1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:01,599 Speaker 1: Hey guys, Saga and Crystal here. 2 00:00:01,680 --> 00:00:05,240 Speaker 2: Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election, 3 00:00:05,360 --> 00:00:07,840 Speaker 2: and we are so excited about what that means for 4 00:00:07,880 --> 00:00:08,720 Speaker 2: the future of this show. 5 00:00:08,880 --> 00:00:10,760 Speaker 3: This is the only place where you can find honest 6 00:00:10,760 --> 00:00:13,280 Speaker 3: perspectives from the left and the right that simply does 7 00:00:13,320 --> 00:00:14,680 Speaker 3: not exist anywhere else. 8 00:00:14,760 --> 00:00:17,080 Speaker 2: So if that is something that's important to you, please 9 00:00:17,120 --> 00:00:19,599 Speaker 2: go to Breakingpoints dot com. Become a member today and 10 00:00:19,640 --> 00:00:22,800 Speaker 2: you'll get access to our full shows, unedited, ad free, 11 00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:25,600 Speaker 2: and all put together for you every morning in your inbox. 12 00:00:25,680 --> 00:00:27,560 Speaker 3: We need your help to build the future of independent 13 00:00:27,560 --> 00:00:29,920 Speaker 3: news media and we hope to see you at Breakingpoints 14 00:00:29,960 --> 00:00:33,839 Speaker 3: dot com. 15 00:00:34,000 --> 00:00:37,320 Speaker 1: Let's move on to Elon Muskrin. Because the EX offices 16 00:00:37,320 --> 00:00:41,240 Speaker 1: were rated in Paris yesterday. I'm going to go ahead 17 00:00:41,280 --> 00:00:45,840 Speaker 1: and read from this AP report about what happened. Headline 18 00:00:45,880 --> 00:00:49,280 Speaker 1: is EX offices rated in France as prosecutors investigate child 19 00:00:49,320 --> 00:00:52,000 Speaker 1: abuse images and deep fake. So you might remember us 20 00:00:52,040 --> 00:00:56,080 Speaker 1: covering the ex child abuse deep fake issue not very 21 00:00:56,120 --> 00:00:59,320 Speaker 1: long ago. AP says French prosecutors raided the offices of 22 00:00:59,320 --> 00:01:01,640 Speaker 1: social media pop from X on Tuesday as part of 23 00:01:01,640 --> 00:01:05,440 Speaker 1: a preliminary investigation into allegations that include spreading child sexual 24 00:01:05,440 --> 00:01:09,000 Speaker 1: abuse images and deep fakes. They've also summoned billionaire owner 25 00:01:09,040 --> 00:01:13,440 Speaker 1: Elon Musk for questioning X and Musk's artificial intelligence company Xai, 26 00:01:13,920 --> 00:01:18,360 Speaker 1: which was just by the way obtained by SpaceX. 27 00:01:19,920 --> 00:01:26,000 Speaker 4: So more financial engineering to dilute the shareholders in favor 28 00:01:26,040 --> 00:01:26,959 Speaker 4: of Elon Musk's wealth. 29 00:01:27,000 --> 00:01:31,800 Speaker 1: Congratulations, guys Ap continues to say. Xai also faced intensifying 30 00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:35,520 Speaker 1: scrutiny from Britain's data privacy regulator, which opened formal investigations 31 00:01:35,520 --> 00:01:38,560 Speaker 1: into how they handled personal data when they developed and deployed. 32 00:01:38,640 --> 00:01:42,840 Speaker 1: Musk's artificial intelligence chat bought Groc, which was built by 33 00:01:42,920 --> 00:01:45,520 Speaker 1: Xai and is available through X, sparked global outrage last 34 00:01:45,520 --> 00:01:48,360 Speaker 1: month after it pumped out a torrent of sexualized, non 35 00:01:48,360 --> 00:01:52,440 Speaker 1: consensual deep fake images in response to requests from X users. 36 00:01:52,480 --> 00:01:57,400 Speaker 1: And so now X is in the crosshairs of European regulators. 37 00:01:57,440 --> 00:02:00,560 Speaker 1: So it's not just in Paris, this is also in 38 00:02:00,600 --> 00:02:05,400 Speaker 1: Spain and Greece and places where they're considering not even 39 00:02:05,600 --> 00:02:10,200 Speaker 1: in targeting X specifically, but broadly teen social media bands. 40 00:02:10,200 --> 00:02:13,519 Speaker 1: This is obviously targeting X specifically in Paris, but teen 41 00:02:13,560 --> 00:02:15,400 Speaker 1: social media bands are on the table in a lot 42 00:02:15,440 --> 00:02:18,160 Speaker 1: of different countries right now. And you can understand why 43 00:02:18,280 --> 00:02:22,640 Speaker 1: if the average social media website had non consensual deep 44 00:02:22,680 --> 00:02:26,600 Speaker 1: fake porn being pumped out onto the Internet pretty easily 45 00:02:26,919 --> 00:02:29,880 Speaker 1: accessible to children at that point. 46 00:02:30,160 --> 00:02:34,960 Speaker 4: Yeah, and this is in some ways part and parcel 47 00:02:35,000 --> 00:02:40,919 Speaker 4: of the kind of EU attack on American big tech. Yes, 48 00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:46,320 Speaker 4: and it's much more restrictive and in some ways censorious 49 00:02:46,560 --> 00:02:52,079 Speaker 4: in a negative way approach to it, but also at 50 00:02:52,120 --> 00:02:53,359 Speaker 4: times big. 51 00:02:53,400 --> 00:02:55,120 Speaker 5: Some big tech companies. 52 00:02:56,200 --> 00:03:00,519 Speaker 4: Very much deserved to be checked by governments because and 53 00:03:00,840 --> 00:03:04,000 Speaker 4: in particular, I'm of a couple of minds with Musk. 54 00:03:04,160 --> 00:03:07,560 Speaker 4: I like that he allows more speech, yes, and I 55 00:03:07,720 --> 00:03:12,440 Speaker 4: like the more libertarian kind of approach to it. At 56 00:03:12,440 --> 00:03:18,359 Speaker 4: the same time, for his own commercial purposes, he does 57 00:03:18,400 --> 00:03:22,560 Speaker 4: stuff that everybody just knows is wrong, like he was 58 00:03:22,600 --> 00:03:27,239 Speaker 4: falling behind and would you know, Grock take up and 59 00:03:28,600 --> 00:03:31,320 Speaker 4: all of the AI world knows. And this is probably 60 00:03:31,360 --> 00:03:35,680 Speaker 4: where it's headed. And it sucks that the Internet runs 61 00:03:35,680 --> 00:03:39,000 Speaker 4: on porn. Yeah, Like that's actually that's the actual basis 62 00:03:39,040 --> 00:03:39,560 Speaker 4: of the Internet. 63 00:03:40,480 --> 00:03:43,240 Speaker 5: And if you the more. 64 00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:46,240 Speaker 1: Of a America runs on duncan the Internet runs on porn. 65 00:03:46,240 --> 00:03:49,080 Speaker 4: The more the pornspigot you turn on for AI, the more, 66 00:03:49,280 --> 00:03:51,880 Speaker 4: the more you're going to get people to use it. 67 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:57,040 Speaker 4: And so he turned on that spigot, and this flood 68 00:03:57,240 --> 00:04:04,760 Speaker 4: of then disgusting child images and that in addition what 69 00:04:05,760 --> 00:04:09,000 Speaker 4: governments are trying to ban, which is doing you know, 70 00:04:09,120 --> 00:04:11,400 Speaker 4: deep fake nudes and porn of real people. 71 00:04:13,120 --> 00:04:15,720 Speaker 5: It just starts flooding in that. 72 00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:18,200 Speaker 4: You like, as a public you've got to be able 73 00:04:18,240 --> 00:04:21,559 Speaker 4: to check that at some point. Yeah, well, but Elon 74 00:04:21,640 --> 00:04:25,200 Speaker 4: Musk is Yeah, just let's feels like he's uncheckable. 75 00:04:25,279 --> 00:04:27,479 Speaker 1: Well, let's put Elon's response up on the screen. This 76 00:04:27,640 --> 00:04:32,560 Speaker 1: is D two and he said, in an in response 77 00:04:32,640 --> 00:04:35,640 Speaker 1: to an X statement on what happened in the Paris office, 78 00:04:36,000 --> 00:04:39,520 Speaker 1: this is a political attack. I'll read a little bit 79 00:04:39,600 --> 00:04:44,120 Speaker 1: more from X's statement about the Paris raid, which calls 80 00:04:44,120 --> 00:04:46,719 Speaker 1: it quote an abusive act of law enforcement theater, designed 81 00:04:46,720 --> 00:04:50,560 Speaker 1: to achieve illegitimate political objectives rather than advance legitimate law 82 00:04:50,640 --> 00:04:54,000 Speaker 1: enforcement goals rooted in the fair and impartial administration of justice. 83 00:04:54,040 --> 00:04:55,520 Speaker 1: And what I like about what you just said, Ryan, 84 00:04:55,640 --> 00:05:00,520 Speaker 1: is that can be true, actually that this is political 85 00:05:00,520 --> 00:05:05,159 Speaker 1: theater and it's a political attack. That's both those things 86 00:05:05,160 --> 00:05:08,280 Speaker 1: can be true at the same time as the sort 87 00:05:08,320 --> 00:05:12,600 Speaker 1: of legitimate concerns about X are true and the deep fake, nonconsensual, 88 00:05:12,680 --> 00:05:17,400 Speaker 1: deep fake porn questions, whether it's in regard to children 89 00:05:17,880 --> 00:05:20,280 Speaker 1: being able to see them or the people who become 90 00:05:20,400 --> 00:05:23,280 Speaker 1: the subjects of them, These two things can be true 91 00:05:23,320 --> 00:05:26,320 Speaker 1: at the same time, it's politicized, and it's a legitimate problem, 92 00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:27,160 Speaker 1: and it should. 93 00:05:26,880 --> 00:05:29,839 Speaker 4: Be politicized in the sense that these are political questions, 94 00:05:29,880 --> 00:05:32,920 Speaker 4: like what we want to tolerate in our yeah, society 95 00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:38,080 Speaker 4: or there when it comes to child nudity yep, and 96 00:05:38,120 --> 00:05:41,599 Speaker 4: stuff like and deep fake porn of real people like 97 00:05:41,600 --> 00:05:42,800 Speaker 4: these are political. 98 00:05:42,440 --> 00:05:45,200 Speaker 1: Questions again from a man who purports to be saving 99 00:05:45,200 --> 00:05:53,839 Speaker 1: Western civilization and is seemingly aligned against like globalist atheists whatever, 100 00:05:53,960 --> 00:05:55,800 Speaker 1: and the right finds a lot of common cause with 101 00:05:55,960 --> 00:05:58,960 Speaker 1: Elon Musk. Now, this is a man who is defending 102 00:05:59,360 --> 00:06:03,280 Speaker 1: I mean you gladly defense pornography on the platform. Uh, 103 00:06:03,560 --> 00:06:06,159 Speaker 1: it's not even that's not even a question at this point, Like, 104 00:06:06,240 --> 00:06:09,279 Speaker 1: of course he does. So it's just a good reminder 105 00:06:09,279 --> 00:06:12,160 Speaker 1: of the golf, the real golf, between Elon Musk and 106 00:06:12,680 --> 00:06:17,039 Speaker 1: the civilization saving forces on the right that align with him. 107 00:06:17,680 --> 00:06:20,800 Speaker 4: And so he's also getting hit in Spain so Prime 108 00:06:20,839 --> 00:06:25,040 Speaker 4: Minister page with Sanchez there is what will play him 109 00:06:25,080 --> 00:06:27,120 Speaker 4: in a second and the content. The context here is 110 00:06:27,160 --> 00:06:31,799 Speaker 4: the center left coalition in Spain is facing a wipeout 111 00:06:31,839 --> 00:06:37,560 Speaker 4: from the right and it's I think important to understand 112 00:06:37,600 --> 00:06:42,000 Speaker 4: this in that context that they they clearly feel like 113 00:06:43,040 --> 00:06:46,919 Speaker 4: this is something that could maybe stave off that wipe out. Potentially, 114 00:06:47,720 --> 00:06:54,760 Speaker 4: we'll play Sanchez and then Elon Musk's which is very predictable, 115 00:06:55,160 --> 00:06:59,359 Speaker 4: predictable in general, but not in particular response. 116 00:06:59,480 --> 00:07:01,279 Speaker 5: So let's let's roll Sanchez. 117 00:07:01,920 --> 00:07:05,800 Speaker 6: Just last week, the owner of X, a migrant himself, 118 00:07:06,360 --> 00:07:09,920 Speaker 6: used his personal account to amplify this information about the 119 00:07:09,960 --> 00:07:14,680 Speaker 6: Sobat indecision by my government, the regularization of five hundred 120 00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:19,120 Speaker 6: thousand migrants that leave work and contribute to the success 121 00:07:19,560 --> 00:07:24,400 Speaker 6: of our country, the same platform that has allowed its 122 00:07:24,600 --> 00:07:28,239 Speaker 6: ai growth to generate illegal sexual content. 123 00:07:29,120 --> 00:07:32,160 Speaker 4: And some of this, to be clear, in my own opinion, 124 00:07:32,200 --> 00:07:36,960 Speaker 4: goes way too far. For instance, in France, it's illegal 125 00:07:37,000 --> 00:07:39,480 Speaker 4: to deny the Holocaust, and at one point Grok was 126 00:07:39,520 --> 00:07:45,640 Speaker 4: doing some like dabbling in Holocaust the nihalism. You kind 127 00:07:45,640 --> 00:07:50,720 Speaker 4: of have llms that screw up making that kind of 128 00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:54,520 Speaker 4: speech criminal to me, pushing it a little too far, 129 00:07:54,600 --> 00:07:56,560 Speaker 4: but Sanchez says, First, we will change the law in 130 00:07:56,640 --> 00:08:01,000 Speaker 4: Spain the whole platform executives legally accountable for many infringements. 131 00:08:01,280 --> 00:08:04,800 Speaker 1: Those laws have been wildly abused. We've seen that, yes. 132 00:08:04,800 --> 00:08:08,240 Speaker 4: And Second, we will turn algorithmic manipulation and amplification of 133 00:08:08,320 --> 00:08:12,760 Speaker 4: illegal content into a new criminal offense. Third, we will 134 00:08:12,800 --> 00:08:17,120 Speaker 4: implement a hate and polarization footprint system to track, quantify, 135 00:08:17,160 --> 00:08:22,720 Speaker 4: and expose how digital platforms fuel division and amplify hate. 136 00:08:22,800 --> 00:08:28,440 Speaker 4: If they turn that into a crime, that's awfully dicey. Fourth, 137 00:08:28,960 --> 00:08:31,560 Speaker 4: Spain will ban access to social media for miners under 138 00:08:31,560 --> 00:08:34,600 Speaker 4: the age of sixteen. Platforms will be required to implement 139 00:08:34,760 --> 00:08:39,040 Speaker 4: effective age verification systems, not just checkboxes, but real barriers 140 00:08:39,320 --> 00:08:41,880 Speaker 4: that work. Fifth, my government will work with our public 141 00:08:41,920 --> 00:08:46,480 Speaker 4: prosecutor to investigate and pursue the infringement committed by rock 142 00:08:47,000 --> 00:08:47,760 Speaker 4: TikTok and. 143 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:50,040 Speaker 5: Instagram. 144 00:08:51,360 --> 00:08:53,200 Speaker 4: Because one way I would think about it is like, 145 00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:58,600 Speaker 4: let's say, so upscrolled is doing tremendously, you know, a 146 00:08:58,640 --> 00:09:01,679 Speaker 4: social platform that is floating in popularity, and they're saying 147 00:09:01,920 --> 00:09:04,320 Speaker 4: we want to be a free speech platform. 148 00:09:04,400 --> 00:09:06,240 Speaker 5: What I would say is, I've heard that before. 149 00:09:06,480 --> 00:09:11,440 Speaker 4: What if Spain decides that some of the speech that 150 00:09:11,480 --> 00:09:15,959 Speaker 4: you're allowing on this platform they consider hateful. Are you 151 00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:20,120 Speaker 4: going to put the upscrolled founders like in prison over that? 152 00:09:21,559 --> 00:09:24,559 Speaker 4: So I think this is not as clear cut as 153 00:09:25,120 --> 00:09:27,480 Speaker 4: kind of a left right thing as people think it is. 154 00:09:28,080 --> 00:09:34,120 Speaker 4: Elon Musk swoops in with the least edifying possible response 155 00:09:34,240 --> 00:09:37,640 Speaker 4: can put up Musk. Here he says dirty Sanchez is 156 00:09:37,679 --> 00:09:40,640 Speaker 4: a tyrant and traitor to the people of Spain, and 157 00:09:40,640 --> 00:09:42,600 Speaker 4: then he has a little poop emoji in case anybody 158 00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:44,520 Speaker 4: doesn't get the reference there. 159 00:09:45,440 --> 00:09:48,280 Speaker 5: I saw that. I was like, where do I know 160 00:09:48,360 --> 00:09:49,000 Speaker 5: that phrase from? 161 00:09:49,000 --> 00:09:52,680 Speaker 4: And I was like, oh, in college, I was telling 162 00:09:53,520 --> 00:09:55,840 Speaker 4: Mac and Emily, who don't remember a time before the internet? 163 00:09:56,040 --> 00:09:57,720 Speaker 5: Emily does, Mac so sure. 164 00:09:57,960 --> 00:10:00,160 Speaker 1: Year old, but Mac is young and spry. 165 00:10:00,200 --> 00:10:04,200 Speaker 4: In college, there was a sheet of paper that was 166 00:10:04,679 --> 00:10:08,480 Speaker 4: passed around like this is what viral stuff was back 167 00:10:08,520 --> 00:10:10,160 Speaker 4: before the internet was a thing. 168 00:10:10,200 --> 00:10:11,560 Speaker 1: It's a piece of paper that had been touched by 169 00:10:11,640 --> 00:10:12,840 Speaker 1: hundreds of hundreds. 170 00:10:12,520 --> 00:10:14,480 Speaker 4: Of people, had been passed around in dorm rooms and parties, 171 00:10:14,760 --> 00:10:17,079 Speaker 4: and on it it was actually multiple pages, I think 172 00:10:17,480 --> 00:10:20,480 Speaker 4: on it was it was it was like an urban dictionary. 173 00:10:20,520 --> 00:10:23,880 Speaker 4: It was a dirty Sanchez and dirty Sanchez would then 174 00:10:23,960 --> 00:10:27,000 Speaker 4: be defined. A lot of you are eating breakfast or 175 00:10:27,120 --> 00:10:33,040 Speaker 4: drinking coffee. So I'm not going to define it. If 176 00:10:33,080 --> 00:10:35,840 Speaker 4: you google it, it says it surfaced in the like two 177 00:10:35,920 --> 00:10:38,600 Speaker 4: thousand and three and some like UK reality show No, No, 178 00:10:38,840 --> 00:10:41,319 Speaker 4: I can I can tell you it was circulating on 179 00:10:41,400 --> 00:10:45,120 Speaker 4: paper in college campuses in the nineteen nineties, which. 180 00:10:44,840 --> 00:10:47,680 Speaker 5: Is apparently where Elon Musk is stuck. 181 00:10:48,720 --> 00:10:51,680 Speaker 4: So a grown man with a with a deep cut 182 00:10:51,720 --> 00:10:58,960 Speaker 4: there to come back at at the Prime Minister of Spain. 183 00:10:59,040 --> 00:11:03,880 Speaker 1: Here we are coping so poorly with this era of technology, 184 00:11:04,600 --> 00:11:10,520 Speaker 1: coping as evidenced by the engineer, by the architect of 185 00:11:10,559 --> 00:11:13,400 Speaker 1: our digital doom. You can see it in his response 186 00:11:13,760 --> 00:11:16,200 Speaker 1: his geopolitical negotiations. You can see it. 187 00:11:16,240 --> 00:11:17,680 Speaker 5: Thirteen year old right there. 188 00:11:20,880 --> 00:11:23,680 Speaker 1: Right, let's move on to Treck Schumer. This video. People 189 00:11:23,760 --> 00:11:26,120 Speaker 1: absolutely have to see this video of Chuck Schumer talking 190 00:11:26,160 --> 00:11:30,280 Speaker 1: about Israel. Yes, let's do it all right, Chuck Schumer, Ryan, 191 00:11:30,320 --> 00:11:32,920 Speaker 1: where was this this was at this was happening? I 192 00:11:32,920 --> 00:11:34,319 Speaker 1: think this was last week, right. 193 00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:36,680 Speaker 5: I can't ask me. I was in Mexico. 194 00:11:36,840 --> 00:11:38,959 Speaker 1: That's right, you were at Mexico and you were very 195 00:11:38,960 --> 00:11:42,800 Speaker 1: focused on raising for I forget what it was a 196 00:11:42,840 --> 00:11:46,079 Speaker 1: fundraiser last week and I want to think I think 197 00:11:46,080 --> 00:11:49,160 Speaker 1: this popped over the weekend. But here's the clip of 198 00:11:49,559 --> 00:11:51,800 Speaker 1: Chuck Schumer that you've all been waiting for. It won't 199 00:11:51,840 --> 00:11:56,680 Speaker 1: surprise you, but unusually brazen given the circumstances, let's roll. 200 00:11:56,640 --> 00:11:59,160 Speaker 7: It for a to Israel. 201 00:11:59,360 --> 00:12:04,160 Speaker 8: All the that Israel needs. I will continue applied for it. 202 00:12:05,200 --> 00:12:09,760 Speaker 8: And we delivered more security assistance than israelan Ali under 203 00:12:09,800 --> 00:12:15,040 Speaker 8: my leadership than ever ever before. We will keep doing that, everybody, 204 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:18,200 Speaker 8: But it is a more puppy to give Israel what 205 00:12:18,280 --> 00:12:22,520 Speaker 8: it needs and to protect itself from the many in 206 00:12:22,600 --> 00:12:26,120 Speaker 8: that difficult region. For one whipe Israel off the face 207 00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:30,440 Speaker 8: of the map. We have to do everything to do that. 208 00:12:31,120 --> 00:12:34,200 Speaker 8: We have to do everything to ensure that the delicacy 209 00:12:34,320 --> 00:12:37,640 Speaker 8: spire securing last year pays away lasting peace. 210 00:12:38,480 --> 00:12:42,080 Speaker 1: Okay, So, according to the foreward, the breakfast quote, previously 211 00:12:42,080 --> 00:12:44,480 Speaker 1: held at the offices of the UJA Federation of New York, 212 00:12:44,559 --> 00:12:45,800 Speaker 1: was held this year for the first time in the 213 00:12:45,800 --> 00:12:48,240 Speaker 1: events hall at Park East Synagogue, which was the site 214 00:12:48,320 --> 00:12:51,640 Speaker 1: of a propouse sitting protest last year that featured, according 215 00:12:51,679 --> 00:12:54,840 Speaker 1: to the forward, anti Semitic slogans and posters. That's how 216 00:12:54,880 --> 00:12:59,880 Speaker 1: this is described. Ryan I said it was unusually brazen, 217 00:13:00,120 --> 00:13:04,240 Speaker 1: not really unusually brazen for given the circumstances from Chuck Schumer. 218 00:13:05,040 --> 00:13:08,280 Speaker 1: But tone duff is probably a better phrase. 219 00:13:08,600 --> 00:13:13,479 Speaker 4: I don't well, I think I think it's another indication 220 00:13:13,760 --> 00:13:15,360 Speaker 4: that Schumer is not running for reelection. 221 00:13:16,200 --> 00:13:20,600 Speaker 5: I think that he is. I think he's just being 222 00:13:20,640 --> 00:13:21,120 Speaker 5: honest here. 223 00:13:21,200 --> 00:13:23,160 Speaker 4: I have many jobs as leader, and one and one 224 00:13:23,240 --> 00:13:25,559 Speaker 4: is to fight for aid to Israel, all the aid 225 00:13:25,640 --> 00:13:27,679 Speaker 4: that Israel needs. I will continue to fight for it. 226 00:13:27,920 --> 00:13:32,160 Speaker 4: That's his authentic, genuine view, like he believes that that 227 00:13:32,320 --> 00:13:34,640 Speaker 4: is that is one of the things that he is 228 00:13:34,960 --> 00:13:38,480 Speaker 4: proudest of in his role as as Democratic leader and 229 00:13:38,720 --> 00:13:41,280 Speaker 4: in his role as a member of the House and 230 00:13:41,320 --> 00:13:46,560 Speaker 4: as a Senator, and certainly at this fundraiser he's going 231 00:13:46,559 --> 00:13:49,280 Speaker 4: to celebrate that. But I do think it's another indication 232 00:13:49,400 --> 00:13:54,320 Speaker 4: that that, you know, he's looking back on his life 233 00:13:54,440 --> 00:13:57,320 Speaker 4: and his achievements rather than thinking. 234 00:13:58,400 --> 00:14:01,560 Speaker 5: He's running forward looking way, Yeah, makes sense. 235 00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:05,360 Speaker 4: If I don't know if AOC is the only one 236 00:14:05,360 --> 00:14:08,360 Speaker 4: that could beat him if he if he does run 237 00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:12,080 Speaker 4: for reelection, I suspect it's possible other people could even 238 00:14:12,679 --> 00:14:14,480 Speaker 4: beat him, but I think that AOC would beat him 239 00:14:14,520 --> 00:14:18,000 Speaker 4: fairly easily at this point. Yeah, because he knows that 240 00:14:18,080 --> 00:14:23,040 Speaker 4: he has thoroughly and completely lost the normy suburban democrats. 241 00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:24,680 Speaker 1: Right, and this is what has won them. 242 00:14:25,000 --> 00:14:29,640 Speaker 4: Yeah, like that that that that would be the political 243 00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:33,840 Speaker 4: environment was nothing that you could have expected five years ago. 244 00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:38,080 Speaker 1: It's watching the views over mom, Donnie. Yeah, right, So Ryan, 245 00:14:38,160 --> 00:14:41,520 Speaker 1: take us meanwhile in Gaza. Take us through some developments 246 00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:44,400 Speaker 1: in Gaza and also some new breaking breaking points. Some 247 00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:45,480 Speaker 1: dropsite reporting on. 248 00:14:45,480 --> 00:14:51,800 Speaker 4: Human Rights Watch, Unice t Rawi, incredible Palestinian reporter obtained 249 00:14:51,840 --> 00:14:57,800 Speaker 4: another just just horrifying video. Not it's not graphic or gruesome, 250 00:14:57,920 --> 00:15:00,120 Speaker 4: it's just genocidally horrifying. 251 00:15:01,120 --> 00:15:03,800 Speaker 5: So this is taking place in Rafa, he writes. 252 00:15:03,920 --> 00:15:07,040 Speaker 4: Israeli troops blew up the Morag water station today, which, 253 00:15:07,040 --> 00:15:09,720 Speaker 4: according to God's water utility, it's applied water to roughly 254 00:15:09,760 --> 00:15:13,160 Speaker 4: one third of Rafa's residents prior to the war. And 255 00:15:14,040 --> 00:15:20,600 Speaker 4: what units consistently finds is the most the most foul 256 00:15:21,240 --> 00:15:25,760 Speaker 4: captions that come along with these videos that the Israeli 257 00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:30,400 Speaker 4: soldiers post themselves and have continued to do for two 258 00:15:30,560 --> 00:15:34,600 Speaker 4: plus years now. At the very beginning, I think a 259 00:15:34,640 --> 00:15:38,600 Speaker 4: lot of sensible people thought, wow, this is really awful 260 00:15:39,040 --> 00:15:43,080 Speaker 4: that the IDF keeps posting evidence of their own genocide 261 00:15:43,080 --> 00:15:48,320 Speaker 4: and brutality, and it's humiliating to Israel's defenders, and the 262 00:15:48,360 --> 00:15:49,880 Speaker 4: IDF is going to put a stop. 263 00:15:49,600 --> 00:15:50,240 Speaker 5: To it like that. 264 00:15:50,280 --> 00:15:52,560 Speaker 4: I think there were you might have even thought that 265 00:15:52,600 --> 00:15:56,440 Speaker 4: at the beginning, like wow, this is some recklessness on 266 00:15:56,480 --> 00:16:00,720 Speaker 4: the part of these soldiers. But the commanders are going 267 00:16:00,760 --> 00:16:03,360 Speaker 4: to get on top of this, and you're going to 268 00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:08,000 Speaker 4: stop seeing these Like if these images are going to 269 00:16:08,040 --> 00:16:10,320 Speaker 4: get out, it's gonna Hamas is going to have to 270 00:16:10,400 --> 00:16:12,880 Speaker 4: like find them on the phones of soldiers or something. 271 00:16:12,880 --> 00:16:16,960 Speaker 4: They're not going to continue to make themselves look like 272 00:16:17,600 --> 00:16:20,360 Speaker 4: a spectacle of evil deliberately. 273 00:16:20,920 --> 00:16:21,960 Speaker 5: And yet here we are. 274 00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:26,880 Speaker 4: More than two years later, they're still posting these types 275 00:16:26,920 --> 00:16:30,440 Speaker 4: of videos. And so the they put the caption they 276 00:16:30,440 --> 00:16:33,760 Speaker 4: put along with the video is we specialize in paint 277 00:16:33,840 --> 00:16:37,960 Speaker 4: jobs and small renovations details on DM. 278 00:16:38,200 --> 00:16:41,840 Speaker 1: I genuinely appreciate the honesty of that. I guess right 279 00:16:41,960 --> 00:16:44,400 Speaker 1: like it's it's so much more honest than continuing to 280 00:16:44,440 --> 00:16:46,600 Speaker 1: say the most moral force that's. 281 00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:48,400 Speaker 4: Ever existed, say we don't hear that much anymore, do 282 00:16:48,480 --> 00:16:52,160 Speaker 4: we the most moral That's interesting. They did, they did 283 00:16:52,200 --> 00:16:56,360 Speaker 4: really sacrifice that for for May what was a year 284 00:16:56,400 --> 00:16:56,840 Speaker 4: we heard that. 285 00:16:57,360 --> 00:17:00,600 Speaker 5: Yeah, that's interesting. It's a good point. 286 00:17:00,600 --> 00:17:03,600 Speaker 4: We don't we don't ever hear the the. 287 00:17:03,560 --> 00:17:04,840 Speaker 5: Most moral army anymore. 288 00:17:05,520 --> 00:17:11,000 Speaker 4: There The situation with access to clean water in in 289 00:17:11,040 --> 00:17:16,159 Speaker 4: Gaza in general is is brutal, and so we we 290 00:17:16,200 --> 00:17:18,440 Speaker 4: had traps had reported that they they blew up gads 291 00:17:18,440 --> 00:17:21,760 Speaker 4: of cities. Right as they were leaving, they burned down 292 00:17:22,200 --> 00:17:25,280 Speaker 4: and blew up gods of cities to its treatment plant. 293 00:17:27,320 --> 00:17:29,240 Speaker 5: And now they're now they blew up this one. 294 00:17:29,240 --> 00:17:33,320 Speaker 4: They also blew up the UNIS had reported for drop 295 00:17:33,320 --> 00:17:36,240 Speaker 4: site that they blew up another one, and also in 296 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:39,560 Speaker 4: Rafa where Rachel Corey. 297 00:17:39,320 --> 00:17:39,920 Speaker 5: Had been killed. 298 00:17:40,600 --> 00:17:46,480 Speaker 4: Actually, back in two thousand and two or three, we 299 00:17:46,520 --> 00:17:53,240 Speaker 4: also had significant significant news out of Human Rights Watch. 300 00:17:53,720 --> 00:17:57,280 Speaker 4: Actually put we can put up three. We'll get to 301 00:17:57,280 --> 00:18:03,679 Speaker 4: that in a second. So Reuters broke broke the news 302 00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:09,720 Speaker 4: that the State's Department and other officials had gotten access 303 00:18:09,760 --> 00:18:14,439 Speaker 4: to northern Gaza early on in the war and had 304 00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:21,840 Speaker 4: put together the most damning and extraordinary evidence you could 305 00:18:21,840 --> 00:18:30,359 Speaker 4: possibly imagine, laying out the utter dystopian carnage, and it 306 00:18:30,440 --> 00:18:35,720 Speaker 4: was blocked by Michael McGirk and other and other States 307 00:18:35,760 --> 00:18:38,880 Speaker 4: Department officials from getting to complete and saying it lacked balance, 308 00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:42,480 Speaker 4: like how do you like one of the details they 309 00:18:42,480 --> 00:18:46,320 Speaker 4: put in there, like you know, the dogs are overweight 310 00:18:47,240 --> 00:18:52,240 Speaker 4: from eating so many corpses, Like how do you balance? 311 00:18:52,320 --> 00:18:52,920 Speaker 5: Like what do you want? 312 00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:56,879 Speaker 4: What's the balance? What's the balance of that detail? Like 313 00:18:58,800 --> 00:19:04,160 Speaker 4: the situation was not balanced. So johnthan Widdall, former official 314 00:19:04,880 --> 00:19:09,680 Speaker 4: pushed out of the UN by Israel by its destruction 315 00:19:09,760 --> 00:19:12,520 Speaker 4: of unra As, has become a journalist. I mean he's 316 00:19:12,520 --> 00:19:15,640 Speaker 4: been done a couple of incredible pieces for drop Site. 317 00:19:16,040 --> 00:19:20,040 Speaker 4: One of them exposes a lot of the photos that 318 00:19:20,119 --> 00:19:22,639 Speaker 4: were taken on that journey. So now you don't have 319 00:19:22,720 --> 00:19:25,160 Speaker 4: to take on that tour of northern Gaza, So now 320 00:19:25,160 --> 00:19:29,560 Speaker 4: you don't have to take the State Department bureaucrats word 321 00:19:30,200 --> 00:19:31,960 Speaker 4: for the devastation that they witnessed. 322 00:19:31,960 --> 00:19:34,200 Speaker 5: You can see the actual photos. 323 00:19:34,200 --> 00:19:36,280 Speaker 4: And it was important for the State Department, the Biden 324 00:19:36,320 --> 00:19:39,000 Speaker 4: State Department, to block that report because if the report 325 00:19:39,040 --> 00:19:42,080 Speaker 4: went through, then there would be legal implications. You'd have 326 00:19:42,119 --> 00:19:44,960 Speaker 4: to stop weapons shipments, you'd have to notify Congress or 327 00:19:45,560 --> 00:19:48,040 Speaker 4: all these different things would kick in, so they had 328 00:19:48,040 --> 00:19:53,920 Speaker 4: to just stop it right there. And then separately, top 329 00:19:54,119 --> 00:19:59,119 Speaker 4: Human Rights Watch official Omar Shakir resigned this week in 330 00:19:59,200 --> 00:20:05,800 Speaker 4: protest of Human Rights Watch squashing some reporting on what. 331 00:20:07,240 --> 00:20:09,000 Speaker 5: What Israel was doing. 332 00:20:08,800 --> 00:20:12,240 Speaker 4: In Gaza and whether or not allowing people to return 333 00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:15,040 Speaker 4: not to return, or broke international law. 334 00:20:15,480 --> 00:20:17,440 Speaker 5: You can read the details at drop side and elsewhere, 335 00:20:19,040 --> 00:20:20,360 Speaker 5: but it goes. 336 00:20:20,160 --> 00:20:23,920 Speaker 4: To this, this this Israeli argument that all of these 337 00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:28,960 Speaker 4: organizations are fundamentally biased against Israel. Human Rights Watch up 338 00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:32,120 Speaker 4: right up there you read what actually goes on inside 339 00:20:32,320 --> 00:20:36,520 Speaker 4: human places like Human Rights Watch. They're absolutely bending over 340 00:20:36,600 --> 00:20:41,879 Speaker 4: backwards to do everything they can to minimize what the 341 00:20:41,920 --> 00:20:44,520 Speaker 4: criticism that they have to dole out. And so the 342 00:20:44,560 --> 00:20:47,760 Speaker 4: criticism that we do get publicly that is the least 343 00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:52,320 Speaker 4: of it. And so this this was Omar Shki is 344 00:20:52,320 --> 00:20:55,520 Speaker 4: somebody who was pretty heavily criticized over the years for 345 00:20:56,480 --> 00:21:01,720 Speaker 4: kind of whitewashing Israeli crimes, and this is his way 346 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:05,440 Speaker 4: of I think saying, yeah, I was fighting as hard 347 00:21:05,440 --> 00:21:08,760 Speaker 4: as I could, Like you were criticizing me from the outside, 348 00:21:08,760 --> 00:21:10,000 Speaker 4: but I was fighting as hard as I could for 349 00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:12,520 Speaker 4: the truth on the inside, and I just feel like 350 00:21:12,560 --> 00:21:13,280 Speaker 4: I cannot. 351 00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:15,080 Speaker 5: I can't do it anymore. 352 00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:17,040 Speaker 4: I can't just because there's always that question like can 353 00:21:17,080 --> 00:21:19,520 Speaker 4: I do more good on the inside of the outside? 354 00:21:19,560 --> 00:21:21,280 Speaker 5: Yeah, totally, And. 355 00:21:22,640 --> 00:21:25,960 Speaker 4: He came to the conclusion that he could no longer 356 00:21:26,160 --> 00:21:31,080 Speaker 4: justify even going along with what they're putting out. 357 00:21:31,680 --> 00:21:34,720 Speaker 1: People can go read this piece on drop site. It's 358 00:21:34,800 --> 00:21:37,320 Speaker 1: a really fascinating glimpse. Great story. 359 00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:41,399 Speaker 4: Ring well, thank you so Up next, we've got the 360 00:21:41,520 --> 00:21:46,480 Speaker 4: Blowback bull Boys, Noah and Brendan, who just returned from Cuba. 361 00:21:49,480 --> 00:21:54,000 Speaker 4: The humanitarian situation in Cuba is spiraling downwards as Trump 362 00:21:54,040 --> 00:21:56,840 Speaker 4: is trying to choke off energy from getting to the 363 00:21:56,840 --> 00:21:59,240 Speaker 4: island to talk about this. We're going to be joined 364 00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:01,720 Speaker 4: by Noah Cool One, who was a co host of 365 00:22:01,800 --> 00:22:05,080 Speaker 4: the Blowback Podcast, as well as joining us from New York. 366 00:22:05,280 --> 00:22:09,440 Speaker 4: Brendan James, the other co host of the Blowback podcast. 367 00:22:10,000 --> 00:22:12,399 Speaker 4: Welcome back to the program. We're having you guys on 368 00:22:12,440 --> 00:22:15,880 Speaker 4: because you just returned from Cuba and so we wanted 369 00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:21,119 Speaker 4: to get an update on the conditions there while you 370 00:22:21,160 --> 00:22:21,560 Speaker 4: were there. 371 00:22:21,760 --> 00:22:24,720 Speaker 5: I believe it was on Thursday, President. 372 00:22:24,320 --> 00:22:31,159 Speaker 4: Trump put out a new executive order, downgrading Cuba further 373 00:22:31,359 --> 00:22:35,560 Speaker 4: into the depths of evilness. Can you describe to us 374 00:22:35,560 --> 00:22:40,600 Speaker 4: what Trump's new executive order is and how what it 375 00:22:40,600 --> 00:22:41,520 Speaker 4: would do and how it was. 376 00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:42,840 Speaker 5: Received while you were there in Cuba? 377 00:22:43,280 --> 00:22:43,600 Speaker 7: Sure? 378 00:22:43,800 --> 00:22:47,120 Speaker 9: So, the situation in Cuba, for those who don't know, 379 00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:51,480 Speaker 9: is that Cuba exists under the gun of an American 380 00:22:51,520 --> 00:22:55,240 Speaker 9: blockade and has for decades. This limits the businesses that 381 00:22:55,280 --> 00:22:57,800 Speaker 9: can do business in Cuba, and it also limits the 382 00:22:57,800 --> 00:23:02,159 Speaker 9: Cuban government's ability to access US basics for its citizenry. 383 00:23:02,680 --> 00:23:05,160 Speaker 9: We're talking about in this case, the most important being 384 00:23:05,200 --> 00:23:08,560 Speaker 9: access to energy. And so this executive order that was 385 00:23:08,560 --> 00:23:13,639 Speaker 9: announced last Thursday was meant to prohibit anybody from doing 386 00:23:13,720 --> 00:23:18,359 Speaker 9: business with Cuba involving the transact involving oil transactions. The 387 00:23:18,480 --> 00:23:21,840 Speaker 9: Cuban electrical grid runs on oil. Cuba is able to 388 00:23:21,880 --> 00:23:24,400 Speaker 9: generate some of its oil, but it needs in order 389 00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:26,200 Speaker 9: to keep the grid functional and to meet the needs 390 00:23:26,200 --> 00:23:29,440 Speaker 9: of its you know, nine million or so population, it 391 00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:33,800 Speaker 9: needs to import oil. And what Trump did was he 392 00:23:33,880 --> 00:23:36,400 Speaker 9: targeted specifically. I mean, he didn't do it by name, 393 00:23:36,800 --> 00:23:39,159 Speaker 9: but this executive order was aimed at Mexico, which in 394 00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:43,960 Speaker 9: recent years has become the primary foreign supplier of Cuba's. 395 00:23:43,560 --> 00:23:45,600 Speaker 5: Oil overcame Venezuela, even. 396 00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:50,720 Speaker 9: Exactly well prior to the Maduro kidnapping earlier or last month. 397 00:23:51,119 --> 00:23:54,399 Speaker 9: And so the executive order said, we are going to 398 00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:57,240 Speaker 9: you know, we're going to do nuclear tariffs on anybody 399 00:23:57,520 --> 00:24:02,480 Speaker 9: who nuclear figurative language here, literal nuclear tariffs on anybody 400 00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:06,760 Speaker 9: who tries to sell oil to Cuba. And the purpose 401 00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:10,399 Speaker 9: of this, which is very explicit, is to choke the 402 00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:13,800 Speaker 9: Cuban population. It is to plunge them into darkness, to 403 00:24:13,880 --> 00:24:15,760 Speaker 9: make it so that they do not have electricity, that 404 00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:18,560 Speaker 9: they do not have the basic means of carrying out 405 00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:21,679 Speaker 9: everyday life. And the goal of that is that it 406 00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:25,560 Speaker 9: will succeed the Americans hope where the last sixty years 407 00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:27,720 Speaker 9: of American policy has not succeeded, and that is to 408 00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:29,280 Speaker 9: bring down the Cuban government. 409 00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:31,840 Speaker 1: Wow. So Bay of Pigs did not go as planned, 410 00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:36,040 Speaker 1: not successful. Unfortunately, it didn't work. But I want to 411 00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:39,080 Speaker 1: get Brendan your reaction to this clip of Trump talking 412 00:24:39,160 --> 00:24:41,399 Speaker 1: about what he thinks might happen next or what he 413 00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:46,200 Speaker 1: thinks he can achieve in terms of the US Cuba relationship. 414 00:24:46,320 --> 00:24:47,320 Speaker 1: Let's roll f one here. 415 00:24:47,680 --> 00:24:50,760 Speaker 6: I want the people that came here that were horribly 416 00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:52,000 Speaker 6: created by Cuba. 417 00:24:51,760 --> 00:24:54,080 Speaker 3: To be taken care of, to be able to go 418 00:24:54,200 --> 00:24:55,760 Speaker 3: back and do what they have to do. 419 00:24:57,000 --> 00:24:58,240 Speaker 5: You know, they have their family there. 420 00:24:58,240 --> 00:24:59,000 Speaker 2: They haven't been able to. 421 00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:03,160 Speaker 6: See him in years, many years. So I think we're 422 00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:04,240 Speaker 6: going to make a deal with Cuba. 423 00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:07,439 Speaker 1: So he thinks he's going to squeeze Cuba into a 424 00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:10,680 Speaker 1: deal that nobody else had been able to achieve before 425 00:25:10,800 --> 00:25:14,040 Speaker 1: reading between the lines of what he's saying there post Venezuela. 426 00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:16,880 Speaker 10: What do you make of it, Brendan, Well, this is 427 00:25:17,160 --> 00:25:19,360 Speaker 10: one of those policies that you can see right now 428 00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:23,800 Speaker 10: that sort of sums up the contradictions in Trump two. 429 00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:29,760 Speaker 10: Because at the top of every statement or order or 430 00:25:30,280 --> 00:25:33,480 Speaker 10: fact sheet, all of which came out with this latest 431 00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:38,800 Speaker 10: move against Mexico providing fuel to Cuba, for example, you 432 00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:42,840 Speaker 10: have the declaration that this is all MAGA, this is 433 00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:45,880 Speaker 10: for the national security interests of the United States, and 434 00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:47,200 Speaker 10: nothing else is more important. 435 00:25:47,200 --> 00:25:48,400 Speaker 5: That's the motivating factor. 436 00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:52,840 Speaker 10: Yet after that point you notice that it's a very 437 00:25:53,359 --> 00:25:59,600 Speaker 10: neo con i would say, Rubio inflected text or policy 438 00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:03,320 Speaker 10: that stresses all of these concerns. For quote unquote, the 439 00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:07,080 Speaker 10: Cuban people, trying to stand up for the Cuban people, 440 00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:10,520 Speaker 10: trying to protect the Cuban people, rescue the Cuban people, 441 00:26:10,520 --> 00:26:13,920 Speaker 10: of course, And I'm not quite sure how one could 442 00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:19,320 Speaker 10: possibly explain how rescuing the Cuban people has anything to 443 00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:25,240 Speaker 10: do with the stated MAGA ideology of putting America first 444 00:26:25,280 --> 00:26:28,399 Speaker 10: and American citizens first. And so when Trump talks about 445 00:26:28,880 --> 00:26:31,040 Speaker 10: people being able to go back and do what they 446 00:26:31,080 --> 00:26:33,640 Speaker 10: want to do in Cuba, of course, there's. 447 00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:34,000 Speaker 5: Really no. 448 00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:39,360 Speaker 10: Idea there about why that's a goal of the United States, 449 00:26:39,640 --> 00:26:44,600 Speaker 10: what form of government the Trump administration wants to see there, 450 00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:48,760 Speaker 10: how that form of government should come about. Certainly, if 451 00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:53,159 Speaker 10: the Cuban government is simply squeezed to collapse, there'll be 452 00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:57,040 Speaker 10: a catastrophe as a result of this policy. One of 453 00:26:57,080 --> 00:27:01,000 Speaker 10: the results, of course, would be a massive influx of 454 00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:04,840 Speaker 10: Cuban immigrants into America, something that you can't really imagine 455 00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:07,560 Speaker 10: being a selling point under the MAGA platform. I'm not 456 00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:09,720 Speaker 10: sure if they really care about that contradiction or not, 457 00:27:10,760 --> 00:27:14,200 Speaker 10: but it's very confusing as soon as you get past 458 00:27:14,320 --> 00:27:18,560 Speaker 10: the sort of typical status quo cliches about and I 459 00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:21,879 Speaker 10: would say neocon cliches that even Trump is saying about 460 00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:25,879 Speaker 10: bringing freedom to an island under communist rule, et cetera. 461 00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:27,240 Speaker 5: Yeah, Noah. 462 00:27:27,320 --> 00:27:30,399 Speaker 4: In that clip, Trump said that they're engaging with the 463 00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:33,159 Speaker 4: Cubans at the highest levels. You've spent a lot of 464 00:27:33,160 --> 00:27:35,080 Speaker 4: time you and Bran V spent a lot of time 465 00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:40,640 Speaker 4: with Cuban officials. In the last week plus. Cuban officials 466 00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:42,920 Speaker 4: publicly have said there. 467 00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:43,800 Speaker 5: Are no talks going on. 468 00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:44,400 Speaker 7: Correct. 469 00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:49,679 Speaker 4: What is your understanding about this explicit assertion from Trump 470 00:27:49,760 --> 00:27:52,880 Speaker 4: that he's in talks with high level Cubans, or that 471 00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:56,200 Speaker 4: the US is in talks with high level Cubans. 472 00:27:55,560 --> 00:27:59,240 Speaker 7: It's a mystery. I think his high level Cuban. 473 00:28:00,119 --> 00:28:04,240 Speaker 9: But yeah, so they may be talking to some Cubans, 474 00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:06,640 Speaker 9: but are they talking to representatives of the Cuban government. 475 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:08,119 Speaker 7: The Cuban government says no. 476 00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:11,800 Speaker 9: The Cuban government has said A senior Cuban minister gave 477 00:28:11,800 --> 00:28:14,520 Speaker 9: an interview to the Associated Press either yesterday or the 478 00:28:14,600 --> 00:28:17,600 Speaker 9: day before, in which he emphasized, listen, we want to 479 00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:19,439 Speaker 9: talk with the Americans. We are desperate to talk with 480 00:28:19,480 --> 00:28:21,200 Speaker 9: the Americans. We want to make a deal, we want 481 00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:23,720 Speaker 9: to have discussions. We want to figure out a way forward. 482 00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:26,720 Speaker 9: It's just that the Americans don't seem to be having 483 00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:29,960 Speaker 9: those conversations regardless of what Trump is saying now. Is 484 00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:32,359 Speaker 9: it possible that Trump is being led down a certain 485 00:28:32,359 --> 00:28:35,480 Speaker 9: path by advisors who have a desired outcome of inflicting 486 00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:37,920 Speaker 9: pain on Cuba, end of trying to topple the government 487 00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:38,880 Speaker 9: no matter what the cost. 488 00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:41,080 Speaker 7: It's possible. 489 00:28:41,400 --> 00:28:43,160 Speaker 9: Is it possible that Trump knows that he's lying. 490 00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:44,120 Speaker 7: That's also possible. 491 00:28:44,440 --> 00:28:47,000 Speaker 9: I think what just seems extremely clear in this moment 492 00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:49,960 Speaker 9: is that there aren't talks going on. I don't think 493 00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:52,320 Speaker 9: that the Cubans would have any incentive to publicly say 494 00:28:52,920 --> 00:28:56,080 Speaker 9: we're not talking with them, or to say we want 495 00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:57,880 Speaker 9: to talk with them, but they're actually talking with them. 496 00:28:58,200 --> 00:28:59,400 Speaker 7: It just doesn't make sense to me. 497 00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:01,959 Speaker 4: I wanted to put up when we can add this 498 00:29:02,240 --> 00:29:05,200 Speaker 4: in posts speaking of Cubans. Maria el Viros Salazar is 499 00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:09,600 Speaker 4: a Cuban American congressman from South Florida. Read what she 500 00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:13,120 Speaker 4: said on Twitter recently and then get your response to 501 00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:15,760 Speaker 4: it based on the conditions that you've seen. So she writes, 502 00:29:15,800 --> 00:29:20,000 Speaker 4: because this is really an extraordinary statement that she put out, 503 00:29:20,040 --> 00:29:22,959 Speaker 4: and you'll see whise I read it. She says, the 504 00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:24,720 Speaker 4: hour of Cuba's freedom has arrived. 505 00:29:24,960 --> 00:29:25,320 Speaker 5: Today. 506 00:29:25,360 --> 00:29:27,760 Speaker 4: We have a president and a Secretary of State determined 507 00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:31,760 Speaker 4: to cleanse our hemisphere of tyrants, drug traffickers, and dictators. 508 00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:35,720 Speaker 4: But the exile community also bears a historic responsibility to 509 00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:39,400 Speaker 4: stop giving oxygen to the dictatorship, because every dollar, every trip, 510 00:29:39,440 --> 00:29:42,400 Speaker 4: and every gesture of false normalcy prolongs the life of 511 00:29:42,440 --> 00:29:45,120 Speaker 4: a criminal regime and condemns the Cuban people to another 512 00:29:45,160 --> 00:29:48,400 Speaker 4: sixty years of misery, repression, and slavery. This is the 513 00:29:48,440 --> 00:29:52,840 Speaker 4: moment to stop everything. No more tourism, no more remittances, 514 00:29:53,160 --> 00:29:57,000 Speaker 4: no more mechanisms that continue to finance and sustain the dictatorship. 515 00:29:57,480 --> 00:30:01,200 Speaker 4: And yes, she says, I understand it's devastating to think 516 00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:04,720 Speaker 4: about a mother's hunger, a child who needs immediate help. 517 00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:08,200 Speaker 4: No one is indifferent to that pain. But that is 518 00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:12,440 Speaker 4: precisely the brutal dilemma we face as exiles. To alleviate 519 00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:17,040 Speaker 4: short term suffering or to free Cuba forever. We can 520 00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:20,520 Speaker 4: no longer continue being hostages of a regime that, even 521 00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:23,720 Speaker 4: from exile, forces us to finance our own oppression. In 522 00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:28,120 Speaker 4: the regime's final hour, the exile community must choose freedom, 523 00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:32,680 Speaker 4: so Brendan, she's explicitly calling for a mother's hunger and 524 00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:35,560 Speaker 4: a child who needs immediate help to be refused that 525 00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:41,160 Speaker 4: help to put pressure on the government to fall. What 526 00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:44,000 Speaker 4: did you see on the ground has been the effect 527 00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:44,920 Speaker 4: of this. 528 00:30:46,480 --> 00:30:48,040 Speaker 5: Strategy. 529 00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:50,880 Speaker 10: Well, if the goal is to, as they used to say, 530 00:30:51,920 --> 00:30:54,280 Speaker 10: destroy or burn down the village to save it, as 531 00:30:54,280 --> 00:30:57,280 Speaker 10: she seems to be describing there, I would say she's 532 00:30:57,320 --> 00:31:01,520 Speaker 10: getting that hunger. She's squeezing the life out of the 533 00:31:01,720 --> 00:31:06,640 Speaker 10: island every day. When I was there in twenty twenty two, 534 00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:09,880 Speaker 10: it was certainly not good times for Cuba. By then, 535 00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:13,360 Speaker 10: Trump in his first term, had passed over two hundred 536 00:31:13,440 --> 00:31:17,880 Speaker 10: new sanctions on top of the existing blockade, which has 537 00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:19,680 Speaker 10: been in effect for the better part of a century. 538 00:31:20,520 --> 00:31:24,479 Speaker 10: But I honestly, I had been around Havana, I'd been 539 00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:26,400 Speaker 10: around other parts of the country. I'm not going to 540 00:31:26,400 --> 00:31:28,680 Speaker 10: say I was over every square inch of Cuba. But 541 00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:32,320 Speaker 10: I didn't see homeless people. I didn't see beggars. I 542 00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:36,560 Speaker 10: didn't really experience any blackouts electrical blackouts which are now 543 00:31:37,040 --> 00:31:42,200 Speaker 10: quite common. Maybe some happened while I was either out 544 00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:47,280 Speaker 10: and about or sleep or something. These days and within 545 00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:50,120 Speaker 10: the past week, I would say no, and I probably 546 00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:54,840 Speaker 10: had power less often than when we didn't have power. 547 00:31:55,800 --> 00:31:59,480 Speaker 10: Some of the blackouts are scheduled, some are unscheduled. They're 548 00:31:59,520 --> 00:32:02,360 Speaker 10: trying to wrap out this fuel and this electricity best 549 00:32:02,360 --> 00:32:06,640 Speaker 10: they can. We did see people begging. I would think 550 00:32:06,680 --> 00:32:10,280 Speaker 10: some of them were homeless or near it. And just 551 00:32:10,360 --> 00:32:14,960 Speaker 10: the conversations you had, you know, compared everything to what 552 00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:17,400 Speaker 10: is known as the Special Period, which was the period 553 00:32:17,520 --> 00:32:19,920 Speaker 10: in the nineteen nineties after the Soviet Union, which had 554 00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:23,480 Speaker 10: always supported Cuba quite heavily with all kinds of aid. 555 00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:26,000 Speaker 10: Of course, the Soviet Union collapsed and Cuba was left 556 00:32:26,040 --> 00:32:28,400 Speaker 10: to fend for itself. It survived the Special Period at 557 00:32:28,400 --> 00:32:31,040 Speaker 10: great cost. But most people would tell you now in Cuba, 558 00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:35,200 Speaker 10: this is worse. They'll have to come up with an 559 00:32:35,200 --> 00:32:43,320 Speaker 10: equally sort of arresting phrase to describe the incredibly difficult and. 560 00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:46,320 Speaker 5: Sort of apocalyptic. 561 00:32:45,680 --> 00:32:48,120 Speaker 10: Conditions that seem to be creeping in every day the 562 00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:52,400 Speaker 10: way they did for the nineteen nineties, because this is worse, and. 563 00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:55,880 Speaker 1: They don't have a one guido in Cuba, and they don't. 564 00:32:55,720 --> 00:32:56,840 Speaker 5: See no unfortunate for them. 565 00:32:56,840 --> 00:32:58,680 Speaker 1: They don't well, this is what I was going to ask, 566 00:32:58,800 --> 00:33:01,600 Speaker 1: is if they're what since you got the Cuban right? 567 00:33:01,680 --> 00:33:03,560 Speaker 1: Because I'm joking about the Bay of Pigs before. But 568 00:33:03,640 --> 00:33:05,680 Speaker 1: this has always been the idea that there's a sleeper 569 00:33:05,760 --> 00:33:11,360 Speaker 1: cell of pro American, pro lowercase deeds democratic Cubans waiting 570 00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:15,280 Speaker 1: to overcome the regime that will rise up if you 571 00:33:15,320 --> 00:33:19,080 Speaker 1: squeeze Cuba enough, if you make enough mothers hungry, it'll 572 00:33:19,160 --> 00:33:21,920 Speaker 1: just all fall like a house of cards at some point. 573 00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:23,440 Speaker 1: So I don't know which of you wants to take that. 574 00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:25,040 Speaker 1: But when you were on the ground, did you get 575 00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:28,800 Speaker 1: a sense of what the state of the Cuban right is? 576 00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:31,960 Speaker 1: Is it emboldened, is it ready to go? Is it big? 577 00:33:32,120 --> 00:33:34,240 Speaker 1: Is it small? What did you make of that? 578 00:33:35,120 --> 00:33:37,360 Speaker 9: We got a limited perspective when we were in Cuba 579 00:33:37,400 --> 00:33:39,680 Speaker 9: into these So I don't want to make I don't 580 00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:41,720 Speaker 9: want to get ahead of our skis here, but I 581 00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:44,640 Speaker 9: would say that, you know, we see every day on 582 00:33:44,720 --> 00:33:49,479 Speaker 9: social media the American diplomat, like the most senior diploma 583 00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:52,200 Speaker 9: American diplomat who is still in Cuba, a guy named 584 00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:54,280 Speaker 9: Mike Hammer who has made it his mission to go 585 00:33:54,320 --> 00:33:57,479 Speaker 9: around on advertise on social media that he is, you know, 586 00:33:57,600 --> 00:33:59,880 Speaker 9: engaging with the free Cubans, and he is, you know, 587 00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:02,719 Speaker 9: and he is uh, you know, dialoguing with them and 588 00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:05,200 Speaker 9: showing that people are are ready and tired for this, 589 00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:06,920 Speaker 9: you know, tired of this government and ready for it 590 00:34:06,960 --> 00:34:09,319 Speaker 9: to come down and so forth. And I do not 591 00:34:09,400 --> 00:34:11,799 Speaker 9: find the video evidence that he is putting out to 592 00:34:11,840 --> 00:34:14,480 Speaker 9: be all that persuasive, and if anything, it is generating 593 00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:18,839 Speaker 9: something of a backlash. I think the American strategy here 594 00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:21,600 Speaker 9: is not which is not to win hearts and minds, 595 00:34:21,600 --> 00:34:24,320 Speaker 9: but rather the opposite, which is to inflict an enormous 596 00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:28,040 Speaker 9: amount of suffering in the hope that something happens. It's 597 00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:30,760 Speaker 9: the kind of strategy that gets pursued when there isn't 598 00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:32,880 Speaker 9: a strong right, when there isn't a group, when there 599 00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:35,200 Speaker 9: isn't a horse that you can back. It's the kind 600 00:34:35,239 --> 00:34:38,440 Speaker 9: of it's before we had germ theory. I know that 601 00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:41,160 Speaker 9: there were attitudes and beliefs that you could just sort 602 00:34:41,160 --> 00:34:43,919 Speaker 9: of that that that diseases and viruses and so forth 603 00:34:43,960 --> 00:34:46,920 Speaker 9: spontaneously arose. And that seems to be the kind of 604 00:34:47,520 --> 00:34:50,440 Speaker 9: theory of democracy that these people are espousing, which is 605 00:34:50,440 --> 00:34:54,600 Speaker 9: that well, if we just inflict enough pain spontaneously, there 606 00:34:54,600 --> 00:34:57,120 Speaker 9: will be something that emerges, you know, a military faction 607 00:34:57,239 --> 00:34:59,120 Speaker 9: or some other thing it. You know, that's what their 608 00:34:59,120 --> 00:35:01,319 Speaker 9: hope is, but the evidence for it is not there. 609 00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:04,800 Speaker 9: All that is happening is that they are inflicting enormous 610 00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:08,800 Speaker 9: human suffering. I mean the you know, to give another 611 00:35:08,840 --> 00:35:11,040 Speaker 9: example that has sat with me for a few days, 612 00:35:11,080 --> 00:35:13,160 Speaker 9: we spend a bunch of time with different Cuban journalists, 613 00:35:13,160 --> 00:35:15,959 Speaker 9: some wonderful people who inflated with a group called Belly 614 00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:17,840 Speaker 9: of the Beast, whose work you can check out online 615 00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:18,920 Speaker 9: English language stuff. 616 00:35:18,920 --> 00:35:19,520 Speaker 7: It's terrific. 617 00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:22,000 Speaker 9: And one member of the Belly of the Beast was 618 00:35:22,040 --> 00:35:24,600 Speaker 9: talking about how, you know, the government gives his family, 619 00:35:24,840 --> 00:35:27,280 Speaker 9: which lives in a more rural area of fuel allotment 620 00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:29,920 Speaker 9: so that they can have gas to cook with, and 621 00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:34,000 Speaker 9: that allotment route last arrived, he believed, last August, and 622 00:35:34,040 --> 00:35:35,919 Speaker 9: so it means that they've been cooking with and using 623 00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:38,440 Speaker 9: wood for fuel, and you know, they're preparing, you know, 624 00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:40,480 Speaker 9: millions of people on that island are preparing for a 625 00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:43,080 Speaker 9: similar reality all over in which they're going to have 626 00:35:43,120 --> 00:35:45,040 Speaker 9: to essentially go back. They're going to have to they're 627 00:35:45,080 --> 00:35:46,480 Speaker 9: going to have to live as if lives have been 628 00:35:46,520 --> 00:35:49,480 Speaker 9: dedeveloped by a century or more to simply get through 629 00:35:49,520 --> 00:35:49,960 Speaker 9: the day. 630 00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:51,920 Speaker 1: That's the question is if they have a Delcia Rodriguez. 631 00:35:53,520 --> 00:35:56,320 Speaker 4: Well, right, the problem probably is that the Cuban president 632 00:35:56,360 --> 00:35:59,920 Speaker 4: isn't fame enough, famous enough to give Trump like Rubio, 633 00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:02,120 Speaker 4: scolars of them replace him. 634 00:36:02,239 --> 00:36:05,359 Speaker 9: I'll give you one other example to the question about 635 00:36:05,360 --> 00:36:06,719 Speaker 9: also how people. 636 00:36:06,440 --> 00:36:08,000 Speaker 7: May be feeling. Brendon and I. 637 00:36:08,040 --> 00:36:11,279 Speaker 9: When we were there, we witnessed and saw the march 638 00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:14,080 Speaker 9: of the Torches, which is celebrating the you know, the 639 00:36:14,680 --> 00:36:19,560 Speaker 9: centenary of the great Cuban patriot, Jose Marti. And it 640 00:36:19,719 --> 00:36:22,120 Speaker 9: was it's in honor of a march that Fidel Castro 641 00:36:22,280 --> 00:36:25,960 Speaker 9: and his comrades made at the University of Havana, a 642 00:36:26,080 --> 00:36:28,960 Speaker 9: night torchlit march down to the seawall, the mal Kon. 643 00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:32,319 Speaker 9: And when we were there, we saw, you know, at 644 00:36:32,320 --> 00:36:35,160 Speaker 9: the head of this procession the President of Cuba, Miguel 645 00:36:35,200 --> 00:36:37,959 Speaker 9: Diaz Canal. Now I'm not saying that the guy didn't 646 00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:40,520 Speaker 9: have protection. I'm not saying they didn't have bodyguards somewhere, 647 00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:42,720 Speaker 9: or that there wasn't the equivalent of Cuban secret service 648 00:36:42,760 --> 00:36:46,080 Speaker 9: officers and planes closed stationed around. But I'm telling you 649 00:36:46,160 --> 00:36:48,799 Speaker 9: that this guy was surrounded without the kind of any 650 00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:50,719 Speaker 9: of the sort of protection that even the most you know, 651 00:36:51,080 --> 00:36:55,239 Speaker 9: junior member of Congress seems to have these days, you know, 652 00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:59,200 Speaker 9: walking in a crowd of thousands, completely unbothered, completely confident, 653 00:36:59,239 --> 00:37:02,440 Speaker 9: completely protect it. And I think that, you know, again, 654 00:37:02,880 --> 00:37:06,520 Speaker 9: I would be I'm not interested in making any like, 655 00:37:06,880 --> 00:37:11,840 Speaker 9: you know, crazy categorical declarative statements about the attitudes of 656 00:37:11,840 --> 00:37:14,960 Speaker 9: every individual Cuban and so forth. But I do believe that, 657 00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:17,600 Speaker 9: you know, what I saw there is some indication that, yeah. 658 00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:18,960 Speaker 7: This is not an island that is ready to eat 659 00:37:19,000 --> 00:37:19,800 Speaker 7: its own leadership. 660 00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:24,480 Speaker 4: Yeah, the island nature of cubas presenting a real dilemma 661 00:37:24,520 --> 00:37:27,200 Speaker 4: for it here. So I grew up on the eastern 662 00:37:27,239 --> 00:37:29,359 Speaker 4: shore of Maryland, and we would go camping on this 663 00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:32,919 Speaker 4: island called Daftil Island, very sick Cuba of the tube 664 00:37:32,960 --> 00:37:36,359 Speaker 4: of the Middlelandic like tenth of a mile wide and 665 00:37:36,400 --> 00:37:39,200 Speaker 4: a quarter of a mile long. We do like three 666 00:37:39,440 --> 00:37:41,120 Speaker 4: three nights out there, and when we would get there, 667 00:37:41,120 --> 00:37:46,040 Speaker 4: there'd be fallen you know, wood everywhere, and after three 668 00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:51,319 Speaker 4: days of campfires, you could just visibly see that the 669 00:37:51,400 --> 00:37:56,160 Speaker 4: island couldn't have couldn't support us much longer, Like you're 670 00:37:56,200 --> 00:37:58,480 Speaker 4: running low, it's pretty soon you'd have to start actually 671 00:37:58,480 --> 00:37:59,680 Speaker 4: like chopping trees down. 672 00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:02,360 Speaker 5: And it was a real kind. 673 00:38:02,239 --> 00:38:07,759 Speaker 4: Of visual and experiential like reckoning with the limits of 674 00:38:07,840 --> 00:38:10,440 Speaker 4: resources that we don't get in the United States in general, 675 00:38:10,760 --> 00:38:13,919 Speaker 4: because we go to the grocery store, we bring groceries home. 676 00:38:14,560 --> 00:38:16,200 Speaker 4: Next time we go to the grocery store, it's filled 677 00:38:16,239 --> 00:38:20,960 Speaker 4: with groceries again, mm hmm. If you cut off oil 678 00:38:21,440 --> 00:38:25,040 Speaker 4: to nine million people, like what is what is that 679 00:38:25,080 --> 00:38:27,160 Speaker 4: going to do in the in the short even the 680 00:38:27,200 --> 00:38:32,560 Speaker 4: short term, Like I imagine the you know, blackouts that 681 00:38:32,560 --> 00:38:36,040 Speaker 4: you're seeing now have to pretty soon become total blackouts, 682 00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:38,680 Speaker 4: and then what does that do for what is supposed 683 00:38:38,680 --> 00:38:40,400 Speaker 4: to be a modern society. 684 00:38:40,960 --> 00:38:44,319 Speaker 10: I think anyone can ask themselves that question about as 685 00:38:44,320 --> 00:38:46,960 Speaker 10: as you're talking about Ryan, just apply it to your 686 00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:50,759 Speaker 10: own life. Think about every time you need to get 687 00:38:50,800 --> 00:38:52,960 Speaker 10: in the car, every time you need to switch on 688 00:38:52,960 --> 00:38:56,120 Speaker 10: the light, every time you need to use the internet. 689 00:38:56,520 --> 00:38:59,799 Speaker 10: It's the question almost answers itself in that it is 690 00:38:59,840 --> 00:39:01,919 Speaker 10: a a. 691 00:39:01,880 --> 00:39:03,600 Speaker 5: True crisis of. 692 00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:09,440 Speaker 10: The kind that I think the Cubans have survived with 693 00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:13,520 Speaker 10: great creativity and quite a bit of grace since that 694 00:39:13,600 --> 00:39:18,520 Speaker 10: special period to different degrees that no one, by the way, 695 00:39:18,520 --> 00:39:20,680 Speaker 10: in America would ever accept. I mean the fact we're 696 00:39:20,719 --> 00:39:23,200 Speaker 10: asking this question, Gee, what would happen if the entire 697 00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:26,000 Speaker 10: island of Cuba and its millions of inhabitants just had 698 00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:28,759 Speaker 10: to do without oil for example, I mean something as 699 00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:32,000 Speaker 10: central as that. No American, no one of any nationality, 700 00:39:32,040 --> 00:39:35,400 Speaker 10: would ever accept this question, being though you ask it 701 00:39:35,440 --> 00:39:40,040 Speaker 10: with good intentions, a hypothetical that another government would be 702 00:39:40,040 --> 00:39:45,879 Speaker 10: inflicting on its society. And for all of this, I mean, 703 00:39:46,000 --> 00:39:48,560 Speaker 10: we were talking a little while ago why this could 704 00:39:48,600 --> 00:39:52,919 Speaker 10: possibly be happening. Maybe a boiler played answer that conservatives 705 00:39:53,040 --> 00:39:55,640 Speaker 10: or the exiles or President Trump would give. As you know, 706 00:39:55,640 --> 00:39:58,000 Speaker 10: we need a more cooperative Cuba. It's all fine and 707 00:39:58,040 --> 00:40:00,920 Speaker 10: good to talk about sovereignty, but you know that this 708 00:40:01,000 --> 00:40:03,919 Speaker 10: is an island that's just never never been oriented toward 709 00:40:04,440 --> 00:40:07,239 Speaker 10: the United States in any way. Well, I mean, if 710 00:40:07,280 --> 00:40:09,840 Speaker 10: they want to partner, we've had Cuba as a partner recently. 711 00:40:10,080 --> 00:40:13,279 Speaker 10: It's good for Cuba to have fuel and electricity when, 712 00:40:13,320 --> 00:40:16,160 Speaker 10: for example, it works with the US Coast Guard to 713 00:40:16,200 --> 00:40:19,920 Speaker 10: prevent drug trafficking, which is which is a cooperation that 714 00:40:19,960 --> 00:40:22,320 Speaker 10: has happened in the very recent past, and Cuba was 715 00:40:22,360 --> 00:40:26,920 Speaker 10: considered and its forces were considered one of the best 716 00:40:26,960 --> 00:40:31,080 Speaker 10: examples of a non corrupt task force in that regard. 717 00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:35,880 Speaker 10: If the Trump administration and the President is so worried 718 00:40:35,880 --> 00:40:39,120 Speaker 10: about as we keep hearing about narco traffickers, this and that, 719 00:40:39,239 --> 00:40:43,279 Speaker 10: all that kind of activity in our hemisphere, it's very 720 00:40:43,280 --> 00:40:46,040 Speaker 10: puzzling as to why we want to shut down Cuba's 721 00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:49,640 Speaker 10: electricity and deprive it of fuel and not work with it, 722 00:40:49,719 --> 00:40:54,719 Speaker 10: let alone block, hate it, and try to destroy its government. So, 723 00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:59,480 Speaker 10: I mean, obviously would be disastrous if this situation is 724 00:40:59,480 --> 00:40:59,960 Speaker 10: not reversed. 725 00:41:00,600 --> 00:41:01,799 Speaker 5: A lot of people that are hoping that. 726 00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:05,319 Speaker 10: Mexico has a you know, the shine Bomb is good 727 00:41:05,360 --> 00:41:09,120 Speaker 10: with with Trump, good good at negotiating with Trump, and 728 00:41:09,200 --> 00:41:11,480 Speaker 10: I think oftentimes getting the better of him. And they're 729 00:41:11,520 --> 00:41:14,919 Speaker 10: really hoping that at the very least the status quo 730 00:41:15,400 --> 00:41:18,600 Speaker 10: can be maintained rather than another lurch into this sort 731 00:41:18,600 --> 00:41:21,920 Speaker 10: of backwardness imposed backwardness by the United States. 732 00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:26,000 Speaker 1: I think patro got advice from Shinebomb yesterday and began 733 00:41:26,080 --> 00:41:28,800 Speaker 1: a very friendly meeting with Trump yesterday. No, can I 734 00:41:28,800 --> 00:41:30,640 Speaker 1: get you to walk us through this slideshow. This is 735 00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:33,759 Speaker 1: going to be f two some pictures here and feel 736 00:41:33,800 --> 00:41:36,200 Speaker 1: free to telecontroller when you want to move from one 737 00:41:36,239 --> 00:41:38,000 Speaker 1: picture to the other, but yeah, walk us through those. 738 00:41:38,200 --> 00:41:41,120 Speaker 9: So we brend and I were greatly honored. We were 739 00:41:41,160 --> 00:41:43,759 Speaker 9: invited to give a talk at the Casadilla samri Cus, 740 00:41:43,920 --> 00:41:47,799 Speaker 9: which is a major influence in Latin American literature, and thought, 741 00:41:47,920 --> 00:41:49,359 Speaker 9: that's actually that photo is. 742 00:41:49,560 --> 00:41:51,920 Speaker 7: We went to a memorial and that's brendan outside of. 743 00:41:51,840 --> 00:41:54,040 Speaker 9: It called Memorial de la d Nuncia, which is a 744 00:41:54,520 --> 00:41:57,480 Speaker 9: museum dedicated to showcasing. That's the towards late mark, but 745 00:41:57,480 --> 00:42:03,279 Speaker 9: the memoryal de Lnuzia showcases the American aggression, all the 746 00:42:03,320 --> 00:42:07,240 Speaker 9: acts of terrorism committed against Cuba supported by the American government, 747 00:42:07,680 --> 00:42:11,000 Speaker 9: and that that floor I thought was particularly moving. 748 00:42:11,040 --> 00:42:12,080 Speaker 7: For anybody in the US. 749 00:42:11,960 --> 00:42:14,680 Speaker 9: Who's been to a Holocaust museum, a common motif is 750 00:42:14,719 --> 00:42:17,480 Speaker 9: to play shoes and close out on the floor to 751 00:42:17,719 --> 00:42:19,640 Speaker 9: you know, illustrate and give a sense of the scope 752 00:42:19,640 --> 00:42:23,719 Speaker 9: of suffering there and to then see also like just 753 00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:26,600 Speaker 9: the sheer number of munitions that Americans have thrown at 754 00:42:26,640 --> 00:42:29,280 Speaker 9: Cuba over many, many years, and it hasn't been successful 755 00:42:29,280 --> 00:42:29,960 Speaker 9: with something. 756 00:42:29,680 --> 00:42:31,640 Speaker 1: Else, presimpably a government museum. 757 00:42:31,840 --> 00:42:33,399 Speaker 7: Oh yes, yeah it was. 758 00:42:33,480 --> 00:42:36,759 Speaker 9: It was very much a government museum, but the it 759 00:42:36,880 --> 00:42:39,239 Speaker 9: was also I mean in these other photos are again 760 00:42:39,280 --> 00:42:43,120 Speaker 9: more images from the march that I was discussing earlier. 761 00:42:44,480 --> 00:42:45,360 Speaker 5: Are good photographers? 762 00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:49,239 Speaker 7: Uh well, Brandon is that one? Isn't that a good one? 763 00:42:49,600 --> 00:42:50,280 Speaker 1: How was the singer? 764 00:42:50,920 --> 00:42:51,319 Speaker 10: That shot? 765 00:42:51,400 --> 00:42:52,600 Speaker 1: Took hours to set up? 766 00:42:53,920 --> 00:42:55,520 Speaker 7: And those are some of the photos that we took. 767 00:42:55,560 --> 00:42:58,560 Speaker 9: I mean, there's a it's it's and we answered Q 768 00:42:58,640 --> 00:43:01,720 Speaker 9: and A from different folks in the crowd there. Learned 769 00:43:01,760 --> 00:43:04,240 Speaker 9: that there were even listeners to blowback podcasts in Cuba, 770 00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:05,959 Speaker 9: which was really quite fun. 771 00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:07,640 Speaker 5: Yeah. 772 00:43:07,760 --> 00:43:09,879 Speaker 9: I mean we met with a lot of different kinds 773 00:43:09,920 --> 00:43:11,760 Speaker 9: of people there. We went on a few different tours, 774 00:43:12,120 --> 00:43:15,960 Speaker 9: but you know, we met with different journalists, had conversations, 775 00:43:16,120 --> 00:43:18,520 Speaker 9: you know, struck up random conversations with people on the street. 776 00:43:19,480 --> 00:43:22,360 Speaker 9: We did not have somebody, you know, trailing our movements 777 00:43:22,440 --> 00:43:23,759 Speaker 9: all twenty four So you know, this. 778 00:43:23,760 --> 00:43:25,120 Speaker 1: Is the image. 779 00:43:25,360 --> 00:43:27,000 Speaker 7: Yeah, well that's fair, but. 780 00:43:27,040 --> 00:43:31,040 Speaker 9: I really think that they probably had better things to 781 00:43:31,080 --> 00:43:36,680 Speaker 9: do than to follow us around. But they really again, 782 00:43:36,760 --> 00:43:38,960 Speaker 9: this is the there's an image that has conveyed in 783 00:43:39,000 --> 00:43:42,680 Speaker 9: American culture of Cuba, not just as an authoritarian state, 784 00:43:42,760 --> 00:43:44,319 Speaker 9: not just as a one party state, not just as 785 00:43:44,320 --> 00:43:47,160 Speaker 9: a communist state, but as a totalitarian state that seeks 786 00:43:47,239 --> 00:43:51,360 Speaker 9: to control and program down to the most minute level. 787 00:43:51,840 --> 00:43:53,600 Speaker 9: The lives of all the people who lived there, and 788 00:43:53,600 --> 00:43:55,759 Speaker 9: what we saw in the encounters that we had there 789 00:43:55,800 --> 00:43:57,080 Speaker 9: just suggest that's just not true. 790 00:43:57,760 --> 00:43:59,440 Speaker 7: Not that that kind of thing is really possible in 791 00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:01,960 Speaker 7: almost any to be fair, but it certainly was not 792 00:44:02,000 --> 00:44:02,760 Speaker 7: the case in Cuba. 793 00:44:04,120 --> 00:44:07,040 Speaker 5: Well, where can people find blowback? 794 00:44:08,080 --> 00:44:11,359 Speaker 9: Blowback wherever you get your podcasts. We have a new 795 00:44:11,400 --> 00:44:14,640 Speaker 9: season currently airing. It's actually partly the story of Cuba, 796 00:44:14,680 --> 00:44:16,840 Speaker 9: but it is also the story of Angolan independence in 797 00:44:16,880 --> 00:44:19,920 Speaker 9: the fight against apartheid, primarily in the seventies and eighties, 798 00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:22,719 Speaker 9: and it is releasing weekly new episodes every Monday. We 799 00:44:22,800 --> 00:44:26,000 Speaker 9: got two more episodes left in this season, and you 800 00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:28,279 Speaker 9: can get it, like I said, wherever you get your podcasts. 801 00:44:28,600 --> 00:44:31,320 Speaker 9: And we also have for those who become paying subscribers 802 00:44:31,360 --> 00:44:33,799 Speaker 9: at Blowback dot Show, we have a season coming up, 803 00:44:33,880 --> 00:44:36,399 Speaker 9: or a mini series rather coming out the spring, about 804 00:44:36,400 --> 00:44:39,040 Speaker 9: the history of the US Israel relationship, in addition to 805 00:44:39,120 --> 00:44:42,920 Speaker 9: another full season somewhere else in Latin America later this year. 806 00:44:43,000 --> 00:44:46,640 Speaker 5: And Emily, you made Phil listen to the Angola one. 807 00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:48,080 Speaker 1: What did he think, Well, we'll have to have Phil 808 00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:53,480 Speaker 1: on sometime. He had some notes. I'm hooked though, I'm 809 00:44:53,480 --> 00:44:55,680 Speaker 1: hooked one of the many things ran Grim has gonna 810 00:44:55,680 --> 00:44:58,400 Speaker 1: be hooked on. Not drugs. Don't do drugs, just say no. 811 00:44:59,400 --> 00:45:01,040 Speaker 1: Thanks guys, thank you, thank you. 812 00:45:01,880 --> 00:45:05,080 Speaker 4: That does it for us today. Thank you everybody, Thank you, Emily, 813 00:45:05,520 --> 00:45:06,279 Speaker 4: see you again soon. 814 00:45:06,360 --> 00:45:10,759 Speaker 1: Thank you, Ryan, so your your gratitude is confounding. This 815 00:45:10,840 --> 00:45:14,160 Speaker 1: is just contay grateful today. Likewise, we're grateful for all 816 00:45:14,160 --> 00:45:15,839 Speaker 1: of you. Thank you so much for tuning in. We'll 817 00:45:15,880 --> 00:45:17,040 Speaker 1: see you back here soon with more