1 00:00:05,200 --> 00:00:07,400 Speaker 1: Hey, this is Adding and Samantha and welcome to stuff. 2 00:00:07,400 --> 00:00:19,040 Speaker 1: I'll never told you a protection of iHeartRadio. And I 3 00:00:19,040 --> 00:00:21,599 Speaker 1: guess before we get into this quick content warning, we 4 00:00:21,640 --> 00:00:23,800 Speaker 1: are going to be talking about death and grief things 5 00:00:23,800 --> 00:00:26,760 Speaker 1: like that, but nothing to in depth. Today we are 6 00:00:26,840 --> 00:00:29,680 Speaker 1: talking about the two thousand and three book The Gangster 7 00:00:29,840 --> 00:00:34,959 Speaker 1: We Are All Looking For by Vietnamese American author Leam Twee. 8 00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:39,280 Speaker 1: It is a short, fragmented piece told by an unnamed 9 00:00:39,360 --> 00:00:43,040 Speaker 1: narrator who immigrated from Vietnam to America as a child. 10 00:00:43,159 --> 00:00:46,919 Speaker 1: The locations and times jump around, largely taking place in 11 00:00:47,080 --> 00:00:50,639 Speaker 1: Vietnam and America. The age of the narrator ranges from 12 00:00:50,680 --> 00:00:56,760 Speaker 1: six to twenty six, and she grapples with things like identity, war, immigration, loss, 13 00:00:56,880 --> 00:01:01,160 Speaker 1: puberty and PTSD, her and her parents, everybody around your 14 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:04,560 Speaker 1: kind of mainly then. The fragmented nature of the book 15 00:01:04,680 --> 00:01:06,880 Speaker 1: is meant to resemble what happens to memory during a 16 00:01:06,920 --> 00:01:11,720 Speaker 1: traumatic event, including the repression of her brother's death. It 17 00:01:11,800 --> 00:01:14,800 Speaker 1: is a very poetic and symbolic book. A lot of 18 00:01:14,800 --> 00:01:18,319 Speaker 1: people describe it as almost your more reading poetry. Here's 19 00:01:18,360 --> 00:01:22,520 Speaker 1: a note from the author in nineteen seventy eight, my 20 00:01:22,680 --> 00:01:25,920 Speaker 1: father and I left Vietnam by boat on board the 21 00:01:26,000 --> 00:01:28,640 Speaker 1: US Navy ship that picked us up. My father incorrectly 22 00:01:28,720 --> 00:01:32,479 Speaker 1: filled out the paperwork identifying me. He listed my name 23 00:01:32,520 --> 00:01:35,679 Speaker 1: as Twee and my date of birth as January fifteenth, 24 00:01:35,760 --> 00:01:39,119 Speaker 1: nineteen seventy two. He claims he never chose my formal name, 25 00:01:39,240 --> 00:01:42,160 Speaker 1: and shugart the shoulders who could fault him for forgetting 26 00:01:42,680 --> 00:01:45,280 Speaker 1: My mother arrived two years later and informed us that 27 00:01:45,319 --> 00:01:48,440 Speaker 1: Bab had been wrong on both counts. She corrected my 28 00:01:48,520 --> 00:01:52,120 Speaker 1: date of birth it was now January twelfth, nineteen seventy two, 29 00:01:53,040 --> 00:01:56,240 Speaker 1: but insisted I keep the name Tweet. My older sister, 30 00:01:56,400 --> 00:01:59,600 Speaker 1: the original Tweet had drowned at a refugee camp in Malaysia. 31 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:04,160 Speaker 1: My mother saw my father's mistake as propitious. It allowed 32 00:02:04,160 --> 00:02:06,040 Speaker 1: a part of my older sister to come to this 33 00:02:06,200 --> 00:02:08,680 Speaker 1: country with us, and so I kept my sister's name 34 00:02:08,760 --> 00:02:11,400 Speaker 1: and wore it like a borrowed garment, one in which 35 00:02:11,440 --> 00:02:14,600 Speaker 1: my mother crowded two daughters, one dead and one living. 36 00:02:15,080 --> 00:02:18,280 Speaker 1: When I decided to publish under my full name in 37 00:02:18,320 --> 00:02:21,440 Speaker 1: the Vietnamese fashion and all in lawer case because I 38 00:02:21,480 --> 00:02:24,560 Speaker 1: prefer the way it runs, I knew that both Americans 39 00:02:24,560 --> 00:02:27,400 Speaker 1: and Vietnamese may find fault with it. It is not 40 00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:31,480 Speaker 1: how names go in either country. Nonetheless, it felt right 41 00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:34,360 Speaker 1: to me I had finally managed to break the name down, 42 00:02:34,480 --> 00:02:38,480 Speaker 1: rebuild it, and reclaim it as my own. So if 43 00:02:38,520 --> 00:02:39,960 Speaker 1: you have read the book, then a lot of this 44 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:44,920 Speaker 1: is going to sound familiar. So it's not autobiographical, but 45 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:48,560 Speaker 1: it's got a lot of similarities to this story and 46 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:51,280 Speaker 1: it is a sman that I were discussing it off 47 00:02:51,360 --> 00:02:54,160 Speaker 1: Mike right before. It is sort of hard to pin 48 00:02:54,360 --> 00:02:57,680 Speaker 1: down because it is kind of like poetry and it 49 00:02:57,720 --> 00:03:02,399 Speaker 1: does jump around a lot. So the plot is essentially 50 00:03:03,480 --> 00:03:09,480 Speaker 1: you have this narrator, a named narrator, young girl who 51 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:15,239 Speaker 1: immigrates via boat from Vietnam to America, loses her brother, 52 00:03:16,800 --> 00:03:22,359 Speaker 1: and then has these memories that stand out. As I said, 53 00:03:22,360 --> 00:03:25,440 Speaker 1: it's supposed to represent like a traumatic or some kind 54 00:03:25,440 --> 00:03:28,560 Speaker 1: of memory that just stands out when you look back 55 00:03:28,639 --> 00:03:34,359 Speaker 1: for whatever reason. And it's exploring that and exploring her 56 00:03:35,000 --> 00:03:39,360 Speaker 1: trying to grapple with the PTSD and her father's PTSD, 57 00:03:39,480 --> 00:03:46,200 Speaker 1: her mother's PTSD and figure things out and just having 58 00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:48,600 Speaker 1: a lot of questions and a lot of a lot 59 00:03:48,680 --> 00:03:50,760 Speaker 1: of feelings that she's not sure what to do with 60 00:03:51,440 --> 00:03:56,720 Speaker 1: but yeah, I mean, that's essentially essentially the plot. So 61 00:03:58,120 --> 00:04:00,360 Speaker 1: if we move into the themes, a big one is 62 00:04:00,360 --> 00:04:05,680 Speaker 1: obviously immigration and identity. Here's the quote. We each thought 63 00:04:05,920 --> 00:04:08,520 Speaker 1: of those long nights floating on the ocean, rocking back 64 00:04:08,560 --> 00:04:11,160 Speaker 1: and forth in the middle of nowhere, with nothing in sight. 65 00:04:11,560 --> 00:04:14,880 Speaker 1: We remembered the ships that kept their distance. We remembered 66 00:04:14,880 --> 00:04:17,200 Speaker 1: the people leaning over the decks of the ships to 67 00:04:17,200 --> 00:04:20,200 Speaker 1: study us through their binoculars, and not liking what they saw, 68 00:04:20,640 --> 00:04:23,760 Speaker 1: turning away from our boat. 69 00:04:23,080 --> 00:04:26,159 Speaker 2: And then another one. I was the only Vietnamese student 70 00:04:26,160 --> 00:04:28,120 Speaker 2: at my school. On the first day of class, the 71 00:04:28,120 --> 00:04:30,480 Speaker 2: teacher introduced me to the other students by holding a 72 00:04:30,520 --> 00:04:32,640 Speaker 2: globe in one hand as she gave it a spin 73 00:04:32,760 --> 00:04:35,560 Speaker 2: with the other, and then pointing her finger at an 74 00:04:35,680 --> 00:04:38,560 Speaker 2: S shaped curve near a body of water. Was that 75 00:04:38,560 --> 00:04:40,760 Speaker 2: where I'd come from? As I stood before them in 76 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:42,919 Speaker 2: a dress the color of an Easter egg, with my 77 00:04:43,000 --> 00:04:46,920 Speaker 2: feet encased in clear plastic sandals, the other students looked 78 00:04:46,920 --> 00:04:49,120 Speaker 2: at the globe and then back at me again. Some 79 00:04:49,200 --> 00:04:51,640 Speaker 2: whispered behind their hands, some just stared. 80 00:04:51,920 --> 00:04:56,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, so again, she's not She's kind of plays feels 81 00:04:56,880 --> 00:05:00,880 Speaker 1: kind of about of place right in this a whole 82 00:05:00,920 --> 00:05:07,400 Speaker 1: situation in the because they first arrived at this guy 83 00:05:07,520 --> 00:05:13,000 Speaker 1: named Mel's house and he never really agreed to take 84 00:05:13,080 --> 00:05:18,160 Speaker 1: them in, but someone in his family did. His father, Yeah, 85 00:05:18,279 --> 00:05:22,960 Speaker 1: so he was like, okay, I'll take them in. And 86 00:05:24,120 --> 00:05:27,200 Speaker 1: but it was a very much like it was not 87 00:05:27,560 --> 00:05:31,760 Speaker 1: in his the cards that he was expecting, right, and 88 00:05:31,880 --> 00:05:34,560 Speaker 1: he his mother was there, right, and she was the 89 00:05:34,600 --> 00:05:38,280 Speaker 1: one that put put her in the like easter dress 90 00:05:38,400 --> 00:05:40,160 Speaker 1: and the sandals. 91 00:05:39,560 --> 00:05:40,839 Speaker 3: And she was her little doll. 92 00:05:41,360 --> 00:05:47,360 Speaker 1: Yes, it was kind of dress, yes, But the narrator 93 00:05:49,400 --> 00:05:53,680 Speaker 1: there was this like glass case of figurines in Mel's 94 00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:57,719 Speaker 1: office or like in his his space. But there was 95 00:05:57,760 --> 00:06:02,320 Speaker 1: also this like glass paperweight. It sounds like to me. 96 00:06:04,080 --> 00:06:07,120 Speaker 2: Like that's like like we've all seen it if you've 97 00:06:07,160 --> 00:06:08,520 Speaker 2: come from the nineties, you know. 98 00:06:09,720 --> 00:06:14,039 Speaker 1: Yeah, but yeah, like a kind of a glass yeah, 99 00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:17,320 Speaker 1: with a butterfly in it. And she, the narrator, was 100 00:06:17,360 --> 00:06:19,719 Speaker 1: just so concerned about this butterfly and felt like she 101 00:06:19,800 --> 00:06:22,680 Speaker 1: could hear it and that it was alive in there 102 00:06:22,680 --> 00:06:24,600 Speaker 1: and it was trapped in there, and she wanted to 103 00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:28,680 Speaker 1: let it out. And everybody was kind of treating her 104 00:06:28,839 --> 00:06:32,240 Speaker 1: like you know, your young girl like, no, it's not. 105 00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:37,800 Speaker 1: But eventually it built up and she grabbed it and 106 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:42,240 Speaker 1: threw it and broke the glass case with all of 107 00:06:42,279 --> 00:06:46,120 Speaker 1: the glass figurines in it in an attempt to free 108 00:06:46,120 --> 00:06:49,920 Speaker 1: the butterfly. And this is when Mel kicked them all out. 109 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:54,839 Speaker 2: Nope, right, because that was the only rule in the house. 110 00:06:54,960 --> 00:06:56,920 Speaker 2: Essential Well, there's a lot of rules, but the biggest 111 00:06:56,960 --> 00:06:59,920 Speaker 2: rule is don't touch these things because it had been 112 00:07:00,080 --> 00:07:04,200 Speaker 2: given from his father. And so both the mother and 113 00:07:04,880 --> 00:07:09,240 Speaker 2: Mel were very very sentimental about these things. I'm assuming 114 00:07:09,400 --> 00:07:11,840 Speaker 2: it was worth some money, maybe not already, just really 115 00:07:11,920 --> 00:07:15,480 Speaker 2: loved it because the father. It was an interesting beginning 116 00:07:15,680 --> 00:07:19,640 Speaker 2: with the father, the portrayal of the father who had 117 00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:24,280 Speaker 2: a dream about saving the people of Vietnam because he 118 00:07:24,360 --> 00:07:27,440 Speaker 2: was a veteran I think, yeah, who would serve there 119 00:07:27,520 --> 00:07:30,120 Speaker 2: and had been cared for there by the people quote unquote, 120 00:07:30,160 --> 00:07:33,040 Speaker 2: and so he wanted to rescue these people. 121 00:07:33,160 --> 00:07:39,200 Speaker 3: That was his calling from a dream that he had supposedly. 122 00:07:40,520 --> 00:07:48,360 Speaker 1: Right, right, And this is this is one of those 123 00:07:48,400 --> 00:07:50,240 Speaker 1: things that when you get to the end, one of 124 00:07:50,280 --> 00:07:52,320 Speaker 1: those books that when you get to the end, you're like, oh, okay. 125 00:07:53,840 --> 00:07:55,920 Speaker 1: But once I got to the end, I was she 126 00:07:56,240 --> 00:07:59,080 Speaker 1: was thinking, this is her brother like trapped in the glass. 127 00:07:59,160 --> 00:08:02,600 Speaker 1: This is like the memory of her rather trapped in 128 00:08:02,600 --> 00:08:05,240 Speaker 1: the glass, and that's why she felt like she could hear, 129 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:07,880 Speaker 1: and she felt like it was she could just free 130 00:08:07,880 --> 00:08:10,600 Speaker 1: this butterfly, right, it would be alive. 131 00:08:10,960 --> 00:08:13,040 Speaker 2: I think with all of that, I found that interesting 132 00:08:13,560 --> 00:08:15,680 Speaker 2: and we don't talk about it at the beginning scene, 133 00:08:15,920 --> 00:08:20,520 Speaker 2: and I I do relate to this because I have 134 00:08:20,560 --> 00:08:22,920 Speaker 2: a very vivid picture of myself in her memory of 135 00:08:23,400 --> 00:08:27,560 Speaker 2: arriving in the airport, not knowing English, being with nobody 136 00:08:27,600 --> 00:08:29,680 Speaker 2: that I knew, just kind of showing. 137 00:08:29,440 --> 00:08:30,920 Speaker 3: Up waiting to be picked up. 138 00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:35,079 Speaker 2: And essentially that's what the experience happens for herself and 139 00:08:35,120 --> 00:08:39,880 Speaker 2: the four other men in MA and they are waiting 140 00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:43,000 Speaker 2: to be picked up, not realizing the person who had 141 00:08:43,000 --> 00:08:46,560 Speaker 2: sponsored them essentially had died and he was being they 142 00:08:46,559 --> 00:08:48,760 Speaker 2: were picked up by another dude who really obviously did 143 00:08:48,800 --> 00:08:51,880 Speaker 2: not want them. And the fact that I think they 144 00:08:52,440 --> 00:08:54,680 Speaker 2: the people who were picking them up, the mother especially 145 00:08:54,800 --> 00:08:56,600 Speaker 2: was thinking she was gonna get a reception of love 146 00:08:56,720 --> 00:09:01,679 Speaker 2: and thankfulness instead, like they were scared and confused more 147 00:09:01,720 --> 00:09:04,320 Speaker 2: than anything else, and that level of like what do. 148 00:09:04,240 --> 00:09:06,520 Speaker 3: We do who are you? 149 00:09:06,559 --> 00:09:06,679 Speaker 1: Do? 150 00:09:06,720 --> 00:09:08,040 Speaker 3: We trust you? Do you trust us? 151 00:09:08,600 --> 00:09:10,920 Speaker 2: And that level of like being a burden and being 152 00:09:11,040 --> 00:09:13,880 Speaker 2: seen as a burden and realizing there a burden without 153 00:09:13,960 --> 00:09:17,480 Speaker 2: even knowing the language. Like it was very reminiscent like 154 00:09:17,520 --> 00:09:20,120 Speaker 2: at that immigration stage of like, yeah, okay, this is 155 00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:20,720 Speaker 2: our status. 156 00:09:20,760 --> 00:09:22,480 Speaker 3: Here, this is our status. 157 00:09:22,520 --> 00:09:24,360 Speaker 2: And I think it was a very telling beginning. 158 00:09:25,040 --> 00:09:32,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, here is another quote, and this one I 159 00:09:32,080 --> 00:09:34,240 Speaker 1: was like, I'm not sure where to put it, but 160 00:09:35,559 --> 00:09:37,120 Speaker 1: I just thought it was interesting because it's kind of 161 00:09:37,160 --> 00:09:41,440 Speaker 1: about like all of these warnings that summer, as I 162 00:09:41,440 --> 00:09:43,560 Speaker 1: sat with her while she worked, she would issue her 163 00:09:43,559 --> 00:09:46,280 Speaker 1: warnings about the pool. She told me, look at you, 164 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:48,319 Speaker 1: you're as small as a mouse. The water is much 165 00:09:48,360 --> 00:09:50,880 Speaker 1: deeper than you think. About cars, she said, they can 166 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:53,320 Speaker 1: hit you and keep going. About the needle on her 167 00:09:53,360 --> 00:09:56,240 Speaker 1: sewing machine, she said, watch your fingers. It can move 168 00:09:56,320 --> 00:09:59,560 Speaker 1: much faster than you can run. And about boys, she warned, 169 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:02,480 Speaker 1: they will try to press you into it. So this 170 00:10:02,520 --> 00:10:05,320 Speaker 1: is when they moved to the next place and it 171 00:10:05,320 --> 00:10:07,240 Speaker 1: has pool and water. We're gonna talk about this at 172 00:10:07,280 --> 00:10:10,199 Speaker 1: the end, but water is a huge theme right throughout 173 00:10:10,240 --> 00:10:13,760 Speaker 1: this whole thing, and this pool was very big thing. 174 00:10:24,960 --> 00:10:26,320 Speaker 3: The Vietnamese word for water. 175 00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:28,680 Speaker 2: It was very similar to the Korean word for water 176 00:10:28,800 --> 00:10:31,760 Speaker 2: more that's the Korean word, And I was like, oh, 177 00:10:31,800 --> 00:10:36,440 Speaker 2: because that's it's like there's a heaviness about it, taking you, 178 00:10:37,240 --> 00:10:39,920 Speaker 2: taking you, taking your life, but taking you places too, 179 00:10:39,960 --> 00:10:42,760 Speaker 2: and being lost in it. That's very, very deep into 180 00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:46,160 Speaker 2: that that they were talking about from jump, them arriving 181 00:10:46,160 --> 00:10:48,400 Speaker 2: from the water and the fact that her parents were 182 00:10:48,400 --> 00:10:51,480 Speaker 2: still in the water, and she didn't know what that meant, 183 00:10:51,600 --> 00:10:57,439 Speaker 2: but it was giant mm hmm. So here's another quote. 184 00:10:57,840 --> 00:11:01,079 Speaker 2: We tumble out the window like people tumbling a continents. 185 00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:04,520 Speaker 2: We are time traveling, weighed down by heavy furniture and 186 00:11:04,600 --> 00:11:08,960 Speaker 2: bags of precious junk. We find ourselves against Boss yellow truck. 187 00:11:09,360 --> 00:11:12,840 Speaker 2: Ma calls his name, her voice reaching like a hand 188 00:11:13,080 --> 00:11:16,080 Speaker 2: feeling for a tree trunk and darkness and the car. 189 00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:19,280 Speaker 2: Ma starts to cry. What about the sea? She asks, 190 00:11:19,440 --> 00:11:22,199 Speaker 2: what about the garden? Boss says we can come back 191 00:11:22,200 --> 00:11:23,920 Speaker 2: in the morning and dig up the stalks of lemon 192 00:11:24,000 --> 00:11:27,920 Speaker 2: grass and fold the sea into a blue square. My sobbing. 193 00:11:28,240 --> 00:11:30,640 Speaker 2: She is beating the dashboard with her fists. I want 194 00:11:30,679 --> 00:11:33,160 Speaker 2: to know, she says, I want to know I want 195 00:11:33,200 --> 00:11:36,400 Speaker 2: to know who is doing this to us? Hiccupping, She says, 196 00:11:36,559 --> 00:11:39,400 Speaker 2: I want to know why why there's always a fence. 197 00:11:39,880 --> 00:11:43,800 Speaker 2: Why there's always someone on the outside wanting someone something 198 00:11:43,840 --> 00:11:47,960 Speaker 2: on the inside and between them this sharp fence. We 199 00:11:48,000 --> 00:11:51,280 Speaker 2: are always leaving like this. And this is where I 200 00:11:51,320 --> 00:11:54,480 Speaker 2: got kind of confused, y'all, because she talks about leaving 201 00:11:54,520 --> 00:11:57,320 Speaker 2: her parents behind in the attic, and I was like, wait, 202 00:11:57,440 --> 00:12:00,960 Speaker 2: was her parents in the attic because there is like 203 00:12:01,000 --> 00:12:04,120 Speaker 2: a moment of conversations where they're prepping for the parents 204 00:12:04,160 --> 00:12:08,320 Speaker 2: to come, and then then a lot of confusion from me. 205 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:15,000 Speaker 1: Well, yeah, well they had to, as this quote tells you, 206 00:12:15,040 --> 00:12:16,760 Speaker 1: they had to leave kind of quickly because they just 207 00:12:16,760 --> 00:12:19,640 Speaker 1: got an eviction notice that was like, hey, we're gonna 208 00:12:19,920 --> 00:12:21,520 Speaker 1: break down, We're going to tear down all of this. 209 00:12:21,640 --> 00:12:24,040 Speaker 1: And this was after they filled in the pool, right, 210 00:12:24,960 --> 00:12:28,000 Speaker 1: and we'll rebuild it and you'll be the first on 211 00:12:28,040 --> 00:12:33,120 Speaker 1: our list when it's up and running again. But they 212 00:12:33,200 --> 00:12:37,120 Speaker 1: just had to They had to leave and steal essentially 213 00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:41,840 Speaker 1: their own stuff, write it out. So it happened very quickly, 214 00:12:42,679 --> 00:12:46,160 Speaker 1: and I mean my interpretation was that the parents had 215 00:12:46,240 --> 00:12:49,200 Speaker 1: not shown up yet, that they were just preparing for them, 216 00:12:49,240 --> 00:12:50,760 Speaker 1: and then they had to leave really quickly, and that's 217 00:12:50,800 --> 00:12:55,840 Speaker 1: why part of the devastation was, well, they're going somewhere 218 00:12:55,840 --> 00:12:58,480 Speaker 1: else now, or how we're going to tell them? How 219 00:12:58,480 --> 00:12:58,920 Speaker 1: will they know? 220 00:13:00,760 --> 00:13:04,000 Speaker 2: One of your theories apparently that I just read, as 221 00:13:04,040 --> 00:13:06,120 Speaker 2: Riswega says at the end, the mother calls out of 222 00:13:06,160 --> 00:13:08,680 Speaker 2: her for her parents, which you've forgotten. This has a 223 00:13:08,720 --> 00:13:11,840 Speaker 2: double meaning. She's calling for her home in Vietnam to 224 00:13:11,960 --> 00:13:15,480 Speaker 2: return to Vietnam, as well as a photograph she's forgotten 225 00:13:15,559 --> 00:13:19,280 Speaker 2: at her Linda Vista home. So it's literal too, Okay, 226 00:13:19,360 --> 00:13:21,560 Speaker 2: So that's where I missed that one. But yeah, it's 227 00:13:21,840 --> 00:13:26,360 Speaker 2: because that's the entirety of the book, y'all. There's double meaning, 228 00:13:26,720 --> 00:13:31,400 Speaker 2: if not triple or like quadriple meaning, which is kind 229 00:13:31,400 --> 00:13:33,640 Speaker 2: of the poetic to it of like oh the deeper, 230 00:13:33,760 --> 00:13:36,120 Speaker 2: the depth that this is probably one of those very 231 00:13:36,160 --> 00:13:38,280 Speaker 2: short books that if you read it three or four 232 00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:41,120 Speaker 2: different times, you're going to find three or four different things, 233 00:13:41,400 --> 00:13:45,800 Speaker 2: like different meanings. Yes, which is beautiful and very very 234 00:13:45,840 --> 00:13:49,520 Speaker 2: intelligent that I apparently is not in my house. 235 00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:53,160 Speaker 1: Well, we were talking about this too, because you usually 236 00:13:53,240 --> 00:13:57,840 Speaker 1: listen audio and I read it with my eyes dress. 237 00:13:58,920 --> 00:14:00,600 Speaker 1: But there are and we were talking about this too, 238 00:14:00,600 --> 00:14:02,120 Speaker 1: of their own book. There are some books that are 239 00:14:02,120 --> 00:14:06,080 Speaker 1: just better. It's it's easier to like keep track of 240 00:14:06,120 --> 00:14:08,559 Speaker 1: the thread if you're reading it, and some it's better 241 00:14:08,640 --> 00:14:12,240 Speaker 1: to do it the audio. But this one I did 242 00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:14,000 Speaker 1: have the thought when I was reading, I was like, oh, bit, 243 00:14:15,960 --> 00:14:18,840 Speaker 1: that's jumping around. You might be a little bit confused about. 244 00:14:18,600 --> 00:14:24,880 Speaker 4: The story because it also has a picture, the photograph 245 00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:29,200 Speaker 4: in it, which is a big part of it, and 246 00:14:29,280 --> 00:14:30,600 Speaker 4: the story of like how. 247 00:14:32,040 --> 00:14:35,600 Speaker 1: The mother and father got together. That's where the title 248 00:14:36,480 --> 00:14:38,560 Speaker 1: comes from. At least again, as you said, there's like 249 00:14:38,720 --> 00:14:43,080 Speaker 1: multiple meanings, right, that is what because the dad it's 250 00:14:43,160 --> 00:14:46,120 Speaker 1: like a the gangster we were looking for. He was 251 00:14:46,160 --> 00:14:49,600 Speaker 1: a gangster right from North Korea. And she was like 252 00:14:49,920 --> 00:14:55,040 Speaker 1: a Catholic girl, so her parents did not approve at all. 253 00:14:56,080 --> 00:14:59,960 Speaker 1: Here's another quote. Mass has wars a bird with a 254 00:15:00,080 --> 00:15:03,400 Speaker 1: broken wing flying over the countryside, trailing blood and burying 255 00:15:03,400 --> 00:15:06,400 Speaker 1: crops and sorrow. If something grows in spite of this, 256 00:15:06,560 --> 00:15:09,160 Speaker 1: it is both a curse and a miracle. When I 257 00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:11,720 Speaker 1: was born, she cried to know that it was war 258 00:15:11,840 --> 00:15:14,160 Speaker 1: I was breathing in and she could never shake it 259 00:15:14,200 --> 00:15:17,840 Speaker 1: out of me. Ma says war makes it dangerous to breathe, 260 00:15:18,240 --> 00:15:21,360 Speaker 1: though she knows you die if you don't. She says, 261 00:15:21,480 --> 00:15:23,640 Speaker 1: she could have thrown me against the wall until I 262 00:15:23,680 --> 00:15:26,080 Speaker 1: broke or coughed up this war that is killing us all. 263 00:15:26,640 --> 00:15:28,800 Speaker 1: She could have stomped on it in the dark and 264 00:15:28,880 --> 00:15:31,440 Speaker 1: danced on it like a mad woman dancing on gravestones. 265 00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:34,120 Speaker 1: She could have grounded down to powder and spat on it, 266 00:15:34,400 --> 00:15:37,800 Speaker 1: but didn't. I know. War has no beginning and no end. 267 00:15:37,960 --> 00:15:41,200 Speaker 1: It crosses oceans like a splintered boat filled with people 268 00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:45,360 Speaker 1: singing a sad song. And that is a big piece 269 00:15:45,440 --> 00:15:49,520 Speaker 1: of this too, is the family aspect, and also the 270 00:15:49,640 --> 00:15:54,480 Speaker 1: trauma and the PTSD aspect, as we have been saying, 271 00:15:55,160 --> 00:16:01,960 Speaker 1: because the the way that it manifests in the different 272 00:16:02,040 --> 00:16:07,880 Speaker 1: characters is different, but it is very clear, like the 273 00:16:07,920 --> 00:16:17,040 Speaker 1: father figure is like an angry alcoholic essentially. The narrator, 274 00:16:17,440 --> 00:16:22,280 Speaker 1: as I've said, is having flashbacks, although she's not really 275 00:16:22,320 --> 00:16:25,320 Speaker 1: sure that she's having them. She's just having these like 276 00:16:26,160 --> 00:16:30,680 Speaker 1: emotions and memories come back based on certain sensations. One 277 00:16:30,680 --> 00:16:33,040 Speaker 1: of them is there's a scene where she goes to 278 00:16:33,160 --> 00:16:35,600 Speaker 1: get a bag of ice and she just carries it 279 00:16:36,840 --> 00:16:42,680 Speaker 1: in her arms, and she has something akin to a 280 00:16:42,720 --> 00:16:49,280 Speaker 1: panic attack because her fingers kind of get wrinkly and 281 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:55,400 Speaker 1: she's cold, and it reminds her in some way of 282 00:16:55,440 --> 00:16:59,560 Speaker 1: her brother being dead in the water, and that that's 283 00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:04,679 Speaker 1: probably his fingers looked like. Also, a lot of the 284 00:17:04,760 --> 00:17:11,480 Speaker 1: relationships are just really tense, a lot of unresolved issues 285 00:17:12,720 --> 00:17:18,199 Speaker 1: for sure. But again going back to the title, there 286 00:17:18,280 --> 00:17:22,480 Speaker 1: is a pretty strong father daughter relationship happening in here. 287 00:17:22,760 --> 00:17:25,679 Speaker 1: He's the one that carried her to the boat. She 288 00:17:25,800 --> 00:17:28,000 Speaker 1: wanted to be like him. He is the gangster they 289 00:17:28,040 --> 00:17:35,320 Speaker 1: are looking for. It's interesting because she does see a 290 00:17:35,359 --> 00:17:39,400 Speaker 1: lot of his faults, but I guess she almost sees 291 00:17:39,440 --> 00:17:44,639 Speaker 1: them as like a strength. It's interesting the way she looks, 292 00:17:45,240 --> 00:17:48,640 Speaker 1: she looks up to him and looks at him. But yeah, 293 00:17:48,680 --> 00:17:54,879 Speaker 1: he was the one that was there and carried her 294 00:17:54,920 --> 00:17:55,399 Speaker 1: in the boat. 295 00:17:57,160 --> 00:17:59,679 Speaker 2: Yeah. She even says at one point, I want to 296 00:17:59,680 --> 00:18:03,120 Speaker 2: be the gangster we are all looking for, like implying 297 00:18:03,160 --> 00:18:06,400 Speaker 2: she wants to be like him. You know, even when 298 00:18:07,200 --> 00:18:12,000 Speaker 2: like the abusive situations happened, she still realizes that he 299 00:18:12,080 --> 00:18:16,879 Speaker 2: carried the family essentially in so many ways. And the 300 00:18:16,920 --> 00:18:19,399 Speaker 2: scenes that we have of just him and his wife 301 00:18:19,720 --> 00:18:25,080 Speaker 2: her her father and mother are really sweet, interestingly a 302 00:18:25,160 --> 00:18:27,960 Speaker 2: contrast to what she remembers from him and why she 303 00:18:28,000 --> 00:18:31,359 Speaker 2: stays away from him, right, But the way he cares 304 00:18:31,400 --> 00:18:34,560 Speaker 2: for her, and like the whole scene where he talks 305 00:18:34,600 --> 00:18:38,760 Speaker 2: about the news anchor said that we're going to get 306 00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:41,239 Speaker 2: this feast and we're going to cook this and she 307 00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:44,480 Speaker 2: he was talking about her being a cook, the mother 308 00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:47,240 Speaker 2: being the cook, and him being a gardener at that point, 309 00:18:47,560 --> 00:18:49,200 Speaker 2: and she was like, oh, really, who's cooking this? And 310 00:18:49,200 --> 00:18:51,320 Speaker 2: he goes, I guess the gardener's implying that he would 311 00:18:51,320 --> 00:18:53,399 Speaker 2: feed her and help her. So it was interesting. It 312 00:18:53,440 --> 00:18:58,040 Speaker 2: was an interesting like flip, yeah, and how she saw 313 00:18:58,119 --> 00:19:00,920 Speaker 2: him in the youth and how the the father saw 314 00:19:01,000 --> 00:19:06,760 Speaker 2: him to the these scenes of him caring for her. 315 00:19:10,600 --> 00:19:16,320 Speaker 1: Yes, yes, and they did have they were They would 316 00:19:16,320 --> 00:19:20,280 Speaker 1: fight like her parents would fight, but they always seemed 317 00:19:20,280 --> 00:19:27,800 Speaker 1: to kind of come back together. It was interesting, definitely, Okay, 318 00:19:27,880 --> 00:19:31,639 Speaker 1: and that I thought the mom was cheating at one point, 319 00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:35,159 Speaker 1: right because there was another guy at the movie theater 320 00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:41,680 Speaker 1: and I was like, Oh, I don't know which, I guess. 321 00:19:41,680 --> 00:19:45,040 Speaker 1: Speaking of adolescence and love is the theme in here. 322 00:19:46,040 --> 00:19:48,880 Speaker 1: Here's a quote. In the early days of my parents' courtship, 323 00:19:48,960 --> 00:19:52,679 Speaker 1: my mother told stories. She confessed elaborate dreams about the 324 00:19:52,760 --> 00:19:55,920 Speaker 1: end of war. Food she'd eat, a banquet table, mangoes 325 00:19:55,960 --> 00:19:58,960 Speaker 1: piled to the ceiling. Songs she'd make up and sing, 326 00:19:59,080 --> 00:20:01,520 Speaker 1: clapping her hands her head and throwing her hair like 327 00:20:01,560 --> 00:20:04,840 Speaker 1: a horse's mane. Dances. She dance, hopping from one foot 328 00:20:04,840 --> 00:20:08,040 Speaker 1: to the other. Unlike the responsible, favorite daughter or sister 329 00:20:08,080 --> 00:20:10,919 Speaker 1: she was to her family with my father in the forest, 330 00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:13,840 Speaker 1: my mother became reckless, drunk on her youth and the 331 00:20:13,840 --> 00:20:17,200 Speaker 1: possibilities of love, ignoring the chores to be done at home. 332 00:20:17,280 --> 00:20:19,679 Speaker 1: She rolled her pants up to her knees, stuck her 333 00:20:19,720 --> 00:20:23,200 Speaker 1: bare feet in puddles, and learned to smoke a cigarette. 334 00:20:24,520 --> 00:20:26,520 Speaker 3: She rebelled bit a little bit. 335 00:20:27,320 --> 00:20:31,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, because the scene that we get is she see 336 00:20:31,600 --> 00:20:34,040 Speaker 2: someone that she hadn't seen in years, like her It 337 00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:37,879 Speaker 2: seems like maybe her first love. But it also coincides 338 00:20:37,960 --> 00:20:41,720 Speaker 2: with the author talking about her first contact with a 339 00:20:41,760 --> 00:20:45,040 Speaker 2: young boy, So it kind of like that melding of 340 00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:49,000 Speaker 2: realizing what her mother was doing and what she was 341 00:20:49,040 --> 00:20:53,560 Speaker 2: doing as well, and her first experience with love and lust. 342 00:20:54,840 --> 00:20:58,240 Speaker 2: And here's another quote, the barbed wire gates open, and 343 00:20:58,320 --> 00:21:02,000 Speaker 2: she crosses through to him, arrives warm, the slightest film 344 00:21:02,040 --> 00:21:04,800 Speaker 2: of sweat on her bare arms. To his disbelieving eyes, 345 00:21:04,840 --> 00:21:08,520 Speaker 2: she says, it's me. It's me, shy and formal and breathless. 346 00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:11,560 Speaker 2: My parents always meeting for the first time, savoring the 347 00:21:11,600 --> 00:21:13,879 Speaker 2: sound of a name, marveling at the bones of the 348 00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:16,680 Speaker 2: face cut by the bones of the hand. I trail 349 00:21:16,760 --> 00:21:19,560 Speaker 2: behind him the tip of their dragon's tail. I am 350 00:21:19,640 --> 00:21:22,320 Speaker 2: drawn along like a silken banner on the body of 351 00:21:22,320 --> 00:21:22,920 Speaker 2: a kite. 352 00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:25,720 Speaker 3: Very beautiful, it's good. 353 00:21:25,920 --> 00:21:28,800 Speaker 1: It's really beautiful. Poetic verse. 354 00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:30,600 Speaker 3: I'm attaching that somewhere. 355 00:21:31,760 --> 00:21:45,159 Speaker 1: It's a long quote, but yeah, I just want to 356 00:21:45,200 --> 00:21:47,480 Speaker 1: briefly touch on this. There is some stuff about religion 357 00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:51,320 Speaker 1: in here that I thought was interesting. Here's a quote. 358 00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:53,840 Speaker 1: My friends told me that if he gave the church 359 00:21:53,880 --> 00:21:56,040 Speaker 1: people the chance, they would open their little books and, 360 00:21:56,119 --> 00:21:58,840 Speaker 1: pointing to the pictures of fresh fruit, say things like, 361 00:21:58,880 --> 00:22:01,399 Speaker 1: this is heaven. Here's the Kingdom of God, where no 362 00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:04,719 Speaker 1: one suffers. Their fingers tracing an invisible line connecting all 363 00:22:04,760 --> 00:22:08,160 Speaker 1: the healthy people walking through the sunlit fields. My friends 364 00:22:08,200 --> 00:22:10,400 Speaker 1: and I took the pamphlets the church people handed out 365 00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:12,879 Speaker 1: and studied the drawings of people having picnics on the 366 00:22:12,880 --> 00:22:15,600 Speaker 1: banks of the Long Blue River, or harvesting wheat, or 367 00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:18,720 Speaker 1: standing arm in arm looking into each other's eyes. To us, 368 00:22:18,880 --> 00:22:21,760 Speaker 1: these pictures were more unbelievable than the warriors we saw 369 00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:24,840 Speaker 1: flying in the Kung Fu movies. As far as we 370 00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:27,760 Speaker 1: could understand it, the church on our street was like 371 00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:30,800 Speaker 1: a ladder to the kingdom. I thought that was an 372 00:22:30,800 --> 00:22:34,160 Speaker 1: interesting through line, right there is her and her mom 373 00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:37,639 Speaker 1: liked to go see Kung Fu movies, so there is 374 00:22:37,680 --> 00:22:40,640 Speaker 1: that through line throughout. But also, yes, there is there 375 00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:41,520 Speaker 1: are some there's. 376 00:22:41,320 --> 00:22:44,360 Speaker 3: A church on the street and Jehovah's Witness church there. 377 00:22:44,440 --> 00:22:49,720 Speaker 1: Yes, there's some people church people about and her and 378 00:22:49,800 --> 00:22:52,760 Speaker 1: most of her friends seemed mostly confused by it. 379 00:22:53,600 --> 00:22:54,600 Speaker 3: I love it. 380 00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:58,440 Speaker 2: It's an interesting conversation about the colonization that was happening 381 00:22:58,480 --> 00:23:01,840 Speaker 2: with the Catholicism of Johoah's Witness and different religions that 382 00:23:01,920 --> 00:23:05,760 Speaker 2: came through in Vietnam, especially during this era. And I 383 00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:08,879 Speaker 2: think it has a bigger conversation because she's more intrigued 384 00:23:08,920 --> 00:23:11,199 Speaker 2: by the tails of it. Yes, I think we all 385 00:23:11,240 --> 00:23:13,320 Speaker 2: are as children, but she is more intrigued by that 386 00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:17,360 Speaker 2: than the actual belief system. 387 00:23:17,359 --> 00:23:20,639 Speaker 1: Right the story of it, which, yeah, leads us to 388 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:21,520 Speaker 1: the next point. 389 00:23:21,760 --> 00:23:22,240 Speaker 3: Dreams. 390 00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:26,000 Speaker 1: Dreams are a big part in this. Here's a quote. 391 00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:28,600 Speaker 1: I began to play with the ceiling, a game that 392 00:23:28,640 --> 00:23:30,320 Speaker 1: I used to play with the sky when I was 393 00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:33,399 Speaker 1: lying in the fishing boat on the sea. At that time, 394 00:23:33,560 --> 00:23:36,520 Speaker 1: I thought that everyone and everything I missed was hovering 395 00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:39,679 Speaker 1: behind the sky. The game involved looking for a seam 396 00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:42,480 Speaker 1: to the sky, a thread I could pull. I told 397 00:23:42,520 --> 00:23:45,000 Speaker 1: myself that if I could find the thread and focus 398 00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:47,520 Speaker 1: on it hard enough with my eyes, I could tear 399 00:23:47,560 --> 00:23:50,080 Speaker 1: the sky open, and my mother, my brother, my grandfather, 400 00:23:50,200 --> 00:23:53,359 Speaker 1: my flippops, my favorite shells would all fall down to me. 401 00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:58,760 Speaker 1: And she's a very imaginative. She's a very imaginative narrator. 402 00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:01,720 Speaker 1: I remember when we were reading, we always like give 403 00:24:01,760 --> 00:24:04,439 Speaker 1: each other a couple of books to choose from, And 404 00:24:04,480 --> 00:24:07,480 Speaker 1: when I was reading the summary of this book, it's 405 00:24:07,560 --> 00:24:10,560 Speaker 1: said in there like she feels things and sees things 406 00:24:10,720 --> 00:24:11,560 Speaker 1: very strongly. 407 00:24:12,800 --> 00:24:17,160 Speaker 2: I feel like that's common for only like lonely children, 408 00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:20,639 Speaker 2: especially when they're forced to be isolated. So language barrier 409 00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:22,840 Speaker 2: and she talked about being the only Vietnamese child not 410 00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:25,160 Speaker 2: being able to speak to anyone, and everybody else were adults, 411 00:24:25,920 --> 00:24:27,399 Speaker 2: so she had to dream. 412 00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:29,119 Speaker 3: She dreamed as. 413 00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:32,199 Speaker 2: Well as like, yes, trauma, so when you have that 414 00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:34,840 Speaker 2: kind of like overlaying each other. And I find it 415 00:24:34,840 --> 00:24:38,639 Speaker 2: interesting that they use the ideas of photos with them 416 00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:41,639 Speaker 2: through here talking about this is photo number one, this 417 00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:44,640 Speaker 2: is what too, this is photo death, because I've talked 418 00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:49,080 Speaker 2: about repeatedly like being a child with no true memories, 419 00:24:49,119 --> 00:24:51,560 Speaker 2: like meaning like a lot of the times that what 420 00:24:51,600 --> 00:24:53,920 Speaker 2: we grow up to remember are things that are fed 421 00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:56,639 Speaker 2: to us and shown to us through photographs. So if 422 00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:59,320 Speaker 2: you only have a photograph with no contexts, the things 423 00:24:59,359 --> 00:25:01,480 Speaker 2: that you imagine, which is kind of what she does. 424 00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:03,640 Speaker 3: M hmm. I thought it was interesting. 425 00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:04,600 Speaker 2: Yeah. 426 00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:09,679 Speaker 1: I also I thought like, because this was you know, 427 00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:16,280 Speaker 1: the escaping war, Vietnam war, coming to America for quote 428 00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:18,639 Speaker 1: hopefully a better life, you know, and so like that 429 00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:21,640 Speaker 1: dream of that as well of like maybe it will 430 00:25:21,680 --> 00:25:24,200 Speaker 1: be better here. And then yes, when they arrived, it 431 00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:28,040 Speaker 1: was isolating and scary, and but that did make me 432 00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:31,000 Speaker 1: think of think of that too, of sort of that 433 00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:37,280 Speaker 1: dream of something across the water is maybe better, right right. 434 00:25:37,400 --> 00:25:41,600 Speaker 2: Taking you somewhere else. Here's another quote. I lay in 435 00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:43,560 Speaker 2: bed and remembered the things I had seen in the 436 00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:46,320 Speaker 2: swimming pool. I remember the body of a boy gliding 437 00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:49,280 Speaker 2: along the floor of the pool, sunlight streaming across his 438 00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:53,400 Speaker 2: bare back. I remembered the reflections of clouds, family of clouds, 439 00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:56,720 Speaker 2: and birds migrating. I remember the leaves that floated to 440 00:25:56,760 --> 00:25:59,239 Speaker 2: the edges of the swimming pool and nested there. I 441 00:25:59,240 --> 00:26:01,280 Speaker 2: remembered how the layer of the sun made the water 442 00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:04,639 Speaker 2: glint like a window pane. I remember the reflections of 443 00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:07,720 Speaker 2: a ball bouncing in the courtyard, and the clotheslines strung 444 00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:10,960 Speaker 2: from reil to rel, the sheets fluttering like banners in 445 00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:14,600 Speaker 2: the wind. But what I remembered most were the boys flying. 446 00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:17,960 Speaker 2: I remember their bodies arking through the air and plunging down. 447 00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:20,920 Speaker 2: I remembered how their hands parted the water, and how 448 00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:23,560 Speaker 2: as they disappeared, the last thing I would see were 449 00:26:23,600 --> 00:26:27,040 Speaker 2: the pale soles of their feet, falling asleep. I remember 450 00:26:27,080 --> 00:26:30,320 Speaker 2: the brightness of the full moon shimmering into the swimming pool, 451 00:26:30,600 --> 00:26:34,400 Speaker 2: so close, so close, like a caught fish. 452 00:26:34,640 --> 00:26:37,120 Speaker 1: Yeah. So, going back to the pool, as we said, 453 00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:40,320 Speaker 1: it was a big piece of this story. She would 454 00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:42,440 Speaker 1: see these boys jumping into the pool, and she would 455 00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:46,600 Speaker 1: kind of observe how they jumped into the pool and 456 00:26:48,320 --> 00:26:55,040 Speaker 1: would think about wanting to do it herself. But I 457 00:26:55,119 --> 00:26:59,119 Speaker 1: just love this section because it does showcase outgrade of 458 00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:06,360 Speaker 1: a writer she is, but also the narrator really taking 459 00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:11,600 Speaker 1: this in and the way that those memories sometimes you 460 00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:15,080 Speaker 1: don't know why they form, but they do. And I 461 00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:16,439 Speaker 1: was thinking about this of the day. I have some 462 00:27:16,520 --> 00:27:18,240 Speaker 1: memories that I'm like, I don't know why my brain 463 00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:22,960 Speaker 1: decided that was important. I remember it so clearly right, 464 00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:26,840 Speaker 1: And I feel like this is a good example of her. 465 00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:29,800 Speaker 1: I mean I feel like that in here it was 466 00:27:31,560 --> 00:27:34,760 Speaker 1: her thinking I want to go jump in that water. 467 00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:37,679 Speaker 1: I want to go jump in the pool, and that 468 00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:42,680 Speaker 1: there's just something so close that I haven't captured yet, 469 00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:45,280 Speaker 1: or that's just like right out of my reach. But 470 00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:50,159 Speaker 1: it's just very vivid imagery, and I think it is 471 00:27:50,200 --> 00:27:54,040 Speaker 1: a good, a really good example of memories and how 472 00:27:54,040 --> 00:27:56,199 Speaker 1: they can form like that. 473 00:27:57,720 --> 00:28:01,920 Speaker 2: I think it's also like the person of the kids 474 00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:04,679 Speaker 2: doing that to the fact that the mother wouldn't let 475 00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:06,840 Speaker 2: her because of our own memories of water and how 476 00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:09,960 Speaker 2: she feels the water is cursed and then the closing 477 00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:13,600 Speaker 2: of the bowl because the landlord has seen this and 478 00:28:13,920 --> 00:28:15,920 Speaker 2: it was the beginning and was like, oh, okay, we're 479 00:28:15,920 --> 00:28:17,800 Speaker 2: gonna fill this up because you don't get yourself killed, 480 00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:20,720 Speaker 2: like essentially doing some of the things. Like all of 481 00:28:20,760 --> 00:28:23,359 Speaker 2: that has that same theme of kind of like the 482 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:26,120 Speaker 2: circling about of like the joy and freedom, but then 483 00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:30,280 Speaker 2: the loss and then the forbidding, like it just all 484 00:28:30,320 --> 00:28:33,600 Speaker 2: happened with that theme again about water. 485 00:28:35,040 --> 00:28:39,400 Speaker 1: Yes, because the the mother was yeah, she was like 486 00:28:39,440 --> 00:28:41,840 Speaker 1: I want to be near water, but she didn't want 487 00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:44,960 Speaker 1: to go in, right, she didn't want her daughter to 488 00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:48,440 Speaker 1: go in. And then when they filled up the pool 489 00:28:48,800 --> 00:28:52,400 Speaker 1: because these boys were jumping off recklessly, she was very 490 00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:55,480 Speaker 1: hurt by it and very like, oh, well, now we 491 00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:59,240 Speaker 1: don't have water near us. And yes, as we said, 492 00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:03,520 Speaker 1: water is a big theme throughout. As you said, the 493 00:29:03,600 --> 00:29:07,520 Speaker 1: Vietnamese word for water very close to the Korean word. 494 00:29:07,760 --> 00:29:12,280 Speaker 2: It is now so sweet. I can't say it like nop. 495 00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:15,560 Speaker 2: I think nope, no, okay, no, that's what it is, 496 00:29:15,800 --> 00:29:18,400 Speaker 2: so nope and I'm sorry to all the Vietnamese people, 497 00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:21,440 Speaker 2: which is like kind of that same level more like that, 498 00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:24,400 Speaker 2: it's very close, but that is yeah, us, I just 499 00:29:24,480 --> 00:29:24,959 Speaker 2: looked it up. 500 00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:30,080 Speaker 1: Yes, And according to what I looked up, it is 501 00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:32,960 Speaker 1: in Vietnamese the word for water and the word for 502 00:29:33,200 --> 00:29:36,000 Speaker 1: a nation, a country, and homeland are one and the 503 00:29:36,040 --> 00:29:41,560 Speaker 1: same because Vietnam is surrounded by water. So and it 504 00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:45,720 Speaker 1: was very prevalent, as we've we've mentioned several times the pool, 505 00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:49,840 Speaker 1: but as the story progresses, you don't really know the 506 00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:54,360 Speaker 1: brother has died fully until more towards the end. 507 00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:56,960 Speaker 2: Right, you don't realize there was a brother, yes, until 508 00:29:57,000 --> 00:29:58,440 Speaker 2: the end exactly. 509 00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:02,280 Speaker 1: And it was as they were getting onto the boats. 510 00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:07,720 Speaker 1: He was jumping between boats and drowned, and they brought 511 00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:13,480 Speaker 1: the body back and the family was saying, like the 512 00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:16,520 Speaker 1: water was heavy, this is bad water, and so that 513 00:30:17,880 --> 00:30:20,640 Speaker 1: like having him in there, it was like, this is 514 00:30:20,680 --> 00:30:24,640 Speaker 1: bad water. And so throughout having those things like with 515 00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:27,160 Speaker 1: the pool, like wanting it there but not wanting to 516 00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:29,800 Speaker 1: go in it, as you were saying, kind of that 517 00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:33,640 Speaker 1: cycle of here's all of the good things with it, 518 00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:36,520 Speaker 1: but here's all the bad things with it, and the 519 00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:42,200 Speaker 1: trauma with it, and then having like the narrator want 520 00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:45,800 Speaker 1: to jump in the water because doesn't quite has repressed 521 00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:51,240 Speaker 1: this memory pretty fully for most of the story. I 522 00:30:51,280 --> 00:30:53,920 Speaker 1: really liked it. It was beautiful, very beautiful. It is 523 00:30:53,960 --> 00:30:58,160 Speaker 1: something definitely I would like to read again because it's 524 00:30:58,240 --> 00:31:00,280 Speaker 1: very poetic and now that I think, now that I 525 00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:05,760 Speaker 1: know how it moves, I think I would be much 526 00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:09,880 Speaker 1: better at keeping track of like okay, I know where 527 00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:13,760 Speaker 1: things are like people are right. But I do highly 528 00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:18,680 Speaker 1: recommend it. It's fairly short and very beautifully written. 529 00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:21,120 Speaker 3: It is yes, go eat it. 530 00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:26,000 Speaker 1: Yes well. Listeners. If you have read it and you 531 00:31:26,040 --> 00:31:27,960 Speaker 1: have any thoughts, please let us know if you have 532 00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:31,080 Speaker 1: any suggestions for the segment. Also, please let us know. 533 00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:34,120 Speaker 1: You can emails a Stephania mom Stuff at iHeartMedia dot com. 534 00:31:34,280 --> 00:31:36,120 Speaker 1: We've met us on Twitter at mom Stuff podcast or 535 00:31:36,120 --> 00:31:38,239 Speaker 1: on Instagram and TikTok at stuff when I've told you. 536 00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:40,360 Speaker 1: We're also on YouTube. We have a tea public store, 537 00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:41,840 Speaker 1: and we have a book you can get wherever you 538 00:31:41,880 --> 00:31:44,240 Speaker 1: get your books. Thanks is always too, our super producer 539 00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:46,880 Speaker 1: Christina or executive producer My and our contributor Joey, Thank 540 00:31:46,920 --> 00:31:48,960 Speaker 1: you and thank see you for listening Stuff I'll Never 541 00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:50,400 Speaker 1: told you. These production of I Heart Radio. For more 542 00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:51,920 Speaker 1: podcasts from my Heart Radio, you can check out the 543 00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:53,880 Speaker 1: heart Radio app Apple podcasts wherever you listen to your 544 00:31:53,880 --> 00:31:54,920 Speaker 1: favorite shows. 545 00:32:00,520 --> 00:32:00,560 Speaker 4: No.