WEBVTT - Marketing for Longevity, Not Leasing, with Michaella Solar-March 0:00:00.120 --> 0:00:03.800 I'm off my game today. No, you're not. People are 0:00:03.840 --> 0:00:05.640 going to have to start making better content. I think 0:00:05.680 --> 0:00:07.240 we're gonna be talking about this for a long time. 0:00:07.240 --> 0:00:10.239 When you program for everyone, you program for no one. 0:00:10.240 --> 0:00:12.320 I think it's at we'd purpose driven platform, like we're 0:00:12.320 --> 0:00:15.680 trying to get to substance? How was that? Are you 0:00:15.720 --> 0:00:19.400 happy with that? This is marketing therapy right now? It 0:00:19.480 --> 0:00:26.200 really is? What's up? I'm Laura Currency and I'm Alexa Kristen. 0:00:26.280 --> 0:00:31.479 Welcome back at Landia. Today we have a Australian that 0:00:31.600 --> 0:00:35.680 became a New Yorker. She was the CMO of Tischmann's 0:00:35.720 --> 0:00:41.800 Spire and she oversaw the complete rebranding and reimagination frankly 0:00:41.960 --> 0:00:46.919 of Rockefeller Center. MICHAELA Solar March is here today. We're 0:00:46.960 --> 0:00:49.760 really excited to have Michaela. And since we recorded with her, 0:00:50.200 --> 0:00:52.639 she has taken a new role and is moving back 0:00:52.680 --> 0:00:55.680 to Australia. We're very sad to lose her. Will miss you. 0:00:55.880 --> 0:00:58.200 We will miss you definitely. We will stay in touch. 0:00:58.360 --> 0:01:00.959 She's moving back to Australia in a new role as 0:01:01.040 --> 0:01:05.560 Chief Marketing Officer of Molus Australia Hospitality Group. And I 0:01:05.600 --> 0:01:10.000 think with this episode Mikhaela has really spent time and 0:01:10.040 --> 0:01:12.199 it doesn't really matter where she was, but I think 0:01:12.240 --> 0:01:15.080 with some of the most iconic spaces. Before she was 0:01:15.120 --> 0:01:18.039 at Tishman Spire and Rockefeller Center, she was at the 0:01:18.040 --> 0:01:22.520 Soho House and ran global programming and really started to 0:01:22.560 --> 0:01:29.640 think about community space commerce together and has a really 0:01:29.640 --> 0:01:32.720 interesting perspective on it that I think vibes with a 0:01:32.720 --> 0:01:35.680 lot of things we've been saying over this last year 0:01:35.800 --> 0:01:41.040 on the show around creation and ownership, not just creating 0:01:41.200 --> 0:01:46.720 for a transaction, but really pushing into what she'll call placemaking, 0:01:46.800 --> 0:01:49.000 and we'll talk more about that. I think it's a 0:01:49.000 --> 0:01:52.520 really interesting place to click in on Alexa when you 0:01:52.640 --> 0:01:57.000 use the word placemaking and really thinking about hospitality. There's 0:01:57.040 --> 0:02:01.080 a really interesting lens to put on top of the 0:02:01.200 --> 0:02:04.720 role of marketing both now and in the future, and 0:02:04.840 --> 0:02:08.960 thinking about is the role of chief marketing officer not 0:02:09.080 --> 0:02:13.240 just rolling up now communications potentially product etcetera, and so forth, 0:02:13.520 --> 0:02:16.760 but actually hospitality and so much of that being driven 0:02:16.880 --> 0:02:20.360 by the increasing importance of not just being in the 0:02:20.400 --> 0:02:23.240 game or being in the business of driving people to 0:02:23.280 --> 0:02:28.560 a website to transact, driving people to um subscription or 0:02:28.639 --> 0:02:32.280 membership as part of service, but actually thinking about community 0:02:32.320 --> 0:02:35.720 building and what you need to create or program for 0:02:36.280 --> 0:02:39.240 as Mikhayla is going to talk about, to create a 0:02:39.240 --> 0:02:45.880 space where that sort of ongoing dialogue, conversation, communication is happening, 0:02:46.200 --> 0:02:49.040 and does that move the role of marketing from this 0:02:49.720 --> 0:02:54.120 push poll mechanism to really the cyclical how you're thinking 0:02:54.160 --> 0:02:58.880 about feedback by in shareholder and what that means in 0:02:58.960 --> 0:03:02.480 terms of community developed an ongoing relationship between consumer and 0:03:02.560 --> 0:03:06.519 brand and Michaela not only has created a really strong 0:03:06.600 --> 0:03:11.240 network of artists, creators, business people, real estate folks through 0:03:11.320 --> 0:03:14.320 her role at t Schman Spire, she has used that 0:03:14.560 --> 0:03:17.880 input to do something that I'm not sure has been 0:03:17.880 --> 0:03:20.760 really well recognized. Um you and I spent a lot 0:03:20.760 --> 0:03:23.000 of time with her at Rock Center. I used to 0:03:23.040 --> 0:03:25.360 when I was at GE we had actually an office 0:03:25.440 --> 0:03:27.799 at our office was at thirty Rock, So I spent 0:03:27.840 --> 0:03:31.079 a ton of time at Rock Center. And at the time, 0:03:31.200 --> 0:03:35.280 this is back in I was at Rock Center all 0:03:35.280 --> 0:03:38.200 the time and it was that kind of feeling of 0:03:38.280 --> 0:03:41.800 like going to Times Square right Rock Center, I've got 0:03:41.800 --> 0:03:44.400 to get through the foot traffic there didn't seem to 0:03:44.480 --> 0:03:48.680 have a sense of a real that New York state 0:03:48.760 --> 0:03:52.800 of mind, that New York feeling, those gems that are 0:03:52.880 --> 0:03:57.600 hidden in that space. What Michaela has done, and what 0:03:57.720 --> 0:04:00.760 Michaela did with that space and the thinking around the 0:04:00.800 --> 0:04:04.920 design and the programming opening up spaces like she's reopened 0:04:04.920 --> 0:04:09.280 spaces in Rock Center that we're closed off for years. 0:04:09.320 --> 0:04:13.360 She's reimagined things. One of the reasons Michaela actually got 0:04:13.440 --> 0:04:15.880 in touch with us was because she was thinking about 0:04:16.360 --> 0:04:22.000 creating a recording studio in an old newsstand in one 0:04:22.080 --> 0:04:26.160 of the Rock Center buildings, and she did it. But 0:04:26.279 --> 0:04:29.440 what's interesting about this there is an infusion of New 0:04:29.520 --> 0:04:36.039 Yorkers where that vibe of kind of authentic New York 0:04:36.120 --> 0:04:40.880 has come back and is continuing to grow at Rockefeller Center. 0:04:41.800 --> 0:04:44.800 And what happens is is now community the kind of 0:04:44.920 --> 0:04:48.120 unlikely New Yorker who would say, no, I don't want 0:04:48.120 --> 0:04:50.559 to meet at Rock Center because it's a tourist trap 0:04:50.600 --> 0:04:53.520 and a tourist attraction is now saying not only do 0:04:53.600 --> 0:04:55.640 I want to meet there, I want to work there. 0:04:55.680 --> 0:04:57.560 I want to shop there, I want to create there. 0:04:57.880 --> 0:05:00.360 And what's exciting through the conversation you and I had 0:05:00.440 --> 0:05:04.240 Laura last night in this morning pre show was what 0:05:04.320 --> 0:05:07.280 does that start to look like when companies, corporate and 0:05:07.520 --> 0:05:14.000 marketers are thinking about co ownership of space with their customer, 0:05:14.279 --> 0:05:18.279 with their fan, with their creator. Go back to our 0:05:18.480 --> 0:05:20.960 last episode, This is not a drill. This is not 0:05:21.040 --> 0:05:23.520 a drill. This is going to happen, and it's happening 0:05:23.560 --> 0:05:25.960 with Doabs and we'll talk about those things and Web 0:05:26.000 --> 0:05:28.880 three and we'll talk about those things more. But to 0:05:29.040 --> 0:05:33.680 take kind of traditional marketing and start to aim it 0:05:33.960 --> 0:05:38.200 towards a new trajectory. I think michaela is actually a 0:05:38.240 --> 0:05:41.520 great example of taking one of the most traditional assets 0:05:41.560 --> 0:05:45.839 in the world, Iconic, and starting to really rethink it 0:05:46.320 --> 0:05:50.200 and rethink it along the lines of true community, content 0:05:50.600 --> 0:05:53.360 and commerce. As you were talking and as somebody who 0:05:53.440 --> 0:05:56.719 who was working with you during those years and knows 0:05:56.760 --> 0:05:59.919 that commute, well, I was thinking about how it was 0:06:00.000 --> 0:06:03.520 a backdrop or it was a place I had to 0:06:03.600 --> 0:06:07.400 go to, and what you're drawing a sort of transition 0:06:07.440 --> 0:06:09.760 to is a place I get to go to, a 0:06:09.800 --> 0:06:13.520 place I want to go to. And no different whether 0:06:13.760 --> 0:06:16.840 you're an e commerce brand, you're in the service business, 0:06:17.400 --> 0:06:21.599 you're uh, you know, running a club, um, you have 0:06:21.640 --> 0:06:24.240 a sports team, right, how do we get to the 0:06:24.360 --> 0:06:26.520 I get to go to I want to go to, 0:06:27.240 --> 0:06:30.160 versus I have to go to And that's the transition 0:06:30.200 --> 0:06:36.520 from transaction right to experience to hospitality. And it's interesting, 0:06:36.680 --> 0:06:40.480 as MICHAELA will talk about in this episode, thinking about 0:06:40.680 --> 0:06:43.640 from the point of entry all the way through to 0:06:44.160 --> 0:06:48.560 the set design. I'm thinking about candles and menu and 0:06:48.920 --> 0:06:52.880 font and patterns and all of these things that are 0:06:52.920 --> 0:06:57.520 the aesthetic that helps to emphasize the narrative. And with that, 0:06:58.240 --> 0:07:08.120 MICHAELA solar Mark, we'll be right back. All right, ed Landia, 0:07:08.240 --> 0:07:10.640 we are back with our partners that yield Mo. If 0:07:10.680 --> 0:07:13.680 you remember, we spent our first mini series talking about 0:07:13.680 --> 0:07:16.560 how yield Mo works with brands to make audience attention 0:07:16.600 --> 0:07:19.720 actionable and in this mini series we take on how 0:07:19.760 --> 0:07:23.960 contextual targeting is being reimagined as brands make every interaction 0:07:24.000 --> 0:07:28.559 with their consumer meaningful. Welcome Lisa Bradner, GM of Data 0:07:28.600 --> 0:07:31.320 and Analytics from yield Mo. Thank you so much, great 0:07:31.360 --> 0:07:33.840 to be back. Always great to talk to you guys. So, Lisa, 0:07:34.000 --> 0:07:37.560 I consider myself to be a fairly strategic and creative 0:07:37.720 --> 0:07:42.040 media buyer. I would say you are yes, thank you, um, 0:07:42.040 --> 0:07:44.160 but but as we're having this conversation, you know, I'm 0:07:44.160 --> 0:07:50.080 thinking about some of the traditional processes and structures that 0:07:50.120 --> 0:07:54.520 exist and how those need to be disrupted to really 0:07:54.520 --> 0:07:59.880 achieve the level of granularity and specificity you're talking about 0:08:00.120 --> 0:08:02.960 in terms of getting to real time, closer to real time, 0:08:03.360 --> 0:08:06.720 more integrated, all of the inputs right that are required 0:08:06.880 --> 0:08:09.040 to achieve the type of success that we're talking about. 0:08:09.200 --> 0:08:12.680 In my mind, I'm seeing these ships from planning seasonally 0:08:12.720 --> 0:08:17.000 to planning situationally right, thinking about moving from transaction to 0:08:17.120 --> 0:08:20.360 thinking about transformation. What are three things you would click 0:08:20.440 --> 0:08:24.120 on for marketers to start today right? Like? What are 0:08:24.160 --> 0:08:31.680 the three fundamental must dues or takeaways for brand marketers, creatives, 0:08:31.800 --> 0:08:37.360 buyers to get closer to context? Not in any particular order. 0:08:37.640 --> 0:08:39.800 There are words that we've talked about before, but I 0:08:39.800 --> 0:08:44.800 think are worth revisiting. Leadership and ownership of the customer experience. 0:08:45.600 --> 0:08:48.040 Far too many samos, I'll just say it, they love 0:08:48.160 --> 0:08:50.360 going to their creative agency. They don't spend as much 0:08:50.360 --> 0:08:54.160 time with their media agency. They don't spend nearly the time, blood, 0:08:54.160 --> 0:08:56.800 sweat and tears on media plans that they do on 0:08:56.920 --> 0:09:00.760 creative plans, and they should be integrating those meetings and 0:09:00.800 --> 0:09:04.520 having both and leading that charge. Don't bring me a 0:09:04.559 --> 0:09:07.280 creative idea without a media plan with it. Don't bring 0:09:07.280 --> 0:09:09.720 me a media plan without understanding how the creative phase 0:09:09.840 --> 0:09:13.560 is in. Cmos can be driving that by demanding that 0:09:13.640 --> 0:09:16.720 out of their agencies, and they absolutely should, so leadership 0:09:16.720 --> 0:09:20.320 around that integration is critical. I'm going to say a 0:09:20.480 --> 0:09:24.720 degree of serendipity in the sense of I think what 0:09:25.040 --> 0:09:29.200 audience data got everybody hung up on is that there 0:09:29.280 --> 0:09:35.280 is a rational answer to every marketing problem. People are messy. 0:09:35.440 --> 0:09:40.439 We buy things for non rational reasons. Were emotional. Sometimes 0:09:40.440 --> 0:09:42.920 we like an add sometimes we hate it. Sometimes it's 0:09:42.920 --> 0:09:44.680 just late enough at night and we're board, so we 0:09:44.760 --> 0:09:49.120 buy stuff. I think marketers have to step back and 0:09:49.240 --> 0:09:52.920 think about serendipity, how to drive it, and how to 0:09:53.040 --> 0:09:57.120 know when it's happening. I think contextual signals that are 0:09:57.360 --> 0:10:01.640 attuned to that can be a critical part of Hey, 0:10:01.679 --> 0:10:04.920 I'm seeing something here. I'm seeing a spike in a 0:10:05.000 --> 0:10:08.280 lot of metrics that are happening right now. Something's going 0:10:08.320 --> 0:10:12.000 on with that execution, with that creative right now, Let's 0:10:12.120 --> 0:10:15.559 double down and figure it out. So to use the data, 0:10:15.720 --> 0:10:18.760 but use the data to inform serendipity so you know 0:10:18.800 --> 0:10:22.199 what's going on. And kind of along those lines, the 0:10:22.280 --> 0:10:26.120 last thing I would say is common sense. Right there 0:10:26.240 --> 0:10:29.000 is art to what we do and common sense about 0:10:29.040 --> 0:10:31.600 as a consumer. What do I mean we are? What 0:10:31.600 --> 0:10:34.520 I've always loved about being in marketing is we're all consumers. 0:10:34.840 --> 0:10:37.200 We all know what it is to see an ad, 0:10:37.200 --> 0:10:39.120 to buy a product, to be in a store, to 0:10:39.200 --> 0:10:42.559 do all these things. So step back and think about 0:10:42.600 --> 0:10:46.920 the experience you want to have and think about how 0:10:46.960 --> 0:10:50.839 to bring that experience through to your brand and not 0:10:50.920 --> 0:10:52.439 at all like you know something, We're not always the 0:10:52.440 --> 0:10:54.960 target audience for our own products, but we're at a 0:10:55.040 --> 0:10:58.160 human level. How do I want brands to show up 0:10:58.200 --> 0:11:00.760 for me? When do I want to hear them? What 0:11:00.960 --> 0:11:03.920 makes a great brand experience for a brand that I'm 0:11:04.040 --> 0:11:07.640 loyal to? How do I want brands to show up 0:11:07.679 --> 0:11:09.960 for me? And how do I make sure as a 0:11:09.960 --> 0:11:13.080 brand that's how I show up? Thank you, Lisa Bradner 0:11:13.160 --> 0:11:15.720 and our partners at yield MO. Looking forward to having 0:11:15.760 --> 0:11:18.280 you back for the last part of our four part 0:11:18.320 --> 0:11:25.280 series What's Up bad Landia. We are back in this studio, 0:11:25.480 --> 0:11:29.560 the Virtual Studio with one of our favorite people, MICHAELA. 0:11:29.920 --> 0:11:34.040 Solar March, the CMO of Tishman Spey. Are welcome, Micham. 0:11:37.440 --> 0:11:39.320 We've got a lot of accents on this show. I 0:11:39.360 --> 0:11:43.480 didn't notice. MICHAELA is our Aussie, our Bossy Auzzy, one 0:11:43.520 --> 0:11:49.640 of our favorite You are the first. You're our first Aussie. 0:11:50.520 --> 0:11:54.679 It's after the floodgates are open. Our mutual friend Roth 0:11:54.760 --> 0:11:58.120 Martin who introduced us. Because you listen to the show. 0:11:58.480 --> 0:12:01.360 You would recently take in the chief Marketing Officer role 0:12:01.520 --> 0:12:05.800 at Tishman Spire and one of the core assets. So 0:12:05.840 --> 0:12:08.719 if you don't know, Tischman Spire is the largest real 0:12:08.840 --> 0:12:11.880 estate company in the world with some of the best 0:12:12.120 --> 0:12:16.760 known and most valuable assets in space and buildings in 0:12:16.800 --> 0:12:20.360 the world. MIKHAELA, how big is it in assets unto management? 0:12:20.360 --> 0:12:22.720 We have fifty six billion in assets on the management 0:12:23.000 --> 0:12:28.480 right now and as part of those assets, you manage 0:12:28.720 --> 0:12:32.000 Rockefeller Center, which is one of the most well known 0:12:32.120 --> 0:12:35.360 in the world spaces in the heart of New York City. 0:12:35.520 --> 0:12:38.200 So we just got to see you in person, which 0:12:38.240 --> 0:12:40.760 was amazing at one of your new spaces that you 0:12:40.880 --> 0:12:44.400 just launched in Rock Center six twenty loft and Garden. 0:12:44.679 --> 0:12:48.120 You had a lunch there. Stunning, stunning. It's so beautiful, 0:12:48.200 --> 0:12:50.400 isn't it. So six twenty Loft and Gun has been 0:12:50.440 --> 0:12:52.800 open for a really long time, but predominantly as a 0:12:52.800 --> 0:12:56.000 wedding venue. Yeah, So if you're getting married in New York, 0:12:56.160 --> 0:12:58.720 you know six twenty. But if you're not getting married, 0:12:58.800 --> 0:13:00.360 or you got married a long time ago like me, 0:13:00.960 --> 0:13:03.360 it's not on your radar. So the lunch that you 0:13:03.400 --> 0:13:05.400 guys came to was a pop up that we're doing 0:13:05.440 --> 0:13:07.840 with local restaurants to to sort of re energize that 0:13:07.880 --> 0:13:11.000 space and reintroduce it to New Yorker's Let's use six 0:13:11.080 --> 0:13:13.680 twenty as a great jumping off point because how you've 0:13:13.679 --> 0:13:19.480 thought about spaces, experiences, creating community um is something that 0:13:19.520 --> 0:13:21.959 you've been doing for a while. To tell us kind 0:13:21.960 --> 0:13:25.000 of how you came to Titium Inspire, what was the 0:13:25.440 --> 0:13:29.240 what was the kind of non linear pathway there? I was. 0:13:29.559 --> 0:13:31.880 I had a friend who was consulting Petition Inspire at 0:13:31.920 --> 0:13:35.880 the time, who had been in hospitality. He'd worked at 0:13:35.920 --> 0:13:38.520 Soho House, which is where I knew him from. He'd 0:13:38.520 --> 0:13:40.680 worked at Noire House, and then he ended up working 0:13:40.720 --> 0:13:44.079 on the West Coast supporting some of the new hospitality 0:13:44.080 --> 0:13:46.680 initiatives that our CEO had been pushing at the time, 0:13:47.320 --> 0:13:51.120 and he recommended me for the CMO role at Rockefeller Center. 0:13:51.160 --> 0:13:54.440 To start with. It wasn't the holistic portfolio of our 0:13:54.800 --> 0:13:57.120 family of assets. It was really focused on Rock Center 0:13:57.520 --> 0:14:01.240 and reimagining and reinvigorating Rockefeller Center. And when dishmonds By 0:14:01.400 --> 0:14:03.840 first called me, I said, no way, that place is 0:14:03.840 --> 0:14:07.400 not for me. Rock Center isn't cool, it's not relevant. 0:14:07.520 --> 0:14:10.160 I don't know how, I don't know what I could 0:14:10.200 --> 0:14:13.720 bring to the table. And the recruiter said to me 0:14:14.000 --> 0:14:17.160 is sort of these very traditional recruiter conversations. The recruiter 0:14:17.240 --> 0:14:19.080 said to me at the time, please come with me 0:14:19.160 --> 0:14:21.040 with these guys, because it doesn't matter that you don't 0:14:21.040 --> 0:14:23.480 come from the commercial real estate world. They want to 0:14:23.480 --> 0:14:26.840 do things differently. At the time when she had reached 0:14:26.840 --> 0:14:31.080 out to me, I was running programming, brand UM and 0:14:31.120 --> 0:14:34.160 sort of member experience for the Soho House group globally. 0:14:34.480 --> 0:14:36.920 I was based in New York, but running that for 0:14:37.120 --> 0:14:41.120 UM the whole suite of properties and hotels and a 0:14:41.120 --> 0:14:43.480 lot of our restaurant spaces all over the world, and 0:14:43.520 --> 0:14:47.520 I was traveling all the time. So the two things 0:14:47.520 --> 0:14:50.920 that sort of sparked my interest about the Rockefeller Center position. 0:14:51.080 --> 0:14:55.600 One was this idea that a legacy asset could reimagine 0:14:55.600 --> 0:14:59.320 itself and re engage New York in a meaningful way. 0:14:59.800 --> 0:15:01.720 And the other was that I maybe wouldn't have to 0:15:01.760 --> 0:15:03.880 travel as much because I had really young kids. Well 0:15:03.920 --> 0:15:05.520 at the time, I had a young kid. Now you 0:15:05.520 --> 0:15:08.200 have another young kid. Now I have another young kids, 0:15:08.640 --> 0:15:11.680 two young kids, and I really missed traveling. So there 0:15:12.080 --> 0:15:15.800 it comes full circle. But yeah, so, I mean I 0:15:15.840 --> 0:15:20.680 had been at SOH House, so space and and UM community, 0:15:20.760 --> 0:15:23.720 and the connection between those two things had always been 0:15:24.680 --> 0:15:28.640 of um major importance and a real fascination to me. 0:15:28.840 --> 0:15:33.760 The idea of programming experiences and creative culture within an 0:15:33.840 --> 0:15:38.160 environment that facilitates the best community connection that matters to me, 0:15:38.280 --> 0:15:39.840 and it was something that I love to do at 0:15:39.880 --> 0:15:42.640 Soho House, and I was really intrigued by the idea 0:15:42.680 --> 0:15:48.600 of doing that within a larger, slightly more structured, far 0:15:48.720 --> 0:15:52.480 more traditional environment, which is definitely commercial real estate. They've 0:15:52.520 --> 0:15:54.240 never done stuff like that, and it was there was 0:15:54.240 --> 0:15:57.040 a real appetite to do things differently and to re 0:15:57.160 --> 0:16:02.760 engage tenants in a way that UM felt more relevant 0:16:02.840 --> 0:16:06.880 for the future. So, Mikaela and thinking about community and space, 0:16:07.200 --> 0:16:11.400 I have to imagine that programming please a pretty critical 0:16:11.560 --> 0:16:17.400 part of obviously leveraging the space to create community. UM, 0:16:17.440 --> 0:16:19.360 can you talk to us a bit about the role 0:16:19.400 --> 0:16:24.480 of programming in space and how that can potentially make 0:16:24.560 --> 0:16:28.680 or break a community's experience. Programming used to be seen 0:16:29.160 --> 0:16:35.840 as events, and the more that hospitality became a thing 0:16:35.920 --> 0:16:39.280 and members clubs were introduced and coworking spaces were introduced, 0:16:39.800 --> 0:16:41.720 and this industry took off in the way that it 0:16:41.800 --> 0:16:44.440 did sort of you know, in the last ten years, 0:16:44.720 --> 0:16:49.520 really concentrated in the last six or seven UM programming 0:16:50.320 --> 0:16:53.600 as a concept sort of air quotes. Programming became a 0:16:53.680 --> 0:16:56.040 lot more relevant because people started to recognize that it 0:16:56.120 --> 0:17:01.320 wasn't just about hosting an event. It is the opportunity 0:17:01.360 --> 0:17:07.840 to curate people and experiences within spaces that were truly 0:17:07.880 --> 0:17:15.040 additive to that community, whether it be for education, mentorship, networking, UM, 0:17:15.040 --> 0:17:20.120 community building, whatever the desired outcome. Programming became the sort 0:17:20.119 --> 0:17:24.879 of catch or for getting people together and creating experiences 0:17:24.960 --> 0:17:29.280 that had a pre event, at event and post event 0:17:29.680 --> 0:17:34.160 UM meaning for the audience whoever that audience might be. 0:17:35.160 --> 0:17:37.400 The evolution of that, I think in the last couple 0:17:37.400 --> 0:17:41.919 of years has become placemaking, which has always been a 0:17:41.920 --> 0:17:44.840 thing in commercial real estate, but more and more is 0:17:44.840 --> 0:17:50.480 starting to be adopted by cities and UM, both local 0:17:50.480 --> 0:17:55.280 and state governments and within the sort of the broader 0:17:56.800 --> 0:18:00.040 real estate world. And placemaking is if you have to 0:18:00.080 --> 0:18:03.320 sort of break it down, all of these various elements 0:18:03.359 --> 0:18:07.640 that UM added up create the experience that you might 0:18:07.680 --> 0:18:10.840 have within a space. So UM, if you think about 0:18:11.800 --> 0:18:14.159 the hospitality elements from the furniture and the law and 0:18:14.320 --> 0:18:18.040 in and the music and the you know, um, the 0:18:18.080 --> 0:18:21.159 hosts in a lobby, to the types of retail and 0:18:21.160 --> 0:18:24.359 the retail merchandizing that you might engage with two the 0:18:24.560 --> 0:18:29.480 tenant mix makeup, to the landscaping, to the interior design, 0:18:30.000 --> 0:18:33.359 to the I mean you name it, the creative that 0:18:33.440 --> 0:18:36.720 you see. It's all of those various elements together. It's 0:18:36.760 --> 0:18:39.280 interesting to think about how you're not just programming in 0:18:39.400 --> 0:18:44.960 terms of speakers or menu, you're programming in terms of 0:18:44.960 --> 0:18:48.760 aesthetic to communicate a narrative or an energy. It's like 0:18:48.800 --> 0:18:52.600 set design. Yeah, and that includes the people too, because programming. 0:18:52.640 --> 0:18:54.879 You've really got to curate the types of people that 0:18:54.920 --> 0:18:58.399 you're engaging for the various you know, whether it's the 0:18:58.520 --> 0:19:02.200 space or the audience. Um, it's really about the people too. 0:19:02.400 --> 0:19:04.879 Who's in that room and why and what are they 0:19:04.880 --> 0:19:07.439 taking away from that experience? When they came to you 0:19:07.520 --> 0:19:09.960 and said we want you to think differently about this, 0:19:10.800 --> 0:19:13.520 did they say we want to have a different audience, 0:19:13.600 --> 0:19:16.360 we want to have different interaction or different we want 0:19:16.359 --> 0:19:19.720 to get too, different types of people and bring different 0:19:19.720 --> 0:19:21.960 types of people into Rock Center that we haven't seen. 0:19:22.000 --> 0:19:25.840 Because Rock Center is a majority, it's either you're working 0:19:25.880 --> 0:19:31.280 there or you are a tourist. The brief was far um, 0:19:31.320 --> 0:19:34.240 it was far less specific. It was incredibly broad because 0:19:34.240 --> 0:19:38.920 they didn't actually know what they wanted. They just knew 0:19:38.960 --> 0:19:42.440 that they had an opportunity to do things differently and 0:19:42.880 --> 0:19:46.000 robbed the CEO of Tishman Spier, who's an incredibly inspiring 0:19:46.040 --> 0:19:48.480 person and a real visionary, and he had the vision 0:19:48.560 --> 0:19:50.600 for Rock Center. He wanted this to be a place 0:19:50.640 --> 0:19:54.480 that New Yorkers wanted to be. But outside of that, 0:19:54.680 --> 0:19:58.640 you know, um, outside of that, he didn't know what 0:19:58.680 --> 0:20:00.800 that meant how to achieve it. I think that was 0:20:00.840 --> 0:20:04.320 the first UM That was the first hook for me, 0:20:04.400 --> 0:20:07.639 the really exciting opportunity about working with Tishman Speyer. The 0:20:07.720 --> 0:20:12.400 portfolio is so vast and the global reaches just deeply impressive. 0:20:13.119 --> 0:20:17.800 But the chance to help shepherd this iconic legacy asset 0:20:17.880 --> 0:20:21.720 into its next chapter and ensure it's relevance for the future, 0:20:22.240 --> 0:20:26.119 I felt like something I could just not pass up. 0:20:26.560 --> 0:20:30.840 So you have balanced and I love for I think 0:20:30.880 --> 0:20:34.800 we would love to get into the the pain of 0:20:34.840 --> 0:20:37.199 this because I've done it as well, the pain of 0:20:37.240 --> 0:20:45.480 balancing big legacy legacy company that is conservative, right and 0:20:45.520 --> 0:20:48.199 conservative probably for a lot of reasons, even though that 0:20:48.240 --> 0:20:54.160 doesn't mean the innovation is excluded from that. But it's 0:20:54.240 --> 0:20:57.960 hard to get through with being tip of this spear 0:20:58.280 --> 0:21:02.560 and creating not only a space, but an experience that 0:21:02.880 --> 0:21:07.360 really refreshes the reputation. What have the struggle has been 0:21:08.040 --> 0:21:11.320 in terms of being a marketer that's really trying to 0:21:11.359 --> 0:21:14.600 innovate in a legacy space. Just focusing on Rock Center 0:21:14.600 --> 0:21:18.160 for now. I think for me where I found success 0:21:18.240 --> 0:21:20.760 was both the high and the low, like finding the 0:21:20.760 --> 0:21:24.600 the really big picture creative thinking that the strategic visioning 0:21:24.600 --> 0:21:29.080 that could UM help guide decision making across the organization 0:21:29.680 --> 0:21:34.080 while also finding those very tactical interventions that were proof 0:21:34.119 --> 0:21:37.280 points for the larger strategy. One of the reasons that 0:21:37.600 --> 0:21:40.399 I had hired Russ, which is how we met in 0:21:40.440 --> 0:21:45.400 the early days, was to help reimagine rock Center in 0:21:45.440 --> 0:21:49.200 the at its care with a brand new belief system. 0:21:49.280 --> 0:21:54.560 There hadn't been an articulation of what Rockefeller Center wanted 0:21:54.640 --> 0:21:57.119 to be its mission and place in the world and 0:21:57.160 --> 0:21:59.600 how that could come to life for the various audiences 0:21:59.600 --> 0:22:02.240 that it's of, and we really engaged Ross at the 0:22:02.280 --> 0:22:06.679 time he was at Blackbird, before Blackbird became known to 0:22:06.760 --> 0:22:10.040 do the strategic positioning for Rockefeller Center. That was a 0:22:10.080 --> 0:22:13.960 massive undertaking and as you're saying, or as you're sort 0:22:13.960 --> 0:22:20.359 of suggesting, um a a real a challenge, a creative 0:22:20.400 --> 0:22:24.280 and exciting challenge, but a challenge nonetheless, shepherding that through 0:22:24.520 --> 0:22:28.560 a very traditional organization, not only traditional in the way 0:22:28.560 --> 0:22:30.080 that it was structured, but in the way that they 0:22:30.119 --> 0:22:32.520 had been doing things. It had been the same way 0:22:32.880 --> 0:22:35.400 for a really long time, and someone like me had 0:22:35.480 --> 0:22:40.399 never worked here, and that was exciting and really really 0:22:40.400 --> 0:22:43.160 difficult for a lot of people as that was being 0:22:44.119 --> 0:22:46.359 sort of carried through as we were working on that 0:22:46.440 --> 0:22:50.080 and then finding the key stakeholders internally and taking everybody 0:22:50.080 --> 0:22:52.040 on that journey. It was really co authored by all 0:22:52.080 --> 0:22:55.440 of my stakeholders internally, and I'm really proud of that. 0:22:55.520 --> 0:22:58.919 Fat everyone got excited, saw the opportunity and got on 0:22:58.960 --> 0:23:03.440 board and helped create what we now have as the 0:23:03.480 --> 0:23:07.679 strategic positioning for Rockefeller Center as this asset. But we 0:23:07.760 --> 0:23:11.000 also found these like small moments that would, as I said, 0:23:11.080 --> 0:23:13.880 become the proofpoints. You've got to find those small, very 0:23:13.920 --> 0:23:17.639 tactical moments that allow you very cheaply and quickly to 0:23:17.760 --> 0:23:20.719 affect the strategy so that people can see it in 0:23:20.760 --> 0:23:22.800 real life and see how it relates to their every 0:23:22.880 --> 0:23:26.720 day So, out of curiosity, can you give us a 0:23:26.840 --> 0:23:32.760 thirty thou foot snapshot of what that positioning was pre 0:23:33.720 --> 0:23:38.320 working with an agency to post. Interestingly, most people don't 0:23:38.359 --> 0:23:44.240 think of Rockefeller Center as as broad of a campus 0:23:44.240 --> 0:23:47.480 as it is, and they don't understand the various components 0:23:47.480 --> 0:23:50.960 that make up this place. It's twelve buildings across six 0:23:51.119 --> 0:23:55.000 city blocks two acres. It's one of the biggest privately 0:23:55.000 --> 0:23:58.800 owned land masses in Manhattan. I think the biggest outside 0:23:58.800 --> 0:24:04.960 of perhaps Hudson Yards and Central Park. Rock Center isn't 0:24:05.040 --> 0:24:08.480 just a collection of attractions and some public space. It's 0:24:08.480 --> 0:24:11.560 one of the biggest office complexes in the city. It 0:24:11.600 --> 0:24:15.680 has entertainment areas, it's got events venues, it includes a 0:24:15.760 --> 0:24:20.560 rainbow room. We've got the various um parks on our rooftop, 0:24:20.560 --> 0:24:22.639 including a new park on the roof of Radio City. 0:24:23.320 --> 0:24:26.480 It's there are all these various components that make up 0:24:26.600 --> 0:24:30.239 Rockefeller Center. So if you think about who works at 0:24:30.320 --> 0:24:34.560 Rockefeller Center, You've got facilities people, You've got property managers, 0:24:34.560 --> 0:24:39.040 you've got leasing teams, you've got retailers, you've got events coordinators, 0:24:39.040 --> 0:24:42.399 You've got everything that essentially anyone that works in a 0:24:42.440 --> 0:24:47.480 small city works at Rockefeller Center. So without a clear 0:24:47.600 --> 0:24:51.240 articulation of the purpose of the brand or a north 0:24:51.280 --> 0:24:54.080