1
00:00:05,120 --> 00:00:08,080
Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha. I don't go to Stephane.

2
00:00:08,080 --> 00:00:20,280
Speaker 1: Never told your protection to I Heart Radio. Samantha. Did

3
00:00:20,320 --> 00:00:22,200
Speaker 1: you have a favorite toy growing up or one that

4
00:00:22,239 --> 00:00:25,720
Speaker 1: comes to mind that was really important in your childhood? Yeah,

5
00:00:25,840 --> 00:00:29,360
Speaker 1: so I actually still have it today. It's my blue

6
00:00:29,560 --> 00:00:34,400
Speaker 1: teddy bear named Blooper. Because I have no imagination. I

7
00:00:34,440 --> 00:00:38,240
Speaker 1: like it and I loved it because it was reminiscent

8
00:00:38,320 --> 00:00:40,199
Speaker 1: of a toy that was sent to me by my

9
00:00:40,240 --> 00:00:43,680
Speaker 1: adoptive parents when I was in the orphanage and Korea,

10
00:00:43,840 --> 00:00:46,840
Speaker 1: and before I traveled to the U S. Someone stole

11
00:00:46,880 --> 00:00:48,800
Speaker 1: it and so I wasn't able to bring it back

12
00:00:48,800 --> 00:00:51,559
Speaker 1: with me. But when I was here, someone gifted me

13
00:00:52,400 --> 00:00:54,880
Speaker 1: similar doll that was blue, so that one day sent

14
00:00:54,920 --> 00:00:57,279
Speaker 1: me was yellow. I did not have a name for that,

15
00:00:58,680 --> 00:01:01,560
Speaker 1: but then came here and so that became the one

16
00:01:01,600 --> 00:01:04,160
Speaker 1: toy that I actually really really liked. And I will

17
00:01:04,200 --> 00:01:05,920
Speaker 1: say I didn't have a lot of toys, and I

18
00:01:06,040 --> 00:01:10,080
Speaker 1: wasn't forced myself to like dolls into natty bears like that.

19
00:01:10,120 --> 00:01:12,000
Speaker 1: I tried to really get into that because that's what

20
00:01:12,120 --> 00:01:14,360
Speaker 1: children are supposed to do. But yeah, this is one

21
00:01:14,360 --> 00:01:17,440
Speaker 1: of the ones that that is most sentimental to me. Yeah,

22
00:01:17,680 --> 00:01:22,240
Speaker 1: I had something kind of similar is a really important

23
00:01:22,840 --> 00:01:25,120
Speaker 1: stepped animal because of it. When I went away to

24
00:01:25,160 --> 00:01:27,199
Speaker 1: college and I started traveling a lot and I wasn't

25
00:01:27,240 --> 00:01:30,360
Speaker 1: home that much of my dad gave me this little

26
00:01:30,400 --> 00:01:33,760
Speaker 1: bear that said someone uh and the Wanaga loves you.

27
00:01:34,520 --> 00:01:40,920
Speaker 1: And it got destroyed by one of our dogs. And

28
00:01:40,959 --> 00:01:44,039
Speaker 1: it happened to coincide with when my dad and my

29
00:01:44,160 --> 00:01:46,760
Speaker 1: relationship really fell apart, and I was like really vindictive

30
00:01:46,760 --> 00:01:52,400
Speaker 1: about it, and now it just makes me sad. Oh wow, Yeah,

31
00:01:52,560 --> 00:01:55,640
Speaker 1: but I was really into I loved my little ponies,

32
00:01:55,640 --> 00:01:57,480
Speaker 1: which I know I've talked about here before and I

33
00:01:57,520 --> 00:01:59,360
Speaker 1: still have them, and there's I have some guilt about

34
00:01:59,360 --> 00:02:01,000
Speaker 1: that because it's not like I play with them anymore.

35
00:02:01,040 --> 00:02:04,720
Speaker 1: But I'm just like, I love them, so must right, right.

36
00:02:04,800 --> 00:02:10,920
Speaker 1: But I also I love Star Wars. But it was

37
00:02:10,960 --> 00:02:14,960
Speaker 1: assumed that I was a girl and I didn't want

38
00:02:15,000 --> 00:02:17,440
Speaker 1: Star Wars toys, and so my brothers got all the

39
00:02:17,440 --> 00:02:20,040
Speaker 1: Star Wars toys and I slowly stole them from them,

40
00:02:20,320 --> 00:02:24,360
Speaker 1: and I'll admit it openly, especially Return of the Jedi,

41
00:02:24,440 --> 00:02:27,359
Speaker 1: because it it became uncool to like Return of the

42
00:02:27,440 --> 00:02:30,520
Speaker 1: Jedi once you reached a certain age, and so I

43
00:02:30,560 --> 00:02:33,440
Speaker 1: was able to steal those Return of the Jedi toys.

44
00:02:33,480 --> 00:02:36,880
Speaker 1: And I still have the Battle of Indoor. Oh, I

45
00:02:36,880 --> 00:02:39,560
Speaker 1: would re enact it. It was so epic, So you're

46
00:02:39,600 --> 00:02:45,679
Speaker 1: re enacting it now. The walk pretty fantastic, the logs,

47
00:02:47,000 --> 00:02:49,840
Speaker 1: that's pretty fantastic. Not that I approve of stealing, but

48
00:02:49,880 --> 00:02:51,880
Speaker 1: I approve of the fact that, yeah, you know what,

49
00:02:51,960 --> 00:02:53,280
Speaker 1: if they're not gonna give it to you, might as

50
00:02:53,280 --> 00:02:56,400
Speaker 1: well take it, don't do it. I think this is

51
00:02:56,480 --> 00:02:59,880
Speaker 1: normal sibling rivalry. I'm sure yeah, they would have so.

52
00:03:00,120 --> 00:03:02,320
Speaker 1: And Plus, my brother played this really men prank ones

53
00:03:02,360 --> 00:03:04,920
Speaker 1: where he put this voice recorder of my doll and

54
00:03:04,960 --> 00:03:07,280
Speaker 1: it's said's like I was sleeping within night and it

55
00:03:07,360 --> 00:03:10,200
Speaker 1: said something like I'm gonna murder you in your state.

56
00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:13,240
Speaker 1: So I think it was fair play. There you go.

57
00:03:13,400 --> 00:03:17,400
Speaker 1: Then okay, that's that's a whole new level. Anyway, the

58
00:03:17,440 --> 00:03:19,560
Speaker 1: reason I'm bringing this up is because we have talked

59
00:03:19,560 --> 00:03:22,639
Speaker 1: a lot about Star Wars on this show, and we've

60
00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:25,520
Speaker 1: mentioned this past episode that I did with Bridget several

61
00:03:25,560 --> 00:03:28,440
Speaker 1: several times about the feminism and Star Wars, and one

62
00:03:28,440 --> 00:03:30,560
Speaker 1: of the things we talked about a lot in this

63
00:03:30,600 --> 00:03:35,040
Speaker 1: episode is costuming, but also toys, the importance of toys,

64
00:03:35,600 --> 00:03:38,440
Speaker 1: and when the first movie of the new sequel, Child

65
00:03:38,520 --> 00:03:41,000
Speaker 1: He came out The Force Awakens, I mean Ray was

66
00:03:41,080 --> 00:03:44,440
Speaker 1: the main character. There were several other characters I would

67
00:03:44,480 --> 00:03:46,800
Speaker 1: say are very close, but she was like the character

68
00:03:47,480 --> 00:03:49,920
Speaker 1: and you couldn't get toys made of her. It was ridiculous.

69
00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:51,880
Speaker 1: And in fact, people would call toy stores and they'd

70
00:03:51,880 --> 00:03:54,240
Speaker 1: be like, why don't you have this Ray doll? And

71
00:03:54,240 --> 00:03:56,200
Speaker 1: they'd be like, we have a lot of Kylo Wren

72
00:03:57,280 --> 00:03:59,800
Speaker 1: and everyone was like, we don't want to with your

73
00:04:00,640 --> 00:04:03,840
Speaker 1: Get out of here. But that is important, and that

74
00:04:03,960 --> 00:04:07,080
Speaker 1: is a conversation that's still ongoing of like all of

75
00:04:07,080 --> 00:04:10,160
Speaker 1: these toys kind of trying to be more inclusive with

76
00:04:10,200 --> 00:04:13,400
Speaker 1: what they offer and be more equal with what they offer.

77
00:04:13,480 --> 00:04:19,000
Speaker 1: So ongoing conversation for sure, but for now, please enjoy

78
00:04:19,120 --> 00:04:27,880
Speaker 1: this classic episode. Hello, I'm Annie and I'm Bridget and

79
00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:41,920
Speaker 1: this is stuff Moll never told you. And today is

80
00:04:42,040 --> 00:04:47,240
Speaker 1: May four, otherwise known as Star Wars Day. May the

81
00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:50,200
Speaker 1: fourth be with your Bridgets, May the fourth be with

82
00:04:50,279 --> 00:04:54,360
Speaker 1: you as well, and thank you, thank you um. As

83
00:04:54,360 --> 00:04:58,360
Speaker 1: you might have guessed from other past episodes, especially action figures.

84
00:04:58,400 --> 00:05:01,839
Speaker 1: I'm a bit of a nerd adweve a dork a geek.

85
00:05:02,680 --> 00:05:04,839
Speaker 1: I'm a very big Star Wars fan. You seem to

86
00:05:04,880 --> 00:05:10,000
Speaker 1: like all things science fiction and fantasy. Yes, this is true.

87
00:05:10,240 --> 00:05:13,839
Speaker 1: I I even like I write science fiction, which is

88
00:05:14,000 --> 00:05:18,440
Speaker 1: I hear very rare for like joy writing. I don't know,

89
00:05:18,480 --> 00:05:22,400
Speaker 1: because I never intend to publish anything. Um, Luke Skywalker

90
00:05:22,480 --> 00:05:26,680
Speaker 1: was my first fictional crush. This four year old Annie

91
00:05:26,720 --> 00:05:28,680
Speaker 1: looking at the screen, and I gave him a kiss

92
00:05:28,720 --> 00:05:32,560
Speaker 1: on the cheek. Why were you so drawn test Star

93
00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:36,520
Speaker 1: Wars so early? It's funny because I actually didn't like

94
00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:39,080
Speaker 1: Star Wars at first, because I didn't buy The Force

95
00:05:39,320 --> 00:05:44,160
Speaker 1: as a young kid. I was like no, But um,

96
00:05:44,200 --> 00:05:46,359
Speaker 1: everyone in my family liked it, and I did have

97
00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:49,159
Speaker 1: a crush on Luke Skywalker, even if I had my

98
00:05:49,320 --> 00:05:52,640
Speaker 1: problems with the Force. I think it was just kind

99
00:05:52,640 --> 00:05:56,120
Speaker 1: of a thing where I kept getting watched in my house,

100
00:05:56,960 --> 00:06:02,039
Speaker 1: and slowly but surely I got over my my issues

101
00:06:02,400 --> 00:06:05,560
Speaker 1: and fell in love with all the characters. And for

102
00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:09,880
Speaker 1: a while I was watching all of the original trilogy

103
00:06:10,200 --> 00:06:12,279
Speaker 1: every at least once a year, and I wore out

104
00:06:12,279 --> 00:06:15,400
Speaker 1: the tape. When you watch it there's like parts are

105
00:06:15,440 --> 00:06:17,680
Speaker 1: funny because you watched it so many times you'd be

106
00:06:17,720 --> 00:06:20,839
Speaker 1: wound it. Yes, and specifically certain parts that I would like.

107
00:06:20,960 --> 00:06:24,719
Speaker 1: This one section I would watch. What section was that

108
00:06:25,000 --> 00:06:27,560
Speaker 1: It was the end of a new hope, the big

109
00:06:27,600 --> 00:06:31,200
Speaker 1: battle with the Death Star. Yeah, yeah, I liked a

110
00:06:31,279 --> 00:06:35,880
Speaker 1: good space battle. Like so here in the studio y'all

111
00:06:35,920 --> 00:06:39,120
Speaker 1: can't see. But in classic antie style, she came dressed

112
00:06:39,120 --> 00:06:42,000
Speaker 1: to impressed. You do this, only I get to see it,

113
00:06:42,080 --> 00:06:45,800
Speaker 1: and it's amazing. She's wearing her Star Wars shirt the

114
00:06:45,839 --> 00:06:49,960
Speaker 1: Empire Strikes Back and space leggings. Yeah, I got like

115
00:06:50,080 --> 00:06:55,719
Speaker 1: the galaxies on them. Yeah, it's cooler than it sounds. Everybody.

116
00:06:55,920 --> 00:06:58,320
Speaker 1: The Empire Strikes Back is my favorite. It is not

117
00:06:58,400 --> 00:07:02,080
Speaker 1: the most feminist Star Wars movie, because we are talking

118
00:07:02,120 --> 00:07:06,400
Speaker 1: about feminism and Star Wars today. Yes, when Virget she

119
00:07:06,480 --> 00:07:08,320
Speaker 1: sent me an email was like, can you come up

120
00:07:08,320 --> 00:07:10,680
Speaker 1: with an angle on Star Wars and feminism? I had

121
00:07:10,760 --> 00:07:14,560
Speaker 1: like two seconds later, I've got a million ideas well.

122
00:07:14,560 --> 00:07:17,080
Speaker 1: This is actually probably a good time to confess something,

123
00:07:17,160 --> 00:07:20,000
Speaker 1: which is I just from knowing you personally, I know

124
00:07:20,080 --> 00:07:25,720
Speaker 1: you love Star Wars, but I I've never seen Star Wars.

125
00:07:25,840 --> 00:07:29,560
Speaker 1: I haven't seen any of them, not a single. Actually,

126
00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:31,240
Speaker 1: when I was that's not true. I was on a

127
00:07:31,280 --> 00:07:34,480
Speaker 1: plane to l a h two weeks ago and the

128
00:07:34,520 --> 00:07:36,679
Speaker 1: movie they were playing with Star Wars, but I didn't

129
00:07:36,680 --> 00:07:38,520
Speaker 1: have headphones, so I watched part of it. I was

130
00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:42,240
Speaker 1: very confused. It seems like a good movie. I wish

131
00:07:42,280 --> 00:07:45,760
Speaker 1: I had gotten the headphone. Which one was it? Do

132
00:07:45,800 --> 00:07:48,800
Speaker 1: you know? It was the Oh god, it was the

133
00:07:48,840 --> 00:07:51,760
Speaker 1: one I hate. I almost said something that I feel

134
00:07:51,760 --> 00:07:55,440
Speaker 1: like people would try to get fired, and I said it, Uh,

135
00:07:55,760 --> 00:07:59,080
Speaker 1: the one with the girl, the most recent one. Well,

136
00:07:59,200 --> 00:08:02,240
Speaker 1: the most of the recent ones have ladies, and that

137
00:08:02,440 --> 00:08:05,320
Speaker 1: the one with Ray. She's in more than one. Okay,

138
00:08:05,320 --> 00:08:09,400
Speaker 1: but I don't know. It's okay, we we forgive you,

139
00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:11,360
Speaker 1: bridget Well. This is why I think this episode is

140
00:08:11,400 --> 00:08:15,200
Speaker 1: good because in my experience, people either love Star Wars

141
00:08:15,280 --> 00:08:19,040
Speaker 1: and they have they had a encyclopedic knowledge of it

142
00:08:19,120 --> 00:08:21,560
Speaker 1: and what it means, and it means it means something

143
00:08:21,640 --> 00:08:24,239
Speaker 1: very personal to them, or they have a super cash

144
00:08:24,280 --> 00:08:26,160
Speaker 1: relationship with it, or haven't seen it. So this isn't

145
00:08:26,240 --> 00:08:29,440
Speaker 1: This is maybe representing that balance a little bit, the

146
00:08:29,440 --> 00:08:34,000
Speaker 1: balance of the floors. Oh my gosh, I get that reference. Yes, yes,

147
00:08:34,360 --> 00:08:37,400
Speaker 1: And speaking of um, I've tasked Bridget with making sure

148
00:08:37,440 --> 00:08:40,600
Speaker 1: that I don't go too deep into Star Wars nurgery

149
00:08:40,640 --> 00:08:43,880
Speaker 1: where no one can understand what I'm saying. I'm sure

150
00:08:43,880 --> 00:08:46,360
Speaker 1: it's gonna be fine. I hope, so, I hope so

151
00:08:46,600 --> 00:08:51,600
Speaker 1: UM and I used to be a much bigger are

152
00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:56,320
Speaker 1: not bigger, but I was maybe a more obsessed fan

153
00:08:56,960 --> 00:08:59,280
Speaker 1: I was. I. I would read all the books, and

154
00:08:59,320 --> 00:09:01,360
Speaker 1: I had the mix, and I add the video games,

155
00:09:01,360 --> 00:09:03,200
Speaker 1: and now I kind of just see the movies and

156
00:09:03,280 --> 00:09:07,959
Speaker 1: enjoy them. So I'm not the same level of encyclopedic

157
00:09:08,000 --> 00:09:12,720
Speaker 1: knowledge that I once was, but for a period, well,

158
00:09:12,760 --> 00:09:15,280
Speaker 1: I almost feel a little bit jealous of people who

159
00:09:15,320 --> 00:09:18,160
Speaker 1: are into Star Wars because there's there's so much lore,

160
00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:20,120
Speaker 1: there's so many ways to be into it, and so

161
00:09:20,800 --> 00:09:23,679
Speaker 1: you know, if you like other kinds of films, you know,

162
00:09:23,720 --> 00:09:26,240
Speaker 1: let's say that you really like Richard link Later films

163
00:09:26,280 --> 00:09:28,560
Speaker 1: or something. Yeah, there's not like you can't get action

164
00:09:28,600 --> 00:09:33,200
Speaker 1: figures and memorabilia and do fan fixure. There's there's so

165
00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:36,200
Speaker 1: much to the universe, I guess, and that being being

166
00:09:36,320 --> 00:09:38,360
Speaker 1: fans of other kinds of film does not lend itself

167
00:09:38,400 --> 00:09:40,640
Speaker 1: easily to that kind of being able to dive in

168
00:09:40,640 --> 00:09:44,080
Speaker 1: into this like very vast, rich universe. And that's something

169
00:09:44,080 --> 00:09:46,480
Speaker 1: I've always really liked about Star Wars, even though I'm not,

170
00:09:46,559 --> 00:09:49,160
Speaker 1: you know, a big fan myself, that it allows for

171
00:09:49,480 --> 00:09:52,719
Speaker 1: that kind of expansion of a fandom. That you can

172
00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:55,120
Speaker 1: be a fan and express that through writing, and there's

173
00:09:55,120 --> 00:09:57,199
Speaker 1: a community for that, express that through cosplay. There's a

174
00:09:57,200 --> 00:10:01,959
Speaker 1: community for that. Like whatever way that that interest manifests

175
00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:04,160
Speaker 1: for you, there's a community out there doing that, which

176
00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:06,000
Speaker 1: is quite interesting, and not a lot of things are

177
00:10:06,040 --> 00:10:09,840
Speaker 1: like that. Yeah, it's cool that you can enter kind

178
00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:14,240
Speaker 1: of at various points and are from various angles, like

179
00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:16,719
Speaker 1: say you like costuming and then you get into Star

180
00:10:16,760 --> 00:10:19,000
Speaker 1: Wars that way. That it's it's interesting that there's just

181
00:10:19,280 --> 00:10:23,839
Speaker 1: all of these sorts of fans co mingling. Well, that's

182
00:10:23,880 --> 00:10:26,280
Speaker 1: actually the if I had to say the way that

183
00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:30,400
Speaker 1: I appreciate Star Wars, it's through Carrie Fisher because I'm

184
00:10:30,400 --> 00:10:33,600
Speaker 1: a huge but I know her more as like a

185
00:10:33,679 --> 00:10:36,640
Speaker 1: writer and humorist and so I'm a huge fan of

186
00:10:37,320 --> 00:10:41,160
Speaker 1: saucy sassy ladies, and she is a saucy, sassy lady.

187
00:10:41,200 --> 00:10:44,240
Speaker 1: And so even though my connection with her is is

188
00:10:44,679 --> 00:10:48,040
Speaker 1: not through that particular film series, I I definitely think

189
00:10:48,080 --> 00:10:51,120
Speaker 1: like that, like that is my thread for appreciating the genre.

190
00:10:52,360 --> 00:10:57,200
Speaker 1: You know, she was in Scream three, she wasn't. I'm

191
00:10:57,280 --> 00:11:00,720
Speaker 1: so glad. I know you can't get me a Carrie Fisher.

192
00:11:00,800 --> 00:11:05,640
Speaker 1: What was she in? Excellent? I was thinking that, like

193
00:11:06,200 --> 00:11:09,000
Speaker 1: back to our horror movie episode Carrie Fisher, it all

194
00:11:09,080 --> 00:11:12,679
Speaker 1: comes you should have talked about her, Well, we had

195
00:11:12,720 --> 00:11:15,920
Speaker 1: other things to discuss. Well, well, well we'll we have

196
00:11:15,960 --> 00:11:17,959
Speaker 1: to do a whole episode on her. Yes, and one

197
00:11:18,040 --> 00:11:20,000
Speaker 1: day we need to do an episode on something that

198
00:11:20,080 --> 00:11:25,800
Speaker 1: you're a total fan for. Oh, there's so many things excellent, excellent.

199
00:11:26,520 --> 00:11:30,520
Speaker 1: But today we're looking at Star Wars and feminism in

200
00:11:30,640 --> 00:11:33,199
Speaker 1: Star Wars because there are so many angles to look

201
00:11:33,240 --> 00:11:34,680
Speaker 1: at it. But I thought we'd do kind of an

202
00:11:34,720 --> 00:11:37,920
Speaker 1: overview of where we are, because right now we're in

203
00:11:38,040 --> 00:11:41,960
Speaker 1: prime Star Wars time, Like there's a new movie coming

204
00:11:42,000 --> 00:11:47,400
Speaker 1: out every year, and it is changing a lot as

205
00:11:47,440 --> 00:11:50,600
Speaker 1: the audience kind of expects that and demands that and

206
00:11:50,760 --> 00:11:52,960
Speaker 1: as times have changed, So there is a lot to

207
00:11:52,960 --> 00:11:55,840
Speaker 1: talk about. Um, if we look at when Star Wars

208
00:11:55,880 --> 00:11:58,960
Speaker 1: first came out. It had what I think is typically

209
00:11:59,280 --> 00:12:02,160
Speaker 1: has been the aastic trio of two white men and

210
00:12:02,240 --> 00:12:05,280
Speaker 1: one white lady. So you have Han Solo, Luke Skywalker,

211
00:12:05,480 --> 00:12:08,959
Speaker 1: Princess Leiah, who was of course a princess. But I

212
00:12:09,000 --> 00:12:11,160
Speaker 1: would say she was still a pretty strong character. She

213
00:12:11,240 --> 00:12:13,079
Speaker 1: was a rebel, she was a fighter. Later she was

214
00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:17,080
Speaker 1: a general um and there is that element of damsel

215
00:12:17,080 --> 00:12:18,959
Speaker 1: in distress, the whole help me will be one kenobe

216
00:12:19,040 --> 00:12:22,240
Speaker 1: 're my only hope um, the whole slave bikini thing

217
00:12:22,640 --> 00:12:25,520
Speaker 1: and return of the Jedi, which was totally to make

218
00:12:25,520 --> 00:12:29,000
Speaker 1: her more palatable to the male gaze. Yeah, and she

219
00:12:29,320 --> 00:12:33,960
Speaker 1: like kills Jab of the Hut with her change, and

220
00:12:34,000 --> 00:12:37,000
Speaker 1: she kind of became a bit of a a resistance

221
00:12:37,240 --> 00:12:39,560
Speaker 1: icon for a little bit. She did that like a

222
00:12:40,080 --> 00:12:43,480
Speaker 1: people use that as a kind of feminist expression of

223
00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:46,480
Speaker 1: rage killing killing your captor with the chains that he

224
00:12:46,720 --> 00:12:48,679
Speaker 1: that he locked you up with, which is so much

225
00:12:48,720 --> 00:12:52,800
Speaker 1: is rad like that's it is it is um. Yeah,

226
00:12:52,840 --> 00:12:55,040
Speaker 1: And she was a feminist icon for the time, and

227
00:12:55,080 --> 00:12:58,120
Speaker 1: I would say pretty progressive for the time, which was

228
00:12:58,160 --> 00:13:04,160
Speaker 1: around nineteen evan. And because of that, she did ruffle

229
00:13:04,320 --> 00:13:07,800
Speaker 1: some some feathers. Review of a New Hope which was

230
00:13:07,840 --> 00:13:11,000
Speaker 1: the first one. The fourth one it gets very confusing,

231
00:13:11,040 --> 00:13:14,520
Speaker 1: but the first one to come out. UM Critic John

232
00:13:14,559 --> 00:13:18,959
Speaker 1: Simon wrote that Princess Leah was played wretchedly by Carrie Fisher,

233
00:13:19,000 --> 00:13:23,840
Speaker 1: who is not even appealing as Princess Leiah organa parentheses

234
00:13:24,280 --> 00:13:29,040
Speaker 1: in organic l what this is a review like a

235
00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:36,719
Speaker 1: critical This is critic. I want to look about the

236
00:13:39,320 --> 00:13:47,079
Speaker 1: angry letter like thirty years later, Bridget Justice. Hey, revenge

237
00:13:47,120 --> 00:13:49,280
Speaker 1: is a dish best serve cold. This is true, not

238
00:13:49,360 --> 00:13:52,760
Speaker 1: from Star Wars, from Star Trek Boom. Oh yeah, you

239
00:13:52,880 --> 00:13:58,000
Speaker 1: nailed it, Bridget. Yes, I have like very loose ideas

240
00:13:58,040 --> 00:14:01,440
Speaker 1: for a Revenge bakery that I want to open. Um,

241
00:14:01,480 --> 00:14:04,640
Speaker 1: so maybe we'll he'll be one of our first customers. Okay,

242
00:14:04,679 --> 00:14:06,959
Speaker 1: we definitely need a table and come. Return to the

243
00:14:07,000 --> 00:14:11,640
Speaker 1: concept of Revenge Bakery. Yes, I would love to talk

244
00:14:11,640 --> 00:14:14,880
Speaker 1: about that more in depth. But um, speaking of Carrie

245
00:14:14,880 --> 00:14:19,200
Speaker 1: Fisher and I love for Carrie Fisher. Um. One of

246
00:14:19,280 --> 00:14:21,440
Speaker 1: my favorite facts about her is that a friend, a

247
00:14:21,480 --> 00:14:24,480
Speaker 1: friend of her, screenwriter Heather Robinson, had to fight off

248
00:14:24,520 --> 00:14:29,520
Speaker 1: a predatory Hollywood producer, and Fisher delivered to him by

249
00:14:29,560 --> 00:14:33,160
Speaker 1: hand a tiffany box containing a cow tongue inside with

250
00:14:33,280 --> 00:14:36,120
Speaker 1: the added touch of a threatening note just to really

251
00:14:36,160 --> 00:14:39,200
Speaker 1: get the message home. And according to Robinson, the note read,

252
00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:42,240
Speaker 1: if you ever touch my darling, Heather or any other

253
00:14:42,280 --> 00:14:45,560
Speaker 1: woman again, the next delivery will be something of yours

254
00:14:45,600 --> 00:14:49,880
Speaker 1: and a much smaller box. Damn right. So this is

255
00:14:49,920 --> 00:14:52,640
Speaker 1: why I love her like even if that's First of all,

256
00:14:52,880 --> 00:14:55,000
Speaker 1: if that works on two levels. One, if that story

257
00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:58,520
Speaker 1: is true. Wow, to that story is not true. Just

258
00:14:58,560 --> 00:15:01,640
Speaker 1: imagine the lore has to surround you for that to

259
00:15:01,680 --> 00:15:04,720
Speaker 1: be the rumor about you and for it to be believable. Yeah,

260
00:15:04,840 --> 00:15:06,360
Speaker 1: the fact that we don't know if it's true or not.

261
00:15:06,480 --> 00:15:09,040
Speaker 1: Just show us what a badass she was. Yes, you were,

262
00:15:09,080 --> 00:15:11,760
Speaker 1: Like I can see her doing that. I totally can

263
00:15:11,760 --> 00:15:16,720
Speaker 1: see her hearing that. Um. Both the original trilogy and

264
00:15:16,760 --> 00:15:19,280
Speaker 1: the prequels had a strong female character, but once that

265
00:15:19,400 --> 00:15:24,200
Speaker 1: straddled being badass with being that demsel damsel that needs rescuing,

266
00:15:24,320 --> 00:15:27,800
Speaker 1: empowered and objectified at the same time, and in a

267
00:15:27,840 --> 00:15:30,400
Speaker 1: way it reflects where we were with women as a

268
00:15:30,440 --> 00:15:35,280
Speaker 1: society and feminism at the time. The prequel's main character,

269
00:15:35,680 --> 00:15:38,400
Speaker 1: pad May, got the unfortunate ranking of four out of

270
00:15:38,440 --> 00:15:42,400
Speaker 1: five worst Hollywood attempts at feminism. As judged by cracked

271
00:15:42,520 --> 00:15:46,120
Speaker 1: dot com, the unfortunate thing with her storyline is she

272
00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:50,880
Speaker 1: was strong and then she just kind of became a

273
00:15:50,960 --> 00:15:52,920
Speaker 1: whole plot point of she had to die, and she

274
00:15:53,040 --> 00:15:56,920
Speaker 1: just died a broken heart, like she existed only to

275
00:15:57,240 --> 00:16:01,400
Speaker 1: further this story of the male character. See that just

276
00:16:01,440 --> 00:16:04,320
Speaker 1: reminds me of so many times in movies that are

277
00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:06,280
Speaker 1: trying to be progressive, and so they add a female

278
00:16:06,360 --> 00:16:08,840
Speaker 1: character or a gay character, but that character is not

279
00:16:08,920 --> 00:16:12,120
Speaker 1: allowed to sort of exist where the other characters exist.

280
00:16:12,200 --> 00:16:14,120
Speaker 1: They have to die a tragic death or they have

281
00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:18,080
Speaker 1: to you know, I love someone who doesn't love them back,

282
00:16:18,080 --> 00:16:20,400
Speaker 1: and get their heartbroken and kill themselves. Right Like, they're

283
00:16:20,440 --> 00:16:23,160
Speaker 1: not allowed to exist as these characters who want them

284
00:16:23,200 --> 00:16:25,240
Speaker 1: to be. They have to be sort of tragic or

285
00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:27,800
Speaker 1: something bad has to happen. That does kind of strike

286
00:16:27,840 --> 00:16:31,200
Speaker 1: me as a weak attempt at feminism. Yeah, it was unfortunate,

287
00:16:31,240 --> 00:16:33,040
Speaker 1: and it's one of those things where it's like the Titanic,

288
00:16:33,080 --> 00:16:36,280
Speaker 1: we all knew she was going to die. That's because

289
00:16:36,280 --> 00:16:40,240
Speaker 1: it was prequels, right, Oh, so you already know. It

290
00:16:40,360 --> 00:16:44,000
Speaker 1: just wasn't handled in the best way. Perhaps, man I

291
00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:45,840
Speaker 1: I would love to get a look at that writer's room,

292
00:16:45,880 --> 00:16:48,440
Speaker 1: because I I would be willing to bet that that

293
00:16:48,520 --> 00:16:52,560
Speaker 1: kind of stab at making a feminist, you know, plotline

294
00:16:52,600 --> 00:16:56,360
Speaker 1: for a female character was handled by male writers, and

295
00:16:56,360 --> 00:16:59,240
Speaker 1: that like, that's why it was kind of narrow or

296
00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:02,080
Speaker 1: fell flat and why she didn't strike you as an authentic,

297
00:17:02,200 --> 00:17:07,600
Speaker 1: you know, multidimensional character. Yeah, there's also a really embarrassing

298
00:17:07,720 --> 00:17:11,000
Speaker 1: scene from the second one attacking the clothes or she's

299
00:17:11,000 --> 00:17:14,159
Speaker 1: like getting a pit and she's fighting. She's tough, but

300
00:17:14,320 --> 00:17:18,159
Speaker 1: she's wearing this like it's almost a crop top, but

301
00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:20,639
Speaker 1: just got it back to it. But then the beast

302
00:17:20,960 --> 00:17:23,879
Speaker 1: like that she's fighting, slashes the back of it, so

303
00:17:23,920 --> 00:17:27,639
Speaker 1: it becomes a full crop top, and it's like that

304
00:17:27,720 --> 00:17:30,600
Speaker 1: what you would wear if you were in hand to

305
00:17:30,600 --> 00:17:33,080
Speaker 1: hand combat. You're like, I need my crop top. That's

306
00:17:33,080 --> 00:17:35,960
Speaker 1: what I wear for combat. My my tactical crop top.

307
00:17:36,080 --> 00:17:40,200
Speaker 1: You right, who among us doesn't have a tactical crop top?

308
00:17:40,680 --> 00:17:43,679
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm basically wearing one right now. Your battle

309
00:17:43,720 --> 00:17:45,680
Speaker 1: in any minute, So I gotta I got a street

310
00:17:45,720 --> 00:17:48,479
Speaker 1: fight planned later, So I'm okay, Yeah, we were we

311
00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:50,040
Speaker 1: were going to meet in the parking lot and fight

312
00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:54,719
Speaker 1: some other podcast crew. Yeah, we have beef with another podcast.

313
00:17:55,320 --> 00:17:57,960
Speaker 1: We'll drop some hits to who it is. Yeah, yeah,

314
00:17:58,400 --> 00:18:01,040
Speaker 1: but we're meeting them in the parking lot later. Anyway,

315
00:18:01,080 --> 00:18:04,359
Speaker 1: back to Star Wars hwnism. If we skip ahead to

316
00:18:04,800 --> 00:18:09,960
Speaker 1: the first of the Star Wars sequel trilogy, The Force Awakens,

317
00:18:10,440 --> 00:18:12,919
Speaker 1: and the announcement that one of the main characters was

318
00:18:13,119 --> 00:18:18,119
Speaker 1: Ray a lady, Oh my goodness, a disturbance in the Force,

319
00:18:18,520 --> 00:18:21,480
Speaker 1: I remember the inevitable. Oh no, the dark side a

320
00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:25,320
Speaker 1: k a. Feminism has ruined Star Wars. Um it's two

321
00:18:25,320 --> 00:18:28,280
Speaker 1: PC comments, which is kind of funny because she was

322
00:18:28,320 --> 00:18:31,800
Speaker 1: still the only female in the cast. Like women are

323
00:18:31,800 --> 00:18:34,119
Speaker 1: taking over, and by taking over, I mean they've added

324
00:18:34,280 --> 00:18:37,560
Speaker 1: like one, right, I mean it was one. I mean,

325
00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:40,200
Speaker 1: I don't know the ratio, isn't That doesn't even throw

326
00:18:40,200 --> 00:18:42,879
Speaker 1: off the ratio that you mentioned before, right, She's just

327
00:18:43,280 --> 00:18:45,719
Speaker 1: she was like the main one. I guess. Princess Leia

328
00:18:45,880 --> 00:18:47,520
Speaker 1: was kind of if you had to list them of

329
00:18:47,600 --> 00:18:50,200
Speaker 1: importance in the in an order of importance, she would

330
00:18:50,200 --> 00:18:53,359
Speaker 1: be at the bottom, but Ray was at the top.

331
00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:57,640
Speaker 1: We think, I mean, this was all speculation. We weren't sure,

332
00:18:57,680 --> 00:19:00,840
Speaker 1: but yeah, I remember this pretty clearly. Um. And the

333
00:19:00,840 --> 00:19:03,840
Speaker 1: good thing about Ray is she she pretty much ditched

334
00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:07,320
Speaker 1: that damsel and distress things she can handle herself, she

335
00:19:07,480 --> 00:19:12,080
Speaker 1: told Han Solo, so Um. But she's not that one

336
00:19:12,080 --> 00:19:15,679
Speaker 1: dimensional strong female character that annoys the hell out of

337
00:19:15,680 --> 00:19:18,440
Speaker 1: me either. Um. She protects b B eight, so she's

338
00:19:18,440 --> 00:19:21,199
Speaker 1: got that kind of like nurturing protective side. She's goofy,

339
00:19:21,280 --> 00:19:24,320
Speaker 1: she makes mistakes, she's a survivor, and the fact that

340
00:19:24,359 --> 00:19:27,320
Speaker 1: some people might doubt her abilities, possibly because of her gender,

341
00:19:27,920 --> 00:19:30,760
Speaker 1: is poked out throughout the movie. When Um male character

342
00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:34,679
Speaker 1: Finn rushes to her aid she's being attacked earlier in

343
00:19:34,680 --> 00:19:37,080
Speaker 1: the movie, he finds she's already taken care of her

344
00:19:37,119 --> 00:19:40,560
Speaker 1: would be assailants, and later when he takes her hand

345
00:19:40,560 --> 00:19:43,040
Speaker 1: as they're running away from their pursuers, she snaps, I

346
00:19:43,119 --> 00:19:46,040
Speaker 1: know how to run without you holding my hand. So

347
00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:48,639
Speaker 1: they're kind of always sort of bringing it up. Um.

348
00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:51,280
Speaker 1: And she's as a character, she's had to learn to

349
00:19:51,320 --> 00:19:54,440
Speaker 1: survive on her own alongside aliens, droids, men, women, all

350
00:19:54,520 --> 00:19:57,520
Speaker 1: of them struggling together. And she's not making a feminine

351
00:19:57,600 --> 00:20:00,520
Speaker 1: feminist statement or representing a movement. She's just doing what

352
00:20:00,560 --> 00:20:02,840
Speaker 1: she has to do and that's the point. She's a

353
00:20:02,880 --> 00:20:06,679
Speaker 1: woman who's doing these things, but it's kind of secondary, right,

354
00:20:06,680 --> 00:20:08,119
Speaker 1: and so they don't make a big deal about the

355
00:20:08,119 --> 00:20:10,679
Speaker 1: fact that you know, a woman is doing so like

356
00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:13,680
Speaker 1: in in in films, I hate it when they beat

357
00:20:13,720 --> 00:20:15,720
Speaker 1: you over the head with the fact that this is

358
00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:18,159
Speaker 1: a one like when it's supposed to be a quote

359
00:20:18,160 --> 00:20:21,720
Speaker 1: strong female character to the point where it's very aware

360
00:20:22,119 --> 00:20:25,760
Speaker 1: that a strong female character. It's hard to explain, but yeah,

361
00:20:25,840 --> 00:20:28,199
Speaker 1: when it keeps strong attention to it, it's like, so

362
00:20:28,240 --> 00:20:31,800
Speaker 1: you're saying, because she's a woman, this is astounding that

363
00:20:31,840 --> 00:20:35,480
Speaker 1: she's able to do this right exactly exactly that that

364
00:20:35,600 --> 00:20:38,560
Speaker 1: just always it almost makes me cringe because I'm happy

365
00:20:38,600 --> 00:20:42,960
Speaker 1: that this was just authentically. You know, I am capable,

366
00:20:43,119 --> 00:20:46,280
Speaker 1: and I have many you know, I have many sides

367
00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:48,360
Speaker 1: to myself. I can be goofy, and I can make mistakes,

368
00:20:48,359 --> 00:20:50,440
Speaker 1: and I can be you know, nurturing, and I can

369
00:20:50,480 --> 00:20:52,880
Speaker 1: be badass and I can take care of the bad guy,

370
00:20:53,400 --> 00:20:55,359
Speaker 1: and I can do all those things because women can

371
00:20:55,359 --> 00:20:56,600
Speaker 1: do all of those things. And it's not a big

372
00:20:56,600 --> 00:20:59,720
Speaker 1: deal because within our you know, multi fascinated humans just

373
00:21:00,040 --> 00:21:06,160
Speaker 1: like everyone else. I know, we've really we've really stumbled

374
00:21:06,240 --> 00:21:11,520
Speaker 1: up on something here. Um. Yeah, and she basically she

375
00:21:11,680 --> 00:21:13,840
Speaker 1: was a character. I feel like if you can just

376
00:21:13,880 --> 00:21:15,960
Speaker 1: write a good character, then they should. It should work

377
00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:19,840
Speaker 1: for male or female. That's my opinion. Her look was

378
00:21:19,880 --> 00:21:23,120
Speaker 1: important too, because there was no slave bikinis here. In fact,

379
00:21:23,119 --> 00:21:26,359
Speaker 1: I believe Carrie Fisher told the actress who plays her,

380
00:21:26,359 --> 00:21:31,480
Speaker 1: plays right, Daisy Ridley, keep fighting against that slave bikini. Um.

381
00:21:31,600 --> 00:21:36,800
Speaker 1: She wore a very Luke Skywark skywalkery tunic. No discernible

382
00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:38,760
Speaker 1: makeup though I'm sure it was that. No makeup makeup

383
00:21:38,800 --> 00:21:42,320
Speaker 1: look um, hair tightly pulled back, almost like her gender

384
00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:44,760
Speaker 1: was secondary. And that's the point. It didn't define her.

385
00:21:44,800 --> 00:21:47,080
Speaker 1: It was her. In the words of the actress who

386
00:21:47,119 --> 00:21:50,600
Speaker 1: played her, she doesn't have to be one thing to

387
00:21:50,680 --> 00:21:53,400
Speaker 1: embody a woman in a film. It just so happens.

388
00:21:53,440 --> 00:21:56,480
Speaker 1: She's a woman, but she just transcends gender. She's going

389
00:21:56,520 --> 00:21:59,320
Speaker 1: to speak to men and women. I love that. That

390
00:21:59,400 --> 00:22:02,000
Speaker 1: actually under scores a point that I love making about gender,

391
00:22:02,080 --> 00:22:05,680
Speaker 1: is that good representations of gender in media is good

392
00:22:05,680 --> 00:22:08,880
Speaker 1: for everyone, not just women, not just men, but everyone

393
00:22:08,920 --> 00:22:14,080
Speaker 1: like men can benefit from seeing multifaceted, strong women on screen.

394
00:22:14,320 --> 00:22:16,439
Speaker 1: In the episode, that I did on Black Panther. We

395
00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:19,520
Speaker 1: talked to General Wortham about this UM from the podcast

396
00:22:19,520 --> 00:22:21,280
Speaker 1: Still Processing, and she made this great point that I

397
00:22:21,320 --> 00:22:25,680
Speaker 1: hadn't considered, which is that when men see strong characters

398
00:22:25,680 --> 00:22:28,600
Speaker 1: who are women, who are multifaceted on screen, it actually

399
00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:31,160
Speaker 1: helps them in their lives because then they're like, oh,

400
00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:34,760
Speaker 1: this is a representation of how men work on teams

401
00:22:34,760 --> 00:22:36,720
Speaker 1: with women or how you know, women control up in

402
00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:38,679
Speaker 1: my life and I should respect them. It's not just

403
00:22:38,760 --> 00:22:42,400
Speaker 1: for women, and to speak to everybody, it's a good everybody. Yeah,

404
00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:47,439
Speaker 1: good representation. Good characters benefits all of us. Well, we

405
00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:50,400
Speaker 1: have so much more Star Wars and feminism to talk about,

406
00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:52,440
Speaker 1: but first a quick break for a word from our sponsor,

407
00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:06,040
Speaker 1: and we're back. Thank you sponsor. One of the big

408
00:23:06,200 --> 00:23:09,639
Speaker 1: arguments I remember seeing about Ray when it when she

409
00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:14,760
Speaker 1: first debuted UM was that she was a Mary Sue UM.

410
00:23:14,800 --> 00:23:18,240
Speaker 1: And if you're not familiar with that terminology, one you've

411
00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:23,800
Speaker 1: clearly never read fan fiction and too here's here's the

412
00:23:23,840 --> 00:23:27,800
Speaker 1: general definition. But it's difficult to pin down a fictional

413
00:23:27,960 --> 00:23:32,400
Speaker 1: female character who is perfect in every way, usually usually

414
00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:36,760
Speaker 1: an idealized wish fulfillment of the author. Can you give

415
00:23:36,800 --> 00:23:43,000
Speaker 1: us some examples of other mary sus. My mind immediately

416
00:23:43,000 --> 00:23:46,560
Speaker 1: went to I have written some Van Victor in my day. Yes,

417
00:23:46,560 --> 00:23:52,840
Speaker 1: it's from this book, this unpublished manuscript by myself forthcoming,

418
00:23:53,040 --> 00:23:55,359
Speaker 1: don't you worry. I wrote a Star Wars dand fiction

419
00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:58,399
Speaker 1: that had a Mary Sue and her name was Tera Polaris.

420
00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:00,280
Speaker 1: And that is a sign of a Mary you right,

421
00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:03,919
Speaker 1: there is when they have a weird like Ariadney, like

422
00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:06,920
Speaker 1: some some weeks, I'm like, oh this this girl's complicated, Yeah,

423
00:24:08,080 --> 00:24:11,840
Speaker 1: mysterious past. Her name is Hella, hard to pronounce. Yes,

424
00:24:12,800 --> 00:24:17,600
Speaker 1: we've got Mary Sue. Um, well, let's look at the

425
00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:20,320
Speaker 1: definition a bit more. She's got mad skill, she's hilarious,

426
00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:23,600
Speaker 1: she's wicked smart, everyone wants to date her probably, Um.

427
00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:27,000
Speaker 1: Depending on what circle you're in, this definition can vary

428
00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:31,320
Speaker 1: wildly because what is perfect anyway, It is usually reserved

429
00:24:31,320 --> 00:24:33,560
Speaker 1: for fan fiction, but it has expanded to more pop culture.

430
00:24:33,720 --> 00:24:37,680
Speaker 1: For another nerd reference, I have heard, um, Lily Potter

431
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:40,760
Speaker 1: from Harry Potter referred to as a Mary Sue. Yeah. Well,

432
00:24:40,760 --> 00:24:43,560
Speaker 1: I've also heard that the main character from the Fifty

433
00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:45,920
Speaker 1: Shades of Gray movies, she's a bit of a Merry

434
00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:48,920
Speaker 1: Sue because she like if you've ever seen I don't

435
00:24:48,920 --> 00:24:51,960
Speaker 1: know if you've seen those movies, but she is super talented,

436
00:24:52,040 --> 00:24:53,639
Speaker 1: Like she excels at her job in this way that

437
00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:55,439
Speaker 1: doesn't make any sense where it's likely you went from

438
00:24:55,680 --> 00:24:59,040
Speaker 1: an intern to running this company. What everybody wants to

439
00:24:59,119 --> 00:25:01,920
Speaker 1: date her like she's always fending off that that, you know,

440
00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 1: affections of people who all want to be in her world.

441
00:25:04,680 --> 00:25:08,280
Speaker 1: And it must be nice. But you know, not a

442
00:25:08,359 --> 00:25:14,320
Speaker 1: probably a fun facts. Probably all of you know this,

443
00:25:14,520 --> 00:25:16,800
Speaker 1: but fifty Shades of Great is based on a Twilight

444
00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:21,320
Speaker 1: fan fiction. I didn't know that. I'm all about fan fiction.

445
00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:23,320
Speaker 1: I really want to do an episode on fan fiction

446
00:25:24,359 --> 00:25:27,679
Speaker 1: one day, one day. UM. The term Mary Suit traces

447
00:25:27,720 --> 00:25:30,960
Speaker 1: back to a Chrecky's Tale, a Star Trek fan fic

448
00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:34,080
Speaker 1: from nineteen seventy four, which itself was a parody of

449
00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:38,160
Speaker 1: another fan fix trope, the self insert, which is when

450
00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:41,960
Speaker 1: a bridget finds herself in the middle of stars, she

451
00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:43,720
Speaker 1: doesn't know how she got there. What is she gonna

452
00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:47,040
Speaker 1: do that? Yeah, that's another one I might have written

453
00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:50,320
Speaker 1: one for UM. TV tropes do work as a good

454
00:25:50,359 --> 00:25:53,080
Speaker 1: breakdown of a Merry Sue and the common traits all

455
00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:56,600
Speaker 1: appropriately ending in sue like anti suit, black hole sue,

456
00:25:56,760 --> 00:26:00,360
Speaker 1: god mode sue, sympathetic sue, thirty soup pile up. What's

457
00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:02,720
Speaker 1: the thirty soup Pilop. I think that's when they're like,

458
00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:06,280
Speaker 1: you have clones, so I thought of Resident Evil and

459
00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:10,159
Speaker 1: Alice has all of those. Yeah, I think that's the

460
00:26:10,240 --> 00:26:15,760
Speaker 1: thirty soup piet. I love the terminology UM, and also

461
00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:17,640
Speaker 1: would be clear we're not talking about the Mary Sue,

462
00:26:17,640 --> 00:26:21,840
Speaker 1: which is a website media thing different um. In the

463
00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:26,399
Speaker 1: context of raise supposed Mary suoness, the fans point to

464
00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:29,800
Speaker 1: her skills like piloting, how quick she was picking up

465
00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:33,879
Speaker 1: the force and a lightsaber as evidence. And this criticism

466
00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:36,760
Speaker 1: has come up enough that Daisy Ridley, the actress again

467
00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:40,600
Speaker 1: was asked about it in an interview and she called

468
00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:43,399
Speaker 1: it sexist. She said, there's no such thing as a

469
00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:47,960
Speaker 1: Ryan Craig, which there is a Gary stew or a

470
00:26:48,080 --> 00:26:52,640
Speaker 1: Marty Sue depending um. But this is derived from Mary Sue,

471
00:26:52,760 --> 00:26:55,800
Speaker 1: and probably most people don't know that term. You might

472
00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:58,240
Speaker 1: you know Mary Sue, but you probably don't know. And

473
00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:00,760
Speaker 1: I feel like, yeah, Mary Sue, even if you're someone

474
00:27:00,760 --> 00:27:03,719
Speaker 1: who was a casual consumer of this kind of kind

475
00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:06,280
Speaker 1: of media. If if, even if you hadn't heard that term,

476
00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:08,520
Speaker 1: if I described it, you'd be like, oh, exactly, I've

477
00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:10,520
Speaker 1: seen that a million times. Gary Stue, I feel like,

478
00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:14,119
Speaker 1: is much less ubiquitous, right, And that's kind of the

479
00:27:14,160 --> 00:27:17,720
Speaker 1: point she was making. Um, it doesn't come up in

480
00:27:17,800 --> 00:27:20,719
Speaker 1: interviews with male actors. Are you a Gary stew Um,

481
00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:25,200
Speaker 1: They're not criticized in the same gendered way. Their characters

482
00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:30,000
Speaker 1: are underdeveloped, are poorly written, they're not Gary Stew's. And

483
00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:32,480
Speaker 1: another thing is Luke from the Originals did pretty much

484
00:27:32,520 --> 00:27:36,480
Speaker 1: the same thing. Um, I've read nitpicky accounts of Yeah,

485
00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:41,159
Speaker 1: but he had more time. He's changed with it. But

486
00:27:41,320 --> 00:27:44,160
Speaker 1: that's not really the point. We didn't even ask these

487
00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:47,919
Speaker 1: questions about him. We didn't even ask in the before

488
00:27:48,080 --> 00:27:50,040
Speaker 1: he went away to train in my favorite one of

489
00:27:50,040 --> 00:27:53,160
Speaker 1: the Empire strikes Back. He picked up those things pretty

490
00:27:53,240 --> 00:27:56,040
Speaker 1: quick in a New Hope. And we didn't ask those

491
00:27:56,080 --> 00:27:59,760
Speaker 1: questions about Haun either. And she's not a perfect character,

492
00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:02,840
Speaker 1: and by no means should all characters be like Ray.

493
00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:06,280
Speaker 1: But we need all types of good female characters as

494
00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:08,679
Speaker 1: diverse as we all are, and some of us are

495
00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:10,960
Speaker 1: good at a lot of stuff, and I read a

496
00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:13,760
Speaker 1: good point I believe it was from the Mary to

497
00:28:14,880 --> 00:28:18,880
Speaker 1: Um about how, like we don't want all male characters

498
00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:22,720
Speaker 1: to be like Captain America. You know, like Ray is

499
00:28:22,840 --> 00:28:27,359
Speaker 1: one type of character, and because they're so rare, I

500
00:28:27,400 --> 00:28:30,080
Speaker 1: guess we're over analyzing everything about it. But she doesn't

501
00:28:30,119 --> 00:28:33,720
Speaker 1: have to be this perfect written character. You know. Well,

502
00:28:33,800 --> 00:28:35,879
Speaker 1: that's a great argument for why we need more female

503
00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:39,400
Speaker 1: representation because if there's not that many, the one who

504
00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:41,720
Speaker 1: we the ones who we have, they're gonna be picked apart,

505
00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:43,480
Speaker 1: and so it's going to be you know, are they

506
00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:46,240
Speaker 1: this or they that? And if we had more, characters

507
00:28:46,280 --> 00:28:48,160
Speaker 1: could just sort of exist and you wouldn't have to

508
00:28:48,200 --> 00:28:51,200
Speaker 1: sort of be asked in every interview you know what

509
00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:53,040
Speaker 1: about this? You know, tell me about your character, what

510
00:28:53,120 --> 00:28:54,800
Speaker 1: do you think about gender? All of that, Like like

511
00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:56,880
Speaker 1: you said earlier, it would just be something that exists

512
00:28:56,920 --> 00:28:58,640
Speaker 1: and not something that has to be sort of picked apart.

513
00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:01,040
Speaker 1: Even though I recognize the irony that we're doing a

514
00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:06,440
Speaker 1: podcast basically doing that, whatever, I think we're picking apart

515
00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:12,200
Speaker 1: more of like the reaction, yeah, I mean, I'm yeah. Um. Also,

516
00:29:12,240 --> 00:29:14,320
Speaker 1: I'll pick up part any media that I love. I'm

517
00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:17,400
Speaker 1: that type of person, but I A good exercise I

518
00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:19,440
Speaker 1: found is to imagine her as a white male character

519
00:29:19,480 --> 00:29:21,320
Speaker 1: and to see if you'd have the same issues cropping

520
00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:24,680
Speaker 1: up with him, this white male character being too good,

521
00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:28,800
Speaker 1: it's something or too many things. That's a good exercise

522
00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:30,800
Speaker 1: is that the any did you come up with that?

523
00:29:31,960 --> 00:29:33,680
Speaker 1: I feel like probably a lot of people have had

524
00:29:33,760 --> 00:29:37,240
Speaker 1: this thought, but I had. I did have the thought

525
00:29:37,360 --> 00:29:41,720
Speaker 1: my brain a Star Wars test. You know, you feel weird,

526
00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:45,520
Speaker 1: ask or something. See what it tells you. An tests

527
00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:49,480
Speaker 1: should coin that. Yes, can we make any money off

528
00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:52,160
Speaker 1: of it? We're all about making the money. And as

529
00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:55,440
Speaker 1: reported by the Mary Suit about this whole Mary su thing,

530
00:29:55,720 --> 00:29:59,480
Speaker 1: a group called down with Disney's treatment of franchises and

531
00:29:59,640 --> 00:30:02,840
Speaker 1: It's and boys raised an army of bots to tank

532
00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:05,960
Speaker 1: The last jedis the which is the sequel to The

533
00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:10,720
Speaker 1: Force Awakens Um Rotten Tomato score why according to them,

534
00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:15,560
Speaker 1: quote introducing more female characters into the franchises universe, making

535
00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:18,280
Speaker 1: one of the male characters quote a victim of anti

536
00:30:18,440 --> 00:30:25,040
Speaker 1: Man's planning movement. The two main male characters might quote

537
00:30:25,280 --> 00:30:28,920
Speaker 1: turn gay. Oh my god, oh my god. Okay, this

538
00:30:29,080 --> 00:30:35,080
Speaker 1: is something that I mean, I the the amount of

539
00:30:36,400 --> 00:30:38,240
Speaker 1: vitriol I have for people that do this kind of

540
00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:42,040
Speaker 1: thing is vast, and you see it so often. They

541
00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:44,400
Speaker 1: did the same thing with The Black Panther, where people

542
00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:47,520
Speaker 1: wanted to not people I guess white men who were

543
00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:53,040
Speaker 1: who were annoying. How dare this one movie have black characters?

544
00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:56,239
Speaker 1: And oh god, I know the worst. But I mean,

545
00:30:56,840 --> 00:31:00,400
Speaker 1: this is a level of protectiveness I think you see

546
00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:03,160
Speaker 1: in a lot of sort of fan cultures where you know,

547
00:31:03,280 --> 00:31:04,880
Speaker 1: it's it's cool to have something that you like and

548
00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:07,080
Speaker 1: you protective of it, but it can really easily spit

549
00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:09,680
Speaker 1: out into something that's super toxic. And it's it's super

550
00:31:09,800 --> 00:31:14,360
Speaker 1: toxic too, have a coordinated campaign to tank the reviews

551
00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:16,520
Speaker 1: and the scores of this film, Like that's if you

552
00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:20,320
Speaker 1: find yourself doing that, take a step back and look

553
00:31:20,360 --> 00:31:25,680
Speaker 1: at yourself. I mean, come on, yeah, it's not yours.

554
00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:29,040
Speaker 1: That what's always gotten to me, Like, it's not yours,

555
00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:33,080
Speaker 1: not yours, everybody, it's everybody's. And the more people, I

556
00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:35,680
Speaker 1: would hope and think, the more people that enjoy it,

557
00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:37,840
Speaker 1: that enjoy something you like, even if it is in

558
00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:39,920
Speaker 1: a different way that maybe it's not the same as yours,

559
00:31:40,400 --> 00:31:43,080
Speaker 1: but they still like it, and can't we all share

560
00:31:43,080 --> 00:31:45,320
Speaker 1: in this enjoyment of the thing and instead of trying

561
00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:48,000
Speaker 1: to exclude people or I could do a whole feel

562
00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:52,440
Speaker 1: about fan entitlement um, especially as since I am a

563
00:31:52,560 --> 00:31:55,000
Speaker 1: nerd and a woman, I get s so many times

564
00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:58,240
Speaker 1: to prove. Like, see you wearing a Star Wars shirt?

565
00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:01,520
Speaker 1: You like Star Wars? So tell me where was? What

566
00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:05,800
Speaker 1: planet is? How old is you? What? What was the

567
00:32:05,920 --> 00:32:08,040
Speaker 1: name of the production assistant? And what high school did

568
00:32:08,080 --> 00:32:10,040
Speaker 1: he go to? In the empire strikes back, Oh, you

569
00:32:10,120 --> 00:32:13,320
Speaker 1: don't know. I got you were a fan. That's I mean,

570
00:32:13,360 --> 00:32:15,440
Speaker 1: I I get that too, Like you know, being a

571
00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:18,560
Speaker 1: music fan. That's like if you're wearing like, uh, you know,

572
00:32:18,720 --> 00:32:22,280
Speaker 1: a short of any band? Dudes love to test you.

573
00:32:22,360 --> 00:32:24,880
Speaker 1: But what's funny is that I guarantee that nine of

574
00:32:25,000 --> 00:32:27,480
Speaker 1: ten dudes out there and I welcome the challenge. So

575
00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:29,400
Speaker 1: you see me in a bar, feel free to challenge me.

576
00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:31,960
Speaker 1: I know more about music than them, and I love

577
00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:34,480
Speaker 1: luring the men like oh yeah, Like, ask me some

578
00:32:34,640 --> 00:32:38,200
Speaker 1: questions so that I can dance circles around you with

579
00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:39,760
Speaker 1: my knowledge, and I bet you do the same thing.

580
00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:44,120
Speaker 1: You're like Oh yeah, please please challenge me, sir, so

581
00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:46,480
Speaker 1: I can show you how much more I know about

582
00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:49,120
Speaker 1: this than you and embarrass you and make you rue

583
00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:51,800
Speaker 1: the day you ever came up and talk to me. Yeah.

584
00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:54,440
Speaker 1: I feel like you're a hustler like instead of a

585
00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:59,800
Speaker 1: pool hustler. Hustler, I love when you do. You win

586
00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:03,160
Speaker 1: those battles and then they kind of are like, well,

587
00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:06,880
Speaker 1: I mean, I guess you know some things, but I

588
00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:11,840
Speaker 1: probably know more. They just kind of walk away. Okay, Cool,

589
00:33:11,920 --> 00:33:17,680
Speaker 1: that was a fun interaction. Um, and we'll we'll come

590
00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:19,400
Speaker 1: back to the last Jedi in a second, and we'll

591
00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:23,680
Speaker 1: come back to even more fun angry response to it.

592
00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:28,080
Speaker 1: But there's another movie we need to touch on, and chronologically,

593
00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:31,440
Speaker 1: Star Wars can get very confusing, and I think bridget

594
00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:33,720
Speaker 1: you and I should have a like Star Wars night.

595
00:33:33,840 --> 00:33:35,800
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna you're gonna have to let me nerd

596
00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:40,200
Speaker 1: out for like twenty minutes and then I'll leave you alone. Um. So,

597
00:33:42,080 --> 00:33:44,920
Speaker 1: you get The Fource Awakens, you get Rogue one, which

598
00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:49,520
Speaker 1: is actually a prequel to a New Hope anyway. Um.

599
00:33:50,080 --> 00:33:53,440
Speaker 1: Felicity Jones plays the main character Jin er So, who

600
00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:56,640
Speaker 1: is tough. She's a fighter. She's a leader. And what's

601
00:33:56,680 --> 00:33:58,480
Speaker 1: interesting about her is that if you look at the

602
00:33:58,520 --> 00:34:01,480
Speaker 1: Star Wars films preceding her, there's always kind of a

603
00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:05,280
Speaker 1: pair thing happening. Um, but this is not really the

604
00:34:05,320 --> 00:34:08,440
Speaker 1: case in Rogue one. There are pairs, but she's the

605
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:13,880
Speaker 1: main character. The story revolves around her, and um, there

606
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:16,120
Speaker 1: is kind of a romance, but I would argue it's

607
00:34:16,120 --> 00:34:18,800
Speaker 1: like not even really a romance. It's just not the

608
00:34:18,880 --> 00:34:23,319
Speaker 1: main point. And it's pretty much her story and not um,

609
00:34:23,840 --> 00:34:28,200
Speaker 1: not even partner pairs like Han and Luke or Leah

610
00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:31,160
Speaker 1: and Han or like it was her and that was

611
00:34:31,320 --> 00:34:36,520
Speaker 1: the first time that's happened in the Star Wars universe. Um.

612
00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:39,759
Speaker 1: And she wears practical combat stuff and she's very successful

613
00:34:39,760 --> 00:34:43,279
Speaker 1: in combat. You keep mentioning the costuming, and that's a

614
00:34:43,320 --> 00:34:45,359
Speaker 1: small thing, but it isn't really a small thing when

615
00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:47,560
Speaker 1: you think about it, Like when you when if you

616
00:34:47,640 --> 00:34:49,760
Speaker 1: grew up watching movies or women fight and they're always

617
00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:53,879
Speaker 1: in bikinis or outfits that make no sense. Even that small,

618
00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:57,880
Speaker 1: the detail like the costuming does signal we understand that

619
00:34:58,200 --> 00:35:00,680
Speaker 1: that we have been treating with female care actors in

620
00:35:00,800 --> 00:35:04,640
Speaker 1: this weird, gross way. With this weird, gross gaze and

621
00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:07,000
Speaker 1: we're stepping away from that. Like even a small detail

622
00:35:07,080 --> 00:35:10,479
Speaker 1: like that does seem to show some sort of progress. Yeah,

623
00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:14,959
Speaker 1: and I will say from a personal level, I wasn't

624
00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:17,200
Speaker 1: until I got to college that I realized how much

625
00:35:17,400 --> 00:35:20,560
Speaker 1: like seeing those images of women sexualized but in kind

626
00:35:20,600 --> 00:35:23,919
Speaker 1: of like a weird it's okay way because they're also

627
00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:27,880
Speaker 1: strong had impacted me because it still is telling you like, ultimately,

628
00:35:28,840 --> 00:35:31,760
Speaker 1: it's your body and your looks is where your value

629
00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:34,399
Speaker 1: is and that's why you're here. You might be able

630
00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:37,920
Speaker 1: to do this stuff and that's cool, but it's your body.

631
00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:41,880
Speaker 1: Even if you're Laura Cross and you're super talented and

632
00:35:41,960 --> 00:35:44,520
Speaker 1: super you know, tactical, you gotta be wearing like a

633
00:35:44,560 --> 00:35:47,640
Speaker 1: sexy outfit. Yeah, and again I'm all about wearing a

634
00:35:47,680 --> 00:35:51,640
Speaker 1: sexy outfit. But it's just like in fighting, situations are

635
00:35:51,680 --> 00:35:55,440
Speaker 1: all the time, constant when it doesn't make sense. That's

636
00:35:55,480 --> 00:35:58,760
Speaker 1: why it's refreshing to see, Oh, she's in practical clothes

637
00:35:58,880 --> 00:36:01,759
Speaker 1: for the situation she is in. It always reminds me

638
00:36:01,920 --> 00:36:04,200
Speaker 1: of this idea of suspension of disbelief. Right when you

639
00:36:04,280 --> 00:36:06,600
Speaker 1: watch a movie, you're supposed to be sort of immersed

640
00:36:06,640 --> 00:36:08,560
Speaker 1: in this world and details like that that are like

641
00:36:08,880 --> 00:36:11,719
Speaker 1: make no sense. It's almost like a continuity issue. But

642
00:36:11,800 --> 00:36:14,920
Speaker 1: it just goes to show that her looking sexy is

643
00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:17,520
Speaker 1: more important than the movie making sense in a kind

644
00:36:17,560 --> 00:36:19,760
Speaker 1: of way, right, Like this would never happen in reality,

645
00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:25,759
Speaker 1: but the filmmakers care less about that, about maintaining the

646
00:36:25,840 --> 00:36:28,320
Speaker 1: integrity of the universe they have belt than they do

647
00:36:28,600 --> 00:36:32,319
Speaker 1: about you know, sexy ladies. Yeah, but it also goes

648
00:36:32,400 --> 00:36:36,239
Speaker 1: to show how um commonplace it is that we don't

649
00:36:36,280 --> 00:36:38,319
Speaker 1: really question it so much, like, well, yeah, of course

650
00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:40,319
Speaker 1: she's going to be no sexy thing. She's a hot

651
00:36:40,400 --> 00:36:43,439
Speaker 1: lady and she's the lady in this group. So that's

652
00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:47,360
Speaker 1: just how it goes. So I'm I'm glad that we're

653
00:36:47,440 --> 00:36:49,440
Speaker 1: moving away from that. And I gotta say I love

654
00:36:49,520 --> 00:36:54,320
Speaker 1: the costuming of like Jenner. So she looks badass. You

655
00:36:54,440 --> 00:36:57,279
Speaker 1: can you can have you can look good and still

656
00:36:57,360 --> 00:37:02,760
Speaker 1: be practical. Yeah. Okay, so we have even more, even

657
00:37:02,880 --> 00:37:06,160
Speaker 1: more um. But first, one last quick break for a

658
00:37:06,200 --> 00:37:20,120
Speaker 1: word from our sponsor, and we're back, Thank you sponsor. Okay.

659
00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:26,440
Speaker 1: Now we arrive at the last Jedi, and as that

660
00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:30,239
Speaker 1: terrified fanboy group decried um, this one did introduce more

661
00:37:30,360 --> 00:37:35,000
Speaker 1: female characters. You've got Rose who took nobis, Admiral Holdo

662
00:37:35,040 --> 00:37:40,080
Speaker 1: who took no bis, especially from quote trigger happy fly Boys. Yeah,

663
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:44,080
Speaker 1: it bought Bacalaia now a commander who takes no bs,

664
00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:47,200
Speaker 1: and right of course, who took no bs. Um. And

665
00:37:47,560 --> 00:37:50,040
Speaker 1: that's the most in the main cast of any Star

666
00:37:50,120 --> 00:37:52,880
Speaker 1: Wars film to date. I love that. So I love

667
00:37:52,960 --> 00:37:56,719
Speaker 1: that they put Leia and Ray kind of in conversation. Yeah, yeah,

668
00:37:56,840 --> 00:38:02,320
Speaker 1: that's cool. Yeah, and um, Admiral holder and Leiah are friends.

669
00:38:02,360 --> 00:38:05,560
Speaker 1: And then it was like the first female stars friendship

670
00:38:05,600 --> 00:38:08,000
Speaker 1: and they just have conversations where they're both leaders trying

671
00:38:08,000 --> 00:38:10,359
Speaker 1: to accomplish this thing, but they're friendly with each other.

672
00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:14,200
Speaker 1: And it's wild that that is. So it's wild that

673
00:38:14,320 --> 00:38:18,080
Speaker 1: that's wild. Yeah exactly. I was watching it like whoa, whoa,

674
00:38:19,120 --> 00:38:24,840
Speaker 1: what's happening? Um. It has been called the most feminist

675
00:38:25,040 --> 00:38:28,560
Speaker 1: Star Wars yet. Anna Smith of The Guardian wrote, both

676
00:38:28,600 --> 00:38:30,840
Speaker 1: in terms of women and non white characters, there's a

677
00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:36,200
Speaker 1: celebratory inclusiveness that seems entirely in the Jedi spirit. Documentarian

678
00:38:36,360 --> 00:38:39,680
Speaker 1: analees A. Fillion wrote The Last Jedi depicts women as

679
00:38:39,840 --> 00:38:45,560
Speaker 1: multifaceted multigenerational, multiracial. There are women in strong leadership leadership

680
00:38:45,600 --> 00:38:50,640
Speaker 1: positions and women who occupy student learner positions. Yeah. So

681
00:38:50,800 --> 00:38:53,880
Speaker 1: I love how she's broken this down because again, it

682
00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:57,000
Speaker 1: sort of reflects how women work in teams where you

683
00:38:57,080 --> 00:38:59,080
Speaker 1: have you know. That's why I love the fact that

684
00:38:59,120 --> 00:39:01,200
Speaker 1: they brought Carrie Fisher back to you know, be in

685
00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:04,400
Speaker 1: conversation with another strong female leader. It really seems to

686
00:39:04,480 --> 00:39:07,480
Speaker 1: reflect the dynamic that women have in workplaces and sort

687
00:39:07,520 --> 00:39:11,200
Speaker 1: of mentorship and peers and you know, getting along or

688
00:39:11,280 --> 00:39:12,840
Speaker 1: like maybe you don't get along, but you're still you

689
00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:16,320
Speaker 1: still respect for each other. I love that it's a

690
00:39:16,400 --> 00:39:21,040
Speaker 1: really multifaceted illustration of women on teams together and women

691
00:39:21,160 --> 00:39:23,919
Speaker 1: leading together. Yeah. I love it too, And I hadn't

692
00:39:23,960 --> 00:39:28,200
Speaker 1: really considered, Um, I was telling you yesterday, Rig that

693
00:39:28,600 --> 00:39:30,840
Speaker 1: doing the research for this episode made me appreciate this

694
00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:34,279
Speaker 1: movie even more because when I first saw it, Um,

695
00:39:34,640 --> 00:39:36,560
Speaker 1: it's all about failure and it's a very difficult movie

696
00:39:36,600 --> 00:39:38,960
Speaker 1: to watch in my opinion, it was. And plus Luke

697
00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:43,920
Speaker 1: Skywalker my crush. Well, anyway, I gotta I gotta tell y'all,

698
00:39:44,000 --> 00:39:46,759
Speaker 1: I ran into Annie in the bathroom here at the

699
00:39:46,800 --> 00:39:49,200
Speaker 1: studio yesterday and we were talking about this in the

700
00:39:49,239 --> 00:39:51,960
Speaker 1: bathroom and you were like, I almost can't watch it again.

701
00:39:52,800 --> 00:39:56,840
Speaker 1: I can't. It's tough because it's all about it is

702
00:39:56,880 --> 00:39:59,600
Speaker 1: about failure, and Um, I didn't realize until I was

703
00:39:59,680 --> 00:40:01,760
Speaker 1: doing this research said, a lot of it is about

704
00:40:01,800 --> 00:40:05,640
Speaker 1: shutting down man's planing. Um. The fanboy group pulls right

705
00:40:06,520 --> 00:40:10,279
Speaker 1: about that. So much of it is like after after

706
00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:13,200
Speaker 1: me and my friends saw it. One of the characters Po,

707
00:40:13,360 --> 00:40:16,600
Speaker 1: who's very likable, UM, and that that's important is that

708
00:40:16,680 --> 00:40:19,520
Speaker 1: he's likable. We all like him. But he keeps making

709
00:40:19,560 --> 00:40:21,800
Speaker 1: these mistakes and he's not listening to Leo when she

710
00:40:21,960 --> 00:40:25,400
Speaker 1: gives him orders. He's not listening to Holdo and she

711
00:40:25,560 --> 00:40:27,879
Speaker 1: gives him orders. He does all these things and kind

712
00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:32,799
Speaker 1: of ruins everything, kind of keeps messing up plan after

713
00:40:32,920 --> 00:40:36,560
Speaker 1: plan after plan. Sounds familiar, Like I know some of

714
00:40:36,640 --> 00:40:39,799
Speaker 1: these types. But see, it's great because we like him.

715
00:40:40,080 --> 00:40:41,759
Speaker 1: It's better to see it because if it's a villain,

716
00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:44,239
Speaker 1: you can just dismiss it. Yeah, exactly. So if he

717
00:40:44,600 --> 00:40:47,200
Speaker 1: because he's likable and he seems like a nice enough guy.

718
00:40:47,840 --> 00:40:50,480
Speaker 1: When there's somebody in your life who was being toxic

719
00:40:50,600 --> 00:40:53,520
Speaker 1: and sexist and racist or whatever. Sometimes it is, or

720
00:40:53,600 --> 00:40:56,000
Speaker 1: I would say probably more often than not, it's someone

721
00:40:56,080 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 1: who you you know, maybe like or do you feel like, Oh,

722
00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:01,600
Speaker 1: he's not a bad person, not a bad guy. So

723
00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:05,200
Speaker 1: it's it's good to have the character who keeps, you know,

724
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:07,479
Speaker 1: up for lack of a better word, and not listening

725
00:41:07,520 --> 00:41:10,160
Speaker 1: to women, be sort of someone who seems nice enough,

726
00:41:10,360 --> 00:41:13,240
Speaker 1: not like this scary, awful villain, because that that author

727
00:41:13,320 --> 00:41:16,719
Speaker 1: rises those those sentiments like those are sentiments that we

728
00:41:16,760 --> 00:41:18,920
Speaker 1: associate with someone who's a bad guy. I'm not a

729
00:41:19,000 --> 00:41:23,319
Speaker 1: bad guy, therefore I'm fine, you know. Yeah, And um,

730
00:41:24,040 --> 00:41:26,960
Speaker 1: he has a character arc and he kind of sees

731
00:41:27,320 --> 00:41:29,440
Speaker 1: I have made all of these mistakes and now I

732
00:41:29,560 --> 00:41:32,600
Speaker 1: really need to shut up and listen. Um. But after

733
00:41:32,680 --> 00:41:35,800
Speaker 1: I left, like, but your minds a buzz with what

734
00:41:35,920 --> 00:41:37,759
Speaker 1: we've just seen. And my friend turned to me and

735
00:41:38,280 --> 00:41:41,640
Speaker 1: I dropped a bucket of popcorn, and she turned to

736
00:41:41,680 --> 00:41:43,640
Speaker 1: me and she said, you really powed it up, which

737
00:41:43,719 --> 00:41:46,400
Speaker 1: is the name of the character. And I didn't realize

738
00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:49,040
Speaker 1: until we're doing this, like, oh, my gosh, man's planning

739
00:41:49,320 --> 00:41:56,480
Speaker 1: oh powing it up. Um. As you can imagine, there

740
00:41:56,600 --> 00:42:01,719
Speaker 1: was so much fanboy backlash tweets like the movie was garbage.

741
00:42:02,200 --> 00:42:06,680
Speaker 1: They're making movies now for feminists in mainland China. The

742
00:42:06,800 --> 00:42:09,800
Speaker 1: rest of us don't matter, I guess for exclamation points

743
00:42:10,680 --> 00:42:15,720
Speaker 1: or too much comedy and social justice warrior references, especially

744
00:42:15,800 --> 00:42:19,720
Speaker 1: by Vice Admiral Purple Hair on the resistance in quotes

745
00:42:20,280 --> 00:42:22,680
Speaker 1: in all calves and quote this of all, if you're

746
00:42:22,680 --> 00:42:24,319
Speaker 1: trying to emphasize the word in a tweet, you don't

747
00:42:24,320 --> 00:42:26,600
Speaker 1: need both. You can or you can do all caps.

748
00:42:26,680 --> 00:42:29,520
Speaker 1: You do not need both. That's egregious. Yeah. Now I'm

749
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:31,880
Speaker 1: like questioning, what if this is a joke tweet. I

750
00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:34,279
Speaker 1: don't know. I mean, look at it. I mean, that's

751
00:42:34,360 --> 00:42:38,120
Speaker 1: really it's too much. It's too much. It was clearly

752
00:42:38,239 --> 00:42:41,680
Speaker 1: aimed at at real Donald Trump and his supporters. Thanks

753
00:42:41,680 --> 00:42:46,280
Speaker 1: for ruining the Star Wars franchise, Disney, And has anyone

754
00:42:46,400 --> 00:42:49,880
Speaker 1: noticed that the new Star Wars series is all feminist propaganda?

755
00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:52,720
Speaker 1: Oh my god. First of all, I love this idea

756
00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:57,719
Speaker 1: that feminists are this underground sleeper cell network that's very powerful,

757
00:42:57,880 --> 00:43:01,239
Speaker 1: that we're churning out propaganda to make more feminists and

758
00:43:01,480 --> 00:43:06,120
Speaker 1: we have meetings underground Disney. I mean, I love this

759
00:43:06,239 --> 00:43:08,759
Speaker 1: reality where we have all this power, you know, you

760
00:43:08,840 --> 00:43:10,759
Speaker 1: know we have that we have a you know, a

761
00:43:10,800 --> 00:43:13,200
Speaker 1: bug in the year of big time executives at Disney.

762
00:43:13,520 --> 00:43:15,800
Speaker 1: I wish that was the case, or maybe it is

763
00:43:15,920 --> 00:43:18,160
Speaker 1: the case. Let's not say too much. Yeah, I don't wanna,

764
00:43:18,239 --> 00:43:22,480
Speaker 1: I don't wanna. Don't give too much away. Um, And

765
00:43:22,920 --> 00:43:24,880
Speaker 1: this is something I did want to know, is um

766
00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:28,400
Speaker 1: and most likely unnecessarily, but in all cases, you cannot

767
00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:31,480
Speaker 1: like the movie. Um. There are problems with all of them,

768
00:43:31,600 --> 00:43:35,799
Speaker 1: legitimate critiques. I had problems with um most of them,

769
00:43:36,040 --> 00:43:38,040
Speaker 1: and especially some of the new ones. But we're looking

770
00:43:38,080 --> 00:43:39,920
Speaker 1: here specifically at people who found the problem with it

771
00:43:39,960 --> 00:43:42,719
Speaker 1: because it was feminist, or because they were looking at

772
00:43:43,080 --> 00:43:45,520
Speaker 1: the female characters in this way that we do not

773
00:43:45,640 --> 00:43:47,960
Speaker 1: look at male characters, are judging them through that way.

774
00:43:48,800 --> 00:43:52,719
Speaker 1: Totally cool to not like a movie for like legitimate,

775
00:43:53,560 --> 00:43:58,759
Speaker 1: non non sexist reason. Yeah, yeah, I think that's an

776
00:43:58,840 --> 00:44:01,719
Speaker 1: important point to make, because you don't make anyone is

777
00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:04,400
Speaker 1: saying you have to like this movie, but not liking

778
00:44:04,480 --> 00:44:09,000
Speaker 1: it specifically because it has too many women is really yeah. Yeah,

779
00:44:09,160 --> 00:44:11,080
Speaker 1: And again, like going back to that Mary Sue argument,

780
00:44:11,160 --> 00:44:14,160
Speaker 1: if you're saying you think the character of Ray is

781
00:44:14,239 --> 00:44:20,160
Speaker 1: underdeveloped or poorly written. Yeah, yeah, that's that's different than

782
00:44:20,239 --> 00:44:24,239
Speaker 1: she's a Mary Sue, and I a man would never

783
00:44:25,920 --> 00:44:28,120
Speaker 1: Oh I did read? Oh wait, I have it right here.

784
00:44:28,440 --> 00:44:33,520
Speaker 1: Here's a quote. Here's a quote from American Greatness. For

785
00:44:33,760 --> 00:44:37,080
Speaker 1: Ray to truly struggle, to encounter an internal crisis that

786
00:44:37,120 --> 00:44:39,719
Speaker 1: would develop her as a character would be to make

787
00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:42,600
Speaker 1: her vulnerable and thus more of a woman, but less

788
00:44:42,800 --> 00:44:46,320
Speaker 1: of a feminist hero. So screenwriter and director Ryan Johnson

789
00:44:46,400 --> 00:44:50,279
Speaker 1: perchure of weakness and dependency, and the filmmakers desire to

790
00:44:50,320 --> 00:44:53,400
Speaker 1: paint her as a feminist badass and girl power boss

791
00:44:53,480 --> 00:44:56,359
Speaker 1: bitch who can take care of herself, Thank you very much.

792
00:44:56,800 --> 00:45:00,600
Speaker 1: Johnson leaves with a lonely and utterly rootless woman crammed

793
00:45:00,640 --> 00:45:04,640
Speaker 1: into a hyper masculine role. This portrayal doesn't work because

794
00:45:04,719 --> 00:45:08,600
Speaker 1: men and women are not interchangeable. Neither are the masculine

795
00:45:08,600 --> 00:45:12,200
Speaker 1: and feminine hero miss. The feminist effort to chevret and

796
00:45:12,239 --> 00:45:17,200
Speaker 1: to the masculine journey results in an essentially transgendered, unnatural,

797
00:45:17,360 --> 00:45:21,759
Speaker 1: and corrupt character, but beyond her in authenticity as a

798
00:45:21,840 --> 00:45:25,360
Speaker 1: masculine hero raised perfection and are cross dressing deprived. The

799
00:45:25,400 --> 00:45:31,360
Speaker 1: film of another crucial element. Wow, I could have quoted

800
00:45:31,400 --> 00:45:33,400
Speaker 1: that whole argument. There was so much there that I

801
00:45:33,440 --> 00:45:38,000
Speaker 1: was reading, like, he cannot be as serious. He's totally serious.

802
00:45:38,960 --> 00:45:41,000
Speaker 1: I was laughing aloud at some of it because I thought,

803
00:45:41,080 --> 00:45:43,480
Speaker 1: no way can someone right this seriously? Yeah, I mean

804
00:45:43,560 --> 00:45:48,000
Speaker 1: that's that's the most intense thing I've ever read. I mean,

805
00:45:48,120 --> 00:45:53,560
Speaker 1: Star Wars brings out the intensity, but that's essentially what

806
00:45:53,640 --> 00:45:55,600
Speaker 1: I'm saying. If you if you got problems with it

807
00:45:56,040 --> 00:45:58,440
Speaker 1: because you think it's poorly written, okay, but if you've

808
00:45:58,480 --> 00:46:00,880
Speaker 1: got problems with it because of something like this, that

809
00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:03,040
Speaker 1: you think that you know she's a I mean, he

810
00:46:03,120 --> 00:46:07,440
Speaker 1: just he describes her as transgendered. He says, essentially transgendered.

811
00:46:09,320 --> 00:46:12,359
Speaker 1: A wild thing to say that is that is such

812
00:46:12,400 --> 00:46:14,799
Speaker 1: a wild thing to say. And he even points out

813
00:46:14,920 --> 00:46:17,239
Speaker 1: her her clothes. I don't know if it was in

814
00:46:17,320 --> 00:46:20,160
Speaker 1: that quote, but he does, he pointed it out. He says, yeah,

815
00:46:20,160 --> 00:46:23,520
Speaker 1: he says that her quote cross dressing by the film

816
00:46:23,600 --> 00:46:26,440
Speaker 1: of Romance. Like, I just think that even the language

817
00:46:26,480 --> 00:46:29,160
Speaker 1: that he uses to break this up down is almost

818
00:46:29,200 --> 00:46:31,719
Speaker 1: I almost find it shocking. Yeah, I really want to

819
00:46:31,760 --> 00:46:36,000
Speaker 1: know what woman hurt this guy, Like what strong feminist

820
00:46:36,160 --> 00:46:40,000
Speaker 1: character who wasn't vulnerable and I was dressed like a man.

821
00:46:41,000 --> 00:46:44,279
Speaker 1: This guy I don't know, Bridget will never know. Um

822
00:46:45,440 --> 00:46:47,960
Speaker 1: Holda was a She was a character. She's played by

823
00:46:48,000 --> 00:46:52,480
Speaker 1: Laura Dern. I love Laura um And she had purple

824
00:46:52,520 --> 00:46:54,400
Speaker 1: hair and jewelry and kind of a nice dress, and

825
00:46:54,520 --> 00:46:58,400
Speaker 1: she drew a lot of criticism. And I think the

826
00:46:58,480 --> 00:47:01,160
Speaker 1: reason a lot of the fanboys really had a problem

827
00:47:01,200 --> 00:47:03,919
Speaker 1: with her, it's because she was feminized, but also because

828
00:47:03,960 --> 00:47:06,719
Speaker 1: she kind of came in and then told Poe that

829
00:47:07,080 --> 00:47:10,680
Speaker 1: the male character that's pretty likable. I'm in I'm in

830
00:47:10,800 --> 00:47:13,160
Speaker 1: charge now and you're gonna do what I say, And

831
00:47:13,680 --> 00:47:18,000
Speaker 1: nobody none of these angry fan boys liked that. I

832
00:47:18,120 --> 00:47:20,160
Speaker 1: also think it's interesting, going back to one of the

833
00:47:20,280 --> 00:47:23,040
Speaker 1: angry fanboy tweets that you shared earlier in the episode,

834
00:47:23,239 --> 00:47:26,440
Speaker 1: that he specifically says, oh with her purple hair. I

835
00:47:26,480 --> 00:47:29,759
Speaker 1: almost wonder if it's something about her presentation, because when

836
00:47:29,760 --> 00:47:33,040
Speaker 1: you wouldn't as someone who has been screamed at by

837
00:47:33,560 --> 00:47:36,399
Speaker 1: white dudes on the internet for being a quote social

838
00:47:36,480 --> 00:47:40,320
Speaker 1: justice warrior or a feminist or whatever. Um, they definitely

839
00:47:40,440 --> 00:47:44,440
Speaker 1: do have a stereotype of you know, oh, you're a shrill,

840
00:47:44,480 --> 00:47:48,279
Speaker 1: angry feminist. Purple hair, you know, septim piercing, you know,

841
00:47:49,400 --> 00:47:51,600
Speaker 1: you dress a certain way. And I almost wonder if

842
00:47:51,719 --> 00:47:54,120
Speaker 1: because she has purple hair and wears jewelry, if that

843
00:47:54,280 --> 00:47:56,879
Speaker 1: that sort of there's a connection there where the kind

844
00:47:56,880 --> 00:47:59,880
Speaker 1: of dudes who shout at feminists on Twitter like oh

845
00:48:00,120 --> 00:48:03,160
Speaker 1: you and your purple hair and and jewelry and knows piercing.

846
00:48:03,480 --> 00:48:05,359
Speaker 1: You see that and they're like, Ah, it's that girl

847
00:48:05,440 --> 00:48:08,440
Speaker 1: from Twitter. And now she's lecturing me about man's bleeding

848
00:48:08,600 --> 00:48:11,680
Speaker 1: and tell this guy what to do. My worst nightmare

849
00:48:11,840 --> 00:48:15,799
Speaker 1: realized on screen is happening now. It's playing out before

850
00:48:15,840 --> 00:48:20,279
Speaker 1: my very eyes. Um. I read from Laura Dern. She

851
00:48:20,600 --> 00:48:24,520
Speaker 1: kind of discussed this because it was a pretty visceral backlash,

852
00:48:25,400 --> 00:48:29,560
Speaker 1: um from a small like it's actually a very small contingent.

853
00:48:29,600 --> 00:48:31,120
Speaker 1: They just have a loud voice, as I'm sure you're

854
00:48:31,239 --> 00:48:33,560
Speaker 1: familiar with. But she she spoke to that and she

855
00:48:33,640 --> 00:48:35,360
Speaker 1: said it was very important to her and also the

856
00:48:35,440 --> 00:48:40,000
Speaker 1: director and screenwriter Ryan Johnson that she be not I

857
00:48:40,040 --> 00:48:43,560
Speaker 1: mean necessarily feminized, but that she'd be kind of there's

858
00:48:43,640 --> 00:48:46,319
Speaker 1: feminine hints to her costume, that she had purple hair,

859
00:48:46,400 --> 00:48:48,200
Speaker 1: that she had jewelry, she had a welfinning dress. She

860
00:48:48,640 --> 00:48:50,880
Speaker 1: like we kind of discussed in the Final Girl episode,

861
00:48:51,320 --> 00:48:54,320
Speaker 1: there was this need to make the Final Girl more masculine,

862
00:48:54,360 --> 00:48:58,399
Speaker 1: but they made a deliberate choice here she's feminine. She's

863
00:48:58,440 --> 00:49:01,480
Speaker 1: a good leader song in this episode. We've talked a

864
00:49:01,480 --> 00:49:03,759
Speaker 1: lot about costuming choices and how it is cool in

865
00:49:03,840 --> 00:49:06,239
Speaker 1: movies when women are dressed appropriately for what they're doing.

866
00:49:06,360 --> 00:49:08,800
Speaker 1: So if they're in battle, you know, they're wearing clothes

867
00:49:08,840 --> 00:49:10,760
Speaker 1: that make sense that you would actually wear into battle.

868
00:49:10,960 --> 00:49:13,480
Speaker 1: But I also think it's cool to have female characters

869
00:49:13,520 --> 00:49:16,200
Speaker 1: who are strong leaders who dressed feminine. I don't know,

870
00:49:16,239 --> 00:49:18,040
Speaker 1: I just think that there's not You can be a

871
00:49:18,120 --> 00:49:20,799
Speaker 1: strong leader and still wear jewelry and get your hair

872
00:49:20,920 --> 00:49:23,560
Speaker 1: dyed and enjoy makeup or where heels or whatever. I

873
00:49:23,640 --> 00:49:26,440
Speaker 1: think that that's sort of my my larger point that

874
00:49:26,560 --> 00:49:28,680
Speaker 1: our media should be representative of all of that. So

875
00:49:28,760 --> 00:49:31,440
Speaker 1: whether you're you know, Laura Dern and you're in the

876
00:49:31,560 --> 00:49:34,560
Speaker 1: salon every two weeks to get your roots done there

877
00:49:34,640 --> 00:49:37,360
Speaker 1: and it's important to you or your ray who just

878
00:49:37,440 --> 00:49:39,040
Speaker 1: wears your hair pulled back and you don't have time

879
00:49:39,080 --> 00:49:42,279
Speaker 1: for that nonsense both of those are are strong women

880
00:49:42,360 --> 00:49:45,120
Speaker 1: leaders and both both of those should be represented right.

881
00:49:45,360 --> 00:49:49,800
Speaker 1: And I think one of the key points to is

882
00:49:49,960 --> 00:49:55,080
Speaker 1: that um people just dismissed her, even Um dismissed Holdo.

883
00:49:55,840 --> 00:49:58,080
Speaker 1: Even Poe the character he sees here and he's like,

884
00:49:58,239 --> 00:50:02,600
Speaker 1: that's Admiral Holdo and it says it kind of derisively.

885
00:50:03,480 --> 00:50:07,399
Speaker 1: So just to see someone, in this case a woman,

886
00:50:07,920 --> 00:50:11,000
Speaker 1: just a certain way and that's it, Like, I'm not

887
00:50:11,080 --> 00:50:13,080
Speaker 1: going to take orders from you, or I think this

888
00:50:13,239 --> 00:50:16,439
Speaker 1: character is the lesbian, or you know, just to write

889
00:50:16,480 --> 00:50:20,479
Speaker 1: someone off immediately or to put these whatever you think

890
00:50:20,640 --> 00:50:24,040
Speaker 1: that means, what the how they're dressing on them immediately.

891
00:50:24,320 --> 00:50:27,520
Speaker 1: I think that was a good Um, it was a

892
00:50:27,800 --> 00:50:30,080
Speaker 1: I like that they made this decision to do that

893
00:50:30,239 --> 00:50:33,320
Speaker 1: purposefully for her. And it's it goes back to the

894
00:50:33,360 --> 00:50:37,200
Speaker 1: context thing to write, because Ray is surviving in the desert,

895
00:50:37,440 --> 00:50:40,680
Speaker 1: so she's gonna have to like be in a tunic,

896
00:50:41,320 --> 00:50:46,960
Speaker 1: and pretty much a tunic which I did read was

897
00:50:47,040 --> 00:50:51,759
Speaker 1: slightly it had a belt to accentuate her waist. Nice.

898
00:50:51,840 --> 00:50:56,200
Speaker 1: It sounds comfortable, right, a belted tunic. If I see

899
00:50:56,280 --> 00:50:58,080
Speaker 1: you walking around the office of the belted tunic, I'm

900
00:50:58,120 --> 00:51:00,399
Speaker 1: gonna go get one too. I'm just saying I'm gonna

901
00:51:00,440 --> 00:51:02,360
Speaker 1: hop on the train, but I need someone else to

902
00:51:02,480 --> 00:51:04,440
Speaker 1: take the first. Yes, but first you know, I'll be

903
00:51:04,600 --> 00:51:09,880
Speaker 1: the Rosa Parks and belted tunic perfect perfect. Um. Yeah. So,

904
00:51:10,760 --> 00:51:14,719
Speaker 1: like we said, uh, Poe dismisses her. But if you

905
00:51:14,840 --> 00:51:20,560
Speaker 1: look at Leia Um Leia to she she's somebody who's

906
00:51:20,600 --> 00:51:23,880
Speaker 1: lost most of her family at this point in one

907
00:51:23,880 --> 00:51:26,800
Speaker 1: way or another. UM, and she's still being a strong

908
00:51:26,960 --> 00:51:29,759
Speaker 1: leader in a mentor um. And if you're looking for

909
00:51:29,840 --> 00:51:33,160
Speaker 1: a good female villain, you have Captain FAsMA who menaces

910
00:51:33,239 --> 00:51:38,960
Speaker 1: Hollywood Studios in Disney World. Right now, Ray, you've got her.

911
00:51:39,080 --> 00:51:41,120
Speaker 1: Of course, she grows more powerful and takes on Kyler

912
00:51:41,160 --> 00:51:43,200
Speaker 1: Ren in a fight scene that felt never felt um

913
00:51:43,760 --> 00:51:48,120
Speaker 1: man versus woman, but instead powerful character versus powerful character.

914
00:51:49,040 --> 00:51:52,120
Speaker 1: UM And most of the heroic things done in this

915
00:51:52,239 --> 00:51:55,279
Speaker 1: movie are done by women, from the self sacrifice in

916
00:51:55,360 --> 00:51:58,400
Speaker 1: the very beginning to Ray lifting hell or Rocks with

917
00:51:58,560 --> 00:52:01,839
Speaker 1: her mind at the end, and um. By and large,

918
00:52:01,880 --> 00:52:04,880
Speaker 1: women hold the most powerful positions, ones that they earned.

919
00:52:05,600 --> 00:52:07,160
Speaker 1: Leia might have been born a princess, but she worked

920
00:52:07,200 --> 00:52:09,319
Speaker 1: a way up to the command rank. And I love.

921
00:52:09,360 --> 00:52:12,960
Speaker 1: A comparison I found between Holdo and Leiah Calm collected,

922
00:52:13,040 --> 00:52:17,080
Speaker 1: reasoned and two of the male characters, Kylo Wren and

923
00:52:17,200 --> 00:52:20,239
Speaker 1: General Hucks, who don't have one scene together where they

924
00:52:20,280 --> 00:52:23,239
Speaker 1: aren't fighting um. As the author suggested, it could be

925
00:52:23,280 --> 00:52:25,840
Speaker 1: because both are occupying a position neither earned, yet they

926
00:52:25,920 --> 00:52:31,080
Speaker 1: both feel deserve more. Yeah, yeah, I like that all.

927
00:52:31,120 --> 00:52:36,160
Speaker 1: I was like, oh yeah, um. And that's another funny

928
00:52:36,280 --> 00:52:39,880
Speaker 1: thing um about this is a couple of people mentioned

929
00:52:40,000 --> 00:52:43,239
Speaker 1: that Adam Driver plays Kyler Wren and he has a

930
00:52:43,280 --> 00:52:46,920
Speaker 1: shirtless scene in this movie and it's very surprising, like

931
00:52:47,080 --> 00:52:49,040
Speaker 1: you do not see it coming, or at least I did.

932
00:52:49,120 --> 00:52:53,560
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh my god, and he's ripped but there's

933
00:52:53,600 --> 00:52:56,680
Speaker 1: no It was like kind of like a usually women

934
00:52:56,719 --> 00:53:03,680
Speaker 1: are getting there was he was he chained to someone? No, no,

935
00:53:04,160 --> 00:53:07,760
Speaker 1: but it was a a girl can dream. No, I'm kidding.

936
00:53:09,200 --> 00:53:13,680
Speaker 1: I mean, there's still one more left bridget um. Oh

937
00:53:13,840 --> 00:53:17,160
Speaker 1: and when Ray turns down Kylo Read's offer to the

938
00:53:17,239 --> 00:53:21,680
Speaker 1: galaxy together, he becomes very angry and violent. And I

939
00:53:21,840 --> 00:53:24,799
Speaker 1: bet that sounds familiar to a lot of us, um

940
00:53:25,120 --> 00:53:29,000
Speaker 1: who have turned down a dude, Oh, a dude who

941
00:53:29,080 --> 00:53:32,200
Speaker 1: seems fine later revealing himself to be toxic and violent.

942
00:53:32,800 --> 00:53:38,080
Speaker 1: I don't say I've never heard of that before. So yeah,

943
00:53:38,239 --> 00:53:41,600
Speaker 1: the last Jedi was I. I should watch it again.

944
00:53:41,680 --> 00:53:45,200
Speaker 1: I should get over my hang up about it. What

945
00:53:45,320 --> 00:53:47,520
Speaker 1: we're doing our Star Wars movie night. Yeah, we are,

946
00:53:47,800 --> 00:53:49,520
Speaker 1: we are. It's gonna be so fun. I mean, it's

947
00:53:49,560 --> 00:53:51,640
Speaker 1: gonna be fun for me. I hope, I I hope

948
00:53:51,680 --> 00:53:55,680
Speaker 1: it'll be fun for you. I'm sure we'll be if

949
00:53:55,719 --> 00:53:57,440
Speaker 1: we're If we're looking at the future and there's a

950
00:53:57,520 --> 00:54:02,000
Speaker 1: long Star Wars future ahead of a. UM. If you

951
00:54:02,000 --> 00:54:04,360
Speaker 1: want to find some Star Wars happiness and signs of

952
00:54:04,480 --> 00:54:06,440
Speaker 1: why this whole thing matters? Why do we have a

953
00:54:06,480 --> 00:54:09,960
Speaker 1: whole episode about Star Wars, you can look up hashtag

954
00:54:10,040 --> 00:54:14,239
Speaker 1: star Wars rep matters UM. And I gotta say, like

955
00:54:14,320 --> 00:54:16,200
Speaker 1: I said, the research on all of this helps me

956
00:54:16,280 --> 00:54:20,440
Speaker 1: appreciate the importance of it even more. It's easy to

957
00:54:20,560 --> 00:54:24,480
Speaker 1: kind of just dismiss things as media, but you forget

958
00:54:25,400 --> 00:54:28,160
Speaker 1: when you're especially when you're a child that's seeing those things.

959
00:54:28,920 --> 00:54:33,000
Speaker 1: It's important and it does matter. UM. So I'm happy

960
00:54:33,080 --> 00:54:38,040
Speaker 1: that there moving they're moving forward, they're progressing well. I'm

961
00:54:38,080 --> 00:54:41,200
Speaker 1: happy they're progressing too. Because one of my favorite actors

962
00:54:41,400 --> 00:54:44,520
Speaker 1: flash musicians is going to be a young Lando Calorussian

963
00:54:44,960 --> 00:54:48,600
Speaker 1: Donald Lover, who I love. And I again, I'm happy

964
00:54:48,840 --> 00:54:51,680
Speaker 1: that this representation does not just count for women, that

965
00:54:51,760 --> 00:54:54,920
Speaker 1: it's also for race. It's it's nice to see folks

966
00:54:55,000 --> 00:54:58,320
Speaker 1: of all colors and genders represented. And when they announced

967
00:54:58,320 --> 00:55:01,040
Speaker 1: that Donald Glover was going to be in solo coming out,

968
00:55:02,040 --> 00:55:04,200
Speaker 1: I was super stoked. Yeah, I mean too, I was

969
00:55:04,360 --> 00:55:09,040
Speaker 1: so excited. Um, and uh it has to I am

970
00:55:09,040 --> 00:55:15,000
Speaker 1: assuming pretty lead type female roles both from HBO Amelia

971
00:55:15,120 --> 00:55:19,719
Speaker 1: Clark and Sandy Newton um and the last year I

972
00:55:19,840 --> 00:55:24,400
Speaker 1: get Rose was the first um Asian American lead in

973
00:55:24,520 --> 00:55:31,960
Speaker 1: Star Wars ever. Yeah, so definitely it's good to move forward,

974
00:55:32,680 --> 00:55:37,680
Speaker 1: um with representing all all people, all of us. Well.

975
00:55:37,920 --> 00:55:39,959
Speaker 1: The counter argument that I think is so funny about

976
00:55:40,000 --> 00:55:41,960
Speaker 1: that when people get bent out of shape of you know,

977
00:55:42,040 --> 00:55:44,200
Speaker 1: people of color being in these movies and they're like, oh,

978
00:55:44,320 --> 00:55:47,279
Speaker 1: well there weren't Asian women and black people and blah

979
00:55:47,280 --> 00:55:51,560
Speaker 1: blah blah. It's like a fantasy. And second of all,

980
00:55:51,600 --> 00:55:56,160
Speaker 1: it's like they have it is. Why is it that

981
00:55:56,400 --> 00:55:59,799
Speaker 1: you know your mind can expand to include like oh yeah,

982
00:55:59,800 --> 00:56:05,600
Speaker 1: they're aliens. There's robots, there's that, but Asian women. No, no,

983
00:56:06,080 --> 00:56:12,720
Speaker 1: my mind cannot on that. There's no space. And money wise,

984
00:56:12,840 --> 00:56:15,919
Speaker 1: the Star Wars sequels now with more ladies are they're

985
00:56:15,960 --> 00:56:18,120
Speaker 1: doing just fine. They're not going away. If we look

986
00:56:18,160 --> 00:56:21,399
Speaker 1: at data from box office Mojo from two thousand six

987
00:56:21,560 --> 00:56:24,839
Speaker 1: to um and if we look at the money made

988
00:56:24,920 --> 00:56:27,680
Speaker 1: by movies with a female lead versus a male lead

989
00:56:27,800 --> 00:56:31,120
Speaker 1: and nothing else like cutting out ensembles or robot alien

990
00:56:31,400 --> 00:56:34,759
Speaker 1: not human leads, the data shows that domestically in the US,

991
00:56:34,960 --> 00:56:39,360
Speaker 1: female lead movies made on average one point six million

992
00:56:39,440 --> 00:56:44,480
Speaker 1: dollars as compared to eighty point six million a year

993
00:56:44,960 --> 00:56:49,360
Speaker 1: um made by movies with male leads. So that's a

994
00:56:49,440 --> 00:56:55,120
Speaker 1: pretty that's a pretty sizeable profit margin chunk right there.

995
00:56:55,640 --> 00:56:59,320
Speaker 1: So these those are making money. Yeah, And um, I

996
00:56:59,440 --> 00:57:01,279
Speaker 1: forgot to mend in this fact at the top, but

997
00:57:01,719 --> 00:57:03,840
Speaker 1: I do want to bring it up. Is in the

998
00:57:03,920 --> 00:57:08,040
Speaker 1: first the original trilogy, there were four female roles in

999
00:57:08,200 --> 00:57:11,880
Speaker 1: all three of them, and Princess Lea is one. The

1000
00:57:11,960 --> 00:57:16,120
Speaker 1: other three each had less than a minute of screen time.

1001
00:57:17,040 --> 00:57:22,400
Speaker 1: Logistically it seems difficult to believe, but damn yeah. Yeah,

1002
00:57:23,120 --> 00:57:27,160
Speaker 1: So now we have four women in lead roles in

1003
00:57:27,240 --> 00:57:29,960
Speaker 1: the last Jedi. So I'm I'm that just goes to

1004
00:57:30,000 --> 00:57:33,160
Speaker 1: show how far we've come. Yeah, I mean that is something.

1005
00:57:33,600 --> 00:57:37,600
Speaker 1: It is so things are improving slowly but surely. And

1006
00:57:37,840 --> 00:57:42,560
Speaker 1: here's hoping on this this Star Wars day that it continues. Um.

1007
00:57:42,720 --> 00:57:44,280
Speaker 1: A good next step that I saw from a lot

1008
00:57:44,320 --> 00:57:47,000
Speaker 1: of people would be a female director or one of color.

1009
00:57:47,080 --> 00:57:52,560
Speaker 1: Are both, um and yes, oh I got so excited. Yes,

1010
00:57:52,680 --> 00:57:54,920
Speaker 1: that would be a Star Wars first So I think

1011
00:57:55,000 --> 00:57:57,959
Speaker 1: that would be great. Get getting more women or people

1012
00:57:58,000 --> 00:58:01,480
Speaker 1: of color, all of the above in writing the writing

1013
00:58:01,520 --> 00:58:05,760
Speaker 1: process to just yeah, it's a it should be an

1014
00:58:05,800 --> 00:58:09,280
Speaker 1: inclusive universe because yeah, this guy's aliens and it's this

1015
00:58:09,440 --> 00:58:14,240
Speaker 1: whole wide galaxy, galaxy, galaxy. I mean, it's a galaxy

1016
00:58:14,320 --> 00:58:17,440
Speaker 1: far far away it is. But yet I think we can.

1017
00:58:17,880 --> 00:58:20,560
Speaker 1: I think we can attain it here. That's beautiful, Annie,

1018
00:58:20,760 --> 00:58:24,120
Speaker 1: Thank you. I gotta see these movies. We're gonna do

1019
00:58:24,320 --> 00:58:27,360
Speaker 1: like the craziest movie night. It's gonna be ex I

1020
00:58:27,760 --> 00:58:30,840
Speaker 1: literally can't wait. Awesome. Well, thank you for indulging me,

1021
00:58:30,920 --> 00:58:34,920
Speaker 1: Bridget and listeners. Um, and have you may the fourth

1022
00:58:35,720 --> 00:58:38,440
Speaker 1: if you've got Star Wars stories Oh. If you've done

1023
00:58:38,440 --> 00:58:41,400
Speaker 1: any kind of Star Wars crafting, our art fan fiction,

1024
00:58:41,840 --> 00:58:43,840
Speaker 1: please send them to us. You can find us on

1025
00:58:43,960 --> 00:58:47,640
Speaker 1: Twitter at mom Stuff podcast, and Instagram stuff Mom Never

1026
00:58:47,800 --> 00:58:51,240
Speaker 1: Told You, and our email is mom Stuff at how

1027
00:58:51,280 --> 00:58:54,040
Speaker 1: stuff works dot com. May the Force be with you,

1028
00:58:54,120 --> 00:59:02,560
Speaker 1: Annie and YouTube bridget two per