Speaker 1: Welcome to How the Money. I'm Joel and I'm Matt.
Speaker 1: Today we're discussing how you should think twice before investing. Yes,
Speaker 1: we want you to think twice before investing, Joel. You know,
Speaker 1: just on Monday, we were talking with West Moss and
Speaker 1: he talked about when it comes to being happy, there
Speaker 1: are a lot of things that he found in his
Speaker 1: research that you can do or maybe not do, in
Speaker 1: order to achieve happiness. It's kind of like an Alec
Speaker 1: hartline and you can kind of pick whatever you want
Speaker 1: to kind of throw in the stew. Yeah, you you
Speaker 1: We we talked about how happiness is sort of like
Speaker 1: the stew. There's not this perfect recipe that you have
Speaker 1: to follow. It's not like baking, where you have to
Speaker 1: have very specific ingredients, the right quantity of ingredients, and
Speaker 1: you have to do them in the right order. When
Speaker 1: it comes to investing, investing is a lot more like baking.
Speaker 1: It's a little bit less like throwing a bunch of
Speaker 1: ingredients together in a big pot and just kind of,
Speaker 1: you know, seasoning to taste and being happy with what
Speaker 1: you have at the end of the day. Because if
Speaker 1: you don't follow the right rules when it comes to
Speaker 1: baking you could. Uh. That's the difference between a nice, sweet,
Speaker 1: fluffy cake uh and some salty plato uh. And we
Speaker 1: want to make sure that you end up with a
Speaker 1: nice cake uh, not something for your kids to play with.
Speaker 1: And I know the people who've been listening for a
Speaker 1: while might see that headline and they're like, what in
Speaker 1: the world, dudes, you talk about investing and only in
Speaker 1: the sunniest, rosiest terms. Why in the world are you
Speaker 1: coming out with a podcast. It's like, thing twice before
Speaker 1: doing this, And I promise we're not trying to be
Speaker 1: a click baity, but really, there are a bunch of
Speaker 1: things you need to think through before you actually start
Speaker 1: investing in. So that's really what this episode is about.
Speaker 1: It's saying, yes, we love it, we still think it's great,
Speaker 1: but there's some due diligence that needs to happen on
Speaker 1: the front end before you jump in head first. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And even a few weeks ago, we talked about the
Speaker 1: importance of investing over consumption, right, how ownership is key.
Speaker 1: And so now that we've convinced you now that you
Speaker 1: want to invest, we want to just taper things a
Speaker 1: little bit and say, hey, there are a number of
Speaker 1: things we want you to think about first. That's what
Speaker 1: we're talking about today, no doubt. Before we get to that, Matt,
Speaker 1: I just really quickly, you wanted to mention someone in
Speaker 1: our Facebook group recently was in a car accident. She
Speaker 1: seemed fine, which is fortunately she was. She was seemed
Speaker 1: like she wasn't hurt from what I could tell, and
Speaker 1: so Jessica, we wish you the best. But she had asked,
Speaker 1: what what what are people's best advice when you're in
Speaker 1: a car accident to make sure that you're not taking
Speaker 1: advantage of financially. And one of the things that it
Speaker 1: instantly made me think of that I don't know if
Speaker 1: we've ever talked about on the show, but I feel
Speaker 1: like for anybody who ever gets in a car accident,
Speaker 1: one of the things you need to remember in your
Speaker 1: potential battle with an insurance company is diminished value. Most people, Matt,
Speaker 1: don't even know what that means. But basically, if you're
Speaker 1: twenty dollar vehicle, hopefully it's more like a ten dollar vehicle.
Speaker 1: But let's say you're twenty thollar vehicle gets hit, yeah,
Speaker 1: and it causes eight thousand dollars worth of damage that
Speaker 1: has to be repaired. The insurance company is going to
Speaker 1: pay to have that car fixed. But the problem is
Speaker 1: or they might total it because if it's too much,
Speaker 1: damaging m title totally. But the thing is, after that
Speaker 1: damage is repaired, your car isn't worth anymore, even though
Speaker 1: the work has been done to repair it. The there's
Speaker 1: this thing called diminished value, where on that car Fax
Speaker 1: report that accident is going to live forever and if
Speaker 1: you try to resell it, it's not selling a pristine
Speaker 1: car that's never been an accident. It's selling a car
Speaker 1: that has had some damage done in the past, and
Speaker 1: that affects resale value. And so that is one of
Speaker 1: the things you should pay attention to. That's one of
Speaker 1: the things you should make sure you're asking your insurance
Speaker 1: company for payment for the diminished value of your vehicle.
Speaker 1: And there's actually an easy formula that you can run
Speaker 1: your car through to kind of come up with a
Speaker 1: realistic amount that you should be asking for. Well, we'll
Speaker 1: link to an article I think it was on bankreat
Speaker 1: dot com that goes through the details of that formula
Speaker 1: and how you can figure out dimnased value in your
Speaker 1: specific case. But that's just one of those things nobody
Speaker 1: talks about. UH. Being made whole in an accident also
Speaker 1: involves receiving compensation or the fact that your car is
Speaker 1: now worthless totally. UH. And it's worth noting too that
Speaker 1: this is specifically the case. When you are in an
Speaker 1: accident and it is the other person's fault. You can
Speaker 1: try to file a diminished value claim with your own
Speaker 1: insure if it's your fault, but they're likely going to
Speaker 1: say no, sorry, it was your fault. But if you
Speaker 1: were in an accident it was somebody else's fault, that
Speaker 1: is a claim that you would file with that insurance company.
Speaker 1: Sometimes it will involve you getting a professional appraisal of
Speaker 1: your vehicle. But I mean if you do have a
Speaker 1: twenty vehicle or even more thirty or forty thousand dollars
Speaker 1: on the line here, you know, getting spending three to
Speaker 1: four bucks on a on an appraisal, would one be
Speaker 1: worth the money if that means you're going to be
Speaker 1: made whole and to recoup some of that lost value
Speaker 1: because of the fact that you are in an accident exactly,
Speaker 1: and part of it is just proving your case. Sometimes
Speaker 1: you will need an appraisal if you're working with a
Speaker 1: particularly stubborn insurance company. It varies by state. Yeah, but
Speaker 1: hopefully that that actual formula for figuring out what the
Speaker 1: diminished value is in your specific case. Hopefully you can
Speaker 1: provide that and have to even hire someone and pay
Speaker 1: out a pocket that would Yeah, that would be ideal. So, yeah,
Speaker 1: make sure in the case of a car accident you
Speaker 1: don't forget about diminished value. But Matt, let's mention the
Speaker 1: beer that we're having on this episode. This one is
Speaker 1: called Emergency Drinking Beer. It's by Wild Heaven Brewing, which
Speaker 1: is just around the corner from us in Atlanta. Can
Speaker 1: you believe that we have never had a Wild Heaven
Speaker 1: beer on our show? Is this the first? It's I
Speaker 1: checked actually before before we hit record, and because I thought,
Speaker 1: certainly back in the day we had Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: when Wild Heaven first came on the scene, we actually
Speaker 1: enjoyed their beers a decent bit esctan. I remember that
Speaker 1: one in particular, being that delicious quad that we enjoyed
Speaker 1: one night playing some board games. But it has been
Speaker 1: a while since I've enjoyed their beers, and I'm excited
Speaker 1: for us to actually have one here on the show.
Speaker 1: Wild Heaven emergency drinking beer. We'll share our thoughts on
Speaker 1: this one at the end of the episode. Sounds good,
Speaker 1: All right, let's move on to the subject at hand.
Speaker 1: We're talking about thinking twice before investing and matters. We're
Speaker 1: preparing this one and made me think about road trips
Speaker 1: for some reason. And when you're heading to the beach,
Speaker 1: you don't just HAVEV in the car and start driving
Speaker 1: south to get there. If you're in Atlanta, right, unless
Speaker 1: you are the star of a sitcom, you're like, we're
Speaker 1: going to the beach. You're Kevin James and King of
Speaker 1: Queens or something like that, right, Yeah, And because like,
Speaker 1: let's if you're in college. I feel like that's the
Speaker 1: thing that that is something maybe you do in college
Speaker 1: where you just like, hey, guess what, I'm turning twenty
Speaker 1: one tomorrow. I want to wake up and see the
Speaker 1: sunrise at Charleston or at Folly Beach and Charleston. A
Speaker 1: friend of mine actually did that, and I opted not
Speaker 1: to go with him because classes early in the morning.
Speaker 1: I thought, I don't think I want to do that.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, you're responsible, sir. Yeah, Well, the thing is,
Speaker 1: if you literally just start driving south, you might hit
Speaker 1: a dead end, you might hit a road closure, you
Speaker 1: could get lost completely if you're just kind of going
Speaker 1: with a general navigational principle. And not only do you
Speaker 1: need a more specific set of directions, Fortunately you don't
Speaker 1: have to pronout those map quest directions like you did
Speaker 1: back in the college days. Remember those getting real nostalgic
Speaker 1: over here. That was terrible, that was the worst. But yeah,
Speaker 1: you you also actually need to have done some prep
Speaker 1: work in advance, like did you ask your boss for
Speaker 1: time off before this trip? Because if you didn't and
Speaker 1: you just don't show up on Monday, that's not going
Speaker 1: to be good for you. Right. Did you pack all
Speaker 1: your beach gear? Matt? You always come prepared with a
Speaker 1: shovel when you go to the beach. Oh, I'm a digger.
Speaker 1: I love digging in the sand, and so you know,
Speaker 1: you show up to the beach with a frown on
Speaker 1: your face if you didn't pack it ahead, and if
Speaker 1: I didn't have my my shovel, I would be sadness.
Speaker 1: The same is true when it comes to investing. You know,
Speaker 1: we talk a lot on how the money, about how
Speaker 1: you've got to get started investing. If you want to
Speaker 1: reach your bigger financial goals. We firmly believe this. It
Speaker 1: is a really, really important part of your personal finances
Speaker 1: and building your wealth. But you also don't want to
Speaker 1: pull the trigger before you've considered a bunch of important things.
Speaker 1: And that's what we want to talk about today. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and you know, there's a good chance that you are
Speaker 1: pretty much constantly hearing the quote unquote responsible voices all
Speaker 1: around you saying that you need to be investing. And
Speaker 1: if you are investing, when you say responsible voices, it
Speaker 1: makes me think of Toby in the office, by the way,
Speaker 1: It's like, yeah, I don't know, sound good. He's not
Speaker 1: respond I mean, just because he's hr doesn't mean he's responsible.
Speaker 1: He's just honestly though, I feel like Jim was always
Speaker 1: just the most responsible, well rounded person, which is why
Speaker 1: we liked him someone. But the fact is that is
Speaker 1: what you hear, and even if you are investing, you're
Speaker 1: likely going to hear folks around you saying that you
Speaker 1: should be investing more right It like, it's great that
Speaker 1: you're headed in the right direction, but let's ramp it up.
Speaker 1: And in fact, those are both sentiments that we regularly
Speaker 1: share here on the podcast. Investor early invest often. But
Speaker 1: if you just take some money and you just throw
Speaker 1: it into the market without a plan, without having specific goals,
Speaker 1: and without knowing where you currently are in your own
Speaker 1: personal finance journey, then the advice to just get investing
Speaker 1: may not be all that helpful, and it could in
Speaker 1: fact harm your personal finance journey down the road if
Speaker 1: you get started too early. You're right, Matt, Yeah, some
Speaker 1: people you've actually talked about how you are encouraged to
Speaker 1: start a roth ira really early on and over time
Speaker 1: that has been really good advice for you. But the
Speaker 1: minute that you opened up your raw ira was's not
Speaker 1: ready for not the best time for That's exactly exactly right,
Speaker 1: And the truth is that some people should avoid investing altogether,
Speaker 1: at least for now. That's because there are a number
Speaker 1: of other money gears that you'll need to get through first.
Speaker 1: And we've yeah, we have our seven money gears that
Speaker 1: we've talked about. I believe we did a whole episode
Speaker 1: in January this year. If you go to how to
Speaker 1: money dot com and you click the start here button,
Speaker 1: you'll see our seven money gears laid out, and it's
Speaker 1: essentially a financial order Operations of when you should do
Speaker 1: certain things, and if you do things out of order,
Speaker 1: just like making that making that cake, you're you're going
Speaker 1: to get a different end result. And so, for example,
Speaker 1: it's important to eliminate any high interest debts that are
Speaker 1: weighing you down before you start investing in attack sheltered
Speaker 1: account like a roth ira. We love roth iras, but
Speaker 1: if you're funding your roth ira before you pay down
Speaker 1: your credit card debt, that's not a smart move. The
Speaker 1: one exception we would say is investing enough to get
Speaker 1: the match that your employer offers if you have access
Speaker 1: to one. That's one of those things that you do
Speaker 1: actually want to take advantage of before you pay off
Speaker 1: that credit card debt. But other than that, we're big
Speaker 1: fans of you becoming an investor. We don't want you
Speaker 1: to put the cart before the horse. Want you to
Speaker 1: pay off those unsecured debts or any personal loans that
Speaker 1: have by interest rates too, before you dip your toes
Speaker 1: in the investing waters. You'll get there at some point,
Speaker 1: but now might not be the time. Yeah, And and
Speaker 1: harkening back to your road trip illustration, Joel, like before
Speaker 1: you even hit the road, there are some things that
Speaker 1: you need to do to make sure that you are
Speaker 1: road ready. Right, You've got to make sure you've got
Speaker 1: gas in the tank. Smart, to make sure you've had
Speaker 1: an oil change recently. Yeah, you want to ensure that
Speaker 1: your tires are inflated properly. You gotta have that playlist
Speaker 1: ready to Oh, that's true. You want to have to
Speaker 1: have the tunes ready to go. These are all important
Speaker 1: steps before you leave on a long road trip. Uh.
Speaker 1: And so similarly, you first want to make sure that
Speaker 1: you first have a solid financial foundation before you invest.
Speaker 1: And so, like you said, Joel, paying off that high
Speaker 1: interest debt that is important and this awesome means having
Speaker 1: enough money in the bank to ensure that you're able
Speaker 1: to withstand any unforeseen setbacks. That is the emergency fund.
Speaker 1: And so if you don't have a fully funded emergency
Speaker 1: fund in your bank, you are not ready to start investing.
Speaker 1: In our opinion. Uh. The cool thing though, is that
Speaker 1: you know once that credit card debt is paid off,
Speaker 1: once you've reached that level of savings, then you've got
Speaker 1: a green light to begin investing. Well, Matt, I would
Speaker 1: say you're almost right on that you do have the
Speaker 1: green lights. After a few more considerations. That's what this
Speaker 1: episode is about. Come on, man. But yeah, another really
Speaker 1: key factor, another thing that you have to have before
Speaker 1: you start your investing journey is knowledge, and that's something
Speaker 1: we want to help you receive here on how the money.
Speaker 1: We want to make sure that you understand the fundamentals
Speaker 1: of how any investment you're considering actually works, and do
Speaker 1: you know the how the specific accounts function and what
Speaker 1: they're designed for. You know, lots of folks are going
Speaker 1: straight to investing any brokerage account when they'd be better
Speaker 1: served to start with a roth ira A instead. That's
Speaker 1: our biggest gripe with robin Hood exactly. Yeah, the fact
Speaker 1: that robin Hood allows investors to start investing pretty easily
Speaker 1: is a nice feature. But when you can invest in
Speaker 1: those tax advantage accounts and you're just going straight to
Speaker 1: a brokerage account, a lot of people don't understand the difference,
Speaker 1: and they don't realize that there's going to be a
Speaker 1: big difference when it comes tax time for all the
Speaker 1: trades they've been making. And yeah, when it comes to
Speaker 1: the specific fund or individual stock or commodity or other
Speaker 1: opportunities that you might come across, you definitely shouldn't be
Speaker 1: making the investment because you saw it in a headline
Speaker 1: or because you saw someone say this stock is now
Speaker 1: a buy and you're like, oh, oh really, okay, I
Speaker 1: guess I should buy it, or maybe you saw promoted
Speaker 1: on Reddit. Right, that's definitely a high place for people
Speaker 1: to get investing tips these days that someone on CNBC say, oh,
Speaker 1: this stock is a loser and you need to get
Speaker 1: rid of it right away, and then you decide to
Speaker 1: short it because why not give that a shot too.
Speaker 1: All of those things like using your hard earned money
Speaker 1: to make decisions when you don't fundamentally understand what you're doing,
Speaker 1: that's something that we want to encourage you to actively avoid.
Speaker 1: And it does take research. It takes acquiring knowledge so
Speaker 1: that you can know what you're getting into before you
Speaker 1: put your money. There another thing to ever invest in
Speaker 1: anything you don't understand. If the investment is super complex,
Speaker 1: we would recommend you to avoid it if you do
Speaker 1: not understand how it works. So a real of thumb
Speaker 1: is that if you can explain how it works to
Speaker 1: like an eight year old, it's probably going to be
Speaker 1: a bad idea. So, for instance, when it comes to
Speaker 1: real estate investing, there are all sorts of ways to
Speaker 1: make money investing in physical homes. Some folks are making
Speaker 1: big bucks buying trailer parks or storage facilities and and
Speaker 1: and you know, I guess in this case, we understand
Speaker 1: how that works. But it's just not necessarily our specialty. Uh, Joel,
Speaker 1: you and I we both right now are sticking to
Speaker 1: single family homes near where we live here in Atlanta.
Speaker 1: And you know, could we do more, We could go bigger, certainly.
Speaker 1: And while you know, we are curious and we like
Speaker 1: learning about some of the different opportunities around us from
Speaker 1: the different ways that other investors make their money, we're
Speaker 1: kind of experts, you know, on this one particular form
Speaker 1: of real estate investing. We when we're looking for deals,
Speaker 1: we have a deep understanding of specific neighborhoods and we
Speaker 1: know that when something comes on the market, we know
Speaker 1: when there's a deal. And we've used that specific expertise
Speaker 1: to grow our wealth over the long all by sticking
Speaker 1: to this method, uh that we've been able to hone
Speaker 1: over the years. I'm just not as knowledgeable and comfortable
Speaker 1: with other methods, and so for now we've kind of
Speaker 1: stick to what we know. Like the back of our hand. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and it's completely in a way of investing that I
Speaker 1: feel like I can easily explain to my eight year old.
Speaker 1: She understands that people need a place to live and
Speaker 1: that they have to pay money to do that, and
Speaker 1: they go to work to get that money to pay
Speaker 1: someone for providing them housing. And yet there are other
Speaker 1: ways of making money in real estate that I can
Speaker 1: barely understand, and so then explaining it to my eight
Speaker 1: year old becomes impossible, and so she's like, huh, Dad,
Speaker 1: I don't get it. Like it sounds like you don't
Speaker 1: get it either, and that is a surefire sign that
Speaker 1: I should stay away from investing in that way. But
Speaker 1: we've got more to get to when it comes to
Speaker 1: what you need to think about before you actually get
Speaker 1: into investing. A lot of it has to do with
Speaker 1: what's going on in your own life, in your own
Speaker 1: specific goals. Will get to that and more right after
Speaker 1: this break. Alright, we're back. We're talking about why you
Speaker 1: should be thinking twice before you start investing, and so
Speaker 1: let's dive in. Right, You've done the necessary prep work
Speaker 1: ahead of time. You've got all your ingredients laid out,
Speaker 1: means in plas when it comes to cooking and baking.
Speaker 1: You're ready to bake that cake, You're ready to begin investing.
Speaker 1: I didn't know you were bilingual, Matt. Yeah, that's my
Speaker 1: two French words. But one of the biggest aspects of
Speaker 1: investing that you need to think twice about, though, is
Speaker 1: your time frame. And you can't think about your time
Speaker 1: frame really without considering your specific goals. Your your time
Speaker 1: horizon is going to be everything when it comes to investing.
Speaker 1: You get that one thing wrong and what might have
Speaker 1: been a great decision maybe turns out to be a
Speaker 1: terrible one for you. So, for example, if you're invested
Speaker 1: in the SNP back around the dot com bubble back
Speaker 1: around two thousand right, or even during the Great Recession
Speaker 1: back in two thousand and eight, two thousand nine, or
Speaker 1: even more recently during the pandemic last spring, if you
Speaker 1: were following the fluctuations too closely, yeah, look was looking
Speaker 1: pretty grim. But when you zoom out a bit, it
Speaker 1: is easy to see that there were turns are now
Speaker 1: looking great. This is an instance where your time frame
Speaker 1: is going to have a massive impact on what you
Speaker 1: perceive to be good news or bad news. You know,
Speaker 1: they say timing is everything, and I tend to agree.
Speaker 1: It makes me think about when I first started dating
Speaker 1: Emily matt Uh. I thought she was really pretty. I
Speaker 1: wanted to ask her out. It turned out she was
Speaker 1: dating somebody else and it wasn't It wasn't really good
Speaker 1: time to ask her out. And then I did ask
Speaker 1: her out. Once they broke up and we went on
Speaker 1: three dates, things weren't clicking. It just wasn't the right time.
Speaker 1: But later on, like we as we developed more of
Speaker 1: a friendship, we started dating again. That was the right time.
Speaker 1: And so yeah, third times the charm and so like, yeah,
Speaker 1: you never know when you know. When it comes to
Speaker 1: the timing of your investment decisions, that and and how
Speaker 1: long you plan to be invested for, you have to
Speaker 1: know your own time rise. And that is a huge
Speaker 1: part of thinking twice before investing is saying how long
Speaker 1: am I gonna be doing this for? And yeah, if
Speaker 1: you don't have the right timing, you could be in
Speaker 1: for some heartache. It's important to understand that there be
Speaker 1: periods of time where you're going to lose money even
Speaker 1: in the market. You know, given fluctuations, like there's gonna
Speaker 1: be weeks, months, or even years where an investment you've
Speaker 1: made it doesn't look very good and you're disappointed and
Speaker 1: you're like, well, Matt and Joel said, investing is supposed
Speaker 1: to be a good thing. They always talk it up. Well,
Speaker 1: that's really what we why we want how the money
Speaker 1: listeners to develop a long term mentality. The gyrations that
Speaker 1: happened consistently, they're going to happen, the volatility you're going
Speaker 1: to see, they're they're just not worth your time and attention.
Speaker 1: If you are a long term investor, and I guess
Speaker 1: then the question pops up, does it ever make sense
Speaker 1: to be a short term investor? We would say not
Speaker 1: really not in our opinion. If my short term you
Speaker 1: mean five years, then that's probably okay on a timeline
Speaker 1: that's that long. But if you're talking like six months,
Speaker 1: one year, two years, it's probably not a good idea
Speaker 1: to be much of an investor. If we're talking about
Speaker 1: a whole lot less than five years, you run the
Speaker 1: risk of needing to pull money out during a bear
Speaker 1: market correction. And that's why that time frame is so crucial,
Speaker 1: is so important. If you don't get that part of
Speaker 1: it right, if you haven't thought twice about how long
Speaker 1: you can leave that money be uh, leave that money
Speaker 1: to grow, then you might need to grab it at
Speaker 1: the exact wrong moment, locking in losses. That's right, and
Speaker 1: that's actually the exact opposite of what I'm looking for
Speaker 1: when I invest my money. I don't know about you,
Speaker 1: but I don't I don't want to lose money. I mean, essentially,
Speaker 1: you know, the longer your timeline, like, the more risk
Speaker 1: you can actually handle. And in fact, the longer your timeline,
Speaker 1: the more that the real risk actually becomes not investing.
Speaker 1: I will actually get to that here a little bit
Speaker 1: later on in this episode, but you've got to ask
Speaker 1: yourself the question, am I okay losing some money? Because
Speaker 1: loss a version, it is a real thing, is something
Speaker 1: that none of us really want to experience, but it
Speaker 1: comes down to your ability to stomach it. And many
Speaker 1: folks have a hard time investing because of this potential
Speaker 1: to see that balance decrease, because it takes an emotional toll,
Speaker 1: even though short term losses are completely insignificant to our
Speaker 1: long term investment plan. Or if it does play a role,
Speaker 1: it's just a signal that maybe you should buy a
Speaker 1: little bit more while everything's on sale. But This is
Speaker 1: exactly why people don't put lump sums in to the market,
Speaker 1: even though everything points to the fact that time in
Speaker 1: the market is more important than actually timing your entrance
Speaker 1: into the market. And then over the long term, we
Speaker 1: can take comfort in knowing that the market it goes
Speaker 1: up nine eight percent of the time over any fifteen
Speaker 1: year period. Long term investing wins uh. And actually, the
Speaker 1: only reason that it's not one, the reason it's percent
Speaker 1: instead of one of the time over fifteen year periods
Speaker 1: is because of the Great Depression. If you look at
Speaker 1: the fifteen year period between that in World War Two,
Speaker 1: it's basically had the two most significant events that had
Speaker 1: a negative impact on our modern economy, and fingers crossed,
Speaker 1: we're not likely to see something like that again. Yeah. So,
Speaker 1: so when we're talking about taking the long term view,
Speaker 1: we're talking about investing in those tax advantage accounts that
Speaker 1: are specifically designed for your money to be there for decades.
Speaker 1: So like your four one K or your I RA
Speaker 1: A are the accounts that you should be looking to
Speaker 1: first put your investment dollars inside of. And that means
Speaker 1: no touchies for a long long time. And so, yeah,
Speaker 1: if you're just starting out in your career. It's probably
Speaker 1: gonna seem a little bit weird to start saving for
Speaker 1: those goals that are so far away that you're not
Speaker 1: even sure if you'll actually get there. You're kind of
Speaker 1: like plan on living hard and dying young. So I
Speaker 1: don't know, Matt and Joel, the the advice to invest
Speaker 1: for my sixties and seventies just doesn't fit me. But
Speaker 1: the thing is, that's what you think now at twenty two,
Speaker 1: But you will actually get to that future point it
Speaker 1: in the earlier you start. Even if it's just with
Speaker 1: small amounts, it's gonna add up and it's going to
Speaker 1: make a huge difference for future you. And so yeah,
Speaker 1: stats actually show that we become better investors. We can
Speaker 1: think more about the actual long term if we can
Speaker 1: visualize our future selves. And this might sound a bit cheesy, Matt.
Speaker 1: Back in the day, I think you and I posted
Speaker 1: a face app photo of us being like, what thirty
Speaker 1: five years older? You definitely look much better as an
Speaker 1: old man than I do. Oh more like fifty five
Speaker 1: years older man? Was that a right? We were like
Speaker 1: set up like eighty five year olds? Okay, all right, well,
Speaker 1: uh yeah, it turns out that even just doing something
Speaker 1: like that, there was a study done a bunch of
Speaker 1: years back, and it's actually gonna give you more sympathy
Speaker 1: for future you, for geriatric you, and it will actually
Speaker 1: help you start the process that you know you need to. So,
Speaker 1: if you've found yourself not saving for retirement because you're like,
Speaker 1: you can't comprehend you can't bridge the gap between being
Speaker 1: in your twenties or thirties and then being in your seventies,
Speaker 1: like that's hard to come to grips with, something as
Speaker 1: simple as taking a picture, putting in the face app
Speaker 1: seeing what an older version of yourself could look like
Speaker 1: can actually help incentivize you to start doing the hard
Speaker 1: work and saving for the long term. Now, yeah, and
Speaker 1: you know we just gave that stat on the stock
Speaker 1: market performance over a fifteen year timeline. Well, here's the thing.
Speaker 1: Once your time frame starts to become shorter than fifteen years,
Speaker 1: you actually do start to realize a higher risk of
Speaker 1: loss UH in what you're actually invested in should likely
Speaker 1: start to change, and so it has an impact on
Speaker 1: what you invest in. Uh if you're looking at investing
Speaker 1: for the next fifteen years or longer, we are huge
Speaker 1: fans of simply going with the total stock market or
Speaker 1: the smp F under indexes out there in order to
Speaker 1: maximize those higher gains with But if you are looking
Speaker 1: at investing for a goal, say in the next five
Speaker 1: to ten years, like kids college, for instance, then looking
Speaker 1: to something like a target date fund could make more
Speaker 1: sense for you. So of course, the great thing about
Speaker 1: target date funds is that they rebalance over the years
Speaker 1: and they automatically become more conservative by allocating more of
Speaker 1: the portfolio away from stocks and towards bonds. This decreases
Speaker 1: the volatility and it lowers the risk that you're going
Speaker 1: to be pulling some money out of the market uh
Speaker 1: during a slump where you lock in those losses. So
Speaker 1: this is just a good thing to keep in mind
Speaker 1: that your goals and your time frame do have an
Speaker 1: impact on how and what it is that you are
Speaker 1: actually invested in no doubt. So that was a lot
Speaker 1: about personal goals and time frame and how you think
Speaker 1: about volatility inside of that, and there are a lot
Speaker 1: of personal decisions that you have to make a about that.
Speaker 1: And yeah, if you're listening to how the money and
Speaker 1: you're in your fifties or sixties, you're going to make
Speaker 1: different allocation decisions than someone who is in their twenties
Speaker 1: or thirties in all likelihood, right, And so the next
Speaker 1: thing to do, still on a personal level, is you know,
Speaker 1: now that you're hopefully identifying as a long term investor,
Speaker 1: you're saying, you know what, I'm gonna invest my money
Speaker 1: for a minimum of five years. You're gonna want to
Speaker 1: have an actionable plan. And then it's also crucial to
Speaker 1: write that plan down. So yeah, anything we would say
Speaker 1: that you write down instantly creates a stickier effect. Studies
Speaker 1: actually show that when you write something you hear down,
Speaker 1: you're far more likely to remember it. So let's say
Speaker 1: you are in class in college and your professor is
Speaker 1: lecturing typing versus handwriting. The handwriting is actually going to
Speaker 1: make it stickier in your brain. You're gonna do better
Speaker 1: on the test even if you never review those notes again. Uh,
Speaker 1: handwriting versus typing. Really, just that simple act changes the
Speaker 1: way your brain processes the information that you're receiving. So yeah,
Speaker 1: we would say there's something about writing down by hand.
Speaker 1: This small short doesn't have to be very long statement,
Speaker 1: this investment plan, it's gonna help reinforce it. It's gonna
Speaker 1: make it easier to recall even if it's not in
Speaker 1: front of you. That's true. But if you happen to
Speaker 1: be somebody who lives uh in an apartment or a
Speaker 1: house where there's no paper, I would still say that
Speaker 1: you find it on the walls. I mean, well, typing
Speaker 1: it out like that's better than nothing, right, because I
Speaker 1: mean I will say, like people who I meet sometimes
Speaker 1: I will run over to notes on my phone real
Speaker 1: quick and write down their name, what they do, you know,
Speaker 1: specifically who their kid is, because like meeting parents at school,
Speaker 1: oftentimes that's the case and the ability to refer back
Speaker 1: to that is invaluable. And so that's remembering facts in
Speaker 1: a college course or remembering parents or kids names. But
Speaker 1: the same thing is true with making sure that you
Speaker 1: write down your plan of attack when it comes to investing.
Speaker 1: You know, just the mere act of just taking pen
Speaker 1: to paper or writing out your plan in a in
Speaker 1: a notes app is going to reinforce your newfound plan
Speaker 1: uh and and then having it on hay and for
Speaker 1: future reference is incredibly helpful as well. I don't know
Speaker 1: how many times I've gone to my document where I
Speaker 1: write these parents names down and I search a word
Speaker 1: that I think is associated with their name, and I
Speaker 1: can find it, and then all of a sudden, I
Speaker 1: remember their name and I can pick up the conversation
Speaker 1: where we left off. And so this can be as
Speaker 1: simple as a plan to invest five dollars into the
Speaker 1: market every single month without fail in order for you
Speaker 1: to max out your your wrath I ray every single year.
Speaker 1: And when it comes to what to invest in, if
Speaker 1: you've got a time frame of at least fifteen years,
Speaker 1: like many of us do when it comes to our
Speaker 1: retirement goals, then simply put that money in a total
Speaker 1: stock market or the SMP five index fund. It can
Speaker 1: literally be as simple as that. But making sure that
Speaker 1: you write it out and that you can refer to
Speaker 1: it will help you to stay the course. Yeah, Matt,
Speaker 1: And there's a really, really good reason that we recommend
Speaker 1: investing in a total stock market or an SMP five
Speaker 1: hundred index fund for a whole lot of people, and
Speaker 1: it's because it's simple. It's a really simple approach, and
Speaker 1: I think a whole lot of One of the major
Speaker 1: reasons that people don't even get started investing, ever, is
Speaker 1: because the financial services industry has made it sound like
Speaker 1: it's really difficult, and we're trying to say no, no,
Speaker 1: actually it's not, and don't let perfect be the enemy
Speaker 1: of great. And you know, low cost index funds are
Speaker 1: a great way to get started in investing. But on
Speaker 1: that note, there are other considerations that you need to
Speaker 1: be aware of before you take the leap into investing in.
Speaker 1: One of them is fees. We'll talk about that and
Speaker 1: how not every index fund is created equal. We'll get
Speaker 1: to that right after this. All right, we're back from
Speaker 1: the break and we're still talking about how you need
Speaker 1: to think twice before investing in Joel et s too.
Speaker 1: Some of the other considerations, specifically fees. Let's talk about him, man.
Speaker 1: We uh, you know, we discussed a whole lot about
Speaker 1: low cost index funds, target date funds. If you purchase
Speaker 1: a total stock market index funds via Vanguard, uh Fidelity,
Speaker 1: even in one or a Schwab, you're gonna pay next
Speaker 1: to nothing to do so. And interestingly enough, some brokers
Speaker 1: charge an arm and a leg for what are essentially
Speaker 1: identical funds. There are still somehow lots of investment firms
Speaker 1: who are charging in the point five percent range for
Speaker 1: you to invest your money in the total stock market
Speaker 1: or the smp F hundred index funds with their firms. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and so that's ten times what you should actually be
Speaker 1: paying with our favorites, who are either either charging literally
Speaker 1: zero or point zero four percent and point zero four
Speaker 1: it sounds like that, like in your head, especially when
Speaker 1: you hear it audibly, you're like, what's what's the big difference, dude?
Speaker 1: This is a massive different different ten x. These are
Speaker 1: huge savings in that same gap exists in our other
Speaker 1: favorite funds, target date funds. The low cost brokerage firms
Speaker 1: make it really cheap to invest in those, but a
Speaker 1: lot of others are still charging uh, pretty high fees.
Speaker 1: We've talked in depth about the impact of fees on
Speaker 1: your investment returns, but uh, if you're paying around one
Speaker 1: percent in additional fees every single year, that could cost
Speaker 1: you of your portfolio's value over forty years. And so,
Speaker 1: just simply put, right, instead of having a million dollars
Speaker 1: by the time you hit retirement, you might actually only
Speaker 1: have seven fifty dollars. And so you want to make
Speaker 1: sure that you are paying close attention to those fees
Speaker 1: important that there's just a really high impact of a
Speaker 1: small amount of fee increase and it seems like that, well,
Speaker 1: what's the difference between point one and point three, and
Speaker 1: it's like, actually, it really really adds up significantly, and
Speaker 1: it's your money. Then it's eroding if you're paying high fees.
Speaker 1: And so before you invest, when we're talking about thinking
Speaker 1: twice before investing, looking taking a hard look at the
Speaker 1: fees uh at that your brokerage is charging you to
Speaker 1: invest inside of those funds is really important because oftentimes
Speaker 1: you you might just be in the wrong place. You
Speaker 1: might be at the wrong firm who is offering you
Speaker 1: access to one of the kinds of funds that we
Speaker 1: talked about, but they charge much more ridiculous fees, meaning
Speaker 1: you should you know, walk out of there and go
Speaker 1: more else, preferably to one of the low cost providers
Speaker 1: that Matt mentioned that isn't going to fee you to death,
Speaker 1: that's going to allow your money to work more for
Speaker 1: you less for someone else. And another consideration we would
Speaker 1: say you need to make before you take the leap
Speaker 1: into investing, you have to ask that question, how liquid
Speaker 1: is my money at Some investment accounts give you access
Speaker 1: to your money in an instant. You can put some
Speaker 1: money in today, you can pull it out tomorrow even
Speaker 1: if you want. That's what we're talking about earlier with
Speaker 1: brokerage accounts right to give you that ability, but there
Speaker 1: are tax implications of doing that. That is actually one
Speaker 1: of the cool things about the Rath I RA, which
Speaker 1: we love. It's one of our favorite investing vehicles. If
Speaker 1: you need to take some of that money out down
Speaker 1: the road, you actually have access to the money you've
Speaker 1: contributed without paying any tax or penalty on it. And
Speaker 1: so the Rath kind of gives you that balanced approach
Speaker 1: where it's like, oh wow, yeah, if if I do
Speaker 1: get in a pinch, I can take at least the
Speaker 1: contribution portion out of that if God forbid, something awful
Speaker 1: happened and I and I really needed it. But but
Speaker 1: for the most part, retirement accounts are inaccessible, and they're
Speaker 1: inaccessible for a reason. Right. There's penalties to make sure
Speaker 1: that you don't touch the money that you're putting aside,
Speaker 1: uh until decades from now. That's kind of the point
Speaker 1: of these accounts, and so there is a a stick
Speaker 1: essentially to prevent you from doing so. But it's important
Speaker 1: to know whether you're gonna have access to the money
Speaker 1: you've invested, or whether it's essentially locked away for years
Speaker 1: and years to come, and what sort of penalty you'll
Speaker 1: incur if you absolutely have to have it. Knowing the
Speaker 1: rules around that and how liquid your funds actually are
Speaker 1: is important, especially when you're considering which investment vehicle you're
Speaker 1: gonna put that money inside of this right, Uh, let's
Speaker 1: talk to you about inflation, because it's also important to
Speaker 1: know what will happen to your money if you choose
Speaker 1: not to become an investor, and that is that you're
Speaker 1: going to see the value of your money erode, and
Speaker 1: that erosion gets worse and worse as the as the
Speaker 1: years chug along. Not investing for a year, maybe two years,
Speaker 1: it's not the worst thing in the world. It's not
Speaker 1: gonna be the end of the world for you. But
Speaker 1: if you choose to wait another decade before you start investing,
Speaker 1: you will have lost some really important years and it compounds.
Speaker 1: And if you've been holding on to that money just
Speaker 1: in savings accounts or other safe places quote unquote safe places, right,
Speaker 1: it's not really safe there. You're actually taking on more
Speaker 1: risk than you should. Inflation is often referred to this
Speaker 1: invisible force. Uh. And it's just this way that we're
Speaker 1: essentially taxed without realizing it. This is something that a
Speaker 1: lot of economists UH point to, like Milton Freeman says
Speaker 1: that this is the one form of taxation that's imposed
Speaker 1: on us without legislation. Thomas Souls says something really similar.
Speaker 1: But we need to be aware of the fact that
Speaker 1: inflation does a road on money, even if it's not
Speaker 1: being extracted from our accounts by a fee or an
Speaker 1: actual heart tax that we're paying. Yeah, and of course
Speaker 1: inflation top of mind these days, and so yes, hopefully
Speaker 1: that helps drive the point home that not investing means
Speaker 1: your money is going to get eaten alive by inflation
Speaker 1: over time. And let's give some stats to back that up.
Speaker 1: For instance, if you stuck a dollar under your mattress
Speaker 1: in ninety three, when I was negative eleven years old,
Speaker 1: it would be worth basically fifteen cents in today's economy.
Speaker 1: The that's because inflation continues to take along. It is.
Speaker 1: What Matt said, is this silent mover that you, uh,
Speaker 1: you almost don't see until the headlines start to recognize
Speaker 1: it and you're like, wait a second, it is having
Speaker 1: an impact. But in most years you barely realize it
Speaker 1: doesn't register on your radar that things are getting more expensive,
Speaker 1: but they are. And so, yeah, being a good saver,
Speaker 1: it's obviously important. We extol the virtues of saving money
Speaker 1: a lot, like we think it's important, But if you
Speaker 1: keep all of the money that you're saving in cash,
Speaker 1: it's going to be worth less and less over time.
Speaker 1: Cash it's not trash. I think that's another terrible misnomer
Speaker 1: when it comes to cash. We we think having money
Speaker 1: and savings money and an emergency fund that liquid cash
Speaker 1: to back you up in case something happens. That's really important.
Speaker 1: But it's also not where you want the majority of
Speaker 1: your net worth either. And if the majority of your
Speaker 1: net worth is in cash, well then you're gonna see
Speaker 1: your net worth slowly start to decline. And yeah, the
Speaker 1: only way to come at that really is through investing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think another way to think about inflation it's, you know,
Speaker 1: with distilling, Like when you're like whiskey goes in barrels,
Speaker 1: it's like an angel share exactly. Yeah, when it says
Speaker 1: there in the in the barrels, a little bit of
Speaker 1: it evaporates over time, and the distillers they call that
Speaker 1: the angel share, and that that's why there's like twenty
Speaker 1: something year old scotches are so much more expensive. Is
Speaker 1: one of the reasons there's been more evaporation, right, and
Speaker 1: literally you are paying for the fact that, well, maybe
Speaker 1: ten years ago you would have gotten a lot more
Speaker 1: for your money, but now there's a lot less. And
Speaker 1: so it's just another way to think about inflation. Is
Speaker 1: this portion of your money that you're just seeing, you know,
Speaker 1: evaporate up to the heavens, to the angels. But up
Speaker 1: until now, you know, we've been primarily talking about investing
Speaker 1: in the stock market, but it's also important to point
Speaker 1: out that there are other ways to invest that might
Speaker 1: align with your strengths and your skills that could lead
Speaker 1: to better outcomes. And I'm thinking specifically about starting a
Speaker 1: small business, because they can often take a lot of
Speaker 1: money to get an operation off the ground, especially if
Speaker 1: it involves a physical space, right, like a brick and
Speaker 1: mortar space, And that is money that might work harder
Speaker 1: for you in your business rather than invested in the
Speaker 1: stock market. And so, you know, Joel, you mentioned our
Speaker 1: money years earlier, and they're pretty formulaic but for the
Speaker 1: vast majority of folks, we feel that they are going
Speaker 1: to work really well for you. They're gonna get you
Speaker 1: on that path to financial independence. But we wanted to
Speaker 1: mention starting your own business because we feel that there
Speaker 1: is room for nuanced conversation and there's room for opportunities
Speaker 1: like this. When it comes to thinking twice before investing.
Speaker 1: You don't have to always say, Okay, you must invest
Speaker 1: as much money as you can in the stock market
Speaker 1: before you pursue this opportunity. But there are ways for
Speaker 1: you to say, you know what, this is something that
Speaker 1: is unique to me. That is something that you need
Speaker 1: to say to yourself that you need to ask yourself,
Speaker 1: because everyone out there knows their own personal specific situation
Speaker 1: better than we do, and sometimes it is worth taking
Speaker 1: the non fundamental look and approach towards investing your money
Speaker 1: as well. Yeah, if you've got an extra ten grand
Speaker 1: and you're like Matt and Joelson, I should invest it
Speaker 1: in the SMP five hunder, but I really wanted to
Speaker 1: start my own business. We don't necessarily just go to
Speaker 1: the stock market direction, because at ten grand invested in
Speaker 1: your own online business or local business, whatever it may be,
Speaker 1: could pay much bigger dividends for you down the road,
Speaker 1: and it could provide a source of like continual income
Speaker 1: of livelihood. And if it's something you're passionate about too,
Speaker 1: you have to factor that in. So, yeah, you definitely
Speaker 1: don't want to be a robot. You want to consider
Speaker 1: your own personal goals and if getting your own business
Speaker 1: off the ground is part of that, or investing in
Speaker 1: yourself to increase your skills, that's another thing that doesn't
Speaker 1: get talked about enough. We would say that, yeah, you
Speaker 1: can earn more over the years if you were to
Speaker 1: invest more in education or skills building, and so that's
Speaker 1: something you have to consider too. It's not just about
Speaker 1: putting more money in your wrath. If you need to
Speaker 1: half cut your ROTH contributions in half for this year
Speaker 1: so that you can go back and get a couple
Speaker 1: of additional skills so that you can make more money,
Speaker 1: that's a good investment. To get recertified. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: if that's if it's some sort of certification that you need,
Speaker 1: Sure you no certification needed for podcast. That's either lucky
Speaker 1: or unlucky, depending on how you view it. But yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: and like so as we're fond of saying personal finance
Speaker 1: is personal, so it really is important to think through
Speaker 1: your own personal goals and how investing fits into those.
Speaker 1: In most of the time, you'll realize that saving and
Speaker 1: investing more of your money is what's going to actually
Speaker 1: allow you to achieve those goals a whole lot sooner.
Speaker 1: But occasionally you might have a more near term goal,
Speaker 1: which means putting more of that money towards an expense
Speaker 1: and seeing it shrink or towards that business to making
Speaker 1: sure he gets off the ground, rather than putting it
Speaker 1: towards an investment and seeing it grow. Another example of
Speaker 1: that on the purchase side would be a house for
Speaker 1: your primary residence. That's that's an example. You know you
Speaker 1: could you could take the down payment and you could
Speaker 1: invest it and keep renting instead of buying a like
Speaker 1: Sweet three two in a neighborhood near where you live.
Speaker 1: And sure you're likely to see a better return on
Speaker 1: your investments. But there are some things that are worth
Speaker 1: spending money on, and you just need to know what
Speaker 1: those things are for you. There's how healthy balance to
Speaker 1: be struck when it comes to investing. We think investing
Speaker 1: is great, but if you're foregoing those other important life
Speaker 1: goals that you have for yourself in order to just
Speaker 1: quote unquote invest more. It's possible that you might get
Speaker 1: to the point where you would be investing what could
Speaker 1: be considered an unhealthy amount for you. But here's the thing,
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, investing it's a really
Speaker 1: great thing. We don't want you to listen to this
Speaker 1: episode and realize or or to think that we're trying
Speaker 1: to steer you away from investing, because truly, we want
Speaker 1: all of our our listeners out there to get to
Speaker 1: the point where they are investing decent chunks of their
Speaker 1: income on a regular basis, but not before you've asked
Speaker 1: yourself some of the important questions right and making sure
Speaker 1: that you've gone through some of those initial money gears.
Speaker 1: And while there are some great resources out there for
Speaker 1: buy and hold investors, it really does feel like all
Speaker 1: the headlines these days are highlighting short term trades and
Speaker 1: risky investment options. We do not want you to succumb
Speaker 1: to the noisiest folks and headlines out there. We want
Speaker 1: you to know your plan, and we want you to
Speaker 1: write it down and then to stick to it. We
Speaker 1: want you to not only be an investor but we
Speaker 1: want you to be an informed investor where you're knowing
Speaker 1: how and why it is that you're making the decisions
Speaker 1: that you make, and we hope that we've been able
Speaker 1: to steer you in that direction with this episode, no doubt.
Speaker 1: And if you're like, I don't know, I'm still feeling confused,
Speaker 1: I've got some specific questions. That's why we have our
Speaker 1: ask h Team episodes for seriously, send in your investing question.
Speaker 1: We'd love to tackle your specific one on an upcoming show.
Speaker 1: It's really easy to do that. You can go to
Speaker 1: have the Money dot com and find the directions there.
Speaker 1: But Matt, let's get back to the beer that we
Speaker 1: had while we were talking about investing here and rethinking
Speaker 1: your approach to it. This one was Emergency Drinking Beer
Speaker 1: by Wild Heaven. It's a pilsner from them. Yeah, what
Speaker 1: was your take on this beer? Well, we don't necessarily
Speaker 1: plan our beers out to go with our episodes, but
Speaker 1: it is worth mentioning that it it is called emergency
Speaker 1: drinking beer, and like we said during the episode, you
Speaker 1: want to make sure you've got that emergency fund before
Speaker 1: you invest. But let's actually, yeah, let's talk about the beer. Uh,
Speaker 1: it is hard to get past the branding of this beer.
Speaker 1: It is an all yellow cane with just stark writing
Speaker 1: across the front of it, and it it just says emergency
Speaker 1: drinking beer sort of, you know, not un like emergency
Speaker 1: drinking water and like a FEMA zone where there's a
Speaker 1: natural disaster and everyone's having to bring in water. And
Speaker 1: I agree that we should also have that when it
Speaker 1: comes to beer, because there are certain emergencies that just
Speaker 1: call for solid quality drinking beer. I will tweet it
Speaker 1: FEMA right away and then make sure they're incorporating this
Speaker 1: into future disaster really plans. You know what's really funny
Speaker 1: is I remember when they first came out with this beer,
Speaker 1: all of the water in the city where this where
Speaker 1: the brewery is went out like there is a I
Speaker 1: don't know, like a pump ottage And anytime there is
Speaker 1: a pump outage like that, you know, you're not like
Speaker 1: a boil water advice. Yeah, you're not supposed to drink
Speaker 1: it because it's been exposed to air or something. I
Speaker 1: don't know how how it works or whatever. But they
Speaker 1: had just released this beer, uh, and they totally were
Speaker 1: able to dovetail that natural disaster on a very small
Speaker 1: scale with the release of this beer. But man, this
Speaker 1: is I mean, it's a Pilsner style ale and so
Speaker 1: it tastes like beer, Like like, there's there's nothing really
Speaker 1: super unique about it. It tastes like your uncle smell
Speaker 1: that Thanksgiving. That's probably pretty accurate. What were your thoughts
Speaker 1: on a Joel, I mean smelled like my uncle was
Speaker 1: being honest, But yeah, I would say it's it's chill,
Speaker 1: it's light, and it's kind of got like a just
Speaker 1: a light biscuity kind of flavor going on with that breadiness. Yeah,
Speaker 1: just just a little bit, but just eminently drinkable. If
Speaker 1: you're one of those people who's like, I like the
Speaker 1: old school style of beers, I'm not really into like
Speaker 1: beer from the eighties, all the happy, hazy, stoudy, all
Speaker 1: that kind of stuff, and you're like, I just want
Speaker 1: to beer that tastes like beer, this is a good
Speaker 1: one for you to check out, for sure. So all right,
Speaker 1: that's gonna do it for this episode. For If you
Speaker 1: want the show notes for this episode, including links to
Speaker 1: anything that we mentioned, well, you can find those up
Speaker 1: on our website at how to money dot com. And
Speaker 1: if you haven't yet already. Make sure to rate and
Speaker 1: review our podcast over at Apple Podcasts or wherever you
Speaker 1: like to listen to your favorite podcasts, and a big
Speaker 1: thank you in advance, because that truly does help to
Speaker 1: get the word out and it allows other folks to
Speaker 1: find this podcast, all right, Joel, that's gonna be it
Speaker 1: for this episode, buddy. Until next time, Best Friends Out,
Speaker 1: Best Friends Out, m M