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Speaker 1: You're listening to the Fantasy Sports Radio Network Fantasy Best
Speaker 1: Friends Forever m Do Do Do Do Do Do Do
Speaker 1: Do Do Do Do Do Do Do Do Do Yeah.
Speaker 1: This as the Fantasy Best Friends Forever here on the
Speaker 1: Fantasy Sports Radio Network alongside Frankie stamfele I am Greg
Speaker 1: so spend Ducks are abound as we go and play
Speaker 1: a little closer Roulette today on the program What's going
Speaker 1: on Frankie Reggae. What's up man? Happy hump Day, Wednesday,
Speaker 1: March six. I noticed you had you had some new
Speaker 1: moves today. You're really really into like the shoulders like yeah,
Speaker 1: to to like, I don't know what you do doing?
Speaker 1: That wasn't a thing. What's up man? Not much, man,
Speaker 1: not much. I'm telling your story off the area either
Speaker 1: off did that story? I cannot say? On there, I
Speaker 1: know you cannot. I'll be listening. I'll be here all day, same,
Speaker 1: we'll talk. I hope. So, man, I hope. So sleep,
Speaker 1: How did I see? I slept pretty well? How did
Speaker 1: you sleep? Oh? Well? Man? Well wow, reversing roles. Here's weird.
Speaker 1: All right, it's weird. You know for me, I'm used
Speaker 1: to be waking up in the middle of the night
Speaker 1: and like, that's okay. My last night I woke up,
Speaker 1: it was one fifty. Like one fifty. That's that's an
Speaker 1: early middle of night wake up. Like I mean, you're
Speaker 1: like fifty years old. I mean it's hard to stay
Speaker 1: start to stay awake nowadays, but like one fifty, Like
Speaker 1: what am I up for right now? And then it's
Speaker 1: just like my mind's my mind has really been racing
Speaker 1: a lot. I think I had a dream of one
Speaker 1: I got fired. That's more of a nightmare than a dream.
Speaker 1: It was bad. I got your back, and I'm just like,
Speaker 1: what what is happening? And then I'm just like I
Speaker 1: just think there's so much wedding stuff going on the
Speaker 1: ring way through my head. We have it knows me
Speaker 1: a very big day at work. We have a lot
Speaker 1: going on today, We have a lot going on. Um,
Speaker 1: next week's a crazy week. It's just a lot going
Speaker 1: on up here. Man. I know you had to you
Speaker 1: had to travel to Jersey to do some wedding stuff yesterday,
Speaker 1: right I did. It? Sounds like a disaster. It was like, honest,
Speaker 1: it was fine. It was fine. Like there was a
Speaker 1: lot of questions and all honestly, like Judy and her
Speaker 1: mom were answered a bunch of questions. Her dad was
Speaker 1: playing on her phone. I was playing on an iPad
Speaker 1: that like they had and why did you need to
Speaker 1: be there? Because I want to make sure my opinions hurt?
Speaker 1: Was it hurt? Did they need you at all? Sounds
Speaker 1: like they didn't really need you, know, so they needed
Speaker 1: me for certain things. Um, like for instance, a lot
Speaker 1: of times at weddings, like when you leave, like they
Speaker 1: get out stuff, okay, like a party favor, either party favor,
Speaker 1: Like when like last food thing. It's like I'd left
Speaker 1: a bunch of weddings. They have like pretzels that they served,
Speaker 1: so whatever whatever. So we had said previously like we
Speaker 1: wanted to give out donuts and then We're just like,
Speaker 1: I don't really want to do the donuts anymore. But
Speaker 1: we wrote that into the contract. Actually wanted me to
Speaker 1: negotiate like how to get the donuts out of the contract.
Speaker 1: So that was that was my That was like my
Speaker 1: purpose there a fair enough, I guess being honest with you, Okay,
Speaker 1: So um, that was my role to being that was Jersey.
Speaker 1: How's the shore looking? Uh? And it wasn't on the shore.
Speaker 1: I was very close to here. I just assumed that
Speaker 1: it every time you go to the Jersey go back,
Speaker 1: you go back home. You know. It was in Jersey City.
Speaker 1: Those Jersey City. I don't think I've ever been there.
Speaker 1: That's great, like Jersey City. All right, So it was fine.
Speaker 1: So everything it's just everything else. I'll tell you off
Speaker 1: the air. Um, but it got wild, It got wild.
Speaker 1: He says, yeah, all right, I'm I'm looking forward to
Speaker 1: Uh do I have you intrigued enough to hearing that
Speaker 1: from you? Do? I have you intrigued enough? Do you
Speaker 1: have my attention? It's all I could ask for see
Speaker 1: what happens. I know we wrote like the relief picture
Speaker 1: breakdown for today's show, but you know, we were having
Speaker 1: a great soccer conversation downstairs. Should just bring those guys
Speaker 1: up here and like and Steve and kick you out.
Speaker 1: We'll just keep the soccer talk. Probably not all right.
Speaker 1: I thought I would just throw it out there. You
Speaker 1: never know. It was very spirited discussion. Surprised you didn't
Speaker 1: chime in and soccer talk for you, you know, I
Speaker 1: just don't know enough. You guys are like obviously going
Speaker 1: at it. And I was like, that's great, the into
Speaker 1: the World Cup when when it was on. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: like the World Cup when it's on unforet Unfortunately, like
Speaker 1: every other soccer fan in that record, every other soccer fan,
Speaker 1: but like a lot of mainstream soccer fans in the Guard,
Speaker 1: you know, American soccer. Sorry, I mean I've kind of
Speaker 1: fallen off really yeah. I mean I'll watch it if
Speaker 1: it's on. But I used to go a lot harder
Speaker 1: actually when it came to soccer. Not so much anymore.
Speaker 1: You are actually gonna be so into baseball and football
Speaker 1: speak a baseball. Frank's super into baseball that he has
Speaker 1: set up his own Patreon this year. So if you're
Speaker 1: watching where you're listening, you haven't signed up for his
Speaker 1: Patreon to do it right now it's however much you
Speaker 1: want to pay a dollar. You don't very much for that,
Speaker 1: so I don't do that. Five dollars, that's okay. But
Speaker 1: the ten dollar tier, that's where you want to be.
Speaker 1: Ten bucks. You get his rankings, they update constantly. You
Speaker 1: want that. That tier is where you want to be.
Speaker 1: The twenty five dollar tier, he's basically your slave at
Speaker 1: that point. It's twenty five dollars a month all you
Speaker 1: can get. Like to think of it as a sidekick,
Speaker 1: greg slave, like your faith. Refrain from the words late,
Speaker 1: we'll go. We'll go with fantasy. I think about however
Speaker 1: you want it, man, But if they pay you twenty
Speaker 1: five dollars, you are what they say they are, you are,
Speaker 1: You're not wrong the dollars. And we have some people
Speaker 1: at that level already where Frank has to run everything.
Speaker 1: Shout out to Mitch from Atlanti signed up yesterday, Cities.
Speaker 1: An avid watcher. He watch this every day. No, no,
Speaker 1: ten dollars, perfect ten dollars. He had a keeper league
Speaker 1: question for me. I chattered up with him a little bit,
Speaker 1: so Mitch crushing it. Constant, constant, he is a fantasy sidekick. Okay, Constantine.
Speaker 1: Maybe he just needs to help. That's what it is.
Speaker 1: Maybe Constant needs help. I mean he does pretty well.
Speaker 1: Oh all right, fair enough, let's get into the relievers. Frank,
Speaker 1: where do we have to Maybe I'm wrong by this,
Speaker 1: but now that my rankings are completely you can vettom
Speaker 1: move me for one cent less than Chris Vnter's asking for.
Speaker 1: And if find out Chris is asking Priss later on,
Speaker 1: we can't have a closure show without. Frank came about
Speaker 1: that line in a half hour ago. I was like,
Speaker 1: you're definitely using it right. This stuff rights itself. Um
Speaker 1: when I look at the closers this year, and maybe
Speaker 1: it's just wrong and maybe I'm just in the in
Speaker 1: the mindset playing too much today, but like it feels
Speaker 1: like this is like the worst crop we've ever seen
Speaker 1: in our lives. It's horrible. It definitely is. There's no
Speaker 1: doubt about Yeah, this is This season has been the
Speaker 1: hardest thus far to rank and breakdown. We will try
Speaker 1: our best. I know a lot of people have asked
Speaker 1: us about holds as well, so we can dive into
Speaker 1: that a little bit. I do think, you know, for
Speaker 1: categories and roto leagues. I think that's why where we
Speaker 1: might be trending saves plus holds because I think at
Speaker 1: that point, Greg and let me know how you think.
Speaker 1: What you think about this is when you get saves
Speaker 1: plus holds as a category, now you're now drafting talent.
Speaker 1: This is what we should be doing. You're not drafting
Speaker 1: the Shane Greens of the world. Shane Green is gonna
Speaker 1: give you a five plus e r A, but hey,
Speaker 1: he might give you twenty five plus saves. Because saves
Speaker 1: are so hard to come by. Shane Green is still
Speaker 1: being drafted as a top twenty five thirty reliever, which
Speaker 1: based on his ratios as the r A and who
Speaker 1: he's terrible, he shouldn't be drafted because he gives you
Speaker 1: twenty five saves. You have to draft him in rhodo
Speaker 1: and and categories. Leagues had to categories leads. I think
Speaker 1: that we should start proposing that saves plus holds is
Speaker 1: better because at that point we're just drafting the most
Speaker 1: talented relievers, regardless of whether they're getting you safe. I mean, sure,
Speaker 1: like Edwin Daz, your elite closers, they're still gonna go
Speaker 1: very highly. But now you know, in situations like Philly
Speaker 1: where we don't necessarily know who the closer is, and
Speaker 1: I don't think we're ever going to know who the
Speaker 1: closer is. You could just draft talent there with David
Speaker 1: Robertson and Sir Anthony Dominguez, because you know, all right,
Speaker 1: on a nightly basis, one guy might get me the save,
Speaker 1: the other might get me the hold, but you know
Speaker 1: that both guys are still gonna be really good and
Speaker 1: give you good e r A and good whip and
Speaker 1: give you a lot of strikeouts. I think that is
Speaker 1: a direction we have to start to look towards more.
Speaker 1: And obviously we can talk a little bit more about
Speaker 1: holds today. I don't think we have a choice because
Speaker 1: there's so many bullpens now they're a bullpen by committee.
Speaker 1: Holds just kind of like work themselves into the relief
Speaker 1: picture conversation. Yeah, so I know, my lea, my Home
Speaker 1: League voted this year on like saves plus holds or
Speaker 1: something like that or adding holds, and it got it
Speaker 1: was not voted in. But I have a feeling that
Speaker 1: like we're gonna have to do something in the future too,
Speaker 1: Like maybe it's not this year, but starting next year,
Speaker 1: you know, correct, I think it's gonna build. Realize you're
Speaker 1: maybe you're you're won't realize this until after the draft happens,
Speaker 1: when we're like, oh, crap, relief pitching is bad. You
Speaker 1: can't find Closerstimately, I would say there's fifteen sixteen set
Speaker 1: closers in baseball right now, look at my last hang on,
Speaker 1: I have it right in front of me. Maybe if
Speaker 1: that one to three, four or five six, that's six.
Speaker 1: One of those includes Craig Kimbrow, which it shouldn't. He's
Speaker 1: not on a team. So that's five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten.
Speaker 1: You can't rust lasses, yes, eleven, twelve, thirteen, fourteen, And
Speaker 1: there are guys that we want to be closers, but
Speaker 1: we don't know if they are for sure. So I, oh,
Speaker 1: there's Shane Green's fifteen, so you're about right. You're about
Speaker 1: right about fifteen. And there's thirty teams in baseball. Half
Speaker 1: the teams have a set closer. And look, I'm selfishly
Speaker 1: for fantasy purposes, obviously we want more closers. I can't
Speaker 1: really debate what real life baseball managers are doing. If
Speaker 1: it's more effective, then sure, go for it. Like look
Speaker 1: at what the Brewers did last year. They didn't have
Speaker 1: a set closer. But they were all over the place
Speaker 1: with Josh Hayter and Jeremy Jefferson and Corey Knable once
Speaker 1: he returned from injury. They're all over the place and
Speaker 1: they had a phenomenal season. So if so, if this
Speaker 1: is the way that baseball is trending and it's working
Speaker 1: for managers, I can't knock them for doing it. So
Speaker 1: I think what you're actually pointing out even more so
Speaker 1: when you do the Brewers, it's a lot of the
Speaker 1: good teams that don't have a a set closer at
Speaker 1: the moment. Necessarily the Royals don't have a sec closer, yes,
Speaker 1: of course, but but they're seeing that as something that's
Speaker 1: working and other managers are starting to adopt. But I
Speaker 1: think the frustrating thing is the is the good teams
Speaker 1: that you know are going to be good theoretically, they
Speaker 1: don't have closures. Milwaukee, Boston, Philly, like those are three
Speaker 1: of the top teams in baseball, and you do not
Speaker 1: know their closer situation. Just disaster for fantasy purposes, Like
Speaker 1: we keep thinking that, all right, Boston is gonna win
Speaker 1: close to a hundred games, Philadelphia is gonna win close
Speaker 1: to a hundred games. But we do not know who
Speaker 1: the closer is. It's terrible. And then a guy like
Speaker 1: Josh Hayter, who will talk about throughout the program, where
Speaker 1: do you draft Josh Hayter. Yes, the metrics are good.
Speaker 1: A couple of years ago Adam at Davino metrics were amazing.
Speaker 1: We had Kristovinski, his metrics were amazing. But yeah, he
Speaker 1: can help you and strike out a whip in e
Speaker 1: er A, but that all important save category. They're not
Speaker 1: helping you, and it's just very frustrating. You cannot rely
Speaker 1: on it. It is so so annoying. And that's why
Speaker 1: when we have Modica come on on Monday's right and
Speaker 1: he's here talking about pitching. He did the relief picture
Speaker 1: right up for the athletic I make sure you go
Speaker 1: check that out. He says you have to have a
Speaker 1: plan going into and he predominantly drafts Rotissori, so you
Speaker 1: know you need the saves category. And he plays for
Speaker 1: an overall, so you can't ignore any category when it
Speaker 1: comes to rohto and you're playing for an overall. So
Speaker 1: that's why he says you need to have a plan
Speaker 1: when it comes to saves heading into your draft. I
Speaker 1: just did a fifteen team league, the Great Fantasy Baseball Invitational.
Speaker 1: I walk away from that draft with Wait Davis, who
Speaker 1: I think is unquestionably the Rockies closer, and then I
Speaker 1: have three like, Okay, whatever you are, I don't really
Speaker 1: know what you are. I have Michael Gibbons, I have
Speaker 1: Drew steckond Writer, and I have Kelvin Herrera. It's a
Speaker 1: fifteen team league. I mean you're gonna at that point
Speaker 1: you just try and grab as many of those names
Speaker 1: as you possibly can. I don't feel great about it,
Speaker 1: but I think in any fifteen team league where you
Speaker 1: need saves as a as a category, you're not really
Speaker 1: ever gonna feel great unless you spend like two or
Speaker 1: three of your top twelve picks on closers, and then
Speaker 1: that's gonna cause deficiency somewhere else. So it's tough. It's tough,
Speaker 1: especially in ROTO, and I think that's where it matters most.
Speaker 1: Like heads head categories, you could just punt the safe category,
Speaker 1: like you could be like, that's fine. You can just
Speaker 1: load up on a bunch of you know, great starting
Speaker 1: pitchers and try to have good ratios and win strikeout
Speaker 1: categories and win wins every single week and just punt
Speaker 1: the saves category and then head to head points leagues.
Speaker 1: I think everyone's head to head points league is different, right,
Speaker 1: because there are starting pitchers who still have relief picture
Speaker 1: eligibility Holan McHugh, Tyler Glass. Now guys like that where
Speaker 1: you can plug them into your relief picture spots and whatever.
Speaker 1: That's fine in my league. In my home leagues, um,
Speaker 1: we play it. You still have to use closers. Like, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's kind of like an honor system. If you see
Speaker 1: someone that has a starting pitcher who's in the relief
Speaker 1: picture spot, you have to like notify the commission or
Speaker 1: you have to like tell that person you have to
Speaker 1: have two closers in your lineup. Still two relievers in
Speaker 1: your you have to have two relievers in your line up, Yes,
Speaker 1: but I mean both of those are twelve team leagues,
Speaker 1: and you know you'll be able to find like twenty
Speaker 1: four whatever relievers. They're not really as sought after in
Speaker 1: head to head points league. That's what I've noticed. They don't.
Speaker 1: They just don't score as points, is like starting pitchers.
Speaker 1: So normally for me leagues, I wait, I wait on closures. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I know, I kind of do it. No, I mean you,
Speaker 1: you've got to be conscious of it. I kind of
Speaker 1: do what I've always done, to be perfectly honest with you, Frank,
Speaker 1: Like I draft one guy that I think I could
Speaker 1: count on, and I try to get a second guy
Speaker 1: that I'm pretty confident in, and I take a shot
Speaker 1: on the third guy and just what was like a
Speaker 1: quantity player. And that's what I try to come out
Speaker 1: of every draft with those three, like those three tiers essentially.
Speaker 1: And I agree with you, but that middle tier is
Speaker 1: harder to find possible. That's why you know I've ended
Speaker 1: up with Michael Gibbons, the guy gave up five and runs.
Speaker 1: Is this we don't know? Let me do the Michel
Speaker 1: don't know. So last apparently you love him. Drafted him
Speaker 1: to give Michel Gibbons conversation. So last year around this time,
Speaker 1: I pinpointed to everybody Shane Green, like that was my guy.
Speaker 1: Shane Green is gonna be the closer we could count
Speaker 1: on him, and like, don't worry about the five years, right,
Speaker 1: He's going to get you a ton of saves. And
Speaker 1: he did exactly what we asked for him. And that
Speaker 1: was like one that I nailed. So a couple so
Speaker 1: about a month ago, Franco's all right, like, who's the
Speaker 1: guy this year? Like it's really really tough. Do you
Speaker 1: have a guy that you think could be last year's
Speaker 1: Shane Green? So I said, all right, let me look,
Speaker 1: give me some time. I looked, and I looked, and
Speaker 1: I thought that, like Hunter Stricken was like too high
Speaker 1: on the list for this because I didn't count. So
Speaker 1: I went with Michael Gibbons. If patient starts laughing at me,
Speaker 1: I'm like, now he's the only reliever we know in
Speaker 1: the on the Orioles. He's got talent. They wanted to
Speaker 1: be good. He's the guy. Frank drafts him. Florio drafts him.
Speaker 1: I told Frank and every draft, every draft, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: pick Michael Gibbons as that last dart throw as a closer.
Speaker 1: What happens next? He allows five runs to whole runs.
Speaker 1: Yesterday he gets fobbed in his first appearance. I'm like,
Speaker 1: oh god, yeah, that's Michael Gillings not looking good. And
Speaker 1: that's basically the closer position as a whole. So correct, correct,
Speaker 1: That's that's what we're dealing with here. Yeah, and uh look,
Speaker 1: I mean there are stats to back it up to
Speaker 1: I looked over the past five years. UH, the number
Speaker 1: of relievers with thirty plus saves over the past five years,
Speaker 1: and it was seventeen. Went up in twenty fifteen to
Speaker 1: twenty one. Every year since we've been seeing a steady decline,
Speaker 1: had sixteen closures with thirty plus saves seventeen all the
Speaker 1: way down to eleven. Eighteen was a repeat with eleven,
Speaker 1: but we also saw in twenty eighteen there were forty
Speaker 1: three relievers with ten plus saves greg and in twenty
Speaker 1: seventeen there were forty nine relievers with ten plus safe.
Speaker 1: So over the past two seasons we've really seen whether
Speaker 1: it's due to injury or closure by committee, there's almost
Speaker 1: you know, there's between forty five and fifty relievers that
Speaker 1: are getting you ten plus saves, so there's not really
Speaker 1: many set guys that are getting you the thirty plus,
Speaker 1: but you kind of find more guys to sprinkled throughout
Speaker 1: who were giving you ten here and ten there. It's
Speaker 1: just you can't draft them. You're gonna end up spending
Speaker 1: your fab throughout the year on those guys. Unfortunately, that's
Speaker 1: that's the nature of the betweens with the picture, because
Speaker 1: when do we come back. We'll give you that first
Speaker 1: year closure is the guy that we guys that we trust.
Speaker 1: How do we rank them? We'll let you know On
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Speaker 1: a guy for you who is absolutely in the top
Speaker 1: ten of pictures who I have decided I am not
Speaker 1: drafting this year. This guy has literally thrown close to
Speaker 1: three thousand innings in his career. Last year may have
Speaker 1: been his best year, arguably his best year, and I'm
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Speaker 1: four BM Eastern on the Fantasy Sports Network and on
Speaker 1: your popular podcast providers Fantasy Best Spreads Forever, Fantasy Sports
Speaker 1: Radio Network, Greg Susman, Franks Stample, A lot to come.
Speaker 1: We had Joe Nieri joining the program a little bit
Speaker 1: later on today. I told forty he's gonna come on
Speaker 1: and talk a little relievers with us, and then our
Speaker 1: buddy Jim SNAs over at FanDuel he's gonna try to
Speaker 1: break down in the tougher closure situations to deal it.
Speaker 1: We also have the ducks in a row here as
Speaker 1: we've gotta pick random teams out and trying to figure
Speaker 1: out who the heck they're closer is. It should be
Speaker 1: fun game show style, Mike, It's gonna be a really
Speaker 1: fun show. So before we do any of that, Frank,
Speaker 1: I wanted to get into the top tier, the guys
Speaker 1: we trust more than anybody, the guys that we can
Speaker 1: rely on. And I know that you're not exactly you know,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna draft the closing with the first or you know,
Speaker 1: the third round or something like that. I want to
Speaker 1: know how early you're willing to go and draft one
Speaker 1: of these guys. The top closer on my board is
Speaker 1: Edwin Diaz, who was just otherworldly last year. Two years
Speaker 1: ago I owned him. Uh, it was kind of struggle.
Speaker 1: He lost his job, he didn't have the control definite,
Speaker 1: but Seattle you hated him last year, Seattle Um Seattle
Speaker 1: just they pulled him from the from the role momentarily,
Speaker 1: but they always wanted to give him back. Last year,
Speaker 1: it was a magical season for Edwin Diaz, so magical
Speaker 1: that he now pitches in Queen's. Seattle's rebuilding, they said, hey,
Speaker 1: we don't get a closer, were rebuilding. They moved him
Speaker 1: to Queens with Robinson Cano. Edwin Diaz now the closer
Speaker 1: of the Mets. He's the number one closer on the board.
Speaker 1: How early did you take him? So as of right now,
Speaker 1: Edwin Diaz is NFBC A DP is pick fifty one.
Speaker 1: So if you played, yeah, fourth round of fifteen team league,
Speaker 1: if you're playing a twelve team or that's the early
Speaker 1: fifth round, that's a steep price to pay. Man. And
Speaker 1: look at the past two seasons, who who has been
Speaker 1: the top reliever being drafted. And I'm not saying that
Speaker 1: this is definitely gonna happen to Edwin Diaz, but the
Speaker 1: oldest chapman two years ago, he's going like the third
Speaker 1: fourth round. He ends up getting hurt. I think only
Speaker 1: has like twenty two saves two years ago. Kelly Jansen
Speaker 1: in my holy league went in the third round. Last
Speaker 1: Lee Janson last year the same thing was going in
Speaker 1: the third fourth round of a lot of drafts last season,
Speaker 1: and he let people down. There's just there's a lot
Speaker 1: of turnover, there's a lot of volatility at the position.
Speaker 1: Look Edwin Diaz is amazing. Unquestionably, he was like second
Speaker 1: among relievers and swinging strike rate. He has nasty stuff
Speaker 1: and he's got the nineties seven mile fastball he's got
Speaker 1: he's got a slider that's nearly ninety miles per hour.
Speaker 1: I mean the k per nine up over fifteen. He
Speaker 1: he limited the walks. That's really where he improved. Right
Speaker 1: two years ago you said he kind of fell apart
Speaker 1: four point three six walks per nine and twenty seventeen.
Speaker 1: That's all the way down to two point zero nine
Speaker 1: walks per nine with the sub two e r a
Speaker 1: a whip below zero point eight. He was amazing, There's
Speaker 1: no question about it. And you can't predict saves, That's
Speaker 1: what it comes down to. It's a lot like you
Speaker 1: can't predict touchdowns in the NFL. Right running back one
Speaker 1: year has twenty touchdowns, I mean doesn't mean it doesn't
Speaker 1: mean he's gonna have twenty touchdowns again next year. I
Speaker 1: mean that's the difference in these in the fantasy value
Speaker 1: here for these players. And I think you know the
Speaker 1: projections on fangraphs have Eduin d has between thirty three
Speaker 1: and thirty eight saves. Personally, I don't know how you
Speaker 1: can project any releas more than forty saves as great
Speaker 1: as his peripherals are gonna be, and we expect the
Speaker 1: Mets to be better. I mean, what happens if all
Speaker 1: the Mets players get hurt again and they suck and
Speaker 1: like he doesn't have that many clothes save opportunities. It's
Speaker 1: just really it's really hard to predict. I do say,
Speaker 1: like the strikeouts, the e r A, the whip, they're
Speaker 1: all gonna be great for sure, Like he's gonna be
Speaker 1: a four category contributor once you get saves in there. Obviously,
Speaker 1: you can't predict wins for a reliever either he was
Speaker 1: he was you know, zero wins, four losses last year.
Speaker 1: I mean, not that matters for a reliever, but I'm
Speaker 1: not gonna I'm not gonna own Edwin Diaz. That's what
Speaker 1: it comes down to. I mean, it's like he's like
Speaker 1: it's just as likely that a guy like Brad Hand
Speaker 1: or Roberto Osuna or or all the chapman leads a
Speaker 1: league and saves as it is Edwin Diaz. You just
Speaker 1: you can't predict save some one year to the next.
Speaker 1: He's going to be elite in three other categories as well.
Speaker 1: So I have nothing bad to say about Edwin Diaz,
Speaker 1: but me personally, I can't use a fourth fifth round
Speaker 1: price tag on a closer. Yeah, I can't do it either.
Speaker 1: I understand that the um peripherals are awesome, of course
Speaker 1: n DZ. His line was awesome. But what he gives you,
Speaker 1: which is theoretically a lot of saves, Like, all right,
Speaker 1: you can do the quantity thing um you get great,
Speaker 1: You're a great whip. You can do a little reliever later,
Speaker 1: like I can get the quantities of save from the
Speaker 1: saves later. I can get all of this later. And
Speaker 1: I want I don't want to invest in early round
Speaker 1: pick on a closure. I know some people's strategies are
Speaker 1: to do that. They oh, they strongly believe in it.
Speaker 1: I've been leaves where you see him go in the
Speaker 1: third round. As I just mentioned, I can never be
Speaker 1: that guy ultimately. Now, you didn't say there's a lot
Speaker 1: of flux with or all this chatman Kenley Jansen. Guys
Speaker 1: have gone to the third or fourth round of the past.
Speaker 1: I will say this, both of those guys still remain
Speaker 1: in my tier one, So there has been some reliability
Speaker 1: on those guys. I know they've battled some injuries, both
Speaker 1: of them, both I still believe remain in Tier one.
Speaker 1: For actually have Kenley Jansen in the second tier. How
Speaker 1: big is that tier for you? So for for me,
Speaker 1: the first tier is Edwin Daz trying and roll the Chatman,
Speaker 1: Craig and bro Okay, so I have Jansen in that
Speaker 1: first year along with for me Phelipe Vasquez as well. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so I have Tier two as still pretty damn good,
Speaker 1: but just not nearly as good as like those top guys.
Speaker 1: I have Brad Hand, Kenley Janson, Felipe A Vasquez, Roberto Sona,
Speaker 1: and then the aforementioned Josh Hayder. So you've hit her there. Okay,
Speaker 1: it's interesting, and that's just because I mean, he's gonna
Speaker 1: give you like a hundred and thirty d forty strikeouts,
Speaker 1: whatever it is, it's still valuable, and maybe he'll give
Speaker 1: you like ten to fifteen as. I don't think I'm
Speaker 1: gonna own Josh had either anywhere. I've done four drafts.
Speaker 1: I haven't drafted him anywhere. You cross your mind the
Speaker 1: draft going to be honest with you, are not really
Speaker 1: just doesn't seem like someone you can look. You can
Speaker 1: make it work, but you're also going to have to
Speaker 1: use another pick around where you take Josh had right,
Speaker 1: So Josh hayd is going to pick three off the board.
Speaker 1: You're also going to have to use a pick around
Speaker 1: there to get one of like the relievers going right
Speaker 1: around him, right, Elly Glaciers, Kirby Yates, Josela Cleric Way Davis.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna have to use two picks in a similar
Speaker 1: range just to get yourself some saves. So in tout
Speaker 1: Wars last night, just for the record, the team that
Speaker 1: drafted Josh Hayter draft the hater in the eighth right.
Speaker 1: Their next closure was in the tenth right around there.
Speaker 1: Like you said with Wade Davis, it's exactly what we're
Speaker 1: gonna have to do. You have to get the saves
Speaker 1: from somewhere. If you want to compete in a Road
Speaker 1: to History league, you can't. Look, you can win in
Speaker 1: rohdo but while getting a fifteen, well, well, while getting
Speaker 1: no points finishing the last in a category. You can
Speaker 1: do it. It's very hard. You basically have to be
Speaker 1: top three in every other category. It's doable, but it's
Speaker 1: really like, you don't have to win the category. You
Speaker 1: could be in the middle of the pack. You can whatever.
Speaker 1: If you end the season with uh, you know, seventy
Speaker 1: five total saves, seven saves and you're in the middle
Speaker 1: of the pack, you could still win in rot like
Speaker 1: then it just it decreases the margin of error that
Speaker 1: you need for all the other categories. So I would say,
Speaker 1: just don't completely tank or punch a category when it
Speaker 1: comes to roto and you know, if you're taking Josh Hayter,
Speaker 1: you're not You're getting like maybe ten of fifteen saves
Speaker 1: is what you're hoping for. But you're also gonna have
Speaker 1: to come back around and use you know, pick either
Speaker 1: your next pick or two rounds later. Like we saw
Speaker 1: in in tow Wars last night they had to go
Speaker 1: and get way Davis two rounds later, which is probably
Speaker 1: a good combination to pair together because Josh Hayter, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna get you a lot of strikeout. It's gonna have
Speaker 1: elite e R a elite whip. Waite. Davis is a
Speaker 1: guy who I would say is safe for at least
Speaker 1: thirty saves, maybe thirty five plus saves. Um. But I
Speaker 1: kind of worry about the era and whip when it
Speaker 1: comes to Wade Davis. So maybe that's a good combination.
Speaker 1: Two guys to the draft together there. Maybe so maybe,
Speaker 1: so let's go back to the top though, if Edwin
Speaker 1: Diaz his first all on every expert's board, including our
Speaker 1: own Frank Stample. Number two everywhere is Blake Trinon. Now,
Speaker 1: Trinon was a guy last year that I think we
Speaker 1: all pinpoint. It was like, oh, we'd loved that Blake Triinan.
Speaker 1: The problem was everyone kind of noticed the same thing
Speaker 1: we were, that how good his stuff was. At the
Speaker 1: end of once he went went over to the a's
Speaker 1: everyone jumped on board on that and he went relatively
Speaker 1: early for a closer as someone that you're taking a
Speaker 1: shot on, but you believed him and trin it was
Speaker 1: absolutely fantastic for Oakland. They brought into jerryus Familia. They've
Speaker 1: brought in other guys like Fernando Roddy and tried and
Speaker 1: still held on in that job with a full grip.
Speaker 1: Last season he comes in as a as one of
Speaker 1: the safest closers on the board. Now he's always had
Speaker 1: this stuff. Now it's under control. His mental health isn't
Speaker 1: the right spot. Blake trying clearly the number two closes
Speaker 1: on the board this year. Yeah, I agree with everything
Speaker 1: you just said too. And this is what I'm talking
Speaker 1: about where you can't predict closers and you can't predict saves.
Speaker 1: Right because Lake trying the versus Edwin Diaz. You can
Speaker 1: argue that Blake training was better edwins he has had
Speaker 1: more strikeouts, but trying to had a zero point seven
Speaker 1: eight e r A. He was amazing. He had at
Speaker 1: zero point eight three whip. You can argue that he
Speaker 1: was at least on par or better than Edwin Diaz.
Speaker 1: The difference you get thirty eight saves. He had nineteen
Speaker 1: fewer saves than Edwin Diaz. And and this is just
Speaker 1: something that you can't predict on a year year basis.
Speaker 1: You know, the Oakland A's, I still do think that
Speaker 1: they're gonna be competitive this year. I think they you know,
Speaker 1: they're gonna be an over five club. They're they're probably
Speaker 1: gonna be in a lot of close games. But Blake trying,
Speaker 1: and for all intents and purposes, he made that next step.
Speaker 1: He absolutely did, Greg, You're right about that kept the
Speaker 1: walks down two point three five walks per nine. The
Speaker 1: Cave per nine went up to a career high over eleven.
Speaker 1: He's got, you know, just a nasty, nasty arsenal of
Speaker 1: you know, he's got a a ninety seven mile pro fastball,
Speaker 1: he's got a fourth seamer and a sinker. He's got
Speaker 1: a nasty, nasty slider as well. You know, you go
Speaker 1: watch on Twitter and you you look up Picture list
Speaker 1: our guy Nick Pollock or you see Pitching Ninja. They're
Speaker 1: they're throwing out a bunch of these gifts. A lot
Speaker 1: of them are Blake Trinan because he just has a nasty,
Speaker 1: nasty slider. I like him a lot as well. He's
Speaker 1: going over the past week NFBC ADP about ten picks
Speaker 1: later than Edwin Diaz. Unfortunately, Greg, it's still just not
Speaker 1: late enough for me to grab my my first closure.
Speaker 1: I'm kind of with you where, you know, maybe I'll
Speaker 1: grab my first closer between round seven and nine, and
Speaker 1: Blake trying is just not falling that far. You know,
Speaker 1: he's going to pick sixty one on average right now.
Speaker 1: So again, you know, in a in a twelve team league,
Speaker 1: he's right around you know, the end of the fifth
Speaker 1: early sixth round and in a in a fifteen team league,
Speaker 1: he's going, you know, early fifth round. So it's just
Speaker 1: too too high of a price tag for me to
Speaker 1: play hey for a closer. Yeah, I just can't do it.
Speaker 1: It's just not how I build my teams traditionally. And
Speaker 1: call me a traditionalist, and that's fine. I never like
Speaker 1: how my team comes out when I take a closer
Speaker 1: that early. Now, it's tough, you know, Frank, when you
Speaker 1: see these closers just fly off the board. And you've
Speaker 1: been in a couple of drafts. Now you see him,
Speaker 1: You're like, crap, I missed this run. And when you're
Speaker 1: on the ends, you don't want to miss those runs.
Speaker 1: It's very, very hard to do if you really have
Speaker 1: to be conscious you have a strategy with that, do you,
Speaker 1: I mean, because you don't want to be so early.
Speaker 1: If you missed the run, you missed the run and
Speaker 1: that sticks. Yeah. I mean, look, it's just it's a
Speaker 1: field for the draft. I mean every draft is going
Speaker 1: to be different, but it's a feel, it's a field
Speaker 1: type of thing. And you know, it's not the worst
Speaker 1: thing if you start a run if you're on the end,
Speaker 1: because if you start you start that run right, like
Speaker 1: say you're on a six seven and you take like
Speaker 1: a Brad Hand or if you take a Roberto Osuna.
Speaker 1: I mean that's you know, we're talking about like the
Speaker 1: top seven eight guys. That's kind of like the last
Speaker 1: of those top seven eight, like legitimate elite close. Yeah,
Speaker 1: me too, And so if you start that run, it's
Speaker 1: not the worst thing because you know that when it
Speaker 1: comes all the way back to you, a lot of
Speaker 1: other teams are gonna notice they need to grab a closer,
Speaker 1: and it's gonna dry up very quickly. Like when you
Speaker 1: get to that eight nine, you're probably looking at the
Speaker 1: likes of you know, jose La Clerk would be lucky
Speaker 1: if Kirby Yates is there even like a way Dave
Speaker 1: is type. So um, it's just something you have to
Speaker 1: be conscious of. But if you're on if you're on
Speaker 1: the ends of these drafts, you know, don't be afraid too.
Speaker 1: I'm not saying you have to do a fourth fifth round,
Speaker 1: but once you get to like one of these six
Speaker 1: seven type turns or even eight nine, I mean you
Speaker 1: got by by the ninth round, you have to grab
Speaker 1: your first closer. I mean that's normally, what I tell
Speaker 1: myself by the ninth fout have to have at least
Speaker 1: one closer on my team. Okay, okay, just trying to
Speaker 1: understand the strategy. There another guy that was in your
Speaker 1: tier one you said, uh, was Craig Kimber, of course.
Speaker 1: And at what point we're mid March? Man, what is
Speaker 1: March six? Right now? Right? We're mid March. We have
Speaker 1: our draft next Thursday. I don't want we have another
Speaker 1: draft Tuesday after that? What are you doing here? And
Speaker 1: he's following down from craft Boards and rightfully, so you
Speaker 1: see the a DP for Craig Kimber all the way
Speaker 1: down to eighty four point nine eight. Now over the
Speaker 1: past week, he's actually going behind the likes of Kennley, Jansen,
Speaker 1: arrollas Chatman and now Brad Hand because we're getting closer
Speaker 1: and the closer you get to the start of the
Speaker 1: regular season and you know, play or two haven't signed.
Speaker 1: I get worried about those guys, because, as we've seen
Speaker 1: over the past couple of years, Greg, if theseels, if
Speaker 1: these pictures pictures specifically need spring training, they need to
Speaker 1: get into a groove. If you're a reliever, maybe not
Speaker 1: as much as a starting picture. But if you're a reliever,
Speaker 1: you want to get four or five appearances in throughout
Speaker 1: the spring and you know, start to get your velocity
Speaker 1: taking up a little bit. You have to get these
Speaker 1: appearances in, and the closer you get to the start
Speaker 1: of the regular season and they're still not signed, it's
Speaker 1: just the more I tend to worry about these guys.
Speaker 1: Kimberle is much much more talented than a guy like
Speaker 1: Greg Holland. But remember last year Greg. With Greg Holland
Speaker 1: the year before with the Rockies, he was phenomenal, turned
Speaker 1: down a qualifying offer. He doesn't get a job until,
Speaker 1: you know, nearly the end of spring trainer signs on
Speaker 1: with the St. Louis Cardinals, and it was a disaster.
Speaker 1: He was cut by mid season. And then he pitched
Speaker 1: obviously much better for Washington late last year. And why
Speaker 1: because he you know, he time Rick and Burle is
Speaker 1: better than Greg Holland, there's no doubt about it. But
Speaker 1: he's human and he has pitched a lot of endings
Speaker 1: over the past couple of years, and he pitched deep
Speaker 1: into October last year as well. The Red Sox won
Speaker 1: the World Series as tough as Edits for for me
Speaker 1: to say out loud. How about the year before when
Speaker 1: Kenley Jansen goes deep into the playoffs? Right? Not the
Speaker 1: same the next year. He barely pitched in spring training
Speaker 1: last year because that was part of like his offseason regiment.
Speaker 1: I mean, there's just there's too much in play here
Speaker 1: for Craig Kimbero. There's too much risk where he's going,
Speaker 1: you know, inside the top eighty five picks, So he's
Speaker 1: he's not gonna be on any of my teams. It's
Speaker 1: not a talent thing with Kimbero. It's just the fact
Speaker 1: that he hasn't signed just has me worried. You know,
Speaker 1: I'll pivot to a guy like Brad Hand who has
Speaker 1: been pitching, or you know, a guy like Roberto Sona
Speaker 1: who has been in camp with these guys, or you know,
Speaker 1: maybe even a few picks earlier, taking a role as
Speaker 1: chatman someone like that, just because he's been around and
Speaker 1: he's doing it right now, Greg, how scared are you
Speaker 1: of the teams that Kimberaller has the rumors of gol
Speaker 1: like Washington, like if you draft Seawan Doolittle, Like, how
Speaker 1: nervous you about that? Of course, the National. It would
Speaker 1: be brutal. The Nationals have come out and said, hey,
Speaker 1: we have our budget. It is what it is. But
Speaker 1: somebody at some point, I have a bunch of money
Speaker 1: now that they didn't use on Bryce Harper. Well, they're
Speaker 1: gonna go over the luxury tax for that. But like,
Speaker 1: the point is Kimbera's gonna sign somewhere and he's not
Speaker 1: signing somewhere to not be the closer. Oh, what are
Speaker 1: the chances he doesn't sign? Minimal? I mean it's it's
Speaker 1: normally at some point he's normally like a leverage thing,
Speaker 1: like you know, I'll sit out of season. It's fine,
Speaker 1: Like will that price come down enough for the Red?
Speaker 1: Soxs just sign? It's left. The season starts, dude, the
Speaker 1: technically the season so you're using the tops, realize the
Speaker 1: season starts in twenty two days, two days, Top five pig,
Speaker 1: I'm not taking he's super talented. Look, I hate to
Speaker 1: like the arm thing, Big Red. Where the seriously where
Speaker 1: the places that we've heard him rumor two? Most Atlanta
Speaker 1: and Washington, Yes, in the in the least. I think
Speaker 1: Atlanta would make a lot of sense because Hurt Rody's
Speaker 1: this kay, you know, like these relievers are fine, but
Speaker 1: the Atlanta Braids have aspirations of making the playoffs and competing.
Speaker 1: I think Craig Kimball would kind of put them over
Speaker 1: the edge. That would really really fortify their bullpen. I
Speaker 1: think that makes a lot of sense. I mean, he
Speaker 1: helps every bullpen, but the Nationals I feel all right
Speaker 1: about their bullpen the way it is right now. I
Speaker 1: think it is fine. He just has to stay healthy.
Speaker 1: And then with the Phillies, I mean, David Robertson has
Speaker 1: been a setup man in the past couple of years
Speaker 1: with the Yankees. He's definitely capable of being a closer.
Speaker 1: There's no question in my mind, Sir Anthony Domingius has
Speaker 1: the stuff. Didn't necessarily, I guess have like the closer
Speaker 1: mentality last year when it came to it's a real
Speaker 1: thing great, I mean, of all the things, I actually
Speaker 1: do agree with the King on that, like the closer
Speaker 1: mentality is actually a thing. It's not there. There are
Speaker 1: relief pictures that are great as a setup man, and
Speaker 1: then once you make them closer, why do they suck
Speaker 1: up so much? Sing Greg because they can't handle it.
Speaker 1: They can't handle the pressure. That's the closure mentality. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's real, it's a real thing. Greg. Sorry, sorry, that's
Speaker 1: not what you want to hear. But there's too much
Speaker 1: risk going on with Craig Kimball right now. I completely
Speaker 1: agree obviously with the Kimbo town probably with Kimber There's
Speaker 1: just no way I'm doing it. You mentioned pivoty into
Speaker 1: a Raulda Chapman if you would take a guy in
Speaker 1: the same spot. Now, Araldus Chapman obviously has been very
Speaker 1: very good for a very very long time at this point.
Speaker 1: Now Oralda's Chapman who you can see the graph behind
Speaker 1: us right like, he's amazing, but he's battled knee issues.
Speaker 1: He said the last couple of years. That fastball, which
Speaker 1: is consistently at one or three in the past, it's
Speaker 1: like and we've seen him certainly up close as Yankee
Speaker 1: fans here, frank where it's been like a little nerve
Speaker 1: racking with Araldis Chapman. The Yankees in that bullpen have
Speaker 1: Dylan Patances, they have Zack Britain, they have Chad Green,
Speaker 1: They have a lot of guys that if Chapman falters,
Speaker 1: they could take over. And he's faltered in the past.
Speaker 1: He has lost his job as a member of the
Speaker 1: New York Yankees within the past couple of years, yet
Speaker 1: he's still in Tier one FIAT. It's that's a famine.
Speaker 1: It was more like injury related. He lost his job.
Speaker 1: M dude, it happened, yeah, but it was like because
Speaker 1: he came back from injury and he like wasn't pitching
Speaker 1: well and weird. Let's take good break when we come back.
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Speaker 1: we bring in the host of Make It Rain and
Speaker 1: one of the members of our team for the morning after.
Speaker 1: It's my guide show here an area. What's up shoe?
Speaker 1: Hey guys, how are you excited? Baseball season is here?
Speaker 1: And I can tell you right now because of this gig.
Speaker 1: If I don't end up winning, uh, you know the
Speaker 1: leagues I'm in this year, I'm never gonna hear it again.
Speaker 1: Of it. So I'm looking forward to picking both of
Speaker 1: your brains about what I should do it when the
Speaker 1: upcoming draft. We appreciate it. And the worst part is
Speaker 1: when you do this every day on a daily basis,
Speaker 1: and then you finish towards the bottom of your league
Speaker 1: standings and it never goes well with your friends. You're like,
Speaker 1: you're your professional, this is your job and you suck.
Speaker 1: And I was like, yeah, they're not wrong, They're not
Speaker 1: something I wanted to ask you, Joe, like, do you
Speaker 1: how many fantasy leagues do you play in? And I
Speaker 1: know that you played, uh at least college ball. I
Speaker 1: don't know if you played anything higher than that. What
Speaker 1: what position did you play? I yeah, I played college.
Speaker 1: I played in the minors too for a couple of years.
Speaker 1: I was an outfielder. I was a center field or so, yeah,
Speaker 1: I was. I was able to hit for a little power,
Speaker 1: and I was able to run a little bit, which
Speaker 1: was which was served me well. I was usually at
Speaker 1: the top of the you order, somewhere around one or two,
Speaker 1: so it it worked as well. So I got a
Speaker 1: little idea of the game of baseball, you know, having
Speaker 1: been there and done that. And of course I'm one
Speaker 1: of these guys that's been in, you know, the same
Speaker 1: leagues with the same guys for the last twenty years
Speaker 1: kind of thing. So having this job is just put
Speaker 1: that much more pressure on me. So I'm looking to
Speaker 1: you guys for sure. Right if we do end up
Speaker 1: ever making a softball team, which is probably not gonna happen,
Speaker 1: we're gonna need Joe to to ship up here. Oh man,
Speaker 1: we got that, We're in. We got I got you,
Speaker 1: I got you all. So we're talking about the top
Speaker 1: tier of closures before we brought you on here, Joe.
Speaker 1: Are we talking about that top tier? And that includes
Speaker 1: Craig Kimbroll, who's just not on the team, and it
Speaker 1: makes drafting him really, really impossible because, as Frank described
Speaker 1: a few moments ago, when guys like a Greg Holland
Speaker 1: signed really late and then you just show up to
Speaker 1: camp a week before the season starts, doesn't work out
Speaker 1: very well. When Kenley Jansen pitched even the postseason a
Speaker 1: couple of years ago, just like Craig Kimberal did last year,
Speaker 1: it doesn't work out very well. Kimberal's being drafted anywhere
Speaker 1: from the fourth round of the eighth round. It is
Speaker 1: hard to decide what to do with Kimberall. What do
Speaker 1: you Where do you think Kimberall ends up? Where would
Speaker 1: you draft him? Would you draft him? What are your
Speaker 1: thoughts Craig Kimberal. You know, I have a feeling Kimberall
Speaker 1: is gonna go to the Washington Nationals UM. If he doesn't,
Speaker 1: then you know what Sean Doolittle is doing, right, So
Speaker 1: we already know where where he's going to be in
Speaker 1: the pecking order. But to me, I do think Kimberroll
Speaker 1: is going to He's gonna head over to the National League,
Speaker 1: and from what I'm here in the the Nationals could
Speaker 1: very well. They gotta sure something up in that in
Speaker 1: that bullpen, especially if they're going to contend the National
Speaker 1: League East we know is probably to me the most
Speaker 1: competitive of all divisions between the Mats and the Braves
Speaker 1: and the Nationals and the Phillies. Now the question is,
Speaker 1: and it always comes down to it, you guys know this,
Speaker 1: who's going to have the better bullpen? Uh, certainly down
Speaker 1: the stretch, and I think Kimball will go a long
Speaker 1: way into Now that the Nationals don't have to pay
Speaker 1: Bryce Happer, I think they can afford to give Kimball
Speaker 1: what he wants. So that's that's what that's what you
Speaker 1: were saying. We were just talking about the Atlanta Braves.
Speaker 1: I think I think, you know, the and at least
Speaker 1: makes a lot of sense for him. But I was
Speaker 1: reading with the Nationals that now that they didn't sign Harper,
Speaker 1: they're just like, you know what, we'll reset our luxury
Speaker 1: tax and yad under the luxury tax. Right now, I
Speaker 1: believe at least under a certain tier of that luxury
Speaker 1: attack to maybe he's not the first one that under
Speaker 1: the second one one and they don't want to go over.
Speaker 1: They have, like I think I read three and a
Speaker 1: half million dollars left to spend, and they're just not
Speaker 1: like Kimbera obviously is going to cost more than three
Speaker 1: and a half million dollars. Well, the problem with do
Speaker 1: you know the guy that got Nanna Doolittle has had
Speaker 1: health issues. He's not a guy that they can exactly
Speaker 1: count on to to be there down this stretch and
Speaker 1: kimber will certainly it might cost a little more, but
Speaker 1: we'll give you that, you know, that piece of mind
Speaker 1: knowing that you can definitely win with him in the pen.
Speaker 1: I can't disagree with that. I will say this, you know,
Speaker 1: if Doottle could say healthy, which is a big question
Speaker 1: mark obviously, I think they have theirselves a nice little
Speaker 1: trio already with the Nationals. You know, any team can
Speaker 1: use Craig kimberal it's just, you know, are they willing
Speaker 1: to go over that looks retected you mentioned Greg. I mean,
Speaker 1: I think this would put their bullpen over the edge,
Speaker 1: like he would make them like a really really eleait bullpen,
Speaker 1: but you look behind Doottle, they have Trevor Rosenthal has
Speaker 1: had closing experience kind of all over the place Cardinals,
Speaker 1: and then with Kyle bar Claud too. I mean they
Speaker 1: traded for him last year with Miami, so they clearly
Speaker 1: like him. Another guy who throws heat and could get
Speaker 1: strikeouts but struggles with walks at times. So I think
Speaker 1: that their bullpen is find the way that it is
Speaker 1: right now. Obviously Kimbera would put them over the edge.
Speaker 1: I think it's really a two team race right now
Speaker 1: between the Nationals and the Braves me personally, the Phillies.
Speaker 1: Phillies too, but I mean they've already spent so much
Speaker 1: money like they it looks not if they want to do. Yeah,
Speaker 1: the Phillies are also one of these teams. We know
Speaker 1: that with Gabe cap or there. They are so into analytics.
Speaker 1: I mean it is literally going to be whatever the
Speaker 1: computer spits out for the best matchup of bad at
Speaker 1: batage is going to be there. And I don't necessarily
Speaker 1: know that that's going to fit what Kimberall wants to do.
Speaker 1: Kimball is an old school giving the ball ninth inning.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get it closed, and the Phillies are going
Speaker 1: to be all about whatever the analytics tell us is
Speaker 1: the best matchup. And that's actually a great point too,
Speaker 1: because as of right now, he can do that. He
Speaker 1: he has that luxury of you know, he goes Sir
Speaker 1: Anthony Dominguez, he can go David Robertson. I don't know
Speaker 1: if they have like a lefty specialist. I assume they do.
Speaker 1: But if that's a route that they wanted to go to,
Speaker 1: if three lefties are coming up in the ninth, that
Speaker 1: should happen as well. And this all just plays into
Speaker 1: what we said earlier on in the show that there
Speaker 1: are more teams that are apt to going towards this
Speaker 1: like committee approach where it's like, Okay, let me just
Speaker 1: do what the analytics are telling me to do. Let
Speaker 1: me just go with the best matchups. Here. We've heard
Speaker 1: the Reds come out and say with rice Ley Glaciers, hey,
Speaker 1: we're gonna use him the way, you know, kind of
Speaker 1: similar to how Josh Hayter was used with the with
Speaker 1: the Milwaukee Brewers last year. We're gonna use Riceley Glaciers
Speaker 1: in the biggest leverage spot in the game. That could
Speaker 1: be the sixth ending with the bases load, that could
Speaker 1: be the seventh ending with the bases loaded, That could
Speaker 1: be the ninth ending, you starting the ninth ending with
Speaker 1: the one world lead. So it kind of it makes
Speaker 1: figuring out relief pitchers and bullpens and closers specifically trying
Speaker 1: to get safe for fantasy baseball that much more difficult. No, absolutely, absolutely,
Speaker 1: Philly would obviously be a bad spot for Craig kimberal
Speaker 1: for the exact reason both you and Joe. And that's
Speaker 1: part of why it hasn't happened already, right, Like, maybe
Speaker 1: maybe Kimber's agent is telling them, like, hey, if we
Speaker 1: come to Philly, we need assurance that we're going to
Speaker 1: be like the set closer. And maybe Gay Kapler's on
Speaker 1: the front office like no, like I'm gonna do things
Speaker 1: my way. He did his he did things his way
Speaker 1: last year, Why would he change it now? Actually? And
Speaker 1: it also, I mean his fantasy value, Kimber's fantasy value
Speaker 1: is going to be directly tied to what team signs him, right,
Speaker 1: I mean, what ball are will be talking that this
Speaker 1: guy is gonna be coming in and and pitching and relieving.
Speaker 1: I think that's also going to have a lot to
Speaker 1: do as far as where are you going to draft
Speaker 1: him or take a shot with him? Really at this point, now,
Speaker 1: how about this Greg, I mean looking over his fan
Speaker 1: grafs page right now. Look, he's he's thirty years old.
Speaker 1: He's gonna turn thirty one at the end of May.
Speaker 1: This year. Here, the strike ass were a three year
Speaker 1: low in terms of k per nine. He was thirteen
Speaker 1: point eights. Still very good, it's great, but it was
Speaker 1: a three year low. The walks four point four eight
Speaker 1: walks per nine that was that was the uh, the
Speaker 1: second highest of his career as a full time closer,
Speaker 1: nine over one, which was also the highest of his career. Like,
Speaker 1: we're starting to get some signs. I mean, maybe that's
Speaker 1: why a team doesn't want to hand out a five year,
Speaker 1: one hundred million dollars. Well, I think it's spent five
Speaker 1: years a hundred million dollars a reliever anymore. Well, it
Speaker 1: didn't really, it didn't really hurt the Yankees from nearly
Speaker 1: giving it to the role. But that's a couple of
Speaker 1: years ago. It wasn't a hundred million, it was eighty million.
Speaker 1: Just saying it was still a record contract. Show the
Speaker 1: signs that you're saying, yeah, but roll this. Chapman. Also
Speaker 1: at the time, you remember what a lot of people said,
Speaker 1: he's not gonna age. Well right, I mean, we're already
Speaker 1: starting to see the fastball velocity took down a little.
Speaker 1: Let me throw that to Joe there throughout the Joe
Speaker 1: I was mentioning before the break that rallis Chapman's had
Speaker 1: some knee injuries here or the issues I should say.
Speaker 1: The velocity now still a hundred miles for hour, but
Speaker 1: the hundred three hundred five we saw. I know that
Speaker 1: sounds so ridiculous, but as I said yesterday in the show,
Speaker 1: players catch up to a fastball. If you can continue
Speaker 1: to throw at the same speed, they're going to catch up,
Speaker 1: no matter if it's a hundred miles prowd. We have
Speaker 1: seen that repeatedly. That's why even though um his strikeout
Speaker 1: numbers keep her nine went up last year, it was
Speaker 1: because of increased usuit of usage of the slider. Increased
Speaker 1: uses of the slider could cause arm issues. We've already
Speaker 1: seen knee issues. Are you at all worried about or
Speaker 1: rather Chapman this year, Well, we already heard from Sonny
Speaker 1: Gray right. Apparently all Yankees all they want is their
Speaker 1: pitchers that throw sliders. So I guess that's the reason
Speaker 1: why he sucked as bad as he did. So it's
Speaker 1: it's definitely going to be the slider. But with Chapman,
Speaker 1: it's it's will he reach six d innings? You know,
Speaker 1: will he be valuable enough that you're going to draft
Speaker 1: him high enough? Are you gonna get sixty endings out
Speaker 1: of him? Fatigue, getting older, injuries all something that you
Speaker 1: have to take into consideration. I will say this, though.
Speaker 1: The good thing about the Yankees bullpen is it's deep
Speaker 1: enough where they can give Chapman that extra rest. They
Speaker 1: can space him out a little bit better than they
Speaker 1: might have been able to in a few years past.
Speaker 1: So if he is showing signs of fatigue and kind
Speaker 1: of wearing down, uh, the Yankees do have other options
Speaker 1: in that bullpen other than just Chapman, Chapman, Chapman, chap
Speaker 1: You're absolutely right, and that's what scares me from a
Speaker 1: fantasy perspective, because if he's slowing down, he does need
Speaker 1: a break, and he's a couple of days off and
Speaker 1: he's a week off whatever, they do have other options,
Speaker 1: and you have to wonder, Frank should he be considered
Speaker 1: in this tier with Trin in with and when Diaz
Speaker 1: when the mention the reasons that Joe mentioned are a
Speaker 1: good potential reason, dude, drop him a little bit. It actually,
Speaker 1: you know, talking about it now reminds me a lot
Speaker 1: of what the Dodgers do with their starting pitchers, right
Speaker 1: the luxury to put a on a phantom dl Stont
Speaker 1: with Clayton kirk Kershaw, you know, likely not going to
Speaker 1: start the season in the rotation. They have all this
Speaker 1: depth from Quentomata to Hinjin Ryou to ros Stripling, where
Speaker 1: you know they don't have to push those guys as
Speaker 1: hard as they you know, another team normally would because
Speaker 1: they have so much depth. The Yankees bullpen kind of
Speaker 1: reminds me a little bit of that. So you go,
Speaker 1: I think you guys are onto something here. I will
Speaker 1: say this. I mean in terms of the e r A,
Speaker 1: the whip and the strikeouts, he's still a three category.
Speaker 1: I mean he's he's a great contributor. I mean he's
Speaker 1: not gonna have the sub zero point zero whip like
Speaker 1: a guy like Edwin Diaz or Blake Trying and because
Speaker 1: Chapman still walks too many guys. It's always been a
Speaker 1: issue for him. But the strikeouts last year were still there.
Speaker 1: I mean sixteen point three k per nine. The swinging
Speaker 1: strike rate was up to you're talking about him using
Speaker 1: the slider more so. I mean, look, the strikeouts still there.
Speaker 1: The E R A, the whip is still gonna be great.
Speaker 1: Um So, I think he his value is adequate where
Speaker 1: he's going in drafts. If you want to pivot to
Speaker 1: somewhere else, like right now, he's going in a B C,
Speaker 1: A DP pick off the board. Um so, he's going
Speaker 1: just behind. You know, the only relievers going ahead of
Speaker 1: him all right now are Blake trying to Edwin Diaz
Speaker 1: and and Kenny Jansen is going a few spots ahead
Speaker 1: of him, and as well, they're all right in the
Speaker 1: same area. And then a little bit further down, like
Speaker 1: five six picks, you get the brad Hands Roberto as
Speaker 1: soon as in the world. If you think those guys
Speaker 1: are safer and healthier than I can't really knock you
Speaker 1: for it. We'll let me bring up Kenny Jansen to
Speaker 1: you here, Joe, because I have Kenny Jansen inside my
Speaker 1: top tier. Frank does not uh Jensen, of course, been
Speaker 1: the closer for a very long time with the Dodgers.
Speaker 1: You see the graphic on the screen, thirty six saves
Speaker 1: in each of his past five seasons. He's had some
Speaker 1: hard issues last year, so he was on the d L.
Speaker 1: Supposedly those are all in the past. Are you comfortable
Speaker 1: to taking Kelly Janson in this tier? No, I'm not,
Speaker 1: as simply for that fact that listen to, these guys
Speaker 1: are only valuable to us from a fantasy perspectives if
Speaker 1: a we can count on them having a good enough
Speaker 1: offense to be able to be put into a safe
Speaker 1: position and be that they're going to be the guy
Speaker 1: on the mound and to be able to go ahead
Speaker 1: and collect that save and give us the points. And
Speaker 1: you know, I just I'm not sure. I'm not confident
Speaker 1: the the way like I'm not confident with uh, you know,
Speaker 1: with Chapman here. Is he going to be the guy
Speaker 1: on a consistent enough basis? Is he gonna get those
Speaker 1: sixty innings? I don't know anymore at this point in
Speaker 1: his career, especially with the hard issues. And you know,
Speaker 1: they could shut him down for two three months and
Speaker 1: then what do we do? How about this greg it's
Speaker 1: three years in a row now. The Dodgers have made
Speaker 1: a deep run into the postseason. Henley Jansen has gone
Speaker 1: at least eighty innings three years in a row now
Speaker 1: with the postseason included. And we saw, you know that
Speaker 1: the type of effect that had from seventeen into eighteen.
Speaker 1: Last year, a lot of struggles early on for Kenley
Speaker 1: Jansen went with that cutter, giving up a lot of
Speaker 1: home runs. The strikeouts were down last year. I mean
Speaker 1: ten point three zero walk for nine still very good,
Speaker 1: right for for your your average reliever, but that was
Speaker 1: a career low for him. I mean his swinging strike
Speaker 1: rate was also a career low. Now we're looking at
Speaker 1: a three point zero one e r A, which all right,
Speaker 1: I mean that's not in the same elite type of
Speaker 1: category like some of these other guys that are being
Speaker 1: drafted around him. And you know, the whip was still great,
Speaker 1: I mean it was still under one. He doesn't really
Speaker 1: walk a lot of guys. But you know, we're for
Speaker 1: getting an ear a over three now and maybe you
Speaker 1: have to worry about workload and not getting the same
Speaker 1: amount of strikeous. I just think there's too many things
Speaker 1: moving here when it comes to Kenley Jansen, and I mean,
Speaker 1: like I've said, from a lot of these other guys,
Speaker 1: typically I'm not going to be using like a a fifth,
Speaker 1: sixth round pick on a closer, and that's still where
Speaker 1: Kenny Janson is going. I thought that you would get
Speaker 1: more of a discount heading into this season on Kenley Janson,
Speaker 1: and it's just not there. I think that the name,
Speaker 1: the name value is just too high. When it comes again,
Speaker 1: keep keep in mind to the Dodger Stadium. I believe
Speaker 1: they were tenth or eleventh last year and giving up
Speaker 1: home runs, so you know that could affect his e
Speaker 1: r A to moving along through the season. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: didn't think there would be a discount in all. Honestly,
Speaker 1: when it comes to Kenley Janson, the name value that
Speaker 1: you mentioned, and let's be frank, the landscape right the
Speaker 1: landscape where it is so hard to pinpoint who these
Speaker 1: guys are, and the consistency that you're never gonna get
Speaker 1: a discount a guy that you know can get the
Speaker 1: job done and has over and over and over again.
Speaker 1: I think the health concerns will push him outside of that.
Speaker 1: What you're talking about elite status out there of a
Speaker 1: guy that. I think the health concerns are something that
Speaker 1: you have to seriously consider at this particular point if
Speaker 1: you're gonna keep him in that upper tier of closers,
Speaker 1: because you know, I just don't know if he's going
Speaker 1: to be there. I mean, that's that's going to be
Speaker 1: a crapshoot. Kenny Jansen outside these top tier four front
Speaker 1: stadfle that includes Edwin Diaz, Blake trinan Ouraldus Chapman and
Speaker 1: Craig Kimberle if he ever gets back on the field
Speaker 1: any else nor Actually, you know, every day I do
Speaker 1: rankings updates, So I've I've lowered Kenny Janson number seven.
Speaker 1: I have Lord Kimberle down to eight. So who who's
Speaker 1: my four or five? Six? Are Brad Hand, Phelippe A
Speaker 1: Vaskis and Roberto Out of those three guys, Joe, I
Speaker 1: know we lived in a minute you left with you.
Speaker 1: But out of those three guys Hand, oh sooner, Felipe
Speaker 1: Vai Vaska is, of course, who would you rather have.
Speaker 1: I'm kind of like, uh, I'm thinking Hand to tell
Speaker 1: you the truth, I kind of like, uh, I kind
Speaker 1: of like the situation that's he's in, and well, listen,
Speaker 1: can we really go wrong with any of these guys?
Speaker 1: I mean, honestly, he was from San Diego, right, he's
Speaker 1: this guy is what was the e r A last
Speaker 1: year two point seven two seven five. Yeah, so I
Speaker 1: I think he's in a I think he's in a
Speaker 1: pretty good situation with a team that's going to score
Speaker 1: an awful lot of runs for him too as well. Yeah. Look,
Speaker 1: I agree, that's how I haven't ranked. I have Brad
Speaker 1: Hand as my fourth guy. I do think this is
Speaker 1: kind of like the range that I'm gonna live in
Speaker 1: if I if I want to try and get my
Speaker 1: first reliever in that, you know, seventh round range. If
Speaker 1: I could get one of hand Felipe A Vasquez or
Speaker 1: Roberto Sona, maybe you pull Roberto Soon up a little
Speaker 1: bit higher because the Astros expected to be better than
Speaker 1: the pits. You can't do that, yes, Braces. But with
Speaker 1: Brad Hand, I mean it's three years in a row
Speaker 1: now of him being legit, like you have up going
Speaker 1: to worry about a two point nine two year a
Speaker 1: or less each of the past three seasons, a one
Speaker 1: point one one whip or less each of the past
Speaker 1: three seasons he had. He's had over a hundred strikeouts
Speaker 1: as a reliever three years in a row, Greg, So
Speaker 1: you want to talk about just in terms of stuff,
Speaker 1: he is elite. The Indians gave up Francisco Miha, who
Speaker 1: was the top catching prospect in baseball, to get him
Speaker 1: in return, so they clearly trust him. He's gonna be
Speaker 1: the closer. Andrew Miller is not there anymore. You don't
Speaker 1: have to worry about that, you know. If I think
Speaker 1: if there's anyone who's going to make that next jump,
Speaker 1: like who's this year's Edwin Diaz, I think Brad hands
Speaker 1: a good answer. I think Bible he's got forty saves
Speaker 1: him for sure, without a doubt. Fair enough. Jo are
Speaker 1: the host of Making Rain with Dame Martinez six to
Speaker 1: nine am Eastern Time here in the Fantasy Sports Network.
Speaker 1: You also catch him right after that on the morning
Speaker 1: after we gave Borenci. Joe, we appreciate the time to
Speaker 1: get some sleep. Appreciate it, guys, thanks so much. Absolutely.
Speaker 1: When we come back, we are joined by Jim Soddis
Speaker 1: of Fan Duel and of course the close up for
Speaker 1: the closer episode of the BFFs. Chris Spencer joins us
Speaker 1: next