WEBVTT - The Interview 0:00:03.920 --> 0:00:06.760 Through that conversation, he asked her, what do you think 0:00:06.800 --> 0:00:07.960 the worst way to die is? 0:00:09.800 --> 0:00:13.960 The autopsy revealed that she fought like a hellcat to 0:00:14.000 --> 0:00:16.080 try to get this guy off her. 0:00:18.040 --> 0:00:19.960 He thinks he's smarter than these cops and he's going 0:00:20.000 --> 0:00:23.640 to figure out what they know prior to this interrogation happening. 0:00:25.160 --> 0:00:27.000 So they set me down and they tell me that 0:00:27.080 --> 0:00:30.680 they have identified a lead suspect in the case and 0:00:30.760 --> 0:00:34.280 that he is a graduate student at Washington State University. 0:00:34.479 --> 0:00:36.680 When I made the connection, the hair on the back 0:00:36.680 --> 0:00:37.879 of my neck kind of stood up. 0:00:44.600 --> 0:00:48.760 This is the Idaho Massacre a production of KAT Studios 0:00:49.000 --> 0:00:58.160 and iHeartRadio season three episode for the interview, I'm Courtney, I'mstrong, 0:00:58.200 --> 0:01:03.080 a producer at KAT Studios with Stephanie Leedeger and Gabriel Castillo. 0:01:05.240 --> 0:01:08.920 After Brian Coberger was sentenced to four consecutive life terms 0:01:08.959 --> 0:01:12.800 for the brutal November twenty twenty two murders of Madison Mogen, 0:01:13.120 --> 0:01:18.240 Kyllie Gonsalvez, Xana Kernodle, and Ethan Chapin, new information has 0:01:18.280 --> 0:01:25.240 continued to emerge about his strange and unsettling past, from 0:01:25.360 --> 0:01:29.120 massive document dumps to witnesses stepping forward with stories to 0:01:29.240 --> 0:01:33.520 former acquaintances describing their encounters with him. Each new detail 0:01:33.640 --> 0:01:35.760 is helping to fill in the gaps and paint a 0:01:35.760 --> 0:01:39.319 more clear, haunting picture of who this man really is. 0:01:40.640 --> 0:01:44.560 Washington State University police chief Gary Jenkins cross paths with 0:01:44.640 --> 0:01:50.800 Brian Coberger before his name made headlines. His first encounter 0:01:50.880 --> 0:01:55.200 with Brian Coberger, long before the arrest, is as unexpected 0:01:55.400 --> 0:01:59.560 as it is chilling. Here's Gary Jenkins filling us in 0:01:59.600 --> 0:02:03.120 on his and his bizarre meeting with one of Idaho's 0:02:03.120 --> 0:02:07.880 most notorious killers. He's joined by our producer Alison Bankston. 0:02:10.400 --> 0:02:13.080 I started my law enforcement crew in southern California. I 0:02:13.120 --> 0:02:15.840 worked for thirty three years in the La County area, 0:02:16.200 --> 0:02:18.640 and then in twenty ten, I was hired as the 0:02:18.639 --> 0:02:21.919 police chief for the city of Pullman, Washington, where Washington 0:02:21.919 --> 0:02:25.480 State University is located. I worked as the police chief 0:02:25.560 --> 0:02:28.359 for the City of Pollman police Department for twelve years, 0:02:28.960 --> 0:02:31.440 and then I was hired as a police chief at 0:02:31.520 --> 0:02:35.280 Washington State University three years ago. We are really a 0:02:35.360 --> 0:02:39.679 tight knit community here. We're somewhat isolated. We're about eight 0:02:39.720 --> 0:02:42.600 miles from Moscow, Idaho, so we're pretty close in our 0:02:42.600 --> 0:02:46.120 communities work together a lot. But besides that, you know, 0:02:46.240 --> 0:02:49.440 the next closest medium sized city is Spokane, Washington, an 0:02:49.440 --> 0:02:52.760 hour and a half away, So we really depend on 0:02:53.160 --> 0:02:56.640 each other a lot, and the communities really worked together 0:02:56.919 --> 0:02:59.520 well a lot out of necessity. 0:03:00.280 --> 0:03:03.079 How did you first find out what happened on November thirteenth, 0:03:03.160 --> 0:03:04.880 twenty twenty two. Can you take me back to that 0:03:04.960 --> 0:03:07.000 day and when you got the call and what you 0:03:07.000 --> 0:03:08.240 were first initially thinking? 0:03:09.480 --> 0:03:13.000 Well, my assistant chief messaged me and said that they 0:03:13.120 --> 0:03:16.760 heard that Moscow had responded to a location in their 0:03:16.800 --> 0:03:21.040 city and they had four people that were dead, and 0:03:21.120 --> 0:03:23.200 we didn't know anymore beyond that. We didn't know if 0:03:23.200 --> 0:03:26.600 it was an accidental from carbon monoxide or what had happened. 0:03:26.800 --> 0:03:30.160 And then I did hear that they did announce that 0:03:30.200 --> 0:03:33.680 it was a homicide, quadruple homicide. So I got on 0:03:33.800 --> 0:03:37.520 the phone and called Chief Fry at Moscow PD his 0:03:37.600 --> 0:03:40.960 cell phone and offered any kind of assistance that our 0:03:41.000 --> 0:03:44.000 department could give him. And he was actually on his 0:03:44.080 --> 0:03:45.640 way back to the city. He was out of town, 0:03:45.720 --> 0:03:48.720 but he was driving back to Moscow, and he said 0:03:49.200 --> 0:03:51.680 thank me for the offer, and that he once he 0:03:51.760 --> 0:03:54.280 got there and assessed what was going on. He'd let 0:03:54.360 --> 0:03:57.080 me know if he needed any help, and turned out 0:03:57.240 --> 0:03:59.200 didn't call us back. They ended up calling in a 0:03:59.240 --> 0:04:02.040 lot of resources from Idaho. Of course they're across the 0:04:02.080 --> 0:04:05.760 state line from us from Washington. But that's what happened 0:04:05.760 --> 0:04:08.400 on that day, and then University of Idaho sent out 0:04:08.400 --> 0:04:11.040 what they call a vandal alert to alert the campus 0:04:11.200 --> 0:04:13.920 when had happened. And then we did the same thing 0:04:14.000 --> 0:04:17.120 on Washington State University campus. We sent out an alert 0:04:17.480 --> 0:04:20.599 no define everyone that there had been a homicide in 0:04:20.680 --> 0:04:23.159 Moscow and the person that had committed the crimes was 0:04:23.200 --> 0:04:24.359 still on the loose. 0:04:24.760 --> 0:04:26.440 And I think of people in your position, you know, 0:04:26.520 --> 0:04:29.880 being the chief of police at WSU, when this huge 0:04:30.080 --> 0:04:33.159 college related murders are going on. That's so much pressure, 0:04:33.160 --> 0:04:35.039 and I'm sure you had a lot of people coming 0:04:35.080 --> 0:04:38.039 to you looking for answers. How do you keep cool 0:04:38.240 --> 0:04:41.240 in situations like that and how do you keep emotions 0:04:41.279 --> 0:04:43.960 down when there's something that's scary going on. 0:04:44.600 --> 0:04:46.040 There's a lot of things that we have to get 0:04:46.080 --> 0:04:49.920 done quickly, and so we get pretty focused on those 0:04:49.960 --> 0:04:52.800 details and trying to get that done. And so I 0:04:52.839 --> 0:04:55.320 think that that kind of keeps our mind, you know, 0:04:55.400 --> 0:04:58.200 focused in the right direction, and we definitely did a 0:04:58.240 --> 0:05:03.159 lot of communication with our students on campus, along with 0:05:03.200 --> 0:05:07.560 our Dina Students' Office and our counseling and psychological services, 0:05:08.080 --> 0:05:11.480 we worked at trying to keep our campus calm. We 0:05:11.920 --> 0:05:16.720 stepped up our patrols to increase our police visibility on campus, 0:05:17.080 --> 0:05:21.159 and this case was particularly challenging because Moscow PD was 0:05:21.440 --> 0:05:24.080 very tight lit on the information that they were sharing 0:05:24.440 --> 0:05:27.680 and so we could only pass along what we would 0:05:27.720 --> 0:05:30.799 hear from them. So we would just try to communicate 0:05:30.839 --> 0:05:34.480 that information as well as just trying to give our 0:05:34.520 --> 0:05:37.400 campus confidence that we were keeping an eye on things 0:05:37.440 --> 0:05:39.040 and that we were doing everything that we can to 0:05:39.120 --> 0:05:40.320 keep our campus safe. 0:05:45.600 --> 0:05:48.760 Thirty six days after the murder, Chief Jenkins gets an 0:05:48.800 --> 0:05:52.240 update on the status of the investigation from Moscow Police 0:05:52.320 --> 0:05:53.720 Chief James Frye. 0:05:57.400 --> 0:05:59.839 The Chief fry sent me a text message on December 0:06:00.080 --> 0:06:02.920 nineteenth asking if I could meet him at the Moscow 0:06:02.920 --> 0:06:05.960 Police Department the next morning, and I thought it was 0:06:06.040 --> 0:06:09.000 just going to be another law enforcement briefing. It'd held 0:06:09.040 --> 0:06:13.039 a couple of law enforcement briefings previously, and so I'd 0:06:13.040 --> 0:06:15.760 met him the next morning and it was just me 0:06:15.760 --> 0:06:18.400 meeting him there, and so I thought that was kind 0:06:18.400 --> 0:06:21.200 of unusual. And then he took me upstairs and we 0:06:21.279 --> 0:06:24.760 went into a room that had the entire investigative team 0:06:24.800 --> 0:06:28.119 there but thirty plus people. So I knew right away 0:06:28.200 --> 0:06:31.920 that there was something something significant happening and had some 0:06:32.040 --> 0:06:35.360 kind of connection, likely to Washington State University. So they 0:06:35.400 --> 0:06:37.279 sent me down and they tell me that they have 0:06:37.520 --> 0:06:41.520 identified a lead suspect in the case and that he 0:06:41.680 --> 0:06:45.159 is a graduate student at Washington State University living in 0:06:45.240 --> 0:06:49.279 graduate student housing on campus. The name sounded familiar to me. 0:06:49.520 --> 0:06:51.920 When I made the connection, you know, the hair on 0:06:51.960 --> 0:06:56.359 the back of my neck stood up. They tell me 0:06:56.400 --> 0:06:59.919 that they have identified a lead suspect in the case 0:07:00.480 --> 0:07:03.960 and his name is Brian Coberger, not a very common name. 0:07:04.520 --> 0:07:06.760 I recalled hearing it before, and it took me about 0:07:06.760 --> 0:07:09.760 thirty seconds early to make the connection that I had 0:07:09.760 --> 0:07:13.960 interviewed him previously when I worked at the Pullman Police Department. 0:07:17.920 --> 0:07:21.080 In April of twenty twenty, two months before the murders, 0:07:21.360 --> 0:07:24.840 Brian Coberger was still wrapping up his master's degree at 0:07:24.840 --> 0:07:28.160 the Sales University and getting ready to start his PhD 0:07:28.240 --> 0:07:33.440 program at Washington State University. Around that time, he submitted 0:07:33.480 --> 0:07:37.720 an application for an internship at the Pullman Police Department. 0:07:40.600 --> 0:07:42.640 When I was police chief at the City of Pullman, 0:07:42.800 --> 0:07:45.679 we had a program that we worked with the Washington 0:07:45.680 --> 0:07:50.200 State University Criminal Justice Program where a PhD student would 0:07:50.240 --> 0:07:53.800 spend three years as a research assistant at the police department. 0:07:54.040 --> 0:07:56.800 You know, at the time, we were having wanted some 0:07:56.880 --> 0:08:01.600 research done on having a our own municipal court there 0:08:01.720 --> 0:08:04.400 in Pullman, which we did not have. We were using 0:08:05.000 --> 0:08:07.160 the county, So that was some of the research we 0:08:07.240 --> 0:08:11.040 wanted done, and just also on looking at crime trends 0:08:11.360 --> 0:08:16.400 and seeing if we needed to reallocate resources to different 0:08:16.400 --> 0:08:20.640 places based on current crime trends and those types of things. 0:08:20.920 --> 0:08:26.560 I was given four applications from Washington State Criminal Justice Program, 0:08:26.800 --> 0:08:29.200 so I interviewed each of the four applicants for about 0:08:29.200 --> 0:08:32.040 thirty minutes each. Two main things I was looking for 0:08:32.240 --> 0:08:35.959 from those applicants. One was someone who was interested not 0:08:36.080 --> 0:08:41.280 just in theoretical research, but really practical, actionable research that 0:08:41.320 --> 0:08:44.040 we could implement in our department to make us more effective. 0:08:44.360 --> 0:08:46.679 And then the other element I was looking for was 0:08:46.679 --> 0:08:50.480 someone who had the ability to develop trust and rapport 0:08:50.559 --> 0:08:54.560 with my staff. Someone coming in to a law enforcement 0:08:54.640 --> 0:08:58.120 environment that's not law enforcement, sometimes that's a very difficult 0:08:58.160 --> 0:09:02.559 situation to develop that that trust and report. I was asking, 0:09:02.640 --> 0:09:05.440 you know, what kind of research they've done already, what 0:09:05.480 --> 0:09:08.760 their particular interests are, you know, what they're looking to 0:09:08.760 --> 0:09:11.320 get out of the program, those types of things. And 0:09:11.400 --> 0:09:15.000 so when I interviewed Brian Coberger, he answered the questions. Okay. 0:09:15.080 --> 0:09:18.240 It was a little bit robotic, I think, and I 0:09:18.360 --> 0:09:20.760 kind of picked up that he didn't have a lot 0:09:20.800 --> 0:09:24.440 of that much interest and necessary the type of research 0:09:24.480 --> 0:09:27.319 we were looking for. Again, I think it was more theoretical. 0:09:27.600 --> 0:09:29.760 I know he had a lot of interest in the 0:09:29.880 --> 0:09:33.960 mind of criminals and why they do what they do 0:09:34.160 --> 0:09:36.160 and how they're feeling when they do what they do, 0:09:36.280 --> 0:09:38.720 and I don't know that that would have been really 0:09:39.480 --> 0:09:41.800 beneficial to our department. 0:09:42.360 --> 0:09:44.920 Were you surprised he even applied, like, I know what, 0:09:45.000 --> 0:09:47.040 to sales. He was kind of really focused in on 0:09:47.080 --> 0:09:49.760 the criminal mind, and it seems like this internship is 0:09:49.840 --> 0:09:52.920 totally different. Why would he apply for an internship that 0:09:53.080 --> 0:09:54.400 wasn't really in his wheelhouse. 0:09:54.960 --> 0:09:57.439 I think really he wanted to see how police departments operate. 0:09:58.000 --> 0:10:00.480 I think he wanted to get that experience working with 0:10:00.559 --> 0:10:03.440 a law enforcement agency, you know, just to add to 0:10:03.480 --> 0:10:07.000 his resume. So it was a little bit out of 0:10:07.040 --> 0:10:09.280 what his interest seemed to be. At the end of 0:10:09.280 --> 0:10:12.079 the thirty minutes, I know, my impressions were that he 0:10:13.040 --> 0:10:16.880 wasn't real personable, He didn't have a real fluid way 0:10:17.040 --> 0:10:22.000 of conversation. He spoke with some hesitation, he was very awkward, 0:10:22.520 --> 0:10:26.800 didn't seem to have very refined social skills, and so 0:10:27.240 --> 0:10:28.840 at the end of it, I just didn't feel like 0:10:28.960 --> 0:10:31.760 he would be able to develop that trust with my 0:10:31.840 --> 0:10:33.480 staff to be an effective researcher. 0:10:34.160 --> 0:10:36.959 Finding out what he did. Would you ever think, oh, 0:10:37.040 --> 0:10:40.160 did he apply to this internship to get to save himself? 0:10:40.720 --> 0:10:43.120 You know, Brian Coper, here he is applying to a 0:10:43.160 --> 0:10:46.000 big internship at a police station, not really interested in 0:10:46.040 --> 0:10:48.280 the stuff that you're offering. Did you ever think that 0:10:48.360 --> 0:10:50.400 maybe he applied to some sort of cover up or 0:10:50.440 --> 0:10:51.200 to get intel. 0:10:52.480 --> 0:10:55.160 Yeah, I think that's definitely possible. I mean, I don't 0:10:55.160 --> 0:11:00.760 think we'll ever know when he planned these crimes. If 0:11:00.800 --> 0:11:03.720 it was something that maybe he had been thinking about, 0:11:04.200 --> 0:11:07.120 that's very possible that he was trying to get into 0:11:07.160 --> 0:11:11.600 the police department to potentially have access to confidential information 0:11:11.960 --> 0:11:15.560 or just to learn more about practices and protocols of 0:11:15.640 --> 0:11:20.800 law enforcement that would help him commit the quote perfect crime. 0:11:21.240 --> 0:11:24.120 And so yes, I did think about that, and more 0:11:24.200 --> 0:11:26.480 thought about that, the more I was glad that I 0:11:26.640 --> 0:11:30.800 decided not to select him. 0:11:31.000 --> 0:11:35.160 After Washington State University Police Chief Gary Jenkins realized he'd 0:11:35.200 --> 0:11:39.760 met Brian Coburger before, he didn't hesitate. He turned to 0:11:39.800 --> 0:11:42.840 Moscow Police Chief James Fry and told him exactly what 0:11:42.920 --> 0:11:48.000 he knew. Ten days later, officers from Washington State University 0:11:48.120 --> 0:11:51.360 joined the Idaho State Police in a coordinated search of 0:11:51.480 --> 0:11:58.560 Coburger's campus apartment and his office. 0:12:00.280 --> 0:12:03.880 Really, nothing of any significance was recovered from either location. 0:12:04.559 --> 0:12:09.480 His apartment, my my assistant chief actually oversaw that warrant service, 0:12:09.520 --> 0:12:12.240 and she reported back to me that there was very 0:12:12.240 --> 0:12:14.880 little in his apartment at the time. In fact, it 0:12:14.920 --> 0:12:18.440 looked like that maybe someone was or that Coburger was 0:12:18.480 --> 0:12:20.160 not planning to come back to that apartment. 0:12:21.080 --> 0:12:23.680 Yeah, and I heard too that his shower curtain was 0:12:23.720 --> 0:12:26.120 missing and there's only a few things of clothing there. 0:12:26.120 --> 0:12:29.160 And I know some people think that the shower curtain 0:12:29.160 --> 0:12:30.520 could have been involved in some way. 0:12:30.920 --> 0:12:33.080 Yeah, I mean that that could have been. It could 0:12:33.120 --> 0:12:35.959 have been that there were some clothing or some evidence 0:12:36.040 --> 0:12:38.079 that he may be wrapped up in there and he 0:12:38.120 --> 0:12:41.800 took a shower, and there could have been blood or 0:12:42.080 --> 0:12:45.760 DNA on that, and so it's you know, very likely 0:12:45.800 --> 0:12:48.880 that that was disposed of somewhere to avoid any type 0:12:48.880 --> 0:12:50.480 of leaving any type of evidence. 0:12:53.440 --> 0:12:55.480 Let's stop here for a break. We'll be back in 0:12:55.520 --> 0:13:08.200 a moment. We've been exploring Brian Coberger's time at Washington 0:13:08.280 --> 0:13:11.880 State University, starting with a strange interview he had with 0:13:12.040 --> 0:13:15.160 Chief Gary Jenkins while applying for an internship at the 0:13:15.200 --> 0:13:19.560 Pullman Police Department. But his unusual behavior on campus did 0:13:19.600 --> 0:13:23.840 not end there. Crime Analyst's Body move in an expert 0:13:23.840 --> 0:13:26.840 in analyzing complex data, is here to walk us through 0:13:26.880 --> 0:13:30.200 more of the recently released documents from the massive evidence 0:13:30.280 --> 0:13:34.760 dump following Coburger's sentencing to life in prison. This time, 0:13:35.000 --> 0:13:37.800 we're zeroing in on some of the records detailing his 0:13:37.840 --> 0:13:43.760 behavior at WSU. Here's body joined by our producer Alison Bankston. 0:13:46.800 --> 0:13:49.680 So let's talk about that interview with his fellow teaching assistant, 0:13:49.720 --> 0:13:51.360 because honestly, I'm floored by. 0:13:51.240 --> 0:13:54.839 That that one is so in that document in its 0:13:55.000 --> 0:13:57.800 entirely is so interesting to me. So in this document, 0:13:58.440 --> 0:14:01.800 it's an interview with somebody that worked with Brian Coberger 0:14:02.280 --> 0:14:06.040 at WSU. It talks about Brian as a TA assistant 0:14:06.120 --> 0:14:09.240 in his relationship with Brian, and he goes on to 0:14:09.280 --> 0:14:12.720 say that somewhere in October or November he couldn't remember, 0:14:13.320 --> 0:14:19.000 he sees scratches on Brian's face and his knuckles were red. 0:14:19.320 --> 0:14:22.360 When he asked Brian Coberger what happened? What happened to you? 0:14:22.800 --> 0:14:25.800 Brian said he was in a car accident, right, and. 0:14:25.800 --> 0:14:28.560 His fellow teaching assistant also says that the scratches looked 0:14:28.560 --> 0:14:31.200 like they were from fingernails. I'm no expert, but what 0:14:31.320 --> 0:14:33.160 car crash causes a scratch like that? 0:14:35.000 --> 0:14:38.640 We as forensic expert Joseph Scott Morgan about the validity 0:14:38.680 --> 0:14:41.840 of Brian Coberger's excuse for the scratches on his face 0:14:42.000 --> 0:14:43.280 shortly after the murders. 0:14:45.200 --> 0:14:47.400 Yeah, you do get scratches in a car accident, but 0:14:47.480 --> 0:14:49.120 you know what you get more of, You get more 0:14:49.160 --> 0:14:53.960 blunt force trauma. The idea that you would merely get 0:14:54.640 --> 0:14:58.640 scratches in a location, and that's odd to say. My 0:14:58.720 --> 0:15:03.120 money would be on k who made scratches, because the 0:15:03.200 --> 0:15:07.160 autopsy revealed that she fought like a hell cat to 0:15:07.240 --> 0:15:10.520 try to get this guy off of her, right, And. 0:15:10.480 --> 0:15:12.280 I feel like he would have a lot more injuries 0:15:12.280 --> 0:15:13.800 if it truly was a car accident. 0:15:14.480 --> 0:15:17.400 It's just so ridiculous, you know, when you think about it, 0:15:17.480 --> 0:15:20.320 because I won't say, well, where else are you're injured? 0:15:20.440 --> 0:15:22.880 And do you need a ride? Can I give you 0:15:22.880 --> 0:15:24.680 a ride somewhere? Because obviously, if you've been in a 0:15:24.720 --> 0:15:27.520 car accident, your car must be damaged. Well, guess what, 0:15:28.400 --> 0:15:31.440 there's no indication this car was damaged anyway. 0:15:31.920 --> 0:15:32.200 Yeah. 0:15:32.280 --> 0:15:34.080 I feel like, again this goes back to him being 0:15:34.120 --> 0:15:37.760 such a strange criminology student because his mistakes are so stupid. 0:15:37.800 --> 0:15:39.520 But he could have said that a cat scratched him 0:15:39.520 --> 0:15:41.120 and it would have been way more unbelievable. 0:15:41.800 --> 0:15:45.240 Yeah, I would have bought that. Yeah, God, this cat, 0:15:45.400 --> 0:15:48.280 you know I love cats. Straight cat that came up 0:15:48.320 --> 0:15:50.640 to the door. I got a camp tunefish in in 0:15:50.680 --> 0:15:52.400 the apartment. I went to feed it and now I 0:15:52.440 --> 0:15:54.320 was trying to pet it while I was eating, and 0:15:54.440 --> 0:15:59.400 thing attacked me. Okay, that sounds plausible to me car accident. 0:15:59.720 --> 0:16:07.320 Not here again, body move in with producer Alison Bankston. 0:16:09.840 --> 0:16:13.800 And then we find out that Brian told him the 0:16:14.040 --> 0:16:18.720 TA assistant he was flying home from Washington to Pennsylvania, 0:16:18.720 --> 0:16:20.160 when in fact we knew he drove and he was 0:16:20.160 --> 0:16:23.600 already there when he told his friend this. He's just 0:16:24.000 --> 0:16:26.000 he's lying. He's a lying liar. 0:16:31.720 --> 0:16:35.400 And the newly released documents reveal even more troubling details 0:16:35.440 --> 0:16:39.320 about Brian Coberger's initial arrest in his home state of Pennsylvania, 0:16:39.800 --> 0:16:42.880 the moment he first came face to face with investigators 0:16:42.880 --> 0:16:46.960 who had been tracking him for weeks. One of interest 0:16:47.000 --> 0:16:50.680 to us an unsettling report written by Moscow Police Corporal 0:16:50.800 --> 0:16:54.800 Brett Payne about Coburger's interview after his arrest. 0:16:55.920 --> 0:17:00.400 And with Brett Payin is ISP detective Sergeant Gilbertson, and 0:17:00.440 --> 0:17:03.720 he's with the Idaho State Police. And additional to that 0:17:04.000 --> 0:17:06.440 FBI special agent surely right. 0:17:06.520 --> 0:17:08.240 And what was so weird to me was that he 0:17:08.280 --> 0:17:11.880 starts off the interview saying that Sergeant Gilbertson looks familiar. 0:17:11.600 --> 0:17:16.040 Right, because it indicates he's been watching news about this case. 0:17:16.160 --> 0:17:19.760 Because Detective Gilbertson is of course with the Idaho State Police, 0:17:20.080 --> 0:17:21.720 and of course he would be talking about this in 0:17:21.720 --> 0:17:24.119 the media or at these press conferences, you know, and 0:17:24.160 --> 0:17:26.760 Brian Coberger is watching these, so that's of course why 0:17:26.800 --> 0:17:28.639 he says this, Oh yeah, you did look familiar. What 0:17:28.680 --> 0:17:29.119 a dummy. 0:17:29.600 --> 0:17:31.800 Yeah, and then he starts implying that he really admires 0:17:31.840 --> 0:17:34.840 law enforcement, has a great admiration for everything these officers 0:17:34.880 --> 0:17:35.320 are doing. 0:17:35.640 --> 0:17:38.239 He's really kind of buttering them up, like I'm one 0:17:38.320 --> 0:17:40.679 of you. They're asking about his studies and he's like, oh, 0:17:40.680 --> 0:17:43.760 you guys already probably know all this, you know, implying 0:17:43.760 --> 0:17:46.439 that you know, they went to criminology school too, when 0:17:46.680 --> 0:17:49.639 of course it's not true. He's very trying to make 0:17:49.680 --> 0:17:52.960 himself like one of them. Right, they're talking about sports, 0:17:53.000 --> 0:17:55.840 they're talking about religion. Brian Coberger says that he was 0:17:55.920 --> 0:17:59.320 raised Christian, and you know, he was basically having doubts 0:17:59.400 --> 0:18:02.160 when he's you know, confronted with the beauty of this world. 0:18:02.160 --> 0:18:05.320 Like it's so weird. It's such a weird conversation. 0:18:05.520 --> 0:18:05.760 I know. 0:18:05.880 --> 0:18:08.040 I just think it's odd that he brought up because again, 0:18:08.119 --> 0:18:10.359 he didn't have to small talks usually, like you know, 0:18:10.400 --> 0:18:11.879 they talked a little bit about he said oh, I 0:18:11.880 --> 0:18:14.639 don't follow WSU footballer because I'm a baseball fan. And 0:18:14.720 --> 0:18:17.480 then to bring up religion out of nowhere. It's because 0:18:17.480 --> 0:18:19.720 he's trying to humanize himself. But then he says, you. 0:18:19.640 --> 0:18:22.560 Know, but I have doubts. He kind of goes in 0:18:22.600 --> 0:18:25.360 this weird circle with it. What else does he say 0:18:25.359 --> 0:18:26.000 in this interview? 0:18:26.240 --> 0:18:29.200 Coberger then spoke about how he became interested in criminal 0:18:29.320 --> 0:18:32.440 justice and stated he thought about being a police officer, 0:18:32.480 --> 0:18:35.000 but did not want to make the commitment unless he 0:18:35.080 --> 0:18:39.080 was absolutely sure. Interesting because he applied to the Pullman 0:18:39.119 --> 0:18:42.680 Police Department and he's telling these police officers, Oh, I 0:18:42.680 --> 0:18:44.399 thought about being a cop, but I just, you know, 0:18:44.720 --> 0:18:46.399 I'm not sure about the commitment. What do you mean 0:18:46.400 --> 0:18:48.199 the commitment. It's a job. If you don't like it, 0:18:48.240 --> 0:18:51.640 you quit. What commitment we're talking about. It's very, very weird. Again, 0:18:51.720 --> 0:18:54.760 he's trying to, like, I think, ingratiate himself into this 0:18:54.880 --> 0:18:57.760 law enforcement family, which he is no part of, by 0:18:57.760 --> 0:19:00.320 the way, but he's trying to like insert himself like 0:19:00.359 --> 0:19:02.760 I'm just like you, I'm one of you exactly. 0:19:02.840 --> 0:19:03.000 Yeah. 0:19:03.040 --> 0:19:05.960 And earlier we were talking with WSU Police Chief Gary 0:19:06.040 --> 0:19:09.439 Jenkins about his interview with Brian Coburger, and you know, 0:19:09.520 --> 0:19:11.439 he said he didn't trust him at all to blend 0:19:11.440 --> 0:19:13.439 in with his staff, and you know, rightfully so. 0:19:13.920 --> 0:19:14.520 And here he is. 0:19:14.440 --> 0:19:17.239 Putting on what seems like some crazy performance with these 0:19:17.280 --> 0:19:20.879 officers in Pennsylvania, probably very untrustworthy. 0:19:21.119 --> 0:19:23.040 What does he do after this in this interview? 0:19:23.600 --> 0:19:26.280 Coberger then stated he understood why they were engaging in 0:19:26.320 --> 0:19:28.400 small talk, but it would appreciate it if we explained 0:19:28.400 --> 0:19:30.840 to him why what he was doing there. And the 0:19:30.880 --> 0:19:33.240 detective goes, well, why do you think you're here? And 0:19:33.320 --> 0:19:37.520 Brian Coberger said he didn't know. Detective Gilbertson asked Coburger 0:19:37.520 --> 0:19:40.639 if he watched the news. Coberger said, I watched the news. 0:19:41.040 --> 0:19:44.560 Detective Gilbertson then asked Coberger why he thought I looked familiar. 0:19:45.040 --> 0:19:47.600 So why do you think I look familiar? Cogerger said 0:19:47.600 --> 0:19:50.399 he wasn't sure and stated I had a familiar face 0:19:50.480 --> 0:19:53.040 and I looked like someone he used to know. Detective 0:19:53.040 --> 0:19:55.960 Gilbertson then said we were there because of what happened 0:19:56.000 --> 0:19:59.800 in November just off the University of Idaho campus. Detective 0:19:59.800 --> 0:20:03.000 go asked Coberger if he knew what was what that was, 0:20:03.480 --> 0:20:07.520 to which Koberger replied, of course. When prompted to elaborate, 0:20:07.600 --> 0:20:10.200 Coberger said, it was the incident we had been investigating 0:20:10.240 --> 0:20:11.560 for how long has it been? 0:20:11.680 --> 0:20:13.920 Okay? It is insane to me that he says how 0:20:13.960 --> 0:20:16.440 long has it been? You know? It almost kind of 0:20:16.480 --> 0:20:17.840 seems like a pride thing to me. 0:20:18.080 --> 0:20:20.480 I mean, of course, I'm no expert, but there's such 0:20:20.480 --> 0:20:22.840 a certain cockiness to it, just from the way that 0:20:22.880 --> 0:20:23.560 I'm reading it. 0:20:24.200 --> 0:20:24.400 Right. 0:20:24.760 --> 0:20:28.159 Detective Gilbertson again stated we were investigating the homicides of 0:20:28.160 --> 0:20:31.040 four students and that we had questions and things we'd 0:20:31.040 --> 0:20:34.480 hoped Coburger would help understand. So this conversation is interesting 0:20:34.920 --> 0:20:38.000 because Coburger is it okay if we engage in small 0:20:38.040 --> 0:20:41.040 talk and the cops are like yeah, they start engaging 0:20:41.080 --> 0:20:44.560 in small talk, and Brian's getting impatient, right, He's hoping 0:20:44.600 --> 0:20:47.120 something's going to slip in this small talk. I think 0:20:47.240 --> 0:20:50.600 he's trying to size up these cops. He thinks he's 0:20:50.600 --> 0:20:52.560 smarter than these cops and he's going to figure out 0:20:52.880 --> 0:20:56.200 what they know prior to this interrogation happening. Right, That's 0:20:56.240 --> 0:20:59.200 what I think. Coburger then asked where his parents were 0:20:59.320 --> 0:21:03.159 and where his daughter was. Coburger re engaged again and 0:21:03.280 --> 0:21:06.800 asked what questions we would have for him. Detective Gilbertson 0:21:06.880 --> 0:21:09.280 then asked Coburger again if he understood his rights and 0:21:09.359 --> 0:21:13.879 asked specifically what Coburger wished. Coburger asked what spipecifically he 0:21:13.920 --> 0:21:16.000 wanted to talk to him about. So they're playing this 0:21:16.040 --> 0:21:19.320 game right now. Coburger's asked for a lawyer, So Detective 0:21:19.320 --> 0:21:23.960 Gilbertson's like, okay, interviews over, but Coberger keeps re engaging, right, 0:21:24.440 --> 0:21:27.080 So the Detective's like, listen, you understand your rights, right, 0:21:27.760 --> 0:21:31.720 what do you want? Coburger asks specifically what we wanted 0:21:31.720 --> 0:21:33.840 to talk to him about, and the reason I told 0:21:33.880 --> 0:21:36.760 Coberger he evoked his Fifth Amendment rights at that moment 0:21:37.119 --> 0:21:39.119 and we were no longer going to be asking him 0:21:39.119 --> 0:21:42.040 any further questions. So Coburger he's fishing. He's like trying 0:21:42.080 --> 0:21:43.439 to find out what they've got. 0:21:43.760 --> 0:21:49.439 It's interesting. Let's stop here for a break. We'll be 0:21:49.480 --> 0:21:59.879 back in a moment. We've been digging through some of 0:21:59.880 --> 0:22:03.720 the most revealing files from the Moscow Police Department's massive 0:22:03.800 --> 0:22:08.399 document release, focusing specifically on those that shed light on 0:22:08.480 --> 0:22:12.720 the strange and sometimes bizarre behaviors of convicted killer Brian 0:22:12.800 --> 0:22:17.320 Coberger in the days and weeks after the murders. In 0:22:17.359 --> 0:22:21.080 these pages, we see how Coberger attempted to explain away 0:22:21.160 --> 0:22:25.879 suspicious injuries, from a bloody knuckle to scratches on his face, 0:22:26.560 --> 0:22:29.600 telling his fellow teaching assistant that it came from a 0:22:29.640 --> 0:22:35.840 car accident. This excuse now reads as obviously false. We 0:22:35.960 --> 0:22:39.240