WEBVTT - Bloomberg Businessweek Weekend - April 25th, 2025 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:07.240 Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio News. 0:00:08.640 --> 0:00:13.000 This is Bloomberg business Week Daily reporting from the magazine 0:00:13.000 --> 0:00:17.599 that helps global leaders stay ahead with insight on the people, companies, 0:00:17.640 --> 0:00:22.520 and trends shaping today's complex economy, plus global business finance 0:00:22.560 --> 0:00:25.880 and tech news as it happens. The Bloomberg Business Week 0:00:25.960 --> 0:00:31.480 Daily Podcast with Carol Masser and Tim Stenebek on Bloomberg Radio. 0:00:32.040 --> 0:00:34.880 Hi, everyone, Welcome to the Bloomberg Business Week Weekend Podcast. 0:00:35.200 --> 0:00:37.360 Another week where it was a given that we would 0:00:37.400 --> 0:00:41.680 talk tariffs, the US China relationship, fed independence, job security 0:00:41.720 --> 0:00:44.480 for Jay Powell, along with a big dose of earnings 0:00:44.520 --> 0:00:46.639 and yes, market volatility, and. 0:00:46.640 --> 0:00:49.360 So that's all ahead as this hour we dig into 0:00:49.400 --> 0:00:54.000 the quarterly updates of two companies, talking supply chains, consumer sentiment, 0:00:54.200 --> 0:00:58.000 and the reality of manufacturing with the CEO of Whirlpool Corporation, 0:00:58.400 --> 0:00:59.200 Mark Bitzer. 0:00:59.240 --> 0:01:01.400 And then it was also a big, big week for 0:01:01.480 --> 0:01:05.960 Tesla as it reported disappointing but not entirely unexpected results 0:01:06.040 --> 0:01:09.600 and getting Elon Musk's presence on the call with analysts 0:01:09.680 --> 0:01:12.600 to announce his soon to come actual presence back at 0:01:12.680 --> 0:01:15.200 or at least is paying more attention to the company 0:01:15.200 --> 0:01:18.040 he runs we will hear from one well known investor 0:01:18.040 --> 0:01:20.800 who owns Tesla's and has at times been a buyer 0:01:20.880 --> 0:01:22.720 and seller of company shares. 0:01:23.080 --> 0:01:25.039 All that to come, we begin with the US China 0:01:25.080 --> 0:01:27.840 trade war, President Trumps signaling an exit ramp may be 0:01:27.920 --> 0:01:30.880 in sight for those sweeping tariffs he's placed on Chinese goods. 0:01:31.120 --> 0:01:34.399 The President said Wednesday that quote everything's active when asked 0:01:34.400 --> 0:01:37.080 if he was engaging with China, and that Beijing was 0:01:37.200 --> 0:01:41.039 quote going to do fine once talks had settled. Meantime, 0:01:41.120 --> 0:01:44.160 US Treasury Secretary Scott Bess and Warren negotiations could take 0:01:44.280 --> 0:01:45.199 up to three years. 0:01:46.080 --> 0:01:48.120 This situation felt really fluid, and there was a lot 0:01:48.120 --> 0:01:51.320 of back and forth throughout the week, which is what 0:01:51.400 --> 0:01:55.520 really kept investors on their toes and markets volatile. Highly 0:01:55.560 --> 0:01:58.400 recommend that you check out the Bloomberg and Bloomberg dot 0:01:58.400 --> 0:02:00.520 com because all of this stuff, as we know, it 0:02:00.520 --> 0:02:03.640 feels like every day there's a whole new batch of headlines, 0:02:03.800 --> 0:02:06.440 especially when it comes to the US China relationship. And 0:02:06.480 --> 0:02:09.560 to help break down the intricate balance between the US 0:02:09.600 --> 0:02:13.200 and China, we turned to Caroline Freund. She is Dean 0:02:13.240 --> 0:02:16.960 of Global Policy and Strategy at uc SAN Diego. She's 0:02:17.000 --> 0:02:19.600 also a former Senior Fellow at the Peterson Institute for 0:02:19.639 --> 0:02:23.560 International Economics, a former Global Director of Trade, Investment and 0:02:23.600 --> 0:02:27.040 Competitiveness at the World Bank, and she also worked at 0:02:27.040 --> 0:02:29.639 the FED and IMF. Her perspective and valuable. 0:02:29.919 --> 0:02:32.320 I want to start with this idea of respect and 0:02:32.440 --> 0:02:34.239 really what it means in the way that China is 0:02:34.320 --> 0:02:38.720 using it in your view in regards to tariffs and 0:02:38.800 --> 0:02:40.919 the tit for tat when it comes to this trade war. 0:02:41.600 --> 0:02:42.560 Yeah, I think you have. 0:02:42.600 --> 0:02:45.480 To take into account that China is a country that 0:02:45.600 --> 0:02:50.360 prides itself on having five thousand years of civilization, so 0:02:50.760 --> 0:02:56.280 a five thousand year history, and they do things gradually. 0:02:56.560 --> 0:02:59.120 They've had the time to learn to do things gradually, 0:02:59.320 --> 0:03:05.000 and Trump is doing things very chaotically and that's not 0:03:05.200 --> 0:03:06.880 something they're used to dealing with. 0:03:07.000 --> 0:03:08.359 There have been comments by. 0:03:08.400 --> 0:03:13.520 Jadie Vance and others talking about peasants lending money to 0:03:13.560 --> 0:03:19.040 buy things made by peasants lending money to the US. 0:03:19.240 --> 0:03:22.560 So this isn't the way to work with China. They 0:03:22.639 --> 0:03:26.960 expect to have a deal worked out by the technical folks, 0:03:27.160 --> 0:03:30.640 and then the leaders to only meet once that deal 0:03:30.840 --> 0:03:34.600 is worked out. So bottom up and gradual, not the 0:03:34.639 --> 0:03:39.680 top down and chaotic that that Trump is initiating. 0:03:40.280 --> 0:03:45.080 So is this just jocking. I keep wondering these two 0:03:45.120 --> 0:03:47.680 economies still kind of need each other or do they not? 0:03:48.000 --> 0:03:50.119 Like is there something we're missing in terms of what's 0:03:50.160 --> 0:03:53.360 going in internally in China? And Tim and I have talked, 0:03:53.400 --> 0:03:56.600 We've listened to some podcasts who said, you know, COVID 0:03:56.680 --> 0:03:58.760 changed a lot of things and a lot of American 0:03:58.800 --> 0:04:02.200 businesses pulled back or executives and eyes on the ground, 0:04:02.200 --> 0:04:05.720 Maybe not so much in China. And there's a lot 0:04:05.760 --> 0:04:09.640 more sophistication in terms of what they are producing and 0:04:09.680 --> 0:04:12.560 how they are doing it that maybe is going unawares 0:04:12.600 --> 0:04:16.680 by the world at large. But help us understand what 0:04:16.839 --> 0:04:20.120 is China today. It's not just a manufacturer of sneakers 0:04:20.120 --> 0:04:20.760 and T shirts. 0:04:21.240 --> 0:04:26.520 No, China is a very advanced country with some of 0:04:26.560 --> 0:04:34.240 the frontier technologies on things like electric vehicles, autonomous driving, 0:04:35.520 --> 0:04:39.279 and even in AI. They've made substantial progress, though they're 0:04:39.320 --> 0:04:43.680 still behind the US. But there is a symbiotic relationship. 0:04:44.080 --> 0:04:49.840 So China is worried about deflation, We're worried about inflation. 0:04:50.080 --> 0:04:52.960 And these are exactly two sides of the same coin 0:04:53.520 --> 0:04:57.200 they have over capacity. We don't really have the capacity 0:04:57.279 --> 0:05:01.320 or know how to do manufacturing anymore. And while there 0:05:01.360 --> 0:05:06.200 have been problems with the relationship, we do need each other. 0:05:07.160 --> 0:05:09.880 And why do we still need each other? Why do 0:05:09.920 --> 0:05:11.480 we still need each other? Because I think there are 0:05:11.480 --> 0:05:14.400 some who say China maybe doesn't I don't know, or 0:05:14.400 --> 0:05:15.480 maybe the US doesn't. 0:05:15.760 --> 0:05:17.600 Well, there are a lot of things we get from 0:05:17.720 --> 0:05:20.719 China that we need to keep our economy going. So 0:05:21.040 --> 0:05:24.200 we live in a world of global supply chains where 0:05:24.200 --> 0:05:27.120 parts and components are coming from China as well as 0:05:27.160 --> 0:05:31.440 other countries. So trying to manufacture in isolation is just 0:05:31.520 --> 0:05:36.360 frankly a non starter. Won't be competitive in a global market. 0:05:37.240 --> 0:05:42.200 China is also sitting on seven hundred billion in US 0:05:42.240 --> 0:05:46.599 dollar assets, so that's another area where China has a 0:05:46.600 --> 0:05:49.880 pretty big trump card to play. I don't think they will. 0:05:50.080 --> 0:05:55.080 It's a country that wants stability. It's a careful in 0:05:55.120 --> 0:05:58.680 any policy move it takes. But we very much need 0:05:58.720 --> 0:06:02.520 each other. We need the goods each other produces, and 0:06:02.560 --> 0:06:05.039 we need to work together and work through this. It's 0:06:05.080 --> 0:06:09.440 not perfect. Some decoupling is probably good, but sudden and 0:06:09.480 --> 0:06:13.080 sharp is going to be painful. And that's why we 0:06:13.160 --> 0:06:17.440 see it. With what's been happening with the stock market now, 0:06:17.839 --> 0:06:20.120 I think we're not only having an own goal, we're 0:06:20.160 --> 0:06:21.839 on our way to an own hat trick. 0:06:22.279 --> 0:06:24.880 The White House Press Secretary Caroline Levit said this week 0:06:24.920 --> 0:06:28.919 that China needs what the US has, which is consumers 0:06:28.960 --> 0:06:31.599 who spend money. Is that accurat in your view? 0:06:32.200 --> 0:06:32.960 Yeah, it is. 0:06:33.040 --> 0:06:38.280 That's why they're suffering deflation, That's why they have excess capacity. 0:06:38.960 --> 0:06:42.039 They need what we have, but we need what they 0:06:42.120 --> 0:06:45.000 have too. We have a population that's used to buying 0:06:45.080 --> 0:06:49.400 things and buying things cheaply. The growth of the Chinese 0:06:49.480 --> 0:06:53.080 economy has been part of what kept inflation so low 0:06:53.600 --> 0:06:59.720 for so long and supported global growth. So yes, they 0:06:59.720 --> 0:07:03.679 need but I wouldn't say that doesn't mean we don't 0:07:03.720 --> 0:07:04.080 need them. 0:07:04.120 --> 0:07:05.440 This is going to hurt us both. 0:07:05.800 --> 0:07:08.120 It may be a question of who it hurts more. 0:07:08.680 --> 0:07:11.600 But there could be a way to make it a 0:07:11.640 --> 0:07:13.480 little softer for both of us. 0:07:13.800 --> 0:07:16.040 You know, one question that I keep asking anyone who 0:07:16.080 --> 0:07:18.160 will speak to me about this is who has the 0:07:18.280 --> 0:07:21.240 leverage in this negotiation between the US and China. You 0:07:21.280 --> 0:07:24.520 said the relationship is symbiotic. These two countries need each other. 0:07:24.880 --> 0:07:28.320 But is there one trading partner that is more powerful 0:07:28.320 --> 0:07:29.600 than the other and why? 0:07:30.120 --> 0:07:32.800 Well, I think initially it looked like the US because 0:07:32.920 --> 0:07:38.200 China's economy is already in a slowdown because of demographics, 0:07:39.160 --> 0:07:46.400 because of their own property issues, property crisis there, so 0:07:46.720 --> 0:07:49.360 it looked like we had more power. They really really 0:07:49.440 --> 0:07:52.800 need our consumer. But there's one thing they have that 0:07:52.880 --> 0:07:56.440 we don't have, which is a population that they can 0:07:56.520 --> 0:08:01.680 control and that is more willing to talk pain than 0:08:02.000 --> 0:08:06.480 the US consumer. So at this point, I think it's 0:08:06.680 --> 0:08:07.800 kind of a toss up. 0:08:08.640 --> 0:08:10.600 So does that just mean President g is willing to 0:08:10.640 --> 0:08:13.280 inflict a little bit more pain maybe on his people 0:08:13.320 --> 0:08:16.240 and means he can kind of fight this fight a 0:08:16.280 --> 0:08:19.160 little bit longer than maybe the US can. Yeah, And 0:08:19.240 --> 0:08:19.840 he has. 0:08:19.720 --> 0:08:22.520 More authorities, so he has complete control of the media. 0:08:22.600 --> 0:08:26.040 So my understanding from Chinese colleagues is that in the 0:08:26.120 --> 0:08:30.280 Chinese press now a lot of people have access to VPNs, 0:08:30.360 --> 0:08:33.720 But in the Chinese press, the average person doesn't know 0:08:34.080 --> 0:08:36.680 that tariffs are over one hundred percent now, so the 0:08:36.800 --> 0:08:40.520 numbers aren't out there, the information isn't out there. There's 0:08:40.559 --> 0:08:45.120 a calm there, and there's an ability to control the economy, 0:08:45.559 --> 0:08:50.120 stimulate the economy, support people that we just frankly don't have, 0:08:50.440 --> 0:08:55.360 as well as the consumer here, who's going to be upset. 0:08:55.679 --> 0:08:58.320 You saw what happen over price of eggs. Imagine when 0:08:58.360 --> 0:09:00.760 that's everything you go to the you go to the 0:09:00.800 --> 0:09:01.200 store for. 0:09:01.559 --> 0:09:03.720 That's a really good point. That is a very good point. 0:09:03.720 --> 0:09:03.920 Hey. 0:09:03.920 --> 0:09:05.400 One of the reasons we wanted to speak to you 0:09:06.040 --> 0:09:09.160 is you have done so much when it comes to trade. 0:09:09.240 --> 0:09:11.920 A reminder, you're a senior fellow at the Peterson Institute 0:09:11.960 --> 0:09:15.640 for International Economics, Global Director of Trade, Investment and Competitiveness 0:09:16.000 --> 0:09:19.400 at the World Bank. How does this trade war end? 0:09:21.080 --> 0:09:26.160 That is the million dollar question. Hopefully it ends with negotiation. 0:09:26.600 --> 0:09:30.760 So there does seem now to be negotiation with other countries. 0:09:30.920 --> 0:09:34.520 Trump has made it clear that if she rings him up, 0:09:34.559 --> 0:09:40.640 he'll take the call. So I think we can get there. 0:09:42.160 --> 0:09:45.200 But right now we have two big trucks driving at 0:09:45.200 --> 0:09:47.520 each other and it looks more like a game of chicken. 0:09:47.679 --> 0:09:50.880 So it's time will tell. 0:09:50.920 --> 0:09:55.720 I guess if the United States aim Caroline is to 0:09:55.880 --> 0:10:00.000 contain the rise of China, if that is the ultimate goal, 0:10:00.760 --> 0:10:05.040 than what I think, that's a really hard thing to do. 0:10:05.280 --> 0:10:08.880 China is a big country, so I think it can 0:10:08.920 --> 0:10:11.560 slow it. I think probably it already has with some 0:10:11.600 --> 0:10:16.120 of the restrictions on technology. That the other side of 0:10:16.160 --> 0:10:20.120 that is it's encouraging innovation in and of itself. So 0:10:20.200 --> 0:10:24.079 the fact that we held back on AI chips probably 0:10:24.160 --> 0:10:28.559 made something like deep Seek more likely. So I don't 0:10:28.640 --> 0:10:32.600 think there's a holding back of a country the size 0:10:32.640 --> 0:10:37.800 of China. So what we need to work towards is 0:10:38.160 --> 0:10:43.600 managing in a world with China and working more. 0:10:43.480 --> 0:10:44.959 Closely with our allies. 0:10:45.240 --> 0:10:48.200 So this could have been handled, in my view, much 0:10:48.280 --> 0:10:52.840 better by working with countries in Europe, countries like Japan 0:10:53.000 --> 0:11:00.520 and Australia, and sort of isolating China that way, couraging 0:11:00.600 --> 0:11:03.480 China to play by the rules that we want to 0:11:03.520 --> 0:11:06.840 set as a globe. The US is less than fifteen 0:11:06.920 --> 0:11:10.200 percent of global trade right now, so there's eighty five 0:11:10.320 --> 0:11:14.600 percent of economic might out there without us. We really 0:11:14.640 --> 0:11:18.480 can't engage in this fight alone, do our allies? 0:11:18.960 --> 0:11:21.760 And I use that term loosely right now, because I 0:11:21.800 --> 0:11:25.280 think a lot of folks would say we're fighting with 0:11:25.360 --> 0:11:27.440 allies right now, at least when it comes to trade. 0:11:27.800 --> 0:11:31.520 Do they feel the same way about China? 0:11:31.559 --> 0:11:34.160 I think they're beginning too. And I think one thing 0:11:34.240 --> 0:11:36.520 this will do is China now needs to sell all 0:11:36.559 --> 0:11:39.280 the goods it's not selling to us somewhere else, and 0:11:39.360 --> 0:11:42.760 other countries are very very worried about that. So in 0:11:42.800 --> 0:11:46.840 that sense, we may pull them along with us, but 0:11:47.679 --> 0:11:52.480 Trump's vitriol has certainly pushed them away. So I think 0:11:53.120 --> 0:11:55.600 we're going to have to see. But I do think 0:11:55.679 --> 0:11:59.560 there's room for that if we behave a little more nicely. 0:12:01.240 --> 0:12:03.679 Ah See, the world would be better if we all 0:12:03.760 --> 0:12:06.240 just were a little bit nicer. It's really kind of 0:12:06.240 --> 0:12:09.200 sim pocomically that now looking at me when you said 0:12:09.600 --> 0:12:11.840 you're super nice. No, I'm not looking at you, but 0:12:11.880 --> 0:12:15.319 I just Carolyne, thank you so much. We were really 0:12:15.360 --> 0:12:17.520 looking to do kind of this deep dive because we 0:12:17.559 --> 0:12:20.040 feel like it certainly is that relationship between the US 0:12:20.040 --> 0:12:23.080 and China so important to kind of what happens next globally. 0:12:23.400 --> 0:12:26.600 She's dean at the UC San Diego School of Global 0:12:26.600 --> 0:12:30.160 Policy and Strategy. Joining us from La Joya, California. 0:12:30.559 --> 0:12:34.520 You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Weekdaily Podcast. Catch us 0:12:34.600 --> 0:12:38.040 live weekday afternoons from two to five pm Eastern. Listen 0:12:38.080 --> 0:12:41.640 on Apple CarPlay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app, 0:12:41.800 --> 0:12:44.360 or watch us live on YouTube. 0:12:44.840 --> 0:12:47.240 Chairs of Whirlpool rally as the company maintained its full 0:12:47.320 --> 0:12:51.440 year financial outlook despite uncertainty over global tariffs, saying their 0:12:51.520 --> 0:12:54.680 long term impact will benefit the company's position in the 0:12:54.800 --> 0:12:56.360 US home appliance market. 0:12:56.600 --> 0:12:59.719 Whirlpool manufactures most of its US bound products in the 0:12:59.840 --> 0:13:02.720 US and expects the new trade restrictions will help the 0:13:02.720 --> 0:13:04.880 company compete against foreign rivals. 0:13:05.240 --> 0:13:08.400 We spoke to l Pool Corporations chairman and CEO Mark 0:13:08.440 --> 0:13:11.600 Bitzer just after the company released it's quarterly update. 0:13:11.760 --> 0:13:13.480 Well, you know, I mean, obviously we saw in our 0:13:13.520 --> 0:13:16.839 earnings release where despite everything else going on, we're pretty 0:13:16.840 --> 0:13:19.400 pleased with our Q one. I mean, we're basically I 0:13:19.400 --> 0:13:22.800 would consider our business largely on track. We hit the 0:13:22.840 --> 0:13:26.280 EPs pretty much in line with consensus. On organic revenues, 0:13:26.280 --> 0:13:28.560 we're up two percent almost six percent margin, which puts 0:13:28.640 --> 0:13:32.080 us on track to our folio guidance, and we're reconfirming guidance. So, 0:13:32.600 --> 0:13:35.200 I mean, obviously it's not all euphoric, but give them 0:13:35.240 --> 0:13:37.320 everything else going on, I think we should feel pretty 0:13:37.360 --> 0:13:39.360 good about being on track in the current environment. 0:13:39.760 --> 0:13:42.000 How would you describe the US consumer right now. 0:13:42.440 --> 0:13:45.640 Yeah, I mean, obviously it's been a lot of all 0:13:45.720 --> 0:13:48.120 utility also a consumer side, and I think, if you 0:13:48.200 --> 0:13:50.040 want to say so, we're probably a little bit the 0:13:50.080 --> 0:13:52.720 cannery and the cole min when it comes to consumer confidence. 0:13:52.760 --> 0:13:54.040 And the reason why I'm saying this one. 0:13:54.080 --> 0:13:56.520 You know, every day, you know, many companies have a 0:13:56.559 --> 0:13:59.200 big order pipeline. Our orders are pretty much seven days. 0:14:00.160 --> 0:14:02.680 I see it pretty fast if consumer orders something or not. 0:14:03.640 --> 0:14:07.800 And we saw actually a very healthy consumer sentiment following 0:14:07.960 --> 0:14:11.600 the election pretty much through January mid February, and then 0:14:11.679 --> 0:14:15.920 we saw a clear deteriation of consumer confidence in particular 0:14:16.040 --> 0:14:18.960 particular my discretionary side of demand and iving. 0:14:19.120 --> 0:14:21.440 That continued to also in Q two. So we see right. 0:14:21.320 --> 0:14:25.040 Now the consumer probably lacks confidence about the financial future 0:14:25.040 --> 0:14:26.880 and holding back discretionary purchases. 0:14:27.120 --> 0:14:30.280 Wellw does that compare with your where consumers have been 0:14:30.360 --> 0:14:32.760 during your tenure at Whirlpool, Because we've spoken to you 0:14:32.840 --> 0:14:36.040 quite a bit over the last few years, throughout through downs, 0:14:36.360 --> 0:14:39.760 through relatively calm periods. How would you describe the consumer 0:14:39.840 --> 0:14:42.080 right now relative to where the consumer has been during 0:14:42.120 --> 0:14:42.600 your tenure? 0:14:43.120 --> 0:14:46.720 Yea, Tim, I've been twenty six years, so you don't 0:14:46.720 --> 0:14:47.560 have enough time to go. 0:14:47.640 --> 0:14:48.640 You give you all the ups and. 0:14:48.640 --> 0:14:50.200 But is it better than the that gives us a 0:14:50.200 --> 0:14:52.560 great view? Is it better than the financial crisis, better 0:14:52.600 --> 0:14:54.600 than the dot com bust? Better than covid? 0:14:55.240 --> 0:14:58.880 You know, it's it's how should I put from an 0:14:58.880 --> 0:15:01.920 economic perspective, it does not from a human perspective. From 0:15:01.920 --> 0:15:04.280 an economic perspective, I think there's a lot of similarities 0:15:04.320 --> 0:15:05.880 to what we saw in the early days of COVID 0:15:06.320 --> 0:15:08.280 and what I'm saying based on consumers. 0:15:08.320 --> 0:15:09.960 It just there's a you know. 0:15:09.920 --> 0:15:13.880 Everyday new messages which don't necessarily help consumer confidence. So 0:15:13.920 --> 0:15:16.760 from a pre consumer confidence perspective, we just want to 0:15:16.800 --> 0:15:18.560 have stability in the message. 0:15:18.640 --> 0:15:21.080 I think consumers can deal with good or bad news. 0:15:21.440 --> 0:15:24.200 It's just the every day changing news and the uncertainty 0:15:24.520 --> 0:15:26.760 which neither helps business investors or consumers. 0:15:26.760 --> 0:15:29.120 And I think so the drop which. 0:15:28.960 --> 0:15:31.560 We've seen kind of in the course of six weeks, yep, 0:15:31.840 --> 0:15:35.080 that was probably among the biggest jobs I've seen. Now 0:15:35.080 --> 0:15:37.080 hopefully at one point it will also come back up again, 0:15:37.600 --> 0:15:40.640 but right now they drop was pretty fast and pretty drastic. 0:15:41.480 --> 0:15:44.040 So we love talking with you. We've got through so 0:15:44.040 --> 0:15:47.200 many cycles together and I'm just thinking of those who 0:15:47.240 --> 0:15:51.040 are watching and listening to Bloomberg Business Week on this Wednesday. 0:15:52.200 --> 0:15:55.080 I am curious about your supply chain, like we are 0:15:55.120 --> 0:15:59.400 all getting a great lesson right in global trade, global 0:15:59.400 --> 0:16:03.120 supply chain, and tell us about your supply chain and 0:16:03.240 --> 0:16:07.480 how the US China or just the US terror of 0:16:07.640 --> 0:16:11.119 trade war is potentially impacting you or making. 0:16:10.840 --> 0:16:11.440 You change it. 0:16:12.680 --> 0:16:14.360 First, well, Carol, I want to give you credit, but 0:16:14.560 --> 0:16:16.800 it took you to question free to raise the ward Tarraff. 0:16:18.360 --> 0:16:19.000 I'm trying. 0:16:19.120 --> 0:16:21.320 I'm trying to kudos to. 0:16:21.320 --> 0:16:25.160 You, you know, And obviously there's a lot of moving 0:16:25.200 --> 0:16:29.160 parts of play. Ultimately comes back to we are kind 0:16:29.200 --> 0:16:32.440 of the only and last American appliance company, and we 0:16:32.560 --> 0:16:34.680 produce eighty percent of what we sell in the US 0:16:34.720 --> 0:16:37.440 in US, and of what we produce in US, more 0:16:37.440 --> 0:16:39.360 than eighty percent of aparts are sourced in the US, 0:16:39.400 --> 0:16:42.480 So we are a domestic producer. I know a lot 0:16:42.480 --> 0:16:44.920 of companies talk about reshoring or on showing. We never 0:16:45.000 --> 0:16:48.440 left Okay, and that's a big difference. So as such, 0:16:49.040 --> 0:16:52.920 even more, we're also faced with some headwinds in particular components, 0:16:52.960 --> 0:16:56.640 et cetera. Ultimately we will be a net winner because 0:16:56.640 --> 0:16:59.480 we're a domestic producer and in this case, this is 0:16:59.480 --> 0:17:00.640 different from our industries. 0:17:00.760 --> 0:17:01.680 There's capacity. 0:17:01.800 --> 0:17:05.560 We have enough capacity, enough factories to fill them, and 0:17:05.880 --> 0:17:08.480 I appreciate other industries. You know, it may take some time, 0:17:08.920 --> 0:17:11.560 but I think ultimately and we all don't know what 0:17:11.600 --> 0:17:14.520 the final final picture of for terifs is, but something 0:17:14.560 --> 0:17:18.320 will be there and we do see us benefiting from 0:17:18.320 --> 0:17:18.840 this one. 0:17:19.400 --> 0:17:22.560 How do you want to see this trade war play out? 0:17:22.600 --> 0:17:28.160 Because I'm assuming that some of these tariffs help you domestically. 0:17:28.800 --> 0:17:31.480 Well, and again I think that probably needs a libit explanation. 0:17:31.520 --> 0:17:34.679 So Carol, actually we're not asking for exemptions. We're not 0:17:34.760 --> 0:17:37.359 asking for tech subsidies or gifts or handouts or whatever 0:17:37.880 --> 0:17:41.600 there are right now in the pre existing so called 0:17:41.640 --> 0:17:44.440 two thirty two and three or one teffs, there are 0:17:44.440 --> 0:17:48.600 loopholes which hurt us and they structurally benefit Asian producers. 0:17:49.160 --> 0:17:52.320 And it's put in simple terms, you know, because the 0:17:52.320 --> 0:17:55.560 two thirty two terriffs, I pay in US for steel 0:17:55.600 --> 0:17:58.560 two or three times more than Asia steel and any 0:17:58.600 --> 0:18:01.000 component which I can't get them US, like an LED 0:18:01.119 --> 0:18:04.399 panel IPAI teriffs. So if the same product is produced 0:18:04.400 --> 0:18:06.760 in Vietnam or Korea. They don't have to pay the 0:18:06.840 --> 0:18:08.720 tariffs and steel they don't have to pay the teriffs 0:18:08.720 --> 0:18:12.760 of components. That difference is big. It's about seventy dollars 0:18:12.800 --> 0:18:14.879 per products and put that in retail price. That basically 0:18:14.880 --> 0:18:17.359 means one hundred and fifty dollars different retail price. So 0:18:17.480 --> 0:18:20.280 all we ask for is just close the loophole. We're 0:18:20.320 --> 0:18:24.280 all in support of having a strong US based steal production. 0:18:24.440 --> 0:18:26.840 I think it's we all agree it's important. Just close 0:18:26.840 --> 0:18:29.280 the loophole. That's all we ask for. So we don't 0:18:29.320 --> 0:18:32.119 ask for special treatment. Just close the loophole. Take the 0:18:32.280 --> 0:18:35.320 disadvantage away. Again, I'm not looking for an unfair advantage. 0:18:35.320 --> 0:18:37.639 We're just looking for a level playing field and then 0:18:37.920 --> 0:18:39.640 when we can compete BAREI well. 0:18:39.920 --> 0:18:42.560 So we're talking, of course with Mark Bitzer. He is 0:18:42.600 --> 0:18:46.160 chief executive officer at Worldpool Corporation, joining us from Michigan. 0:18:46.320 --> 0:18:48.000 One thing I want to ask you what you have 0:18:48.080 --> 0:18:51.840 learned about manufacturing in the United States. Is there a 0:18:51.960 --> 0:18:54.359 lesson or something a message you'd like to share with 0:18:54.640 --> 0:18:56.520 other folks who are saying I can't manufacture in the 0:18:56.600 --> 0:18:57.440 United States. 0:18:58.320 --> 0:19:01.400 You know, and again it's Carol, as you can probably 0:19:02.000 --> 0:19:05.280 tell for my accent, dual citizen of American and German. 0:19:05.600 --> 0:19:08.080 So to say sit here and say I'm staying here 0:19:08.080 --> 0:19:11.400 for patriotic reason, it's probably not credible. US production can 0:19:11.520 --> 0:19:13.640 be working well well, and I really and I'm proud 0:19:13.680 --> 0:19:16.480 of our ten strong factors in the US. And if 0:19:16.480 --> 0:19:18.159 you go to a factory like in clyde O, Hi, 0:19:18.320 --> 0:19:21.640 where you have three generational factor workers, these are proud 0:19:21.680 --> 0:19:23.840 people that have worked very hard. So I know there's 0:19:23.880 --> 0:19:26.360 now a lot of jokes about US manufacturing. You can 0:19:26.480 --> 0:19:30.960 produce in US, and there's a very good skilled workforce 0:19:31.000 --> 0:19:33.880 which you can have as long as we don't harm 0:19:33.960 --> 0:19:36.800 ourselves with kind of you know, issues which make production 0:19:36.880 --> 0:19:40.200 more difficult in US, like steep price and component costs. 0:19:40.320 --> 0:19:43.240 So I really, I know some people are hesitating about 0:19:43.240 --> 0:19:45.359 moving back to US. We have been producing in the 0:19:45.400 --> 0:19:48.000 US for one hundred and fourteen years, this success. 0:19:48.840 --> 0:19:52.840 So you know, I'm curious about since you already produced 0:19:52.840 --> 0:19:54.800 here in the US, and you have eighty percent of 0:19:54.840 --> 0:19:57.920 the production that goes to the US actually being made here, 0:19:58.000 --> 0:20:00.280 plus you source a lot of the parts here, you're 0:20:00.320 --> 0:20:04.320 relatively unaffected by tariffs. Would you say that the tariffs 0:20:04.359 --> 0:20:07.200 that the Trump administration has proposed or is even putting 0:20:07.200 --> 0:20:09.800 on have been a net benefit for your business. 0:20:10.960 --> 0:20:14.479 You know, it's again so far, there's more announcements than 0:20:14.520 --> 0:20:17.000 already action in place. So far what is in places 0:20:17.040 --> 0:20:20.159 for two thirty two and the ten percent tariffs? But 0:20:20.280 --> 0:20:22.160 you know, I go back to and I know there's 0:20:22.200 --> 0:20:25.320 a lot of talk about what the previous Trump administration did, 0:20:25.400 --> 0:20:27.720 but two A one tariffs in twenty eighteen, because I 0:20:27.720 --> 0:20:28.280 know there's. 0:20:28.119 --> 0:20:30.240 A lot of talk about did they raise price or not? 0:20:30.840 --> 0:20:34.280 If you now today look back, these terrfs were put 0:20:34.280 --> 0:20:36.560 in place in twenty eighteen, and where we are today. 0:20:37.160 --> 0:20:40.400 Washer prices today are lower than wevern two or fourteen. 0:20:40.680 --> 0:20:43.359 So tell me one product category which has lower prices 0:20:43.400 --> 0:20:46.240 been two or fourteen and compared to twenty eighteen, there's 0:20:46.240 --> 0:20:48.080 two more factories producing washes in US. 0:20:48.160 --> 0:20:50.120 So from that perspective, what the. 0:20:50.119 --> 0:20:53.399 Prior Trump administration did actually in our industry worked. It 0:20:53.480 --> 0:20:56.200 brought new production and the prices did not raise. Now 0:20:56.240 --> 0:20:58.760 there's always some moving parts as you go through this one, 0:20:59.000 --> 0:21:01.640 but it worked. Now that may be different in other industries, 0:21:01.680 --> 0:21:04.720 But I think I know ironersty pretty well you add 0:21:04.720 --> 0:21:08.280 production capacity to ultimately build benefit for consumer. 0:21:08.240 --> 0:21:13.040 Does the risk though, of declining US consumer sentiment as 0:21:13.040 --> 0:21:16.840 a result of rising prices in other categories and concerns 0:21:16.880 --> 0:21:21.920 about uncertainty moving forward? Does that way to a greater 0:21:22.040 --> 0:21:24.520 extent than the benefit that you get from tariffs as 0:21:24.520 --> 0:21:25.920 a US producer of products. 0:21:27.280 --> 0:21:29.480 Yeah, I mean, I think it's a fair question. Of course, 0:21:29.480 --> 0:21:32.040 in the short term there will be call it wobbliness 0:21:32.080 --> 0:21:34.680 along the way. But I think, as I mentioned earlier, 0:21:34.680 --> 0:21:37.760