1 00:00:02,520 --> 00:00:07,040 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. 2 00:00:07,800 --> 00:00:11,280 Speaker 2: Republicans in Congress gearing up to negotiate an extension of 3 00:00:11,280 --> 00:00:14,440 Speaker 2: Donald Trump's twenty seventeen tax cuts. A group of House 4 00:00:14,480 --> 00:00:17,319 Speaker 2: Republicans we're invited to meet with Trump this weekend at 5 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:19,880 Speaker 2: Mari Laco and are expected to push to include an 6 00:00:19,920 --> 00:00:24,079 Speaker 2: expansion of salt tax deductions in Congress's upcoming package. A 7 00:00:24,120 --> 00:00:25,599 Speaker 2: place to say that joining us now is one of 8 00:00:25,600 --> 00:00:29,800 Speaker 2: those House Republicans. Congressman Michael Awner of New York Congressman Fantastical, 9 00:00:29,880 --> 00:00:32,080 Speaker 2: catch up with you once again, sir. I just want 10 00:00:32,120 --> 00:00:34,280 Speaker 2: to know, from your perspective, how many friends you have 11 00:00:34,400 --> 00:00:36,760 Speaker 2: outside of New York in the House that would be 12 00:00:36,760 --> 00:00:37,800 Speaker 2: on board with this effort. 13 00:00:39,479 --> 00:00:41,360 Speaker 1: A lot more than people realize. 14 00:00:41,760 --> 00:00:45,440 Speaker 3: Obviously New York, New Jersey, and California three of the 15 00:00:45,640 --> 00:00:50,919 Speaker 3: high tax states where this has most acutely impacted. Certainly 16 00:00:51,600 --> 00:00:55,760 Speaker 3: we have a coalition, and given our small majority in 17 00:00:55,800 --> 00:01:00,880 Speaker 3: the House, it's certainly a powerful coalition. But there's other 18 00:01:00,920 --> 00:01:05,320 Speaker 3: states and members across the country in which, you know, 19 00:01:05,400 --> 00:01:09,000 Speaker 3: over the last seven years they've seen their own taxes 20 00:01:09,160 --> 00:01:14,680 Speaker 3: rise up against that ten thousand dollars cap. So quietly 21 00:01:14,760 --> 00:01:16,959 Speaker 3: there's a few more members than. 22 00:01:16,840 --> 00:01:18,560 Speaker 1: People would realize, but would realize. 23 00:01:18,720 --> 00:01:22,319 Speaker 3: Look, the cap on salt was a pay for for 24 00:01:22,360 --> 00:01:25,040 Speaker 3: the twenty seventeen tax Cuts in Jobs Act. 25 00:01:25,200 --> 00:01:25,800 Speaker 1: That's it. 26 00:01:25,800 --> 00:01:28,000 Speaker 3: It was used as a pay for to pay for 27 00:01:28,120 --> 00:01:33,240 Speaker 3: other provisions within the tax bill. The ten thousand dollars 28 00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:38,440 Speaker 3: cap is woefully insufficient. It's had a negative impact on 29 00:01:38,560 --> 00:01:42,320 Speaker 3: states like New York. Now we can get into how 30 00:01:42,400 --> 00:01:46,400 Speaker 3: New York excessively spends. They've increased their state budget by 31 00:01:46,440 --> 00:01:49,920 Speaker 3: sixty one billion dollars in the last four years, for instance. 32 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:51,440 Speaker 1: That needs to change. 33 00:01:52,080 --> 00:01:55,480 Speaker 3: But taxpayers should not be penalized by living in a 34 00:01:55,680 --> 00:01:56,600 Speaker 3: high tax state. 35 00:01:56,760 --> 00:01:58,120 Speaker 1: This is double taxation. 36 00:01:59,080 --> 00:02:01,440 Speaker 3: And for those of my colleagues that say this is 37 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:05,760 Speaker 3: somehow a subsidy, the fact is New York contributes more 38 00:02:05,760 --> 00:02:09,639 Speaker 3: to the federal government than it receives, and more than 39 00:02:09,760 --> 00:02:14,040 Speaker 3: some of these states in which you know my colleagues 40 00:02:14,080 --> 00:02:18,080 Speaker 3: will claim that they don't want their taxpayers subsidizing New York, 41 00:02:18,200 --> 00:02:20,240 Speaker 3: but the reality is it's the other way around. 42 00:02:20,400 --> 00:02:23,000 Speaker 4: Congressman, you certainly don't have a friend though, And someone 43 00:02:23,160 --> 00:02:26,160 Speaker 4: like Lindsey Graham, the center of South Carolina, who said, 44 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:29,240 Speaker 4: why should I from South Carolina pay for what's going 45 00:02:29,280 --> 00:02:31,440 Speaker 4: on in some of these blue states. And he's pushing 46 00:02:31,480 --> 00:02:35,640 Speaker 4: for this one big sorry for the two bill approach 47 00:02:35,840 --> 00:02:37,800 Speaker 4: because he doesn't want to talk about taxes, he thinks 48 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:39,880 Speaker 4: it's going to take too long, and he doesn't frankly 49 00:02:39,919 --> 00:02:42,400 Speaker 4: want to sign up for salt. How are you going 50 00:02:42,440 --> 00:02:44,840 Speaker 4: to convince the President this weekend that you should do 51 00:02:44,919 --> 00:02:46,960 Speaker 4: one bill together and make sure salts included. 52 00:02:48,120 --> 00:02:50,919 Speaker 3: Well, Respectfully, South Carolina is one of those states that 53 00:02:51,840 --> 00:02:56,119 Speaker 3: gets more back, certainly percentage wise than New York does. 54 00:02:56,240 --> 00:02:59,440 Speaker 3: So you know, if we want to talk about subsidies, 55 00:02:59,440 --> 00:03:02,400 Speaker 3: we can go after and burst through everybody's subsidies that 56 00:03:02,440 --> 00:03:06,240 Speaker 3: they get. Look with respect to one versus too. The 57 00:03:06,280 --> 00:03:10,120 Speaker 3: President has already made clear he is moving forward on 58 00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:15,800 Speaker 3: one big bill. We need to deal with taxes, the border, 59 00:03:16,320 --> 00:03:21,760 Speaker 3: energy debt, among other issues. And the fact is, given 60 00:03:21,880 --> 00:03:25,359 Speaker 3: our small margin in the House, we're going to need 61 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:28,079 Speaker 3: everybody's vote and everybody on board. 62 00:03:28,160 --> 00:03:31,960 Speaker 1: Two track bills are going to make that harder. 63 00:03:32,680 --> 00:03:35,520 Speaker 3: So while it may take a little bit more time 64 00:03:35,640 --> 00:03:40,520 Speaker 3: to get one bill negotiated, it is necessary if we're 65 00:03:40,560 --> 00:03:43,440 Speaker 3: going to get all of these issues addressed. And I 66 00:03:43,480 --> 00:03:45,840 Speaker 3: think the President understands SID. I think that's why the 67 00:03:45,880 --> 00:03:50,800 Speaker 3: President made clear last week one bill, and that's how 68 00:03:50,840 --> 00:03:52,600 Speaker 3: we are proceeding forward. 69 00:03:52,360 --> 00:03:53,040 Speaker 1: In the House. 70 00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:58,520 Speaker 3: And look, ultimately, our Senate and House Republican majorities are 71 00:03:58,520 --> 00:04:01,360 Speaker 3: going to have to work together. Nobody's going to get 72 00:04:01,400 --> 00:04:04,360 Speaker 3: everything they want out of this. There's going to have 73 00:04:04,400 --> 00:04:07,440 Speaker 3: to be a good faith negotiation if we have any 74 00:04:07,520 --> 00:04:10,680 Speaker 3: chance of passing a reconciliation bill. 75 00:04:11,280 --> 00:04:14,080 Speaker 4: I was one of those individuals who watched your festivus 76 00:04:14,160 --> 00:04:17,040 Speaker 4: airing of grievances during the Christmas week and you did 77 00:04:17,040 --> 00:04:20,240 Speaker 4: a little bit of a wink at your potential future 78 00:04:20,360 --> 00:04:23,480 Speaker 4: maybe becoming the governor of New York to make sure 79 00:04:23,520 --> 00:04:26,240 Speaker 4: you could potentially go down that path, do you need 80 00:04:26,320 --> 00:04:28,480 Speaker 4: to secure a higher salt tax break. 81 00:04:30,120 --> 00:04:33,560 Speaker 3: Look, regardless of whether or not I run for governor, 82 00:04:33,720 --> 00:04:37,040 Speaker 3: this was a promise of mine and it's a top 83 00:04:37,120 --> 00:04:39,720 Speaker 3: priority for my district. I represent one of the highest 84 00:04:39,720 --> 00:04:43,560 Speaker 3: tax districts in the country, inclusive of Westchester and Rockland 85 00:04:43,640 --> 00:04:47,479 Speaker 3: Counties number one and number two highest property tax counties 86 00:04:47,520 --> 00:04:51,599 Speaker 3: in America. So this is critically important. To lift the 87 00:04:51,640 --> 00:04:57,920 Speaker 3: cap on salt. Ten thousand dollars is woefully insufficient, and 88 00:04:58,720 --> 00:05:00,839 Speaker 3: this is something that I said I would deliver on, 89 00:05:00,920 --> 00:05:04,680 Speaker 3: and we're going to as part of this reconciliation bill. 90 00:05:05,520 --> 00:05:08,520 Speaker 3: Long term for New York, this is critical. We lead 91 00:05:08,560 --> 00:05:12,120 Speaker 3: the nation in out migration. Our tax base is eroding, 92 00:05:12,279 --> 00:05:16,120 Speaker 3: in large part because of the disastrous policies of Cappy 93 00:05:16,200 --> 00:05:20,200 Speaker 3: Hokel and Albany Democrats. One party rule in Albany has 94 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:23,960 Speaker 3: been an abject disaster, whether you're talking about the affordability 95 00:05:23,960 --> 00:05:27,680 Speaker 3: crisis or public safety. People being burned alive on subways, 96 00:05:27,760 --> 00:05:31,720 Speaker 3: pushed in front of oncoming subway trains. Kappy Hochl now 97 00:05:31,800 --> 00:05:35,919 Speaker 3: scamming New Yorkers out of twenty five hundred dollars a 98 00:05:36,080 --> 00:05:39,320 Speaker 3: year just for the privilege of driving to work, while 99 00:05:39,320 --> 00:05:44,320 Speaker 3: spending billions of dollars of taxpayer money on free housing, clothing, food, education, 100 00:05:44,839 --> 00:05:48,680 Speaker 3: and healthcare for illegal immigrants. New York needs change, there's 101 00:05:48,720 --> 00:05:51,800 Speaker 3: no question about that. But from a federal perspective, we 102 00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:55,120 Speaker 3: should not be penalizing New York taxpayers because of the 103 00:05:55,200 --> 00:05:58,839 Speaker 3: disastrous decisions of Cappy HOCl and Albany Democrats. 104 00:05:58,920 --> 00:06:01,039 Speaker 4: And just to be clear, comes to the salt cap, 105 00:06:01,120 --> 00:06:03,159 Speaker 4: how high are you looking for it to be raised? 106 00:06:04,200 --> 00:06:06,400 Speaker 1: Look, I've introduced legislation. 107 00:06:07,560 --> 00:06:11,680 Speaker 3: You know, my marriage penalty elimination bill reintroduced to raise 108 00:06:11,720 --> 00:06:14,799 Speaker 3: it to one hundred thousand dollars for individuals two hundred 109 00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:16,600 Speaker 3: thousand dollars for married couples. 110 00:06:16,960 --> 00:06:18,360 Speaker 1: This is going to be a negotiation. 111 00:06:19,360 --> 00:06:21,919 Speaker 3: My colleagues and I are looking forward to sitting down 112 00:06:22,080 --> 00:06:26,479 Speaker 3: with the President having a discussion about it, hearing obviously 113 00:06:26,520 --> 00:06:29,520 Speaker 3: what his priorities are as part of the tax bill, 114 00:06:30,200 --> 00:06:33,279 Speaker 3: and working to a consensus. At the end of the day, 115 00:06:34,200 --> 00:06:38,400 Speaker 3: my objective is to provide tax relief to hard working Americans. 116 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:42,359 Speaker 3: It's incumbent upon everybody to negotiate in good faith because 117 00:06:42,360 --> 00:06:45,320 Speaker 3: here's the reality. If we do not pass a tax 118 00:06:45,360 --> 00:06:49,719 Speaker 3: bill number one, salt comes back unlimited, but it is 119 00:06:49,760 --> 00:06:53,520 Speaker 3: accompanied by the largest tax increase in American history. So 120 00:06:53,560 --> 00:06:57,599 Speaker 3: it is important that we actually negotiate a fair tax 121 00:06:57,680 --> 00:07:01,040 Speaker 3: deal for the American people in August. 122 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:02,400 Speaker 4: I just want to end on this. You are one 123 00:07:02,400 --> 00:07:04,520 Speaker 4: of these individuals that wrote a letter to the Speaker 124 00:07:04,680 --> 00:07:08,119 Speaker 4: talking about that you didn't want the repeal of energy 125 00:07:08,200 --> 00:07:10,560 Speaker 4: tax credits with the IRA. This is something that president 126 00:07:10,560 --> 00:07:12,440 Speaker 4: like Donald Trump wants. Are you going to be trying 127 00:07:12,480 --> 00:07:15,400 Speaker 4: to assuage him of your view over this weekend in 128 00:07:15,480 --> 00:07:15,960 Speaker 4: mar Lago. 129 00:07:17,760 --> 00:07:22,360 Speaker 3: Look, many provisions of the IRA absolutely need to be repealed. 130 00:07:22,680 --> 00:07:24,960 Speaker 3: What we signed on to a letter is that we 131 00:07:24,960 --> 00:07:27,880 Speaker 3: were not going to just sign off on a wholesale repeal. 132 00:07:27,920 --> 00:07:30,880 Speaker 3: There needed to be a discussion and again a negotiation. 133 00:07:31,720 --> 00:07:37,560 Speaker 3: Companies make decisions based on tax provisions, and they need certainty. 134 00:07:37,560 --> 00:07:40,800 Speaker 3: And there's already been significant investment, including in New York, 135 00:07:41,560 --> 00:07:45,520 Speaker 3: based on some of these energy tax credits, and so 136 00:07:45,560 --> 00:07:48,400 Speaker 3: we want to make sure that any changes are done 137 00:07:48,760 --> 00:07:53,360 Speaker 3: smartly and not just wholesale repeal. So that'll be part 138 00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:58,640 Speaker 3: of the discussion and conversation as we move forward. And again, 139 00:07:58,760 --> 00:08:01,560 Speaker 3: I think the key here is to come up with 140 00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:07,360 Speaker 3: a reconciliation bill that increases domestic production of energy, ensures 141 00:08:07,400 --> 00:08:12,600 Speaker 3: the American people have a good, smart tax bill to 142 00:08:12,680 --> 00:08:16,800 Speaker 3: reduce their taxes, reduce the cost of living here in 143 00:08:16,840 --> 00:08:20,000 Speaker 3: the US, and ultimately secures our border. 144 00:08:20,160 --> 00:08:21,440 Speaker 1: It's a lot of. 145 00:08:21,480 --> 00:08:26,040 Speaker 3: Important issues that have to be included in this reconciliation bill. 146 00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:30,440 Speaker 3: It's going to require negotiation, and it's going to ultimately 147 00:08:30,680 --> 00:08:33,760 Speaker 3: require every Republican supporting the final product. 148 00:08:33,880 --> 00:08:36,800 Speaker 2: A Congressman, as we speak, Bonyold of climbing and We've 149 00:08:36,840 --> 00:08:39,360 Speaker 2: seen quite a significant move since September when the Federal 150 00:08:39,360 --> 00:08:42,319 Speaker 2: Reserve standing its rate cutting effort. We've moved one hundred 151 00:08:42,400 --> 00:08:44,880 Speaker 2: basis points. And I certainly don't expect you to follow 152 00:08:44,920 --> 00:08:47,280 Speaker 2: the ins and outs of fixed income on any given day, 153 00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:50,079 Speaker 2: but I wonder whether you and your colleagues are sensitive 154 00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:52,160 Speaker 2: to some of the pressure that is starting to build 155 00:08:52,360 --> 00:08:53,600 Speaker 2: in the US dept market. 156 00:08:55,280 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 3: No question, Look, our tet at thirty six trillion dollars 157 00:09:00,120 --> 00:09:05,240 Speaker 3: total and counting, is a major problem. And this is 158 00:09:05,280 --> 00:09:08,640 Speaker 3: something that everybody in the Republican Conference is in agreement on. 159 00:09:08,880 --> 00:09:10,760 Speaker 1: We have to tackle our debt. 160 00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:15,800 Speaker 3: We have to reduce our deficit spending, we have to 161 00:09:15,880 --> 00:09:17,600 Speaker 3: right size the federal government. 162 00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:19,960 Speaker 1: Spending is out of control. 163 00:09:20,080 --> 00:09:26,080 Speaker 3: Joe Biden's disastrous first two years gave us record inflation 164 00:09:26,200 --> 00:09:28,560 Speaker 3: it spite the cost of living. 165 00:09:29,040 --> 00:09:31,760 Speaker 1: And we have to unwind a lot of this. 166 00:09:32,240 --> 00:09:34,320 Speaker 3: You look at a state like New York, it is 167 00:09:34,480 --> 00:09:38,319 Speaker 3: floundering because of some of the economic pressures. 168 00:09:38,920 --> 00:09:39,880 Speaker 1: And just think about this. 169 00:09:40,400 --> 00:09:45,240 Speaker 3: The MTA has more debt than eighty percent of the 170 00:09:45,320 --> 00:09:49,320 Speaker 3: states in the country. So debt is a major problem. 171 00:09:49,440 --> 00:09:52,880 Speaker 3: It's something that we have to deal with across the board. 172 00:09:53,760 --> 00:09:59,200 Speaker 3: We cannot continue to print and borrow money at the levels. 173 00:09:58,840 --> 00:09:59,280 Speaker 1: That we have. 174 00:09:59,480 --> 00:10:01,600 Speaker 2: Do you think we can and afford to extend CCJA, 175 00:10:02,040 --> 00:10:04,439 Speaker 2: which baseline is something like four to five trillion? Do 176 00:10:04,480 --> 00:10:06,440 Speaker 2: you think we can afford to include an expansion of 177 00:10:06,480 --> 00:10:09,120 Speaker 2: cell tax deductions? And Congressman, I wouldn't push back against 178 00:10:09,120 --> 00:10:11,559 Speaker 2: anything you said about the effort that needs to take 179 00:10:11,600 --> 00:10:14,319 Speaker 2: place elsewear, I'm just wondering how much fiscal space you 180 00:10:14,400 --> 00:10:16,840 Speaker 2: and your colleagues believe we actually have at the moment. 181 00:10:17,640 --> 00:10:22,240 Speaker 3: Look, tax policy is critical to economic growth, but it's 182 00:10:22,240 --> 00:10:26,320 Speaker 3: one part. We need to increase domestic production of energy, 183 00:10:26,600 --> 00:10:31,120 Speaker 3: which will help generate more revenues. Energy policy is also critical, 184 00:10:31,200 --> 00:10:35,560 Speaker 3: not just domestically for cost, but for national security. You 185 00:10:35,600 --> 00:10:39,199 Speaker 3: were talking obviously about the threats to Europe from Russia. 186 00:10:39,679 --> 00:10:44,240 Speaker 3: Europe is still buying gas from Russia. It's idiotic. It 187 00:10:44,360 --> 00:10:47,560 Speaker 3: makes no sense that they're helping fund the very war 188 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:51,120 Speaker 3: they're trying to stop. So there is a lot that 189 00:10:51,240 --> 00:10:55,920 Speaker 3: has to be done here, including reigning in federal spending. Obviously, 190 00:10:56,280 --> 00:10:59,000 Speaker 3: as we work through the tax cuts, we will look 191 00:10:59,040 --> 00:11:03,640 Speaker 3: to help offset some of the cost through spending reduction. 192 00:11:03,840 --> 00:11:06,960 Speaker 3: So this is going to be a comprehensive approach to 193 00:11:07,120 --> 00:11:10,240 Speaker 3: how we right size the American economy. I do think 194 00:11:10,240 --> 00:11:12,120 Speaker 3: it's possible. It's going to be one of the most 195 00:11:12,200 --> 00:11:16,720 Speaker 3: critical things any of us ever do in our careers 196 00:11:16,760 --> 00:11:19,560 Speaker 3: in government. And so we all have to be committed 197 00:11:19,600 --> 00:11:21,440 Speaker 3: to the final cause here and. 198 00:11:21,440 --> 00:11:23,920 Speaker 2: We're certainly looking forward to continue in the conversation with you, sir, 199 00:11:24,000 --> 00:11:26,599 Speaker 2: in your current capacity and maybe in the future. Is 200 00:11:26,640 --> 00:11:28,720 Speaker 2: the next government of the great State of New York. 201 00:11:28,840 --> 00:11:31,480 Speaker 2: Mike Lauda there, Congressman, thank you, sir, appreciate it.