WEBVTT - Howard Lindzon Tells Us Why He Launched His Own SPAC 0:00:10.680 --> 0:00:14.680 Hello, and welcome to another episode of the Odd Lots Podcast. 0:00:14.720 --> 0:00:19.760 I'm Joe Wisn't Thal and I'm Tracy Alloway. Tracy UM. 0:00:19.800 --> 0:00:23.239 You know, we've done a few episodes on SPACs, and 0:00:23.320 --> 0:00:26.720 obviously at this point, I don't think anyone has missed 0:00:26.880 --> 0:00:30.440 the incredible spack boom that we've seen over the last 0:00:30.440 --> 0:00:32.560 several months. But I have to admit I still have 0:00:32.640 --> 0:00:35.000 like tons of questions about like how they work and 0:00:35.040 --> 0:00:39.040 where this all came from. I was just thinking, if we, uh, 0:00:39.159 --> 0:00:42.800 if we timed our all thoughts back episodes for every 0:00:42.840 --> 0:00:45.160 time a new SPAC entered the market, we'd be doing 0:00:45.200 --> 0:00:48.640 what like two or three episodes per week for each SPAC. 0:00:49.080 --> 0:00:52.159 It's been insane the number that have come to market. No, 0:00:52.320 --> 0:00:54.800 it would be way more than two or three episodes 0:00:55.200 --> 0:00:58.360 per week. Tracy. You know that last Friday, so we're 0:00:58.400 --> 0:01:03.600 recording this on I think it's Tuesday, February. Last Friday, 0:01:04.000 --> 0:01:08.360 there were thirteen SPACs filed in one day last Friday, 0:01:08.400 --> 0:01:10.399 and then I think there were like another five that 0:01:10.560 --> 0:01:13.240 like we're out by like Monday morning the next week. 0:01:13.319 --> 0:01:16.200 So we would never we would just be all SPACs 0:01:16.240 --> 0:01:20.520 all the time. There's no way our producer Laura would 0:01:20.520 --> 0:01:22.839 be able to handle the handle the long, our long 0:01:22.920 --> 0:01:26.319 suffering producer. So here's one thing that I always think 0:01:26.319 --> 0:01:29.080 of when we talk about SPACs. I get a little 0:01:29.160 --> 0:01:33.720 bit nervous when the focus is on a particular capital 0:01:33.840 --> 0:01:37.119 markets tool, Like it's never a good indicator for where 0:01:37.120 --> 0:01:39.679 you are in the cycle. When people start talking about 0:01:39.720 --> 0:01:45.440 the actual packaging of the product versus the content. Yeah, 0:01:45.480 --> 0:01:48.000 that is a pretty I agree. I mean that is 0:01:48.080 --> 0:01:51.480 kind of weird. People are more interested in the phenomenon 0:01:51.720 --> 0:01:54.920 of SPAC than like the companies. The other question that 0:01:55.000 --> 0:01:57.280 I have, and this is something it is like where 0:01:57.280 --> 0:01:59.520 do they come from? Because one of the things that 0:01:59.560 --> 0:02:02.200 we've see is that a lot of them like are 0:02:02.240 --> 0:02:04.919 associated with a very well known name, like for example, 0:02:04.960 --> 0:02:09.600 you know, like Colin Kaepernick for example, the quarterback um 0:02:09.720 --> 0:02:11.880 has a SPACK. And what I was like, did he 0:02:11.919 --> 0:02:13.320 reach out to someone say I want to do a 0:02:13.360 --> 0:02:16.760 SPAC or did someone reach out to him and say, Colin, 0:02:16.840 --> 0:02:18.600 you should really be involved in our spect There's like 0:02:18.639 --> 0:02:21.200 a bunch of names like I saw, Like I swear 0:02:21.240 --> 0:02:23.280 to god, it's so weird. Like the former editor in 0:02:23.360 --> 0:02:27.120 chief of Cosmo, the magazine is involved in a spack 0:02:27.600 --> 0:02:30.519 that to take the clearing company behind, like we will 0:02:30.600 --> 0:02:32.960 like it's it's just there's a bunch of weird stuff. 0:02:32.960 --> 0:02:34.519 But I like where did these come from? And who 0:02:34.600 --> 0:02:37.360 like brought in the where did he? You know, whose 0:02:37.400 --> 0:02:39.200 idea was it to bring in the former editor in 0:02:39.240 --> 0:02:42.440 chief of Cosmo to do a spec our former Bloomberg 0:02:42.440 --> 0:02:44.960 News colleague Betty Lewis doing a spec Like where did 0:02:44.960 --> 0:02:47.040 that come from? I have all these questions I want 0:02:47.040 --> 0:02:49.280 to know, like wh was that? It was it over 0:02:49.400 --> 0:02:52.000 some zoom, Like how did this happen? Well, when a 0:02:52.120 --> 0:02:55.360 venture capitalists loves a company very much, they get together, 0:02:55.440 --> 0:02:57.679 right now, that's not where spacts come from. Um, yes, 0:02:57.800 --> 0:03:01.360 I agree, Like, obviously this is a hot phenomenon in 0:03:01.440 --> 0:03:03.440 markets right now. It does feel like a bunch of 0:03:03.440 --> 0:03:06.880 people are jumping on the bandwagon. But how does the 0:03:06.919 --> 0:03:10.240 actual process work? Who approaches who? And then of course, 0:03:10.280 --> 0:03:13.600 like how does the actual process of raising money and 0:03:13.639 --> 0:03:18.320 finding a company to acquire or merge with work? So 0:03:18.440 --> 0:03:21.200 I'm very excited about our episode today because I think 0:03:21.200 --> 0:03:25.000 we might at least answer some of these questions and 0:03:25.240 --> 0:03:27.880 where they come from. What the opportunity is with someone 0:03:27.919 --> 0:03:32.160 who it's very, very open and honest, and I think 0:03:32.160 --> 0:03:35.200 will be really help us demystify the whole thing. We're 0:03:35.240 --> 0:03:38.640 going to be speaking with Howard lenz In. Um. He 0:03:38.680 --> 0:03:41.280 has a VC. He's a founding partner at the venture 0:03:41.320 --> 0:03:45.680 capital firm Social Leverage. Bunch of big winners, right. He 0:03:45.800 --> 0:03:48.520 was an early investor in robin Hood and stock twits 0:03:48.560 --> 0:03:51.680 and Toro and a company called Manscape dot com, which 0:03:51.720 --> 0:03:54.440 will learn more about. But I basically like know Howard 0:03:54.680 --> 0:03:57.440 lens In and a lot of people do because he's 0:03:57.440 --> 0:03:59.960 been on Twitter for a long time talking about tag 0:04:00.000 --> 0:04:03.720 and investing, extremely open and when I he's always sort 0:04:03.720 --> 0:04:06.320 of one of these people that I think just has 0:04:06.360 --> 0:04:10.040 this sort of uncanny intuition about where the puck is going, 0:04:10.160 --> 0:04:13.440 as they say in hockey. And it's like sometimes I 0:04:13.480 --> 0:04:15.320 see him and he's talking about stuff and I'm like 0:04:15.320 --> 0:04:17.680 this is crazy, but he always ends up sort of 0:04:17.720 --> 0:04:19.680 being right and sort of has this just sort of 0:04:20.160 --> 0:04:22.960 feel of where the market's going, where stocks are going, 0:04:22.960 --> 0:04:25.520 where VC is going, where tech is going. And now 0:04:26.600 --> 0:04:29.960 he is the CEO of a spec and he is 0:04:30.080 --> 0:04:33.920 uh recently, I think late January filed the S one 0:04:33.960 --> 0:04:37.880 for Social Leverage Acquisition Corps, and we're going to learn 0:04:37.920 --> 0:04:40.120 more about his process and why he's doing it and 0:04:40.120 --> 0:04:45.280 how it came about. Here all the wisdom of Howard Linsen. So, Howard, 0:04:45.360 --> 0:04:50.200 thank you so much for joining us intro. I totally 0:04:50.240 --> 0:04:53.440 mean it. I mean I followed you online. We've talked 0:04:53.720 --> 0:04:56.040 for probably a decade now, over a decade, I think 0:04:56.040 --> 0:04:58.279 probably like two eight. You were probably one of the 0:04:58.320 --> 0:05:00.279 first people that thought Twitter was good to be a 0:05:00.279 --> 0:05:02.560 really big thing, and you thought Twitter was going to 0:05:02.680 --> 0:05:06.080 be a big thing for markets, which it turned out 0:05:06.120 --> 0:05:09.560 to be in particular. So I've always sort of enjoyed 0:05:09.560 --> 0:05:12.279 following your stuff. But you know, like, where did this 0:05:12.360 --> 0:05:15.960 come from? Like let's just start like where did one 0:05:16.120 --> 0:05:18.039 Where did the idea of the light bulb come off? 0:05:18.400 --> 0:05:23.120 To launch us back? So it's a great question because 0:05:23.120 --> 0:05:25.760 there is an origin story for everything, and you get 0:05:26.440 --> 0:05:30.520 the I'm from Toronto, so you get as back when 0:05:30.520 --> 0:05:33.679 you're born. It's like it's like a Tim Horton's doughnut 0:05:34.040 --> 0:05:36.880 that you you're entitled to a spack that goes to 0:05:37.000 --> 0:05:41.280 zero and record time. The So I think, you know, 0:05:41.360 --> 0:05:46.360 growing up in Toronto with the the mining and Saskatchewan 0:05:47.279 --> 0:05:51.960 and drilling for oil and belize, and that was Canada. 0:05:52.160 --> 0:05:53.920 Like I mean, you didn't call your broker and asked 0:05:53.920 --> 0:05:57.279 for a tech growth stock. You got served as back 0:05:57.960 --> 0:06:01.600 and you didn't have a good experience with them spacks. 0:06:02.680 --> 0:06:05.560 So I have to say I had a very twisted 0:06:06.800 --> 0:06:09.440 I would curl my mustache. If I had a mustache, 0:06:09.480 --> 0:06:13.119 I would play with it all the time. Color me surprised. 0:06:13.279 --> 0:06:18.400 I was My last pre COVID memory of a fun 0:06:18.440 --> 0:06:23.120 time was that this incredible dinner at Carbones, which is 0:06:23.160 --> 0:06:26.760 like an institution, you know, for some reason in New York, 0:06:27.279 --> 0:06:29.920 hard to get into Italian place. And I was sitting 0:06:29.960 --> 0:06:33.800 at a table with Adam Bain as a friend and 0:06:33.960 --> 0:06:40.719 really amazing entrepreneur and former CFO of Twitter, former CEO 0:06:40.960 --> 0:06:46.840 or CFO. He's had every every job there. He's kryptonite, 0:06:46.839 --> 0:06:49.400 this man. You know, I'm kind of cousins with him. 0:06:49.560 --> 0:06:52.320 I'm actually like fourth cousins. You're like the Adam Baine 0:06:52.360 --> 0:06:56.200 of media. You're like me, are you really looking for 0:06:56.240 --> 0:06:58.719 a compliment right now? We're going to do our own 0:06:58.800 --> 0:07:01.120 sac No, but keep going. But I am actually very 0:07:01.160 --> 0:07:04.799 weirdly related to that guy. And you know me because 0:07:05.000 --> 0:07:06.839 it's funny because you talked about some stuff. One of 0:07:06.839 --> 0:07:09.560 my favorite companies that ever was a seat investor was 0:07:09.720 --> 0:07:11.600 your company that you worked for with Henry. I was 0:07:11.640 --> 0:07:14.640 one of Henry's first investors at Ali Insider, Business insider, 0:07:14.760 --> 0:07:17.400 whatever the hell they call it these days in the 0:07:17.440 --> 0:07:20.240 trade n f t S. And you'll probably have me 0:07:20.280 --> 0:07:22.080 on in six months to talk about n f t s. 0:07:22.120 --> 0:07:25.160 But anyway, so I'm sitting in February and Carbones, and 0:07:25.920 --> 0:07:28.239 there was two things that you talked about at the time. 0:07:28.760 --> 0:07:31.200 With Adam Bain. We were talking about what the hell 0:07:31.240 --> 0:07:33.040 is going on with this COVID thing, what are we 0:07:33.080 --> 0:07:34.760 gonna be doing? We didn't know it would be locked 0:07:34.760 --> 0:07:38.560 down a week later, two weeks later forever. And uh, 0:07:39.280 --> 0:07:41.680 what is this spac that you speak of? Like everybody 0:07:41.720 --> 0:07:45.880 was very Everybody was talking about Virgin Collactic, which was 0:07:46.200 --> 0:07:50.920 an Adam Bain production with Chama that was done by Spack, 0:07:51.080 --> 0:07:54.000 and as a Canadian, I was very I looked at 0:07:54.040 --> 0:07:55.760 him and I was like, oh God, what are you 0:07:55.840 --> 0:07:59.240 doing to people, Adam Bain, You're supposed to be a 0:07:59.320 --> 0:08:02.840 nice guy. He took the time to to walk us 0:08:02.880 --> 0:08:06.080 through how Chamath was thinking about Spacks. So we're kind 0:08:06.080 --> 0:08:08.320 of like ground zero because you know, if you had 0:08:08.400 --> 0:08:12.560 told me that COVID would strike two weeks later and 0:08:12.600 --> 0:08:14.360 the country would shut down, I would have said, yeah, 0:08:14.440 --> 0:08:16.760 I saw that coming kind of But if you said 0:08:17.480 --> 0:08:21.360 it would lead to stocks only go up and barstool 0:08:21.480 --> 0:08:25.880 Dave and Chamath being the new Warren Buffett and spacks 0:08:25.880 --> 0:08:31.160 backs back discussions on your show by the following year, 0:08:31.240 --> 0:08:33.839 I would have laughed. I would have giggled like a 0:08:34.080 --> 0:08:36.600 like a child. And so so he explains to us 0:08:36.640 --> 0:08:39.280 what a what a spack is and how they were 0:08:39.480 --> 0:08:43.120 using it more importantly for growth ideas. Right, So spacks 0:08:43.120 --> 0:08:45.920 have been around an elegant really an elegant feature, right 0:08:46.000 --> 0:08:49.600 for a punch of entrepreneurs that have influenced right, kind 0:08:49.600 --> 0:08:52.160 of like they talked about director, consumers these days are 0:08:52.200 --> 0:08:55.040 around the influencer network and so in in the most 0:08:55.080 --> 0:09:00.160 simplest term, I understood the edit that the wedge the 0:09:00.520 --> 0:09:04.640 pivot of a spack to be still about the promoter 0:09:04.840 --> 0:09:08.560 slash creator slash influencer, but more about how they were 0:09:08.559 --> 0:09:10.760 going to use it. They weren't just going to use 0:09:10.840 --> 0:09:16.720 it to go speculate on a mining uh. Discovery facts 0:09:16.720 --> 0:09:19.280 have always been this elegant feature. It's been around for 0:09:19.320 --> 0:09:23.920 a long time, and much like the swipe became an 0:09:23.960 --> 0:09:28.280 important thing on the iPhone with Tinder SPACs, subtle chain 0:09:28.920 --> 0:09:33.040 was the fact that we had the cloud, we had 0:09:33.080 --> 0:09:35.520 this growth, and for ends, we had zero interest rates. 0:09:35.559 --> 0:09:39.120 We have these new influencers like Chama, we have a 0:09:39.440 --> 0:09:41.480 lack of I p O s. And then I think 0:09:41.480 --> 0:09:44.560 one of the most important things was you also had 0:09:45.240 --> 0:09:48.840 this late stage money in the hands of what we 0:09:48.880 --> 0:09:51.760 found out where some empty suits let's call them, or 0:09:51.960 --> 0:09:55.280 like promoters themselves and weren't creating any value like we 0:09:55.320 --> 0:09:59.160 work like soft Bag story and like t row price 0:09:59.160 --> 0:10:01.960 and fidelity, So that late stage money, all these things 0:10:01.960 --> 0:10:05.240 were combining together for a perfect moment for spects. But 0:10:05.360 --> 0:10:08.480 we didn't know that. But you know, along the way, 0:10:08.600 --> 0:10:11.280 like we're soft Bank was writing four or five million 0:10:11.280 --> 0:10:14.640 dollars checks based on an Uber ride, you know, based 0:10:14.679 --> 0:10:16.959 on their feelings about a CEO at the Uber. And 0:10:17.160 --> 0:10:20.880 I think that whole concoction, that whole moment in time 0:10:20.920 --> 0:10:25.679 back last year, guys like me learning from Adam Bay 0:10:25.720 --> 0:10:28.520 in a ground zero how they were you know, tinkering 0:10:28.559 --> 0:10:31.560 with the with the back towards growth and towards uh 0:10:32.040 --> 0:10:35.680 big ideas versus drilling a hole in the ground and 0:10:35.920 --> 0:10:39.520 you know, rolling up something in real estate or something 0:10:39.559 --> 0:10:43.200 in finance. Was this, Oh my god, if soft bank 0:10:43.240 --> 0:10:45.200 can do this, we can do this, you know. That 0:10:45.280 --> 0:10:47.000 was my epiphany, was like, we would make fun of 0:10:47.040 --> 0:10:49.680 soft Bank and there and their silly investments in the 0:10:49.720 --> 0:10:53.719 way they folded money into the market, And how is 0:10:53.760 --> 0:10:57.280 that different than us back, Like it's it's it's really 0:10:57.400 --> 0:11:00.160 just an expression on how you feel about the the 0:11:00.200 --> 0:11:05.319 person running this back. So so you have this epiphany 0:11:05.400 --> 0:11:08.720 that you can start your own spack do whatever soft 0:11:08.720 --> 0:11:12.480 Bank does. How do you actually get the ball rolling? Like, 0:11:12.679 --> 0:11:18.120 what does that inception process look like? Well, for me, 0:11:18.320 --> 0:11:20.120 that's a good question for me, it was like, well, 0:11:20.120 --> 0:11:22.840 I'm not going to do this. I'm like, the last 0:11:22.880 --> 0:11:25.520 thing I want to do is go through the process 0:11:25.520 --> 0:11:29.640 of hiring an expensive law firm, uh, to do an 0:11:29.760 --> 0:11:33.840 S one, going on a road show, uh, and pitching 0:11:33.880 --> 0:11:37.680 people you know in a room about you know, because 0:11:37.880 --> 0:11:39.960 this is still about raising money. You know. It's back 0:11:40.080 --> 0:11:43.520 is all fancy term and it looks so sexy because 0:11:43.760 --> 0:11:46.080 we're a public company and we have a lot of cash. 0:11:46.480 --> 0:11:48.960 But really behind all that. It's just a lot of 0:11:50.240 --> 0:11:57.720 boring and very detailed and careful disclosures about what this 0:11:58.160 --> 0:12:01.000 you know entity will do and you know what is 0:12:01.040 --> 0:12:04.240 its purpose? Who is on the team, Why did you 0:12:04.280 --> 0:12:08.040 assemble this team, what do you plan to do? What 0:12:08.080 --> 0:12:11.040 are your high level of focuses? So so you need 0:12:11.080 --> 0:12:13.679 a quarterback for all this, And lucky for me at 0:12:13.720 --> 0:12:16.920 that dinner was my friend Doug Horlick, who's an next 0:12:16.960 --> 0:12:20.720 Goldman guy, and he just his ears perked up when 0:12:21.040 --> 0:12:25.280 he was listening to Adam Bain and he was like 0:12:25.320 --> 0:12:29.480 taking notes. We're all like joking around and and enjoying 0:12:29.480 --> 0:12:32.840 our our last meal. It turns out pre COVID. But 0:12:33.120 --> 0:12:35.440 he came out of that meeting dog and he said, Howard, 0:12:35.559 --> 0:12:38.920 you're the perfect guy to be the CEO of a spack. 0:12:39.559 --> 0:12:42.000 You have this huge audience of which you can talk to. 0:12:42.679 --> 0:12:46.520 People trust you. You've got all this uh trust built up. 0:12:46.880 --> 0:12:50.480 You know, why shouldn't you quarterback back? And I said, 0:12:50.480 --> 0:12:51.760 you know, I don't want anything to do with this, 0:12:51.920 --> 0:12:57.959 with the regulatory and in the hoops and the detail. Um. 0:12:58.120 --> 0:12:59.720 But he said, I got your back. I know how 0:12:59.720 --> 0:13:02.000 to do this, and off we went. So Now I 0:13:02.040 --> 0:13:04.400 had a partner, Doug Horlick, who really had a lot 0:13:04.440 --> 0:13:09.040 of experience in markets. He also knew who to call 0:13:09.120 --> 0:13:11.880 in the banking side, just pitched the idea and see 0:13:11.880 --> 0:13:14.359 if they would be as excited as he was about 0:13:14.400 --> 0:13:16.920 this idea that than that. So that was the first 0:13:16.920 --> 0:13:19.800 step that we needed someone too that I felt there's 0:13:19.800 --> 0:13:21.320 no way I was going to go down this road 0:13:21.320 --> 0:13:25.320 with just Doug. We needed someone who had public market experience, right. 0:13:25.400 --> 0:13:28.360 So sure the media hasn't having a field d and 0:13:28.440 --> 0:13:31.280 say oh anybody should have us back, right, and we 0:13:31.320 --> 0:13:33.800 all we all fall prey to that. It's just whatever 0:13:33.800 --> 0:13:37.439 whoever's got the hot tape. But really I would say, 0:13:37.679 --> 0:13:42.000 do not do this unless you have someone at your 0:13:42.040 --> 0:13:45.360 side who has tremendous public market experience. And for me, 0:13:45.520 --> 0:13:48.360 that was Paul Grimberg, who happened to be an LP 0:13:49.240 --> 0:13:53.200 and was president of Encore Capital, which is, you know, 0:13:53.679 --> 0:13:58.200 a global financial lending business, and also the chairman of 0:13:58.360 --> 0:14:02.480 Axos Bank, which is a large public bank, profitable public bank. 0:14:03.000 --> 0:14:06.400 So what a perfect moment for me to know someone 0:14:06.480 --> 0:14:08.960 like that, and I called Paul. Has raised money around 0:14:09.000 --> 0:14:13.600 the world his jobs and overseeing audits of public companies 0:14:13.640 --> 0:14:17.000 and overseeing, you know, the growth of profitability of a 0:14:17.000 --> 0:14:19.200 public bank. And I said, is this is this something 0:14:19.240 --> 0:14:21.000 you can help me with? And you got really excited, 0:14:21.000 --> 0:14:23.920 he says, oh, man with your network. And so we 0:14:24.040 --> 0:14:26.720 got Paul Grimberg on. So now we have the makings 0:14:26.760 --> 0:14:28.520 of a band. As you would say, it's like the 0:14:28.560 --> 0:14:33.440 traveling willberrys of finance. I've got a Goldman person, I've 0:14:33.440 --> 0:14:37.680 got a public market chairman of a of a great 0:14:37.760 --> 0:14:41.120 bank in the New York Stock Exchange. And now I 0:14:41.200 --> 0:14:44.000 just got to keep filling out the band. And so 0:14:44.120 --> 0:14:46.400 my next piece of the publics how to find some 0:14:46.440 --> 0:14:50.240 partners that have targets. So so now if you are 0:14:50.280 --> 0:14:52.240 going to do its back, you've got to, like I said, 0:14:52.280 --> 0:14:56.400 find someone to put the banking relationships together and and 0:14:56.760 --> 0:14:59.240 ensemble a road show. You also need someone to get 0:14:59.280 --> 0:15:01.560 you through the s process. And I would say, don't 0:15:01.600 --> 0:15:04.480 just hire scattering or some expensive attorney, which we did, 0:15:04.800 --> 0:15:07.280 but you need someone to guide these attorneys, and you 0:15:07.320 --> 0:15:09.280 need someone who understands how to do all the filings. 0:15:09.320 --> 0:15:11.640 And that I found with Paul Grimberg. We had the 0:15:11.720 --> 0:15:15.560 core of a SPAC team pretty quickly. But there's still 0:15:15.760 --> 0:15:33.240 so much more that you have to put together. So 0:15:33.320 --> 0:15:35.440 I want to go back to a point you made, 0:15:35.720 --> 0:15:37.960 and you you know, it's like, we look at all 0:15:38.040 --> 0:15:40.840 these SPACs run by public figures, and there's like, you know, 0:15:41.560 --> 0:15:44.320 the the Use back and the Colin Kaepernick spack and 0:15:44.520 --> 0:15:46.800 the founder the co founder of Facebook's back or the 0:15:46.840 --> 0:15:49.240 co founder of Dell's back or the Betty Loose back, 0:15:49.960 --> 0:15:54.600 and you mentioned and then of course the spacks we're 0:15:54.600 --> 0:15:57.520 going to get. And you mentioned the importance of that 0:15:57.640 --> 0:16:01.200 public network the promoter someone who's kind of basically an influencer. 0:16:01.960 --> 0:16:07.400 Can you articulate specifically why in this current iteration of 0:16:07.440 --> 0:16:13.320 the SPACs, whatever the SPAC cycle, what exactly your network, 0:16:13.520 --> 0:16:16.360 your platform allows you to do and really allows you 0:16:16.440 --> 0:16:20.200 to sort of contribute to the spec value creation. Okay, 0:16:20.520 --> 0:16:24.080 this is all high level because I can't even explain it, like, 0:16:24.160 --> 0:16:27.200 and you're asking me to explain something that I laugh 0:16:27.240 --> 0:16:29.880 because I wish I could film the whole processes from 0:16:29.920 --> 0:16:32.000 the eyes of a Larry David of finance. Right, I 0:16:32.520 --> 0:16:34.880 look at this is all rather silly. I mean, it's 0:16:34.960 --> 0:16:38.120 very important and I take this thing extremely seriously. Hopefully 0:16:38.160 --> 0:16:40.120 the origin story helps with that. It's not like I 0:16:40.160 --> 0:16:42.680 woke up, had lunch with Adam Bain and said, well, 0:16:42.960 --> 0:16:44.920 like I joke and I said, well, Adam Bank can 0:16:44.960 --> 0:16:46.800 do a spec. I can do a spec. Like that's 0:16:46.800 --> 0:16:50.400 an easy, funny joke. But reality is Adam was explaining, 0:16:50.840 --> 0:16:53.160 and that's the genius. It's just not a one minute 0:16:53.160 --> 0:16:56.720 It's a very complicated process that people need that people 0:16:56.960 --> 0:17:01.720 generally take seriously. I have to imagine because sec and lawyers, 0:17:01.800 --> 0:17:07.000 and it's expensive. It's not free. So so getting to 0:17:07.080 --> 0:17:11.040 the to the next part of it is um The 0:17:11.200 --> 0:17:15.240 key thing here about the markets to understand is we 0:17:15.600 --> 0:17:18.280 talk about the creator economy, right, Like, for there was 0:17:18.320 --> 0:17:20.119 all these years where I was like, man, people like 0:17:20.200 --> 0:17:24.040 my writing and they respect my work, but like, should 0:17:24.040 --> 0:17:27.119 I set up a Shopify store to like, how do 0:17:27.200 --> 0:17:30.760 I monetize all this daily writing on my blog and 0:17:30.840 --> 0:17:33.520 my tweets and all these people that think I'm funny 0:17:33.840 --> 0:17:39.240 or smart so so so I felt, as someone who 0:17:39.280 --> 0:17:43.200 writes for free and gets all the feedback that maybe 0:17:43.200 --> 0:17:46.920 I should have, I'm not monetized singing myself properly, right, 0:17:47.000 --> 0:17:50.080 Like everybody has that feeling someone tells them they're great. 0:17:50.600 --> 0:17:56.680 You know. Spacts are basically a perfect tool for financial 0:17:57.000 --> 0:18:00.280 you know entrepreneurs, right. You know I have a farm 0:18:00.400 --> 0:18:02.600 with two great partners, Tom and Gary. But when we 0:18:02.640 --> 0:18:06.280 commit to a fund, we have to commit to twenty 0:18:06.920 --> 0:18:09.639 five investments over three to five years. Together. We have 0:18:09.760 --> 0:18:13.320 to go through the money raising process and you're in it. 0:18:13.800 --> 0:18:16.080 You got to write an album. It's like Bruce Springsteen 0:18:16.119 --> 0:18:18.120 in the East Street Band. If I would just say, 0:18:18.480 --> 0:18:20.760 you know, music is like the closest thing to it 0:18:20.800 --> 0:18:24.240 with a spack, I could put a separate band together, 0:18:24.320 --> 0:18:27.320 like I said the Traveloy Wilbury to just try and 0:18:27.359 --> 0:18:30.600 produce one hit. Okay, And there's a lot and something 0:18:30.600 --> 0:18:33.320 more elegant about that, right when you consider how many 0:18:33.320 --> 0:18:36.359 people can I just ask a real specific question. Is 0:18:36.359 --> 0:18:40.240 it on the fundraising side that the platform helps, as in, okay, 0:18:40.280 --> 0:18:43.480 we want to back the Howard Linson spac is either 0:18:43.560 --> 0:18:45.359 from the people who buy into the I p O 0:18:46.240 --> 0:18:48.320 or the pipe that's part of the process. Or is 0:18:48.359 --> 0:18:51.840 it on the deal acquisition part that people wanted that 0:18:52.000 --> 0:18:55.240 a company thinking about going public wants to be part 0:18:55.240 --> 0:18:59.440 of it? Like, what specifically is the brand the Howard 0:18:59.520 --> 0:19:02.639 Lendson What part does it help with the most that 0:19:02.920 --> 0:19:05.800 you know Joshmo would have a harder time with That's 0:19:05.800 --> 0:19:07.880 a good question. It really helped with all of them 0:19:07.920 --> 0:19:10.159 and color me as surprised as everybody else because I 0:19:10.160 --> 0:19:12.240 had Doug tell me, how are they're going to love 0:19:12.280 --> 0:19:14.560 you that you don't understand they know what stock twitches 0:19:14.680 --> 0:19:17.520 and they know what Twitter is, and I would laugh, 0:19:17.560 --> 0:19:19.560 I said, I don't think so, right. So it was, 0:19:19.800 --> 0:19:21.760 you know, it was very you know, it was very 0:19:21.840 --> 0:19:25.119 much curby R exuberant I call it versus curb your enthusiasm. 0:19:25.240 --> 0:19:27.040 I was. I was saying, guys, we're gonna go here, 0:19:27.080 --> 0:19:28.760 and these headphones are gonna laugh us out of the 0:19:28.840 --> 0:19:32.000 room because they don't even know what Twitter is. But 0:19:32.040 --> 0:19:35.840 I think I guess they do. From the road show, 0:19:35.880 --> 0:19:38.439 I learned that I actually have a little bit of 0:19:38.840 --> 0:19:41.720 cashet in that world, and I think it helped the 0:19:42.160 --> 0:19:45.800 game stop at Wall Street bets and and and read 0:19:45.880 --> 0:19:50.920 it and Twitter and TikTok and social media and investing 0:19:51.119 --> 0:19:52.879 things that you know I was talking about with you 0:19:53.000 --> 0:19:56.440 and Henry Blodgett, you know, fifteen years ago, all of 0:19:56.480 --> 0:20:00.680 a sudden, I am someone with some grab a toss 0:20:00.720 --> 0:20:03.480 in that space. And I can't explain why it's now, 0:20:04.320 --> 0:20:08.240 but it's just that perfect kind of moment that I 0:20:08.320 --> 0:20:11.080 might have gotten lucky or you know, the people that 0:20:11.400 --> 0:20:14.200 talk me gently said, Howard, this will be this. You'll 0:20:14.240 --> 0:20:17.239 you'll kill them on Broadway, which is like you're going 0:20:17.280 --> 0:20:20.280 to kill them on a zoom road show. And they're 0:20:20.320 --> 0:20:22.399 gonna be prepared and they're gonna know what stuck to 0:20:22.480 --> 0:20:24.240 its is and and to be honest Rail, you know 0:20:24.400 --> 0:20:27.679 they did like the hedge funds that and the asset 0:20:27.720 --> 0:20:32.520 managed from black Rock on down below. They know that 0:20:33.040 --> 0:20:35.919 public companies have two things to sell. They have the 0:20:36.119 --> 0:20:39.600 company itself, the product where the widget, whatever that company is. 0:20:39.680 --> 0:20:42.520 And then when you're public, you also have your product 0:20:42.600 --> 0:20:46.440 is the ticker. And you have to tell this story. Right, 0:20:46.480 --> 0:20:50.840 There's there's Tesla the company, and then there's Tesla the 0:20:50.960 --> 0:20:55.280 men's right, and some people are saying they're interchangeable today, 0:20:55.320 --> 0:20:59.480 but the narrative is become And again this isn't just timing. 0:20:59.520 --> 0:21:02.800 And this some time in market and spacts might not 0:21:02.880 --> 0:21:06.680 have happened if COVID, you know, hadn't happen, or if 0:21:06.880 --> 0:21:09.280 if there was only two ways to really go public, 0:21:09.320 --> 0:21:12.639 which is Goldman and Morgan Stanley, right, like, there's only 0:21:12.640 --> 0:21:16.360 two pipes that get you onto the onto the stage. Well, 0:21:16.400 --> 0:21:20.280 of course all this going on SPACs became interesting, but 0:21:20.359 --> 0:21:23.080 the most important thing to me was like the reception 0:21:23.200 --> 0:21:27.480 was very strong for someone that understood social media, for 0:21:27.560 --> 0:21:31.199 someone that understood the importance of helping a company that 0:21:31.520 --> 0:21:34.520 is does choose to go public through respect how to 0:21:34.560 --> 0:21:38.560 build a narrative, right, how our team can help just 0:21:38.680 --> 0:21:41.600 as well as hero Price or Fidelity or soft Bank 0:21:42.080 --> 0:21:44.879 or any late stage VC. How our team that we 0:21:44.920 --> 0:21:51.159 assemble can help a company actually accelerate themselves post going public, 0:21:51.240 --> 0:21:53.159 because the SPAC or the I p O is just 0:21:53.320 --> 0:21:56.119 one day in the end, right, Like, how you choose 0:21:56.160 --> 0:21:58.600 to go public, and you've probably heard this a hundred times, 0:21:58.680 --> 0:22:01.359 it's just one day and then the bell gets wrong, 0:22:01.800 --> 0:22:03.800 the stock gets traded, and the next day no one 0:22:03.880 --> 0:22:06.080 remembers if you were public through an I p O 0:22:06.240 --> 0:22:09.680 or through a spack. And I started seeing that happen 0:22:09.720 --> 0:22:12.240 with drafting, you know, as someone who started stock to it, 0:22:13.280 --> 0:22:15.720 I was seeing this happen with Virgin Galactic. I'm like, 0:22:16.000 --> 0:22:17.840 I was just as surprised as the next guy. The 0:22:17.960 --> 0:22:21.480 draft Kings was a successful spack, so you know, you 0:22:21.520 --> 0:22:24.679 start seeing a few successes and you start trying to 0:22:24.960 --> 0:22:27.879 glean from podcasts. You know, I've had Jason Robinson on 0:22:27.880 --> 0:22:30.800