1 00:00:00,880 --> 00:00:08,360 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. A gorgeous young nursing student, 2 00:00:08,520 --> 00:00:15,400 Speaker 1: Holly Bobo walks into the woods and vanishes forever. At tonight, 3 00:00:16,200 --> 00:00:22,400 Speaker 1: her brutal killer to walk free. I'm Nancy Grace. This 4 00:00:22,480 --> 00:00:23,400 Speaker 1: is Crime Stories. 5 00:00:23,480 --> 00:00:51,040 Speaker 2: I want to thank you for being with us. 6 00:00:27,920 --> 00:01:02,320 Speaker 1: Okay, oh my stars, you are hearing the heartbroken mother 7 00:01:02,480 --> 00:01:06,560 Speaker 1: of Holly Bobo begging, begging for law enforcement to go 8 00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:09,880 Speaker 1: immediately to her home. You hear her stating, I'm at school, 9 00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:12,119 Speaker 1: she's a school teacher. I'm trying to get to my home. 10 00:01:13,000 --> 00:01:17,840 Speaker 1: Neighbors heard her screaming, and somebody in camouflage got Holly. 11 00:01:18,360 --> 00:01:23,320 Speaker 1: And that is how this case her disappearance kicked off. 12 00:01:23,640 --> 00:01:27,280 Speaker 1: Listen to more of that nine one one calling off. 13 00:01:31,240 --> 00:01:48,560 Speaker 1: The pain in the mother's voice is almost unbearable. It's 14 00:01:48,600 --> 00:01:53,440 Speaker 1: excruciating to hear it. You were hearing Holly Bobo's mother 15 00:01:54,040 --> 00:01:58,520 Speaker 1: raising the alarm her daughter has been taken by a 16 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:01,960 Speaker 1: man in camo. Joining me an all star panel to 17 00:02:02,000 --> 00:02:04,800 Speaker 1: make sense of what we are learning. Straight out to 18 00:02:04,880 --> 00:02:08,960 Speaker 1: Shane Dieter joining us from Tennessee form our assignment editor 19 00:02:09,160 --> 00:02:12,320 Speaker 1: wat and Memphis Chane, thank you for being with us. 20 00:02:12,400 --> 00:02:18,200 Speaker 1: Just hearing Holly's mother is heartbreaking in the nine one 21 00:02:18,320 --> 00:02:23,160 Speaker 1: one call. Her voice is sometimes a scream, and then 22 00:02:23,200 --> 00:02:30,000 Speaker 1: she's begging and she's crying, and the excruciating trip from 23 00:02:30,080 --> 00:02:35,360 Speaker 1: work trying to get home. Describe where was the mother 24 00:02:35,520 --> 00:02:38,639 Speaker 1: when she learns this is happening, Shane. She was at work. 25 00:02:38,760 --> 00:02:43,080 Speaker 3: She is a school teacher and she was at work. 26 00:02:43,280 --> 00:02:47,320 Speaker 3: I know she was so upset that she had to 27 00:02:47,400 --> 00:02:52,200 Speaker 3: have a friend or a coworker driver home. I just 28 00:02:52,200 --> 00:02:55,480 Speaker 3: couldn't imagine, you know, getting that call and then making 29 00:02:55,480 --> 00:03:00,960 Speaker 3: that call. It was heartbreaking as you heard. I could 30 00:03:00,960 --> 00:03:05,560 Speaker 3: not imagine the scared that that mother had. That was 31 00:03:05,560 --> 00:03:06,480 Speaker 3: her baby. 32 00:03:06,639 --> 00:03:11,880 Speaker 1: That is Holly Bobo's mother. But who is Holly? 33 00:03:12,120 --> 00:03:15,160 Speaker 4: Holly Bobo a beautiful twenty year old nursing student at 34 00:03:15,200 --> 00:03:18,160 Speaker 4: the University of Tennessee Martin. She lives with her parents 35 00:03:18,160 --> 00:03:20,760 Speaker 4: and brother Clint at the family home in Darden, Tennessee. 36 00:03:20,919 --> 00:03:24,480 Speaker 4: April thirteen, Holly awakens at four thirty am to study 37 00:03:24,480 --> 00:03:26,760 Speaker 4: for an exam. Brother Clint wakes up to the sound 38 00:03:26,760 --> 00:03:29,600 Speaker 4: of the family dogs barking. Around seven forty five am. 39 00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:31,760 Speaker 4: Looks out to see Holly and a man dressed in 40 00:03:31,800 --> 00:03:34,760 Speaker 4: camouflage in the garage. Clint thinks Holly and her boyfriend 41 00:03:34,800 --> 00:03:36,520 Speaker 4: Drew Scott are having an argument. 42 00:03:36,760 --> 00:03:39,200 Speaker 5: As I listened a little bit closer, I could tell 43 00:03:39,240 --> 00:03:41,240 Speaker 5: that that was Holly's voice, So I knew it was Holly, 44 00:03:41,600 --> 00:03:44,120 Speaker 5: So in my mind the male's voice I knew to 45 00:03:44,200 --> 00:03:45,000 Speaker 5: be Drew. 46 00:03:45,240 --> 00:03:46,440 Speaker 3: You know who is her boyfriend? 47 00:03:46,480 --> 00:03:49,760 Speaker 1: That's who of my friends at ABC twenty twenty again 48 00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:53,680 Speaker 1: joining me at All Star panel. You know, it's very 49 00:03:54,240 --> 00:03:57,960 Speaker 1: disconcerting to doctor angel Arnold joining us fronaw psychiatrist out 50 00:03:58,000 --> 00:04:00,600 Speaker 1: of the Atlanta jurisdiction, and you can find her at 51 00:04:00,680 --> 00:04:04,720 Speaker 1: angela Arnold md dot com. Because your day is going 52 00:04:04,760 --> 00:04:09,560 Speaker 1: along as normal until it's not. And you hear the 53 00:04:09,640 --> 00:04:13,680 Speaker 1: mother just she can hardly talk. She screams, then she 54 00:04:13,840 --> 00:04:17,520 Speaker 1: begs and she cries, trying to get the entire community 55 00:04:17,560 --> 00:04:21,680 Speaker 1: out pronto to help find her daughter. All she knows 56 00:04:21,720 --> 00:04:26,760 Speaker 1: at this juncture is that a male wearing camo led 57 00:04:26,839 --> 00:04:30,440 Speaker 1: her daughter, took her daughter after an argument in their 58 00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:35,120 Speaker 1: car port into the woods that goes along the Tennessee River. 59 00:04:35,360 --> 00:04:38,400 Speaker 1: That's all she knows. When she's calling nine one one 60 00:04:38,680 --> 00:04:41,359 Speaker 1: there she is at work, she's a school teacher and 61 00:04:41,440 --> 00:04:45,279 Speaker 1: she gets this call and her life will never be 62 00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:47,120 Speaker 1: the same, Doctor Angie. 63 00:04:46,920 --> 00:04:52,120 Speaker 5: Imagine Nancy. She has literally no control over what is 64 00:04:52,160 --> 00:04:54,880 Speaker 5: happening to her daughter. All she can do is try 65 00:04:54,880 --> 00:04:56,960 Speaker 5: to get there as fast as she can and try 66 00:04:57,000 --> 00:04:59,080 Speaker 5: to get as many people there as fast as they 67 00:04:59,120 --> 00:05:03,120 Speaker 5: can get there. But she knows that she has no 68 00:05:03,240 --> 00:05:07,640 Speaker 5: control over the situation. I can't even imagine a more 69 00:05:07,800 --> 00:05:09,320 Speaker 5: horrible feeling for a mother. 70 00:05:09,560 --> 00:05:13,760 Speaker 1: Now, we just heard from our friends at ABC twenty twenty, 71 00:05:14,320 --> 00:05:20,200 Speaker 1: Clant Bobo speaking. He was stating, as I listened a 72 00:05:20,240 --> 00:05:23,640 Speaker 1: little closer, I could tell it was Holly's voice. So 73 00:05:23,720 --> 00:05:27,840 Speaker 1: I knew if it's Holly, then she must be talking 74 00:05:27,880 --> 00:05:32,400 Speaker 1: to her boyfriend Drew. Okay, how did he come to 75 00:05:32,480 --> 00:05:37,159 Speaker 1: the idea? Shane Deeter joining us from Tennessee, that Holly 76 00:05:37,279 --> 00:05:40,200 Speaker 1: was talking to the boyfriend Nancy. 77 00:05:39,880 --> 00:05:43,560 Speaker 3: The night before the brother and Drew, the boyfriend, were talking. 78 00:05:43,640 --> 00:05:48,960 Speaker 3: They were also friends, and Drew talked about going Honey. 79 00:05:49,520 --> 00:05:52,680 Speaker 3: So when Holly's brother heard die and saw her going 80 00:05:52,720 --> 00:05:56,719 Speaker 3: out towards the wood with this man in camouflage, he 81 00:05:56,880 --> 00:06:01,560 Speaker 3: thought it was her boyfriend or boyfriend. 82 00:06:02,160 --> 00:06:10,360 Speaker 1: This one critical mistake may have cost Holly her life. 83 00:06:10,400 --> 00:06:16,120 Speaker 1: When the brother by all accounts well intentioned looks out. 84 00:06:17,560 --> 00:06:21,400 Speaker 1: He sees his sister with a guy. They're talking and 85 00:06:21,440 --> 00:06:25,160 Speaker 1: he thinks it's the boyfriend listen. 86 00:06:25,240 --> 00:06:27,760 Speaker 6: Clint calls his mother Karen, at work, telling his mother 87 00:06:27,880 --> 00:06:30,080 Speaker 6: it looks like Holly and Drew are having an argument 88 00:06:30,160 --> 00:06:33,440 Speaker 6: air walking towards the woods. Karen says that is not Drew. 89 00:06:33,600 --> 00:06:36,400 Speaker 6: Grab a gun and shoot whoever is with Holly. Drew 90 00:06:36,520 --> 00:06:40,200 Speaker 6: is turkey hunting on Bobo family property. Clint asks, you 91 00:06:40,240 --> 00:06:43,599 Speaker 6: want me to shoot Drew. Karen Bobo immediately calls nine 92 00:06:43,600 --> 00:06:45,160 Speaker 6: to one one around eight am. 93 00:06:45,400 --> 00:06:47,240 Speaker 1: I said, that's not Dree. You get a gun and 94 00:06:47,279 --> 00:06:49,760 Speaker 1: shoot him. And Clint said, you want me to shoot Drew? 95 00:06:50,160 --> 00:06:51,800 Speaker 1: And I think that's when I hung up and call 96 00:06:51,920 --> 00:06:54,440 Speaker 1: nine one one from our friends at ABC. So what 97 00:06:54,640 --> 00:06:58,880 Speaker 1: she didn't know, out to Dave Matt Crime Stories Investigative reporter, 98 00:06:59,080 --> 00:07:05,400 Speaker 1: what he didn't know is when he's told Mom, some guy, 99 00:07:06,880 --> 00:07:11,520 Speaker 1: I guess the boyfriend is leading her down the trail 100 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:16,280 Speaker 1: to the river into the woods. Her response is she knew. 101 00:07:16,320 --> 00:07:19,800 Speaker 1: She did not have time to explain. Dave mac She says, 102 00:07:20,440 --> 00:07:26,400 Speaker 1: get a gun and shoot him, and the brother Clint 103 00:07:26,520 --> 00:07:29,040 Speaker 1: is just groggy what he's just waking up. He's like, 104 00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:32,840 Speaker 1: you want me to shoot Drew. But what the mother 105 00:07:33,240 --> 00:07:37,400 Speaker 1: knew and the brother didn't know was at that very moment, 106 00:07:37,440 --> 00:07:42,280 Speaker 1: the boyfriend wasn't even there. He was miles away turkey 107 00:07:42,360 --> 00:07:47,200 Speaker 1: hunting with his own father. But the brother didn't know that. 108 00:07:47,280 --> 00:07:50,440 Speaker 1: He's like, what explain it, Dave. 109 00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:54,320 Speaker 4: That's exactly what happened, Nancy. All right, Clint was just 110 00:07:54,360 --> 00:07:57,400 Speaker 4: waking up and he here's the dog's barking. You mentioned 111 00:07:57,640 --> 00:08:02,280 Speaker 4: that Parry knows that Drew is hunting because he's turkey 112 00:08:02,320 --> 00:08:05,400 Speaker 4: hunting on Bobo family property. It's actually Karen's grandmother. That's 113 00:08:05,440 --> 00:08:08,440 Speaker 4: the property they're hunting on. So he's thirty miles away, 114 00:08:08,720 --> 00:08:11,480 Speaker 4: and so she knows it's not bu it can't be Drew, 115 00:08:12,080 --> 00:08:14,840 Speaker 4: and Clint has no clue. He's just blurry eyed and 116 00:08:14,880 --> 00:08:18,000 Speaker 4: he's like, here's his sister. He hears her voice, but 117 00:08:18,360 --> 00:08:20,880 Speaker 4: he hears a tinge in her voice that he feels 118 00:08:20,880 --> 00:08:23,880 Speaker 4: like they're arguing. And I think he said he heard 119 00:08:23,960 --> 00:08:27,920 Speaker 4: the word no, but the way that he briefly saw 120 00:08:28,160 --> 00:08:30,520 Speaker 4: it just in his mind, he couldn't think who I mean, 121 00:08:30,520 --> 00:08:32,120 Speaker 4: think about it. It's early in the morning. Who else 122 00:08:32,160 --> 00:08:34,560 Speaker 4: would you be talking to you, wouldn't be talking to 123 00:08:34,600 --> 00:08:36,640 Speaker 4: somebody who didn't know out by your car, getting ready 124 00:08:36,640 --> 00:08:38,640 Speaker 4: to go to school. That's why Clint was kind of 125 00:08:38,720 --> 00:08:42,000 Speaker 4: out of it and just assumed it was Drew right then. 126 00:08:42,400 --> 00:08:45,280 Speaker 4: And Karen obviously knew it couldn't be. She knew it 127 00:08:45,320 --> 00:08:47,160 Speaker 4: could That's why she grab a gun and shoot him. 128 00:08:47,160 --> 00:08:50,720 Speaker 4: That was her She could go shoot him. She knew intuitively, 129 00:08:50,720 --> 00:08:53,880 Speaker 4: a mother's intuition, knew her daughter was in trouble, and 130 00:08:53,920 --> 00:08:55,719 Speaker 4: that man meant no good. 131 00:08:57,240 --> 00:08:57,800 Speaker 1: With your mercy. 132 00:08:58,040 --> 00:08:59,320 Speaker 2: Somebody has my daughter. 133 00:09:00,200 --> 00:09:01,959 Speaker 7: Now, cars some money and pull camel. 134 00:09:02,040 --> 00:09:06,400 Speaker 1: What got Holly? Please get everybody looking out. They're on 135 00:09:06,520 --> 00:09:07,199 Speaker 1: their way sweetie. 136 00:09:07,200 --> 00:09:09,280 Speaker 7: I got everybody on their way right now already. 137 00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:10,400 Speaker 1: Oh my god. 138 00:09:10,720 --> 00:09:13,200 Speaker 4: Clint Bobo can see sister Holly with the man in 139 00:09:13,240 --> 00:09:15,600 Speaker 4: Camos on a trail that leads to a logging road, 140 00:09:15,720 --> 00:09:18,800 Speaker 4: and Clinton notices the man is bigger than her boyfriend Drew. 141 00:09:19,240 --> 00:09:22,200 Speaker 4: Holly's mother, Karen, tells Clint to grab a pistol and 142 00:09:22,280 --> 00:09:24,920 Speaker 4: go outside toward the garage, calling nine one one. As 143 00:09:24,960 --> 00:09:28,640 Speaker 4: he walks in the garage, Clint finds bloodstains. Police arrive 144 00:09:28,679 --> 00:09:30,160 Speaker 4: at the Bobo residence in ten. 145 00:09:30,040 --> 00:09:33,560 Speaker 1: Minutes straight back out to Shane Deeter, former assignment editor 146 00:09:33,800 --> 00:09:38,960 Speaker 1: w at M Memphis. Shane, what is it that Clint 147 00:09:39,040 --> 00:09:43,720 Speaker 1: the brother saw? First of all, a neighbor hears screams. 148 00:09:43,840 --> 00:09:46,840 Speaker 1: A neighbor hears a woman we now know to be 149 00:09:46,880 --> 00:09:52,040 Speaker 1: Holly Bobo screaming. The neighbor calls the mom at school 150 00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:56,600 Speaker 1: where she's working. The mom tells Clint to look out, 151 00:09:56,840 --> 00:10:00,400 Speaker 1: get up, son, go look outside, and he's say, well, 152 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:04,480 Speaker 1: you know, she's walking into the woods with a guy 153 00:10:04,600 --> 00:10:09,520 Speaker 1: and camera. But Shay, you describe for me what Clint saw. 154 00:10:09,760 --> 00:10:13,920 Speaker 1: You know, when he saw them kneeling and the car port, he. 155 00:10:13,960 --> 00:10:16,520 Speaker 3: Just thought it was his sister having an argument with 156 00:10:16,600 --> 00:10:21,560 Speaker 3: her boyfriend. So again, like we said, he saw the 157 00:10:21,600 --> 00:10:26,440 Speaker 3: guy in cameouflaws. He didn't realize that Drew was thirty 158 00:10:26,520 --> 00:10:32,920 Speaker 3: miles away, and so he's, you know, he did what 159 00:10:33,000 --> 00:10:35,719 Speaker 3: most people would do, you know, until his mom told 160 00:10:35,800 --> 00:10:37,640 Speaker 3: him to get a gun. Then he went out and 161 00:10:37,679 --> 00:10:38,520 Speaker 3: found the blood. 162 00:10:38,679 --> 00:10:42,280 Speaker 1: So Dave Matt explained to me, when he looks out, 163 00:10:42,559 --> 00:10:48,840 Speaker 1: they're not walking yet, No, they're kneeling. Kneeling, Yeah, yeah, 164 00:10:48,880 --> 00:10:50,640 Speaker 1: and that's describe that That's. 165 00:10:50,520 --> 00:10:56,680 Speaker 4: What really set Clint off. Nancy, because he sees hollye kneeling, 166 00:10:56,760 --> 00:11:00,760 Speaker 4: and he sees the other person also kneeling. It's not 167 00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:03,400 Speaker 4: something you see on any time a given day. And 168 00:11:03,440 --> 00:11:06,200 Speaker 4: the guy's just waking up, and so he sees what 169 00:11:06,240 --> 00:11:09,680 Speaker 4: he thinks is Holly and her boyfriend. But they're kneeling. 170 00:11:09,720 --> 00:11:11,800 Speaker 4: They're not in a way that he would expect them 171 00:11:11,840 --> 00:11:14,040 Speaker 4: to be. And that's a very important point here, because 172 00:11:14,400 --> 00:11:18,680 Speaker 4: he didn't take immediate corrective action because he thought that 173 00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:22,600 Speaker 4: Drew was breaking up with Holly. He sees Holly kneeling, 174 00:11:22,960 --> 00:11:25,920 Speaker 4: he hears her say no. You start putting it all together, 175 00:11:25,960 --> 00:11:28,640 Speaker 4: and you realize he didn't want to insert himself into 176 00:11:28,679 --> 00:11:31,960 Speaker 4: that situation. He didn't see it as dangerous. Somebody on 177 00:11:32,000 --> 00:11:36,160 Speaker 4: their knees. If they're both kneeling, that's not a dangerous situation, Nancy. 178 00:11:36,160 --> 00:11:37,679 Speaker 4: And that's the way he described. 179 00:11:37,360 --> 00:11:42,280 Speaker 1: Todd Shipley joining me from Reno. Former detective sergeant with 180 00:11:42,520 --> 00:11:49,079 Speaker 1: the Nevada Police Department, twenty five years in la You know, interesting, 181 00:11:49,880 --> 00:11:53,559 Speaker 1: well back at every crime right and you can say 182 00:11:53,880 --> 00:11:57,840 Speaker 1: would have, could have, should have If they should have 183 00:11:58,040 --> 00:12:02,240 Speaker 1: known that wasn't Drew the boy friend, he could have 184 00:12:02,280 --> 00:12:06,800 Speaker 1: called nine one one. He would have done the right thing. 185 00:12:06,920 --> 00:12:11,959 Speaker 1: But the reality is he couldn't see the guy's face. Ever, 186 00:12:12,320 --> 00:12:16,280 Speaker 1: he never saw the purpse face. He saw him from behind. 187 00:12:16,520 --> 00:12:20,199 Speaker 1: He describes him as wearing camo, a baseball hat, and 188 00:12:20,240 --> 00:12:22,440 Speaker 1: that he had dark hair coming out from under his 189 00:12:22,760 --> 00:12:26,679 Speaker 1: cap that you know, kind of went under his collar 190 00:12:26,960 --> 00:12:30,000 Speaker 1: to show how long the hair was. He said he 191 00:12:30,120 --> 00:12:32,920 Speaker 1: was five ten to six feet. Hey, that could be anybody, 192 00:12:33,360 --> 00:12:35,560 Speaker 1: and that he weighed one hundred and eighty to up 193 00:12:35,600 --> 00:12:39,840 Speaker 1: around two hundred pounds. But he never saw his face. 194 00:12:40,320 --> 00:12:44,360 Speaker 1: So all the speculation it's the brother Clint's fought, it's not. 195 00:12:45,160 --> 00:12:49,440 Speaker 1: Clint is not the one that kidnapped Holly Bobo. It's 196 00:12:49,480 --> 00:12:52,760 Speaker 1: not his fault. He did not see the purpse face. 197 00:12:52,920 --> 00:12:56,240 Speaker 1: And isn't it true, Shipley that in every case people say, 198 00:12:56,600 --> 00:13:00,400 Speaker 1: if only fill in the blank, if only I had 199 00:13:00,440 --> 00:13:02,719 Speaker 1: worn a state belt, if only I hadn't gone to 200 00:13:02,760 --> 00:13:05,559 Speaker 1: the liquor store, if only I hadn't gone jogging. I mean, 201 00:13:05,760 --> 00:13:09,319 Speaker 1: that could be a million scenarios. Would I could have 202 00:13:09,400 --> 00:13:13,600 Speaker 1: should have? But it doesn't fit here because he didn't 203 00:13:13,640 --> 00:13:16,360 Speaker 1: see the face, He could not have known who the 204 00:13:16,400 --> 00:13:17,160 Speaker 1: purp is. 205 00:13:17,480 --> 00:13:20,120 Speaker 7: No, of course, I mean, and we all regret things 206 00:13:20,160 --> 00:13:23,360 Speaker 7: that have happened, especially in those stress situations where you know, 207 00:13:23,679 --> 00:13:27,920 Speaker 7: the person realizes later that if they had intervened, the 208 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:30,880 Speaker 7: whole situation could have changed. And so that poor young 209 00:13:30,920 --> 00:13:33,560 Speaker 7: man is regretting, you know, so many things in his 210 00:13:33,640 --> 00:13:36,920 Speaker 7: life and has for years. But had he walked out there, 211 00:13:36,960 --> 00:13:39,200 Speaker 7: it would have been a very different situation. But we 212 00:13:39,280 --> 00:13:41,960 Speaker 7: don't know whether that person's arm, what was happening. He 213 00:13:41,960 --> 00:13:44,199 Speaker 7: could have gotten killed himself too at that point in time. 214 00:13:44,280 --> 00:13:46,760 Speaker 7: We just don't know, because it's all what is after 215 00:13:46,800 --> 00:13:48,520 Speaker 7: the fact, and that's the unfortunate thing. 216 00:13:49,040 --> 00:13:51,640 Speaker 6: Extensive searches of the area around the Bobo home are 217 00:13:51,679 --> 00:13:54,600 Speaker 6: conducted on foot and with dogs. An hour and a half, 218 00:13:54,640 --> 00:13:58,559 Speaker 6: her cell phone traveled throughout Decatur County. The phone tracks 219 00:13:58,640 --> 00:14:02,480 Speaker 6: north to a wooded area forty stops moving between eight 220 00:14:02,520 --> 00:14:05,280 Speaker 6: thirty am and nine am, and begins moving again as 221 00:14:05,280 --> 00:14:08,840 Speaker 6: it pings back south toward the Bobo residence, but not 222 00:14:09,120 --> 00:14:10,360 Speaker 6: on the same route today. 223 00:14:10,400 --> 00:14:14,680 Speaker 1: Matt Crimestory, investigative reporter. We heard earlier that when the 224 00:14:14,720 --> 00:14:21,360 Speaker 1: brother Clint goes into the garage, he sees blood stains 225 00:14:22,320 --> 00:14:26,880 Speaker 1: on the garage floor, and there were at least two bloodstains, 226 00:14:26,920 --> 00:14:29,440 Speaker 1: as I recall, one about the size of a fist, 227 00:14:30,560 --> 00:14:37,000 Speaker 1: and one a much smaller blood drop. Drop. That's significant 228 00:14:37,000 --> 00:14:40,520 Speaker 1: that it was a drop, not a smear, not a transfer, 229 00:14:40,800 --> 00:14:46,160 Speaker 1: but a drop. Describe the blood the brother Clint finds 230 00:14:46,280 --> 00:14:48,760 Speaker 1: in the Bobo family garage. 231 00:14:49,000 --> 00:14:52,120 Speaker 4: The blood drop is you just mentioned, Nancy. That's actually 232 00:14:52,160 --> 00:14:55,160 Speaker 4: the real big indicator that there was probably an injury 233 00:14:55,520 --> 00:14:59,520 Speaker 4: that was bleeding profusely enough that it would fall off 234 00:14:59,800 --> 00:15:01,800 Speaker 4: of her body. And by the way, the blood did 235 00:15:01,880 --> 00:15:06,320 Speaker 4: test as for Holly Bobo. Now Clint has to assume 236 00:15:06,600 --> 00:15:08,640 Speaker 4: it's his sister's blood when he sees it, which most 237 00:15:08,680 --> 00:15:13,240 Speaker 4: of us would. The bigger of the two could have 238 00:15:13,320 --> 00:15:15,560 Speaker 4: been put. It could have happened anyway. 239 00:15:15,600 --> 00:15:15,800 Speaker 8: You know. 240 00:15:15,880 --> 00:15:18,080 Speaker 4: You can fall down on something, you can sit on something. 241 00:15:18,440 --> 00:15:20,720 Speaker 4: You know, we know that she was kneeling in the garage. 242 00:15:21,160 --> 00:15:24,680 Speaker 4: And it's the blood drop that actually is the biggest 243 00:15:24,720 --> 00:15:27,440 Speaker 4: part of this because it shows it's a fresh cut 244 00:15:27,640 --> 00:15:30,680 Speaker 4: that is bleeding enough that it's not just a smear. 245 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:32,440 Speaker 4: You didn't just cut your finger and smear it on 246 00:15:32,480 --> 00:15:36,440 Speaker 4: the on the floor. It's actually dropping from your body 247 00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:40,600 Speaker 4: freely onto the floor, and it actually can indicate they'll 248 00:15:40,600 --> 00:15:42,720 Speaker 4: look at that blood to see if it's going towards 249 00:15:42,720 --> 00:15:45,760 Speaker 4: her car or away from her car. Was she attacked 250 00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:47,640 Speaker 4: on her way to the car? Was she surprised on 251 00:15:47,720 --> 00:15:49,680 Speaker 4: her You know, there's any number of ways that they'll 252 00:15:49,840 --> 00:15:53,120 Speaker 4: use that blood droplet to find out exactly how she 253 00:15:53,280 --> 00:15:56,280 Speaker 4: was attacked, when it happened, and who probably did it. 254 00:15:56,360 --> 00:15:59,840 Speaker 1: What does it mean when you take this blood spatter 255 00:16:00,080 --> 00:16:02,720 Speaker 1: conjunction with the story that Clint the brother is telling. 256 00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:07,320 Speaker 1: It's a very, very disturbing story. The search is on 257 00:16:07,320 --> 00:16:11,320 Speaker 1: on foot with dogs. The phone. Her phone tracks north 258 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:14,720 Speaker 1: to a wooded area near I forty. It stops moving. 259 00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:18,040 Speaker 1: Remember all this is happening in the early morning hour. 260 00:16:18,120 --> 00:16:20,520 Speaker 1: She gets up study at four point thirty a m. 261 00:16:21,520 --> 00:16:25,320 Speaker 1: She's heading to school, Mom's at work, Dad's at work. 262 00:16:26,040 --> 00:16:31,720 Speaker 1: The phone stops moving. By nine am, it begins moving again, 263 00:16:31,840 --> 00:16:35,120 Speaker 1: pinging back south toward the Bobo home, but on a 264 00:16:35,320 --> 00:16:39,120 Speaker 1: different route than a discovery. 265 00:16:39,320 --> 00:16:42,440 Speaker 4: Several items belonging to Holly are found scattered throughout the 266 00:16:42,480 --> 00:16:45,960 Speaker 4: area on country roads. Her lunch homework, a receipt with 267 00:16:46,040 --> 00:16:48,560 Speaker 4: her name on it, a card from school, her cell 268 00:16:48,600 --> 00:16:51,400 Speaker 4: phone and a SIM card which have been removed from 269 00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:51,920 Speaker 4: the phone. 270 00:16:52,160 --> 00:16:56,560 Speaker 1: Meany would argue that the discovery of her belonging, school papers, homework, 271 00:16:56,640 --> 00:17:01,680 Speaker 1: her lunch is random. No joining me is a veteran 272 00:17:01,720 --> 00:17:04,920 Speaker 1: trial lawyer criminal defense attorney Ben Powers, and you can 273 00:17:04,960 --> 00:17:09,960 Speaker 1: find him at legalpowers dot com. Ben, Please, if possible, 274 00:17:10,320 --> 00:17:14,600 Speaker 1: take off your defense hat just one moment. The fact 275 00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:20,520 Speaker 1: that her items were scattered along various country roads is significant. 276 00:17:20,840 --> 00:17:22,919 Speaker 1: It sounds like they were thrown out a window of 277 00:17:22,960 --> 00:17:27,000 Speaker 1: a vehicle. So now we have to figure out she 278 00:17:27,200 --> 00:17:30,119 Speaker 1: was walking being forced to walk by a guy and 279 00:17:30,240 --> 00:17:33,440 Speaker 1: camo of atrail that leads down to the Tennessee River. 280 00:17:34,320 --> 00:17:37,119 Speaker 1: But yet her items she would have had, like in 281 00:17:37,160 --> 00:17:41,040 Speaker 1: a backpack or in her arm, are scattered along various 282 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:47,320 Speaker 1: country roads. What if anything can I deduce from that, 283 00:17:47,480 --> 00:17:48,200 Speaker 1: Ben Powers? 284 00:17:48,400 --> 00:17:53,040 Speaker 8: So the first inference that I have is something's already 285 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:56,119 Speaker 8: happened to Hally by that point, something very serious has 286 00:17:56,160 --> 00:17:58,800 Speaker 8: probably already happened to or something grave has already happened 287 00:17:58,840 --> 00:18:01,880 Speaker 8: to her, because now they're trying to distance themselves from 288 00:18:01,880 --> 00:18:04,880 Speaker 8: her and her belongings, and they're just throwing them out 289 00:18:04,880 --> 00:18:06,800 Speaker 8: the window as they draw because they think that's the 290 00:18:06,800 --> 00:18:09,640 Speaker 8: best way to get rid of this backpack of contents 291 00:18:10,000 --> 00:18:12,400 Speaker 8: that they now have that they're trying to get themselves 292 00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:15,280 Speaker 8: away from, and in turn, what they've done is basically 293 00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:18,200 Speaker 8: create a trail of breadcrumbs in the direction that they 294 00:18:18,240 --> 00:18:20,880 Speaker 8: went to help pone in the investigation. 295 00:18:20,440 --> 00:18:21,200 Speaker 7: In that direction. 296 00:18:21,359 --> 00:18:24,880 Speaker 8: But my first impression is that it's a sign that 297 00:18:25,640 --> 00:18:28,840 Speaker 8: something bad had happened prior to that moment, and now 298 00:18:28,840 --> 00:18:32,359 Speaker 8: they're trying to distance themselves from that by getting rid 299 00:18:32,400 --> 00:18:34,560 Speaker 8: of any evidence that can tie them to Holly Bobo. 300 00:18:35,320 --> 00:18:38,560 Speaker 4: Investigators put together a timeline of what happened to Holly Bobo. 301 00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:41,520 Speaker 4: Waking up early to study for her test. Holly gets 302 00:18:41,520 --> 00:18:43,679 Speaker 4: a call boyfriend Drew at seven p thirty. Drew his 303 00:18:43,680 --> 00:18:46,240 Speaker 4: turkey hunting on Bobo family property with his dad about 304 00:18:46,320 --> 00:18:49,280 Speaker 4: thirty minutes away. Holly sends a text at seven forty 305 00:18:49,280 --> 00:18:53,080 Speaker 4: two am. Holly did not send or answer another text 306 00:18:53,119 --> 00:18:56,600 Speaker 4: or call after seven forty two am. At seven forty 307 00:18:56,640 --> 00:18:59,160 Speaker 4: three am, Holly walks to the car part to get 308 00:18:59,160 --> 00:19:00,320 Speaker 4: in her car and go to school. 309 00:19:00,760 --> 00:19:05,960 Speaker 1: The so called A train word gets around that the 310 00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:10,040 Speaker 1: A train may have had something to do with Holly 311 00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:14,040 Speaker 1: Bobo's disappearance. What is the A train? 312 00:19:14,200 --> 00:19:21,280 Speaker 9: I'll tell you it's Zach Adams, Shane Austin, Jason Autrey, 313 00:19:22,520 --> 00:19:30,119 Speaker 9: and Zach Adams's brother, John Dillon Adams Adams Adams, Austin Autrey. 314 00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:35,879 Speaker 1: Why is it that people cannot shut their pie holes? 315 00:19:36,920 --> 00:19:40,119 Speaker 1: How is it? Here we go to doctor Kendall Crowns 316 00:19:40,240 --> 00:19:44,600 Speaker 1: joining us. Now his expertise is dead bodies. But how 317 00:19:44,640 --> 00:19:47,320 Speaker 1: do the dead bodies get there? And how do we 318 00:19:47,640 --> 00:19:51,159 Speaker 1: solve cases? Doctor Kendall Crowns is with us the chief 319 00:19:51,320 --> 00:19:54,960 Speaker 1: medical Examiner Terran County. That's fort Worth, never a lack 320 00:19:54,960 --> 00:19:57,800 Speaker 1: of business. He is the star of a podcast about 321 00:19:57,840 --> 00:20:00,639 Speaker 1: to hear the airwaves Mayhem and the more. He is 322 00:20:00,680 --> 00:20:04,719 Speaker 1: the esteemed lecturer at the Burnett School of Medicine at TCU, 323 00:20:05,160 --> 00:20:09,639 Speaker 1: Dodger Kendl Crowns. For every dead body that is a 324 00:20:09,720 --> 00:20:13,320 Speaker 1: victim of homicide that you see on your table, I 325 00:20:13,480 --> 00:20:17,200 Speaker 1: guarantee you fifty percent of those cases are solved by 326 00:20:17,320 --> 00:20:23,120 Speaker 1: loose lips that sink ships. When you look at one 327 00:20:23,160 --> 00:20:26,960 Speaker 1: of the victims that you autopsy, that you cut apart 328 00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:32,320 Speaker 1: to determine cause of death, can you imagine that somewhere 329 00:20:32,359 --> 00:20:34,480 Speaker 1: out there a killer is bragging. 330 00:20:34,840 --> 00:20:35,080 Speaker 9: Yeah. 331 00:20:35,400 --> 00:20:39,040 Speaker 10: Often when I'm doing the autopsies, I think about what 332 00:20:39,160 --> 00:20:42,080 Speaker 10: the individual who may have done this is doing right 333 00:20:42,080 --> 00:20:45,199 Speaker 10: at that present time. Often they're already in custody, but 334 00:20:45,480 --> 00:20:47,960 Speaker 10: sometimes they're not, and you kind of always have to wonder, 335 00:20:48,080 --> 00:20:50,120 Speaker 10: did you walk past them on your way into work 336 00:20:50,160 --> 00:20:53,720 Speaker 10: that day, did you run into them at the grocery store, 337 00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:55,919 Speaker 10: or something of that nature. You never know, but you 338 00:20:56,000 --> 00:20:59,119 Speaker 10: are right, Nancy. People really love to boast about the 339 00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:02,439 Speaker 10: things they do and the evil that they commit on 340 00:21:02,480 --> 00:21:07,040 Speaker 10: other individuals. 341 00:21:10,560 --> 00:21:18,199 Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace, nothing is stronger than a 342 00:21:18,240 --> 00:21:22,120 Speaker 1: mother's love. Nothing stronger on this earth than a mother's love. 343 00:21:23,040 --> 00:21:28,760 Speaker 1: It is said, much like Natalie Holloway's mother Beth confronted 344 00:21:29,480 --> 00:21:33,520 Speaker 1: Natalie's killer, trying to get the truth. Of course, you 345 00:21:33,560 --> 00:21:36,240 Speaker 1: Gorn van der Sloot totally blew her off such an 346 00:21:36,280 --> 00:21:43,480 Speaker 1: a whole technical legal term. Here, Holly's mother hears the rumblings, 347 00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:47,399 Speaker 1: hears their rumors that a train had something to do 348 00:21:47,440 --> 00:21:50,760 Speaker 1: with Holly's disappearance. At this time, she has no idea 349 00:21:50,840 --> 00:21:54,320 Speaker 1: where her daughter is, and she confronts. 350 00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:57,720 Speaker 4: Them Karen Tadd, Zach Adams, and Jason Audrey when they 351 00:21:57,760 --> 00:21:59,760 Speaker 4: were in grade school, and knows the type of men 352 00:21:59,800 --> 00:22:02,000 Speaker 4: they are. All deny any involvement. 353 00:22:02,600 --> 00:22:06,720 Speaker 1: I asked them, did they know anything about our daughter's abduction? 354 00:22:06,960 --> 00:22:09,639 Speaker 1: Of course they all denied it. That from our friends 355 00:22:09,680 --> 00:22:14,160 Speaker 1: at ABC twenty twenty. Well, to use a technical legal 356 00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:16,760 Speaker 1: term on you, doctor Angela Arnold, she's got balls the 357 00:22:16,840 --> 00:22:17,800 Speaker 1: size of coconuts. 358 00:22:17,920 --> 00:22:21,640 Speaker 5: Well, she sure does. And Nancy, you need to have 359 00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:23,800 Speaker 5: balls the size of coconuts to take care of your 360 00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:26,720 Speaker 5: own children when things like this happen, because you can't 361 00:22:26,800 --> 00:22:28,720 Speaker 5: leave it in anyone else's hands. 362 00:22:29,119 --> 00:22:30,439 Speaker 1: I don't blame her in the least for. 363 00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:34,640 Speaker 5: Going after these kids and confronting them and asking them 364 00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:35,160 Speaker 5: what they did. 365 00:22:35,280 --> 00:22:37,440 Speaker 1: Why are you calling them kids? Well, I believe on 366 00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:40,720 Speaker 1: a train I called them kids. I believe you did 367 00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:44,040 Speaker 1: when she taught them they were kids. These are grown men. 368 00:22:45,080 --> 00:22:47,040 Speaker 5: And you know what, Nancy, maybe that had something to 369 00:22:47,080 --> 00:22:49,000 Speaker 5: do with the fact that she was able to confront them. 370 00:22:49,040 --> 00:22:51,679 Speaker 5: Also because maybe she thought of them as kids because 371 00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:53,360 Speaker 5: they were kids when she. 372 00:22:53,920 --> 00:22:55,120 Speaker 1: Knew them and taught them. 373 00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:58,160 Speaker 5: I understand that they're grown men and they should all 374 00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:02,199 Speaker 5: go away for grown men consequences for what they did 375 00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:03,160 Speaker 5: to this beautiful girl. 376 00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:06,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, you know what, you said something really interesting right there, Well, 377 00:23:06,080 --> 00:23:09,080 Speaker 1: a lot really interesting, but the fact that she knew them. 378 00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:15,320 Speaker 1: She taught two of them fourth grade. And yes, the 379 00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:19,440 Speaker 1: word is they took Holly Bobo out of her own 380 00:23:19,560 --> 00:23:24,080 Speaker 1: car port on her way to nursing school, a girl 381 00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:29,600 Speaker 1: they knew. If this is true. So at that juncture, 382 00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:33,119 Speaker 1: straight out to Shane Dieer, what did the A train 383 00:23:33,320 --> 00:23:35,040 Speaker 1: have to say back? I bet they got a big 384 00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:38,600 Speaker 1: laugh off Holly's mother coming to ask them where's Holly. 385 00:23:38,840 --> 00:23:41,520 Speaker 3: They claimed that they had nothing to do with it, 386 00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:46,959 Speaker 3: and you know, they were out bragging about it. And 387 00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:50,440 Speaker 3: the mother was listening to these stories. And you talk 388 00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:54,640 Speaker 3: about someone that's involved, it was her daughter. And then 389 00:23:54,720 --> 00:24:00,080 Speaker 3: she taught these kids, she knows them, and h this 390 00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:03,600 Speaker 3: is Bobo is a mama bear. She went after them, 391 00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:07,200 Speaker 3: I mean, and that's you know, I hear a bunch 392 00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:09,919 Speaker 3: of stories. Is that's how cases are solved, is a 393 00:24:10,040 --> 00:24:11,680 Speaker 3: parent gets involved. 394 00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:14,520 Speaker 1: In has to go after the people. 395 00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:18,240 Speaker 3: And that's so dangerous. That shows you how brave the 396 00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:18,960 Speaker 3: mother is. 397 00:24:19,119 --> 00:24:24,560 Speaker 1: Shane Dieter, You are so right, Shane Deeter joining us 398 00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:27,560 Speaker 1: from this jurisdiction off Tennessee, who was on the case 399 00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:32,600 Speaker 1: of the very very beginning. So the mom goes after them, 400 00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:37,080 Speaker 1: the so called a train and they laugh her off. 401 00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:42,399 Speaker 1: But the word is bubbling around this tiny, tiny town 402 00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:46,080 Speaker 1: in Tennessee. The word is bubbling that the a train 403 00:24:46,280 --> 00:24:48,160 Speaker 1: is somehow responsible. 404 00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:52,960 Speaker 4: And then a break, a random arrest of Dylan Adams 405 00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:56,240 Speaker 4: on a weapons charge cracks the ice. Adams tells police 406 00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:58,800 Speaker 4: in April thirteenth, he went to Za's house to get 407 00:24:58,800 --> 00:25:02,000 Speaker 4: his truck and saw Bobo sitting in a green share 408 00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:04,040 Speaker 4: in the living room wearing a pink T shirt, with 409 00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:08,639 Speaker 4: Jason Autry standing nearby. Adams also tells police his brother 410 00:25:08,760 --> 00:25:12,040 Speaker 4: was wearing chemouflage shorts, black cut off sleeve T shirt, 411 00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:15,200 Speaker 4: and a pair of green crocs. Adams says brothers Zach 412 00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:18,080 Speaker 4: Adams told him he raped Holly Bobo and videotaped it. 413 00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:22,080 Speaker 4: This confession led to Zach Adams, Jason Autry, and Shane Austen. 414 00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:26,479 Speaker 4: His confession led to Jason Autry agreeing to testify against 415 00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:27,280 Speaker 4: Zach Adams. 416 00:25:27,359 --> 00:25:30,000 Speaker 11: And now you're saying that Sane Austen is sitting room. 417 00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:39,399 Speaker 11: You're sitting man, Jason Alfrey sitting a kijay? Is there 418 00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:40,359 Speaker 11: anybody else us? 419 00:25:40,400 --> 00:25:49,240 Speaker 1: All? Was Holly BOI nap? Will she? Oh my stars? 420 00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:52,879 Speaker 1: That's for our friends at ABC twenty twenty. Let me 421 00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:57,760 Speaker 1: understand has been Powers, so nobody knows what's happened to Holly. 422 00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:02,399 Speaker 1: The mom confronts the h about their potential involvement. Do 423 00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:05,000 Speaker 1: they know where she is? She's desperate? You know why? 424 00:26:05,560 --> 00:26:11,560 Speaker 1: Because Zach Adams has been bragging. Don't you love a 425 00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:15,840 Speaker 1: bragger for a client that can't keep his piehole shut, 426 00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:20,640 Speaker 1: saying things like to his girlfriend, you gonna end up 427 00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:24,640 Speaker 1: tied up in a hole just like Holly, Or I'll 428 00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:27,960 Speaker 1: do the same thing to you. I did Holly bragging 429 00:26:28,040 --> 00:26:32,120 Speaker 1: the bravado he must have had saying all that, and 430 00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:35,239 Speaker 1: it gets around. You can't say things like that as 431 00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:39,240 Speaker 1: a small town and nobody find out. Well, mom found 432 00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:42,960 Speaker 1: out in confronted him and don't you know, Ben Powers. 433 00:26:43,240 --> 00:26:47,800 Speaker 1: The first minute they could arrest the brother, Dylan John 434 00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:53,119 Speaker 1: Dylan Adams, brother of Zack the Bragger, they started putting 435 00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:55,720 Speaker 1: the screws to him, right yeah. 436 00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:58,439 Speaker 8: I mean once they started really drilling him about the 437 00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:02,120 Speaker 8: details and getting him to admit very incriminating things like 438 00:27:02,400 --> 00:27:04,400 Speaker 8: you know she's in their home, she's wearing a pink 439 00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:06,560 Speaker 8: T shirt. These are the guys that are with me. 440 00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:08,960 Speaker 8: This is who did what and this is the condition 441 00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:11,960 Speaker 8: of things, and this is what happened. I mean, from 442 00:27:12,040 --> 00:27:14,080 Speaker 8: that point, it's just a matter of trying to corroborate 443 00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:16,919 Speaker 8: what he's saying. If you're the state, if you're on 444 00:27:16,960 --> 00:27:19,280 Speaker 8: the defense side, you're pointing out all the ways his 445 00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:22,440 Speaker 8: story doesn't match the physical evidence that they've collected, and 446 00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:26,760 Speaker 8: doesn't match other electronic data like self ping data and 447 00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:29,520 Speaker 8: other messages that might be recovered from cell phones and 448 00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:32,080 Speaker 8: things like that. But that's where it goes next, is 449 00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:35,480 Speaker 8: you try to either build a statement or discredit the statement. 450 00:27:35,640 --> 00:27:40,560 Speaker 1: Right Todd Shipley joining US former detective Sergeant Reno Nevada 451 00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:44,959 Speaker 1: author surviving a cyber attack. Hey Todd. Also the level 452 00:27:45,160 --> 00:27:51,040 Speaker 1: of detail in John Dillon's description. He gets to the 453 00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:53,080 Speaker 1: house and there he sees Holly Bobo in a pink 454 00:27:53,119 --> 00:27:56,560 Speaker 1: shot a pink top sitting there. His brother is wearing 455 00:27:56,600 --> 00:28:00,880 Speaker 1: camo shorts, a black cutoff T shirt and green crocs, 456 00:28:01,119 --> 00:28:06,000 Speaker 1: and the brother brags that they Holly and videoed it. 457 00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:10,320 Speaker 1: That's a lot of detail for somebody to make up. 458 00:28:10,520 --> 00:28:13,240 Speaker 7: Well, it depends on what they're trying to defend themselves with. 459 00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:16,160 Speaker 7: Are they trying to put the blame on somebody else 460 00:28:16,760 --> 00:28:20,439 Speaker 7: and give very detailed information about what they supposedly did 461 00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:22,199 Speaker 7: and when it could have been himself that did it. 462 00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:25,600 Speaker 7: I'm not sure that we know all those facts. And 463 00:28:25,680 --> 00:28:28,840 Speaker 7: as mentioned earlier by your guest, was the details don't 464 00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:31,280 Speaker 7: match up with the evidence, and that becomes problematic and 465 00:28:31,720 --> 00:28:34,919 Speaker 7: where the prosecution or the law enforcement is going to 466 00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:37,720 Speaker 7: go with the evidence. Do they disprove what he said 467 00:28:38,120 --> 00:28:40,720 Speaker 7: or do they try to build their case around that statement, 468 00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:43,680 Speaker 7: And that becomes a very difficult thing to live. 469 00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:57,479 Speaker 1: Crime Stores with Nancy Grace, what happened to Holly Bobo 470 00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:01,880 Speaker 1: and will her killer now walk through? Is that possible? 471 00:29:02,040 --> 00:29:05,640 Speaker 1: In what world can that happen? Because not only do 472 00:29:05,720 --> 00:29:09,200 Speaker 1: we have the brother of Zachary Adams when he gets 473 00:29:09,280 --> 00:29:13,000 Speaker 1: arrested on an unrelated gun charge, spill it all about 474 00:29:13,040 --> 00:29:19,320 Speaker 1: Holly being and murdered, Now we have another member of 475 00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:24,680 Speaker 1: the so called a train singing like a nightingale. Listen, 476 00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:26,560 Speaker 1: I'm standing over the top of them. 477 00:29:28,400 --> 00:29:29,200 Speaker 7: On my knees. 478 00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:37,400 Speaker 8: She being rocky, see. 479 00:29:37,360 --> 00:29:44,560 Speaker 10: Foot sound of distress. 480 00:29:44,520 --> 00:29:48,520 Speaker 1: Called from I told him my sage, You're still alive. 481 00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:51,400 Speaker 1: From our friends at ABC twenty twenty, that's Jason Autry 482 00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:56,160 Speaker 1: describing what happened to Holly Bobo? I mean, did you 483 00:29:56,560 --> 00:30:00,400 Speaker 1: hear that, Doctor Kendall Crowns, He just he drives a 484 00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:04,720 Speaker 1: multicolored blanket that is in the back of one of 485 00:30:04,760 --> 00:30:09,320 Speaker 1: the other perpse truck and he's looking at it, and 486 00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:14,760 Speaker 1: the foot moves and he hears an audible sigh and 487 00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:18,000 Speaker 1: they realize Holly Bobo is still alive. 488 00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:22,800 Speaker 10: Yes, that can happen occasionally in murders where the individual 489 00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:26,040 Speaker 10: is found to still be alive after the initial assault 490 00:30:26,040 --> 00:30:28,440 Speaker 10: that they thought they killed him with. Often we see 491 00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:32,200 Speaker 10: this in strangulations. And what happens then is they will 492 00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:34,840 Speaker 10: use whatever means they have available to make sure they 493 00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:37,440 Speaker 10: end that person's life so that person can't wake up 494 00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:39,920 Speaker 10: and testify against him at a later date. They may 495 00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:42,480 Speaker 10: beat their head into with a rock. If they have 496 00:30:42,600 --> 00:30:46,200 Speaker 10: knives available, they may stab them even multiple times. I've 497 00:30:46,240 --> 00:30:48,840 Speaker 10: even seen them try to cut heads off, and then 498 00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:51,160 Speaker 10: they'll also in this case shoot them in the head 499 00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:51,680 Speaker 10: with a gun. 500 00:30:51,760 --> 00:30:54,600 Speaker 1: And Doctor Angela Arnold, did you hear the callous nature? 501 00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:58,920 Speaker 1: Did Witch re referred to Holly? He sees the foot move, 502 00:30:59,280 --> 00:31:01,280 Speaker 1: he sees her foot and if he hears her sigh, 503 00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:05,000 Speaker 1: and he says, this still alive. 504 00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:09,760 Speaker 5: Oh well, Nancy, they never, they never didn't have a 505 00:31:09,840 --> 00:31:15,240 Speaker 5: callous feeling towards her. They kidnapped her, they murdered her. 506 00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:18,360 Speaker 5: They never had any warm and fuzzy feelings towards her. 507 00:31:18,480 --> 00:31:22,520 Speaker 5: So that just describes how all of them are. Okay, Nancy, 508 00:31:22,560 --> 00:31:25,040 Speaker 5: there are a bunch of psychopaths. There are a bunch 509 00:31:25,080 --> 00:31:29,600 Speaker 5: of psychopaths. They wanted to rape her. And you know, Nancy, 510 00:31:29,600 --> 00:31:32,080 Speaker 5: what the sad thing is. You know when we talk 511 00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:36,480 Speaker 5: about she was gay, Nancy, not just one of them, 512 00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:43,040 Speaker 5: She was gay. This poor woman suffered unmercifully at the 513 00:31:43,080 --> 00:31:45,840 Speaker 5: hands of these horrific psychopaths. 514 00:31:46,120 --> 00:31:49,400 Speaker 1: Talk about singing like a bird. Listen, an Autrey, good 515 00:31:49,480 --> 00:32:01,800 Speaker 1: Tim William John one up shall underneath that bridge. It 516 00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:03,600 Speaker 1: was just one shot, but it echoed. 517 00:32:03,320 --> 00:32:05,920 Speaker 11: Underneath the bridge all the way down that damn river body. 518 00:32:06,600 --> 00:32:11,680 Speaker 3: And when that gun went, birds whatever, all up under 519 00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:15,440 Speaker 3: that breed and it was just dead silence or just 520 00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:16,040 Speaker 3: a shot. 521 00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:19,280 Speaker 1: From my friends at ABC twenty twenty, Bienpowers, criminal defense attorney, 522 00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:21,840 Speaker 1: Why isn't all your clients have guns that just go off? 523 00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:26,360 Speaker 1: Nobody ever says he shot her under the bridge and 524 00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:30,880 Speaker 1: then it echoed twice. It sounded like three gunshots from 525 00:32:30,920 --> 00:32:35,400 Speaker 1: the echo under that concrete bridge, and then the birds 526 00:32:35,440 --> 00:32:38,800 Speaker 1: flew up in the air and then everything was dead, silent. 527 00:32:39,000 --> 00:32:42,280 Speaker 1: How what all your clients, the gun just goes off. 528 00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:43,680 Speaker 1: Nobody pulls it to that. 529 00:32:43,720 --> 00:32:46,520 Speaker 8: I have all my clients that the guns just goes off. 530 00:32:46,760 --> 00:32:48,440 Speaker 8: I think the state trust to put a gun in 531 00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:51,680 Speaker 8: my client's hands. Instead they used it intentionally. But that 532 00:32:51,800 --> 00:32:55,160 Speaker 8: always that doesn't always match the forensic evidence that we 533 00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:57,080 Speaker 8: have in the case. But that's certainly what the state 534 00:32:57,240 --> 00:32:59,920 Speaker 8: likes to do. Is it's cleaner to say this person 535 00:33:00,080 --> 00:33:01,640 Speaker 8: Shawn intentionally. 536 00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:07,480 Speaker 1: Those pasty guns that just go off with such incredible 537 00:33:08,120 --> 00:33:12,520 Speaker 1: precision that they actually kill the victim when they just 538 00:33:12,800 --> 00:33:16,360 Speaker 1: go off, And that's what they're saying here. Autry, he's singing, 539 00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:21,920 Speaker 1: but he ain't singing on tune because he's saying the 540 00:33:22,040 --> 00:33:27,120 Speaker 1: gun went off and boom, boom boom from the three 541 00:33:27,240 --> 00:33:32,160 Speaker 1: the shot and the two echoes underneath the bridge and 542 00:33:32,200 --> 00:33:39,240 Speaker 1: the birds fly off. Now we have a problem. We've 543 00:33:39,240 --> 00:33:49,840 Speaker 1: got John Dillon Adams confessing. We have Autry testifying in 544 00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:54,880 Speaker 1: the hopes that someday, somehow he'll get a plea a 545 00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:59,800 Speaker 1: cheap plea, but yet it's still a no body k 546 00:34:00,280 --> 00:34:04,120 Speaker 1: how hard is it to prove and nobody tastes being powers. 547 00:34:04,320 --> 00:34:06,120 Speaker 8: Well, I think it's really hard for the state because 548 00:34:06,120 --> 00:34:09,000 Speaker 8: they're going to rely on probably not the most outstanding 549 00:34:09,080 --> 00:34:11,880 Speaker 8: witness or witnesses, and you know, they're probably not the 550 00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:13,960 Speaker 8: first choice for the state on who they put on 551 00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:15,960 Speaker 8: a stand because I'm sure they have a lot of 552 00:34:16,040 --> 00:34:21,120 Speaker 8: character flaws, possible drug abuse histories, things like that. I 553 00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:26,280 Speaker 8: believe one or all of them were pretty familiar character flaws. 554 00:34:26,320 --> 00:34:30,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, did you just say possible flaws? You mean a 555 00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:32,480 Speaker 1: rap sheet as long as I seventy five? Is that 556 00:34:32,560 --> 00:34:34,120 Speaker 1: a possible flaw in your mind? 557 00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:37,719 Speaker 8: That's one example of a possible flaw. But yeah, that's 558 00:34:38,080 --> 00:34:41,440 Speaker 8: a rap sheet. Just bad character. I mean, even the 559 00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:44,400 Speaker 8: ones that are testifying are involved. You know, they're not 560 00:34:44,440 --> 00:34:46,960 Speaker 8: a good Samaritan. They're just trying to help themselves. And 561 00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:50,600 Speaker 8: so that brings into some concern are they really testifying 562 00:34:51,120 --> 00:34:53,120 Speaker 8: to do the right thing or are they testifying to 563 00:34:53,160 --> 00:34:57,960 Speaker 8: save themselves? To the forensics, And with that, I don't 564 00:34:57,960 --> 00:34:58,239 Speaker 8: have to. 565 00:34:58,200 --> 00:35:03,399 Speaker 1: Worry about it because it's just Heaven drops another bombshell 566 00:35:04,280 --> 00:35:05,920 Speaker 1: in the States. Lat listen. 567 00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:08,640 Speaker 6: Six months after the arrest of Dylan Adams and subsequent 568 00:35:08,719 --> 00:35:11,480 Speaker 6: arrest of others, Larry Stone is hunting ginseeing in a 569 00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:14,279 Speaker 6: wooded area about twenty miles from Darden. Stone says he 570 00:35:14,320 --> 00:35:16,480 Speaker 6: saw a large bucket in the woods and beneath the 571 00:35:16,480 --> 00:35:20,040 Speaker 6: bucket he found a human skull. Investigators recover the skull 572 00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:24,160 Speaker 6: and other remains in the area and positively identify Holly Bobo. 573 00:35:24,480 --> 00:35:27,040 Speaker 6: Her skull has a bullet hole in the back and 574 00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:29,799 Speaker 6: fracturing her cheekbone as it exited straight out. 575 00:35:29,840 --> 00:35:33,600 Speaker 1: To doctor Kendall Crown's chief medical examiner, Terrance County Star 576 00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:38,200 Speaker 1: on Mayhem in the Morgue, Doctor Kendall crowns decipher what 577 00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:42,960 Speaker 1: we just learned that was found by two gen saying hunters, 578 00:35:43,239 --> 00:35:46,239 Speaker 1: they see a bucket, they look under the bucket. Of 579 00:35:46,280 --> 00:35:48,520 Speaker 1: course they looked under the bucket. They couldn't help themselves, 580 00:35:48,600 --> 00:35:50,520 Speaker 1: and they find Holly Bobo's skull. 581 00:35:50,800 --> 00:35:53,960 Speaker 10: So what they described is the skull had no flesh 582 00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:56,439 Speaker 10: on it and had an entrance wound in the back 583 00:35:56,520 --> 00:35:58,840 Speaker 10: right side of the head and an eggsit wound on 584 00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:01,600 Speaker 10: the left side of the facial bones of the cheek. 585 00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:05,080 Speaker 10: So it showed that she was kind of executed by 586 00:36:05,080 --> 00:36:07,239 Speaker 10: a single gunshot wound to the back of the head. 587 00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:10,840 Speaker 1: Doctor crowns, how do you explain the fact that only 588 00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:14,719 Speaker 1: a few of her bones were found. That doesn't necessarily 589 00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:17,040 Speaker 1: mean she was dismembered, does it? It does not. 590 00:36:17,280 --> 00:36:22,239 Speaker 10: Sometimes when an individual dies in a wooded area, animals 591 00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:28,560 Speaker 10: come out and they scavenge. The vultures, crows, if there's razor, 592 00:36:28,840 --> 00:36:32,440 Speaker 10: hogs in the area, tye oats, anything can come in 593 00:36:32,600 --> 00:36:36,440 Speaker 10: and take parts of the body away, and they'll spread 594 00:36:36,440 --> 00:36:41,400 Speaker 10: them over a wide, vast area of the wooded spot, 595 00:36:41,480 --> 00:36:43,719 Speaker 10: and you will find bones everywhere, and in fact, they 596 00:36:43,719 --> 00:36:46,399 Speaker 10: can drag them off for miles and you may never 597 00:36:46,480 --> 00:36:48,040 Speaker 10: find all that person again. 598 00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:50,640 Speaker 4: The caate hook years to solve and longer to get 599 00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:53,839 Speaker 4: to court, But once there, Prosecutor Paul Hagerman laid out 600 00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:56,880 Speaker 4: Zach Adams told Jason Audrey that he, Jane Austen, and 601 00:36:56,960 --> 00:37:00,759 Speaker 4: John Dylan Adams had kidnapped and Colly Autrey saw a 602 00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:02,799 Speaker 4: blanket in the bed of adams truck. There was a 603 00:37:02,840 --> 00:37:05,680 Speaker 4: body in the blanket. Hagerman says, Autry has been offered 604 00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:07,960 Speaker 4: immunity to testify, and that going to tell the jury 605 00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:11,400 Speaker 4: he asked, sag Adams, how did this blank get in 606 00:37:11,480 --> 00:37:14,000 Speaker 4: your truck? The plan was to gut her body so 607 00:37:14,080 --> 00:37:16,600 Speaker 4: it would sink in the water, but Holly moved and 608 00:37:16,680 --> 00:37:19,720 Speaker 4: made a noise. That's when Zach Adams got a gun 609 00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:22,080 Speaker 4: and shot Holly in the back of the head. He 610 00:37:22,239 --> 00:37:32,080 Speaker 4: hurt her, he killed, she. 611 00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:42,800 Speaker 7: Held her up, she fragged about it, and he almost. 612 00:37:42,440 --> 00:37:46,200 Speaker 1: Got away from our friends that law news. So let 613 00:37:46,239 --> 00:37:54,839 Speaker 1: me understand, Shane Deeert. These guys convicted. How is it 614 00:37:56,480 --> 00:38:02,840 Speaker 1: that's some way the lee member on the A train 615 00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:07,160 Speaker 1: could walk free? How can this be? 616 00:38:07,440 --> 00:38:12,600 Speaker 3: My understanding is Nancy that Audrey has began did his 617 00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:16,399 Speaker 3: testimony and has admitted that he did it to get 618 00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:21,319 Speaker 3: a deal. And that's you know where we're staying. When 619 00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:24,719 Speaker 3: you lose your star witness, h then. 620 00:38:24,640 --> 00:38:27,279 Speaker 1: You got hold on just a moment, Shane Diner, let 621 00:38:27,280 --> 00:38:32,680 Speaker 1: me understand something. So we've got Jason Autrey testifying a 622 00:38:32,719 --> 00:38:35,919 Speaker 1: trial with a story so rich in detail it's hard 623 00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:40,359 Speaker 1: not to believe, even talking about his own involvement. But then, 624 00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:46,600 Speaker 1: let's don't forget about being powers that John Dylon Adams 625 00:38:46,640 --> 00:38:52,720 Speaker 1: also took a guilty play to thirty five years behind bars. 626 00:38:53,000 --> 00:38:56,560 Speaker 1: So what they're gonna plead guilty to thirty five years 627 00:38:56,560 --> 00:39:00,520 Speaker 1: and eight years, respectively, because they didn't do it well. 628 00:39:00,520 --> 00:39:02,080 Speaker 8: I think they're going to take a plea in that 629 00:39:02,160 --> 00:39:05,480 Speaker 8: situation because the state's got a witness that they're concerned 630 00:39:05,480 --> 00:39:08,000 Speaker 8: about testifying and being able to put it all together 631 00:39:08,320 --> 00:39:11,520 Speaker 8: in a compelling way. And what they're looking at is 632 00:39:11,560 --> 00:39:16,239 Speaker 8: the possibility of life without parole, or the next best 633 00:39:16,239 --> 00:39:18,840 Speaker 8: thing would be life with parole, which is fifty one years. 634 00:39:18,960 --> 00:39:22,160 Speaker 8: And so under those circumstances, there's a lot of motive 635 00:39:22,200 --> 00:39:24,680 Speaker 8: to take a plea that doesn't always have to do 636 00:39:24,840 --> 00:39:28,160 Speaker 8: with guilt or innocence, but rather self preservation. 637 00:39:28,480 --> 00:39:34,520 Speaker 1: Now, isn't it also true to Dave Mac that when 638 00:39:34,560 --> 00:39:37,400 Speaker 1: I said it was critical where her discarded items are found, 639 00:39:38,160 --> 00:39:42,560 Speaker 1: that many of them were found just seventy five feet 640 00:39:42,800 --> 00:39:47,479 Speaker 1: from one of the purpose driveways. Another coincidence, Dave Mac. 641 00:39:47,600 --> 00:39:50,320 Speaker 4: The fascinating part about where those items are found me 642 00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:53,360 Speaker 4: as as you pointed out, is these men were familiar 643 00:39:53,480 --> 00:39:55,880 Speaker 4: so much with the area that they were driving the 644 00:39:55,920 --> 00:39:58,560 Speaker 4: first drive away from the house and then back towards 645 00:39:58,600 --> 00:40:00,600 Speaker 4: it on different roads, but back in this day direction, 646 00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:04,040 Speaker 4: seventy five feet from Shane Austen's front door. That's where 647 00:40:04,080 --> 00:40:07,399 Speaker 4: they found a receipt with Holly Bobo's name on it. Now, 648 00:40:07,640 --> 00:40:10,440 Speaker 4: you mentioned a minute ago about the guilty pleas and 649 00:40:10,480 --> 00:40:13,600 Speaker 4: things like that, of the four members of the A train, 650 00:40:14,920 --> 00:40:18,359 Speaker 4: only Zach Adams actually went to trial. You know, we've 651 00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:21,920 Speaker 4: got Audrey rolling over on everybody and creating such an 652 00:40:21,960 --> 00:40:25,200 Speaker 4: incredible story on the stand. Is so articulate. The judge 653 00:40:25,239 --> 00:40:26,919 Speaker 4: that he was the best witness he had ever seen. 654 00:40:27,800 --> 00:40:31,719 Speaker 4: John Dillon Adams, you know, he just he was the 655 00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:33,839 Speaker 4: reason that even got an arrest to start with, when 656 00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:37,680 Speaker 4: there was no body found. And Shane Austen actually committed 657 00:40:37,719 --> 00:40:42,280 Speaker 4: suicide in February of twenty fifteen. So he commits suicide 658 00:40:42,320 --> 00:40:43,000 Speaker 4: and they never get it. 659 00:40:43,040 --> 00:40:44,480 Speaker 1: Police under why. 660 00:40:45,160 --> 00:40:46,120 Speaker 4: But they offered him. 661 00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:51,120 Speaker 1: As killing Holly Bobo and commit suicide. So two of 662 00:40:51,160 --> 00:40:54,040 Speaker 1: them take to play. One commits suicide in the other 663 00:40:54,080 --> 00:40:57,200 Speaker 1: coast to trial and is now saying it's all a 664 00:40:57,200 --> 00:40:59,200 Speaker 1: big line. But let me ask you one more thing. 665 00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:06,520 Speaker 1: Isn't true, Dave Mack that Autrey gave the statement about 666 00:41:06,520 --> 00:41:09,520 Speaker 1: how Holly Bobo was shot once in the back of 667 00:41:09,520 --> 00:41:15,520 Speaker 1: the head. Then the skull is found and lo and behold, 668 00:41:15,719 --> 00:41:21,399 Speaker 1: it's exactly what he says happened, exactly as Autry describes it. 669 00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:23,719 Speaker 4: Odd that you would tell the truth and claim it's 670 00:41:23,760 --> 00:41:26,400 Speaker 4: a lie. You know, none of it makes sense, But 671 00:41:26,480 --> 00:41:30,160 Speaker 4: I don't know. When you've got lifelong criminals and drug 672 00:41:30,160 --> 00:41:33,239 Speaker 4: addicts and dealers, you can't believe anything they're saying. But 673 00:41:33,320 --> 00:41:35,279 Speaker 4: when they tell the truth and it matches up with 674 00:41:35,320 --> 00:41:38,000 Speaker 4: the evidence you've got, I kind of think you go 675 00:41:38,040 --> 00:41:38,960 Speaker 4: ahead and believe that. 676 00:41:39,160 --> 00:41:42,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, especially in light of the fact that they describe 677 00:41:42,520 --> 00:41:47,399 Speaker 1: what happened before the skull is found, So I guess 678 00:41:47,440 --> 00:41:51,160 Speaker 1: they're clairvoyant. Yet again, this is coming to the court 679 00:41:51,320 --> 00:41:55,799 Speaker 1: under a very little used writ of quorum and nabis, 680 00:41:56,080 --> 00:42:00,719 Speaker 1: which means that, according to the convicted killer, Zachary Adams, 681 00:42:00,800 --> 00:42:05,800 Speaker 1: he wants to correct the record of its factual inaccuracies. 682 00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:09,360 Speaker 12: Zachary adams former lead defense attorney, has testified before a 683 00:42:09,360 --> 00:42:12,799 Speaker 12: Harden County judge that she does not believe she was 684 00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:17,480 Speaker 12: a competent, effective capital defender during Adam's twenty seventeen trial. 685 00:42:17,840 --> 00:42:21,359 Speaker 12: She was depressed, she told the court, overwhelmed by an 686 00:42:21,440 --> 00:42:25,480 Speaker 12: electronic discovery dump and facing a judge she believed would 687 00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:29,360 Speaker 12: get a conviction no matter what. During the trial, prosecutors 688 00:42:29,400 --> 00:42:34,520 Speaker 12: instead relied largely on Autrey's testimony, along with statements attributed 689 00:42:34,560 --> 00:42:38,279 Speaker 12: to John Dylan Adams and several jail house witnesses who 690 00:42:38,320 --> 00:42:44,320 Speaker 12: claimed Zachary Adams made incriminating comments. Attorney Jennifer Thompson alleges, 691 00:42:44,400 --> 00:42:48,720 Speaker 12: after reviewing the discovery, she believes Autrey crafted his statement 692 00:42:48,760 --> 00:42:52,640 Speaker 12: and other witnesses followed along. What's more, the judge denied 693 00:42:52,680 --> 00:42:57,160 Speaker 12: her request for Austin's former attorney to join her trial team, 694 00:42:57,640 --> 00:43:00,359 Speaker 12: leaving her with more digital discovery than she she could 695 00:43:00,400 --> 00:43:05,480 Speaker 12: handle alone. Thompson said she considered withdrawing, but didn't because 696 00:43:05,520 --> 00:43:08,600 Speaker 12: she was afraid Adams would be pressured into a plea. 697 00:43:09,360 --> 00:43:12,880 Speaker 12: A judge is now considering what Thompson says she failed 698 00:43:12,920 --> 00:43:17,080 Speaker 12: to do at trial in essence her ineffectiveness at trial. 699 00:43:17,840 --> 00:43:20,560 Speaker 12: Zachary adams bid for a new trial continues at the 700 00:43:20,640 --> 00:43:23,600 Speaker 12: end of this month December twenty ninth, and thirtieth for 701 00:43:23,680 --> 00:43:28,080 Speaker 12: the state's remaining witnesses and closing arguments. A written ruling 702 00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:31,440 Speaker 12: is expected to be issued within sixty days of the 703 00:43:31,440 --> 00:43:36,680 Speaker 12: hearings conclusion. If the judge grants Adams relief. Prosecutors would 704 00:43:36,760 --> 00:43:40,480 Speaker 12: have to decide whether to retry Adams or walk away. 705 00:43:41,280 --> 00:43:44,480 Speaker 1: We wait as justice unfolds, and now we remember an 706 00:43:44,480 --> 00:43:49,560 Speaker 1: American hero police officer, Ciarra Burton, just twenty eight years old, 707 00:43:50,160 --> 00:43:56,800 Speaker 1: shot and killed at a traffic stop, survived by fiance 708 00:43:57,360 --> 00:44:03,480 Speaker 1: set to be wed in just nine days. Sierra and 709 00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:13,400 Speaker 1: K nine partner Brev American hero police officer Siarra Burton. 710 00:44:14,560 --> 00:44:17,600 Speaker 1: Nancy Grace signing off goodbye friend