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Speaker 1: So when we would talk to folks out would ask us, so,

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Speaker 1: what's your next move? What's your next plan? You not

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Speaker 1: understanding it's a business And the moment that the numbers

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Speaker 1: go down, the metrics go down, Uh, they'll remind you

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Speaker 1: that it's a business, business a business.

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Speaker 2: What if I told you there was more to the

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Speaker 2: story behind game changing events? Get ready for my new podcast,

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Speaker 2: That Moment with Damon John will jump into the personal

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Speaker 2: stories of some of the most influential people on the planet,

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Speaker 2: from business mobiles and celebrities to athletes and artists. So

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Speaker 2: I'm sitting here today with a very special friend and

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Speaker 2: buddy that I respect, Sway Callaway and you whether thank you, Damion,

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Speaker 2: thank you brother for being here. Of course, Sway, as

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Speaker 2: you may or may not know, is amazing broadcaster and

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Speaker 2: you may have seen him everything from MTV to I

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Speaker 2: heard him of course on Cyrus Exam and things of

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Speaker 2: that nature. But my team and I only had a

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Speaker 2: good idea. Why don't I actually interview Sway? Ah No,

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Speaker 2: who told you that was a good idea though? Uh?

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Speaker 2: One of the millennials, one of the millennials around myself

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Speaker 2: with a bunch of Malmi mods, Okay, have you been

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Speaker 2: interview before. I'm sure.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I've been asked a lot of questions before, but

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Speaker 1: not I've been an interview. But you know, it's it's

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Speaker 1: will you. Will you do this for a living? Is

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Speaker 1: kind of control the narrative, right, you know, when someone

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Speaker 1: is interviewing you. So I very seldom let my hair down,

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Speaker 1: so to speak, you know, in the interview, as I

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Speaker 1: would with you if you asked me a.

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Speaker 2: Question, I definitely I definitely appreciate that. Yeah, so good.

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Speaker 2: So I'm gonna ask you a couple of questions that

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Speaker 2: I think that maybe I've been curious about. So a

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Speaker 2: lot of people may or may not know your history.

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Speaker 2: Can you tell me just a little bit about where

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Speaker 2: you started and you know, before becoming a that's a broadcast.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't speak a lot about the history. In

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Speaker 1: high school, I met my partner, DJ King Tech who

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Speaker 1: and he and I both were just fans of music.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 1: I grew up playing instruments. I played the saxophone and

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Speaker 1: played the clarinet. I played the bass clarinet. He just

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Speaker 1: grew up a music lover and got into deep boy

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Speaker 1: coaching and used to break dance in the Oakland Bay area.

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Speaker 1: I'm from Oakland. He was from Hayward. We had a

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Speaker 1: mutual friend who introduced us. Friend I grew up running

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Speaker 1: track with and he grew up dancing with. And that

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Speaker 1: friend took a different path after he introduced us. He

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Speaker 1: went more of a street path, you know, he went

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Speaker 1: into the streets basically, you know, which left two strangers

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Speaker 1: who had a single idea of becoming a rap group.

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Speaker 1: And like anyone else who was in high school, you know,

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Speaker 1: LLL was somebody we idolized, and you know, you know,

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Speaker 1: hum D and all these guys. But we were from

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Speaker 1: the Bay and we started making music. The way we

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Speaker 1: did it is we saved up money and bought equipment.

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Speaker 1: M One of the first keyboards we bought was from

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Speaker 1: shock G from Digital Underground. One of the first drum

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Speaker 1: sequences we bought Digital Underground had money be Tupac shakor

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Speaker 1: for fear DJ fusing it. And we start making this music.

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Speaker 1: I didn't sound like a guy from Oakland, you know,

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Speaker 1: at that time you had towo shortened others coming from Oakland.

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Speaker 1: I was more of a guy who was trying to

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Speaker 1: flip syllables, you know, Big Daddy Kane with somebody I

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Speaker 1: liked m And so it took us a long time

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Speaker 1: to really kind of find a home at home. And

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Speaker 1: we had a lot of doors slammed in our faces.

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Speaker 1: We were shopping record deals and and when we came

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Speaker 1: to New York where the most of the business was

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Speaker 1: we I was from Oakland. I didn't sound like a

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Speaker 1: New York MC and we were told you'll never make it, alright,

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Speaker 1: You'll never make it, you know. And so we came

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Speaker 1: home and tried to figure out how can we get

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Speaker 1: our music out if nobody's gonna give us a chance.

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Speaker 1: And San Francisco State, you know, when we were in

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Speaker 1: the high school, off of these extra extended curriculum courses

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Speaker 1: on the law aspects of the music business. And it

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Speaker 1: was taught by a guy by the name of Ralph

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Speaker 1: Tajan who was an attorney, active attorney in the music business.

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Speaker 1: And all you had to do was pay a little

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Speaker 1: bit of money you could take these courses. So I

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Speaker 1: didn't know where it would lead me, but I went

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Speaker 1: and took this course, and in the process, this attorney

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Speaker 1: started breaking down, well, this is how distribution works, all right,

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Speaker 1: this is how marketing works. This is our promo system.

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Speaker 1: He broke down the system and he created He showed

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Speaker 1: us the infrastructure on how record labels do their business.

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Speaker 1: And my partner Tech and I were like, man, well,

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Speaker 1: look if we can't get anybody else to do it

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Speaker 1: for us. He was working at Domino's. I was working

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Speaker 1: at place called quick Ways, a burger joint exclusive to Oakland,

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Speaker 1: Let's save up our money and do it ourselves. And

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Speaker 1: we saved up money, and we worked out of this studio,

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Speaker 1: sixteen track studio and called Artevire's.

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Speaker 2: This guy name and and he Earnst.

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Speaker 1: He was the engineer, and he ended up allowing us

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Speaker 1: to come to utilize the studio. We didn't have enough

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Speaker 1: money to pay them, so we worked in this studio

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Speaker 1: and with the time he compensated us with time instead

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Speaker 1: of in money. And and from there we were able

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Speaker 1: to make our first demo tape and then create our

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Speaker 1: first laquer that we were able to burn vinyl with.

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Speaker 1: With this company called Rainbow Records, which is independent, we

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Speaker 1: made cassette tapes. We made a minimum amount of cassette tapes,

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Speaker 1: we made a minimum amount of vinyl, and we wanted CDs.

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Speaker 1: Was still kind of like a bath technology back there,

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Speaker 1: you know. So we were put those things out to

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Speaker 1: see what would happen if people would respond. What year

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Speaker 1: was that, This was eighty nine, eight nine, about eighty eight, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and we put it out to see how people will react.

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Speaker 1: And immediately we start doing these things. Well I didn't

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Speaker 1: know what a assignment deal was, you know. And we

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Speaker 1: would go to these stores and say, yeah, man, just

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Speaker 1: leave it here, come back in thirty days, and we'll

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Speaker 1: pay you what we sold.

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Speaker 2: Really that's how it works. So we'll leave.

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Speaker 1: Fifty cassettes there in thirty days, you know, thirty of

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Speaker 1: them will sell, and they would pay us partial payments.

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Speaker 1: It's like, well, but you're not going to pay for

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Speaker 1: the whole thirty Well if you if you reshow for

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Speaker 1: us with more product, then we'll pay you for the

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Speaker 1: first back.

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Speaker 2: And then and there I started learning about the inner

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Speaker 2: workings of the music business. Really.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, if you keep feeding the system, the system will

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Speaker 1: keep feeding you.

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Speaker 2: Right, okay.

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Speaker 1: And so we went back and pressed up a bunch

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Speaker 1: of the same product, but we pressed up a lot more,

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Speaker 1: but it didn't sell like the little bit did you know.

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Speaker 1: So it was like one inventory in the market had

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Speaker 1: more inventory in the market, but it was and moving

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Speaker 1: and we were like, how do we get.

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Speaker 2: It to move?

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Speaker 1: And we'll go back to the retailers and they'll say, well,

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Speaker 1: you didn't sell as much.

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Speaker 2: Do you have anything new you?

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Speaker 1: All right, man, we got another group we could, you know,

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Speaker 1: bring you that. And so we just got into this

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Speaker 1: circle of finance, you know, meet demand, product, you know,

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Speaker 1: product finance, this whole circle.

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Speaker 2: And but there was a learning process that we took

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Speaker 2: from it. Uh.

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Speaker 1: We eventually, because of that move we made started creating

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Speaker 1: a buzz in northern California. The same person who taught

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Speaker 1: that class at San Francisco State. We went back to

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Speaker 1: his named Ralph Tajohn. He's in the book The Hit Men,

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Speaker 1: an industry music industry book that because a it's a

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Speaker 1: it's a legendary.

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Speaker 2: That's a legendary. And somebody's in music, they don't know

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Speaker 2: that book. They got a bigger problem. They should know

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Speaker 2: that book. Right.

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Speaker 1: Ralph is one of the key characters in that book,

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Speaker 1: and he took it to he took our product with

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Speaker 1: the track record or a proof of concept if you will,

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Speaker 1: all right, you know, to a guy by the name

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Speaker 1: of Irving Azoff who had just kicked off this new

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Speaker 1: label called Giant Warner Brothers and Irving as Off. I

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Speaker 1: don't know if he knew the music or cared about

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Speaker 1: the music, but they saw the numbers, you know, what

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Speaker 1: we were doing independently in the bay. He was like, wow, well,

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Speaker 1: these guys are doing this on their own, what will

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Speaker 1: they do with us. Different experience though, when we signed

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Speaker 1: with the major label, because there was so many moving

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Speaker 1: variables that we didn't know about, and budgets were being

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Speaker 1: thrown around the place and we had no control over

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Speaker 1: the budgets, and people were hired on our budget that

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Speaker 1: we never even heard of and paid on our budget

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Speaker 1: that we had we would have to pay back in

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Speaker 1: our recruitment. But taught us another level about the business. Well,

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Speaker 1: well let me let me let me ask you something.

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Speaker 2: You know, many people would have said, man, I don't

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Speaker 2: have any money gets studio equipment. So you did that.

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Speaker 2: Then you go to New York and everybody tells, you know,

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Speaker 2: it can't happen, and they would say, well, listen, we

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Speaker 2: just went to the home of hip hop, right and

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Speaker 2: all right, I guess we're done. All right. Then somebody

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Speaker 2: would said, well, you know, we want to do our

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Speaker 2: own stuff, but we don't have enough hours to you know,

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Speaker 2: money to buy hours in the studio. So you go

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Speaker 2: and leverage your time and you find that and then

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Speaker 2: somebody would say, well the store is not going to

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Speaker 2: buy it from us, Well who are what'll stuck? So

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Speaker 2: what was in for the studio owner was? I guess

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Speaker 2: he gets some really uh inexpensive labor because I'm sure, yeah,

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Speaker 2: you got you got, you got all hours putting in.

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Speaker 2: You know, we're not quantifiable in a sense. The store

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Speaker 2: owner is, I have to pay for this. I had

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Speaker 2: to pay for this. I had to pay for this.

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Speaker 2: That's an expenditure. But if this is uh in my

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Speaker 2: store already, I don't have to pay for it. Everything

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Speaker 2: I make I can keep and I don't. I don't

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Speaker 2: have to pay it by don't you use it? So

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Speaker 2: it's an advantage to me. What gave you that mentality

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Speaker 2: to understand how to leverage what's in it for the

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Speaker 2: person you're leveraging you with. That's a great question.

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Speaker 1: You know you mentioned something earlier about education and teachers

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Speaker 1: being our greatest natural resource in this country. And if

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Speaker 1: it's a kid who's being taught about history and Christopher

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Speaker 1: Columbus Shore. We should all know our history. They'll be

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Speaker 1: excited about that. But if it's someone over here on

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Speaker 1: the other side making you a business, offer your innate

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Speaker 1: response or impults, we all kind.

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Speaker 2: Of gravitate towards that.

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Speaker 1: I was gravitating towards the opportunity to learn how this

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Speaker 1: business works. And I was willing to take the loss

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Speaker 1: of two steps to gain that information that can help

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Speaker 1: me grow five steps.

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Speaker 2: And so it was that.

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Speaker 1: And then the second thing was this intangible feeling that

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Speaker 1: I know New York is the mecca, but they really

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Speaker 1: don't know what they have in front of them.

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Speaker 2: They don't know who we are. They don't And I

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Speaker 2: bet if we could show.

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Speaker 1: People who we are, the regional boundaries and all of

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Speaker 1: that stuff won't make a difference. We believed in ourselves

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Speaker 1: so much that when people told us no, we didn't

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Speaker 1: think we were whack. We just thought, damn, they don't

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Speaker 1: get it.

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Speaker 2: Well. But you also went ahead and took a course

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Speaker 2: that was available for you. And the course wasn't on

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Speaker 2: how to play instruments, was it? Or was it wasn't

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Speaker 2: on how to operate this keyboard. It was on the

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Speaker 2: business of music. So that's generally rare. When somebody is

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Speaker 2: a creative and they're an artist and they want to

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Speaker 2: go out and create art, it's almost like a painter

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Speaker 2: going to take the business of selling artwork. Was it

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Speaker 2: because your desire was to participate in this world of

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Speaker 2: hip hop in whatever form? Was it I don't want

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Speaker 2: to get screwed when I get to this level, or

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Speaker 2: was it.

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Speaker 1: Something else? It was both of It was all of

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Speaker 1: those things. It was the desire to be in this

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Speaker 1: world by any means, you know.

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Speaker 2: It was what appealed to me. I loved what what.

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Speaker 1: The culture stands for, what it provided for us, a

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Speaker 1: voice representation when we had a lack thereof.

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Speaker 2: It was exciting.

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Speaker 1: I didn't see myself going your typical path of going

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Speaker 1: to college and graduating and taking some job and uh

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Speaker 1: s some you know that I didn't really want to

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Speaker 1: be in number one number two being from Oakland. So

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Speaker 1: in Oakland we grow up with a hustler's and ntality,

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Speaker 1: and we know that preparation is the best protection. Information

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Speaker 1: to me is the most valuable thing you have at

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Speaker 1: your disposal when you don't have money, and so I

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Speaker 1: wanted to obtain that information because the business wasn't letting

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Speaker 1: me in, So I wanted to learn about the business

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Speaker 1: that wasn't letting me in. Find a door I go

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Speaker 1: open for myself, get in anyway, and in the process,

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Speaker 1: you're always gonna get jerked, you know, in the music business, sure,

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Speaker 1: but it's you're always gonna get fucked. But I didn't

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Speaker 1: want to get gang banged, so, you know. So that

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Speaker 1: information helped us get there. But to your point, it

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Speaker 1: did stifle the creative process from your you know. And

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Speaker 1: I understood too that I need to adjust myself in

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Speaker 1: this process in order to stay asset in it. This

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Speaker 1: was before we got to radio and we were still artists.

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Speaker 1: But the more I learned about the business, the more

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Speaker 1: I wanted to kind of protect the art, you know

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Speaker 1: what I mean, and be that person to put the

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Speaker 1: art out.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I think that's one thing that a lot

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Speaker 2: of people don't realize. So whether it's whether it's selling

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Speaker 2: music or there it's real estate, people don't realize that

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Speaker 2: no matter what, in every transaction, somebody makes money. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: no matter what people think. Well that the building I

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Speaker 2: bought it, it wasn't no good. So well so then

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Speaker 2: the bankruptcy attorney made of the auctioneer made the money

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Speaker 2: or whatever the case is, or somebody got it for

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Speaker 2: cheap costs in flipped it. But no matter what, every transaction,

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Speaker 2: somebody makes money. And a lot of times in let's say,

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Speaker 2: in the mu using business. You know, if you get

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Speaker 2: to know the business and whatever business people are they're

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Speaker 2: listening to us, they need to understand that there are

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Speaker 2: forces moving in certain ways that will profit of success, mediocre, theft,

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Speaker 2: or just failure. And as you get to know those

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Speaker 2: aspects of the business, people think they only need to

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Speaker 2: know one aspect of business, and business is something that

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Speaker 2: I'm still learning, right, So you're learning now this business.

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Speaker 2: You go to you know, Warner and you start to

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Speaker 2: find out a lot of people getting checks that should

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Speaker 2: or shouldn't. A lot of things happened. What's going on

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Speaker 2: with your success as a as an artist? As an artist?

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Speaker 2: It was interesting, it was.

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Speaker 1: You know, when we signed the Warner Brothers, we we

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Speaker 1: had a song that started doing really well in northern

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Speaker 1: California called follow for Now and and this is at

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Speaker 1: the tell end of us be an artist belongs to

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Speaker 1: us at that time, you know, you know, the song

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Speaker 1: was doing well, was circulating all over northern California's gravitating

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Speaker 1: towards the Midwest, and but the album wasn't doing well,

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Speaker 1: you know what I mean. And back then, you know,

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Speaker 1: you didn't get no second chances. And one of the

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Speaker 1: things we did, you know, we traveled. I remember coming

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Speaker 1: to Philadelphia on the tour and we were had a

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Speaker 1: performance right under the stairs where Rocky Balboa ran up

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Speaker 1: the well side along we were at the bottom of

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Speaker 1: the stairs.

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Speaker 2: Well. Some radio station that played that supported our song,

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Speaker 2: and we're like, in Philadelphia, people know us in Philadelphia.

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Speaker 2: They't no sway of tech armh Philadelphia. Wow.

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Speaker 1: So I'm performing, We're doing the song and we were

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Speaker 1: really great with showmanship. And afterwards we were going to

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Speaker 1: leave and a bunch of a group of kids hung

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Speaker 1: out and was like, hey man, can.

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Speaker 2: We get your autoground And we were like, wow, I'm

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Speaker 2: you even know who we are, That's why we're here, man.

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Speaker 2: They play a song on the radio. Yeah man, cool man,

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Speaker 2: yeah man. And I'm signing autographs yeah man. And Philly Man,

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Speaker 2: you know we got you know, we got the cheese

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Speaker 2: steaks and you know, we'll off from the West side.

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Speaker 2: Well over here, we got this that and I'm learning

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Speaker 2: about as people are talking, I'm asking im about the city.

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Speaker 1: Hum, okay, great man, thank you man. I stayed out

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Speaker 1: there extra hour. All those people just man, we love

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Speaker 1: you man. Congratulations. Could you know wishoot the best? Every

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Speaker 1: city we did that in. At the end of the show,

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Speaker 1: I start doing that same thing. So I'm learning about

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Speaker 1: these cities and they know how it benefit us. Fast forward,

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Speaker 1: my partner can check into the DJ contest into a

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Speaker 1: rap battle because he wanted to get more music played

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Speaker 1: on the on the radio, and the winner of the

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Speaker 1: DJ contest got forty minutes to mix. The winner of

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Speaker 1: the rap battle got a song played on the station,

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Speaker 1: the local station. We both won each contest, so they

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Speaker 1: played our song on the station, so it gave us

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Speaker 1: more exposure. The forty minute mix he did ended up

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Speaker 1: kind of revolutionizing how Bay area program radio, which eventually

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Speaker 1: revolutionized what we know today as rap on mainstream radio.

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Speaker 1: You had the legends here in New York that were

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Speaker 1: doing a lot of night shows and had rap programs,

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Speaker 1: whether it was Rap Attack or whatever it was, but

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Speaker 1: general consensus in mainstream radio P one stations programmers were

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Speaker 1: not playing a rap in regular day parts in the

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Speaker 1: afternoon drive in midday, and that mix we did was

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Speaker 1: at night time, but it got so popular that they

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Speaker 1: never had to kind of call out response that they

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Speaker 1: received from somebody doing a forty minute mix. And we

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Speaker 1: approached the program director and say, instead of us doing

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Speaker 1: this forty minute mix, give us a two hour show

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Speaker 1: and then this show, we'll call it the wake Up Show,

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Speaker 1: a double untimeo to be at nighttime, but we want

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Speaker 1: to wake people up to information about culture, lifestyle, politics.

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Speaker 1: Everything that Source magazine became from the beginning was with

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Speaker 1: this show. Was it and it got it got really popular,

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Speaker 1: you know, and at that point I was making my

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Speaker 1: transition from being an artist in front of the mic

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Speaker 1: rapping to being a broadcaster in front of the mike talking.

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Speaker 2: But what made you want to do that? You know,

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Speaker 2: many of us know the book Who Moved My Cheese?

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Speaker 2: And you know this hym and Hall, the ones who

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Speaker 2: keep saying, no, the cheese is going to come back,

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Speaker 2: the cheese is going to come back. And artists, many

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Speaker 2: of them say, you know, the cheese is going to

355
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Speaker 2: come back. One more hit, one more hit, and they

356
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Speaker 2: actually me say, I'm not going to be the guy

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Speaker 2: interviewing people I should be interviewed. I my mama told me,

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Speaker 2: I can say, all right, what was the need to say?

359
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Speaker 2: I can do that, and maybe I'm not as good

360
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Speaker 2: or the rapper or managers don't want to be involved

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Speaker 2: in that side of the business. What gave you that?

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Speaker 1: Either guts or fear or whatever it was, Well, all

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Speaker 1: these things were happening, but you know, at any given

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Speaker 1: two weeks, everything could have felt apart. So it was

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00:20:22,160 --> 00:20:27,159
Speaker 1: a sense of survival in this. I learned that what

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Speaker 1: I enjoyed most about being on stage rapping is communicating

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Speaker 1: with people and generating a response from folks. And I

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Speaker 1: didn't think as a rapper that I could see myself

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Speaker 1: excelling any further, you know, unless I put everything else

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Speaker 1: down and put all my energy into that. And by

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Speaker 1: that time we started producing other groups and putting them

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Speaker 1: out independently, and I really enjoyed overseeing projects and being

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Speaker 1: a part of the creative process in that way, and

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Speaker 1: I started to enjoy it as much as I did

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Speaker 1: being in front of the mic. And then I started

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Speaker 1: to enjoy it more because it was a sense of

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Speaker 1: pride in knowing that we were autonomous and how we

378
00:21:08,760 --> 00:21:11,800
Speaker 1: were releasing all these independent artists, and even though we

379
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Speaker 1: weren't selling as much as major artists may have been,

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Speaker 1: it was ours. And when that opportunity came to get

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Speaker 1: on the mic and do this mix show and do

382
00:21:21,320 --> 00:21:24,880
Speaker 1: this radio show, I realized that, man, now the reach

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Speaker 1: is even broader, you know, And I'm still really doing

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Speaker 1: the same thing, but I'm doing it in the form

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Speaker 1: of a broadcaster. I didn't study journalism or anything like that,

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Speaker 1: but I was able to adjust. But what happened was

387
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Speaker 1: the same thing. Thirst I had to learn about, Well,

388
00:21:40,440 --> 00:21:43,439
Speaker 1: how does distribution and all this stiff stuff work. I

389
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Speaker 1: wanted to learn about radio. So how does radio work? Like,

390
00:21:47,720 --> 00:21:52,080
Speaker 1: how do songs get played? How do radio personalities get big?

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Speaker 1: Who are the biggest radio personalities at that time? Was

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Speaker 1: a guy named John London who did our morning show.

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Speaker 1: Howard Stern had broadcast in the Bay. There's a guy

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Speaker 1: named Rick Chase, a woman Nay were now And one

395
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Speaker 1: of the things that they all had in common was

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00:22:11,160 --> 00:22:15,160
Speaker 1: they had empathy on the mic for for the audience,

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Speaker 1: you know, or at least they portrayed it right, you

398
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Speaker 1: know what I mean, Like they faked it well enough,

399
00:22:20,600 --> 00:22:22,880
Speaker 1: or you thought, man, this to man, these are they

400
00:22:22,960 --> 00:22:25,359
Speaker 1: really get where we are, where we're coming from. I

401
00:22:25,400 --> 00:22:28,440
Speaker 1: didn't have to fake it, all right, So I didn't

402
00:22:28,440 --> 00:22:33,119
Speaker 1: have proper training. So when we spoke, we spoke directly

403
00:22:34,200 --> 00:22:37,160
Speaker 1: to our audience. We didn't speak broadcasters back then. Was hey,

404
00:22:37,240 --> 00:22:39,800
Speaker 1: welcome to the soul and you know, it was like, okay,

405
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Speaker 1: what's up?

406
00:22:40,800 --> 00:22:41,160
Speaker 2: All right?

407
00:22:41,200 --> 00:22:43,560
Speaker 1: So man hawja, we go to man, this is what happened,

408
00:22:43,560 --> 00:22:45,320
Speaker 1: and this is what took place in my day. You

409
00:22:45,359 --> 00:22:47,440
Speaker 1: could relate to that. Man call us up, and this

410
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Speaker 1: is what we're going to do.

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Speaker 2: And as we go through this, and I know you

412
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Speaker 2: have a limit of time, and I'm not gonna take

413
00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:55,240
Speaker 2: up too much more of your time because there's a

414
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Speaker 2: lot of people that watch information like this and they say, well,

415
00:22:57,600 --> 00:22:59,439
Speaker 2: how does that apply to me? But if you look

416
00:22:59,480 --> 00:23:02,720
Speaker 2: at the fund and mentals of business, it's nobody ever

417
00:23:02,760 --> 00:23:05,800
Speaker 2: has to buy anything from your meaning they don't have

418
00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:07,600
Speaker 2: to listen to your radio station, they don't have to

419
00:23:07,640 --> 00:23:09,919
Speaker 2: like your YouTube channel, follow you on whatever, buy your

420
00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:14,320
Speaker 2: shirt of lotion. But that every day person, what you're

421
00:23:14,359 --> 00:23:16,440
Speaker 2: doing for your customer, no matter how you perceive them,

422
00:23:16,520 --> 00:23:20,760
Speaker 2: is you take You're curing a pain that they have.

423
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Speaker 2: And when you look at empathy, people are feeling like

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00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:28,879
Speaker 2: the world is so negative. And whether it's how A

425
00:23:28,920 --> 00:23:31,400
Speaker 2: Stern or one of the people that you were talking about,

426
00:23:32,040 --> 00:23:35,560
Speaker 2: they're there, they yell at their subjects, but they have

427
00:23:35,600 --> 00:23:39,600
Speaker 2: empathy for their audience, right, And it's still going to

428
00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:42,199
Speaker 2: be the fundamentals of business, no matter what are you

429
00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:45,400
Speaker 2: doing for those individuals out there, and the empathy, whether

430
00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:47,640
Speaker 2: you're selling them a shirt. They may say I don't

431
00:23:47,640 --> 00:23:50,080
Speaker 2: feel good unless I'm wearing a brand, right, Or they

432
00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:52,600
Speaker 2: may say I don't feel warm or whatever case is,

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Speaker 2: you know what, Or I feel bad when I spend

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Speaker 2: eighty dollars and it's only worth three, so it's all

435
00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:57,000
Speaker 2: to me for three because I can throw it away.

436
00:23:57,160 --> 00:24:01,320
Speaker 2: Whatever it is. The fundamentals are you you're so a

437
00:24:01,520 --> 00:24:05,280
Speaker 2: pain or something that hurts them. And now you have

438
00:24:05,320 --> 00:24:11,119
Speaker 2: a show going and it's a it's a local show, right,

439
00:24:11,280 --> 00:24:13,879
Speaker 2: just in San Francisco at that time. Yeah, then all

440
00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:17,960
Speaker 2: of a sudden, I start to see you, yeah on

441
00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:23,040
Speaker 2: MTV other places. How did that come home? What a

442
00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:23,840
Speaker 2: local show?

443
00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:28,760
Speaker 1: The reason why I told you about when I went

444
00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:33,640
Speaker 1: on tour, I started really communicating with the audience when

445
00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:36,600
Speaker 1: I got on radio. I remembered that, you know, and

446
00:24:36,680 --> 00:24:43,480
Speaker 1: I remember, you know, things that were personal, connecting with

447
00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:47,119
Speaker 1: things that were personal with people while we delivered information

448
00:24:47,520 --> 00:24:52,040
Speaker 1: that people weren't privy to. Information is a great product,

449
00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:56,000
Speaker 1: you know. There's we seek information every single day on

450
00:24:56,040 --> 00:25:00,600
Speaker 1: our phones, so we love consuming information. At that time,

451
00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:03,000
Speaker 1: we didn't have these devices.

452
00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:06,080
Speaker 2: So I honed in on that, like, well, let me

453
00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:08,159
Speaker 2: feed folks. I got this power.

454
00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:12,359
Speaker 1: We're on this mic, and that's all we ever wanted

455
00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:16,320
Speaker 1: to do always, but it's important that I feed myself

456
00:25:16,359 --> 00:25:20,639
Speaker 1: to learn about how I could take those next affordable

457
00:25:20,680 --> 00:25:24,119
Speaker 1: steps and what we're trying to do. And what I

458
00:25:24,160 --> 00:25:27,760
Speaker 1: saw was avoid in many cities around the country, maybe

459
00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:30,240
Speaker 1: not New York. New York is his own special place,

460
00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:33,600
Speaker 1: but people didn't have shows like this, you know. And

461
00:25:33,960 --> 00:25:37,679
Speaker 1: so we approached clear Channel, which was a corporation that

462
00:25:37,760 --> 00:25:41,120
Speaker 1: owned it before I think that now iHeart if I'm

463
00:25:41,119 --> 00:25:44,360
Speaker 1: not mistaken, and said, hey man, we want to syndicate

464
00:25:44,400 --> 00:25:48,920
Speaker 1: this show, and we got a sister station in La

465
00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:52,000
Speaker 1: ninety two point three to beat at that time was

466
00:25:52,040 --> 00:25:56,879
Speaker 1: the biggest station coming from the West coast, So we

467
00:25:56,920 --> 00:25:59,359
Speaker 1: want to be in San Francisco, in ninety two point

468
00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:01,560
Speaker 1: three to beat. And we also got a sister station

469
00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:04,680
Speaker 1: in Philadelphia, which was Power ninety nine at that time,

470
00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:08,640
Speaker 1: and we have a following in Philadelphia, so how can

471
00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:09,920
Speaker 1: we syndicate this show here?

472
00:26:11,080 --> 00:26:13,200
Speaker 2: And initially we didn't.

473
00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:17,880
Speaker 1: Get a response from the company, and eventually I had

474
00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:40,359
Speaker 1: to approach another broadcast company. And eventually I had to

475
00:26:40,359 --> 00:26:45,399
Speaker 1: approach another broadcast company who was the competition in the

476
00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:48,600
Speaker 1: main market LA and say, listen, all these things we're

477
00:26:48,640 --> 00:26:52,080
Speaker 1: doing in northern California, everything at Jock's in southern California

478
00:26:52,280 --> 00:26:54,200
Speaker 1: kind of emulating comes from this source.

479
00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:56,480
Speaker 2: We want to expand, and.

480
00:26:56,440 --> 00:26:59,680
Speaker 1: We created a bid in war you know, and eventually

481
00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:04,280
Speaker 1: the company kept us. From there, we start picking up

482
00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:07,280
Speaker 1: more and more stations, and eventually we became syndicated on

483
00:27:08,320 --> 00:27:12,560
Speaker 1: four different continents and twenty nine different stations around the

484
00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:17,720
Speaker 1: country and in other places. Seeing the power of that

485
00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:20,199
Speaker 1: reach gave us a lot of power in the music business,

486
00:27:20,240 --> 00:27:22,960
Speaker 1: because if you want to break a record, got to

487
00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:23,280
Speaker 1: go to you.

488
00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:24,800
Speaker 2: We gotta come and sway in tech.

489
00:27:25,119 --> 00:27:30,639
Speaker 1: And when you guys first began FOOBU, you know, and

490
00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:32,520
Speaker 1: y'all would coming to the West coast and you was

491
00:27:32,520 --> 00:27:35,080
Speaker 1: coming on the radio station promoting y'all had T shirts

492
00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:39,040
Speaker 1: and were We actually were doing giveaways, you know, in LA.

493
00:27:40,359 --> 00:27:41,080
Speaker 2: For that reason.

494
00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:44,639
Speaker 1: But I saw the power in that, and still with

495
00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:47,800
Speaker 1: the idea we want to protect the art. We focused

496
00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:50,600
Speaker 1: on a lot of artists who didn't have mainstream appeal

497
00:27:50,680 --> 00:27:53,360
Speaker 1: and didn't have a big machine behind them and gave

498
00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:54,480
Speaker 1: them a lot of exposure.

499
00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:55,600
Speaker 2: Artists like at.

500
00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:59,359
Speaker 1: That time, you know, the Fuji's or Nis or you know,

501
00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:03,160
Speaker 1: before they beat came these household names and we would

502
00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:07,560
Speaker 1: do concerts. We would create that experience. You were talking

503
00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:11,359
Speaker 1: about how millennials they would prefer to pay for an

504
00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:14,919
Speaker 1: experience than a product, and we would create an experience

505
00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:18,920
Speaker 1: in these concerts that we would do, and the experience

506
00:28:18,920 --> 00:28:22,280
Speaker 1: would incorporate all the elements of hip hop. All of

507
00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:24,240
Speaker 1: these things were taking place in the nineties.

508
00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:27,200
Speaker 2: You know, we even dabbled the merchandise and lost a lot,

509
00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:28,639
Speaker 2: got it. But I mean, and that's some of the

510
00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:30,480
Speaker 2: some of the good points that I wanna also touch on.

511
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:32,960
Speaker 2: You know, as you tell your story, and I often

512
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:34,680
Speaker 2: we're too close to it, and whether it's people who

513
00:28:34,720 --> 00:28:36,840
Speaker 2: are watching us in this room or watching us on

514
00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:41,200
Speaker 2: these cameras everybody has at a certain point during that

515
00:28:41,240 --> 00:28:43,400
Speaker 2: cause it sounded like that may have expanded ten years,

516
00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:46,440
Speaker 2: right or whatever. But how are you paying yourself? And

517
00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:48,760
Speaker 2: how many times did you say, man, I need to

518
00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:51,440
Speaker 2: go get a regular job again, or this is never

519
00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:56,120
Speaker 2: gonna go anywhere, or there's a hundred different hosts in

520
00:28:56,240 --> 00:28:59,600
Speaker 2: different markets and they're gonna get syndicated, and you start

521
00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:02,920
Speaker 2: second to yourself and maybe the love of your life

522
00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:05,640
Speaker 2: is second guessing you, and your mother and father and parents,

523
00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:08,680
Speaker 2: even though they may support you. How many times did

524
00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:10,920
Speaker 2: you want to give up or did you just say

525
00:29:11,080 --> 00:29:13,000
Speaker 2: it doesn't matter, I'm not going to give up.

526
00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:19,200
Speaker 1: I was never going to give up, but I was

527
00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:23,360
Speaker 1: scared that I was scared I was never going to

528
00:29:23,440 --> 00:29:26,520
Speaker 1: get in At one point, you know, it was we

529
00:29:26,560 --> 00:29:29,080
Speaker 1: were trying a whole lot of things that weren't working.

530
00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:32,400
Speaker 2: I'm telling you the things that, of course, and that's

531
00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:34,560
Speaker 2: I think that's a lot. Because all of a sudden,

532
00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:36,920
Speaker 2: we you know, we then start to see you MTV

533
00:29:37,040 --> 00:29:40,640
Speaker 2: and where you are today, and I have maybe like

534
00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:42,360
Speaker 2: one or two other questions that I find as fast

535
00:29:42,360 --> 00:29:45,360
Speaker 2: that we can talk for hours on this after you've

536
00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:48,200
Speaker 2: gotten to that point in life. You then started to

537
00:29:48,280 --> 00:29:53,560
Speaker 2: interview everybody in the world, and there's reasons and fundamentals

538
00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:56,360
Speaker 2: of why people make it, and the same in the

539
00:29:56,400 --> 00:30:00,920
Speaker 2: other area why people don't make it. You'll see stars, athletes, politicians.

540
00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:04,800
Speaker 2: Can you tell me one of the or two or

541
00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:07,680
Speaker 2: three of the four reasons why the people that have

542
00:30:07,760 --> 00:30:13,040
Speaker 2: come through your door have not made it after they

543
00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:15,240
Speaker 2: came through your door, can you tell me some of

544
00:30:15,280 --> 00:30:20,680
Speaker 2: the mistakes you see people make that are detrimental to them,

545
00:30:20,720 --> 00:30:22,520
Speaker 2: and they didn't realize they're doing it at the time

546
00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:27,520
Speaker 2: they do it. What I found what people who who

547
00:30:27,640 --> 00:30:33,200
Speaker 2: only thought about today and didn't think about tomorrow, or

548
00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:36,120
Speaker 2: they didn't have a plan, so they were living in

549
00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:40,840
Speaker 2: the hype of the day, and in the process it

550
00:30:40,920 --> 00:30:43,720
Speaker 2: didn't feel like they were paying attention to the things.

551
00:30:43,440 --> 00:30:45,840
Speaker 1: That got them there in the first place. You know,

552
00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:48,880
Speaker 1: they were forgetting the fundamentals. They were forgetting the fundamentals forget.

553
00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:53,120
Speaker 1: They weren't advancing and expecting change. They were so happy

554
00:30:53,360 --> 00:30:57,440
Speaker 1: what was happening now that some of them, especially in

555
00:30:57,440 --> 00:31:00,520
Speaker 1: the nineties, thought man, they didn't think that this does last,

556
00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:03,600
Speaker 1: This might not last forever, this might not even last

557
00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:06,840
Speaker 1: for a few months or half a year, and so

558
00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:08,960
Speaker 1: when we would talk to folks, I would ask us, so,

559
00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:09,840
Speaker 1: what's your next move?

560
00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:14,240
Speaker 2: What's your next plan? What you mean is that because

561
00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:16,920
Speaker 2: they didn't have like minded people around them? Is it

562
00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:22,400
Speaker 2: because you know, they just weren't intelligent enough to do that,

563
00:31:22,480 --> 00:31:25,400
Speaker 2: you think, or maybe they were discovered overnight and they

564
00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:28,240
Speaker 2: never had the foundation. I mean, I'm curious because artists

565
00:31:28,800 --> 00:31:35,000
Speaker 2: can really experience hyper growth, not necessarily due to our work.

566
00:31:35,160 --> 00:31:37,640
Speaker 2: Usually it is or talent. But when you have an

567
00:31:37,800 --> 00:31:40,320
Speaker 2: entire machine that picks up a record, goals I like this,

568
00:31:40,440 --> 00:31:43,280
Speaker 2: I could sell it all around the world. Then sometimes

569
00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:46,320
Speaker 2: you never went through that course, you never took affordable

570
00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:48,040
Speaker 2: step and the fact you went from here to there.

571
00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:53,000
Speaker 2: So you know, I think it's well the nuances of

572
00:31:53,040 --> 00:31:55,920
Speaker 2: the music business. A lot of dudes egos got inflated

573
00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:59,920
Speaker 2: and probably didn't feel like a lot of them thought

574
00:32:00,040 --> 00:32:04,000
Speaker 2: would never end, like I'm never gonna stink, I'm never

575
00:32:04,040 --> 00:32:07,720
Speaker 2: gonna be whack. Secondly, to your point, a lot of

576
00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:10,160
Speaker 2: folks will coddle in through the music business.

577
00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:12,360
Speaker 1: So you know, it's the gift and the curse, just

578
00:32:12,960 --> 00:32:15,520
Speaker 1: you know, when you know we work our whole lives

579
00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:17,560
Speaker 1: to get signed to these major record companies, and then

580
00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:19,440
Speaker 1: you get signed to them, and then they start handling

581
00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:24,160
Speaker 1: everything for you, you know, and and and you know

582
00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:26,520
Speaker 1: understanding it's a business. It's like you think it's just

583
00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:30,280
Speaker 1: going to be this ongoing relations show business, show business,

584
00:32:30,320 --> 00:32:33,320
Speaker 1: and the moment that the numbers go down, the metrics

585
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:37,080
Speaker 1: go down, they'll remind you that it's a business. And

586
00:32:37,120 --> 00:32:39,440
Speaker 1: then you're kind of out on your out, out on

587
00:32:39,480 --> 00:32:41,120
Speaker 1: your butt, you know what I mean, You're out of

588
00:32:41,160 --> 00:32:44,440
Speaker 1: luck and you haven't taken the proper steps to plan

589
00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:45,640
Speaker 1: for what's next.

590
00:32:46,320 --> 00:32:49,840
Speaker 2: And I agree going through the system, because even as

591
00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:52,120
Speaker 2: you equate that to artists who they had a whole

592
00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:55,400
Speaker 2: machine behind them, or like we talk about in the book,

593
00:32:55,480 --> 00:32:59,520
Speaker 2: as athletes may they've been they practiced being the best

594
00:32:59,520 --> 00:33:03,360
Speaker 2: physical specimen from ten years old to twenty two years old.

595
00:33:03,640 --> 00:33:05,800
Speaker 2: They have a very specific skill set. Now all of

596
00:33:05,800 --> 00:33:07,720
Speaker 2: a sudden, they have one hundred million dollars, but they

597
00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:10,800
Speaker 2: try to utilize that tool, but they don't have a

598
00:33:10,840 --> 00:33:15,120
Speaker 2: skill set in how money or business works. And then

599
00:33:15,400 --> 00:33:17,480
Speaker 2: over sixty five percent of I'm a bankrupt three years

600
00:33:17,520 --> 00:33:20,080
Speaker 2: outside of the league or a lot of winner when

601
00:33:20,120 --> 00:33:22,400
Speaker 2: you do that, and that's why I think that, and

602
00:33:22,440 --> 00:33:24,080
Speaker 2: that's why I wanted to get to because you're a

603
00:33:24,120 --> 00:33:27,200
Speaker 2: hustle to grind, rise and grind. The purpose of that

604
00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:30,720
Speaker 2: process is to make sure you learn it also when you.

605
00:33:31,160 --> 00:33:34,800
Speaker 1: Do have it where you again, and I learned early

606
00:33:34,880 --> 00:33:38,840
Speaker 1: on I had to adjust, you know, because the MC

607
00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:40,800
Speaker 1: thing was great and I had it for a moment,

608
00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:44,680
Speaker 1: But I want to work in the business and sustain

609
00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:48,400
Speaker 1: have a sustainable livelihood through this culture, and so I

610
00:33:48,520 --> 00:33:52,000
Speaker 1: constantly adjust it as the times adjust it. But I

611
00:33:52,040 --> 00:33:55,080
Speaker 1: followed my same rules in that process. So becoming a

612
00:33:55,160 --> 00:33:58,480
Speaker 1: radio broadcaster, I put the same energy into that as

613
00:33:58,520 --> 00:34:01,240
Speaker 1: I did trying to be an as I did trying

614
00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:02,560
Speaker 1: to learn the business.

615
00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:04,680
Speaker 2: And everything else.

616
00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:09,080
Speaker 1: So all of those things built this brand equity for

617
00:34:09,400 --> 00:34:12,800
Speaker 1: me and Keen Tech throughout the nineties. So MTV approached

618
00:34:12,800 --> 00:34:14,920
Speaker 1: me three times to come work for them, and I

619
00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:16,799
Speaker 1: was like, what do I need to work for MTV for?

620
00:34:18,040 --> 00:34:21,040
Speaker 1: We had the biggest show in the country at that time,

621
00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:25,800
Speaker 1: was the first one syndicated of its kind that large.

622
00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:29,720
Speaker 1: That's how you and I actually met. We had concert

623
00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:32,960
Speaker 1: tours going, we felt at merchandise. We tried to do

624
00:34:33,040 --> 00:34:36,399
Speaker 1: some clothes and everything. Yeah, we got we got beat

625
00:34:36,480 --> 00:34:39,680
Speaker 1: up in that. Yeah yeah, yeah, you don't try to

626
00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:43,680
Speaker 1: all right, And we continue to move product, you know, music,

627
00:34:44,360 --> 00:34:46,120
Speaker 1: and we always deal well with that. By the time

628
00:34:46,280 --> 00:34:51,600
Speaker 1: MTV came, our main flagship station at that time was

629
00:34:51,680 --> 00:34:54,200
Speaker 1: ninety two point three to beat. It just got bought

630
00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:58,560
Speaker 1: out by another radio conglomerate. The program director at that

631
00:34:58,600 --> 00:35:01,760
Speaker 1: time wanted us to change formula and how we programmed

632
00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:05,120
Speaker 1: the show and play only mainstream artists. We explained to

633
00:35:05,200 --> 00:35:07,920
Speaker 1: him that that would compromise the integrity of the show

634
00:35:08,080 --> 00:35:12,319
Speaker 1: and what's made it so successful throughout the years. They

635
00:35:12,320 --> 00:35:15,719
Speaker 1: gave us oldtimatum, either you do this or you have

636
00:35:15,800 --> 00:35:18,359
Speaker 1: to leave this company. If you left that station, then

637
00:35:18,400 --> 00:35:22,879
Speaker 1: you would lose your syndication, and it was important to us,

638
00:35:23,840 --> 00:35:26,760
Speaker 1: and we left the station and we start slowly losing

639
00:35:26,800 --> 00:35:31,960
Speaker 1: the syndication. So by the fourth time MTV call you.

640
00:35:32,520 --> 00:35:34,919
Speaker 2: Yeah, man, it sounds like a plan. I'll come out

641
00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:37,160
Speaker 2: there and we'll get tried. And we all know how

642
00:35:37,200 --> 00:35:39,279
Speaker 2: I ended up with the fact that you and I

643
00:35:39,440 --> 00:35:41,560
Speaker 2: here and we've been through a lot, and it's very

644
00:35:41,560 --> 00:35:43,279
Speaker 2: hard to be up broadcast. I have one last question,

645
00:35:43,320 --> 00:35:46,000
Speaker 2: even very gracious with your time. I gotta ask you

646
00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:49,080
Speaker 2: a question. If somebody was talking to the younger Sway

647
00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:52,279
Speaker 2: when you were fifteen or eighteen, or even ten, and

648
00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:55,680
Speaker 2: they laid out every single thing you had to do

649
00:35:55,800 --> 00:35:58,280
Speaker 2: to get to this position where you are in life

650
00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:03,440
Speaker 2: it all out, would you say, yes, I wanted to

651
00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:06,080
Speaker 2: do that, or would you say that's too much.

652
00:36:09,520 --> 00:36:12,759
Speaker 1: I'll be honest with You's damn the youngest Sway it

653
00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:15,360
Speaker 1: was probably a lot braver and more courageous than the

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00:36:15,400 --> 00:36:25,560
Speaker 1: one you're looking at today. And the young Sway believed that.

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00:36:23,200 --> 00:36:24,560
Speaker 2: I always had to believe.

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00:36:24,600 --> 00:36:27,560
Speaker 1: We grew up our welfare man and my mother and

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00:36:27,280 --> 00:36:30,560
Speaker 1: my family put installed in us to believe that. Even

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00:36:30,600 --> 00:36:33,680
Speaker 1: though you're walking to school and your sockets hanging out

659
00:36:33,719 --> 00:36:36,400
Speaker 1: in the rain, and your brother's wearing the same shirt

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00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:38,560
Speaker 1: he's been wearing three days straight, and you know, we

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00:36:38,600 --> 00:36:42,280
Speaker 1: didn't wash the clothes because we can't afford to wash clothes.

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00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:44,560
Speaker 1: And your sister we got to dress her nice because

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00:36:44,560 --> 00:36:47,600
Speaker 1: she's a girl. But y'all, you know, if the free

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00:36:47,680 --> 00:36:50,480
Speaker 1: lunch don't come on time, y'all not gonna eat at school.

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00:36:50,680 --> 00:36:53,839
Speaker 1: With all these things that was happening in Oakland at

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00:36:53,840 --> 00:36:57,680
Speaker 1: that time in the seventies and in our lives, I

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00:36:57,880 --> 00:37:01,960
Speaker 1: always felt like I had an advantage on anybody I

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00:37:02,040 --> 00:37:05,399
Speaker 1: came up against, anybody who was in my class role.

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00:37:05,480 --> 00:37:08,319
Speaker 2: It was a confidence. It was confidence and still that

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00:37:08,400 --> 00:37:10,839
Speaker 2: was stilled by your parents, probably by your family.

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00:37:10,600 --> 00:37:14,879
Speaker 1: Family parents in Oakland. Well, thank you, man, I really

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00:37:14,960 --> 00:37:17,640
Speaker 1: value Thank you man. I was fun talking about me

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00:37:17,760 --> 00:37:18,240
Speaker 1: for first.

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00:37:19,000 --> 00:37:23,080
Speaker 2: Good job, man, try to take my job. I'm good.

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00:37:23,080 --> 00:37:27,120
Speaker 2: I'll make a third. Okay, all right. That moment with

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00:37:27,239 --> 00:37:31,320
Speaker 2: Damon John is a production of the Black Effect Podcast Network.

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00:37:31,440 --> 00:37:34,960
Speaker 2: For more podcasts from the Black Effect Podcast Network, visit

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00:37:35,040 --> 00:37:39,560
Speaker 2: the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to

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00:37:39,719 --> 00:37:43,879
Speaker 2: your favorite show and don't forget to subscribe to and

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00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:47,000
Speaker 2: rate the show. And of course you didn't all connect

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00:37:47,000 --> 00:37:49,360
Speaker 2: with me on any of my social media platforms. At

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00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:53,520
Speaker 2: the Shark, Damon spelled like Raymond, but what a d