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Speaker 1: dot up work dot com. Hello everyone, I'm a dd Kinkabala,
Speaker 1: joined as always by the fabulous Mike Yam and we
Speaker 1: are here for NFL explained By the way. I love
Speaker 1: when you call me fabulous and I did catch it
Speaker 1: on NFL Now the other day when you were promoting
Speaker 1: the podcast. It did make me smile. Belladitia. This week,
Speaker 1: we're all about the trade deadline. We are knocking on
Speaker 1: the door for I think a time of the season
Speaker 1: that gives anxiety to some players, maybe more so in
Speaker 1: other sports, but certainly in the NFL. When you think
Speaker 1: there's a chance you could be on the move, there's
Speaker 1: some upheaval in your personal life, which you know, what
Speaker 1: is a great segue to this, Mike. You know that
Speaker 1: I love trivia. What do Doug Flutie, Carson Palmer, and
Speaker 1: Jimmy Garoppolo all have in common? You know, normally you
Speaker 1: ask questions and I don't know the answer. When I
Speaker 1: hear the trivia music time, I know this one. Quarterbacks.
Speaker 1: Here we go, quarterbacks, fruit quarterbacks who were on the move.
Speaker 1: We'll keep with the theme of today's shill quarterbacks who
Speaker 1: are no longer with their teams and they've been shipped
Speaker 1: out of town. Yeah, trade deadline exactly. They were all
Speaker 1: traded on the NFL's trade deadline. You know, Mike, there
Speaker 1: is just a lot more to learn about trades and
Speaker 1: trades in general, and why the NFL treats the whole
Speaker 1: trade deadline differently than perhaps the NBA or Major League Baseball,
Speaker 1: So I think this is a really good opportunity to
Speaker 1: dive into that as fans think about the makeup of
Speaker 1: their team's rosters. Yeah, I couldn't agree with you more.
Speaker 1: Not to mention, I think getting the perspective from someone
Speaker 1: who's been traded is always unique. I actually reached out
Speaker 1: to a couple buddies that played in the league, and
Speaker 1: none of them were actually traded, which also speaks to
Speaker 1: sometimes the lack of movement that the NFL has, which
Speaker 1: we'll get to. But Vernon Davis is going to be
Speaker 1: stopping by a little bit later in this show. Certainly
Speaker 1: pumped too to hear your conversation add with him. But
Speaker 1: as you made reference to trade deadline coming the Tuesday
Speaker 1: after week number eight so this season, four pm Eastern time,
Speaker 1: November two this year. And I think there's actually a
Speaker 1: lot of different ways we can dissect this. But the
Speaker 1: first question is like why even have a trade deadline?
Speaker 1: I think understanding trades is one thing, but add why
Speaker 1: even bother? Well, first of all, the NFL is indeed
Speaker 1: a deadline league. People like having deadlines a b Well, people, okay,
Speaker 1: that's you know what, Mike, That's a much better way
Speaker 1: to phrase it. People do need deadlines in the NFL
Speaker 1: is certainly a league that needs deadlines too. I think
Speaker 1: the timing of this deadline is tremendously notable. You know,
Speaker 1: it used to be week six. It was moved back
Speaker 1: to week eight starting in two thousand twelve. But even
Speaker 1: though there is a movement, there are agents that wish
Speaker 1: that trade deadline would be moved back even further. I
Speaker 1: don't necessarily see that happening. And I'll give you a
Speaker 1: few reasons. Number one, the NFL loves the idea of
Speaker 1: competitive bows and parody, and the trade deadline being where
Speaker 1: it is effectively prevents teams that are winning from stacking
Speaker 1: their rosters as the playoffs get closer. The flip side
Speaker 1: to that is it prevents teams that are sitting at
Speaker 1: whatever one in six from having a fire sale. And
Speaker 1: did I do the math on that right, No, I didn't.
Speaker 1: It would have to be one in seven unless the
Speaker 1: one in six team was on a by then it
Speaker 1: would make sense of some money. We'll make the numbers
Speaker 1: work either way. Well, I read well, and we'll got
Speaker 1: to that because we will have to talk about making
Speaker 1: the cap numbers work. But in any case, when you
Speaker 1: think about the competitive balance here, the way the NFL
Speaker 1: does its schedule is obviously you play your division mates
Speaker 1: and then you're matched up against another division out of
Speaker 1: the conference. So let's pretend, Mike that I'm an a
Speaker 1: f C North team and this year I have to
Speaker 1: play the NFC East and I end up playing the
Speaker 1: Eagles and the Giant in in September and October. But
Speaker 1: let's say you another a f C North team play
Speaker 1: the Eagles and the Giants in December, when both of
Speaker 1: them are already out of it and both of them
Speaker 1: have basically gotten rid of all their great players. Well,
Speaker 1: then I'm not playing the same type of team that
Speaker 1: you are playing, and that's not particularly fair. I think
Speaker 1: it's a really good point, and I think the reality
Speaker 1: is that competitive balance is a really important distinction to
Speaker 1: d D because the NFL has done a tremendous job.
Speaker 1: Look no further than this season. I mean, every single
Speaker 1: Sunday or Thursday or Monday, we're getting results with these
Speaker 1: razor thin advantages and edges. You know that that old
Speaker 1: cliche the game's battle of inches. Well, in a lot
Speaker 1: of ways, it's kind of proved to be that way,
Speaker 1: So it is really important to try to maintain that
Speaker 1: competitive balance. I think it's also notable to say, you know,
Speaker 1: you talked about this before, that we don't necessarily see
Speaker 1: the same number of trades in the NFL that we
Speaker 1: do maybe in baseball. So let's get into why that is.
Speaker 1: You have give me, give me one idea. There's multiple reasons,
Speaker 1: but go ahead and throw one at me. Look, the
Speaker 1: biggest one you got to say, is this hard salary
Speaker 1: cap in this idea of limiting the amount of dollars
Speaker 1: that you can allocate for your team, and it is different.
Speaker 1: You know, I spent a long time in my career
Speaker 1: covering in the n b A. You don't necessarily have
Speaker 1: to worry about that. If you've got a team owner
Speaker 1: that's got some deep pockets, you know that soft cap
Speaker 1: is something that is okay as long as your team
Speaker 1: owner is willing to pay a luxury tax at the
Speaker 1: end of the season. And then, of course you've got
Speaker 1: a league like Major League Baseball where you can get
Speaker 1: these mammoth mega deals and not have to worry about it.
Speaker 1: Because Baseball doesn't have a salary cap, so the trade
Speaker 1: deadline as a whole is just less busy just because
Speaker 1: of the restraints that NFL teams have, and managing that
Speaker 1: cap is a very hard mathematical equation. It needs to
Speaker 1: be put into place, you know, Mike, you say that,
Speaker 1: and it's very interesting who you talk to, because I
Speaker 1: actually talked to an agent who has been a part
Speaker 1: of a lot of negotiations over the last few years
Speaker 1: leading up to the trade deadline, after offseason whatever, and
Speaker 1: he kind of pooh pooed this idea, and he said,
Speaker 1: if you want to make the mathwork, you can make
Speaker 1: the mathwork. It's kind of like what we saw in
Speaker 1: the movie Draft Day. But on the flip side, I
Speaker 1: talked to a team executive who's really in charge of
Speaker 1: managing his team's cap, and he was saying that there
Speaker 1: are not a lot of teams that have flexibility, especially
Speaker 1: when you're looking for somebody who's a high priced player.
Speaker 1: Look at what just happened a couple of weeks ago,
Speaker 1: Mike with a former Defensive Player of the Year in
Speaker 1: Stefan Gilmour. How many teams could maneuver things to have
Speaker 1: the cap room to acquire a player of that caliber
Speaker 1: with a salary like that, not that many and so
Speaker 1: the Panthers were indeed able to make that happen. But
Speaker 1: I don't know how many other potential suitors there would
Speaker 1: have been who could have done that. It's a great call,
Speaker 1: and you know, I just remember even being here in
Speaker 1: the San Francisco Bay area heading down until you buy
Speaker 1: a stadium before the season had started, and there was
Speaker 1: obviously this big back and forth among fans. Hey is
Speaker 1: it Trey Lance, is it Jimmy G. What are you
Speaker 1: supposed to do? Hey, we should go and trade Jimmy Garoppolo. Well,
Speaker 1: the reality is, you know, at the beginning of the season,
Speaker 1: as you made reference to a d D, there's not
Speaker 1: many teams that have the room to take on a
Speaker 1: salary cap hit. And if I'm not mistaken, it's like,
Speaker 1: well into like the mid twenty millions is what Jimmy
Speaker 1: G would bring to the table. So you know, there's
Speaker 1: not a line of teams that you can say, Okay,
Speaker 1: let's just make this work. And because it's the quarterback position,
Speaker 1: and Daniel Jeremiada I think does a great job on
Speaker 1: NFL Network when he's evaluating not only players, but talking
Speaker 1: about sometimes the cap hit that some of these players
Speaker 1: will will cost their teams, and they value at certain positions. Now,
Speaker 1: the quarterback, you know, is the most important position on
Speaker 1: the field. That position is going to allocate a larger number.
Speaker 1: So when you're plugging and playing and trying to build
Speaker 1: your roster, you're gonna allocate according to position in a
Speaker 1: lot of ways, and some of those spots just have
Speaker 1: higher value. But you know what, it's not only the cap,
Speaker 1: it's also that there's no like huge feeding system. You know,
Speaker 1: if you're if one quarterback goes down, what are you doing? Basically?
Speaker 1: So think about it. If let's pretend we're playing baseball,
Speaker 1: Mic and you are my first baseman, and I may
Speaker 1: really like you at first base, but I've got two
Speaker 1: unbelievable star first base prospects in my farm system. Well,
Speaker 1: I don't need three great first baseman, so I may
Speaker 1: as well move you In the NFL. Your fifty three
Speaker 1: is kind of your fifty three. There's not necessarily a
Speaker 1: feeding ground like that. There's not necessarily a place to
Speaker 1: plug somebody in, and you never know what can happen
Speaker 1: on the injury front. I'm thinking about before this season
Speaker 1: the Pittsburgh Steelers, James Washington seemed to be a receiver
Speaker 1: who was sort of an odd man out, a tremendously
Speaker 1: talented player, especially down the field, but with Deonte Johnson
Speaker 1: and Chase Claypool and Juju Smith Schuster, you know, James
Speaker 1: Washington just felt like there weren't a lot of snaps
Speaker 1: to be had, and he or his representation approached the
Speaker 1: Steelers about trade. The Steelers didn't want to do it,
Speaker 1: and then lo and behold, Juju Smith Schuster gets hurt
Speaker 1: and his loss for the year. The Steelers need James Washington.
Speaker 1: Had they moved on from him, then where would they
Speaker 1: be a d D. To be clear, you're not going
Speaker 1: to trade me. I'm a locker room guy. Not only
Speaker 1: do I put up historic numbers every single season, and
Speaker 1: I'm always in the m v P conversation. I'm good
Speaker 1: in the locker room. Oh come on now, Mike, don't
Speaker 1: you know that anybody is tradeable? I knew a coach
Speaker 1: who once said that he'd considered trading his wife if
Speaker 1: he could get two first round picks. Sounds like the
Speaker 1: happiest of marriages. By the way, when I hear something
Speaker 1: like that, although two first rounders is sort of a
Speaker 1: king's ransom there, we know, how if you're throwing in
Speaker 1: Aaron Rodgers, right, if it's Aaron Rodgers and two first rounders,
Speaker 1: well then uh, but then maybe it is something that
Speaker 1: you need to consider, you know, a d The one
Speaker 1: thing that's I think we've done a pretty good job
Speaker 1: of on this podcast is give people answers. And there's
Speaker 1: one question that we can't answer with the trade deadline
Speaker 1: basically a week away. Who's on the move? We don't
Speaker 1: know who that player or players are going to be you,
Speaker 1: But when we come back, we'll give you a sense
Speaker 1: of some of the big name guys as we go
Speaker 1: down memory lane who worshipped and maybe it was a
Speaker 1: surprise to not only those players but those fan bases.
Speaker 1: And add your conversation with a guy who was traded
Speaker 1: in Vernon Davis from the Niners to the Broncos. It
Speaker 1: actually ended up not being the worst thing in the world,
Speaker 1: because he's got some blaing on his hand because of it.
Speaker 1: But can't wait to hear some of the things that
Speaker 1: he had to tell you. I don't know if he
Speaker 1: was necessarily happy or sad about it. We'll get into
Speaker 1: it with him how he found out, if he even
Speaker 1: suspected it, and whether he did the happy dance or
Speaker 1: if all he could think about was crap. I have
Speaker 1: to pack up all my stuff now, because we all
Speaker 1: know moving is such a pain, no one legs to move.
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Speaker 1: Your results may very not an endorsement speed comparison to
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Speaker 1: on network conditions and five G content optimization. Mike amm
Speaker 1: In Indita Kinka Wlo back with you here on the
Speaker 1: NFL explained podcasts some big name players when they were
Speaker 1: shipped out of town. It's something that has happened. A
Speaker 1: DD will get to that in just a second here.
Speaker 1: But I think as we were trying to explain why
Speaker 1: you don't necessarily see a ton of trades around the
Speaker 1: trade deadline in the NFL compared to some other sports,
Speaker 1: Bill Belichick a couple of years ago back in actually
Speaker 1: gave some really good context as to why that is. Well,
Speaker 1: we brought up baseball before right in the comparison that
Speaker 1: there's not necessarily a feeding system, the cap is not
Speaker 1: hard like that. Belichick actually talked about getting a player
Speaker 1: up to speeds, so listen to this is what he said.
Speaker 1: It's so hard to get a guy ready in a
Speaker 1: short amount of time. I don't know that much about
Speaker 1: base ball, but maybe you take a third baseman on
Speaker 1: this team and put him at third base on the
Speaker 1: other team and let him hit. How much is there
Speaker 1: involved in that? I'm sure there's some, but it's not
Speaker 1: like playing left guard and having twenty different protections and
Speaker 1: two dozen running plays and a dozen different defenses you
Speaker 1: have to block on every week. It's a lot more involved,
Speaker 1: I have to say really quickly. Are you surprised that
Speaker 1: Belichick is making football sound way more intellectual and smarter
Speaker 1: than baseball? Uh? No, but I think he is onto
Speaker 1: something with his observation there, at least when it comes
Speaker 1: to baseball. I think you can make an argument, even
Speaker 1: on the basketball side at dB. I think that that's
Speaker 1: very fair true, and that's why you may see a
Speaker 1: veteran player more likely to be traded at the trade deadline,
Speaker 1: someone who could get up to speed a little bit
Speaker 1: more quickly, but ultimately, Mike, it is very very hard
Speaker 1: in football for one player to be the absolute difference maker.
Speaker 1: Unlike in basketball. If we're talking about the NBA right now,
Speaker 1: one guy in you're starting five can make an enormous difference.
Speaker 1: One guy in you're starting twenty two. In the NFL
Speaker 1: is not necessarily completely changing the way you play. Could
Speaker 1: not agree with you more. Talk about this all the
Speaker 1: time and the NBA, one single player really can be
Speaker 1: the difference. And while you can make an argument you
Speaker 1: got the quarterback, you've got a chance to win. In
Speaker 1: the NFL, there are a lot of moving parts, especially
Speaker 1: in front. I mean, if an offensive line can't get
Speaker 1: it done, or you know, from a defensive perspective, you
Speaker 1: can't get enough pressure on your opposing quarterback. Like, there's
Speaker 1: a lot of moving parts the NBA, that one on
Speaker 1: one isolation game sometimes can put you over the top.
Speaker 1: But all of these factors aside. You know, Ded, we
Speaker 1: actually have had notable trades for big name players around
Speaker 1: the deadline, and I do want to throw out a
Speaker 1: couple of those players. Leondard Williams, speaking of defense, is
Speaker 1: one of those guys who remember was the six overall
Speaker 1: pick back and a couple of years ago in twenty nineteen,
Speaker 1: traded from the Jets to the Giants. Not a good
Speaker 1: thing for him, and you made reference to it when
Speaker 1: we were teasing Vernon d of his packing is never fun. Uh,
Speaker 1: didn't necessarily have to pack. I don't think to to
Speaker 1: move too far if you are Leonard Williams from that perspective,
Speaker 1: Golden Tate the wide receiver, remember he was at the
Speaker 1: time the leading of receiver on that football team. Goes
Speaker 1: from the Lions to the Eagles back in eighteen. Jimmy Garoppolo,
Speaker 1: I know we've made reference to him a couple of
Speaker 1: times in this show. And Bill Belichick Patriots to the
Speaker 1: Niners in exchange for a second rounder. Sodd. You're seeing
Speaker 1: some of these names of some players who have actually
Speaker 1: had a pretty good impact on their respective teams post
Speaker 1: that trade, like Carson Palmer when he moved from the
Speaker 1: Bengals to the Raidiers, still for the first and second
Speaker 1: round picks. Right, Roy Williams, wide receiver, you know, Lions
Speaker 1: to the Cowboys. You know you think about the impact
Speaker 1: that some of these guys are able to put together.
Speaker 1: What you think about the extra guys to the ancillary guys.
Speaker 1: So you're talking about major, mega trades. What about the
Speaker 1: herschel Walker trade was back in he went from the
Speaker 1: Cowboys to the Vikings. There were eighteen players along with
Speaker 1: draft picks and of don that. So think if you're
Speaker 1: like the third string tight end and you're just showing
Speaker 1: up to do your job and play special teams, and
Speaker 1: all of a sudden you're telling your wife up, we
Speaker 1: gotta back up, and we're leaving all of a sudden,
Speaker 1: and you're just like, I didn't even know anybody on
Speaker 1: any team new that I existed, you know. And it's
Speaker 1: that's across the board, right and every single sport when
Speaker 1: you're trying to make some of those numbers work. When
Speaker 1: you were having that conversation with you know, I don't
Speaker 1: know whether it's agents or other players around that time,
Speaker 1: the life stuff that gets involved. How difficult has is
Speaker 1: there like any perspective that you got from any of
Speaker 1: that group about just how difficult it is to be
Speaker 1: on the move when you're not necessarily like the star
Speaker 1: player in a trade. Actually, Mike, this is really funny.
Speaker 1: This is reminding me of earlier this year, and again
Speaker 1: I'm sticking with I'm just sticking with the a f
Speaker 1: C North year. But Joe Schobert, who was a linebacker
Speaker 1: with the Browns for a long time and then was
Speaker 1: playing down in Jacksonville, was traded to the Steelers just
Speaker 1: before the start of the season. And he's a I Megan,
Speaker 1: they have a young child. Uh, they have a baby.
Speaker 1: And Megan took to Twitter or TikTok or somewhere on
Speaker 1: social media and basically made a joke of being traded
Speaker 1: after they had just bought their first house together with
Speaker 1: a baby, while her husband was already gone to his
Speaker 1: new team, so she had to pack up her house,
Speaker 1: manage the child, figure out where they were moving, do
Speaker 1: the whole entire thing by herself. And she basically made
Speaker 1: this joke like the NFL does this and they're not
Speaker 1: sending me wine. And a few weeks later, she tweets
Speaker 1: a picture of herself with like a case of wine
Speaker 1: or you know, six bottles of wine, and she goes,
Speaker 1: thank you Steelers. So I guess somebody from the Steelers
Speaker 1: decided to take pity on her and send her reinforcements.
Speaker 1: Those are the best reinforcements you could possibly have that
Speaker 1: will get you through some rough packing moments, for sure,
Speaker 1: and some tense moments as things are trying to get
Speaker 1: loaded out onto that truck, well for sure. But you
Speaker 1: know what I think would be super super interesting is
Speaker 1: the trades that almost happened at the trade deadline and
Speaker 1: then didn't. And I bring that up because I have
Speaker 1: a friend, Peter Schaefer, who is one of the smartest,
Speaker 1: most accomplished NFL agents and has been at this game
Speaker 1: for a long time in the NFL, and I was
Speaker 1: picking his brain a little bit about some of his
Speaker 1: best stories. And actually one of his best stories is
Speaker 1: about our good friend Joe Thomas, says. We all know
Speaker 1: Joe Thomas, a likely future Hall of Famer, played his
Speaker 1: entire career in Cleveland. Joe felt very strongly about the
Speaker 1: organization and the city and felt loyalty to the Browns,
Speaker 1: although considering how much losing he did and how many
Speaker 1: quarterbacks he had to play with, one questions why he did.
Speaker 1: But he did, and so he would never actively seek
Speaker 1: a trade and he didn't want anybody to know that
Speaker 1: he wanted to be traded. But their him of time
Speaker 1: when he and his agent had a conversation and he
Speaker 1: heard that there was some potential interest out there for him,
Speaker 1: or there was always interest, but that maybe the Browns
Speaker 1: would be willing to move him at the right price.
Speaker 1: And so Joe said, well, I don't actively want to trade.
Speaker 1: I don't actively want to go, but you know, if
Speaker 1: you want to see what's out there, there are certain
Speaker 1: places that I could potentially listen to. So let's fast
Speaker 1: forward and the Denver Broncos same year that Vernon Davis
Speaker 1: was traded at the trade deadline, John E. White was
Speaker 1: kind of a mover and shaker that year in two
Speaker 1: thousand fifteen, and so the Denver Broncos and the Cleveland
Speaker 1: Browns and Joe Thomas's agent all sort of had these
Speaker 1: conversations about whether Joe Thomas should go to Denver. And
Speaker 1: you know, Peter Shaffer told me that these conversations started
Speaker 1: maybe a week before the deadline. As they got closer
Speaker 1: to the deadline, both teams were a little bit more
Speaker 1: willing to give. And you know, Joe was again like
Speaker 1: very adamant, I'm not looking to be traded, but if
Speaker 1: this is the best thing for all sides, Denver would
Speaker 1: work for him. And so it almost got done, and
Speaker 1: then it ultimately didn't and Peter didn't even he doesn't
Speaker 1: even remember what exactly blew up the whole thing, but
Speaker 1: they worked right to the wire, couldn't get a deal done.
Speaker 1: And I was just stunned at the idea of Joe
Speaker 1: Thomas potentially going to Denver, protecting Peyton Manning's blindside and
Speaker 1: winning a Super Bowl, which would be a completely different
Speaker 1: identity than Joe Thomas, who spent his entire career with
Speaker 1: a Brown's team that was just kind of levable losers. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's you know, it's wild too, because you think about
Speaker 1: a legacy that a player has when they spend their
Speaker 1: entire career in one spot, and you see that more
Speaker 1: often than not in the NFL, and I think in
Speaker 1: other sports there's somewhat of a jealousy from some of
Speaker 1: the other players that don't always get to do those
Speaker 1: type types of things. Like you know, you think about
Speaker 1: you know, Dirk, for example, in a Dallas Mavericks uniform
Speaker 1: for a long period of time, Jeter and Baseball wearing
Speaker 1: that Yankees uniform. There's something special about being able to
Speaker 1: be a city's person. You mentioned some of the deals
Speaker 1: that that were at least one deal on Joe Thomas
Speaker 1: that didn't get done as they're creeping too that deadline
Speaker 1: and adety. I can't even imagine what the truck was
Speaker 1: actually filled like. From a Vernon Davis family perspective, coming up,
Speaker 1: something tells me that Vernon Davis wasn't the person who
Speaker 1: was actually doing the packing when he was going from
Speaker 1: the Niners to Denver. We will hear your conversation with
Speaker 1: Vernon Davis coming up next on the NFL Explained podcast.
Speaker 1: Coming up next, I'm stop Bowl Champion Vernon Davis. I
Speaker 1: want to explain what is like he traded in the NFL.
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Speaker 1: Home Today. We are here with my old friend and
Speaker 1: a fourteen year veteran of the NFL, Vernon Davis, who
Speaker 1: played for three teams, who has won a Super Bowl,
Speaker 1: who is now poised to win an Academy Award. He
Speaker 1: is a seasoned actor and I'm thinking that playing for
Speaker 1: multiple different teams and having to be a different person
Speaker 1: for different teams kind of prepped you for this life
Speaker 1: as an actor. Vernon, Yeah, I mean it's um. I
Speaker 1: feel like everything that you go through in life always
Speaker 1: prepares you for the next moment, whatever that is going
Speaker 1: to be. And in this case, it's been football. Football
Speaker 1: has been my journey, it's been my life, It's been everything,
Speaker 1: and I learned some valuable lessons throughout the journey. Okay,
Speaker 1: so we want to talk to you about one very
Speaker 1: very specific moment in that football journey. You, my friend,
Speaker 1: the day before the trade deadline in two thousand fifteen,
Speaker 1: somehow find out that the longest tenured player on the
Speaker 1: San Francisco forty Niners, you were going to leave town.
Speaker 1: And what I read is that you were actually very
Speaker 1: very surprised by this. So can you tell us were
Speaker 1: there any inklings at all? Why were you so surprised
Speaker 1: and how did you find out? Let me tell you.
Speaker 1: So this time I went down. Let me take you back, right,
Speaker 1: So we we just finished the game, I believe, yes, No,
Speaker 1: I vividly remember we were playing the St. Louis Rams,
Speaker 1: the old Ramps when they were playing in St. Louis,
Speaker 1: So we just finished that game, and I believe I
Speaker 1: led the team in receptions that day. So go home,
Speaker 1: get up. That next morning, I see my phone. I
Speaker 1: got a text from Trent Balk, the general management of
Speaker 1: the San Francisco forty nine. He said, when you get this,
Speaker 1: come in and see me. So automatically already knew what
Speaker 1: it was because I heard stories about me going to
Speaker 1: another team and this and that, but I wasn't quite sure.
Speaker 1: So I go in and sit down in front of him.
Speaker 1: I was like, I sit in front of him, I
Speaker 1: take a deep breath. Am I being traded? He looked
Speaker 1: at me, and I looked at him. He said, yes.
Speaker 1: At that moment, let me tell you, I felt like
Speaker 1: everything was spending so fast. I saw my whole entire
Speaker 1: career with the San Francisco for you now to just
Speaker 1: go back so fast. And it was very, very heartbreaking
Speaker 1: to hear that I was being traded. It's like one
Speaker 1: of those things like when the team that you've been
Speaker 1: playing with for so long they want to get rid
Speaker 1: of you. That's that's how you feel. They just want
Speaker 1: to get rid of you. They don't want you know more,
Speaker 1: And uh, it's only right to feel that way because
Speaker 1: I'm a human being. I mean, we're humans, and humans
Speaker 1: have feelings, we have emotions. But I sat there and
Speaker 1: we kind of went through some of the teams that
Speaker 1: were interested in me, and the Denver Broncos came up
Speaker 1: at the time, and uh, I was like, okay, I
Speaker 1: guess I'll be going to Denver, right And you know,
Speaker 1: I had done my research after that meeting, and you're
Speaker 1: just kind of looking at the teams, and to me,
Speaker 1: I felt like Denver had a great chance of winning
Speaker 1: the super Bowl. And as we all know, I was
Speaker 1: right about that winning a Super Bowl year sixteen. Back
Speaker 1: and leave stadium where where I was sent out. Wait,
Speaker 1: but okay, so Vernon take me back then. So when
Speaker 1: trump Bulky called you in, he was saying, we do
Speaker 1: need to move on from you. But he didn't already
Speaker 1: have a trade partner. He allowed you to have some
Speaker 1: say in where he sent you. Well, he had like
Speaker 1: three teams that he was showing me, and it was
Speaker 1: like it was kind of weird, you know, in my
Speaker 1: opinion from what I've heard, you know, what guys get traded,
Speaker 1: they're going you don't really have any say, so in
Speaker 1: this case, it was almost as if I had an
Speaker 1: opportunity to pick with team I wanted to go play with.
Speaker 1: Do you think that was out of respect for the
Speaker 1: ten years you'd given the forty Niners? I think that's
Speaker 1: probably out of respect, you know what I mean? He
Speaker 1: was they were being They wanted to be uh kind
Speaker 1: and you know, just kind of you know, part ways
Speaker 1: and the spirits. What can you tell U you the
Speaker 1: other two words? She wasn't? I think one team was
Speaker 1: Miami and another team Gosh, I can't remember because it
Speaker 1: happened so fast, but it was Miami and it was Dimmer.
Speaker 1: Those are the two teams that I remember. Did you
Speaker 1: ask him? Why did you say? I've given you ten
Speaker 1: years of my life. I just caught more balls than
Speaker 1: anybody else? Why? What was your what's the decision on this?
Speaker 1: What He's like? We just feel like we want to
Speaker 1: go in another direction, That's all he said. He kept
Speaker 1: it short and sweet. I feel like we want to
Speaker 1: go in another direction, all right. That just feels like
Speaker 1: a guy saying to me, it's not you, it's me.
Speaker 1: When he said that, I had this little tip just
Speaker 1: like and they landed in my right hand. Oh who
Speaker 1: did you call? Who did you call first? You walked
Speaker 1: out of Trent bal Key's office, Who'd you call first?
Speaker 1: And the time I called my kids mom, and then
Speaker 1: I called my grandmother, called my brother, um. Yeah, And
Speaker 1: I was just letting you know hey and moving on
Speaker 1: and being traded, and that's how it all went down.
Speaker 1: And then how many days after that converse ation did
Speaker 1: you find out you were actually going to Denver? I
Speaker 1: knew right away that. Oh okay, so you had the meeting.
Speaker 1: He said who do you like? You said Denver and
Speaker 1: he said, okay, it's going to be Denver. Yeah, it
Speaker 1: was kind of he was saying who do I like?
Speaker 1: But he was kind of pushing, really pushing Denver on
Speaker 1: me because they were that John Elway was, you know,
Speaker 1: he was really he was very interested in bringing me in.
Speaker 1: So it was almost as if that was the team,
Speaker 1: you know it was, that was the TEA made sense
Speaker 1: for for me, it made sense for everyone. I mean,
Speaker 1: I guess it just worked out that way. Okay, So
Speaker 1: how quickly before you got into plane to go to Denver?
Speaker 1: And what were the like? Did you stay home and
Speaker 1: helped pack up your house or did you say, see
Speaker 1: you let me tell you stuthing They wanted to getting
Speaker 1: on the plane right then and there that day they went.
Speaker 1: But I said, whoa, I can't get on the plane
Speaker 1: right now. Let me go home. I got kids. I
Speaker 1: talked to my family, and I'll come the next day,
Speaker 1: the next night. So I went that very next day.
Speaker 1: Wait a minute, So when you go home and you
Speaker 1: tell your then partner, the mother of your children, all right,
Speaker 1: I'm leaving see you, and she has to pack up
Speaker 1: the kids and find a new school and find a
Speaker 1: new place to live, or did you decide we're just
Speaker 1: going to stay. It was a crazy session. But this
Speaker 1: normally doesn't happen, but it happened to me because she
Speaker 1: didn't want to leave my side. So what we did,
Speaker 1: which is crazy, we said there, we talked about it,
Speaker 1: and she's like, no, I'm going with you. We're gonna
Speaker 1: put the kids in my high academy. She's like, I
Speaker 1: heard the great school. We're gonna live in Long Street.
Speaker 1: We're gonna put the kids there. And when I left,
Speaker 1: she came a week later and next thing you know,
Speaker 1: the kids were old in Mouth High Academy. She did
Speaker 1: the whole thing, She packed up the whole household and
Speaker 1: moved with two kids, packed up the whole house. I
Speaker 1: hope that he shipped the car and I ended up
Speaker 1: buying a pickup truck. Well, I hope you appreciated that,
Speaker 1: because no one likes moving. Tell me about the transition
Speaker 1: when you are learning a new scheme. I mean, you've
Speaker 1: been on Dancing with the Stars. Is it kind of
Speaker 1: like learning a new dance or is it totally or
Speaker 1: is it for everybody who can't see right now Vernon
Speaker 1: is showing us some fancy dance moves. What was the
Speaker 1: process of picking up I mean, you don't have an
Speaker 1: off season with this new team. You don't know your
Speaker 1: new teammates. You just plopped into a new locker room.
Speaker 1: Did you even know anybody? It's a tough situation, you
Speaker 1: know what, Actually, when I walked in the locker room,
Speaker 1: I probably knew half of the team, But doesn't always
Speaker 1: work that way because I played for so long, and
Speaker 1: you know, I played for ten years and by that
Speaker 1: time you've seen just about everybody. So I walked in,
Speaker 1: I knew half of the team, and everyone knew me,
Speaker 1: and they were welcoming me. Payt Manning called me right away.
Speaker 1: Where you get here, I'll come, said, I said. I said,
Speaker 1: all right, Payton, not be there. I can see soon
Speaker 1: as I get in, buddy. So yeah, I get there
Speaker 1: and next thing, you know, I don't know. I don't
Speaker 1: know anything about Denver. You know, I don't know about
Speaker 1: the snow there. But it didn't take long for me
Speaker 1: to find out about the snow. You know, three days there,
Speaker 1: I'm driving and it starts knowing it's coming down hard
Speaker 1: to next day, you know, I got ice all over
Speaker 1: my window. I'm out there scraping, and I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: my fitness. I had to go to my neighbor's door.
Speaker 1: I knocked on, do you have a scraper? I just
Speaker 1: moved here, and I got an ice all stuck on
Speaker 1: my window. Get up, and I had to go to practice.
Speaker 1: I'm struggling right now. I'm struggling. So I stayed in
Speaker 1: the hotel for about end up standing the hotel for
Speaker 1: about a week. And then I found something. I rented
Speaker 1: a house there, a lone tree. But it was tough.
Speaker 1: And then, you know, being in Denver, I had to
Speaker 1: go through the climate change. I had my nose. I
Speaker 1: had nose bleed for maybe an entire month, right and
Speaker 1: what about the playbook was that really difficult to pick up.
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, let me tell you something, girl, Yeah,
Speaker 1: that was extremely hard. I didn't think about it before
Speaker 1: I wrapped the Denver. I didn't think about it, I said. Normally,
Speaker 1: for an offensive player to really grasp a playbook and
Speaker 1: get it to like when you know it like the
Speaker 1: back of your hand, it takes months. It takes months,
Speaker 1: takes up an offseason, O t a s off scenes training,
Speaker 1: it takes training camp. So basically it takes from April
Speaker 1: from the time you arrived all the way up to
Speaker 1: summer camp to really know that playbook the way you
Speaker 1: need to know. So that's April, May, June July. That's
Speaker 1: like two three months, you know what I mean. But
Speaker 1: I'm getting dead way through, so I need at least
Speaker 1: two months to digest this playbook to get it the
Speaker 1: way I know it. You know, especially in an effic
Speaker 1: system like Peyton Manning, because you know Peyton, he has
Speaker 1: his stuff that he likes to do and it comes
Speaker 1: with him. I mean, everything that he's running, he's been
Speaker 1: running for years, and you know he's like a general
Speaker 1: when it comes to those meetings, he he pretty much
Speaker 1: takes over the offensive coordinator sits down and he's up
Speaker 1: there and he's offensive coordinated. He's the most impressive quarterback
Speaker 1: I've ever said. So let's put this in perspective, because
Speaker 1: zach Ertz was just traded. He scored a touchdown with
Speaker 1: the Eagles, he gets traded, and the very next week
Speaker 1: he scores a touchdown for his new team, the Arizona Cardinals,
Speaker 1: and the ball in his gloves are going to the
Speaker 1: Hall of Fame. Because that never happened. From what you're saying,
Speaker 1: you don't feel that that's really that surprising that that's
Speaker 1: never happened. That is wild to me. Yeah, that was greaty.
Speaker 1: Don't it never really happens like that, because it is
Speaker 1: that much of an adjustment. What about within the locker room, Like,
Speaker 1: was it hard to get to know you said you
Speaker 1: knew guys, but like to feel like family. Did it
Speaker 1: take a while or did you feel like all right, yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: let me tell you. It's a lot of pressure riding.
Speaker 1: I mean from learning the playbook, getting the playbook to
Speaker 1: getting acclimated and cultivating relationships with the team your new teammates.
Speaker 1: I mean it's a lot. I mean it's a lot
Speaker 1: for a guy to take on. But sometimes it could
Speaker 1: be worth like in my case winning a championship with
Speaker 1: the Demo Broncos, it was definitely well worth it. But yeah,
Speaker 1: when you look back now, you said that you cried
Speaker 1: when Trent Balkie first said that they were moving on.
Speaker 1: How long did it take before you kind of got
Speaker 1: over that? Are you still mad at him? No? No,
Speaker 1: I don't, Holp Gergies, I'm not mad. I'm not upset.
Speaker 1: You know, understand the nature of the business, and I
Speaker 1: know that things don't last, you know, they you know, everything,
Speaker 1: especially opportunities like playing in the NFL. I mean, you're
Speaker 1: not gonna always be on the same team. You're gonna
Speaker 1: go on and you know, maybe maybe you get traded,
Speaker 1: maybe your your career in something, it's gonna end. Everything
Speaker 1: has an expliration date, so you know, I just it
Speaker 1: took me a little bit time. Maybe after like a week,
Speaker 1: I was kind of over it and I was like, uh,
Speaker 1: it's cool, it's cool. It's time for me to move on.
Speaker 1: If you're mentoring a young guy right now and he
Speaker 1: gets traded, what's your advice to him. First thing you
Speaker 1: do when you get to make sure you get everything
Speaker 1: that you need, especially the playbook. Make sure you get
Speaker 1: that right away. Start digesting that playbook as much as
Speaker 1: you possibly can, because that's always the toughest part is
Speaker 1: being able to really feel comfortable in the system, a
Speaker 1: different system, something you've never been in or seen before.
Speaker 1: So just make sure you find a you know, some
Speaker 1: somewhere comfortable to live and um, just enjoy. That's that's
Speaker 1: pretty much the only thing, um that I can think of.
Speaker 1: You know, something I would even tell myself. Just continue
Speaker 1: to be happy, smile, make new friends, make new team needs,
Speaker 1: and do everything you've been doing and be the best
Speaker 1: you can be. But what about inside football here, who's
Speaker 1: the one person in the building you need to make
Speaker 1: friends with right away? If you were tight in or
Speaker 1: wide receiver, the first person you need to go to
Speaker 1: before you hit on that get on that plane. You
Speaker 1: better get the quarterbacks number. That's fair. You better get
Speaker 1: that quarterbacks number, buddy. I'm trying to tell you, yes, yes,
Speaker 1: make sure now. Defensively, I think just being a just
Speaker 1: they're going they're want to reach out to you anyway,
Speaker 1: the general manager, the president of the organization. They I mean,
Speaker 1: they started texting me right away, vernon very We're excited
Speaker 1: to get you, but I can't wait to get you here.
Speaker 1: They make it, you know, they go out their way
Speaker 1: to make sure they reach out to you. All right,
Speaker 1: super last one. We've seen these elevated different practice squads.
Speaker 1: Now the rules have been different the last few years,
Speaker 1: and teams keep picking up players that have played on
Speaker 1: another team. When you were in Washington, did you have
Speaker 1: any qualms talking about what Denver or San Francisco did?
Speaker 1: Would you ever reveal what you knew about a previous
Speaker 1: to your new team? You know, just you know, just
Speaker 1: a little things like how do certain players play against
Speaker 1: certain positions? Like you know, they might ask we played Denver,
Speaker 1: if von Miller, we gotta go against vom Miller. Coach
Speaker 1: might coming to me and say, how what do we
Speaker 1: need to know about von Miller on this particular play?
Speaker 1: I said, you might want to go inside because once
Speaker 1: the running back, if he's going this way, Von's gonna
Speaker 1: jump outside. He's gonna turn his butt out and he's
Speaker 1: gonna press with his right hand, so we have a
Speaker 1: chance to get that tight end on his upfield shoulder
Speaker 1: and just kind of just drop, you know, So a
Speaker 1: little little little things like little things, uh, little things
Speaker 1: but um, that's about it. But yeah, and you know,
Speaker 1: I think that's the nature of this game. That's what
Speaker 1: makes this game what it is, right because guys come
Speaker 1: from different teams and now they're able to give us information.
Speaker 1: Now it's up to that team to be really creative
Speaker 1: and not give out what they're doing, you know, so
Speaker 1: they don't give their plays in their scheme away. But
Speaker 1: I think for the most part, teams are really good
Speaker 1: like that. I know when I was playing with Washington
Speaker 1: before I retired, when you know, with Kirk Cousins, we
Speaker 1: would make sure we changed about signals from time to time,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, so the guys couldn't figure
Speaker 1: us out. So we're really good about that. Awesome, great well, Vernon,
Speaker 1: I so so appreciate this time, especially coming straight off
Speaker 1: of plane from Rome. And like you said, it's all
Speaker 1: worked out. You got the ring, you got another few
Speaker 1: years in a fun city, and you got prepped for
Speaker 1: a new career. Yes, Vernon Davis, you're the best. Thank
Speaker 1: you so so much. Thank you Pew is all I
Speaker 1: have to say, Mike after listening to Vernon Davis, Thank
Speaker 1: goodness your rap sheet tweet was fake because I'm not
Speaker 1: quite sure I could pack up this family and move
Speaker 1: across country and learn a new offense and do it
Speaker 1: all in eight hours. And I think it does scream
Speaker 1: to what Bill Belichick was talking about as we made
Speaker 1: reference to earlier in this show, about how complicated sometimes
Speaker 1: these moves can be from a player's perspective, but really
Speaker 1: telling and very appreciative of earning given us some time
Speaker 1: and really explaining what it's actually like for a player
Speaker 1: to be dealt at that trade deadline. I know you
Speaker 1: and I both love hearing from a lot of people
Speaker 1: that are listening to the show. We will do a
Speaker 1: mail bag episode at some point, so if you have
Speaker 1: some questions about the NFL that you want answers to
Speaker 1: at Mike Underscore, yam at a ki kabwala. I am
Speaker 1: keeping a running tab a deity of a lot of
Speaker 1: these questions, and I promise we will get to them
Speaker 1: at a later episode. But wherever you get your podcast,
Speaker 1: make sure you follow the NFL Explained Podcast not so mention.
Speaker 1: We always love to hear what you think. You can
Speaker 1: give us a rating and a review, and that Mike
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