1 00:00:04,280 --> 00:00:07,240 Speaker 1: Get in touch with technology with tech Stuff from how 2 00:00:07,320 --> 00:00:14,240 Speaker 1: stuff works dot com. Hey there, everyone, and welcome to 3 00:00:14,400 --> 00:00:18,040 Speaker 1: tech Stuff. I'm Jonathan Strickland and i'm and Today we 4 00:00:18,120 --> 00:00:20,880 Speaker 1: are going to tackle part one of a two part 5 00:00:20,960 --> 00:00:26,000 Speaker 1: series about alternative fuels. Yes, we can technically do like 6 00:00:26,040 --> 00:00:28,240 Speaker 1: a seven part series on this, but we decided to 7 00:00:28,320 --> 00:00:30,600 Speaker 1: kind of condense it the way that you would perhaps 8 00:00:30,680 --> 00:00:35,360 Speaker 1: a natural guests or yeah, hey, looks the only one 9 00:00:35,360 --> 00:00:41,040 Speaker 1: who can. Really basically, we are compressing these subjects into 10 00:00:41,080 --> 00:00:43,559 Speaker 1: two parts. The first part is going to be kind 11 00:00:43,560 --> 00:00:47,040 Speaker 1: of an overview of the different alternatives that we think 12 00:00:47,080 --> 00:00:49,760 Speaker 1: of with alternative fuel, keeping in mind that, you know, 13 00:00:49,800 --> 00:00:52,400 Speaker 1: the ones that we're talking about today are the major players, 14 00:00:52,560 --> 00:00:55,560 Speaker 1: and that there could be an alternative fuel right around 15 00:00:55,560 --> 00:00:57,920 Speaker 1: the corner that is completely different from the ones we're 16 00:00:58,200 --> 00:01:02,120 Speaker 1: chatting about. Now, uh, you know, that's a possibility, but 17 00:01:02,160 --> 00:01:04,720 Speaker 1: these are the These are the ones that are currently 18 00:01:04,800 --> 00:01:08,320 Speaker 1: in some form of production and use in various places 19 00:01:08,360 --> 00:01:10,839 Speaker 1: around the world. It also will behoove us to mention 20 00:01:10,920 --> 00:01:14,319 Speaker 1: the fact that Lauren and I come from the United 21 00:01:14,400 --> 00:01:16,680 Speaker 1: States of America. That is where we live, that is 22 00:01:16,680 --> 00:01:18,880 Speaker 1: our frame of reference UM and a lot of the 23 00:01:18,920 --> 00:01:23,640 Speaker 1: information available to us immediately centered around that kind of experience, 24 00:01:23,640 --> 00:01:26,480 Speaker 1: so we know more about the laws, the prices, and 25 00:01:26,520 --> 00:01:31,240 Speaker 1: the general availability exactly right, right, what's the infrastructure status 26 00:01:31,240 --> 00:01:33,520 Speaker 1: in the US. Now, keep in mind that some of 27 00:01:33,520 --> 00:01:36,160 Speaker 1: these alternative fuels have a lot of support in other 28 00:01:36,319 --> 00:01:40,319 Speaker 1: nations around the world. Uh, some nations have have invested 29 00:01:40,319 --> 00:01:43,400 Speaker 1: a great deal in say propane for example, as a 30 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:46,920 Speaker 1: possible fuel source. And we're really talking about fuel for 31 00:01:46,959 --> 00:01:50,919 Speaker 1: the most part as vehicle fuel and specifically vehicle fuel 32 00:01:51,200 --> 00:01:54,160 Speaker 1: for you guys as in consumers. Yes, we will mention 33 00:01:54,240 --> 00:01:56,400 Speaker 1: a couple of places where some of these fuels have 34 00:01:56,560 --> 00:02:01,120 Speaker 1: been used commercially or in a government fleet vehicles right, 35 00:02:01,240 --> 00:02:05,400 Speaker 1: or in industrial vehicles that are used in factories or 36 00:02:05,520 --> 00:02:08,320 Speaker 1: or construction yards or whatever. But for the most part, 37 00:02:08,360 --> 00:02:11,920 Speaker 1: we're really looking at this is the alternative to the 38 00:02:12,040 --> 00:02:15,960 Speaker 1: stuff what you put in your gas tank or diesel 39 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:21,360 Speaker 1: tank as the case maybe, or hydrogen fuel cell or etcetera, etcetera. Yeah. So, um, 40 00:02:21,440 --> 00:02:24,080 Speaker 1: so you can look at these in lots of different ways. 41 00:02:24,160 --> 00:02:28,080 Speaker 1: You can divide them up into all sorts of different categories. 42 00:02:28,240 --> 00:02:32,120 Speaker 1: And so we kind of arbitrarily made these into our 43 00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:36,800 Speaker 1: own categories based upon my whim not not completely arbitrary. 44 00:02:37,160 --> 00:02:41,080 Speaker 1: We're first going to cover I think of biodiesel and ethanol. Yeah, 45 00:02:41,200 --> 00:02:43,200 Speaker 1: and and the idea here is that these are two 46 00:02:43,280 --> 00:02:48,320 Speaker 1: fuels that we get from uh organic sources, and then 47 00:02:48,360 --> 00:02:51,760 Speaker 1: we process it to make it into fuel. Also, these 48 00:02:51,800 --> 00:02:55,640 Speaker 1: two different fuels, they are different. Ethanol and biodesel are 49 00:02:55,760 --> 00:02:59,320 Speaker 1: not the same thing. Uh. These two fuels also, besides 50 00:02:59,400 --> 00:03:03,760 Speaker 1: requiring some processing, have some other stuff in common. For instance, 51 00:03:04,080 --> 00:03:07,720 Speaker 1: both of them you will frequently see in blended form, 52 00:03:07,880 --> 00:03:11,800 Speaker 1: meaning that we actually blend these with petroleum based fuels. 53 00:03:11,840 --> 00:03:14,040 Speaker 1: In the case of ethanol, we're talking gasoline, and with 54 00:03:14,080 --> 00:03:18,519 Speaker 1: bio diesel we're talking yeah. But anyway, in both cases, 55 00:03:18,680 --> 00:03:24,280 Speaker 1: we're talking about mixing uh this this biologically uh created 56 00:03:24,320 --> 00:03:28,040 Speaker 1: fuel with stuff that is petroleum based. Keeping in mind, 57 00:03:28,040 --> 00:03:30,400 Speaker 1: of course, if we want to go all the way back, 58 00:03:30,960 --> 00:03:34,800 Speaker 1: even petroleum based stuff was organic at one point. But sure, sure, 59 00:03:34,880 --> 00:03:37,280 Speaker 1: but but there's a difference between a between man made, 60 00:03:37,320 --> 00:03:41,760 Speaker 1: processed organics and stuff that took millions and millions and 61 00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:44,880 Speaker 1: millions of years to form the way it did. Yeah, 62 00:03:44,920 --> 00:03:48,160 Speaker 1: there's a tiny difference there. Uh So So let's let's 63 00:03:48,160 --> 00:03:50,840 Speaker 1: start with um, Well, let's start with ethanol, I think, 64 00:03:50,840 --> 00:03:53,280 Speaker 1: because that one is probably the one that that a 65 00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:55,360 Speaker 1: lot of people who may not be aware of it 66 00:03:55,440 --> 00:03:58,560 Speaker 1: are using already. Right, um, I think that in American 67 00:03:58,880 --> 00:04:02,960 Speaker 1: most places in America use a blend of gasoline to 68 00:04:03,000 --> 00:04:06,320 Speaker 1: about ethanol. Yeah, it's called E ten. That's the the 69 00:04:06,480 --> 00:04:10,640 Speaker 1: general term for that blend or gasohol. That's also what 70 00:04:10,720 --> 00:04:13,120 Speaker 1: it's often referred to, although, which sounds so goofy and 71 00:04:13,120 --> 00:04:17,280 Speaker 1: it's it's it's I've seen it increasing, or rather I 72 00:04:17,320 --> 00:04:19,719 Speaker 1: should say there's a decreasing trend to call it that. 73 00:04:19,800 --> 00:04:22,839 Speaker 1: I think it almost has a stigma against it because 74 00:04:22,839 --> 00:04:26,719 Speaker 1: people realize that uh ethanol, which by the way, is 75 00:04:26,839 --> 00:04:29,640 Speaker 1: ethyl alcohol, you know, it's it's just another name for 76 00:04:29,680 --> 00:04:33,640 Speaker 1: ethyl alcohol. Um that ethyl alcohol could be pretty hard 77 00:04:33,800 --> 00:04:37,359 Speaker 1: on some engine parts, depending upon what you know, what 78 00:04:37,520 --> 00:04:40,799 Speaker 1: your engine had in it, like various tubes and connectors 79 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:43,520 Speaker 1: and things like that. Al Right, it is a solvent 80 00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:45,479 Speaker 1: so um So one of the problems and using some 81 00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:48,200 Speaker 1: of the higher blends and in normal engines is that 82 00:04:48,320 --> 00:04:52,560 Speaker 1: it can um a start start knocking some some extra 83 00:04:52,600 --> 00:04:56,240 Speaker 1: stuff loose um and clogging fuel filters that way, and 84 00:04:56,520 --> 00:04:58,799 Speaker 1: be can start eating away at some of the rubber 85 00:04:58,839 --> 00:05:02,839 Speaker 1: components fuel exactly exactly. And so what's what's kind of 86 00:05:02,839 --> 00:05:05,520 Speaker 1: funny is that when it's eating away at that that 87 00:05:05,800 --> 00:05:08,000 Speaker 1: stuff that's built up in an engine. Let's say that 88 00:05:08,040 --> 00:05:11,640 Speaker 1: you've been using regular gasoline in an engine for a while, 89 00:05:11,680 --> 00:05:15,280 Speaker 1: but the engine can also accept ethanol of various blends, 90 00:05:15,320 --> 00:05:18,920 Speaker 1: like even a even a high concentration of of um 91 00:05:18,960 --> 00:05:23,599 Speaker 1: ethanol to actual gasoline. Well, the nice thing is that 92 00:05:23,680 --> 00:05:25,960 Speaker 1: it's actually going to start cleaning your system. But the 93 00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:28,040 Speaker 1: problem is all that stuff that's built up has to 94 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:29,960 Speaker 1: go somewhere, and that's when you get into that problem 95 00:05:29,960 --> 00:05:32,400 Speaker 1: of it clogging up filters and things like that. Right, 96 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:35,240 Speaker 1: which is why should you Should you have a vehicle 97 00:05:35,279 --> 00:05:37,839 Speaker 1: that can accept both, and you start using higher blends 98 00:05:37,839 --> 00:05:40,960 Speaker 1: of ethanol um, it's recommended to replace your fuel pumps 99 00:05:41,000 --> 00:05:44,000 Speaker 1: with something that is more capable of dealing with that, right, Right, 100 00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:47,360 Speaker 1: And then once you've got everything you know cleaned out 101 00:05:47,480 --> 00:05:52,000 Speaker 1: that first run through, just have a basic maintenance and 102 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:55,040 Speaker 1: replacement schedule, just as you would your normal vehicle. The 103 00:05:55,080 --> 00:05:57,920 Speaker 1: way most of us ignore UH and UH. I say 104 00:05:57,960 --> 00:06:00,440 Speaker 1: that because I know a lot of car owners, and 105 00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:03,200 Speaker 1: I think regular maintenance is something that just happens to 106 00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:07,600 Speaker 1: other people. Uh, I've been I've been that guy once 107 00:06:07,720 --> 00:06:10,560 Speaker 1: or twice. I I take the train, so what do 108 00:06:10,600 --> 00:06:14,120 Speaker 1: I know. But anyway, so it's it's very common in 109 00:06:14,160 --> 00:06:17,400 Speaker 1: the United States. Uh. In fact, I think something like 110 00:06:18,400 --> 00:06:22,800 Speaker 1: cent of gas stations have used some blend of ethanol. 111 00:06:22,880 --> 00:06:25,760 Speaker 1: And part of the reason for that is that ethanol 112 00:06:25,880 --> 00:06:29,279 Speaker 1: will increase the octane of your gasoline. Now, octane is 113 00:06:29,360 --> 00:06:32,080 Speaker 1: this this rating that we think of that can actually 114 00:06:32,120 --> 00:06:34,840 Speaker 1: reduce what we call engine knocking. So if you've ever 115 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:38,160 Speaker 1: been in an old car running on you know, a 116 00:06:38,200 --> 00:06:41,640 Speaker 1: low uh octane gasoline and you start hearing this weird 117 00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:44,080 Speaker 1: knocking noise coming out of the engine, that's that's from 118 00:06:44,120 --> 00:06:48,120 Speaker 1: this this octane issue. Adding an ethanol increases the octane. 119 00:06:48,440 --> 00:06:52,400 Speaker 1: What it also does, however, is it it lowers the 120 00:06:52,440 --> 00:06:56,640 Speaker 1: actual energy content of the gasoline, because ethanol does not 121 00:06:56,800 --> 00:07:00,560 Speaker 1: have as much potential energy stored in it as gasoline, right, 122 00:07:00,560 --> 00:07:02,960 Speaker 1: which in all practicality means that the gallon for gallon, 123 00:07:03,040 --> 00:07:05,440 Speaker 1: you're going to get less mileage out of ethanol than 124 00:07:05,480 --> 00:07:08,360 Speaker 1: you will out of gasoline, right, And the less mileage 125 00:07:08,360 --> 00:07:11,280 Speaker 1: all depends upon that blend, Right, Like So if it's 126 00:07:11,320 --> 00:07:13,280 Speaker 1: an E ten blend where you've got the ten percent 127 00:07:13,400 --> 00:07:17,720 Speaker 1: ethanol and gasoline, you might get three to four percent 128 00:07:17,840 --> 00:07:20,000 Speaker 1: fewer miles per gallon than you would if you were 129 00:07:20,080 --> 00:07:23,880 Speaker 1: using just regular gasoline, if you were using eight five, 130 00:07:24,280 --> 00:07:26,080 Speaker 1: which is kind of the flip side of that, it's 131 00:07:26,120 --> 00:07:30,960 Speaker 1: ethanol and percent gasoline. This is something that flexible fuel 132 00:07:31,080 --> 00:07:33,240 Speaker 1: vehicles or f f vs as we call them in 133 00:07:33,280 --> 00:07:36,840 Speaker 1: the biz, can use. Then you're talking about a significant 134 00:07:36,920 --> 00:07:40,640 Speaker 1: drop in miles per gallon. You're talking, right, that's a 135 00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:44,080 Speaker 1: that's big, right. I mean, these are why we have 136 00:07:44,240 --> 00:07:48,360 Speaker 1: these different considerations, and we'll do a full episode about why. Uh, 137 00:07:48,400 --> 00:07:51,520 Speaker 1: there are a lot of challenges to switching to alternative fuel, 138 00:07:51,520 --> 00:07:53,080 Speaker 1: So I'm not going to really get into it there, 139 00:07:53,120 --> 00:07:54,840 Speaker 1: but you can kind of already see one of the 140 00:07:54,920 --> 00:07:58,040 Speaker 1: issues here. Um, So it does have a lower energy 141 00:07:58,080 --> 00:08:02,440 Speaker 1: content than gasoline. The cost of ethanol kind of varies 142 00:08:02,960 --> 00:08:05,400 Speaker 1: in the Midwest, where you've got a lot of places 143 00:08:05,400 --> 00:08:08,960 Speaker 1: that are actually growing the feedstocks. That's what we call 144 00:08:09,040 --> 00:08:12,560 Speaker 1: the stuff what we turn into ethanol, right, right, Starch 145 00:08:12,600 --> 00:08:16,480 Speaker 1: crops are what are used to ferment and distill um 146 00:08:16,520 --> 00:08:19,880 Speaker 1: stuff into ethanol, and especially in the US. That is 147 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:22,480 Speaker 1: the stuff. Yes, and um so corn is here in 148 00:08:22,520 --> 00:08:25,040 Speaker 1: the US is used mostly in Brazil. I think it's sugarcane, 149 00:08:25,240 --> 00:08:28,120 Speaker 1: but you can also use wheat, barley, potatoes. Right. The 150 00:08:28,360 --> 00:08:31,080 Speaker 1: starch based or sugar based stuff can be turned into this. 151 00:08:31,160 --> 00:08:36,000 Speaker 1: You can also use cellulose based cellulosic ethanol, which would 152 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:39,480 Speaker 1: come from things like wood chips or switch grass. Uh. Now, 153 00:08:39,520 --> 00:08:43,439 Speaker 1: this stuff has potentially a better return on investment when 154 00:08:43,440 --> 00:08:45,559 Speaker 1: it comes to energy. There's this thing called e r 155 00:08:45,640 --> 00:08:49,800 Speaker 1: o I that's energy return on investment. Whenever we're talking 156 00:08:49,800 --> 00:08:53,760 Speaker 1: about producing any sort of fuel, producing the fuel requires 157 00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:57,520 Speaker 1: you put energy into the production, and so it's really 158 00:08:57,559 --> 00:08:59,920 Speaker 1: important that the energy you get out from that pot 159 00:09:00,080 --> 00:09:02,160 Speaker 1: entol fuel, like whatever you're going to use that fuel for, 160 00:09:02,280 --> 00:09:04,800 Speaker 1: the energy is greater than what you've put in, right 161 00:09:04,840 --> 00:09:07,240 Speaker 1: because otherwise why are you doing it? Yees? Otherwise it 162 00:09:07,240 --> 00:09:09,480 Speaker 1: would be an energy sink. Because let's say, let's say 163 00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:11,360 Speaker 1: that you know, for the most part, the energy you're 164 00:09:11,400 --> 00:09:13,600 Speaker 1: going to be getting to produce the stuff is still 165 00:09:13,640 --> 00:09:16,640 Speaker 1: coming from fossil fuels, because that's what we really depend 166 00:09:16,679 --> 00:09:19,720 Speaker 1: upon right now. So if you would actually consume more 167 00:09:19,800 --> 00:09:22,840 Speaker 1: fossil fuel producing this alternative fuel than you would if 168 00:09:22,840 --> 00:09:24,960 Speaker 1: you had used the fossil fuel in the first place. 169 00:09:25,280 --> 00:09:27,839 Speaker 1: Then it's an energy sink and you're playing a losing game. 170 00:09:27,880 --> 00:09:30,520 Speaker 1: You want that energy to be greater the same the 171 00:09:30,559 --> 00:09:33,360 Speaker 1: same way that that fusion reactors are not popular yet 172 00:09:33,440 --> 00:09:35,959 Speaker 1: because they use more energy to start up than they 173 00:09:36,040 --> 00:09:38,920 Speaker 1: put out exactly. Yeah, if you've got an energy sink, 174 00:09:38,920 --> 00:09:41,400 Speaker 1: then really you've just got a thing what goes deep. 175 00:09:41,600 --> 00:09:43,960 Speaker 1: It's just what a lot in this. I apologize that 176 00:09:44,000 --> 00:09:45,760 Speaker 1: I don't know what it was that got into my head. 177 00:09:45,800 --> 00:09:48,840 Speaker 1: I shot a video today cackled insanely and then got 178 00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:53,200 Speaker 1: called on it on Twitter. Lauren, Hey, I that was 179 00:09:53,240 --> 00:09:55,920 Speaker 1: not Lauren. That was your humble narrator. That was completely different. 180 00:09:56,000 --> 00:09:59,079 Speaker 1: Fair enough, that's true. You can talk to her right so. 181 00:09:59,360 --> 00:10:02,400 Speaker 1: But some other things about ethanol, uh, they do. Ethanol 182 00:10:02,679 --> 00:10:05,439 Speaker 1: does tend to put out fewer greenhouse gas emissions than 183 00:10:05,480 --> 00:10:09,520 Speaker 1: gasoline combustion does, which is important. You know. One of 184 00:10:09,559 --> 00:10:11,640 Speaker 1: the questions we have to ask ourselves about moving to 185 00:10:11,640 --> 00:10:14,319 Speaker 1: an alternative fuel is why are you doing it right? 186 00:10:14,320 --> 00:10:16,120 Speaker 1: Because there are a lot of different potential answers you 187 00:10:16,120 --> 00:10:18,520 Speaker 1: could give, and if one of those answers is I'm 188 00:10:18,520 --> 00:10:23,280 Speaker 1: concerned about the environmental impact of gasoline consumption, then something 189 00:10:23,320 --> 00:10:26,200 Speaker 1: like this where you're talking about fewer greenhouse gas emissions, 190 00:10:26,440 --> 00:10:29,520 Speaker 1: is important. Uh, you know, so that's that's something to 191 00:10:29,559 --> 00:10:32,959 Speaker 1: keep in mind. Ethanol, of course, is also produced domestically. 192 00:10:33,240 --> 00:10:36,080 Speaker 1: That's also important because in the United States, you know, 193 00:10:36,200 --> 00:10:38,720 Speaker 1: some of our oil a great deal roil. Around half 194 00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:41,960 Speaker 1: of it really is brought in from it. Yeah, important, 195 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:44,040 Speaker 1: and some of that's imported from places in the world 196 00:10:44,040 --> 00:10:46,560 Speaker 1: where that it would be perhaps better for us to 197 00:10:46,679 --> 00:10:49,839 Speaker 1: not be supporting economically and politically, right the money that 198 00:10:49,880 --> 00:10:52,880 Speaker 1: we are are putting out could be funding things that 199 00:10:52,920 --> 00:10:57,199 Speaker 1: could be harmful to either that region's stability or to 200 00:10:57,520 --> 00:11:01,000 Speaker 1: the United States. Is stability in general role and so 201 00:11:01,160 --> 00:11:05,200 Speaker 1: anything you can produce domestically removes that that or at 202 00:11:05,240 --> 00:11:10,520 Speaker 1: least reduces that issue. So that's another reason why ethanol 203 00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:13,760 Speaker 1: is considered to be a nice alternative, is because it's 204 00:11:13,800 --> 00:11:17,440 Speaker 1: something that we can produce domestically. However, Uh, there's also 205 00:11:17,520 --> 00:11:21,040 Speaker 1: an issue about how much ethanol we produce versus um 206 00:11:21,160 --> 00:11:23,640 Speaker 1: how much gasoline we produce. But again, I'll save that 207 00:11:23,679 --> 00:11:26,440 Speaker 1: for the next show. I don't want to spoil everything 208 00:11:26,440 --> 00:11:30,000 Speaker 1: in this one. But anyway, um, yeah, I mean that's 209 00:11:30,080 --> 00:11:33,840 Speaker 1: that's generally the big picture on ethanol now for ethanol, 210 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:36,240 Speaker 1: for like things like that E a D five blend 211 00:11:36,280 --> 00:11:39,839 Speaker 1: where you have the ethanol. Again, that's something that's only 212 00:11:39,960 --> 00:11:43,640 Speaker 1: really useful in specific vehicles that have been tooled to 213 00:11:43,800 --> 00:11:47,400 Speaker 1: accept that as a fuel, so called that flexible fuel vehicles, 214 00:11:47,480 --> 00:11:50,920 Speaker 1: right exactly. So you don't want to fill up your 215 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:54,520 Speaker 1: your right off the lot car that normally runs on 216 00:11:54,559 --> 00:11:57,080 Speaker 1: gasoline with E eighty five because that's not a good 217 00:11:57,080 --> 00:12:00,480 Speaker 1: fuel for it. It could eat through those rubber hoses 218 00:12:00,520 --> 00:12:04,160 Speaker 1: like you were talking about, Lauren. So this is you know, 219 00:12:04,200 --> 00:12:06,240 Speaker 1: it's it's one of those things where you're really looking 220 00:12:06,240 --> 00:12:10,000 Speaker 1: at offsetting gasoline consumption, not completely replacing it. All right, 221 00:12:10,040 --> 00:12:12,480 Speaker 1: So let's talk about biodiesel, which is the other sort 222 00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:17,000 Speaker 1: of biological fuel source that we wanted to mention. Biodiesel, 223 00:12:17,120 --> 00:12:19,920 Speaker 1: of course, as the name suggests, is not a replacement 224 00:12:19,920 --> 00:12:23,120 Speaker 1: for gasoline. It's more like a substitute for diesel, which 225 00:12:23,160 --> 00:12:27,040 Speaker 1: is again a petroleum based fuel, but it's different from gasoline. 226 00:12:27,360 --> 00:12:32,960 Speaker 1: So a gasoline engine will not burn diesel fuel efficiently. 227 00:12:32,960 --> 00:12:36,120 Speaker 1: You have to have a diesel engine to do that now. 228 00:12:36,240 --> 00:12:41,240 Speaker 1: I actually remember when diesel cars were more popular than 229 00:12:41,280 --> 00:12:44,960 Speaker 1: they are now, because that's how old I am. I 230 00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:46,840 Speaker 1: was about to say, I don't remember that at all, Jonathan, 231 00:12:46,840 --> 00:12:48,679 Speaker 1: and I'm not even making fun of you right now. Yeah, no, 232 00:12:48,840 --> 00:12:51,320 Speaker 1: I remember it because, uh I was alive in the 233 00:12:51,360 --> 00:12:55,920 Speaker 1: seventies and nine, I saw diesel engine cars. Uh, you know, 234 00:12:55,920 --> 00:13:01,719 Speaker 1: because they're still very common in industrial use large vehicles 235 00:13:01,760 --> 00:13:06,520 Speaker 1: like buses or trucks. But and there are still cars 236 00:13:06,559 --> 00:13:11,439 Speaker 1: that are diesel engine cars. They're just not as common. Yeah, 237 00:13:11,480 --> 00:13:12,920 Speaker 1: a lot of And I did want to mention a 238 00:13:12,920 --> 00:13:15,840 Speaker 1: lot of the changes that have been made to how 239 00:13:15,880 --> 00:13:19,199 Speaker 1: we consume fossil fuels started out in the nineteen seventies 240 00:13:19,240 --> 00:13:22,360 Speaker 1: with them a the here in America, the the Clean 241 00:13:22,400 --> 00:13:25,680 Speaker 1: Air Act being passed by the Environmental Protection Agency, and 242 00:13:25,760 --> 00:13:28,679 Speaker 1: also the Arab oil Embargo from seventy three to seventy four, 243 00:13:28,720 --> 00:13:32,000 Speaker 1: and then the Iranian Revolution from seventy seventy nine. Yeah, 244 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:35,080 Speaker 1: we had some major fuel crises in the United States 245 00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:38,679 Speaker 1: and the seventies which really started the ball rolling. Things 246 00:13:38,720 --> 00:13:40,760 Speaker 1: that have kept the ball rolling are everything from the 247 00:13:40,800 --> 00:13:43,720 Speaker 1: domestic safety issue that I referred to earlier and the 248 00:13:43,800 --> 00:13:46,920 Speaker 1: environmental issue as well as just people concerned with trying 249 00:13:46,920 --> 00:13:49,480 Speaker 1: to find a way that would uh some sort of 250 00:13:49,480 --> 00:13:52,760 Speaker 1: fuel that could be less expensive, less volatile in price 251 00:13:52,920 --> 00:13:57,559 Speaker 1: than gasoline, right because between say seventy eight and one UM, 252 00:13:57,840 --> 00:14:01,880 Speaker 1: the cost of oil per barrel skyrocketed from fourteen dollars 253 00:14:01,880 --> 00:14:04,480 Speaker 1: to over thirty five. Well, I remember when I first 254 00:14:04,520 --> 00:14:07,560 Speaker 1: moved to Atlanta, gasoline was eighty five cents a gallon. 255 00:14:08,320 --> 00:14:11,480 Speaker 1: I I love watching things like a like die Hard 256 00:14:11,520 --> 00:14:14,360 Speaker 1: where suddenly it pans past a gas station and you 257 00:14:14,400 --> 00:14:17,120 Speaker 1: know that it's that it was before our time, because 258 00:14:17,120 --> 00:14:19,560 Speaker 1: it's like seventy nine cents a gallon. Yeah, now it's 259 00:14:19,600 --> 00:14:22,280 Speaker 1: over you know, three dollars a gallon easily in most 260 00:14:22,320 --> 00:14:24,360 Speaker 1: of the United States. And now that we should complain 261 00:14:24,400 --> 00:14:26,880 Speaker 1: about that because in Europe it's much much much higher, 262 00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:29,400 Speaker 1: right right, But again, but anyway, sign of the times. 263 00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:33,080 Speaker 1: So so biodiesel is interesting and that this is diesel 264 00:14:33,160 --> 00:14:37,000 Speaker 1: fuel that's manufactured from vegetable oils, animal fats, and even 265 00:14:37,080 --> 00:14:41,120 Speaker 1: recycled restaurant grease. I remember reading a news report a 266 00:14:41,160 --> 00:14:44,440 Speaker 1: few years ago, uh, an article in Creative Loafing, which 267 00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:49,000 Speaker 1: is a local weekly paper here in Atlanta, and it 268 00:14:49,040 --> 00:14:51,560 Speaker 1: was a feature on a guy out in Athens who 269 00:14:51,640 --> 00:14:55,040 Speaker 1: had had tinkered with his car so that it could 270 00:14:55,080 --> 00:15:00,080 Speaker 1: accept a form of restaurant grease with minimum amount of processing. 271 00:15:00,120 --> 00:15:02,880 Speaker 1: So he was actually using biodiesel and kind of the 272 00:15:03,400 --> 00:15:06,520 Speaker 1: issues he was running into on the official end because 273 00:15:06,520 --> 00:15:09,680 Speaker 1: this was all kind of um from a tinkerer's perspective 274 00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:11,960 Speaker 1: as opposed to this is something that was fully supported 275 00:15:12,000 --> 00:15:16,000 Speaker 1: by an infrastructure. But the idea here is that you're 276 00:15:16,080 --> 00:15:19,320 Speaker 1: using this stuff, this renewable resource, because there's you know, 277 00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:24,520 Speaker 1: we can keep growing more vegetables or animals or McDonald's, 278 00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:27,440 Speaker 1: and then we get the stuff from it, this grease 279 00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:30,800 Speaker 1: or or fat or oil and process it and in 280 00:15:30,840 --> 00:15:34,040 Speaker 1: that processing we then end up with this biodiesel. It's 281 00:15:34,040 --> 00:15:39,640 Speaker 1: a biodegradable fuel. Uh, it's non toxic, so less toxic 282 00:15:39,680 --> 00:15:42,200 Speaker 1: than say table salt, which is great, you know, right, 283 00:15:42,280 --> 00:15:46,520 Speaker 1: you know, you have a massive biodegrade or biodesel fuel spill. 284 00:15:46,960 --> 00:15:49,480 Speaker 1: It is biodegradable, it's non toxic, and it makes the 285 00:15:49,560 --> 00:15:53,160 Speaker 1: highway small like French fries. So really, I mean who 286 00:15:53,240 --> 00:15:55,680 Speaker 1: loses which which isn't to say that that a giant 287 00:15:55,680 --> 00:15:58,200 Speaker 1: oil spill of this stuff would be happy for the environment. 288 00:15:58,200 --> 00:16:00,880 Speaker 1: It's not going to like moisturize all of the seal's 289 00:16:00,920 --> 00:16:02,840 Speaker 1: faces or anything like that, but it's just you know, 290 00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:04,720 Speaker 1: but but it's a little bit less scary and easier 291 00:16:04,760 --> 00:16:08,280 Speaker 1: to clean up. Yeah, it's considered to have a lower 292 00:16:08,360 --> 00:16:10,960 Speaker 1: environmental impact from that perspective, and you still have to 293 00:16:10,960 --> 00:16:13,120 Speaker 1: have processes stuff, so you still have to put energy 294 00:16:13,160 --> 00:16:15,120 Speaker 1: into the system, just like you do with ethanol. So 295 00:16:15,640 --> 00:16:18,280 Speaker 1: don't don't think that this takes fossil fuels out entirely, 296 00:16:18,280 --> 00:16:21,760 Speaker 1: and in fact, just like ethanol, biodiesel is something that 297 00:16:21,840 --> 00:16:28,000 Speaker 1: is frequently blended with petroleum based diesel, so they're different blends. Um, 298 00:16:28,040 --> 00:16:31,520 Speaker 1: there's uh, there's B two which is only two percent 299 00:16:31,560 --> 00:16:36,800 Speaker 1: biodiesel and percent petroleum based diesel, B five which is 300 00:16:36,960 --> 00:16:40,160 Speaker 1: five percent biodiesel, and B twenty, which is biodiesel. You 301 00:16:40,240 --> 00:16:43,080 Speaker 1: can get B one hundred, although I don't think there 302 00:16:43,080 --> 00:16:46,160 Speaker 1: are any consumer vehicles that are that run on B 303 00:16:46,280 --> 00:16:49,200 Speaker 1: one hundred, but B one hundred would be one percent 304 00:16:49,360 --> 00:16:54,760 Speaker 1: pure biodiesel. Most vehicles in the United States don't go 305 00:16:54,960 --> 00:16:59,760 Speaker 1: over B five as the the recommended blend for running 306 00:16:59,760 --> 00:17:02,280 Speaker 1: into the engine. The engines that you know, the manufacturers 307 00:17:02,280 --> 00:17:05,600 Speaker 1: say this engine was not designed to run anything with 308 00:17:05,680 --> 00:17:09,439 Speaker 1: a greater than B five blend for biodiesel to diesel. 309 00:17:09,840 --> 00:17:12,240 Speaker 1: But but even even those very small concentrations can make 310 00:17:12,240 --> 00:17:16,080 Speaker 1: a very large difference in the way that the fuel burns. Right. 311 00:17:16,200 --> 00:17:20,680 Speaker 1: In fact, again just like with ethanol, the biodiesel has 312 00:17:20,720 --> 00:17:26,040 Speaker 1: a lower fuel economy than than pure diesel does. So 313 00:17:26,160 --> 00:17:28,600 Speaker 1: for example, if you go with B one hundred, it's 314 00:17:28,640 --> 00:17:32,520 Speaker 1: something like a ten percent lower fuel economy, right, which 315 00:17:32,520 --> 00:17:34,640 Speaker 1: which means that it would take about one point one 316 00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:37,880 Speaker 1: gallons of biodiesel to equal one gallon of standard right, 317 00:17:37,920 --> 00:17:41,119 Speaker 1: whereas B twenty is more like just a two percent 318 00:17:41,560 --> 00:17:45,160 Speaker 1: deficit in fuel economy. So obviously, when you're getting close 319 00:17:45,200 --> 00:17:48,600 Speaker 1: to B five or B two, the change is negligible 320 00:17:48,640 --> 00:17:51,159 Speaker 1: to the point where you probably wouldn't notice it that 321 00:17:51,280 --> 00:17:54,400 Speaker 1: much unless you're really min maxing era. You're driving experience, 322 00:17:54,440 --> 00:17:56,960 Speaker 1: and hardly anyone, I mean, there are people who do that. 323 00:17:57,600 --> 00:18:01,480 Speaker 1: There's some people who go to some pretty extreme links 324 00:18:01,520 --> 00:18:04,960 Speaker 1: to try and maximize fuel economy. My programmer friends sometimes 325 00:18:04,960 --> 00:18:08,560 Speaker 1: get bored in their hybrid vehicles and do that. Also 326 00:18:08,600 --> 00:18:10,520 Speaker 1: they're really tracking it. I think of the people who 327 00:18:10,560 --> 00:18:14,440 Speaker 1: are drafting behind massive trucks. That's not a safe thing 328 00:18:14,480 --> 00:18:20,200 Speaker 1: to do, by the way, But it does actually fuel economy, 329 00:18:20,600 --> 00:18:25,960 Speaker 1: but it decreases your life expectancy, so uh. It does 330 00:18:26,680 --> 00:18:31,160 Speaker 1: in general have fewer greenhouse gas and UH and pollutant 331 00:18:31,160 --> 00:18:34,119 Speaker 1: emissions than diesel, although there is the possibility of an 332 00:18:34,200 --> 00:18:38,440 Speaker 1: increase in nitrous oxide emissions. So it's not like this 333 00:18:38,560 --> 00:18:43,200 Speaker 1: is across the board cleaner than petroleum based diesel. But 334 00:18:43,720 --> 00:18:47,800 Speaker 1: for most of the types of emissions that we would 335 00:18:47,840 --> 00:18:51,600 Speaker 1: consider harmful, it's better than the petroleum based one. It's 336 00:18:51,640 --> 00:18:55,280 Speaker 1: just not hands down or runaway wins. So you can't 337 00:18:55,320 --> 00:18:57,919 Speaker 1: just point it bio diesel and say this is this, 338 00:18:57,920 --> 00:19:00,679 Speaker 1: this is the cure for our environmental problem, right right. 339 00:19:00,680 --> 00:19:04,560 Speaker 1: It does. It does reduce carbon dioxide emissions, but that's 340 00:19:04,600 --> 00:19:06,520 Speaker 1: a big one. I mean CEO two emissions, that's a 341 00:19:06,560 --> 00:19:09,119 Speaker 1: big problem. And also they point out that really the 342 00:19:09,119 --> 00:19:13,520 Speaker 1: CEO two emissions, the way that it quote unquote reduces them, 343 00:19:13,560 --> 00:19:18,200 Speaker 1: in part is because you are you are creating feedstocks 344 00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:20,639 Speaker 1: again in order to create the biodiesel, and by creating 345 00:19:20,680 --> 00:19:23,679 Speaker 1: the feed stocks, you're creating carbon dioxide sinks, right right, 346 00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:26,399 Speaker 1: you're offsetting some of that some of what's going to 347 00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:28,320 Speaker 1: be burned later, right, Yeah, the stuff that's going to 348 00:19:28,359 --> 00:19:30,640 Speaker 1: be released in the atmosphere is actually getting pulled in 349 00:19:30,760 --> 00:19:34,000 Speaker 1: by the stuff that is turning into growing. So in 350 00:19:34,320 --> 00:19:37,359 Speaker 1: this case, it's it's almost deceptive in a way to 351 00:19:37,480 --> 00:19:40,119 Speaker 1: say lower carbon dioxide emissions, because part of that is 352 00:19:40,200 --> 00:19:43,160 Speaker 1: due to the fact that they're saying, well, yeah, it's 353 00:19:43,160 --> 00:19:48,440 Speaker 1: lower because this stuff is taking carbon dioxide in. Yeah, 354 00:19:48,520 --> 00:19:50,159 Speaker 1: but I mean you have to That's That's one of 355 00:19:50,160 --> 00:19:52,320 Speaker 1: the other things that we'll be talking about in this 356 00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:55,920 Speaker 1: podcast is you really have to look at the big picture. 357 00:19:56,080 --> 00:19:59,960 Speaker 1: There's so many factors involved of you know, how how 358 00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:03,480 Speaker 1: you create something, how you process it, and what ship it, 359 00:20:03,640 --> 00:20:05,679 Speaker 1: how you ship it, oh yeah, yeah, and and what 360 00:20:05,720 --> 00:20:07,320 Speaker 1: it does natural gas. It's going to be big on 361 00:20:07,359 --> 00:20:08,960 Speaker 1: that one. And and and what it does to the 362 00:20:09,000 --> 00:20:13,800 Speaker 1: environment overall. Um. Another benefit of biodiesel is that it acts. 363 00:20:13,840 --> 00:20:16,080 Speaker 1: It's another thing that acts as a solvent in your engine, 364 00:20:16,080 --> 00:20:20,400 Speaker 1: which which can again create some problems initially initially if 365 00:20:20,440 --> 00:20:22,840 Speaker 1: you if you aren't um, watching out for your fuel 366 00:20:22,880 --> 00:20:26,760 Speaker 1: pump and rubber rubber bits, right, and then once uh, 367 00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:29,160 Speaker 1: once you do get all that cleaned out, all that gunk, 368 00:20:29,240 --> 00:20:31,760 Speaker 1: that's in there, then it's it should run much more 369 00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:36,240 Speaker 1: cleanly than a typical diesel engine would. And um, I 370 00:20:36,240 --> 00:20:37,919 Speaker 1: mean a lot of people point out that this is 371 00:20:37,960 --> 00:20:40,320 Speaker 1: one of those things that if we can figure out 372 00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:42,600 Speaker 1: a way to make it work, it's a huge benefit 373 00:20:42,680 --> 00:20:46,160 Speaker 1: because first of all, you're taking stuff that nobody wants 374 00:20:46,359 --> 00:20:49,720 Speaker 1: used restaurant grease, you know, stuff that would you know, 375 00:20:49,800 --> 00:20:51,639 Speaker 1: we we already have to figure out a way of 376 00:20:51,720 --> 00:20:54,320 Speaker 1: disposing of that so it doesn't clog up drains or 377 00:20:54,359 --> 00:20:57,400 Speaker 1: cause problems. If we can then take what would normally 378 00:20:57,440 --> 00:20:59,960 Speaker 1: be a waste product and turn it into a few 379 00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:03,760 Speaker 1: fuel product, then that's a win win in that scenario. 380 00:21:04,760 --> 00:21:06,760 Speaker 1: Once you start looking outside that, that's when you're like, 381 00:21:06,800 --> 00:21:08,080 Speaker 1: all right, but you have to take these other things 382 00:21:08,080 --> 00:21:10,919 Speaker 1: into consideration. Well, yeah, you know, both both biodiesel and 383 00:21:10,960 --> 00:21:14,159 Speaker 1: ethanol can be created from what we would normally be 384 00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:17,359 Speaker 1: considered as waste crops um, you know, extra bits that 385 00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:19,639 Speaker 1: we wouldn't really be using that would either you know, 386 00:21:19,800 --> 00:21:23,760 Speaker 1: go into multure, a landfill or something. Although the ethanol argument, 387 00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:26,520 Speaker 1: people get really up in arms about that because if 388 00:21:26,520 --> 00:21:29,040 Speaker 1: you're talking about growing corn just for fuel, and then 389 00:21:29,080 --> 00:21:33,199 Speaker 1: you take into account other things like starvation issues or 390 00:21:33,520 --> 00:21:36,359 Speaker 1: you know, good or effective land use. Then that brings 391 00:21:36,440 --> 00:21:39,320 Speaker 1: up another debate. But again I think that actually fits 392 00:21:39,320 --> 00:21:41,760 Speaker 1: in our second episode, probably a little more. So we'll 393 00:21:42,000 --> 00:21:44,520 Speaker 1: we'll say that, we'll we'll get on the soapbox for 394 00:21:44,560 --> 00:21:46,720 Speaker 1: the second one. Will spare you that for right now. 395 00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:50,680 Speaker 1: So that that's the biological stuff. Um, let's see, do 396 00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:54,399 Speaker 1: you want to go right into the more fossil fuel 397 00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:57,240 Speaker 1: oriented ones or do you want to do hydrogen next? 398 00:21:58,080 --> 00:22:00,879 Speaker 1: Let's let's do I've got natural gas next on my paper. 399 00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:04,960 Speaker 1: Let's do that. Then it so natural gas. We're primarily 400 00:22:04,960 --> 00:22:08,320 Speaker 1: talking about methane here. Methane is one of those greenhouse 401 00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:10,520 Speaker 1: gases that you hear about a lot. It actually has 402 00:22:11,040 --> 00:22:15,440 Speaker 1: the capacity to do far more harm than carbon dioxide, 403 00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:18,920 Speaker 1: but on a shorter time scale. So uh, it's greenhouse 404 00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:21,679 Speaker 1: effect is greater than c O two. It does not 405 00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:24,440 Speaker 1: stay in the atmosphere as long as c O two. 406 00:22:25,200 --> 00:22:27,120 Speaker 1: But um, but that's one of those things that people 407 00:22:27,119 --> 00:22:29,959 Speaker 1: will point out. But methane is a clear and odorless 408 00:22:30,040 --> 00:22:32,400 Speaker 1: gas that might surprise you when you think of all 409 00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:36,520 Speaker 1: the things that methane is said to be generated by. Um, yeah, 410 00:22:36,560 --> 00:22:40,160 Speaker 1: it on pure methane is it's clear and it's odorless. 411 00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:43,399 Speaker 1: It's only gets odors from other things that are mixed 412 00:22:43,400 --> 00:22:47,760 Speaker 1: in with it. Uh. It is normally sold in one 413 00:22:47,760 --> 00:22:52,800 Speaker 1: of two forms, either compressed natural gas where you actually 414 00:22:52,800 --> 00:22:56,679 Speaker 1: have it in compressed canisters in gas form YEP, or 415 00:22:56,800 --> 00:23:00,280 Speaker 1: liquefied natural gas, which means that it's really compressed yeah, 416 00:23:00,359 --> 00:23:03,400 Speaker 1: to the point where it's actually liquefied. Now we all 417 00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:06,120 Speaker 1: know that, or if we don't, we will soon that 418 00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:09,359 Speaker 1: when you compress gas enough, assuming that you've got the 419 00:23:09,480 --> 00:23:13,040 Speaker 1: right uh set up here, you are actually pushing those 420 00:23:13,160 --> 00:23:16,200 Speaker 1: gas atoms closer and closer together, and if you are 421 00:23:16,400 --> 00:23:19,360 Speaker 1: in the right conditions, you can then eventually get add 422 00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:22,560 Speaker 1: enough pressure where you can liquefy something. Now, once it 423 00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:26,359 Speaker 1: is released from that pressure, assuming that the temperature outside 424 00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:29,720 Speaker 1: of the pressurized compartment is greater than it's boiling point, 425 00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:33,399 Speaker 1: it will then immediately boil off into gas. Uh. We 426 00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:36,240 Speaker 1: see this with lots of different stuff. So, for example, 427 00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:40,360 Speaker 1: liquid nitrogen, if it once it's removed from being pressurized, 428 00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:44,640 Speaker 1: starts to boil off and it becomes a gaseous nitrogen, 429 00:23:45,080 --> 00:23:47,520 Speaker 1: which is why why you know you you see that 430 00:23:47,560 --> 00:23:50,119 Speaker 1: whenever you see any of those liquid nitrogen demonstrations. You 431 00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:55,240 Speaker 1: just see this this pour of Yeah, that's that's UM 432 00:23:55,480 --> 00:23:58,640 Speaker 1: part of this whole process. Well, anyway, methane is one 433 00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:01,960 Speaker 1: of those that at room temperature is a gas. It's 434 00:24:02,040 --> 00:24:06,159 Speaker 1: essentially carbon and four hydrogen atoms. That's your basic building 435 00:24:06,200 --> 00:24:10,920 Speaker 1: block for methane and UM. It can be used either 436 00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:15,240 Speaker 1: in vehicles that are dedicated to using natural gas, or 437 00:24:15,280 --> 00:24:18,720 Speaker 1: it can be used in what is called a a 438 00:24:18,800 --> 00:24:22,840 Speaker 1: duel or by fuel vehicle, which means they can use 439 00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:27,159 Speaker 1: both um methane or gasoline or diesel, depending upon what 440 00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:31,560 Speaker 1: the engine is. So. Uh, one of the reasons we 441 00:24:31,600 --> 00:24:34,399 Speaker 1: could look at natural gas as being an alternative fuel 442 00:24:34,640 --> 00:24:36,800 Speaker 1: is we produce a lot of it in the United States. 443 00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:40,480 Speaker 1: A lot of nations produce a great deal of natural gas. Yeah. 444 00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:43,439 Speaker 1: The thing about natural gases that it occurs naturally in 445 00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:46,959 Speaker 1: association with crude oil. Usually when you tap into a 446 00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:50,280 Speaker 1: into a well, you're going to get both crude oil 447 00:24:50,320 --> 00:24:54,359 Speaker 1: and natural gas. Right, So it's a byproduct in that sense. So, 448 00:24:54,640 --> 00:24:56,800 Speaker 1: but it's a byproduct that's useful. It's you know, it 449 00:24:57,000 --> 00:24:59,920 Speaker 1: means that you get two things for one process. Right. 450 00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:02,080 Speaker 1: We only started being able to use it, and I 451 00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:04,879 Speaker 1: think about the nineties, which is when they started figuring 452 00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:08,199 Speaker 1: out how to to basically bottle and transport it. Right, 453 00:25:08,280 --> 00:25:12,560 Speaker 1: it's efficiently the whole process well processing natural gas so 454 00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:15,080 Speaker 1: that you can actually draw it off of everything else 455 00:25:15,119 --> 00:25:19,399 Speaker 1: and make it into a usable fuel. Um. About natural 456 00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:23,720 Speaker 1: gas in the United States is domestically produced, so only 457 00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:26,920 Speaker 1: six percent or so is imported from outside the US. 458 00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:30,040 Speaker 1: Other nations produce all the natural gas they want, or 459 00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:32,080 Speaker 1: some of them have to import quite a bit of it. 460 00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:35,240 Speaker 1: And mostly in the US we use it for heating 461 00:25:35,320 --> 00:25:39,560 Speaker 1: and cooking. Uh, there's it's used for electric power production 462 00:25:39,640 --> 00:25:42,800 Speaker 1: and also in industrial uses. Very little of it is 463 00:25:42,840 --> 00:25:47,040 Speaker 1: being used in transportation outside of a few notable instances 464 00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:50,240 Speaker 1: like here in Atlanta, we have a public transportation system 465 00:25:50,280 --> 00:25:54,679 Speaker 1: called Marta and a lot of the buses actually just 466 00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:57,040 Speaker 1: I think just the buses, but yeah, I was about 467 00:25:57,080 --> 00:25:58,680 Speaker 1: to say trains, and I was trying to catch myself, 468 00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:01,040 Speaker 1: but yeah, the buses in mark on Marta for the 469 00:26:01,040 --> 00:26:03,640 Speaker 1: most part are natural gas buses, so they are using 470 00:26:03,640 --> 00:26:07,640 Speaker 1: this as their fuel. Uh. It tends to produce fewer 471 00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:14,840 Speaker 1: smog producing pollutants by about depending upon the vehicle's calibration 472 00:26:15,160 --> 00:26:18,280 Speaker 1: and the specific type of natural gas you're using, whether 473 00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:21,720 Speaker 1: it's that compressed natural gas or liquefied natural gas, as 474 00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:27,080 Speaker 1: well as a few other variables. It also is about um, well, 475 00:26:27,119 --> 00:26:30,639 Speaker 1: it produces five to nine percent fewer greenhouse gas emissions, 476 00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:35,600 Speaker 1: so it's cleaner than gasoline. Um although you're still producing 477 00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:38,879 Speaker 1: greenhouse gases. It's not like it's eliminating them all right, Right, 478 00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:41,000 Speaker 1: It is still a fossil fuel, so even though it's 479 00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:44,320 Speaker 1: an alternate, it's yeah, and that's another thing to remember. 480 00:26:44,359 --> 00:26:46,280 Speaker 1: It is a fossil fuel. It's not it's not a 481 00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:49,480 Speaker 1: renewable resource the way that that for example ethanol and 482 00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:53,160 Speaker 1: bio diesel. Right exactly. It does tend to be cheaper 483 00:26:53,280 --> 00:26:56,280 Speaker 1: than gasoline, so that's good. It does have lower energy 484 00:26:56,359 --> 00:26:58,720 Speaker 1: content than gasoline, so just like the other ones we've mentioned. 485 00:26:58,760 --> 00:27:02,040 Speaker 1: In fact, you're gonna see a runing theme here where 486 00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:04,639 Speaker 1: the energy content of the fuel when you when you 487 00:27:04,680 --> 00:27:08,399 Speaker 1: compare it to a comparable amount of gasoline is lower. 488 00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:10,960 Speaker 1: One of the many reasons that gasoline became popular in 489 00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:14,720 Speaker 1: the first place was that it was so so efficient. Yeah, 490 00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:16,480 Speaker 1: I had a lot of it had a high energy 491 00:27:16,520 --> 00:27:20,399 Speaker 1: density compared to other fuels, and uh, you know, it's 492 00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:23,600 Speaker 1: another thing to keep in mind is that it's really 493 00:27:23,640 --> 00:27:27,159 Speaker 1: hard to compare some of these fuels against gasoline because 494 00:27:27,160 --> 00:27:29,639 Speaker 1: they are in different formats. Right, so, right, right, how 495 00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:31,720 Speaker 1: do you how do you compare a gallon of air 496 00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:34,320 Speaker 1: versus a gallon of liquid And you have to look 497 00:27:34,359 --> 00:27:38,199 Speaker 1: at cubic feet of gas versus a gallon of liquid. 498 00:27:38,200 --> 00:27:42,080 Speaker 1: It's it becomes very difficult to make a meaningful comparison. 499 00:27:42,119 --> 00:27:44,520 Speaker 1: Same sort of thing will come true in in hydrogen, 500 00:27:44,560 --> 00:27:46,359 Speaker 1: but I'll talk about that when we get there. Right, 501 00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:48,359 Speaker 1: the real measure that we can figure out is um 502 00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:50,320 Speaker 1: and just kind of how many how many miles per 503 00:27:50,320 --> 00:27:52,360 Speaker 1: gallon you get off of it? And and even then 504 00:27:52,400 --> 00:27:54,520 Speaker 1: you start to be affected by things like the fact 505 00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:58,120 Speaker 1: that natural gas tanks can be very heavy um and 506 00:27:58,119 --> 00:28:01,320 Speaker 1: and drag down the efficiency would be a you might, 507 00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:03,920 Speaker 1: you might. I think for me, the best measurement I 508 00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:05,760 Speaker 1: would be able to say is if you had two 509 00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:09,720 Speaker 1: vehicles that were of comparable weight and design, and they 510 00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:12,840 Speaker 1: were both fully fueled with whatever fuel they had, how 511 00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:14,640 Speaker 1: far could they get before you had to call Mom 512 00:28:14,720 --> 00:28:18,000 Speaker 1: to come pick you up? And if that number is 513 00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:20,160 Speaker 1: greater with gasoline. Than then you say, all right, well, 514 00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:23,000 Speaker 1: if you're talking about a fully fueled vehicle, whatever, the 515 00:28:23,040 --> 00:28:25,399 Speaker 1: definition of that is, whatever kind of tank it is 516 00:28:25,480 --> 00:28:28,560 Speaker 1: is filled up right, and that and that tank the 517 00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:32,040 Speaker 1: two exactly our fuel cell. The two the two vehicles 518 00:28:32,040 --> 00:28:34,639 Speaker 1: are of equivalent weight and design because you have to 519 00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:36,640 Speaker 1: figure the design too. I mean, if one of them 520 00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:38,240 Speaker 1: is if they both weigh the same, but one of 521 00:28:38,280 --> 00:28:40,120 Speaker 1: them is essentially a wall and the other one is 522 00:28:40,120 --> 00:28:42,640 Speaker 1: a super sleek car, then obviously that's going to play 523 00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:45,320 Speaker 1: a part. It's one if one way is like a 524 00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:48,360 Speaker 1: best spun, the other is a STV, right right, Yeah, 525 00:28:48,400 --> 00:28:50,800 Speaker 1: these are these are This just just shows you how 526 00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:53,160 Speaker 1: complex this problem is. It really is one of those 527 00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:55,200 Speaker 1: things where if you look at it just on the 528 00:28:55,240 --> 00:28:58,120 Speaker 1: surface and you say, oh, this has fewer greenhouse gas 529 00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:01,600 Speaker 1: emissions and uh and and it's not nearly as many 530 00:29:01,600 --> 00:29:05,480 Speaker 1: particulars that we should use this all the time, and 531 00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:08,520 Speaker 1: then you look at all the factors. Yeah, it's a 532 00:29:08,560 --> 00:29:10,600 Speaker 1: complicated problem. I'm glad that this I'm glad I just 533 00:29:10,640 --> 00:29:12,520 Speaker 1: get to pay to talk about it as opposed to 534 00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:16,400 Speaker 1: have to make the decisions. All right. Before the break, 535 00:29:16,400 --> 00:29:19,360 Speaker 1: we talked about natural gas. Let's talk about another type 536 00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:24,760 Speaker 1: of fossil fuel, propane, which is also called liquefied petroleum 537 00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:27,880 Speaker 1: gas UM. You know, we talked about how natural gas 538 00:29:27,920 --> 00:29:30,240 Speaker 1: we we can find that in the same places that 539 00:29:30,280 --> 00:29:33,959 Speaker 1: we find oil. Propane is actually something that is truly 540 00:29:34,040 --> 00:29:38,320 Speaker 1: a byproduct of natural gas, processing of yeah, or or 541 00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:41,520 Speaker 1: even of crude oil. So we can get it from 542 00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:45,920 Speaker 1: processing natural gas or crude oil. Propane is h is 543 00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:51,040 Speaker 1: this colorless and odorless fuel very much, you know, just 544 00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:52,959 Speaker 1: as methane is colorless and odorless. By the way, if 545 00:29:52,960 --> 00:29:55,160 Speaker 1: you if you're wondering how is this possible? Because I 546 00:29:55,240 --> 00:29:59,000 Speaker 1: know the smell of things like natural gas, that's because uh, 547 00:29:59,360 --> 00:30:02,520 Speaker 1: odorance are actually mixed in with that that fuel. So 548 00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:06,040 Speaker 1: they're so dangerous that if if they weren't, then if 549 00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:08,880 Speaker 1: you got a leak, it's a lot easier to send 550 00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:13,840 Speaker 1: detect a leak than to die of overexposure. You would 551 00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:16,160 Speaker 1: want there to be some way of detecting it apart 552 00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:19,640 Speaker 1: from a spark ends up igniting a huge explosion obviously, 553 00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:23,440 Speaker 1: so by mixing odorance, and it's really just to alert 554 00:30:23,600 --> 00:30:27,480 Speaker 1: safety measure to its presence. Um. Right, So propane and 555 00:30:27,520 --> 00:30:30,440 Speaker 1: butane um, which you know, is used in in lighter 556 00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:34,400 Speaker 1: fluid are both collected during the production of natural gas 557 00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:38,240 Speaker 1: and oil refinery in order to prevent them from condensing 558 00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:41,800 Speaker 1: and causing processing difficulties. Right, so we can actually use 559 00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:45,320 Speaker 1: this in other formats as well, other other uses. So 560 00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:48,920 Speaker 1: in the United States, for example, propanes used in home 561 00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:52,640 Speaker 1: and water heating. It's used in cooking as a strickland, 562 00:30:52,840 --> 00:30:56,480 Speaker 1: I am very well aware of propane and propane accessories. 563 00:30:57,200 --> 00:31:00,960 Speaker 1: That joke was never funny. And then it's also used 564 00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:04,720 Speaker 1: in refrigerating and clothes drying and farm in industrial equipment, 565 00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:08,200 Speaker 1: and even in drying corn. That's mainly what we use 566 00:31:08,240 --> 00:31:11,600 Speaker 1: it for here in the United States. The propane here 567 00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:14,680 Speaker 1: in the US comes from domestic sources, so again we've 568 00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:17,920 Speaker 1: mostly we've produce it ourselves here in the US, and 569 00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:22,240 Speaker 1: we don't import that much compared to the stuff we produce. UH. 570 00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:26,120 Speaker 1: As a fuel, it does have lower carbon dioxide emissions 571 00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:30,440 Speaker 1: than gasoline, but it also has a lower energy content. Yes, 572 00:31:30,560 --> 00:31:32,920 Speaker 1: so again if you're if you're talking about a fully 573 00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:36,200 Speaker 1: fueled vehicle with propane versus a fully fueled vehicle with gasoline, 574 00:31:36,600 --> 00:31:38,880 Speaker 1: you may not be able to go as far in 575 00:31:38,920 --> 00:31:43,440 Speaker 1: the propane vehicle. Uh. It also can emit fewer carbon 576 00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:48,120 Speaker 1: monoxide and non methane hydrocarbon emissions, so it's also cleaner 577 00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:51,520 Speaker 1: in that respect. It tends to be less expensive than gasoline, 578 00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:54,760 Speaker 1: although that price can fluctuate over time, right, right, even 579 00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:56,720 Speaker 1: even for the course of a year, especially here in 580 00:31:56,760 --> 00:31:58,440 Speaker 1: the U S where we use it a lot for heating, 581 00:31:58,480 --> 00:32:00,920 Speaker 1: it can be very much mar pensive than gasoline in 582 00:32:00,920 --> 00:32:03,560 Speaker 1: the winter, and then very much cheaper in the summer. Yep. 583 00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:06,320 Speaker 1: All depends on on when and where you're you're picking 584 00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:09,440 Speaker 1: it up. Uh. And it's um, you know, it's it's 585 00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:12,840 Speaker 1: got a higher octane than gasoline does, but like you said, 586 00:32:12,920 --> 00:32:15,040 Speaker 1: has a lower fuel economy, so it does have a 587 00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:17,840 Speaker 1: trade off. And it's a fossil fuel, you know, just 588 00:32:17,880 --> 00:32:20,640 Speaker 1: like natural gas is a fossil fuel. So it is 589 00:32:20,680 --> 00:32:23,880 Speaker 1: technically non renewable, right, So renewable over the course of 590 00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:27,360 Speaker 1: billions of years, right right, It's it's not renewable on 591 00:32:27,400 --> 00:32:29,720 Speaker 1: any kind of time frame that does us any good 592 00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:32,440 Speaker 1: whatsoever until we hit that fancy singularity thing that's coming 593 00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:35,040 Speaker 1: in twenty to forty years, right. And and like like 594 00:32:35,160 --> 00:32:38,560 Speaker 1: the compressed natural gas, you have to worry about how 595 00:32:38,560 --> 00:32:42,400 Speaker 1: you're going to actually store this stuff. You know, it's 596 00:32:42,440 --> 00:32:45,200 Speaker 1: not the same as the liquid gasoline that we can 597 00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:48,719 Speaker 1: pump into a car, right right, It has to be 598 00:32:48,760 --> 00:32:52,719 Speaker 1: pressurized and compressed essentially. So yeah, it's it's you know, 599 00:32:52,760 --> 00:32:55,280 Speaker 1: it's it's usually under when you get a propane it's 600 00:32:55,320 --> 00:32:58,480 Speaker 1: usually a propane tank that's under a big, heavy tanks. Yeah. Yeah, 601 00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:01,280 Speaker 1: So so refueling be an issue, just as it would 602 00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:03,080 Speaker 1: be with some of the other alternatives we talked about. 603 00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:07,640 Speaker 1: Ethanol and biodiesel are again the most like gasoline, so 604 00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:11,240 Speaker 1: that you're the most compatible with current engine designs and 605 00:33:11,640 --> 00:33:16,040 Speaker 1: infrastructure infrastructure, right yeah. So so in this case, if 606 00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:18,840 Speaker 1: we were to make a switch to propane, then it 607 00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:23,200 Speaker 1: would require us to rethink how we package and deliver 608 00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:26,040 Speaker 1: and and consume this stuff, and how how would you 609 00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:28,200 Speaker 1: refuel your vehicle? Would it require you to get the 610 00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:31,680 Speaker 1: assistance of a couple of burly dudes? Probably would for me, 611 00:33:32,080 --> 00:33:35,800 Speaker 1: I don't have a large lifting capacity, so uh. But 612 00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:38,720 Speaker 1: that that's kind of the low down on propane. And 613 00:33:38,720 --> 00:33:40,720 Speaker 1: now we're going to talk a little bit about one 614 00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:43,520 Speaker 1: of my favorite elements of all time, which is good 615 00:33:43,560 --> 00:33:45,640 Speaker 1: because it's also one of the It is the most 616 00:33:45,640 --> 00:33:50,080 Speaker 1: abundant in the universe. Hydrogen. Hydrogen, yes, hydrogen, of course 617 00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:52,880 Speaker 1: is the fuel that we think about when we think 618 00:33:52,920 --> 00:33:55,680 Speaker 1: about what the sun is doing, where it's taking hydrogen 619 00:33:55,720 --> 00:34:00,920 Speaker 1: and fusing it into helium millions of degrees doom. Yeah, 620 00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:03,360 Speaker 1: I can't, I can't not do that. We've done that 621 00:34:03,400 --> 00:34:05,240 Speaker 1: before in the podcast. I know. Don't write in and 622 00:34:05,280 --> 00:34:07,160 Speaker 1: tell us that we did that joke already. We know 623 00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:10,800 Speaker 1: we did. They might they might be. Giants are awesome, 624 00:34:10,880 --> 00:34:13,760 Speaker 1: and we're not sorry. No, we're not even a little sorry. 625 00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:16,880 Speaker 1: So and we'll probably do it again in a future episode, 626 00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:19,080 Speaker 1: maybe even in the next one, who knows. But at 627 00:34:19,120 --> 00:34:21,400 Speaker 1: any rate, hydrogen can be used as a fuel in 628 00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:23,359 Speaker 1: a couple of different ways. You could just burn it 629 00:34:23,719 --> 00:34:28,160 Speaker 1: in an internal combustion engine. It is combustible. Uh, if 630 00:34:28,200 --> 00:34:32,200 Speaker 1: you were to do that, it would actually produce some 631 00:34:32,560 --> 00:34:35,359 Speaker 1: nitrous ox side as an as one of the things 632 00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:39,960 Speaker 1: that would emit a pollutant. But another way you could 633 00:34:40,040 --> 00:34:43,400 Speaker 1: use hydrogen is in a fuel cell. Hydrogen and a 634 00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:48,000 Speaker 1: fuel cells are really cool idea. It's not practical, but 635 00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:50,000 Speaker 1: at the moment, but we'll talk about that in a 636 00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:52,719 Speaker 1: little bit. First of all, the ideas that with a 637 00:34:52,719 --> 00:34:56,200 Speaker 1: fuel cell, you've got essentially a membrane and you have 638 00:34:56,680 --> 00:34:59,520 Speaker 1: hydrogen on one side of this membrane and oxygen on 639 00:34:59,560 --> 00:35:03,400 Speaker 1: the other side the membrane, and that membrane allows ions 640 00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:07,200 Speaker 1: to pass through but not electrons. So the hydrogen really 641 00:35:07,239 --> 00:35:09,160 Speaker 1: wants to get over to where the oxygen is. There's 642 00:35:09,160 --> 00:35:13,080 Speaker 1: a there's a catalyst that's on this membrane, there's an 643 00:35:13,080 --> 00:35:16,080 Speaker 1: electro light on the membrane. It's all going to facilitate 644 00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:18,880 Speaker 1: this this chemical reaction that's going to happen. Actually, this 645 00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:22,840 Speaker 1: this physical reaction really that happens. So since the hydrogen 646 00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:25,799 Speaker 1: wants to go and party with the oxygen and the 647 00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:28,520 Speaker 1: the electrons are being a total pill about it, they 648 00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:31,120 Speaker 1: ditch the electrons and then they go right on through 649 00:35:31,160 --> 00:35:33,719 Speaker 1: that that member membrane, which is kind of like the 650 00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:36,160 Speaker 1: bouncer at a club, right. You know, you want to 651 00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:38,520 Speaker 1: get in the club, but you brought your you know, 652 00:35:38,640 --> 00:35:41,880 Speaker 1: dorky friend who is totally not club material. So your 653 00:35:41,920 --> 00:35:44,799 Speaker 1: choice is either leave the club or ditch the dorky friend. 654 00:35:45,080 --> 00:35:48,400 Speaker 1: Hydrogen ditches the dorky electron friend and goes into the 655 00:35:48,440 --> 00:35:51,360 Speaker 1: club and parties with the oxygen. The electrons are thinking, oh, 656 00:35:51,440 --> 00:35:53,279 Speaker 1: I'm not having none of that. I will get into 657 00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:55,439 Speaker 1: that club. I'm just using the back door. The back 658 00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:57,640 Speaker 1: door in this case is going through some form of circuit, 659 00:35:58,080 --> 00:35:59,680 Speaker 1: and then once it goes to the circuit, it comes 660 00:35:59,719 --> 00:36:03,040 Speaker 1: to the other side of the fuel cell rejoins the 661 00:36:03,120 --> 00:36:05,480 Speaker 1: hydrogen and oxygen says, didn't get rid of me after all, 662 00:36:05,520 --> 00:36:07,560 Speaker 1: did you? And then they all have a big water 663 00:36:07,680 --> 00:36:11,359 Speaker 1: party because at that point you have H two O. Right. Yes, 664 00:36:11,440 --> 00:36:15,239 Speaker 1: this is called electrochemical conversion. I like my version where 665 00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:18,440 Speaker 1: it's a club. I like that better too. Okay, at 666 00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:21,640 Speaker 1: any rate, so the output here is really interesting. You 667 00:36:21,680 --> 00:36:25,680 Speaker 1: get electricity, you get water, and you get heat. Heat 668 00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:28,680 Speaker 1: is a byproduct as well. So a lot of people 669 00:36:28,680 --> 00:36:31,360 Speaker 1: have said fuel cells, that's gotta be the way to 670 00:36:31,440 --> 00:36:33,360 Speaker 1: the future, because think about it, you don't have to 671 00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:36,800 Speaker 1: worry about any greenhouse gas emissions except for water vapor, 672 00:36:36,880 --> 00:36:39,960 Speaker 1: which is a greenhouse gas, but it can easily be 673 00:36:40,080 --> 00:36:43,960 Speaker 1: incorporated into the water cycle, um, whereas you know other 674 00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:48,560 Speaker 1: ones can't. Uh. And the idea that it's a contained cell, 675 00:36:48,640 --> 00:36:51,960 Speaker 1: you're you're using the same product over and over again. Well, yeah, essentially, 676 00:36:52,000 --> 00:36:54,839 Speaker 1: what happens is you get the water in the fuel cell, 677 00:36:54,840 --> 00:36:57,040 Speaker 1: and then you have to refuel the fuel cell with 678 00:36:57,080 --> 00:36:59,880 Speaker 1: more hydrogen. Uh. And then the question is, all right, 679 00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:02,080 Speaker 1: where do you get the hydrogen? Uh Huh. There's the 680 00:37:02,160 --> 00:37:05,960 Speaker 1: rub because it turns out hydrogen, while plentiful, tends to 681 00:37:06,040 --> 00:37:09,160 Speaker 1: buddy up with just about everything which is which which 682 00:37:09,200 --> 00:37:10,799 Speaker 1: is a how you get the water. But but you 683 00:37:10,840 --> 00:37:13,880 Speaker 1: know you can extract hydrogen from water, but you have 684 00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:16,759 Speaker 1: to expel energy to do that. So the question then 685 00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:19,680 Speaker 1: is like, is it more efficient for you to free 686 00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:21,840 Speaker 1: up that hydrogen so that you can get that pure 687 00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:25,400 Speaker 1: hydrogen you need for the fuel cell. Is the energy 688 00:37:25,440 --> 00:37:28,399 Speaker 1: that you're pouring in to get the hydrogen more than 689 00:37:28,440 --> 00:37:31,120 Speaker 1: the benefit you're getting from the fuel cell. If it is, 690 00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:33,279 Speaker 1: then it's an energy sink, like we talked about at 691 00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:36,480 Speaker 1: the top of the podcast. And with hydrogen that tends 692 00:37:36,480 --> 00:37:38,280 Speaker 1: to be the problem is that how do you get 693 00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:42,520 Speaker 1: lots of pure hydrogen? It doesn't occur that that often 694 00:37:42,560 --> 00:37:45,360 Speaker 1: here on on Earth. Yeah, not in its unbound form. 695 00:37:45,480 --> 00:37:49,279 Speaker 1: It's almost always bound with something else. So you have 696 00:37:49,360 --> 00:37:51,759 Speaker 1: to find a way of breaking those molecular bonds to 697 00:37:51,800 --> 00:37:54,480 Speaker 1: free up that hydrogen that that requires you to put 698 00:37:54,520 --> 00:37:57,160 Speaker 1: forth a little effort, and that's that's where the that's 699 00:37:57,160 --> 00:37:59,239 Speaker 1: where the problem is, all right. I think the other 700 00:37:59,280 --> 00:38:02,120 Speaker 1: big problem with high rygen is is a perception concept 701 00:38:02,200 --> 00:38:05,120 Speaker 1: because you know, people think hydrogen and sometimes they think 702 00:38:05,200 --> 00:38:08,080 Speaker 1: Hindenburg and then they think oh the humanity and yeah, 703 00:38:08,120 --> 00:38:10,879 Speaker 1: and that's and you know it's I mean, yes, yes, 704 00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:14,880 Speaker 1: the Hindenburg was filled with hydrogen, but but really the 705 00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:19,759 Speaker 1: problem there was the aluminum powder coating and yeah, and 706 00:38:20,160 --> 00:38:23,879 Speaker 1: various other explosive properties that they weren't really thinking about 707 00:38:23,920 --> 00:38:26,920 Speaker 1: too hard. Right. It also depends on whether it's an 708 00:38:26,960 --> 00:38:30,200 Speaker 1: internal combustion engine use of hydrogen or fuel cell use 709 00:38:30,239 --> 00:38:33,320 Speaker 1: of hydrogen, but it still does have you know issues. 710 00:38:33,440 --> 00:38:38,040 Speaker 1: Procity totten really fast. How do you store it and 711 00:38:38,080 --> 00:38:39,720 Speaker 1: how do you make sure it gets to the fuel 712 00:38:39,719 --> 00:38:42,480 Speaker 1: cell safely? Or do you just replace fuel cells? Is 713 00:38:42,480 --> 00:38:44,920 Speaker 1: that the way you refuel your fuel cell vehicle? And 714 00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:46,680 Speaker 1: if so, do you need to get those burly guys 715 00:38:46,719 --> 00:38:49,640 Speaker 1: back over at the refueling station because you know, these 716 00:38:49,680 --> 00:38:52,000 Speaker 1: things get heavy. Remember, you know, when we're talking about 717 00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:55,600 Speaker 1: a fuel cell, that's one unit of what would be 718 00:38:55,960 --> 00:38:59,160 Speaker 1: essentially a huge stack of these things that yeah, because 719 00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:00,879 Speaker 1: if you just if you just plug one and it's 720 00:39:00,920 --> 00:39:02,440 Speaker 1: not going to get you very far, but you have 721 00:39:02,600 --> 00:39:05,600 Speaker 1: very much juice at all. Yeah yeah, um and and 722 00:39:05,600 --> 00:39:08,440 Speaker 1: and it would require something like like a giant steel 723 00:39:08,600 --> 00:39:13,360 Speaker 1: tank in order to create something sturdy enough to house 724 00:39:13,800 --> 00:39:16,560 Speaker 1: this kind of this kind of gas now hydrogen. And 725 00:39:16,600 --> 00:39:18,400 Speaker 1: of course, and the heavier you make the vehicle, the 726 00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:20,239 Speaker 1: more power you need to move the vehicle. So it 727 00:39:20,280 --> 00:39:23,480 Speaker 1: becomes this kind of this that you're chasing, this constant 728 00:39:23,520 --> 00:39:26,239 Speaker 1: problem that just shifts where the problem actually is. Right, 729 00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:28,719 Speaker 1: you're like, oh, I solve this, but oh now this 730 00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:31,840 Speaker 1: is the issue. Uh, this is something engineer struggle with 731 00:39:31,880 --> 00:39:34,920 Speaker 1: all the time, not just in vehicle design or alternative fuels, 732 00:39:34,920 --> 00:39:40,040 Speaker 1: but all sorts of applications. Now, hydrogen does contain less 733 00:39:40,160 --> 00:39:43,960 Speaker 1: energy than gasoline if you're talking about by volume, if 734 00:39:43,960 --> 00:39:47,160 Speaker 1: you're talking about by weight, hydrogen has the highest energy 735 00:39:47,239 --> 00:39:50,880 Speaker 1: content of any fuel. But here's the thing. Hydrogen's really, really, 736 00:39:50,960 --> 00:39:55,160 Speaker 1: really light. It's the lightest element. So when you're talking 737 00:39:55,160 --> 00:39:59,240 Speaker 1: about getting a lot of hydrogen together before it makes 738 00:39:59,440 --> 00:40:03,200 Speaker 1: a weight of any appreciable amount, that's a lot of hydrogen. 739 00:40:03,320 --> 00:40:05,560 Speaker 1: So that's why you talk about it being a low 740 00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:09,440 Speaker 1: energy by volume as opposed to a high energy by weight. 741 00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:11,960 Speaker 1: When you when you get enough for you to compare 742 00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:16,080 Speaker 1: the hydrogen versus the gasoline, it doesn't bigger than the car. 743 00:40:16,160 --> 00:40:20,359 Speaker 1: Probably it's it's that's the big issue, or one of 744 00:40:20,400 --> 00:40:23,160 Speaker 1: the many issues really in high In the United States, 745 00:40:23,200 --> 00:40:28,520 Speaker 1: hydrogen is mostly used to refine petroleum, to treat metals, 746 00:40:28,520 --> 00:40:32,319 Speaker 1: and also to produce fertilizer. So, um, that's the other 747 00:40:32,400 --> 00:40:34,080 Speaker 1: thing is that you always have to think about how 748 00:40:34,120 --> 00:40:38,160 Speaker 1: we're what we are using this stuff for currently and uh, 749 00:40:38,320 --> 00:40:43,319 Speaker 1: then thinking about the added stress we would put on them. Yeah, 750 00:40:43,320 --> 00:40:44,920 Speaker 1: and we'll talk about more than in the in the 751 00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:50,200 Speaker 1: next episode. So this leaves us with our final alternative fuel, 752 00:40:50,280 --> 00:40:52,680 Speaker 1: which is not it's not really a fuel, not in 753 00:40:52,680 --> 00:40:55,120 Speaker 1: the sense of the others, and we've already kind of 754 00:40:55,160 --> 00:40:58,520 Speaker 1: touched on it with hydrogen fuel cells, but it's electricity. 755 00:40:58,719 --> 00:41:01,640 Speaker 1: And electricity is just another are alternative to making your 756 00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:04,200 Speaker 1: cars go. And the interesting thing here is, of course, 757 00:41:04,239 --> 00:41:07,360 Speaker 1: for those of you who know your history with cars, 758 00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:10,120 Speaker 1: some of the first vehicles were electrical. Yeah, electric cars 759 00:41:10,160 --> 00:41:15,320 Speaker 1: actually pre date the gasoline powered cars. Uh, but electric 760 00:41:15,360 --> 00:41:20,880 Speaker 1: cars were while they were early versions of personal vehicles 761 00:41:21,239 --> 00:41:24,040 Speaker 1: they were a little limited. You were limited pretty much 762 00:41:24,080 --> 00:41:27,279 Speaker 1: by the area that you could drive in, and that 763 00:41:27,360 --> 00:41:31,680 Speaker 1: was mostly in cities, because they had the capacity to 764 00:41:31,719 --> 00:41:34,879 Speaker 1: generate and distribute the electricity that you would need to 765 00:41:34,880 --> 00:41:38,879 Speaker 1: to recharge your vehicle. Um once people got it into 766 00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:42,959 Speaker 1: their heads, this crazy notion of hey, this vehicle would 767 00:41:43,080 --> 00:41:47,160 Speaker 1: actually allow me to go and explore beyond just getting 768 00:41:47,160 --> 00:41:48,680 Speaker 1: from point A to point B in my city, but 769 00:41:50,120 --> 00:41:53,000 Speaker 1: out somewhere, maybe not across the wild beyond. Right, I've 770 00:41:53,000 --> 00:41:55,960 Speaker 1: always I've always wanted to drive from New York to 771 00:41:56,480 --> 00:41:59,799 Speaker 1: you know, uh to Chicago. Then you would need some 772 00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:03,040 Speaker 1: thing that would allow you to uh to get further 773 00:42:03,120 --> 00:42:04,759 Speaker 1: than that, or you would have to have some sort 774 00:42:04,760 --> 00:42:07,640 Speaker 1: of infrastructure in place that could allow you to refuel. 775 00:42:08,120 --> 00:42:13,040 Speaker 1: And that's kind of how gasoline took over. Now these 776 00:42:13,080 --> 00:42:15,560 Speaker 1: these days, of course, there are lots of hybrid vehicles 777 00:42:15,560 --> 00:42:19,280 Speaker 1: and a few all electric vehicles, and we are creating 778 00:42:19,360 --> 00:42:23,280 Speaker 1: more of an infrastructure around those for charging stations in between, 779 00:42:23,360 --> 00:42:24,799 Speaker 1: you know, so that if you don't happen to have 780 00:42:24,840 --> 00:42:27,799 Speaker 1: a house once every thirty miles along your route, right, yeah, 781 00:42:27,840 --> 00:42:31,040 Speaker 1: you can't just you know, sneakily plug in your vehicle 782 00:42:31,120 --> 00:42:34,840 Speaker 1: to whatever outlet happens to be nearby. Uh, yeah, you can. 783 00:42:35,000 --> 00:42:39,279 Speaker 1: You can support it through these official infrastructure utilities that 784 00:42:39,320 --> 00:42:43,279 Speaker 1: are out there. Also, there's uh, there are other innovations 785 00:42:43,280 --> 00:42:47,680 Speaker 1: like regenerative breaking, where you've get some which you save 786 00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:50,600 Speaker 1: up some the kinetic energy that you create from breaking 787 00:42:50,719 --> 00:42:53,560 Speaker 1: or from and normally you would just you would just 788 00:42:53,600 --> 00:42:55,920 Speaker 1: lose that energy. That energy would normally just be converted 789 00:42:55,920 --> 00:42:59,440 Speaker 1: into heat and you would lose it. But with regenerative breaking, 790 00:42:59,440 --> 00:43:02,239 Speaker 1: you're actually capturing some of that energy that otherwise would 791 00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:04,520 Speaker 1: just go into heat, and you can put that back 792 00:43:04,520 --> 00:43:07,480 Speaker 1: into the battery. Now, of course there's no way to 793 00:43:07,560 --> 00:43:10,360 Speaker 1: completely eliminate heat. If we could, we'd have the perfect 794 00:43:10,360 --> 00:43:12,600 Speaker 1: closed system and every time we use the brakes, we 795 00:43:12,640 --> 00:43:14,839 Speaker 1: would capture all of that energy and put it right 796 00:43:14,840 --> 00:43:17,080 Speaker 1: back into the battery. Doesn't mean that you would even 797 00:43:17,360 --> 00:43:19,320 Speaker 1: you would never have to recharge the battery, but it 798 00:43:19,360 --> 00:43:20,680 Speaker 1: would mean that you could do it. We could go 799 00:43:20,719 --> 00:43:22,600 Speaker 1: for a really long time. Yeah, but it turns out, 800 00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:24,400 Speaker 1: you know, we can't do that. We can't press you. 801 00:43:25,719 --> 00:43:31,320 Speaker 1: Oh your thermodynamics. Um, I blame Newton. Really, it's his fault. 802 00:43:32,160 --> 00:43:34,600 Speaker 1: If that apple had not hit his head. And he 803 00:43:34,640 --> 00:43:38,080 Speaker 1: had just stuck with figs, we would have been I 804 00:43:38,080 --> 00:43:41,280 Speaker 1: think I'm mixing things up anyway. So, uh So, getting 805 00:43:41,280 --> 00:43:44,919 Speaker 1: back into electricity, the nice thing about an electrical car 806 00:43:45,120 --> 00:43:49,279 Speaker 1: is that you really have no appreciable emissions to speak of. Right, 807 00:43:49,320 --> 00:43:51,520 Speaker 1: you know, you do have to worry about whatever the 808 00:43:51,560 --> 00:43:54,560 Speaker 1: battery is made out of, if that stuff is toxic 809 00:43:54,640 --> 00:43:57,040 Speaker 1: or dangerous, and how do you dispose of that once 810 00:43:57,120 --> 00:43:59,960 Speaker 1: you need to eventually replace it and keeping in my 811 00:44:00,000 --> 00:44:02,560 Speaker 1: and you can charge and drain a battery a lot 812 00:44:02,600 --> 00:44:06,319 Speaker 1: of several times, but eventually you will need to replace it. Um. 813 00:44:06,440 --> 00:44:10,839 Speaker 1: So there that's a concern on top of that. Just 814 00:44:10,880 --> 00:44:15,520 Speaker 1: because your car is clean, like the the electricity isn't 815 00:44:15,560 --> 00:44:19,680 Speaker 1: producing any sort of appreciable emissions, doesn't mean that there 816 00:44:19,719 --> 00:44:25,759 Speaker 1: were no emissions created during the processing of that battery, yeah, 817 00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:29,920 Speaker 1: or of the electricity that you put into that battery, 818 00:44:30,080 --> 00:44:32,400 Speaker 1: right yeah, because because how does you know, how does 819 00:44:32,440 --> 00:44:34,239 Speaker 1: power get to your house? Yeah? If you if your 820 00:44:34,239 --> 00:44:38,200 Speaker 1: power is coming from a coal powered plant, then the 821 00:44:38,239 --> 00:44:42,360 Speaker 1: fact that your car is not emitting greenhouse gases or 822 00:44:42,520 --> 00:44:45,920 Speaker 1: pollutants is nice, but it's still getting its energy from 823 00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:48,640 Speaker 1: a source that really is producing a lot of greenhouse 824 00:44:48,640 --> 00:44:51,600 Speaker 1: gases and pollutants. So in a way, the way I 825 00:44:51,640 --> 00:44:56,360 Speaker 1: like to say is that it kind of shifts the 826 00:44:56,520 --> 00:44:59,759 Speaker 1: burden the responsibility to a different party. But it's all 827 00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:03,480 Speaker 1: dull part of this overall system. So again, if your goal, 828 00:45:03,880 --> 00:45:06,279 Speaker 1: because it doesn't necessarily mean that your goal to switch 829 00:45:06,320 --> 00:45:09,000 Speaker 1: from one fuel to an alternative, it doesn't necessarily have 830 00:45:09,120 --> 00:45:12,520 Speaker 1: to be environmental. But if it is environmental, switching all 831 00:45:12,560 --> 00:45:14,560 Speaker 1: of this other stuff into consider it. You can't just 832 00:45:14,600 --> 00:45:18,600 Speaker 1: switch to electrical and think I am now saving the world. 833 00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:20,880 Speaker 1: It all depends on how the energy is produced. Now, 834 00:45:20,880 --> 00:45:23,600 Speaker 1: if your energy is being produced by plants that are 835 00:45:23,640 --> 00:45:27,719 Speaker 1: mainly using hydro power or geothermal power, or solar or 836 00:45:27,760 --> 00:45:31,960 Speaker 1: wind power. First of all, I'm amazed, uh, not so 837 00:45:32,040 --> 00:45:34,080 Speaker 1: much with the hydro power. There are quite a few 838 00:45:34,160 --> 00:45:37,600 Speaker 1: facilities that use that. But but you know, if most 839 00:45:37,600 --> 00:45:40,160 Speaker 1: people aren't off the grid enough and most people, yeah, 840 00:45:40,239 --> 00:45:43,120 Speaker 1: but most areas are not in the US anyway, are 841 00:45:43,160 --> 00:45:46,120 Speaker 1: not using that kind of power for yeah, I mean generation. 842 00:45:46,200 --> 00:45:48,560 Speaker 1: Not everyone has access to the kind of stuff. Like 843 00:45:48,719 --> 00:45:50,520 Speaker 1: you know, if you're using hydro power, you've got to 844 00:45:50,520 --> 00:45:53,280 Speaker 1: have access to a great amount of water that's in motion. 845 00:45:53,680 --> 00:45:55,040 Speaker 1: If you happen to be in a part of the 846 00:45:55,120 --> 00:45:57,560 Speaker 1: United States or the world in general that is not 847 00:45:58,040 --> 00:46:01,080 Speaker 1: close to any sort of major river or or title 848 00:46:01,719 --> 00:46:04,000 Speaker 1: motion or anything like that where you can harness this, 849 00:46:04,360 --> 00:46:07,359 Speaker 1: then you have to find something else to create your electricity. 850 00:46:07,560 --> 00:46:11,200 Speaker 1: It's not even that you're necessarily you know, uh, part 851 00:46:11,280 --> 00:46:13,680 Speaker 1: of the what what some people think of as a 852 00:46:13,760 --> 00:46:17,000 Speaker 1: giant conspiracy among car companies and oil companies and that 853 00:46:17,080 --> 00:46:20,040 Speaker 1: sort of thing. Personally, I don't believe that conspiracy really exists. 854 00:46:20,080 --> 00:46:22,600 Speaker 1: I believe that there are a lot of companies out 855 00:46:22,680 --> 00:46:25,120 Speaker 1: there that have interests and they will lobby to have 856 00:46:25,160 --> 00:46:28,000 Speaker 1: those interests protected. But I don't think it goes so 857 00:46:28,040 --> 00:46:32,640 Speaker 1: far as to let us suppress all innovation. They don't 858 00:46:32,640 --> 00:46:35,239 Speaker 1: need to, and we'll talk about more about that in 859 00:46:35,280 --> 00:46:39,000 Speaker 1: the next podcast. But but at any rate, so, yeah, 860 00:46:39,640 --> 00:46:42,239 Speaker 1: it's it's a lack of availability of um of of 861 00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:46,240 Speaker 1: a rare earth elements to to help things like photovoltaics 862 00:46:46,360 --> 00:46:49,000 Speaker 1: and and be um just just access to the natural 863 00:46:49,040 --> 00:46:52,200 Speaker 1: resources needed to to really collect wind on a wind 864 00:46:52,200 --> 00:46:55,360 Speaker 1: farm or solar energy exactly. Yeah, you may not be 865 00:46:55,400 --> 00:46:58,400 Speaker 1: in a part of the world that is conducive to 866 00:46:58,440 --> 00:47:01,440 Speaker 1: any of that, so you have to get it somehow. So, yeah, 867 00:47:01,520 --> 00:47:04,960 Speaker 1: electricity is good in theory, but again it all depends 868 00:47:04,960 --> 00:47:07,480 Speaker 1: on how that electricity was generated, whether or not you 869 00:47:07,520 --> 00:47:12,720 Speaker 1: are net doing a service to the environment. And again 870 00:47:12,880 --> 00:47:15,680 Speaker 1: if if that's not your concern, if the environment isn't 871 00:47:15,680 --> 00:47:17,880 Speaker 1: the reason you're switching to an alternative fuel, this is 872 00:47:18,000 --> 00:47:21,640 Speaker 1: a moot discussion in the first place, because, like we said, 873 00:47:21,640 --> 00:47:24,160 Speaker 1: there are lots of different reasons. All right, So that 874 00:47:24,280 --> 00:47:26,320 Speaker 1: is the overview. Do you have anything else about electricity 875 00:47:26,360 --> 00:47:29,880 Speaker 1: you wanted to add? Excellent? Alright, So we have covered 876 00:47:29,920 --> 00:47:33,239 Speaker 1: the various alternatives that are typically talked about when we 877 00:47:33,280 --> 00:47:36,480 Speaker 1: talk about alternative fuel. In our next episode, we're really 878 00:47:36,480 --> 00:47:39,879 Speaker 1: going to cover why is gasoline something that we really 879 00:47:39,880 --> 00:47:41,880 Speaker 1: depend on? We've touched on a lot of it already, 880 00:47:42,280 --> 00:47:45,640 Speaker 1: and talk about what are the big challenges to moving 881 00:47:45,719 --> 00:47:51,319 Speaker 1: to a gasoline free fuel system? And there are quite 882 00:47:51,360 --> 00:47:53,879 Speaker 1: a few challenges, as it turns out, but we'll cover 883 00:47:53,960 --> 00:47:56,000 Speaker 1: that in our next episode. If you guys have any 884 00:47:56,040 --> 00:47:58,799 Speaker 1: suggestions for future episodes that we should cover here on 885 00:47:58,920 --> 00:48:01,600 Speaker 1: Tech Stuff, please let us know. A lot of you 886 00:48:01,680 --> 00:48:04,440 Speaker 1: been writing in and giving us some great suggestions for 887 00:48:04,560 --> 00:48:06,600 Speaker 1: future topics. Thank you so much for all of your 888 00:48:06,640 --> 00:48:08,839 Speaker 1: all of your letters. Yeah, we really appreciate it. We've 889 00:48:08,840 --> 00:48:11,439 Speaker 1: been adding to the list, and trust us, that list 890 00:48:11,560 --> 00:48:13,440 Speaker 1: is very important to us because it means that we 891 00:48:13,480 --> 00:48:15,960 Speaker 1: don't have to sit there and invent stuff. We already 892 00:48:15,960 --> 00:48:18,279 Speaker 1: know what you want to hear, and when we know 893 00:48:18,320 --> 00:48:21,160 Speaker 1: what you want to hear, it makes it better for everybody. 894 00:48:21,200 --> 00:48:23,360 Speaker 1: So keep that up. Let us know, send us an email, 895 00:48:23,480 --> 00:48:27,680 Speaker 1: our addresses tech stuff at Discovery dot com, or drop 896 00:48:27,719 --> 00:48:30,040 Speaker 1: us a line on social media. You can find us 897 00:48:30,080 --> 00:48:33,200 Speaker 1: on Facebook or Twitter. Our handle at both of those 898 00:48:33,360 --> 00:48:36,560 Speaker 1: is text stuff H. S. W and Lauren and I 899 00:48:36,560 --> 00:48:45,520 Speaker 1: will talk to you again really soon for more on 900 00:48:45,600 --> 00:48:47,880 Speaker 1: this and bath into other topics. Does It Has to 901 00:48:48,040 --> 00:48:58,320 Speaker 1: Works dot Com