1 00:00:08,600 --> 00:00:20,880 Speaker 1: Body Backs with Joseph Scott Morgan. Day in and day out, 2 00:00:20,920 --> 00:00:29,440 Speaker 1: I spend my life around college students, and I don't know, God, 3 00:00:29,480 --> 00:00:31,160 Speaker 1: this is kind of dark for me to say this. 4 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:36,280 Speaker 1: Every time I'm around them, though recently in particular, I 5 00:00:36,280 --> 00:00:41,480 Speaker 1: think about how old I am. It just it's I'm 6 00:00:41,479 --> 00:00:45,720 Speaker 1: coming up on my twentieth year in academia. Actually as 7 00:00:45,760 --> 00:00:49,440 Speaker 1: of March, I'm sorry, as of May May four, I'll 8 00:00:49,440 --> 00:00:52,800 Speaker 1: celebrate my twentieth year in academia. Can't believe how much 9 00:00:52,840 --> 00:00:58,280 Speaker 1: time has gone by. But I see these these kids 10 00:00:58,280 --> 00:01:01,160 Speaker 1: that are on campus, and they are kids to me, 11 00:01:01,400 --> 00:01:04,720 Speaker 1: particularly at this stage of my life, and I can't. 12 00:01:05,319 --> 00:01:08,160 Speaker 1: It's hard for me to remember what it was like 13 00:01:08,319 --> 00:01:12,440 Speaker 1: to be the age that my students are right now. 14 00:01:12,920 --> 00:01:16,880 Speaker 1: I've tried, but you know, through the fog of time, 15 00:01:16,959 --> 00:01:19,160 Speaker 1: you just kind of forget. Every now and then I'll 16 00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:23,679 Speaker 1: hear a song, you know, there's something that will, you know, 17 00:01:23,920 --> 00:01:27,560 Speaker 1: bring me back to those younger moments in my life. 18 00:01:28,319 --> 00:01:30,760 Speaker 1: I was talking with Dave just a little while ago 19 00:01:30,840 --> 00:01:33,039 Speaker 1: when we were talking about my son having gone to 20 00:01:33,319 --> 00:01:36,959 Speaker 1: a Journey concert last night. You started talking about all 21 00:01:37,000 --> 00:01:39,560 Speaker 1: the songs that made me remember what it was like 22 00:01:40,120 --> 00:01:45,360 Speaker 1: to be young. But as cliched as it sounds, there's 23 00:01:45,920 --> 00:01:51,320 Speaker 1: many in our society nowadays that will remain forever young 24 00:01:52,560 --> 00:02:01,240 Speaker 1: because they never advance any further than, say, for instance, 25 00:02:01,400 --> 00:02:08,080 Speaker 1: twenty one. But today on Bodybacks, we're going to talk 26 00:02:08,120 --> 00:02:14,120 Speaker 1: about a young lady who was twenty one. Her name 27 00:02:14,200 --> 00:02:20,120 Speaker 1: was Annabelle and she met arguably one of the most 28 00:02:20,160 --> 00:02:30,000 Speaker 1: horrific ends that I've discussed on my program. I'm Joseph 29 00:02:30,000 --> 00:02:39,799 Speaker 1: Scott Morgan and this is Bodybacks. Every now and then, Dave, 30 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:43,320 Speaker 1: my mind will drift back. It'll drift back to days 31 00:02:43,360 --> 00:02:45,920 Speaker 1: when I'd ride around with a windows down. I was 32 00:02:46,000 --> 00:02:51,040 Speaker 1: listening to, in my opinion, the coolest music ever created. 33 00:02:52,600 --> 00:02:56,040 Speaker 1: And you know, we were talking about rocking down the 34 00:02:56,080 --> 00:02:59,120 Speaker 1: Highway a little while ago. The Doobie Brothers makes you 35 00:02:59,240 --> 00:03:04,000 Speaker 1: dry fast, you know, unlike maybe some song that Michael 36 00:03:04,040 --> 00:03:07,960 Speaker 1: McDonnell had a hand in. You know, we could do. 37 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:12,560 Speaker 1: There's certain things they do a whole show. Yeah, there 38 00:03:12,560 --> 00:03:15,639 Speaker 1: are these things that you know, kind of stimulate your 39 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:17,560 Speaker 1: your mind. You go back in time and you think 40 00:03:17,560 --> 00:03:21,040 Speaker 1: about Wow. Some people say, I wish I could go back. 41 00:03:21,720 --> 00:03:23,280 Speaker 1: I wish I could go back. I wish I could 42 00:03:23,320 --> 00:03:24,760 Speaker 1: be this age in that age, and I got to 43 00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:29,160 Speaker 1: tell you, man, I've made it through. I'm happy to 44 00:03:29,200 --> 00:03:31,639 Speaker 1: be the age I am right now. I truly am, 45 00:03:31,760 --> 00:03:35,200 Speaker 1: because you know, you get some perspective and you look 46 00:03:35,240 --> 00:03:37,600 Speaker 1: back the things you've accomplished, and look back at your 47 00:03:37,640 --> 00:03:43,080 Speaker 1: family all around you, and but it's it's quite horrible 48 00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:45,200 Speaker 1: when you look around and there's an empty chair. I 49 00:03:45,200 --> 00:03:49,560 Speaker 1: would imagine that will never be occupied again. And you know, 50 00:03:49,640 --> 00:03:55,080 Speaker 1: today we're talking about young miss annabel and that's the 51 00:03:55,160 --> 00:03:57,960 Speaker 1: situation I would imagine her family's in right now today. 52 00:03:57,960 --> 00:04:01,160 Speaker 2: You and Joe when we look at a story and 53 00:04:01,200 --> 00:04:06,360 Speaker 2: we have the victim, Annabelle Rose mean, twenty one years 54 00:04:06,360 --> 00:04:09,680 Speaker 2: old and she's living with a man who is thirty 55 00:04:09,760 --> 00:04:13,520 Speaker 2: three years old that she actually he was hitting on 56 00:04:13,560 --> 00:04:16,680 Speaker 2: her when she was in high school. He's thirty three. 57 00:04:16,960 --> 00:04:22,560 Speaker 2: His name is Leroy Brahm, the third. And when you 58 00:04:22,600 --> 00:04:25,040 Speaker 2: were talking about college, you know, and being around the students, 59 00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:27,359 Speaker 2: and I was thinking about my college years when I 60 00:04:27,400 --> 00:04:30,839 Speaker 2: was twenty one. And we don't have a way to 61 00:04:30,880 --> 00:04:35,159 Speaker 2: see the future, and so sometimes we see our own 62 00:04:35,200 --> 00:04:38,640 Speaker 2: future through somebody else's past. And I look at Annabelle 63 00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:41,680 Speaker 2: Rose meaning and I think of how she met her 64 00:04:41,680 --> 00:04:46,159 Speaker 2: demise at the hands of this man who is not 65 00:04:46,240 --> 00:04:50,520 Speaker 2: really a man, he's adult male. Because I want you 66 00:04:50,560 --> 00:04:53,919 Speaker 2: to listen to all of all of this is on video, Shoe, 67 00:04:55,160 --> 00:04:58,080 Speaker 2: everything we're going to talk about is on video because 68 00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:01,919 Speaker 2: mean and had secure cameras all over the house, which 69 00:05:01,960 --> 00:05:05,680 Speaker 2: tells you a little bit about him. East Vincent Township 70 00:05:05,720 --> 00:05:10,760 Speaker 2: police called to the Spring City trailer December fourth, twenty 71 00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:14,560 Speaker 2: twenty one after a report of a quote unquote medical emergency. 72 00:05:15,640 --> 00:05:18,440 Speaker 2: Police are called to the home. When they get there, 73 00:05:18,480 --> 00:05:24,000 Speaker 2: they find Annabelle Rose meaning unresponsive. She's lying on the 74 00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:26,960 Speaker 2: living room floor with wounds to her face, chest, arms, 75 00:05:26,960 --> 00:05:32,880 Speaker 2: and legs. According to the report, Leroy Braum the third 76 00:05:33,040 --> 00:05:36,479 Speaker 2: made no attempt at any life saving measures. She was 77 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:40,520 Speaker 2: taken to the hospital and pronounced dead. Doctors told investigators 78 00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:46,800 Speaker 2: that she had extensive trauma on her head, face, lacerations 79 00:05:46,839 --> 00:05:49,040 Speaker 2: on the rest of her body, including her arms, legs, 80 00:05:49,080 --> 00:05:53,760 Speaker 2: in pelvic area. There was bruising to his hand and 81 00:05:53,920 --> 00:05:58,080 Speaker 2: finger and bruising and swelling to his ankle. What they 82 00:05:58,080 --> 00:06:03,320 Speaker 2: were able to find out through the surveillance video, Leroy 83 00:06:03,960 --> 00:06:09,960 Speaker 2: Brahm the third is on video punching Annabelle Rose, meaning 84 00:06:10,080 --> 00:06:12,839 Speaker 2: in the head and body at least eighty five times, 85 00:06:13,400 --> 00:06:19,440 Speaker 2: kicking and stomping her at least eighty times. He repeatedly 86 00:06:19,480 --> 00:06:23,480 Speaker 2: beat her, stomped her about the head. Then he took 87 00:06:23,480 --> 00:06:28,320 Speaker 2: a sofa and he dropped a sofa on her hard. 88 00:06:28,800 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 2: Then he sat on the sofa while it's on top 89 00:06:32,360 --> 00:06:34,560 Speaker 2: of her, and he fell asleep. 90 00:06:35,839 --> 00:06:39,560 Speaker 1: Dave, I defy you to take to make up a 91 00:06:39,600 --> 00:06:43,280 Speaker 1: story like this, and we've said this before on bodybags, 92 00:06:43,480 --> 00:06:46,599 Speaker 1: make up a story like this and walk into a 93 00:06:46,600 --> 00:06:55,240 Speaker 1: producer's office in Hollywood. They they they wouldn't believe you 94 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:58,719 Speaker 1: when you it's just too far fetched. And there's no 95 00:06:59,120 --> 00:07:01,960 Speaker 1: it's not a mystery, you know. I mean, I think 96 00:07:02,040 --> 00:07:04,680 Speaker 1: in this case, the electronics really you know, kind of 97 00:07:04,720 --> 00:07:07,839 Speaker 1: open this up. But you know, when you think about 98 00:07:07,880 --> 00:07:11,440 Speaker 1: how over the top this is, that this could be, 99 00:07:12,760 --> 00:07:17,400 Speaker 1: and this this wasn't like one one moment in time. 100 00:07:17,920 --> 00:07:20,800 Speaker 1: It's not like it was, you know, an acute event 101 00:07:20,920 --> 00:07:26,280 Speaker 1: where some guy flies off the handle and starts striking 102 00:07:26,320 --> 00:07:29,680 Speaker 1: out at the person that's closest to them, that's closest 103 00:07:29,720 --> 00:07:37,200 Speaker 1: in proximity. We're talking about we're talking about a progression, 104 00:07:37,760 --> 00:07:47,600 Speaker 1: a slow slouching progression toward oblivion for Annabelle. And there 105 00:07:47,600 --> 00:07:53,840 Speaker 1: are so many people out there that that suffer in 106 00:07:53,920 --> 00:07:58,200 Speaker 1: these abusive relationships. And how old did you say? 107 00:07:58,200 --> 00:08:01,240 Speaker 2: He was thirty three? She was twenty one. 108 00:08:01,800 --> 00:08:04,480 Speaker 1: I don't know about you. I know that that young 109 00:08:04,560 --> 00:08:10,480 Speaker 1: ladies developed faster than us dudes, most of tom But 110 00:08:10,760 --> 00:08:19,200 Speaker 1: a twenty one year old woman in these circumstances, she probably, 111 00:08:19,440 --> 00:08:23,560 Speaker 1: I would imagine, thought that she found love, that she 112 00:08:23,680 --> 00:08:26,920 Speaker 1: found somebody that was older that was going to take 113 00:08:26,960 --> 00:08:31,720 Speaker 1: care of her, and she'd probably do anything in the. 114 00:08:31,640 --> 00:08:34,760 Speaker 2: World for it. Think about the guys she's having, really, 115 00:08:34,800 --> 00:08:37,680 Speaker 2: you know, she would be around other twenty one year olds, 116 00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:42,079 Speaker 2: other people in her age group, and how how we 117 00:08:42,120 --> 00:08:45,000 Speaker 2: act when we're that age. And then you have this other, 118 00:08:45,280 --> 00:08:47,600 Speaker 2: this guy who's also an adult man, you know, but 119 00:08:47,679 --> 00:08:50,959 Speaker 2: he's an actual really he doesn't act like them. So, yeah, 120 00:08:51,320 --> 00:08:53,600 Speaker 2: he's been around the ballpark a few times, and she's 121 00:08:53,640 --> 00:08:55,959 Speaker 2: known him for several years. The thing, as you mentioned, 122 00:08:56,920 --> 00:09:00,600 Speaker 2: this was not a fluke. He didn't just lose his 123 00:09:00,640 --> 00:09:04,000 Speaker 2: cookies one night and beat her eighty five times with 124 00:09:04,080 --> 00:09:07,200 Speaker 2: his hands and eighty times with his feet. This was 125 00:09:07,280 --> 00:09:10,000 Speaker 2: the end of a string of beatings that had been 126 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:12,480 Speaker 2: taking place for a long time, and most of them 127 00:09:12,520 --> 00:09:16,040 Speaker 2: captured on his own security cameras because he had them 128 00:09:16,360 --> 00:09:19,000 Speaker 2: all over his place. And of course the police now 129 00:09:19,040 --> 00:09:19,520 Speaker 2: have all that. 130 00:09:20,559 --> 00:09:22,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, and you know, who would have ever have thought 131 00:09:22,920 --> 00:09:26,560 Speaker 1: that someone would video I mean, I know that this 132 00:09:26,720 --> 00:09:30,080 Speaker 1: is insane because people who videotaped themselves for years doing 133 00:09:30,120 --> 00:09:34,560 Speaker 1: horrible things. But right was you'd have to ask the question, 134 00:09:35,679 --> 00:09:41,720 Speaker 1: how would he have so much camera coverage and have 135 00:09:41,800 --> 00:09:45,520 Speaker 1: an awareness stupid enough not to delete it? Yeah, exactly, 136 00:09:45,880 --> 00:09:48,400 Speaker 1: And why would you have this much camera coverage that 137 00:09:48,440 --> 00:09:52,600 Speaker 1: you're going to, uh, you know, depict this horrible event? 138 00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:55,680 Speaker 1: It's horrible events. Let me rie that plural. 139 00:09:55,840 --> 00:09:57,959 Speaker 2: Every guy I know that has a bunch of surveillance 140 00:09:57,960 --> 00:10:00,280 Speaker 2: cameras inside their house, they're up to no good. 141 00:10:01,160 --> 00:10:04,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, you have to think, you know, is it okay? 142 00:10:04,600 --> 00:10:11,760 Speaker 1: Is it voyeuristic? Or or is it something that is 143 00:10:11,800 --> 00:10:16,600 Speaker 1: so twisted within them where they trust no one and 144 00:10:16,800 --> 00:10:18,959 Speaker 1: they live in some kind of world where they think 145 00:10:19,000 --> 00:10:39,680 Speaker 1: that everybody's out to get them. I really wonder about that, Dave. 146 00:10:39,720 --> 00:10:43,360 Speaker 1: Have you ever heard the term your moral compasses busted? 147 00:10:44,480 --> 00:10:47,280 Speaker 1: I've come across that a couple of times. I've actually 148 00:10:47,320 --> 00:10:50,880 Speaker 1: borne witness to it throughout my career, you know, with 149 00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:54,240 Speaker 1: some of the these cases that I've worked, and you 150 00:10:54,320 --> 00:11:00,960 Speaker 1: stand over, you know, these poor souls that die at 151 00:11:01,000 --> 00:11:04,280 Speaker 1: the hands of somebody that is so, so very violent, 152 00:11:06,000 --> 00:11:08,960 Speaker 1: and the person kind of meeting this out, you know, 153 00:11:09,400 --> 00:11:13,240 Speaker 1: relative to Annabelle, I'd say he qualifies for you know, 154 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:18,480 Speaker 1: there's something wrong with his moral compass. Yeah, And I'm 155 00:11:18,920 --> 00:11:21,240 Speaker 1: there's one thing that really kind of sticks in my 156 00:11:21,320 --> 00:11:30,520 Speaker 1: crawl with this this case, and that is this man. 157 00:11:31,440 --> 00:11:33,800 Speaker 1: And I hesitate to call him that. I know, this 158 00:11:34,480 --> 00:11:42,720 Speaker 1: male was encouraging Annabelle, this twenty one year old, to 159 00:11:42,840 --> 00:11:47,319 Speaker 1: engage in I don't know, let's say, in some activities 160 00:11:47,320 --> 00:11:49,800 Speaker 1: that were less than morally sound. 161 00:11:50,040 --> 00:11:52,280 Speaker 2: Well, he's encouraging her to have sex with a friend 162 00:11:52,280 --> 00:11:55,240 Speaker 2: of his, and he's encouraging that in such a way 163 00:11:55,360 --> 00:11:59,679 Speaker 2: that he Now they look every article I've gone over 164 00:11:59,720 --> 00:12:05,480 Speaker 2: with this, says jealous boyfriend. Jealous boyfriend, jealous boyfriend. No, 165 00:12:06,400 --> 00:12:08,480 Speaker 2: he was a control freak who tried to push her 166 00:12:08,480 --> 00:12:10,680 Speaker 2: into doing things that she probably didn't want to do. 167 00:12:10,760 --> 00:12:12,599 Speaker 2: But then when she decided, Okay, I'm going to go 168 00:12:12,640 --> 00:12:14,880 Speaker 2: along with this, then he turns it on her uses 169 00:12:14,920 --> 00:12:17,719 Speaker 2: that as an excuse to beat her. It was like 170 00:12:17,760 --> 00:12:20,160 Speaker 2: he was setting her up to give him a reason 171 00:12:20,200 --> 00:12:21,760 Speaker 2: to beat her. 172 00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:25,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, and you know we talk about when you look 173 00:12:25,320 --> 00:12:32,360 Speaker 1: at victimology and kind of study these attacks, it winds up. 174 00:12:32,400 --> 00:12:34,880 Speaker 1: It always comes back to this kind of asymmetry in 175 00:12:34,880 --> 00:12:37,719 Speaker 1: a relationship. And when you've got this thirty three year 176 00:12:37,720 --> 00:12:43,480 Speaker 1: old grown man that is treating this young girl this 177 00:12:43,520 --> 00:12:48,520 Speaker 1: way twenty one years old, he's and it's his house 178 00:12:48,760 --> 00:12:52,000 Speaker 1: as well. And not only is it his house, it's 179 00:12:52,080 --> 00:12:58,480 Speaker 1: a house that is under constant surveillance within it. And 180 00:12:58,520 --> 00:13:01,640 Speaker 1: you know, surveillance, I think is is a means to control. 181 00:13:02,760 --> 00:13:04,720 Speaker 1: And you can look at that from you know, people 182 00:13:04,720 --> 00:13:07,840 Speaker 1: will say, well, yeah, people have surveillance for safety. You're right, 183 00:13:08,360 --> 00:13:11,040 Speaker 1: But when you get to this level where you've got 184 00:13:11,080 --> 00:13:14,160 Speaker 1: cameras that are kind of posted all over the place, 185 00:13:15,559 --> 00:13:21,400 Speaker 1: it goes from It goes from maybe voyeuristic certainly doesn't 186 00:13:21,400 --> 00:13:24,480 Speaker 1: have anything to do with security. I don't think goes 187 00:13:24,520 --> 00:13:29,280 Speaker 1: from voyeuristic to now where you're in a position where 188 00:13:29,320 --> 00:13:32,840 Speaker 1: you can take someone that maybe is less emotionally mature, 189 00:13:33,320 --> 00:13:36,360 Speaker 1: that is heavily depended upon you as a provider now 190 00:13:37,440 --> 00:13:41,240 Speaker 1: and you can totally and completely control them today with everything. Yeah, 191 00:13:41,720 --> 00:13:44,120 Speaker 1: you know, video evidence everything. 192 00:13:44,360 --> 00:13:46,480 Speaker 2: A point of guys like this, they always go after 193 00:13:46,559 --> 00:13:49,200 Speaker 2: younger girls because the younger girls see them as something 194 00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:51,800 Speaker 2: more than what the other their pairs are. You know 195 00:13:52,360 --> 00:13:55,160 Speaker 2: all it is. And mean you see any guy that's 196 00:13:55,200 --> 00:13:57,520 Speaker 2: thirty three, and I can I know a couple of 197 00:13:57,520 --> 00:14:00,920 Speaker 2: these control guys that are dating girls out of high school. 198 00:14:01,240 --> 00:14:04,160 Speaker 2: Think about that for just a minute. In your thirties, 199 00:14:04,240 --> 00:14:06,280 Speaker 2: you were married and had your first kids and all that, 200 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:09,120 Speaker 2: and this guy's strolling the high school. That tells you 201 00:14:09,160 --> 00:14:11,640 Speaker 2: a lot about him as a person, and the fact 202 00:14:11,679 --> 00:14:14,079 Speaker 2: that he lures her into doing things that she probably 203 00:14:14,120 --> 00:14:16,840 Speaker 2: wouldn't do to use it as an excuse to beater 204 00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:19,040 Speaker 2: and like you said, control her with the video cameras 205 00:14:19,280 --> 00:14:20,600 Speaker 2: or the surveillance footage rather. 206 00:14:21,240 --> 00:14:24,760 Speaker 1: It's ridiculous. Yeah, it truly is. And one of the 207 00:14:24,840 --> 00:14:28,880 Speaker 1: things in forensics that that we're going to look at 208 00:14:28,920 --> 00:14:30,960 Speaker 1: in a case like this, particularly when you have this 209 00:14:31,080 --> 00:14:37,600 Speaker 1: much videographic evidence. And we do this in child abuse 210 00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:41,720 Speaker 1: cases too. I've talked about contusions before, and in this 211 00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:46,360 Speaker 1: case it's particularly important because you know, we're talking about 212 00:14:46,360 --> 00:14:50,760 Speaker 1: something again that is ongoing. It's been a long you know, this, 213 00:14:50,760 --> 00:14:54,440 Speaker 1: this long kind of approach to you know, to the 214 00:14:54,560 --> 00:14:55,320 Speaker 1: end of her life. 215 00:14:55,400 --> 00:14:57,360 Speaker 2: Can you tell as they're getting worse? Can you tell 216 00:14:57,400 --> 00:15:00,120 Speaker 2: if the beatings are getting worse as they come in 217 00:15:00,160 --> 00:15:02,480 Speaker 2: this particular case where the last night of her life, 218 00:15:02,520 --> 00:15:05,680 Speaker 2: he beats her with his hands eighty five times, at 219 00:15:05,800 --> 00:15:08,240 Speaker 2: least eighty times with his feet at least to the 220 00:15:08,240 --> 00:15:10,880 Speaker 2: point where his hands are beaten and swollen and his 221 00:15:10,960 --> 00:15:15,560 Speaker 2: ankle is from kicking her. His ankle is swallen. But 222 00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:19,320 Speaker 2: can you then go back and look at previous times 223 00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:22,160 Speaker 2: where he has beaten her and look at her body 224 00:15:22,200 --> 00:15:24,720 Speaker 2: and see any of those healing? Can you tell? 225 00:15:25,560 --> 00:15:28,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, you possibly can. What's what's going to be key 226 00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:30,960 Speaker 1: in a case like this is that you would do 227 00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:35,040 Speaker 1: a you would have to do full body X rays. Okay? 228 00:15:35,400 --> 00:15:36,960 Speaker 2: Is that common? Uh? 229 00:15:38,680 --> 00:15:43,800 Speaker 1: No, it's not. But when you have insults that are 230 00:15:43,880 --> 00:15:48,120 Speaker 1: this extensive, you would want to go head to toe 231 00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:50,800 Speaker 1: and you would you would want to do what are 232 00:15:50,840 --> 00:15:53,760 Speaker 1: referred to as aps and laterals, which the ap are 233 00:15:53,800 --> 00:15:55,920 Speaker 1: straight on, you know, kind of like when you go 234 00:15:56,080 --> 00:15:58,760 Speaker 1: get a chest X ray, and then lateral is when 235 00:15:58,760 --> 00:16:02,120 Speaker 1: you roll the deceiting up on their side, and you 236 00:16:02,160 --> 00:16:05,640 Speaker 1: hold them in place over a cartridge and you take 237 00:16:05,960 --> 00:16:08,480 Speaker 1: you take snapshots from the top of their head or 238 00:16:08,520 --> 00:16:11,760 Speaker 1: take X rays, radiographs from the top of their head, 239 00:16:11,880 --> 00:16:15,240 Speaker 1: all the way, you know, down range until and you're 240 00:16:15,280 --> 00:16:19,240 Speaker 1: doing it segmentally, okay, which is you know most of 241 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:21,440 Speaker 1: the time, that's the way X rays are done, and 242 00:16:21,480 --> 00:16:24,200 Speaker 1: you till you get to the feet. Because you know, 243 00:16:24,240 --> 00:16:28,440 Speaker 1: this borders to me, Dave, when you're talking about a 244 00:16:28,440 --> 00:16:31,560 Speaker 1: young woman being pummeled like this for so long, this 245 00:16:31,640 --> 00:16:37,280 Speaker 1: starts to leach over into the area of torture, and 246 00:16:37,360 --> 00:16:39,680 Speaker 1: I think that that's something that has to be considered, 247 00:16:39,960 --> 00:16:43,480 Speaker 1: you know, to think about. You know, I remember there 248 00:16:43,520 --> 00:16:47,080 Speaker 1: were when I was a kid, I remember, uh, And 249 00:16:47,240 --> 00:16:50,240 Speaker 1: forgive me because I can't remember this man's name, uh, 250 00:16:50,320 --> 00:16:52,360 Speaker 1: but he's he was one of the survivors of the 251 00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:55,520 Speaker 1: Hanoi Hilton, you know, back during the Vietnam War. He 252 00:16:55,520 --> 00:16:58,080 Speaker 1: had been a pow and he was I think he'd 253 00:16:58,120 --> 00:17:02,640 Speaker 1: been a pilot. He'd been shot down. Anyway, he had 254 00:17:02,640 --> 00:17:04,639 Speaker 1: talked about how he knew what time of day it 255 00:17:04,800 --> 00:17:06,439 Speaker 1: was because he knew he was going to receive his 256 00:17:06,560 --> 00:17:09,760 Speaker 1: beating at that time, and they would come in and 257 00:17:09,760 --> 00:17:12,760 Speaker 1: they would beat him every single day, and sometimes he'd 258 00:17:12,760 --> 00:17:15,080 Speaker 1: be punched and kicked, other times that he would be 259 00:17:15,080 --> 00:17:19,320 Speaker 1: beaten with a rod, and they did all manner of 260 00:17:19,400 --> 00:17:22,240 Speaker 1: things to him. But the body can tell the history 261 00:17:22,240 --> 00:17:25,680 Speaker 1: of what's happening. So let's just say, for instance, she's 262 00:17:25,720 --> 00:17:28,880 Speaker 1: been a good example of being punched in the ribs, 263 00:17:29,640 --> 00:17:31,679 Speaker 1: particularly early on, if you don't want to see and 264 00:17:31,720 --> 00:17:34,359 Speaker 1: you see this with child abusers too. They won't strike 265 00:17:34,760 --> 00:17:38,320 Speaker 1: their victims in the face because they don't have that 266 00:17:38,400 --> 00:17:40,760 Speaker 1: kind of attention drawn to him. But if you pop 267 00:17:40,840 --> 00:17:43,719 Speaker 1: somebody in the ribs or in the stomach, you know, 268 00:17:43,920 --> 00:17:46,560 Speaker 1: if the person's fully clothed, you're not going to see 269 00:17:46,560 --> 00:17:48,800 Speaker 1: any evidence of contusions. You're not going to see an 270 00:17:48,840 --> 00:17:53,040 Speaker 1: abrasion or anything like that. But what you might see 271 00:17:53,119 --> 00:17:56,520 Speaker 1: if you were a physician and you brought a person 272 00:17:56,520 --> 00:17:58,560 Speaker 1: in for treatment, you might see a fracture cribbed if 273 00:17:58,560 --> 00:18:02,440 Speaker 1: you did an X ray and post mortem, we can 274 00:18:02,520 --> 00:18:09,359 Speaker 1: actually appreciate fractured bones that have healed in an otherwise 275 00:18:09,640 --> 00:18:13,840 Speaker 1: non therapeutic manner. They haven't been treated at all, and 276 00:18:14,000 --> 00:18:17,159 Speaker 1: the bone naturally wants to get back together, so if 277 00:18:17,240 --> 00:18:20,280 Speaker 1: you have a fractured rib, for instance, that's never been treated, 278 00:18:20,800 --> 00:18:22,680 Speaker 1: it's going to show up on the X ray. Any 279 00:18:22,680 --> 00:18:26,360 Speaker 1: physician that's worth their salt that can interpret radiographs, they're 280 00:18:26,359 --> 00:18:30,919 Speaker 1: going to note that. And then with the contusions, you're 281 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:33,879 Speaker 1: gonna have overlying contusions, Dave, You'll have them set on. 282 00:18:34,080 --> 00:18:37,639 Speaker 1: And obviously the head for her was a strike point 283 00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:40,040 Speaker 1: for him. He loved hitting her in the head, kicking 284 00:18:40,040 --> 00:18:43,919 Speaker 1: her in the head. So you'll have overlapping contusions and 285 00:18:43,960 --> 00:18:47,639 Speaker 1: it would be an absolute mess to try to untangle 286 00:18:47,640 --> 00:18:48,520 Speaker 1: all this stuff, Dave. 287 00:18:49,680 --> 00:18:52,440 Speaker 2: When you were talking a minute ago about contusions, and 288 00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:55,080 Speaker 2: one of the things that he was talking about on 289 00:18:55,119 --> 00:19:02,480 Speaker 2: here on the report about the last lacerations and bruising 290 00:19:02,600 --> 00:19:06,200 Speaker 2: on her back, arms, legs, torso and a pelvic area. 291 00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:10,199 Speaker 2: Are when they're talking about lacerations like that, are we 292 00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:13,640 Speaker 2: talking cuts? Are we talking what are we talking about 293 00:19:13,640 --> 00:19:15,160 Speaker 2: when we say lacerations and bruising. 294 00:19:15,560 --> 00:19:18,639 Speaker 1: Let's break it down this way. I like to I 295 00:19:18,760 --> 00:19:24,720 Speaker 1: like to refer to lacerations as tears. And that's that's 296 00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:29,800 Speaker 1: specifically how you generate that kind of injury to the body. 297 00:19:30,440 --> 00:19:35,040 Speaker 1: That is, if you apply force, blunt force to a 298 00:19:35,160 --> 00:19:38,240 Speaker 1: region of the body as the hand or the foot 299 00:19:38,359 --> 00:19:42,320 Speaker 1: generates enough power energy and that's transferred onto the surface 300 00:19:42,560 --> 00:19:46,800 Speaker 1: of the skin. Guess what, man, the skin is going 301 00:19:46,880 --> 00:19:50,640 Speaker 1: to give way and you'll get this tearing that occurs, 302 00:19:50,680 --> 00:19:53,640 Speaker 1: and it's not going to be neat and clean. Now, 303 00:19:53,680 --> 00:19:57,600 Speaker 1: you can have minor lacerations or you can have major lacerations. 304 00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:00,919 Speaker 1: Let's say, for instance, some it has been struck in 305 00:20:00,960 --> 00:20:04,160 Speaker 1: the head with a baseball bat. You get these big, nasty, 306 00:20:04,359 --> 00:20:09,719 Speaker 1: gaping impact in injuries where you'll have what are referred 307 00:20:09,720 --> 00:20:12,760 Speaker 1: to as tissue bridging, where you have strands of tissue 308 00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:15,520 Speaker 1: that are still connecting either side, but yet the skin 309 00:20:15,680 --> 00:20:18,600 Speaker 1: is torn and the edges are going to be real jagged, 310 00:20:20,000 --> 00:20:22,160 Speaker 1: whereas that's not going to look anything like a short, 311 00:20:22,280 --> 00:20:25,800 Speaker 1: sharp force injury. And then there will be an associated 312 00:20:25,840 --> 00:20:30,680 Speaker 1: contusion surrounding the laceration. So if someone is struck, say 313 00:20:30,760 --> 00:20:33,920 Speaker 1: for instance, in the side of the head, the skin 314 00:20:34,040 --> 00:20:38,400 Speaker 1: is torn, you know, in this case a laceration as 315 00:20:38,440 --> 00:20:42,359 Speaker 1: we'd mentioned, you would have you know, a dark area 316 00:20:42,400 --> 00:20:45,479 Speaker 1: surrounding that, and that'd be the associated contusion because you're 317 00:20:45,760 --> 00:20:49,639 Speaker 1: disrupting all of the vascular vasculature beneath the surface of 318 00:20:49,680 --> 00:20:52,840 Speaker 1: the skin. Those little blood vessels are bursting in there 319 00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:56,840 Speaker 1: and it's kind of leaching out into the interstitial tissue 320 00:20:57,320 --> 00:20:57,640 Speaker 1: right now. 321 00:20:58,320 --> 00:21:02,199 Speaker 2: Inside the house, they found blood stains on the kitchen walls. 322 00:21:03,040 --> 00:21:06,440 Speaker 2: The oven's glass door was shattered, there was a hole 323 00:21:06,440 --> 00:21:11,240 Speaker 2: in the wall, and they did find Annabelle's damaged cell 324 00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:15,440 Speaker 2: phone on the floor. And they mentioned that the defendant 325 00:21:15,800 --> 00:21:19,480 Speaker 2: his hand, finger, and elbow had bruising and swelling from 326 00:21:19,520 --> 00:21:21,439 Speaker 2: the beating that he was inflicting. Can you imagine the 327 00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:24,879 Speaker 2: elbow drop and things like that, But where would we 328 00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:30,200 Speaker 2: You're talking about blood on the kitchen walls. Yeah, yeah, 329 00:21:30,240 --> 00:21:32,960 Speaker 2: every time blood spatter from or. 330 00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:37,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, it would, it would. It can come in one 331 00:21:38,000 --> 00:21:41,200 Speaker 1: of well a couple of ways. But let's just think 332 00:21:41,200 --> 00:21:44,480 Speaker 1: about it. For instance, if she's standing adjacent to the 333 00:21:44,480 --> 00:21:48,399 Speaker 1: wall and she's punched in the face, maybe her nose, 334 00:21:48,600 --> 00:21:52,639 Speaker 1: all right, that can be projected blood. It would be 335 00:21:52,760 --> 00:21:55,960 Speaker 1: very low velocity. You would have a deposition on the 336 00:21:56,000 --> 00:22:01,520 Speaker 1: wall that would lend lend itself. It would be it 337 00:22:01,560 --> 00:22:04,800 Speaker 1: would be evident of low velocity. It's not like she's 338 00:22:04,840 --> 00:22:07,640 Speaker 1: struck with a baseball bat or certainly a gun, where 339 00:22:07,640 --> 00:22:10,120 Speaker 1: you have high velocity that's kind of misting. It has 340 00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:13,680 Speaker 1: a misting appearance to it. In a case like this, 341 00:22:14,480 --> 00:22:17,280 Speaker 1: you can generate it like that. Or if she is 342 00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:21,359 Speaker 1: if she is struck and bleeding, she could be thrown 343 00:22:21,400 --> 00:22:26,359 Speaker 1: against the wall and that would be a contact, a 344 00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:31,600 Speaker 1: contact amount of blood that's left behind that is emanating 345 00:22:32,320 --> 00:22:34,120 Speaker 1: from say the nose of the mouth. I'm just using 346 00:22:34,160 --> 00:22:36,840 Speaker 1: it as an example, and it's transferred onto the surface 347 00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:40,200 Speaker 1: of the wall, so it's really important. Or you can 348 00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:43,399 Speaker 1: have the victim or the perpetrator if they've got like 349 00:22:43,560 --> 00:22:45,760 Speaker 1: for instance, all of us have had bloody noses. And 350 00:22:45,800 --> 00:22:49,560 Speaker 1: if you touch your bloody nose and you look at 351 00:22:49,560 --> 00:22:51,520 Speaker 1: it and then you put your hand down on a 352 00:22:51,560 --> 00:22:54,840 Speaker 1: surface or against a surface, that's transfer all right. So 353 00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:58,040 Speaker 1: it's not projected, you're actually transferring it onto that surface. 354 00:22:58,640 --> 00:23:03,880 Speaker 1: And those that are really good at blood interpretation, they're 355 00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:12,040 Speaker 1: capable of giving you their opinion relative to how that 356 00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:15,400 Speaker 1: blood wound up on that surface. And here's the thing 357 00:23:15,680 --> 00:23:19,560 Speaker 1: that's really troubling about this, Dave. If you go back 358 00:23:19,560 --> 00:23:28,040 Speaker 1: into time with this so called relationship, there could be 359 00:23:28,280 --> 00:23:33,720 Speaker 1: just as much evidence deposited on the surfaces of that 360 00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:56,280 Speaker 1: house trailer as there is evidence on her body. The 361 00:23:56,359 --> 00:24:06,719 Speaker 1: prosecutor Anna Belle's case used the term unfathomable, and I 362 00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:12,040 Speaker 1: love that. I love that term. I always have. It 363 00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:17,000 Speaker 1: gives you an idea that you can't really measure the 364 00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:22,880 Speaker 1: extent or the depth of something that for a person 365 00:24:23,320 --> 00:24:27,200 Speaker 1: that is in their normal state of mind. When as 366 00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:32,800 Speaker 1: to kind of consider the level of trauma and brutality 367 00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:38,080 Speaker 1: in a case like this, most people, and I think 368 00:24:38,119 --> 00:24:41,480 Speaker 1: that we would hope this of our fellow citizens, would 369 00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:45,160 Speaker 1: you know, retract at the idea of that. And and 370 00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:49,080 Speaker 1: you know this is actually coming from a prosecutor, Dave 371 00:24:49,640 --> 00:24:52,520 Speaker 1: h in this town, in this county up there in Pennsylvania. 372 00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:57,480 Speaker 1: He's he sees a lot and he uses the term 373 00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:03,080 Speaker 1: unfathomable when you begin to think about the level of 374 00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:05,920 Speaker 1: violence that was exacted upon Annabelle. 375 00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:11,400 Speaker 2: When you said level of violence, that's unfathomable, level of violence, 376 00:25:11,840 --> 00:25:16,880 Speaker 2: that's actually a descriptor for this that it actually does 377 00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:21,040 Speaker 2: measure up to that Look this girl, Annabelle, Annabelle Rose 378 00:25:21,119 --> 00:25:23,880 Speaker 2: meaning okay, and maybe this is hitting me a little 379 00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:27,800 Speaker 2: harder because she's there's pictures of her with her hair 380 00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:30,480 Speaker 2: that look just like my Hannah and my hand is small. 381 00:25:30,560 --> 00:25:34,560 Speaker 2: She's you know, light weight. I just and this little girl, 382 00:25:34,600 --> 00:25:36,600 Speaker 2: she's little. I know she's not a little girl. I'm 383 00:25:36,640 --> 00:25:38,680 Speaker 2: not trying to be dismissive. She's twenty one years old. 384 00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:40,399 Speaker 2: I know she's an adult and makes a decision. But 385 00:25:40,520 --> 00:25:43,399 Speaker 2: she looks like my daughter. So and she's small. You 386 00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:45,800 Speaker 2: never stopped being a daddy, never. And I look at 387 00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:51,280 Speaker 2: this guy's mugshot and he's smirking. He is smirking in 388 00:25:51,320 --> 00:25:54,040 Speaker 2: his mugshot, and I'm thinking of the destruction he did 389 00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:56,119 Speaker 2: to her, not just once, he had been doing it 390 00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:59,040 Speaker 2: for a while. He was gonna. You mentioned controlling her. 391 00:25:59,440 --> 00:26:01,720 Speaker 2: He was control her every which way there was. He 392 00:26:01,840 --> 00:26:05,480 Speaker 2: was controlling her by putting her in situations where he 393 00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:08,200 Speaker 2: could use it against her to beat her. That's all 394 00:26:08,200 --> 00:26:10,800 Speaker 2: it was. And I hope he enjoys his time where 395 00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:12,879 Speaker 2: he's going to spend some years. But I wanted to 396 00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:14,479 Speaker 2: add a couple of things here very quickly. 397 00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:15,080 Speaker 1: Yeah. 398 00:26:15,160 --> 00:26:19,960 Speaker 2: Sure, the Annabel was This is from her family. Annabel 399 00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:22,919 Speaker 2: Rose was hilarious, fun to be around, always stood up 400 00:26:22,920 --> 00:26:26,200 Speaker 2: for what she believed in. When Alabella was in the room, 401 00:26:26,200 --> 00:26:28,160 Speaker 2: When Annabel was in the room, she always made sure 402 00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:35,280 Speaker 2: everyone felt comfortable and their voice heard, their voice heard 403 00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:37,320 Speaker 2: him thinking there was nobody there for her to make 404 00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:39,399 Speaker 2: sure her voice was heard. Nobody could get her out 405 00:26:39,440 --> 00:26:47,440 Speaker 2: of this mess. The prosecutor pointed out that Leroy Brahm 406 00:26:48,040 --> 00:26:50,600 Speaker 2: the third had put Annabelle in a situation to be 407 00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:58,400 Speaker 2: with another man, encouraged it until she was and then, apparently, 408 00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:01,600 Speaker 2: according to the prosecutor, annabel was seeing him for who 409 00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:06,719 Speaker 2: he was. She was seeing through Leroy Brahm, and the 410 00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:10,920 Speaker 2: prosecutor said he was done with annabel choosing another man 411 00:27:11,359 --> 00:27:16,200 Speaker 2: instead of himself. When investigators asked him about this, Joe 412 00:27:16,200 --> 00:27:21,800 Speaker 2: Scott Morgan asked him to explain the bruises on her 413 00:27:21,880 --> 00:27:25,440 Speaker 2: near naked body. You know what this guy said, what's 414 00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:32,960 Speaker 2: that day? It's just a sexual kink. We like rough sacks. 415 00:27:33,280 --> 00:27:39,439 Speaker 1: Yeah, and you know, I gotta I think my response 416 00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:46,760 Speaker 1: to that would be, does you know dropping a sofa 417 00:27:46,920 --> 00:27:51,720 Speaker 1: on this young woman who you have literally beat. 418 00:27:51,480 --> 00:27:53,560 Speaker 2: The hell out of you beat her to death with 419 00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:55,640 Speaker 2: your hands and feet. What part of that was sexual? 420 00:27:56,080 --> 00:27:57,399 Speaker 2: And was it the time when you hit her in 421 00:27:57,440 --> 00:27:59,679 Speaker 2: the face with your fist was that sexual? And you 422 00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:02,280 Speaker 2: kick during the stomach was that sexual? You know? That's 423 00:28:02,280 --> 00:28:04,320 Speaker 2: the part that really bothers me is that he actually 424 00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:06,320 Speaker 2: could say Her family had to hear him say that. 425 00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:10,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, I know. And it again unfathomable. You can't plumb 426 00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:14,440 Speaker 1: the depths of it that you would be so depraved 427 00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:18,119 Speaker 1: in your mind that you would take this young woman 428 00:28:18,359 --> 00:28:21,480 Speaker 1: and use her because she she's a thing to him, 429 00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:26,159 Speaker 1: nothing more. That's that's what she was. And and here's 430 00:28:26,280 --> 00:28:30,679 Speaker 1: here's kind of an interesting little aside here when she 431 00:28:31,160 --> 00:28:35,880 Speaker 1: was actually extricated from that trailer and died at the 432 00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:40,920 Speaker 1: hospital and eventually, you know, they listed her her death 433 00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:42,920 Speaker 1: as cardiac arrest. 434 00:28:43,280 --> 00:28:44,320 Speaker 2: I was going to ask you about that. 435 00:28:44,520 --> 00:28:46,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, And you know, don't. 436 00:28:46,400 --> 00:28:48,360 Speaker 2: We all die from that our heart stop beating? 437 00:28:48,880 --> 00:28:55,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, you can, uh, you know if you're beheaded, Yeah, uh, 438 00:28:55,360 --> 00:28:57,400 Speaker 1: your heart is going to stop beating. I hate I 439 00:28:57,400 --> 00:28:59,800 Speaker 1: hate it when they say cardiac arrest because it means 440 00:28:59,800 --> 00:29:03,440 Speaker 1: that there's not a lot of thought that goes into that. 441 00:29:03,480 --> 00:29:06,000 Speaker 1: There's not a lot of depth, scientific depth of that, 442 00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:09,040 Speaker 1: because you have to try to understand the underlying factors 443 00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:15,040 Speaker 1: of what was going on. I think that potentially her 444 00:29:15,080 --> 00:29:18,040 Speaker 1: heart did stop beating. Some of it could be internal 445 00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:20,320 Speaker 1: blood loss, it could be as a result of shock 446 00:29:20,560 --> 00:29:23,960 Speaker 1: that would send you into a cardiac arrest. But here's 447 00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:29,960 Speaker 1: one of the other interesting things. She had apparently been 448 00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:34,320 Speaker 1: plied with cocaine as well. They found this in her system, 449 00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:39,520 Speaker 1: and I wonder about this. I wonder if he had 450 00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:44,400 Speaker 1: he got off on this behavior because listen, by his 451 00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:47,080 Speaker 1: own admission, he said that this is a sexual kink 452 00:29:47,320 --> 00:29:52,040 Speaker 1: that they shared. I wonder if she would get so 453 00:29:52,240 --> 00:29:57,680 Speaker 1: drowsy because of the head injuries she was sustaining, she 454 00:29:57,760 --> 00:30:02,720 Speaker 1: couldn't maintain focus. If he gave her a bump or 455 00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:10,600 Speaker 1: a dosage of coke, would that would that reinvigorate her 456 00:30:10,800 --> 00:30:13,920 Speaker 1: to the point where she has an awareness of what's happening. 457 00:30:15,560 --> 00:30:18,960 Speaker 1: That she didn't just like softly slip off into a coma. 458 00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:24,120 Speaker 1: She's still alive, Dave, and he decides at that moment 459 00:30:24,120 --> 00:30:29,400 Speaker 1: in time, well, let's see, I've punched her, I've stomped her, 460 00:30:30,520 --> 00:30:33,920 Speaker 1: I've kicked her, I've drug her all through this house, 461 00:30:34,280 --> 00:30:37,960 Speaker 1: and I've videotaped it while I've done it. The accusations 462 00:30:38,920 --> 00:30:42,800 Speaker 1: were not satisfactory to me. I didn't receive from that 463 00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:45,760 Speaker 1: what I wanted. I think to put an exclamation point 464 00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:49,040 Speaker 1: on this whole thing the way I'm going to end 465 00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:54,080 Speaker 1: this evening with this young lady who I don't know. 466 00:30:54,160 --> 00:30:58,280 Speaker 1: On one level he's taken responsibility of he is trying 467 00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:03,080 Speaker 1: to provide for her. I guess he's housing her. Dave. 468 00:31:03,320 --> 00:31:07,680 Speaker 1: He drops a freaking sofa on her, let that sink 469 00:31:07,720 --> 00:31:11,000 Speaker 1: in on top of her, and then as if that 470 00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:17,360 Speaker 1: wasn't enough, he lays down on the sofa and goes 471 00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:21,880 Speaker 1: to sleep with her beneath it. How do you how 472 00:31:21,880 --> 00:31:25,720 Speaker 1: do we even take the measure of that. I'm very happy, 473 00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:30,520 Speaker 1: I'm not so numb at this point after all these 474 00:31:30,600 --> 00:31:35,280 Speaker 1: years of covenant that I still can find find this totally, 475 00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:36,880 Speaker 1: completely repugnant. 476 00:31:36,400 --> 00:31:39,840 Speaker 2: Day when you have somebody in this situation where we 477 00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:43,560 Speaker 2: know that, look, this last beating they were able to 478 00:31:44,040 --> 00:31:45,800 Speaker 2: I hope you guys have caught that. We've mentioned the 479 00:31:45,920 --> 00:31:48,280 Speaker 2: number of hits with his hands and the number of 480 00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:50,680 Speaker 2: kicks with his feet, because they were able to count 481 00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:58,200 Speaker 2: those in the surveillance video. And that's a beating that 482 00:31:58,360 --> 00:32:02,080 Speaker 2: you don't take in a professional No, But do they 483 00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:04,120 Speaker 2: do these types of things because we know that he 484 00:32:04,160 --> 00:32:06,960 Speaker 2: had done it before to her and that she was 485 00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:11,120 Speaker 2: a regular victim of this domestic violence. But do those 486 00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:14,840 Speaker 2: types of beatings take a toll on somebody at her 487 00:32:14,920 --> 00:32:19,320 Speaker 2: size where you get beat about the head and body 488 00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:22,320 Speaker 2: over a period of time, and even though each time 489 00:32:22,360 --> 00:32:25,560 Speaker 2: the beating escalates but you don't have time to fully 490 00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:29,040 Speaker 2: recover from the previous beating, do they continue to have 491 00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:33,000 Speaker 2: a bigger and bigger impact on your physical ability to reges? 492 00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:40,080 Speaker 1: Oh? Absolutely, yeah, absolutely, Because if she's taken head strikes, David, 493 00:32:39,560 --> 00:32:43,680 Speaker 1: he could, he could essentially without you know, her having 494 00:32:43,680 --> 00:32:46,760 Speaker 1: any awareness of it. She might have a severe headache, 495 00:32:47,080 --> 00:32:51,720 Speaker 1: he may rupture some tiny vessel in her head and 496 00:32:51,880 --> 00:32:55,520 Speaker 1: that area that is so traumatized. There's not been sufficient 497 00:32:55,520 --> 00:32:58,640 Speaker 1: amount of time to recover from that, So she's going 498 00:32:58,720 --> 00:33:03,080 Speaker 1: to have this kind of fog foggy way about her. 499 00:33:03,120 --> 00:33:06,320 Speaker 1: And then the next thing she does something else that irritates, 500 00:33:06,600 --> 00:33:10,120 Speaker 1: and again he flies into her again and begins striking. 501 00:33:10,280 --> 00:33:13,760 Speaker 1: So yeah, it's a totality. It's literally a totality of 502 00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:17,440 Speaker 1: all of this trauma that she is sustaining day after 503 00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:21,479 Speaker 1: day after day. Other thing that you have to factor 504 00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:26,920 Speaker 1: into this is that when people are constantly subjected to 505 00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:32,320 Speaker 1: this level of abuse, their body is always in a 506 00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:37,000 Speaker 1: heightened state. Okay, they're always in a heightened state of 507 00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:41,160 Speaker 1: fear you're thinking about you know, her adrenaline is pumping 508 00:33:41,560 --> 00:33:47,440 Speaker 1: all the time. She probably can't sleep. She probably doesn't 509 00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:51,240 Speaker 1: eat very much, I would imagine, because when you're around 510 00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:56,280 Speaker 1: an abuser like this, they'll do anything they can find 511 00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:59,760 Speaker 1: a fence in the slightest little thing that is going 512 00:33:59,800 --> 00:34:03,760 Speaker 1: to prompt them to lash out at this person that 513 00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:07,040 Speaker 1: they're in this asymmetrical relationship with. And she's not going 514 00:34:07,120 --> 00:34:10,520 Speaker 1: to tell anybody, you know, she's not. He's got her 515 00:34:10,680 --> 00:34:13,959 Speaker 1: in his home. It's a home that he's providing for her. 516 00:34:14,600 --> 00:34:17,799 Speaker 1: And she's always survived, always surveiled. I mean, she's like 517 00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:21,319 Speaker 1: a you know what, the burden of guilded cage. She's 518 00:34:21,360 --> 00:34:25,759 Speaker 1: not going anywhere, and she knows she's being watched. And 519 00:34:25,800 --> 00:34:28,080 Speaker 1: I'm sure that he's pointed this out to her over 520 00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:30,759 Speaker 1: and over and over again. And be honest with you, 521 00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:34,600 Speaker 1: it would not surprise me if he had perhaps had 522 00:34:34,640 --> 00:34:40,680 Speaker 1: some kind of video of her engaging in sexual activity 523 00:34:40,920 --> 00:34:44,440 Speaker 1: with this guy. That's that would not surprise me in 524 00:34:44,480 --> 00:34:46,680 Speaker 1: the least bit. And again, as an abuser, he can 525 00:34:46,719 --> 00:34:50,080 Speaker 1: take that and throw it in her face and accuse her, 526 00:34:50,200 --> 00:34:51,720 Speaker 1: and of course that drives her down. 527 00:34:51,560 --> 00:34:52,320 Speaker 2: Further and further. 528 00:34:52,520 --> 00:34:56,120 Speaker 1: She feels worthless and oh yeah, you got another beating coming. 529 00:34:57,200 --> 00:35:01,320 Speaker 2: All I can think of is how it's been described, 530 00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:06,120 Speaker 2: how her death has been described, and how he did 531 00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:09,200 Speaker 2: call nine one one and say, you know, you got 532 00:35:09,200 --> 00:35:12,640 Speaker 2: a medical emergency. But when they are friends, Yeah, when 533 00:35:13,080 --> 00:35:16,160 Speaker 2: when they arrived, they said he had taken none and 534 00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:19,120 Speaker 2: was unwilling to take any kind of life saving measures. 535 00:35:19,960 --> 00:35:23,040 Speaker 2: He wasn't willing to help, not one bit. After everything 536 00:35:23,080 --> 00:35:25,200 Speaker 2: he'd the only thing he did was call basically because 537 00:35:25,239 --> 00:35:28,080 Speaker 2: she was dead. She hadn't died yet, she was still breathing, 538 00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:29,880 Speaker 2: she was still alive at that point in time, but 539 00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:33,960 Speaker 2: he was doing nothing to help her survive. And as 540 00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:37,799 Speaker 2: you mentioned, after he beat her, after he beat her unconscious, 541 00:35:38,280 --> 00:35:41,280 Speaker 2: he then drops a couch on her and then hops 542 00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:42,720 Speaker 2: on the couch and goes to sleep. 543 00:35:43,760 --> 00:35:46,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, and here's another thing with that. One of the 544 00:35:46,520 --> 00:35:49,160 Speaker 1: first things I thought about. I don't know, you know, 545 00:35:49,600 --> 00:35:51,720 Speaker 1: for all of our friends out there that are listening, 546 00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:56,960 Speaker 1: if you ever consider your sofa at home, and everybody's 547 00:35:56,960 --> 00:35:59,759 Speaker 1: as different, obviously, but look look at the clearance that 548 00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:02,839 Speaker 1: you have from the the underneath of your sofa to 549 00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:07,080 Speaker 1: the floor. I really begin to think if she had 550 00:36:07,120 --> 00:36:16,200 Speaker 1: not maybe had been deprived of oxygen because of positional asphyxia. 551 00:36:16,440 --> 00:36:20,600 Speaker 1: In this case, where you know she's already compromised, you know, 552 00:36:20,920 --> 00:36:24,799 Speaker 1: from a circulatory standpoint, because she's been so beat up 553 00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:27,560 Speaker 1: and battered, there's no telling how much hemorrhage is going 554 00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:32,560 Speaker 1: on with her internally. Now you compromise her, her her 555 00:36:32,640 --> 00:36:37,440 Speaker 1: ability to facilitate the rising and falling of her chest 556 00:36:37,719 --> 00:36:40,760 Speaker 1: so that she can uptake oxygen. She's in this tiny 557 00:36:40,760 --> 00:36:43,880 Speaker 1: little space. I mean, it just gets progressively more and 558 00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:46,399 Speaker 1: more horrible all the way, you know, all the way 559 00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:50,440 Speaker 1: down the line with this, I don't know necessarily that 560 00:36:50,880 --> 00:36:54,239 Speaker 1: even if they had gotten to her prior to the 561 00:36:54,280 --> 00:36:59,760 Speaker 1: sofa event, that you know that the the medical personnel 562 00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:02,160 Speaker 1: could have saved her. I think it was this bad 563 00:37:02,560 --> 00:37:06,279 Speaker 1: at this point. And the fact, again this goes back 564 00:37:06,320 --> 00:37:10,560 Speaker 1: to a point you made earlier, Dave, when he didn't 565 00:37:10,600 --> 00:37:13,640 Speaker 1: take these heroic measures, I think that that goes to 566 00:37:13,680 --> 00:37:21,759 Speaker 1: show you how very little value that he assigned to her. 567 00:37:22,440 --> 00:37:27,560 Speaker 1: She's just another thing for him, just another thing that 568 00:37:28,520 --> 00:37:33,040 Speaker 1: could be thrown away. And that's essentially what he did. 569 00:37:34,320 --> 00:37:38,439 Speaker 1: Annabelle's gone now, but I will tell you this, he's 570 00:37:38,480 --> 00:37:42,759 Speaker 1: gone too. He's gone to the State penitentiary and he's 571 00:37:42,840 --> 00:37:46,600 Speaker 1: going to serve out the rest of his natural life 572 00:37:46,600 --> 00:37:52,920 Speaker 1: because he's been convicted a first degree murder. For anybody 573 00:37:53,080 --> 00:37:57,640 Speaker 1: today that is listening to me, and here's this. If 574 00:37:57,680 --> 00:38:02,680 Speaker 1: you know of anyone, and I mean anyone in your 575 00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:09,160 Speaker 1: circle that is going through issues with domestic violence, let 576 00:38:09,239 --> 00:38:12,359 Speaker 1: me give you a phone number. Please have them call 577 00:38:12,680 --> 00:38:20,440 Speaker 1: one eight hundred seven nine seven two three three. Again 578 00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:26,839 Speaker 1: that number, one eight hundred seven nine nine seven two 579 00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:33,640 Speaker 1: three three. That's the National Domestic Violence Hotline. I'm Joseph 580 00:38:33,640 --> 00:38:37,480 Speaker 1: Scott Morgan and this is Body Bags