Speaker 1: Hey, and welcome to what Future. I'm your host, Joshua
Speaker 1: to Pulsky. Nothing's on my mind. My mind is absolutely
Speaker 1: vacant at this point. I'm so drained of ideas, I'm
Speaker 1: so drained of inspiration. Right now, I'm a husk. I'm
Speaker 1: a shell of a person. Like I'm walking around. It
Speaker 1: looks like a person. I'm talking, I'm doing things, and
Speaker 1: yet inside there's just nothing. It's empty, It's hollow in here,
Speaker 1: and I'm just very tired. You know, it's the end
Speaker 1: of January. I try to do dry January. I failed
Speaker 1: Dry January became wet January, and I have to say
Speaker 1: it makes me a lot happier to drink. And you know,
Speaker 1: maybe that is a bad sign. Maybe that's maybe that
Speaker 1: means there's something wrong with me. But there's something wrong
Speaker 1: with everybody. I mean, it's not just me. It's all
Speaker 1: people have a problem, and some people fill that problem
Speaker 1: up with vodka, and some people, you know, I don't
Speaker 1: know what other people do, because I'm I'm not going
Speaker 1: to make assumptions about humanity or not. Maybe I'll make
Speaker 1: assumptions about humanity, just not individual people that make up humanity. Anyhow,
Speaker 1: this has nothing to do with the fantastic guests that
Speaker 1: we have on the show today, who hopefully, if he
Speaker 1: is not already a household name, he should become a
Speaker 1: household name. Of course I'm talking about and you don't
Speaker 1: know what I say, of course, like you know who
Speaker 1: exactly who I'm talking about, but it could be literally anybody.
Speaker 1: But I'm talking about fascinating and hilarious man named Dallas
Speaker 1: gold Tooth. You may have seen his work on the
Speaker 1: show Reservation Dogs. And he's here with me now. So
Speaker 1: I'm gonna say a few things about you. You're an actor,
Speaker 1: is that true? I am in some In some circles,
Speaker 1: they would say yes, a writer, is that correct? Yes,
Speaker 1: that is correct, an activist, an organizer? True or false?
Speaker 1: I would say true? Okay, co founder of comedy group. Yes, okay,
Speaker 1: Wow that was intense. I felt that. Hold on, But
Speaker 1: now before we get into all the interesting stuff. How
Speaker 1: much sleep did you get last night? How many hours
Speaker 1: did you got? I got two and a half hours
Speaker 1: of sleep? Yes? Why why would you only sleep for
Speaker 1: three hours? Because I I am horrible at time management,
Speaker 1: I've always been, and I'm a procrastinator and I am
Speaker 1: working on a draft for season three of Reservation Dogs,
Speaker 1: which I'm a writer on, and so I have to
Speaker 1: work on a draft, had to turn an outline for
Speaker 1: another show that I'm pitching with the buddy of mine
Speaker 1: and we're trying to get into development. And in between
Speaker 1: those two projects which I needed to get done, I
Speaker 1: decided to play some video games. And you know a
Speaker 1: good procrastinator. Wait, so um, yeah, it was a late night. Okay, okay,
Speaker 1: this opens up a lot of the avenues of question,
Speaker 1: but I'm gonna start with the thing that I'm most
Speaker 1: interested at this moment is what game were you playing?
Speaker 1: And at what time were you playing? At as like
Speaker 1: one in the morning, I was playing a game called
Speaker 1: hell Let Loose. It was World War two first person
Speaker 1: shooter game, hell Let Loose. I've I've never heard of
Speaker 1: this game. This is a new game? Is it an
Speaker 1: old game? It's like about three years old hell Let Loose.
Speaker 1: I'm looking. I'm looking at this right now hard on. Yeah,
Speaker 1: because I'm like, I'm a huge gamer. So how interesting.
Speaker 1: It's a first person shoot. It's one of those like
Speaker 1: it's in the realm of like realistic meaning it one shot,
Speaker 1: one kill thing. It's a tactical game. You have to
Speaker 1: work with your squad. Actually a chief objective it is.
Speaker 1: I like it the fact that it's like you have
Speaker 1: to communicate with people, so you can't just go and
Speaker 1: be like I'm just gonna shoot click click click click.
Speaker 1: You actually have to work as a squad, as a team.
Speaker 1: So this is good. So this is a game, like,
Speaker 1: you're a soldier, it's World War two? Is that easy?
Speaker 1: World War two? You are what signed you want? Hold on,
Speaker 1: let's make sure this is your wich? Side are you
Speaker 1: fighting for in this game? It's a multiple really, you
Speaker 1: could be you could be a Nazi and you can
Speaker 1: be American, you can be rushing. Really. Wow, that's very
Speaker 1: that's very spicy. That's very hot stuff. Hot button ship.
Speaker 1: All right, okay, so you're a soldier and it is
Speaker 1: um sorry, I know this is not what you came
Speaker 1: to talk about. I can talk about anything and everything.
Speaker 1: I'm here. Great, So it's one in the morning. You
Speaker 1: fire up. Hell, let let lose. What platform are you
Speaker 1: playing on? By the way, PC? P a your PC gamer?
Speaker 1: Oh wow, we already have so much in common. I
Speaker 1: love PC gaming. Okay, hold on before I go on
Speaker 1: go off on a tangent. Okay, but I'm also very
Speaker 1: a d D, A d H, whatever acronym it is.
Speaker 1: So I'm super random. So I'm if you give me
Speaker 1: the space, I'm going to take you on tangents here
Speaker 1: and I'm just just the way it goes. Well, guess what,
Speaker 1: So am I like severely a d D. So this
Speaker 1: is gonna be a nerve shattering hell ride for all
Speaker 1: of the listeners. So, okay, it's one in the morning.
Speaker 1: You fire up hell Let Loose? Is it called helllet Loose?
Speaker 1: Is that what it? And you have a you have
Speaker 1: team members you play with like like online. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I decided to join a gaming clan, so it's actually
Speaker 1: a community, a group of gamers who all play the
Speaker 1: game hell Let Loose. And last night was the first
Speaker 1: time we actually played as a squad. So it was
Speaker 1: a bunch of folks all on the game together and
Speaker 1: we were just talking, hanging out, getting to know each
Speaker 1: other because we never really played together as a squad,
Speaker 1: and uh, that was kind of cool. I've come to
Speaker 1: a point in my life where one is, I don't
Speaker 1: have a lot of time to game, so it's usually
Speaker 1: late at night, kids are asleep and I'm stressed out
Speaker 1: on my eye. I'm just play some games. And because
Speaker 1: of the nature of my work, actually I find myself
Speaker 1: of looking for camaraderie. Right Finding a team, a squad
Speaker 1: is enticing to me and to hold the space with
Speaker 1: other folks, um rather than just you know, playing with
Speaker 1: a bunch of randoms. For me, this is what I
Speaker 1: need and want right now. Are they people you know?
Speaker 1: Or these are just people you met and then no
Speaker 1: clue who they are. They're just all coming together like
Speaker 1: on the internet. Yeah, the squad I was playing with
Speaker 1: last night, there was a Nigerian dude, there was a
Speaker 1: Russian player, and then there was like two guys from
Speaker 1: like like Fort Lauderdale of course Florida men, this woman
Speaker 1: from Phoenix, so where everyone is everywhere. Yeah, so this
Speaker 1: is like one of those stories. It's like the Internet
Speaker 1: is so beautiful, Like this is such a because most
Speaker 1: of the stories, and we talked about this a lot
Speaker 1: on this on this podcast, like the Internet is a
Speaker 1: pretty ugly place, but that's like a beautiful part of
Speaker 1: the Internet. I'm curious, like, so, how long did you
Speaker 1: play for? I put in about forty minutes. That's it. Okay,
Speaker 1: you were in and out. Yeah, forty five minutes. It
Speaker 1: was short. It was a short game. And do any
Speaker 1: of these people know that you're on a like a
Speaker 1: nationally or internationally airing television show. Okay, interesting, you don't
Speaker 1: bring that up in casual conversation. I don't bring it
Speaker 1: up in casual conversation. I'm curious. I actually I've been
Speaker 1: thinking about whether I bring it up or at what
Speaker 1: point do I bring it up? But you should be like,
Speaker 1: this reminds me of um that when we were shooting
Speaker 1: the scene on my on my show recently. Just like that,
Speaker 1: like like they know, it's like, no big deal. I
Speaker 1: feel like the fun ways you guys ever seen the show?
Speaker 1: What do you think about it? What do you think
Speaker 1: about this actor on the show named Dallas called what if?
Speaker 1: They're like, I fucking hate that guy. He's so annoying.
Speaker 1: I'll be like, Oh, I gotta go. Then you're gonna
Speaker 1: have to leave the clan. I'm leaving the clan. I'm
Speaker 1: burning the clan down out of the clan. Okay, So
Speaker 1: you've got three hours of sleep or something you're writing
Speaker 1: on season three reservation talks, which we're gonna talk about
Speaker 1: and something new and then you were like, I gotta
Speaker 1: play some video games. The families asleep, you fire up
Speaker 1: the PC so you didn't go to bed ntil like
Speaker 1: what three in the morning or something? Yeah? Three? Then
Speaker 1: are you normally a night owl? Uh? I don't want
Speaker 1: to be about I am. Yeah. My wife and I
Speaker 1: we have we have five kids, and they all stay
Speaker 1: up late. We have a whole crew. We have the
Speaker 1: whole range. We have a three year old and we
Speaker 1: have a twenty one year old. Oh my god, that's
Speaker 1: a crazy range. That's the range we were dealing with
Speaker 1: the one year old. You gotta put the twenty one
Speaker 1: year old to work, like babysitting and stuff, right, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: let babysitting watching the kids and all that stuff. Wow,
Speaker 1: our youngest is in night owls. Like We've been struggling
Speaker 1: to try to get him out of sleep schedule so
Speaker 1: that he falls asleep earlier, but he ends up staying
Speaker 1: up later. So and then I get up and get
Speaker 1: the kids up in the morning. So that's why I
Speaker 1: think about the exact in the morning. I like that.
Speaker 1: Now that's daring, I have to tell you, And I'm
Speaker 1: bad at this. I'm not a morning person. I am
Speaker 1: a night owl and and my wife definitely gets up. Oh,
Speaker 1: we only have one kid, so it's way probably way simpler. Boy,
Speaker 1: if I knew I had to get up and they
Speaker 1: were like gonna be five, Well hold on, let's see,
Speaker 1: you got a twenty one year old, so you don't
Speaker 1: have to worry about twenty one year old. What's the
Speaker 1: next age down from twenty one? We have three that
Speaker 1: are have ten year old, a fourteen year old, and
Speaker 1: a fifteen year old. Okay, so those are those are
Speaker 1: the ones that got get up and getting get them
Speaker 1: out of the door, right, Especially the teens. Teens need
Speaker 1: a lot of sleep. There's a whole thing. It's like
Speaker 1: we make like school really early for teenagers, but like
Speaker 1: all the scientific studies show that they actually need a
Speaker 1: lot more sleep, and we're like robbing them of their
Speaker 1: precious hours. So but I don't know, but that's you know,
Speaker 1: that's not your that's not your problem. You just gotta
Speaker 1: get the kids up. Okay. So all right, what did
Speaker 1: you have for breakfast? What was your what was you
Speaker 1: how do you how do you like energize for the
Speaker 1: day ahead? Well, I I love cooking for my family.
Speaker 1: I'm not a good cook. But I love cooking. I
Speaker 1: took my love language is cooking. I'm not a good cook,
Speaker 1: but I like cooking. You haven't gotten good at it,
Speaker 1: but you want to. You want to express yourself in
Speaker 1: that way. That's beautiful. And also I make it a
Speaker 1: thing is I cook for my kids before they go
Speaker 1: to school every morning, so I make them food and
Speaker 1: then I make their lunches. And so this morning I
Speaker 1: just did something simple, just eggs, bacon, and then bagels.
Speaker 1: But I toasted bagels with some cream. Yeah, so that's
Speaker 1: why I had this morning. I haven't at dinner. That
Speaker 1: sounds really good. Alright, So moving on from your night
Speaker 1: owl and gaming and your breakfast situation. So you are
Speaker 1: on this show Reservation Dogs on which is on effects.
Speaker 1: You also write for it, right, yeah, like set the
Speaker 1: show up, like talk about the show like for somebody
Speaker 1: who's never seen it. And I started watching it because
Speaker 1: I knew that we were going to talk. I have
Speaker 1: been on my list and I'm like, oh, ship, like
Speaker 1: that's got to move to the top of the queue.
Speaker 1: And it is. It's super funny and super like heartfelt show.
Speaker 1: But can you talk about a little bit like for
Speaker 1: somebody who's never seen it like what the setup is. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it is a coming of age story. It follows five
Speaker 1: indigenous teens in Oklahoma, rural Oklahoma who go through the
Speaker 1: trials and relations of being a teenager and also dealing
Speaker 1: with the aspects of grief and having lost a friend
Speaker 1: to tragedy. And it's a comedy, it's but it's really
Speaker 1: like as you said, really um immersed in emotion and
Speaker 1: a lot of feelings about how do we build community
Speaker 1: and how how do we stay healthy as a community
Speaker 1: when we're dealing with tragedy and hardships and guilt and
Speaker 1: loss and all those other fields that come with life.
Speaker 1: We just completed our second season this last fall and
Speaker 1: we're now currently writing the third season. So and in
Speaker 1: my character, I play spirit uh a k a William
Speaker 1: knife Man and I'm a I'm a spirit. I'm a
Speaker 1: spirit helper. I provide assistance and you could I use
Speaker 1: assistance very loosely. And you will know why if you
Speaker 1: watch the show. To one of the characters, of the
Speaker 1: main characters, a young man who is trying to find
Speaker 1: himself and understand what it means to be a man.
Speaker 1: He's like, you know, fifteen, sixteen years old, and he
Speaker 1: is still trying to figure out what what does it
Speaker 1: mean to be a quote unquote warrior? Right? And like
Speaker 1: I gotta say, like when when you first appear in
Speaker 1: the show, I mean, listen, I'm gonna like, you know,
Speaker 1: be a fanboy whatever. The character is a hilarious just
Speaker 1: a hilarious vibe of a character I wasn't think I
Speaker 1: was struck by. It's like it's kind of playing on
Speaker 1: the trope of like I mean, you're seeing a lot
Speaker 1: of like popular culture pop media, especially like not made
Speaker 1: by indigenous people, Like where there's this character, like the
Speaker 1: Native American character who is like the guide or is
Speaker 1: going to tell you what's going on or like explain
Speaker 1: like the truth about something. Your character is kind of
Speaker 1: like it's hard, hard articulate, but it's kind of like
Speaker 1: fucking with that idea. It's kind of like in a
Speaker 1: way making fun of the idea but also like not
Speaker 1: fully not embracing that part of it where there is
Speaker 1: like knowledge there, there is like history, there is like
Speaker 1: a message to impart. But like you're definitely having fun
Speaker 1: with that trope. Is that was that like as you
Speaker 1: conceptualize this character, part of it, Oh, absolutely, I think
Speaker 1: that there's a whole meta narrative to the show, and
Speaker 1: and and I guess an intention as writers to take
Speaker 1: ownership of our stories, and that this show doesn't exist
Speaker 1: in a vacuum very much. We are as writers, as
Speaker 1: indigenous writers who folks, all of us who grew up
Speaker 1: in the eighties and nineties were well aware of how
Speaker 1: Native people have been displayed on camera on TV movies,
Speaker 1: were well aware of the stories that are told about us.
Speaker 1: And so this show very much is mindful of that
Speaker 1: context of how stories have been told and maybe even
Speaker 1: continue to be told, and we want to take ownership
Speaker 1: of them and say, well funk that we get to
Speaker 1: decide how we tell our own stories, you know, and
Speaker 1: be subversive in that so very much. My character is
Speaker 1: totally making fun at the stoic Native American on horseback
Speaker 1: who's here to give wisdom about one's life. It is
Speaker 1: very much a spoof of sorts, just as a background
Speaker 1: like I got my training, I guess you could say,
Speaker 1: as as a performer doing sketch comedy and improv comedy
Speaker 1: with our comedy group. I co created the Fortune on
Speaker 1: Ones and fortunately Ones are are all a part of
Speaker 1: the creative team for Reservation Dogs. The showrunner Sterling hard
Speaker 1: Joe how you know, he was one of our co
Speaker 1: creators of the Comedy Group, So we were able to
Speaker 1: bring in a lot of elements of the characters that
Speaker 1: we've been working on over years into the show. In
Speaker 1: spirit is very much ja amalgamation of these different characters
Speaker 1: who are over the top, hyper masculine characters who have
Speaker 1: a lot of insecurities when they're being performative. It's all there, right.
Speaker 1: Just the delivery is so it's very modern. It's like
Speaker 1: part like okay, it is that classic trope, right, and
Speaker 1: then it's also like you're just talking. Like the vibe
Speaker 1: of it is very modern, and that mixture is also
Speaker 1: really interesting because it's like a very unexpected like you're like, no,
Speaker 1: I'm just walking with you or whatever, like in the
Speaker 1: like the first thing you're and it's like okay, Like
Speaker 1: that character would not say it like that in the
Speaker 1: popular conception of like what we think of that Yellow
Speaker 1: Stones version of that would not have that character, right,
Speaker 1: or the avatar version of that. We're gonna talk about avatar.
Speaker 1: I actually I have an avatar conversation for you in
Speaker 1: a minute, but you very second I want to stick
Speaker 1: on the show. You said you grew up in the nineties, right,
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know how old you are, but
Speaker 1: we're probably close in age. I'm thirty nine. Okay, you're
Speaker 1: much much older than me. No, I'm kidding. That's you're
Speaker 1: actually much younger than me, and that's very upsetting, uh
Speaker 1: the U. But like you grew up in like the
Speaker 1: Oliver Stone era, right, Like all Oliver Stone is like
Speaker 1: one of these like directors who like over and over again,
Speaker 1: is like using like indigenous people and as this like
Speaker 1: kind of prop in a way. I mean, he's one
Speaker 1: of many. But and maybe I don't know, maybe Oliver
Speaker 1: Stone is like maybe he's doing it better than others.
Speaker 1: But is a lot of the comedy in the show
Speaker 1: are just like comedy you've done, like a reflection of that.
Speaker 1: I just kind of happened to push back against those
Speaker 1: like weirdly prevalent pop culture sort of ideas about who
Speaker 1: you are and who people are. Yeah, I think really really, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's it is. Um, it's a matter of giving the
Speaker 1: opposite of what people expect. If I get up in
Speaker 1: front of a crowd and say, okay, I'm now going
Speaker 1: to share a Native American story. If this is your
Speaker 1: average quote unquote American mainstream crowd here, I can literally
Speaker 1: draw on the board what the images that come to
Speaker 1: mind when I say that, because that's what they've grown
Speaker 1: up with, that's what they learned every day, that's what
Speaker 1: they It's been the story that's been told time after time. Right,
Speaker 1: tell me what's on the board. What's the Native American story? Boom,
Speaker 1: You're seeing tps, You're seeing Indians on horseback, You're seeing
Speaker 1: eighteen eighties, right, You're seeing cowboys and Indians. What you see,
Speaker 1: first thing is a story that exists in the past
Speaker 1: as opposed to something that exists in the moment. Not
Speaker 1: only that, you're also seeing a very oversimplified version of
Speaker 1: what Native means. Because you know there's over five five hundred,
Speaker 1: six hundred different distinct nations in this country. You know,
Speaker 1: I'm in count in Canada, hundreds and hundreds of different
Speaker 1: cultures and languages, and all you know is TPS. Right.
Speaker 1: You might know wig moms, you might know something else.
Speaker 1: But as a performer, I feel like as as me
Speaker 1: as as a as a Dakota man might tribe, I'm Dakota,
Speaker 1: like I have to be well aware of that when
Speaker 1: I walk into the room, because in some ways people
Speaker 1: are going to experience what I say, or it's a joke, whatever,
Speaker 1: no matter what, there's to be a filter there that
Speaker 1: it passes through. And I find comedy and jamming up
Speaker 1: that filter as much as possible. We're like, well, what
Speaker 1: the fund is I didn't expect this, you know, I
Speaker 1: was not expecting this character, or this person or this story.
Speaker 1: I was just thinking, like, it's also a tool, right,
Speaker 1: because the fact that you are in control of like
Speaker 1: how you can subvert the expectation is a really interesting
Speaker 1: and I think maybe it exists to some degree. I mean, like,
Speaker 1: you know, like I'm a I'm like a Jewish guy,
Speaker 1: and I look very Jewish, and I'm sure people if
Speaker 1: I were to get up on stage and start talking
Speaker 1: about like my you know, cranky Jewish parents or something,
Speaker 1: there'd be an immediate you know, not the same thing.
Speaker 1: I'm not saying there's a parallel, but like you have
Speaker 1: that whole set of tropes that people start to think of, right,
Speaker 1: and that's what like your character on the show is
Speaker 1: like subverting that in a way that is like so
Speaker 1: unexpected that it's it's like immediately hilarious, but then you
Speaker 1: also start to go, oh yeah, right, like I see
Speaker 1: this character in one way everywhere, and that's actually not
Speaker 1: the entirety or the extent of of the story. You know,
Speaker 1: you mentioned Avatar, or I believe you mentioned Avatar. I
Speaker 1: was looking at your Twitter. I found a tweet that
Speaker 1: I think is quite interested. Is an old tweet pressiant,
Speaker 1: very Pressian tweet, in my opinion, and I'm gonna read
Speaker 1: it to you. I just want to get your thoughts
Speaker 1: on this. Tell me how you're feeling. One of my
Speaker 1: old tweets or is that someone else's. I think it's
Speaker 1: one of your old tweets. I'm pretty sure this is yours.
Speaker 1: There is a random tweet that I found, No one
Speaker 1: of your old tweets. My most favorite recent Indian movie
Speaker 1: has got to be Avatar. I'm really looking forward to
Speaker 1: the return of Avatar, to the return of John Smith descendant.
Speaker 1: This is a tweet that you did. Maybe like now
Speaker 1: Avatar too is out? Okay, yeah it is. Have you
Speaker 1: seen it? I have seen it. I actually just saw
Speaker 1: it two days ago, really, and I didn't have to
Speaker 1: pay for it because I'm in the writer's guild as
Speaker 1: a writer be all the screenplays and then they send
Speaker 1: the screeners And so I got a code where I
Speaker 1: can go online and watch it streaming offline. That it's
Speaker 1: for all the award seasons, right, so it's nominated for
Speaker 1: Best Picture, right, Yes, So that's why I got it
Speaker 1: to watch it, And I was like, Kelly, I don't
Speaker 1: have to pay for it. I'll do it here. So
Speaker 1: I watched it here at home. Um, I had to
Speaker 1: watch in two cities that we can sit through it.
Speaker 1: It's a long movie. There's a long movie. We started
Speaker 1: watching at eleven o'clock at night, so like we we
Speaker 1: have to stop. But I did see it. I will
Speaker 1: say this, and this is like the context of that tweet. Hey,
Speaker 1: I believe in your audience they're intelligent people. Only the
Speaker 1: most intelligent folks listen to what Future podcast. So what
Speaker 1: I'm about to say, maybe are They're already on the
Speaker 1: same page. But for those handful of folks out there,
Speaker 1: it is poke Honness in space like verbatim, it's the
Speaker 1: same story. It's even the same acronyms, like the colonizers
Speaker 1: come from a different planet to a new world to
Speaker 1: discover and obtain natural resources. In the movie Avatar, it's
Speaker 1: Jake Sully j s and Pocahona's John Smith j s
Speaker 1: that Jake Sully John Smith gets saved, encounters the Princess
Speaker 1: Pocahona Materi. She saves him like she throws her body. No,
Speaker 1: don't kill him like it's the same story. It's but pocahonest.
Speaker 1: It's literally pokehon on purpose, right. That is the part
Speaker 1: of it is that I think it is on purpose,
Speaker 1: but not for the same on purpose that you see
Speaker 1: reservation dogs having an Indian on horseback like in my character.
Speaker 1: And I'm being very intentional where we are reclaiming that
Speaker 1: space and very mindful of the context of the images
Speaker 1: that we're putting in front of an audience and using
Speaker 1: that to subvert the conversation to uplift communities who have
Speaker 1: been marginalized, who are have been on the margins, and
Speaker 1: uplift their voices to take over that space. Avatar didn't
Speaker 1: do that. It's just just telling you another Wild Wild
Speaker 1: West show story. And at the core root of it,
Speaker 1: it's another white savior story where the white man becomes
Speaker 1: Indian and then becomes more Indian than the Indians, and
Speaker 1: at the very end, he's saying, this is our land,
Speaker 1: and everyone's like, yes, thank you white Man for becoming
Speaker 1: one of us and showing us the way to save
Speaker 1: our people. It's ridiculous, it's crazy, it's nuts. But also
Speaker 1: I enjoyed the movie because it's entertainment. So I'm like,
Speaker 1: I'm flying on dragons. I see it like like that part,
Speaker 1: I'm like, I can't ignore the fact that this is
Speaker 1: still entertaining even though highly problematic, and I have a
Speaker 1: lot of conflict with that. You can make a really
Speaker 1: fun movie and that's also like reductive in a bunch
Speaker 1: of ways. And in fact, like probably some of the
Speaker 1: most fun movies and we go back and look at
Speaker 1: them are full of ship like wow, that's funking offensive
Speaker 1: or stupid or like really shortsighted or reductive. Absolutely. You
Speaker 1: know how many movies now, like you go back and
Speaker 1: how many like gay jokes are queer folks or trans
Speaker 1: folks with the butt of the joke that back in
Speaker 1: the tail, like, oh, that was funny, but now you're
Speaker 1: like that doesn't age. Well. No. I was watching The
Speaker 1: Gilmore Girls a couple of years ago, which I love.
Speaker 1: By the way, you know, these two women are the
Speaker 1: main characters and they're very progressive or whatever, and like
Speaker 1: one of the characters like that Bag is gay or whatever,
Speaker 1: like and I'm like, this is from two thousand, three
Speaker 1: years to four whatever, and I'm like, yeah, like that
Speaker 1: would not fly. I mean that's a small thing. But
Speaker 1: you know it's weird how just casual it was. It's
Speaker 1: so interesting. I mean, so this is like stuff I
Speaker 1: talked about with my parents because like their perspective is
Speaker 1: so I'm a little bit more aware than they are,
Speaker 1: but like you know, sometimes I'll be explaining it. It's
Speaker 1: like you're trying to explain like the systemic stuff. It's
Speaker 1: like they love this thing and you're like, well, let
Speaker 1: me explain how this is actually really fucked up, and
Speaker 1: like it's very hard. It's hard to like to pull
Speaker 1: back to all those different layers and see how we've
Speaker 1: just built the system of like a type of storytelling
Speaker 1: like Avatar is a perfect example. And that's why The
Speaker 1: Reservation Dogs is such an interesting new type of show.
Speaker 1: And I'm gonna be very honest, like that's a world
Speaker 1: I don't feel like I know anything about. I don't
Speaker 1: know what's up with, Like how what's happening on reservations.
Speaker 1: I don't really know the modern story of indigenous people
Speaker 1: in this country, Like we know the moments where it's
Speaker 1: like the Dakota Access pipeline or like these like flashpoints
Speaker 1: or whatever, or when people are critical something like Avatar
Speaker 1: and people are talking about it. But like I think,
Speaker 1: what's so fascinating about the show and so good about
Speaker 1: it is it just is like it's like a modern story.
Speaker 1: It pulls on all that stuff and and even in
Speaker 1: some way has fun with it, like your character, but
Speaker 1: it's also like resonating a lot of that history, right,
Speaker 1: but not like the Pocahona story. It is something new,
Speaker 1: and like there's not that much new right that we're
Speaker 1: seeing in popular culture. Like the character name thing in
Speaker 1: Avatar is kind of sucking me up, Like I've never
Speaker 1: made that connection where it's literally the same initials and
Speaker 1: the same setup, and like I haven't seen the new one.
Speaker 1: Maybe they progress it like oh Avatary, No, No, it's
Speaker 1: it's it's just this problematic. The thing is all right,
Speaker 1: this is but it is an entertaining movie. James Cameron
Speaker 1: knows how to make a blockbuster and the technology is amazing,
Speaker 1: Like you are immersed in the world. It is fantastic
Speaker 1: be swimming with alien whales. That happens. Okay, yeah, But
Speaker 1: the issue that I have and a lot of folks
Speaker 1: have brought up, is that it's not telling anything new,
Speaker 1: like you said, it is it is. How do I
Speaker 1: explain it? It's like it is the same story. Colin
Speaker 1: are just come and they do bad things, and then
Speaker 1: the original people's the indigenous people suffer and die and
Speaker 1: because they are not able to adapt quote unquote is
Speaker 1: and it's all from a West perspective. It's because they
Speaker 1: weren't able to adapt, they died. But there's one character
Speaker 1: is the white guy who becomes native. He knows how
Speaker 1: to adapt because he lives in both worlds, and he's
Speaker 1: the savior. Here's the centerpiece of the story. And like
Speaker 1: movies do not exist in a vacuum. Everything is context.
Speaker 1: Whether you're going and you want to zone out, yes,
Speaker 1: there's some movies, zombie movies where you can zone out.
Speaker 1: But hey, also, zombie movies were created with a socially
Speaker 1: conscious theme at the very root of it. I mean,
Speaker 1: the first zombie movies were conversations about race and racism
Speaker 1: in the United States and and so movies have a
Speaker 1: context in them, and with that context, you're saying something
Speaker 1: and the fact that you're telling another story about Indigenous
Speaker 1: people in a way that's that sucks what happened to
Speaker 1: them in the past. Yeah, what it does is it
Speaker 1: really limits the ability for Indigenous voices now to say
Speaker 1: we're existing now and we have stories we're telling now. Well,
Speaker 1: it's crazy how hard coded it is in like the
Speaker 1: people who are making it too right again, I have
Speaker 1: seen the new one. I'm sure there are elements he had.
Speaker 1: For sure. I saw the original and their elements who
Speaker 1: were like, wow, that's thrilling. Like you said, like James
Speaker 1: Cameron knows how to make a blockbuster, But like, it's
Speaker 1: very likely James Cameron was not thinking I mean, who knows.
Speaker 1: Maybe he's like totally nefarious and was like like, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna just reuse this story and play on all these
Speaker 1: tropes because it's really effective. But probably more likely he
Speaker 1: kind of was like I'm telling this. Maybe he even
Speaker 1: thought he was being like, I'm going to re contextualize
Speaker 1: the story so that a modern audience understands the harm
Speaker 1: we've done the white man has done too Indigenous people
Speaker 1: or whatever. Meanwhile, he's just kind of like telling the
Speaker 1: White Savior story version of that story. But it is
Speaker 1: kind of hard coded in people that they can't see
Speaker 1: past it. You know. It's like I think all the
Speaker 1: time about J. K. Rowling, and I mean, it's got
Speaker 1: lots of problems, but I don't know how if I
Speaker 1: familiar are at the Harry Potter universe, but there's like
Speaker 1: a whole sub group of characters they run the banks
Speaker 1: and Harry Potter. They have like big noses and they're
Speaker 1: like goblins and they're like fucking crazy Jewish stereotypes like
Speaker 1: bad and like she'd be like, no, these are just
Speaker 1: characters I created or whatever, Like I didn't that's not
Speaker 1: what I was doing. And it's like no, like you
Speaker 1: just took this like trope that exists and you re
Speaker 1: contextualized it or you thought you not even she didn't
Speaker 1: think about it. But it's like it's there, Like this
Speaker 1: thing is there, And that's kind of like, again, I'm
Speaker 1: not saying there's a direct parallel, but it is that
Speaker 1: idea that there's a certain type of creator that creates
Speaker 1: these massive properties that are like informing pop culture and
Speaker 1: they're replaying these ideas that are like ancient ideas in
Speaker 1: a way, like really kind of stuck in this weird
Speaker 1: you know mode, my buddy, But we were just talking
Speaker 1: about Harry Potter and you brought it up and she
Speaker 1: was like, you know, what's fucked up about it? He's
Speaker 1: like I was just thinking about it, and you know,
Speaker 1: Harry Potter is so fucking classist. He's like, look, everyone
Speaker 1: made fun Harry Potter because he was poor and his
Speaker 1: friend Ron Weasley, they were seen as the poor kids.
Speaker 1: But Harry Potter is a trust fund kid. He has
Speaker 1: a fucking bankful of money from his parents. Oh yeah, see.
Speaker 1: I started reading because like my daughter got interested in.
Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, we'll read the books. I've never read
Speaker 1: it because I always hated Harry Potter as a character
Speaker 1: because I'm like, oh, he's like everybody's like, oh, he's
Speaker 1: important and he's special and he's been taking care of
Speaker 1: his whole life. And he came to Hogwarts and everybody's like,
Speaker 1: oh you're Harry Potter, we love you. And it's like
Speaker 1: I'm like, what's the struggle here? Like, like, dude, like
Speaker 1: has been protected by all of these powerful wizards because
Speaker 1: he's like the chosen one and like I'm supposed to
Speaker 1: feel what like, yeah, he had like some bad foster
Speaker 1: parents for a few years, like and now he's a
Speaker 1: celebrity anyhow, But just in the weeds, perhaps on the
Speaker 1: Harry Potter totally in the weeds, like my buddy went
Speaker 1: down the rabbit hole, where I was like, I don't
Speaker 1: know about that. He's Ron Weasley exactly. Ron Weasley seen
Speaker 1: as poor, but his dad worked for the fucking ministry
Speaker 1: and his dad was like a g man. His dad
Speaker 1: was like part of the up level. So it's a
Speaker 1: good point. I mean, that's only one. That's just one
Speaker 1: of the many problematic things about Harry Potter. You is
Speaker 1: fucking down the line. The Goblin ship is real, though,
Speaker 1: I mean, like if you watch the movies I watched.
Speaker 1: When I watched the first movie, I was like, this
Speaker 1: is It's like George Lucas. He had all these characters
Speaker 1: in the fucking New Star Wars movies that are like, oh,
Speaker 1: that's like a crazy Asian stereotype. This is a crazy
Speaker 1: Jewish stereotype. It's very much like the James Cameron thing
Speaker 1: where he clearly is internalized. This ship doesn't even realize
Speaker 1: it and then spits it back out. It's like you
Speaker 1: feel like you're smart because you found parallels in real life,
Speaker 1: but you're not given actually in depth commentary on it.
Speaker 1: You're just replicating it anyhow. So like that's why I
Speaker 1: hope everybody who's listening to watches the show, because it
Speaker 1: is like such a different conversation about indigenous people in
Speaker 1: this country, like their experience. I got totally sucked into it.
Speaker 1: I think it's like fascinating. I'll just say, like that
Speaker 1: close it out. So Sterling Hard as a show runner,
Speaker 1: he's from Oklahoma, is very intentional across the board about
Speaker 1: how he tells a story. First and foremost, the entire
Speaker 1: show is filmed in Oklahoma on a reservation in native community.
Speaker 1: They hire as many Native people on the crew behind
Speaker 1: the camera just as much as the folks who are
Speaker 1: writing it and in front of the camera. But then also,
Speaker 1: we don't get preachy. We don't like to be preachy.
Speaker 1: We don't like to be saying that this is this
Speaker 1: is our commentary and society. It's like, really, what is
Speaker 1: the experience of these kids, Like, let's get down to
Speaker 1: this experience of what it means to be a Native kid.
Speaker 1: In America and rural Oklahoma and let the fields flow
Speaker 1: from there. So I really do hope folks check it out.
Speaker 1: There is a kind of segue here that I wanted
Speaker 1: to get into a little bit, which is I mentioned
Speaker 1: before you're an activist and an organizer. Your father, Tom B. K.
Speaker 1: Gold Tooth was, And I've done I've done my research.
Speaker 1: I'm not saying like I've been reading up on this
Speaker 1: for years, but I did some research. He was a
Speaker 1: founder of the Indigenous Environmental Network. He's a well known
Speaker 1: figure in the in the activism space. And the Avatary
Speaker 1: is like they're not just sorry not to drop barrels,
Speaker 1: like like there's like James Cameron's also like one of
Speaker 1: his things is he's trying to be like, you know,
Speaker 1: save the planet or protect you know, it's like this
Speaker 1: whole thing about like protecting the ecosystem and being respectful
Speaker 1: of you know, Mother Earth and all this, but you're
Speaker 1: actually out there doing real world work where because we're
Speaker 1: actually fucking up the real planet we live on, not
Speaker 1: what is the what Pandora is that the name of
Speaker 1: the planet Avatar. That's a that's a computer generated plan.
Speaker 1: You can FuG it up really all you want. But
Speaker 1: in the real world, we're we're actually destroying like the
Speaker 1: planet we live on, while also totally violating communities that
Speaker 1: have been here far longer than the people who are
Speaker 1: trying to put a oil pipeline or whatever through their land.
Speaker 1: And I've listened to some podcasts with you, I've read
Speaker 1: some stuff, and and you talk a lot about joy
Speaker 1: and the kind of joy of activism and organizing and
Speaker 1: how you have to kind of go into that stuff
Speaker 1: in a way where it isn't just about doom and gloom.
Speaker 1: It is like about like seeing the possibilities and the potential,
Speaker 1: but like also not to be a downer on this ship,
Speaker 1: but like it feels like the potential and the possibilities
Speaker 1: are getting like crushed to every at every angle. So
Speaker 1: tell me about like the experience of trying to kind
Speaker 1: of get people working towards a better tomorrow, like a
Speaker 1: better version of this planet we live on in the
Speaker 1: face of governments and corporations and and just a general
Speaker 1: sense of like the apathy from a lot of the people,
Speaker 1: like how do you do that? And and and and
Speaker 1: are you still doing it? Do you feel like that's
Speaker 1: still a big part of like what you do right now?
Speaker 1: It's a good that's a good question. Sorry, that's a
Speaker 1: kind of wide ranging. Yeah, I struggle with it. That's
Speaker 1: the thing is, I'm not here to be the cheerleader.
Speaker 1: Richard Simmons like, yeah, it's gonna be okay, you guys,
Speaker 1: Let's just focus on the good stuff now, Like, Hey,
Speaker 1: people have a right to be angry. People have a
Speaker 1: right to be afraid and anxious and have an anxiety.
Speaker 1: People have a right to have rage. And I'm not
Speaker 1: here to police that. But I am here as an
Speaker 1: individual too in my own journey try not to get
Speaker 1: stuck in the muck that is climate anxiety. Like, man,
Speaker 1: it's been hard. I got burnt out like so many times,
Speaker 1: especially the past few years. And I on a personal level,
Speaker 1: like I'm transitioning out of my work as an organizer
Speaker 1: and going into this new realm as a writer, as
Speaker 1: a performer. And a part of that is because I, yeah,
Speaker 1: I burnt out. I struggled my own mental well being,
Speaker 1: because it's the writings on the wall in many ways
Speaker 1: right where the path that we're on, and I do
Speaker 1: feel at times like I don't know if we have
Speaker 1: what it takes collectively as the human race to steer
Speaker 1: the ship in the other direction where it needs to go.
Speaker 1: But with that being set, like I refuse to give
Speaker 1: into that, I still actively choose to find joy in
Speaker 1: the work that I do in the world I am,
Speaker 1: and I also put joy into what I want to
Speaker 1: build and and not to like beat the horse, the
Speaker 1: dead horse over the head or whatever the euphemism is.
Speaker 1: Like going back to Avatar and the issues I have
Speaker 1: with this all it's all tied to down, it connected,
Speaker 1: it's all connected. But look, Avatar to made two billion dollars, right,
Speaker 1: two billion dollars? How much? And I don't know how
Speaker 1: much money it costs them to make it, like I
Speaker 1: imagine at least, but still a lot of money. Let's say,
Speaker 1: even if you start with two hundred million dollars, you
Speaker 1: have two hundred million dollars to build a world of future,
Speaker 1: an entire universe where we did not sunk up the planet,
Speaker 1: where we did not kill indigenous people's where we are.
Speaker 1: Actually you live in a life that's far different than this,
Speaker 1: and yet you choose this story like I think that's
Speaker 1: where I want to put my energy into. And as
Speaker 1: an organizer and as a storyteller is I want to
Speaker 1: actively put my energy into radically imagining a future in
Speaker 1: which I can exist on my own terms and that
Speaker 1: my people in my community can exist on our own
Speaker 1: terms in a way that's in line with our principles
Speaker 1: as Native people's, as Dakota people's, but um in line
Speaker 1: with our principles just being good relatives to each other.
Speaker 1: So that's where I find my passion, That's where I
Speaker 1: find my drive to encourage myself but to also embolden
Speaker 1: others to radically imagine that future. Yeah, I mean, I
Speaker 1: mean it's like, actually, when you put it that way,
Speaker 1: like to your point about Avatar, if you can choose
Speaker 1: to tell a story and you can tell a story
Speaker 1: to to a larger group of people that does imagine that.
Speaker 1: It's like, again, I don't want to take away anything
Speaker 1: from activists and organizers, but you know what, existing pop
Speaker 1: culture is a powerful tool, right, Like what exists in
Speaker 1: our shared sort of storytelling is really powerful. And you're
Speaker 1: talking about like, can we make the two billion dollar
Speaker 1: movie that imagines like the better version or the different
Speaker 1: version or tells the different story, which I think is
Speaker 1: maybe we haven't gotten there yet, but we could get there,
Speaker 1: and there aren't maybe enough people trying. Our world is
Speaker 1: built on stories. Our entire existence, our society is nothing
Speaker 1: but stories in myth, right, what's currency? Currency is nothing
Speaker 1: but a story that we all agree upon and say
Speaker 1: this has value, These things have value. What is the
Speaker 1: concept of gender? You know? These are all stories and
Speaker 1: it is the meta narrative, those subliminal messages that are
Speaker 1: implanted in society that's keeping the current structure that is
Speaker 1: oppressing many for the benefit of a few. That really
Speaker 1: is the problem. And so like by countering those messages
Speaker 1: by by chipping away at the story, by saying, hey, actually, yeah,
Speaker 1: those what are the goblins of hogwarts? Like you may
Speaker 1: not understand it, but but folks who have been characterized
Speaker 1: in that way, they get what that's started trying to say, Yeah,
Speaker 1: we have to be better, we have to try better.
Speaker 1: And I'm not saying you have to water things on
Speaker 1: and I don't. And also I'm not a big fan
Speaker 1: of quote unquote WoT culture. I want to allow ourselves
Speaker 1: to tell stories as we see fit and we don't
Speaker 1: have to like give into a super politicized narratives. But
Speaker 1: the core story we're trying to tell can be different. God,
Speaker 1: I mean, you've got me think about all this stuff.
Speaker 1: We're probably gotta wrap up, and that's a great place
Speaker 1: to like kind of end on. But I think that
Speaker 1: idea of changing the story, it is so true what
Speaker 1: you just said, like that that we are just living
Speaker 1: story to story and if we can tell a different one,
Speaker 1: if we can get the next generation to like hear
Speaker 1: a different and it can make a huge difference. Like
Speaker 1: that's an awesome thought. Actually, like talking about like being optimistic,
Speaker 1: I think that's the most optimistic idea in the world.
Speaker 1: And you're working on it right now, Like you're doing
Speaker 1: it right now, like you're coming off three hours of
Speaker 1: sleep and but working on like writing projects that could
Speaker 1: be you know, some one of those stories or or
Speaker 1: these stories. So, Dallas, I gotta say, this has been
Speaker 1: an amazing conversation, Like a super fucking interesting conversation. I
Speaker 1: really appreciate you coming on and talking about all this
Speaker 1: stuff before we go. Anything you want to plug like, um,
Speaker 1: I mean obviously we talked about a lot of your projects,
Speaker 1: but anything you know the standard follow me on social
Speaker 1: media It's Dallas gold Tooth across the map TikTok Instagram Twitter, Facebook. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm on TikTok dancing or you dancing dances. I've been
Speaker 1: known to uh, to be the uncle on TikTok that
Speaker 1: does some dances. And yeah, folks can follow me and
Speaker 1: check me out, you know. In the season three I
Speaker 1: think I expected to come out for Reservation Dogs. Sometimes
Speaker 1: this follow tone and um, pretty stoked for all of it.
Speaker 1: I'm so thankful for for you having me on the show.
Speaker 1: And uh, yeah it's been it's been pretty awesome. Yeah,
Speaker 1: this is awesome. Thanks so much. Well, that is our
Speaker 1: show for this week, and what a show, my goodness,
Speaker 1: so many topics, so many thought provoking subjects. I'm I'm provoked,
Speaker 1: both on a thought level and also on a more
Speaker 1: visceral kind of body level, which is interesting. But anyhow,
Speaker 1: will be back next week with more what future, and
Speaker 1: as always, I wish you and your family the very best.