1 00:00:09,080 --> 00:00:22,120 Speaker 1: Body Backs with Joseph Scott Morgan. You work hard all 2 00:00:22,160 --> 00:00:25,759 Speaker 1: your life, you raise a family, three boys. You're coming 3 00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:29,000 Speaker 1: to the end of your career. You're looking forward to retirement. 4 00:00:29,440 --> 00:00:32,160 Speaker 1: You've been sweating away in central Florida all these years, 5 00:00:32,159 --> 00:00:34,280 Speaker 1: and you decided to buy a retirement home up in 6 00:00:34,320 --> 00:00:37,640 Speaker 1: the mountains of Tennessee. You've got your eyes set on 7 00:00:37,680 --> 00:00:42,400 Speaker 1: the prize, and suddenly one day your life comes to 8 00:00:42,520 --> 00:00:49,880 Speaker 1: swift and violent end at the hand of your own child. Today, 9 00:00:49,920 --> 00:00:52,160 Speaker 1: we're going to talk about the Masker of the Motto 10 00:00:52,240 --> 00:00:59,680 Speaker 1: family and their son Grant a Motto. I'm Joseph Scott 11 00:00:59,720 --> 00:01:06,840 Speaker 1: Morgan and this his body Backs Back. With me today 12 00:01:07,000 --> 00:01:11,279 Speaker 1: is Jackie Howard, executive producer of Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. 13 00:01:12,600 --> 00:01:16,520 Speaker 1: Jackie tell us about the tragedy. Joe grant A Motto 14 00:01:16,800 --> 00:01:18,760 Speaker 1: is a twenty nine year old nurse and he is 15 00:01:18,800 --> 00:01:22,520 Speaker 1: accused of killing his family members at their home. The 16 00:01:22,600 --> 00:01:26,959 Speaker 1: reason is an obsession with a bulk arian webcam model 17 00:01:27,040 --> 00:01:29,720 Speaker 1: that he met as a result of his addiction to 18 00:01:29,800 --> 00:01:35,120 Speaker 1: online porn. He had stolen two hundred thousand dollars from 19 00:01:35,200 --> 00:01:40,560 Speaker 1: his family to pay this online model. The police investigation 20 00:01:40,640 --> 00:01:44,480 Speaker 1: into the model family began after a coworker called police 21 00:01:44,840 --> 00:01:47,240 Speaker 1: when Cody A Motto had not come into work. The 22 00:01:47,280 --> 00:01:51,360 Speaker 1: deputies circled the Amodel home and inside about nine am, 23 00:01:51,480 --> 00:01:55,600 Speaker 1: they found three people dead. According to Grant's arrest, Warren 24 00:01:55,640 --> 00:01:58,760 Speaker 1: at the David Chatta Motto his dad was found dead 25 00:01:58,800 --> 00:02:01,480 Speaker 1: in the kitchen of their home, Cody A. Motto was 26 00:02:01,600 --> 00:02:05,440 Speaker 1: killed in a storage room, and Margaret A Motto, his mom, 27 00:02:05,840 --> 00:02:09,840 Speaker 1: was found shot dead in an office chair. Police officers 28 00:02:09,880 --> 00:02:14,680 Speaker 1: say Cody and Margaret A Motto suffered execution style wounds. 29 00:02:15,320 --> 00:02:17,760 Speaker 1: Of that money that was stolen from his family, the 30 00:02:17,760 --> 00:02:21,840 Speaker 1: two thousand dollars sixty thou dollars was stolen from his 31 00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:26,000 Speaker 1: brother Cody. He also stole Cody's guns and sold them 32 00:02:26,040 --> 00:02:29,520 Speaker 1: without his permission, all to fund his obsession with this 33 00:02:29,680 --> 00:02:33,400 Speaker 1: Bulgaria model. What a Motto was doing was taking the 34 00:02:33,480 --> 00:02:36,480 Speaker 1: money that he had received or stolen from his family 35 00:02:36,880 --> 00:02:40,919 Speaker 1: and was wiring it to Bulgaria to this model. Granda 36 00:02:40,960 --> 00:02:44,920 Speaker 1: Motto was not a stupid person. You would you know, 37 00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:47,520 Speaker 1: hearing all of this, you would think that, uh, he 38 00:02:47,600 --> 00:02:50,240 Speaker 1: didn't have two cents in his brain to rub together. 39 00:02:50,360 --> 00:02:55,079 Speaker 1: But this kid was professionally sound to a certain degree. 40 00:02:55,200 --> 00:02:57,720 Speaker 1: He was a registered nurse. He and his brother had 41 00:02:57,800 --> 00:03:01,600 Speaker 1: both graduated from nur in school and he, you know, 42 00:03:01,800 --> 00:03:05,040 Speaker 1: just prior to these events, he was actually practicing as 43 00:03:05,080 --> 00:03:08,440 Speaker 1: a nurse. But his his life kind of went down 44 00:03:08,440 --> 00:03:10,680 Speaker 1: to this dark path at one point in time. He 45 00:03:10,680 --> 00:03:14,160 Speaker 1: had kind of been bulked up. Was involved in weightlifting, 46 00:03:14,320 --> 00:03:18,760 Speaker 1: He participated in air soft competitions. He loved shooting guns 47 00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:20,720 Speaker 1: with his brother and his He and his brother got 48 00:03:20,720 --> 00:03:24,720 Speaker 1: along really really well. But over a period of time, Jackie, 49 00:03:24,720 --> 00:03:27,720 Speaker 1: you know, he he became very, very diminished as he 50 00:03:27,760 --> 00:03:30,960 Speaker 1: got into this world of the sexual addiction where he's 51 00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:35,680 Speaker 1: just feeding money, uh to this woman in Bulgaria, and uh, 52 00:03:35,720 --> 00:03:38,240 Speaker 1: you know, friends had talked about how he he almost 53 00:03:38,280 --> 00:03:41,880 Speaker 1: took on almost a skeletal like appearance, eyes were sunken 54 00:03:41,920 --> 00:03:45,320 Speaker 1: back in his head. His weight had dropped precipitously, probably 55 00:03:45,360 --> 00:03:48,560 Speaker 1: lost close to fifty pounds or so. So when he, 56 00:03:48,960 --> 00:03:52,000 Speaker 1: you know, would pass her an area, he had almost 57 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:54,720 Speaker 1: like a spectral appearance to him, and you know, kind 58 00:03:54,720 --> 00:03:57,800 Speaker 1: of ominous when you begin to think about it. Um, 59 00:03:57,880 --> 00:04:01,520 Speaker 1: his brother, Cody had actually gotten a degree as as 60 00:04:01,600 --> 00:04:05,920 Speaker 1: a nurse, a neesthetist, and uh, Grant had attempted to 61 00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:08,920 Speaker 1: go through the same program, but unlike his brother, he 62 00:04:08,960 --> 00:04:11,480 Speaker 1: had actually flunked out of the program. Some people say 63 00:04:11,560 --> 00:04:14,280 Speaker 1: that this was the moment in time when his life 64 00:04:14,320 --> 00:04:17,720 Speaker 1: began to kind of tumble down. He had these aspirations 65 00:04:17,720 --> 00:04:22,400 Speaker 1: of becoming like a super duper millionaire, you know, independently wealthy, 66 00:04:22,560 --> 00:04:25,320 Speaker 1: and he and his brother had had planned on having 67 00:04:25,400 --> 00:04:28,680 Speaker 1: matching BMW's that they would drive around in. And you know, 68 00:04:28,720 --> 00:04:31,039 Speaker 1: they were gonna live in this house that their parents 69 00:04:31,080 --> 00:04:33,279 Speaker 1: had down in Florida, and the parents were going to 70 00:04:33,320 --> 00:04:35,640 Speaker 1: retire to Tennessee. As a matter of fact, they had 71 00:04:35,640 --> 00:04:38,320 Speaker 1: already uh targeted home up there that they were going 72 00:04:38,360 --> 00:04:41,360 Speaker 1: to move into. So it's it's all a bunch of 73 00:04:41,480 --> 00:04:45,640 Speaker 1: tragic circumstances that led to these fatal events, Jackie. We 74 00:04:45,760 --> 00:04:48,520 Speaker 1: know that the surviving brother, Jason A Moto, told police 75 00:04:48,760 --> 00:04:52,320 Speaker 1: that Grant a Motto had spent about two weeks out 76 00:04:52,360 --> 00:04:56,760 Speaker 1: of facility getting treated for depression. Grant A Motto was 77 00:04:56,800 --> 00:05:00,400 Speaker 1: actually enrolled in a sixty day treatment pro grand for 78 00:05:00,600 --> 00:05:04,520 Speaker 1: internet and sex addiction, but he only completed about two 79 00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:07,599 Speaker 1: weeks of that program before he came home. According to 80 00:05:07,640 --> 00:05:10,400 Speaker 1: the testimony from grant a motto. He was an anheated 81 00:05:10,520 --> 00:05:13,080 Speaker 1: argument with his father and got kicked out of the 82 00:05:13,120 --> 00:05:16,560 Speaker 1: home because he did not cut off communication with the 83 00:05:16,600 --> 00:05:21,159 Speaker 1: Bulgarian model as advised and instructed by his family. My 84 00:05:21,279 --> 00:05:24,840 Speaker 1: question to you, Joe is, obviously these parents are not 85 00:05:24,920 --> 00:05:27,320 Speaker 1: forensic specialists and would not have been looking at it 86 00:05:27,360 --> 00:05:30,479 Speaker 1: with this critical of an eye as you do. But 87 00:05:31,160 --> 00:05:35,520 Speaker 1: should there have been things that they noticed or maybe 88 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:37,880 Speaker 1: they did and that's what led to this? Well, yeah, 89 00:05:38,000 --> 00:05:40,720 Speaker 1: you know, you talk about forensics, and you know often 90 00:05:40,800 --> 00:05:43,160 Speaker 1: have students, you know, ask me, you know, well, professor 91 00:05:43,160 --> 00:05:46,640 Speaker 1: Morgan Wood, what should I do in forensics? And one 92 00:05:46,640 --> 00:05:50,200 Speaker 1: of the biggest growing areas to the largest areas in 93 00:05:50,240 --> 00:05:55,359 Speaker 1: forensic practice are actually forensic computer science and forensic accounting, 94 00:05:55,960 --> 00:05:58,799 Speaker 1: and certainly that came into play in this case. Jackie. 95 00:05:58,920 --> 00:06:03,599 Speaker 1: I mean, can you can you even begin to fathom, um, 96 00:06:03,839 --> 00:06:07,440 Speaker 1: seeing your bank accounts literally drained away. I think that 97 00:06:07,520 --> 00:06:11,080 Speaker 1: it was close to the actual dollar specific dollar amount, 98 00:06:11,440 --> 00:06:14,120 Speaker 1: it's like a hundred and fifty thousand dollars and that 99 00:06:14,240 --> 00:06:18,479 Speaker 1: was just liquidity of cash that was that was drawn away. 100 00:06:18,520 --> 00:06:21,600 Speaker 1: And then I think that there was um a loan 101 00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:24,320 Speaker 1: that had been taken out on the family home for 102 00:06:25,000 --> 00:06:27,640 Speaker 1: an arrangement about sixty thousand. And in addition to that, 103 00:06:28,839 --> 00:06:34,120 Speaker 1: Grant had swiped in excess of of ten thousand dollars 104 00:06:34,120 --> 00:06:37,480 Speaker 1: from his brother, So we're we're above two hundred thousand 105 00:06:37,520 --> 00:06:39,880 Speaker 1: dollars at this point in time. So you know, when 106 00:06:39,920 --> 00:06:44,200 Speaker 1: you're piecing this together from a forensic standpoint, you know everything, 107 00:06:44,960 --> 00:06:49,120 Speaker 1: everything you know has a contact back in time with 108 00:06:49,120 --> 00:06:51,560 Speaker 1: with an investigation, you look for these little points of 109 00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:55,000 Speaker 1: connection all the way through the forensic narrative. And so 110 00:06:55,240 --> 00:06:58,520 Speaker 1: you would when you're piecing this together, you try to 111 00:06:58,760 --> 00:07:00,960 Speaker 1: match up the narrative of what you're hearing as an 112 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:04,760 Speaker 1: investigator with the cold heart facts. And if if you 113 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:07,520 Speaker 1: can look at the numbers, and there are very specific 114 00:07:07,600 --> 00:07:10,080 Speaker 1: numbers here, you can kind of see this drain. If 115 00:07:10,080 --> 00:07:11,680 Speaker 1: you put it on a graft, you can see this 116 00:07:11,760 --> 00:07:14,920 Speaker 1: kind of downward tumble that was taking place. Now in 117 00:07:14,960 --> 00:07:18,480 Speaker 1: addition to this, let's keep in mind, uh, Grant the 118 00:07:18,600 --> 00:07:22,080 Speaker 1: motto was not hopping on a on a plane and 119 00:07:22,240 --> 00:07:25,520 Speaker 1: flying to eastern Europe. He was doing all of this. 120 00:07:26,080 --> 00:07:29,880 Speaker 1: Uh let me let me rephrase that he was in 121 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:35,480 Speaker 1: contact with this can model via the Internet. So every 122 00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:40,440 Speaker 1: time every time he would engage with her. There is 123 00:07:40,520 --> 00:07:43,920 Speaker 1: actually a digital footprint that's left behind. And one more 124 00:07:44,240 --> 00:07:47,280 Speaker 1: interesting thing I found about this, you know, when we 125 00:07:47,320 --> 00:07:50,760 Speaker 1: begin to talk about electronic forensics and how this kind 126 00:07:50,760 --> 00:07:55,320 Speaker 1: of sex trade works like this, in order to facilitate 127 00:07:55,560 --> 00:07:58,200 Speaker 1: this kind of on camera session that he would have 128 00:07:58,360 --> 00:08:01,600 Speaker 1: with her, he had to perch just these digital coins, 129 00:08:01,640 --> 00:08:05,480 Speaker 1: if you will. And um, there's even evidence that he 130 00:08:05,520 --> 00:08:09,960 Speaker 1: had purchased roughly six hundred dollars worth of these coins 131 00:08:11,000 --> 00:08:15,240 Speaker 1: just prior to what they believe were the deaths the 132 00:08:15,320 --> 00:08:19,560 Speaker 1: murders of his family members. And that goes to tell 133 00:08:19,600 --> 00:08:22,800 Speaker 1: you how obsessed he was in this world that he 134 00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:46,000 Speaker 1: had kind of buried himself into. During the course of 135 00:08:46,000 --> 00:08:49,320 Speaker 1: my career, I've walked into many scenes where there have 136 00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:52,599 Speaker 1: been multiple desks, but I don't know that there is 137 00:08:52,640 --> 00:08:56,840 Speaker 1: anything that kind of literally rips my heart out. Then 138 00:08:56,920 --> 00:09:01,559 Speaker 1: walking into a blood soaked environment where a family has 139 00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:05,800 Speaker 1: almost literally been completely wiped out, and in the case 140 00:09:05,920 --> 00:09:09,800 Speaker 1: of the Motto family, save the perpetrator and the brother 141 00:09:09,840 --> 00:09:11,720 Speaker 1: that was not at the house, that's basically what happened. 142 00:09:11,800 --> 00:09:15,559 Speaker 1: Jackie Grant a Motto is accused of shooting his father 143 00:09:15,640 --> 00:09:19,320 Speaker 1: first in the kitchen and then killing his mother and 144 00:09:19,360 --> 00:09:23,880 Speaker 1: brother execution style. What does that mean? What makes a 145 00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:28,240 Speaker 1: murder and execution style death classically? When we begin to 146 00:09:28,240 --> 00:09:33,240 Speaker 1: think about execution style homicides, what we're talking about is 147 00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:38,760 Speaker 1: the perpetrator being in a dominant position over the victim. 148 00:09:38,840 --> 00:09:42,360 Speaker 1: And generally the individual that is shot will either be 149 00:09:42,440 --> 00:09:46,760 Speaker 1: in a seated position below the level of a standing perpetrator, 150 00:09:47,040 --> 00:09:50,560 Speaker 1: they'll be kneeling, they'll be laying. That is the victim 151 00:09:50,600 --> 00:09:53,560 Speaker 1: I'm referring to. And in this particular case, when you 152 00:09:53,600 --> 00:09:58,319 Speaker 1: see the mother, Margaret, she is actually positioned at her 153 00:09:58,440 --> 00:10:02,040 Speaker 1: desk Jackie. And if folks at home will feel on 154 00:10:02,080 --> 00:10:06,360 Speaker 1: the back of their head, there's a little protuberant area 155 00:10:06,720 --> 00:10:09,800 Speaker 1: on the back of your skull. It's called the occiput. 156 00:10:10,240 --> 00:10:12,600 Speaker 1: And if you'll put your hand to the right side 157 00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:17,080 Speaker 1: of the midline, that's actually where Margaret's entrance was. And 158 00:10:17,600 --> 00:10:21,680 Speaker 1: that gunshot woman that she sustained is a classic execution 159 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:26,640 Speaker 1: style gunshot. It passes through the right occiput. That bone 160 00:10:26,679 --> 00:10:28,640 Speaker 1: and very bony structure is very thick. As a matter 161 00:10:28,640 --> 00:10:30,360 Speaker 1: of fact, it's one of the thickest bones of the skull, 162 00:10:31,320 --> 00:10:35,040 Speaker 1: and it goes from right to left and it actually 163 00:10:35,080 --> 00:10:38,360 Speaker 1: comes out below her left eye. It exits out of 164 00:10:38,360 --> 00:10:42,199 Speaker 1: the cheek, you know. In in my estimation, she probably 165 00:10:42,360 --> 00:10:47,440 Speaker 1: never knew what happened, and it's it's an interesting thing. 166 00:10:47,520 --> 00:10:51,720 Speaker 1: I was kind of contemplating this. How many times had 167 00:10:51,720 --> 00:10:55,520 Speaker 1: her child grant walked into her office space in that 168 00:10:55,679 --> 00:10:58,880 Speaker 1: area and she thinks nothing of it. I mean, she's 169 00:10:58,880 --> 00:11:01,720 Speaker 1: sitting there, she might hear the click of his heels 170 00:11:01,760 --> 00:11:04,360 Speaker 1: on the on the floor, you know, approaching from the rear. 171 00:11:04,440 --> 00:11:06,760 Speaker 1: She feels safe in this environment, and and you would 172 00:11:06,800 --> 00:11:09,360 Speaker 1: feel safe, this is your home, and then all of 173 00:11:09,440 --> 00:11:12,120 Speaker 1: a sudden, I don't even know if your brain can 174 00:11:12,160 --> 00:11:15,680 Speaker 1: calculate hearing the sound as your shot in this primal 175 00:11:15,760 --> 00:11:17,840 Speaker 1: area of the brain that causes everything to shut down. 176 00:11:17,840 --> 00:11:19,360 Speaker 1: And you know, people always ask when you know, is 177 00:11:19,360 --> 00:11:22,920 Speaker 1: this an instantaneous death? This is probably about as close 178 00:11:23,679 --> 00:11:27,040 Speaker 1: as you can have to an instantaneous event, because you're 179 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:30,840 Speaker 1: you're knocking out the primal brain center. This is passing 180 00:11:30,880 --> 00:11:35,560 Speaker 1: through most likely at least the top aspect of the 181 00:11:35,600 --> 00:11:38,960 Speaker 1: brain stem, taking up the cerebellum, and then you know, 182 00:11:39,200 --> 00:11:41,559 Speaker 1: crossing over the midline of the brain and then exiting 183 00:11:41,559 --> 00:11:43,880 Speaker 1: out of the face. It's it's very horrific, but in 184 00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:49,240 Speaker 1: her case, it was very very quick. Um. When you 185 00:11:49,800 --> 00:11:53,600 Speaker 1: consider dad, this is Chad. He was found in an 186 00:11:53,600 --> 00:11:57,200 Speaker 1: adjacent area, adjacent to the kitchen and this sort of thing. 187 00:11:57,800 --> 00:12:01,480 Speaker 1: He also had gunshot wounds to uh, the back of 188 00:12:01,640 --> 00:12:04,959 Speaker 1: his head on the right aspect as well. So that 189 00:12:05,040 --> 00:12:08,240 Speaker 1: gives you when you begin to look at entrance wounds, 190 00:12:08,520 --> 00:12:11,960 Speaker 1: UM and examine them, not only are you getting an 191 00:12:12,040 --> 00:12:15,440 Speaker 1: idea of the position of the victim, you're also getting 192 00:12:15,720 --> 00:12:20,080 Speaker 1: an idea of the position of the perpetrator. So if 193 00:12:20,120 --> 00:12:22,280 Speaker 1: you will just imagine that in this case, grant a 194 00:12:22,320 --> 00:12:25,319 Speaker 1: Motto would have been to the right rear of his father, 195 00:12:25,400 --> 00:12:29,839 Speaker 1: because as it turns out, there was actually two two 196 00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:34,840 Speaker 1: gunshot wounds to his dad's head. And one of these, 197 00:12:35,240 --> 00:12:37,439 Speaker 1: and this is quite gruesome when you begin to think 198 00:12:37,440 --> 00:12:42,000 Speaker 1: about it, one of these actually clipped through the right aspect, 199 00:12:42,200 --> 00:12:44,880 Speaker 1: the rear aspect of his head, came out, went back 200 00:12:44,920 --> 00:12:48,240 Speaker 1: in through his ear, and then back into his head 201 00:12:48,920 --> 00:12:51,360 Speaker 1: and then wait wait, wait wait wait wait say that again. 202 00:12:51,520 --> 00:12:55,400 Speaker 1: It did the bullet. What was the trajectory of the bullet. Yeah, 203 00:12:55,640 --> 00:12:58,680 Speaker 1: what you're talking about is um and many times. You'll 204 00:12:58,720 --> 00:13:01,400 Speaker 1: see this, Jackie. You will have these cases where you'll 205 00:13:01,440 --> 00:13:06,760 Speaker 1: have um uh an entrance, then an exit, and then 206 00:13:06,880 --> 00:13:11,160 Speaker 1: a re entrance, and then finally you may have another 207 00:13:11,240 --> 00:13:15,199 Speaker 1: exit and it's all the same bullet that is creating 208 00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:18,560 Speaker 1: this cavity in the brain. And interestingly enough, you know, 209 00:13:18,559 --> 00:13:21,560 Speaker 1: when the forensic pathologist Dr Jones actually testified in this 210 00:13:21,720 --> 00:13:25,920 Speaker 1: case at at trial, the prosecution was asking her questions, 211 00:13:25,920 --> 00:13:28,080 Speaker 1: how how exactly do you track these wounds? And this 212 00:13:28,120 --> 00:13:29,880 Speaker 1: is something we do in the Morrigan. This is kind 213 00:13:29,880 --> 00:13:33,960 Speaker 1: of fascinating when we have multiple gunshot wounds, particularly that 214 00:13:34,000 --> 00:13:36,680 Speaker 1: are so close together, like in the case of Chatter. 215 00:13:36,720 --> 00:13:39,960 Speaker 1: Motto will use what are referred to as dowel rods 216 00:13:40,000 --> 00:13:42,400 Speaker 1: that you can buy at any large box store or 217 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:46,680 Speaker 1: home depot, you know Blows or Walmart and their wooden dowels, 218 00:13:46,760 --> 00:13:49,440 Speaker 1: and we have tiny ones in the morgue and we 219 00:13:49,520 --> 00:13:54,680 Speaker 1: can actually pass these through the defect that's created by 220 00:13:54,720 --> 00:13:57,400 Speaker 1: the projectile and it will give you an idea of 221 00:13:57,559 --> 00:14:01,040 Speaker 1: them of the trajectory of the round if it travels 222 00:14:01,040 --> 00:14:04,240 Speaker 1: from above to below or from below to above, and 223 00:14:04,280 --> 00:14:07,880 Speaker 1: also uh the directionality if it goes from right to 224 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:10,080 Speaker 1: left or left to right, or if it just stays 225 00:14:10,400 --> 00:14:14,160 Speaker 1: right straight straightaway down the mid line. And when you 226 00:14:14,240 --> 00:14:16,480 Speaker 1: do this, it's kind of odd when you think about it, 227 00:14:16,520 --> 00:14:19,400 Speaker 1: but it's as a demonstration tool, particularly when you go 228 00:14:19,440 --> 00:14:22,080 Speaker 1: to court if you have these dow rods in place 229 00:14:22,120 --> 00:14:25,240 Speaker 1: with multiple gunshot wounds and you've got tracks that are 230 00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:27,840 Speaker 1: criss crossing one another, and it makes it highly complex. 231 00:14:28,200 --> 00:14:31,400 Speaker 1: When you put these static little pieces of wood in 232 00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:33,880 Speaker 1: there and they're projecting in and out of the body 233 00:14:34,200 --> 00:14:37,440 Speaker 1: and you snap a photograph of that, Suddenly the jury 234 00:14:37,600 --> 00:14:42,520 Speaker 1: gets an instantaneous picture of the relationship between the shooter 235 00:14:43,120 --> 00:14:46,040 Speaker 1: and the victim. And that that's powerful stuff when you're 236 00:14:46,720 --> 00:14:48,840 Speaker 1: a jury member and say, you're not used to seeing 237 00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:50,840 Speaker 1: this sort of thing, and lord knows who in the 238 00:14:50,880 --> 00:14:53,480 Speaker 1: world would be, particularly in a case like this that's 239 00:14:53,520 --> 00:14:57,600 Speaker 1: just absolute pure butchery. But it orients them to that 240 00:14:57,720 --> 00:15:01,440 Speaker 1: space and time and the orientation between Grant in his 241 00:15:01,520 --> 00:15:04,360 Speaker 1: father's head when he executed. So let's talk a little 242 00:15:04,400 --> 00:15:07,320 Speaker 1: bit about each crime scene, because we have three. We 243 00:15:07,360 --> 00:15:11,400 Speaker 1: have the kitchen, we have the room that the mother 244 00:15:11,520 --> 00:15:15,720 Speaker 1: was in in the office chair, and a storage room. 245 00:15:15,920 --> 00:15:20,360 Speaker 1: Would you not have heard the shots being fired for 246 00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:22,680 Speaker 1: the dad I mean the mother, the mother and the 247 00:15:22,720 --> 00:15:25,400 Speaker 1: father were home at the same time, So would you 248 00:15:25,480 --> 00:15:28,680 Speaker 1: not have heard the shot that killed the father? You know, 249 00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:31,920 Speaker 1: that's that's a fantastic question, Jackie. And I have to 250 00:15:31,960 --> 00:15:34,720 Speaker 1: tell you, I think that, in my estimation, at least, 251 00:15:35,120 --> 00:15:38,640 Speaker 1: I don't think you could pull this off with all 252 00:15:38,680 --> 00:15:40,880 Speaker 1: three of these individuals in the house at the same time. 253 00:15:40,880 --> 00:15:43,880 Speaker 1: I think he laid in wait and kind of worked 254 00:15:43,880 --> 00:15:48,360 Speaker 1: this out systematically. In my opinion, the mother is in 255 00:15:48,440 --> 00:15:51,360 Speaker 1: a very static position, Jackie. When you see and I've 256 00:15:51,400 --> 00:15:55,400 Speaker 1: seen these crime scene images and they are absolutely horrible, 257 00:15:56,360 --> 00:16:00,520 Speaker 1: the mom is just kind of in a very RESTful position. 258 00:16:00,640 --> 00:16:03,640 Speaker 1: There's no evidence of struggle or twisting about her this 259 00:16:03,720 --> 00:16:06,400 Speaker 1: sort of thing. She is literally laying forward, pitched for it, 260 00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:09,320 Speaker 1: if you will, And that's that's that's a pretty accurate term, 261 00:16:09,400 --> 00:16:13,320 Speaker 1: pitched for it on the surface of this desk. The dad, however, 262 00:16:14,160 --> 00:16:18,480 Speaker 1: is laying in what we refer to as a supine position, 263 00:16:18,560 --> 00:16:21,160 Speaker 1: and that's kind of fancy talk for laying face up. 264 00:16:21,760 --> 00:16:26,120 Speaker 1: And what's so interesting about this is that when he 265 00:16:26,280 --> 00:16:30,120 Speaker 1: is observed at the scene, Jackie, one of the investigators 266 00:16:30,120 --> 00:16:32,520 Speaker 1: that was out there, noted that even though he is 267 00:16:32,600 --> 00:16:36,680 Speaker 1: face up. There's an indication Jackie, that he had been moved. 268 00:16:37,160 --> 00:16:39,920 Speaker 1: He had been moved post mortem. And the way that 269 00:16:40,000 --> 00:16:43,320 Speaker 1: we determine that is that when a body is laying 270 00:16:43,320 --> 00:16:47,960 Speaker 1: in specific position dead, blood will settle to a particular area. Okay. 271 00:16:47,960 --> 00:16:50,840 Speaker 1: So let's just say, for instance, someone is um like 272 00:16:51,240 --> 00:16:55,200 Speaker 1: Mr Ramato was lying on his stomach. Okay, blood will 273 00:16:55,200 --> 00:16:59,560 Speaker 1: settle to his chest, his antior chest, and to his 274 00:16:59,640 --> 00:17:03,080 Speaker 1: abt month maybe two his thighs. You'll have points of 275 00:17:03,080 --> 00:17:06,439 Speaker 1: contact that will we blanched out and that blood is 276 00:17:06,440 --> 00:17:09,439 Speaker 1: going to settle to those areas and fix Remember their 277 00:17:09,480 --> 00:17:12,639 Speaker 1: bodies weren't found to the next day. But if you 278 00:17:13,560 --> 00:17:16,280 Speaker 1: if you manipulate that body in any way, which we 279 00:17:16,359 --> 00:17:21,439 Speaker 1: believe happened with Chad, you will still have this anterior 280 00:17:21,600 --> 00:17:25,399 Speaker 1: or frontal presentation of lividity, but it will be absent 281 00:17:25,440 --> 00:17:27,399 Speaker 1: on the back. And that's one of the things we 282 00:17:27,520 --> 00:17:31,240 Speaker 1: look for to see if a scene has particularly been staged, 283 00:17:31,320 --> 00:17:33,879 Speaker 1: and the term staging came up over and over and 284 00:17:33,920 --> 00:17:36,480 Speaker 1: over again that he tried to make this case or 285 00:17:36,520 --> 00:17:39,200 Speaker 1: try to make the scene appear different. And one a 286 00:17:39,800 --> 00:17:42,600 Speaker 1: very interesting element with Chad's body is the fact that 287 00:17:43,840 --> 00:17:46,919 Speaker 1: he was wearing a holstered weapon. Can you imagine that 288 00:17:46,960 --> 00:17:50,040 Speaker 1: he's wearing a holstered weapon on his belt in his home, 289 00:17:50,840 --> 00:17:54,960 Speaker 1: and it's oddly positioned. It's on his right side, but 290 00:17:55,160 --> 00:17:58,159 Speaker 1: it's turned so that the butt of the weapon is 291 00:17:58,200 --> 00:18:03,600 Speaker 1: facing forward, so you would that's called a cross draw configuration, 292 00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:05,879 Speaker 1: where an individually you think about an old cowboy movie 293 00:18:06,359 --> 00:18:10,399 Speaker 1: where uh, a gunfighter would reach across their body and 294 00:18:10,440 --> 00:18:12,679 Speaker 1: pull the weapon out safer left handed. You pull it 295 00:18:12,680 --> 00:18:15,359 Speaker 1: from your right hip and and hold it in your 296 00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:20,960 Speaker 1: left hand. But here's the twist. Chad's right handed. But 297 00:18:21,080 --> 00:18:25,760 Speaker 1: yet this this oddly positioned weapon is positioned on his 298 00:18:25,880 --> 00:18:28,200 Speaker 1: right hand, so that if he had to draw that weapon, 299 00:18:28,240 --> 00:18:30,960 Speaker 1: he would have had to literally twist his arm around 300 00:18:31,000 --> 00:18:33,800 Speaker 1: at the elbow in order to facilitate that. And that's 301 00:18:33,800 --> 00:18:38,119 Speaker 1: another indication that this happened after death. They believe that 302 00:18:38,160 --> 00:18:41,520 Speaker 1: Grant probably moved the body around in an attempt to 303 00:18:41,560 --> 00:18:45,479 Speaker 1: strap this weapon onto his dad. And again another just 304 00:18:45,760 --> 00:18:50,760 Speaker 1: odd ball set of circumstances. When you get to Cody's body, 305 00:18:51,040 --> 00:18:53,800 Speaker 1: the brother and this is this is so sad, you know, 306 00:18:53,920 --> 00:18:58,359 Speaker 1: because Cody and Grant were very close. Um, and I 307 00:18:58,440 --> 00:19:01,960 Speaker 1: remember watching this trial, and you can see Grant sitting 308 00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:04,119 Speaker 1: at the table and just weeping when they're talking about 309 00:19:04,119 --> 00:19:07,960 Speaker 1: his brother. Uh, that he he shot and you know 310 00:19:08,040 --> 00:19:11,640 Speaker 1: we talked about execution with mom and dad. With Cody Jackie, 311 00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:15,040 Speaker 1: he shot his brother in the face. And what that 312 00:19:15,280 --> 00:19:20,159 Speaker 1: tells us is that he was I two I with 313 00:19:20,880 --> 00:19:23,080 Speaker 1: his brother who was roughly a year and a half 314 00:19:23,119 --> 00:19:24,720 Speaker 1: to two years older than him, a kid that he 315 00:19:24,760 --> 00:19:26,800 Speaker 1: had grown up with, that they participated in the air 316 00:19:26,840 --> 00:19:30,600 Speaker 1: soft with, they had gone hunting with, they've done martial arts, 317 00:19:30,680 --> 00:19:34,720 Speaker 1: they traveled to Japan together. Can you imagine you're there 318 00:19:34,720 --> 00:19:38,040 Speaker 1: with your sibling and you were so obsessed, you're so 319 00:19:38,080 --> 00:19:41,120 Speaker 1: obsessed with the sexual addiction that you have to this 320 00:19:41,359 --> 00:19:45,200 Speaker 1: person that lives in Eastern Europe, that you would take 321 00:19:45,240 --> 00:19:49,760 Speaker 1: a handgun and pointed at your own brother's face and 322 00:19:49,920 --> 00:19:51,840 Speaker 1: kill him. And that's what he did. He shot him 323 00:19:51,880 --> 00:19:55,520 Speaker 1: right below his right eye, and that bullet, that bullet 324 00:19:55,720 --> 00:19:59,320 Speaker 1: traveled through his brother's head and knocked him down to 325 00:19:59,359 --> 00:20:00,960 Speaker 1: the ground. He st hill standing there. He had just 326 00:20:01,000 --> 00:20:03,040 Speaker 1: gotten home from work. Jackie was still wearing you know, 327 00:20:03,080 --> 00:20:05,040 Speaker 1: his brother is a nurse as well. He's still wearing 328 00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:08,960 Speaker 1: his green scrub suit, and even his lunch box. You know, 329 00:20:09,000 --> 00:20:11,520 Speaker 1: it's one of those insulated lunch boxes like that the 330 00:20:11,720 --> 00:20:13,399 Speaker 1: zip you know that you can pack all you It 331 00:20:13,520 --> 00:20:16,400 Speaker 1: was laying immediately adjacent to his to his brother, and 332 00:20:16,400 --> 00:20:21,280 Speaker 1: and in another attempt to stage a crime scene, he 333 00:20:21,359 --> 00:20:25,679 Speaker 1: had taken a weapon and laid it immediately adjacent to 334 00:20:25,800 --> 00:20:29,880 Speaker 1: his brother's hand. And investigators believe that Grant had done 335 00:20:29,880 --> 00:20:31,840 Speaker 1: this in an attempt to make this look like a 336 00:20:31,920 --> 00:20:35,000 Speaker 1: murder suicide, that his brother had walked in the house, 337 00:20:36,240 --> 00:20:39,119 Speaker 1: shot his mom and dad, and then took his own life. 338 00:20:39,560 --> 00:20:41,640 Speaker 1: And you know the problem with that when you begin 339 00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:44,639 Speaker 1: to look at it out of all of the suicides. 340 00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:47,480 Speaker 1: And I think I've said this before, but it bears repeating. 341 00:20:47,880 --> 00:20:50,560 Speaker 1: You know, as medical legal death investigators, you think that, 342 00:20:50,800 --> 00:20:52,640 Speaker 1: oh boy. You know you work at the Corners Office, 343 00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:55,040 Speaker 1: the Medical examin You work a lot of homicides. You know, 344 00:20:55,800 --> 00:21:00,320 Speaker 1: suicide is actually out number homicides, probably to the probably 345 00:21:00,320 --> 00:21:03,119 Speaker 1: three to one actually, so we work a lot more suicides. 346 00:21:03,720 --> 00:21:07,439 Speaker 1: I don't recall. In the course of my career, I 347 00:21:07,440 --> 00:21:11,399 Speaker 1: can probably count on one, maybe two hands, how many 348 00:21:11,680 --> 00:21:14,399 Speaker 1: cases I've worked of self inflicted gunshot wounds where people 349 00:21:14,400 --> 00:21:18,000 Speaker 1: shot themselves in the face. Um, it's just an aide. 350 00:21:18,080 --> 00:21:20,800 Speaker 1: It's what we call an atypical gunshot wound. It it 351 00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:25,080 Speaker 1: doesn't fit the pattern. It's more consistent. And and here's 352 00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:31,240 Speaker 1: here's the even bigger problem. When the forensic pathologists was describing, uh, 353 00:21:31,240 --> 00:21:34,119 Speaker 1: these injuries, you know, she's she's relating the fact that 354 00:21:34,200 --> 00:21:38,560 Speaker 1: this um that this was not a close contact gunshot wound. 355 00:21:38,600 --> 00:21:41,080 Speaker 1: So again, that would mean him holding the weapon away 356 00:21:41,119 --> 00:21:43,879 Speaker 1: from his face in order to to shoot himself in 357 00:21:43,880 --> 00:22:09,280 Speaker 1: the face. Cases like this that involve a lot of trauma, 358 00:22:09,440 --> 00:22:12,320 Speaker 1: there's a lot of blood there. For the investigators, uh, 359 00:22:12,800 --> 00:22:15,679 Speaker 1: people that work in my field of medical legal death investigation, 360 00:22:16,240 --> 00:22:18,760 Speaker 1: it's very difficult to kind of make your way through 361 00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:23,800 Speaker 1: these scenes. Uh. First off, you're worrying about the complexity 362 00:22:23,840 --> 00:22:27,200 Speaker 1: of it, how you can cross contaminate things, how you're 363 00:22:27,320 --> 00:22:30,680 Speaker 1: going to destroy your evidence. And I gotta tell you this, 364 00:22:30,680 --> 00:22:33,560 Speaker 1: this case, the Amoto case, stands out to me because 365 00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:37,600 Speaker 1: it is so very complex that these investigators would have 366 00:22:37,680 --> 00:22:40,680 Speaker 1: really have had to take their time in processing this scene. 367 00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:44,240 Speaker 1: Jack Well, especially considering that they had three scenes to process. 368 00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:48,920 Speaker 1: So I'm wondering, Joe in looking at how this was staged. 369 00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:53,240 Speaker 1: You have each victim in a separate room, and as 370 00:22:53,359 --> 00:22:57,320 Speaker 1: you said, it was thought that these individuals were killed 371 00:22:57,320 --> 00:23:00,440 Speaker 1: one at a time. The dad was killed first in kitchen, 372 00:23:00,800 --> 00:23:03,280 Speaker 1: the mom must have come home and not gone into 373 00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:07,200 Speaker 1: the kitchen. And the brother was found in a storage room. 374 00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:09,920 Speaker 1: I'm curious about the storage room. How do we get 375 00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:12,240 Speaker 1: the brother to go to the storage room? Was it 376 00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:14,440 Speaker 1: in the garage? I mean, how how do we keep 377 00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:18,159 Speaker 1: the brother from not going through the house and discovering 378 00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:22,840 Speaker 1: what's going on? Was this planned or was this a 379 00:23:23,040 --> 00:23:26,679 Speaker 1: crime of passion and opportunity for it to happen that way? 380 00:23:27,119 --> 00:23:29,200 Speaker 1: I think that this was planned, Jackie, and I, you know, 381 00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:33,520 Speaker 1: I'll go back to my earlier point that it's my 382 00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:37,640 Speaker 1: belief that um that he laid in wait for these 383 00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:41,199 Speaker 1: individuals he knew he kind of if you ever, you know, 384 00:23:41,240 --> 00:23:43,000 Speaker 1: if you ever watch a cat that's going to spring 385 00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:45,600 Speaker 1: on something, I think that that's what he was. He 386 00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:48,920 Speaker 1: was sitting on go in the house as the opportunity 387 00:23:48,920 --> 00:23:54,240 Speaker 1: presented itself, As he presented himself as stealthily as possible 388 00:23:54,280 --> 00:23:56,479 Speaker 1: in this environment which he knew very well. Remember this 389 00:23:56,560 --> 00:23:59,480 Speaker 1: is his home. He knows all blind spots he knows 390 00:23:59,520 --> 00:24:04,280 Speaker 1: the place is to hide. He also knows, um the 391 00:24:04,480 --> 00:24:07,879 Speaker 1: tendencies of the people that that he lived in the 392 00:24:07,880 --> 00:24:10,560 Speaker 1: house with mom, dad and brother. And just think about it. 393 00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:12,439 Speaker 1: I mean we you know, for those of us in 394 00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:14,639 Speaker 1: our audience that live with individuals, you know what the 395 00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:16,960 Speaker 1: tendencies are. You know where they're gonna come and go 396 00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:19,000 Speaker 1: and that sort of thing. You know their timing, you 397 00:24:19,040 --> 00:24:21,879 Speaker 1: know when they're going to arrive at home. So um, 398 00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:25,280 Speaker 1: he everything is stacked in his advantage. And you know 399 00:24:26,440 --> 00:24:29,600 Speaker 1: this is this is quite interesting little aside here, but 400 00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:35,520 Speaker 1: you know, when you come home, home is associated with haven, 401 00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:39,399 Speaker 1: It's associated with a place of safety, a place of security. 402 00:24:39,840 --> 00:24:42,080 Speaker 1: So your guard is down. You know, when you walk 403 00:24:42,119 --> 00:24:44,200 Speaker 1: into home, it's not like you're turning down at dark 404 00:24:44,200 --> 00:24:46,359 Speaker 1: alley and you don't know what's down there is someplace 405 00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:49,639 Speaker 1: you've never been before. But in the context of coming 406 00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:53,720 Speaker 1: home and making your way through the house, it's it's 407 00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:56,000 Speaker 1: going to give you a false sense of security. So 408 00:24:56,040 --> 00:24:58,399 Speaker 1: if you've got somebody that means to do you harm 409 00:24:58,480 --> 00:25:01,520 Speaker 1: in this case grant a model, oh, then your guard 410 00:25:01,560 --> 00:25:03,640 Speaker 1: will be down for that amount of time and it's 411 00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:06,000 Speaker 1: easy for him to pray and you know. And this 412 00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:09,320 Speaker 1: is another thing. And when you have the familiarity, you 413 00:25:09,359 --> 00:25:11,159 Speaker 1: remember I was talking about the mom how she was 414 00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:15,040 Speaker 1: kind of uh in this relaxed position at the desk. Um, 415 00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:19,320 Speaker 1: you don't expect for your son to kill you if 416 00:25:19,320 --> 00:25:22,320 Speaker 1: your dad the same thing. And when Cody comes home, 417 00:25:22,359 --> 00:25:24,840 Speaker 1: he doesn't you know, uh, you know, his brother could 418 00:25:24,880 --> 00:25:28,560 Speaker 1: approach him quite easily, and he would have his guard down. 419 00:25:28,640 --> 00:25:30,680 Speaker 1: He'd just be holding his lunch box in his hand. 420 00:25:30,760 --> 00:25:33,240 Speaker 1: He'd be there in his scrubs and he'd be you know, hey, bro, 421 00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:35,520 Speaker 1: how you doing. And the next thing, you know, he 422 00:25:35,720 --> 00:25:37,800 Speaker 1: the last thing he sees is maybe a puff of 423 00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:41,160 Speaker 1: smoke and his life comes to an end. And so 424 00:25:41,320 --> 00:25:45,040 Speaker 1: all of these given the close proximity of kind of 425 00:25:45,080 --> 00:25:48,440 Speaker 1: the storage area that's there, which is near a point 426 00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:53,040 Speaker 1: of entrance. Um, you've got mom um that is there 427 00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:55,680 Speaker 1: in in her you know, in her office area, which 428 00:25:55,760 --> 00:25:58,480 Speaker 1: most of us feel very safe, and then Dad's in 429 00:25:58,600 --> 00:26:01,800 Speaker 1: the kitchen. Um, their guard is going to be down 430 00:26:01,840 --> 00:26:06,320 Speaker 1: at those moments in time. What's kind of interesting about 431 00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:09,400 Speaker 1: this case though, And you really have to just let 432 00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:11,679 Speaker 1: me say this to you and let you wrap your 433 00:26:11,680 --> 00:26:17,000 Speaker 1: brain around this. After Mom and Dad had died. Investigators 434 00:26:17,200 --> 00:26:20,120 Speaker 1: estimate and just listen to this very carefully and let 435 00:26:20,119 --> 00:26:25,840 Speaker 1: it sink in. Investigators estimate. The Granda Motto stayed in 436 00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:30,760 Speaker 1: the house with his executed parents. These individuals that had 437 00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:35,640 Speaker 1: loved him, taking care of him, tolerated him through all 438 00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:38,600 Speaker 1: of this nonsense that he was involved in. He stayed 439 00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:41,520 Speaker 1: in that house, Jackie, for four hours with their bodies. 440 00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:47,520 Speaker 1: Can you Imaine staying in there as your parents, uh 441 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,600 Speaker 1: lay there on the floor and in their office area waiting, 442 00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:54,719 Speaker 1: just waiting for your brother Cody to come walking through 443 00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:56,960 Speaker 1: the door so that you can end his life to 444 00:26:57,240 --> 00:27:00,399 Speaker 1: Another interesting aspect of this show is that well that 445 00:27:00,600 --> 00:27:03,840 Speaker 1: actually there's more than one. Grant was a member of 446 00:27:03,840 --> 00:27:09,639 Speaker 1: a competitive Aerosoft team, which means he had firearms experience. 447 00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:14,080 Speaker 1: Maybe not leathal firearms experience, but to be able to 448 00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:18,520 Speaker 1: win an Aerosoft competition you have to be accurate. And also, 449 00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:22,960 Speaker 1: Grant a Motto had some medical training, so he would 450 00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:27,479 Speaker 1: have known the best place to shoot to kill. Yeah, right, 451 00:27:27,560 --> 00:27:29,720 Speaker 1: you are, Jackie. Yeah, he was part of an airsoft team, 452 00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:32,560 Speaker 1: as was his brother. I mean he had firearms proficiency 453 00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:38,080 Speaker 1: in addition to air soft proficiency. Air Soft proficiency. Even 454 00:27:38,119 --> 00:27:41,320 Speaker 1: though it's not the same as an actual firearm, it 455 00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:45,040 Speaker 1: gives you. It gives you proficiency in the area of 456 00:27:45,359 --> 00:27:48,600 Speaker 1: being able to aim and put put the weapon on target, 457 00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:51,160 Speaker 1: if you will, and moving moving targets, you know, because 458 00:27:51,160 --> 00:27:52,960 Speaker 1: these guys run all over the place where they're doing that. 459 00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:56,040 Speaker 1: And there's several images of him where he's all commoed out. 460 00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:58,640 Speaker 1: You know, he's stressed. He's carrying these weapons that look 461 00:27:58,720 --> 00:28:01,240 Speaker 1: like military style weapons with their air soft weapons. But 462 00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:04,359 Speaker 1: you have to keep in mind he also owned and 463 00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:08,479 Speaker 1: the family did, um multiple real firearms as well, and 464 00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:10,760 Speaker 1: there's even images of him out you know, fire and 465 00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:13,440 Speaker 1: shot guns and all these sorts of things. So he 466 00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:18,280 Speaker 1: was not uncomfortable, uncomfortable in in a world of firearms 467 00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:23,040 Speaker 1: and so um that that becomes kind of wrote, you know, 468 00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:27,000 Speaker 1: when when you begin to think about the family coming 469 00:28:27,040 --> 00:28:29,639 Speaker 1: home and him essentially ambushing him. I mean, it's like 470 00:28:29,720 --> 00:28:32,879 Speaker 1: he had been practicing for this for a while, um 471 00:28:32,920 --> 00:28:36,760 Speaker 1: in his mind, because you know, when everything began to 472 00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:38,920 Speaker 1: collapse around him. And you know, one thing I forgot 473 00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:41,680 Speaker 1: to mention to you had mentioned that he he was 474 00:28:41,680 --> 00:28:43,480 Speaker 1: was a nurse, and he was a nurse. He just 475 00:28:43,880 --> 00:28:49,040 Speaker 1: he flunked out of anesthesia school um and UM, but 476 00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:52,520 Speaker 1: he was a practicing nurse. But this is interesting as well. Jackie. 477 00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:59,200 Speaker 1: You know, he had been caught at work, um in 478 00:28:59,320 --> 00:29:04,240 Speaker 1: the Orlando area, at at his job, UM stealing uh, 479 00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:09,120 Speaker 1: stealing a drug that is used as a a sedative, 480 00:29:09,160 --> 00:29:13,720 Speaker 1: what they referred to as a uh pre anesthesia drug. 481 00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:15,520 Speaker 1: It's one of these drugs that they'll give you, you know, 482 00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:18,240 Speaker 1: like I'll give you an example for anybody's ever had surgery, 483 00:29:18,240 --> 00:29:22,120 Speaker 1: you know, uh that when the nurse goes to inject 484 00:29:22,120 --> 00:29:24,360 Speaker 1: your your IV line, they'll say, now you're gonna feel 485 00:29:24,360 --> 00:29:26,920 Speaker 1: something cold in your line, and then all of a sudden, 486 00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:29,840 Speaker 1: the world begins to get kind of milky and warm 487 00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:31,600 Speaker 1: and that sort of thing. And that's that's kind of 488 00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:34,200 Speaker 1: what they do before they give you the jolt of 489 00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:37,840 Speaker 1: the antidual. Well, this drug, in particular, Jackie, he had 490 00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:42,280 Speaker 1: stolen in excess of four thousand dollars worth these drugs, 491 00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:45,360 Speaker 1: and not only had he been fired from the hospital, 492 00:29:45,400 --> 00:29:48,080 Speaker 1: but they were pressing charges for grand theft in addition 493 00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:50,200 Speaker 1: to this. And I think that this probably wound up 494 00:29:50,200 --> 00:29:53,440 Speaker 1: in the suspension of his nursing license. So all of 495 00:29:53,440 --> 00:29:55,880 Speaker 1: This was like kind of this perfect storm that was 496 00:29:56,280 --> 00:30:00,400 Speaker 1: cycling about in his life. What you know, it was 497 00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:03,680 Speaker 1: going to send him down in flames, and unfortunately, you know, 498 00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:06,520 Speaker 1: his family wound up bearing the brunt of it. Why 499 00:30:06,560 --> 00:30:10,560 Speaker 1: would he have stolen these drugs show? Is it possible 500 00:30:10,600 --> 00:30:14,160 Speaker 1: that he intended to use them on his parents or 501 00:30:14,320 --> 00:30:17,880 Speaker 1: maybe sell them to get more money for his webcam girlfriend. 502 00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:22,960 Speaker 1: Fantastic question, Jackie, And I think that it's probably going 503 00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:25,920 Speaker 1: to be the latter more than likely because, and I'll 504 00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:28,840 Speaker 1: tell you why. First off, there was no evidence that 505 00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:32,800 Speaker 1: they had this particular drug, propofol is the name of it. 506 00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:35,320 Speaker 1: There was no evidence of this in their system, and 507 00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:38,240 Speaker 1: this had happened a couple of months prior to but 508 00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:41,920 Speaker 1: he had been acquiring these meds um I think that 509 00:30:42,200 --> 00:30:46,040 Speaker 1: there would be a higher possibility that he could have 510 00:30:46,120 --> 00:30:49,600 Speaker 1: sold them. What he his rationale that he gave when 511 00:30:49,600 --> 00:30:53,040 Speaker 1: he was questioned was I guess he viewed himself as 512 00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:56,560 Speaker 1: some kind of Florence Nightingale, because he presented himself to 513 00:30:56,680 --> 00:30:58,680 Speaker 1: the staff and to the police. He's like, well, you know, 514 00:30:58,760 --> 00:31:02,080 Speaker 1: the my patient, it's on the floor or under medicated. 515 00:31:02,680 --> 00:31:05,960 Speaker 1: So I wanted to assist him by injecting them with 516 00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:08,680 Speaker 1: this medication in order to I don't know, alleviate their 517 00:31:08,720 --> 00:31:11,720 Speaker 1: pain or their anxiety or whatever it was. But I 518 00:31:11,800 --> 00:31:14,160 Speaker 1: found that quite telling as well. This is a very 519 00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:18,160 Speaker 1: dangerous environment for somebody that has this kind of uh 520 00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:22,080 Speaker 1: proclivity if you will, to be around really sick people 521 00:31:22,120 --> 00:31:26,920 Speaker 1: and applying this very very powerful hypnotic drug that can 522 00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:29,920 Speaker 1: really depress the system. I'm they're very fortunate that if 523 00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:35,080 Speaker 1: he did apply to these people, that he didn't kill him. So, 524 00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:37,440 Speaker 1: you know, no one really knows what he did with 525 00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:40,040 Speaker 1: the drug, but they know that the drugs were missing 526 00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:42,920 Speaker 1: and they tied it back to him. Um, And I 527 00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:46,040 Speaker 1: think that that's again, this goes into this kind of 528 00:31:46,200 --> 00:31:49,480 Speaker 1: pathology that he's dealing with. He was on a real 529 00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:58,680 Speaker 1: downhill slide. I'm Joseph Scott Morgan in this is Body Backs.