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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, Radio News.

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Speaker 2: Hello and welcome to The Money Stuff Podcast, your weekly

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Speaker 2: podcast where we talk about stuff related to money. I'm

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Speaker 2: Matt Levin and I are at the Money Stuff column

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Speaker 2: for Bloomberg Opinion.

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Speaker 1: And I'm Katie Greifeld, a reporter for Bloomberg News and

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Speaker 1: an anchor for Bloomberg Television.

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Speaker 2: Katy, we traveled into the future. Yes, five minutes ago.

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Speaker 2: We're recording a money Stuff episode for I'm going to

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Speaker 2: say September.

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Speaker 1: Thirteenth, possible Friday the thirteenth, the thirteenth.

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Speaker 3: And now.

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Speaker 2: Still before Friday the thirteenth, we're recording an episode for

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Speaker 2: I'm going to guess Friday the twentieth.

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Speaker 1: You're so right, Yeah, yeah, seven days to thirteen, you

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Speaker 1: get twenty all.

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Speaker 2: Right, So here we are.

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Speaker 1: We asked for questions.

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Speaker 2: From eight days ago.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, we asked you for questions, and boy did you

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Speaker 1: deliver our inbox flooded.

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Speaker 2: We haven't delivered yet.

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Speaker 1: Well, no, we haven't delivered.

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Speaker 3: But you did.

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Speaker 1: Singing mail Bag, mail Bag. It's our first real mail bag.

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Speaker 2: Episode, first all mail bag episode.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so let's dive right in. A writer who asked

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Speaker 1: to stay anonymous asks why are private markets the new

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Speaker 1: public markets? And is it bad that private markets are

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Speaker 1: the new public markets. It's a topic we explore frequently,

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Speaker 1: and I guess we should talk about whether or not

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Speaker 1: it's like a good development.

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Speaker 2: I feel like my like Poddot answer on this is,

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Speaker 2: like why are the new public markets? Because there's so

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Speaker 2: much money in private markets to that, like, if you

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Speaker 2: wanted to raise a lot of money, you went to

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Speaker 2: the public markets because like the best way to reach

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Speaker 2: people was to like advertise broadly. But now like there

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Speaker 2: are a lot of rich people. Financial markets are very

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Speaker 2: globalized so that you can call the rich people in

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Speaker 2: Saudi Arabia instead of having to like get the rich

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Speaker 2: people in America. And technology is such that it's like

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Speaker 2: pretty easy to care emphasis all the people with a

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Speaker 2: lot of money, and so it is much less necessary

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Speaker 2: to go out to public markets to raise a lot

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Speaker 2: of money because like it is relatively straightforward to access

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Speaker 2: giant pools of money in the private markets. And other

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Speaker 2: than the money, like private markets are a lot easier, Right,

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Speaker 2: It's like you don't have the same disclosure rules, you

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Speaker 2: don't have the same like governance rules, you don't have

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Speaker 2: the same getting sued by shareholders. It's a lot easier

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Speaker 2: to stay private in many ways. And if you can

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Speaker 2: access as much money as like you know, open Ai

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Speaker 2: or SpaceX can access in the private markets, then they

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Speaker 2: sort of become the default place. And then our questioner

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Speaker 2: also asks, is it bad that private markets in the

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Speaker 2: new public markets? I mean, the standard story is that

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Speaker 2: the point of public markets is in part to like

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Speaker 2: allocate capital of the best uses or whatever, but it's

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Speaker 2: also in part, like, there are a lot of people

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Speaker 2: who have like retirement savings, and you'd like them to

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Speaker 2: have adequate retirement savings. True, and like you know, this

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Speaker 2: block market is a way to invest in like the

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Speaker 2: growth of the economy. Right, you can stakes in big companies,

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Speaker 2: and as the economy grows, the value of your stakes

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Speaker 2: grows and you end up more than keeping pace with

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Speaker 2: inflation and have a lot of money to retire on.

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Speaker 2: And if all of the cool, fast growing, innovative small

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Speaker 2: companies that will become large are in the private markets

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Speaker 2: and the public markets are just for kind of older,

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Speaker 2: more stable companies that are no longer growing dynamically, then

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Speaker 2: that's worse for retirements for ordinary people, because only essentially

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Speaker 2: rich people and like institutions can access the fast growing companies,

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Speaker 2: and people say this, you know, Jake Clayton, when you

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Speaker 2: around the SEC was fun of saying things like this.

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Speaker 2: People sometimes then make the further leap of like, therefore

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Speaker 2: we should let retail investors have more access to private investments.

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Speaker 1: But like, perhaps they're an ETF from Apollo.

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Speaker 2: Sure a nice callback to eight days.

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Speaker 1: Ago too, roughly minutes.

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Speaker 2: Ago time as a flat circle.

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Speaker 1: It's a concept, the concept, but.

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Speaker 2: The problem is that like if you give retail investors

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Speaker 2: access to private like there's no such thing as private

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Speaker 2: markets or like a public market. It's like you can

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Speaker 2: buy all the stocks on the public market because they

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Speaker 2: just trade publicly. The private market there's no market, right,

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Speaker 2: It's just like you can invest in SpaceX if Elon

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Speaker 2: Musk likes you, you can invest in open Ai if

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Speaker 2: open Ai calls you. If they don't call you, you

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Speaker 2: can invest in a different private company. But like if

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Speaker 2: you're just like a random person, the private company opportunities

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Speaker 2: that you get are not as good as the ones

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Speaker 2: that you know, Warren Buffet gets or whatever. And so

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Speaker 2: the problem of like ordinary retail investors not having access

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Speaker 2: to like the best private market investments is not sold

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Speaker 2: by giving them access to the worst private market investments.

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Speaker 1: Right, it's made worse. Well, the follow up question that

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Speaker 1: someone DM me about is can companies just stay private forever?

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Speaker 1: I mean the answer in a lot of cases is yes.

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Speaker 1: But I mean do you think about open ai, what

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Speaker 1: it has? One hundred and fifty billion dollar valuations? Spacexi,

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Speaker 1: forget what they're at. But if you're in that position,

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Speaker 1: is there any pressure to go public?

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Speaker 2: I mean, companies stay private forever? Right? I mean, yeah,

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Speaker 2: Coke Industries has been private for decades or whatever. Everyone

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Speaker 2: in this room is gesturing at the room or to

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Speaker 2: suggest another private company that exists. Yeah, you know, like

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Speaker 2: the big names are like open Ai, SpaceX, and Stripe. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: like these big, like Silicon Valley venture funded tech companies.

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Speaker 2: There is an expectation among your venture capital investors and

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Speaker 2: among your employees that they'll be able to cash out

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Speaker 2: their stock, right, Like they bought stock or they got

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Speaker 2: paid in stock, and they want to cash out. And

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Speaker 2: the ordinary way to cash out is you do an

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Speaker 2: IPO and then they can sell their stock. Those companies

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Speaker 2: have found a way to avoid that, which is they

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Speaker 2: do tender offers. They raise money from new investors and

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Speaker 2: they use it to buy back the old investors. It's

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Speaker 2: not as good, it's not as nice for the investors.

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Speaker 2: It's more complicated. It's more work and like more managerial

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Speaker 2: attention possibly than just letting stock trade on the open market,

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Speaker 2: but you avoid magorial attention to other things like disclosure.

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Speaker 2: I don't know. I mean, my vet is like these

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Speaker 2: companies probably could they have it forever. I think they

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Speaker 2: have some pressure to make it easier to sell. But

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Speaker 2: you know, like if you're an open AI employee and

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Speaker 2: you want to sell your ten million dollars of stock

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Speaker 2: and the company says, we're not going to go public,

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Speaker 2: but we'll do a tender, and like it'll be a

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Speaker 2: little bit of administratively annoying, but you'll probably get your

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Speaker 2: ten million dollars. That's fine because you like you you

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Speaker 2: got so much money from like working at this hot startup.

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Speaker 2: Right if in ten years they're not growing fast, you know,

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Speaker 2: it's like more administratively annoying to not go public. But yeah,

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Speaker 2: you get a lot of runway if you are a

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Speaker 2: hot startup and there's so much money in the private

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Speaker 2: markets to let you cash out early. Investors.

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Speaker 1: Well, we've gotten through one question. Great, so let's move

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Speaker 1: swiftly along here. Jeff writes, howdy, you've spent a lot

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Speaker 1: of time talking about regulatory finds. For example, the SEC

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Speaker 1: collected almost four hundred million dollars in twenty twenty three

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Speaker 1: as a result of off channel business communications. My question

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Speaker 1: is where does that money go. The off channel communications

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Speaker 1: example isn't necessarily harming anyone in particular, so I don't

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Speaker 1: imagine it gets paid out as restitution to victims.

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Speaker 2: Right off channel communication that means like people texting about

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Speaker 2: work on their cell phones, which as SCC's big inforce

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Speaker 2: and parity. I write a lot about the SEC being

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Speaker 2: like a machine for generating fines, right and like the

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Speaker 2: cell phone stuff is such a good way to generate

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Speaker 2: fines because every single bank has employees who have texted

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Speaker 2: about work, and so you can find all of the

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Speaker 2: bank's you know, nine figure sums the answer to the question.

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Speaker 2: So the SEC is funded by fees that it charges

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Speaker 2: for registration of securities. The SEC has a budget, then

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Speaker 2: goes to Congress for its budget, but then the government

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Speaker 2: doesn't pay for it like the securities industry pays for it,

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Speaker 2: like companies registering securities pay for it, so the sec

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Speaker 2: is like free to the government sort of. And it

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Speaker 2: last year had like a budget of like two billion

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Speaker 2: dollars like employees and stuff, and it collected about five

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Speaker 2: billion dollars in fines. She's like pretty good return on capital.

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Speaker 2: Most of that I think is like what is referred

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Speaker 2: to as discorg min which means like you made money

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Speaker 2: illicitly and you have to give it back. Some of

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Speaker 2: that is going to be discord to victims, right, Like

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Speaker 2: a lot of that is like you stole money and

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Speaker 2: you have to give the money back that you stole.

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Speaker 2: But there is like a lot of money left over

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Speaker 2: for the sec A lot of that goes I think

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Speaker 2: they paid out like nine hundred million dollars through victims,

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Speaker 2: and they paid at six hundred million dollars the whistleblowers. Nice,

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Speaker 2: they pay a commission.

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Speaker 1: Not a bad business all these.

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Speaker 2: Fines, right, Like you know, six hundred million divided by

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Speaker 2: five billion is like you know, they pay like like

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Speaker 2: twelve percent fees to the whistleblowers who bring them the fines,

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Speaker 2: and then the rest just goes to the treasury, just

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Speaker 2: goes back to the U. S. Government. It's a revenue

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Speaker 2: source for the US government. I don't know that the

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Speaker 2: SEC thinks of itself that way. I think they must

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Speaker 2: think of themselves you have a higher yeah, protecting investors

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Speaker 2: and like upholding the rule of law, whatever. But I

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Speaker 2: like to think of them as doing a certain amount

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Speaker 2: of like you know, revenue maximization, and they're good of it.

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Speaker 3: Good for them.

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Speaker 1: We have a question for me, so I'm.

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Speaker 2: Going to read this question, okay. Paul asks Katie what

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Speaker 2: is the value of writing a big story as Katy

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Speaker 2: did last week?

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Speaker 1: Last week, which is actually weeks ago.

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Speaker 2: Katie wrote a big story about single stock single stock

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Speaker 2: she got so many questions about, and a big story

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Speaker 2: at least one that is widely circulated and cited in

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Speaker 2: financial media. It was cited by such luminaries as the

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Speaker 2: Money Stuff Newsletter, True and.

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Speaker 1: Cliffs really just the two institutions care about the most.

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Speaker 2: Anyway, what was the How did you feel about that? Well?

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Speaker 1: First off, I am glad that we got so many

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Speaker 1: questions about average details. Yes, because we end up talking

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Speaker 1: about ETFs A loted on this podcast, and I feel

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Speaker 1: like that is a lot of my influence. So I'm

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Speaker 1: glad that people are somewhat interested, right, It.

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Speaker 2: Would be a shame if everyone's like, like one note

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Speaker 2: is less ets.

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Speaker 1: Yes, please stop talking. I think it's pretty human. It's

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Speaker 1: fun to see the hit count on an article that

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Speaker 1: is widely circulated. It's also nice when people talk about

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Speaker 1: the thing that you wrote about, because usually when I

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Speaker 1: pitch an article on a topic that I find cool

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Speaker 1: and then people read it a lot and talk about

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Speaker 1: it a lot and tweet about it and also think

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Speaker 1: it's cool, that is gratifying. And also just when you

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Speaker 1: write an article that has an impact, it tends to

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Speaker 1: open up communication to people that you would like to

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Speaker 1: talk about, who you would think are interesting, so you

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Speaker 1: get more inbound from interesting people.

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Speaker 2: So I always find it like super gratifying when I

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Speaker 2: am right about a thing where I'm like, this is

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Speaker 2: ridiculous in our care and of interest only to me,

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Speaker 2: and then like that gets me the best feedback and

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Speaker 2: be like, oh I love this. Right, it's really satisfying

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Speaker 2: that I got like there are people like me out there,

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Speaker 2: you know, Yeah, it.

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Speaker 1: Is really nice. And also I mean I can see

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Speaker 1: my hits, so like it's instant gratification for something that

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Speaker 1: you know if you write that story. I mean, it

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Speaker 1: didn't take me too long, but I probably worked on

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Speaker 1: it for like a week and a half and then

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Speaker 1: just got the instant gratification always feels good. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: you don't mean you read spikes on the terminal every

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Speaker 1: single day that you publish. I read spiking is when

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Speaker 1: you get a certain amount of spikes and a certain

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Speaker 1: amount of time. And Matt always reads spikes, so we

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Speaker 1: have a rea. I have read spike alerts, So, Justin writes,

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Speaker 1: both Icon and Acman have been living rent free in

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Speaker 1: my mind lately thanks to Matt's columns, And it made

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Speaker 1: me think about how it would be funny if Acman

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Speaker 1: took an activist position on i EP. Given the history

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Speaker 1: of public feuds between the two and the recent precipitous

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Speaker 1: fall of that stocks price, could this actually play out?

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Speaker 1: That would be amazing. I go back and I watched

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Speaker 1: that CNBC cliff.

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Speaker 2: It's like the most famous piece of financial television ever.

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Speaker 1: Probably watch it once a month. It's just so good

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Speaker 1: just to remind myself, like, what who is on?

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Speaker 2: Is it? Akman was on and I kind of called the.

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Speaker 1: Inner Vice versas I think Akman was on an Icon

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Speaker 1: called it and they just let it run.

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Speaker 2: I definitely said that I want to be friends with

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Speaker 2: with you, Bill, I wouldn't And I wait, you say

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Speaker 2: you'd like to be friends so that we could invest together,

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Speaker 2: cal I have no interest.

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Speaker 3: Do you think I want to invest with you?

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Speaker 2: Okay, let's fees. Would you let me move on?

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Speaker 3: Earth, Let's move on.

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Speaker 2: This is like ten years This is like more than

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Speaker 2: ten years ago.

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Speaker 1: I know, but I watched it to remind myself. What

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Speaker 1: like peak financial television looks like.

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Speaker 2: The greatest fight financial television ever. It's so good. I

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Speaker 2: don't think they've like.

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Speaker 1: Any they have like, yeah, they've appeared on stage together.

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Speaker 2: They're friends, but let's for the purposes podcast together would

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Speaker 2: not be so good. Can we just give up our seats.

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Speaker 1: To be icon show? Yeah, we'll just leave them alone

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Speaker 1: in this box of a room.

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Speaker 2: That would be so good.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: But failing that, iep is I kind of Enterprises, which

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Speaker 2: is Carla CON's probably traded company, which has had a

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Speaker 2: precipitous fall because a short cellar accused it of being

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Speaker 2: a Ponzi's game, and it like lost a lot of

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Speaker 2: its bibe. The answer is no, Acman can't really do

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Speaker 2: much activism in IEP just because Carla Kon owns eighty

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Speaker 2: five percent of it, and so that's not much activism do.

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Speaker 2: Now he had margined a lot of that stock and

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Speaker 2: had his bank seased and sold his stock, then there

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Speaker 2: might be something there, but that would be a bigger

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Speaker 2: problem for him than that just Bill Ackman being in

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Speaker 2: the stock. But the real answer is question is no,

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Speaker 2: Acman can't do that, but the reverse is possible. True,

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Speaker 2: And in fact, Elliott built an activist steak in Bill

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Speaker 2: Ackman's European public vehicle in like twenty seventeen, which like

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Speaker 2: he has talked about, Like I think.

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Speaker 1: He revealed it on a podcast this podcast with Carl

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Speaker 1: not this podcast. I think it was Lux Friedman.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And so like it's a little unclear exactly what

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Speaker 2: happened because it's just like his version of the story

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Speaker 2: and like they didn't actually do any activism because I

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Speaker 2: think basically they were building a stake and like, yeah,

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Speaker 2: Akan was able to head them off, but I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I was looking idly through the filing for Pershing Square USA,

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Speaker 2: and it sort of looked like there were in that

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Speaker 2: many anti activist protections. So if he does end up

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Speaker 2: taking that thing public. God Will wants the bar against

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Speaker 2: his iep' stot to try something. It'd be fun.

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Speaker 1: I mean, my fantasy lineup is psh IPOs trades it

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Speaker 1: a discount. Boas Wysteine does activism.

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Speaker 2: Right, But I think and Black are they're friends their friends.

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Speaker 1: I know, Well that's the thing, like, is Boas morally obligated.

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Speaker 2: To do close unfund activism wherever the opportunity for Maybe

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Speaker 2: maybe he is.

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Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying.

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Speaker 2: I have a podcast with them.

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Speaker 1: Yes, yes, Jeff. I wonder if he said the same, Jeff.

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Speaker 1: Jeff asks, So, whether I'm in the long or short

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Speaker 1: micro strategy leverage gtfs, I'm guaranteed to lose money over

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Speaker 1: the long term. Is it possible to borrow these shares

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Speaker 1: to short them? And isn't this a guaranteed money maker?

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Speaker 2: No, you're not guaranteed to lose money.

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Speaker 1: You tell him, Jeff, what do you It happens.

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Speaker 2: To be the case that this micro strategy ETF that

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Speaker 2: Katie wrote about low of these two weeks ago, it's

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Speaker 2: like a triple levered ETF. That micro strategy was up

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Speaker 2: a lot over the year, and the ETF was down

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Speaker 2: a lot. Because the way the math works is that

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Speaker 2: if you leverage a vital stock enough, then even though

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Speaker 2: the stock goes up, your triple levered stock can go down.

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Speaker 2: But that just you know, was kind of bad luck.

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Speaker 2: And in fact, lots of other triple leverty ETFs, including

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Speaker 2: the in video one, like go up when the stock

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Speaker 2: goes up, like normally goes up, and the stock goes up,

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Speaker 2: and it has to be things have to go pretty

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Speaker 2: wrong for it to go down when the stock goes up.

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Speaker 2: But then we also got a question from then, if

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Speaker 2: a leverage single stock fund produces worse long term returns

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Speaker 2: than the volatile underlying stock, then would you get better

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Speaker 2: returns than the underlying stock if the fund gave you

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Speaker 2: less than one hundred percent of the stock's daily returns

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Speaker 2: e g. A fund that gives you fifty percent of

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Speaker 2: the daily return of micro Strategy. I think the answer

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Speaker 2: is yes.

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Speaker 1: That's really interesting.

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Speaker 2: I think if you you can create that yourself, right,

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Speaker 2: you create that by like taking one hundred dollars and

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Speaker 2: putting fifty dollars of it into micro Strategy stock and

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Speaker 2: just keeping the other fifty dollars in cash, and then

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Speaker 2: you have half as much volatile as micro strategy, and

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Speaker 2: then the key is you keep it fifty to fifty.

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Speaker 2: You rebalance each day. So if micro strategy goes down,

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Speaker 2: so you have like forty five dollars of micro strategy,

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Speaker 2: then you rebalance. You put two to fifty into micro strategy,

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Speaker 2: so now you have forty seven to fifty of cash

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Speaker 2: forty seven to fifty of micro strategy. Micro strategy goes up,

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Speaker 2: on the other end, you sell micro strategy and keep

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Speaker 2: some cash. So each day you always start fifty to fifty.

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Speaker 2: And what that strategy is is just buying low and

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Speaker 2: selling high. Right, It's you're sort of assuming that micro

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Speaker 2: strategy will be like more volatile than directional, like it'll

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Speaker 2: bounce around a lot without going anywhere. And if that's true,

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Speaker 2: then each time it goes down, you'll buy. Each time

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Speaker 2: it goes up, you'll sell, and you'll make money over

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Speaker 2: the long term. That happens to work sometimes, but it's

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Speaker 2: just a guess on what the stock will look like.

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Speaker 2: If the stock is very volatile that doesn't go anywhere,

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Speaker 2: that'll make money. But if the stock goes up a lot,

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Speaker 2: you'll be sad that you did that instead of.

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Speaker 1: Just buying the stock, Well, might as well launch it.

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Speaker 2: You don't even need to have you just need to

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Speaker 2: I mean fine.

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Speaker 1: This week, you mean this week last week? What are

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Speaker 1: your favorite types of stock malfeasance? Is that how I

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Speaker 1: see malfeasance? To cover? Short cellar witch hunts, no shorts.

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Speaker 1: That was one sentence, short cellar witch hunts, gnarly bankruptcies,

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Speaker 1: insurance fraud, question mark which one?

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Speaker 2: Well, I always love clever ones, right, I love the

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Speaker 2: Spotify or you're talking.

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Speaker 1: Nah, that's about you mean the one that we covered

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Speaker 1: last week last week?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, the Spotify one from last week last I love

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Speaker 2: clever ones. I love things that like use leverage. So like,

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Speaker 2: there's some really good insurance frauds where like the thing

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Speaker 2: to notice about insurance is like, this is true of

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Speaker 2: a bank too, and it's maybe more intuitive with the bank.

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Speaker 2: A bank is like a pot of a billion dollars

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Speaker 2: with like one hundred million dollars of equity, right, like

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Speaker 2: a bank. You can buy control of a bank by

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Speaker 2: buying its stock, and the stock is just a tiny

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Speaker 2: fraction of the value of money in the bank. Right.

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Speaker 2: The bank is mostly leverage, and so if you buy

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Speaker 2: a bank stock, you control all that money in the

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Speaker 2: bank and then you can give it to yourself. And

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Speaker 2: of course, of course, of course banking and regulation, I

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Speaker 2: mean banking and insurance, there's regulation to stop you from

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Speaker 2: doing that extremely obvious straight but people find ways, mostly

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Speaker 2: an insurance sometimes in banking too, but like insurance, you

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Speaker 2: buy this little insurance company. It has this big pot

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Speaker 2: of premiums that it's written and like money that it controls,

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Speaker 2: and then you give that money to yourself. Yeah, and

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Speaker 2: it's great, It's very clever. The other thing I really

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Speaker 2: like to write about is Evan writing about it a

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Speaker 2: lot recently. It is fake takeover offers, because you think

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Speaker 2: it's like the stereotype of fake takeover offers, which is

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Speaker 2: that it's like you buy a stock, you put out

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Speaker 2: a fake press relief saying that you're buying the company,

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Speaker 2: the stock goes up, you sell the stock, you make money.

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Speaker 2: And in fact, there are a lot of cases like that.

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Speaker 2: In almost every case they don't make money because they

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Speaker 2: are bad at it, and they like don't sell in time,

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Speaker 2: and so they lose money. It doesn't matter. That's like

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Speaker 2: regular front But there are a lot of cases of

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Speaker 2: like fake or quasi fake takeovers where they're not trying

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Speaker 2: to do that where they just want to go on television. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: just want to be a big shot, you know, they

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Speaker 2: want to like have a little merger negotiation.

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Speaker 1: So which I say, just start an AI company, you'll

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Speaker 1: get on TV.

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Speaker 2: I know. But I'm so sympathetic to as like an

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Speaker 2: m and a guy. Like it's like, I understand it's

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Speaker 2: fun to negotiate a merger and like, if you don't

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Speaker 2: have the money to buy a big company, just pretend

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Speaker 2: you have the money to buy the company.

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Speaker 1: Who are we talking about?

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Speaker 2: Lots?

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Speaker 1: I know, but recently in the past three months, who

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Speaker 1: did that.

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Speaker 2: Here's the guy who tried to buy a Virgin Orbit. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: and he went on television a lot.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and he was bad on TV.

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Speaker 2: Many of them are it was stressful.

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Speaker 1: Well, they don't have media training because they're not legit.

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Speaker 1: They don't anyway, they're so excited to be there. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I get it, I got it. It is amazing before

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Speaker 1: you know, closely paying attention to money stuff. I wouldn't

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Speaker 1: have thought that there would be plural that many plural.

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Speaker 2: I have to say. It's the thing I noticed more recently.

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Speaker 2: The other thing about it is like it's a continuum

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Speaker 2: with real takeover offers, because very few people offered to

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Speaker 2: buy a company saying I've got a pot of cash

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Speaker 2: right here sufficient to buy the company. They're like, if

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Speaker 2: you engage with me and we negotiate a deal, I

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Speaker 2: will get financing, Like someone will lend me the money

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Speaker 2: about the company, or I'll be able to sell them.

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Speaker 2: I'll be able to raise this money. But like I

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Speaker 2: don't have it now. I have to talk to you

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Speaker 2: about the merger first. Yeah, and like that can be

439
00:21:07,480 --> 00:21:09,560
Speaker 2: very legitimate, and like that's how Elon must bought Twitter, right,

440
00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:11,359
Speaker 2: I mean, it's like a real thing. It's how most

441
00:21:12,080 --> 00:21:13,879
Speaker 2: big dollar em and a gets done. It's like you

442
00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:16,320
Speaker 2: started without having all the money lined up, but like

443
00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:18,399
Speaker 2: there's a continuum down to the guy with like literally

444
00:21:18,560 --> 00:21:21,400
Speaker 2: one dollar in his bank account calling up Version Orbit

445
00:21:21,440 --> 00:21:23,640
Speaker 2: and I could probably get the money he couldn't write.

446
00:21:23,680 --> 00:21:25,440
Speaker 2: But it's like it's all on to continue.

447
00:21:26,040 --> 00:21:26,960
Speaker 1: God bless.

448
00:21:38,000 --> 00:21:40,520
Speaker 2: All Right, what's up now?

449
00:21:40,560 --> 00:21:44,280
Speaker 1: It's a question for me. Okay, your questions are very intense.

450
00:21:44,600 --> 00:21:46,040
Speaker 1: This is a good question for me, though I have

451
00:21:46,160 --> 00:21:46,760
Speaker 1: a real answer.

452
00:21:47,200 --> 00:21:50,840
Speaker 2: Thomas also asks Katie, what's your pitch for the next

453
00:21:50,920 --> 00:21:54,560
Speaker 2: great cat based business financial fundamentals need not apply.

454
00:21:55,680 --> 00:21:57,040
Speaker 1: So I have a real answer for this, and I'm

455
00:21:57,040 --> 00:21:58,879
Speaker 1: going to steal it from my husband. But we've been

456
00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:00,080
Speaker 1: talking about this for a while.

457
00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:03,800
Speaker 2: And discusses.

458
00:22:04,840 --> 00:22:08,160
Speaker 1: Yes, let me tell you. So you know cat trees, Matt, Yeah,

459
00:22:08,200 --> 00:22:10,680
Speaker 1: I know cates. Have you ever had a cat? No?

460
00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:11,320
Speaker 3: Oh?

461
00:22:11,560 --> 00:22:13,720
Speaker 1: Well, okay, so I've.

462
00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:15,919
Speaker 2: Had a dog who was really interested in cats.

463
00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:19,280
Speaker 1: Okay, so that doesn't count. But cat trees, if you

464
00:22:19,320 --> 00:22:20,680
Speaker 1: have a cat, you have to get a cat trick.

465
00:22:21,160 --> 00:22:21,280
Speaker 2: You know.

466
00:22:21,359 --> 00:22:24,560
Speaker 1: They're usually beige. They usually have some scratchy posts and

467
00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:27,160
Speaker 1: little platforms that the cat can hop up on because

468
00:22:27,200 --> 00:22:30,600
Speaker 1: cats like to go hi. We end up buying a

469
00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:33,760
Speaker 1: cat tree every couple of years because they get gnarly

470
00:22:34,000 --> 00:22:35,520
Speaker 1: or just like your cat is bored of them.

471
00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:37,520
Speaker 2: Okay when I say that, I know about cat tries.

472
00:22:37,840 --> 00:22:40,920
Speaker 2: When I lived in Brooklyn, yeah, every so often a

473
00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:43,280
Speaker 2: cat owner would buy a new cat tree, and yes,

474
00:22:43,480 --> 00:22:46,000
Speaker 2: throughout the old cat tree on the street, and my

475
00:22:46,320 --> 00:22:49,920
Speaker 2: obsessed dog it would sniff it and sit by it

476
00:22:50,359 --> 00:22:52,520
Speaker 2: and lurk hoping there is a cat inside.

477
00:22:52,680 --> 00:22:53,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, I get that.

478
00:22:53,960 --> 00:22:54,879
Speaker 2: I'm aware of the discarding.

479
00:22:55,080 --> 00:22:59,000
Speaker 1: They're probably really stinky of cats. Yes, yeah, because the

480
00:22:59,080 --> 00:23:01,359
Speaker 1: cat spent so much on their cattery, but you have

481
00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:03,160
Speaker 1: to switch them out every few years because they get

482
00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:07,280
Speaker 1: grody and your cat gets bored. Modular cat trees okay,

483
00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:09,880
Speaker 1: so that you can mix and match, and it's also good.

484
00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:12,840
Speaker 1: I saw a TikTok recently. I should stop revealing how

485
00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:14,879
Speaker 1: much time it's been on TikTok, but I get a

486
00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:17,840
Speaker 1: lot of like cat behavioral videos, like a lot of

487
00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:18,840
Speaker 1: Jackson Galaxy.

488
00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:21,320
Speaker 2: I'm nodding, not knowledgeably.

489
00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:24,080
Speaker 1: A lot of Jackson Galaxy and stuff. And someone made

490
00:23:24,119 --> 00:23:26,920
Speaker 1: the point that you should make every day a little

491
00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:29,359
Speaker 1: bit different for your cat, because your cat stays in

492
00:23:29,480 --> 00:23:34,440
Speaker 1: your apartment and you want them to be fun and stimulated.

493
00:23:35,000 --> 00:23:36,639
Speaker 1: And I think it would be nice if you had

494
00:23:36,720 --> 00:23:39,000
Speaker 1: modular cat trees that you could switch up easily so

495
00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:43,040
Speaker 1: that your cat encounters something new more often than every

496
00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:43,760
Speaker 1: couple of years.

497
00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:45,480
Speaker 3: Thank you.

498
00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:51,520
Speaker 1: We have so many great ideas that we just never

499
00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:52,800
Speaker 1: execute a lot of great ideas.

500
00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:54,720
Speaker 2: I was a little worried that you've disclosed it on

501
00:23:54,760 --> 00:23:58,000
Speaker 2: them now. Fortunately this podcast will air eight days after,

502
00:23:58,760 --> 00:24:01,120
Speaker 2: so you have eight days to really act.

503
00:24:02,359 --> 00:24:10,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, to work l w ass. How can you

504
00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:14,200
Speaker 1: both be a broker and a dealer, as in SEC

505
00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:18,160
Speaker 1: registered broker slash dealers. Isn't being both at the same

506
00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:21,600
Speaker 1: time a problem? A straightforward conflict. I e. Some trades

507
00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:25,400
Speaker 1: you broker and some trades you take a principal position.

508
00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:27,520
Speaker 2: This question, it's so on my wavelimp, How can you

509
00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:29,240
Speaker 2: be both a broker and dealer?

510
00:24:29,440 --> 00:24:32,240
Speaker 1: Are you l W did you write in No?

511
00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:34,440
Speaker 2: I just like it's just a good you know, like

512
00:24:34,560 --> 00:24:36,720
Speaker 2: it's a it's a good phrase, like an SEC broker dealer.

513
00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:39,480
Speaker 2: Everyone's a broker dealer, but like right, those are differently something.

514
00:24:40,080 --> 00:24:42,880
Speaker 2: A broker is someone who like matches up a transaction,

515
00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:46,200
Speaker 2: so like you want to buy someone else wants to sell.

516
00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:48,680
Speaker 2: I sit in the middle. I take a commission. I

517
00:24:48,960 --> 00:24:49,879
Speaker 2: sell from them to you.

518
00:24:50,119 --> 00:24:50,239
Speaker 1: Right.

519
00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:53,800
Speaker 2: A dealer is someone who like trades directly with the customer.

520
00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:55,080
Speaker 2: So you want to buy, I'm like, I'll sell it

521
00:24:55,119 --> 00:24:59,280
Speaker 2: to you, right. And many businesses in the world are

522
00:24:59,359 --> 00:25:01,439
Speaker 2: dealer business right. Like if you want to buy a car,

523
00:25:01,560 --> 00:25:03,080
Speaker 2: you go to a car dealer and they'll sell you

524
00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:06,320
Speaker 2: a car that they own. And many businesses are broker businesses.

525
00:25:06,359 --> 00:25:06,439
Speaker 3: Right.

526
00:25:06,480 --> 00:25:07,879
Speaker 2: They want to buy a house, you go to a

527
00:25:08,200 --> 00:25:10,879
Speaker 2: real estate agent, and they find you a house and

528
00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:12,720
Speaker 2: take a commission, but they don't own the house. You know,

529
00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:16,600
Speaker 2: in a lot of financial markets, there is a broker

530
00:25:16,680 --> 00:25:19,920
Speaker 2: dealer model where like you want to buy a security

531
00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:24,040
Speaker 2: and you go to your bank, it's the generic term,

532
00:25:24,520 --> 00:25:26,920
Speaker 2: and they will either be your broker or they'll be

533
00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:29,080
Speaker 2: your dealer. They'll either like find it for you or

534
00:25:29,119 --> 00:25:31,520
Speaker 2: they'll deal directly off their balance sit with you. And

535
00:25:31,680 --> 00:25:33,320
Speaker 2: is that a conflict? I mean, like, yeah, of course

536
00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:34,879
Speaker 2: it's a conflict, but it's also it's like it's just

537
00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:37,680
Speaker 2: good service, right, Like it's like the reason that exists

538
00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:40,160
Speaker 2: is because there is someone you can call and you say,

539
00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:42,200
Speaker 2: I want to buy this bond, and if they have

540
00:25:42,280 --> 00:25:43,359
Speaker 2: the bomb, they'll sell it to you. And if they

541
00:25:43,400 --> 00:25:44,879
Speaker 2: don't have the bomb, they'll find it for you, right,

542
00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:49,600
Speaker 2: And they have some amount of you know, regulatory and

543
00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:52,280
Speaker 2: also just like sort of custom expectation that they will

544
00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:55,680
Speaker 2: do the best thing they can for you. You see

545
00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:58,280
Speaker 2: this in like retail stock trading, where like your retail

546
00:25:58,320 --> 00:26:01,359
Speaker 2: broker who is only a broker, and we'll just route

547
00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:05,080
Speaker 2: it to like a big market maker. Your retail broker

548
00:26:05,119 --> 00:26:06,760
Speaker 2: will write your order to a big market maker and

549
00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:08,680
Speaker 2: the big market maker will either fill it out of

550
00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:10,920
Speaker 2: inventory at a better price than you could get on

551
00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:12,800
Speaker 2: the stock exchange, or they will send it to the

552
00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:15,800
Speaker 2: stock exchange and they'll do whatever they think is best,

553
00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:17,840
Speaker 2: and they have like an obligation the best execution, and

554
00:26:17,920 --> 00:26:20,520
Speaker 2: I you know, they're getting measured by their broker to

555
00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:22,680
Speaker 2: like make sure they're giving you the best price. So

556
00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:24,840
Speaker 2: you know, in general, it's a good service, right, And

557
00:26:24,880 --> 00:26:26,959
Speaker 2: I often think of like, like I've written a lot

558
00:26:26,960 --> 00:26:29,080
Speaker 2: about private credit, and like one thing in private credit

559
00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:31,639
Speaker 2: is like if you're a company looking for financing or

560
00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:34,080
Speaker 2: like a private equity sponsor looking to do an LBA,

561
00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:36,280
Speaker 2: and you go to a bank and you say, I

562
00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:38,360
Speaker 2: want to borrow money for this LBO, Like the bank

563
00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:41,840
Speaker 2: will be like, okay, we can probably find you that money.

564
00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:43,720
Speaker 2: We got to go find investors and get you that money.

565
00:26:43,920 --> 00:26:46,520
Speaker 2: If you go to a private credit fund, I'll just

566
00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:48,719
Speaker 2: be like, yeah, we have money, Like you take the money, right,

567
00:26:49,119 --> 00:26:51,240
Speaker 2: And that's in some ways a better service. And I've

568
00:26:51,280 --> 00:26:54,320
Speaker 2: written about how like banks, because they're getting into private credit,

569
00:26:54,359 --> 00:26:56,719
Speaker 2: because they can like broker private credit treds banks, they

570
00:26:57,000 --> 00:26:59,680
Speaker 2: should be able to offer you either we'll give you

571
00:26:59,720 --> 00:27:02,560
Speaker 2: the fundinancing, or we'll send to get to the financing, right.

572
00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:04,480
Speaker 2: And I think there's like some of that in real banking,

573
00:27:04,920 --> 00:27:06,840
Speaker 2: And like that's a broken deal a model, right, that's

574
00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:09,520
Speaker 2: like for some price, we can just give you the money,

575
00:27:09,560 --> 00:27:11,639
Speaker 2: we can just face you on the trade, and for

576
00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:13,600
Speaker 2: some other price, we can find someone else to face

577
00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:15,360
Speaker 2: you on the trade, and we'll do both because we're

578
00:27:15,440 --> 00:27:18,280
Speaker 2: like working for you however we can. It obviously raises

579
00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:20,720
Speaker 2: the possibility of conflicts, because like what you could do

580
00:27:20,880 --> 00:27:23,520
Speaker 2: is the opposite, right, what you could do is if

581
00:27:23,560 --> 00:27:25,280
Speaker 2: it's the best deal for you, you take it, and

582
00:27:25,359 --> 00:27:26,880
Speaker 2: if it's not the best deal for you, you send

583
00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:29,080
Speaker 2: it to someone else. But you know, that's why it's

584
00:27:29,119 --> 00:27:29,960
Speaker 2: a regulated business.

585
00:27:30,359 --> 00:27:33,120
Speaker 1: It's a good thing you wrote yourself that question, because

586
00:27:33,119 --> 00:27:34,359
Speaker 1: that was an interesting answer there.

587
00:27:38,600 --> 00:27:39,199
Speaker 3: This is a long one.

588
00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:42,040
Speaker 1: Anonymous asks why does there need to be an actual

589
00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:44,760
Speaker 1: stock to borrow when shorting seems like there would have

590
00:27:45,280 --> 00:27:48,440
Speaker 1: been a more direct derivative contract that mimics the risk

591
00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:51,560
Speaker 1: slash rewards slash cash flow structure of a short but

592
00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:53,800
Speaker 1: without having to worry about the actual shares of stock

593
00:27:53,840 --> 00:27:56,600
Speaker 1: floating around to various parties. Is that the key that

594
00:27:56,800 --> 00:27:59,280
Speaker 1: three slash four parties each brings something unique to the

595
00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:02,360
Speaker 1: deal in releaship into the short cellar and derivatives contracts

596
00:28:02,359 --> 00:28:05,680
Speaker 1: aren't typically coordinated between multiple parties. If this does in

597
00:28:05,800 --> 00:28:08,840
Speaker 1: fact exist, please don't make me look stupid on air.

598
00:28:09,200 --> 00:28:12,399
Speaker 2: Okay, Okay, So there's two points here. Yeah, one is

599
00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:15,680
Speaker 2: like what is a derivative? So, like, are there derivative

600
00:28:15,680 --> 00:28:19,200
Speaker 2: contracts to short stocks? Yeah, Like there's puts and there's

601
00:28:19,280 --> 00:28:21,199
Speaker 2: totally turn swaps, like you can if you're a big

602
00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:22,720
Speaker 2: hedge on you want to short of stock, you can

603
00:28:22,760 --> 00:28:24,680
Speaker 2: easily go to a bank and say I want to

604
00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:28,000
Speaker 2: get short the stock on swap. So the derivative absolutely exists.

605
00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:31,840
Speaker 2: But that doesn't matter because like a derivative is like

606
00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:33,159
Speaker 2: you go to a bank to say I want to

607
00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:35,359
Speaker 2: get short the stock on swap. The bank says, fine,

608
00:28:35,359 --> 00:28:37,680
Speaker 2: we'll charge you for it, and we will go hedge

609
00:28:37,720 --> 00:28:40,360
Speaker 2: that derivative by shortening the stock ourselves. So you still

610
00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:42,960
Speaker 2: need the shares of stock to borrow because you can't

611
00:28:43,080 --> 00:28:45,400
Speaker 2: like manufacture the short out of nothing. The bank is

612
00:28:45,480 --> 00:28:47,760
Speaker 2: not going to just make that bet against you, like

613
00:28:47,880 --> 00:28:49,520
Speaker 2: on its own account. It's going to hedge that bet

614
00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:51,520
Speaker 2: and the way it hedges it by shorting. Now it

615
00:28:51,520 --> 00:28:53,480
Speaker 2: doesn't have to hedge by shorting. It can hedge by

616
00:28:53,520 --> 00:28:55,680
Speaker 2: finding someone on the long side of the swap. Right, So, like,

617
00:28:55,720 --> 00:28:57,720
Speaker 2: if you want to get short on swap, the bank

618
00:28:57,760 --> 00:28:59,360
Speaker 2: can find someone wants to get long on swap and

619
00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:02,320
Speaker 2: they can match you up and then no stock needs

620
00:29:02,360 --> 00:29:05,280
Speaker 2: to be borrowed. But why would someone want to get

621
00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:08,480
Speaker 2: long on swap rather than by buying the stock themselves.

622
00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:11,360
Speaker 2: The answer is, I mean they wouldn't, right, because like

623
00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:13,360
Speaker 2: then they're taking credit risk and it's like weird, and

624
00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:15,480
Speaker 2: it's like harder to get out of. It's just more inconvenient.

625
00:29:15,840 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 2: The reason they do it is like if they get

626
00:29:17,760 --> 00:29:20,320
Speaker 2: long on swap, they could get paid more than by

627
00:29:20,360 --> 00:29:24,440
Speaker 2: owning the stock themselves. But that ultimately sort of leads

628
00:29:24,480 --> 00:29:26,880
Speaker 2: you back to the stock borrowing market. Right, If like

629
00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:30,080
Speaker 2: a stock is difficult to borrow, then it's going to

630
00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:33,600
Speaker 2: be just as pricey and difficult to get short on swap.

631
00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:35,960
Speaker 2: So you get short via derivative as it would be

632
00:29:36,200 --> 00:29:38,200
Speaker 2: to get short in the cash market, because like everyone

633
00:29:38,280 --> 00:29:41,240
Speaker 2: involved knows that, And like if you get short on

634
00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:43,080
Speaker 2: swap with the bank, either the bank has to short

635
00:29:43,120 --> 00:29:44,640
Speaker 2: the stock, which is expensive for the bank, so I

636
00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:46,400
Speaker 2: won't do it, or the bank has to find someone

637
00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:48,520
Speaker 2: to get long on swap, and the person getting long

638
00:29:48,560 --> 00:29:51,960
Speaker 2: on swap knows that the stock is expensive to borrow

639
00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:53,800
Speaker 2: and they could make a lot of money by owning

640
00:29:53,840 --> 00:29:56,720
Speaker 2: it in cash and lending it out in the stock

641
00:29:56,760 --> 00:29:59,880
Speaker 2: borrow market. So it doesn't work. The derivative contract doesn't work.

642
00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:02,720
Speaker 2: They kind of were expected, like doesn't solve the problem.

643
00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:05,239
Speaker 2: Which the problem is there are some stocks that are

644
00:30:05,280 --> 00:30:09,200
Speaker 2: hard to borrow, and therefore you can't short them. You

645
00:30:09,320 --> 00:30:11,719
Speaker 2: can't for the most part, practically get around that by

646
00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:14,160
Speaker 2: using derivatives. You know, you can do options, you can

647
00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:16,600
Speaker 2: like sell put options on the stock, or byput options

648
00:30:16,640 --> 00:30:18,560
Speaker 2: on the stock, but again the pricing is going to

649
00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:20,880
Speaker 2: be affected by the borrow market. The second part of

650
00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:22,360
Speaker 2: the question is like why do we have that as

651
00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:24,680
Speaker 2: a rule, and why not just allowed naked short selling?

652
00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:25,120
Speaker 3: Yeah? Why not?

653
00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:28,080
Speaker 2: And like, yeah, I've kind of written that, like tentatively,

654
00:30:28,360 --> 00:30:31,880
Speaker 2: people get really mad, get really mad. People really don't

655
00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:33,760
Speaker 2: like naked short selling. They think it's like a way

656
00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:37,120
Speaker 2: to manipulate stocks. There's probably some limit where it could

657
00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:39,080
Speaker 2: be a way to manipulate stocks, right, where like if

658
00:30:39,080 --> 00:30:42,120
Speaker 2: you could just manufacture an infinite amount of stock and

659
00:30:42,600 --> 00:30:45,040
Speaker 2: sell it, you could probably drive the price of the

660
00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:48,000
Speaker 2: stock down and like maybe do some damage. I don't

661
00:30:48,040 --> 00:30:50,080
Speaker 2: think that's as big a concern as people who get

662
00:30:50,120 --> 00:30:52,360
Speaker 2: mad about naked short selling think it is, but it's

663
00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:54,520
Speaker 2: like a real concern. It's like funny, I probably can't

664
00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:56,800
Speaker 2: have like unlimited naked short selling. You also have like

665
00:30:56,840 --> 00:30:59,640
Speaker 2: weird voting effects with naked short selling, yeah, because like

666
00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:02,960
Speaker 2: you manufacture an unlimited number of shares and the people

667
00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:04,920
Speaker 2: who buy the shares don't know if they own actual

668
00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:06,560
Speaker 2: shares and they can vote, or if they own fake

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00:31:06,600 --> 00:31:08,640
Speaker 2: shares and they can't vote. So it's a little weird.

670
00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:11,280
Speaker 2: But I don't know. I've always been sort of fond

671
00:31:11,320 --> 00:31:13,000
Speaker 2: of the idea that there has to be some way

672
00:31:13,040 --> 00:31:15,720
Speaker 2: to allow naked short selling to because it would make

673
00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:17,600
Speaker 2: markets more efficient. It would just like allow you to

674
00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:21,320
Speaker 2: bet against over priced stocks. And you see that there

675
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:24,120
Speaker 2: are certain stocks where they're hard to borrow, and I

676
00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:26,480
Speaker 2: won't name any names, there's stocks that are hard to

677
00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:29,560
Speaker 2: borrow and that trade at very very inflated prices where

678
00:31:29,600 --> 00:31:31,880
Speaker 2: people would probably like to bet against them and be correct,

679
00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:34,080
Speaker 2: but they can't do it because it's so expensive to

680
00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:37,160
Speaker 2: borrow them, and if you use short stock without borrowing it,

681
00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:41,000
Speaker 2: those prices would be more efficient. And I mean mostly

682
00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:43,720
Speaker 2: Trump media, but also also there's a few others.

683
00:31:47,360 --> 00:31:51,800
Speaker 1: Sent Hill from Chicago. He writes, since you both acknowledge

684
00:31:51,840 --> 00:31:55,040
Speaker 1: being needy, no shame in that, and wanted more questions

685
00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:57,360
Speaker 1: about yourselves. How do you talk to your children and

686
00:31:57,560 --> 00:31:59,960
Speaker 1: or nibblings at all about money stuff?

687
00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:04,400
Speaker 2: How do you I don't talk to my children a

688
00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:06,840
Speaker 2: ton about money stuff. Now they have listened to the

689
00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:11,600
Speaker 2: podcast in the car and I found it very amusing. Yeah,

690
00:32:12,040 --> 00:32:15,280
Speaker 2: my sons are like, listen to I heard you talk

691
00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:17,720
Speaker 2: to me and said, why'd she call you Matt Because

692
00:32:17,800 --> 00:32:18,760
Speaker 2: to them, I'm not mad.

693
00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:21,560
Speaker 1: I guess you're either dad or mister Levine.

694
00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:24,520
Speaker 2: Yes, I'm my children. Yeah, but like it is just

695
00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:26,280
Speaker 2: a kick for them to just hear my voice in

696
00:32:26,360 --> 00:32:30,160
Speaker 2: a format that normally plays. You know, Olivia Rodrigo. I

697
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:32,160
Speaker 2: don't talk about the newsletter that much, but I do

698
00:32:32,320 --> 00:32:35,520
Speaker 2: remember that I was once with my daughter and we

699
00:32:35,840 --> 00:32:38,360
Speaker 2: met like another dad who is like a money stuff

700
00:32:38,360 --> 00:32:40,880
Speaker 2: reader and was like I found on the newsletter and

701
00:32:41,360 --> 00:32:44,640
Speaker 2: my daughter didn't like fully understand the economic model. After

702
00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:47,400
Speaker 2: he left, she was like, does he give you money

703
00:32:47,560 --> 00:32:49,360
Speaker 2: for writing such a good newsletter?

704
00:32:49,720 --> 00:32:54,440
Speaker 1: And I was like, ah, that sense indirectly he does, sweetie,

705
00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:55,440
Speaker 1: that's really cute.

706
00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:58,200
Speaker 2: Every so often I will try to like explain a

707
00:32:58,560 --> 00:33:02,120
Speaker 2: financial news her mouth. He's in story at the dinner table,

708
00:33:02,240 --> 00:33:04,520
Speaker 2: but like they're a little young for that. Yeah, yeah,

709
00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:06,520
Speaker 2: you talk to your siblings.

710
00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:10,320
Speaker 1: So my family are money stuff fans. They've been Matt

711
00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:11,080
Speaker 1: Levine fans.

712
00:33:12,680 --> 00:33:14,000
Speaker 2: How do you talk to your parents.

713
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:18,360
Speaker 1: More directly? How do you talk to your dad? No,

714
00:33:18,520 --> 00:33:21,160
Speaker 1: but my brothers are as well. My mom likes you,

715
00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:26,480
Speaker 1: but she she isn't particularly interested in the newsletter. But

716
00:33:26,840 --> 00:33:28,800
Speaker 1: my parents do listen to the podcast quite a bit.

717
00:33:29,240 --> 00:33:31,040
Speaker 1: I feel like my brothers listen on the side. But

718
00:33:31,600 --> 00:33:33,640
Speaker 1: I said this in one of the trailers, like having

719
00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:36,360
Speaker 1: this podcast is great proof that we actually are friends.

720
00:33:36,760 --> 00:33:40,000
Speaker 1: Because before we launched it, and like you would come

721
00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:42,720
Speaker 1: up in our conversations, like when we were gathered as

722
00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:44,200
Speaker 1: a family, I'd be like, oh, yeah, like I know

723
00:33:44,320 --> 00:33:47,040
Speaker 1: Matt Levien, like we're friends, and they'd be like, yeah, okay,

724
00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:49,720
Speaker 1: I talk to your dad on your phone once I know,

725
00:33:50,360 --> 00:33:53,040
Speaker 1: I know, but still I feel like my one brother

726
00:33:53,120 --> 00:33:57,000
Speaker 1: in particular was skeptical. And then I actually I brought

727
00:33:57,000 --> 00:33:58,680
Speaker 1: you to a Capital one cafe.

728
00:33:58,640 --> 00:34:00,920
Speaker 2: And he was Capital Cafe in the Bloomberg Building.

729
00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:03,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, and he was there, and I think he truly

730
00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:07,080
Speaker 1: wash like super yeah. No, he thought it was like

731
00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:10,200
Speaker 1: an elaborate long con that we were actually friends.

732
00:34:10,760 --> 00:34:13,359
Speaker 2: So this podcast is a continuation of the long con.

733
00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:16,880
Speaker 1: It is great, great proof to stick it to him

734
00:34:17,000 --> 00:34:20,400
Speaker 1: that I have friends and some of them are Matt Levine.

735
00:34:21,040 --> 00:34:22,440
Speaker 2: As many as one of them, yeah.

736
00:34:23,200 --> 00:34:25,640
Speaker 1: As many as one. My parents do listen to Money

737
00:34:25,680 --> 00:34:28,719
Speaker 1: stuffal and I do get comments, like on episodes that

738
00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:31,480
Speaker 1: we recorded weeks ago, and then like my dad has

739
00:34:31,600 --> 00:34:34,200
Speaker 1: like another point that he wants to tell me about

740
00:34:34,239 --> 00:34:41,880
Speaker 1: and I'm like, I cannot remember. Oh my gosh, that

741
00:34:41,920 --> 00:34:42,560
Speaker 1: would be great.

742
00:34:43,680 --> 00:34:47,040
Speaker 2: All right. That was the Money Stuff mail Bag, mail Bag,

743
00:34:47,640 --> 00:34:50,560
Speaker 2: thank you so much for these questions, which good. We

744
00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:54,640
Speaker 2: appreciate from the bottom of our hearts. Sending us questions.

745
00:34:54,960 --> 00:34:57,120
Speaker 1: It was hard to h whittle it down, so we

746
00:34:57,160 --> 00:34:59,680
Speaker 1: didn't get to everyone, of course, but keep sending us

747
00:34:59,760 --> 00:35:01,239
Speaker 1: question We'll do it again.

748
00:35:01,480 --> 00:35:02,040
Speaker 3: This is great.

749
00:35:02,600 --> 00:35:07,960
Speaker 2: Thank you. And that was the Money Stuff Podcast.

750
00:35:08,160 --> 00:35:10,040
Speaker 1: I'm Matt Levian and I'm Katie Greifeld.

751
00:35:10,520 --> 00:35:12,560
Speaker 2: You can find my work by subscribing to The money

752
00:35:12,600 --> 00:35:14,480
Speaker 2: Stuff newsletter on Bloomberg.

753
00:35:14,040 --> 00:35:16,479
Speaker 1: Dot com, and you can find me on Bloomberg TV

754
00:35:16,680 --> 00:35:20,320
Speaker 1: every day on Open Interest between nine to eleven am Eastern.

755
00:35:20,640 --> 00:35:22,319
Speaker 2: We'd love to hear from you. You can send an

756
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:25,520
Speaker 2: email to Moneypod at Bloomberg dot net, ask us a

757
00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:27,000
Speaker 2: question and we might answer it on air.

758
00:35:27,440 --> 00:35:29,560
Speaker 1: You can also subscribe to our show wherever you're listening

759
00:35:29,680 --> 00:35:31,680
Speaker 1: right now and leave us a review. It helps more

760
00:35:31,719 --> 00:35:32,560
Speaker 1: people find the show.

761
00:35:33,360 --> 00:35:36,120
Speaker 2: The Money Stuff Podcast is produced by Anna Maserakus and

762
00:35:36,239 --> 00:35:37,000
Speaker 2: Moses Onen.

763
00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:39,160
Speaker 1: Our theme music was composed by Blake.

764
00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:41,960
Speaker 2: Maples, Brandon, Francis Nuinimits our executive.

765
00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:44,239
Speaker 1: Producer, and Stage Bauman is Bloomberg's head of Podcasts.

766
00:35:44,680 --> 00:35:46,960
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to The Money Stuff Podcast. We'll be

767
00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:48,480
Speaker 2: back next week with more stuff