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Speaker 1: Hi. I'm Laura Vanderkamp. I'm a mother of five, an author, journalist,

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Speaker 1: and speaker.

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Speaker 2: And I'm Sarah hart Hunger, a mother of three, practicing physician,

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Speaker 2: writer and course creator. We are two working parents who

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Speaker 2: love our careers and our families.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to best of both worlds. Here we talk about

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Speaker 1: how real women manage work, family, and time for fun.

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Speaker 1: From figuring out childcare to mapping out long term career goals.

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Speaker 1: We want you to get the most out of life.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to best of both worlds. This is Laura. This

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Speaker 1: episode is airing in late July of twenty twenty six.

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Speaker 1: We're going to be talking all things decluttering. This is

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Speaker 1: a decluttering blitz of an episode. We happen to know

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Speaker 1: that decluttering is a big topic. Much of my Instagram

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Speaker 1: feed is about people declutter. We see the videos about it,

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Speaker 1: lots of articles in magazines. And it makes sense because

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Speaker 1: having an uncluttered house makes it more functional. I mean,

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Speaker 1: people like to have things where they're supposed to be.

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Speaker 1: There is much joy in opening a drawer and finding

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Speaker 1: your scissors exactly where the scissors are supposed to be,

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Speaker 1: and not surrounded by a million other things that are

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Speaker 1: not supposed to be there. So, Sarah, you had set

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Speaker 1: a goal to declutter your house for many years.

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Speaker 2: Right, Yes, I different variations of that goal, Like sometimes

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Speaker 2: I wanted to do it in a specific way using

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Speaker 2: the organized through sixty five method, which we'll talk about

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Speaker 2: in this episode. Other times I just had a general

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Speaker 2: goal of decluttering different areas.

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Speaker 1: And finally, in.

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Speaker 2: Twenty twenty six, I said I would like to declutter,

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Speaker 2: but I am going to hire a professional to help

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Speaker 2: me do so because I failed this goal too many

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Speaker 2: other times. And as someone who does talk about what

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Speaker 2: to do when you hit roadblocks with goals, I knew

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Speaker 2: that just setting it again was probably not going to

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Speaker 2: be the answer. Yeah, So there we were at the

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Speaker 2: start of twenty twenty six.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, set it again and we'll talk about that. But

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Speaker 1: real quick, we want to just do a quick life

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Speaker 1: recap because we haven't talked that much in the podcast.

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Speaker 1: We record quite a bit ahead of time. Like you

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Speaker 1: thought you would be in somewhere else right now in

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Speaker 1: late July.

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Speaker 2: Correct Sarah, Yes, as this is airing, I should have

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Speaker 2: been like waking up for my last day in Maui

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Speaker 2: and headed to Kawai for this trip. You guys, you

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Speaker 2: listeners have heard about a bunch because it has played

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Speaker 2: an anticipatory role in my life for probably a year now.

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Speaker 1: I literally started.

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Speaker 2: Booking the hotels over a year ago.

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Speaker 1: In fact, the trip even got moved.

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Speaker 2: If you were in a student listener, you may know

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Speaker 2: we were going to go in early June and then

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Speaker 2: moved it to mid July because of my daughter's geometry class.

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Speaker 2: But I was so proud that I was able to

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Speaker 2: move it and make it work. The irony is that

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Speaker 2: if we had gone in June, we would have gone

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Speaker 2: on the trip, yep. But we did not go in June,

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Speaker 2: and Annabel is acing jometry, So for what it's worth,

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Speaker 2: there was a good reason for moving the trip. However,

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Speaker 2: in early July, or maybe it was the end of June,

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Speaker 2: obviously end of the end of June, my husband went

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Speaker 2: to a basketball game and I got a phone call

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Speaker 2: and he said.

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Speaker 1: I broke my leg. I'm so sorry.

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Speaker 2: And this wasn't even the first time I've been through

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Speaker 2: that exact phone call, which.

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Speaker 1: Is pretty crazy.

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Speaker 2: Literally had like that same phone call fourteen years ago

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Speaker 2: when he broke his other leg skiing, But this break

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Speaker 2: actually turned out to be worse it involved the joint.

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Speaker 2: It was shattering of multiple bones that doctors said it

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Speaker 2: looked much more like a motorcycle accident than a basketball injury.

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Speaker 2: And thankfully he's okay. He underwent surgery, he has slowly recovered.

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Speaker 2: Probably by the time this airs, he will be much

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Speaker 2: more recovered. Right now, he's in the kind of early

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Speaker 2: phases to a lot of pain. Will not be weight

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Speaker 2: bearing until August. And we had to obviously change everything

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Speaker 2: about our summer that we had envisioned and that I

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Speaker 2: had spent a lot of time thinking about. So that

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Speaker 2: included our trip and included a lot of processing time.

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Speaker 2: He's obviously out of work. I didn't have to take

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Speaker 2: off too much work. I mean, I've been like helping him,

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Speaker 2: but ar Nanny has been helping him when I'm not there,

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Speaker 2: and so at least that's been pretty okay. And at

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Speaker 2: this point and certainly by the time this errs, I mean,

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Speaker 2: I'm it is what it is like.

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Speaker 1: This has been a year of more.

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Speaker 2: Disappointments, though than like a normal person should have. Obviously

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Speaker 2: there is no should. I'm still here. Everyone's in one

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Speaker 2: mostly in one piece, like no one who's a horse.

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Speaker 1: I mean one piece put together. I mean, yeah, so.

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Speaker 2: There's hope for the future. But like so I ended

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Speaker 2: up canceling my trip in July to see Laura and

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Speaker 2: a good friend. I had already missed a conference in

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Speaker 2: San Francisco because my mother in law passed. Like they

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Speaker 2: were all like very much like good reasons, like I

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Speaker 2: couldn't have done it any other way, or I wouldn't

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Speaker 2: have done it any other way. And it's also just

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Speaker 2: added up to a kind of a sucky like it's

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Speaker 2: I've had my own personal COVID year, yeah.

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Speaker 1: While everyone else got to have normal. But that's You's

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Speaker 1: a planner, right, you got a new planner so so

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Speaker 1: that you don't have to look at all the stuff

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Speaker 1: that you're not doing well. I did that in twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty two.

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Speaker 2: But yes, I did get a new July to December

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Speaker 2: planner because I couldn't stand the idea of trying to

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Speaker 2: plan my work schedule right on top of my snorkeling

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Speaker 2: and surf lesson.

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Speaker 1: Guys, wait, were you going to do the surf lesson?

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Speaker 1: I thought you had decided not to do the surflas.

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Speaker 2: So caectate this surf less and I was very excited

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Speaker 2: to do so it was going to be so cool,

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Speaker 2: Like he even told me, like there's a place to sit.

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Speaker 1: Like, here's the good news.

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Speaker 2: My planning did not go to waste because I have

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Speaker 2: a really well thought out Hawaii trip just waiting to

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Speaker 2: be rebooked. And you guys, my organization helped. Like I

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Speaker 2: was able to find everything very easily, and I have

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Speaker 2: learned to book refundable over the years, so I got

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Speaker 2: pretty much everything back.

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Speaker 1: So that part is at least we will.

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Speaker 2: Be able to use all that planning for a future

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Speaker 2: Hawaii trip, which I've decided can't happen until next summer

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Speaker 2: because I really want that full two week window and

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Speaker 2: without doing crazy heroics and pulling kids out of school

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Speaker 2: for long lengths of time, that would have to wait

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Speaker 2: till next Summer's Yeah, but.

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Speaker 1: You'll do something else for spring break, right, you'll do

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Speaker 1: a trip maybe that you would have a spring break.

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Speaker 2: You're exactly like trying to make up for the fact that, hey,

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Speaker 2: like our vacation coffers will be a little more full

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Speaker 2: than we might have expected for twenty twenty seven. Let's

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Speaker 2: see what kind of really special things we can do.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's exciting. Well, best slide Plans, life happens, and

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Speaker 1: we're amazed how resilient Sarah has been about all this.

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Speaker 1: But anyway, so that's a life update there. But as

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Speaker 1: part of that, you are home more, you are having

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Speaker 1: more time to declutter. So we can pivot from there

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Speaker 1: to your decluttering journey. So back in January, you hired

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Speaker 1: somebody to come help you, right, What was the thinking

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Speaker 1: with that?

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Speaker 2: Yes, So, as I've talked about, if you're setting a

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Speaker 2: goal over and over again and you're not changing any

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Speaker 2: of the variables associated with that goal, you're like sort of.

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Speaker 1: Doing an exercise and futility, and you.

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Speaker 2: Can make a goal smaller, you can decide not to

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Speaker 2: do a goal, you can change a goal, or you

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Speaker 2: can get some kind of outsourcing or assistance. And I

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Speaker 2: chose to go that route with my decluttering goal. We

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Speaker 2: actually had a member of Best Laid Plans Live about

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Speaker 2: a year ago that was a kon Mari consultant, which

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Speaker 2: is how.

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Speaker 1: I got the idea. Like, I will talk about con

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Speaker 1: Mari in a minute.

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Speaker 2: But I just think it's a fascinating framework of decoll uttering.

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Speaker 2: And she has a training program where people can get

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Speaker 2: trained in her methods. And this woman at our bestling,

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Speaker 2: Plans Live was doing that, and I actually emailed her

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Speaker 2: during the conference, Hey, can I hire you, like, will

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Speaker 2: you help me virtually organize my house? She said no,

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Speaker 2: she doesn't do virtual organizing, but she used some people

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Speaker 2: that did. And then I really thought about it, and

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Speaker 2: I was like, I don't really think virtual it's the

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Speaker 2: way to go here, Like I think I need a

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Speaker 2: human person with me in my house making things happen.

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Speaker 2: It would be a little too easy to just not

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Speaker 2: be accountable to something that felt less tangible. So I

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Speaker 2: hired a woman named so It found there's like a

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Speaker 2: network of kon Mari people. I sent emails out to

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Speaker 2: two of them that were in South Florida, and I

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Speaker 2: ended up hiring a woman named Sophie. And Sophie is young,

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Speaker 2: she's in her twenties and she's come I don't know,

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Speaker 2: like maybe seven or eight times now. She usually comes

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Speaker 2: for three hours at a time, and we work on

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Speaker 2: a kon Mari fired category.

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Speaker 1: So we work together, like I am working.

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Speaker 2: It is not like I can go do a podcast

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Speaker 2: and she is organizing my bedroom like no, no, no,

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Speaker 2: Like I am the one who has to decide what

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Speaker 2: to keep and what to give away, et cetera.

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Speaker 1: So, for example, we.

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Speaker 2: Just did the kitchen, and the kitchen is not really

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Speaker 2: a con Marin category, but again she works in the

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Speaker 2: she's flexible and so it's one of the Homono categories,

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Speaker 2: which just means like everyday things. And she actually divides

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Speaker 2: the kitchen into food stuffs and then cooking preparation things,

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Speaker 2: and then serving things. So there's like three categories. We

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Speaker 2: did two out of the three during this three hour session.

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Speaker 2: We did cooking preparation things, which is like pots, pans, gadgets,

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Speaker 2: spatula's everything, and then also serving stuff, so that means

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Speaker 2: every plate, every spoon, every whatever. And we took stuff

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Speaker 2: out and then we decided did it spark joy or not,

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Speaker 2: and then we put a lot of things to donate

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Speaker 2: because they didn't spark joy, and then she helped me

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Speaker 2: put them back in a smart fashion. And every time

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Speaker 2: we've done an area, I get rid of a lot because,

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Speaker 2: as it turns out, when you're not actively weeding out

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Speaker 2: your stuff, you just kind of keep accumulating and accumulating.

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Speaker 2: So that's kind of what the sessions look like. She

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Speaker 2: actually at the last session, she could tell I was

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Speaker 2: overwhelmed with like what do I do with all this stuff?

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Speaker 2: And she's like, I will don't eat it for you

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Speaker 2: for an extra little small fee, and I was like, yes,

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Speaker 2: you will do that. I was like, here, please take

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Speaker 2: my stuff for all I know. She sold it and

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Speaker 2: then she made money twice.

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Speaker 1: I don't care. It was out of my house.

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Speaker 2: And that is what the kun Marii sessions look like.

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Speaker 2: They're very helpful. There is a part that it's like, oh,

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Speaker 2: I could do that on my own, but guys, I

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Speaker 2: absolutely would not.

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Speaker 1: I would not.

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Speaker 2: And every time that she's even calming, I'm like, oh,

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Speaker 2: there's a other stuff I'd rather be doing. But you know,

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Speaker 2: when I've scheduled this and I promised myself I would

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Speaker 2: do it, and I made time for it, and then

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Speaker 2: after I'm done, I'm like, that was good. This really

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Speaker 2: makes me feel better. This space is better. We did paper,

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Speaker 2: which means we went through every single book in the house,

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Speaker 2: not the kid's books, every single adult book in the house,

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Speaker 2: and every single fire in my files.

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Speaker 1: That was great. I mean they're much more functional now.

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Speaker 1: That's cool. I mean, so I have a question, Sarah, like,

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Speaker 1: is it really that bad? I mean, didn't you guys

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Speaker 1: move in twenty twenty two.

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Speaker 2: I don't think it's that bad, but it's not as

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Speaker 2: good as I would like it to be.

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Speaker 1: I see, okay, because I mean it sounds like she's

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Speaker 1: been there what like twenty plus hours now, and it's

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Speaker 1: been twenty plus hour projects.

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Speaker 2: If you're really looking at like every paper you own,

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Speaker 2: it takes a while. Maybe I didn't let me see,

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Speaker 2: I didn't look at every paper I own.

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Speaker 1: We did my.

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Speaker 2: Closet, we did the bathrooms, we did the kitchen, and

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Speaker 2: we did office supplies, books, papers. I think that's it.

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Speaker 2: We haven't done the kids rooms. She hasn't done my husband,

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Speaker 2: like Joshu said, And I think this will help a

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Speaker 2: lot as well that he is willing to do sessions

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Speaker 2: with her, because now he's like seeing what that looks like.

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Speaker 1: And I do think some of.

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Speaker 2: What is cluttering our house is maybe more his. But

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Speaker 2: if he's going to do those sessions, then that will

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Speaker 2: help as well. So yeah, I think I don't have

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Speaker 2: like a hard deadline like initially because I wanted to

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Speaker 2: finish in the year, but I'm definitely making significant progress

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Speaker 2: and I just want to keep steadily going until we

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Speaker 2: feel pretty done.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean that is always the challenge. I mean,

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Speaker 1: when you live with other people, there are many things

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Speaker 1: you can do. There are also other things that are

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Speaker 1: harder to do based on other people's things that they

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Speaker 1: may or may not. Sometimes people feel things are perfect

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Speaker 1: because they are theirs, an attitude that's out there.

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Speaker 2: I've heard, Yes, that can be a barrier, but at

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Speaker 2: least I don't know. I think it helps everybody in

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Speaker 2: the family have an awareness of how things can be

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Speaker 2: more functional when there's less clutter around, which I think

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Speaker 2: is helpful.

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Speaker 1: It's helpful put it that way. All right, Well, we're

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Speaker 1: going to take a quick ad break and then we'll

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Speaker 1: be back talking more about decluttering. Well, we are back

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Speaker 1: talking decluttering. I mean, certainly the moving as an impetus

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Speaker 1: to do this. You did get rid of some stuff,

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Speaker 1: didn't you. I mean in twenty twenty two when you moved.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, we definitely did. I think we could have

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Speaker 2: done a slightly better job, but it definitely helped. I

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Speaker 2: feel like you really did a blitz when you guys

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Speaker 2: switched homes. Like there was a lot of boxes, and

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Speaker 2: I feel like you were more ruthless about going through them.

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Speaker 1: Maybe, I mean, we didn't get rid of everything. Certainly

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Speaker 1: there were a ton of boxes just like put in

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Speaker 1: the basement or put in the attic. But what did

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Speaker 1: happen is then we hired the home manager shortly thereafter,

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Speaker 1: and she kind of went through a lot of the stuff.

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Speaker 1: And so I will put that out there as an

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Speaker 1: idea for people. Certainly you can be part of the

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Speaker 1: going through things, but if you sort of trust that

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Speaker 1: the person is probably not going to throw out some

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Speaker 1: priceless heirloom, right, you can also let somebody else do

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Speaker 1: a lot of it. And part of what they're doing

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Speaker 1: is not necessarily even getting rid of stuff, it's organizing it, like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: these things all go in this bin, and now it's

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Speaker 1: got a label on it, and so you can find

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Speaker 1: the Christmas decorations, and she's not going through and saying like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's a really crappy Christmas decoration. You don't need that.

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Speaker 1: But it is all going in a bin, and so

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Speaker 1: when you pull it out later, you may decide you

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Speaker 1: don't want to keep some of it, but it's all

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Speaker 1: in one place. And so I know there's sort of

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Speaker 1: a rule in decluttering that you're supposed to get rid

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Speaker 1: of stuff first before organizing it. But I'll just point

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Speaker 1: out that you can also have somebody organize stuff and

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Speaker 1: then decide later if you're keeping things not, and that

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Speaker 1: this is something you can get help with even if

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Speaker 1: you are not personally going to be answering every question

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Speaker 1: of do I like that sheet? Does that fork? Spark toy?

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Speaker 1: And so forth? Speaking of sparking joy, so let's talk

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Speaker 1: kan Mari. Sarah, what's the deal with kan Mari?

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Speaker 2: Yes, we're going to compareing. Don't worry, this whole episode

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Speaker 2: is not about kan Mari. We're going to compare and

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Speaker 2: contrast some popular decluttering methodologies that we have come across

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Speaker 2: over the year, many of which have been guests on

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Speaker 2: our podcast, although not Marie Condo yet.

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Speaker 1: Maybe one of these days we shall say. Well, her

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Speaker 1: co author in a book was so we had remember

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Speaker 1: that year's right? Okay, close enough.

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Speaker 2: So Marie Condo obviously wrote The Life Changing Magic of

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Speaker 2: Tidying Up, which came out around twenty fourteen. I believe

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Speaker 2: it's not that old of a methodology, and she talks

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Speaker 2: about holding every item in your house and figuring out

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Speaker 2: whether it's sparks joy and then deciding whether to keep

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Speaker 2: it and doing that in categories. She's very much not

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Speaker 2: to go room by room. It's to literally like find

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Speaker 2: every shirt in your house. But her methods are a

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Speaker 2: little bit more tailored, I think, to a one bedroom

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Speaker 2: apartment in Tokyo with no kids than they are to

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Speaker 2: a four bedroom house in South Florida. Let's say, so

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Speaker 2: there are parts that work. She has really strong opinions

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Speaker 2: about how certain things should be stored. She really hates

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Speaker 2: putting anything in wrappers. She believes that everything should be

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Speaker 2: stored like stacked vertically. Her folding methods are I think genius,

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Speaker 2: and I use many of them. And she gets a

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Speaker 2: little bit of a bad rap for people thinking that

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Speaker 2: she's prescribing minimalism.

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Speaker 1: But that's actually a misunderstanding.

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Speaker 2: So she once said something like I got down to

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Speaker 2: ten books, and that got publicized as this person says

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Speaker 2: to throw out all your books. You should only have

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Speaker 2: ten books, unless she's like, I did not say that.

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Speaker 2: She's like, in my personal situation, only ten of my

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Speaker 2: books spark joy, so I let the others go. You

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Speaker 2: may have a thousand books that spark joy, and that

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Speaker 2: is fine with you. So it's more individualizable, I think

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Speaker 2: than people give it credit for. But the idea is

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Speaker 2: that everything in your house should you should really want.

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Speaker 1: It to be there actively.

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Speaker 2: She also kind of promises that you only have to

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Speaker 2: do it once, but I've heard she's kind of backed

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Speaker 2: out of that since having children.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think, I mean, the idea that anything one

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Speaker 1: would only have to do once is just kind of

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I feel like the world doesn't necessarily

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Speaker 1: work that way. Life doesn't work that way. There's entropy, right,

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Speaker 1: Like things revert to a sort of less ordered state

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Speaker 1: in the absence of effort, So it's going to have

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Speaker 1: to be there. Yeah, I have to say I have

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Speaker 1: not been found the whole kon Mari thing that appealing,

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Speaker 1: And part of it was just, yes, the practic decalities

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Speaker 1: of like here you are trying to like put everything,

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Speaker 1: like every shirt in my house would be a disaster,

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Speaker 1: or every book in the house. I think it would

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Speaker 1: just be so overwhelming that we would just make a

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Speaker 1: big mess and never get through anything. But I think

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Speaker 1: more I really had a problem with the phrase your

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Speaker 1: life begins when you put your house in order, and

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Speaker 1: I think that is really a pernicious thought that is

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Speaker 1: already in a lot of women's heads that I can't

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Speaker 1: relax if my house is a mess, I can't go

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Speaker 1: have fun. If my house is a mess, I have

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Speaker 1: to clean up before I can live the life I want,

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Speaker 1: And that is ridiculous. You can absolutely relax if your

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Speaker 1: house is a mess. I mean, because the problem is

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Speaker 1: if you live with other people, there are going to

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Speaker 1: be messes, and then you'll never get to do anything

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Speaker 1: else because it's just they're going to keep making messes,

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Speaker 1: and then you will be trapped in this world where

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Speaker 1: you never relax. So I would say, get past that idea.

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Speaker 1: Your life begins now. Your life is going on. Now,

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Speaker 1: this is life, whether your house is organized or not.

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Speaker 2: You could ignore that part and just pay attention to

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Speaker 2: the genius folding techniques.

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Speaker 1: The folding techniques, well, there you go. What makes it

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Speaker 1: so genius just because they don't get wrinkled then or.

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Speaker 2: You can you can put stuff in drawers and see

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Speaker 2: every shirt versus if they're in stacks, you only see

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Speaker 2: the one on the top. But if they're like lying

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Speaker 2: on their side, you can see everything. It's like much

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Speaker 2: more logical.

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Speaker 1: There you go. So let's move to Dana K. White.

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Speaker 1: The K is important because Dana White is something like

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Speaker 1: ultimate Fighting, I believe. But Dana Ka White is the

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Speaker 1: organizing expert who is the author of A Slob Comes

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Speaker 1: Clean was her blog and I think one of her books.

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Speaker 1: We've both interviewed her. I believe Sarah at this point.

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Speaker 2: Yes, I had her on Bustly Plans and she's so.

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Speaker 1: Like mutual and orderly and all that, and I have

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Speaker 1: trouble believing that she was actually that much of a slob.

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Speaker 1: But maybe we never know what goes on behind closed doors,

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Speaker 1: and that she has made a quite the career of

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Speaker 1: writing about But I love her methods versus some of

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Speaker 1: the other ones, So maybe you can talk about that. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So her like main method is called the five step method,

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Speaker 2: and it works for any space. And the five steps

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Speaker 2: are number one, look for trash and trash it. Number two,

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Speaker 2: find the easy stuff and re home it. So things

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Speaker 2: that are like, oh, that's a shoe, It goes in

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Speaker 2: the closet where we keep all the shoes. Number three,

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Speaker 2: obvious donations socks with holes in them. And then for

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Speaker 2: four and five, for anything left, ask where would I

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Speaker 2: look for this? And then if there's a place that

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Speaker 2: comes up, you put it there. And would I even

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Speaker 2: think to look for it or would I just order

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Speaker 2: a new one or go with that or whatever, And

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Speaker 2: if it's the latter, then you can get rid of it.

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Speaker 1: So very practical. And she also has.

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Speaker 2: Two kind of major I don't know themes to what

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Speaker 2: she does, which is to immediately bring stuff to their

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Speaker 2: home so that you're never making a mess, meaning you

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Speaker 2: will see a purse and then you rehome it, and

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Speaker 2: then you see the bottle of Edyde drops that have

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Speaker 2: visual aids but you guys can't see them, and you

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Speaker 2: rehome that versus throwing everything on the floor and then

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Speaker 2: making a giant mess that you then have to clean

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Speaker 2: up if you get.

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Speaker 1: Interrupted halfway through. So a wonderful method.

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Speaker 2: For people with young chick kids, people who might be

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Speaker 2: decluttering in small chunks of time. And then she also

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Speaker 2: wasting called the container concept, which I like, which is

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Speaker 2: that once you've defined a container for a given item,

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Speaker 2: like this is my sock drawer. If it's full, that's

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Speaker 2: all the socks you get to have. And if you're

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Speaker 2: adding another pair and they don't fit, you have to

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Speaker 2: remove one. I mean, of course there's limits to this,

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Speaker 2: Like you could decide that you were ready for your

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Speaker 2: next era in socks and you needed to have a

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Speaker 2: bigger sock container. But in general this being a good

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Speaker 2: policy to follow because our houses are finite, and having

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Speaker 2: stuff that's just like overstuffed and overflowing all over the

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Speaker 2: place generally makes it very hard to use and very frustrating.

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Speaker 1: So I like the container concept. Yeah, I would say

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Speaker 1: that's the one part I was not so fond of

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Speaker 1: because I feel it's just like, well, in life, you

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Speaker 1: can always get a bigger container, like in many circumstances.

437
00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:06,679
Speaker 1: I mean maybe if you're like floating in the middle

438
00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:08,600
Speaker 1: of the water on a house boat, like, no, you

439
00:20:08,640 --> 00:20:11,800
Speaker 1: can't get a larger container. But like in a lot

440
00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:15,720
Speaker 1: of circumstances in modern life, you can in fact get

441
00:20:15,720 --> 00:20:20,119
Speaker 1: a larger container for whatever you want to do. If anyway,

442
00:20:20,280 --> 00:20:24,000
Speaker 1: I think some people have trouble raining themselves in though

443
00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:26,240
Speaker 1: I didn't like the idea that it could be used

444
00:20:26,240 --> 00:20:30,160
Speaker 1: to like bully other household members too. Oh fair, okay,

445
00:20:30,280 --> 00:20:33,040
Speaker 1: Like mommy wants to have a minimalist bedroom for my kids,

446
00:20:33,040 --> 00:20:35,000
Speaker 1: so you can only have six toys. I have defined

447
00:20:35,040 --> 00:20:37,800
Speaker 1: the container as six toys, Like I think that's not her,

448
00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:39,760
Speaker 1: that's not her saying, but that's what I've seen that

449
00:20:40,000 --> 00:20:43,760
Speaker 1: container concept used in sort of like people explaining how

450
00:20:43,800 --> 00:20:46,320
Speaker 1: they think about it, and I just like that repulses

451
00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:48,680
Speaker 1: me so much that I am, no, that's wrong. I agree.

452
00:20:48,760 --> 00:20:51,840
Speaker 2: You can't define someone else's container. Come on, no, no,

453
00:20:52,920 --> 00:20:54,560
Speaker 2: I was thinking of it more for your own container.

454
00:20:54,600 --> 00:20:58,920
Speaker 2: And I do think some people just have trouble setting limits,

455
00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:02,320
Speaker 2: like yeah, let me keep twenty seven winter coats because

456
00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:05,119
Speaker 2: I might need one, Like those kind of people can benefit.

457
00:21:04,760 --> 00:21:07,160
Speaker 1: From some God yea well. And I am totally into

458
00:21:07,160 --> 00:21:10,600
Speaker 1: the container concept when I travel, Like, what you can

459
00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:13,520
Speaker 1: take on this trip is the size of suitcase that

460
00:21:13,520 --> 00:21:16,119
Speaker 1: will fit in an overhead container on an international flight,

461
00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:18,080
Speaker 1: like that is what you can take because if you're

462
00:21:18,080 --> 00:21:20,960
Speaker 1: going bigger than that, you are checking bags, the airpline

463
00:21:21,000 --> 00:21:22,520
Speaker 1: is going to lose them. They are going to get

464
00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:25,200
Speaker 1: stuck somewhere in like Heathrow, and you will never get

465
00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:27,399
Speaker 1: them back, or else you'll just be waiting for an

466
00:21:27,400 --> 00:21:29,520
Speaker 1: hour for them to come out of the baggage claim.

467
00:21:29,880 --> 00:21:33,520
Speaker 1: And who needs that, right, Just define your container smaller

468
00:21:33,600 --> 00:21:36,040
Speaker 1: and you will never face that. So I do totally

469
00:21:36,040 --> 00:21:38,119
Speaker 1: get it in that circumstance. I just think sort of

470
00:21:38,119 --> 00:21:40,840
Speaker 1: for like normal life. It may be slightly less of

471
00:21:40,880 --> 00:21:45,600
Speaker 1: an effective way there because there isn't a true limit

472
00:21:45,640 --> 00:21:47,959
Speaker 1: in many cases. But I love the idea of not

473
00:21:48,119 --> 00:21:51,000
Speaker 1: making a bigger mess. I mean this is like it

474
00:21:51,119 --> 00:21:56,399
Speaker 1: just is so more practical because the reason your life

475
00:21:56,440 --> 00:21:58,960
Speaker 1: is sort of like you don't have unlimited amount of

476
00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:01,639
Speaker 1: time to go through your Like the reason things are

477
00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:04,960
Speaker 1: stacking up is because you have three little kids and

478
00:22:05,000 --> 00:22:08,040
Speaker 1: a job, and the mail comes in and before you

479
00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:10,840
Speaker 1: can sort it, somebody needs a glass of milk, and

480
00:22:10,880 --> 00:22:12,840
Speaker 1: somebody else needs help in the bathroom. And then it's

481
00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:15,920
Speaker 1: because you are gonna constantly be pulled away. If any

482
00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:18,320
Speaker 1: sort of organizing creates a bigger mess, it's just gonna

483
00:22:18,359 --> 00:22:20,480
Speaker 1: go backwards, like you will just have a bigger mess,

484
00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:24,480
Speaker 1: and then it's frustrating. And so it does seem inefficient

485
00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:26,679
Speaker 1: to like rehome things quickly, although you could always like

486
00:22:27,040 --> 00:22:29,359
Speaker 1: put us like five things together to take up to

487
00:22:29,400 --> 00:22:31,520
Speaker 1: your bedroom from the kitchen or whatever it is. But

488
00:22:31,640 --> 00:22:34,240
Speaker 1: you know who doesn't need more steps? Right? Like this

489
00:22:34,359 --> 00:22:35,680
Speaker 1: is like, oh, well, I'm gonna be going up the

490
00:22:35,680 --> 00:22:38,080
Speaker 1: stairs more times than I need to. Great, like call

491
00:22:38,119 --> 00:22:41,880
Speaker 1: it your cardio for the day, mini workout, mini workout

492
00:22:41,960 --> 00:22:44,800
Speaker 1: for sure, for sure. All right, let's quick do the

493
00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:48,439
Speaker 1: systematic overhaul with Organized three sixty five. Like because I

494
00:22:48,600 --> 00:22:51,000
Speaker 1: Lisa is a big friend of the show. We've talked

495
00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:54,520
Speaker 1: to her, both of us. Alisa Woodruff Organized three sixty five.

496
00:22:54,960 --> 00:22:57,760
Speaker 1: You've done this program a few times, right, Sarah. I've

497
00:22:57,800 --> 00:22:59,680
Speaker 1: done parts of it a few times. I love Lisa.

498
00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:02,880
Speaker 2: I love how she like this is not at all

499
00:23:02,960 --> 00:23:05,159
Speaker 2: to disparage her stuff, because I think it's fantastic. I

500
00:23:05,200 --> 00:23:07,960
Speaker 2: love how she thinks. I enjoy her work immensely, and

501
00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:10,840
Speaker 2: I consider her a friend. She has a home organization

502
00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:12,800
Speaker 2: program that has like a small video for what you

503
00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:15,480
Speaker 2: do each day to basically organize your entire home over

504
00:23:15,520 --> 00:23:17,760
Speaker 2: the course the scope of a year, and I think

505
00:23:17,760 --> 00:23:19,720
Speaker 2: it's really well done. I just have never made it

506
00:23:19,760 --> 00:23:20,440
Speaker 2: through to the end.

507
00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:21,040
Speaker 1: Personally.

508
00:23:21,560 --> 00:23:25,359
Speaker 2: I think that it's actually a fantastic way to break

509
00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:28,280
Speaker 2: up a Sisifian task like organizing your home into actual

510
00:23:28,359 --> 00:23:31,119
Speaker 2: bite sized pieces, like none of them are that bad.

511
00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:34,240
Speaker 2: I just always tended to lose motivation somewhere in the middle,

512
00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:36,600
Speaker 2: and then I don't know, maybe I have too much

513
00:23:36,600 --> 00:23:39,040
Speaker 2: of an all or nothing mindset and had trouble climbing

514
00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:39,359
Speaker 2: back on.

515
00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:41,600
Speaker 1: That's not even to say that I wouldn't even do it.

516
00:23:41,640 --> 00:23:43,840
Speaker 2: Someday, maybe after I've conmarried my house, I'll do that

517
00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:44,600
Speaker 2: as a refresh.

518
00:23:44,680 --> 00:23:45,800
Speaker 1: I think it's a great system.

519
00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:48,800
Speaker 2: The other thing that she pairs with that is she

520
00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:50,760
Speaker 2: does have ways that you can find community with that

521
00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:54,080
Speaker 2: might help people with the motivational piece. I just wasn't

522
00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:56,640
Speaker 2: looking for that specifically, but it is a great technique,

523
00:23:56,720 --> 00:23:59,760
Speaker 2: and I like the systematic nature of it, Like it'll

524
00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:03,560
Speaker 2: be like one day is just sucks and another.

525
00:24:03,359 --> 00:24:06,520
Speaker 1: Day just for organized through sixty five. Are there three

526
00:24:06,640 --> 00:24:09,520
Speaker 1: hundred and sixty five things or is it like yeah,

527
00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:11,440
Speaker 1: so one it's something like that. It's like one a

528
00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:12,320
Speaker 1: day for a year.

529
00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:15,520
Speaker 2: Okay, on very small spots, and like you'll be like

530
00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:18,080
Speaker 2: in the kitchen, let's say for a month, but each

531
00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:22,640
Speaker 2: day is like a task. Organize your spices, organize your forks.

532
00:24:22,720 --> 00:24:24,360
Speaker 2: Yeah it's a bad example, but you know what I mean.

533
00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:27,000
Speaker 1: And so then you need to just like anything broken

534
00:24:27,040 --> 00:24:29,760
Speaker 1: down into small bits is going to be easier to

535
00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:32,800
Speaker 1: do than Again, it's wonderful that Sarah is finding three

536
00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:35,119
Speaker 1: hours and partly hiring someone to come in to do

537
00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:37,360
Speaker 1: it is allowing that to happen, because it's then she's

538
00:24:37,400 --> 00:24:39,679
Speaker 1: put money into it. But in many cases people are

539
00:24:39,720 --> 00:24:41,520
Speaker 1: not going to do that. So it's like, Okay, if

540
00:24:41,520 --> 00:24:44,080
Speaker 1: I've decided I have twenty minutes a day to do this,

541
00:24:44,520 --> 00:24:46,440
Speaker 1: that's still a reasonable amount of time. Over the course

542
00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:48,320
Speaker 1: of a year, you could get a lot done. You

543
00:24:48,480 --> 00:24:50,560
Speaker 1: just have to keep going, and Lisa has these great

544
00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:52,400
Speaker 1: ideas for what you can do next, and keep going

545
00:24:52,440 --> 00:24:54,679
Speaker 1: and keep going. I think somebody doing that disease to

546
00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:58,359
Speaker 1: make sure they've got the accountability piece figured out. So

547
00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:00,159
Speaker 1: maybe do it with a friend, right, Like each day

548
00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:02,960
Speaker 1: you would text each other did you do your forks? Yes?

549
00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:04,639
Speaker 2: Oh that's a great idea. I like that to do

550
00:25:04,680 --> 00:25:05,160
Speaker 2: it with friend.

551
00:25:05,280 --> 00:25:05,480
Speaker 1: Yeah.

552
00:25:05,480 --> 00:25:07,520
Speaker 2: It's funny because I consider myself very good at checking

553
00:25:07,520 --> 00:25:10,399
Speaker 2: off boxes and accountability. But I mean, listen, all of

554
00:25:10,480 --> 00:25:12,399
Speaker 2: us have areas of weakness, and I think for me,

555
00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:14,240
Speaker 2: I would get home from a day of work and

556
00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:16,640
Speaker 2: I'm like, well I'm not no one's no I got

557
00:25:16,760 --> 00:25:19,159
Speaker 2: I mean again, I think I'm an upholder that actually

558
00:25:19,359 --> 00:25:21,520
Speaker 2: leans obliger sometimes because I'm like, well, no one actually

559
00:25:21,600 --> 00:25:25,240
Speaker 2: cares if I do this, and like I'm tired.

560
00:25:25,600 --> 00:25:29,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, well there you go. But if you can brush

561
00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:31,400
Speaker 1: your teeth every day, you could probably find a couple

562
00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:33,200
Speaker 1: of minutes to organize your house every day if you

563
00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:35,560
Speaker 1: just figure out what the motivation is. Yeah, all right,

564
00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:37,040
Speaker 1: we're going to take one more quick ad break and

565
00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:52,360
Speaker 1: then we'll be back with a little bit more on decluttering. Well,

566
00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:55,600
Speaker 1: we are back. We are talking at decluttering, different methods,

567
00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:59,480
Speaker 1: our thoughts on them. Minimalism is a hot topic for sure.

568
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:03,720
Speaker 1: Dif forms people have this like simplicity or essentialism, and

569
00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:06,800
Speaker 1: the idea is basically that you just have very little.

570
00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:11,000
Speaker 1: How's that working for you, Sarah? Are you minimalist? No?

571
00:26:11,560 --> 00:26:15,359
Speaker 2: I mean, listen, I'm also highly attracted to this without

572
00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:19,800
Speaker 2: living it at Oh, Like, my clothes are pretty minimal.

573
00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:23,480
Speaker 1: If she was still on Instagram, her entire feed would

574
00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:27,000
Speaker 1: be like, this is my beige nursery with one toy.

575
00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:32,560
Speaker 2: I mean my clothing. Like the amount of clothes I have,

576
00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:36,200
Speaker 2: I think is approaching minimalists. That is the one area

577
00:26:36,240 --> 00:26:37,680
Speaker 2: of my life.

578
00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:38,160
Speaker 1: Even then.

579
00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:40,960
Speaker 2: So Shira Gill is famous for this, and she wrote

580
00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:43,560
Speaker 2: a book called Minimalista. She's been on our podcast. She's

581
00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:46,800
Speaker 2: an amazing designer. Like her design sense is fantastic, and

582
00:26:46,840 --> 00:26:49,240
Speaker 2: she's written a number of beautiful books on the topic.

583
00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:52,919
Speaker 2: She also cataloged at one point every single thing she owned,

584
00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:54,879
Speaker 2: like she knew everything in her house, and I'm like,

585
00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:57,199
Speaker 2: that is so cool. And also I could never like

586
00:26:58,280 --> 00:27:04,400
Speaker 2: too much chaos, too many people, too many things not happening.

587
00:27:04,520 --> 00:27:06,840
Speaker 1: Though, doesn't she have three kids? She has three kids.

588
00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:07,720
Speaker 1: She has a bunch of kids.

589
00:27:07,800 --> 00:27:09,439
Speaker 2: I think there was a caveat that, like not all

590
00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:11,359
Speaker 2: of her kids' pro possessions might have been included in

591
00:27:11,400 --> 00:27:13,800
Speaker 2: the list, partly for privacy purposes.

592
00:27:14,520 --> 00:27:18,560
Speaker 1: Okay, each individual lego. I'm curious. I have ten blue

593
00:27:18,840 --> 00:27:19,600
Speaker 1: four by two.

594
00:27:22,840 --> 00:27:26,320
Speaker 2: I mean, the idea of having less is appealing. It

595
00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:27,720
Speaker 2: is less to clean up when you.

596
00:27:27,640 --> 00:27:28,439
Speaker 1: Have less stuff.

597
00:27:28,840 --> 00:27:31,480
Speaker 2: It can just lead itself to an aesthetic that I

598
00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:34,360
Speaker 2: enjoy like I would much rather. I mean, I joke

599
00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:35,800
Speaker 2: that I'd like to live in like a jail cell,

600
00:27:35,960 --> 00:27:38,480
Speaker 2: like nothing in it, just from an esthetic point of view,

601
00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:42,000
Speaker 2: like clean lines, nothing on the walls, like I maybe

602
00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:44,440
Speaker 2: one flower in a slim vase like that's it, right,

603
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:46,720
Speaker 2: versus people who like the look of abundance, like a

604
00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:50,399
Speaker 2: bunch of different colorful vases around in artwork and things

605
00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:53,119
Speaker 2: like that. So like the esthetic piece appeals to me.

606
00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:55,479
Speaker 2: The big downside to me is like, if you live

607
00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:57,760
Speaker 2: with other people and they're not interested, then you are not.

608
00:27:58,280 --> 00:28:00,399
Speaker 2: Your stuff can be minimalists, but you will live a

609
00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:04,199
Speaker 2: minimalist lifestyle. And I have to say that like anybody

610
00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:05,960
Speaker 2: who has is not as many pens as I have

611
00:28:06,560 --> 00:28:09,520
Speaker 2: probably can't really call themselves a minimalist.

612
00:28:11,200 --> 00:28:12,760
Speaker 1: Well, I'm glad to know, Sarah that if you ever

613
00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:14,520
Speaker 1: wind up in a jail cell, I know it's to

614
00:28:14,600 --> 00:28:17,480
Speaker 1: send you a single flower in a small, slim vase.

615
00:28:17,800 --> 00:28:20,000
Speaker 1: That'll be my head. A pack of pens and a

616
00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:23,960
Speaker 1: pack of pens. Well, yes, that'll be useful for sure. Yeah,

617
00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:26,320
Speaker 1: I know. I mean like, sometimes life is just inherently

618
00:28:26,359 --> 00:28:29,400
Speaker 1: complex and there's only so much simplicity you can have

619
00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:31,520
Speaker 1: in a household of seven people, even though I know

620
00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:33,920
Speaker 1: some people do manage to pull it off. And sometimes

621
00:28:33,960 --> 00:28:36,600
Speaker 1: it's just like what might be simple with three people

622
00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:39,360
Speaker 1: becomes more complex with seven people. I mean, I've talked

623
00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:42,720
Speaker 1: in the past about how if a family has one

624
00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:45,800
Speaker 1: kid and that kid is in five activities, that seems

625
00:28:45,840 --> 00:28:47,040
Speaker 1: like a lot. People will be like, oh, I'm so

626
00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:49,400
Speaker 1: worried about overscheduling. My kid is in five activities. Well,

627
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:51,480
Speaker 1: if I have five kids and they're each in one thing,

628
00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:54,200
Speaker 1: it's the same volume. It's the same volume stuff. And

629
00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:57,520
Speaker 1: so what would peer like overwhelmingly big with one kid

630
00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:01,040
Speaker 1: is just absolutely minimal with five, And so we tend

631
00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:03,200
Speaker 1: to be more in the realm of like twenty different

632
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:06,000
Speaker 1: things going on. That is what it is. That's you

633
00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:08,560
Speaker 1: can have good systems, you have orderly systems. It's just

634
00:29:08,600 --> 00:29:12,360
Speaker 1: not going to be simplistic or minimalist or anything like that.

635
00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:14,920
Speaker 1: And I guess it's okay. I do like clear counters,

636
00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:17,400
Speaker 1: though I get itchy when I come home from a

637
00:29:17,400 --> 00:29:19,400
Speaker 1: trip and I can tell because I'm the one who's

638
00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:20,800
Speaker 1: enforcing it, and I come home from a trip and

639
00:29:20,800 --> 00:29:23,440
Speaker 1: there's stuff on the kitchen counters, like unless our cleaning

640
00:29:23,440 --> 00:29:25,640
Speaker 1: service has been there that morning, our home manager was

641
00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:27,400
Speaker 1: working that day, Like, there's just gonna be stuff on

642
00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:29,600
Speaker 1: the counter. I've been to your house. The counters are

643
00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:33,320
Speaker 1: pretty darn clear. What it is. I like it. It

644
00:29:33,360 --> 00:29:35,680
Speaker 1: makes things feel calm, Like do you have that? I

645
00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:39,720
Speaker 1: mean you're I mean you don't restore a ton of stuff. Yeah,

646
00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:41,280
Speaker 1: we don't have a ton of stuff on our counters.

647
00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:44,040
Speaker 1: I also really like setting my desk back to like

648
00:29:44,400 --> 00:29:48,040
Speaker 1: pristine whiteness and having a desk that just looks good.

649
00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:49,800
Speaker 1: And it can be messy for like a day or two,

650
00:29:49,840 --> 00:29:52,760
Speaker 1: but then I go and like, yeah, like for me

651
00:29:52,920 --> 00:29:55,120
Speaker 1: to set out to work with a nice, clean, orderly

652
00:29:55,200 --> 00:29:57,640
Speaker 1: desk makes me happy. And our counters are usually.

653
00:29:57,680 --> 00:29:59,600
Speaker 2: Actually right now, I think all that's on our little

654
00:29:59,680 --> 00:30:02,840
Speaker 2: ledge is a single face with orchinds in it.

655
00:30:03,880 --> 00:30:07,040
Speaker 1: I love it. I love it. That's great. And then finally,

656
00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:10,160
Speaker 1: tidy Dad, your buddy tell us about tidy Dad. Yeah,

657
00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:11,080
Speaker 1: I love Tyler Moore.

658
00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:13,440
Speaker 2: So he wrote a book called I think it's called

659
00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:16,239
Speaker 2: Tidy Dad, and his idea is like gamifying a lot

660
00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:18,240
Speaker 2: of decluttering. But one thing he came up with that

661
00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:19,960
Speaker 2: I just thought was pretty brilliant was the idea of

662
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:22,440
Speaker 2: having like a monthly cadence. So he's not promising that

663
00:30:22,480 --> 00:30:25,160
Speaker 2: you're gonna be done decluttering, like there's no end, but

664
00:30:25,280 --> 00:30:28,120
Speaker 2: instead to be like every month has a theme and.

665
00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:29,480
Speaker 1: They're thought out strategically.

666
00:30:29,560 --> 00:30:32,200
Speaker 2: So for example, November you would do your holiday decourse

667
00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:34,320
Speaker 2: so that you're like ready for the holiday season coming up,

668
00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:37,240
Speaker 2: and like August you would do all the backpack related stuff,

669
00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:39,760
Speaker 2: and I forget like your mudroom if you have one,

670
00:30:39,840 --> 00:30:42,960
Speaker 2: so you're always going through and different months. You might

671
00:30:43,000 --> 00:30:44,800
Speaker 2: know that you're always busy in June and traveling, so

672
00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:46,240
Speaker 2: maybe you don't have a lot that month, but you

673
00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:46,800
Speaker 2: just have this.

674
00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:48,360
Speaker 1: Like Cadence, and I believe.

675
00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:50,760
Speaker 2: I think you can probably find his stuff on his

676
00:30:50,800 --> 00:30:53,160
Speaker 2: Instagram and like actually get a copy of his template.

677
00:30:53,160 --> 00:30:54,760
Speaker 2: But I also feel like this is right for making

678
00:30:54,840 --> 00:30:57,320
Speaker 2: your own, Like maybe his isn't exactly what you'd want,

679
00:30:57,320 --> 00:30:59,760
Speaker 2: but for your household. School starts in August, so you'd

680
00:30:59,800 --> 00:31:01,040
Speaker 2: want to do the school stuff in July.

681
00:31:01,320 --> 00:31:04,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, I like it. And so he's got the system

682
00:31:04,120 --> 00:31:06,760
Speaker 1: that you follow his system like what happens what month?

683
00:31:06,960 --> 00:31:09,440
Speaker 2: He has a suggestion system. But then it's my twist

684
00:31:09,520 --> 00:31:10,000
Speaker 2: to like come.

685
00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:12,840
Speaker 1: Up with your own excellent and have you ever done

686
00:31:12,840 --> 00:31:15,000
Speaker 1: one of those things like the fifteen minute daily sleep

687
00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:17,000
Speaker 1: sweep or go through with a trash bag and get

688
00:31:17,080 --> 00:31:19,480
Speaker 1: rid of one hundred items in fifteen minutes or whatever

689
00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:20,640
Speaker 1: that is? Have you done any of that?

690
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:24,320
Speaker 2: I've never done any of that, but I think it's cool.

691
00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:26,440
Speaker 2: There's a blogger that I follow. I think she's like

692
00:31:26,600 --> 00:31:28,800
Speaker 2: the Hawaii Plan or something like that, and she'll often

693
00:31:28,840 --> 00:31:30,760
Speaker 2: have in her goals list for the month to like

694
00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:32,360
Speaker 2: declutter one hundred items, and I'm like.

695
00:31:32,360 --> 00:31:34,800
Speaker 1: Is she counting the items? I mean, it's pretty cool.

696
00:31:34,840 --> 00:31:36,160
Speaker 2: And then a lot of times she will to be like,

697
00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:38,680
Speaker 2: i'd you cluttered one hundred and seventy items, Like wow,

698
00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:40,400
Speaker 2: So no, I have not tried it.

699
00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:42,840
Speaker 1: I think it sounds great. So I think this could

700
00:31:42,840 --> 00:31:44,600
Speaker 1: be a one fun way to sort of like gamify

701
00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:47,120
Speaker 1: it if with family members like to get help with

702
00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:49,480
Speaker 1: this sort of thing, Like if every kid had a

703
00:31:49,520 --> 00:31:52,520
Speaker 1: trash bag and they're like, okay, find twenty things that

704
00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:54,640
Speaker 1: need to be thrown out in this house or out

705
00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:56,600
Speaker 1: in the yard, right, like, because then people have put

706
00:31:56,600 --> 00:31:59,200
Speaker 1: trash alongside the road or something. That could be really

707
00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:01,640
Speaker 1: helpful because especially if you have three or four kids

708
00:32:01,720 --> 00:32:03,479
Speaker 1: or something, I mean that's like eighty things that are

709
00:32:03,480 --> 00:32:05,280
Speaker 1: out of the house, it's probably going to look better

710
00:32:05,440 --> 00:32:07,920
Speaker 1: with the obvious trash out to it. That's always something

711
00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:10,360
Speaker 1: I liked about the Dana K. White version of it too,

712
00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:11,720
Speaker 1: Like the first thing is to get rid of the

713
00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:14,880
Speaker 1: obvious trash, and even if you do nothing else, like

714
00:32:14,920 --> 00:32:16,920
Speaker 1: almost any room is going to look better without the

715
00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:20,280
Speaker 1: trash in it, So you win, you win, like even

716
00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:24,440
Speaker 1: without organizing stuff in cool little bins and putting true

717
00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:29,200
Speaker 1: labels on it. Yeah all right, So how many more

718
00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:31,920
Speaker 1: sessions do you have with Sophie? That's what I'm saying.

719
00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:33,560
Speaker 2: I don't know in the end actually is going to be.

720
00:32:33,600 --> 00:32:35,920
Speaker 2: I mean, well, I'm going to guess we're half done.

721
00:32:36,200 --> 00:32:38,480
Speaker 1: We're half done, Okay, yeah it is. We're halfway through

722
00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:41,600
Speaker 1: the year. So yeah, that works. That works, all right,

723
00:32:41,640 --> 00:32:43,600
Speaker 1: So good investment. You're happy you did it?

724
00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:46,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean honestly, compared to things like renovations, it

725
00:32:46,840 --> 00:32:49,920
Speaker 2: has not been that expensive. I think she's happy with

726
00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:52,440
Speaker 2: what she's earning. It's an hourly. I didn't buy a package.

727
00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:55,040
Speaker 2: I'd just pay her by the hour. But it really

728
00:32:55,080 --> 00:32:57,640
Speaker 2: hasn't been too crazy, so I think it's a great investment.

729
00:32:57,760 --> 00:32:59,000
Speaker 2: I would not have done this on my own.

730
00:32:59,200 --> 00:33:01,240
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, there's an idea if you think you need

731
00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:03,440
Speaker 1: to put on an addition because you're out of room

732
00:33:03,480 --> 00:33:07,600
Speaker 1: in your house, like possibly paying an organizer to help

733
00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:09,280
Speaker 1: you get through some of the stuff and get rid

734
00:33:09,320 --> 00:33:11,360
Speaker 1: of it might be a lot cheaper than doing that,

735
00:33:11,440 --> 00:33:14,000
Speaker 1: So stand corrected there on the container thing. Sometimes that

736
00:33:14,040 --> 00:33:17,040
Speaker 1: would be maybe recognizing the container size of the house

737
00:33:17,160 --> 00:33:19,640
Speaker 1: versus adding on a different room to it, or a

738
00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:23,680
Speaker 1: sex floor storage unit. Storage unit. We paid for one

739
00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:26,040
Speaker 1: for a couple of years, but for a reason, when

740
00:33:26,640 --> 00:33:28,560
Speaker 1: Jasper was born and we were still in a one

741
00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:33,240
Speaker 1: bedroom apartment, we put his crib, like we had to

742
00:33:33,240 --> 00:33:34,960
Speaker 1: put his crib in one of the common areas, and

743
00:33:34,960 --> 00:33:37,400
Speaker 1: so everything that had been in that area had to

744
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:39,960
Speaker 1: go somewhere. So we put it in a storage unit

745
00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:41,920
Speaker 1: because we were living in New York City at the time,

746
00:33:42,480 --> 00:33:44,320
Speaker 1: and so I guess that's the thing. You can get

747
00:33:44,360 --> 00:33:47,720
Speaker 1: the container larger by getting a storage unit. We kept

748
00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:50,479
Speaker 1: it for the time we were there, which is about

749
00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:53,720
Speaker 1: I want to say, three years, and we moved into

750
00:33:53,880 --> 00:33:56,280
Speaker 1: a different apartment and kept it there. But then when

751
00:33:56,320 --> 00:34:00,360
Speaker 1: we moved to our new house in Pennsylvania, we got

752
00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:02,520
Speaker 1: everything out of the storage unit and in fact wound

753
00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:06,160
Speaker 1: up keeping like we've put the chair back in the house,

754
00:34:06,240 --> 00:34:08,200
Speaker 1: like we put the dining room table back in the house,

755
00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:10,440
Speaker 1: like we started using it again. So I think in

756
00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:12,400
Speaker 1: our case that was like a little different.

757
00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:15,520
Speaker 2: If it's nice stuff that was like expensive, then I

758
00:34:15,520 --> 00:34:17,600
Speaker 2: guess it makes sense otherwise. I mean, we tend to

759
00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:19,759
Speaker 2: buy ikia, So my guess is that the storage unit

760
00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:21,400
Speaker 2: would cost far more than it would cost to just

761
00:34:22,560 --> 00:34:25,080
Speaker 2: rebuy some furniture. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

762
00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:28,239
Speaker 1: Not as good for the earth, though, So there you go. Yeah. Well, so, okay,

763
00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:29,960
Speaker 1: should we do the Q and A first or the

764
00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:32,400
Speaker 1: Love of the week first? Which do you prefer to?

765
00:34:33,120 --> 00:34:36,000
Speaker 1: Let's do the Love of the week. Okay, what's making

766
00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:36,799
Speaker 1: you happy this week?

767
00:34:36,840 --> 00:34:39,080
Speaker 2: Sarah? Well, I mentioned to have a lot of pens,

768
00:34:39,080 --> 00:34:41,080
Speaker 2: and I also have a lot of stickers, and it's

769
00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:44,800
Speaker 2: not minimalist at all. I mean, maybe it's a little minimist.

770
00:34:44,840 --> 00:34:46,799
Speaker 2: Like it's not like I have like five drawers of them.

771
00:34:46,800 --> 00:34:48,560
Speaker 2: I have like one drawer of them. But they make

772
00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:51,320
Speaker 2: me so happy. And I'm forty six years old and

773
00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:52,240
Speaker 2: I like my stickers.

774
00:34:52,800 --> 00:34:54,840
Speaker 1: Stickers are never too old to be any age and

775
00:34:54,880 --> 00:34:58,440
Speaker 1: love your stickers. So I'm going to say Midsummer flowers

776
00:34:58,520 --> 00:35:01,520
Speaker 1: Hydrangea's liies Rose says, I would probably not just go

777
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:04,200
Speaker 1: for a single flower in a small vase, although I

778
00:35:04,239 --> 00:35:06,080
Speaker 1: don't really put that many inside. I like to look

779
00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:08,799
Speaker 1: at them outside. I don't know when they're inside. Then

780
00:35:08,880 --> 00:35:10,319
Speaker 1: you know something you have to deal with the water

781
00:35:10,520 --> 00:35:12,279
Speaker 1: you have. They start going bad at some point, and

782
00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:14,000
Speaker 1: then the petals are falling off, and then they're on

783
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:16,120
Speaker 1: my counter, and so I'm picking up petals off the counter,

784
00:35:16,200 --> 00:35:18,240
Speaker 1: so kind of at the moment, I've just been enjoying

785
00:35:18,239 --> 00:35:21,080
Speaker 1: them outside. But you know, you can go outside, so

786
00:35:21,239 --> 00:35:24,839
Speaker 1: that works, all right. Question what is in your every

787
00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:28,320
Speaker 1: day carrying bag? This is another place that people sometimes

788
00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:31,839
Speaker 1: declutter at their purse. Yeah, all right.

789
00:35:32,160 --> 00:35:34,080
Speaker 2: In my work bag, which is like a little leather

790
00:35:34,239 --> 00:35:36,800
Speaker 2: toe that I've had for like a decade, I carry

791
00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:39,880
Speaker 2: my laptop every day, my oh I need you planner,

792
00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:44,759
Speaker 2: my car keys, my wallet, sunglasses, an extra pair of

793
00:35:44,800 --> 00:35:47,160
Speaker 2: contact lenses, and emergency tampon.

794
00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:49,200
Speaker 1: That's pretty much it. Yeah.

795
00:35:49,239 --> 00:35:51,480
Speaker 2: And then in my like out and about bag that

796
00:35:51,680 --> 00:35:54,239
Speaker 2: I would use, like on weekends, I have usually just

797
00:35:54,360 --> 00:35:56,200
Speaker 2: pull I don't bring my whole wallet, I just bring

798
00:35:56,239 --> 00:35:59,120
Speaker 2: like my d in, a couple credit cards, a small sunscreen,

799
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:02,000
Speaker 2: a small masque spray or even mosquito spray wipes if

800
00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:05,960
Speaker 2: I'm trying to be streamlined, a lip bomb, sunglasses, and

801
00:36:06,040 --> 00:36:07,600
Speaker 2: again an emergency tampon.

802
00:36:08,600 --> 00:36:11,520
Speaker 1: So question, why do you have a different bag for

803
00:36:11,600 --> 00:36:15,960
Speaker 1: the weekend versus your work bag. Oh, my work bag

804
00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:16,600
Speaker 1: is much bigger.

805
00:36:16,640 --> 00:36:18,759
Speaker 2: I don't, okay, carry my laptop and planner around if

806
00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:21,400
Speaker 2: we're going to like my in law's house or something.

807
00:36:21,680 --> 00:36:25,160
Speaker 1: My weekend bag is like your weekend bag is significantly

808
00:36:25,200 --> 00:36:26,520
Speaker 1: smaller than the work bag.

809
00:36:26,680 --> 00:36:28,720
Speaker 2: My weekend bag is just like a cross body little

810
00:36:29,320 --> 00:36:32,120
Speaker 2: I could walk everywhere and whatever my work bag. It's

811
00:36:32,160 --> 00:36:33,560
Speaker 2: not like I'm doing a lot of walking. I mean,

812
00:36:33,600 --> 00:36:36,200
Speaker 2: I park and then I walk across the parking lot

813
00:36:36,200 --> 00:36:37,160
Speaker 2: and carry it to my office.

814
00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:40,560
Speaker 1: So I can carry on as much as I want. Okay, gotcha.

815
00:36:41,239 --> 00:36:44,160
Speaker 1: So I don't have like a separate weekend bag. I

816
00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:46,239
Speaker 1: just have my everyday one, which is my But of

817
00:36:46,239 --> 00:36:47,800
Speaker 1: course I'm working from home most of the time, so

818
00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:49,560
Speaker 1: I'm not really using it to go back and forth

819
00:36:49,560 --> 00:36:52,200
Speaker 1: to an office. But I have this long shomp tote.

820
00:36:52,680 --> 00:36:56,400
Speaker 1: It is gray leather. I bought it in December of

821
00:36:56,440 --> 00:36:59,319
Speaker 1: twenty eighteen, so it is eight years old.

822
00:36:59,400 --> 00:36:59,480
Speaker 2: Now.

823
00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:02,759
Speaker 1: Oh my going strong, which is good because I like

824
00:37:02,840 --> 00:37:05,600
Speaker 1: my things to last. I would be very upset if

825
00:37:05,640 --> 00:37:08,400
Speaker 1: it was breaking. I don't really, I'm just trying to

826
00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:10,640
Speaker 1: remember what is actually in there, because I try not

827
00:37:10,719 --> 00:37:15,080
Speaker 1: to look in there too often, but my wallet, my keys,

828
00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:18,040
Speaker 1: my sunglasses. If I'm traveling far, I will put my

829
00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:20,840
Speaker 1: actual glasses in there, because that's then the fallback. Obviously,

830
00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:23,080
Speaker 1: if something goes wrong with my contact lenses, then I

831
00:37:23,080 --> 00:37:25,480
Speaker 1: want to make sure I have my actual glasses so

832
00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:29,080
Speaker 1: I can see chapstick and lipstock, like one of the

833
00:37:29,200 --> 00:37:32,280
Speaker 1: little lipstick floss. I get stuff stuck in my teeth

834
00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:34,239
Speaker 1: all the time and really annoys me if I don't

835
00:37:34,280 --> 00:37:37,560
Speaker 1: have a floss with me. Obviously, personal products as needed,

836
00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:40,560
Speaker 1: my phone, headphones. I actually have two kinds of headphones.

837
00:37:40,560 --> 00:37:43,840
Speaker 1: I have the ones that plug into my iPhone and

838
00:37:43,840 --> 00:37:47,680
Speaker 1: then also the ones that go into like the airplane

839
00:37:47,840 --> 00:37:50,000
Speaker 1: back of seat, so I have both of those in there.

840
00:37:50,640 --> 00:37:52,640
Speaker 1: If it might rain, I'll stick an umbrella in there,

841
00:37:52,640 --> 00:37:54,799
Speaker 1: but I usually don't automatically have an umbrella in there.

842
00:37:54,800 --> 00:37:57,000
Speaker 1: If I'm going far reading material like I can put

843
00:37:57,040 --> 00:37:59,760
Speaker 1: a magazine in there, and if I'm traveling, my laptop

844
00:37:59,800 --> 00:38:02,279
Speaker 1: will in there. I often use my tote as my

845
00:38:02,800 --> 00:38:06,360
Speaker 1: carry on bag on my personal item, so it's important

846
00:38:06,360 --> 00:38:08,600
Speaker 1: that it fit my laptop, but I just bring it

847
00:38:08,600 --> 00:38:10,480
Speaker 1: around on weekends too. It's not that heavy and if

848
00:38:10,480 --> 00:38:12,200
Speaker 1: I don't have my laptop in it, then it's not

849
00:38:12,400 --> 00:38:13,360
Speaker 1: hard to carry around.

850
00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:15,240
Speaker 2: Usually I forgot my AirPods.

851
00:38:15,280 --> 00:38:16,120
Speaker 1: I do usually have those.

852
00:38:16,160 --> 00:38:16,920
Speaker 2: You have those in there with her?

853
00:38:17,400 --> 00:38:19,960
Speaker 1: All right? Well. It reminds me I have to declutter

854
00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:21,720
Speaker 1: it though, every time I go get on an airplane,

855
00:38:21,719 --> 00:38:24,560
Speaker 1: because I might have randomly stuck some sort of liquid

856
00:38:24,560 --> 00:38:26,200
Speaker 1: item in there and I forget about it, and then

857
00:38:26,200 --> 00:38:29,160
Speaker 1: it would cause a problem at the essay going through.

858
00:38:29,280 --> 00:38:31,080
Speaker 1: So I do have to go through it every time

859
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:33,560
Speaker 1: I fly. So I guess that keeps it relatively clean.

860
00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:35,960
Speaker 2: There you go every day, carry kind of fit with

861
00:38:36,000 --> 00:38:36,840
Speaker 2: the decluttering theme.

862
00:38:36,719 --> 00:38:38,680
Speaker 1: Every day carry all right? Well, this has been best

863
00:38:38,719 --> 00:38:41,680
Speaker 1: of both worlds. We've been talking all things decluttering, looking

864
00:38:41,719 --> 00:38:44,120
Speaker 1: at various different methods. We will be back next week

865
00:38:44,120 --> 00:38:48,800
Speaker 1: with more on making work and life fit together. Thanks

866
00:38:48,800 --> 00:38:49,360
Speaker 1: for listening.

867
00:38:49,600 --> 00:38:52,640
Speaker 2: You can find me Sarah at the shoebox dot com

868
00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:56,720
Speaker 2: or at the Underscore Shoebox on Instagram, and you can.

869
00:38:56,600 --> 00:39:00,839
Speaker 1: Find me Laura at Laura vandercam dot com. This has

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Speaker 1: been the best of both worlds podcasts. Please join us

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Speaker 1: next time for more on making work and life work together.