, yeah,

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Speaker 1: there's uh sex of basically every permutation in this movie.

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Speaker 1: There's men and women, men and men, women and women,

421
00:23:15,400 --> 00:23:20,960
Speaker 1: brothers and sisters. Uh did I miss anything? No? Dog,

422
00:23:22,600 --> 00:23:24,760
Speaker 1: You'd be forgiven for thinking that the sexual tension on

423
00:23:24,800 --> 00:23:27,000
Speaker 1: the set of this movie could be unbearable, but Joshua

424
00:23:27,119 --> 00:23:30,440
Speaker 1: Jackson told Entertainment Weekly that the vibe was quote playful,

425
00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:33,080
Speaker 1: and that was nice because my first day was doing

426
00:23:33,119 --> 00:23:35,800
Speaker 1: this scene where I'm giving a blow chop and I

427
00:23:35,960 --> 00:23:39,080
Speaker 1: was diving into the deep end, he said. And there

428
00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:41,480
Speaker 1: was one scene from the film that was ultimately cut

429
00:23:41,560 --> 00:23:44,399
Speaker 1: where Sebastian is on the phone with a net and

430
00:23:44,680 --> 00:23:48,600
Speaker 1: to emphasize the difference between her sweetness and his debauched lifestyle.

431
00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:50,960
Speaker 1: In the background when he's on the phone are two

432
00:23:51,119 --> 00:23:54,080
Speaker 1: naked cheerleaders oiling themselves up all he speaks to a net,

433
00:23:54,760 --> 00:23:57,240
Speaker 1: and according to Roger Humboldt, this was just quote to

434
00:23:57,359 --> 00:23:59,840
Speaker 1: show what a cat he was at that stage. And

435
00:24:00,040 --> 00:24:02,560
Speaker 1: for that, I wanted to see some gratuitous nudity, but

436
00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:04,920
Speaker 1: I didn't want some girl crying on her trailer about

437
00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:08,000
Speaker 1: having to get naked. My parents did raise me that way,

438
00:24:08,080 --> 00:24:10,960
Speaker 1: he said. I didn't want to force anybody, so I

439
00:24:11,119 --> 00:24:13,800
Speaker 1: was like, I know, I'll hire an adult film star.

440
00:24:14,160 --> 00:24:17,040
Speaker 1: They have no problem with that. So Kumble hired a

441
00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:20,359
Speaker 1: woman named Alicia Klass, whom he considered quote the biggest

442
00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:23,440
Speaker 1: star in adult films. In the late nineties, and she

443
00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:27,640
Speaker 1: was hired to play the aforementioned naked cheerleader. However, rather

444
00:24:27,720 --> 00:24:30,399
Speaker 1: than having a performer who was uncomfortable with being naked,

445
00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:35,080
Speaker 1: Alicia Klass was perhaps a little too comfortable. Kumble recalls

446
00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:38,359
Speaker 1: customer Denise Wingate coming into his office one day and saying,

447
00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:40,800
Speaker 1: we've got a problem the women on the set of

448
00:24:40,840 --> 00:24:43,720
Speaker 1: a problem And he's like, what's going on? She said,

449
00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:46,800
Speaker 1: your actors at catering and she's wearing just a fish

450
00:24:46,880 --> 00:24:50,479
Speaker 1: net whatever body skirt and basically flashing all of us.

451
00:24:51,280 --> 00:24:53,600
Speaker 1: And Kumble said, so it was like a no good

452
00:24:53,680 --> 00:24:56,199
Speaker 1: deed situation where I just didn't want to force an

453
00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:58,480
Speaker 1: actor to go topless in a scene. I got the

454
00:24:58,560 --> 00:25:01,240
Speaker 1: one person with no inhibition and now I'm like the

455
00:25:01,359 --> 00:25:04,920
Speaker 1: pig in front of all the women on the crew. Ultimately,

456
00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:06,680
Speaker 1: it was all for naught and the scene was cut

457
00:25:06,760 --> 00:25:09,400
Speaker 1: because it tested poorly and just seemed a little too

458
00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:11,560
Speaker 1: good to it us. But Kamba said that she was

459
00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:14,840
Speaker 1: extremely sweet Alicia Klaus and even brought some of her

460
00:25:14,960 --> 00:25:18,640
Speaker 1: DVDs as gifts for some of the grips. Very nice.

461
00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:21,760
Speaker 1: I just want to read a section from her Wikipedia

462
00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:25,200
Speaker 1: page here which is Uh. Class began starting in portographic

463
00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:29,040
Speaker 1: movies around becoming the best known collaborator of director Seymour

464
00:25:29,119 --> 00:25:33,440
Speaker 1: Butts aka Adam Glasser, to whom she was once engaged.

465
00:25:33,880 --> 00:25:37,679
Speaker 1: Class had a tattoo on her rear reading Seymour Butts. However,

466
00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:41,080
Speaker 1: following an acrimonious breakup in two thousand, she since had

467
00:25:41,119 --> 00:25:43,960
Speaker 1: it covered with a dolphin. It's a bet affle like

468
00:25:44,000 --> 00:25:46,960
Speaker 1: I have a dollphel on his back too. No, he

469
00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:50,840
Speaker 1: is the Phoenix is the full back tattoo of the phoenix.

470
00:25:53,640 --> 00:25:59,560
Speaker 1: But without question, the most memorable, impactful what's the word

471
00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:01,400
Speaker 1: I'm looking for? Whatever the case, The scene that will

472
00:26:01,480 --> 00:26:04,720
Speaker 1: forever live in infamy is the scene where Sarah Michelle

473
00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:08,120
Speaker 1: Gellar's character is giving young Cecile played by Selma Blair,

474
00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:12,560
Speaker 1: kissing lessons in the middle of Central Park. Adorably. Selma

475
00:26:12,640 --> 00:26:15,960
Speaker 1: Blair admitted to feeling deeply nervous before the shoot. She said,

476
00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:18,720
Speaker 1: I'd never kissed a girl before. I remember, I was like,

477
00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:22,119
Speaker 1: what if I'm a really horrible kisser. Apparently she had

478
00:26:22,119 --> 00:26:24,760
Speaker 1: nothing to worry about, because Sarah Michelle Geller was extremely

479
00:26:24,800 --> 00:26:28,600
Speaker 1: complimentary in interviews over the years, saying, oh, I remember

480
00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:31,720
Speaker 1: was thinking I could kiss Selma all day. She told

481
00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:35,320
Speaker 1: Entertainment Weekly her skin was so soft. My skin is

482
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:37,720
Speaker 1: really sensitive, so when I kiss on camera lot, it

483
00:26:37,840 --> 00:26:44,119
Speaker 1: gets raw. In that Entertainment In that Entertainment Weekly thing,

484
00:26:44,200 --> 00:26:46,960
Speaker 1: there's a great line where Sama Blair says that her mom,

485
00:26:47,160 --> 00:26:50,159
Speaker 1: when she saw the scene for the first time, she

486
00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:53,280
Speaker 1: told Selma, honestly, Selma, did you have to use so

487
00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:56,440
Speaker 1: much tongue that poor Sarah? She looks so delicate and

488
00:26:56,520 --> 00:27:00,200
Speaker 1: then you just have that goliath in her mouth. That

489
00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:06,080
Speaker 1: was someone players mom, So poor poor sols nerves weren't

490
00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:07,920
Speaker 1: helped by the fact that they shot the scene on

491
00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:10,879
Speaker 1: the very last day of filming, so the anticipation had

492
00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:14,080
Speaker 1: been building. I think the film shoot went from June

493
00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:18,880
Speaker 1: nine July, so if anyone's a time machine and wants

494
00:27:18,880 --> 00:27:21,919
Speaker 1: to go to Central Park, there you go. Now another day, uh.

495
00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:25,240
Speaker 1: And there were hundreds of extras and photographers around and

496
00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:28,600
Speaker 1: and it ended up making tabloid headlines the following week.

497
00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:31,159
Speaker 1: And she said, we saw headlines that said something like,

498
00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:33,679
Speaker 1: Sarah spends a day in Central Park with a friend

499
00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:37,280
Speaker 1: somewhat remembered. I guess they all had their telescopic lenses

500
00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:41,200
Speaker 1: ready that day and the scene is I can't believe

501
00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:43,600
Speaker 1: I'm about to say this. The scene is memorable because

502
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:47,760
Speaker 1: of a bit of spittle that appears as they pull

503
00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:50,960
Speaker 1: away from one another. Initially, one of the dps was

504
00:27:51,040 --> 00:27:53,720
Speaker 1: pushing to shoot the scene again, but Roger Cumbell held

505
00:27:53,800 --> 00:27:56,280
Speaker 1: fast for his art. He said, I forgot who but

506
00:27:56,359 --> 00:27:59,120
Speaker 1: someone said we need to go again. There's saliva connecting them,

507
00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:04,119
Speaker 1: something I've never said out loud. And our cinematographer said no,

508
00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:07,440
Speaker 1: it's beautiful, and I was like, no, it's hot. I mean,

509
00:28:07,680 --> 00:28:10,840
Speaker 1: we'll go again, but I think it's cool. So it

510
00:28:10,920 --> 00:28:13,560
Speaker 1: was a happy accident and it's kind of been remembered

511
00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:17,160
Speaker 1: for that because something about all these dudes, young women

512
00:28:17,280 --> 00:28:21,600
Speaker 1: kissing the park and me like, yeah, go again, good,

513
00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:26,360
Speaker 1: go again, one more time. But Geller and Blair won

514
00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:28,880
Speaker 1: the Best Kiss Award at the two thousand MTV Movie

515
00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:31,560
Speaker 1: Awards for that scene, beating out such heavy hitters as

516
00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:34,120
Speaker 1: Hilary Swank and Chloe seven Yer and Boys Don't Cry,

517
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:37,840
Speaker 1: Drew Barrymore and Michael Verton and Never Been Kissed, and

518
00:28:38,040 --> 00:28:41,640
Speaker 1: Katie Holmes and Barry Watson in Teaching Mrs Tingle. Poor

519
00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:45,520
Speaker 1: Katie Holmes and cruel intentions. Always a bridemaid didn't get

520
00:28:45,520 --> 00:28:50,200
Speaker 1: the role. They wouldn't let her live up someone with

521
00:28:50,680 --> 00:28:53,920
Speaker 1: more force of character. What a brutal thing to say

522
00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:57,280
Speaker 1: about not casting an actress. Damn. But Selma Blair and

523
00:28:57,320 --> 00:29:00,440
Speaker 1: Sarah Michelle geller If remain close in the US years

524
00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:03,680
Speaker 1: since making cruel intentions, which I really like. They frequently

525
00:29:03,760 --> 00:29:07,600
Speaker 1: post girl crush photos and tbts of each other girl

526
00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:10,960
Speaker 1: crush being there whereas not mine. Not long after Selma

527
00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:14,240
Speaker 1: revealed her MS diagnosis, she posted a very sweet tribute

528
00:29:14,280 --> 00:29:16,800
Speaker 1: to Sarah Michelle Gellar for supporting her, calling her quote

529
00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:19,400
Speaker 1: an angel of a friend, which I think is really nice.

530
00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:22,920
Speaker 1: She wrote, this girl always, my girl is everything. She

531
00:29:23,080 --> 00:29:25,200
Speaker 1: tucked me in and brought me dinner and loved me up.

532
00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:27,280
Speaker 1: I woke up with so much love for Sarah Michelle

533
00:29:27,320 --> 00:29:29,720
Speaker 1: Gellar since the day I met her over twenty years ago.

534
00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:32,440
Speaker 1: She fought for me along with Roger Kumbel to besa seal.

535
00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:34,960
Speaker 1: She took me under her wing and today is no different.

536
00:29:35,200 --> 00:29:37,240
Speaker 1: I'm so in love with my angel of a friend,

537
00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:40,600
Speaker 1: the best even through me my baby shower and is

538
00:29:40,640 --> 00:29:42,680
Speaker 1: there for me every step of the way, maybe we

539
00:29:42,760 --> 00:29:44,760
Speaker 1: all have a friend like this. I love you, Sarah,

540
00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:47,640
Speaker 1: Michelle Geller and my whole team of lovely I count

541
00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:52,320
Speaker 1: my blessings. Speaking of bodily fluids, where there's where there's smoke,

542
00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:56,680
Speaker 1: there's fire, and where there's spit, there's vomit. Yes, Witherspoon,

543
00:29:57,240 --> 00:30:01,760
Speaker 1: no Smotherspoon made her then boyfriend Ryan Philippy throw up

544
00:30:01,880 --> 00:30:04,640
Speaker 1: after a particularly intense scene. Do you feel about that?

545
00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:06,959
Speaker 1: I don't know anything about Ryan Philippi, but he's got

546
00:30:07,040 --> 00:30:09,000
Speaker 1: that like Tom Brady energy to me, so that like

547
00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:11,960
Speaker 1: when bad things happened to him, I'm all in. He's

548
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:16,680
Speaker 1: just too pretty. He's got that that yalely you know,

549
00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:24,880
Speaker 1: roofy people and face. I don't know anyway. Uh. Sebastian

550
00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:27,080
Speaker 1: has fallen in love with Annette, who is the subject

551
00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:30,560
Speaker 1: of the bat, and he's basically no longer interested in Katherine,

552
00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:34,160
Speaker 1: who you know, the aforementioned you can put it anywhere

553
00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:38,600
Speaker 1: his stepsister, yep, the only reason for taking them beat

554
00:30:38,600 --> 00:30:41,160
Speaker 1: in the first place. Catherine forces Sebastian to break up

555
00:30:41,200 --> 00:30:44,000
Speaker 1: with a Nette, which leads to a heated argument between

556
00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:46,240
Speaker 1: the two of them, during which Annette slaps him across

557
00:30:46,280 --> 00:30:49,240
Speaker 1: the face. This was not planned. Ryan later told The

558
00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:53,000
Speaker 1: Morning Call. At one point, I was improvising off camera

559
00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:55,440
Speaker 1: for Reese. I guess I said some pretty mean things,

560
00:30:55,760 --> 00:30:58,480
Speaker 1: so she came over and slapped me. Roger loved it

561
00:30:58,560 --> 00:31:00,960
Speaker 1: so much he incorporated it into the scene, so I

562
00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:04,320
Speaker 1: basically got slapped around for a couple of hours. This

563
00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:08,880
Speaker 1: scene was This scene was not. Yeah, try working in

564
00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:12,600
Speaker 1: digital media. Uh. This scene was not easy for either actor,

565
00:31:12,760 --> 00:31:16,880
Speaker 1: considering they were dating at the time. But it's took

566
00:31:17,280 --> 00:31:20,160
Speaker 1: take after take after take, and Roger Crumble said, you know,

567
00:31:20,280 --> 00:31:22,160
Speaker 1: I want to be professional, but until like I feel

568
00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:24,800
Speaker 1: like we have it, you just have to go. As

569
00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:26,440
Speaker 1: a director, You're like, I'm not going to be the

570
00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:29,520
Speaker 1: most liked person today, he said. I don't think we

571
00:31:29,600 --> 00:31:31,840
Speaker 1: did too many takes, but you know, you get what

572
00:31:31,960 --> 00:31:33,920
Speaker 1: you need to get. You really want to see him

573
00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:37,360
Speaker 1: ripping his heart out. So Ryan says, they shot this

574
00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:40,840
Speaker 1: for four straight hours and he uh left the set,

575
00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:43,840
Speaker 1: went outside and vomited. He said, it was so emotionally

576
00:31:43,920 --> 00:31:46,800
Speaker 1: punishing for me that he went outside and literally threw up.

577
00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:54,160
Speaker 1: So good for him, As is so often the case

578
00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:56,360
Speaker 1: in life. Let us go from the breakup scene to

579
00:31:56,440 --> 00:31:59,760
Speaker 1: The sex scene one of many in this movie, but

580
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:02,800
Speaker 1: it's the one that everybody probably remembers the most. Between

581
00:32:02,920 --> 00:32:06,440
Speaker 1: Ryan Phillippi and Reese Witherspoon. Is scored by Counting Crows

582
00:32:06,560 --> 00:32:10,280
Speaker 1: haunting song color Blind, and that song has become so

583
00:32:10,520 --> 00:32:12,760
Speaker 1: identified with that scene to me at least, that it's

584
00:32:12,800 --> 00:32:15,560
Speaker 1: difficult to imagine anything else in there for the soundtrack.

585
00:32:16,080 --> 00:32:19,480
Speaker 1: But color Blind very nearly was not used. In Cruel Intentions.

586
00:32:19,800 --> 00:32:22,080
Speaker 1: Director Roger Kumbell said the one of the scene to

587
00:32:22,200 --> 00:32:25,280
Speaker 1: be beautiful and not exploitative. He compared it to a

588
00:32:25,360 --> 00:32:28,040
Speaker 1: love scene in Robert Altman's The Player with Tim Robbins

589
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:35,680
Speaker 1: and grettas Sketchy Scotchy and grettis Jim Robbins with just

590
00:32:35,800 --> 00:32:41,080
Speaker 1: Jim Robbins is in it. Uh. In that Cosmo interview,

591
00:32:41,320 --> 00:32:43,600
Speaker 1: Roger Kumbell is a funny line about doing these kinds

592
00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:46,000
Speaker 1: of scenes. He said, what I do in situations like

593
00:32:46,080 --> 00:32:48,280
Speaker 1: that and anything I'm working on is I just dropped

594
00:32:48,280 --> 00:32:51,040
Speaker 1: the pretensions of the job and go, okay, let's deal

595
00:32:51,080 --> 00:32:52,880
Speaker 1: with the elephant in the room. I'm about the film

596
00:32:52,920 --> 00:32:55,160
Speaker 1: of sex scene with you, and I feel weird. And

597
00:32:55,200 --> 00:32:57,000
Speaker 1: then usually the actors are like, no, no, no, we

598
00:32:57,080 --> 00:32:59,440
Speaker 1: get it. It's weird, and then I go, how do

599
00:32:59,560 --> 00:33:01,240
Speaker 1: I make it? That's weird. Let's all be on the

600
00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:05,280
Speaker 1: same page. So that's nice. Now. Over the years has

601
00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:07,680
Speaker 1: been a great deal of speculation as to whether Reese

602
00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:10,240
Speaker 1: and Ryan We're actually having sex on camera for real,

603
00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:13,240
Speaker 1: since they were together in real life and people have

604
00:33:13,400 --> 00:33:17,000
Speaker 1: no chill in their imaginations. Director Roger Kumba, whoever, was

605
00:33:17,040 --> 00:33:19,920
Speaker 1: confirmed that the sex was simulated. The actors were not

606
00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:22,320
Speaker 1: even fully naked when filming the scene, since in the

607
00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:24,600
Speaker 1: scene each one is only visible from the waist up.

608
00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:28,000
Speaker 1: But the intensity of the scene is definitely heightened by

609
00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:31,840
Speaker 1: the song color Blind. But amazingly, as I said earlier,

610
00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:33,720
Speaker 1: that was not the song that was originally supposed to

611
00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:35,800
Speaker 1: be in there. Kamba wanted to use the song to

612
00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:39,520
Speaker 1: Sheila by the Smashing Pumpkins that was very much in

613
00:33:39,600 --> 00:33:41,240
Speaker 1: his head the whole time. In fact, he says he

614
00:33:41,320 --> 00:33:44,200
Speaker 1: wrote the scene while listening to that song on repeat,

615
00:33:44,360 --> 00:33:47,840
Speaker 1: but sadly, Billy Corgan and the band turned him down,

616
00:33:48,640 --> 00:33:51,800
Speaker 1: and this occurred fairly late in the production, so the

617
00:33:51,880 --> 00:33:54,280
Speaker 1: team had to really scramble to find a replacement track

618
00:33:54,440 --> 00:33:57,680
Speaker 1: for the sex scene and Kumba wanted to track initially

619
00:33:57,760 --> 00:34:01,240
Speaker 1: by Neil Finn of Crowded House fame Don't Dream It's

620
00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:05,200
Speaker 1: over a Crowded House. Yeah yeah, but the studio we're

621
00:34:05,200 --> 00:34:08,000
Speaker 1: not into the idea. So they kind of found themselves

622
00:34:08,080 --> 00:34:11,080
Speaker 1: at a creative stand still until Adam Derrett swooped in

623
00:34:11,239 --> 00:34:14,480
Speaker 1: and saved the day. Apparently he saw an early cut

624
00:34:14,560 --> 00:34:16,680
Speaker 1: of the movie and loved it, and, according to Kumble

625
00:34:16,719 --> 00:34:20,000
Speaker 1: at least wrote the song almost immediately after and sent

626
00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:23,440
Speaker 1: a demo to the production team, and Kumble and producer

627
00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:26,160
Speaker 1: Neil Murritz went to the house that Counting Crows were

628
00:34:26,200 --> 00:34:28,759
Speaker 1: renting and watched them record color Blind a couple of

629
00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:31,360
Speaker 1: days later, and that became a stand up cut on

630
00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:37,200
Speaker 1: the soundtrack. Yeah yeah, Adam Durretts or whoever is running

631
00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:40,280
Speaker 1: the Counting Crows Twitter confirmed that I was just looking

632
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:44,120
Speaker 1: that up. So that is like for a band that

633
00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:48,160
Speaker 1: I tend to. You love Counting Crows, don't you even

634
00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:51,920
Speaker 1: you you talk about Counting Crows when like hang you

635
00:34:52,040 --> 00:34:57,680
Speaker 1: like hanging around a lot. I wrote a a treatment

636
00:34:57,760 --> 00:35:02,120
Speaker 1: for a script making one of that song. Really, why

637
00:35:02,160 --> 00:35:03,719
Speaker 1: did you keep trying to get us to cover it? That?

638
00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:05,080
Speaker 1: Because I thought it was I thought it was a

639
00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:07,560
Speaker 1: funny thing to cover. I just thought, and I also

640
00:35:07,600 --> 00:35:09,560
Speaker 1: thought you'd do a good job of it. And it

641
00:35:09,719 --> 00:35:16,400
Speaker 1: was maybe I like counting Crows. I think round here,

642
00:35:17,840 --> 00:35:23,680
Speaker 1: Oh ways, that song around here. I think there's I

643
00:35:23,800 --> 00:35:26,120
Speaker 1: probably like more songs by them than I realized. But

644
00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:30,040
Speaker 1: color blind is like, that's got a punch to it.

645
00:35:30,360 --> 00:35:33,719
Speaker 1: That sounds devastating. I had a roommate in college. We

646
00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:35,719
Speaker 1: each had her own bedrooms, but be sure the kitchen

647
00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:40,440
Speaker 1: common area, and he had a literal ceed mix that

648
00:35:40,640 --> 00:35:43,720
Speaker 1: was his sex mix, and it opened with color Blinds.

649
00:35:43,840 --> 00:35:46,080
Speaker 1: And so whenever I heard that song start, I still

650
00:35:46,120 --> 00:35:49,080
Speaker 1: did this day of a Pavlovian responsive, like, oh I

651
00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:51,960
Speaker 1: gotta get my white noise machine. So you put like

652
00:35:52,040 --> 00:35:55,879
Speaker 1: a playground love by air, you know what? Actually tell

653
00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:58,640
Speaker 1: you what that might have been on there too? Definitely

654
00:35:58,680 --> 00:36:01,600
Speaker 1: something from the Virgin Suicide on track, Yeah, the same arrow.

655
00:36:02,120 --> 00:36:09,800
Speaker 1: I just had pan stuff online. Bump up no no, no,

656
00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:16,000
Speaker 1: no no no, or brings a whole meaning to in

657
00:36:16,120 --> 00:36:21,080
Speaker 1: the mood. It's just the chips a hoy dude, bump

658
00:36:21,160 --> 00:36:29,400
Speaker 1: bump bum How dare you as you meditate on that,

659
00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:32,520
Speaker 1: We'll be right back with more too much information. After

660
00:36:32,600 --> 00:36:48,520
Speaker 1: these messages, you cannot talk about the music in cruel

661
00:36:48,520 --> 00:36:51,320
Speaker 1: intentions without talking about the elephant in the room. And

662
00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:55,960
Speaker 1: that is Bitter Sweet Symphony obviously not written specifically for

663
00:36:56,000 --> 00:36:58,320
Speaker 1: the film, but it plays during the climax of the

664
00:36:58,400 --> 00:37:02,879
Speaker 1: movie as a Nett gets revenge over Catherine following Sebastian's

665
00:37:02,920 --> 00:37:06,040
Speaker 1: death and then cruises off in his jag with his

666
00:37:06,200 --> 00:37:09,359
Speaker 1: journal by her side. But the song very nearly did

667
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:12,360
Speaker 1: not make it into the movie because everything about it

668
00:37:12,760 --> 00:37:16,080
Speaker 1: is a Copa esque bureaucratic nightmare. Couple said that he

669
00:37:16,239 --> 00:37:19,480
Speaker 1: wrote the scene to the music without getting the rights first,

670
00:37:19,600 --> 00:37:22,000
Speaker 1: which you said is a big no note on screen.

671
00:37:22,040 --> 00:37:25,920
Speaker 1: Ren In school they tell you never put songs in

672
00:37:26,560 --> 00:37:31,279
Speaker 1: scripts because all that the people read again will do

673
00:37:31,440 --> 00:37:34,040
Speaker 1: is just see a bunch of like dollar signs that

674
00:37:34,200 --> 00:37:36,960
Speaker 1: they don't want to spend. Yeah, never do that. Yeah.

675
00:37:37,000 --> 00:37:40,200
Speaker 1: Maurita told an entertainment weekly that song cost close to

676
00:37:40,280 --> 00:37:42,680
Speaker 1: a million dollars, which is a tenth of the budget.

677
00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:46,080
Speaker 1: They tried like hundreds of other songs and they just

678
00:37:46,160 --> 00:37:48,480
Speaker 1: said nothing else worked, so they ponied up for him.

679
00:37:48,640 --> 00:37:51,480
Speaker 1: That's insane. They spent a tenth of the budget on

680
00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:56,000
Speaker 1: that song. Kumbolt told Cosmo, it just fit amazingly, the

681
00:37:56,080 --> 00:37:58,279
Speaker 1: strings hitting and she's breaking down on the podium and

682
00:37:58,320 --> 00:38:00,400
Speaker 1: then you cut outside right when the song kicks in.

683
00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:03,920
Speaker 1: Just accomplished everything. And he says, so we're like, oh,

684
00:38:04,040 --> 00:38:05,840
Speaker 1: let's get the rights from the Verve, but then you

685
00:38:05,920 --> 00:38:07,799
Speaker 1: find out the Verve doesn't own the rights. The Rolling

686
00:38:07,840 --> 00:38:10,239
Speaker 1: Stones on the rights, so it was a headache. It

687
00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:11,800
Speaker 1: was one of those things with the studio was like,

688
00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:13,920
Speaker 1: try another song, and we kept trying and trying and

689
00:38:13,960 --> 00:38:15,919
Speaker 1: no one could agree, and the studio was like, let's

690
00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:18,400
Speaker 1: just pay for it. We paid for everything, but we

691
00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:21,360
Speaker 1: really paid for that one. So the story behind Bittersweet

692
00:38:21,400 --> 00:38:23,560
Speaker 1: Symphony is that it is based on a sample from

693
00:38:23,600 --> 00:38:26,680
Speaker 1: a nineteen sixty five version of the Rolling Stones song

694
00:38:26,840 --> 00:38:30,920
Speaker 1: The Last Time by the Andrew Oldham Orchestra, and that

695
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:34,160
Speaker 1: was the Stones manager at the time, back in the sixties.

696
00:38:34,680 --> 00:38:37,160
Speaker 1: That was his side project. He basically got a bunch

697
00:38:37,200 --> 00:38:39,600
Speaker 1: of session musicians, including members of the Rolling Stones, in

698
00:38:40,120 --> 00:38:43,680
Speaker 1: to uh, you know, record different versions of these songs

699
00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:47,080
Speaker 1: and an easy listening album that's really weird. I I

700
00:38:47,280 --> 00:38:52,239
Speaker 1: like it, but I'm also eighty three years old. Well,

701
00:38:52,600 --> 00:38:56,280
Speaker 1: so apparently they obtained the rights to use that sample

702
00:38:56,440 --> 00:38:59,680
Speaker 1: from the copyright hold A Decca Records, but they were

703
00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:03,200
Speaker 1: on permission from the Rolling Stones X manager Alan Klein.

704
00:39:03,560 --> 00:39:08,399
Speaker 1: So they ended up forfeiting all royalties from that song,

705
00:39:08,719 --> 00:39:12,279
Speaker 1: which was a hit, a huge hit, their biggest American hit.

706
00:39:12,360 --> 00:39:16,760
Speaker 1: That and the Drugs Don't Work yep. Forfeited all royalties

707
00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:19,920
Speaker 1: from it to uh the Rolling Stones what do? Who do?

708
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:22,680
Speaker 1: They forfeit them too? Because I know Jagger and Richards

709
00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:25,360
Speaker 1: were added to the credits, but I think the Stones

710
00:39:25,719 --> 00:39:27,839
Speaker 1: got the money for it for I think they gave

711
00:39:27,920 --> 00:39:31,200
Speaker 1: it back recently, like in the last couple of years.

712
00:39:31,280 --> 00:39:35,000
Speaker 1: I believe I'm just doing this from memory. Yes, no, no, Yeah,

713
00:39:35,120 --> 00:39:38,840
Speaker 1: Ashcroft got a thousand dollars from it following the settlement,

714
00:39:41,120 --> 00:39:43,560
Speaker 1: but know the rights did revert back to him. This

715
00:39:43,680 --> 00:39:46,640
Speaker 1: was in nine so he's back to making money on

716
00:39:46,719 --> 00:39:51,880
Speaker 1: it twenty five years later. Good lord. Yeah, And I

717
00:39:51,960 --> 00:39:54,200
Speaker 1: guess admirably Jagger and Richards were like, man, we don't

718
00:39:54,200 --> 00:39:58,279
Speaker 1: really need the money anyway. That's story bitter sweet. It

719
00:39:58,360 --> 00:40:04,160
Speaker 1: was indeed hit, and ate just rights itself well, speaking

720
00:40:04,239 --> 00:40:06,920
Speaker 1: of the ending of cruel intentions, which is perfect and

721
00:40:07,040 --> 00:40:11,439
Speaker 1: satisfying and surprising. It could have been different, although sort

722
00:40:11,480 --> 00:40:14,640
Speaker 1: of only slightly. You remember that Sebastian is having a

723
00:40:14,719 --> 00:40:19,440
Speaker 1: fist fight with Ronald, Cecil's boyfriend because Catherine told Ronald

724
00:40:19,520 --> 00:40:22,719
Speaker 1: that Sebastian had an affair with Cecile, and in the

725
00:40:22,840 --> 00:40:25,200
Speaker 1: actual ending, a Net runs over to the pair as

726
00:40:25,239 --> 00:40:27,520
Speaker 1: they're fighting and having a tussle on the sidewalk in

727
00:40:27,600 --> 00:40:30,759
Speaker 1: Central Park. Tries to pull him off one another, but

728
00:40:30,840 --> 00:40:34,680
Speaker 1: then she tumbles into oncoming traffic and Sebastian valiantly pushes

729
00:40:34,719 --> 00:40:36,560
Speaker 1: her out of the way gets struck by a cab,

730
00:40:36,680 --> 00:40:39,600
Speaker 1: leading to his death. In an earlier version, he dies

731
00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:42,120
Speaker 1: in a kind of less gallant manner. He's in the

732
00:40:42,160 --> 00:40:43,879
Speaker 1: middle of his fight with Ronald and then he sees

733
00:40:43,920 --> 00:40:46,160
Speaker 1: a Net approaching and crosses the street to greet her

734
00:40:46,520 --> 00:40:48,839
Speaker 1: when he is struck by a cab as he sort

735
00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:51,239
Speaker 1: of eagerly running across the street to see her. Very

736
00:40:51,320 --> 00:40:54,759
Speaker 1: mean girls, very like when Regina gets hit by the bus. Yeah.

737
00:40:55,280 --> 00:40:57,520
Speaker 1: More interesting to me is that another early draft of

738
00:40:57,560 --> 00:41:00,040
Speaker 1: the script involved in ending with a Net instead of

739
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:03,560
Speaker 1: publishing Sebastian's journal to embarrass and expose Catherine in front

740
00:41:03,600 --> 00:41:06,759
Speaker 1: of the entire school. She simply uses it to blackmail

741
00:41:06,840 --> 00:41:09,239
Speaker 1: Catherine privately. You know how they have that scene where

742
00:41:09,239 --> 00:41:11,160
Speaker 1: they meet up in the bathroom right before she gives

743
00:41:11,239 --> 00:41:14,239
Speaker 1: us the eulogy for her stepbrother. I would imagine in

744
00:41:14,320 --> 00:41:17,440
Speaker 1: there she probably, like you know, confronts her with what

745
00:41:17,600 --> 00:41:20,520
Speaker 1: she knows, and but not a cinematic not as big

746
00:41:20,920 --> 00:41:24,480
Speaker 1: you know, the whole student body holding this you know, purloined,

747
00:41:24,960 --> 00:41:29,800
Speaker 1: scandalous burn book of a diary. Uh not, it was dramatic,

748
00:41:30,080 --> 00:41:32,319
Speaker 1: So they went with this new ending that we now

749
00:41:32,400 --> 00:41:35,680
Speaker 1: know and love. Uh. Cruel Intentions, speaking of which is

750
00:41:35,800 --> 00:41:40,040
Speaker 1: such a fantastic title. That's the name of Sebastian's journal

751
00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:43,200
Speaker 1: when it's published and distributed around the school. But the

752
00:41:43,320 --> 00:41:45,799
Speaker 1: name Cruel Intentions was something of a last minute change up.

753
00:41:46,320 --> 00:41:48,760
Speaker 1: A few years back, Sarah Michelle Geller posted a photo

754
00:41:48,840 --> 00:41:51,640
Speaker 1: to Instagram from the kickoff dinner for the movie back

755
00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:55,120
Speaker 1: and in the caption she said that the original title

756
00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:59,279
Speaker 1: for the movie was actually Cruel Inventions, and apparently this

757
00:41:59,440 --> 00:42:02,960
Speaker 1: was changed because Cruel Inventions didn't test well with audiences

758
00:42:03,120 --> 00:42:05,200
Speaker 1: because I guess people thought it sounded more like a

759
00:42:05,280 --> 00:42:09,520
Speaker 1: science fiction film instead of whatever you wanna call Cruel

760
00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:13,400
Speaker 1: Intentions comedy drama. Think of it was more of a comedy,

761
00:42:13,480 --> 00:42:19,160
Speaker 1: more of a drama drama, okay, or a black comedy. Yeah.

762
00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:24,399
Speaker 1: So Cruel Intentions not Cruel Inventions, was released on March,

763
00:42:26,360 --> 00:42:28,560
Speaker 1: which actually surprises me because it seems like such a

764
00:42:28,560 --> 00:42:32,400
Speaker 1: summer movie. But critics, uh felt kind of weird about it.

765
00:42:32,960 --> 00:42:35,360
Speaker 1: Stephen Holden of The New York Times wrote, you have

766
00:42:35,520 --> 00:42:37,560
Speaker 1: the queasy sense that the whole thing is just an

767
00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:41,520
Speaker 1: elaborate stunt, and in this case, an exploitative one, and

768
00:42:41,640 --> 00:42:44,680
Speaker 1: the sentiment was echoed by Charles Taylor of Salon dot Com,

769
00:42:44,760 --> 00:42:48,240
Speaker 1: who described the movie as quote the dirtiest minded American

770
00:42:48,360 --> 00:42:53,440
Speaker 1: movie in recent memory. It wasn't wrong, I mean it

771
00:42:53,520 --> 00:42:57,880
Speaker 1: was pretty scandalous, to be like, you know, yeah, I mean,

772
00:42:57,960 --> 00:43:01,239
Speaker 1: naturally for this very reason, every one wanted to see it.

773
00:43:01,960 --> 00:43:05,920
Speaker 1: It's sexy, but it's also taboo, perverse or reverent. It

774
00:43:06,040 --> 00:43:08,200
Speaker 1: was given a hard R rating, which led to a

775
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:10,640
Speaker 1: rash of miners trying to sneak in the theaters to

776
00:43:10,719 --> 00:43:14,080
Speaker 1: see it. Roger Kumble says that he remembers seeing signs

777
00:43:14,120 --> 00:43:18,719
Speaker 1: and theaters saying no one under seventeen, especially for Cruel intentions.

778
00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:21,359
Speaker 1: I should have taken a photo of it. He later

779
00:43:21,480 --> 00:43:23,680
Speaker 1: left and given all the buzz, the movie was a

780
00:43:23,719 --> 00:43:27,840
Speaker 1: financial success, taking in seventy six point three million dollars

781
00:43:27,920 --> 00:43:31,399
Speaker 1: worldwide against the ten point five million dollar budget. That's

782
00:43:31,400 --> 00:43:34,200
Speaker 1: pretty good. Well. Given the success of the movie, Roger

783
00:43:34,280 --> 00:43:38,719
Speaker 1: Crumble was approached by Fox Television about the idea of

784
00:43:38,760 --> 00:43:41,080
Speaker 1: developing a TV show based on the movie. They came

785
00:43:41,160 --> 00:43:44,160
Speaker 1: up with a prequel called Manchester Prep, named after the

786
00:43:44,200 --> 00:43:46,759
Speaker 1: private school characters attend. It was going to begin with

787
00:43:46,840 --> 00:43:49,200
Speaker 1: Sebastian and Katherine meeting for the first time after their

788
00:43:49,239 --> 00:43:52,280
Speaker 1: parents got married. A younger version of Sarah Michelle Geller's

789
00:43:52,320 --> 00:43:55,960
Speaker 1: character Katherine was played by Amy Adams, first starring role

790
00:43:56,000 --> 00:43:58,880
Speaker 1: for the six time Oscar nominated actress, which is a

791
00:43:59,280 --> 00:44:01,680
Speaker 1: hell of a bow, hell of a debut. Kamba was

792
00:44:01,719 --> 00:44:04,759
Speaker 1: given free rein to be about his boundary, pushing with

793
00:44:04,840 --> 00:44:08,560
Speaker 1: this proposed show as the film version until they saw

794
00:44:08,640 --> 00:44:13,680
Speaker 1: the dailies. Um, you know, the Columbine massacre had occurred

795
00:44:14,080 --> 00:44:17,520
Speaker 1: just six weeks after Cruel Intentions came out, so having

796
00:44:17,560 --> 00:44:20,120
Speaker 1: all of this violence directed at children in a classroom

797
00:44:20,280 --> 00:44:25,279
Speaker 1: did not age well, and the network may have underestimated

798
00:44:25,360 --> 00:44:28,800
Speaker 1: just how twisted these plots would be when compared to

799
00:44:28,880 --> 00:44:32,080
Speaker 1: what was then standard primetime fair network Grass saw a

800
00:44:32,239 --> 00:44:35,120
Speaker 1: rough cut of the third episode, in which a teenage

801
00:44:35,200 --> 00:44:41,759
Speaker 1: girl achieves um satisfaction while riding a horse, speaking of

802
00:44:41,800 --> 00:44:50,480
Speaker 1: the Rolling Stones. Yes, yes, Uh. That is when the

803
00:44:50,600 --> 00:44:55,200
Speaker 1: network demanded an emergency reworking of the show and scard

804
00:44:55,280 --> 00:45:01,640
Speaker 1: shopping executive. Horse isn't for killing, not for sections. What

805
00:45:01,760 --> 00:45:05,520
Speaker 1: did you learn from never ending story? We blow up

806
00:45:05,560 --> 00:45:12,359
Speaker 1: horses in this in this industry, we don't deflower them. Um, well,

807
00:45:12,400 --> 00:45:16,279
Speaker 1: I keep that I don't know, uh, And that is

808
00:45:16,320 --> 00:45:19,000
Speaker 1: when the media swooped in. Kumba later told The Telegraph

809
00:45:19,160 --> 00:45:22,040
Speaker 1: Entertainment Tonight grabbed our b roll and didn't expose on

810
00:45:22,200 --> 00:45:25,200
Speaker 1: us before we aired, called has TV gone too far?

811
00:45:26,120 --> 00:45:28,759
Speaker 1: He said, from what I understood, Rupert Murdoch's wife or

812
00:45:28,840 --> 00:45:30,960
Speaker 1: somebody like that saw the thing, and we were off

813
00:45:31,040 --> 00:45:34,320
Speaker 1: the network the next day before we ever aired. So

814
00:45:34,680 --> 00:45:37,799
Speaker 1: that is the leads us to the unfortunate second life

815
00:45:37,840 --> 00:45:40,640
Speaker 1: of this. Uh. They tried to make lemonade out of

816
00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:42,680
Speaker 1: their lemons and re cut the three episodes that they

817
00:45:42,719 --> 00:45:45,719
Speaker 1: had filmed into a ninety minute movie and taking comparative

818
00:45:45,760 --> 00:45:49,520
Speaker 1: freedom of the film versus network television sets of standards.

819
00:45:49,560 --> 00:45:52,040
Speaker 1: They added a bunch of nude scenes and released it

820
00:45:52,160 --> 00:45:54,880
Speaker 1: direct to video in two thousand, to all of the

821
00:45:54,960 --> 00:45:58,800
Speaker 1: fanfare that you would expect from direct to video. Cruel

822
00:45:58,840 --> 00:46:02,920
Speaker 1: Intentions adapt with added sex scenes. Uh, and you just

823
00:46:03,000 --> 00:46:05,400
Speaker 1: gotta feel bad for Amy Adams, who thought she'd scored

824
00:46:05,440 --> 00:46:08,000
Speaker 1: a lead role in a hotly anticipated primetime drama and

825
00:46:08,040 --> 00:46:11,000
Speaker 1: wound up in a glorified skin flick heading straight to

826
00:46:11,320 --> 00:46:14,400
Speaker 1: Uh straight to the bargain being of a Walmart. Walmart

827
00:46:14,440 --> 00:46:17,319
Speaker 1: wouldn't carry that. Yeah, you're right straight to the ball

828
00:46:17,960 --> 00:46:20,480
Speaker 1: if your gas station, I was to say, you're Texico

829
00:46:21,160 --> 00:46:23,759
Speaker 1: KUMBOA letter told Telegraph. It was her first job out

830
00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:26,840
Speaker 1: in Hollywood. I'm sure she's not pleased about that, but

831
00:46:26,960 --> 00:46:30,760
Speaker 1: she's always nice when I run into her. But Amy

832
00:46:30,800 --> 00:46:32,840
Speaker 1: Adams can take some small solace from the fact that

833
00:46:32,920 --> 00:46:36,359
Speaker 1: she at least was not in Cruel Intentions three, which

834
00:46:36,400 --> 00:46:38,160
Speaker 1: doesn't even have any of the same characters as the

835
00:46:38,200 --> 00:46:41,279
Speaker 1: original movie. It focuses on Catherine's cousin. I tried to

836
00:46:41,360 --> 00:46:44,320
Speaker 1: look up Cruel Attentions three to see if there was

837
00:46:44,360 --> 00:46:48,080
Speaker 1: anything don't worry about it. People just list the cast

838
00:46:48,320 --> 00:46:51,239
Speaker 1: and crew. There. No one has written a word one

839
00:46:51,520 --> 00:46:54,960
Speaker 1: about this movie. It is amazing grubbed from the internet.

840
00:46:57,000 --> 00:46:59,080
Speaker 1: And this was pretty much the end of it until

841
00:47:00,120 --> 00:47:02,359
Speaker 1: when NBC announced that they were launching a new TV

842
00:47:02,520 --> 00:47:05,000
Speaker 1: show that picked up with the original Cruel Intentions movie

843
00:47:05,080 --> 00:47:07,600
Speaker 1: left off and would follow the adventures of a Net

844
00:47:07,719 --> 00:47:12,160
Speaker 1: and Sebastian's child, which I'm a little confused by because

845
00:47:12,160 --> 00:47:16,239
Speaker 1: Sebastian died as a high schooler, so maybe that means

846
00:47:16,360 --> 00:47:20,279
Speaker 1: that he got a Net pregnant before he died. I

847
00:47:20,360 --> 00:47:22,960
Speaker 1: make guess it must be what it means. Uh. I

848
00:47:23,120 --> 00:47:26,720
Speaker 1: think they only had sex during the color blind sex scene.

849
00:47:27,200 --> 00:47:29,640
Speaker 1: Has the phrase color blind sex scene ever been said before?

850
00:47:29,680 --> 00:47:32,719
Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm glad that's recorded. Um. But this

851
00:47:32,920 --> 00:47:35,520
Speaker 1: was big news because Sarah Michelle Geller agreed to come

852
00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:37,480
Speaker 1: back to play Catherine, who is now in her mid

853
00:47:37,560 --> 00:47:40,080
Speaker 1: to late thirties and vying for control of the business

854
00:47:40,120 --> 00:47:44,080
Speaker 1: empire built by her late stepbrother's family, the Valmont's, and also,

855
00:47:44,120 --> 00:47:47,000
Speaker 1: according to press briefings, battling for the soul of her

856
00:47:47,040 --> 00:47:51,080
Speaker 1: teenage step nephew, which there's not a lot about the

857
00:47:51,080 --> 00:47:53,520
Speaker 1: plot of the show out there, but I personally take

858
00:47:53,600 --> 00:47:55,440
Speaker 1: to mean she was trying to have an affair with

859
00:47:55,760 --> 00:47:59,560
Speaker 1: her step nephew, because they're not blood related. If she

860
00:47:59,680 --> 00:48:02,759
Speaker 1: was to sleep with her stepbrother stepbrother son even more

861
00:48:02,800 --> 00:48:06,440
Speaker 1: far removed, I don't know, just just spit ball in.

862
00:48:06,480 --> 00:48:11,320
Speaker 1: Here're just developing. I'm not sure how far into production

863
00:48:11,400 --> 00:48:14,000
Speaker 1: this got, but there were promo photos of Sarah Michelle

864
00:48:14,000 --> 00:48:17,200
Speaker 1: gellar in an expensive looking bathtub, dressed all in black

865
00:48:17,239 --> 00:48:20,080
Speaker 1: with her infamous coke filled crucifix. Uh. So there's a

866
00:48:20,120 --> 00:48:22,360
Speaker 1: lot of excitement around that. But then the show started

867
00:48:22,400 --> 00:48:25,920
Speaker 1: to disintegrate and cast members began to depart, and ultimately

868
00:48:26,040 --> 00:48:28,600
Speaker 1: NBC declined to pick up the pilot for the summer

869
00:48:29,040 --> 00:48:32,520
Speaker 1: seventeen season, and Geller later said that she was relieved

870
00:48:32,760 --> 00:48:36,080
Speaker 1: since watering down the plot of Cruel Intentions for network TV,

871
00:48:36,560 --> 00:48:38,560
Speaker 1: it seemed like kind of a shame, She told The

872
00:48:38,600 --> 00:48:41,479
Speaker 1: New York Times. There was a whole crazy time. Nothing

873
00:48:41,560 --> 00:48:45,160
Speaker 1: against NBC, but Cruel Intentions is straight streaming. On the

874
00:48:45,239 --> 00:48:47,480
Speaker 1: first day, I was like, this isn't working. It's just

875
00:48:47,560 --> 00:48:50,120
Speaker 1: not a network show. If it is a network show,

876
00:48:50,320 --> 00:48:53,480
Speaker 1: it's not my Cruel Intentions. So I was actually grateful

877
00:48:53,600 --> 00:48:56,160
Speaker 1: that it was not picked up. However, in the spring

878
00:48:56,200 --> 00:48:58,480
Speaker 1: of two, it was announced that there was a new

879
00:48:58,520 --> 00:49:02,040
Speaker 1: Cruel Intentions related SIA and development for Amazon's free streaming

880
00:49:02,120 --> 00:49:06,040
Speaker 1: services IMDb TV, and it's set at an elite DC

881
00:49:06,280 --> 00:49:10,360
Speaker 1: area college where, according to Deadline, after a brutal hazing

882
00:49:10,440 --> 00:49:15,160
Speaker 1: incident threatens the entire Panhellenic system Greek life, they'll do

883
00:49:15,239 --> 00:49:18,120
Speaker 1: whatever is necessary to preserve their power and reputations. I

884
00:49:18,239 --> 00:49:22,000
Speaker 1: imagine this is referring to Catherine, and maybe Sebastian even

885
00:49:22,120 --> 00:49:24,920
Speaker 1: seduced the daughter of the Vice President of the United

886
00:49:25,000 --> 00:49:28,640
Speaker 1: States since national treasure. Yeah, good, good luck time. I

887
00:49:28,680 --> 00:49:32,399
Speaker 1: don't even steal the Constitution. I don't know if they're

888
00:49:32,400 --> 00:49:35,200
Speaker 1: bringing Sebastian back for this, if you like made it

889
00:49:35,440 --> 00:49:38,800
Speaker 1: that he faked his own death, because yeah, I don't know.

890
00:49:39,120 --> 00:49:42,320
Speaker 1: I don't know. I guess we'll see. Yeah. But probably

891
00:49:42,360 --> 00:49:45,400
Speaker 1: the most successful Cruel Intentions related production has been the

892
00:49:45,480 --> 00:49:49,160
Speaker 1: musical by Roger Kumble, Lindsay Rosen, and Jordan Ross. It

893
00:49:49,239 --> 00:49:51,239
Speaker 1: had limited showings in l A and New York before

894
00:49:51,280 --> 00:49:53,959
Speaker 1: beginning an off Broadway run at the Greenwich Village Venue

895
00:49:54,000 --> 00:49:58,279
Speaker 1: Lapoissan Rouge in November. He's lived on the street from there,

896
00:49:58,680 --> 00:50:00,560
Speaker 1: and it was supposed to be a ten week engagement,

897
00:50:00,640 --> 00:50:04,200
Speaker 1: but the show is extended three times through April, and

898
00:50:04,600 --> 00:50:07,160
Speaker 1: Sara Michelle Geller had a cute little cameo. She provided

899
00:50:07,200 --> 00:50:10,200
Speaker 1: the voice for a prerecorded warning that played right before

900
00:50:10,280 --> 00:50:12,759
Speaker 1: curtain went up, warning the audience to turn off their

901
00:50:12,840 --> 00:50:15,520
Speaker 1: cell phone and not take pictures, and failure to do so,

902
00:50:15,719 --> 00:50:18,800
Speaker 1: she said, would result in her quote, cyber shaming you

903
00:50:18,960 --> 00:50:22,040
Speaker 1: into oblivion. I love her so much. It feels like

904
00:50:22,080 --> 00:50:24,680
Speaker 1: he glossed over the fact. There's a jukebox musical focusing

905
00:50:24,719 --> 00:50:27,239
Speaker 1: on the nineties, which meant you're getting stuff like No Doubt,

906
00:50:27,400 --> 00:50:31,440
Speaker 1: Sunday Morning, bumping up against losing my religion, and sinking

907
00:50:31,600 --> 00:50:35,360
Speaker 1: deep Blue something doing breakfast Tiffany's Next to No Scrubs

908
00:50:35,840 --> 00:50:40,120
Speaker 1: set against the dramatic back dump of cruel intentions. I

909
00:50:40,160 --> 00:50:42,560
Speaker 1: didn't mention it my friends. Why would they do that?

910
00:50:44,480 --> 00:50:48,640
Speaker 1: She loved it. Oh my, because people are easily manipulated,

911
00:50:48,840 --> 00:50:54,480
Speaker 1: my god, which is the theme of the film. Really yeah,

912
00:50:54,719 --> 00:50:58,440
Speaker 1: I'm gonna say yeah, man, I love this movie. I

913
00:50:58,560 --> 00:51:00,279
Speaker 1: touched on this at the top of the episode. But

914
00:51:00,520 --> 00:51:04,239
Speaker 1: it's more than just taboo topics and a ludicrously attractive cast.

915
00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:06,840
Speaker 1: It's a movie that really shows the dark side of

916
00:51:06,920 --> 00:51:10,800
Speaker 1: human nature and also how it's possible to change. Director

917
00:51:10,880 --> 00:51:13,640
Speaker 1: regro Humbel later said it's one thing to have juicy

918
00:51:13,719 --> 00:51:16,719
Speaker 1: dialogue and mean teens, but it's also a tale of redemption.

919
00:51:17,280 --> 00:51:20,680
Speaker 1: This guy, meaning Sebastian soul is saved. That's why I

920
00:51:20,760 --> 00:51:24,840
Speaker 1: think it resonates that and the people are hot. I

921
00:51:25,000 --> 00:51:28,040
Speaker 1: can't can't really underestimate that. I don't think anyone that

922
00:51:28,120 --> 00:51:29,799
Speaker 1: we want to watch a movie of our souls being

923
00:51:29,840 --> 00:51:32,399
Speaker 1: saved for ninety minutes? Do you higgle? Isn't the plot

924
00:51:32,440 --> 00:51:36,000
Speaker 1: of the City of Angels in anyways, I think that's

925
00:51:36,040 --> 00:51:38,640
Speaker 1: what this podcast is, just our souls being saved for

926
00:51:38,760 --> 00:51:43,800
Speaker 1: ninety minutes. As we dive deep on Goonies, increase and

927
00:51:43,960 --> 00:51:47,239
Speaker 1: Steely Tan records. Well, Jordan's I think you did a

928
00:51:47,280 --> 00:51:49,520
Speaker 1: good enough job on this. You can put it anywhere.

929
00:51:52,600 --> 00:51:57,920
Speaker 1: Shut it down, one long sensor beep until we roll credits.

930
00:52:01,160 --> 00:52:04,640
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening, folks. It's just been too much information,

931
00:52:05,040 --> 00:52:07,839
Speaker 1: way too much information this time around. I'm popping open

932
00:52:07,920 --> 00:52:12,000
Speaker 1: my crucifix as we speak. Tell him who you are.

933
00:52:12,560 --> 00:52:21,480
Speaker 1: I'm Alex Hegel. And I Have Jordan run Talk. Too

934
00:52:21,560 --> 00:52:24,160
Speaker 1: Much Information was a production of I Heart Radio. The

935
00:52:24,200 --> 00:52:27,359
Speaker 1: show's executive producers are Noel Brown and Jordan run Talk.

936
00:52:27,520 --> 00:52:31,160
Speaker 1: The supervising producer is Mike John's. The show was researched, written,

937
00:52:31,239 --> 00:52:33,880
Speaker 1: and hosted by Jordan run Talk and Alex Heigel, with

938
00:52:34,000 --> 00:52:36,960
Speaker 1: original music by Seth Applebaum on the Ghost Funk Orchestra.

939
00:52:37,480 --> 00:52:39,480
Speaker 1: If you like what you heard, please subscribe and leave

940
00:52:39,560 --> 00:52:42,080
Speaker 1: us a review. For more podcasts and I heart Radio,

941
00:52:42,239 --> 00:52:45,200
Speaker 1: visit the I heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever

942
00:52:45,280 --> 00:52:46,560
Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows.