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Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, Welcome to episode number forty six of The

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Speaker 1: Hunting Collective. I'm Ben O'Brien and I'm joined today by

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Speaker 1: Donnie Vincent. Donnie Vincent is a biologist, slash filmmaker, slash

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Speaker 1: world adventurer who creates some pretty awesome films. Has a

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Speaker 1: new film out called The Other Side, which is an

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Speaker 1: hour and twenty minute long feature film about his bear

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Speaker 1: hunting adventures up north. It's a great conversation. Donnie is

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Speaker 1: is sneakily smart dude, and and has been around the

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Speaker 1: world and done some amazing things and collected some pretty

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Speaker 1: awesome perspectives in doing so. So it was a pleasure

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Speaker 1: to be joined by him in Las Vegas, durning shot

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Speaker 1: show hang Out to talk shop to learn a little

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Speaker 1: bit about his story and his perspectives. So enjoy episode

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Speaker 1: number forty six. Donnie Vincent, Hey, Donny, Hey man, what's

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Speaker 1: going on? Man? Just enjoying your awesome hotel room? Are

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Speaker 1: you impressed by it? The Mediator? The Mediator budget is

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Speaker 1: apparently doing well. It's doing well. I just noticed there's

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Speaker 1: a phone in your toilet, So there's no phone in

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Speaker 1: in my toilet. Yeah, so this is well listen. You

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Speaker 1: never know what's gonna happen in there. Yeah. Yeah, your

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Speaker 1: legs could fall asleep. I was in there and I thought,

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Speaker 1: what would you need a phone in the toilet? And

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Speaker 1: then I thought, hey, you know maybe falling you can't

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Speaker 1: get up? Yeah, because you've ever been on there, you're

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Speaker 1: you're doing your business and your leg might fall asleep.

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Speaker 1: You got a call for help if you compartment syndrome, Yeah, yep,

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Speaker 1: he's falling around you don't know, or you got order

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Speaker 1: a pizza. Things you could do, and then I bet

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Speaker 1: it's been done. I'll bet you a large sum of

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Speaker 1: money a pizza has been ordered on this. So you think, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean, if you if you're if you've never been

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Speaker 1: in like the Venetian sweets, like we're in right now, um,

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Speaker 1: and you come in when you feel pretty you're like,

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Speaker 1: it's going pretty pretty well. It's nice. You're you've done

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Speaker 1: something different, right, you're making feature length film which which

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Speaker 1: um with the rivers, divide with your new film on

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Speaker 1: the other side, like these these are this is a

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Speaker 1: different way to do it, right, yes, and we um

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Speaker 1: you know, and I can sit here and say this

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Speaker 1: in this chair and and nobody's the wiser other than

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Speaker 1: my crew. But you know, we film everything with absolute truth. Right,

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Speaker 1: If I miss we show it. If I wounded animal,

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Speaker 1: we show what. I went through several years and I

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Speaker 1: didn't talk about it on camera at all because I

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Speaker 1: didn't understand it at first. But I went through several

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Speaker 1: years of target panic, and I went through years and

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Speaker 1: years and years of being an archer, and I'll absolutely

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Speaker 1: i'd I'd sit with a group of guys and they'd say, hey,

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Speaker 1: if you haven't, you know, if you haven't missed an animal,

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Speaker 1: you know you haven't, you haven't hunted enough. And I'd say, oh, yeah, absolutely.

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Speaker 1: But it's funny because my first several years of being

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Speaker 1: an archer, I never missed. I never not just absolutely

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Speaker 1: slam dunk shot animal. It went a very short distance

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Speaker 1: and fell over dead. It never happened to me because

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Speaker 1: I was taking close shots. I was taking very measured

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Speaker 1: shots because I was unsure of myself as an archer.

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Speaker 1: So I've come to full draw and I'd literally find

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Speaker 1: my anchor point, which I didn't even know what that was.

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Speaker 1: I'd look at the deer, I'd put my pin behind

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Speaker 1: his shoulder or whatever it was. I was shooting bear

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Speaker 1: or whatever. I put my pin behind his shoulder and

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Speaker 1: then I remember when I was younger several times, and

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Speaker 1: obviously this isn't being filmed, but I would literally back

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Speaker 1: my face off of my bow and just look like, okay,

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Speaker 1: release my arrows, knocked on the rest strings on the camp,

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Speaker 1: everything okay, and I leaned and shoot the deer and

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Speaker 1: it'd run off and died. So I'd sit with these

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Speaker 1: guys and they'd say, oh, yeah, I mean, if you

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Speaker 1: haven't wounded, you haven't hunted enough. If you haven't missed

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Speaker 1: a deer, you haven't hunted enough, you know. And I'd

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Speaker 1: agree with them, oh yeah, yeah, But really I was

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Speaker 1: the guy in the room that hadn't done that yet yet.

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Speaker 1: Then it happened to me once, and then it happened

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Speaker 1: to me twice. Then it happened to me three times.

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Speaker 1: And then I was shooting in an archery league and

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Speaker 1: my partner got target panic, and I'll never forget he

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Speaker 1: asked me one time, Um, we were just shooting at

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Speaker 1: twenty yards and he said, hey, um, when you're bringing

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Speaker 1: your pin up to the bull's eye and it's blow

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Speaker 1: the bull's eye, what do you do you know, I'm thinking,

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Speaker 1: you raise it up to the bull's eye and then

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Speaker 1: shoot the bull's eye and he's like, yeah, I can't

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Speaker 1: do that. My boat gets really heavy, and I thought,

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Speaker 1: is this a joke? And then fast forward I got it.

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Speaker 1: And then of course I'm trying to establish this career,

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Speaker 1: not not to be famous, not to sign hats, not

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Speaker 1: to do anything other than I wanted to hunt. And

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Speaker 1: when I would hunt, people would ask me stories about

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Speaker 1: what happened. And I love telling the stories about what happened.

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Speaker 1: And I even loved even more so when I'm hunting.

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Speaker 1: I I love long form hunting. I love going places

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Speaker 1: for days, so I love telling people about And then

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Speaker 1: and then this is all the river fro is up

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Speaker 1: and it was cool. You know. I got up one

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Speaker 1: morning in the rivers, just covered in skim ice, and

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Speaker 1: there's a bull moose and he was grunting on the

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Speaker 1: other side of the river, and I can see steam

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Speaker 1: pouring out of his nose. I wasn't even hunting moose,

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Speaker 1: but here I am ten minutes into a story about

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Speaker 1: this moose blowing steam out of his nose, and people

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Speaker 1: just sit there and I looked around the room and

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Speaker 1: I'd see people just sitting there kind of wide eyed,

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Speaker 1: you know, and they're like, you're a great storyteller. And

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Speaker 1: I said, oh, oh, thank you, you know, and I

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Speaker 1: just move on and and I would do these things.

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Speaker 1: And then and then as I started doing these films

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Speaker 1: and and developed into having target panic, I just ran

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Speaker 1: into uh mess. And so we just started did you

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Speaker 1: ever have a time or you had to? You had

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Speaker 1: discussion with your team, you got a talent, the team

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Speaker 1: of guys around you that film and edit, like should

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Speaker 1: we show this wom Yes, just conversations like you know,

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Speaker 1: what do we do now? Yes? Too. I'll give you

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Speaker 1: two examples. One in The River Divide. In The Rivers Divide,

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Speaker 1: Kyle nick Light, who's my producer and editor, very gifted storyteller,

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Speaker 1: very gifted filmmaker, film film school graduate. Um, He's like, okay,

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Speaker 1: I want you to write. We're writing voiceovers for The

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Speaker 1: Rivers Divide. And he said, right, I need you to write.

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Speaker 1: I want you to write about this, this, this, this,

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Speaker 1: Because he's building the spine of the film. So he's like,

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Speaker 1: I just want to see what your verbage is going

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Speaker 1: to kind of shake out as we progress through the story.

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Speaker 1: Just really quick scribble so I can scribble stuff down

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Speaker 1: handed to him. And he reasons, He's like, I've literally

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Speaker 1: never heard you talk like this ever. And I basically wrote, um,

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Speaker 1: you know, like TV scribble, like I wrote things that

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Speaker 1: you would hear on some of the more writing this

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Speaker 1: for TV. And he said, I've never heard you. And

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Speaker 1: then I was in the office one day and I

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Speaker 1: was talking about how when I killed Steve. Um. I

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Speaker 1: was like, man, Steve, yes, I'm sorry, I'm not not

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Speaker 1: my neighbor, but yeah, Steve the deer when I killed him. Um,

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Speaker 1: I was just telling calm. One day. I was like, man,

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Speaker 1: it really I had a heavy heart, you know, I

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Speaker 1: was really filled the star And I said, you know,

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Speaker 1: it's funny because every animal I've ever killed, it's really

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Speaker 1: left me with a heavy heart. Uh. I. I just

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Speaker 1: was always aware that that animal would still be alive

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Speaker 1: that minute. Maybe not the next day, maybe a mountaine

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Speaker 1: would ki him where you get hit by a car,

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Speaker 1: died from starvation, whatever, but that minute, that day, that second,

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Speaker 1: right then I'm I'm the executioner, right, I'm the hunter,

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Speaker 1: predator and prey, and um, there's no no backs to that.

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Speaker 1: And so I just I've always realized that that is

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Speaker 1: such a big deal coming to full draw, such a

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Speaker 1: big deal clicking your safety off your rifle. And so

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Speaker 1: I told it to him. He's like, that that right that.

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Speaker 1: And I was like, I can't write that. People are

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Speaker 1: gonna rip me up like the guys that jacked their

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Speaker 1: pickup trucks up. And we're baseball caps and have a

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Speaker 1: big chew in right now, those guys are gonna rip

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Speaker 1: me off. Perfect, And he's like, who cares? Who cares

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Speaker 1: about those guys. Let's make the film for us, how

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Speaker 1: you would do it, how we would do it. Let's

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Speaker 1: make it for us. Let's be selfish, make this for us.

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Speaker 1: We'll put it out there for people like it. Great.

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Speaker 1: If they don't, you know, we'll move on with our lives.

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Speaker 1: You'll go back to being a biologist. I'll go get

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Speaker 1: a job at another company and high five piece out.

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Speaker 1: So that too fast forward to you know, when we

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Speaker 1: knew we were going to show me missing Steve at seventeen,

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Speaker 1: we knew that we knew we were gonna show me

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Speaker 1: shooting him in the shoulder at UM thirty four. The

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Speaker 1: one thing that I wish we would have shown is

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Speaker 1: after I wounded him. We showed a little bit of

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Speaker 1: sorrow in the tree stand, and we showed a little

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Speaker 1: bit of sorrow that night. But there were days days

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Speaker 1: of that sorrow. There were multiple trips where we couldn't

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Speaker 1: even really get out of the sorrow. Like we'd go there,

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Speaker 1: we'd hunt him, he wouldn't show up. We couldn't find

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Speaker 1: him with bionos. That the places a very visual ranch.

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Speaker 1: We couldn't find him with bios. We couldn't find him.

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Speaker 1: We had not It was just I wish we would

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Speaker 1: have filmed all that, but we were so in the

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Speaker 1: dumps about it. Not true tragedy here, right, I'm not

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Speaker 1: talking about it feels I mean it's not. Yes, you're

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Speaker 1: not being hyper violic like it feels shitty. It feels

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Speaker 1: really bad. And we were feeling so we're having such

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Speaker 1: a pity party where you know, it was spilt milk

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Speaker 1: everywhere that we just kind of never even turned the

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Speaker 1: camera on. So I didn't have anything to good say,

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Speaker 1: maybe nothing to say at all, But I really wish

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Speaker 1: we would have harnessed all that fast forward that too,

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Speaker 1: the other side and the engagement that happens at the

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Speaker 1: end of the Grizzly Bear. You haven't seen the film yet, correct.

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Speaker 1: I watched the first ten minutes before you all right, UM, don't,

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Speaker 1: I won't. I won't. But there's there's a piece at

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Speaker 1: the end that is very volatile and um, it's very

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Speaker 1: difficult to watch whether you're a hunter and non hunter

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Speaker 1: and anti hunter, a barre biologists. It's very difficult to watch.

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Speaker 1: And there's additional footage to that piece. And we played

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Speaker 1: with a bunch of different pieces. There's nothing that's secret.

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Speaker 1: Everything bad that happens you see, but it's just we

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Speaker 1: just move things around. It's still truth one percent of timeline, um,

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Speaker 1: but we just moved things around that we thought would

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Speaker 1: We didn't want to linger there for too long, and

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Speaker 1: so we shortened some of it up, and we and

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Speaker 1: we played with it to where what we did is

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Speaker 1: we had some young ladies come in our office that

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Speaker 1: were I'm not gonna say they're anti hunters, but they're

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Speaker 1: definitely not hunters, and they're definitely not proponents of hunting,

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Speaker 1: but they're they're good friends. Came and watched it and

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Speaker 1: we watched their body language, watched there and they were

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Speaker 1: you know, we played it the first time and and uh,

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Speaker 1: it was really cool because we had a long form.

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Speaker 1: We played it for him. They're like, um, we totally

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Speaker 1: get what's happening here, but um, this was extremely uncomfortable

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Speaker 1: to watch. So then I had a couple of friends

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Speaker 1: watch it. Girls. I don't know why we lingered there,

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Speaker 1: but um, I had a very dear friend of mine

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Speaker 1: who's a woman. She watched it, and she's a her

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Speaker 1: and she watched it, and I watched her get angry.

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Speaker 1: And so she watched it and she just crossed her arms.

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Speaker 1: She's like, oh, yeah, okay, this is yep, you're gonna

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Speaker 1: put this out there. That's how you're gonna put it

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Speaker 1: out there. And I was like, well this, yeah, this

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Speaker 1: is what we're thinking. And then you could tell her

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Speaker 1: response was visceral. She was upset at this. What how

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Speaker 1: this all went down? And um, and I explained her,

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Speaker 1: you know, and and she had never hunted bears or whatever.

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Speaker 1: So we played with some placement there. Everything is I

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Speaker 1: shouldn't even say we placed. We played with placement. The

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Speaker 1: placement is the same. We played with lengths of time

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Speaker 1: that we showed that. It's interesting that you did that,

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Speaker 1: you know. I don't know how many folks in the

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Speaker 1: hunting you know, in our content world, would would have

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Speaker 1: someone who doesn't hunt or or doesn't understand it, watch

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Speaker 1: a film like and then read their body language and

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Speaker 1: try to understand, like how that the psychology absorb, you know,

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Speaker 1: and absorb what they're watching, because man, we got a

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Speaker 1: lot of bubble mentality in our world, you know, where

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Speaker 1: we don't. So I think it's really cool way you

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Speaker 1: did that, and that was it's important. And I didn't

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Speaker 1: know this, but when we started coming out with these films,

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Speaker 1: when we started writing for Instagram and writing for Facebook

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Speaker 1: and whatever else, I started getting more letters from anti

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Speaker 1: hunters than I was from hunters, and not not f you, letters,

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Speaker 1: letters with questions like I don't like hunting, I hate hunters,

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Speaker 1: but what are what is? What do you? What is this?

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Speaker 1: You know, like I really appreciate how you killed this

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Speaker 1: caribou and you caught it up and backpacked it out,

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Speaker 1: and and so they had questions. So then I started thinking,

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Speaker 1: I still wrote the film selfishly for me, still did,

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Speaker 1: but I did so in a manner that might help

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Speaker 1: answer some questions or elicit better questions, And so I did.

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Speaker 1: I told this to rogan Um I know he's a

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Speaker 1: friend of yours, but he he made a statement one time.

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Speaker 1: I think he did in a joke, but I took

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Speaker 1: it very serious. He said, we are shaped by outside,

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Speaker 1: by our our influencers. So if I you know, if

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Speaker 1: I come into your hotel room and put my fist

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Speaker 1: through your mirror, you know, we might still do the

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Speaker 1: podcast where you're gonna be like, okay, super never ever

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Speaker 1: ever going to have that guy here again. And so

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Speaker 1: then you know, we do things that that you know,

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Speaker 1: how you behave at a party might might reflect if

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Speaker 1: you get invited to a party later on, or how

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Speaker 1: you behave yourself fishing, or always say it's like a

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Speaker 1: choose your own adventure type of use your own adventure.

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Speaker 1: Every decision has a tree, and every tree, every secondary

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Speaker 1: decision has another tree. That's how you get yeah, And

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Speaker 1: so that's basically what it was is. Even though I

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Speaker 1: wrote this thing selfishly for myself, the fact that I

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Speaker 1: started getting a lot of letters from non hunters and

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Speaker 1: anti hunters made me think like, okay, I have to

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Speaker 1: write this so again. The same woman that watched the

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Speaker 1: same woman, the friend of mine, her names Crystal. She

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Speaker 1: watched this um the the snare at the end that

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Speaker 1: was uncomfortable. She also, this was really good because she's

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Speaker 1: a hunter, but she watched these different scenarios and she

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Speaker 1: didn't realize some of the differences techniques of like hunting

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Speaker 1: brown bears or hunting grizzly bears, and well, why are

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Speaker 1: you doing this and this and this and this and

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Speaker 1: so then I thought, oh, okay, so here's a hunter

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Speaker 1: that understands she's a deer hunter. She understands deer hunting,

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Speaker 1: but not having ever gone to Alaska hunted these different

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Speaker 1: species of bears, you didn't know. So then I so

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Speaker 1: then I realized, okay, we have to be a little

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Speaker 1: bit more blatant in some of our voiceovers and some

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Speaker 1: of our guidance to carry people along that may have

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Speaker 1: questions or may have never done these things. So it's

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Speaker 1: really good. It's it's an interesting thing. It's almost like,

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Speaker 1: you know, it's writing a book. If you're presenting a

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Speaker 1: book to two different people, then one person has already

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Speaker 1: read it, has already read the first six chapters, and

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Speaker 1: the other person has to still read the first six chapters.

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Speaker 1: You know, hunters, you're like, I don't if I'm watching

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Speaker 1: you hunt Steve in a tree stand. I'm not wondering

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Speaker 1: why is he in the tree? Yeah? What's he doing

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Speaker 1: in the tree? Why is this bo hanging there like that?

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Speaker 1: Why is he looking that way? Why is he set

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Speaker 1: up where he is? Yeah, I know what you're doing.

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Speaker 1: It's inherent, just based on the being a hunter and

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Speaker 1: have shared experiences like yeah, I know what Donny's doing there,

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Speaker 1: but so I'm looking at something different. And if you've

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Speaker 1: never something and appreciate something different, if you've never done it,

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Speaker 1: then you're you're you're reading all those things like Okay,

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Speaker 1: what is this? What is this? What is this? And

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Speaker 1: it seems just it's a more And I've done this

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Speaker 1: too and talked a lot of nine hunters about a

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Speaker 1: lot of different things, and it comes up in podcasts,

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Speaker 1: but you know, it's hard for us who are hunters

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Speaker 1: to see how somebody absorbs that information, who has a

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Speaker 1: million questions before we even get to the drawing your bow?

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Speaker 1: And the cool thing is that you being a hunter.

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Speaker 1: You know when I missed Steve, Like at first, you'd say,

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Speaker 1: why would you show you missed a giant deer at

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Speaker 1: seventeen yards? Why would you show that? Well, because maybe

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Speaker 1: you've missed a giant deer at seventeen yards. So then

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Speaker 1: when you see that, you're with your body and you're like, oh,

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Speaker 1: do you remember when we're in Texas and my my

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Speaker 1: arrow hit that branch and deflected over that deer and

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Speaker 1: you you know that emotion. It's why books are successful,

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Speaker 1: It's why movies are successful. It's why Joe Rogan is

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Speaker 1: successful at as a comedian because what he's talking about

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Speaker 1: on stage, we're all like, yeah, I've done that. It's

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Speaker 1: I loved listening to comedians talk about that stuff because

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Speaker 1: especially talking to Joe and how they like craft, you know,

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Speaker 1: the craft, their sets and craft build like because nothing

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Speaker 1: they say until gymnastics, nothing they say is funny. It's

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Speaker 1: just that we sit there and go, I have done that.

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Speaker 1: I've been I've been with specifically Joe. He's the only

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Speaker 1: comedian I fucking know, so it's like I've been with him.

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Speaker 1: We were to hunt in Texas one time and he

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Speaker 1: wrote a bit about you ever been to a Bucky's

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Speaker 1: gas station. It's like this giant gas station in Texas

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Speaker 1: with like a thousand pumps and it's the you know,

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Speaker 1: it's like a Walmart with a gas station and we

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Speaker 1: went there like two in the morning, and I just

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Speaker 1: remember Joe was like bouncing around, He's writing stuff on

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Speaker 1: a piece of paper. What the fun is he doing?

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Speaker 1: And then he went We went and hunted, and on

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Speaker 1: the way back he did his show in Austin and

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Speaker 1: he had a bit about BUCkies in the show. It

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Speaker 1: was the first time I had been a part of

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Speaker 1: I'm like, holy sh it, Like he I watched and

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Speaker 1: he developed it over like a day, a three day

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Speaker 1: hunt that we did for BIGS, and I was like,

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Speaker 1: it's unbelievable how he took what is normal, what was

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Speaker 1: a normal stop to get some like beef jerky, and

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Speaker 1: turned it into this like hilarious experience for the people

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Speaker 1: of Texas, because there's nothing funny about BUCkies other than

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Speaker 1: the irony of the size and the complexity of this

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Speaker 1: gas whole thing where there was like some Texas oil

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Speaker 1: tycoon doing cocaine and be like, we need more gas pumps, man,

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Speaker 1: more gas pumps. And I was like, god, it just

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Speaker 1: you know, that was the first time I was like

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Speaker 1: truly had been a part of that process and seeing

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Speaker 1: somebody turn normal life into comedy, and uh, I was

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Speaker 1: just I was amazed by it. And that's what we attempting,

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Speaker 1: our attempting to do. And I'm not gonna say we're

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Speaker 1: good at our craft, but I worked with an exceedingly

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Speaker 1: talented group of guys and we we do put our

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Speaker 1: best foot forward like this is right now. We get

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Speaker 1: better all the time, but this is all we've got

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Speaker 1: and um, and it's cool from everything from the writing

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Speaker 1: that I do to the editing that Kyle does, because

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Speaker 1: he'll bring in you know, he's taught me things where

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Speaker 1: you know, we'll be editing something, he'll be editing something

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Speaker 1: and all of a sudden, our minds do everything left

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Speaker 1: to right and then all of a sudden will come

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Speaker 1: into a scene that is going to feed you some contention.

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Speaker 1: And you'll see this in horror movies. All of a sudden,

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Speaker 1: all the scenes will start moving from right to left,

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Speaker 1: and instantly your brain doesn't like it. So instantly you

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Speaker 1: know you'll be in the movie theater and you don't

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Speaker 1: even realize that, but you'll sit up and be like,

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Speaker 1: you know, what the hell is going on? And then

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Speaker 1: the music changes, you know, and you're like, okay, great,

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Speaker 1: now something something's gonna happen, and you know, like you're

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Speaker 1: hyper aware. And so we'll do the same thing in

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Speaker 1: our films. And then we have a musician, Casey Olsen.

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Speaker 1: He goes by Rodriguez. He'll like, yeah, Rodriguez, I gotta

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Speaker 1: get I gotta get like a name call names. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: he don't have a name. I don't, but I wish

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Speaker 1: he would. I wish he was a fighter pile because

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Speaker 1: I know, yeah, so he um, but he'll score the music.

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Speaker 1: He knows nothing about hunting. He don't, you know, other

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Speaker 1: than he eats, like I give him tons of meat

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Speaker 1: and he just loves it because he doesn't spend money

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Speaker 1: on anything. And so you know, he's messy hair and

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Speaker 1: covering tattoos and he's skinny and super super talented musician.

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Speaker 1: But he'll come in my office and say, hey, I

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Speaker 1: gotta get him for the podcast. So writes music. Oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: he'll score music for you. He's super dominant. But he

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Speaker 1: he'll come in my office and say, hey, when you

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Speaker 1: saw that grizzly bear, you know, were you afraid? I'll say, no,

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Speaker 1: you weren't, No, well, you know what were you feeling?

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Speaker 1: I was just hyperwary, you know, like everything fell quiet,

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Speaker 1: and his oh okay, and then he'll run back to

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Speaker 1: his office into our little we have a recording studio

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Speaker 1: which is basically h ice fishing house with sound equipment

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Speaker 1: in it, and he'll go play his violin, as cello,

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Speaker 1: his bass, piano, whatever, and he'll create music but his

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Speaker 1: sat So he's following the emotion. Kyle's editing to kind

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Speaker 1: of drive your guy's emotion to how we felt in

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Speaker 1: the space to bring you along. William is filming the

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Speaker 1: little tiny birds and the leaves and the frost and

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Speaker 1: the sunshine, and the clouds in the rain, the mosquitoes,

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Speaker 1: so that because if you're a hunter, you've been in

401
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Speaker 1: all those places. Even if you're not a hunter, you

402
00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:25,040
Speaker 1: can appreciate those things. Even and even if you live

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Speaker 1: in New York City you never leave New York City,

404
00:20:27,760 --> 00:20:29,399
Speaker 1: you see this stuff and you're like, wow, I never

405
00:20:29,400 --> 00:20:30,879
Speaker 1: thought I was going to see the artic circle. This

406
00:20:30,920 --> 00:20:32,840
Speaker 1: is pretty cool to kind of experience. This guy took

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00:20:32,920 --> 00:20:35,720
Speaker 1: us there. So williams bringing you there. I'm writing to

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Speaker 1: tell you what's going on and how I was feeling

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Speaker 1: in it. And then the animals in the wilderness and

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Speaker 1: wildlife are all doing their part naturally, and we blend

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Speaker 1: it all together to try and tell a tale, right,

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Speaker 1: talk about a craft man, talk about as like I'm

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Speaker 1: always interested in those things like craft. How you know

414
00:20:53,680 --> 00:20:56,520
Speaker 1: me too? It's it's and you guys have developed over

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Speaker 1: the years. I mean, oh, I want to get into

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Speaker 1: the kind of like how you how you came along

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Speaker 1: in hunting and eventually here. But it's this this selfish

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Speaker 1: because interesting to me just because you're talking about, you know,

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Speaker 1: not the manipulation of a story, the telling of a story,

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Speaker 1: telling of a story. You know, how do I craft? Um?

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Speaker 1: What happened to me in such a way to make

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Speaker 1: compelling to interest folks and and for them to be

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Speaker 1: able to take something away from it? Um. And when

424
00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:25,520
Speaker 1: you and when you're looking at you, you have a

425
00:21:25,560 --> 00:21:28,639
Speaker 1: wide people, a wide array of folks that watch your films,

426
00:21:28,640 --> 00:21:30,639
Speaker 1: and they'll all take something different from it, which is

427
00:21:31,000 --> 00:21:33,240
Speaker 1: which I'm sure is the challenge, you know. Yeah, and

428
00:21:33,280 --> 00:21:36,600
Speaker 1: it's it's been really rewarding. We just did um premiere

429
00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:41,120
Speaker 1: in Fort Collins, Colorado, a very artsy theater and there's

430
00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:43,760
Speaker 1: a very diverse group and there, I mean mostly mostly

431
00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:46,960
Speaker 1: people that were got invitations from most partners of ours

432
00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:49,280
Speaker 1: and things like that, and um, so that was a

433
00:21:49,280 --> 00:21:51,159
Speaker 1: really good group of people. But there's several people in

434
00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:53,560
Speaker 1: the theater that I have never hunted, do not really

435
00:21:53,600 --> 00:21:56,280
Speaker 1: know hunters. Because that's the funny thing if if you

436
00:21:56,320 --> 00:21:59,439
Speaker 1: think about it, not to digress, but you know, the

437
00:21:59,520 --> 00:22:02,280
Speaker 1: people that we came from our parents. Like if you

438
00:22:02,320 --> 00:22:04,920
Speaker 1: asked your dad and your mom, Hey, did you guys

439
00:22:04,920 --> 00:22:08,120
Speaker 1: grow up annoying hunters? Oh yeah, yeah, of course. But

440
00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:10,679
Speaker 1: you get to our generation and you ask some of

441
00:22:10,680 --> 00:22:13,800
Speaker 1: your friends, say, yeah, you guys know any hunters. No.

442
00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:16,840
Speaker 1: Our parents all new hunters because it was a mainstay

443
00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:20,679
Speaker 1: of society. And now, unfortunately, as some generations are moving along,

444
00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:23,600
Speaker 1: you don't really know hunters. And we hunters used to be,

445
00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:27,239
Speaker 1: you know, statesman if you will. They used to be

446
00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:32,000
Speaker 1: like upper classman guys that knew everything from um it

447
00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:34,080
Speaker 1: was kind of the guy that knew how to navigate

448
00:22:34,080 --> 00:22:36,480
Speaker 1: in the dark. He knew how to live off the land.

449
00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:38,600
Speaker 1: He knew how to break down an animal and get

450
00:22:38,640 --> 00:22:41,280
Speaker 1: it back to his wife and kids, and he knew

451
00:22:41,280 --> 00:22:43,600
Speaker 1: how to forge and have space. And he also was

452
00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:48,120
Speaker 1: strong and tough and um, honest and true. And these

453
00:22:48,160 --> 00:22:49,920
Speaker 1: are these are things that kind of followed that. Yeah,

454
00:22:49,920 --> 00:22:51,960
Speaker 1: they have a lot of important jobs, right, a lot

455
00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:54,640
Speaker 1: of a lot of important jobs, which makes them exalted

456
00:22:54,680 --> 00:22:56,440
Speaker 1: in the community. And yeah, yeh. Had a guy on

457
00:22:56,480 --> 00:23:00,359
Speaker 1: the podcast that us told us um he game from

458
00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:02,840
Speaker 1: Czechoslovakia and he was telling there they have a term

459
00:23:02,880 --> 00:23:04,560
Speaker 1: over there, and I always fuck it up. I think

460
00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:08,000
Speaker 1: it's like mechlovic or something like that. Mesovic Um it

461
00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:12,080
Speaker 1: means hunter and thinker and that's you know over there

462
00:23:12,119 --> 00:23:15,399
Speaker 1: coming up they had to um learn about that. They

463
00:23:15,400 --> 00:23:16,840
Speaker 1: had to go to class to be a hunter and

464
00:23:16,920 --> 00:23:19,399
Speaker 1: learn about the flora and fauna and there, you know,

465
00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:22,639
Speaker 1: their model of conservation, if you will, was to the

466
00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:26,119
Speaker 1: more work you did outside, the better opportunities you had

467
00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:28,119
Speaker 1: to go hunt. So if you worked all day, you

468
00:23:28,119 --> 00:23:30,359
Speaker 1: could go hunt red deer. If you only hurt half

469
00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:32,560
Speaker 1: the day, you could only go and then hunt a

470
00:23:32,560 --> 00:23:35,560
Speaker 1: squirrel or a rabbit. So it's interesting like that, like

471
00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:38,000
Speaker 1: the idea in that community that the hunter was this

472
00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:41,480
Speaker 1: you know, yeah, thinker and someone who had to make

473
00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:44,520
Speaker 1: like the most important decisions when it came to wildlife.

474
00:23:44,560 --> 00:23:46,760
Speaker 1: And it was funny. So I was in several years ago,

475
00:23:46,800 --> 00:23:52,399
Speaker 1: but I was in Nepal. I was in southern Nepal

476
00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:54,960
Speaker 1: and the Royal Chitwan National Forest, a place called death

477
00:23:55,320 --> 00:23:59,200
Speaker 1: Up and I was studying tigers for UM, the local biologists.

478
00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:03,920
Speaker 1: They're working in conjunction with them, and they are very

479
00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:06,879
Speaker 1: much against hunting. Uh in this region, the guys that

480
00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:09,840
Speaker 1: I were working with and uh, um the native people

481
00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:13,159
Speaker 1: very much against hunting. UH. They do some hunting, of

482
00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:16,000
Speaker 1: course for themselves, and some fishing to supply meat for

483
00:24:16,040 --> 00:24:18,879
Speaker 1: their families, but I'm mostly uh talking about the tiger

484
00:24:19,320 --> 00:24:21,479
Speaker 1: right there. Everyone's there to save the tiger, other than

485
00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:25,000
Speaker 1: the poachers that are trying to sell their skin. But UM,

486
00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:27,800
Speaker 1: so they quote unquote hate these guys that are killing

487
00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:30,040
Speaker 1: the tigers. They're not hunters or poachers, but they hate them.

488
00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:33,040
Speaker 1: But it's funny. When I came into camp, they asked

489
00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:34,880
Speaker 1: what I like to do, and I told you, let's

490
00:24:34,880 --> 00:24:38,080
Speaker 1: back up about how you find yourself. Let's not skip

491
00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:41,240
Speaker 1: over how the fund do you find yourself working as

492
00:24:41,240 --> 00:24:46,560
Speaker 1: a as a It's actually pretty interesting. So I I

493
00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:48,960
Speaker 1: graduated from the University of Minnesota with a degree and

494
00:24:48,960 --> 00:24:53,160
Speaker 1: wildlife biology and scientific biology. And UM, you hunter, then

495
00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:55,800
Speaker 1: I was a hunter, then you're in fact, That's what

496
00:24:55,920 --> 00:24:59,160
Speaker 1: led me to I was hunting and and and had

497
00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:00,800
Speaker 1: no idea what I want do for a career. I

498
00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:05,840
Speaker 1: was really unsuccessful in high school. UM basically remedial classes

499
00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:08,240
Speaker 1: all the way up through high school, just challenged as

500
00:25:08,880 --> 00:25:12,400
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna necessarily say challenged as a as a student.

501
00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:14,920
Speaker 1: But teachers didn't believe in me. I certainly didn't believe

502
00:25:14,960 --> 00:25:17,879
Speaker 1: in me, and parents didn't believe in me, and so

503
00:25:17,960 --> 00:25:22,600
Speaker 1: I just was Monday became a Friday, became a Sunday,

504
00:25:22,720 --> 00:25:26,159
Speaker 1: turned into a month, into a year, and uh, you know,

505
00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:28,679
Speaker 1: ninth grade of serious, tenth grade it was we were

506
00:25:28,720 --> 00:25:31,080
Speaker 1: supposed to be more serious. Eleventh grade was supposed to

507
00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:34,199
Speaker 1: be really serious and get ready for life. And all

508
00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:36,720
Speaker 1: of a sudden, like, I'm just a high school student.

509
00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:38,040
Speaker 1: What am I supposed to do? And I saw the

510
00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:41,320
Speaker 1: other kids around me that were really smart and talented.

511
00:25:41,320 --> 00:25:45,800
Speaker 1: We're taking post secondaries classes, and they weren't getting in trouble,

512
00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:47,399
Speaker 1: and not naturally that I was getting in trouble for

513
00:25:47,440 --> 00:25:49,119
Speaker 1: trivial stuff, but I was getting in a little bit

514
00:25:49,119 --> 00:25:53,000
Speaker 1: of trouble. And anyway, flast forward and I went to

515
00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:57,760
Speaker 1: the University of Minnesota, and UM, I ended up seeing

516
00:25:57,760 --> 00:26:01,600
Speaker 1: a cow moose on a brochure. Uh kalmo standing in

517
00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:06,760
Speaker 1: a pond eating vegetation on a roster. Yeah. Um for

518
00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:11,000
Speaker 1: the UH School of Natural Resources. And I thought, and

519
00:26:11,040 --> 00:26:16,520
Speaker 1: I loved wildlife, loved I loved wildlife and I loved hunting.

520
00:26:16,560 --> 00:26:20,400
Speaker 1: To me, those two things were synonymous. There wasn't zoos

521
00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:24,320
Speaker 1: the outdoors. I'm also a hunter and a fisherman like

522
00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:26,439
Speaker 1: guys now are like, I'm a bass fisherman or I

523
00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:28,320
Speaker 1: hunt white til deer. I did this to me that

524
00:26:28,359 --> 00:26:30,520
Speaker 1: none of that exists. Still to this day, none of

525
00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:33,440
Speaker 1: that exists. To me, I'm all of those things, and

526
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:37,360
Speaker 1: I'm a zookeeper and I'm a wildlife biologist and I'm

527
00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:40,040
Speaker 1: a steward of habitat like that. To me, being a hunter,

528
00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:43,000
Speaker 1: your job is all of that. You own all of that.

529
00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:47,399
Speaker 1: That's a responsibility. And so um, I was hunting and

530
00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:49,160
Speaker 1: wanting to hunt more and more, and so I saw

531
00:26:49,160 --> 00:26:51,280
Speaker 1: this brochure and I was like, oh, you know, I'd

532
00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:54,080
Speaker 1: love to do this, And and the school was ranked

533
00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:56,720
Speaker 1: really high, the program at that you was ranked really high.

534
00:26:56,720 --> 00:27:01,280
Speaker 1: So when applied and literally the ladies like oh no, absolutely,

535
00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:05,280
Speaker 1: like you are so far from getting in this program,

536
00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:10,760
Speaker 1: it's not even funny. So I said, no, she was awesome.

537
00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:14,160
Speaker 1: Actually she was awesome. Yeah, but she said basically like,

538
00:27:14,240 --> 00:27:16,240
Speaker 1: you are so far on the plate, it's not even funny.

539
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:17,720
Speaker 1: But why why do you even want to do this?

540
00:27:17,800 --> 00:27:19,359
Speaker 1: You know? And I said, well, I and this is

541
00:27:19,400 --> 00:27:22,200
Speaker 1: I'm not telling you this story to as a as

542
00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:24,879
Speaker 1: a proponent of like yep, somebody told me I couldn't

543
00:27:24,880 --> 00:27:26,640
Speaker 1: do it, and I just buckled up and did it. No,

544
00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:30,680
Speaker 1: it was just I was so afraid of failure, so

545
00:27:30,760 --> 00:27:34,320
Speaker 1: afraid of I watched tons of people around me flounder

546
00:27:34,440 --> 00:27:37,360
Speaker 1: with drugs and alcohol and and as young kids. I mean,

547
00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:39,240
Speaker 1: I'm talking middle school on up. You know. That was

548
00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:42,080
Speaker 1: like ment alive. I'm not very smart anyway, I'm not

549
00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:45,359
Speaker 1: very bright to begin with. I'm in remedial classes all

550
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:48,760
Speaker 1: through high school. I bet her, damn buckle down and

551
00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:50,880
Speaker 1: try to learn as much information as I can before

552
00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:53,760
Speaker 1: I move forward and try to do something with my life.

553
00:27:54,359 --> 00:27:55,959
Speaker 1: And I have a brother and a sister both are

554
00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:58,640
Speaker 1: severe drug addicts and uh, and so I watched them

555
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:01,920
Speaker 1: just a constant. I were a lot of control and

556
00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:04,880
Speaker 1: in and out of jail and stealing from my parents

557
00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:06,800
Speaker 1: and they get kicked out and then they move back in.

558
00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:13,240
Speaker 1: It's just this ship show. And so UM, this lady said,

559
00:28:13,280 --> 00:28:14,360
Speaker 1: why do you want to do this? And I said,

560
00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:16,040
Speaker 1: I just love wildlife. I'd love to do this. She said,

561
00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:19,680
Speaker 1: I tell you what. You take all of these classes.

562
00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:22,159
Speaker 1: And it was all of the Algebras. It was pre

563
00:28:22,359 --> 00:28:26,199
Speaker 1: calcuant in two. It was a freshman English. It was

564
00:28:26,240 --> 00:28:28,240
Speaker 1: a second language because I never had a second language

565
00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:32,200
Speaker 1: in high school. Um. Basically, it was two years of classes.

566
00:28:33,080 --> 00:28:37,879
Speaker 1: And she's like, you do all of these with absolute regularity,

567
00:28:37,920 --> 00:28:40,480
Speaker 1: and you'd get good grades and I'll let you into

568
00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:43,240
Speaker 1: the program. So it's great, went to school for two years.

569
00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:45,480
Speaker 1: She let me into the program, went through the program.

570
00:28:45,520 --> 00:28:46,760
Speaker 1: It sounds like you just needed to care it. It It

571
00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:49,280
Speaker 1: sounds like you just need something. Yeah, I just needed

572
00:28:49,280 --> 00:28:51,680
Speaker 1: to care and some support, I guess maybe, and and

573
00:28:51,720 --> 00:28:55,480
Speaker 1: maybe an ounce of believing in myself. And then um,

574
00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:57,880
Speaker 1: and then at the end of that program, you have

575
00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:00,640
Speaker 1: a fields course in which we would go to this

576
00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:03,560
Speaker 1: place called Douglas Lake in Lake Michigan. It sat on

577
00:29:03,680 --> 00:29:07,360
Speaker 1: Lake Michigan, um in the northern part of the Lower

578
00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:11,120
Speaker 1: Peninsula of Michigan. And and we go through this course

579
00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:14,600
Speaker 1: and learning, you know, how to really classify plants in

580
00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:17,600
Speaker 1: the forest, right, not textbook stuff, but like we're doing

581
00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:20,160
Speaker 1: actual vegetation work here. We're looking at trees, reading a

582
00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:22,600
Speaker 1: lot of stuff. And one of the one of the

583
00:29:22,640 --> 00:29:26,760
Speaker 1: courses was run by this guy named Dr David Smith.

584
00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:31,120
Speaker 1: He's a world famous tiger ecologist. So he in the

585
00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:35,600
Speaker 1: beginning of the summer, the University of Michigan would radio

586
00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:39,440
Speaker 1: caller raccoons and then they let them go and so

587
00:29:39,600 --> 00:29:43,680
Speaker 1: we'd study their movements with radio telemetry all summer long.

588
00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:45,640
Speaker 1: And then at the end of the summer what are

589
00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:48,000
Speaker 1: you looking for there? Oh, just literally learning how to

590
00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:51,000
Speaker 1: use telemetry equipment. So like, oh, he's in a dumpster tonight.

591
00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:55,320
Speaker 1: And then here's what we frowned. No, raccoons are a

592
00:29:55,320 --> 00:29:59,880
Speaker 1: little asshole. Literally, we'd locate and be like, oh, he

593
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:03,200
Speaker 1: he's in cabin for tonight, and or he's up on

594
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:04,640
Speaker 1: this hill, you know, and why is he up on

595
00:30:04,640 --> 00:30:06,000
Speaker 1: this hill? And then we go up there and be like, oh,

596
00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:07,720
Speaker 1: so somebody dumped a sack of apples up here and

597
00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:11,160
Speaker 1: he's been sent up here eating so all these different things, um,

598
00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:13,160
Speaker 1: and then at the end of the summer, the University

599
00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:17,120
Speaker 1: of Minnesota would basically try and capture those raccoons to

600
00:30:17,120 --> 00:30:18,920
Speaker 1: get their radio collars off of them. So there's this

601
00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:22,880
Speaker 1: friendly little bet between your University of Minnesota University of Michigan.

602
00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:26,280
Speaker 1: So the guy that I was working for, David Smith,

603
00:30:26,320 --> 00:30:28,760
Speaker 1: the professor that I was studying underneath, he had me

604
00:30:28,760 --> 00:30:30,640
Speaker 1: and another guy. He's like, why don't you guys take

605
00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:35,480
Speaker 1: first crack. You go out tonight, triangulate the raccoons, set

606
00:30:35,520 --> 00:30:39,000
Speaker 1: up traps, live traps, and see how many you can capture.

607
00:30:39,160 --> 00:30:41,960
Speaker 1: Three of them now a radio color and the most

608
00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:44,480
Speaker 1: anyone had ever caught up to that point, I believe

609
00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:48,000
Speaker 1: was one and um, and long story short, we ended

610
00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:51,360
Speaker 1: up catching all three in the first night. So then

611
00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:54,280
Speaker 1: we started talking and we were at this basically a

612
00:30:54,280 --> 00:30:57,760
Speaker 1: celebration party at the end, and he just said, uh,

613
00:30:58,240 --> 00:31:00,720
Speaker 1: He's like, hey, I'm going over to Bangladesh and Nepal

614
00:31:00,880 --> 00:31:04,040
Speaker 1: to go do some tiger stuff this summer. Um, would

615
00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:06,200
Speaker 1: you like to come along? And I said, man alive,

616
00:31:06,280 --> 00:31:10,600
Speaker 1: I would love. I was early twenties. Nobody says no

617
00:31:10,680 --> 00:31:12,800
Speaker 1: to that. No, And then it was really cool. This

618
00:31:12,880 --> 00:31:16,400
Speaker 1: is this guy's David Smith again. His basically Indiana Jones

619
00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:20,120
Speaker 1: literally basically Indiana. He did wear a hat, yep, and

620
00:31:20,440 --> 00:31:23,240
Speaker 1: he had white hair, and he he'd have glasses. He

621
00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:25,520
Speaker 1: let his glasses slide down to the end of his nose,

622
00:31:25,560 --> 00:31:27,960
Speaker 1: almost like Santa Claus, and he kind of suck on

623
00:31:28,040 --> 00:31:31,720
Speaker 1: his bottom lip and go yeah, Ben, yeah, yeah yeah.

624
00:31:31,840 --> 00:31:34,080
Speaker 1: And so he do these things. Oh, it's awesome, and

625
00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:36,560
Speaker 1: then he um. One time he got gored. This is

626
00:31:36,720 --> 00:31:38,360
Speaker 1: I was not there, but he got gored by an

627
00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:40,120
Speaker 1: Asian ryin on one time with his son. Him and

628
00:31:40,160 --> 00:31:42,880
Speaker 1: his son, Guy scooped up all of his intestines because

629
00:31:42,880 --> 00:31:45,160
Speaker 1: they're everywhere. His intestines are all over the place in

630
00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:50,120
Speaker 1: the jungle, scoops them all up, carries them and his

631
00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:55,040
Speaker 1: son back to the camp and wanders in, peels out.

632
00:31:55,360 --> 00:31:58,120
Speaker 1: They fly him, They put him in an airplane. They

633
00:31:58,120 --> 00:32:01,600
Speaker 1: fly him emergently to Catman. You and the doctors and

634
00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:05,120
Speaker 1: Kamin who were like, we're not touching this guy, like

635
00:32:05,160 --> 00:32:07,520
Speaker 1: he's seen Yeah, I've seen the hospitals in Kevin. They're

636
00:32:07,560 --> 00:32:09,520
Speaker 1: not you know, you're not there to you're not there

637
00:32:09,560 --> 00:32:12,280
Speaker 1: to get a cavity fixed. And so they flew him

638
00:32:12,320 --> 00:32:15,080
Speaker 1: to Bangkok and the guys at Bangkok, just crushed and

639
00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:16,960
Speaker 1: put him all back together. But his stomach he looks

640
00:32:17,000 --> 00:32:18,480
Speaker 1: like you know when you have your apendix out, he

641
00:32:18,480 --> 00:32:21,880
Speaker 1: looks like he's had nineteen appendixes out. So that's the

642
00:32:21,920 --> 00:32:23,720
Speaker 1: type of guy that this guy ever written Any books

643
00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:28,000
Speaker 1: we gotta do, I'm sure this guy. I'm sure a film, yeah,

644
00:32:28,080 --> 00:32:30,840
Speaker 1: where we recreate that. He's he's a sick dude. Man.

645
00:32:30,840 --> 00:32:33,000
Speaker 1: He's just he's one of those guys. When he are

646
00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:35,800
Speaker 1: around him or you know him, you're like, oh, I'm

647
00:32:35,840 --> 00:32:38,520
Speaker 1: I'm and I feel this way today, I'm I'm in Amiba.

648
00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:41,680
Speaker 1: Compared to this man, he's ten times smarter than I am.

649
00:32:41,720 --> 00:32:44,120
Speaker 1: He's in his sixties, And when I was in my

650
00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:46,160
Speaker 1: twenties and he was in his sixties, he was ten

651
00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:48,840
Speaker 1: times tougher than I was, ten times smarter than I was.

652
00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:51,480
Speaker 1: It's just you're around somebody like that and you're like,

653
00:32:51,680 --> 00:32:54,800
Speaker 1: you're you really you realize what human beings can be. Yeah,

654
00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:58,360
Speaker 1: you're laughing, You're basically he's basically superhero. Sure, Sure, it

655
00:32:58,400 --> 00:32:59,960
Speaker 1: was good for you and your twenties to be around that.

656
00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:03,480
Speaker 1: It's always incredible to give you and so it's remarkable

657
00:33:03,520 --> 00:33:05,680
Speaker 1: to see what he would do. But he gaining this

658
00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:07,720
Speaker 1: piece of paper and he had his glasses down on

659
00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:09,640
Speaker 1: the end of his nose and he took his pen out,

660
00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:12,720
Speaker 1: and he's like, uh, you know where you know where

661
00:33:12,720 --> 00:33:17,200
Speaker 1: Bangkok is? You know, I'm like Thailand. It's like, yeah, yeah,

662
00:33:17,240 --> 00:33:19,080
Speaker 1: So you're gonna fly. What I want you to do

663
00:33:19,120 --> 00:33:20,920
Speaker 1: is I want you to fly from Minneapolis. You fly

664
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:23,160
Speaker 1: at the Minneapolis right. Yeah, you fly to the Minneapolis

665
00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:26,080
Speaker 1: and you're gonna fly down to Atlanta, Georgia. From Georgia,

666
00:33:26,160 --> 00:33:29,120
Speaker 1: then I'm gonna have you fly to Bangkok. I'm gonna

667
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:31,440
Speaker 1: have you overnight in Bangkok and uh and then from

668
00:33:31,480 --> 00:33:33,200
Speaker 1: there in the morning, you're gonna go back to the airport.

669
00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:37,520
Speaker 1: You're gonna fly through Tokyo and then um, I'm gonna

670
00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:39,720
Speaker 1: have you land in uh let's see here. I'll probably

671
00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:43,320
Speaker 1: have you land in uh in Dhaka. Yeah, how many

672
00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:46,560
Speaker 1: landing Dhaka, Bangladesh. And then and then you're gonna go

673
00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:48,240
Speaker 1: out there's a big metal gate. You're gonna go out

674
00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:49,800
Speaker 1: this gate and then you're gonna walk over to the

675
00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:52,960
Speaker 1: domestic airport and you're gonna a charter an airplane, probably

676
00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:55,120
Speaker 1: a twin prop or something and you're gonna fly that

677
00:33:55,120 --> 00:33:57,040
Speaker 1: down to just shore. And then when you get down

678
00:33:57,080 --> 00:34:01,320
Speaker 1: to the shore, don't talk to anyone because just there's

679
00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:03,520
Speaker 1: some people down there. Just don't talk to anyone. And

680
00:34:03,520 --> 00:34:05,600
Speaker 1: and when you get off the airplane, you're just gonna

681
00:34:05,600 --> 00:34:07,600
Speaker 1: walk into town. It's talk going to be dirt and jungle,

682
00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:10,200
Speaker 1: and don't don't talk to anyone. And then you just

683
00:34:10,239 --> 00:34:12,400
Speaker 1: sit there on the street corner and I'll find you

684
00:34:13,880 --> 00:34:16,080
Speaker 1: in a couple of days, in a couple of days,

685
00:34:16,120 --> 00:34:17,759
Speaker 1: a couple of days, a couple of days from because

686
00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:20,279
Speaker 1: it took me like three days to fly there. So

687
00:34:20,760 --> 00:34:23,319
Speaker 1: you see this piece of paper and that's that's all

688
00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:28,439
Speaker 1: it says on So I fly to Bangkok and through

689
00:34:28,480 --> 00:34:31,080
Speaker 1: Tokyo to DCA and and then I go to walk

690
00:34:31,120 --> 00:34:32,719
Speaker 1: through the metal gate that he told me to walk through,

691
00:34:32,760 --> 00:34:35,080
Speaker 1: and there's a guy with a machine gun and he's

692
00:34:35,080 --> 00:34:37,680
Speaker 1: like hey, hey, hey, and he's pointing his gun at me.

693
00:34:38,760 --> 00:34:42,480
Speaker 1: And the guy going through customs in in DACA, guys

694
00:34:42,520 --> 00:34:45,280
Speaker 1: point at a K at my chest safeties off pointy.

695
00:34:45,320 --> 00:34:46,520
Speaker 1: I don't know if he had one in the chamber,

696
00:34:46,520 --> 00:34:48,799
Speaker 1: but he's pointing the a K on my chest and

697
00:34:48,840 --> 00:34:52,719
Speaker 1: he's like passport. I handed my passport. He drifts the

698
00:34:52,760 --> 00:34:54,719
Speaker 1: mull's love his gun off me a little bit. It

699
00:34:54,760 --> 00:34:58,000
Speaker 1: looks at my passport and go no no. He slides

700
00:34:58,040 --> 00:34:59,880
Speaker 1: it back and he goes back to his weapon. I

701
00:35:00,280 --> 00:35:01,759
Speaker 1: what do you mean? Knowing he's like, no, this is

702
00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:04,120
Speaker 1: not not a good passport. Where'd you get this? Like

703
00:35:04,239 --> 00:35:07,560
Speaker 1: Washington d C. He was no, no, no, no, no no.

704
00:35:07,960 --> 00:35:10,080
Speaker 1: And so he's kind of bickering with me. And I

705
00:35:10,120 --> 00:35:12,439
Speaker 1: saw there's another military guy over here that's a little

706
00:35:12,440 --> 00:35:15,120
Speaker 1: bit more decorated. And I called him over and said, man,

707
00:35:15,160 --> 00:35:18,839
Speaker 1: I'm here from the university and studying tigers and and um,

708
00:35:18,880 --> 00:35:21,239
Speaker 1: I gotta get in here. And and he's like, where

709
00:35:21,239 --> 00:35:23,000
Speaker 1: are you staying? And I said, I'm staying in the jungle. Man,

710
00:35:23,040 --> 00:35:25,200
Speaker 1: I don't have an address. And he's like, you need

711
00:35:25,200 --> 00:35:27,360
Speaker 1: an address. And I'm like, I'm staying in the sunder Bonds.

712
00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:29,759
Speaker 1: It's the world's largest main grove swamp, living on a

713
00:35:29,800 --> 00:35:32,640
Speaker 1: boat in the jungle. There's no address, Like, man, you

714
00:35:32,680 --> 00:35:34,360
Speaker 1: need an address. And I was like, okay, So I

715
00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:36,839
Speaker 1: go to the next guy, and here's where you're staying.

716
00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:40,560
Speaker 1: I go Hotel sunder Bond and the other guy looks

717
00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:43,719
Speaker 1: at me like, you didn't just tell me that, And

718
00:35:43,760 --> 00:35:45,839
Speaker 1: he's like, okay, you're staying at the hotel sunder Barn,

719
00:35:45,880 --> 00:35:52,600
Speaker 1: which doesn't exist, and so he writes and so he

720
00:35:53,040 --> 00:35:54,680
Speaker 1: So they finally let me in and I go to

721
00:35:54,719 --> 00:35:56,960
Speaker 1: walk through the gate to go to the domestic airport,

722
00:35:57,520 --> 00:35:59,160
Speaker 1: and the dude in the machine guns like, hey, if

723
00:35:59,200 --> 00:36:00,800
Speaker 1: you go through the gate to shoot you, that's a

724
00:36:00,880 --> 00:36:03,439
Speaker 1: no no walk zone, Like if you go through this gate,

725
00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:06,919
Speaker 1: I have to shoot you, you know. And I'm like, oh, yeah,

726
00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:09,200
Speaker 1: well okay, so I'm not I won't go through the gate,

727
00:36:09,480 --> 00:36:10,920
Speaker 1: And so where do I How do I do this?

728
00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:12,480
Speaker 1: He's like, you need to take a cab. The only

729
00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:13,759
Speaker 1: way you can get over there is if you get

730
00:36:13,760 --> 00:36:15,040
Speaker 1: in a cab and go over there. So I go

731
00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:18,799
Speaker 1: over this cabby parked nearby and I said, can you

732
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:21,279
Speaker 1: give me a ride to the domestic airport? And he's

733
00:36:21,360 --> 00:36:24,560
Speaker 1: he just goes no, he just sucked on his lip,

734
00:36:24,640 --> 00:36:27,680
Speaker 1: kind of sucked on his tooth, and no, I go, please,

735
00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:30,440
Speaker 1: can you know? So all the sime, I see this

736
00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:34,279
Speaker 1: police officer and he's kind of noticing this guy's given

737
00:36:34,280 --> 00:36:37,280
Speaker 1: me a little gouff. So he comes over and he says,

738
00:36:37,320 --> 00:36:39,640
Speaker 1: excuse me, what's you know? Who are you? I need

739
00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:42,239
Speaker 1: to see your papers. I showed my papers. He's like,

740
00:36:42,280 --> 00:36:44,200
Speaker 1: what are you doing. I said, I'm American. I'm here

741
00:36:44,680 --> 00:36:48,120
Speaker 1: study tigers. They hold their tigers very, very high, you know,

742
00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:50,279
Speaker 1: A they're all afraid of them because there's a lot

743
00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:52,439
Speaker 1: of man eaters there. So the fact that you're coming

744
00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:55,279
Speaker 1: to find tigers, they oh, okay, so you're going to

745
00:36:55,280 --> 00:36:57,360
Speaker 1: the jungle, like you're going to go look for tigers,

746
00:36:57,520 --> 00:37:00,280
Speaker 1: and you're here to help us with our tiger are

747
00:37:00,360 --> 00:37:04,000
Speaker 1: poaching problem. So he looks at my passport, looks my

748
00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:06,120
Speaker 1: papers like okay, he's like, what's going on? I like,

749
00:37:06,160 --> 00:37:09,040
Speaker 1: he just won't take me to the domestic airport. He

750
00:37:09,160 --> 00:37:13,200
Speaker 1: walks over there, smashes the guy in the head, smashes

751
00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:16,600
Speaker 1: him with a right I mean smashes him. Then the

752
00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:19,040
Speaker 1: guy his head kind of pops back out the window.

753
00:37:19,120 --> 00:37:21,840
Speaker 1: The cops smashes him with an elbow. The guy is

754
00:37:21,920 --> 00:37:27,440
Speaker 1: now bleeding profusely from his left temple, and then he goes, okay,

755
00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:31,080
Speaker 1: he'll take you now, no charge. And I get in

756
00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:33,040
Speaker 1: and the guy's bleeding from his head and he drives

757
00:37:33,080 --> 00:37:36,520
Speaker 1: me over the domestic airport for free. Yeah, so he

758
00:37:36,600 --> 00:37:39,160
Speaker 1: lets me out. And then so I get in the

759
00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:41,680
Speaker 1: airplane and fly down to just Shore. I get off

760
00:37:41,719 --> 00:37:44,160
Speaker 1: the airplane, grab my bag, go down this gravel strip

761
00:37:44,480 --> 00:37:47,759
Speaker 1: sitting on the street corner. It's midnight, one am, and

762
00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:49,680
Speaker 1: this guy comes over in a rickshaw when those little

763
00:37:49,719 --> 00:37:53,320
Speaker 1: three wheel bicycles got a little ring ring. He comes in.

764
00:37:53,400 --> 00:37:55,799
Speaker 1: He goes, hey, where are you staying? And I said,

765
00:37:55,840 --> 00:37:57,279
Speaker 1: I don't know where I'm staying yet, you know, I'm

766
00:37:57,640 --> 00:37:59,359
Speaker 1: waiting for friends. And he says, no, no, no no, we're

767
00:38:00,120 --> 00:38:01,839
Speaker 1: um where he's staying. I'll take you there. And I said,

768
00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:03,320
Speaker 1: you know, I don't know where we're staying. You know,

769
00:38:03,360 --> 00:38:04,759
Speaker 1: we're gonna be living on a boat. And he goes, well,

770
00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:07,319
Speaker 1: there's a hotel right down the street here. Why don't

771
00:38:07,320 --> 00:38:09,239
Speaker 1: you let me take you there. You can relax there.

772
00:38:09,239 --> 00:38:11,359
Speaker 1: They have bottled water, because you don't drink anything out

773
00:38:11,360 --> 00:38:13,600
Speaker 1: of the tap. There they have bottled water, the fresh

774
00:38:13,600 --> 00:38:17,480
Speaker 1: food you can get, bite the you know, relax and

775
00:38:17,480 --> 00:38:19,480
Speaker 1: and then i'll let your friends. You know, you know

776
00:38:19,480 --> 00:38:21,040
Speaker 1: where you went. And so I said no, no, I

777
00:38:21,120 --> 00:38:23,480
Speaker 1: was told to state here and not talk to anyone, remember,

778
00:38:24,160 --> 00:38:27,439
Speaker 1: So that guy keeps coming by, and then finally, at

779
00:38:27,480 --> 00:38:29,440
Speaker 1: like three thirty in the morning, I see a land

780
00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:31,759
Speaker 1: rover coming on the street and open end, open air

781
00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:37,600
Speaker 1: land rover and there's Dave and I'm like, this worked.

782
00:38:37,800 --> 00:38:41,399
Speaker 1: This whole half a page of scribble notes worked. So

783
00:38:41,440 --> 00:38:43,600
Speaker 1: he rides up. He's like, hey, how's your flight and everything.

784
00:38:43,600 --> 00:38:46,440
Speaker 1: I'm like, everything basically how you described it, other than

785
00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:48,920
Speaker 1: you almost got me killed going to the airport. And

786
00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:50,360
Speaker 1: he's like, what do you mean you can't walk to

787
00:38:50,440 --> 00:38:52,080
Speaker 1: the game. And he's like, oh yeah, yeah, that's right.

788
00:38:52,080 --> 00:38:56,879
Speaker 1: You gotta take a car over there. Thank you, thank

789
00:38:56,920 --> 00:38:59,319
Speaker 1: you for that. So then I get in the car

790
00:38:59,360 --> 00:39:00,719
Speaker 1: and I go, yeah, I most was gonna wait for

791
00:39:00,760 --> 00:39:03,920
Speaker 1: you guys at a hotel. And the driver goes, what

792
00:39:04,040 --> 00:39:05,920
Speaker 1: a hotel? And I said, the guy there on the

793
00:39:06,000 --> 00:39:09,000
Speaker 1: rickshaw and you could see him. I'm like, he said,

794
00:39:09,000 --> 00:39:10,600
Speaker 1: he's gonna take me the hotel. He's like, oh no,

795
00:39:11,120 --> 00:39:13,839
Speaker 1: It's like he was probably gonna murder you. It's like

796
00:39:13,880 --> 00:39:15,800
Speaker 1: what they'll do is they'll get you in their rickshaw

797
00:39:15,960 --> 00:39:17,960
Speaker 1: and then they'll just ride you over somewhere. They ring

798
00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:20,399
Speaker 1: their bell, you know, guys jump out and slit your throat,

799
00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:23,440
Speaker 1: take all your goods and off the races. And so

800
00:39:23,520 --> 00:39:27,200
Speaker 1: he's like, yeah, there's no hotel around here. So yeah,

801
00:39:27,239 --> 00:39:29,200
Speaker 1: So then I jumped in a boat and went into

802
00:39:29,239 --> 00:39:31,960
Speaker 1: the jungle. So that's how I got to there. But

803
00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:35,080
Speaker 1: back to my original points, they are against hunting and

804
00:39:35,160 --> 00:39:37,880
Speaker 1: hunters there, but they hold hunters in very high regard

805
00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:46,839
Speaker 1: because all before um, late nineties, late nineties, and so

806
00:39:46,960 --> 00:39:51,920
Speaker 1: before they became kind of a recognized society the civil War,

807
00:39:52,000 --> 00:39:56,120
Speaker 1: to all of their elders, if you will, were all hunters,

808
00:39:56,160 --> 00:40:00,360
Speaker 1: and so they hunters were revered there. But um, no

809
00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:02,080
Speaker 1: longer do they do any hunting there. No, But it

810
00:40:02,120 --> 00:40:03,919
Speaker 1: was quite an experience, it was, and I never saw

811
00:40:03,960 --> 00:40:07,040
Speaker 1: a tiger the whole time. How long? How long are

812
00:40:07,040 --> 00:40:09,360
Speaker 1: you there? Um? I was feeling people are like finished

813
00:40:09,360 --> 00:40:11,600
Speaker 1: the story, Donny, Oh yeah, I know. I was there.

814
00:40:11,680 --> 00:40:14,000
Speaker 1: I was there. I was in Bangladesh for several weeks,

815
00:40:14,040 --> 00:40:17,040
Speaker 1: and then from there I went to Nepal for several weeks,

816
00:40:17,160 --> 00:40:20,480
Speaker 1: and um, it was so close to seeing a tiger,

817
00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:23,160
Speaker 1: Like I was in this room with tigers, but I

818
00:40:23,200 --> 00:40:25,399
Speaker 1: just couldn't see them because the jungle tracks and yeah,

819
00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:28,040
Speaker 1: i'd see tracks. So every time the tigers stepped. It's

820
00:40:28,080 --> 00:40:30,839
Speaker 1: called a pug mark. Every time the tiger would step,

821
00:40:30,880 --> 00:40:33,560
Speaker 1: the track would fill with water. And so you could

822
00:40:33,600 --> 00:40:36,360
Speaker 1: take your hand or your foot, put it in a

823
00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:39,320
Speaker 1: mud and pull push it to the same death of

824
00:40:39,400 --> 00:40:42,239
Speaker 1: the tiger, pull it up and measure how long it takes.

825
00:40:42,320 --> 00:40:44,640
Speaker 1: And so we had tiger prints for that were just

826
00:40:44,840 --> 00:40:48,240
Speaker 1: dimpling with water, which is you know, four or five seconds,

827
00:40:48,520 --> 00:40:50,560
Speaker 1: and so he was right here she or she was

828
00:40:50,640 --> 00:40:53,040
Speaker 1: right here, but you can't see them because the jungle.

829
00:40:54,120 --> 00:40:58,960
Speaker 1: These are what kind of tigers? Tigers? Yeah, yeah, yeah, Well,

830
00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:01,920
Speaker 1: nowadays in Nepal, hunting has become They have one hunting

831
00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:06,240
Speaker 1: district which I hunted in Um with Cool Kramer mutual

832
00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:09,360
Speaker 1: friend Um. And this is you know, I want to

833
00:41:09,360 --> 00:41:12,000
Speaker 1: say it's only been open for about four years, Okay,

834
00:41:12,000 --> 00:41:14,040
Speaker 1: I always get that wrong, four or five years. It's

835
00:41:14,040 --> 00:41:17,120
Speaker 1: called the Rokum District. And they they'll do uh each year,

836
00:41:17,200 --> 00:41:19,440
Speaker 1: they do uh what we would call a tag draw,

837
00:41:19,560 --> 00:41:21,719
Speaker 1: but they do like a tag auction and the outfitters,

838
00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:24,600
Speaker 1: I think there's uh two or three outfitters that they

839
00:41:24,760 --> 00:41:26,440
Speaker 1: lie up. Yeah, they just buy them up in an

840
00:41:26,440 --> 00:41:29,040
Speaker 1: auction and there'll be a certain amount of blue sheep tags,

841
00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:32,880
Speaker 1: a certain amount of um tar tags for things like

842
00:41:32,920 --> 00:41:35,759
Speaker 1: that over there. So we've we got We were, you know,

843
00:41:35,800 --> 00:41:37,000
Speaker 1: one of the first folks to do that. But we

844
00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:42,040
Speaker 1: went to western Nepal, which, um it was pretty damn remote.

845
00:41:42,120 --> 00:41:45,240
Speaker 1: We were, you know, the little the hamlet, the little

846
00:41:45,480 --> 00:41:47,680
Speaker 1: village that we flew into. It was like six days

847
00:41:47,719 --> 00:41:51,680
Speaker 1: walk from the nearest road. And which I I said

848
00:41:51,719 --> 00:41:54,799
Speaker 1: a lot on this podcast, but that that like those

849
00:41:54,880 --> 00:41:59,400
Speaker 1: dudes were, They're telling amazing stories in that part of

850
00:41:59,400 --> 00:42:03,000
Speaker 1: the world. No tigers around, but all kinds of it's

851
00:42:03,040 --> 00:42:06,439
Speaker 1: just completely different, right, unbelieved, completely different. You have no

852
00:42:07,160 --> 00:42:10,719
Speaker 1: concept um and I say that in this latest film,

853
00:42:10,760 --> 00:42:14,600
Speaker 1: this idea of I have this notion that I live with,

854
00:42:14,680 --> 00:42:17,600
Speaker 1: and one of them is that we always must hunt

855
00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:20,080
Speaker 1: well and good, no matter if you're on camera off camera.

856
00:42:20,160 --> 00:42:22,920
Speaker 1: Just how we carry ourselves. And I don't mean so

857
00:42:22,960 --> 00:42:26,200
Speaker 1: we don't get caught poaching, but even we need to

858
00:42:26,239 --> 00:42:28,640
Speaker 1: leave the habitat better. We need to be conservationists. We

859
00:42:28,680 --> 00:42:31,080
Speaker 1: need to educate those that don't know. We have to

860
00:42:31,200 --> 00:42:34,480
Speaker 1: educate ourselves. We have to constantly keep asking ourselves difficult questions.

861
00:42:34,480 --> 00:42:36,960
Speaker 1: Should we even be hunting these animals, should we be here,

862
00:42:36,960 --> 00:42:40,160
Speaker 1: should be doing this that notion, and then also this

863
00:42:40,160 --> 00:42:44,400
Speaker 1: this other notion of that. Um unless you go, unless

864
00:42:44,400 --> 00:42:47,000
Speaker 1: you live there, unless you participate, you really have no

865
00:42:47,080 --> 00:42:49,160
Speaker 1: opinion on what is going on. Like we love to

866
00:42:49,200 --> 00:42:52,879
Speaker 1: sit back, particularly in the United States, and say, oh,

867
00:42:53,040 --> 00:42:55,080
Speaker 1: I you know, this is how I would handle Nepoll

868
00:42:55,160 --> 00:42:57,960
Speaker 1: or this is how I would handle Iraq or Afghanistan

869
00:42:58,080 --> 00:43:03,360
Speaker 1: or Cuba whatever, and and from its wildlife to its habitat,

870
00:43:03,400 --> 00:43:06,000
Speaker 1: to its people too, you know. And then but really,

871
00:43:06,080 --> 00:43:10,480
Speaker 1: unless you're there, you know, what would people in in Manhattan,

872
00:43:10,480 --> 00:43:13,920
Speaker 1: New York, how much do they have to say about, um,

873
00:43:13,960 --> 00:43:16,680
Speaker 1: you know, the wildlife in Montana. You know, even though

874
00:43:16,719 --> 00:43:19,200
Speaker 1: they're probably watching CNN. I'm making this all up. But

875
00:43:19,200 --> 00:43:22,440
Speaker 1: even though they're probably watching CNN and seeing some you know,

876
00:43:23,320 --> 00:43:28,280
Speaker 1: lands becoming privatized or becoming remaining public or becoming privatized,

877
00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:30,360
Speaker 1: they might sit in New York as a you know,

878
00:43:30,400 --> 00:43:32,279
Speaker 1: a big fact can be like, well, yeah, this is

879
00:43:32,320 --> 00:43:34,800
Speaker 1: my opinion on it. You know that. But really, unless

880
00:43:34,800 --> 00:43:39,160
Speaker 1: you're there Nepal, unless you're listening to these stories, unless

881
00:43:39,160 --> 00:43:41,480
Speaker 1: you're walking the six miles to the village, unless you're

882
00:43:42,040 --> 00:43:45,319
Speaker 1: listening to the people there. You you really have you

883
00:43:45,360 --> 00:43:47,560
Speaker 1: don't even have an opinion then, but at least you

884
00:43:47,640 --> 00:43:50,200
Speaker 1: have some wisdom in some That's what I say. It's

885
00:43:50,239 --> 00:43:52,439
Speaker 1: so hard, Like I think my biggest challenge with going

886
00:43:52,440 --> 00:43:55,080
Speaker 1: over there for a brief time was like being stressed

887
00:43:55,080 --> 00:43:58,560
Speaker 1: out about learning enough. My stress was like, I want

888
00:43:58,560 --> 00:44:01,799
Speaker 1: to learn, uh um, what has happened to here? What

889
00:44:01,840 --> 00:44:04,200
Speaker 1: will happen here? I want to learn the culture. I

890
00:44:04,239 --> 00:44:06,759
Speaker 1: want to learn their practices for hunting, if they have any,

891
00:44:06,800 --> 00:44:09,600
Speaker 1: which they really you know, they have some traditional hunting practice,

892
00:44:09,719 --> 00:44:12,239
Speaker 1: it's not they don't have any modern hunting practice other

893
00:44:12,280 --> 00:44:15,520
Speaker 1: than kill animal if hungry. It's become a trophy, right.

894
00:44:15,640 --> 00:44:18,120
Speaker 1: They try to provide that Western experience that we all

895
00:44:18,360 --> 00:44:21,759
Speaker 1: I should say we all that I loathe, we participated.

896
00:44:21,800 --> 00:44:23,360
Speaker 1: I say that all the time. Like one thing that

897
00:44:23,400 --> 00:44:25,759
Speaker 1: bothers me about it is because you'll see and I've

898
00:44:25,760 --> 00:44:28,120
Speaker 1: seen this happen. I'm not been around long enough to

899
00:44:28,160 --> 00:44:30,319
Speaker 1: see it kind of like bloom, but I've seen it.

900
00:44:30,600 --> 00:44:32,960
Speaker 1: I could see it. Where is it where a country

901
00:44:34,480 --> 00:44:36,360
Speaker 1: like we there's a lot of dollars in these in

902
00:44:36,400 --> 00:44:42,719
Speaker 1: this country, and another country is looking to to replicate

903
00:44:42,719 --> 00:44:45,439
Speaker 1: that to like to kind of extract you know, who

904
00:44:45,440 --> 00:44:48,560
Speaker 1: has the money, what are they spending it on? And

905
00:44:48,600 --> 00:44:51,759
Speaker 1: can we create an industry in our country to extract

906
00:44:51,800 --> 00:44:54,839
Speaker 1: that money and have have people travel and come hunt here.

907
00:44:55,600 --> 00:44:58,640
Speaker 1: And so these industries pop up, and man, I'll be

908
00:44:58,719 --> 00:45:03,440
Speaker 1: flat honest, places like News Zealand, um, where they're basically

909
00:45:03,480 --> 00:45:06,759
Speaker 1: just catering to a certain type of hunter, and that's

910
00:45:06,800 --> 00:45:09,680
Speaker 1: because that hunter has dollars. Then they created a tourism industry.

911
00:45:09,719 --> 00:45:13,480
Speaker 1: It's supply and demand, it's economics. And it's funny because

912
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:16,719
Speaker 1: this goes back to some of my original hypocrisy that

913
00:45:16,719 --> 00:45:18,680
Speaker 1: I was telling you about. I don't want to go

914
00:45:18,719 --> 00:45:22,560
Speaker 1: to New Zealand and Hanatar or Shammy and be a

915
00:45:22,600 --> 00:45:24,719
Speaker 1: tourist and all this stuff. Not Now, if I went

916
00:45:24,760 --> 00:45:28,239
Speaker 1: to New Zealand for sixty days and I was living

917
00:45:28,239 --> 00:45:30,880
Speaker 1: in a little village or camping or hiking or doing

918
00:45:30,920 --> 00:45:33,359
Speaker 1: whatever it is, it's so funny because it's just semantics.

919
00:45:33,360 --> 00:45:37,000
Speaker 1: But to me it's serious. If I was enveloping myself

920
00:45:37,000 --> 00:45:40,800
Speaker 1: into the culture and then found myself in the mountains

921
00:45:40,880 --> 00:45:42,640
Speaker 1: and some guy was like, Hey, I'm going on a

922
00:45:42,680 --> 00:45:45,920
Speaker 1: tar hunt this weekend to go get a bunch of

923
00:45:45,960 --> 00:45:47,719
Speaker 1: tar meat for my family. Do you want to come

924
00:45:47,719 --> 00:45:51,360
Speaker 1: along and help me backpack the tar meat off the mountains? Yeah?

925
00:45:51,520 --> 00:45:53,040
Speaker 1: And then when I'm up there, he says, hey, do

926
00:45:53,040 --> 00:45:54,560
Speaker 1: you want to shoot one? You know, you don't need

927
00:45:54,560 --> 00:45:56,400
Speaker 1: a license for it. You can use my rifle or whatever.

928
00:45:56,440 --> 00:45:59,359
Speaker 1: Do you want to shoot one? Yeah? And then all

929
00:45:59,400 --> 00:46:01,759
Speaker 1: of a sudden, that whole experience, to me is me

930
00:46:01,920 --> 00:46:05,160
Speaker 1: living my life in New zealand participating with a local

931
00:46:05,280 --> 00:46:08,399
Speaker 1: or participating with the wildlife in the habitat and going

932
00:46:08,400 --> 00:46:10,840
Speaker 1: about my days and learning the culture and really having

933
00:46:10,880 --> 00:46:14,640
Speaker 1: this barrier entry of belonging, which is a complete opposite

934
00:46:14,680 --> 00:46:16,440
Speaker 1: of a ten day hunt in the Mabia where I'm

935
00:46:16,440 --> 00:46:18,960
Speaker 1: trying to say, hey, I shot eight planes games. Yeah,

936
00:46:18,960 --> 00:46:21,719
Speaker 1: it's a depth, depth of perspective, you know, like I've

937
00:46:21,719 --> 00:46:24,600
Speaker 1: always you know. That's why I think storytelling is great,

938
00:46:24,600 --> 00:46:26,839
Speaker 1: because you can tell a story, right, You can tell

939
00:46:26,840 --> 00:46:30,600
Speaker 1: a story about your experience without without coming by, without

940
00:46:31,160 --> 00:46:33,719
Speaker 1: you know, coloring it as an expert, like this is

941
00:46:33,760 --> 00:46:37,000
Speaker 1: just my experience. I was only there for ten days. Yeah,

942
00:46:37,040 --> 00:46:39,319
Speaker 1: I can't tell you. I can tell you what I experienced,

943
00:46:39,600 --> 00:46:42,319
Speaker 1: and hopefully you know if you've never been to that area,

944
00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:44,200
Speaker 1: of the world experienced that it gives you a little

945
00:46:44,200 --> 00:46:46,719
Speaker 1: bit of a window into what might be happening. But

946
00:46:46,800 --> 00:46:49,560
Speaker 1: what you're talking about is just purely a depth of experience.

947
00:46:49,600 --> 00:46:52,360
Speaker 1: You know, like the more time you spend, the better

948
00:46:53,160 --> 00:46:56,400
Speaker 1: UM you're able to, you know, take that experience across

949
00:46:56,480 --> 00:46:59,319
Speaker 1: other folks. It adds up to so much more. It

950
00:46:59,360 --> 00:47:02,520
Speaker 1: adds up to so much more in and UM. I

951
00:47:02,600 --> 00:47:04,360
Speaker 1: learned this from a pilot. One time I tried to

952
00:47:04,400 --> 00:47:06,520
Speaker 1: do this. I was fly fishing in Alaska. I was

953
00:47:06,560 --> 00:47:08,640
Speaker 1: up there doing research for the US Fishing Wildlife Service.

954
00:47:09,040 --> 00:47:11,520
Speaker 1: I was doing a bunch of fly fishing, and I

955
00:47:11,560 --> 00:47:14,880
Speaker 1: had maybe six or seven days before I had to

956
00:47:14,920 --> 00:47:18,160
Speaker 1: fly out too before I had to go home because

957
00:47:18,160 --> 00:47:20,359
Speaker 1: I had another project I had to work on. And

958
00:47:20,440 --> 00:47:22,600
Speaker 1: I talked to this pilot friend of mine, Doug Brewer,

959
00:47:22,680 --> 00:47:24,839
Speaker 1: and I said, hey, dog, this was back when, um

960
00:47:25,040 --> 00:47:27,880
Speaker 1: there was a herd in western Alaska called the mold Chatten,

961
00:47:27,880 --> 00:47:30,359
Speaker 1: a herd of caribou. So I said, Doug, he can

962
00:47:30,400 --> 00:47:33,040
Speaker 1: fly me there and in a day, not even a day,

963
00:47:33,080 --> 00:47:35,160
Speaker 1: a couple of hours. So I said, Doug, will you

964
00:47:35,200 --> 00:47:38,240
Speaker 1: fly me and drop me off? Um and by myself

965
00:47:38,239 --> 00:47:40,399
Speaker 1: in the middle chatten herd or by the mold chatten herd.

966
00:47:40,440 --> 00:47:42,360
Speaker 1: I just want to camp. I have two and a

967
00:47:42,360 --> 00:47:45,879
Speaker 1: half days to hunt and then I'll meet you fly back.

968
00:47:45,920 --> 00:47:48,200
Speaker 1: And he said, no, man, he's like, I'm not going

969
00:47:48,239 --> 00:47:50,600
Speaker 1: to fly you in there and for two and a

970
00:47:50,640 --> 00:47:52,120
Speaker 1: half days a hunt. I said why not. He's like,

971
00:47:52,160 --> 00:47:56,680
Speaker 1: because the animals deserve more than that, and and he said,

972
00:47:56,719 --> 00:48:03,040
Speaker 1: if you can stay for five days, it's it. That's

973
00:48:03,160 --> 00:48:06,160
Speaker 1: that's the beginning. If you can stay for seven days.

974
00:48:06,920 --> 00:48:09,239
Speaker 1: And the math doesn't add up here, so don't don't

975
00:48:10,000 --> 00:48:12,120
Speaker 1: your listeners, don't hang me on this. But if you

976
00:48:12,120 --> 00:48:14,759
Speaker 1: can stay seven days, that's ten times more than five days.

977
00:48:15,000 --> 00:48:17,319
Speaker 1: If you can stay ten days, that's ten times more

978
00:48:17,360 --> 00:48:19,480
Speaker 1: than seven days. If you can stay fourteen days is

979
00:48:19,520 --> 00:48:22,319
Speaker 1: ten times more than ten days. And he's basically saying

980
00:48:22,360 --> 00:48:24,919
Speaker 1: like every two days that you give this, you're gonna

981
00:48:24,920 --> 00:48:27,520
Speaker 1: have ten times the experience that you would have had.

982
00:48:27,800 --> 00:48:30,360
Speaker 1: And so he's like for two and a half days, no, No,

983
00:48:30,480 --> 00:48:32,200
Speaker 1: I'm not flying you in there. You might with a

984
00:48:32,280 --> 00:48:34,040
Speaker 1: high part rifle, or you get lucky with the ball,

985
00:48:34,040 --> 00:48:38,360
Speaker 1: you might smash a big bowl um before I have

986
00:48:38,360 --> 00:48:40,200
Speaker 1: to com pick you out. But He's like, that's not hunting,

987
00:48:40,880 --> 00:48:44,400
Speaker 1: you know. And I was still learning my own wisdoms

988
00:48:44,400 --> 00:48:46,920
Speaker 1: and learning my own ropes and even what it meant

989
00:48:46,960 --> 00:48:48,960
Speaker 1: to be a hunter then, and so you know, to me,

990
00:48:49,000 --> 00:48:51,360
Speaker 1: I was like, yeah, zip in there, shoot a giant bowl.

991
00:48:51,920 --> 00:48:54,120
Speaker 1: Quarterm up, carrying back to camp, get back in then plane,

992
00:48:54,440 --> 00:48:56,879
Speaker 1: take some photos. Great hunt, I go home. I go yeah.

993
00:48:56,920 --> 00:48:58,200
Speaker 1: I killed the caribol and one of them for two

994
00:48:58,200 --> 00:49:01,000
Speaker 1: and a a half days, expert, patting myself on the back,

995
00:49:01,040 --> 00:49:03,280
Speaker 1: you know. And then Doug's like no, no, no, And

996
00:49:03,280 --> 00:49:07,480
Speaker 1: and it was funny because fast forward several several years.

997
00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:11,719
Speaker 1: I spent twenty five days in the Arctic and the

998
00:49:11,760 --> 00:49:13,399
Speaker 1: guy picked me up pilot pick and it was really

999
00:49:13,400 --> 00:49:16,280
Speaker 1: cool because they dropped this off as basically summer. Everything

1000
00:49:16,320 --> 00:49:18,759
Speaker 1: was green, the bugs were bad, it was warm during

1001
00:49:18,800 --> 00:49:21,279
Speaker 1: the day. Picked me up. Twenty five days later, the

1002
00:49:21,360 --> 00:49:24,160
Speaker 1: river was frozen solid and no attack was frozen solid

1003
00:49:24,440 --> 00:49:27,040
Speaker 1: snow on the ground. The moose had went through their

1004
00:49:27,080 --> 00:49:29,359
Speaker 1: complete rot cycle, and we're moving on with their lives

1005
00:49:29,400 --> 00:49:32,319
Speaker 1: are in the breeding cycle now, and and um, you know,

1006
00:49:32,360 --> 00:49:35,640
Speaker 1: we went from watching black bears and grizzly bears lazily

1007
00:49:35,680 --> 00:49:39,080
Speaker 1: loaf around the tundra, eating grass and nipping in this,

1008
00:49:39,160 --> 00:49:44,480
Speaker 1: and nipping in this, going into hyper hyper um feeding

1009
00:49:44,560 --> 00:49:47,440
Speaker 1: to get ready for hibernation, and watching them cross ground

1010
00:49:47,440 --> 00:49:49,640
Speaker 1: squirrels and blueberries and all this stuff trying to get ready,

1011
00:49:49,640 --> 00:49:53,239
Speaker 1: trying to and so literally watched the evolution of this

1012
00:49:53,360 --> 00:49:55,600
Speaker 1: landscape over twenty five days. And when the pilot picked

1013
00:49:55,600 --> 00:49:58,200
Speaker 1: me up, you know, we're flying back and he's like, uh,

1014
00:49:58,280 --> 00:50:01,080
Speaker 1: did you see any seeny wolves. I'm like yeah, I

1015
00:50:01,080 --> 00:50:04,040
Speaker 1: got surrounded by two different packs twice and he's like,

1016
00:50:04,080 --> 00:50:06,040
Speaker 1: oh cool. He's like seeing grizzly bears. I'm like yeah,

1017
00:50:06,040 --> 00:50:09,440
Speaker 1: I mean I saw ten different grizzly bears, two giant boars.

1018
00:50:09,520 --> 00:50:12,600
Speaker 1: One charged me. And he's like, did you see any

1019
00:50:12,680 --> 00:50:16,280
Speaker 1: black bears. I'm like, oh, I saw twelve big, plump

1020
00:50:16,520 --> 00:50:18,799
Speaker 1: black bears and and stocked a couple of them and

1021
00:50:19,040 --> 00:50:21,600
Speaker 1: took photographs and you know, you see any moves. Yeah,

1022
00:50:21,600 --> 00:50:24,080
Speaker 1: I saw fifty moose And he's like, yeah, I seen

1023
00:50:24,080 --> 00:50:27,279
Speaker 1: any bowls over sevent I'm like yeah, most of them.

1024
00:50:27,440 --> 00:50:31,120
Speaker 1: Like I saw moose fighting, and I saw them, you know,

1025
00:50:31,400 --> 00:50:34,440
Speaker 1: breeding cows, and I saw them with giant harems, and

1026
00:50:34,440 --> 00:50:37,239
Speaker 1: I saw them form these harems and everything. He asked me.

1027
00:50:37,760 --> 00:50:40,239
Speaker 1: I was like, yeah, do you hear any wolves? How? Oh? Yeah,

1028
00:50:40,280 --> 00:50:42,920
Speaker 1: you see the northern lights? Yeah, all this stuff, like,

1029
00:50:43,440 --> 00:50:46,800
Speaker 1: but it took twenty five days to do all that stuff.

1030
00:50:46,920 --> 00:50:49,120
Speaker 1: And still it's just I mean, you think about it.

1031
00:50:49,120 --> 00:50:51,759
Speaker 1: I watched it go from summer to what you could

1032
00:50:51,800 --> 00:50:56,600
Speaker 1: nearly confuse his winter in twenty five days, and uh god,

1033
00:50:57,000 --> 00:50:58,880
Speaker 1: that's all I want to do. Ever. Now it's just

1034
00:50:59,280 --> 00:51:00,680
Speaker 1: like if I can go, why to hunting and I

1035
00:51:00,760 --> 00:51:03,640
Speaker 1: wa for days or thirty days or yeah? Great? Well

1036
00:51:03,640 --> 00:51:05,759
Speaker 1: and as a traveling hunter, right, I I recently moved

1037
00:51:05,800 --> 00:51:07,400
Speaker 1: to Montane and a big part of that for me

1038
00:51:07,520 --> 00:51:09,240
Speaker 1: was I got to thinking, and this is a fucking

1039
00:51:09,719 --> 00:51:12,360
Speaker 1: first world problem if there ever was one. But I

1040
00:51:12,440 --> 00:51:15,799
Speaker 1: got I got to thinking. I do a lot of traveling, right,

1041
00:51:15,880 --> 00:51:18,520
Speaker 1: travel around the world hunting and done all this and

1042
00:51:19,040 --> 00:51:20,400
Speaker 1: the one thing I feel like I'm missing in my

1043
00:51:20,480 --> 00:51:24,240
Speaker 1: hunting life, and moved around for work a lot, you know, Illinois, Texas,

1044
00:51:24,239 --> 00:51:27,800
Speaker 1: different places, Like I want to plant my flag somewhere

1045
00:51:28,800 --> 00:51:31,680
Speaker 1: and not not only go travel the world and like

1046
00:51:31,760 --> 00:51:34,440
Speaker 1: get and gather perspectives and meet from these places and

1047
00:51:34,440 --> 00:51:38,880
Speaker 1: experiences and bring them back But have you know, have

1048
00:51:39,000 --> 00:51:41,319
Speaker 1: a place where I live that I have such an

1049
00:51:41,360 --> 00:51:44,839
Speaker 1: intense relationship with that could be informed and informed by

1050
00:51:44,880 --> 00:51:47,760
Speaker 1: these other places I go on hunt because I felt

1051
00:51:47,800 --> 00:51:50,880
Speaker 1: like I had all these great traveling hunting experience, But

1052
00:51:50,960 --> 00:51:53,840
Speaker 1: when I went back in this just in this context

1053
00:51:53,840 --> 00:51:56,759
Speaker 1: of Texas, it could have been anywhere. I'm looking around like, man,

1054
00:51:56,760 --> 00:52:00,200
Speaker 1: I don't have any relationship with this place, and that

1055
00:52:00,600 --> 00:52:02,839
Speaker 1: it kind of disconnects everything else, because what am I

1056
00:52:02,880 --> 00:52:05,080
Speaker 1: really trying to build upon if it's not to go

1057
00:52:05,200 --> 00:52:07,239
Speaker 1: home and be better at what I'm doing in my

1058
00:52:07,280 --> 00:52:10,719
Speaker 1: backyard and your backyard is I told people that all

1059
00:52:10,719 --> 00:52:14,320
Speaker 1: the time. If you being in Montana. Now this is

1060
00:52:14,360 --> 00:52:17,400
Speaker 1: not a very grand statement to make, but I currently

1061
00:52:17,440 --> 00:52:21,000
Speaker 1: live in Hudson, Wisconsin, and if somebody told me, I

1062
00:52:21,040 --> 00:52:22,680
Speaker 1: love it too. But if somebody told me, hey, for

1063
00:52:22,719 --> 00:52:26,160
Speaker 1: the next I'm forty four years old, that they said,

1064
00:52:26,200 --> 00:52:28,600
Speaker 1: from from today to the day you die, you can

1065
00:52:28,640 --> 00:52:32,160
Speaker 1: only hunt within twenty five miles of your house, Okay,

1066
00:52:32,480 --> 00:52:34,440
Speaker 1: no problem. I love the things that I go do,

1067
00:52:34,640 --> 00:52:36,200
Speaker 1: I love the place that I get to go see,

1068
00:52:36,960 --> 00:52:38,920
Speaker 1: but I will be like a kid in a candy

1069
00:52:38,960 --> 00:52:42,359
Speaker 1: store within twenty five miles of my house, catching little

1070
00:52:42,400 --> 00:52:47,360
Speaker 1: itty bitty trout, shooting three pheasants a year, um hunting

1071
00:52:47,360 --> 00:52:51,120
Speaker 1: white till deer nearly every day of the season, rough grouse,

1072
00:52:52,360 --> 00:52:57,120
Speaker 1: huge Canada geese, docks, catching walleyes, moski smallmouth bass. Like,

1073
00:52:57,880 --> 00:53:00,160
Speaker 1: there's so much. I'm not talking about the people live

1074
00:53:00,200 --> 00:53:03,239
Speaker 1: in New York City, but there's so much in your neighborhood.

1075
00:53:03,360 --> 00:53:05,320
Speaker 1: People say, oh, man, I wish i'd go sheep hunting.

1076
00:53:05,719 --> 00:53:07,239
Speaker 1: I say, I wish you could go sheep hunting two.

1077
00:53:07,280 --> 00:53:09,279
Speaker 1: And I know it's really expensive, but you want to

1078
00:53:09,280 --> 00:53:11,680
Speaker 1: know something. The first seven sheep hunts I went on

1079
00:53:12,200 --> 00:53:14,440
Speaker 1: were me backpacking for friends of mine that were going

1080
00:53:14,480 --> 00:53:16,640
Speaker 1: on sheep hunts. And I paid my own airfare, I

1081
00:53:16,680 --> 00:53:18,239
Speaker 1: paid for my own hotel, and I paid for my

1082
00:53:18,280 --> 00:53:20,960
Speaker 1: own food. And I walked in their footsteps on the hunt,

1083
00:53:21,280 --> 00:53:23,319
Speaker 1: watched them kill a sheep, helped them cut it up,

1084
00:53:23,480 --> 00:53:26,719
Speaker 1: filled my backpack two and hiked it out. And I

1085
00:53:26,800 --> 00:53:30,160
Speaker 1: consider those sheep punts every bit is. I don't the

1086
00:53:30,239 --> 00:53:33,880
Speaker 1: horns sit in their homes, but every ounce of that

1087
00:53:33,920 --> 00:53:36,320
Speaker 1: sheep hunt was ours. You didn't send the bull, but

1088
00:53:36,400 --> 00:53:38,640
Speaker 1: he's still You're still there, He's still a part of it. Yeah,

1089
00:53:38,680 --> 00:53:40,160
Speaker 1: and so that's what I mean. Like when I was

1090
00:53:40,200 --> 00:53:43,360
Speaker 1: a kid, um, I was in Alaska one time. I

1091
00:53:43,360 --> 00:53:46,040
Speaker 1: don't remember. I was there fishing, and I was in

1092
00:53:46,120 --> 00:53:49,200
Speaker 1: the hotel and anchorage. And if you've never been an anchorage,

1093
00:53:49,200 --> 00:53:51,279
Speaker 1: it's so amazing because you can walk out of your

1094
00:53:51,280 --> 00:53:53,879
Speaker 1: hotel room and the chewcatch mountains are right there. I mean,

1095
00:53:53,880 --> 00:53:56,759
Speaker 1: you walk out of your hotel room be looking at

1096
00:53:56,800 --> 00:53:59,200
Speaker 1: a gas station and also looking at some of the

1097
00:53:59,360 --> 00:54:02,759
Speaker 1: finest all sheep and moose habitat in the world in

1098
00:54:02,800 --> 00:54:05,879
Speaker 1: the same view. And so I remember I came out

1099
00:54:05,880 --> 00:54:08,360
Speaker 1: of I was staying at a hotel called the puffing In.

1100
00:54:08,719 --> 00:54:11,520
Speaker 1: It's a little crappy hotel in here. The it's really nice,

1101
00:54:11,520 --> 00:54:13,400
Speaker 1: actually puffing In. I'm sorry, I said that, it's actually

1102
00:54:13,440 --> 00:54:16,680
Speaker 1: really nice. But I'm at the puffing In. I might

1103
00:54:16,680 --> 00:54:19,000
Speaker 1: get a coupon, but I'm at the puffing In. This

1104
00:54:19,040 --> 00:54:21,719
Speaker 1: guy comes walking out of his door on the outside,

1105
00:54:21,719 --> 00:54:24,439
Speaker 1: and he was wearing blue jeans and a flannel shirt

1106
00:54:24,440 --> 00:54:26,480
Speaker 1: and kind of looked like Tom Selleck. And he goes, hey,

1107
00:54:26,560 --> 00:54:28,000
Speaker 1: how are you doing. I said, I'm good. He's what

1108
00:54:28,000 --> 00:54:30,080
Speaker 1: are you doing? I said, I'm here fly fishing. He's like, cool,

1109
00:54:30,360 --> 00:54:32,040
Speaker 1: So what are you doing. He's like, I'm doll sheep,

1110
00:54:32,520 --> 00:54:36,640
Speaker 1: just like, man alive, Are you serious your dolls sheep?

1111
00:54:36,680 --> 00:54:38,200
Speaker 1: And he's like yeah, And I'm like back then a

1112
00:54:38,239 --> 00:54:40,719
Speaker 1: doll sheep and was like eight grand, Like, oh my god,

1113
00:54:40,760 --> 00:54:42,960
Speaker 1: you bought a eight doll dollar sheep on He's it's like,

1114
00:54:43,000 --> 00:54:48,719
Speaker 1: I'm going before as soon as you purchased it. Yeah.

1115
00:54:48,800 --> 00:54:50,359
Speaker 1: And so I sat there and talked to that guy

1116
00:54:50,440 --> 00:54:54,800
Speaker 1: like he was king in the world, and I I wished,

1117
00:54:54,960 --> 00:54:56,920
Speaker 1: I wish we could have coordinated our trips to where

1118
00:54:56,920 --> 00:54:58,759
Speaker 1: I could hurt his stories afterwards. But I was so

1119
00:54:58,920 --> 00:55:01,960
Speaker 1: enamored with doll sheep, with Alaska, with the things that

1120
00:55:02,000 --> 00:55:05,360
Speaker 1: I was doing. And on that particular trip, I packed

1121
00:55:06,280 --> 00:55:09,399
Speaker 1: using candle light because my electricity was shut off and

1122
00:55:10,280 --> 00:55:12,720
Speaker 1: I couldn't even shower before I head to there approached

1123
00:55:12,760 --> 00:55:15,080
Speaker 1: my water was also shut off, and so but I

1124
00:55:15,120 --> 00:55:18,560
Speaker 1: was I wasn't paying my bills necessarily on time, but

1125
00:55:18,640 --> 00:55:20,880
Speaker 1: I was still going to Alaska because that's where I

1126
00:55:20,880 --> 00:55:24,759
Speaker 1: wanted to be, And so talking to this guy, I

1127
00:55:24,840 --> 00:55:27,560
Speaker 1: was just like, it's just such a dream, Like I

1128
00:55:27,600 --> 00:55:29,239
Speaker 1: can't believe I'm talking to a doulshep onter. I can't

1129
00:55:29,239 --> 00:55:31,280
Speaker 1: believe I'm talking to a dollshep onter right now. And

1130
00:55:31,280 --> 00:55:33,840
Speaker 1: and that stuff is just always enveloped my life always,

1131
00:55:33,840 --> 00:55:36,840
Speaker 1: and so I whether it be Bozeman or hot some

1132
00:55:36,880 --> 00:55:41,280
Speaker 1: Wisconsin or whatever. Like you look in your yard, sincerely,

1133
00:55:41,360 --> 00:55:45,520
Speaker 1: have this idea of adventure in your head. Sincerely, embody

1134
00:55:45,719 --> 00:55:48,000
Speaker 1: what it means to be a hunter, whether that be

1135
00:55:48,040 --> 00:55:50,759
Speaker 1: a gray squirrel, on antelope, a mule deer, a white

1136
00:55:50,760 --> 00:55:54,399
Speaker 1: till dear, a pheasant. You embodied these things. And whether

1137
00:55:54,480 --> 00:55:57,120
Speaker 1: you're breaking down a gray squil, you're breaking down an antelope,

1138
00:55:57,400 --> 00:56:01,839
Speaker 1: it is the exact same thing. It's the exact same thing.

1139
00:56:02,600 --> 00:56:07,400
Speaker 1: Shooting two snowshoe hair, walking out wearing wool slacks and

1140
00:56:07,440 --> 00:56:09,960
Speaker 1: a flannel shirt and your dad's jacket, and you have

1141
00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:14,200
Speaker 1: an old shotgun and two fat snowshoe hairs in your knuckles. Yeah,

1142
00:56:14,239 --> 00:56:16,480
Speaker 1: you might as well be holding onto a fourty inch

1143
00:56:16,520 --> 00:56:18,160
Speaker 1: dollar ship as far as I'm concerned. Do you feel

1144
00:56:18,200 --> 00:56:20,360
Speaker 1: like that's I always think about that. It's like, is it?

1145
00:56:20,360 --> 00:56:22,360
Speaker 1: It's I feel like it's a perfect hunting life to

1146
00:56:22,440 --> 00:56:25,600
Speaker 1: have that at home. But then also be lucky enough,

1147
00:56:25,680 --> 00:56:28,560
Speaker 1: like you have been, and I have been to go

1148
00:56:28,640 --> 00:56:32,319
Speaker 1: out and travel and see those things and be able

1149
00:56:32,360 --> 00:56:35,000
Speaker 1: to you know, have both those at the same time.

1150
00:56:36,200 --> 00:56:40,799
Speaker 1: And that's fair. Yeah. I hear guys all the time.

1151
00:56:40,840 --> 00:56:42,919
Speaker 1: They talk about and we all do. They talk about,

1152
00:56:42,960 --> 00:56:45,839
Speaker 1: Oh man, this guy like owners the Eddie, like, oh

1153
00:56:45,880 --> 00:56:53,920
Speaker 1: my god, they sold their company for hundreds of millions. WHOA, yeah, okay,

1154
00:56:53,920 --> 00:56:56,600
Speaker 1: like that's really cool. But I don't even know. If

1155
00:56:56,640 --> 00:56:58,960
Speaker 1: I was a billionaire, I would still do this because

1156
00:56:58,960 --> 00:57:01,080
Speaker 1: I still want to go to these hunts. I'd still

1157
00:57:01,120 --> 00:57:03,919
Speaker 1: want to see these places in North America. I still

1158
00:57:03,920 --> 00:57:06,600
Speaker 1: want to tell you about him. I'd still be hiring

1159
00:57:06,600 --> 00:57:08,640
Speaker 1: guys that are as talented and I could find, which

1160
00:57:09,040 --> 00:57:11,160
Speaker 1: doesn't even matter how much I pay the guys that

1161
00:57:11,239 --> 00:57:13,480
Speaker 1: work with me, because I can only pay him so much.

1162
00:57:13,760 --> 00:57:19,400
Speaker 1: And there's such soulful individuals and such craftsmen that I'm

1163
00:57:19,400 --> 00:57:21,120
Speaker 1: not gonna say it wouldn't matter what I pay them,

1164
00:57:21,160 --> 00:57:24,440
Speaker 1: because you know they we're all in this together. But

1165
00:57:24,640 --> 00:57:28,040
Speaker 1: it's it's what we love to do and in the

1166
00:57:28,040 --> 00:57:30,240
Speaker 1: craft that we love doing, love doing it for other companies.

1167
00:57:30,240 --> 00:57:32,320
Speaker 1: You know, we've never worked with Yetdie, but like working

1168
00:57:32,320 --> 00:57:35,560
Speaker 1: with Shields or we're gonna like love what we do,

1169
00:57:35,800 --> 00:57:38,920
Speaker 1: love going to these places, like it doesn't matter necessarily

1170
00:57:38,920 --> 00:57:40,400
Speaker 1: that you have all this money. That's why I like.

1171
00:57:40,440 --> 00:57:44,080
Speaker 1: If I run into a guy at the show and he's, yeah, yeah,

1172
00:57:44,080 --> 00:57:46,680
Speaker 1: I'm a grand slammer man when I got all four sheeps, like,

1173
00:57:46,720 --> 00:57:51,600
Speaker 1: oh okay, that's great. Well, um, that's cool. I don't know.

1174
00:57:51,640 --> 00:57:55,040
Speaker 1: But if I run into Chuck Adams, if Chuck Adams says, hey,

1175
00:57:55,120 --> 00:57:58,240
Speaker 1: Donny and trust me, Chuck Adams has no idea I'm

1176
00:57:58,280 --> 00:58:00,240
Speaker 1: even alive. But if I run in, it's I got

1177
00:58:00,280 --> 00:58:03,040
Speaker 1: up and he says, hey, um, let me. If I

1178
00:58:03,040 --> 00:58:04,880
Speaker 1: had a cup of coffee, I'd like to sit down

1179
00:58:04,920 --> 00:58:07,320
Speaker 1: and tell you about my four sheep hunts. I'd like

1180
00:58:07,320 --> 00:58:08,960
Speaker 1: to sit down and tell you about what my grand

1181
00:58:08,960 --> 00:58:11,520
Speaker 1: slam meant to me with my bow and the equipment

1182
00:58:11,520 --> 00:58:13,320
Speaker 1: I was using, the bows I was using, the places

1183
00:58:13,320 --> 00:58:14,640
Speaker 1: that I went, and the shots that I took, and

1184
00:58:14,680 --> 00:58:20,760
Speaker 1: the things that I saw. I would freak out what

1185
00:58:21,040 --> 00:58:26,760
Speaker 1: I would freak like coffee, but I will chuck some seriously.

1186
00:58:26,800 --> 00:58:29,040
Speaker 1: I would if I had the opportunity to sit down

1187
00:58:29,040 --> 00:58:31,560
Speaker 1: with him and hear him tell me his hunting stories,

1188
00:58:31,800 --> 00:58:35,840
Speaker 1: what the gear he's using his approach why he shot

1189
00:58:35,840 --> 00:58:39,520
Speaker 1: the one he did, Like, yeah, there's so much flip out, man,

1190
00:58:39,640 --> 00:58:42,360
Speaker 1: there's so much respective in that. Yeah, And I think

1191
00:58:42,840 --> 00:58:46,440
Speaker 1: truly when you talk about the Grand Slams and now

1192
00:58:46,600 --> 00:58:48,240
Speaker 1: you know, I was thinking about the Grand Slam in

1193
00:58:48,280 --> 00:58:50,720
Speaker 1: Dolls Dream this year. I thought, I want to get

1194
00:58:50,880 --> 00:58:53,560
Speaker 1: the Grand Slam in Turkey, Yeah, in one year. And

1195
00:58:53,600 --> 00:58:55,760
Speaker 1: I thought, is that Am I wrong for this? Fucking

1196
00:58:55,920 --> 00:58:58,080
Speaker 1: doing it for the wrong reasons? But I was like, no,

1197
00:58:58,120 --> 00:59:01,280
Speaker 1: I'm not. I don't think so. Then I was like, fucking,

1198
00:59:01,640 --> 00:59:04,480
Speaker 1: I'm doing it like I tend to. You may be

1199
00:59:04,600 --> 00:59:06,600
Speaker 1: like me. I tend to overthink all types of ship

1200
00:59:06,640 --> 00:59:08,880
Speaker 1: when it comes to hunting. Now, there are there are

1201
00:59:08,880 --> 00:59:10,959
Speaker 1: a number of people that I have in my life

1202
00:59:10,960 --> 00:59:13,400
Speaker 1: that if they listen to this, will be shaking their

1203
00:59:13,440 --> 00:59:15,800
Speaker 1: head yes, because I will. I got a lot of

1204
00:59:15,880 --> 00:59:18,400
Speaker 1: listeners who are like, listen, call the funk down. Man,

1205
00:59:18,880 --> 00:59:21,800
Speaker 1: it's just a picture, Like I don't know, see if

1206
00:59:21,840 --> 00:59:23,600
Speaker 1: you on the same way, and if you say something

1207
00:59:23,640 --> 00:59:25,040
Speaker 1: to me, I'll be like, did you see the way

1208
00:59:25,040 --> 00:59:29,480
Speaker 1: he was standing next? Like no, yeah, Like I don't know,

1209
00:59:30,560 --> 00:59:33,240
Speaker 1: but yeah, there's this somebody like that. It's like it

1210
00:59:33,320 --> 00:59:36,560
Speaker 1: got a little twisted in that the Grand Slam for

1211
00:59:36,600 --> 00:59:41,680
Speaker 1: somebody like Chuck Adams. I don't know Chuck, obviously, but

1212
00:59:42,000 --> 00:59:44,240
Speaker 1: it was more than just the collection of it, and

1213
00:59:44,880 --> 00:59:48,320
Speaker 1: right it was. It was his life's experiences in his

1214
00:59:48,400 --> 00:59:53,320
Speaker 1: way to um, you know, to express his hunting expertise

1215
00:59:53,320 --> 00:59:55,000
Speaker 1: and his hunting life. That's that's what it was. It

1216
00:59:55,080 --> 00:59:59,120
Speaker 1: was him taking his craft two different places, like, Okay,

1217
00:59:59,200 --> 01:00:02,400
Speaker 1: I've solved this maze. I heard they have a really

1218
01:00:02,400 --> 01:00:04,600
Speaker 1: cool mazing idahole um, So I'm gonna go out there

1219
01:00:04,640 --> 01:00:06,000
Speaker 1: and see if i can solve that maze. I hear

1220
01:00:06,000 --> 01:00:08,800
Speaker 1: there's another cool mazing Massachusetts. And so, like you said,

1221
01:00:08,800 --> 01:00:11,760
Speaker 1: it would be a mistake then to take that, take

1222
01:00:11,840 --> 01:00:16,600
Speaker 1: the number or and make that the achievement, right, because

1223
01:00:16,600 --> 01:00:19,240
Speaker 1: the achievement is honing your craft and using it and

1224
01:00:19,600 --> 01:00:22,520
Speaker 1: to be successful in that way. That the achievement is

1225
01:00:22,560 --> 01:00:25,600
Speaker 1: not the collection of the thing or the numbers. You know.

1226
01:00:25,680 --> 01:00:30,480
Speaker 1: The achievement is is finding respect from your peers through this,

1227
01:00:30,680 --> 01:00:33,520
Speaker 1: earning it. Yeah. Yeah, And so that's such a nebulous

1228
01:00:34,080 --> 01:00:36,600
Speaker 1: thing to figure out, but still it's there. It's still there,

1229
01:00:37,120 --> 01:00:38,840
Speaker 1: and if you're doing it right, I feel like, you know,

1230
01:00:38,880 --> 01:00:41,160
Speaker 1: you're doing it right. Yeah, and there's no question. Have

1231
01:00:41,280 --> 01:00:44,080
Speaker 1: you ever read um Aldo Leopold, Oh yeah, yeah, I

1232
01:00:44,160 --> 01:00:48,640
Speaker 1: just like that guy, Sands County. Yeah, I mean like

1233
01:00:48,760 --> 01:00:54,600
Speaker 1: I I I travel with the Sand County Almanac in

1234
01:00:54,640 --> 01:01:02,200
Speaker 1: my backpack every day, and I'll it's just so perfectly written,

1235
01:01:03,040 --> 01:01:07,120
Speaker 1: so perfectly lived. He knows why he's a hunter, he

1236
01:01:07,160 --> 01:01:10,360
Speaker 1: knows what it embodies to be a hunter because of

1237
01:01:11,200 --> 01:01:13,800
Speaker 1: the craft that he is, of the steward that he

1238
01:01:13,920 --> 01:01:16,560
Speaker 1: is for the land, and he realizes the relationship between

1239
01:01:17,080 --> 01:01:20,480
Speaker 1: the plants and the berries, and the grouse and the

1240
01:01:20,520 --> 01:01:24,040
Speaker 1: woodcock and the songbirds and the white tail deer and

1241
01:01:24,080 --> 01:01:27,320
Speaker 1: the dock. And it's just it just I've learned so

1242
01:01:27,400 --> 01:01:29,560
Speaker 1: much from that, man. I know, you know you talked

1243
01:01:29,560 --> 01:01:31,160
Speaker 1: to guys like Steve Ronella. I'd say the same thing.

1244
01:01:31,600 --> 01:01:33,400
Speaker 1: Read that and it defined me. Do you want to

1245
01:01:33,400 --> 01:01:35,560
Speaker 1: know what I'm embarrassed. I've never talked to Steve. I've

1246
01:01:35,560 --> 01:01:38,400
Speaker 1: never met Steve. I've never listened to a single podcast

1247
01:01:38,400 --> 01:01:41,920
Speaker 1: of his. It's gonna change, It's gonna change, and I have.

1248
01:01:42,240 --> 01:01:47,240
Speaker 1: I was given recently. I was given his book The

1249
01:01:47,280 --> 01:01:53,720
Speaker 1: American Bison, American Buffalo, American Buffalo Um so somebody just

1250
01:01:53,800 --> 01:01:55,880
Speaker 1: gave that to me, and it's very high on my

1251
01:01:55,920 --> 01:02:01,400
Speaker 1: list of my opinion. And I just and somebody who's

1252
01:02:01,400 --> 01:02:03,400
Speaker 1: into the history of these these wild creatures. You will

1253
01:02:03,480 --> 01:02:07,040
Speaker 1: love that book. I'll live for it. And so and then, um,

1254
01:02:07,160 --> 01:02:10,080
Speaker 1: somebody just got me his cookbook for Christmas. Good good.

1255
01:02:10,160 --> 01:02:13,840
Speaker 1: We said a lot of those things. Um yeah, it

1256
01:02:13,840 --> 01:02:16,320
Speaker 1: turns out people like to go to stuffy. In fact.

1257
01:02:16,600 --> 01:02:20,920
Speaker 1: Um so I have one, two, three, four, five, six

1258
01:02:20,920 --> 01:02:24,120
Speaker 1: guys in my crew, and four of us got the

1259
01:02:24,120 --> 01:02:28,440
Speaker 1: book for Christmas. That's all from different people. That's like, yeah, no,

1260
01:02:28,640 --> 01:02:31,280
Speaker 1: that's a product of like this, this product of And

1261
01:02:31,640 --> 01:02:33,200
Speaker 1: Steve says it all this time, and I think you're

1262
01:02:33,480 --> 01:02:37,640
Speaker 1: me and Steve have that's not an argument, But I come,

1263
01:02:37,760 --> 01:02:40,240
Speaker 1: I I fall on the y side, right. I'm always

1264
01:02:40,240 --> 01:02:42,120
Speaker 1: asking why are we doing stuff? Why are we doing stuff?

1265
01:02:42,120 --> 01:02:44,240
Speaker 1: That's why I have a podcast, because I just want

1266
01:02:44,240 --> 01:02:47,320
Speaker 1: to like find everyone's why and explore it and use

1267
01:02:47,360 --> 01:02:51,360
Speaker 1: that the paint a picture of kind of maybe they're collective. Um.

1268
01:02:51,480 --> 01:02:53,160
Speaker 1: And the point Steve may we did him and I

1269
01:02:53,200 --> 01:02:54,919
Speaker 1: did a podcast last week in Mexico, and he made

1270
01:02:54,920 --> 01:02:56,240
Speaker 1: the point of, like some people just want to have

1271
01:02:56,240 --> 01:02:58,720
Speaker 1: a good time. They want to always be saying like

1272
01:02:58,800 --> 01:03:02,160
Speaker 1: why why why? Some people just want to enjoy their

1273
01:03:02,160 --> 01:03:05,600
Speaker 1: time outside and enjoy nature and not have to be

1274
01:03:06,240 --> 01:03:10,440
Speaker 1: saddled with this you know, pretentious why why why? And

1275
01:03:10,560 --> 01:03:12,919
Speaker 1: you put out probably the first time I ever really

1276
01:03:12,920 --> 01:03:14,880
Speaker 1: thought hard about it, you put out a video called

1277
01:03:15,160 --> 01:03:17,200
Speaker 1: why we Hunt? Who we Are, Who we are? We

1278
01:03:17,240 --> 01:03:19,240
Speaker 1: are who we are, which was about why we hunt.

1279
01:03:20,240 --> 01:03:22,080
Speaker 1: And um, I've listened to the story of how that

1280
01:03:22,160 --> 01:03:23,880
Speaker 1: kind of came to be and how you did it,

1281
01:03:24,000 --> 01:03:26,200
Speaker 1: and um, I think that was one of the first

1282
01:03:26,240 --> 01:03:30,360
Speaker 1: times that I thought like this, non hunters and people

1283
01:03:30,400 --> 01:03:34,560
Speaker 1: that don't do this need this. It's it's we can

1284
01:03:34,760 --> 01:03:36,600
Speaker 1: you know, all of us is in the hunting bubble

1285
01:03:36,640 --> 01:03:39,080
Speaker 1: can criticize what Donnie might have said there, or we

1286
01:03:39,160 --> 01:03:42,360
Speaker 1: might not agree exactly with the why he said. It

1287
01:03:42,520 --> 01:03:45,400
Speaker 1: was not for us, man, this is like, this isn't

1288
01:03:45,440 --> 01:03:50,000
Speaker 1: medicine for us, it's medicine for for the illness outside

1289
01:03:50,000 --> 01:03:53,440
Speaker 1: of And that wasn't glad you said that, because that

1290
01:03:53,480 --> 01:03:57,560
Speaker 1: wasn't well orchestrated. Yea, you made that temper tantrum. Yeah,

1291
01:03:57,560 --> 01:04:00,440
Speaker 1: you made that for Nagio. Correct that that's correct, because yeah,

1292
01:04:00,440 --> 01:04:03,800
Speaker 1: because this this girl from l A. Her name is Naomi,

1293
01:04:03,920 --> 01:04:09,240
Speaker 1: but she sat down, really stunning African American woman and vegetarian.

1294
01:04:09,720 --> 01:04:12,000
Speaker 1: But she said, yeah, Natio wants to know why you hunt,

1295
01:04:12,040 --> 01:04:16,840
Speaker 1: you know, And I was like oh. And then literally

1296
01:04:16,880 --> 01:04:18,560
Speaker 1: I couldn't come up with an answer, you know. I

1297
01:04:18,600 --> 01:04:21,400
Speaker 1: was like, oh, yeah, I hunt because I'm trying to

1298
01:04:21,400 --> 01:04:24,280
Speaker 1: come up with, you know, ecological reason. I'm thinking about

1299
01:04:24,320 --> 01:04:27,000
Speaker 1: like the North American Wildlife model, and I'm trying to

1300
01:04:27,000 --> 01:04:33,720
Speaker 1: think of really a y, a single y the base

1301
01:04:33,840 --> 01:04:35,920
Speaker 1: of the pyramid of wise and I couldn't really come

1302
01:04:36,000 --> 01:04:40,040
Speaker 1: up with one. So then we were in the Northwest

1303
01:04:40,120 --> 01:04:42,960
Speaker 1: Territories and and Um, William Altman, the guy that was

1304
01:04:42,960 --> 01:04:44,480
Speaker 1: shooting me on that triple he shot me on all

1305
01:04:44,520 --> 01:04:46,680
Speaker 1: the trips, but he was there and he's like, hey,

1306
01:04:46,760 --> 01:04:48,720
Speaker 1: let's just answer some of those questions as to why,

1307
01:04:48,880 --> 01:04:51,800
Speaker 1: you know, in a big rainstorm was coming and and

1308
01:04:51,920 --> 01:04:54,280
Speaker 1: um and so he hit record and I was talking

1309
01:04:54,320 --> 01:04:56,040
Speaker 1: in the camera and I'd lose my way or I

1310
01:04:56,120 --> 01:04:57,760
Speaker 1: talked to the camera and I fumble over my words,

1311
01:04:57,760 --> 01:05:00,520
Speaker 1: and I'd see this rainstorm coming and I just keep talking.

1312
01:05:00,560 --> 01:05:02,400
Speaker 1: I was looking and had the anxiety of the rainstorm

1313
01:05:02,440 --> 01:05:05,520
Speaker 1: coming and just getting piste off at myself that I

1314
01:05:05,560 --> 01:05:07,360
Speaker 1: kept fumbling over my words and my ideas and I

1315
01:05:07,360 --> 01:05:10,360
Speaker 1: didn't orchestrate anything out. And so then it got to

1316
01:05:10,400 --> 01:05:12,800
Speaker 1: where the rain was right there and and and Williams

1317
01:05:12,840 --> 01:05:15,120
Speaker 1: kind of like, dude, you gotta like we gotta do this,

1318
01:05:15,200 --> 01:05:16,919
Speaker 1: like the rain is coming, and I was like, cover

1319
01:05:17,000 --> 01:05:20,760
Speaker 1: off the camera, get out of my face, walk away,

1320
01:05:21,080 --> 01:05:23,480
Speaker 1: and I just had, you know, seven minute temper tantrum.

1321
01:05:23,600 --> 01:05:26,960
Speaker 1: And then that's what. So we talked about it a

1322
01:05:27,000 --> 01:05:28,760
Speaker 1: number of times that I would love to apart two

1323
01:05:29,200 --> 01:05:32,400
Speaker 1: and actually flesh out, like come up with an outline,

1324
01:05:32,960 --> 01:05:36,120
Speaker 1: flesh it out, really talk about it, um and do

1325
01:05:36,200 --> 01:05:39,000
Speaker 1: it still in an off the cuff manner, because that's

1326
01:05:39,000 --> 01:05:42,160
Speaker 1: how things are delivered the best for people to absorb.

1327
01:05:42,240 --> 01:05:45,360
Speaker 1: In my opinion, Um, but you're right, like that is

1328
01:05:45,480 --> 01:05:50,160
Speaker 1: that was just a poorly orchestrated temper tantrum. But answered

1329
01:05:50,160 --> 01:05:53,440
Speaker 1: a few. Yeah, And it was fun for me to watch,

1330
01:05:53,640 --> 01:05:55,919
Speaker 1: you know, not I fell non endemic. It's just people

1331
01:05:55,920 --> 01:05:58,120
Speaker 1: who don't think that we think it's it was fun

1332
01:05:58,120 --> 01:06:00,000
Speaker 1: for me to watch, like Outside magazine pick it up

1333
01:06:00,040 --> 01:06:02,560
Speaker 1: and other places to pick it up. And it's fun

1334
01:06:02,560 --> 01:06:04,240
Speaker 1: to me to just you know, just like you watched

1335
01:06:04,320 --> 01:06:08,680
Speaker 1: the person, the non hunter watched the other side. You know,

1336
01:06:09,840 --> 01:06:11,320
Speaker 1: something that I like to do is just watch that

1337
01:06:11,400 --> 01:06:14,280
Speaker 1: reaction and try. You know, you're you're always going to

1338
01:06:14,360 --> 01:06:17,360
Speaker 1: get the murder or murder. You're gonna get it, like

1339
01:06:17,400 --> 01:06:19,080
Speaker 1: we know you're gonna get it. But every once in

1340
01:06:19,080 --> 01:06:21,480
Speaker 1: a while, every ten comments or so where every you know,

1341
01:06:21,840 --> 01:06:25,840
Speaker 1: you'll get somebody like huh interesting. And that goes back

1342
01:06:25,880 --> 01:06:28,919
Speaker 1: to in my very first podcast with Ronnella, we talked

1343
01:06:28,960 --> 01:06:33,240
Speaker 1: about out of Loophole in in the Sans Cainli Almanac,

1344
01:06:33,520 --> 01:06:35,760
Speaker 1: the San kind of Almanac, and he said his brother

1345
01:06:35,800 --> 01:06:40,520
Speaker 1: read it and had a conservation epiphany and the ideas

1346
01:06:42,160 --> 01:06:44,960
Speaker 1: that were presented in that writing, and that in those

1347
01:06:44,960 --> 01:06:49,080
Speaker 1: writings like it was just not even through us, most

1348
01:06:49,160 --> 01:06:53,240
Speaker 1: was like directly affected his life. And that that exchange

1349
01:06:53,240 --> 01:06:57,240
Speaker 1: of ideas the person he's never met, changed who he was.

1350
01:06:57,840 --> 01:06:59,560
Speaker 1: And I think that's probably what we're all trying to

1351
01:06:59,560 --> 01:07:01,400
Speaker 1: do it and I and yeah, and I could say

1352
01:07:01,440 --> 01:07:05,360
Speaker 1: the same, like it changed. I fell into the hunting.

1353
01:07:05,880 --> 01:07:08,240
Speaker 1: I fell under the hunting umbrella that I see here

1354
01:07:08,280 --> 01:07:09,640
Speaker 1: in this room and that I see at the a

1355
01:07:09,800 --> 01:07:11,880
Speaker 1: t and I see in the hunting camps while around

1356
01:07:11,880 --> 01:07:14,240
Speaker 1: the country, and I felt this way a long time.

1357
01:07:14,240 --> 01:07:16,480
Speaker 1: And I don't mean this to be disrespectful or to

1358
01:07:17,240 --> 01:07:19,880
Speaker 1: make to elevate myself, but I'd go to all these

1359
01:07:19,920 --> 01:07:22,040
Speaker 1: hunting camps around the country and I talked to other hunters,

1360
01:07:23,120 --> 01:07:25,600
Speaker 1: and I would think, I have nothing in common with

1361
01:07:25,640 --> 01:07:27,800
Speaker 1: any of these guys other than we're we're both here

1362
01:07:27,840 --> 01:07:29,720
Speaker 1: hunting the white til deer in Illinois or whatever, like

1363
01:07:29,800 --> 01:07:35,080
Speaker 1: I and so. And it's just that I I assimilated

1364
01:07:35,120 --> 01:07:38,120
Speaker 1: with Aldo Leopold, like his connection to the land that

1365
01:07:38,200 --> 01:07:40,480
Speaker 1: he had, and I didn't really put two and two together.

1366
01:07:40,480 --> 01:07:42,240
Speaker 1: And I just kind of when I first started hunting,

1367
01:07:42,240 --> 01:07:44,920
Speaker 1: it was kind of that cause and effect, you know,

1368
01:07:44,960 --> 01:07:48,200
Speaker 1: Like I remember one time I shot a either shot.

1369
01:07:48,280 --> 01:07:50,920
Speaker 1: I think I shot a black cat chickeny once with

1370
01:07:51,000 --> 01:07:53,080
Speaker 1: a twelve gauge when I was a kid, just boom

1371
01:07:53,280 --> 01:07:57,200
Speaker 1: off this limb, you know, and it hit me hard,

1372
01:07:58,360 --> 01:08:00,959
Speaker 1: like I you know, I shot at this black capped

1373
01:08:01,000 --> 01:08:04,920
Speaker 1: chicken ee um, shot at it missed like it fluttered

1374
01:08:04,960 --> 01:08:06,720
Speaker 1: away before it shot at A miss shot at a

1375
01:08:06,800 --> 01:08:10,400
Speaker 1: miss shot at killed it. And then I went over

1376
01:08:10,400 --> 01:08:12,400
Speaker 1: there and saw its dead body, and of course had

1377
01:08:12,440 --> 01:08:14,080
Speaker 1: nothing to do with it. It's a black cap chicken.

1378
01:08:14,080 --> 01:08:17,200
Speaker 1: I just shot at the twelve gage. Yeah, so here,

1379
01:08:17,240 --> 01:08:22,840
Speaker 1: I literally just was. I popped a balloon, right, I

1380
01:08:22,880 --> 01:08:25,799
Speaker 1: flipped the light switch. But this animal lost its life,

1381
01:08:26,240 --> 01:08:30,040
Speaker 1: and I did so as an egotistical, little monstrous kid

1382
01:08:31,080 --> 01:08:35,040
Speaker 1: sayings or something, and it was terrible. It's horrible, And

1383
01:08:35,080 --> 01:08:38,559
Speaker 1: I was like, this is nothing of what our lives

1384
01:08:38,560 --> 01:08:40,400
Speaker 1: are to be or what this animal's life was to be.

1385
01:08:40,439 --> 01:08:44,640
Speaker 1: And even when I started hunting instantly, I was you know,

1386
01:08:44,680 --> 01:08:48,040
Speaker 1: you'd see these guys out are doing things greater than

1387
01:08:48,080 --> 01:08:50,479
Speaker 1: you were in the outdoor space. And for me, I

1388
01:08:50,520 --> 01:08:53,400
Speaker 1: was lucky enough. Like you said about my beginning, I

1389
01:08:53,439 --> 01:08:56,679
Speaker 1: started reading guys like Jack O'Connor that was very well written.

1390
01:08:57,080 --> 01:08:59,599
Speaker 1: Knew exactly why they hunted, although they didn't always tell

1391
01:08:59,640 --> 01:09:03,800
Speaker 1: you why. They knew exactly why and how they hunted,

1392
01:09:03,840 --> 01:09:06,479
Speaker 1: and they talked about big, plump, hearty animals. Is funny

1393
01:09:06,479 --> 01:09:10,120
Speaker 1: when those guys talked about trophy animals. When those guys

1394
01:09:10,120 --> 01:09:12,639
Speaker 1: talked about trophy animals, there's all about their body condition,

1395
01:09:12,680 --> 01:09:15,240
Speaker 1: about their horn condition, And the reason they were liked

1396
01:09:15,320 --> 01:09:17,760
Speaker 1: is because of premier habitat and being left alone and

1397
01:09:17,800 --> 01:09:22,040
Speaker 1: being and so it's really fantastic, whereas we have made

1398
01:09:22,080 --> 01:09:26,800
Speaker 1: the transgression now into yeah, look at his and his

1399
01:09:26,880 --> 01:09:28,800
Speaker 1: bases for this and this and this, and those guys

1400
01:09:28,840 --> 01:09:31,760
Speaker 1: wrote for a completely different reason, and so I felt it.

1401
01:09:32,080 --> 01:09:34,120
Speaker 1: I grew up reading those original guys, and I had

1402
01:09:34,160 --> 01:09:38,120
Speaker 1: a very good understanding of wanting to go and do

1403
01:09:38,200 --> 01:09:40,439
Speaker 1: the things that they did. But once I started hunting,

1404
01:09:40,680 --> 01:09:45,040
Speaker 1: actually hunting and running into hunters, they kind of sucked

1405
01:09:45,080 --> 01:09:48,280
Speaker 1: me into that shallow field of Hey, let's just kill

1406
01:09:48,320 --> 01:09:50,160
Speaker 1: a big box. This is how you kill a big box.

1407
01:09:50,200 --> 01:09:52,479
Speaker 1: You need you know, you don't, I'm making all this up,

1408
01:09:52,520 --> 01:09:54,559
Speaker 1: but you dump corn on the ground, or you do

1409
01:09:54,680 --> 01:09:56,760
Speaker 1: this or this, and this is the shortcut. You're you're

1410
01:09:56,760 --> 01:09:59,200
Speaker 1: gonna need a slug gun that shoots this far because

1411
01:09:59,200 --> 01:10:01,800
Speaker 1: this is instantly came a gear. Then you're hanging on

1412
01:10:01,880 --> 01:10:04,320
Speaker 1: your wall. You put the pictures up, and I remember like, dude,

1413
01:10:04,360 --> 01:10:07,479
Speaker 1: you gotta get a wall hanger, and that you need one,

1414
01:10:07,520 --> 01:10:09,400
Speaker 1: and then you need two wall hangers, and this is

1415
01:10:09,400 --> 01:10:11,519
Speaker 1: how you do. And if you have two wall hangers,

1416
01:10:11,520 --> 01:10:13,280
Speaker 1: then when I introduce you to a buddy of mine

1417
01:10:13,360 --> 01:10:15,080
Speaker 1: is like, yeah, Hey, this is Nick. He's got two

1418
01:10:15,080 --> 01:10:18,200
Speaker 1: wall hangers, you know. And and so I fell into

1419
01:10:18,240 --> 01:10:21,880
Speaker 1: that trap. And then once I started actually hunting on

1420
01:10:21,920 --> 01:10:25,240
Speaker 1: my own, getting away from these guys, I started enveloping

1421
01:10:25,240 --> 01:10:27,240
Speaker 1: myself with the chicken eas and the birds and the

1422
01:10:27,240 --> 01:10:30,639
Speaker 1: weather and the animals, and I slipped right back into

1423
01:10:31,160 --> 01:10:33,680
Speaker 1: the writings of all the Leopold and Jack O'Connor and

1424
01:10:33,680 --> 01:10:35,840
Speaker 1: all these guys. And so then I started realizing, like, oh,

1425
01:10:35,880 --> 01:10:39,040
Speaker 1: I really am different. Either I'm different or these guys

1426
01:10:40,280 --> 01:10:42,280
Speaker 1: are putting on the facade, just like I was putting

1427
01:10:42,320 --> 01:10:44,240
Speaker 1: on the facade and never really got out of it. Yeah,

1428
01:10:44,280 --> 01:10:46,240
Speaker 1: when I was, when we were talking about that on

1429
01:10:46,280 --> 01:10:48,400
Speaker 1: the on the last recording, it got got I got

1430
01:10:48,400 --> 01:10:50,479
Speaker 1: me thinking, I'm like, man, this is gonna sound pretentious

1431
01:10:50,479 --> 01:10:52,200
Speaker 1: if I say it in the podcast, but funk it.

1432
01:10:52,280 --> 01:10:55,400
Speaker 1: I'll say it anyway. Like the guys who just want

1433
01:10:55,400 --> 01:10:57,719
Speaker 1: to have fun and go hunting, I got no problem

1434
01:10:57,720 --> 01:11:01,160
Speaker 1: with that either. I want you to have fun. I

1435
01:11:01,200 --> 01:11:03,280
Speaker 1: think you need me, though, and you need people like

1436
01:11:03,360 --> 01:11:06,200
Speaker 1: you that are thinking about the why, that are thinking

1437
01:11:06,240 --> 01:11:08,439
Speaker 1: about different ways to do it, that are examining like

1438
01:11:08,760 --> 01:11:11,960
Speaker 1: the tough issues and trying to tell stories that promote

1439
01:11:12,000 --> 01:11:13,800
Speaker 1: the right things, like if you want to just go

1440
01:11:13,880 --> 01:11:17,360
Speaker 1: and have fun, you need you need people that are

1441
01:11:17,920 --> 01:11:20,840
Speaker 1: questioning these things. And he and he like the front

1442
01:11:20,880 --> 01:11:23,120
Speaker 1: line of defense for anyone that might want to take

1443
01:11:23,160 --> 01:11:26,120
Speaker 1: away your privilege to do this. Yes, and I agree

1444
01:11:26,160 --> 01:11:27,880
Speaker 1: with Steve. Some guys just want to go and have fun.

1445
01:11:27,960 --> 01:11:32,200
Speaker 1: But you need and this is a big idea or

1446
01:11:33,080 --> 01:11:37,639
Speaker 1: easy idea to compartmentalized, but you need guys that are

1447
01:11:37,760 --> 01:11:40,400
Speaker 1: thinking men and women are thinking about Okay, so you

1448
01:11:40,439 --> 01:11:42,280
Speaker 1: just want to go and have fun in the outdoors, Okay,

1449
01:11:42,360 --> 01:11:45,920
Speaker 1: that's great, but you have to have fun under these parameters.

1450
01:11:45,960 --> 01:11:48,479
Speaker 1: Because we went out in the outdoors and we all

1451
01:11:48,560 --> 01:11:50,120
Speaker 1: just went out and had fun around the turn of

1452
01:11:50,120 --> 01:11:54,439
Speaker 1: the century and we shot the entire continent out of animals.

1453
01:11:54,600 --> 01:11:56,720
Speaker 1: It was it was fun, a lot of personal gain

1454
01:11:57,160 --> 01:11:59,960
Speaker 1: we shot you know whatever sixteen million bison or whatever

1455
01:12:00,120 --> 01:12:02,040
Speaker 1: was that we shot. And like, yeah, that's what happens

1456
01:12:02,080 --> 01:12:04,400
Speaker 1: when you out and have fun. So we need regulatory

1457
01:12:04,520 --> 01:12:08,920
Speaker 1: we need seasons, we need licenses, we need habitat, we

1458
01:12:09,000 --> 01:12:11,439
Speaker 1: need you know, with ever increasing people we now have,

1459
01:12:11,600 --> 01:12:14,479
Speaker 1: this drives me nuts to again another rabbit hole. But

1460
01:12:14,600 --> 01:12:18,360
Speaker 1: this whole private land public land. Right on this program,

1461
01:12:18,840 --> 01:12:21,679
Speaker 1: everyone wants to talk about that, and and and and

1462
01:12:21,800 --> 01:12:24,040
Speaker 1: what annoys me is I'll kill the big sheep, or

1463
01:12:24,040 --> 01:12:26,120
Speaker 1: I'll kill a deer, I'll kill a gray squirrel. And

1464
01:12:26,160 --> 01:12:29,000
Speaker 1: everyone goes first thing, Hey, is that public or private land?

1465
01:12:29,120 --> 01:12:34,439
Speaker 1: Used to public? Private? Public or private? Yeah, so I'd

1466
01:12:34,439 --> 01:12:39,519
Speaker 1: get at and I say, I, uh, you know, I

1467
01:12:39,680 --> 01:12:44,000
Speaker 1: hunt of everything. I hunted on public land, as with

1468
01:12:44,120 --> 01:12:46,759
Speaker 1: most of us, because if you hunt anything in mountains

1469
01:12:46,800 --> 01:12:49,280
Speaker 1: or anything that you're generally hunting on, if you really

1470
01:12:49,320 --> 01:12:50,800
Speaker 1: like to hunt, you're going to go and do a

1471
01:12:50,840 --> 01:12:54,160
Speaker 1: whole lot of things that are accessible. First. Yes, absolutely

1472
01:12:54,200 --> 01:12:57,240
Speaker 1: for the gate open, that's right. And so you know,

1473
01:12:58,840 --> 01:13:02,120
Speaker 1: we kind of have this idea of this, the fence

1474
01:13:02,200 --> 01:13:04,320
Speaker 1: being built between the two. I had a great conversation

1475
01:13:04,400 --> 01:13:07,519
Speaker 1: last night with Lee Chose about this. The problem is

1476
01:13:07,560 --> 01:13:10,040
Speaker 1: that we have so many people right now, and we're

1477
01:13:10,080 --> 01:13:14,360
Speaker 1: obviously making more every second of every day, and the

1478
01:13:14,479 --> 01:13:17,880
Speaker 1: wealthy and the poor, the span is growing, and so

1479
01:13:18,040 --> 01:13:21,360
Speaker 1: the private sectors growing more powerful than the public sector.

1480
01:13:21,439 --> 01:13:25,920
Speaker 1: And so we need these two types of land to

1481
01:13:26,040 --> 01:13:28,639
Speaker 1: talk to one another. So you need the fat cat

1482
01:13:28,760 --> 01:13:32,000
Speaker 1: rich guy that owns this ten thousand acres to start

1483
01:13:32,040 --> 01:13:35,439
Speaker 1: talking to the state wildlife biologists that owned own this

1484
01:13:35,600 --> 01:13:38,720
Speaker 1: tenth represent this ten thousand acres, and we need to

1485
01:13:38,720 --> 01:13:40,920
Speaker 1: start talking about how this ten thousand acres can talk

1486
01:13:40,960 --> 01:13:43,040
Speaker 1: to this ten thousand acres and we can do things together.

1487
01:13:43,640 --> 01:13:45,400
Speaker 1: And like Lee and I are talking about last night,

1488
01:13:45,439 --> 01:13:48,400
Speaker 1: he was talking about in in the Degradation of water

1489
01:13:48,479 --> 01:13:56,479
Speaker 1: following and waterfall hunting, and and the thing is that

1490
01:13:56,560 --> 01:13:59,000
Speaker 1: he's like, all these wealthy guys are creating these hunting

1491
01:13:59,000 --> 01:14:01,519
Speaker 1: clubs that are beautiful hole, but they're all creating hunting

1492
01:14:01,520 --> 01:14:06,160
Speaker 1: clubs for killing ducks, not raising docks, not creating habitat

1493
01:14:06,200 --> 01:14:08,479
Speaker 1: for ducks, for killing ducks. Like we have these bunkers,

1494
01:14:08,520 --> 01:14:11,160
Speaker 1: we fled flood, this rice field, this cornfield, and so

1495
01:14:11,960 --> 01:14:14,559
Speaker 1: you it's just as hunters, you know, we want to

1496
01:14:14,560 --> 01:14:16,559
Speaker 1: know did did you shoot on public land? You shooting

1497
01:14:16,600 --> 01:14:18,799
Speaker 1: on private land? Did you hire an outfit? Were you guided?

1498
01:14:18,800 --> 01:14:21,120
Speaker 1: Because if you're guided, you don't have many woodsmanship And

1499
01:14:21,200 --> 01:14:23,519
Speaker 1: then you know, I see guys ripping other guys all

1500
01:14:23,520 --> 01:14:25,800
Speaker 1: the time like oh you're guided, Oh you have no woodsmanships?

1501
01:14:25,840 --> 01:14:27,720
Speaker 1: Like no, man, I was hunting in Alberto, which is

1502
01:14:27,760 --> 01:14:30,400
Speaker 1: illegal to do with so you know, these are these

1503
01:14:30,400 --> 01:14:31,920
Speaker 1: are the things that we have to do. But I

1504
01:14:32,000 --> 01:14:36,479
Speaker 1: do believe that as we populate this the mothership Earth here,

1505
01:14:37,280 --> 01:14:41,519
Speaker 1: that we need to protect our public lands, like I mean,

1506
01:14:42,120 --> 01:14:45,360
Speaker 1: to the point of war. We need to protect them. Um,

1507
01:14:45,400 --> 01:14:47,920
Speaker 1: the fat cats are not going to have our best interest.

1508
01:14:47,960 --> 01:14:50,640
Speaker 1: And a few of them that are building beautiful hunting properties,

1509
01:14:50,880 --> 01:14:52,920
Speaker 1: kudos to you. I would do the same damn thing

1510
01:14:52,960 --> 01:14:54,800
Speaker 1: if I was a billionaire, I would buy up as

1511
01:14:54,880 --> 01:14:57,639
Speaker 1: much land as I possibly could. Would I keep you out?

1512
01:14:58,320 --> 01:15:00,200
Speaker 1: I keep some of you out. But what I was

1513
01:15:00,240 --> 01:15:01,800
Speaker 1: gonna say, like, yeah, I really want to get risk,

1514
01:15:01,880 --> 01:15:04,080
Speaker 1: I can buy land. That's right. That's right, I mean literally,

1515
01:15:04,080 --> 01:15:06,559
Speaker 1: that's that's that's the next door that opens for me.

1516
01:15:06,600 --> 01:15:08,639
Speaker 1: Because everything I have right now is what I want.

1517
01:15:09,200 --> 01:15:11,400
Speaker 1: I can't grow anymore as a person. I can only

1518
01:15:11,439 --> 01:15:13,320
Speaker 1: get better as a man. I can get more kind,

1519
01:15:13,400 --> 01:15:15,920
Speaker 1: I can get smarter, I can I can work with

1520
01:15:15,960 --> 01:15:18,000
Speaker 1: people more. I can mentor people more. I can get

1521
01:15:18,040 --> 01:15:20,800
Speaker 1: mentored more. I can grow my own wisdom. But I can't.

1522
01:15:21,320 --> 01:15:24,040
Speaker 1: I have everything at my fingertips really that I want

1523
01:15:24,040 --> 01:15:26,240
Speaker 1: in life, and and there are other things that I

1524
01:15:26,280 --> 01:15:28,840
Speaker 1: want to chase. But but I'm not looking at them

1525
01:15:28,880 --> 01:15:30,920
Speaker 1: as a goal to say, hey, I've accomplished this, Now

1526
01:15:30,960 --> 01:15:33,479
Speaker 1: I can retire. I'm never going to retire. We all

1527
01:15:33,479 --> 01:15:35,120
Speaker 1: know I'm gonna die in a small airplane, and so

1528
01:15:35,280 --> 01:15:39,479
Speaker 1: I just want to keep chasing every day and getting

1529
01:15:39,479 --> 01:15:42,120
Speaker 1: this point. But I really think that we have to start,

1530
01:15:42,280 --> 01:15:43,920
Speaker 1: you know, like these two sectors are going to have

1531
01:15:43,960 --> 01:15:48,519
Speaker 1: to start talking. And then I was talking to a fellow.

1532
01:15:49,120 --> 01:15:52,880
Speaker 1: It emailed in about um he's works. He's a professor

1533
01:15:53,520 --> 01:15:57,280
Speaker 1: UC Berkeley and he studies land use. His name is

1534
01:15:57,360 --> 01:15:59,760
Speaker 1: Luke McAuley. I believe his name is. I want to

1535
01:15:59,760 --> 01:16:00,920
Speaker 1: have him want to talk about it was doing a

1536
01:16:01,000 --> 01:16:03,240
Speaker 1: land you study. I don't believe he was a hunter,

1537
01:16:03,280 --> 01:16:05,160
Speaker 1: and I don't I don't believe he ever hunted. What

1538
01:16:05,280 --> 01:16:08,360
Speaker 1: he it was doing land you study, and had was

1539
01:16:08,400 --> 01:16:11,519
Speaker 1: looking at the best habitat the best land, the best

1540
01:16:11,600 --> 01:16:15,240
Speaker 1: chunks of private land for wildlife. And he was telling

1541
01:16:15,240 --> 01:16:18,519
Speaker 1: me he stumbled upon this trend that big chunks of

1542
01:16:18,560 --> 01:16:22,280
Speaker 1: private land that were um leased up or or or

1543
01:16:22,280 --> 01:16:24,599
Speaker 1: at least by outfitters or had outfitted hunts on it,

1544
01:16:24,760 --> 01:16:29,280
Speaker 1: that had hunting that was for sale basically was some

1545
01:16:29,400 --> 01:16:32,640
Speaker 1: of the best managed habitat in the country, you know,

1546
01:16:32,720 --> 01:16:34,760
Speaker 1: and so at somebody who I'm just like, you know,

1547
01:16:34,880 --> 01:16:38,360
Speaker 1: public lands, public lands, public lands, public lands, you always

1548
01:16:38,439 --> 01:16:41,519
Speaker 1: have to like spin it come back a little bit

1549
01:16:41,760 --> 01:16:44,599
Speaker 1: super trendy to say to say public lands. But it's

1550
01:16:44,640 --> 01:16:49,880
Speaker 1: like lands, just like healthy ecosistants lands. Whoever, I don't

1551
01:16:49,880 --> 01:16:51,880
Speaker 1: give a ship who owns it and managed it. I

1552
01:16:51,920 --> 01:16:54,400
Speaker 1: just wanted to be owned and managed well. So let's

1553
01:16:54,479 --> 01:16:57,080
Speaker 1: you know, so there's perspectives out there. We can't sell

1554
01:16:57,080 --> 01:17:00,200
Speaker 1: our public land to the private guys because they earn

1555
01:17:00,240 --> 01:17:04,120
Speaker 1: us down. Because certain guys like um, you know, if

1556
01:17:04,160 --> 01:17:06,080
Speaker 1: you if you sold it, if I was a billionaire

1557
01:17:06,120 --> 01:17:09,120
Speaker 1: and you've sold me, Let's say you have acres in

1558
01:17:09,120 --> 01:17:13,080
Speaker 1: in Illinois and you sold me that acres in Illinois,

1559
01:17:13,160 --> 01:17:15,519
Speaker 1: I'm gonna I'm gonna turn it into the best quail,

1560
01:17:16,360 --> 01:17:21,599
Speaker 1: wild turkey, songbird, white tailed deer, gray squirrel, fox squirrel

1561
01:17:21,680 --> 01:17:23,960
Speaker 1: habitat you've ever seen in your life, because I like

1562
01:17:24,160 --> 01:17:28,080
Speaker 1: to see that perpetual idea or even notion of harmony,

1563
01:17:28,080 --> 01:17:30,280
Speaker 1: because there's a hand in value and like you value

1564
01:17:30,280 --> 01:17:33,400
Speaker 1: the animal for the animal, and that's what this guy

1565
01:17:33,400 --> 01:17:35,559
Speaker 1: with this this private land you study like they value

1566
01:17:35,560 --> 01:17:38,040
Speaker 1: the animal for the cash money. Yes, it's work that

1567
01:17:38,080 --> 01:17:40,439
Speaker 1: works though as we know if that works, But the

1568
01:17:40,479 --> 01:17:43,720
Speaker 1: problem is if you sell that to the wrong billionaire,

1569
01:17:44,880 --> 01:17:48,080
Speaker 1: he's gonna say, oh, man, there's coal, there's coal ten

1570
01:17:48,080 --> 01:17:51,960
Speaker 1: feet down, and I heard there's maybe oil here, or

1571
01:17:52,240 --> 01:17:54,880
Speaker 1: I could sell off all this top soil for this

1572
01:17:55,160 --> 01:17:57,760
Speaker 1: development over here, and so then he starts. You know,

1573
01:17:57,800 --> 01:17:59,640
Speaker 1: then the thing just gets raped in pillage and you

1574
01:17:59,640 --> 01:18:02,640
Speaker 1: can't get burned down. So we have to keep the

1575
01:18:02,640 --> 01:18:05,519
Speaker 1: public land public. We have to encourage the private guys

1576
01:18:05,560 --> 01:18:08,960
Speaker 1: to do um um, to do good work on their land.

1577
01:18:09,000 --> 01:18:10,760
Speaker 1: I have a little hunting lease just east of my

1578
01:18:10,880 --> 01:18:15,000
Speaker 1: house in Glenwood City, Wisconsin. It's a hundred fifty three acres.

1579
01:18:15,040 --> 01:18:17,280
Speaker 1: The dead center of the properties a twenty six acre

1580
01:18:17,360 --> 01:18:20,640
Speaker 1: cornfield was a cornfield and when I was a cornfield

1581
01:18:20,640 --> 01:18:23,719
Speaker 1: and a bean field, it was just a chunk of raw, muddy,

1582
01:18:23,800 --> 01:18:25,759
Speaker 1: crappy ground. And I went in there and I planted

1583
01:18:25,760 --> 01:18:28,759
Speaker 1: all warm season grasses. I do do. I'm not totally

1584
01:18:28,800 --> 01:18:30,600
Speaker 1: self righteous. I have a couple of food plots that

1585
01:18:30,640 --> 01:18:33,240
Speaker 1: I plant that that for animals that I hunt and

1586
01:18:33,320 --> 01:18:35,240
Speaker 1: provide food for the deer over the winter. We have

1587
01:18:35,280 --> 01:18:38,120
Speaker 1: harsh winters, of course, but the majority of it I

1588
01:18:38,120 --> 01:18:41,519
Speaker 1: planted a warm season grasses and um and then let

1589
01:18:41,600 --> 01:18:44,840
Speaker 1: natural vegetation like big blue stem and gold rod and

1590
01:18:44,840 --> 01:18:47,240
Speaker 1: all this stuff come up and and repopulate. And it's

1591
01:18:47,240 --> 01:18:50,120
Speaker 1: funny because when I leased the land for several years,

1592
01:18:50,120 --> 01:18:52,240
Speaker 1: it was a cornfield or a bean field. I never

1593
01:18:52,280 --> 01:18:55,599
Speaker 1: saw snakes, I never saw rough grouse, I never saw pheasants,

1594
01:18:55,840 --> 01:18:59,000
Speaker 1: never saw turtles, saw very few songbirds unless I was

1595
01:18:59,040 --> 01:19:00,879
Speaker 1: in the woods. And even when I in the woods,

1596
01:19:01,479 --> 01:19:03,840
Speaker 1: there's a lot of noxious and a lot of nonindigenous

1597
01:19:03,840 --> 01:19:07,040
Speaker 1: plants that are really choking out the forest floor. So

1598
01:19:07,160 --> 01:19:09,920
Speaker 1: really like it was a really sterile property I put

1599
01:19:09,920 --> 01:19:12,920
Speaker 1: in all these grasses, and it's just remarkable now, I

1600
01:19:12,960 --> 01:19:15,160
Speaker 1: was telling this to lead last night. Remarkable the grouse

1601
01:19:15,200 --> 01:19:18,479
Speaker 1: that I see in here, drumming all. It's not pheasant

1602
01:19:18,520 --> 01:19:20,920
Speaker 1: country at all. And I'll still I'll bump three or

1603
01:19:20,960 --> 01:19:22,760
Speaker 1: four roosters when I'm going out to bowl hunt deer,

1604
01:19:22,840 --> 01:19:25,360
Speaker 1: wild turkeys. I'm seeing a ton of my favorite things.

1605
01:19:25,400 --> 01:19:27,800
Speaker 1: I'm seeing a ton of snakes, and I'm seeing just

1606
01:19:27,880 --> 01:19:31,360
Speaker 1: all this stuff, and I just like all I did

1607
01:19:31,560 --> 01:19:36,880
Speaker 1: was work on twenty six acres did I change the world,

1608
01:19:37,920 --> 01:19:41,320
Speaker 1: not one drop of it, but that neighborhood is better

1609
01:19:41,360 --> 01:19:44,519
Speaker 1: because of it. Yeah, And I think I've changed, I know,

1610
01:19:44,560 --> 01:19:46,160
Speaker 1: I don't think I know that I've changed. Over the

1611
01:19:46,240 --> 01:19:49,240
Speaker 1: last year or two, was talking to ecologists and folks

1612
01:19:49,280 --> 01:19:51,960
Speaker 1: like yourself, biologists and people that really care about wildlife.

1613
01:19:52,560 --> 01:19:55,400
Speaker 1: The answer to like, what's the main purpose of your hunting?

1614
01:19:55,720 --> 01:19:57,800
Speaker 1: And I would just say like being a part of

1615
01:19:57,800 --> 01:20:01,280
Speaker 1: this community, doing this and making the efforts that that

1616
01:20:01,360 --> 01:20:03,040
Speaker 1: I do, and trying to live the lifestyle the best

1617
01:20:03,040 --> 01:20:05,439
Speaker 1: way I can and hold myself accountable. I think the

1618
01:20:05,479 --> 01:20:09,800
Speaker 1: answer right now is is I'm for healthy ecosystems. That's

1619
01:20:09,840 --> 01:20:13,880
Speaker 1: what I'm for. Like even if that means you can't hunt, yes,

1620
01:20:14,240 --> 01:20:16,960
Speaker 1: And that's been I would never have said that before.

1621
01:20:16,960 --> 01:20:18,559
Speaker 1: I would always have said that, oh, you know the meat,

1622
01:20:18,640 --> 01:20:21,880
Speaker 1: you know, that's great. I like the Meat Conservation Show

1623
01:20:22,080 --> 01:20:24,360
Speaker 1: was having a seizure last night over feel the table.

1624
01:20:24,439 --> 01:20:29,000
Speaker 1: He was so angry, like it's I always like, I'd

1625
01:20:29,000 --> 01:20:31,280
Speaker 1: love to get your reaction to this I came up with.

1626
01:20:31,320 --> 01:20:34,200
Speaker 1: In fact, I was bear hunting with rogan Um as

1627
01:20:34,200 --> 01:20:35,840
Speaker 1: soon as you going, and we were just talking and

1628
01:20:35,840 --> 01:20:37,479
Speaker 1: he was challenging me and calling me an idiot on

1629
01:20:37,520 --> 01:20:40,200
Speaker 1: some stuff, and well, she he does and always does well.

1630
01:20:40,840 --> 01:20:44,479
Speaker 1: And I just came up, like I said, Okay, meat eating,

1631
01:20:44,479 --> 01:20:47,280
Speaker 1: meat and conservation are byproducts of hunting. They're not the

1632
01:20:47,320 --> 01:20:49,880
Speaker 1: reason I go hunting. They're they're things that I know

1633
01:20:49,960 --> 01:20:52,680
Speaker 1: are happening. They know I know the result of the

1634
01:20:52,720 --> 01:20:55,759
Speaker 1: thing I'm doing is is these two things. But they're not.

1635
01:20:56,040 --> 01:20:59,320
Speaker 1: I'm done saying these are the reasons I hunt. I'm

1636
01:20:59,360 --> 01:21:01,439
Speaker 1: done with that. You know, I can't do that anymore

1637
01:21:01,439 --> 01:21:05,200
Speaker 1: because I don't think it's true. I don't mean it's

1638
01:21:05,240 --> 01:21:07,479
Speaker 1: not true. Because you're just examining your own actions, you

1639
01:21:08,040 --> 01:21:11,400
Speaker 1: would almost immediately come to find that it's not you know,

1640
01:21:11,439 --> 01:21:12,639
Speaker 1: like why do you hunt with the bow if you're

1641
01:21:12,640 --> 01:21:14,160
Speaker 1: just there for the me you want? Like? What are

1642
01:21:14,200 --> 01:21:17,000
Speaker 1: you doing if you're just there for conservation? Why do

1643
01:21:17,000 --> 01:21:18,760
Speaker 1: you do this? This, this and this and so? If

1644
01:21:18,760 --> 01:21:20,880
Speaker 1: you would just examine your own actions, you would find

1645
01:21:20,920 --> 01:21:24,000
Speaker 1: that the reasons we often trot out as the reasons

1646
01:21:24,040 --> 01:21:27,280
Speaker 1: we go ye, and and that's really it. But the

1647
01:21:27,320 --> 01:21:30,960
Speaker 1: thing is is that a few of us, uh you, myself,

1648
01:21:31,000 --> 01:21:37,600
Speaker 1: other guys have the outside. Um, it's very this is

1649
01:21:37,760 --> 01:21:39,720
Speaker 1: more complex than I'm making it, but you might get

1650
01:21:39,800 --> 01:21:43,120
Speaker 1: somebody in let's just say l A right. Um, I've

1651
01:21:43,160 --> 01:21:45,679
Speaker 1: done a fair bit of work with William Morris Endeavor,

1652
01:21:45,760 --> 01:21:48,160
Speaker 1: the large talent agency out there, and they've flown me

1653
01:21:48,200 --> 01:21:50,639
Speaker 1: in there to. They always want me to find bigfoot

1654
01:21:50,800 --> 01:21:55,160
Speaker 1: or find gold in Alaska. Yeah, they want me to

1655
01:21:55,200 --> 01:21:58,519
Speaker 1: trap beavers and and uh so all this stuff, right,

1656
01:21:58,560 --> 01:22:00,360
Speaker 1: they want me to do all these TV shows that

1657
01:22:00,360 --> 01:22:03,880
Speaker 1: are popular right now and and um. But they're always

1658
01:22:03,880 --> 01:22:07,880
Speaker 1: trying to And it's the same reason I did Who

1659
01:22:07,880 --> 01:22:10,160
Speaker 1: We Are for Nacchio. If they're always trying to pin

1660
01:22:10,280 --> 01:22:13,479
Speaker 1: up why as to like there has to be just

1661
01:22:13,520 --> 01:22:16,479
Speaker 1: a singular reason, and like you said, it's tough to

1662
01:22:16,560 --> 01:22:19,800
Speaker 1: articulate because multiple But when they hear oh, yeah, I

1663
01:22:19,840 --> 01:22:23,639
Speaker 1: hunt for food, then they go, Okay, you're hunting for food,

1664
01:22:23,880 --> 01:22:28,040
Speaker 1: so you like organic food, that's why you hunt. You're

1665
01:22:28,080 --> 01:22:33,400
Speaker 1: hunting for organics. This is organic Donnie, Donnie the organic hunter,

1666
01:22:33,600 --> 01:22:35,640
Speaker 1: that's right. So then so then you get guys in

1667
01:22:35,680 --> 01:22:37,840
Speaker 1: this hunting show that have no idea why they hunt.

1668
01:22:38,000 --> 01:22:40,040
Speaker 1: They don't necessarily have to have an idea why they hunt,

1669
01:22:40,040 --> 01:22:42,000
Speaker 1: but they certainly have no idea why they hunt. Other

1670
01:22:42,040 --> 01:22:45,000
Speaker 1: than they can say, man, I like killing deer. I

1671
01:22:45,040 --> 01:22:47,679
Speaker 1: like hunting deer, which is nothing wrong with that falls

1672
01:22:47,680 --> 01:22:49,479
Speaker 1: into a little bit of the Steves like I just

1673
01:22:49,520 --> 01:22:51,200
Speaker 1: want to have fun. It also falls into a little

1674
01:22:51,200 --> 01:22:52,840
Speaker 1: bit of like what you just said, where I'm not

1675
01:22:52,960 --> 01:22:55,120
Speaker 1: hunting for food, I'm not hunting for conservation. I'm hunting

1676
01:22:55,120 --> 01:22:57,880
Speaker 1: because I'm because of our Really it probably comes from

1677
01:22:57,920 --> 01:23:00,680
Speaker 1: our ancestors right where really we step from hunters, so

1678
01:23:00,720 --> 01:23:03,559
Speaker 1: we have this innate piece of our DNA that's like

1679
01:23:03,640 --> 01:23:07,120
Speaker 1: you should go outside and do something hardy. For me,

1680
01:23:07,240 --> 01:23:09,080
Speaker 1: it was like this for me. It was a derivative

1681
01:23:09,120 --> 01:23:11,320
Speaker 1: of I can't. This podcast is a derivative of I

1682
01:23:11,360 --> 01:23:13,760
Speaker 1: can't figure this sh it out. Yes I can't. And

1683
01:23:13,800 --> 01:23:17,280
Speaker 1: so but you continue to ask the question, which continues

1684
01:23:17,360 --> 01:23:20,400
Speaker 1: to bring you wisdom, which continues to run you into

1685
01:23:20,439 --> 01:23:23,120
Speaker 1: interesting people and having fun stories and doing fun things

1686
01:23:23,160 --> 01:23:27,040
Speaker 1: and staying and really nice. But um, but the truth

1687
01:23:27,160 --> 01:23:29,719
Speaker 1: is is that it's not for food. It's not necessarily

1688
01:23:29,760 --> 01:23:33,800
Speaker 1: for conservation. But guys that don't have a good tagline

1689
01:23:33,800 --> 01:23:37,439
Speaker 1: as to why, then they'll say, oh, yeah, I'm you know, white.

1690
01:23:37,479 --> 01:23:39,960
Speaker 1: There's nothing more organic than a white till deer. And

1691
01:23:39,960 --> 01:23:42,200
Speaker 1: then you say, well, you sprayd all of your food

1692
01:23:42,240 --> 01:23:44,880
Speaker 1: plots with round up, and so there's like cafe in

1693
01:23:44,920 --> 01:23:47,559
Speaker 1: your deer's meat, and so really it's not very organic

1694
01:23:47,600 --> 01:23:49,880
Speaker 1: and so buzz words. Yeah, there was a man. It

1695
01:23:50,000 --> 01:23:51,639
Speaker 1: was like a Wall Street drillers. An article I read

1696
01:23:51,680 --> 01:23:55,720
Speaker 1: the other day hipster hunters. What was the headline? I

1697
01:23:56,200 --> 01:23:57,760
Speaker 1: want to look this up because the headline. I was

1698
01:23:57,760 --> 01:23:59,519
Speaker 1: just like, the article is not bad, but the headline

1699
01:23:59,520 --> 01:24:02,519
Speaker 1: was like ship. Yeah, I just put they put down

1700
01:24:02,520 --> 01:24:05,280
Speaker 1: their kombucha and pick up their crossbows. That's what it was.

1701
01:24:05,520 --> 01:24:09,040
Speaker 1: It was hipster hunters. Colon put down your camp but

1702
01:24:09,120 --> 01:24:13,040
Speaker 1: they put their putting down their combuch. The cross a

1703
01:24:13,280 --> 01:24:16,559
Speaker 1: terrible a turn of phrase, like and it's funny because

1704
01:24:16,560 --> 01:24:19,320
Speaker 1: I know guys now that I've met that would I

1705
01:24:19,320 --> 01:24:22,360
Speaker 1: would categorize as I want to categorize them. But if

1706
01:24:22,360 --> 01:24:24,160
Speaker 1: we're going to categorize them, I would say they're hips

1707
01:24:24,200 --> 01:24:27,240
Speaker 1: or hunters there lack of a better term. Their cover

1708
01:24:27,360 --> 01:24:30,240
Speaker 1: and tattoos. They wear skinny jeans. There had stocking caps

1709
01:24:30,320 --> 01:24:32,120
Speaker 1: much like my owner, hanging off the back of their head.

1710
01:24:32,120 --> 01:24:35,120
Speaker 1: They're wearing trendy little flannels much like myself and but

1711
01:24:35,160 --> 01:24:37,080
Speaker 1: I do. I do it because this is what I've

1712
01:24:37,120 --> 01:24:40,920
Speaker 1: basically always done. They're doing it, um a bit more

1713
01:24:40,920 --> 01:24:43,519
Speaker 1: out of fashion. Right like going to a Filson store

1714
01:24:43,640 --> 01:24:46,280
Speaker 1: in any city in America right now, you're not standing

1715
01:24:46,320 --> 01:24:50,160
Speaker 1: amongst hunters. You're standing amongst hipsters. And these guys have

1716
01:24:50,160 --> 01:24:52,320
Speaker 1: not realized that they can go and buy a bow

1717
01:24:53,040 --> 01:24:56,519
Speaker 1: and go to the Parks system in Minneapolis and get

1718
01:24:56,520 --> 01:25:00,599
Speaker 1: a Metro area hunting permit by take asking a test,

1719
01:25:00,640 --> 01:25:03,320
Speaker 1: and they can go and shoot organic food. Man. And

1720
01:25:03,360 --> 01:25:05,320
Speaker 1: they can buy a hatchet, and they can hang the

1721
01:25:05,320 --> 01:25:07,719
Speaker 1: hatchet on their wall, and and they can talk about

1722
01:25:07,760 --> 01:25:11,160
Speaker 1: the stuff at their dinner parties and you know, and

1723
01:25:11,160 --> 01:25:13,639
Speaker 1: and it doesn't mean there are any different from us.

1724
01:25:13,840 --> 01:25:15,960
Speaker 1: It just came means they came to hunting in a

1725
01:25:16,040 --> 01:25:20,120
Speaker 1: different roundabout. It's like it's for them. They're you know, adults,

1726
01:25:20,200 --> 01:25:22,080
Speaker 1: most of them. When they're doing this is like this

1727
01:25:22,200 --> 01:25:24,640
Speaker 1: easier for them to do, right that it's easier for

1728
01:25:24,640 --> 01:25:26,920
Speaker 1: them to explain in the beginning. But I guarantee them

1729
01:25:27,320 --> 01:25:30,400
Speaker 1: somebody would say like, man, I'm an organic hunter. Um,

1730
01:25:30,479 --> 01:25:32,200
Speaker 1: I just go out to get organic meat and that's it.

1731
01:25:32,240 --> 01:25:34,840
Speaker 1: I'm like, well, listen, I bet they come back in

1732
01:25:34,880 --> 01:25:37,400
Speaker 1: five years, hunt for five more years, and I bet

1733
01:25:37,439 --> 01:25:39,360
Speaker 1: you when you come back and five more years, you

1734
01:25:39,360 --> 01:25:41,599
Speaker 1: will tell me that it's more complicated than just the meat. Now,

1735
01:25:42,560 --> 01:25:46,160
Speaker 1: you may start out thinking it's just field table, but

1736
01:25:46,280 --> 01:25:49,519
Speaker 1: you're gonna learn and be enriched by so much, so

1737
01:25:49,560 --> 01:25:52,680
Speaker 1: many different things in those experiences that you'll you will

1738
01:25:52,720 --> 01:25:55,760
Speaker 1: find it impossible to say that's just from organic meat. Then,

1739
01:25:55,960 --> 01:25:58,760
Speaker 1: and even when we were in an original society, even

1740
01:25:58,840 --> 01:26:03,120
Speaker 1: when it was about starve Asian survival, I'll guarantee you

1741
01:26:03,400 --> 01:26:07,200
Speaker 1: those people, our ancestors still hunted for a different reason,

1742
01:26:07,880 --> 01:26:10,120
Speaker 1: certainly hunted for me. And then some people hang their

1743
01:26:10,120 --> 01:26:12,519
Speaker 1: hats on that and say, oh, those people, you know,

1744
01:26:12,600 --> 01:26:15,000
Speaker 1: I'll get that's the I don't get very much hate mail.

1745
01:26:15,439 --> 01:26:17,800
Speaker 1: It's I feel bad for people that do. I see

1746
01:26:17,840 --> 01:26:20,960
Speaker 1: some of the I see some of the um. You know,

1747
01:26:21,120 --> 01:26:22,960
Speaker 1: people in the industry just say, oh my word, I

1748
01:26:23,000 --> 01:26:25,559
Speaker 1: get lit up. And luckily I don't get that lit up.

1749
01:26:25,960 --> 01:26:27,920
Speaker 1: But um, I don't either from like you mean, like

1750
01:26:27,920 --> 01:26:30,599
Speaker 1: from anti hunters. But I don't either, which I get

1751
01:26:30,680 --> 01:26:32,759
Speaker 1: very little. It's every once in a while bare photo

1752
01:26:32,800 --> 01:26:34,559
Speaker 1: will go up and then some two or three people

1753
01:26:34,560 --> 01:26:36,200
Speaker 1: will say something, but you just write it off and

1754
01:26:36,240 --> 01:26:37,920
Speaker 1: go on. But yeah, you're right, I don't. I don't

1755
01:26:37,920 --> 01:26:39,439
Speaker 1: need here and I don't I don't think that says

1756
01:26:39,479 --> 01:26:42,000
Speaker 1: anything about me or you. It's just like, how do

1757
01:26:42,040 --> 01:26:44,439
Speaker 1: you how do you get exposed to it? And I

1758
01:26:44,439 --> 01:26:46,160
Speaker 1: think it's kind of what you're doing. It's the same

1759
01:26:46,160 --> 01:26:49,080
Speaker 1: thing because when I posted, when we posted about hunting

1760
01:26:49,120 --> 01:26:52,040
Speaker 1: mountain lions, like, that's the easily the most I've gotten ripped.

1761
01:26:52,040 --> 01:26:54,280
Speaker 1: And it's still continues, and I don't pay attention to

1762
01:26:54,360 --> 01:26:56,840
Speaker 1: it because most people are they're so far off base, right,

1763
01:26:57,200 --> 01:26:59,840
Speaker 1: But um, but yeah, I think it's Um, I kind

1764
01:26:59,840 --> 01:27:03,600
Speaker 1: of lost my train of thought. But um, we're just

1765
01:27:03,640 --> 01:27:06,800
Speaker 1: talking about that so many different things. I can't believe

1766
01:27:06,800 --> 01:27:08,720
Speaker 1: I just lost my train of thought. But anyway, so,

1767
01:27:09,160 --> 01:27:12,679
Speaker 1: but it is this, It is this digression of hunting

1768
01:27:12,720 --> 01:27:15,760
Speaker 1: for me or we're hunting for a particular reason and

1769
01:27:15,760 --> 01:27:20,160
Speaker 1: and uh, and we give ourselves this this notion of

1770
01:27:20,160 --> 01:27:22,160
Speaker 1: of that we have to prove why we're hunting. And

1771
01:27:22,160 --> 01:27:25,519
Speaker 1: I'll guarantee you even though our ancestors were hunting for food,

1772
01:27:25,840 --> 01:27:32,000
Speaker 1: certainly that they're still wash you know something like I'll

1773
01:27:32,040 --> 01:27:36,759
Speaker 1: guarantee you lions and hyenas and cougars and black bears.

1774
01:27:36,800 --> 01:27:40,080
Speaker 1: I'll guarantee you they get this. You know, when a

1775
01:27:40,080 --> 01:27:42,120
Speaker 1: when a black bear is able to sneak up on

1776
01:27:42,160 --> 01:27:44,200
Speaker 1: a snow shoe hair and chase it down and pounce

1777
01:27:44,280 --> 01:27:46,599
Speaker 1: on it and bite the back of its head, I'll

1778
01:27:46,640 --> 01:27:49,040
Speaker 1: guarantee you there's more than just this is a meal.

1779
01:27:49,880 --> 01:27:53,400
Speaker 1: I'll guarantee there's a euphoric feeling to them of of

1780
01:27:53,439 --> 01:27:55,800
Speaker 1: their you know, their hardiness. And and so I just

1781
01:27:55,840 --> 01:27:58,479
Speaker 1: think that I think even back then when we were

1782
01:27:58,560 --> 01:28:02,400
Speaker 1: certainly hunting for food and ins and tools, they're probably

1783
01:28:02,439 --> 01:28:05,840
Speaker 1: still was you know, probably still got goose bumps. Yeah,

1784
01:28:05,960 --> 01:28:07,759
Speaker 1: something in the age. And I think this whole conversation

1785
01:28:07,800 --> 01:28:09,640
Speaker 1: we're having is modern luxury. I mean, we have the

1786
01:28:09,640 --> 01:28:11,760
Speaker 1: modern luxury to like choose to do it or not

1787
01:28:11,840 --> 01:28:16,000
Speaker 1: do it, and choosing to do it is somehow um

1788
01:28:16,160 --> 01:28:18,599
Speaker 1: requires a why. But you go back to your parents.

1789
01:28:18,640 --> 01:28:21,280
Speaker 1: My parents, My dad never had to walk in a room.

1790
01:28:21,280 --> 01:28:22,760
Speaker 1: But like, I'm a hunter, and people like that great,

1791
01:28:23,560 --> 01:28:26,160
Speaker 1: And what you know, I I walk into a room

1792
01:28:26,160 --> 01:28:27,720
Speaker 1: in a lot of places, and I spent a lot

1793
01:28:27,720 --> 01:28:29,800
Speaker 1: of time and places where they're not a lot of

1794
01:28:29,840 --> 01:28:31,560
Speaker 1: hunters around and I walk in the room, They're like,

1795
01:28:31,560 --> 01:28:32,680
Speaker 1: what do you do for living? I'm like, while I'm

1796
01:28:32,680 --> 01:28:35,559
Speaker 1: in the hunting industry, I have to almost immediately then explain, Yeah,

1797
01:28:35,680 --> 01:28:38,519
Speaker 1: what why why hunt? So that's what caused me to

1798
01:28:38,560 --> 01:28:41,519
Speaker 1: kind of break into this whole um song and dance

1799
01:28:41,560 --> 01:28:43,519
Speaker 1: around why we do what we do and try to

1800
01:28:43,520 --> 01:28:47,200
Speaker 1: figure it out because because not because I really wanted to,

1801
01:28:47,280 --> 01:28:51,160
Speaker 1: but people kept asking me, and I'm like, have a

1802
01:28:51,160 --> 01:28:53,519
Speaker 1: good answer. I guess you know, same for me, and

1803
01:28:53,520 --> 01:28:56,800
Speaker 1: and and I enjoy it because I'm happy that these

1804
01:28:56,840 --> 01:28:59,160
Speaker 1: people have asked me these questions what I've been Because

1805
01:28:59,200 --> 01:29:01,760
Speaker 1: then I started to ask my self these questions. And

1806
01:29:02,240 --> 01:29:07,559
Speaker 1: I always asked. I always sought out the adventure. And

1807
01:29:07,920 --> 01:29:10,679
Speaker 1: also Jack O'Connor's going to the Yukoni hunting dollar sheep.

1808
01:29:10,760 --> 01:29:12,360
Speaker 1: So he had to you know, he had to wear

1809
01:29:12,360 --> 01:29:14,000
Speaker 1: his pack, and he had to go through here, and

1810
01:29:14,040 --> 01:29:16,519
Speaker 1: they got some weather and they ran into some grizzly bears.

1811
01:29:16,560 --> 01:29:20,280
Speaker 1: So always looking at solving the house and the wise

1812
01:29:20,320 --> 01:29:24,120
Speaker 1: of the hunt. But really, when I started asking myself,

1813
01:29:24,800 --> 01:29:27,120
Speaker 1: you know, when you go to the Yukon and you

1814
01:29:27,160 --> 01:29:29,040
Speaker 1: go hunt, and you go pay to hunt and you're

1815
01:29:29,280 --> 01:29:31,160
Speaker 1: now in the Yukon territories. You paid to hunt a

1816
01:29:31,160 --> 01:29:33,040
Speaker 1: dollar sheep, and now you're in the mountains, honey doll sheep.

1817
01:29:34,320 --> 01:29:38,840
Speaker 1: What are you leaving that place better than when you

1818
01:29:38,960 --> 01:29:41,880
Speaker 1: found it? And obviously there's a footprint, you know, because

1819
01:29:41,920 --> 01:29:44,800
Speaker 1: we're using up av gas to the airplane wasln't fly

1820
01:29:44,840 --> 01:29:47,479
Speaker 1: if we weren't there, And we're obviously leaving maybe a

1821
01:29:47,479 --> 01:29:49,640
Speaker 1: bit of litter or something like that on accident, or

1822
01:29:49,680 --> 01:29:51,800
Speaker 1: even the litter of our footprints and the litter of

1823
01:29:51,800 --> 01:29:54,680
Speaker 1: stepping on tundra or whatever it is. We're leaving our

1824
01:29:54,760 --> 01:29:58,719
Speaker 1: marks certainly by being present. But really that also falls

1825
01:29:58,720 --> 01:30:01,960
Speaker 1: back on what Steve was saying that, you know, there's

1826
01:30:02,000 --> 01:30:06,320
Speaker 1: this idea of fun, and so my idea of living

1827
01:30:06,360 --> 01:30:10,040
Speaker 1: my life, my ride on this earth is that. And

1828
01:30:10,439 --> 01:30:11,840
Speaker 1: I want to go to the Yukon. I want to

1829
01:30:11,840 --> 01:30:13,479
Speaker 1: see dollshep, I want to see moose, I want to

1830
01:30:13,479 --> 01:30:16,080
Speaker 1: see grizzly bears. I want to feel the burn, I

1831
01:30:16,120 --> 01:30:18,000
Speaker 1: want to be in the rain, I want to see

1832
01:30:18,000 --> 01:30:22,200
Speaker 1: the mosquitoes, and and that that's this, This is my

1833
01:30:22,360 --> 01:30:24,240
Speaker 1: ride that I want to do on the earth. But

1834
01:30:24,280 --> 01:30:27,400
Speaker 1: I don't want to be so selfish that I know

1835
01:30:27,600 --> 01:30:30,920
Speaker 1: my candle is going to burn out when I'm fifties, sixty,

1836
01:30:31,000 --> 01:30:33,479
Speaker 1: seventy whatever, And then I I know I don't have

1837
01:30:33,520 --> 01:30:36,240
Speaker 1: to worry about the conservation of this mothership, this earth

1838
01:30:36,280 --> 01:30:37,920
Speaker 1: that we have. I don't have to worry about that

1839
01:30:37,960 --> 01:30:39,800
Speaker 1: after I die, So I get to just freaking go

1840
01:30:39,920 --> 01:30:43,280
Speaker 1: through life like a comet, just burning and destroying everything

1841
01:30:43,280 --> 01:30:45,160
Speaker 1: behind me. I don't want to do that. We want

1842
01:30:45,160 --> 01:30:47,640
Speaker 1: to I want to leave it better. And because the

1843
01:30:47,760 --> 01:30:52,760
Speaker 1: intrinsic value of being a hunter, you know, exactly what

1844
01:30:52,840 --> 01:30:54,960
Speaker 1: we talked about in the beginning, what what being a

1845
01:30:55,040 --> 01:30:58,240
Speaker 1: hunter used to mean. I want being a hunter to

1846
01:30:58,240 --> 01:31:00,519
Speaker 1: still mean that. And if it doesn't mean it for everyone,

1847
01:31:00,560 --> 01:31:02,439
Speaker 1: I certainly wanted to mean it from me. Yeah. No,

1848
01:31:02,640 --> 01:31:05,639
Speaker 1: that's that's man, That's that's well put. And then I've

1849
01:31:05,720 --> 01:31:08,000
Speaker 1: you know, I said, recently, we've had these conversations. I've

1850
01:31:08,000 --> 01:31:10,479
Speaker 1: had some people right in and I don't know if

1851
01:31:10,479 --> 01:31:12,479
Speaker 1: you're like me, but I read all the positive comments

1852
01:31:12,479 --> 01:31:16,160
Speaker 1: and go right to the negative one, and I'm like, yeah, okay,

1853
01:31:16,360 --> 01:31:18,760
Speaker 1: And I've had some people right in like you're you know, listen, man,

1854
01:31:19,280 --> 01:31:22,320
Speaker 1: I appreciate the conversation, but you're overthinking it, and you know,

1855
01:31:23,120 --> 01:31:27,280
Speaker 1: it comes off seeming pretentious, and I'm like, listen, maybe

1856
01:31:27,320 --> 01:31:30,280
Speaker 1: it does. I'm willing to admit that it is or

1857
01:31:30,360 --> 01:31:33,400
Speaker 1: might be. I'm not better than you. I don't want

1858
01:31:33,439 --> 01:31:35,080
Speaker 1: to be better than you. I want to be one

1859
01:31:35,120 --> 01:31:40,160
Speaker 1: of you. Um, but boy, there's some real heavy stuff

1860
01:31:40,200 --> 01:31:42,639
Speaker 1: here that we gotta work out. We're taking a little

1861
01:31:42,640 --> 01:31:45,760
Speaker 1: bit more work it out together. It doesn't mean we

1862
01:31:45,840 --> 01:31:47,960
Speaker 1: have to come up with this hierarchy, and it doesn't

1863
01:31:47,960 --> 01:31:51,479
Speaker 1: mean we have to speak intelligently and be articulate at

1864
01:31:51,520 --> 01:31:53,519
Speaker 1: all times. We can still hoot and holler and be

1865
01:31:54,160 --> 01:31:58,000
Speaker 1: village idiots and in the process, but we should probably

1866
01:31:58,600 --> 01:32:01,799
Speaker 1: ask ourselves big, differ go questions, and as we approach

1867
01:32:01,880 --> 01:32:04,280
Speaker 1: eight billion people on the Earth and growing, we should

1868
01:32:04,280 --> 01:32:07,960
Speaker 1: probably keep asking ourselves with difficult questions with greater frequency. Yea,

1869
01:32:08,600 --> 01:32:10,120
Speaker 1: how do we get here? How do we get you?

1870
01:32:10,160 --> 01:32:12,080
Speaker 1: How we get where we are? Yeah? Well we got

1871
01:32:12,080 --> 01:32:15,479
Speaker 1: here in to Vegas with via airplane and it's kind

1872
01:32:15,479 --> 01:32:17,800
Speaker 1: of weird. What else? What other shots shre stuff you

1873
01:32:17,800 --> 01:32:20,439
Speaker 1: got going on? Nothing? We just have, um a couple

1874
01:32:20,479 --> 01:32:22,840
Speaker 1: of meetings that you know. We own Sigmanta, so we

1875
01:32:22,880 --> 01:32:25,120
Speaker 1: do a lot of production for other companies. And we're

1876
01:32:25,160 --> 01:32:27,640
Speaker 1: here meeting with Shields. We have some projects that we're

1877
01:32:27,640 --> 01:32:30,280
Speaker 1: doing with Shields, and UM meeting with some other companies

1878
01:32:30,280 --> 01:32:33,120
Speaker 1: that are interested in in hiring us to to shoot production,

1879
01:32:33,120 --> 01:32:35,840
Speaker 1: do commercial work, catalog work, things like that. Where can

1880
01:32:35,880 --> 01:32:38,240
Speaker 1: people will go see the other side and and you know,

1881
01:32:38,320 --> 01:32:40,640
Speaker 1: obviously if you haven't, if you're listening to this, you

1882
01:32:40,680 --> 01:32:43,559
Speaker 1: can need to go watch the Rivers divide. The Rivers divide,

1883
01:32:43,600 --> 01:32:45,760
Speaker 1: Terranova and the Other Side are our three now and

1884
01:32:45,760 --> 01:32:48,759
Speaker 1: and so then go to don Evenson dot com UM

1885
01:32:48,920 --> 01:32:51,559
Speaker 1: and we sell it as DVD and Blu ray and

1886
01:32:51,880 --> 01:32:54,439
Speaker 1: uh mobile download is not a true download is kind

1887
01:32:54,439 --> 01:32:57,240
Speaker 1: of more like a streaming UM and we're working on that.

1888
01:32:57,280 --> 01:32:59,559
Speaker 1: Everyone always wants us to put on iTunes, but iTunes

1889
01:32:59,600 --> 01:33:02,200
Speaker 1: is way way too expensive for our type of platform.

1890
01:33:02,240 --> 01:33:04,679
Speaker 1: It's way it's just people are like put on iTunes

1891
01:33:04,720 --> 01:33:07,200
Speaker 1: because everyone wants it at their fingertips, but it's it's impossible.

1892
01:33:07,200 --> 01:33:09,840
Speaker 1: So Donny Vinson dot com and then we're We have

1893
01:33:09,960 --> 01:33:12,639
Speaker 1: played the Other Side in three theaters so far, once

1894
01:33:12,640 --> 01:33:15,160
Speaker 1: in four Collins Colorado sold out as Awesome sold out

1895
01:33:15,200 --> 01:33:18,680
Speaker 1: to theaters in Minneapolis, and we're gonna do. We'd like

1896
01:33:18,720 --> 01:33:21,880
Speaker 1: to do like a ten, twelve, thirteen fourteen theater tour

1897
01:33:22,000 --> 01:33:24,160
Speaker 1: across the country and just to bring it into in

1898
01:33:24,160 --> 01:33:27,240
Speaker 1: front of other people. But yeah, well good, I can't

1899
01:33:27,280 --> 01:33:29,280
Speaker 1: wait to watch it. It's good the first ten minutes.

1900
01:33:29,280 --> 01:33:31,519
Speaker 1: And then you showed up. I'm like ship, yeah, so

1901
01:33:31,560 --> 01:33:33,559
Speaker 1: you'll have to watch it and then and then Texas

1902
01:33:33,640 --> 01:33:36,880
Speaker 1: later on. I will appreciate taking the time, man, what

1903
01:33:36,920 --> 01:33:39,439
Speaker 1: you do, and I really appreciate it. All right, thanks,

1904
01:33:39,800 --> 01:33:46,160
Speaker 1: thanks boss, all right, brother, that's it. That's all Episode

1905
01:33:46,240 --> 01:33:51,120
Speaker 1: number forty six in the books. Thanks to Donnie for

1906
01:33:51,200 --> 01:33:54,479
Speaker 1: hanging out uh in Vegas with us, for taking some

1907
01:33:54,520 --> 01:33:56,920
Speaker 1: time from the shot show to tell us his stories,

1908
01:33:56,920 --> 01:33:59,640
Speaker 1: to give us a little bit about his life is

1909
01:34:00,040 --> 01:34:02,240
Speaker 1: and what he's done with it, which is pretty amazing.

1910
01:34:03,160 --> 01:34:06,479
Speaker 1: So go to the Downy Vinceent dot com. Check out

1911
01:34:06,560 --> 01:34:08,679
Speaker 1: what he's done, check out his work. His latest film

1912
01:34:09,000 --> 01:34:11,920
Speaker 1: was talked about, The Other Side, is out there for

1913
01:34:12,000 --> 01:34:16,120
Speaker 1: you to watch, and it's a feature length film, which

1914
01:34:16,200 --> 01:34:19,479
Speaker 1: is not all that common in our space, So give

1915
01:34:19,479 --> 01:34:22,840
Speaker 1: it a watch and check out time. What else? What

1916
01:34:22,880 --> 01:34:25,080
Speaker 1: else we got we got? Yeah, hey, we got the

1917
01:34:25,080 --> 01:34:27,519
Speaker 1: meat Eator dot com. You go over there to the

1918
01:34:27,560 --> 01:34:31,639
Speaker 1: metator dot com and you'll find while you're there the

1919
01:34:31,640 --> 01:34:35,400
Speaker 1: newsletter subscribe button. And when you subscribe to the newsletter,

1920
01:34:35,439 --> 01:34:40,880
Speaker 1: you're gonna get gifted from us to you all the

1921
01:34:40,960 --> 01:34:44,639
Speaker 1: great articles and content from our crew every Wednesday morning

1922
01:34:44,640 --> 01:34:50,640
Speaker 1: and your inbox. Ryan Callahan just sneezed. That was a

1923
01:34:50,640 --> 01:34:54,639
Speaker 1: good one. Bless you. Um what else? What else? Currently?

1924
01:34:54,680 --> 01:34:56,479
Speaker 1: If you? If you, if you're listening to this currently,

1925
01:34:57,040 --> 01:34:59,400
Speaker 1: I we're in our hotel room and shot we're recording,

1926
01:34:59,400 --> 01:35:02,600
Speaker 1: of course the oltro to this current podcast. I'm in

1927
01:35:02,680 --> 01:35:05,920
Speaker 1: my underwear and Ryan Callahan is sitting across from me

1928
01:35:06,520 --> 01:35:11,640
Speaker 1: and he just sneezed into his breakfast and ruined and

1929
01:35:11,720 --> 01:35:15,920
Speaker 1: ruined what was a wonderful hot pocket that he's eating. Um,

1930
01:35:16,000 --> 01:35:20,719
Speaker 1: anyway back to but yeah, it's about growing up. Back

1931
01:35:20,760 --> 01:35:23,800
Speaker 1: to uh what we were talking about, which was the

1932
01:35:23,800 --> 01:35:26,439
Speaker 1: meat Eator dot com. If you got your newsletter, then

1933
01:35:26,439 --> 01:35:28,160
Speaker 1: you're gonna go to want to go to the shop

1934
01:35:28,760 --> 01:35:32,120
Speaker 1: and you're gonna want to You're gonna want to buy

1935
01:35:32,120 --> 01:35:34,280
Speaker 1: stuff there, right, you wanna buy T shirts, You're gonna

1936
01:35:34,280 --> 01:35:37,160
Speaker 1: want to buy hoodies, You're gonna want to buy all

1937
01:35:37,280 --> 01:35:41,040
Speaker 1: kinds of stuff. That's there, Hunting Collective logo, you get

1938
01:35:41,120 --> 01:35:44,519
Speaker 1: your pro Nuance anti bullshit shirt, you got Eddie tumbler

1939
01:35:44,600 --> 01:35:47,040
Speaker 1: with our logo on it, all kinds of stuff. And

1940
01:35:47,040 --> 01:35:49,559
Speaker 1: if you don't like us for some reason and you

1941
01:35:49,560 --> 01:35:51,120
Speaker 1: want to buy meat eatter gear, there's a lot of

1942
01:35:51,160 --> 01:35:52,920
Speaker 1: meat eater gear there. And if you don't like meat

1943
01:35:52,960 --> 01:35:56,439
Speaker 1: eater for some reason, there's Ryan Callahan's smell Us Now

1944
01:35:56,520 --> 01:36:00,760
Speaker 1: Lady t shirt and all profits good a conservation on

1945
01:36:00,800 --> 01:36:02,679
Speaker 1: that one, so you should check that out as well.

1946
01:36:03,000 --> 01:36:05,640
Speaker 1: And if you have a little bit more time and

1947
01:36:05,760 --> 01:36:09,320
Speaker 1: energy and you don't have a lot going on, then

1948
01:36:09,439 --> 01:36:11,960
Speaker 1: you're gonna want to look at the events page on

1949
01:36:12,000 --> 01:36:14,400
Speaker 1: that website and you're going to see all the places

1950
01:36:14,400 --> 01:36:18,679
Speaker 1: we're going on the live tour um, most notably where

1951
01:36:18,720 --> 01:36:24,439
Speaker 1: I'll be, which is Reno, Sacramento and Boise and hopefully

1952
01:36:24,439 --> 01:36:26,559
Speaker 1: it'll be announcing in Austin stop soon, which I know

1953
01:36:26,640 --> 01:36:29,840
Speaker 1: I'll be taking part it. So all you need to

1954
01:36:29,880 --> 01:36:33,920
Speaker 1: do is go get the newsletter, buy some gear, and

1955
01:36:33,960 --> 01:36:36,000
Speaker 1: then sign up for an event. That's it. That's all.

1956
01:36:36,080 --> 01:36:40,320
Speaker 1: That's that's nothing. Uh, there's plenty of fun stuff from

1957
01:36:40,320 --> 01:36:42,080
Speaker 1: the Mediata crew. Proud to be a part of it.

1958
01:36:42,640 --> 01:36:45,400
Speaker 1: Proud to put out this podcast and thank you all

1959
01:36:45,439 --> 01:36:49,360
Speaker 1: for listening to it as always, And next week we're

1960
01:36:49,360 --> 01:36:52,080
Speaker 1: gonna get back to you with episode number forty seven

1961
01:36:52,200 --> 01:36:55,599
Speaker 1: with a man named Ian Harrison who is the editor

1962
01:36:55,640 --> 01:37:00,439
Speaker 1: of Recoil Magazine, a native of England and has a

1963
01:37:00,479 --> 01:37:04,519
Speaker 1: great story about why and how he came to this country.

1964
01:37:05,080 --> 01:37:09,599
Speaker 1: So enjoy that next week on the Honey Collective. Bye