1 00:00:00,320 --> 00:00:04,000 Speaker 1: Hey, I'm John Gonzalez. I'm a senior writer at Sports Illustrated. 2 00:00:04,480 --> 00:00:08,080 Speaker 1: Welcome to our new podcast, Sports Illustrated Weekly. On this 3 00:00:08,119 --> 00:00:11,360 Speaker 1: show will collect the best sports journalism from inside and 4 00:00:11,480 --> 00:00:14,360 Speaker 1: outside the pages of s I and deliver them to 5 00:00:14,400 --> 00:00:21,880 Speaker 1: you right here every week. Let's get started. On this 6 00:00:21,960 --> 00:00:26,240 Speaker 1: premiere episode of Sports Illustrated Weekly, Executive editor John Wortheim 7 00:00:26,320 --> 00:00:29,160 Speaker 1: joins us to discuss Tom Brady still being on top 8 00:00:29,160 --> 00:00:32,239 Speaker 1: of his profession at forty four, how much longer he 9 00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:34,520 Speaker 1: can stay there, and why he's one of the most 10 00:00:34,560 --> 00:00:40,240 Speaker 1: successful and polarizing athletes in sports. Then former Brown's tackle 11 00:00:40,360 --> 00:00:43,080 Speaker 1: Joe Thomas tells us about the first time he appeared 12 00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:46,519 Speaker 1: in Sports Illustrated and who he was back then before 13 00:00:46,560 --> 00:00:50,320 Speaker 1: he became one of the best offensive linemen in NFL history. 14 00:00:50,560 --> 00:00:53,720 Speaker 1: But we begin with the Golden State Warriors. Senior writer 15 00:00:53,760 --> 00:00:56,200 Speaker 1: Howard Beck tells us how they rebooted their dynasty on 16 00:00:56,240 --> 00:00:59,680 Speaker 1: the fly and kept Steph Curry happy in the process. 17 00:01:00,720 --> 00:01:05,000 Speaker 1: It's January nineteen. I'm your host, John Gonzalez from Sports 18 00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:09,279 Speaker 1: Illustrated and I Heart Radio. This is Sports Illustrated Weekly. 19 00:01:13,000 --> 00:01:16,720 Speaker 1: But Toronto Raptors are back in Oakland against the goal 20 00:01:16,800 --> 00:01:19,880 Speaker 1: of State Warriors as we welcome you, so they have 21 00:01:20,160 --> 00:01:25,720 Speaker 1: a finals Brusa. I thought that night that we saw 22 00:01:26,240 --> 00:01:31,120 Speaker 1: the dynasty literally crumble before us. Howard Beck is a 23 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:35,200 Speaker 1: senior writer for Sports Illustrated who covers the NBA. Tomson 24 00:01:35,280 --> 00:01:40,320 Speaker 1: running the floor out of foul and Thomson Grants has 25 00:01:40,400 --> 00:01:46,880 Speaker 1: left me now writhing at pay. Clay Thompson goes down 26 00:01:46,920 --> 00:01:48,640 Speaker 1: with the A C L just a couple of days 27 00:01:48,640 --> 00:01:51,160 Speaker 1: after we've seen Kevin Durank go down with the blown Achilles. 28 00:01:51,840 --> 00:01:55,920 Speaker 1: Leonard at the line to ice the game and to 29 00:01:56,000 --> 00:02:00,320 Speaker 1: win the championship, Free throws up and in the there's 30 00:02:00,360 --> 00:02:03,720 Speaker 1: by four Cousins in bounds the ball. Curry heaves it 31 00:02:03,800 --> 00:02:07,840 Speaker 1: at the puzzer. It's no good. The Toronto Raptors are 32 00:02:08,000 --> 00:02:12,560 Speaker 1: NBA champions. Howard and I were both there Game six 33 00:02:12,680 --> 00:02:17,000 Speaker 1: of the NBA Finals, the last Warriors game in Oakland, 34 00:02:17,600 --> 00:02:20,000 Speaker 1: and what we thought was the end of their dynasty. 35 00:02:20,800 --> 00:02:23,520 Speaker 1: The Raptors won their first championship that night, and the 36 00:02:23,560 --> 00:02:27,400 Speaker 1: Warriors were left to deal with the fallout. My strongest 37 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:30,279 Speaker 1: memory of that night, aside from the Raptors celebrating their championship, 38 00:02:30,440 --> 00:02:34,320 Speaker 1: was going in the back hallways Bob Myers was spent. 39 00:02:35,200 --> 00:02:38,200 Speaker 1: We were we were just out of words, we were 40 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:41,320 Speaker 1: out of emotion. I mean, we just I don't know how. 41 00:02:41,720 --> 00:02:43,760 Speaker 1: You don't as a human being, you can only process 42 00:02:43,840 --> 00:02:47,400 Speaker 1: so much. He had almost no voice. Remember he'd been 43 00:02:47,480 --> 00:02:50,120 Speaker 1: in tears a couple of nights earlier talking about Durant 44 00:02:50,160 --> 00:02:52,240 Speaker 1: and how badly he felt about Durant going down. When 45 00:02:52,240 --> 00:02:55,160 Speaker 1: they put him back out there, and when I gently 46 00:02:55,200 --> 00:02:57,639 Speaker 1: asked about the possibility that this is it, this night 47 00:02:57,680 --> 00:03:00,400 Speaker 1: is where it all ends, he didn't just sit out 48 00:03:00,400 --> 00:03:02,280 Speaker 1: of hand, and he basically said that there are these 49 00:03:02,280 --> 00:03:04,280 Speaker 1: transition moments and you've got to be ready for him, 50 00:03:04,320 --> 00:03:07,120 Speaker 1: and it's okay. However it comes, it comes, And so 51 00:03:07,440 --> 00:03:10,200 Speaker 1: he was ready for the possibility that the dynasty as 52 00:03:10,200 --> 00:03:15,280 Speaker 1: we knew it was over. And as dark as that 53 00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:18,040 Speaker 1: night was, Howard and I remember it well as do you, 54 00:03:18,639 --> 00:03:20,919 Speaker 1: things got worse. I mean, it didn't all of a 55 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:23,680 Speaker 1: sudden get better immediately for them. Klay Thompson, as you 56 00:03:23,720 --> 00:03:25,840 Speaker 1: mentioned here, it's his knee. He comes back, he tears 57 00:03:25,840 --> 00:03:28,880 Speaker 1: his achilles as well. Steph misses most of the following 58 00:03:28,880 --> 00:03:31,519 Speaker 1: season with a hand injury. The Warriors miss out on 59 00:03:31,560 --> 00:03:34,040 Speaker 1: the bubble completely. Not having them for the playoffs, even 60 00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:36,760 Speaker 1: in a weird season like that was awfully strange. But 61 00:03:36,840 --> 00:03:39,480 Speaker 1: how bleak did it look for them in their darkest hours? 62 00:03:41,160 --> 00:03:43,040 Speaker 1: You know, the one thing they could fall back on 63 00:03:43,160 --> 00:03:47,000 Speaker 1: John was, Okay, we still have Steph Curry. Granted, you know, 64 00:03:47,560 --> 00:03:49,920 Speaker 1: maybe late prime Steph Curry, and we don't know how 65 00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:51,760 Speaker 1: much more we can get out of him, but we 66 00:03:51,840 --> 00:03:55,120 Speaker 1: still have Steph Curry, and we'll eventually have Klay Thompson 67 00:03:55,160 --> 00:03:57,800 Speaker 1: Beck and we still have Draymond Green, you know, the 68 00:03:57,840 --> 00:03:59,440 Speaker 1: heart of our defense, the heart of our team in 69 00:03:59,440 --> 00:04:01,640 Speaker 1: a lot of ways. But when Clay goes down a 70 00:04:01,680 --> 00:04:04,320 Speaker 1: second time a year later with the achilles, and now 71 00:04:04,360 --> 00:04:07,920 Speaker 1: he's got back to back two of the toughest injuries, like, 72 00:04:08,960 --> 00:04:12,280 Speaker 1: where's the path out of that? In a weird way though, 73 00:04:12,320 --> 00:04:15,280 Speaker 1: because they go through all this adversity, and Bob Myers 74 00:04:15,320 --> 00:04:18,120 Speaker 1: told you that the dark days actually sort of placed 75 00:04:18,120 --> 00:04:20,839 Speaker 1: them on this path to rebuild on the fly, And 76 00:04:20,920 --> 00:04:24,599 Speaker 1: maybe they wouldn't have gone this way if you know, 77 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:27,400 Speaker 1: Steph had been healthy, if Clay had been healthy. Was 78 00:04:27,440 --> 00:04:30,800 Speaker 1: it planned out? Now? We we didn't plan to have 79 00:04:30,960 --> 00:04:34,440 Speaker 1: play go down for two years for steps and its 80 00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:36,800 Speaker 1: most of the year two years ago. But it happened, 81 00:04:37,000 --> 00:04:40,200 Speaker 1: and it happened in the NBA, so it afforded this opportunity. 82 00:04:40,360 --> 00:04:45,000 Speaker 1: And when you draft high, you try to take the 83 00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:46,920 Speaker 1: player you believe will be end up being the best player. 84 00:04:47,520 --> 00:04:50,400 Speaker 1: They were going to take a step back regardless what's 85 00:04:50,440 --> 00:04:53,360 Speaker 1: Kevin Durrett went down. Edward's Kevin Durrett then decided to 86 00:04:53,480 --> 00:04:57,000 Speaker 1: leave the Warriors entirely right. He was m v P 87 00:04:57,120 --> 00:05:00,800 Speaker 1: of both finals and their last two championships, So you 88 00:05:00,839 --> 00:05:02,279 Speaker 1: were already going to have to find a way to 89 00:05:02,360 --> 00:05:06,559 Speaker 1: kind of reconstitute yourselves, um in a post Durant world. 90 00:05:07,400 --> 00:05:10,600 Speaker 1: So Durant leaves and they fashion a dual sign and 91 00:05:10,640 --> 00:05:12,920 Speaker 1: trade where they send Kevin Durant to the Brooklyn Nets, 92 00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:14,200 Speaker 1: where he was going to sign out right as a 93 00:05:14,200 --> 00:05:16,560 Speaker 1: free agent anyway, and the Nets in turn send D'Angelo 94 00:05:16,640 --> 00:05:18,520 Speaker 1: Russell as a sign and trade back to the Warriors. 95 00:05:18,600 --> 00:05:20,920 Speaker 1: I don't think they ever thought D'Angelo russells here long term, 96 00:05:21,120 --> 00:05:23,160 Speaker 1: but it was a way to get some value out 97 00:05:23,160 --> 00:05:26,200 Speaker 1: of Durant leaving. And then they flipped Angelo Russell to 98 00:05:26,320 --> 00:05:31,440 Speaker 1: Minnesota for Andrew Wiggins and a lightly protected first round pick. 99 00:05:32,360 --> 00:05:34,919 Speaker 1: They were setting themselves up. They were trying to be 100 00:05:35,080 --> 00:05:38,440 Speaker 1: creative and clever on the fly, knowing that they had 101 00:05:38,480 --> 00:05:40,640 Speaker 1: to move into some other phase, whatever it would be. 102 00:05:41,160 --> 00:05:45,280 Speaker 1: They do have this small grouping of promising young players. 103 00:05:45,360 --> 00:05:48,720 Speaker 1: Jordan Poole has certainly stepped up this season. Jonathan cominga 104 00:05:48,839 --> 00:05:52,000 Speaker 1: James weissman, they end up drafting him pretty high. But 105 00:05:52,080 --> 00:05:54,520 Speaker 1: some of those guys, Howard, end up spending time in 106 00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:56,800 Speaker 1: the G League, which used to be sort of an 107 00:05:56,800 --> 00:05:59,120 Speaker 1: insult to ask guys to work on their game, especially 108 00:05:59,200 --> 00:06:02,200 Speaker 1: if they were as highly as James Weisman was. But 109 00:06:02,360 --> 00:06:05,240 Speaker 1: Steve Kurt told you, it's not like that anymore. If 110 00:06:05,279 --> 00:06:07,480 Speaker 1: not for the G League. This whole thing we're talking 111 00:06:07,520 --> 00:06:09,640 Speaker 1: about is like that much harder, right, like your way hard. 112 00:06:09,680 --> 00:06:11,520 Speaker 1: And maybe you're force feeding them more minutes here if 113 00:06:11,560 --> 00:06:14,880 Speaker 1: you don't have it, yeah, or you know, just trying 114 00:06:14,920 --> 00:06:19,120 Speaker 1: to play more pickup stuff here. Um, But the G 115 00:06:19,320 --> 00:06:23,000 Speaker 1: League's emergence has really helped in that regard. Not that 116 00:06:23,120 --> 00:06:26,279 Speaker 1: long ago, when the NBA first created what was first 117 00:06:26,279 --> 00:06:28,360 Speaker 1: called the n B d L D NBA Development League 118 00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:29,960 Speaker 1: and then the D League and now the G League, 119 00:06:30,520 --> 00:06:34,840 Speaker 1: it was spoken about in ways that were less than charitable, 120 00:06:34,960 --> 00:06:37,320 Speaker 1: less less than gracious. And when you talked about a 121 00:06:37,320 --> 00:06:39,800 Speaker 1: player being sent down, it's like in baseball, you sent 122 00:06:39,880 --> 00:06:42,080 Speaker 1: down to the minor league, like the even the verbiage 123 00:06:42,120 --> 00:06:46,080 Speaker 1: we use is really disparaging. To be sent down never 124 00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:52,320 Speaker 1: sounds good. And so lottery picks spending time in the 125 00:06:52,440 --> 00:06:57,040 Speaker 1: D or G League unheard of and agents would have 126 00:06:57,040 --> 00:06:59,160 Speaker 1: thrown a fit, but you have said it. My guy debt, 127 00:06:59,160 --> 00:07:00,680 Speaker 1: my guy was a third over, I'll pick. You can't 128 00:07:00,680 --> 00:07:03,719 Speaker 1: send them to the to the G League. That's changed now, 129 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:06,880 Speaker 1: and that's a really important and very healthy bit of 130 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:10,160 Speaker 1: progress for the NBA as a whole. That was a 131 00:07:10,200 --> 00:07:13,280 Speaker 1: really important part of Jordan Pools development last season and 132 00:07:13,320 --> 00:07:16,360 Speaker 1: a big reason why he is now this critical part 133 00:07:17,120 --> 00:07:20,280 Speaker 1: of their team. There's a bunch of guys in this 134 00:07:20,360 --> 00:07:23,120 Speaker 1: league who are now really good players, who spent a 135 00:07:23,120 --> 00:07:24,840 Speaker 1: lot of time in the GE League, and we remind 136 00:07:24,840 --> 00:07:28,520 Speaker 1: our players of that too. Um, there's no there's no shame. 137 00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:32,640 Speaker 1: It's a it's a legitimate part of development. And so 138 00:07:32,920 --> 00:07:36,280 Speaker 1: the Warriors very much see the G League as a 139 00:07:36,560 --> 00:07:41,000 Speaker 1: critical critical part to developing young players, which is interesting 140 00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:43,760 Speaker 1: for their part because they don't have the room to 141 00:07:43,760 --> 00:07:46,280 Speaker 1: develop their young guys in the present because they're still 142 00:07:46,280 --> 00:07:48,960 Speaker 1: trying to win a championship with their events. Yeah, so 143 00:07:49,280 --> 00:07:52,280 Speaker 1: all of this from an academic perspective, Howard makes sense 144 00:07:52,320 --> 00:07:54,800 Speaker 1: to me as a Philadelphia and I obviously spent a 145 00:07:54,800 --> 00:07:59,160 Speaker 1: lot of time watching the process sixers, but that's different 146 00:07:59,160 --> 00:08:01,800 Speaker 1: than actually secuting the plan, especially when you have a 147 00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:05,800 Speaker 1: superstar of somebody, say like Steph Curry's caliber. Steph was 148 00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:09,200 Speaker 1: pretty revealing in what he said, which was basically that 149 00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:13,240 Speaker 1: I only want to compete for championships. If the goal 150 00:08:13,280 --> 00:08:15,720 Speaker 1: is not winning championship, and I don't want to be here. 151 00:08:15,920 --> 00:08:19,800 Speaker 1: But if you're like, what are options? What makes sense? 152 00:08:20,040 --> 00:08:24,760 Speaker 1: What's realistic? Also a rational person, I understand like best 153 00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:28,200 Speaker 1: elite works a certain way. You can't just wave go 154 00:08:28,320 --> 00:08:31,680 Speaker 1: on and things are gonna go your way, Like that 155 00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:34,559 Speaker 1: can't be the expectation. Steph Curry is there for one 156 00:08:34,559 --> 00:08:37,800 Speaker 1: purpose alone, so is Draymond Green and Clay Thompson. Now 157 00:08:37,800 --> 00:08:40,400 Speaker 1: that he's back, you know what the agenda is for 158 00:08:40,440 --> 00:08:42,920 Speaker 1: this team right now, and so everything has to be 159 00:08:42,960 --> 00:08:45,880 Speaker 1: funneled towards that. And so the conversation that I think 160 00:08:45,920 --> 00:08:48,400 Speaker 1: that Steph and Draymond and Clay too, probably had to 161 00:08:48,400 --> 00:08:51,360 Speaker 1: have with management was well, if you can't get us 162 00:08:51,679 --> 00:08:54,720 Speaker 1: immediate help by flipping these picks, now that you've used them, 163 00:08:54,760 --> 00:08:57,280 Speaker 1: what is our plan? What is our path? Like we're 164 00:08:57,280 --> 00:09:00,559 Speaker 1: asking now and what we have, there's a great oportunity 165 00:09:00,600 --> 00:09:05,719 Speaker 1: to develop and maintain this core that we've done. They 166 00:09:05,760 --> 00:09:07,960 Speaker 1: just gave it a shot, and then you kind of 167 00:09:08,040 --> 00:09:11,440 Speaker 1: ride that wave until the signs say, you know, do 168 00:09:11,559 --> 00:09:14,200 Speaker 1: something different. So I'm sorry to have to go who 169 00:09:14,360 --> 00:09:17,120 Speaker 1: and do what we can do it make it work. 170 00:09:17,800 --> 00:09:21,680 Speaker 1: And I think any concerns that the players had have 171 00:09:21,840 --> 00:09:24,440 Speaker 1: probably been calmed by a couple of things. One that 172 00:09:24,480 --> 00:09:27,959 Speaker 1: they've been fantastic this season without having needed to cash 173 00:09:28,000 --> 00:09:33,400 Speaker 1: out Moody Comingo Wiseman for veterans, Jordan Pool making this leap. 174 00:09:33,760 --> 00:09:37,280 Speaker 1: Andrew Wiggins, who, like with Dangel Russell in the first place, 175 00:09:37,280 --> 00:09:39,480 Speaker 1: we was just kind of a flyer. The Warriors knew 176 00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:41,200 Speaker 1: for sure that what they would get. But they've got 177 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:45,880 Speaker 1: this wonderful, much more polished version, now matured, refined version 178 00:09:45,880 --> 00:09:48,080 Speaker 1: of Andrew Wiggins, and he now feels kind of essential 179 00:09:48,080 --> 00:09:50,480 Speaker 1: to them. And then behind all of that, and it's 180 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:53,360 Speaker 1: a kind of an important point. I absolutely believe John 181 00:09:54,080 --> 00:09:55,880 Speaker 1: more than believe that if the Warriors had had the 182 00:09:55,880 --> 00:09:59,199 Speaker 1: opportunity to trade some combination of young players and picks 183 00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:01,920 Speaker 1: for in mediate help, especially all star help, they would 184 00:10:01,960 --> 00:10:05,199 Speaker 1: have those deals weren't there. And by the way, if 185 00:10:05,240 --> 00:10:09,120 Speaker 1: a deal presents itself tomorrow, that might cost them one 186 00:10:09,120 --> 00:10:11,120 Speaker 1: of those young guys that they're so high on. And 187 00:10:11,160 --> 00:10:15,080 Speaker 1: they're are saying our our future, our post Steph Clay 188 00:10:15,240 --> 00:10:18,319 Speaker 1: Draymond future. It could still happen. I don't think it's 189 00:10:18,360 --> 00:10:23,960 Speaker 1: going to We could still happen. But despite all of this, Howard, 190 00:10:24,000 --> 00:10:26,560 Speaker 1: all these different moving parts that are sort of swirling 191 00:10:26,559 --> 00:10:28,520 Speaker 1: around all the things that happened to them and didn't 192 00:10:28,520 --> 00:10:32,240 Speaker 1: happen to them by circumstance, they find themselves in this 193 00:10:32,480 --> 00:10:37,280 Speaker 1: intersection of what you exactly described, playing well now while 194 00:10:37,320 --> 00:10:40,880 Speaker 1: also looking at the future, and the degree of difficulty 195 00:10:41,360 --> 00:10:43,240 Speaker 1: on rebuilding on the fly is through the roof. And 196 00:10:43,280 --> 00:10:45,920 Speaker 1: we know that because it's never really happened before. As 197 00:10:45,920 --> 00:10:47,559 Speaker 1: you mentioned in the piece, the last time that it 198 00:10:47,840 --> 00:10:51,520 Speaker 1: was even tried really was during the Lakers aboarded trade 199 00:10:51,880 --> 00:10:54,920 Speaker 1: for Chris Paul, which the league overruled. So to put 200 00:10:54,960 --> 00:10:58,520 Speaker 1: it in historical context, how unique is what the Warriors 201 00:10:58,559 --> 00:11:01,280 Speaker 1: are attempting. If they pull it off, it's the first 202 00:11:01,280 --> 00:11:04,160 Speaker 1: of its kind. Right, teams generally crash and burn for 203 00:11:04,240 --> 00:11:08,680 Speaker 1: the obvious reasons. Superstar late in teams that win championships 204 00:11:08,679 --> 00:11:10,800 Speaker 1: tend to be older. They've got to run in them. 205 00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:12,680 Speaker 1: Maybe it's three years, maybe it's five, maybe it's seven. 206 00:11:12,679 --> 00:11:14,920 Speaker 1: But the end of it, they're old and they break down, 207 00:11:15,040 --> 00:11:17,040 Speaker 1: and you don't usually trade those guys in their prime, 208 00:11:17,720 --> 00:11:22,160 Speaker 1: so you don't have high value, high talent prospects to develop. 209 00:11:22,440 --> 00:11:25,559 Speaker 1: But the Warriors do now. And that's the part that's 210 00:11:25,600 --> 00:11:29,760 Speaker 1: so incredibly unique. Partially by just circumstances and misfortune, they 211 00:11:29,800 --> 00:11:32,400 Speaker 1: ended up drafting high because they were bad for a 212 00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:35,720 Speaker 1: couple of years because of injuries. But they still have 213 00:11:36,240 --> 00:11:39,880 Speaker 1: Steph and Clay and Draymond who are still in some 214 00:11:39,920 --> 00:11:42,440 Speaker 1: semblance of their prime. It may not be it's not 215 00:11:42,480 --> 00:11:44,120 Speaker 1: their early prime, it's not their mid prime. I think 216 00:11:44,120 --> 00:11:45,920 Speaker 1: it's kind of late prime, if I'm just making up 217 00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:48,920 Speaker 1: terms on the fly. But those are guys who are 218 00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:52,520 Speaker 1: still capable of carrying a team to a championship. So 219 00:11:53,120 --> 00:11:55,520 Speaker 1: what the Warriors are doing is still unique. They are 220 00:11:55,559 --> 00:11:58,520 Speaker 1: a team that has won three championships, in recent history, 221 00:11:58,559 --> 00:12:00,679 Speaker 1: that is only a couple of years removed, almost now 222 00:12:00,720 --> 00:12:03,400 Speaker 1: three years removed from their last finals, that still has 223 00:12:03,440 --> 00:12:06,240 Speaker 1: their core, and that is developing what we think might 224 00:12:06,280 --> 00:12:09,120 Speaker 1: be their next core. I want the Warriors to be 225 00:12:09,200 --> 00:12:11,880 Speaker 1: great for the next fifteen years. And I'm not going 226 00:12:11,960 --> 00:12:13,839 Speaker 1: to be the coach here for the next fifteen years, 227 00:12:14,400 --> 00:12:17,120 Speaker 1: but I want the franchise to do well. I love Bob, 228 00:12:17,160 --> 00:12:19,240 Speaker 1: I love Joe, I love the front off. I want 229 00:12:19,400 --> 00:12:24,520 Speaker 1: this franchise to be successful for a long time. Um. 230 00:12:24,559 --> 00:12:27,360 Speaker 1: And so if that means that we grow the next 231 00:12:27,440 --> 00:12:30,040 Speaker 1: core right now over the next two years with this 232 00:12:30,120 --> 00:12:32,880 Speaker 1: team and they end up taking over the team and 233 00:12:32,880 --> 00:12:36,040 Speaker 1: the team is great for the next ten years, I'd 234 00:12:36,040 --> 00:12:38,559 Speaker 1: be awesome. I would love that. In the NBA, those 235 00:12:38,559 --> 00:12:40,840 Speaker 1: of us who have covered the league, we talk a 236 00:12:40,840 --> 00:12:43,360 Speaker 1: lot about heat culture, right, That's sort of like a 237 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:47,160 Speaker 1: fun cliche that we all bandy about. But what role 238 00:12:47,240 --> 00:12:50,440 Speaker 1: do you think Kerr and Warriors culture has played in 239 00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:53,800 Speaker 1: being able to pull this off. I think it's a 240 00:12:53,880 --> 00:12:56,080 Speaker 1: huge part of it. John. And one of the interesting 241 00:12:56,120 --> 00:12:59,319 Speaker 1: things about while I was reporting this story was that 242 00:12:59,400 --> 00:13:02,160 Speaker 1: I was acting to find more of like the process 243 00:13:02,280 --> 00:13:04,320 Speaker 1: part of what they were going to do to develop Kuminga, 244 00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:08,480 Speaker 1: Moody Weiseman, what are the mechanics of that? But it's 245 00:13:08,520 --> 00:13:12,400 Speaker 1: as much about warriors culture as it is about teaching them, 246 00:13:12,679 --> 00:13:15,040 Speaker 1: you know, post up drills. And when we talk about 247 00:13:15,080 --> 00:13:17,440 Speaker 1: Warriors culture, a lot of that I think is the 248 00:13:17,520 --> 00:13:20,080 Speaker 1: humanity of Bob Meyers and Steve Kerr and their approach 249 00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:23,280 Speaker 1: to this game and this business. I think they've got 250 00:13:23,280 --> 00:13:26,400 Speaker 1: a very human touch. These are guys with high emotional 251 00:13:26,400 --> 00:13:29,199 Speaker 1: intelligence and the kind of organization that we'll talk about 252 00:13:29,360 --> 00:13:32,320 Speaker 1: emotional intelligence. What don't we always hear the Warriors talking 253 00:13:32,320 --> 00:13:34,079 Speaker 1: about joy, the joy of playing with stuff, the joy 254 00:13:34,120 --> 00:13:36,760 Speaker 1: of watching stuff, the joyfulness of the Warriors, So to 255 00:13:36,840 --> 00:13:39,400 Speaker 1: the extent that Steve Kerr and Steph Curry and these 256 00:13:39,440 --> 00:13:43,400 Speaker 1: guys exude that, that's the environment that Wiseman and Moody 257 00:13:43,559 --> 00:13:47,000 Speaker 1: and Komena are learning in. They're getting to learn how 258 00:13:47,000 --> 00:13:49,000 Speaker 1: to win from guys who have done it at the 259 00:13:49,080 --> 00:13:53,600 Speaker 1: highest level. And I'm glad you brought up the joy component, Howard, 260 00:13:53,640 --> 00:13:56,480 Speaker 1: because this team this year has been full of surprises. 261 00:13:56,480 --> 00:13:58,920 Speaker 1: I don't think anybody expected them to be this good 262 00:13:59,520 --> 00:14:02,480 Speaker 1: this sea reason. But beyond that, they reminded me that 263 00:14:02,520 --> 00:14:05,880 Speaker 1: there was a time before they were inevitable where it 264 00:14:05,960 --> 00:14:08,320 Speaker 1: was fun to watch the Warriors. It was fun to 265 00:14:08,360 --> 00:14:13,440 Speaker 1: watch Steph Curry. Basketball is entertainment, right, and they have 266 00:14:13,520 --> 00:14:15,680 Speaker 1: been some of the best entertainers in the league for 267 00:14:15,720 --> 00:14:18,720 Speaker 1: a long time now and now are again. The worst 268 00:14:18,760 --> 00:14:21,720 Speaker 1: thing possible is a feeling of inevitability. You don't want 269 00:14:21,720 --> 00:14:23,360 Speaker 1: the mystery to go out of it, right, You want 270 00:14:23,360 --> 00:14:25,800 Speaker 1: there to be some sense of suspense. And for a 271 00:14:25,800 --> 00:14:28,000 Speaker 1: while there we just knew it was gonna be Warriors 272 00:14:28,080 --> 00:14:31,440 Speaker 1: versus Lebron every year. Sure, it resulted in some great finals, 273 00:14:31,640 --> 00:14:34,520 Speaker 1: and I think the ratings were probably bonkers and everything else, 274 00:14:34,600 --> 00:14:39,040 Speaker 1: but was it as much fun. So they're fresh again now, right, 275 00:14:39,440 --> 00:14:42,280 Speaker 1: Durant is gone. They're no longer the evil Empire. They've 276 00:14:42,320 --> 00:14:45,640 Speaker 1: had to go through some stuff. They've had injuries, they've 277 00:14:45,720 --> 00:14:49,040 Speaker 1: been bad, they've been humbled, and so I think they're 278 00:14:49,200 --> 00:14:52,240 Speaker 1: they're kind of cuddly again, right. That gets they're they're 279 00:14:52,280 --> 00:14:55,120 Speaker 1: almost they are almost underdogs, even with the record that 280 00:14:55,120 --> 00:14:57,520 Speaker 1: they've got and the season that they've had there they 281 00:14:57,560 --> 00:15:00,440 Speaker 1: almost feel like underdogs where they're they're they're kind of 282 00:15:00,520 --> 00:15:03,440 Speaker 1: rising out of the ashes. And I do I think 283 00:15:03,440 --> 00:15:07,640 Speaker 1: it's made them more embraceable again, more embraceable, cuddly, more fun. 284 00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:09,760 Speaker 1: All these words that you're using bring to mind a 285 00:15:09,800 --> 00:15:18,600 Speaker 1: guy that they recently got back, Clay Thompson. Right now, 286 00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:25,560 Speaker 1: there is a season out of loss. It a state university, 287 00:15:27,040 --> 00:15:37,200 Speaker 1: Leonard col Thomson. Whether or not you're a Warriors fan, 288 00:15:37,320 --> 00:15:40,160 Speaker 1: it's hard not to like Clay Thompson, you and I 289 00:15:40,280 --> 00:15:43,520 Speaker 1: having interacted with him in our professional capacity, but certainly 290 00:15:43,560 --> 00:15:46,840 Speaker 1: he's quirky, he's he definitely marches to his own beat. 291 00:15:47,080 --> 00:15:49,120 Speaker 1: And now having him back and folding him not just 292 00:15:49,280 --> 00:15:51,720 Speaker 1: into what he can do on the court, but that 293 00:15:51,800 --> 00:15:54,440 Speaker 1: culture that we talk about with the Warriors and sort 294 00:15:54,480 --> 00:15:57,160 Speaker 1: of making it light and easy, and Clay doesn't really 295 00:15:57,200 --> 00:16:00,280 Speaker 1: sweat the small stuff. So having that fine an old 296 00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:02,640 Speaker 1: cherry on top of the fun Sunday is is one 297 00:16:02,680 --> 00:16:05,840 Speaker 1: more positive for the Warriors this season. As much as 298 00:16:05,840 --> 00:16:07,720 Speaker 1: we talked about Steph Curry, this was it was about 299 00:16:07,760 --> 00:16:10,000 Speaker 1: the Splash Brothers, right It's about the best shooting backcourt 300 00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:12,520 Speaker 1: in the history of the game. As Mark Jackson correctly 301 00:16:13,240 --> 00:16:15,960 Speaker 1: proclaimed once upon a time before any of us were 302 00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:18,960 Speaker 1: ready to accept that, well, I's hyping his own guys, 303 00:16:18,960 --> 00:16:22,360 Speaker 1: it's a little hyperbolic. No, he was absolutely right. Clay 304 00:16:22,400 --> 00:16:24,400 Speaker 1: Thompson would probably be the best shooter in NBA history 305 00:16:24,440 --> 00:16:25,960 Speaker 1: if it worked. For the fact that he's playing next 306 00:16:25,960 --> 00:16:28,600 Speaker 1: to the best shooter in NBA history. Claytompson has never 307 00:16:28,600 --> 00:16:32,200 Speaker 1: been below from three in a full season is in 308 00:16:32,240 --> 00:16:35,720 Speaker 1: his NBA career, and there is something else about him 309 00:16:35,760 --> 00:16:38,560 Speaker 1: that just sheen of cool. Because he is so inflammable, 310 00:16:38,600 --> 00:16:41,640 Speaker 1: because he is so copacetic at all times, and because 311 00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:44,360 Speaker 1: he's got that beautiful shot, and because he's likely to 312 00:16:44,720 --> 00:16:47,440 Speaker 1: erupt for maybe ten threes in a quarter or something, 313 00:16:47,840 --> 00:16:50,600 Speaker 1: and because of his defense as important as anything to 314 00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:52,920 Speaker 1: the part that we always overlook with the Warriors that 315 00:16:53,160 --> 00:16:55,560 Speaker 1: you know, here's this guy who could defend the best 316 00:16:55,560 --> 00:16:58,880 Speaker 1: perimeter player on the opponent every night, and so having 317 00:16:58,960 --> 00:17:01,560 Speaker 1: him back is what really makes the Warriors whole. I 318 00:17:01,600 --> 00:17:04,720 Speaker 1: think the really fascinating part of this season is that 319 00:17:04,760 --> 00:17:07,000 Speaker 1: we started at saying, you know, the Warriors might be 320 00:17:07,080 --> 00:17:09,840 Speaker 1: contenders again when Clay gets back, and if Clay is Clay, 321 00:17:09,920 --> 00:17:12,879 Speaker 1: and it turns out the Warriors were already back before 322 00:17:12,880 --> 00:17:15,639 Speaker 1: even Clay came back. But I still think it is 323 00:17:15,720 --> 00:17:19,000 Speaker 1: his presence that will convince anybody who might still be 324 00:17:19,080 --> 00:17:22,280 Speaker 1: a little skeptical that this team actually can go back 325 00:17:22,680 --> 00:17:26,720 Speaker 1: and win another title, maybe two, maybe more. We'll see 326 00:17:27,400 --> 00:17:29,920 Speaker 1: the greatest teams, okay, I when you knew their role 327 00:17:30,240 --> 00:17:32,920 Speaker 1: and they played into perfection. So we can be that 328 00:17:33,080 --> 00:17:34,920 Speaker 1: we could be one of the greatest dynasties. And it's 329 00:17:34,960 --> 00:17:38,480 Speaker 1: not over, truly, Bread that that is not over. Yeah, 330 00:17:39,680 --> 00:17:42,920 Speaker 1: Howard Back, you are a one man dynasty, unto yourself. 331 00:17:43,320 --> 00:17:46,360 Speaker 1: Thank you for doing this. It's pleasure, John. Thanks man. 332 00:17:48,880 --> 00:17:51,919 Speaker 1: You can read Howard Beck's articles The Warriors Quest to 333 00:17:51,960 --> 00:17:55,719 Speaker 1: Achieve what other Dynasties couldn't and The Fire that Burns 334 00:17:55,760 --> 00:17:59,040 Speaker 1: Inside Clay Thompson on SI dot com. We'll link to 335 00:17:59,080 --> 00:18:02,000 Speaker 1: the pieces on our show notes when we come back. 336 00:18:02,280 --> 00:18:06,719 Speaker 1: Executive editor John Wortheim on The Ageless Tom Brady. Brady 337 00:18:06,800 --> 00:18:10,480 Speaker 1: really speaks his mind, including some coarse language, so be advised. 338 00:18:15,680 --> 00:18:18,920 Speaker 1: I imagine not playing and I imagine he watching football 339 00:18:18,920 --> 00:18:22,639 Speaker 1: on Sunday gone, and these guys suck. I mean I 340 00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:25,800 Speaker 1: could do way better than that, and then still knowing 341 00:18:25,800 --> 00:18:28,320 Speaker 1: in my heart that I actually could do it. Tom 342 00:18:28,359 --> 00:18:31,560 Speaker 1: Brady certainly doesn't lack for confidence. There's a reason why 343 00:18:31,560 --> 00:18:34,679 Speaker 1: the Buccaneers quarterback is the goat. He's been doing this 344 00:18:34,760 --> 00:18:37,359 Speaker 1: better than his peers for longer than his peers or 345 00:18:37,400 --> 00:18:40,600 Speaker 1: anyone else could have imagined. And as his conversation with 346 00:18:40,680 --> 00:18:44,520 Speaker 1: John Wortheim reveals, that longevity has not only made him 347 00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:48,240 Speaker 1: a seven times Super Bowl champion, it's granted him perspective 348 00:18:48,359 --> 00:18:51,399 Speaker 1: on his endless achievements and how he's changed over the 349 00:18:51,440 --> 00:18:59,920 Speaker 1: course of his lengthy career. So, John, it sometimes feels 350 00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:02,399 Speaker 1: Tom Brady has always been in our lives. He was 351 00:19:02,480 --> 00:19:05,159 Speaker 1: recently named s I Sports Person of the Year, and 352 00:19:05,200 --> 00:19:07,920 Speaker 1: it's the second time he's won it. The first time 353 00:19:08,160 --> 00:19:12,040 Speaker 1: was somehow sixteen years ago, which seems impossible. How much 354 00:19:12,200 --> 00:19:15,800 Speaker 1: different is he now from the person he was back 355 00:19:15,840 --> 00:19:18,919 Speaker 1: then in two thousand and five. It's funny you say that. 356 00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:21,439 Speaker 1: I mean, we're jokingly he's he's been in our lives forever, 357 00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:24,520 Speaker 1: it seems. And here's what for a frame majority of 358 00:19:24,560 --> 00:19:28,280 Speaker 1: the world's population. That actually is true, the majority of 359 00:19:28,320 --> 00:19:30,840 Speaker 1: people on Earth, they are younger than Tom Brady is. 360 00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:33,320 Speaker 1: But yeah, I mean, I think some of this is 361 00:19:33,320 --> 00:19:36,560 Speaker 1: obviously personal. When he won the award the first time, 362 00:19:36,680 --> 00:19:39,280 Speaker 1: he was unmarried, he was in his twenties he was 363 00:19:39,280 --> 00:19:42,440 Speaker 1: a New England Patriot. But I also think he really 364 00:19:42,480 --> 00:19:47,200 Speaker 1: sort of leans into this personal growth dimension. I think 365 00:19:47,240 --> 00:19:49,600 Speaker 1: I'm I'm wise beyond my years. I think I've had 366 00:19:49,600 --> 00:19:51,960 Speaker 1: a lot of life experience packed into forty four years. 367 00:19:52,240 --> 00:19:53,600 Speaker 1: You know, I feel twenty five when I'm in the 368 00:19:53,600 --> 00:19:55,840 Speaker 1: locker room with the guys, which is probably why I 369 00:19:55,920 --> 00:19:57,399 Speaker 1: still do it, you know, because I still feel like 370 00:19:57,400 --> 00:19:59,920 Speaker 1: a high school kid in the locker room with my buddies. 371 00:20:00,480 --> 00:20:02,240 Speaker 1: And then when I leave that, I feel like, all right, 372 00:20:02,320 --> 00:20:04,520 Speaker 1: you know, there's other things with more perspective that I 373 00:20:04,560 --> 00:20:07,040 Speaker 1: think I can accomplish, and there's things beyond football that 374 00:20:07,080 --> 00:20:11,840 Speaker 1: I want to accomplish. He would tell you that philosophically, 375 00:20:11,960 --> 00:20:13,879 Speaker 1: he has a much different person than he was sixteen 376 00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:17,720 Speaker 1: years ago, and certainly from when he was drafted, when uh, 377 00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:21,800 Speaker 1: here's the chubby quarterback from Michigan with the laughable combine 378 00:20:22,000 --> 00:20:26,040 Speaker 1: empiricals who has transformed himself into the greatest of all time. 379 00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:28,800 Speaker 1: For most people at this point, John it would be 380 00:20:28,800 --> 00:20:32,040 Speaker 1: a downslope, but Tom Brady is still performing really well. 381 00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:35,240 Speaker 1: He does. He spend much time reflecting on the fact 382 00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:37,320 Speaker 1: that he is still doing this at such a high level. 383 00:20:38,000 --> 00:20:40,919 Speaker 1: I think initially age was an annoyance to him, and 384 00:20:40,920 --> 00:20:42,880 Speaker 1: he would be in his late thirties and they would say, well, 385 00:20:42,880 --> 00:20:45,560 Speaker 1: you know you're you're older than Joe Montana was and 386 00:20:45,640 --> 00:20:48,439 Speaker 1: Dan Marino and the other great quarterbacks had retired by 387 00:20:48,440 --> 00:20:50,640 Speaker 1: this point. And I think at some point he really 388 00:20:50,640 --> 00:20:53,679 Speaker 1: started to embrace it, and he realized that there was 389 00:20:53,800 --> 00:20:57,439 Speaker 1: this inspirational component commercial pilots who said, well, I was 390 00:20:57,480 --> 00:20:59,760 Speaker 1: going to retire, but then I figured I'd pullo Brady. 391 00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:02,479 Speaker 1: I think he realized that there was real sort of 392 00:21:02,920 --> 00:21:05,760 Speaker 1: I don't overstated, it's real sort of spiritual value. I 393 00:21:05,760 --> 00:21:09,159 Speaker 1: think he's really sort of leaned into this and what 394 00:21:09,320 --> 00:21:12,520 Speaker 1: had once been Listen, this is an indelicate topic. I 395 00:21:12,560 --> 00:21:14,720 Speaker 1: just want to keep going. I think he really takes 396 00:21:14,720 --> 00:21:17,240 Speaker 1: a great deal of pride in not Yeah, it's interesting 397 00:21:17,240 --> 00:21:19,800 Speaker 1: that you mentioned that, probably because sometimes athletes are sensitive 398 00:21:19,840 --> 00:21:22,720 Speaker 1: about their age. And when an athlete wins sports Person 399 00:21:22,760 --> 00:21:25,359 Speaker 1: of the Year, there's this awards banquet and Gronk was 400 00:21:25,359 --> 00:21:28,640 Speaker 1: tasked with introing Brady's speech, and he really roasts him 401 00:21:28,720 --> 00:21:32,119 Speaker 1: for being old. He's actually old enough to be my grandpa. 402 00:21:32,520 --> 00:21:35,400 Speaker 1: He's been playing football since this award started in nineteen 403 00:21:35,520 --> 00:21:41,080 Speaker 1: fifty four. Truly incredible, and I would almost expect, maybe previously, 404 00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:44,560 Speaker 1: for Brady to sort of ignore that or pivot on it, 405 00:21:44,600 --> 00:21:46,879 Speaker 1: and instead he really leans into it in this self 406 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:50,240 Speaker 1: deprecating way. It seems like he's almost having more fun 407 00:21:50,320 --> 00:21:53,080 Speaker 1: with it now. Back in two thousand and five, when 408 00:21:53,119 --> 00:21:56,159 Speaker 1: I first won this award, I was a fresh faced 409 00:21:56,240 --> 00:21:59,600 Speaker 1: punk with something to prove. I think how far we've 410 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:05,000 Speaker 1: come back. Then Beyonce was still in Destiny's Child. We 411 00:22:05,080 --> 00:22:08,600 Speaker 1: only had two C S I s and only one 412 00:22:09,080 --> 00:22:11,959 Speaker 1: N C I S one. I mean, oh cool, Ja 413 00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:16,600 Speaker 1: was still just a rapper then. Yeah, as he recognizes 414 00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:19,160 Speaker 1: the absurdity that that guys are starting to come into 415 00:22:19,160 --> 00:22:22,440 Speaker 1: the league that we're born when he was drafted, and 416 00:22:22,520 --> 00:22:24,960 Speaker 1: you just sort of run through the math a dozen 417 00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:27,879 Speaker 1: head coaches that are younger than he is and people 418 00:22:27,960 --> 00:22:30,080 Speaker 1: I remember watching you when I was in second grade. 419 00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:32,159 Speaker 1: You won your first Super Bowl, and I think it 420 00:22:32,320 --> 00:22:35,080 Speaker 1: sort of moved from this point of Sin's indelicate to 421 00:22:35,119 --> 00:22:38,160 Speaker 1: talk about age two. I may as well just laugh 422 00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:41,600 Speaker 1: with everybody else. John, I'm not a Brady evangelist for 423 00:22:41,640 --> 00:22:44,919 Speaker 1: reasons of background and geography that we'll get into but 424 00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:47,480 Speaker 1: we have an interesting perspective on all of this. Both 425 00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:50,440 Speaker 1: you and I are in our forties and Brady is 426 00:22:50,480 --> 00:22:52,879 Speaker 1: forty four, and for all the records and accomplishments for 427 00:22:52,920 --> 00:22:55,159 Speaker 1: all of his titles, I think his longevity might be 428 00:22:55,200 --> 00:22:58,680 Speaker 1: the biggest accomplishment of all. I have to fact check 429 00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:02,040 Speaker 1: that and concede as this pains me. I've I've recently 430 00:23:02,119 --> 00:23:05,560 Speaker 1: left the forties demographic. It's a sort of topic. But 431 00:23:06,400 --> 00:23:07,880 Speaker 1: some of what I think he's looking to do after 432 00:23:07,920 --> 00:23:12,040 Speaker 1: football probably ties to anti aging and longer living and 433 00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:15,439 Speaker 1: quality of life. So I think there's a transactional strand 434 00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:18,040 Speaker 1: to all of this. But I think he recognizes that 435 00:23:18,440 --> 00:23:21,640 Speaker 1: we love geniuses, right, We love precocious. We love the 436 00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:24,359 Speaker 1: tennis player that just won the US Open is eighteen 437 00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:26,320 Speaker 1: years old. She should be in high school, but instead 438 00:23:26,400 --> 00:23:28,280 Speaker 1: she was making millions of dollars. We we love sort 439 00:23:28,280 --> 00:23:30,240 Speaker 1: of the low end, but we love the Betty White 440 00:23:30,800 --> 00:23:33,960 Speaker 1: high end as well. The longevity thing, though, has sort 441 00:23:33,960 --> 00:23:35,439 Speaker 1: of a flip side to it. It's kind of like 442 00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:39,360 Speaker 1: the Batman line about dying the hero or living long 443 00:23:39,480 --> 00:23:42,000 Speaker 1: enough to see yourself become the villain. And I think 444 00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:45,040 Speaker 1: for a lot of people. Tom Brady has been, you know, 445 00:23:45,080 --> 00:23:48,040 Speaker 1: a chief foil at the Philadelphian enemy certainly has him 446 00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:51,280 Speaker 1: on a mental dartboard. Does he think about that ripple 447 00:23:51,280 --> 00:23:53,639 Speaker 1: effect of his success? Does he mind playing the foil 448 00:23:53,720 --> 00:23:55,080 Speaker 1: or is it's sort of a badge of honor in 449 00:23:55,119 --> 00:23:58,320 Speaker 1: some ways? He didn't really bite on the question, but 450 00:23:58,359 --> 00:24:00,880 Speaker 1: he kind of did talk him. You feel like you're 451 00:24:00,880 --> 00:24:03,760 Speaker 1: talking to another peer and there's no sense of this 452 00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:07,320 Speaker 1: is a star athlete who's coming with these prepackaged lines 453 00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:10,240 Speaker 1: or these media traits and kind of reading between the lines. 454 00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:12,280 Speaker 1: I feel like part of the joy of going to 455 00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:15,520 Speaker 1: Tampa is no one hates the Buccaneers the way they 456 00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:17,800 Speaker 1: hate the Patriots. And I think the fact that Tom 457 00:24:17,840 --> 00:24:21,239 Speaker 1: Brady has enjoyed this bumping popularity is something that he 458 00:24:21,359 --> 00:24:25,720 Speaker 1: definitely senses. The peer component is interesting to me because 459 00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:29,520 Speaker 1: sometimes athletes of his stature can be fussy interview subjects. 460 00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:31,359 Speaker 1: And I got the sense from you that he was 461 00:24:31,640 --> 00:24:34,960 Speaker 1: surprisingly the opposite, that he was even responsive when you 462 00:24:35,040 --> 00:24:38,120 Speaker 1: reached out to him after a loss. Right, I spoke 463 00:24:38,119 --> 00:24:40,080 Speaker 1: to him, I don't you remember the Buccaneers had a 464 00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:43,560 Speaker 1: rough game against Washington. It was not Tom Brady's finest game, 465 00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:46,360 Speaker 1: as he was quick to admit, and people were joking like, oh, 466 00:24:46,359 --> 00:24:49,000 Speaker 1: you've been a reschedule and you're gonna get one word answers. 467 00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:51,640 Speaker 1: And I texted him and said, just to be clear here, 468 00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:54,720 Speaker 1: this is an award about your achievements in one I 469 00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:57,600 Speaker 1: don't I don't give a ship what happened, uh Sundays 470 00:24:57,680 --> 00:25:00,480 Speaker 1: And there was like no problem, buddy of color, any 471 00:25:00,560 --> 00:25:03,240 Speaker 1: problems getting to the site. Let me know, this is 472 00:25:03,280 --> 00:25:05,600 Speaker 1: sort of all the candor and all the warmth and 473 00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:07,800 Speaker 1: personality that he may have had to suppress a little 474 00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:09,720 Speaker 1: bit of New England is now coming out at age 475 00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:13,840 Speaker 1: forty four. That's amazing that he was so responsive so quickly. 476 00:25:13,840 --> 00:25:15,760 Speaker 1: Are you guys still in touch? Are you, you know, 477 00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:18,480 Speaker 1: planning a sleepover? Maybe you'll build a forward out of 478 00:25:18,480 --> 00:25:21,440 Speaker 1: the couch cushions. What's the relationship like? Now he's got 479 00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:26,040 Speaker 1: the the inflatable bouncy castle and the no he um. 480 00:25:26,320 --> 00:25:28,080 Speaker 1: It's funny. I mean, you know, I had interviewed him 481 00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:30,239 Speaker 1: a few times through the years. I think he's at 482 00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:32,840 Speaker 1: a point where, first of all, I think things may 483 00:25:32,880 --> 00:25:36,120 Speaker 1: have been so constricted and restricted in New England that 484 00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:38,320 Speaker 1: now he had had a chance to be a little 485 00:25:38,320 --> 00:25:41,480 Speaker 1: bit more out there. Tell me if I'm wrong. It 486 00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:44,800 Speaker 1: seems like we're getting more Tom Brady in the last year. 487 00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:48,639 Speaker 1: Uh here you were seeing you you seem Yeah, I 488 00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:51,000 Speaker 1: feel like I putt yourself out there a little more naturally. 489 00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:54,479 Speaker 1: I'd say, I'm very introverted. You know, I'm rediscovering, you know, 490 00:25:54,560 --> 00:25:56,919 Speaker 1: my voice, and and I'm having fune with it. And 491 00:25:56,960 --> 00:25:59,520 Speaker 1: I think there's more comfortable just that as an older 492 00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:02,639 Speaker 1: guy too. You know, there's might give a ship levels 493 00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:06,320 Speaker 1: probably a lot less, probably a lot more ten years. 494 00:26:06,320 --> 00:26:08,280 Speaker 1: So now I'm kind of like a little Okay, what's 495 00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:09,800 Speaker 1: gonna make ten years? So I'm really not going to 496 00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:12,760 Speaker 1: give a ship. Then he just doesn't give us sh it. 497 00:26:12,800 --> 00:26:14,320 Speaker 1: I mean, I'll talk to who I want to talk to, 498 00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:16,920 Speaker 1: and I won't who I won't, and I'll figure out 499 00:26:16,920 --> 00:26:18,960 Speaker 1: a way to bend time if I have to bend time. 500 00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:21,000 Speaker 1: You get to feel like he's sort of like a 501 00:26:21,080 --> 00:26:24,359 Speaker 1: rum Springer, right, He's like he's having this second life 502 00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:27,879 Speaker 1: as a public figure. Sometimes we do still see this 503 00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:30,720 Speaker 1: sort of old careful Tom Brady. We got a little 504 00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:33,240 Speaker 1: bit of that with the Antonio Brown situation, which he 505 00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:35,199 Speaker 1: didn't really address how he and the team and had 506 00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:38,320 Speaker 1: enabled Brown. As our colleague Gary Grambling wrote, what did 507 00:26:38,359 --> 00:26:42,080 Speaker 1: you make of how Brady handled that situation? I think 508 00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:43,960 Speaker 1: you pretty much nailed it. I mean, I do get 509 00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:47,639 Speaker 1: the feeling that everything is in service of football, right, 510 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,960 Speaker 1: Everything is just maximizing. Everything he does is to optimize 511 00:26:52,280 --> 00:26:54,600 Speaker 1: his success as a football players, a forty four year 512 00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:58,080 Speaker 1: old football player. It's got to be a daily commitment. 513 00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:03,880 Speaker 1: You know, I bring water everywhere, So it's just I mean, yeah, 514 00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:06,200 Speaker 1: that's a part of a commitment. I love that commitment. 515 00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:08,359 Speaker 1: It's not that's no problem, and that part's easy. You know, 516 00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:10,560 Speaker 1: it's all pretty easy at this point. It's just effort. 517 00:27:11,080 --> 00:27:13,600 Speaker 1: It's not like it's hard. It's just I gotta do it. 518 00:27:14,280 --> 00:27:16,199 Speaker 1: If he goes on Howard Stern, if he goes on 519 00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:19,239 Speaker 1: Dax Shepherd, what's the worst thing that could happen? If 520 00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:21,639 Speaker 1: he's sitting there in an NFL locker room and something 521 00:27:21,720 --> 00:27:24,679 Speaker 1: he says can be misconstrued or be a distraction for 522 00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:27,680 Speaker 1: the team. I think that's a little different. Did Tom 523 00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:30,680 Speaker 1: Brady probably get off pretty easily in terms of accountability 524 00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:33,080 Speaker 1: with Antonio Brown? I think you could make that case 525 00:27:33,359 --> 00:27:36,639 Speaker 1: but I also think that everything this guy does is 526 00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:40,520 Speaker 1: in service of winning football games, and that means taking 527 00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:42,840 Speaker 1: Antonio Brown in and having him stay at your house, 528 00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:46,960 Speaker 1: and when Antonio Brown betrays that, backing up from it 529 00:27:47,119 --> 00:27:52,560 Speaker 1: and really minimizing and diffusing any controversy. Yeah. I think 530 00:27:52,560 --> 00:27:56,120 Speaker 1: the way that he's managed the perception of himself has 531 00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:59,080 Speaker 1: changed and evolved. He's got all these side hustles that 532 00:27:59,160 --> 00:28:01,199 Speaker 1: I wanted to talk to you about. He's got the 533 00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:04,760 Speaker 1: TV twelve method in these commercials for Subway in various companies, 534 00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:07,000 Speaker 1: and I know he avoids nightshades and I think he's 535 00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:09,600 Speaker 1: peaking too avocados or something. Some of it gets used 536 00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:12,440 Speaker 1: for comedic fodder John, but it's also a big deal 537 00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:16,480 Speaker 1: for him now, isn't it? No need shades? God damn it. Um. 538 00:28:16,560 --> 00:28:19,520 Speaker 1: What he has done, I think very savily is he's 539 00:28:19,640 --> 00:28:23,200 Speaker 1: kind of leading the retirees life while he's still active. 540 00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:26,320 Speaker 1: When he's not playing football, he's on zoom calls, he's 541 00:28:26,359 --> 00:28:29,040 Speaker 1: meeting with investors. This is not just some I'm slapping 542 00:28:29,040 --> 00:28:30,800 Speaker 1: my name on a product. And I think what he's 543 00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:33,760 Speaker 1: realizing too, is that it's not enough anymore just to 544 00:28:33,960 --> 00:28:36,800 Speaker 1: be Tom Brady. He has to stand for something. He 545 00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:39,880 Speaker 1: has to have some presents. And so you talk to 546 00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:41,760 Speaker 1: some of his business partners and they say, you would 547 00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:44,120 Speaker 1: not believe the level of detail. And we'll send him 548 00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:47,080 Speaker 1: spreadsheets and he'll get back to us. And it's the 549 00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:49,120 Speaker 1: middle of the NFL season and he's jumping on a 550 00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:53,400 Speaker 1: zoom to uh talk about our Q four strategy. Most 551 00:28:53,440 --> 00:28:56,280 Speaker 1: of his income isn't football related these days. He's really 552 00:28:56,280 --> 00:28:59,480 Speaker 1: sort of living this career two point oh life while 553 00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:03,320 Speaker 1: he's still lining up behind center on Sunday. Does he 554 00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:05,520 Speaker 1: have an idea of what comes next? Whether it is 555 00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:08,479 Speaker 1: business or broadcasting or owning a team or politics. I mean, 556 00:29:08,520 --> 00:29:09,880 Speaker 1: do you have a sense of what he's going to 557 00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:12,600 Speaker 1: lean into there? He leaves little down. I don't think 558 00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:15,840 Speaker 1: politics are in his future. He seems very upset by 559 00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:18,960 Speaker 1: the polarized state of our country. Get a whole kind 560 00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:22,920 Speaker 1: of middle aged man riff about social media and why 561 00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:26,520 Speaker 1: are people so nasty? And hopefully we can return to 562 00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:29,800 Speaker 1: mutual respect, Hopefully we can return to kindness. Hopefully we 563 00:29:29,800 --> 00:29:32,640 Speaker 1: can learn to hey, you, I'll respect your opinion. You 564 00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:35,400 Speaker 1: gotta respect my opinion too. And right now it's like, no, 565 00:29:35,480 --> 00:29:37,160 Speaker 1: I don't want to respect your opinion if you don't 566 00:29:37,160 --> 00:29:40,000 Speaker 1: agree with me, which that's a hard way to have relationships. 567 00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:43,200 Speaker 1: All of what you would agree with wholeheartedly, but you 568 00:29:43,240 --> 00:29:46,280 Speaker 1: wouldn't necessarily expect it from Tom Brady. But I think 569 00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:48,640 Speaker 1: he sort of built for these startups. You have a product, 570 00:29:48,640 --> 00:29:50,640 Speaker 1: you go find investments, You sort of moved from phase 571 00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:53,080 Speaker 1: to phase to phase. But I think something like these 572 00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:54,560 Speaker 1: n f T s. I mean it's at one point 573 00:29:54,600 --> 00:29:56,840 Speaker 1: I sort of said, listen, time is finite. We got 574 00:29:56,840 --> 00:29:58,200 Speaker 1: to stop talking about n f T s and we 575 00:29:58,240 --> 00:30:00,720 Speaker 1: gotta get to these questions I I need to ask 576 00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:03,240 Speaker 1: to put together the story. But I think these equity 577 00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:06,440 Speaker 1: stake in companies that could grow, I think that appeals 578 00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:09,920 Speaker 1: to him much more than politics and certainly broadcasting. I 579 00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:12,040 Speaker 1: know that he keeps casting down on this. But eventually, 580 00:30:12,120 --> 00:30:15,520 Speaker 1: John the Man will have to retire. So how much 581 00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:20,160 Speaker 1: longer realistically is he going to play? Um, that's the 582 00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:22,640 Speaker 1: great question. Tom Brady is gonna be forty five years 583 00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:25,800 Speaker 1: old in August, so one knee gives out on him, 584 00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:27,920 Speaker 1: and we may have our answer short of that. I mean, 585 00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:32,320 Speaker 1: I think could he play five more years? Statistically? Yeah? 586 00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:34,200 Speaker 1: Why not? I mean some of this is dependent on 587 00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:36,560 Speaker 1: how much he can handle us mentally, as he has 588 00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:38,840 Speaker 1: children of a certain age and a family, and he says, 589 00:30:38,880 --> 00:30:40,800 Speaker 1: you know, he's he's at this point where there's not 590 00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:43,400 Speaker 1: this win lost symmetry that if you win, it's sort 591 00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:45,680 Speaker 1: of a relief, and if you lose, its brutal. That 592 00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:48,320 Speaker 1: sounds like something you need to confront or it could 593 00:30:48,440 --> 00:30:51,120 Speaker 1: very easily lead to burnout. But could he you know, 594 00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:53,840 Speaker 1: the guy's in the m v P conversation at forty four? 595 00:30:54,360 --> 00:30:57,000 Speaker 1: Is it crazy to think he'll play a few more years? 596 00:30:57,000 --> 00:31:00,400 Speaker 1: I don't think so. If he plays till fifty, that 597 00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:02,880 Speaker 1: would be truly remarkable. And I don't want to say 598 00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:05,200 Speaker 1: that I'm rooting for Tom Brady to play until he's 599 00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:07,640 Speaker 1: fifty because if I said those words, then everybody from 600 00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:11,800 Speaker 1: Philadelphia would disown me. But as he continues this, he 601 00:31:11,920 --> 00:31:14,520 Speaker 1: softens me a little bit. The longer he goes, the 602 00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:17,760 Speaker 1: more I end up liking him against my better judgment. 603 00:31:18,280 --> 00:31:20,760 Speaker 1: So when he is done, is he just gonna wear 604 00:31:20,800 --> 00:31:22,800 Speaker 1: all of us down? I was gonna say, I think 605 00:31:22,800 --> 00:31:26,000 Speaker 1: he's grinding you down. John. Thank god, I'm hearing effect. 606 00:31:26,120 --> 00:31:30,120 Speaker 1: I'm hearing grudging affection. You mentioned the number fifty. I 607 00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:32,440 Speaker 1: think that is not lost on him. I think he's 608 00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:36,680 Speaker 1: someone that finds motivation very easily. But you win seven 609 00:31:36,720 --> 00:31:38,560 Speaker 1: super Bowls and I'm not sure if an eighth is 610 00:31:38,920 --> 00:31:41,760 Speaker 1: the bright shiny toy. But if you say you could 611 00:31:41,760 --> 00:31:44,880 Speaker 1: be a starting NFL quarterback at age fifty, you're gonna 612 00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:48,720 Speaker 1: get an a RP card. You're also going to be 613 00:31:48,800 --> 00:31:51,360 Speaker 1: an NFL quarter starting NFL quarterback. I can see that 614 00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:54,800 Speaker 1: being a source of motivation fair enough. One day. Tom 615 00:31:54,840 --> 00:31:57,880 Speaker 1: Brady will eventually have to hang it up. But John Wortheim, 616 00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:00,800 Speaker 1: we hope you never do. Thanks for doing this. Thanks John, 617 00:32:00,840 --> 00:32:04,160 Speaker 1: that was fun. You can read John Wortheim's excellent piece 618 00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:06,480 Speaker 1: on Tom Brady being named sports Person of the Year 619 00:32:06,640 --> 00:32:09,960 Speaker 1: at s I dot com. After the break, our final 620 00:32:10,040 --> 00:32:12,840 Speaker 1: segment with one of the best offensive linemen in NFL 621 00:32:12,920 --> 00:32:21,800 Speaker 1: history and where it all began for Joe Thomas. All Right, 622 00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:24,479 Speaker 1: we're thrilled to be joined by legendary Brown's offensive lineman, 623 00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:28,160 Speaker 1: now an NFL Network analyst. Joe Thomas, thanks for doing this, 624 00:32:28,840 --> 00:32:30,760 Speaker 1: hey man, thanks for having me on. It's exciting to 625 00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:35,720 Speaker 1: be here and talking about my most fond memories from 626 00:32:35,800 --> 00:32:40,240 Speaker 1: my youth days. Yeah, So along with your NFL Network 627 00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:43,480 Speaker 1: teammate Steve Smith Sr. You guys are responsible really for 628 00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:46,680 Speaker 1: coming up with this idea. We're having a conversation one night, 629 00:32:46,960 --> 00:32:49,280 Speaker 1: and you guys are both thoughtful people, and you were 630 00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:51,360 Speaker 1: asking me how the new job was going, and that 631 00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:54,120 Speaker 1: led to this conversation that I thought was really interesting. 632 00:32:54,160 --> 00:32:55,680 Speaker 1: So I'll sort of teer it up to you the 633 00:32:55,720 --> 00:32:59,080 Speaker 1: way that we discussed it that night. Joe Thomas, tell 634 00:32:59,120 --> 00:33:02,200 Speaker 1: me about the first time you're in Sports Illustrated. Yes, 635 00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:04,200 Speaker 1: Steve and I can get a little creative after a 636 00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:06,320 Speaker 1: couple of pops late at night when we're hanging out 637 00:33:06,360 --> 00:33:09,040 Speaker 1: with John and Colleen. So I thought this was a 638 00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:12,760 Speaker 1: fun idea, right, because Sports Illustrated is just one of 639 00:33:12,800 --> 00:33:16,240 Speaker 1: the most iconic franchises in all of media, not just 640 00:33:16,320 --> 00:33:19,160 Speaker 1: sports media. And when I was a kid, first thing 641 00:33:19,320 --> 00:33:21,720 Speaker 1: it was Sports Illustrated for kids, right, and you got 642 00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:24,120 Speaker 1: that magazine every week or every month, I can't remember 643 00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:26,160 Speaker 1: how often it came out, but you were so excited 644 00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:28,600 Speaker 1: to peel it open, and that was your window into 645 00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:32,240 Speaker 1: the sports world back then before sports media and social media. 646 00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:34,840 Speaker 1: And then you got a little bit older than you 647 00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:38,360 Speaker 1: got the weekly Sports Illustrated. Then you got the swimsuit issue, 648 00:33:38,400 --> 00:33:40,400 Speaker 1: and life was good when you're like a fourteen year 649 00:33:40,440 --> 00:33:43,040 Speaker 1: old boy, and you know as soon as that that 650 00:33:43,080 --> 00:33:44,880 Speaker 1: would show up, you'd peel it open. You'd look for 651 00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:47,040 Speaker 1: faces in the crowd and see if maybe there's anybody 652 00:33:47,040 --> 00:33:49,840 Speaker 1: from near your hometown or the states you grew up in, 653 00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:52,320 Speaker 1: or Joe I never made the cut. Surprisingly, yeah, I 654 00:33:52,400 --> 00:33:53,880 Speaker 1: never made the cut either. I know, so you and 655 00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:55,880 Speaker 1: I have a lot lot more in common than you think. 656 00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:58,000 Speaker 1: But it was so cool and it was such a 657 00:33:58,040 --> 00:34:02,360 Speaker 1: part of the fabric of why I loved all sports, 658 00:34:02,400 --> 00:34:04,320 Speaker 1: not just the ones that I was playing, but they 659 00:34:04,360 --> 00:34:07,000 Speaker 1: made it so real to a kid with all the 660 00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:11,480 Speaker 1: photos and every little segment and section of the magazines 661 00:34:11,520 --> 00:34:14,520 Speaker 1: was so much fun to dive into that the first 662 00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:17,640 Speaker 1: time you're in it, it's such a vivid memory along 663 00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:21,160 Speaker 1: with some of the most historic things that happened during 664 00:34:21,160 --> 00:34:22,920 Speaker 1: your life, good and bad. Right, It's kind of like 665 00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:26,080 Speaker 1: where were you when this happened? You can instantly remember 666 00:34:26,320 --> 00:34:30,279 Speaker 1: the sites, the smells, the sounds, the feelings and emotions. 667 00:34:30,680 --> 00:34:32,840 Speaker 1: It was the same thing the first time I remember 668 00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:35,320 Speaker 1: pulling open a Sports Illustrated and seeing a big article 669 00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:38,799 Speaker 1: about myself. Yeah, so what was like, did you know 670 00:34:38,880 --> 00:34:40,560 Speaker 1: that you were going to be in the magazine? Did 671 00:34:40,600 --> 00:34:42,560 Speaker 1: somebody tell you about it? Did you stumble upon it 672 00:34:42,680 --> 00:34:45,239 Speaker 1: organically and say, oh my god, I'm in it? Well 673 00:34:45,320 --> 00:34:49,040 Speaker 1: what happened? Yeah? So when I was maybe a freshman 674 00:34:49,239 --> 00:34:52,799 Speaker 1: or sophomore in college, I'm sure my name was in there, 675 00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:57,520 Speaker 1: like Joe Thomas Badgers, right like penalty seventy two Wisconsin 676 00:34:57,680 --> 00:35:00,080 Speaker 1: something like that, maybe in the box score, but of 677 00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:04,080 Speaker 1: things significant until my senior year at Wisconsin coming up 678 00:35:04,080 --> 00:35:06,080 Speaker 1: on the draft. So I was right about right now 679 00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:11,760 Speaker 1: in January, and Peter King was writing stories on draft 680 00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:14,320 Speaker 1: prospects and he got ahold of me through my agent, 681 00:35:14,560 --> 00:35:16,320 Speaker 1: and then he actually came out to Madison, which was 682 00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:17,880 Speaker 1: where I was living, where I was training for the 683 00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:21,200 Speaker 1: NFL Combine, and kind of spent a day or day 684 00:35:21,239 --> 00:35:23,480 Speaker 1: and a half with me and just followed me around. 685 00:35:23,960 --> 00:35:25,360 Speaker 1: And it was just so much fun being able to 686 00:35:25,400 --> 00:35:27,440 Speaker 1: spend time with Peter King, because one, he was such 687 00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:30,520 Speaker 1: an iconic writer for football in general, but he was 688 00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:34,840 Speaker 1: also such an important piece of Sports Illustrated that for 689 00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:36,239 Speaker 1: him to be able to spend the day with me 690 00:35:36,400 --> 00:35:38,880 Speaker 1: was pretty cool. For me, and then for him to 691 00:35:38,920 --> 00:35:41,279 Speaker 1: write an article that had some photos in there and 692 00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:45,160 Speaker 1: it kind of uh, he definitely put my life as 693 00:35:45,160 --> 00:35:47,680 Speaker 1: a college kid on a pedestal, which was pretty cool 694 00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:51,120 Speaker 1: because I was still living in my crappy apartment and 695 00:35:51,160 --> 00:35:53,799 Speaker 1: I had a laptop that would overheat if you spent 696 00:35:53,840 --> 00:35:56,080 Speaker 1: more than five minutes on it, so I actually had 697 00:35:56,120 --> 00:35:59,400 Speaker 1: it propped up on like little pieces of toilet paper, 698 00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:02,799 Speaker 1: the old cardboard toilet paper rolls, so it could get 699 00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:08,400 Speaker 1: some airflow underneath where it needed to cool off. How innovative. Yeah, yeah, innovative. 700 00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:10,879 Speaker 1: We had a couple of old deer amounts that had 701 00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:12,920 Speaker 1: like bras hanging from him in the corner. It was 702 00:36:12,960 --> 00:36:17,440 Speaker 1: just kind of like your typical animal house college apartment lifestyle, 703 00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:20,040 Speaker 1: and Peter King like fell in love with it and 704 00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:22,560 Speaker 1: so writing that big article and then for me to 705 00:36:22,640 --> 00:36:24,360 Speaker 1: see that and to be able to like show that 706 00:36:24,440 --> 00:36:27,440 Speaker 1: to my buddies, like somebody else cares about the slum 707 00:36:27,560 --> 00:36:29,520 Speaker 1: that we're living in and thinks it's cool, Like how 708 00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:34,799 Speaker 1: cool is that? You're what around that time? Yeah, so 709 00:36:35,120 --> 00:36:37,200 Speaker 1: that's a lot for a kid, right, I mean, what 710 00:36:37,320 --> 00:36:40,160 Speaker 1: kind of pressure did you feel at the time? Yeah, 711 00:36:40,320 --> 00:36:42,360 Speaker 1: I felt like I was in a pretty good situation, 712 00:36:42,360 --> 00:36:44,600 Speaker 1: and I think it wasn't even until like the end 713 00:36:44,600 --> 00:36:47,280 Speaker 1: of my junior year when scouts were coming to practice 714 00:36:47,280 --> 00:36:48,680 Speaker 1: and asking me if I was going to come out 715 00:36:48,719 --> 00:36:50,920 Speaker 1: after my junior year, that I even realized I was 716 00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:52,560 Speaker 1: maybe good enough to play in the NFL or be 717 00:36:52,640 --> 00:36:54,719 Speaker 1: drafted into the NFL. So I think I sort of 718 00:36:54,719 --> 00:36:57,800 Speaker 1: had the humble upbringing that helped. Does it help also 719 00:36:57,920 --> 00:37:01,080 Speaker 1: in addition to you know, your upbringing, did it help 720 00:37:01,160 --> 00:37:04,760 Speaker 1: also the position, because I mean, we've talked a lot 721 00:37:04,800 --> 00:37:07,240 Speaker 1: about you being an offensive lineman and what goes into 722 00:37:07,280 --> 00:37:10,960 Speaker 1: that when we're having conversations offline, But it's not like 723 00:37:11,080 --> 00:37:14,040 Speaker 1: you're one of the top quarterback prospects coming out. You're 724 00:37:14,040 --> 00:37:18,120 Speaker 1: a really popular and talented offensive lineman. But with the 725 00:37:18,120 --> 00:37:22,279 Speaker 1: exception of Peter King dropping and parachuting into your college situation, 726 00:37:22,800 --> 00:37:26,120 Speaker 1: offensive lineman don't get a lot of attention, there's no doubt. 727 00:37:26,160 --> 00:37:29,240 Speaker 1: And two fold, I think the position of offensive lineman 728 00:37:29,280 --> 00:37:32,120 Speaker 1: just because we never get the attention unless it's bad, 729 00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:35,719 Speaker 1: Like naturally, you've shown the attention, right, I don't want 730 00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:38,760 Speaker 1: to get highlighted for that holding or that offside penalty 731 00:37:38,840 --> 00:37:41,800 Speaker 1: or forgiven up that sack. So I think the position 732 00:37:41,880 --> 00:37:46,759 Speaker 1: sortat of naturally breeds a humility and a shunning of 733 00:37:46,840 --> 00:37:49,800 Speaker 1: the focus being on me, so that helps. But also 734 00:37:50,200 --> 00:37:52,920 Speaker 1: it is an anonymous position, which is really nice and 735 00:37:52,960 --> 00:37:56,120 Speaker 1: the benefit of being under the radar. It wasn't until 736 00:37:56,120 --> 00:37:58,600 Speaker 1: you know, maybe the second half of my career in Cleveland, 737 00:37:58,640 --> 00:38:00,640 Speaker 1: where people would even recognize me when I would go 738 00:38:00,680 --> 00:38:03,560 Speaker 1: out in public, and certainly not at Wisconsin. Like if 739 00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:06,040 Speaker 1: you were the star running back or the star quarterback, 740 00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:08,680 Speaker 1: that's a different ball game. But as an offensive linement, 741 00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:11,680 Speaker 1: I was drafted third overall and I can count on 742 00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:14,040 Speaker 1: one hand the number of times that in four years 743 00:38:14,040 --> 00:38:16,759 Speaker 1: at Wisconsin that I got stopped on campus by somebody 744 00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:18,520 Speaker 1: who either wanted a picture or an autograph for me, 745 00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:21,480 Speaker 1: because it just didn't happen, like nobody cared. And that 746 00:38:21,520 --> 00:38:23,480 Speaker 1: was actually probably really good because that was a good 747 00:38:23,520 --> 00:38:25,919 Speaker 1: situation and it made it really easy to just show 748 00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:29,160 Speaker 1: up and do your job when nobody really cared, how's 749 00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:32,160 Speaker 1: the picture? When somebody stopped you, it was like surprised, 750 00:38:33,120 --> 00:38:34,880 Speaker 1: are you sure you know who I am? Like, I'm 751 00:38:34,920 --> 00:38:36,719 Speaker 1: not the running back, I'm not a basketball player. I 752 00:38:36,760 --> 00:38:39,000 Speaker 1: know I'm pretty tall, but see this belly on me 753 00:38:39,040 --> 00:38:41,080 Speaker 1: like I clearly can't go up and down the hardwood 754 00:38:41,160 --> 00:38:44,480 Speaker 1: very often. It's a perfect way to finish the soft 755 00:38:44,560 --> 00:38:47,200 Speaker 1: Joe Thomas, you've been in the magazine, now you've been 756 00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:50,520 Speaker 1: on Sports Illustrated Weekly. Your star keeps shining. Thanks for 757 00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:53,120 Speaker 1: doing this, hey man, Thanks for having me on. John, 758 00:38:57,440 --> 00:38:59,480 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for listening to the first episode 759 00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:01,839 Speaker 1: of Sports Stradio Weekly. We'll be back with a new 760 00:39:01,840 --> 00:39:04,600 Speaker 1: episode next Wednesday and every Wednesday, so make sure you 761 00:39:04,640 --> 00:39:07,520 Speaker 1: subscribe or followed to get new episodes delivered to your 762 00:39:07,520 --> 00:39:10,319 Speaker 1: podcast feed each week. And if you're listening in an app, 763 00:39:10,480 --> 00:39:12,080 Speaker 1: please do go ahead and leave us a rating and 764 00:39:12,120 --> 00:39:15,040 Speaker 1: a review that helps other people find the show. Sports 765 00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:17,680 Speaker 1: Illustrated Weekly is a production of Sports Illustrated and I 766 00:39:17,800 --> 00:39:21,200 Speaker 1: Heart Radio. For more podcasts from my Heart Radio, visit 767 00:39:21,200 --> 00:39:24,600 Speaker 1: the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you 768 00:39:24,640 --> 00:39:27,799 Speaker 1: get your podcasts. And for more of Sports Illustrated It's 769 00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:34,960 Speaker 1: best stories and podcasts, visit SI dot com. This episode 770 00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:37,759 Speaker 1: of Sports Illustrated Weekly was produced by Alex Kappelman and 771 00:39:37,840 --> 00:39:41,520 Speaker 1: Isaac Lee, who was also our sound engineer. Our senior 772 00:39:41,560 --> 00:39:45,440 Speaker 1: producer is Dan Bloom Our executive producers are Scott Brody 773 00:39:45,520 --> 00:39:49,240 Speaker 1: and me John Gonzalez. Our theme song is by Nolan Schneider. 774 00:39:49,880 --> 00:39:53,640 Speaker 1: Our incredible artwork was created by SIS Creative Director Steven 775 00:39:53,719 --> 00:39:57,840 Speaker 1: Scalaki and SIS Art Director Stephen Goji. Special thanks to 776 00:39:58,000 --> 00:40:01,160 Speaker 1: SIS editors in chief Ryan Hunt and Stephen Cannela, and 777 00:40:01,239 --> 00:40:03,680 Speaker 1: everyone at Sports Illustrated and I Heart Radio who helped 778 00:40:03,680 --> 00:40:06,279 Speaker 1: to get the show off the ground. And if you've 779 00:40:06,280 --> 00:40:10,200 Speaker 1: stuck around this long, we leave you with this. A 780 00:40:10,200 --> 00:40:13,440 Speaker 1: lot of my friends are here tonight, UM and obviously 781 00:40:13,520 --> 00:40:17,240 Speaker 1: my personal trainer, DJ Khalid's here who's Tonight's co host, 782 00:40:17,640 --> 00:40:20,680 Speaker 1: and he's always pushing me to do more reps. Another one, 783 00:40:21,239 --> 00:40:22,320 Speaker 1: another one,