WEBVTT - Is the Pied Piper About a Real Historic Tragedy? 0:00:01.120 --> 0:00:04.560 Welcome to Stuff you Should Know from how Stuff Works 0:00:04.600 --> 0:00:13.600 dot Com. Hey, welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark, 0:00:13.600 --> 0:00:16.319 and there's Charles W Chuck Bryant, and there's Jerry over there. 0:00:16.880 --> 0:00:21.480 This is Stuff you Should Know fairy Tale Edition. Jerry 0:00:21.560 --> 0:00:25.040 is supposedly on vacation. Yea, what's going on? But she 0:00:25.160 --> 0:00:28.680 came in here just for us, Jerry. I think she 0:00:28.720 --> 0:00:32.400 feels beholden. That's nice, which is weird because she's We've 0:00:32.440 --> 0:00:35.559 had guest producers. I don't know. Maybe she feels like 0:00:35.560 --> 0:00:40.159 her job is threatened. Is today the day I die? Oh? Jeesus? 0:00:40.159 --> 0:00:42.360 Hoping Jerry knows it. Can't we at least get these 0:00:42.400 --> 0:00:45.640 two in the can first? Yeah, well probably unless something 0:00:45.720 --> 0:00:49.000 really crazy happens in the next hour and two. Yeah, 0:00:49.080 --> 0:00:51.159 that'll give me time to get in touch with like 0:00:51.400 --> 0:00:53.360 the five people I have on my list to replace you. 0:00:54.760 --> 0:01:01.760 I know, the five Bano right, Obama? Right, Michael Stipe, 0:01:01.880 --> 0:01:05.240 Michael Stipe, Bobby Fisher. I think there was one more. 0:01:05.240 --> 0:01:08.880 I can't remember, Bobby Fisher, the chess player. Yeah, that's 0:01:08.880 --> 0:01:11.840 a little random. Well, I want to correct that episode 0:01:12.000 --> 0:01:17.640 and Optimus Prime that's the fifth one, that's right, yea. Uh, Chuckers. 0:01:18.720 --> 0:01:22.000 Have you ever heard of fairy Tale before? Yeah? We 0:01:22.160 --> 0:01:25.880 uh we did two very good episodes. Oh, if you 0:01:25.880 --> 0:01:28.680 say so yourself. No, these were good. I don't often 0:01:28.720 --> 0:01:31.959 say that, but in November of two thousand fifteen, we 0:01:32.000 --> 0:01:34.399 did it back to backer with the dark origins of 0:01:34.440 --> 0:01:37.760 fairy tales and how the Grimm's fairy tales work or 0:01:37.840 --> 0:01:41.120 the grand Brothers. We had fairy tale fever. We did, 0:01:41.280 --> 0:01:43.720 but man, we licked it. So did you go back 0:01:43.720 --> 0:01:45.959 and listen to them and you're like, wow, these are 0:01:45.959 --> 0:01:48.000 good or you just remember them being good. I remember 0:01:48.040 --> 0:01:51.240 them being good, okay, and being especially kind of proud 0:01:51.240 --> 0:01:54.760 of those too. Really, that's fantastic. That's how I feel 0:01:54.760 --> 0:01:59.280 about your limb is torn off? Now? What? That was 0:01:59.280 --> 0:02:02.720 a good one good title about reattachment surgery. Remember that? Yeah? 0:02:02.760 --> 0:02:05.440 I think that that titles all you. That's a Josh 0:02:05.440 --> 0:02:07.880 Clark title. You've got some good titles out there too. 0:02:09.080 --> 0:02:11.600 What's the deal with blank? You know who's really good 0:02:11.600 --> 0:02:16.359 at coming up with titles? Bono? Yeah, where the streets 0:02:16.360 --> 0:02:20.520 have no name? Right? Where the where the streets have 0:02:20.639 --> 0:02:25.200 no drums? M dude, you just did it. So we're 0:02:25.200 --> 0:02:29.120 talking about fairy tales today, specifically, specifically, we're talking about 0:02:29.200 --> 0:02:32.440 the fairy tale of the Pie Piper of Hamlin, And 0:02:32.520 --> 0:02:35.880 as far as fairy tales go, it seems to be 0:02:36.200 --> 0:02:41.080 a little different than other fairy tales. And the reason 0:02:41.120 --> 0:02:46.840 why it's a little different is because, horrifically it's people 0:02:46.960 --> 0:02:51.880 think scholars, not just you know, average truck like, real 0:02:51.919 --> 0:02:55.760 deal scholars think that something actually happened that formed the 0:02:55.800 --> 0:03:01.239 basis of this fairy tale. Right Whereas with Hansel and 0:03:01.280 --> 0:03:06.320 Gretel it wasn't based on some witchy lady who ate children, No, 0:03:06.480 --> 0:03:08.480 but that one might have had some basis in fact too. 0:03:08.560 --> 0:03:13.359 How about like rumpel Stiltskin, probably not based in fact? Right? 0:03:13.440 --> 0:03:16.240 You remember the little guy who, like you, trick him 0:03:16.240 --> 0:03:19.639 into saying his own name back? The little I don't 0:03:19.680 --> 0:03:22.359 think he had a big heart. He had an insatiable 0:03:22.400 --> 0:03:25.160 sexual appetite, is what it was. Oh, the little girls. 0:03:25.200 --> 0:03:28.920 The big heart was Bono, right man. We're gonna get 0:03:29.000 --> 0:03:31.920 so many emails from people being like, layoff Bono. What's 0:03:32.040 --> 0:03:36.080 what's with the bono references? Who's Bono? They must work 0:03:36.080 --> 0:03:41.280 with that Bono guy? I wish so chuck Um the 0:03:41.320 --> 0:03:43.600 pie Piper. The reason why we say it might be 0:03:43.680 --> 0:03:47.720 based in fact is because there's actual, like historic evidence 0:03:47.760 --> 0:03:50.400 that kind of supports this thing, and you can find 0:03:50.400 --> 0:03:52.680 it in this town of Hamlin, which is a real place. 0:03:53.400 --> 0:03:55.680 It's not a made up like fairy tale land. Like 0:03:56.240 --> 0:04:00.560 you knows your first clue. Yeah, most fair detales are 0:04:00.560 --> 0:04:04.120 not set in an actual place, right, I don't know, 0:04:04.320 --> 0:04:07.880 are they know? They're just made up, or they're in 0:04:07.920 --> 0:04:11.760 a very vague place, or they take place in a 0:04:11.840 --> 0:04:14.200 larger place like oh, in Germany one day, or in 0:04:14.240 --> 0:04:18.880 Bavaria one day, not like in this town that actually 0:04:18.920 --> 0:04:21.240 existed at the time we're saying it did. Which is 0:04:21.279 --> 0:04:24.320 another thing too, because if you look at the actual 0:04:24.360 --> 0:04:26.360 fairy tales we'll get to in a second, there's like 0:04:26.400 --> 0:04:32.400 a specific date that also is very unusual for their tale. 0:04:32.560 --> 0:04:34.520 So the more you dig into it, the more you're like, yeah, 0:04:34.520 --> 0:04:37.440 this might have actually happened. And then what you think, oh, 0:04:37.480 --> 0:04:41.839 this might have actually happened, then you're struck with some 0:04:41.960 --> 0:04:46.920 of the greatest dread human being can experience, because it's 0:04:47.000 --> 0:04:51.120 something bad happened, is what happened? Let's talk about it, 0:04:51.400 --> 0:04:54.640 all right, Well, let's get into the original fairy tale, 0:04:54.680 --> 0:04:59.920 The Grimm's Brothers Tale of the Pipe Piper. Not even 0:05:00.120 --> 0:05:06.080 Irish um. Jane McGrath, good old Jane from back in 0:05:06.120 --> 0:05:08.640 the day wrote this one, and she points out that 0:05:08.680 --> 0:05:12.479 it is a tale, a cautionary tale about governance as 0:05:12.480 --> 0:05:17.000 well as taking responsibility for financial agreements. She's right, but 0:05:17.040 --> 0:05:18.840 it putting it that way, it seems a little funny. 0:05:19.520 --> 0:05:24.520 But it is twelve eighty four in Hamlin in Germany, 0:05:24.760 --> 0:05:28.880 and there was a rat infestation in the town at 0:05:28.920 --> 0:05:31.520 the time, and the mayor and this is the fairy tale, 0:05:31.520 --> 0:05:34.279 you're gonna right, yeah, yeah, And so that the mayor 0:05:34.320 --> 0:05:37.440 of the town didn't know what to do. The burgermeister, 0:05:38.160 --> 0:05:42.159 Oh yeah, maister Burger. Uh, the stranger comes into town 0:05:42.320 --> 0:05:45.440 and war and I didn't know what pid even meant. 0:05:45.520 --> 0:05:49.040 I didn't either. What is it? Multi colored? Yeah, he 0:05:49.160 --> 0:05:53.240 wore multi colored clothes, pied multi colored clothes. That's all 0:05:53.240 --> 0:05:56.039 he was. He was a piper who wore colorful clothing. 0:05:56.160 --> 0:05:59.719 Had nothing to do with eating pies or I thought 0:05:59.720 --> 0:06:02.320 walk king on his feet, you know, he thought that's 0:06:02.320 --> 0:06:04.880 what it meant. Yeah, why because I think like a 0:06:05.600 --> 0:06:11.520 like pedestrian comes from pied p well, but I think 0:06:11.560 --> 0:06:15.000 it's like maybe Italian or something that certainly makes more 0:06:15.040 --> 0:06:17.919 sense than me having no clue. Yeah, but I was 0:06:18.040 --> 0:06:22.360 way off, so it doesn't matter. He walked. He did walk. 0:06:23.000 --> 0:06:25.440 That was the other reason I thought that too. So 0:06:25.640 --> 0:06:28.960 his outfit looked a little weird. Apparently multicolored people didn't 0:06:29.000 --> 0:06:31.480 dress like that. I reckon. I saw though that it 0:06:31.520 --> 0:06:36.359 was also like um, like a splendid outfit that he 0:06:36.560 --> 0:06:39.359 attracted a lot of attention, and people were like, I 0:06:39.400 --> 0:06:42.120 wish I could, I wish I had the Cohonans dressed 0:06:42.120 --> 0:06:46.479 like you pie piper dance around with a band. Uh. 0:06:46.520 --> 0:06:49.480 And he had a called it a musical pipe or 0:06:49.560 --> 0:06:53.960 some kind of flute, not a smoking pipe. Heads no uh. 0:06:53.960 --> 0:06:56.440 And he hears about this rat problem. He comes into town. 0:06:57.200 --> 0:07:01.479 He drags his fingernails along the chalkboard and gets everyone attention, 0:07:01.520 --> 0:07:04.760 and the down meeting says, I'll kill that shark. Oh, 0:07:04.800 --> 0:07:07.120 you gotta do it, but no, no, no, I'll kill 0:07:07.160 --> 0:07:10.560 the rats. Yeah, but in the voice, I can't do 0:07:10.640 --> 0:07:13.160 quint well, whatever, you can do anything. You're like the 0:07:13.240 --> 0:07:16.160 rich little of this this company. Jerry's laughing at us 0:07:16.200 --> 0:07:20.680 for no reason. She's so sick of this man, she's 0:07:20.720 --> 0:07:23.840 really tickled today, Jerry, are you stoned? No, she's been 0:07:23.880 --> 0:07:27.280 smoking her own magical pipe. So they agree on a 0:07:27.360 --> 0:07:30.800 price to get rid of the rats. Piper takes out 0:07:30.920 --> 0:07:34.320 his his little his little hand flute. Yeah, yeah, I 0:07:34.400 --> 0:07:37.240 don't know if that's what's called. But the price is important. 0:07:37.360 --> 0:07:39.680 Can I go into the price for a second. So 0:07:40.000 --> 0:07:41.800 he initially said that he would get rid of the 0:07:41.880 --> 0:07:45.040 rats for a thousand florins, which is either coins or 0:07:45.680 --> 0:07:49.040 money from Italy or France or the Netherlands, but money 0:07:49.200 --> 0:07:52.119 a thousand a lot of the time, thousand pieces of money. 0:07:52.280 --> 0:07:55.400 And this this town of Hamlin was so overrun by rats. 0:07:55.400 --> 0:07:59.640 Apparently all their cats had died. Though yes they got 0:07:59.640 --> 0:08:04.320 they beat the cats. I didn't see explained what happened 0:08:04.320 --> 0:08:06.040 to the cats, just that the cats died, and that's 0:08:06.040 --> 0:08:08.320 why the town is over rung. Okay, which is a 0:08:08.400 --> 0:08:10.680 weird little thing, don't you think. Yeah, because my first 0:08:10.720 --> 0:08:13.040 thing was like, why a pie piper just get some cats? 0:08:13.640 --> 0:08:17.280 The cats had all died, all right, good thinking, chuck um. 0:08:17.320 --> 0:08:20.000 But they they say a thousand florins will give you 0:08:20.040 --> 0:08:22.239 fifty thousand florins if you get rid of these rats. 0:08:22.240 --> 0:08:25.440 Our problem is so bad, and he says done. But 0:08:25.640 --> 0:08:28.520 was that a facetious offer? I think it was a 0:08:28.640 --> 0:08:33.280 desperate a desperate boast. Okay, But the pipe piper was like, 0:08:33.400 --> 0:08:35.439 all right, I'll agree to your terms. I just wanted 0:08:35.480 --> 0:08:37.880 a thousand, but fifty thousand it is, and they went 0:08:38.040 --> 0:08:41.240 I think we ever spent. I regret saying that. You 0:08:41.240 --> 0:08:44.920 should hear the guy. So he pulls out the instrument 0:08:45.040 --> 0:08:48.640 he um starts playing. As the story goes, all the 0:08:48.720 --> 0:08:52.560 rats congregate around him, and he leaps about and dances 0:08:52.559 --> 0:08:58.520 through town into the Weser River, which the rats drowned, 0:08:58.559 --> 0:09:03.560 which is complete um fabrication, because rats are very good swimmers. 0:09:03.600 --> 0:09:05.520 They really are. I thought about that too. I even 0:09:05.559 --> 0:09:08.120 looked it up. They're good swimmers, not just rats you've 0:09:08.160 --> 0:09:11.800 seen it's rats in general. Yeah. I mean the first thing, honestly, 0:09:11.800 --> 0:09:13.320 when I heard that, the first thing that made me 0:09:13.360 --> 0:09:16.000 think that was like, wait a minute, first blood. He's 0:09:16.040 --> 0:09:19.640 in that abandoned mind chat. Those rats are swimming all 0:09:19.679 --> 0:09:21.520 over the place. So I looked it up. I was like, 0:09:21.600 --> 0:09:24.160 is that true? And apparently rats are really good swimmers, 0:09:24.360 --> 0:09:26.280 better than others. It's in there too, So this fairy 0:09:26.280 --> 0:09:32.200 tale stinks of bs already, okay, But the the story 0:09:32.280 --> 0:09:34.520 goes that the rats followed this guy in a trance 0:09:34.600 --> 0:09:36.720 to the river, whereupon they drowned. Maybe they were in 0:09:36.760 --> 0:09:39.360 the trance and that was why they couldn't swim, because 0:09:39.360 --> 0:09:42.800 they were just so lulled by his his hand flute, 0:09:43.800 --> 0:09:46.719 his smooth jazz. Should you take a break there and 0:09:46.720 --> 0:09:49.480 finish the story after, Oh, it's quite a cliff banger. 0:09:49.600 --> 0:10:16.719 All right, let's do that, all right, Chuck, We're back 0:10:16.800 --> 0:10:19.400 to lay it on them. Man, that was that was 0:10:19.480 --> 0:10:22.720 high class. Well, they drown all the rats. The pie 0:10:22.720 --> 0:10:25.840 piper is successful. Everyone parties German style, which is to 0:10:25.880 --> 0:10:30.360 say they probably got hammered on eight eight ounce beers. 0:10:32.080 --> 0:10:34.400 Have you ever been to Germany? You ever had the 0:10:34.440 --> 0:10:36.679 beers there? The big Yeah? I mean they've got big 0:10:36.679 --> 0:10:38.840 old beers there for sure. And they have lids on 0:10:38.920 --> 0:10:42.720 their their mugs too, because you know, there's so much 0:10:42.720 --> 0:10:44.200 of it you can just set it down, save it 0:10:44.240 --> 0:10:46.320 for later. But I don't think they save it for later. 0:10:46.400 --> 0:10:48.280 The beer garden I went too did not have the lids. 0:10:49.200 --> 0:10:51.560 Maybe I've just seen in those on TV. But what 0:10:51.600 --> 0:10:55.160 they did have was a four and a half foot 0:10:55.160 --> 0:11:01.960 tall woman with popeye sized four arms, carrying six of 0:11:01.960 --> 0:11:07.000 those giants, like like a pro, not like a bro. 0:11:07.120 --> 0:11:09.280 They were pros well too. It's probably sold to the 0:11:09.360 --> 0:11:12.920 beer garden at a young age and was raised. Please 0:11:12.920 --> 0:11:16.719 tell me that's not the case. Um alright, so, uh 0:11:16.960 --> 0:11:19.440 where are we? Townspeople are partying? They're they're getting hammered, 0:11:19.440 --> 0:11:23.760 they're singing, they're they're they're prosting, singing your German beer 0:11:23.800 --> 0:11:28.600 hall uh songs as they are one to do. And 0:11:28.600 --> 0:11:34.960 then dude says, uh, what's up with that? All those florins? Yeah, 0:11:35.080 --> 0:11:37.679 he's like, everybody, I'm really glad you enjoyed my work, 0:11:37.720 --> 0:11:39.960 but now it's time for me to go pay me. 0:11:40.160 --> 0:11:42.880 And did they just stiff them or did they say, well, 0:11:42.960 --> 0:11:46.840 let's go back to the thousand. Uh, they said, we're 0:11:46.840 --> 0:11:49.520 not giving you fifty thousand florins. What you We thought 0:11:49.559 --> 0:11:51.000 you were going to get rid of these rets through 0:11:51.040 --> 0:11:53.800 hard work. You just played some flute, Like that's cool 0:11:53.840 --> 0:11:55.800 that you can do that with the flute, but that's 0:11:55.840 --> 0:11:58.760 not really work. So no, we're not gonna pay you 0:11:58.840 --> 0:12:02.000 fifty thousand florence. He's like, well, in a thousand florins 0:12:02.040 --> 0:12:04.559 at least that's what I originally agreed to. And they're like, 0:12:04.800 --> 0:12:07.520 how about this. We're gonna give you fifty and if 0:12:07.520 --> 0:12:10.800 you're not happy with that, then you're getting nothing. And 0:12:10.880 --> 0:12:13.079 he was still so mad that they're like, fine, nothing, 0:12:13.120 --> 0:12:16.720 get out of town. And he says, you will regret 0:12:17.280 --> 0:12:19.560 you know what that's like. That's like highering the critter 0:12:19.640 --> 0:12:23.120 remover because you have a raccoon in your attic. You 0:12:23.160 --> 0:12:25.160 agree to a price. He comes over and shoots the 0:12:25.240 --> 0:12:29.200 raccoon and says game over, and you're like, wait a minute. 0:12:29.200 --> 0:12:31.960 I expected a little more like uh, like you were 0:12:32.000 --> 0:12:34.640 going to hypnotize him or or coax him down from 0:12:34.679 --> 0:12:39.200 the roof with your smooth jazz. Right, not just shoot it. 0:12:39.280 --> 0:12:41.720 Anybody could shoot it. I thought you're gonna like step 0:12:41.760 --> 0:12:44.800 on it or something. Yeah, Like I would have shot it. 0:12:44.920 --> 0:12:47.880 Looking for a peaceful, less solution right in place, I 0:12:47.960 --> 0:12:49.680 have a bullet hole in my house. Now have you 0:12:49.679 --> 0:12:52.400 ever had to call one of those people a raccoon remover? Well, 0:12:52.440 --> 0:12:55.120 I'll just you know those dudes, just like you know, 0:12:55.120 --> 0:12:58.800 I'll do snakes and raccoons or whatever. I haven't either, 0:12:59.400 --> 0:13:02.520 but a lot of my friends do that. I'm over one. 0:13:02.760 --> 0:13:05.120 I think I mentioned with cockroaches right now, and it's 0:13:05.160 --> 0:13:08.800 just it's getting bad still, Yeah, dude, because I don't 0:13:08.800 --> 0:13:12.000 know what to do. Hire an exterminator. Yeah, but we're 0:13:12.000 --> 0:13:14.240 not into the poison stuff. But I think it's like, 0:13:14.480 --> 0:13:17.640 we gotta do it. I think there's green exterminators that 0:13:17.679 --> 0:13:20.800 are not quite as deadly. Jerry's nodding, But will they 0:13:20.840 --> 0:13:25.920 kill all the cockroaches? Probably? Probably? You probably with their 0:13:26.040 --> 0:13:29.520 magic flute, and I need to do something. It's gotten 0:13:29.600 --> 0:13:32.200 out of hand. Yeah, you got to do something, like 0:13:32.240 --> 0:13:36.280 I almost I'm gonna tell you what happens, but I 0:13:36.280 --> 0:13:39.120 feel like people judge me on how disgusting it is. 0:13:39.280 --> 0:13:41.480 We can always edit it out later, all right. I'll 0:13:41.520 --> 0:13:43.600 go in and and this is not like it's not 0:13:43.640 --> 0:13:46.400 like food is out. I will clean the kitchen. I 0:13:46.400 --> 0:13:47.960 will go in there to get a glass of water. 0:13:48.120 --> 0:13:52.040 At midnight, I'll turn the light on and a dozen 0:13:52.120 --> 0:13:56.080 will scatter. Jerry's geting, Nope, like I will just I 0:13:56.080 --> 0:13:59.080 will hear them going, sure, Yeah, that's one of the 0:13:59.120 --> 0:14:01.600 creepiest things. And they you know, as soon as they 0:14:01.600 --> 0:14:03.840 see that light, they're gone. And it sounds like we 0:14:03.920 --> 0:14:06.080 live in filth. But it doesn't matter. We're infested. They're 0:14:06.120 --> 0:14:10.080 just like, I don't know what to do. Yeah, well, um, 0:14:10.160 --> 0:14:13.520 I think you may want to call an exterminator, but fine, 0:14:13.600 --> 0:14:16.400 one you live into cator. I'm sure you'd be hard 0:14:16.440 --> 0:14:19.440 pestifind an exterminator that did use deadly You throw a 0:14:19.560 --> 0:14:24.760 rock indicator and you'll hit a dust So I yes, 0:14:24.840 --> 0:14:28.200 I think it might be time. All right, Sorry about 0:14:28.200 --> 0:14:32.240 getting sidetracks so much. They offer him, what fifty fifty 0:14:32.280 --> 0:14:35.120 not even not fifty thou or a thousand fifty? And 0:14:35.120 --> 0:14:39.080 so what does he say? He says, but he did 0:14:39.120 --> 0:14:41.120 that little everybody. You can't see me, but you know 0:14:41.200 --> 0:14:44.160 where you flick the underside of your chain, that feel 0:14:44.200 --> 0:14:47.120 like that's Italian? Well, I mean this is Germany, it's 0:14:47.160 --> 0:14:49.640 Lower Saxony. It wasn't too far from Germany. But is 0:14:49.640 --> 0:14:52.080 that Italian? I was just wondering. Yeah, it feels like 0:14:52.080 --> 0:14:56.720 a very like Italian thing to do. Yeah, okay, right exactly. 0:14:56.760 --> 0:14:59.000 You gotta say it like that, all right. So he 0:14:59.040 --> 0:15:01.440 gives him that number and says I'm gonna come back. 0:15:02.360 --> 0:15:03.920 Does he even warn them and say I'm gonna come 0:15:03.920 --> 0:15:05.760 back and get your kids or I'm just gonna it 0:15:05.880 --> 0:15:08.640 depends on it's all good, you'll see me again. It 0:15:08.720 --> 0:15:12.000 depends on the story. Some say, yeah, he vowed vengeance. 0:15:12.040 --> 0:15:13.880 Some say he came back a month later. Some say 0:15:13.880 --> 0:15:15.560 he came back a year later. Some say he just 0:15:15.600 --> 0:15:19.120 immediately started playing his flute. Some say, and I think 0:15:19.160 --> 0:15:22.640 the brothers grim version is that he waited until the 0:15:22.680 --> 0:15:25.320 town went to sleep, and then came through the town 0:15:25.320 --> 0:15:28.240 and started playing again. All right, but this time he's 0:15:28.280 --> 0:15:33.200 wearing Hunter's clothing. Did not see that anywhere? Oh? Really 0:15:33.760 --> 0:15:36.400 does that? Bs? Well? I don't think it's b S. 0:15:36.480 --> 0:15:38.360 I think this story has just been added to so 0:15:38.440 --> 0:15:40.640 many times over there. But yeah, I shouldn't have ever 0:15:40.720 --> 0:15:43.240 been to anything. All right, So he comes back regardless 0:15:43.280 --> 0:15:45.320 of what he's wearing. Let's say he's buck naked, which 0:15:45.320 --> 0:15:47.400 makes it even more fun. Well, you just added to 0:15:47.440 --> 0:15:50.400 the legend just there. He starts playing this flute again, 0:15:50.560 --> 0:15:55.720 but this time the children are entranced. He leads like 0:15:55.760 --> 0:15:58.760 a hundred and thirty kids supposedly, Yeah, paying attention to 0:15:58.760 --> 0:16:01.200 a number. It seems a little specific, doesn't it does. 0:16:01.760 --> 0:16:03.720 He leads a hundred and thirty children out of town 0:16:04.640 --> 0:16:08.480 up a mountain to a cave. They supposedly enter and 0:16:08.520 --> 0:16:12.080 are never heard from again, right, And the mountain has 0:16:12.080 --> 0:16:16.920 a landslide and covers up the cave mouth, and supposedly 0:16:16.920 --> 0:16:20.160 it was a magical door that opened in the mountain 0:16:20.200 --> 0:16:25.080 that revealed the key. They go in, doors closed, landslide gone, 0:16:25.400 --> 0:16:27.680 never heard from again, like you said, And the townspeople 0:16:27.720 --> 0:16:31.640 are like, there goes our labor pool, there goes my baby, 0:16:32.080 --> 0:16:35.080 there goes their labor pool. Who's going to service at 0:16:35.080 --> 0:16:38.800 the beer gardens? And supposedly there in one version, at 0:16:38.880 --> 0:16:43.040 least um there was the mayor's grown daughter was among 0:16:43.360 --> 0:16:46.480 that group, and this feels like a specific jab at 0:16:46.560 --> 0:16:50.240 the mayor, like even though your daughter's grown, I'm gonna 0:16:50.360 --> 0:16:53.840 and transfer with my flute as well. Yeah, well I 0:16:53.840 --> 0:16:56.080 don't think that was in the original Grand Brothers one either, 0:16:56.160 --> 0:16:59.080 But but two children survived correct or they come back, 0:16:59.480 --> 0:17:02.040 I think. And the Grimm Brothers version is just one. 0:17:02.240 --> 0:17:05.399 Sometimes it's up to three. But there there's in a 0:17:05.440 --> 0:17:09.359 lot of retellings, there's a kid who either Um is 0:17:09.480 --> 0:17:13.320 deaf and so can't hear the magic flute song, so 0:17:13.400 --> 0:17:17.920 it's not entranced. Um has some sort of physical disability, 0:17:18.040 --> 0:17:20.960 and so he or she can't keep up with the 0:17:20.960 --> 0:17:24.119 rest of the kids and survives from that um or 0:17:25.119 --> 0:17:29.199 I think it's blind and can't see their way. Either way, 0:17:29.280 --> 0:17:33.680 some kid who had some unique characteristic that kept them 0:17:33.720 --> 0:17:39.239 from being um entranced or whatever. Uh is like the 0:17:39.240 --> 0:17:42.080 eyewitness that comes back and tells the parents what happened, 0:17:42.480 --> 0:17:45.840 or in another version, is just a skeptic child skeptic. 0:17:46.240 --> 0:17:55.360 This can't be happening. Louis the child's skipt um. That's funny. 0:17:55.520 --> 0:17:58.840 So all right, so let's get into this. It may 0:17:58.880 --> 0:18:02.520 not to be fictions, as it turns out, because a 0:18:02.560 --> 0:18:04.919 lot of historians and scholars have looked into this. You 0:18:04.960 --> 0:18:08.640 talked about the specificity being a little weird. One thing 0:18:08.680 --> 0:18:10.879 we do know is that at one point there was 0:18:10.880 --> 0:18:13.960 a stained glass window in the in the town church 0:18:14.800 --> 0:18:18.040 um that depicted and this was what around thirteen hundreds 0:18:18.119 --> 0:18:21.560 is after it would have happened, but I mean sixteen 0:18:21.640 --> 0:18:25.720 years in memory, living memory, it was when they first 0:18:25.720 --> 0:18:29.439 erected that window, which kind of makes sense as a memorial. Uh. 0:18:29.520 --> 0:18:32.159 And on that window it said on the day of 0:18:32.240 --> 0:18:35.959 John Paul, I'm sorry John and Paul. One thirty children 0:18:35.960 --> 0:18:39.000 in Hamlin went to Calvary were brought through all kinds 0:18:39.000 --> 0:18:44.120 of danger to the copin mountain and lost. Yeah. So 0:18:44.160 --> 0:18:48.399 the Calvary thing that I thought was another word for Heaven, 0:18:49.280 --> 0:18:52.520 isn't it. I'm gone, I'm going to Calvary in that 0:18:52.560 --> 0:18:56.440 was like in that like the hill where was crucified. 0:18:58.400 --> 0:19:00.880 If I know this, surely you know used to know this. 0:19:01.240 --> 0:19:04.080 I know it looms large and and Christianity, but I 0:19:04.080 --> 0:19:06.600 can't remember exactly. I think it's like shorthand for I'm 0:19:06.680 --> 0:19:10.040 going to meet my maker. I saw elsewhere that they 0:19:10.040 --> 0:19:14.840 referred to the mountain as cavalry. Yeah. They also referred 0:19:14.840 --> 0:19:17.840 to the area that the children went to Calvary as 0:19:17.960 --> 0:19:21.360 the execution place. I never saw any explanation of that. 0:19:21.920 --> 0:19:24.520 And then the copp And Mountain. I don't understand why 0:19:24.560 --> 0:19:27.560 that would be also named Calvary, and they would mention 0:19:27.600 --> 0:19:29.960 at the same place twice with two different names. So 0:19:30.280 --> 0:19:32.159 it's a bit of a mystery. But the point is, 0:19:32.560 --> 0:19:37.280 about fifteen sixteen years after this event supposedly happened, or 0:19:37.280 --> 0:19:40.960 the fairy tale takes place, the town of Hamlin, Germany 0:19:41.000 --> 0:19:45.320 in um Lower Saxony or West Falley, I think is 0:19:45.359 --> 0:19:48.680 what it's called now, put put up of stained glass 0:19:49.359 --> 0:19:52.840 window commemorating this and the window did not survive, but 0:19:52.880 --> 0:19:56.480 apparently there are accounts of that window, yeah, like in 0:19:56.520 --> 0:19:58.120 more than one place. Yeah, and it was I mean 0:19:58.160 --> 0:19:59.919 you can understand that it would be because it was 0:20:00.000 --> 0:20:02.320 in the town church for hundreds of years before it 0:20:02.400 --> 0:20:04.840 was destroyed. No one knows how it was destroyed, but 0:20:04.880 --> 0:20:09.280 there is documentation that this window existed. Obviously, no living 0:20:09.359 --> 0:20:12.840 historians saw it with their own eyes, but there's enough, 0:20:13.080 --> 0:20:16.400 um documentary evidence that it seems to be. Yes, there 0:20:16.440 --> 0:20:18.879 was a window that was erected in That is a 0:20:19.000 --> 0:20:22.200 very weird thing to do to just make up right, 0:20:22.800 --> 0:20:27.040 very weird, um, especially in the church. Yeah, you don't 0:20:27.040 --> 0:20:30.959 why you go to hell for that? So that was 0:20:31.200 --> 0:20:35.080 that was the first documentary evidence, right. The next one 0:20:35.119 --> 0:20:39.800 I saw comes a hundred years later in four and 0:20:40.000 --> 0:20:43.160 um it's in the Hamlin Town Chronicle for that year, 0:20:43.880 --> 0:20:46.720 and all it says is it is one hundred years 0:20:46.720 --> 0:20:50.919 since our children left. Yeah. Kind of weird. And what 0:20:51.040 --> 0:20:53.760 is that just a blurb? I guess so you'd think 0:20:53.800 --> 0:20:56.400 a hundred year commemoration they might add a little more 0:20:56.440 --> 0:20:59.960 than that. Yeah, and what is this the Luneberg Manu's 0:21:00.040 --> 0:21:04.000 script This was about a hundred years after the window. 0:21:04.960 --> 0:21:07.919 And this was a monk who wrote it, Heinrich of Hereford, 0:21:08.800 --> 0:21:11.679 and he says, he writes an account and says a 0:21:11.760 --> 0:21:14.040 man about thirty years old came to town playing a 0:21:14.119 --> 0:21:18.359 flute and lead the children out. Yeah, pretty simple. Yeah, 0:21:18.400 --> 0:21:23.320 but what's noteworthy about that one. There's a couple of things. Um, 0:21:23.400 --> 0:21:27.960 So the the piper doesn't show up in the first 0:21:28.119 --> 0:21:31.760 in the window, right, but he does show up in 0:21:32.480 --> 0:21:37.359 the Lumberg manuscript. He mentions the piper. But no rats 0:21:37.359 --> 0:21:40.320 in any of these, right, not yet. But the other 0:21:40.359 --> 0:21:43.879 thing about the Lumberg manuscript is that it Looomberg is 0:21:43.920 --> 0:21:46.800 a nearby town. So there are other towns that are 0:21:46.840 --> 0:21:51.480 talking about this event that happened in their own chronicles. Right, 0:21:51.920 --> 0:21:54.440 it was one of the reasons why. But it supports 0:21:54.440 --> 0:21:56.480 the idea that it's real, because if it's just this 0:21:56.600 --> 0:22:00.240 one town that's deluded, even if other towns are talking 0:22:00.280 --> 0:22:03.840 about it, they'll probably be by the way, they're all nuts. 0:22:03.880 --> 0:22:08.000 But other towns chronicles seemed to be verifying that this 0:22:08.119 --> 0:22:10.880 happened or recounting this story in like a credulous way. 0:22:11.320 --> 0:22:13.960 So something happened in twelve eighty four, and the evidence 0:22:14.000 --> 0:22:16.760 is starting to mount. Um. But the other thing about 0:22:16.800 --> 0:22:19.840 the fact that this is another town is that this 0:22:19.920 --> 0:22:24.240 town Loomburg and other towns. Um cited that Hambling came 0:22:24.240 --> 0:22:31.240 to be known to commemorate things counting backward or forward 0:22:31.400 --> 0:22:35.880 from the date of twelve eighty four. So, for example, 0:22:35.960 --> 0:22:38.720 they put up a gate in fifteen fifty six in 0:22:38.760 --> 0:22:41.720 the town. This is what they inscribed on the gate, 0:22:41.800 --> 0:22:45.720 chuck uh In this year of fifteen fifty six, two 0:22:45.800 --> 0:22:48.320 hundred and seventy two years after the magician led a 0:22:48.359 --> 0:22:50.919 hundred and thirty children out of the town, this portal 0:22:51.040 --> 0:22:55.320 was erected. That's like saying, like this, we're putting up 0:22:55.400 --> 0:22:58.000 the sewer two hundred and sixty two years after our 0:22:58.080 --> 0:23:00.480 children were led out of town by a magician. Enjoy 0:23:00.560 --> 0:23:04.800 the sewer. Like, that's a weird thing to inscribe in something. 0:23:04.840 --> 0:23:07.640 And apparently the town became known for that kind of thing. 0:23:08.280 --> 0:23:13.680 What just these random inscriptions about this weird, like mysterious event. Yeah, 0:23:13.720 --> 0:23:17.600 just like dating everything from twelve eighty four on based 0:23:17.640 --> 0:23:20.280 on their their children leaving. And again you'll notice it 0:23:20.400 --> 0:23:24.520 mentions a hundred and thirty children. Things changed over the retelling. 0:23:24.880 --> 0:23:27.840 But the one thing that's remained the same is the 0:23:27.920 --> 0:23:30.920