Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.
Speaker 2: The former US Vice President Mike Pence warning of threats
Speaker 2: to the Republican Party in his latest book, What Conservatives Believe,
Speaker 2: Rediscovering the Conservative Conscience, Pence writing, quote, Trump has not
Speaker 2: always governed as a conservative. The result is that many
Speaker 2: Americans are confused about what it means to be a conservative.
Speaker 2: I'm very pleased to say the forty eighth Vice President
Speaker 2: of the United States, Mike Pence, joins us now for more.
Speaker 2: Mister Vice President, welcome back to Bloomberg Surveillance on Bloomberg TV.
Speaker 2: Thank you great to be back on. It's good to
Speaker 2: see you, sir. I'll ask that question to you, what
Speaker 2: does it mean to be a conservative?
Speaker 3: Well, for decades, the Republican Party has really been the
Speaker 3: home of conservatism in this country. It's a commitment to
Speaker 3: limited government, free market economics, strong defense, American leadership in
Speaker 3: the world, and traditional values has really guided the Republican
Speaker 3: Party since Ronald Reagan into the White House. And it's
Speaker 3: why I and millions of Americans were drawn to the
Speaker 3: Republican Party over the years. Our principal contest was against
Speaker 3: the Liberal Democratic Party over those decades, but as the
Speaker 3: Democratic Party has been overtaken by more progressive left policies,
Speaker 3: including socialist policies, not just in New York but all
Speaker 3: around the country. I wrote the book because I wanted
Speaker 3: Republicans to know that there's a new threat to that
Speaker 3: conservative agenda within our movement from a populist right that
Speaker 3: would really challenge our commitment to limited government, to free enterprise,
Speaker 3: challenge America's role as leader of the free world, marginalized values.
Speaker 3: And I do think, as you quoted from the book,
Speaker 3: that many are confused about what it means to be
Speaker 3: a conservative. So that's what inspired what conservatives believe.
Speaker 4: Well, you served alongside him, of course in the first term.
Speaker 4: Was he a conservative?
Speaker 3: Then?
Speaker 5: Well I think, Look, I say this in the book.
Speaker 3: You know I know Donald Trump better than his most
Speaker 3: ardent defenders. We worked together every day and spoke every
Speaker 3: day for four and a half years, and in fairness
Speaker 3: to the President, he's actually never said he was a conservative.
Speaker 3: In fact, I lost count of the number of times
Speaker 3: that I would say in conversations in the Oval office, well,
Speaker 3: that position is a conservative position, and he would he
Speaker 3: would wave his hand and say, what conservative, It's just
Speaker 3: common sense and so.
Speaker 5: But in our administration, I.
Speaker 3: Will tell you I think we were very faithful in
Speaker 3: most cases to the traditional conservative agenda, appointing conservative judges,
Speaker 3: upholding the rule of law, and particularly in the area
Speaker 3: of free market and economics and free enterprise. You know,
Speaker 3: we cut taxes, rolled back regulations, unleashed American energy. But
Speaker 3: on economic issues, I think it's becoming more apparent, particularly
Speaker 3: in the business community across this country, with the advent
Speaker 3: of broad based tariffs imposed on friend and foa like that.
Speaker 3: While they were turned back by the Supreme Court, we
Speaker 3: saw the news this morning of a new round of
Speaker 3: tariffs attempted by the USTR. The nationalization of American businesses
Speaker 3: with something we never countenance in our administration is much
Speaker 3: more a part of a traditional socialists.
Speaker 5: Thinking around the world.
Speaker 3: Price controls on pharmaceuticals and credit cards, these are I
Speaker 3: think these are policies that come out of the populous
Speaker 3: right amory, and they represent a real shift. Now, can
Speaker 3: I just say, I think the second Trump administration has
Speaker 3: gotten a lot right, standing up to Iran, standing with Israel,
Speaker 3: extending those tax cuts, securing our border. But on some
Speaker 3: key issues we've seen those populous rights policies take hold,
Speaker 3: and I want conservatives around the country to know that these.
Speaker 4: Are ideas that you'd hear from a Senator Elizabeth Warren
Speaker 4: or Senator Bernie Sanders.
Speaker 5: But the issue in Washington right now.
Speaker 4: Is there's not a lot of people speaking out against
Speaker 4: this in Congress. Do you feel that Trump has gotten
Speaker 4: a lot more carte blanche this time around?
Speaker 5: Well, I think so.
Speaker 3: I mean, the president is the leader of the party,
Speaker 3: and with majorities in the Congress, I think there's been
Speaker 3: a tremendous amount.
Speaker 5: Of deference to the president. But you put a fine
Speaker 5: point on it.
Speaker 3: In fact, in my book, I point out when the
Speaker 3: president first announced a nationalization policy, it might have been
Speaker 3: the golden chairs in US steel, Elizabeth Warren said memorably,
Speaker 3: Donald Trump has come across an idea that I came
Speaker 3: up with years ago. And John might argue whether nationalization
Speaker 3: was something Elizabeth Warren came up with there might be
Speaker 3: a deeper history in other.
Speaker 5: Parts of the world.
Speaker 3: But I honestly believe that the there's not been a
Speaker 3: great deal of awareness broadly among grassroots Americans about some
Speaker 3: of these shifts, but people are starting to wake up
Speaker 3: to it, and I hope my book is a part
Speaker 3: of that awakening, not just because I think conservative policies
Speaker 3: are good for the Republican parties, because I believe freedom,
Speaker 3: free market economics, commitment to limited government, and American leadership
Speaker 3: in the world is good for America.
Speaker 1: To build on what Amory was talking about, though, we've
Speaker 1: seen recent primary elections and the people who are considered
Speaker 1: a bit more populist have been the winners of the
Speaker 1: Republican primary process. Those are the ones that have been
Speaker 1: backed by President Trump. He still has quite a bit
Speaker 1: of clout in getting those to Congress, to Washington, d C.
Speaker 1: He is, in many ways the Republican Party. Do you
Speaker 1: think that the Republican Party that you're talking about still exists?
Speaker 5: Oh?
Speaker 2: I do.
Speaker 3: And don't leave out his influence in primaries in Louisiana
Speaker 3: and Kentucky and Indiana, some state senate races in Indiana. Look,
Speaker 3: the President enjoys tremendous support among Republican primary voters, and
Speaker 3: I think it derives from the fact that from the
Speaker 3: time he came down that Golden escalator here in New
Speaker 3: York City, he has been willing to fight the radical left.
Speaker 3: He did it during our years together he did it
Speaker 3: since battled through law fair won back the White House,
Speaker 3: and I think.
Speaker 5: There's a great appreciation.
Speaker 3: By Republican voters for his continued fight against the radical left.
Speaker 3: But what I wrote the book for was just to
Speaker 3: make sure that we don't conflate the loyalty to the president,
Speaker 3: as some on the populous right would have an embrace
Speaker 3: of a new agenda for the Republican Party. I think
Speaker 3: the Republican Party has to be a party committed to
Speaker 3: free market economics and limited government and all the ideals
Speaker 3: and principles. I'm particularly troubled at am maried with your
Speaker 3: background on foreign affairs. Particularly, I'm particularly troubled about the
Speaker 3: stops and starts on American support for Ukraine.
Speaker 5: It was the.
Speaker 3: Populas right voices inside and outside the administration that actually
Speaker 3: argued against striking Around's nuclear facilities a year ago and
Speaker 3: even launching Operation Epic Fury, and even more troubling to me,
Speaker 3: voices on the populist writer questioning America's support for Israel,
Speaker 3: and with that rhetoric actually descending at times into the
Speaker 3: dark hallways of anti Semitism. Look, that's not who conservatives
Speaker 3: are in this country. It's not what conservatives believe, and
Speaker 3: I try and call it out in the book.
Speaker 2: Let's finish on one particular policy debate that I think
Speaker 2: will be a defining policy debate for the next decade perhaps,
Speaker 2: and that's Ai. I've sat here wondering at times, what
Speaker 2: is the conservative position? What will the conservative position be?
Speaker 2: I know what the left will do and how they respond.
Speaker 2: Tax we distribute, tax we distribute. What's the conservative position
Speaker 2: on that technology? What's it going to be? How evolved
Speaker 2: in the next ten years?
Speaker 5: We'll sun well. I encourage you to read my book, John,
Speaker 5: because you'll see.
Speaker 2: I'm just going to come.
Speaker 5: I think there is a look.
Speaker 3: A conservative view would be that technology is neutral.
Speaker 5: It's neither good nor bad.
Speaker 3: I greatly admire the former chairman of Intel, who's written
Speaker 3: a wonderful book entitled ar Ai for Good. And I
Speaker 3: think it's imperative that as we move into this, that
Speaker 3: we trust the marketplace, but that also we ensure that
Speaker 3: that artificial intelligence work for us in the way that
Speaker 3: we want it to impact our economies, in our workplace,
Speaker 3: and most importantly for conservatives is that it respects the values,
Speaker 3: the universal values of the overwhelming majority of the American
Speaker 3: people who believe in and and and cherish freedom and
Speaker 3: cherish the importance of family. You know, when you see
Speaker 3: troubling stories about the chat programs that actually assist teenagers
Speaker 3: in finding ways to take their own life, it's just
Speaker 3: tragic consequence. I think it's abstulutely imperative the conservative step
Speaker 3: forward and say, let's create the guardrails around AI so
Speaker 3: that consumers will have places to go for AI that
Speaker 3: really reflects our goals, our objectives, our values, and let
Speaker 3: the marketplace work.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's what I'm kind of getting at. I can
Speaker 2: trust the market rump Limpack. I think that's a great
Speaker 2: tradition of support for free markets and limited government in
Speaker 2: our audience. At least, can we trust the leadership of
Speaker 2: these companies?
Speaker 3: Well, I think that's I think that's the real question today,
Speaker 3: and what we want to do is facilitate the emergence
Speaker 3: of alternatives within the market.
Speaker 5: Look. I think the American people.
Speaker 3: Have understandably have concerns about AI, but have given the
Speaker 3: opportunity to spend their dollars and spend their business resources
Speaker 3: on AI that works for us and respects those universal values.
Speaker 3: I trust the American people will choose well.
Speaker 4: The one thing on AI to Jonathan's earlier point about
Speaker 4: what the left is going to do, Bernie Sanders says
Speaker 4: he wants to tax these companies fifty percent. Steve Bannon,
Speaker 4: which you know well from Trump's first term, one of
Speaker 4: his key architects of his rise and how Trump would speak,
Speaker 4: doesn't think Bernie Sanders goes far enough. Is that going
Speaker 4: to be the Republican position, whether you agree with it
Speaker 4: or not in twenty twenty eight.
Speaker 3: Republicans don't raise taxes. Republicans cut taxes. And I would
Speaker 3: caution you against given anybody too much credit for Donald
Speaker 3: Trump's rise other than Donald Trump.
Speaker 5: I meant this president.
Speaker 4: From that's where the base is right now.
Speaker 3: Well, you know, I honestly think that when you talk
Speaker 3: about the base, which is one of my least favorite
Speaker 3: terms in politics, we talk about our core voters. There's,
Speaker 3: as I said to Lisa, a great, great appreciation and
Speaker 3: affection for the president. It's totally understandable for the fight
Speaker 3: that he's waged against the radical left the last ten years.
Speaker 3: But on the populous right, there are voices that want
Speaker 3: to take that loyalty and permanently change the direction of
Speaker 3: the republican party to a big government party that embraces protectionism.
Speaker 3: Isolationism marginalizes values, and to put a fine point on it,
Speaker 3: I don't think that's what conservatives believe.
Speaker 2: When did you speak to each other?
Speaker 3: You know, we spoke shortly after he won re election
Speaker 3: and we had a warm exchange.
Speaker 5: John was what did you talk about? I just congratulated him.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I can tell he was moved by that,
Speaker 3: as was the first lady. Look I I uh uh uh.
Speaker 3: You know, President and I served together very closely. He
Speaker 3: wasn't just my president, he was my friend. Our administration
Speaker 3: didn't end the way I wanted it to, but I'll
Speaker 3: always believe, by God's grace, I did my duty that day.
Speaker 3: But you know, for me, it's I want this president
Speaker 3: to succeed. I love this country, and I don't talk
Speaker 3: to the president as often as I used to, but
Speaker 3: I get the distinct impression that he still listens to me,
Speaker 3: and so I hope he gets a chance to.
Speaker 2: I listened to you as well, and I promise you
Speaker 2: I'll read the book. It's coming next to the Thatcher
Speaker 2: biography on the bed site table. All right, good to
Speaker 2: see you, sir, Thank you the former vice president of
Speaker 2: the United States.
Speaker 5: Mike Pence