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Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha. I don't know I'm

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Speaker 1: a step I'd ever told you protection of iheartrate you.

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Speaker 1: So we have another classic book club for you because

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Speaker 1: I was fondly remembering I know we were talking about

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Speaker 1: you know, we don't get to read for joy as

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Speaker 1: much anymore, or I do, but it's all fan fiction almost.

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Speaker 1: But I do remember when I was a kid, like

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Speaker 1: that excitement of getting a book and in the summer

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Speaker 1: and like taking it to the beach or I don't know,

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Speaker 1: taking it wherever and just I would just devour it,

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Speaker 1: like stay up all night with a flashlight. I was

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Speaker 1: that good. M hm. So I was thinking about that,

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Speaker 1: and then it's Pride month as this comes out, and

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Speaker 1: I remembered the book we read Ash, which is sort

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Speaker 1: of an L G B, t Q plus take on Cinderella,

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Speaker 1: which I really really liked. Um yeah, and I think

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Speaker 1: it was fun. I think it's a good like summer read.

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Speaker 1: It was one of our first. It was one of

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Speaker 1: our first, and I really liked it. And I'm actually

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Speaker 1: on the hunt for more books like that. So listeners

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Speaker 1: a few getting suggestions, UM, please send them our way

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Speaker 1: because I'm I'm ready I'm looking, But in the meantime,

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Speaker 1: please enjoy this classic episode. Hey, this is Annie and

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Speaker 1: Samantha and welcome to stuff Mob never told your production

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Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio Today is a special episode for

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Speaker 1: several reasons, but the number one might be that we

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Speaker 1: are for the first time recording from our home studios. So, Samantha,

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Speaker 1: why are you described to the listeners where you are

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Speaker 1: recording from. Well, I think I've already showed a video

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Speaker 1: myself trying to set up this amazing, amazing equipment. Thank you.

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Speaker 1: It was a sixteen minute video which should have been

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Speaker 1: a two minute video. Oh god, mine, if I had

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Speaker 1: recorded all of mine, it would have been very long

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Speaker 1: and a lot of cursing. I lied, I said it

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Speaker 1: was a little cursing. It was a lot. I do

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Speaker 1: like that. There was several listeners are like, yes, thank you,

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Speaker 1: keep it real, show the struggle, and it was, um,

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Speaker 1: I am now in my dining room. I have kicked

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Speaker 1: out my dog because she is too loud and when

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Speaker 1: she hears any noise, and especially with me being around

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Speaker 1: almost all the time now, I think she's hyper aware

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Speaker 1: that something is happening. But in my dining room, literally

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Speaker 1: sitting with my laptop, Mike, and my headset's kind of

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Speaker 1: on my head because the way we're recording it is

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Speaker 1: through Skype, but at the same time we're using audio

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Speaker 1: limit that our superproducer Andrew is going to have to

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Speaker 1: fix and spliced together. Thank you very much. Um, I'm

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Speaker 1: definitely in pajama pants, no bra, a little bit of

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Speaker 1: wine I did. I did let this, brush my teeth

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Speaker 1: and wash my face today, though, I feel like I've

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Speaker 1: been pretty good at maintaining some semblance of I put

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Speaker 1: on clothes and I washed my face, and I shower

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Speaker 1: and I exercise, But who knows how long that will last.

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Speaker 1: I definitely only exercise for the first time yesterday for

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Speaker 1: about five minutes. Um. If you follow on my Twitter,

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Speaker 1: you will see that it did not really help in

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Speaker 1: comparison to all that I've ingested. Just say, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: that is a strungle. Yeah, I am recording from my closet. Yes,

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Speaker 1: I see all the games. Yeah, there's games and books

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Speaker 1: and mostly costumes. This is my costuming closet, really big closet.

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Speaker 1: Thank you. I don't know why I feel so proud

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Speaker 1: to have a big closet. A lot of people who

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Speaker 1: have visited my apartment. Don't even know this exists, and

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Speaker 1: then when I showed them, they're always like wow, um,

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Speaker 1: but uh yeah, it's it's cozy, it's cozy, I I put.

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Speaker 1: I posted a picture as well if anyone wants to

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Speaker 1: see it. Um, but it is right next to the window,

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Speaker 1: and I've done my best to sound proof. But if

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Speaker 1: you hear birds or traffic, just bear with us as

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Speaker 1: we work out the kinks in this system. So, how

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Speaker 1: how is your quarantine going? I will say I have

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Speaker 1: been a lot luckier than some. I do have a partner.

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Speaker 1: I think I've talked about him a little bit. Uh

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Speaker 1: where he is around because he's literally my downstairs neighbor.

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Speaker 1: Yeah that's a whole big story. And so essentially we

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Speaker 1: live together but don't so we can be away from

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Speaker 1: each other but together. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah yeah, So

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Speaker 1: it's a perfect little setup. I will say that I

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Speaker 1: feel like I'm definitely getting antsy. I think that's the

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Speaker 1: best word I can think of it, because I do.

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Speaker 1: I getting to the point where my house gets cluttered

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Speaker 1: with things, and I'm at this point where everything is

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Speaker 1: cluttered but at the same time is kind of there

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Speaker 1: for a purpose. But I'm feeling a little little bit overwhelmed. Sure,

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Speaker 1: but I think I'm doing okay. Everything is. I know

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Speaker 1: that I'm fearing better than most, so I feel very

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Speaker 1: privileged in that. But how how are you doing? Because

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Speaker 1: I know you are alone, and that made me, It

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Speaker 1: gives me a little worried. I am a I'm a

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Speaker 1: very social creature, and I know I talked about in

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Speaker 1: our Trauma mini series. One of the ways I cope

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Speaker 1: is by constantly keeping myself busy, and that is harder

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Speaker 1: to do when you can't leave and like Atlanta. Of course,

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Speaker 1: Atlanta is miserable weather for months and right when the

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Speaker 1: city is like, everyone, do not leave your place. It's

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Speaker 1: beautiful outside, and it's so cordially beautiful. Um. But I

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Speaker 1: happen staying in touch with people, and we're working on,

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Speaker 1: you know, the virtual watch parties. Samantha and I are

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Speaker 1: talking about doing some of those ourselves. So finding these

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Speaker 1: virtual ways to to have company and to keep contact

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Speaker 1: with people has been really really helpful, right, I think

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Speaker 1: if people, I will say, I do love the fact

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Speaker 1: that we're almost more in touch with each other now

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Speaker 1: than we were before because we're like, hey, um, and

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Speaker 1: I was talking about a previous episode where we have

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Speaker 1: just an app whether it's the go to meeting, zoom, whatever,

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Speaker 1: and we have it up all day, not necessarily because

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Speaker 1: we're watching and talking together all day, but the option

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Speaker 1: of hey, which is silly. It's this silly thing just

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Speaker 1: happened and we've never done that before. But now that

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Speaker 1: we're like, oh, this is what we can do now

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Speaker 1: that we are absolutely all alone or with the only

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Speaker 1: the one person who may not understand what we're talking

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Speaker 1: about in comparison to so that has been kind of

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Speaker 1: nice to see. I mean when it comes down to

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Speaker 1: communication wise, been nice to see in trying to bond

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Speaker 1: with each other. And I will say, yeah, this definitely

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Speaker 1: has brought in a whole level of I think this

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Speaker 1: is when people talking about going in through like a

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Speaker 1: military service together where only you guys know what it

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Speaker 1: feels like to be in that weird situation. Because Quarantine

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Speaker 1: Life has kind of put us all on that same page. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: like globally, Yeah, it really has. As um and I

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Speaker 1: did want to a quick note before we get into

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Speaker 1: our episode. UM, I did want to say we were

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Speaker 1: pretty far ahead before this happened. Um, so you're going

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Speaker 1: to hear some episodes that we recorded in the before

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Speaker 1: times um come out after this one, and I think

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Speaker 1: it would be pretty obvious which ones those are, but

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Speaker 1: just want to put that out there. We are doing

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Speaker 1: our we are doing our a bit, we're quarantining, we're

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Speaker 1: social distancing. But there are some episodes you're going to

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Speaker 1: hear that we recorded in some cases like months ago, right, um,

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Speaker 1: that are only gonna just come out probably in April.

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Speaker 1: So there's that note. And uh relevant to this episode,

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Speaker 1: which is a book club episode. I remember when we

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Speaker 1: first said like, let's we're gonna make this book club happen,

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Speaker 1: we both had concerns about how, well, how are we

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Speaker 1: going to read one book a month? And now I'm

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Speaker 1: kind of like, hey, and I will say for books

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Speaker 1: like this because another listener had also said the same

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Speaker 1: thing that it took our two days to read this.

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Speaker 1: It took me like a day and a half to

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Speaker 1: read this. It was a really good, uh simple read,

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Speaker 1: very fantasy level. So stuff like this is like, okay,

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Speaker 1: well this is not too bad. Yeah, it was a

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Speaker 1: quick read. So what we're talking about for this edition

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Speaker 1: of book Club is Ash by Melinda Lowe and uh

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Speaker 1: Samantha and I are doing it with wine. Yes, we

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Speaker 1: are definitely making this an official book club book club

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Speaker 1: by adding our own little beverages. And for those who

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Speaker 1: don't drink, I hope you're listening with it. Whatever sparkling water,

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Speaker 1: you want, just a regular water, iced tea, hot tea, whatever,

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Speaker 1: just join, cuddle up and imagine this as our book

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Speaker 1: club together, our book club together. I love it. And

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Speaker 1: this was actually a listener recommendation for forever ago when

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Speaker 1: I asked for LGBTQ plus fiction. So thanks to the

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Speaker 1: people who wrote in and suggested this one, and always, always,

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Speaker 1: always keep those recommendations coming. We need our next book

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Speaker 1: for next month's book club. We need our next movie

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Speaker 1: for fitness movie Friday. Please send in your suggestions. But

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Speaker 1: for today, okay, Ash, let's talk about the plots. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So the story is a reimagining of the Cinderella fairy tale,

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Speaker 1: complete with fairies and magic, split up into two sections,

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Speaker 1: which is the Fairy and the Hundreds. Is a tale

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Speaker 1: of loneliness and love and magic. It follows Ashling or Ash,

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Speaker 1: and it opens with her mother's as a young girl,

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Speaker 1: and it's clear that they were very close and the

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Speaker 1: death really impacts Ash and I wanted to put in here.

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Speaker 1: One of my worst auditions ever, and that's actually quite

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Speaker 1: the feat because I've had some bad auditions. Was for

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Speaker 1: one of the step sisters in Cinderella. But to be

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Speaker 1: fair or to not be fair, I was trying to

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Speaker 1: get out of band practice. I actually didn't really care.

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Speaker 1: I just knew if I auditioned, I didn't have to

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Speaker 1: go to band practice. So that's fair. When I we

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Speaker 1: had um into the Woods with one of our plays,

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Speaker 1: and I played the mother of Jack and the beanstalk funny.

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Speaker 1: I'll say I feel like I was pretty funny. I

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Speaker 1: got a lot of laughs of that I do remember.

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Speaker 1: But to go back to the name Ash, obviously it's

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Speaker 1: a reference to the Cinderella fairy tale where she's falling

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Speaker 1: asleep in the ashes or cinders of the hearth, and

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Speaker 1: according to Low, it also means dreams or visions, and

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Speaker 1: Ash has a lot of those throughout this Joy is

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Speaker 1: definitely intertwined throughout. Oh yeah, and and we um, we

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Speaker 1: forgot to mention, but we were accidentally timely with this

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Speaker 1: pick because nineteen was the tenure anniversary of this book,

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Speaker 1: so they re released it. Um. It's in really perfectly timed. Yeah. Um. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: the world it takes place in is in the middle

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Speaker 1: of a transition between the old fashioned ways of magic

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Speaker 1: and those that believe the stories of magic are all

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Speaker 1: fairy tales. Ash's mother, Eleanor, fell into the old fashioned camp,

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Speaker 1: and she was what was called a green witch. They

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Speaker 1: created potions and big cast spells, some of which her

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Speaker 1: mother recorded in books that later become a huge comfort

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Speaker 1: to Ash when Ash finds them. She also left behind

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Speaker 1: books of fairy tales that Ash reads pretty much every night.

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Speaker 1: One in particular is her favorite, about a girl who

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Speaker 1: essentially dies to live in the fairy world. She chooses

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Speaker 1: kind of eternal sleep, I think to be in the

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Speaker 1: fairy world as opposed to existing in the real world. Um.

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Speaker 1: Ash frequently sleeps by her mother's grave, hoping to see

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Speaker 1: a fairy and believing that the fairies will be able

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Speaker 1: to reunite her with her mother and then. Her father, meanwhile,

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Speaker 1: fell into the more logical camp. Soon after his wife dies,

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Speaker 1: he leaves for the city of Royal City to do

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Speaker 1: some trading, leaving Ash at their home in Rook Hill

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Speaker 1: on the border of the mysterious Wood with a capital W.

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Speaker 1: A place stories say is home to all of the fairies,

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Speaker 1: and when he returned, it's with a new wife named

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Speaker 1: Isabelle and her two daughters, Anna and Clara. Ash is

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Speaker 1: obviously unhappy with the situation, feeling as though it was

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Speaker 1: a betrayal to her mother. I can see that, and

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Speaker 1: she continues to search the woods for the fairies and

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Speaker 1: finally makes contact with one. He instructs her to leave, angrily,

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Speaker 1: calling her a fool for looking for them at all.

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Speaker 1: Right in Ash returns home, she discovers her father has

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Speaker 1: fallen seriously ill. One of her mother's friends and fellow Greenwich,

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Speaker 1: pushes for treatment of the old ways, telling Isabel if

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Speaker 1: she calls her a physician it will make things worse.

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Speaker 1: Isabel ignores her, and soon after Ash's father dies, she

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Speaker 1: and her stepmother and stepsisters move into Isabel's house, called

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Speaker 1: the Queen House at West Riding, which is five miles

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Speaker 1: outside of rural city and is the famous staging ground

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Speaker 1: of the Royal Hunt. These hunts are always led by

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Speaker 1: women called huntresses, which is awesome, yes, So soon after

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Speaker 1: Isabel informs Ash that her father left behind a series

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Speaker 1: of debts and to pay them off, she demands the

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Speaker 1: Ash works as a servant and she wars from Dawnt

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Speaker 1: or Dusk, dealing with her stepmother's cruel treatment and abuse

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Speaker 1: that it often involves striking Ash and walking her in

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Speaker 1: the cellar, but at night she reads the stories her

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Speaker 1: mother left her when she came. She sneaks out to

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Speaker 1: the woods searching for fairies in a way to bring

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Speaker 1: her mom back, and Jigan runs into the fairy she

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Speaker 1: met earlier. He's intimidating, I'm mysterious and gives off an

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Speaker 1: air of danger. I'm not gonna lie. When I read this,

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Speaker 1: I kind of thought of like the Twilight level word. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I didn't wonder that. So throughout the series she has

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Speaker 1: a lot of meetings and she learns his name as Sheen,

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Speaker 1: and she begs him to take her with him to

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Speaker 1: the fair world, but he keeps saying it's not time yet.

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Speaker 1: Also shout out to Melinda Lowe for having a section

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Speaker 1: on her website on how to pronounce all the names.

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Speaker 1: I really appreciate that we need those obviously. Any any

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Speaker 1: time you can write out the pronunciation of things, thank you, yes, um.

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Speaker 1: So years go by, Ash becomes very familiar with the

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Speaker 1: trails of the royal Woods. She continues to meet Machine

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Speaker 1: and they develop an uneasy friendship, I guess. At the

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Speaker 1: same time, Anna, the oldest daughter, becomes of age, which

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Speaker 1: means Isabel regularly takes her to the city to find

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Speaker 1: a rich husband. And they are very transparent. That is

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Speaker 1: what they are all about. Anna bickers with her younger

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Speaker 1: sister about it, kind of insinuating that the younger sister

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Speaker 1: doesn't know anything. They are both excited though, at the

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Speaker 1: prospect of meeting Prince Aidan. One day, Ash falls asleep

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Speaker 1: in the woods and when she awakes, she sees a

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Speaker 1: woman drinking from the river. They make eye contact and

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Speaker 1: the woman smiles before disappearing into the wood, and Ash

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Speaker 1: later dreams about this woman. Ashes taken to the city

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Speaker 1: to act as a servant for her stepfamily during fuel

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Speaker 1: There she meets fellow servant Gwynn and they become fronts.

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Speaker 1: It's really nice to have a few characters who actually

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Speaker 1: like her. Thank you, because it's so dark, so they

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Speaker 1: turned a party for the servants and Ash sees the

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Speaker 1: woman from the wood and realized this she is the

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Speaker 1: Royal Huntress. Um and ashleeings are again later and it

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Speaker 1: said when she leaves the party early, feeling lonely. Ash

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Speaker 1: skips out on the party too, and that night Gwinn

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Speaker 1: probes Ash about her feelings about men, obviously and who

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Speaker 1: she wants to marry, and Ash feels uncomfortable and sure

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Speaker 1: and the conversation makes Ash think of a different kind

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Speaker 1: of love and she obviously desperately misses her mother. Gwinn

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Speaker 1: gives her a spell meant to give her dreams of

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Speaker 1: her future husband. Ash takes it, and then they returned

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Speaker 1: to Quinn House. The morning after they return, Ash gives

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Speaker 1: a spell to her stepsister Anna Um and it does

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Speaker 1: not work, and Anna angrily calls her rustic. Ash goes

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Speaker 1: out that night to meet Sheen, who tells her that

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Speaker 1: he knew her mother Um. He protects her from other fairies,

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Speaker 1: informing them that Ash belongs to him, but still he

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Speaker 1: tells her it is not time, but he does give

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Speaker 1: her a medallion to wish for impossible things. Inter the Huntress,

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Speaker 1: Ash meets her again in the forest where the huntress

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Speaker 1: is tracking a deer, and they chat about how they've

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Speaker 1: come across each other. Several times. Ash pulls the classic

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Speaker 1: I'm Lost routine to spend more time with her, even

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Speaker 1: though she wasn't outlaws at all. We learned the Huntress's

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Speaker 1: name is Kaisa and that they both share a love

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Speaker 1: of the forest. So during this time, Anna begins courting

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Speaker 1: a man, or a man begins courting Anna, leaving Ash

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Speaker 1: alone at queen House more often. Yeah, this allows her

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Speaker 1: more time to wander into the woods and hang with Kaisa.

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Speaker 1: Kaisa offers to teach her how to ride a horse,

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Speaker 1: and they spend several afternoons riding through the forest. Kaisa

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Speaker 1: provides a horse and clothing, say you can't ride a

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Speaker 1: horse and address, I guess that's true. You can, but

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Speaker 1: it's difficult, feel like here, and I don't ride horses,

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Speaker 1: so yeah, no, I don't either. They become closer and

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Speaker 1: Kaisa divulges some of her history and how she became

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Speaker 1: the Royal Huntress, and she tells Ash her favorite fairy tale,

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Speaker 1: a story of a hundreds who fell in love and

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Speaker 1: made a deal with a fairy to make all this happen,

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Speaker 1: and the deal required her to spend time with the

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Speaker 1: fairy queen, and as time passed, the huntress is said

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Speaker 1: fell in love with the fairy queen instead of the

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Speaker 1: one that she was going after and fairy Queen loved

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Speaker 1: her as well. Ash he is more hesitant, believing her

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Speaker 1: station effectively renders her a nobody, and it is also

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Speaker 1: always torn with thoughts of Sheen in the fairy world.

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Speaker 1: She says, perhaps one day she'll share her favorite fairy

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Speaker 1: tale with Kaisa, and it's all kind of awkward and

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Speaker 1: sweet and full of usc who Annie is having to

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Speaker 1: put in here for me because I didn't know what

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Speaker 1: this was, which means unresolved sexual tension. Thank you, fan

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Speaker 1: fiction world, Yes, thank you so much, fan fiction world.

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Speaker 1: You've helped me get through this quarantine like you would

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Speaker 1: not believe. Eventually, Kaisa asked if Ash would like to

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Speaker 1: join her on the King's hunt, and ashe feels like

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Speaker 1: she has never wanted anything more in her life, so

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Speaker 1: she uses the medallion to ask Sheen to make this

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Speaker 1: a reality because her stepmother would never allow it. He

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Speaker 1: tells her there will be a price, and she agrees

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Speaker 1: rather quickly. At my opinion, she agrees uh. The wish

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Speaker 1: provides her with a horse and well fitting clothes and

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Speaker 1: a fairy to take his place so that they don't

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Speaker 1: notice she's missing, but the fairy does tell her that

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Speaker 1: she will be recognized by those that know her. Um,

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Speaker 1: the hunt commences, a stag is called. Much celebration has

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Speaker 1: had Kais's apprentice Lore consistently hints that Kaisa has feelings

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Speaker 1: for Ash. Kaisa and Ash have an awkward goodbye since

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Speaker 1: ashe can't explain her haste and nerves and why she

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Speaker 1: has to leave so suddenly as the magic wears off,

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Speaker 1: and then Prince Aiden remember Prince Aiden from before, for

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Speaker 1: who he's essentially the prince in this Cinderella tale, Um

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Speaker 1: sends out a letter to every eligible woman to attend

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Speaker 1: a ball that he reluctantly it's hinted, is throwing in

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Speaker 1: search of a wife. Anna is set on big that wife,

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Speaker 1: so of course it culminates and Kaisa asking Ash to

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Speaker 1: Prince Aiden's ball, the Soul's Night Masquerade. She again goes

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Speaker 1: to Sheen for her wish to let her attend the ball.

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Speaker 1: He reminds her that she will have to pay, and

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Speaker 1: she again agrees. And this is after Ash asked Kaisa

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Speaker 1: if she would not want to be a princess, and

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Speaker 1: Kaisa says it depends on if it means marrying a

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Speaker 1: prince the hint um and so the day of the ball,

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Speaker 1: Ash finds a very beautiful dress and jewels laid out

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Speaker 1: for her. A carriage awaits, but the driver warns her

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Speaker 1: magic will wear all at midnight, very Cinderella esque with

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Speaker 1: a mask of her face. Ash we used to the

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Speaker 1: crowd before she is asked to dance by a mysterious man.

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Speaker 1: Ash agrees, and after the man leaves her to her

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Speaker 1: room and asked her to wait, impatient, Ashley's and searches

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Speaker 1: for Kaisa. It's revealed that the main Ash dance with was,

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Speaker 1: of course dump Um Prince Aidan, and Cash is the

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Speaker 1: talk of the ball because you know she's gorgeous in

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Speaker 1: this new made up way um. Kaisa tells as she

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Speaker 1: does not like mask and that while the dress is beautiful,

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Speaker 1: it doesn't really suit her. Kaisa deduces that Ash has

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Speaker 1: a debt, but Ash refuses to tell her about it.

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Speaker 1: Kaisa promises Ash that her help comes without a price

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Speaker 1: and that it is her choice, but Ash turns her

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Speaker 1: down and as forcibly as the belt tolls. Unfortunately, though,

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Speaker 1: she does not beat her stepmother home, and she is

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Speaker 1: accused of stealing. How did she get this beautiful dress

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Speaker 1: and all these jewels and she is accosted and struck

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Speaker 1: several times by her stepmother. Her stepsister rips the jewels

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Speaker 1: from her hair before she is locked in the cellar.

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Speaker 1: When she is released, she ventures into the wood, knowing

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Speaker 1: the time to pay up his calm, and she learns

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Speaker 1: that her mother cursed Sheen after he tried persistently to

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Speaker 1: bring her to the fairy world um and so she

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Speaker 1: cursed him with falling in love with a human girl

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Speaker 1: so that he would understand love and what it was

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Speaker 1: he was doing and why it was wrong bringing humans

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Speaker 1: into the fair world against their will. Unfortunately, he ended

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Speaker 1: up falling for her her Oh no Ash. He calls

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Speaker 1: it agony and sees that something has changed within Ash,

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Speaker 1: that Ash no longer wants to give up her life

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Speaker 1: for the fairy world, that her favorite fairy tale is

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Speaker 1: no longer her favorite fairy tale. She wants to live right,

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Speaker 1: and I'm afraid of her stepmother. In the face of

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Speaker 1: possibly never seen Kaisa again, Ash goes to the ball

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Speaker 1: where the princess to announce his chosen bride. She waves

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Speaker 1: through the crowd in her cloak and service dress and

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Speaker 1: asked Kaisa for a dance. Kaisa agrees and everyone is shocked.

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Speaker 1: They kiss, but then Ash admits she must leave and

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Speaker 1: that she hopes that they will see each other again.

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Speaker 1: Not They want to point out that the sister Clara

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Speaker 1: seems to be actually a good character as well. I

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Speaker 1: think she used to bond at this point at the end,

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Speaker 1: they certainly do. She's the most sympathetic of the three

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Speaker 1: um and that's not saying much for a lot of

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Speaker 1: the story, but towards the end for sure. UM. So

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Speaker 1: Ash rushes off to Sheen and she tells him that

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Speaker 1: if he loves her, he will set her free. He

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Speaker 1: agrees on the condition they spend one night together. And

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Speaker 1: time is different in the fairy world, so one night

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Speaker 1: could be a long time in the fairy world. And

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Speaker 1: Samantha and I are going to return to our different

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Speaker 1: views on what this minute later, but he promises her

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Speaker 1: she will wake up the next morning in her own world.

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00:23:20,320 --> 00:23:22,520
Speaker 1: She asked if she will die and he says only

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Speaker 1: a little. So the next morning she does wake up.

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00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:28,399
Speaker 1: She goes to find Kaisa and tells her she is

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Speaker 1: free to love her, and they kiss happily ever after,

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00:23:32,160 --> 00:23:35,960
Speaker 1: and of story into fairy tale. So that's the plot,

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00:23:36,760 --> 00:23:39,600
Speaker 1: UM And now we're going to discuss some tropes and

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00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:41,800
Speaker 1: some of our thoughts about it, but first we're going

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Speaker 1: to take a quick break for word from our sponsor,

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00:23:57,280 --> 00:24:02,199
Speaker 1: and we're back, Thank you, sponsor. So Oh, one of

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Speaker 1: the big themes in this is one we've talked about

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Speaker 1: a lot, and it's one that is in a lot

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00:24:06,480 --> 00:24:09,960
Speaker 1: of children's stories especially, and fairy tales especially, and that

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00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:14,560
Speaker 1: is of the mother stepmother, usually the mother dying and

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00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:21,360
Speaker 1: the stepmother being evil and trying to take her place.

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00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:24,919
Speaker 1: And I will say it's interesting in the case of

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00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:29,800
Speaker 1: this story, you never know for sure whether the stepmother

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00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:34,080
Speaker 1: was lying about her father's debts. You don't know. You

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00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:37,040
Speaker 1: never know what she was implying in or what he

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00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:39,680
Speaker 1: had done for her, what hadn't done for her. Um.

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Speaker 1: There's also this whole level like you obviously have a

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Speaker 1: big villain. There's nothing about her that you would want

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00:24:48,160 --> 00:24:54,800
Speaker 1: to give sympathy to. She is very obviously the evil stepmother. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and it's been a long time since I've seen the

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00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:03,240
Speaker 1: Disney version of sinder Ella um Or, Oh, I know

428
00:25:03,359 --> 00:25:05,840
Speaker 1: she is. I was just trying to think of comparisons.

429
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:09,879
Speaker 1: I really loved ever after when I was in middle school.

430
00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:13,959
Speaker 1: I loved them. Look, I continued throughout the entire time

431
00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:16,960
Speaker 1: I was, I was reading this comparing it to ever After,

432
00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:20,760
Speaker 1: because it was very similar because again Clara and the

433
00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:25,159
Speaker 1: other step sister, they were very sympathetic to uh Cinderella

434
00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:28,119
Speaker 1: slash ash and so that was very similar to that

435
00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:31,359
Speaker 1: as well. But in Jesica, Houston did an amazing job

436
00:25:31,800 --> 00:25:34,720
Speaker 1: in that, at the very least and ever after, you

437
00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:38,360
Speaker 1: knew she loved him like that was the one thing

438
00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:41,880
Speaker 1: that she had. She may have had disdain for the

439
00:25:42,119 --> 00:25:47,719
Speaker 1: Cinderella character, but she loved the husband right. And I

440
00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:51,480
Speaker 1: feel like in this one, the best argument you can

441
00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:56,840
Speaker 1: make that she is sympathetic is that the whole system

442
00:25:56,880 --> 00:25:59,280
Speaker 1: they were caught up in that there's no other way

443
00:25:59,280 --> 00:26:02,280
Speaker 1: to get money or to have property or whatever it is.

444
00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:06,960
Speaker 1: So there is like this level of tension and it's

445
00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:11,920
Speaker 1: even addressed outright at one point where ashe feels something

446
00:26:11,920 --> 00:26:15,959
Speaker 1: like sympathy for Anna, even though Anna is terrible to her,

447
00:26:16,560 --> 00:26:20,600
Speaker 1: because she sees this pressure that Isabel is putting on

448
00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:23,320
Speaker 1: her daughter to find like you have to do this

449
00:26:23,920 --> 00:26:26,320
Speaker 1: or else We're the whole family is going to have

450
00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:29,080
Speaker 1: no money and no station, and what will we do, right,

451
00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:31,480
Speaker 1: and then you do feel sympathy with her trying to

452
00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:36,600
Speaker 1: desperately defined a husband. Yeah, with the curse or another

453
00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:41,600
Speaker 1: curse with the spell, which obviously she didn't care for, right. Yeah,

454
00:26:41,640 --> 00:26:44,560
Speaker 1: that whole scene of So we're talking about the part

455
00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:49,640
Speaker 1: where Ash gave Anna the spell, um because she noticed

456
00:26:49,680 --> 00:26:54,560
Speaker 1: that Anna was taking part in this day of fasting

457
00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:58,439
Speaker 1: that is sort of a old ways magic thing and

458
00:26:58,520 --> 00:27:01,359
Speaker 1: you say the spell and you fast and then you

459
00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:04,520
Speaker 1: dream of your husband at night. So she notices that

460
00:27:05,040 --> 00:27:08,399
Speaker 1: Anna is fasting and gives her the spell, and it

461
00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:11,640
Speaker 1: kind of reminds me of the whole thing where you're

462
00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:14,200
Speaker 1: so desperate or are I've seen this play out where

463
00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:17,320
Speaker 1: people are so desperate to lose weight and they'll try

464
00:27:17,400 --> 00:27:20,320
Speaker 1: diets that they honestly don't really believe in, but they're like,

465
00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:22,920
Speaker 1: I just I'm so desperate, I've got to do this thing.

466
00:27:23,440 --> 00:27:26,959
Speaker 1: So even though she doesn't believe in it, she's just

467
00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:31,600
Speaker 1: feeling that level of desperation. I will try this spell,

468
00:27:31,800 --> 00:27:34,399
Speaker 1: even though I think it is rustic, especially when it

469
00:27:34,440 --> 00:27:36,440
Speaker 1: doesn't work all of a sudden, it's like the stupidest

470
00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:41,639
Speaker 1: thing ever. Yeah, So that's that's a big trope. Another

471
00:27:41,680 --> 00:27:48,160
Speaker 1: one related is sort of this women's intuition versus men's logic,

472
00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:51,320
Speaker 1: and we see that play out with which is and

473
00:27:51,320 --> 00:27:56,160
Speaker 1: and the spells and potions that um Ash's mother took

474
00:27:56,200 --> 00:28:00,280
Speaker 1: part in um and also this whole like old new

475
00:28:00,280 --> 00:28:06,800
Speaker 1: world fantasy versus the real world thing. Yeah, so it

476
00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:10,040
Speaker 1: is odd reading it with our modern eyes because like

477
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:13,280
Speaker 1: the scene where her dad is dying, you're definitely, as

478
00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:16,439
Speaker 1: a reader meant to be like, no, stick to the

479
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:21,199
Speaker 1: old ways in which they should in this story, they

480
00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:23,880
Speaker 1: should have. He was getting better. It just didn't um

481
00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:27,399
Speaker 1: look exactly like how they thought it would, and it wasn't.

482
00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:29,359
Speaker 1: It was kind of slower than they thought, so they

483
00:28:29,359 --> 00:28:31,919
Speaker 1: switched the position and that killed him. But looking at

484
00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:35,199
Speaker 1: it through our modern eyes, you're like, no, science, that

485
00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:39,200
Speaker 1: is very reminiscent of pants Labyrinth. Do you think about that? Oh,

486
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:41,200
Speaker 1: it's been so long since I've seen that. You know,

487
00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:43,400
Speaker 1: when the mother is sick and she starts putting the

488
00:28:43,440 --> 00:28:46,880
Speaker 1: things underneath the bed, and the father and the husband's

489
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:49,640
Speaker 1: like nomad, like get rid of those is what is nonsense.

490
00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:52,280
Speaker 1: But she was actually getting better and it got rid

491
00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:54,480
Speaker 1: of all that. She ended up dying, But Yeah, it's

492
00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:59,959
Speaker 1: kind of that same level of old culture versus new culture,

493
00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:05,360
Speaker 1: new technology. Yeah. Um, And you see it also in

494
00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:11,920
Speaker 1: Sleepy Hollow, Yeah, Christina Ricci and her doing the Eye

495
00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:15,320
Speaker 1: under the bed and people not understanding what she was

496
00:29:15,440 --> 00:29:18,920
Speaker 1: doing and thinking it was evil. So there there is that.

497
00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:24,320
Speaker 1: And then also, yeah, the whole thing the book being

498
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:27,680
Speaker 1: divided into the two sections, The Fairy and the Huntress,

499
00:29:28,200 --> 00:29:32,640
Speaker 1: sort of represents Ash's decision she has to make. Is

500
00:29:32,680 --> 00:29:35,720
Speaker 1: she going to give up everything and going go into

501
00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:38,560
Speaker 1: this fantasy world with the Fairy, which is where the

502
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:40,920
Speaker 1: first half of the book is that is her goal,

503
00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:45,360
Speaker 1: that is what she wants, or especially as it moves

504
00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:48,040
Speaker 1: into the later part of the book, is she going

505
00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:52,200
Speaker 1: to give up on bringing her mother back on this

506
00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:57,080
Speaker 1: fairytale world and be with someone she loves in the

507
00:29:57,120 --> 00:30:00,720
Speaker 1: real world the Huntress. And I think a lot of

508
00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:03,720
Speaker 1: that too is also about going through grief a little

509
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:08,040
Speaker 1: bit that that desperation to go back to and wanting

510
00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:12,360
Speaker 1: that person that you lost, but sometimes moving past that

511
00:30:12,440 --> 00:30:16,000
Speaker 1: and accepting what that what has happened and going into

512
00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:19,200
Speaker 1: a better version of and not for everyone, but that

513
00:30:19,200 --> 00:30:24,080
Speaker 1: this is a very like binary idea, but it is like, okay,

514
00:30:24,080 --> 00:30:28,920
Speaker 1: accepting death and then moving on to live right. Um,

515
00:30:29,000 --> 00:30:31,200
Speaker 1: And that's what she ends up doing, is she chooses

516
00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:35,360
Speaker 1: the real world and life after she has squared her

517
00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:39,440
Speaker 1: debts and can enter a relationship fully and openly. And

518
00:30:39,680 --> 00:30:42,240
Speaker 1: there's one scene in the book that the jewels that

519
00:30:42,440 --> 00:30:46,960
Speaker 1: on a tour out of ashes hair, when they wake

520
00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:51,600
Speaker 1: up the next day, they they're worthless and fake. Um.

521
00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:58,320
Speaker 1: So there is that whole layer two of fantasy and

522
00:30:58,360 --> 00:31:01,280
Speaker 1: these these dreams, these day dreams that we have and

523
00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:04,320
Speaker 1: what does Dumbledore say, It does not do to dwell

524
00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:07,320
Speaker 1: in on dreams and forget to live. It's kind of

525
00:31:07,360 --> 00:31:12,240
Speaker 1: that whole thing where it's not real, it's all fake.

526
00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:14,800
Speaker 1: And and one big thing of this book, I will

527
00:31:14,840 --> 00:31:20,360
Speaker 1: say is somberness and loneliness. Um. That is a theme throughout.

528
00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:23,640
Speaker 1: So it totally makes sense that she's fantasizing about this

529
00:31:23,920 --> 00:31:27,680
Speaker 1: which she believes to be this better world where she

530
00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:31,120
Speaker 1: doesn't have an evil stepmother and two stepsisters that don't

531
00:31:31,120 --> 00:31:33,840
Speaker 1: treat her well, and she isn't totally alone and maybe

532
00:31:33,880 --> 00:31:37,280
Speaker 1: her mother is there. Like it's kind of like you said,

533
00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:41,440
Speaker 1: it's almost reminiscent of the stages of grief. Of bargaining.

534
00:31:43,760 --> 00:31:49,160
Speaker 1: Another trope we wanted to talk about is mask and

535
00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:54,000
Speaker 1: especially in the context of assumed heterosexuality, because I think

536
00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:56,760
Speaker 1: if I had read this book and I had not

537
00:31:56,880 --> 00:32:00,360
Speaker 1: known going in that was the lgbt Q plus story,

538
00:32:00,760 --> 00:32:03,480
Speaker 1: I would have seen, Oh, she's okay the Prince. They didn't.

539
00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:08,760
Speaker 1: They're gonna end up somehow together. And I do love that.

540
00:32:08,800 --> 00:32:11,000
Speaker 1: It is a nonsensical bit of like it could have

541
00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:13,080
Speaker 1: just not even been in the story. You wouldn't have known.

542
00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:16,680
Speaker 1: I love when she sees him the first time, she's like, Oh,

543
00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:19,560
Speaker 1: he's not that handsome, right? Like that? This is the

544
00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:22,160
Speaker 1: kind of fighting of her. They said he was handsome?

545
00:32:22,280 --> 00:32:26,600
Speaker 1: Are you kidding me? I liked that. I'm not gonna lie.

546
00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:30,040
Speaker 1: I think I had like a Seth Rogan picture of Oh,

547
00:32:30,480 --> 00:32:33,920
Speaker 1: he's assumed to be handsome because he's got a B,

548
00:32:34,040 --> 00:32:37,800
Speaker 1: C and D. But in actuality he's fine. There's nothing

549
00:32:37,840 --> 00:32:39,880
Speaker 1: wrong with him, but there's nothing really great about him.

550
00:32:40,360 --> 00:32:43,160
Speaker 1: He to me, right, did he reminded me of Prince Harry?

551
00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:46,360
Speaker 1: I think he was described as having like thin red hair.

552
00:32:46,600 --> 00:32:49,200
Speaker 1: I could be wrong, but that's that's the image I

553
00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:51,360
Speaker 1: got my head. Oh, I guess I also pictured like

554
00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:54,160
Speaker 1: a a little bit of like a dad bod happening.

555
00:32:54,320 --> 00:32:57,240
Speaker 1: Nothing wrong with us, I'm just saying, like, that's what

556
00:32:57,360 --> 00:33:00,880
Speaker 1: I imagined as instead of like your Chris Evans or

557
00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:05,800
Speaker 1: Chris Helmsworth, which typically is the Prince traditional. Yeah, like

558
00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:09,280
Speaker 1: what Lauren and um our coworker and friend, Lauren, she

559
00:33:09,360 --> 00:33:14,320
Speaker 1: calls that um Disney Prince SPoD Yeah, yeah, so yeah.

560
00:33:14,360 --> 00:33:17,600
Speaker 1: If I hadn't known going in, Even though I do

561
00:33:17,840 --> 00:33:26,120
Speaker 1: feel the romance with Kaysa and Ash, it was very

562
00:33:26,600 --> 00:33:28,760
Speaker 1: clear when I knew that, I don't know if I

563
00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:31,840
Speaker 1: would have picked up on it otherwise. And I also

564
00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:34,720
Speaker 1: was thinking, like if Kis had been a guy, it

565
00:33:34,720 --> 00:33:37,360
Speaker 1: would have changed how I felt about certain scenes, because

566
00:33:37,400 --> 00:33:39,360
Speaker 1: there's one part where she shows up at her house

567
00:33:39,800 --> 00:33:42,720
Speaker 1: kind of unannounced when she's alone, and that would have

568
00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:46,520
Speaker 1: had a different vibe if it had been a dude,

569
00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:48,960
Speaker 1: at least for me. I don't think it necessarily has to,

570
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:51,360
Speaker 1: but right, I think there was also a part of

571
00:33:51,400 --> 00:33:56,000
Speaker 1: that that they make uh Kaisa a little bit masculine

572
00:33:56,040 --> 00:33:59,080
Speaker 1: in that she seems to be a player. Laura even

573
00:33:59,160 --> 00:34:02,400
Speaker 1: says how about you, which is one more of her lovers, right,

574
00:34:02,800 --> 00:34:06,160
Speaker 1: And I feel like that was purposeful, and I wondered

575
00:34:06,160 --> 00:34:08,480
Speaker 1: why that would be that other than to play on

576
00:34:08,600 --> 00:34:11,759
Speaker 1: the fact a maybe to talk about it that in

577
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:15,480
Speaker 1: that society, that was not an abnormal thing for same

578
00:34:15,560 --> 00:34:20,040
Speaker 1: sex couple and to happen they seemed accepted. But at

579
00:34:20,040 --> 00:34:23,359
Speaker 1: the same time, be that she got around and so

580
00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:25,839
Speaker 1: you may be let let supposed to put that little

581
00:34:25,880 --> 00:34:28,040
Speaker 1: bit of doubt of like whether you're special or not,

582
00:34:28,719 --> 00:34:30,719
Speaker 1: and so they need to make sure she understood how

583
00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:32,920
Speaker 1: special she was. But I was like, that's kind of like,

584
00:34:33,320 --> 00:34:36,640
Speaker 1: maybe that's an understatement to say it seems masculine esque

585
00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:40,080
Speaker 1: to put that in terms of someone who is very

586
00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:44,520
Speaker 1: powerful and or seen as powerful. Yeah, And I wonder

587
00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:48,279
Speaker 1: how much of that is um. This book came out

588
00:34:48,280 --> 00:34:51,680
Speaker 1: in two thousand nine, which a lot has changed since then.

589
00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:55,520
Speaker 1: And in just the way of being like Na, she

590
00:34:55,600 --> 00:34:59,880
Speaker 1: might be interested in you, like you because Astro was

591
00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:02,879
Speaker 1: kind of I don't maybe oblivious isn't the right word,

592
00:35:02,920 --> 00:35:05,480
Speaker 1: but she didn't seem to be picking up on a

593
00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:10,400
Speaker 1: lot of things right. Also, she was definitely that perfect

594
00:35:11,000 --> 00:35:13,960
Speaker 1: innocent girl who didn't know how amazing she was or

595
00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:16,640
Speaker 1: gorgeous she was. And I'm like, that is an absolute

596
00:35:16,680 --> 00:35:19,960
Speaker 1: trope in itself where she just doesn't know how beautiful

597
00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:23,160
Speaker 1: she is and she but she doesn't. She just needs

598
00:35:23,160 --> 00:35:26,359
Speaker 1: to wipe the ash off her face. We just need

599
00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:29,040
Speaker 1: to strain her air and take off the glasses. It

600
00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:31,600
Speaker 1: is funny, though you don't really or maybe I missed it,

601
00:35:31,640 --> 00:35:33,359
Speaker 1: but I feel like I didn't really get that vibe

602
00:35:33,400 --> 00:35:37,600
Speaker 1: until someone outright says it, when Clara tells her towards

603
00:35:37,640 --> 00:35:42,080
Speaker 1: the like maybe like middle for that, I wasn't really sure. Um,

604
00:35:42,800 --> 00:35:45,200
Speaker 1: Claria out right it's like, oh, you're so beautiful. It's

605
00:35:45,239 --> 00:35:48,760
Speaker 1: so much better than Anna. Yeah, I think that's exactly

606
00:35:48,760 --> 00:35:50,520
Speaker 1: where we were all trying to figure out, Like, and

607
00:35:51,040 --> 00:35:53,279
Speaker 1: that says a lot about myself. And it's although, like

608
00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:56,040
Speaker 1: how good looking is she? Could she get away with

609
00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:59,640
Speaker 1: this in real life? You know? And it could all

610
00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:01,400
Speaker 1: talk abou able is um? And the fact that she

611
00:36:01,560 --> 00:36:09,800
Speaker 1: is able to be perfectly quote unquote normal in that aspect. Yeah,

612
00:36:09,960 --> 00:36:14,280
Speaker 1: And and one of the scenes, the scene where Kaisas

613
00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:19,360
Speaker 1: says like, I don't like masks. The dress looks good

614
00:36:19,400 --> 00:36:22,400
Speaker 1: but doesn't suit you. A lot of people have interpreted

615
00:36:22,480 --> 00:36:26,919
Speaker 1: that as sort of a critiques not the right word,

616
00:36:27,320 --> 00:36:29,800
Speaker 1: but like pointing to l G B, t Q plus

617
00:36:30,160 --> 00:36:34,480
Speaker 1: people having to wear this mask to hide their true selves.

618
00:36:34,640 --> 00:36:38,879
Speaker 1: And so at the end when Kaisa, I'm assuming, kind

619
00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:41,960
Speaker 1: of dramatically shows up at the ball without a mask

620
00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:45,520
Speaker 1: and it's like you Kaysa were dancing together and they kiss,

621
00:36:45,719 --> 00:36:50,560
Speaker 1: it's sort of her finally taking it off and being herself.

622
00:36:52,320 --> 00:36:54,120
Speaker 1: I mean, she does seem to have the struggle of

623
00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:58,000
Speaker 1: like Shane is as clared, as declared as mel and

624
00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:02,160
Speaker 1: then Prince Sadan, like she has these ICs, her preferences

625
00:37:02,280 --> 00:37:09,080
Speaker 1: or her her sexuality leans towards Kaisa instead. Yes, that's

626
00:37:09,239 --> 00:37:12,759
Speaker 1: who she loves um And speaking of love, that is

627
00:37:12,800 --> 00:37:15,640
Speaker 1: another big trope in this whole thing. So there's the

628
00:37:15,680 --> 00:37:22,520
Speaker 1: trope of marrying rich and classism, which throughout Ash feels

629
00:37:22,520 --> 00:37:27,200
Speaker 1: like she is not worthy of Kaisa because she is

630
00:37:28,040 --> 00:37:31,799
Speaker 1: a servant um she So there is this layer of like,

631
00:37:31,960 --> 00:37:34,960
Speaker 1: I am not in your class, so we cannot be together.

632
00:37:35,520 --> 00:37:38,880
Speaker 1: And there there's a whole scene where Ash tells Clara,

633
00:37:39,320 --> 00:37:41,000
Speaker 1: you know, you don't have to marry for riches, you

634
00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:43,360
Speaker 1: can marry for love, and that's sort of the beginning

635
00:37:43,520 --> 00:37:47,560
Speaker 1: of their tentative truth. Even though Clara totally rejects her

636
00:37:47,600 --> 00:37:49,120
Speaker 1: when she says it the first time, because she's like,

637
00:37:49,120 --> 00:37:51,440
Speaker 1: you don't understand what it's like, Like there's so much

638
00:37:51,480 --> 00:37:55,120
Speaker 1: pressure to do this and if I don't, then how

639
00:37:55,120 --> 00:37:59,360
Speaker 1: will I live? Um? So there's that. And as we

640
00:37:59,440 --> 00:38:03,560
Speaker 1: talked about Ash having this pity around the pressure placed

641
00:38:03,560 --> 00:38:08,360
Speaker 1: on Anna by her mother to marry someone of high status, Um,

642
00:38:08,400 --> 00:38:11,520
Speaker 1: there's Gwynn who seemingly does not understand that Ash doesn't

643
00:38:11,560 --> 00:38:14,560
Speaker 1: want to be with someone, particularly a man, um that

644
00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:16,560
Speaker 1: it's not her whole thing, that it's not her end all,

645
00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:19,840
Speaker 1: be all right. I think Gwyn's character is definitely the

646
00:38:19,840 --> 00:38:25,480
Speaker 1: Gigglies schoolgirl. Sure, yeah, she's I I loved gwyn She's

647
00:38:25,520 --> 00:38:29,040
Speaker 1: like every time you see her, she has a different like, dude,

648
00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:32,000
Speaker 1: she's after I mean, that's exactly the point. I think

649
00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:34,239
Speaker 1: she was the comic relief in it all. I did

650
00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:36,040
Speaker 1: want to talk about the fact that I found it

651
00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:40,080
Speaker 1: interesting when she in comparison to the hunting outfit that

652
00:38:40,120 --> 00:38:43,280
Speaker 1: the Fairies gave her versus the dress that the Fairies

653
00:38:43,320 --> 00:38:46,160
Speaker 1: gave her, and her feeling, and also being the fact

654
00:38:46,160 --> 00:38:48,920
Speaker 1: that boots we're supposed to be her slippers, even though

655
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:51,040
Speaker 1: she never lost her slippers, but that it fits her

656
00:38:51,040 --> 00:38:54,480
Speaker 1: feet so perfectly, right, Um, and I found that she

657
00:38:54,680 --> 00:38:58,320
Speaker 1: was more comfortable, which could be a hit or miss

658
00:38:58,400 --> 00:39:01,120
Speaker 1: um in conversations when comes to the l GRE d

659
00:39:01,239 --> 00:39:06,080
Speaker 1: Q expectations um of dressing in general. But I found

660
00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:09,839
Speaker 1: that an interesting commentary. Yeah, because the Woods was such

661
00:39:09,880 --> 00:39:13,400
Speaker 1: a big part of who she was and what she loved. Um.

662
00:39:13,520 --> 00:39:15,960
Speaker 1: But Okay, we would be remiss if we did not

663
00:39:16,040 --> 00:39:18,520
Speaker 1: talk about what we said we would, which is where

664
00:39:18,560 --> 00:39:22,040
Speaker 1: Samantha and I had a very different interpretation, and it's

665
00:39:22,160 --> 00:39:25,880
Speaker 1: really telling of our personalities about what happened when she

666
00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:30,960
Speaker 1: agreed to spend the night with Sheen. Right, I think,

667
00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:33,040
Speaker 1: I think this is a good time for a nad

668
00:39:33,040 --> 00:39:35,239
Speaker 1: break and then we come back in because I think

669
00:39:35,280 --> 00:39:38,319
Speaker 1: it's it's a minute of a conversation, all right, So

670
00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:40,399
Speaker 1: we'll take one more quick break and then we'll be back.

671
00:39:54,280 --> 00:39:58,439
Speaker 1: We're back, Thank you, sponsor. All Right, So I'm gonna

672
00:39:58,440 --> 00:40:00,360
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go ahead and jump in because I found

673
00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:04,239
Speaker 1: it very interesting and very telling for both of us.

674
00:40:04,239 --> 00:40:06,680
Speaker 1: Because we also had our producer Andrew as a part

675
00:40:06,680 --> 00:40:10,720
Speaker 1: of this conversation. Towards the end before we started recording

676
00:40:10,760 --> 00:40:13,680
Speaker 1: this portion, that there's a conversation of the fact that

677
00:40:13,719 --> 00:40:16,000
Speaker 1: she has to prove to him what love is, what

678
00:40:16,280 --> 00:40:20,560
Speaker 1: love truly means, and that according to the Mother's book,

679
00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:23,440
Speaker 1: the way to break this deal, to break this curse,

680
00:40:23,840 --> 00:40:28,920
Speaker 1: I guess slash deal conversation is to show him Sean

681
00:40:29,239 --> 00:40:33,320
Speaker 1: what love truly is and love being sacrificing or giving

682
00:40:33,440 --> 00:40:37,800
Speaker 1: up that person if they don't love you, essentially, And

683
00:40:37,880 --> 00:40:42,200
Speaker 1: but that still promised a night, and we did talk

684
00:40:42,239 --> 00:40:44,359
Speaker 1: about the fact that the very world a night might

685
00:40:44,400 --> 00:40:48,360
Speaker 1: be longer than a night, but in essence, like he

686
00:40:48,520 --> 00:40:51,200
Speaker 1: grabs her hands and they talk about what this looks

687
00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:52,920
Speaker 1: like and if she's going to die a little bit,

688
00:40:53,040 --> 00:40:56,840
Speaker 1: all of these things. So for me as a very

689
00:40:56,960 --> 00:41:00,880
Speaker 1: uh almost say, it's very heteronormative or relationship. But at

690
00:41:00,920 --> 00:41:03,080
Speaker 1: the same time, you know, and I do enjoy. We

691
00:41:03,080 --> 00:41:05,320
Speaker 1: talked about sex and what we enjoy, what we don't enjoy.

692
00:41:05,560 --> 00:41:08,319
Speaker 1: But I'm like, yeah, obviously part of the giving of

693
00:41:08,400 --> 00:41:11,560
Speaker 1: the love was her giving up her virginity and having

694
00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:15,200
Speaker 1: sex with the dude um as to show yeah, this

695
00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:17,480
Speaker 1: is love, this is us together, this is giving to

696
00:41:17,560 --> 00:41:21,719
Speaker 1: each other whatever whatnot. And that was my explanation of

697
00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:27,640
Speaker 1: what he expected from love and Annie that never even

698
00:41:27,719 --> 00:41:34,000
Speaker 1: occurred to me, not once. I never thought they had sex.

699
00:41:34,600 --> 00:41:37,280
Speaker 1: I just thought they spent some weird time in fairy

700
00:41:37,280 --> 00:41:42,920
Speaker 1: world and I was shocked that I love so My

701
00:41:43,040 --> 00:41:45,560
Speaker 1: interpretation of her interpretation was, what this is like a

702
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:48,520
Speaker 1: nineteen fifties Leave It to Beaver type of episode where

703
00:41:48,560 --> 00:41:50,920
Speaker 1: they sleep in single beds next to each other and

704
00:41:50,960 --> 00:41:52,720
Speaker 1: just call each other mom and papa for a little

705
00:41:52,719 --> 00:41:57,240
Speaker 1: bit and move on in life and and a fairy tale.

706
00:41:58,239 --> 00:42:00,480
Speaker 1: You know that we should come back and talk about

707
00:42:00,480 --> 00:42:03,000
Speaker 1: this more in depth because I have been thinking about

708
00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:05,480
Speaker 1: this a lot. I had a really enlightening conversation with

709
00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:09,840
Speaker 1: my friend about essentially what is love? Um, and I

710
00:42:09,880 --> 00:42:16,200
Speaker 1: guess to me had a day was there before anybody,

711
00:42:16,239 --> 00:42:20,279
Speaker 1: But essentially I think, I guess I assumed to me

712
00:42:20,440 --> 00:42:25,080
Speaker 1: love is respect and consent, and so I assumed like

713
00:42:25,120 --> 00:42:29,640
Speaker 1: if he truly loved her and she doesn't want to

714
00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:32,839
Speaker 1: do that, then they didn't do it. And maybe that's

715
00:42:32,840 --> 00:42:37,719
Speaker 1: really naive and oblivious of me, but that was my thought,

716
00:42:37,840 --> 00:42:40,840
Speaker 1: like maybe she did, and I saw from her point

717
00:42:40,840 --> 00:42:43,520
Speaker 1: of view that this is the sacrifice she was willing

718
00:42:43,560 --> 00:42:46,400
Speaker 1: to go to be released from his contract. Which is

719
00:42:46,400 --> 00:42:50,240
Speaker 1: a very different tale in itself that you and I assume.

720
00:42:50,440 --> 00:42:52,839
Speaker 1: When she asked him, this is gonna am I gonna die?

721
00:42:53,320 --> 00:42:55,520
Speaker 1: And he said just a little, I assumed that was

722
00:42:55,600 --> 00:42:57,440
Speaker 1: part of like, because it is it's the morning of

723
00:42:57,480 --> 00:43:00,680
Speaker 1: a loss of something of yourself, which is a whole

724
00:43:00,719 --> 00:43:03,880
Speaker 1: deeper perception like and not everyone has those experiences, and

725
00:43:03,880 --> 00:43:05,920
Speaker 1: that takes it down to a really dark road. But

726
00:43:06,200 --> 00:43:09,880
Speaker 1: the level of sacrifice two thousand nine, Melinda Lowe, I

727
00:43:09,920 --> 00:43:12,399
Speaker 1: can't tell you what she was thinking, but in that

728
00:43:12,520 --> 00:43:15,000
Speaker 1: mind of set of what are you willing to go

729
00:43:15,040 --> 00:43:18,120
Speaker 1: ahead and get through it in order to sacrit to

730
00:43:18,160 --> 00:43:20,359
Speaker 1: get back to your own and what does that look like?

731
00:43:20,400 --> 00:43:25,239
Speaker 1: And we've had this conversation of many women somehow, I'm

732
00:43:25,239 --> 00:43:28,560
Speaker 1: taking it back to here who have always been to

733
00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:30,680
Speaker 1: that portion of it was easier just to get it

734
00:43:30,760 --> 00:43:34,200
Speaker 1: over with than to fight it. And that's kind of

735
00:43:34,239 --> 00:43:36,719
Speaker 1: the same culmination of what I saw her say it

736
00:43:36,800 --> 00:43:39,200
Speaker 1: might as well get this done with. I'll sacrifice this

737
00:43:39,320 --> 00:43:41,759
Speaker 1: bit of myself to get to the happiness that I

738
00:43:41,800 --> 00:43:47,480
Speaker 1: need to get to. Yeah, And I totally understand and

739
00:43:48,080 --> 00:43:52,319
Speaker 1: see that point, and probably that is what I don't

740
00:43:52,360 --> 00:43:54,080
Speaker 1: know if that's the truth. I mean, I like your

741
00:43:54,200 --> 00:43:56,960
Speaker 1: version better where they just hang out and watch some

742
00:43:57,200 --> 00:44:00,200
Speaker 1: Netflix and they eat some popcorn and then all of

743
00:44:00,280 --> 00:44:02,800
Speaker 1: the night and go to their separate bedrooms and the

744
00:44:02,920 --> 00:44:06,520
Speaker 1: story well. And I want to come back and talk

745
00:44:06,560 --> 00:44:09,080
Speaker 1: about this so badly because I feel like this is

746
00:44:09,120 --> 00:44:11,839
Speaker 1: something I've been struggling with. I know for a lot

747
00:44:11,880 --> 00:44:14,439
Speaker 1: of people, love is sex is a part of that,

748
00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:19,719
Speaker 1: but for someone like me, it's not, And so it's

749
00:44:19,760 --> 00:44:26,600
Speaker 1: caused a lot of anxiety and just like concern, um

750
00:44:26,719 --> 00:44:31,080
Speaker 1: and in my own relationships, uh, because it literally didn't

751
00:44:31,080 --> 00:44:35,359
Speaker 1: even occur to me. And I think that says a lot.

752
00:44:36,000 --> 00:44:39,879
Speaker 1: And I'm really sad that we didn't have that on record, men,

753
00:44:39,960 --> 00:44:42,720
Speaker 1: you recording this conversation that you and I had, because

754
00:44:42,760 --> 00:44:46,680
Speaker 1: it was such a big what what moment that it

755
00:44:46,880 --> 00:44:52,560
Speaker 1: was like, Yeah, it really was, And I'm thinking, Wow,

756
00:44:53,040 --> 00:44:58,719
Speaker 1: I think maybe I am just very not I'm just

757
00:44:58,800 --> 00:45:02,040
Speaker 1: very oblivious. I want to live in your world. I

758
00:45:02,080 --> 00:45:04,399
Speaker 1: don't know. I don't know. We should definitely come back

759
00:45:04,440 --> 00:45:07,000
Speaker 1: and talk about it though, because I have it has

760
00:45:07,080 --> 00:45:10,920
Speaker 1: been on my mind a lot lately, um, because I

761
00:45:10,960 --> 00:45:15,120
Speaker 1: had a friend she was talking about I don't want

762
00:45:15,120 --> 00:45:18,080
Speaker 1: to go into the whole conversation, but basically it boiled

763
00:45:18,080 --> 00:45:22,319
Speaker 1: down to I I couldn't believe that if someone wanted

764
00:45:22,360 --> 00:45:24,520
Speaker 1: to have sex with me that they thought I had

765
00:45:24,560 --> 00:45:28,239
Speaker 1: any other value, Like that is all they want, so

766
00:45:28,320 --> 00:45:30,680
Speaker 1: for me, like, I think there's some kind of disconnect

767
00:45:30,719 --> 00:45:34,680
Speaker 1: between sex and love and it's all messed up. Um So,

768
00:45:34,719 --> 00:45:36,960
Speaker 1: I think that could be said for everyone else. But

769
00:45:37,120 --> 00:45:40,640
Speaker 1: the level of trauma and or just level of preference

770
00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:44,480
Speaker 1: in itself can make it very disjointed in the conversation

771
00:45:44,480 --> 00:45:48,200
Speaker 1: in itself, for sure. Um So that is a conversation

772
00:45:48,520 --> 00:45:53,319
Speaker 1: we shall return to. Yes, Uh, And I think like

773
00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:57,800
Speaker 1: we both agreed. Uh. Overall, the book was really good,

774
00:45:57,800 --> 00:45:59,560
Speaker 1: but I know a listener wrote in and said, it's

775
00:45:59,600 --> 00:46:01,960
Speaker 1: kind of anti climactic. It does feel like it's like

776
00:46:02,160 --> 00:46:04,359
Speaker 1: the it leads up to it and then it just ends,

777
00:46:04,520 --> 00:46:06,560
Speaker 1: which I know fairy tales are like that, Like that's

778
00:46:06,600 --> 00:46:08,400
Speaker 1: the whole thing is it's happily ever after and you

779
00:46:08,520 --> 00:46:12,280
Speaker 1: just assume how their life plays out. But yeah, overall,

780
00:46:12,320 --> 00:46:14,200
Speaker 1: I enjoyed it. And I'm not really big into romance,

781
00:46:14,239 --> 00:46:21,160
Speaker 1: but I was like, yeah, I get together please, yeah again,

782
00:46:21,280 --> 00:46:24,319
Speaker 1: just like we were talking about the previous listeners said

783
00:46:24,360 --> 00:46:26,279
Speaker 1: it was a really easy read, and it was. It

784
00:46:26,360 --> 00:46:28,640
Speaker 1: was a really easy read. It's like maybe a two

785
00:46:28,680 --> 00:46:33,319
Speaker 1: hour read. Nice little moment of huh, yeah, what would

786
00:46:33,320 --> 00:46:37,960
Speaker 1: happen if fairies exist? Yeah? I really enjoyed it. So

787
00:46:38,400 --> 00:46:42,959
Speaker 1: those are thoughts on Ash by Melinda Low And now

788
00:46:43,040 --> 00:46:46,600
Speaker 1: we need your thoughts on what our next book should

789
00:46:46,640 --> 00:46:49,960
Speaker 1: be so we can get to reading. Um, please please

790
00:46:49,960 --> 00:46:55,720
Speaker 1: please send in your suggestions, any movie suggestions to for

791
00:46:55,800 --> 00:47:00,000
Speaker 1: our next feminist movie Friday, and any streaming and entertainment

792
00:47:00,040 --> 00:47:04,279
Speaker 1: recommendations which um, I actually locked into Netflix for the

793
00:47:04,320 --> 00:47:07,880
Speaker 1: first time and several I don't know how long really,

794
00:47:08,120 --> 00:47:11,400
Speaker 1: and I was shocked at auto play. I do not approve.

795
00:47:11,760 --> 00:47:14,359
Speaker 1: I hear you can turn it off. You can, but

796
00:47:14,440 --> 00:47:19,200
Speaker 1: it's not my accountant, so I'll check with the owner

797
00:47:19,239 --> 00:47:22,120
Speaker 1: of the account about that. Well, all of Supernatural is

798
00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:24,239
Speaker 1: on there, Annie, so if you want to stop from

799
00:47:24,280 --> 00:47:28,200
Speaker 1: season one all the way through, it's all the way there. Um,

800
00:47:28,360 --> 00:47:30,120
Speaker 1: don't tell me about the final season because I haven't

801
00:47:30,160 --> 00:47:33,920
Speaker 1: seen it. Well, the newest episode came out this Monday,

802
00:47:34,360 --> 00:47:35,920
Speaker 1: and they said they don't know when they're going to

803
00:47:36,000 --> 00:47:40,280
Speaker 1: come back, so yeah, you might have to wait at all. Time.

804
00:47:40,600 --> 00:47:43,880
Speaker 1: Oh no, well, maybe they'll add it to Netflix. But yeah,

805
00:47:43,960 --> 00:47:47,480
Speaker 1: so tell us just the streaming recommendations because I've watched

806
00:47:47,480 --> 00:47:52,880
Speaker 1: the same four shows repeatedly because I'm still in the

807
00:47:52,920 --> 00:47:55,759
Speaker 1: realms of leading the social work world, so I don't

808
00:47:55,760 --> 00:47:59,000
Speaker 1: like anything too realistic or too traumatic. Don't give me those,

809
00:47:59,600 --> 00:48:03,400
Speaker 1: uh what we need because suggestions, y'all. Obviously, I've already

810
00:48:03,400 --> 00:48:05,920
Speaker 1: talked about doing a Netflix party when we get to

811
00:48:05,920 --> 00:48:07,800
Speaker 1: watch a couple of things. Maybe we could do it

812
00:48:07,840 --> 00:48:09,560
Speaker 1: as a whole was spenty because we don't know. I

813
00:48:09,560 --> 00:48:11,680
Speaker 1: don't know if too many people would be interested, but

814
00:48:11,719 --> 00:48:13,960
Speaker 1: if you all are interested, maybe we could have one

815
00:48:14,080 --> 00:48:17,879
Speaker 1: giant Netflix party Oh yeah, with our spenty listeners where

816
00:48:17,920 --> 00:48:20,480
Speaker 1: we get to just chat. Because I know you'll are

817
00:48:20,480 --> 00:48:23,560
Speaker 1: looking for content, something different, and please let us know

818
00:48:23,640 --> 00:48:28,120
Speaker 1: what you want because we are just as confused and

819
00:48:28,160 --> 00:48:31,799
Speaker 1: well definitely, um do you round up of suggestions people

820
00:48:31,800 --> 00:48:33,759
Speaker 1: send in and we'll add our own suggestions in case

821
00:48:33,800 --> 00:48:39,120
Speaker 1: you are looking for some streaming recommendations are other entertainment recommendations.

822
00:48:39,200 --> 00:48:42,480
Speaker 1: So if you would like to email us those recommendations,

823
00:48:42,520 --> 00:48:45,279
Speaker 1: you can. Our email is stuff Media Mom Stuff at

824
00:48:45,280 --> 00:48:47,960
Speaker 1: iHeart media dot com. You can also find us on

825
00:48:48,040 --> 00:48:50,480
Speaker 1: Instagram as Stuff I've Never Told You or on Twitter

826
00:48:50,520 --> 00:48:53,800
Speaker 1: at mom Stuff Podcast. Thanks as always to our super

827
00:48:53,840 --> 00:48:59,080
Speaker 1: producer Andrew Howard, than thanks to you for listening. Stuff

828
00:48:59,120 --> 00:49:01,040
Speaker 1: I've Never Told You is production of I Heart Radio.

829
00:49:01,080 --> 00:49:03,200
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from I Heart Radio, check out the

830
00:49:03,200 --> 00:49:05,560
Speaker 1: I heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen

831
00:49:05,600 --> 00:49:06,480
Speaker 1: to your favorite shows.