1 00:00:02,920 --> 00:00:07,280 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. 2 00:00:09,760 --> 00:00:13,280 Speaker 2: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch 3 00:00:13,360 --> 00:00:16,400 Speaker 2: Just Live weekdays at noon Eastern on Appocarplay and then 4 00:00:16,520 --> 00:00:19,920 Speaker 2: Rouno with the Bloomberg Business app. Listen on demand wherever 5 00:00:20,000 --> 00:00:25,320 Speaker 2: you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube. 6 00:00:25,560 --> 00:00:27,080 Speaker 2: You're on Bloomberg TV and Radio. 7 00:00:27,120 --> 00:00:29,319 Speaker 3: I'm Joe Matthew. Indeed, Kaylee Lines is back with us 8 00:00:29,360 --> 00:00:32,400 Speaker 3: today as we usher in the start of an important 9 00:00:32,400 --> 00:00:35,879 Speaker 3: summit this week in Washington, the seventy fifth anniversary of 10 00:00:36,000 --> 00:00:38,840 Speaker 3: NATO and Kayleie, we've been talking about this so much 11 00:00:38,880 --> 00:00:41,159 Speaker 3: through the guise of Joe Biden's well being. He's going 12 00:00:41,200 --> 00:00:43,280 Speaker 3: to be speaking later today. We'll bring you that address, 13 00:00:43,720 --> 00:00:46,200 Speaker 3: of course, around five o'clock at least some of his words, 14 00:00:46,240 --> 00:00:49,000 Speaker 3: to see how he's feeling and how he's projecting himself. 15 00:00:49,040 --> 00:00:51,800 Speaker 3: But of course this is a critical time for the Alliance, 16 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:54,279 Speaker 3: Kaylee to be meeting, not only because of Ukraine, but 17 00:00:54,680 --> 00:00:58,640 Speaker 3: uncertainty throughout Europe following elections over the past week or 18 00:00:58,680 --> 00:01:01,680 Speaker 3: so here and a lot of questions about the future 19 00:01:01,960 --> 00:01:03,280 Speaker 3: of politics here in the US. 20 00:01:03,680 --> 00:01:03,920 Speaker 2: Yeah. 21 00:01:03,960 --> 00:01:07,080 Speaker 4: Absolutely, these countries leaders may also be bracing for the 22 00:01:07,080 --> 00:01:09,840 Speaker 4: potential return of Donald Trump, questioning what that might mean 23 00:01:09,880 --> 00:01:12,279 Speaker 4: for this alliance that now, of course is much larger 24 00:01:12,319 --> 00:01:15,040 Speaker 4: as it celebrates at seventy fifth anniversary, with the addition 25 00:01:15,120 --> 00:01:18,320 Speaker 4: of Sweden and Finland, of course that we've seen under 26 00:01:18,360 --> 00:01:20,880 Speaker 4: this administration. But you're absolutely right, Joe, we do expect 27 00:01:20,920 --> 00:01:23,800 Speaker 4: that Ukraine will feature highly as well as concerns about 28 00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:27,320 Speaker 4: what Russia could do next if it indeed is victorious 29 00:01:27,360 --> 00:01:29,560 Speaker 4: in Ukraine. And that's a concern that especially the Baltic 30 00:01:29,600 --> 00:01:32,160 Speaker 4: states we know very much have and we want to 31 00:01:32,160 --> 00:01:34,959 Speaker 4: bring in now a foreign minister from one of those states, Latvia, 32 00:01:35,080 --> 00:01:38,679 Speaker 4: the country Biba Breiza is with us now here in 33 00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:41,160 Speaker 4: our Washington, d C studio. She is indeed the Latvia 34 00:01:41,160 --> 00:01:43,440 Speaker 4: and foreign minister minister. Thank you so much for being 35 00:01:43,440 --> 00:01:44,679 Speaker 4: with us here on Bloomberg TV. 36 00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:46,039 Speaker 5: Thanks for having me and radio. 37 00:01:46,280 --> 00:01:48,280 Speaker 4: Welcome to Washington. I'm sure it's going to be a 38 00:01:48,320 --> 00:01:53,000 Speaker 4: busy several days for you and very hot ones. Yes, 39 00:01:53,040 --> 00:01:55,640 Speaker 4: what are you hoping to leave here with? What is 40 00:01:55,680 --> 00:01:57,760 Speaker 4: your outcome that you were looking for from this? 41 00:01:57,800 --> 00:01:58,160 Speaker 6: All? Right? 42 00:01:58,280 --> 00:02:01,160 Speaker 5: So, naitoy' is a defense alliance has a particular meaning. 43 00:02:01,200 --> 00:02:04,240 Speaker 5: It's political military alliance. The only of its kind. So 44 00:02:04,480 --> 00:02:07,040 Speaker 5: the primary purpose of that is of course the defense 45 00:02:07,080 --> 00:02:10,160 Speaker 5: of allies. So there is a lot of change that 46 00:02:10,280 --> 00:02:13,520 Speaker 5: is happening with Russia's attack on Ukraine. So we have 47 00:02:13,639 --> 00:02:16,400 Speaker 5: moved from out of area operations where we had choice 48 00:02:16,440 --> 00:02:19,480 Speaker 5: of sending people to Iraq you know, for six months, 49 00:02:19,520 --> 00:02:24,720 Speaker 5: and then rotating them again to a collective defense. Back 50 00:02:24,760 --> 00:02:27,400 Speaker 5: to collective defense what we had in the Cold War times, 51 00:02:27,440 --> 00:02:30,400 Speaker 5: with General Eisenhower establishing the basis of that after the 52 00:02:30,440 --> 00:02:34,760 Speaker 5: Second World War. So defending allies, having troops in place, 53 00:02:34,880 --> 00:02:41,360 Speaker 5: having capabilities, having command control in place, ability to reinforce, 54 00:02:41,400 --> 00:02:44,200 Speaker 5: and so on and so forth. So that's that package is 55 00:02:44,200 --> 00:02:46,919 Speaker 5: the most important outcome. It goes hand in hand with 56 00:02:47,040 --> 00:02:50,800 Speaker 5: support Ukraine obviously because what Russia is doing in Ukraine 57 00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:54,760 Speaker 5: is something that is considered the threat to all allies. 58 00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:59,800 Speaker 5: So supporting Ukraine and its liberation fight is crucially important. 59 00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:02,200 Speaker 5: Fighting for freedom, that's what we all are there for. 60 00:03:02,600 --> 00:03:07,320 Speaker 5: We all want freedom, right, So Ukraine, winn Ukraine is 61 00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:09,720 Speaker 5: very important for all of us. And then of course 62 00:03:09,760 --> 00:03:13,079 Speaker 5: working with a wider range of partners from Indo Pacific 63 00:03:13,120 --> 00:03:15,920 Speaker 5: for example, they will be here for the summit to 64 00:03:16,000 --> 00:03:19,480 Speaker 5: address other challenges and threats, such as you know, challenges 65 00:03:19,480 --> 00:03:22,920 Speaker 5: from China, constant cyber attacks. You will have seen the 66 00:03:23,400 --> 00:03:26,880 Speaker 5: trying to change the balance of power globally, So that 67 00:03:27,000 --> 00:03:29,280 Speaker 5: is also important for all of us because it's not 68 00:03:29,400 --> 00:03:32,519 Speaker 5: just about Russia's conventional war. It's also about the challenges 69 00:03:32,760 --> 00:03:34,600 Speaker 5: to all of us to who we are and how 70 00:03:34,639 --> 00:03:35,960 Speaker 5: we function as democracies. 71 00:03:36,160 --> 00:03:38,560 Speaker 3: There's a conversation of course in Europe right now about 72 00:03:38,640 --> 00:03:41,560 Speaker 3: levels of commitment when it comes to Ukraine, but also 73 00:03:41,640 --> 00:03:45,440 Speaker 3: NATO more broadly as the alliance. Because of your border, 74 00:03:45,440 --> 00:03:49,480 Speaker 3: you're on the front lines of protecting democracy as a 75 00:03:49,560 --> 00:03:53,680 Speaker 3: NATO member, do you worry about a fissure in European 76 00:03:53,760 --> 00:03:57,160 Speaker 3: politics having seen elections recently when it comes to this. 77 00:03:57,080 --> 00:04:00,840 Speaker 5: Issue, well, NATO has had a borderline with with Russia 78 00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:04,120 Speaker 5: since it was established in Norway and other places. So 79 00:04:04,640 --> 00:04:07,880 Speaker 5: now it's longer. Now it's Finland joined. The Baltic States 80 00:04:07,920 --> 00:04:11,440 Speaker 5: have been born in Russia since we were established one 81 00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:13,720 Speaker 5: hundred and five years one hundred and six years ago, 82 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:17,440 Speaker 5: and since we joined NATO twenty years ago. So we 83 00:04:17,480 --> 00:04:21,080 Speaker 5: are all peaceful countries, but we want to continue being 84 00:04:21,160 --> 00:04:24,960 Speaker 5: peaceful countries. So that's why we established that defense capability 85 00:04:25,000 --> 00:04:28,520 Speaker 5: together with the US, and US is an essential member 86 00:04:28,520 --> 00:04:31,120 Speaker 5: of that alliance, so that link is crucially important. So 87 00:04:31,160 --> 00:04:34,440 Speaker 5: of course we are interested in successful US. Of course 88 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:37,360 Speaker 5: we have a share in US is concerned, whether it's China, 89 00:04:37,400 --> 00:04:42,000 Speaker 5: whether it's other challenges that we face together. So that's 90 00:04:42,080 --> 00:04:45,119 Speaker 5: that's why we are together here in Washington as native 91 00:04:45,160 --> 00:04:47,920 Speaker 5: alliance to address any threat to any LA. 92 00:04:48,680 --> 00:04:52,360 Speaker 4: Well, it's you though, among the allies that potentially are 93 00:04:52,560 --> 00:04:55,240 Speaker 4: most immediately affected. If Russia were to decide to move 94 00:04:55,320 --> 00:04:59,360 Speaker 4: naant Ukraine Nate, but that exactly Article five. Theoretically, at 95 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:01,880 Speaker 4: any the other Baltic country, any country in the alliance 96 00:05:01,920 --> 00:05:05,000 Speaker 4: were to be attacked, theoretically that would trigger all of 97 00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:08,520 Speaker 4: the NATO forces coming together in a defensive way. How 98 00:05:08,520 --> 00:05:10,760 Speaker 4: should we think about what that attack could actually mean? 99 00:05:10,760 --> 00:05:13,760 Speaker 4: Knowing we've seen hybrid attacks, cyber attacks, for example, Russia 100 00:05:13,760 --> 00:05:16,680 Speaker 4: has been conducting in the region, turning to China as well, 101 00:05:16,760 --> 00:05:20,120 Speaker 4: moving buoys in the river that separates Estonia in Russia, 102 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:23,000 Speaker 4: how should we be quantifying what an Article five triggering 103 00:05:23,040 --> 00:05:25,320 Speaker 4: event actually might be. Could it be something like that? 104 00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:28,440 Speaker 5: So the important part is actually to have that situational 105 00:05:28,520 --> 00:05:32,800 Speaker 5: awareness which means to have the intelligence reconnaissance capabilities to 106 00:05:32,960 --> 00:05:36,680 Speaker 5: understand the threats. That means both on the Russian side, 107 00:05:36,720 --> 00:05:41,719 Speaker 5: but also globally. It's about terrorists, it's about cyber attacks 108 00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:44,159 Speaker 5: from wherever they can come. We have called out also 109 00:05:44,240 --> 00:05:47,880 Speaker 5: Iran on cyber attacks. So it's important to have that 110 00:05:47,960 --> 00:05:51,359 Speaker 5: situational awareness to be ready because once you know what 111 00:05:51,480 --> 00:05:54,479 Speaker 5: is happening, it's easier to respond. And this is where 112 00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:57,560 Speaker 5: NATO together we have invested so much. That's why we 113 00:05:57,680 --> 00:06:02,600 Speaker 5: have that defense growth in terms of defense spenning. That's 114 00:06:02,640 --> 00:06:08,120 Speaker 5: why we have additional defense capabilities, and that means expensive technology, satellites, 115 00:06:08,240 --> 00:06:11,760 Speaker 5: that means, you know, reconnaissance capability is that means drawing 116 00:06:11,920 --> 00:06:15,760 Speaker 5: all the data together, working with the private sector, giving 117 00:06:15,800 --> 00:06:19,040 Speaker 5: back to the private sector, private sector contributing to that 118 00:06:19,160 --> 00:06:23,719 Speaker 5: open source awareness. So it's a pretty complicated algorithm. But 119 00:06:23,960 --> 00:06:27,400 Speaker 5: all together as the alliance, it's not about the Baltic States, 120 00:06:27,440 --> 00:06:30,200 Speaker 5: it's about whole of NATO because we are in it together. 121 00:06:30,640 --> 00:06:34,039 Speaker 5: And once once we have that situation awareness, once we 122 00:06:34,200 --> 00:06:37,720 Speaker 5: know what is threatening us or not, we are able 123 00:06:37,720 --> 00:06:40,760 Speaker 5: to respond as necessary. So for now, there is no 124 00:06:40,880 --> 00:06:43,440 Speaker 5: direct military threat to any of the allies because we 125 00:06:43,520 --> 00:06:46,320 Speaker 5: have invested so much work to make sure that we 126 00:06:46,680 --> 00:06:50,359 Speaker 5: have that deterrance capability and the terrence is what we 127 00:06:50,440 --> 00:06:50,920 Speaker 5: are seeking. 128 00:06:51,080 --> 00:06:53,200 Speaker 3: Well, Minister, I know you're here to engage with the 129 00:06:53,200 --> 00:06:56,440 Speaker 3: administration and your allies. You're at the convention center just 130 00:06:56,480 --> 00:06:59,599 Speaker 3: a couple of blocks away from where we are, and 131 00:06:59,640 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 3: you're not here to talk about Donald Trump. But there 132 00:07:02,200 --> 00:07:05,719 Speaker 3: is a debate about redefining Article five right now if 133 00:07:05,720 --> 00:07:08,839 Speaker 3: he were re elected, and he's called into question whether 134 00:07:08,920 --> 00:07:13,000 Speaker 3: certain members would qualify for Article five protection based on 135 00:07:13,040 --> 00:07:16,600 Speaker 3: their contributions. Are you concerned about or do you expect 136 00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:20,080 Speaker 3: Article five to be redefined if Donald Trump is realized. 137 00:07:20,120 --> 00:07:22,320 Speaker 5: No, we don't expect that. We worked very well with 138 00:07:22,360 --> 00:07:27,600 Speaker 5: the Trump administration before, and you know it's we work 139 00:07:27,640 --> 00:07:30,720 Speaker 5: with all the administrations and don't recommend to any politician 140 00:07:30,800 --> 00:07:35,880 Speaker 5: to comment on another countries internal politics. But whoever is elected, 141 00:07:35,880 --> 00:07:40,840 Speaker 5: we will work with him, her, them. And it's important 142 00:07:40,920 --> 00:07:43,560 Speaker 5: for America to know that it has friends and allies. 143 00:07:43,840 --> 00:07:46,440 Speaker 5: I mean for all the countries, it's important to have 144 00:07:46,520 --> 00:07:49,800 Speaker 5: those friends and allies, and there's no closer friend or 145 00:07:49,840 --> 00:07:53,240 Speaker 5: allies at any country in Natal four for America, and 146 00:07:53,320 --> 00:07:55,960 Speaker 5: I think That's why. Also when President Trump was in 147 00:07:56,000 --> 00:07:58,880 Speaker 5: power the previous time, it was very clear that they 148 00:07:58,920 --> 00:08:01,560 Speaker 5: were all types of room that he would withdraw America 149 00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:03,760 Speaker 5: from NATO and so on and so forth. But it 150 00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:07,720 Speaker 5: never happened because at the end, we are better stronger together. 151 00:08:08,280 --> 00:08:11,120 Speaker 5: And as I said, currently, the defense spending is that 152 00:08:11,240 --> 00:08:14,800 Speaker 5: the rise as never before. Twenty three allies are about 153 00:08:14,800 --> 00:08:17,640 Speaker 5: two percent of GDP on defense and it will be rising. 154 00:08:18,640 --> 00:08:22,440 Speaker 4: Speaking of spending money on defense or other countries defense, 155 00:08:22,480 --> 00:08:24,760 Speaker 4: we don't only have questions about what the selection means 156 00:08:24,760 --> 00:08:28,560 Speaker 4: for potentially US membership in NATO, but also the amount 157 00:08:28,600 --> 00:08:31,000 Speaker 4: of money the US is going to be willing to 158 00:08:31,040 --> 00:08:34,120 Speaker 4: continue to provide to Ukraine. It was very difficult for 159 00:08:34,240 --> 00:08:37,320 Speaker 4: Congress to get the aid passed earlier this year. Across 160 00:08:37,360 --> 00:08:41,080 Speaker 4: the finish line, if the US kid no longer provides 161 00:08:41,120 --> 00:08:43,960 Speaker 4: that aid to Ukraine, what would that mean for other 162 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:47,760 Speaker 4: NATO countries? If Ukraine is less in its ability to 163 00:08:47,840 --> 00:08:50,880 Speaker 4: defend against the Russian invasion as a result. 164 00:08:51,400 --> 00:08:53,800 Speaker 5: Let me be straightforward, I think that it's in the 165 00:08:53,920 --> 00:08:56,320 Speaker 5: US interest to provide the t AID because most of 166 00:08:56,360 --> 00:08:59,440 Speaker 5: the money, almost all of it goes back into US economy. 167 00:08:59,480 --> 00:09:02,640 Speaker 5: In the U s defense industry sort of increasing its 168 00:09:02,640 --> 00:09:06,720 Speaker 5: own capabilities research capabilities. Also in terms of lessons learned 169 00:09:06,720 --> 00:09:09,320 Speaker 5: from the war in Ukraine, it's both the war of 170 00:09:09,360 --> 00:09:11,280 Speaker 5: the past, but also a war of the future from 171 00:09:11,280 --> 00:09:13,800 Speaker 5: what we are seeing with the drones, with targeting through 172 00:09:13,840 --> 00:09:17,400 Speaker 5: mobile phones, with applications used for identifying the targets, and 173 00:09:17,440 --> 00:09:20,160 Speaker 5: so on and so forth. So I think all our 174 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:24,560 Speaker 5: military and defense industries are really working closely with Ukrainians 175 00:09:24,600 --> 00:09:27,000 Speaker 5: to learn and prepare for those future wars that we 176 00:09:27,120 --> 00:09:30,840 Speaker 5: might be faced with wherever we don't know, We don't 177 00:09:30,880 --> 00:09:34,839 Speaker 5: know where it can arise. So from that perspective, US 178 00:09:35,160 --> 00:09:37,960 Speaker 5: aid to Ukraine is a help to the US itself 179 00:09:38,000 --> 00:09:39,240 Speaker 5: to prepare for the future. 180 00:09:39,559 --> 00:09:42,400 Speaker 3: Do you expect to leave the summit with a clearer 181 00:09:42,600 --> 00:09:45,800 Speaker 3: path for Ukrainian membership listen? 182 00:09:46,120 --> 00:09:50,400 Speaker 5: Ukraine is one of the strongest fighting forces in Europe today. 183 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:53,840 Speaker 5: I mean it's a country. It's the hour that has shown, 184 00:09:53,960 --> 00:09:56,600 Speaker 5: with the biggest army in Europe that it's able to 185 00:09:56,720 --> 00:09:59,880 Speaker 5: defend itself. Yes, with the Allies help obviously, and that 186 00:10:01,440 --> 00:10:04,559 Speaker 5: will make NATO stronger, it will make America stronger. Once 187 00:10:05,200 --> 00:10:05,760 Speaker 5: Ukraine joints. 188 00:10:05,760 --> 00:10:07,560 Speaker 3: Should there be a timeline. 189 00:10:08,040 --> 00:10:11,800 Speaker 5: Possibly again, you know, it depends on the success on 190 00:10:11,840 --> 00:10:14,719 Speaker 5: the battlefield. The sooner Ukraine is victorious and we can 191 00:10:14,760 --> 00:10:18,240 Speaker 5: reach a deal on the end of the war. As 192 00:10:18,800 --> 00:10:23,200 Speaker 5: sooner we can sort of finish financing the war, but 193 00:10:23,360 --> 00:10:26,600 Speaker 5: very clearly also then we can have a sort of 194 00:10:26,880 --> 00:10:30,280 Speaker 5: post war architecture with Ukraine in it. 195 00:10:30,679 --> 00:10:33,560 Speaker 4: But effectively the war needs to end first before any 196 00:10:33,559 --> 00:10:33,839 Speaker 4: of that. 197 00:10:33,960 --> 00:10:36,880 Speaker 5: Ukraine needs to achieve that victory is that it has 198 00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:39,640 Speaker 5: to define what is a victory. Nobody else but Ukraine 199 00:10:39,880 --> 00:10:42,199 Speaker 5: has to define what is a victory on the battlefield, 200 00:10:43,000 --> 00:10:45,480 Speaker 5: and we have to be there to support them to 201 00:10:45,520 --> 00:10:46,080 Speaker 5: achieve that. 202 00:10:46,720 --> 00:10:49,560 Speaker 3: What do you make of the conversation that we're having 203 00:10:49,559 --> 00:10:52,280 Speaker 3: here in the United States about our president now eighty 204 00:10:52,320 --> 00:10:54,480 Speaker 3: one years old, in questions about whether he has the 205 00:10:54,520 --> 00:11:01,040 Speaker 3: mental acuity to continue, whether his counterparts in NATO think 206 00:11:01,040 --> 00:11:04,520 Speaker 3: that he should continue in the job. What's your thought? 207 00:11:04,520 --> 00:11:05,199 Speaker 3: What does laugh via? 208 00:11:05,360 --> 00:11:09,120 Speaker 5: Well, I've met President Biden both when I worked at NATO, 209 00:11:09,559 --> 00:11:12,720 Speaker 5: and I look forward to seeing him tomorrow as a summit, 210 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:16,600 Speaker 5: and I wish at age of eighty one I would 211 00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:19,040 Speaker 5: be as strong as he is. We all have our 212 00:11:19,160 --> 00:11:21,640 Speaker 5: ups and downs, you know, at a moment so I 213 00:11:21,720 --> 00:11:24,559 Speaker 5: don't expect it to lead any kind of tragic outcome 214 00:11:24,640 --> 00:11:29,200 Speaker 5: or anything. But quite clearly, American democracy will be able 215 00:11:29,200 --> 00:11:32,120 Speaker 5: to handle all the challenges, and you will find the 216 00:11:32,160 --> 00:11:34,959 Speaker 5: way through this or through other challenges. I don't doubt that. 217 00:11:35,160 --> 00:11:37,760 Speaker 5: And you will be as strong as ever and as 218 00:11:37,800 --> 00:11:38,600 Speaker 5: powerful as ever. 219 00:11:39,400 --> 00:11:41,480 Speaker 4: And so essentially what you're saying is the strength of 220 00:11:41,480 --> 00:11:44,440 Speaker 4: the country is more about the country as a whole 221 00:11:44,559 --> 00:11:46,040 Speaker 4: versus the figurehead. 222 00:11:47,160 --> 00:11:50,720 Speaker 5: Again, the figure head is important, obviously, I mean, we 223 00:11:50,800 --> 00:11:55,280 Speaker 5: all look up, we describe the free world absolutely, so 224 00:11:55,360 --> 00:11:59,440 Speaker 5: it's very important. But in the same time, obviously we 225 00:11:59,559 --> 00:12:03,280 Speaker 5: all have our ups and downs, and we cannot predict 226 00:12:03,280 --> 00:12:06,640 Speaker 5: when that happens. But I don't know that US is 227 00:12:06,679 --> 00:12:07,360 Speaker 5: the strongest ever. 228 00:12:08,360 --> 00:12:12,400 Speaker 3: We'll be carrying his remarks when he speaks marking seventy 229 00:12:12,440 --> 00:12:14,720 Speaker 3: five years. What do you want to hear from President 230 00:12:14,760 --> 00:12:15,640 Speaker 3: Biden later today? 231 00:12:16,480 --> 00:12:20,120 Speaker 5: I want to hear that America and the link with 232 00:12:20,360 --> 00:12:22,720 Speaker 5: allies as the strongest evers, that we are as united 233 00:12:22,880 --> 00:12:26,200 Speaker 5: as ever, and the strength and the belief in freedom 234 00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:29,840 Speaker 5: and democracy both in Europe and America, and support you Ukraine. 235 00:12:29,840 --> 00:12:33,160 Speaker 4: All right, minister, we appreciate you joining us here at 236 00:12:33,240 --> 00:12:36,520 Speaker 4: Bloomberg Today. That's lappyas Foreign Minister Byba Braja here with 237 00:12:36,600 --> 00:12:39,280 Speaker 4: us around the table and enjoy the remainder of your 238 00:12:39,400 --> 00:12:43,920 Speaker 4: very hot time here in Washington. Make sure to hydrate. 239 00:12:43,960 --> 00:12:48,760 Speaker 4: We appreciate your time, minister. Thank you. 240 00:12:48,760 --> 00:12:52,040 Speaker 2: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Can 241 00:12:52,240 --> 00:12:55,040 Speaker 2: just live weekdays at noon Eastern on Apple car Play 242 00:12:55,080 --> 00:12:57,679 Speaker 2: and enroun Oo with the Bloomberg Business app. You can 243 00:12:57,720 --> 00:13:01,480 Speaker 2: also listen live on Amazon Alexa, our flagship New York station, 244 00:13:01,840 --> 00:13:05,960 Speaker 2: Jo Say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty. 245 00:13:06,880 --> 00:13:09,800 Speaker 4: Coming to you live from Washington, which is a busy town. 246 00:13:09,920 --> 00:13:12,400 Speaker 4: I must say this week a lot of roads leading 247 00:13:12,440 --> 00:13:17,040 Speaker 4: to the Bloomberg office here blocked off closed. I think 248 00:13:17,080 --> 00:13:18,960 Speaker 4: traffic was a nightmare this morning because there are a 249 00:13:18,960 --> 00:13:21,600 Speaker 4: lot of important people in town, Joe, including the lead 250 00:13:22,280 --> 00:13:25,560 Speaker 4: NATO countries. There's more than thirty of them, and it's 251 00:13:25,600 --> 00:13:28,640 Speaker 4: all teeing up a verty big moment or moments plural 252 00:13:28,840 --> 00:13:29,839 Speaker 4: for President Joe Biden. 253 00:13:29,920 --> 00:13:32,360 Speaker 3: Yeah, if you want some real elitist complaining here, you 254 00:13:32,400 --> 00:13:35,480 Speaker 3: can't get around the nation's capital. It's brutal outside. It's 255 00:13:35,480 --> 00:13:37,880 Speaker 3: also about one hundred degrees if we put those two together. 256 00:13:37,920 --> 00:13:40,199 Speaker 3: That's kind of the backdrop for this summit. And can 257 00:13:40,240 --> 00:13:42,079 Speaker 3: we welcome Kaylee Lines back. It's great to see you. 258 00:13:42,160 --> 00:13:43,240 Speaker 2: We missed you for the last week. 259 00:13:43,320 --> 00:13:45,840 Speaker 3: Now that we get serious about some stuff here, this 260 00:13:45,920 --> 00:13:48,120 Speaker 3: is an important moment. Joe Biden's going to speak around 261 00:13:48,160 --> 00:13:51,000 Speaker 3: five o'clock about four hours from now. That will be 262 00:13:51,080 --> 00:13:54,320 Speaker 3: followed by his news conference on Thursday. The world is watching, 263 00:13:54,400 --> 00:13:56,920 Speaker 3: not just Washington, and we'll bring you up to day 264 00:13:57,000 --> 00:13:59,480 Speaker 3: on what's been happening on Capitol Hill earlier today. Let's 265 00:13:59,480 --> 00:14:02,280 Speaker 3: bring in Nick Watams first to talk about what's behind 266 00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:03,959 Speaker 3: this summit and what we should be looking for. He 267 00:14:04,040 --> 00:14:07,160 Speaker 3: runs our national security coverage here in Washington, and it's 268 00:14:07,160 --> 00:14:08,040 Speaker 3: great to see you back here. 269 00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:08,320 Speaker 7: Nick. 270 00:14:08,640 --> 00:14:11,959 Speaker 3: This is a big deal, seventy five years. It's got 271 00:14:12,000 --> 00:14:13,760 Speaker 3: a bit of a cloud hanging over it because of 272 00:14:13,840 --> 00:14:16,840 Speaker 3: domestic politics, questions about Joe Biden. All of these leaders 273 00:14:16,840 --> 00:14:19,240 Speaker 3: are being asked about their relationships with him, but also 274 00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:22,720 Speaker 3: some of the uncertainty following elections in Europe. This is 275 00:14:22,760 --> 00:14:24,480 Speaker 3: a peculiar moment for this summit. 276 00:14:24,800 --> 00:14:26,760 Speaker 8: Yeah, I mean, it's the timing in a lot of 277 00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:28,600 Speaker 8: ways could not be worse. I mean, this was supposed 278 00:14:28,600 --> 00:14:30,120 Speaker 8: to be a summit that was going to be a 279 00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:34,440 Speaker 8: celebration of NATO talk about Unity project, a real show 280 00:14:34,480 --> 00:14:37,880 Speaker 8: of force against Vladimir Putin, I talk about the defense 281 00:14:37,920 --> 00:14:40,280 Speaker 8: of Ukraine. In a lot of ways, it's doing exactly 282 00:14:40,280 --> 00:14:42,320 Speaker 8: the opposite. So you have a lot of concern about 283 00:14:42,320 --> 00:14:45,120 Speaker 8: the long term viability of these leaders. Obviously Joe Biden 284 00:14:45,200 --> 00:14:47,800 Speaker 8: over his age, but the fact that he trails Donald 285 00:14:47,840 --> 00:14:51,240 Speaker 8: Trump so much in the polls. French President Emmanuel Macron 286 00:14:51,280 --> 00:14:53,880 Speaker 8: made an election gamble that didn't turn out so well 287 00:14:53,920 --> 00:14:57,680 Speaker 8: for him. He's looking hobbled Germany as well, rise of 288 00:14:57,720 --> 00:15:00,080 Speaker 8: the far right in a lot of ways. So we 289 00:15:00,120 --> 00:15:03,440 Speaker 8: have these leaders coming in where their focus really is elsewhere. 290 00:15:03,440 --> 00:15:05,600 Speaker 8: And then underneath all of that you have the fact 291 00:15:05,640 --> 00:15:08,120 Speaker 8: that they can't agree on Ukraine. So again we get 292 00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:11,720 Speaker 8: into this dynamic where they're offering, dangling the idea of 293 00:15:11,760 --> 00:15:16,160 Speaker 8: membership at some point for Ukraine, but not giving a 294 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:18,520 Speaker 8: firm timeline on when that might happen. And that's the 295 00:15:18,560 --> 00:15:20,360 Speaker 8: thing that Ukraine really wants. 296 00:15:20,480 --> 00:15:22,400 Speaker 4: And of course Ukraine is going to make the case 297 00:15:22,440 --> 00:15:25,320 Speaker 4: in person here President vlat of Mrzolinski is in Washington 298 00:15:25,440 --> 00:15:28,640 Speaker 4: for the summit. If not an invitation to be a member. 299 00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:33,200 Speaker 4: Can Ukraine expect anything tangible to come from NATO within the. 300 00:15:33,200 --> 00:15:33,920 Speaker 9: Next few days. 301 00:15:34,200 --> 00:15:36,960 Speaker 8: Well, I think what you will see, what we're hearing 302 00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:39,520 Speaker 8: is that there will be an announcement around air defense. 303 00:15:39,560 --> 00:15:42,720 Speaker 8: What they really want is additional air defenses, so maybe 304 00:15:42,720 --> 00:15:46,480 Speaker 8: some more patriots, a few more batteries, something like that, 305 00:15:47,360 --> 00:15:51,760 Speaker 8: and then a potential form of a longer term commitment. 306 00:15:51,920 --> 00:15:54,880 Speaker 8: But what we're not really going to see is anything 307 00:15:54,880 --> 00:15:58,480 Speaker 8: that actually changes the situation on the ground that would 308 00:15:58,520 --> 00:16:03,480 Speaker 8: allow Ukraine to expelpell Russian forces from its territory. We're 309 00:16:03,480 --> 00:16:06,200 Speaker 8: going to see Ukraine basically being a bunker mode. And 310 00:16:06,240 --> 00:16:08,720 Speaker 8: so that's really the bigger question on Ukraine that hovers 311 00:16:08,760 --> 00:16:11,480 Speaker 8: over this whole thing. Okay, you're going to continue flowing 312 00:16:11,520 --> 00:16:14,160 Speaker 8: weapons to Ukraine, but not give them the weapons they 313 00:16:14,200 --> 00:16:18,600 Speaker 8: need to expel Russia for good. So then what is 314 00:16:18,680 --> 00:16:22,400 Speaker 8: the long term endgame here? Do you just keep going indefinitely. 315 00:16:22,560 --> 00:16:23,880 Speaker 8: Something they have not been able to. 316 00:16:23,840 --> 00:16:27,920 Speaker 3: Answer questions about you mentioned air defense is the use 317 00:16:27,960 --> 00:16:31,600 Speaker 3: of F sixteen's, which we labored over for months. Nick, 318 00:16:31,640 --> 00:16:33,120 Speaker 3: we talked to you about it. It was a no 319 00:16:33,280 --> 00:16:36,120 Speaker 3: then maybe than a yes now apparently there are some 320 00:16:36,160 --> 00:16:41,320 Speaker 3: real challenges in training pilots, even getting runways to be 321 00:16:41,360 --> 00:16:44,240 Speaker 3: adaptable in Ukraine? Was this idea of failure? Did we 322 00:16:44,720 --> 00:16:46,960 Speaker 3: finally say yes? At one point we should have said no. 323 00:16:47,320 --> 00:16:49,760 Speaker 8: Well, I mean, I think what you saw there was 324 00:16:49,800 --> 00:16:52,800 Speaker 8: a desire to essentially, you know, this was something that 325 00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:57,200 Speaker 8: Vladimir Zelensky really wanted. But it's a real numbers game obviously, 326 00:16:57,240 --> 00:17:00,800 Speaker 8: the question of pilots, So the number of you would 327 00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:03,280 Speaker 8: be training, it's a pretty small number in Ukraine. You 328 00:17:03,400 --> 00:17:06,160 Speaker 8: have language issues. These guys would be flying a system 329 00:17:07,440 --> 00:17:10,119 Speaker 8: in working with trainers who are speaking English when they 330 00:17:10,160 --> 00:17:13,720 Speaker 8: may not speak English. And then just the broader term 331 00:17:13,760 --> 00:17:16,200 Speaker 8: issue of well what's this going to look like? How 332 00:17:16,240 --> 00:17:18,440 Speaker 8: long is this going to take and how many plans 333 00:17:18,480 --> 00:17:19,800 Speaker 8: are you actually going to be able to get up 334 00:17:19,840 --> 00:17:21,960 Speaker 8: in the air to make a difference. And right now 335 00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:24,600 Speaker 8: it's one of these things that you know, the time 336 00:17:24,720 --> 00:17:27,280 Speaker 8: lag is so long. I mean you're looking at years 337 00:17:27,760 --> 00:17:31,120 Speaker 8: to get these jets in operation over Ukraine, and then 338 00:17:31,119 --> 00:17:33,800 Speaker 8: you'd be talking about a small number. So it's a 339 00:17:33,800 --> 00:17:35,960 Speaker 8: big investment for not a lot of show. 340 00:17:36,240 --> 00:17:38,399 Speaker 4: Well, and if we're talking over the span of years, 341 00:17:38,760 --> 00:17:40,560 Speaker 4: a lot could change within the course of just the 342 00:17:40,600 --> 00:17:43,320 Speaker 4: next year, including potentially who the president of the United 343 00:17:43,320 --> 00:17:45,800 Speaker 4: States is. How much should we expect to hear from 344 00:17:45,880 --> 00:17:49,480 Speaker 4: NATO members about their plans for the potential of a 345 00:17:49,520 --> 00:17:52,000 Speaker 4: Trump two point zero How much will that dominate the 346 00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:52,920 Speaker 4: conversation this week? 347 00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:55,880 Speaker 8: Well, I mean, it's it's a great question because there 348 00:17:55,960 --> 00:17:58,639 Speaker 8: is no question that it is one of the biggest 349 00:17:58,640 --> 00:18:01,640 Speaker 8: things on everybody's mind, essentially aside from Joe Biden's age. 350 00:18:01,640 --> 00:18:04,040 Speaker 8: But there is also no question that they really do 351 00:18:04,119 --> 00:18:06,280 Speaker 8: not want to be talking about it, or they will 352 00:18:06,320 --> 00:18:08,520 Speaker 8: be talking about it in a way that they don't 353 00:18:08,520 --> 00:18:11,919 Speaker 8: acknowledge it. So you have Canada coming and saying, Okay, 354 00:18:11,920 --> 00:18:15,400 Speaker 8: we're going to offer our path to the appropriate level 355 00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:18,880 Speaker 8: of defense spending, you know, two percent of GDP. We're 356 00:18:18,920 --> 00:18:21,000 Speaker 8: gonna We're gonna tell you how we're gonna get there. 357 00:18:21,080 --> 00:18:23,160 Speaker 8: We're not there yet, but we want to get there. 358 00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:27,200 Speaker 8: That is something that's really aimed at appeasing Republicans Donald Trump, 359 00:18:27,200 --> 00:18:29,840 Speaker 8: who say, listen, everybody in NATO needs to be spending 360 00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:31,359 Speaker 8: that amount. So you're going to see a lot of 361 00:18:31,840 --> 00:18:36,320 Speaker 8: Trump proofing slash Trump orientation in anticipation of him coming. 362 00:18:36,359 --> 00:18:38,719 Speaker 8: But this is not something. I mean, I'd be shocked 363 00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:40,840 Speaker 8: if you hear any one of the thirty or so 364 00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:43,720 Speaker 8: NATO leaders who are in town actually say his name publicly. 365 00:18:43,760 --> 00:18:44,679 Speaker 8: They're just not going to do it. 366 00:18:44,720 --> 00:18:46,520 Speaker 3: Isn't that something We're gonna spend a little time later 367 00:18:46,560 --> 00:18:49,840 Speaker 3: this hour with the Foreign Minister of Latvia. What does 368 00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:52,480 Speaker 3: a successful summit look like to her? 369 00:18:53,320 --> 00:18:57,359 Speaker 8: Well, the Latvians like, like the Baltic countries, they want 370 00:18:57,600 --> 00:19:01,760 Speaker 8: Ukraine to get far more guarantee. They want a much 371 00:19:01,800 --> 00:19:05,159 Speaker 8: more robust path for Ukraine to get to NATO, and 372 00:19:05,200 --> 00:19:08,160 Speaker 8: they also want NATO to make very firm commitments about 373 00:19:08,160 --> 00:19:12,399 Speaker 8: protecting the eastern flank because Baltic countries fear that if 374 00:19:12,720 --> 00:19:15,800 Speaker 8: Vladimir Putin starts to look beyond Ukraine, the first place 375 00:19:15,840 --> 00:19:19,639 Speaker 8: he's going to look is to them. So what we 376 00:19:19,680 --> 00:19:22,320 Speaker 8: are hearing so far is that Baltic countries are not 377 00:19:22,560 --> 00:19:25,280 Speaker 8: especially with happy with the language that's coming out of 378 00:19:25,280 --> 00:19:28,560 Speaker 8: this when they feel that leaders have not budged sufficiently 379 00:19:28,600 --> 00:19:32,560 Speaker 8: to offer the guarantees that Ukraine wants. I mean, they 380 00:19:32,600 --> 00:19:36,000 Speaker 8: are certainly an outlier in the overall sentiment of what 381 00:19:36,119 --> 00:19:39,040 Speaker 8: NATO feels towards Ukraine, but they're not happy right now. 382 00:19:40,000 --> 00:19:43,080 Speaker 3: Even as Europe has stepped up contributions. 383 00:19:43,440 --> 00:19:46,280 Speaker 8: What will we hear on that from Well, I mean again, 384 00:19:46,320 --> 00:19:49,199 Speaker 8: what you're seeing is a lot of dispute between the 385 00:19:49,280 --> 00:19:51,520 Speaker 8: fact that there are some countries like the Baltics that 386 00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:55,760 Speaker 8: want more financial commitments. Obviously they don't have the kind 387 00:19:55,800 --> 00:19:57,760 Speaker 8: of money that the US and Germany and the UK 388 00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:01,960 Speaker 8: have against trees the big countries, the US, the UK, 389 00:20:02,080 --> 00:20:05,360 Speaker 8: Germany not wanting to commit long term. I mean, that's 390 00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:09,960 Speaker 8: what NATO really wants. The Yen Stoltenberg, the outgoing Secretary General, 391 00:20:10,160 --> 00:20:12,600 Speaker 8: he wants long term commitments from all these countries basically 392 00:20:12,680 --> 00:20:16,200 Speaker 8: to move well beyond Trump and offer those guarantees to Ukraine. 393 00:20:16,400 --> 00:20:19,159 Speaker 8: They do not want to offer that. So I expect 394 00:20:19,200 --> 00:20:23,520 Speaker 8: you'll see some financial commitments, but certainly not in the 395 00:20:23,600 --> 00:20:26,840 Speaker 8: tens or twenties of billions of dollars that Ukraine would want. 396 00:20:27,080 --> 00:20:30,320 Speaker 4: All right, Bloomberg's Nick Wadams, who leads our national security coverage, 397 00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:32,359 Speaker 4: thank you so much setting the stage for us great 398 00:20:32,359 --> 00:20:34,840 Speaker 4: primmer on this first day of the NATO summit here 399 00:20:34,880 --> 00:20:37,280 Speaker 4: in Washington, and as we spoke with Nick about it 400 00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:39,639 Speaker 4: comes at a time of great domestic question for the 401 00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:42,119 Speaker 4: United States and President Biden as he gets set to 402 00:20:42,200 --> 00:20:45,680 Speaker 4: speak at NATO later this afternoon, just about four hours 403 00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:47,840 Speaker 4: from now, is when he has expected as lawmakers on 404 00:20:47,880 --> 00:20:52,399 Speaker 4: the Hill debate whether he should be the Democratic nominee 405 00:20:52,480 --> 00:20:54,159 Speaker 4: as they return. We're joined now by one of them, 406 00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:56,600 Speaker 4: I'm pleased to say live from Capitol Hill, Congressman Brad 407 00:20:56,640 --> 00:20:59,960 Speaker 4: Sherman of California. The Democrat is with us now, Congressman, 408 00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:01,560 Speaker 4: and we do want to talk to you, as you 409 00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:04,040 Speaker 4: said on the Foreign Affairs Committee, about NATO and some 410 00:21:04,119 --> 00:21:06,040 Speaker 4: other matters as well. But of course there was a 411 00:21:06,080 --> 00:21:08,880 Speaker 4: caucus meeting with you and your colleagues this morning. Did 412 00:21:08,920 --> 00:21:12,360 Speaker 4: any consensus about the future of Biden as the nominee 413 00:21:12,359 --> 00:21:15,000 Speaker 4: emerge from that meeting or did it just create more confusion. 414 00:21:16,119 --> 00:21:20,200 Speaker 6: We at a consensus that Biden has been an outstanding president. 415 00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:24,560 Speaker 6: Biden had a bad night. Trump has led a bad life. 416 00:21:25,359 --> 00:21:29,959 Speaker 6: As to what we should do now, I won't say that. 417 00:21:30,040 --> 00:21:31,720 Speaker 6: You know, we're a Democratic party. We've got a lot 418 00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:36,760 Speaker 6: of different views. Some thought that no matter what, Biden 419 00:21:36,840 --> 00:21:40,520 Speaker 6: should be our nominee and it shouldn't be discussed. Others 420 00:21:40,520 --> 00:21:44,880 Speaker 6: thought we are at to urge Biden to drop out. 421 00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:48,359 Speaker 6: I took kind of a midpoint. I think that the 422 00:21:48,440 --> 00:21:52,680 Speaker 6: delegates will make the best possible decision if Biden provides 423 00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:56,520 Speaker 6: more tests and more information. We'll see that in the 424 00:21:56,560 --> 00:21:58,800 Speaker 6: press conference he's going to do in a couple of days. 425 00:21:59,320 --> 00:22:02,399 Speaker 6: I would like to see him for ninety minutes live 426 00:22:03,119 --> 00:22:07,119 Speaker 6: at nine PM in the next couple of weeks, because 427 00:22:07,280 --> 00:22:10,479 Speaker 6: on September tenth, he's got his second debate with Trump, 428 00:22:10,800 --> 00:22:14,800 Speaker 6: which will be ninety minutes live at nine PM, and 429 00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:18,000 Speaker 6: it's important that the delegates have a chance to see 430 00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:20,800 Speaker 6: him perform under a similar circumstance. 431 00:22:22,160 --> 00:22:26,360 Speaker 3: This isn't an endless conversation, obviously, Congressman, and I can 432 00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:28,760 Speaker 3: hear your support for Joe Biden here while I realize 433 00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:31,560 Speaker 3: you want to see more. How much time is there 434 00:22:31,560 --> 00:22:34,720 Speaker 3: for Democrats? Is it between now and the convention in Chicago? 435 00:22:34,840 --> 00:22:37,040 Speaker 3: Or are we looking at a couple of weeks here, 436 00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:40,040 Speaker 3: knowing that we've got issues potentially getting on ballots and 437 00:22:40,040 --> 00:22:41,879 Speaker 3: so forth. If it's not going to be Joe Biden 438 00:22:41,920 --> 00:22:43,120 Speaker 3: at the top of the ticket. 439 00:22:44,080 --> 00:22:45,880 Speaker 6: I think it's clear that we can get on all 440 00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:49,040 Speaker 6: the ballots if we act at the time of our convention. 441 00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:53,240 Speaker 6: Ohio was an outlier. They've changed their rules. So although 442 00:22:53,240 --> 00:22:57,040 Speaker 6: we were planning to meet Ohio's requirements by having a 443 00:22:57,160 --> 00:23:01,159 Speaker 6: virtual vote in early August, and now do this on 444 00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:02,600 Speaker 6: August twentieth, and. 445 00:23:03,400 --> 00:23:07,280 Speaker 3: That will work for all fifty states as a political convention, 446 00:23:07,400 --> 00:23:08,560 Speaker 3: is the deadline. 447 00:23:09,400 --> 00:23:12,400 Speaker 6: Yes, And yet I think we'll be making a decision, 448 00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:20,280 Speaker 6: a collective decision, long before then. And I think important 449 00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:24,720 Speaker 6: that we see before the convention that Biden can meet 450 00:23:24,800 --> 00:23:27,520 Speaker 6: that test of September tenth when he debates Trump a 451 00:23:27,560 --> 00:23:28,160 Speaker 6: second time. 452 00:23:29,520 --> 00:23:31,800 Speaker 4: What we have heard from the President congressman is a 453 00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:35,080 Speaker 4: suggestion or a pushback against polling that suggests he is 454 00:23:35,200 --> 00:23:38,320 Speaker 4: lagging behind Donald Trump in a meaningful way, or perhaps 455 00:23:38,320 --> 00:23:40,719 Speaker 4: that has widened since his debate performance at the end 456 00:23:41,240 --> 00:23:43,760 Speaker 4: of last month. Do you believe what you're seeing in 457 00:23:43,800 --> 00:23:44,240 Speaker 4: the polls? 458 00:23:46,160 --> 00:23:49,480 Speaker 6: Well, it takes a while for a major event to 459 00:23:49,560 --> 00:23:52,479 Speaker 6: really register with the public and really be reflected in 460 00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:54,240 Speaker 6: the polls, and so I think it's polls for a 461 00:23:54,240 --> 00:23:57,560 Speaker 6: few days from now that will reflect what happened on 462 00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:02,040 Speaker 6: June twenty seventh. But I don't think anybody would say 463 00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:09,840 Speaker 6: that the debate performance helped the Biden campaign and I 464 00:24:09,880 --> 00:24:14,159 Speaker 6: think a similar performance on September tenth would be a 465 00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:17,680 Speaker 6: big problem. And that's why I think we need our 466 00:24:17,720 --> 00:24:21,400 Speaker 6: presidential candidate, the leader of our party, to demonstrate, then 467 00:24:21,440 --> 00:24:24,600 Speaker 6: the words of Nancy Pelosi, that was an episode, not 468 00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:28,080 Speaker 6: a condition. I think he can meet that test. I'd 469 00:24:28,119 --> 00:24:30,359 Speaker 6: prefer the test to be as close as possible to 470 00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:34,920 Speaker 6: the one he'll face on September September tenth, but there'll 471 00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:37,359 Speaker 6: be a number of ways in which he demonstrates to 472 00:24:37,400 --> 00:24:40,840 Speaker 6: the delegates who are the ultimate decision makers here, that 473 00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:44,639 Speaker 6: he is fully up to the job not only of 474 00:24:44,680 --> 00:24:47,600 Speaker 6: beating Donald Trump, not only of beating him in the debate, 475 00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:51,000 Speaker 6: but also in governing this country until the end of 476 00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:52,240 Speaker 6: the second term. 477 00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:55,159 Speaker 3: Well as a Democrat who has not yet made up 478 00:24:55,200 --> 00:24:58,080 Speaker 3: his mind on this or found common ground with colleagues 479 00:24:58,119 --> 00:25:00,639 Speaker 3: in the House and from your perch on the Foreign 480 00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:04,720 Speaker 3: Affairs Committee, Congressman, what are you looking for when Joe 481 00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:07,760 Speaker 3: Biden speaks at the NATO summit today at five o'clock? 482 00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:10,320 Speaker 3: What do you want to hear? What spirit do you 483 00:25:10,359 --> 00:25:11,840 Speaker 3: expect him to bring to the podium. 484 00:25:13,640 --> 00:25:16,600 Speaker 6: I want him to deal with tough questions that he 485 00:25:16,680 --> 00:25:21,760 Speaker 6: may not have anticipated, and to acquit himself. Well, I 486 00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:24,760 Speaker 6: am very sure that his policies toward NATO will be 487 00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:28,120 Speaker 6: reasonable and ones that I would generally support. So I'm 488 00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:32,040 Speaker 6: not looking at that press conference in terms of does 489 00:25:32,040 --> 00:25:34,399 Speaker 6: he have the right views about our foreign policy. I'm 490 00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:37,680 Speaker 6: looking at that press conference to see whether he can 491 00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:43,320 Speaker 6: convince the country that one debate was just an episode. 492 00:25:45,440 --> 00:25:48,800 Speaker 4: Okay. So if you're not looking for policy, Congressman, others 493 00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:51,480 Speaker 4: might be is there a tangible outcome you would like 494 00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:54,080 Speaker 4: to see from the NATO summit this week as it 495 00:25:54,119 --> 00:25:55,879 Speaker 4: pertains to Ukraine or anything else. 496 00:25:57,440 --> 00:26:01,840 Speaker 6: Well, I think we need European trees and Canada to 497 00:26:01,920 --> 00:26:06,920 Speaker 6: step forward and meet that two percent commitment. The majority 498 00:26:06,920 --> 00:26:09,080 Speaker 6: of NATO countries have done that, but most of that 499 00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:13,080 Speaker 6: majority are the smaller countries with the smaller gross national products. 500 00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:16,399 Speaker 6: We need to see Germany and France step forward, when 501 00:26:16,400 --> 00:26:19,960 Speaker 6: need to see Canada step forward and spend more on 502 00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:23,800 Speaker 6: their own defense. They used to think that they're on 503 00:26:23,840 --> 00:26:26,760 Speaker 6: a totally safe continent. That is clearly not the case. 504 00:26:29,240 --> 00:26:33,560 Speaker 3: You make of all this talk of Trump proofing NATO, Congressman, 505 00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:37,199 Speaker 3: and the idea of European nations looking to stand up 506 00:26:37,240 --> 00:26:40,680 Speaker 3: their own armies possibly an EU army in a world 507 00:26:40,760 --> 00:26:44,440 Speaker 3: in which the United States is no longer leading as 508 00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:48,560 Speaker 3: the tip of the spear in this alliance. Is that 509 00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:50,120 Speaker 3: a conversation that you're allowing. 510 00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:55,960 Speaker 6: I think that if they spend the money and particularly 511 00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:59,359 Speaker 6: on equipment and develop their own military forces, that the 512 00:26:59,440 --> 00:27:04,800 Speaker 6: NATO can and structure will work well. I think that 513 00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:09,600 Speaker 6: if there are so many reasons for Europe to be 514 00:27:09,680 --> 00:27:12,679 Speaker 6: able to do more, maybe one of those reasons is 515 00:27:13,359 --> 00:27:16,040 Speaker 6: that under a Trump administration, America would do less. 516 00:27:18,119 --> 00:27:19,879 Speaker 4: It's great to have you, Congressman, weigh in on that, 517 00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:21,879 Speaker 4: given your seat on the Foreign Affairs Committee, just in 518 00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:24,000 Speaker 4: our final moment with you knowing you also sit on 519 00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:27,000 Speaker 4: House Financial Services. What's your top question for FED Shair 520 00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:29,120 Speaker 4: Jerome Powell when he testifies before you tomorrow. 521 00:27:30,280 --> 00:27:33,720 Speaker 6: Well, the big issue here was his testimony today that 522 00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:37,679 Speaker 6: they're going to completely revise and republish the apposal three 523 00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:42,199 Speaker 6: banking regulations. Too many of our regulations push the banks 524 00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:44,560 Speaker 6: to put their money on Wall Street and not to 525 00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:48,840 Speaker 6: make those small loans to businesses on Main Street. And 526 00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:54,200 Speaker 6: we need bank regulations that don't unfairly discriminate in favor 527 00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:59,120 Speaker 6: of a buying billion dollars bond portfolios and instead push 528 00:27:59,160 --> 00:28:01,840 Speaker 6: the banks to their true role of making loans in 529 00:28:01,880 --> 00:28:02,560 Speaker 6: local cities. 530 00:28:04,200 --> 00:28:06,640 Speaker 3: Great to have you back, Congressman. We'll be watching and listening. 531 00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:10,240 Speaker 3: That hearing starts ten am tomorrow. As j Powell moves 532 00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:13,000 Speaker 3: to the house side Brad Sherman of California with the 533 00:28:13,119 --> 00:28:16,760 Speaker 3: view from a Democrat in the middle of this conversation today, Kaylee, 534 00:28:16,840 --> 00:28:19,040 Speaker 3: pretty interesting. That was a private meeting that we were 535 00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:21,000 Speaker 3: talking to him about. No cameras or microphones. 536 00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:23,399 Speaker 4: Yeah, just a lot of questions for reporters who are 537 00:28:23,400 --> 00:28:26,119 Speaker 4: out there sweating in the heat. As lawmakers emerged, and 538 00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:28,840 Speaker 4: as the Congressman suggested, doesn't seem like they emerged with 539 00:28:28,920 --> 00:28:32,760 Speaker 4: one idea of whether or not Joe Biden should continue. 540 00:28:32,920 --> 00:28:38,960 Speaker 2: We got a TBD on that one. You're listening to 541 00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:42,880 Speaker 2: the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch us live weekdays 542 00:28:42,880 --> 00:28:45,560 Speaker 2: at noon Eastern on AMO CarPlay and Thenroud Auto with 543 00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:48,760 Speaker 2: the Bloomberg Business app. Listen on demand wherever you get 544 00:28:48,800 --> 00:28:53,800 Speaker 2: your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube. 545 00:28:54,040 --> 00:28:56,520 Speaker 4: We have a few top stories, and to some extent 546 00:28:56,600 --> 00:28:59,320 Speaker 4: they are related, as one pertains to the future of 547 00:28:59,360 --> 00:29:02,160 Speaker 4: President Joe Biden. As the Democratic nominee in this twenty 548 00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:04,720 Speaker 4: twenty four election cycle. The other pertains to something else 549 00:29:04,800 --> 00:29:07,200 Speaker 4: on his plate this week, which is the NITO summit 550 00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:09,600 Speaker 4: that is being held here in Washington. He will be 551 00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:12,479 Speaker 4: speaking at that summit less than four hours from now. 552 00:29:12,560 --> 00:29:14,920 Speaker 3: Joe, Yeah, we'll bring you some of his remarks to 553 00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:16,880 Speaker 3: get a sense of how it's going. I don't know 554 00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:18,800 Speaker 3: he's going to make a lot of news today, Kaylee. 555 00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:21,640 Speaker 3: This is kind of the opener, but every time Joe 556 00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:24,320 Speaker 3: Biden is in front of a camera, it's a moment here. 557 00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:27,080 Speaker 3: That's just kind of the world that we're in. Just 558 00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:30,400 Speaker 3: hours after House Democrats met on this matter, you were 559 00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:32,800 Speaker 3: hearing us discuss it earlier. There doesn't appear to be 560 00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:37,160 Speaker 3: following our conversation with Congressman Sherman, any consensus moving forward. 561 00:29:37,360 --> 00:29:39,640 Speaker 3: Everyone's in a wait and see mode, and I suspect 562 00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:42,960 Speaker 3: that goes for our panel as well. Adam Hodge is 563 00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:46,960 Speaker 3: with us today, Democratic strategist, managing director the Bully Pulpit 564 00:29:47,040 --> 00:29:50,160 Speaker 3: International and a veteran of the National Security Council and 565 00:29:50,160 --> 00:29:53,360 Speaker 3: the Biden administration, joined by Lester Munson, of course, Republican 566 00:29:53,480 --> 00:29:56,520 Speaker 3: strategist back with us from BGR Group It's great to 567 00:29:56,520 --> 00:29:58,440 Speaker 3: have both of you with us here. 568 00:29:58,840 --> 00:29:59,160 Speaker 6: Adam. 569 00:29:59,200 --> 00:30:01,760 Speaker 3: This is another test today as we've been seeing for 570 00:30:01,880 --> 00:30:04,480 Speaker 3: Joe Biden. But coming off of that conversation we just 571 00:30:04,520 --> 00:30:07,480 Speaker 3: had with Congressman Sherman, is this good news or bad 572 00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:11,000 Speaker 3: news when you hear a California Democrat saying I support 573 00:30:11,080 --> 00:30:14,080 Speaker 3: Joe Biden, but we haven't found consensus yet. 574 00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:17,080 Speaker 9: I think there's no question that the President has had 575 00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:19,520 Speaker 9: a good twenty four hours. And if you look at 576 00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:22,600 Speaker 9: where the conversation was leading into this weekend, I don't 577 00:30:22,600 --> 00:30:24,440 Speaker 9: think what you heard from Brad Sherman there was what 578 00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:25,960 Speaker 9: you would have heard of if we didn't have the 579 00:30:26,040 --> 00:30:29,280 Speaker 9: last twenty four hours from the Biden campaign. The president 580 00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:32,280 Speaker 9: has been forcefull. He's been clear about what his vision 581 00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:34,760 Speaker 9: and what his record is. He has to maintain that 582 00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:37,720 Speaker 9: for the next one hundred and nineteen days to prove 583 00:30:37,760 --> 00:30:40,520 Speaker 9: to the voters why he should be the Democratic nominee. 584 00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:43,280 Speaker 9: Only he can do that, and that's the task at 585 00:30:43,280 --> 00:30:47,520 Speaker 9: hand for this week, certainly with NATO, but also leading 586 00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:50,080 Speaker 9: into the Democratic invention and then at the debate in 587 00:30:50,120 --> 00:30:51,560 Speaker 9: September through election Day. 588 00:30:51,920 --> 00:30:54,680 Speaker 4: Well Lester, considering the concerns about the president's age and 589 00:30:54,680 --> 00:30:57,480 Speaker 4: mental acuity seem to be so pervasive at this point. 590 00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:00,360 Speaker 4: How far could one speech this evening, you know, or 591 00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:03,720 Speaker 4: one press conference later on this week that we're expecting Thursday, 592 00:31:03,880 --> 00:31:07,840 Speaker 4: go to to erasing some of those concern or is 593 00:31:07,840 --> 00:31:09,920 Speaker 4: it going to take more than just a few good 594 00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:11,640 Speaker 4: moments to erase the bad ones? 595 00:31:13,080 --> 00:31:14,640 Speaker 7: I think it's gonna it's gonna take more than a 596 00:31:14,640 --> 00:31:17,880 Speaker 7: few Kyley. The speech today, I don't think is going 597 00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:22,920 Speaker 7: to push things one where or another absence some dramatic event, 598 00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:26,520 Speaker 7: because he'll be likely reading off a teleprompter and he 599 00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:29,720 Speaker 7: can do okay in that kind of situation. The press 600 00:31:29,760 --> 00:31:32,280 Speaker 7: conference later this week is a little more interesting. Is 601 00:31:32,320 --> 00:31:35,000 Speaker 7: he going to get some unexpected questions? 602 00:31:35,440 --> 00:31:35,640 Speaker 6: You know? 603 00:31:35,720 --> 00:31:38,640 Speaker 7: The White House has been the staff have been hit 604 00:31:38,800 --> 00:31:41,280 Speaker 7: for trying to manage these things a little too closely. 605 00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:44,840 Speaker 7: Can they have a free wheeling event, and can the 606 00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:48,480 Speaker 7: President be in the moment and be fully responsive and 607 00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:51,480 Speaker 7: give clear and complete answers. That would be a nice 608 00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:54,440 Speaker 7: step forward for him, but he's gonna again he's going 609 00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:57,959 Speaker 7: to have to do that consistently for the next four months. 610 00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:03,080 Speaker 3: A lot of quis about the President's relationship with his 611 00:32:03,120 --> 00:32:07,720 Speaker 3: doctor and whether he was seeking some sort of therapy 612 00:32:07,760 --> 00:32:11,160 Speaker 3: for something more than just getting old. Parkinson's came up 613 00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:14,040 Speaker 3: a number of times in the White House Press briefing yesterday, 614 00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:15,959 Speaker 3: and his doctor had to issue a letter last night 615 00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:18,760 Speaker 3: two pages long to clarify. I want to bring it 616 00:32:18,800 --> 00:32:21,280 Speaker 3: back to the White House briefing room yesterday Karine Jean Pierre, 617 00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:24,200 Speaker 3: the Press Secretary, and a back and forth with reporters on. 618 00:32:24,160 --> 00:32:29,360 Speaker 7: This was this experts visits whereas multiplejits the president. 619 00:32:29,400 --> 00:32:33,160 Speaker 1: Well, here's the thing I've said, he's he has had 620 00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:37,120 Speaker 1: three he has had three three physicals. 621 00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:38,560 Speaker 6: In those three. 622 00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:42,840 Speaker 1: Physicals, that's when he has seen a specialist, neurological specialists. 623 00:32:42,920 --> 00:32:46,000 Speaker 1: I cannot speak to every person because there are actually 624 00:32:46,040 --> 00:32:49,800 Speaker 1: there's actually a security reasons to protect their privacy. We 625 00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:53,360 Speaker 1: respect and protecting people's privacy, so do not want to share. 626 00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:55,840 Speaker 1: I'm not going to share people's names from here. 627 00:32:56,160 --> 00:32:58,320 Speaker 2: Very bait. 628 00:32:58,360 --> 00:33:01,400 Speaker 1: Wait wait, wait, way, wait a. 629 00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:04,360 Speaker 2: Second, wait times, or at least once in. 630 00:33:04,280 --> 00:33:07,320 Speaker 6: Regard to hold on a second. 631 00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:08,960 Speaker 8: You should be able to answer by this point. 632 00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:12,480 Speaker 1: Wait no, no, no, no, no, no wait a minute, Ed, 633 00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:15,320 Speaker 1: please a little respect here. 634 00:33:17,240 --> 00:33:20,760 Speaker 3: That's Ed O'Keeffe, our colleague, at CBS News from the 635 00:33:20,800 --> 00:33:23,200 Speaker 3: briefing room yesterday. So we go to a two page 636 00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:26,720 Speaker 3: letter from the doctor Kevin O'Connor who visited the White House. 637 00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:30,440 Speaker 3: He said, Kevin Kinnard visited the White House several times 638 00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:32,800 Speaker 3: over the last year. This is the neurology consultant to 639 00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:36,520 Speaker 3: the White House Medical Office, and he apparently holds neurology 640 00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:39,600 Speaker 3: clinics at the White House for active duty military members. 641 00:33:40,520 --> 00:33:42,520 Speaker 3: This is difficult for people to start getting through their 642 00:33:42,560 --> 00:33:44,760 Speaker 3: heads here exactly who's coming, who's going? Did he see 643 00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:47,640 Speaker 3: a neurologist? Does he have Parkinson's? You know, there's something 644 00:33:47,640 --> 00:33:49,520 Speaker 3: about if you're explaining or losing? I think is the 645 00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:52,040 Speaker 3: line is the White House Communications Office, the press office 646 00:33:52,120 --> 00:33:53,200 Speaker 3: up to this look. 647 00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:55,880 Speaker 9: I think what you heard from the White House last 648 00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:58,840 Speaker 9: night is that the President has seen a neurologist and 649 00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:03,160 Speaker 9: the words of very, very care a neurologist each physical 650 00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:06,280 Speaker 9: I having been in the White House Medical Unit, yes, 651 00:34:06,320 --> 00:34:08,919 Speaker 9: having seen people who've come and gone out of that room. 652 00:34:09,200 --> 00:34:11,560 Speaker 9: There are a lot of experts and who treat a 653 00:34:11,640 --> 00:34:14,960 Speaker 9: lot of active duty and reservists who work at the 654 00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:17,600 Speaker 9: White House. There's an act. I mean, he is the 655 00:34:17,640 --> 00:34:20,759 Speaker 9: commander in chief. Let's not forget that. Sure, he has 656 00:34:20,880 --> 00:34:23,480 Speaker 9: military aids who are with him all the time, and 657 00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:26,439 Speaker 9: they also get care through the White House Medical Unit. 658 00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:29,719 Speaker 9: The doctor was very clear like that. They said he 659 00:34:29,880 --> 00:34:33,920 Speaker 9: saw the neurologist one time for each of the physicals 660 00:34:33,960 --> 00:34:36,919 Speaker 9: that he's had over the last few years, and each 661 00:34:36,960 --> 00:34:40,080 Speaker 9: of those visits they determined and did an assessment, and 662 00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:43,640 Speaker 9: they determined he did not have Parkinson's. That's what a 663 00:34:43,680 --> 00:34:47,600 Speaker 9: doctor I mean, he's a doctor. He has the medical 664 00:34:47,840 --> 00:34:51,600 Speaker 9: oath that he has to follow, and he has made 665 00:34:51,680 --> 00:34:54,880 Speaker 9: clear that that's not the president's diagnosis. And so I 666 00:34:54,920 --> 00:34:57,400 Speaker 9: think what you saw yesterday was the White House not 667 00:34:57,480 --> 00:34:59,799 Speaker 9: quite able to speak to the full breath of what 668 00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:04,399 Speaker 9: the doctor canard, I think his name, what his full 669 00:35:04,440 --> 00:35:07,160 Speaker 9: scope of work is there. They then got that clarity 670 00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:10,200 Speaker 9: and informed the public that's what you saw last night. 671 00:35:10,480 --> 00:35:12,879 Speaker 4: Well, I guess it becomes a question of knowing the 672 00:35:12,920 --> 00:35:16,239 Speaker 4: intensity around of the scrutiny into Joe Biden and his 673 00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:18,480 Speaker 4: mental and physical health right now. Is it not a 674 00:35:18,480 --> 00:35:20,719 Speaker 4: moment in which the White House or the campaign needs 675 00:35:20,760 --> 00:35:23,319 Speaker 4: to be embracing a kind of radical transparency. There's been 676 00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:25,680 Speaker 4: a lot of talk about taking a cognitive test for 677 00:35:25,719 --> 00:35:28,960 Speaker 4: both Joe Biden and Donald Trump. Would it not behove 678 00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:31,960 Speaker 4: President Biden, as a candidate who wants to be elected 679 00:35:31,960 --> 00:35:34,360 Speaker 4: for another four years, go deeper into his eighties in 680 00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:36,560 Speaker 4: the meantime to just say, all right, fine, I will 681 00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:38,000 Speaker 4: do it. I will put the questions to bed. 682 00:35:38,280 --> 00:35:41,759 Speaker 9: My understanding is that the neurological exam that as part 683 00:35:41,760 --> 00:35:44,040 Speaker 9: of his physical is more robust than the cognitive test. 684 00:35:44,280 --> 00:35:47,000 Speaker 9: So I take that as I'm not a doctor. Sure 685 00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:49,759 Speaker 9: neither the three of us are doctors, but I'll take 686 00:35:49,800 --> 00:35:52,719 Speaker 9: that from what I read and what I heard, I 687 00:35:52,760 --> 00:35:55,359 Speaker 9: think what is clear that the President should do over 688 00:35:55,360 --> 00:35:57,640 Speaker 9: the next one hundred and nineteen days is everything they 689 00:35:57,680 --> 00:36:01,680 Speaker 9: can to dispel this idea that the president is unfit 690 00:36:01,880 --> 00:36:04,799 Speaker 9: to serve another four years. And so, like Congressman Sherman said, 691 00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:07,000 Speaker 9: it's a good idea. The White House can have him 692 00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:10,560 Speaker 9: do more press conferences in primetime. Also will help prep 693 00:36:10,600 --> 00:36:14,279 Speaker 9: for the debate in September, have a great speech at 694 00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:17,200 Speaker 9: the convention, do all those steps to show the American 695 00:36:17,200 --> 00:36:20,120 Speaker 9: public that what you saw from Joe Biden over the 696 00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:23,480 Speaker 9: last twenty four hours is what you can expect throughout 697 00:36:23,480 --> 00:36:25,560 Speaker 9: the rest of the campaign and in the next four years, 698 00:36:25,560 --> 00:36:26,160 Speaker 9: that's his job. 699 00:36:26,840 --> 00:36:27,360 Speaker 2: Let's right on. 700 00:36:27,400 --> 00:36:29,000 Speaker 3: If you read the New York Times this morning. I 701 00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:30,520 Speaker 3: don't know if you go near the New York Times, 702 00:36:30,520 --> 00:36:33,600 Speaker 3: but James Carvell's writing an op ed today, and man, 703 00:36:33,680 --> 00:36:37,359 Speaker 3: it's a doozy. He says that Joe Biden is not 704 00:36:37,440 --> 00:36:41,040 Speaker 3: going to be the nominee. Mark my words. The top line. 705 00:36:41,080 --> 00:36:43,320 Speaker 3: Biden is not going to be the nominee. Will be 706 00:36:43,360 --> 00:36:45,560 Speaker 3: out of the twenty twenty four presidential race, whether he 707 00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:49,560 Speaker 3: is ready to admit it or not. And he's proposing 708 00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:52,040 Speaker 3: a new approach here, forget all those people in the 709 00:36:52,040 --> 00:36:56,160 Speaker 3: White House. Carvel calling for a super democratic process, as 710 00:36:56,160 --> 00:36:59,720 Speaker 3: he names this, to choose the nominee, starting with four 711 00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:05,160 Speaker 3: regional town halls moderated by former Presidents Obama and Clinton. 712 00:37:05,920 --> 00:37:09,600 Speaker 3: I don't know what James Carvill had with dinner last night, Lester, 713 00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:12,520 Speaker 3: but what would happen if that took place? 714 00:37:14,600 --> 00:37:19,879 Speaker 7: Well, boy, talk about the clash of egos. This it's 715 00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:24,080 Speaker 7: pretty spectactically, Omar. I did see that piece. I do 716 00:37:24,200 --> 00:37:26,719 Speaker 7: like the New York Times most of the time. I 717 00:37:26,719 --> 00:37:32,680 Speaker 7: think I think Carville is probably correct. This Again, common 718 00:37:32,680 --> 00:37:35,400 Speaker 7: sense tells us this the condition of the President is 719 00:37:35,400 --> 00:37:38,560 Speaker 7: only going in one direction, and he can you know, 720 00:37:38,600 --> 00:37:41,359 Speaker 7: as much as the White House staff, God bless them, 721 00:37:41,360 --> 00:37:44,840 Speaker 7: they're doing their jobs, are trying to offer some spin 722 00:37:45,080 --> 00:37:50,880 Speaker 7: and some cover and explanations. People see what is happening. 723 00:37:51,320 --> 00:37:55,439 Speaker 7: They saw it very clearly during the debate. The president, really, 724 00:37:55,480 --> 00:37:57,839 Speaker 7: he's going to have to be flawless going forward here. 725 00:37:57,840 --> 00:37:59,720 Speaker 7: If he's gonna if he's gonna stay in this position 726 00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:03,799 Speaker 7: and at all competitive with Donald Trump in November, that's 727 00:38:03,840 --> 00:38:06,319 Speaker 7: the real issue. And I think James Carville, I'm old 728 00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:11,000 Speaker 7: enough to remember when he was only middle age and 729 00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:16,600 Speaker 7: a pretty good campaign consultant for Bill Clinton. He really 730 00:38:16,600 --> 00:38:19,319 Speaker 7: cares about the Democratic Party and about defeating Donald Trump, 731 00:38:19,360 --> 00:38:21,600 Speaker 7: and that's where this is coming from, and so I 732 00:38:21,640 --> 00:38:25,759 Speaker 7: think we should The mechanics may not be perfect for 733 00:38:25,840 --> 00:38:29,000 Speaker 7: what he's describing, but the sentiment I think is spot on. 734 00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:31,239 Speaker 4: Adam, you want to quickly weigh in on this with 735 00:38:31,320 --> 00:38:33,360 Speaker 4: about about thirty secon super Democratic press. 736 00:38:33,640 --> 00:38:36,360 Speaker 9: I mean, I think the chances of Barack Obama stepping 737 00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:38,719 Speaker 9: into an event like that are virtually zero. I think 738 00:38:38,719 --> 00:38:41,239 Speaker 9: he has shown he has no interest in stepping into that. 739 00:38:41,920 --> 00:38:45,080 Speaker 9: I think Lester Raises a good point about where the 740 00:38:45,080 --> 00:38:48,719 Speaker 9: Democratic Party is. We've got to figure out and Joe 741 00:38:48,719 --> 00:38:50,600 Speaker 9: Biden has to make the case of why he should 742 00:38:50,640 --> 00:38:53,200 Speaker 9: be the Democratic nominee. If he does that, he decides 743 00:38:53,200 --> 00:38:55,920 Speaker 9: he's the nominee, then Democrats have to unite behind. 744 00:38:55,719 --> 00:38:59,440 Speaker 4: Him, all right. Adam Hodge, Democratic strategist and managing director 745 00:38:59,640 --> 00:39:02,359 Speaker 4: ATLIT International, thank you so much for joining us today 746 00:39:02,360 --> 00:39:05,319 Speaker 4: alongside Republican strategist Leinster Munson, who is the co head 747 00:39:05,360 --> 00:39:08,319 Speaker 4: of the international practice at the BGR Group. While we've 748 00:39:08,320 --> 00:39:11,080 Speaker 4: been talking about the Democratic nominee and where the delegates 749 00:39:11,160 --> 00:39:13,640 Speaker 4: ultimately are going to go political reporting, now Joe Nicki 750 00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:16,680 Speaker 4: Haley releasing her ninety seven delegates and telling them to 751 00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:19,040 Speaker 4: vote for Donald Trump, just like at the convention. 752 00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:21,360 Speaker 3: So much for a contested convention in Milwaukee. 753 00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:21,880 Speaker 6: We'll find out. 754 00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:22,840 Speaker 2: I'm but of Chakaka. 755 00:39:26,280 --> 00:39:29,480 Speaker 3: Thanks for listening to the Balance of Power podcast. Make 756 00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:32,480 Speaker 3: sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, 757 00:39:32,560 --> 00:39:35,160 Speaker 3: or wherever you get your podcasts, and you can find 758 00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:38,440 Speaker 3: us live every weekday from Washington, DC at noontime Eastern 759 00:39:38,760 --> 00:39:40,160 Speaker 3: at Bloomberg dot com.