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Speaker 1: You're listening to I Choose Me with Jenny Garth. Hi, everybody,

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Speaker 1: welcome to I Choose Me.

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Speaker 2: This podcast is all about the choices we make and

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Speaker 2: where they lead us. This is a special day today

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Speaker 2: on the podcast. All of you listeners have gotten to

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Speaker 2: know some of the other people in my inner circle,

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Speaker 2: but today you get to meet my youngest daughter, Fiona. Hi,

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Speaker 2: Fiona Bai.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to the podcast.

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Speaker 3: So happy to be here.

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Speaker 1: Oh, I'm happy to have you here.

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Speaker 2: Now it's I think I've had everyone. Oh maybe not Luca,

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Speaker 2: I can't remember. Anyways, Today we're going to talk about

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Speaker 2: something that affects both of us, I know, stress and overthinking,

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Speaker 2: and we're going to be joined by a psychologist and

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Speaker 2: author of Stress Resets, doctor Jenny Taits a little bit later,

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Speaker 2: but first I want to kind of just talk about

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Speaker 2: the fact that we're overthinkers.

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Speaker 1: M hmm, yeah, I know.

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Speaker 2: I've been overthinking most of my life, certainly upon becoming

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Speaker 2: an adult. I think that's when it really started for me.

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Speaker 2: Before I was an adult, I was working in an

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Speaker 2: adult environment, so I had a lot of stress, and

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Speaker 2: I think that caused me to overthink more than a

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Speaker 2: normal person.

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Speaker 4: Perhaps I can imagine.

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Speaker 1: I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I'm trying to think of like, what are certain things

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Speaker 2: I overthink about? What are things that you overthink everything? Everything?

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Speaker 4: But I feel like recently it's gotten worse as I've

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Speaker 4: gotten a little bit older, with all the stresses and

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Speaker 4: end of high school and all that, just thinking about

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Speaker 4: my future and stuff. But yeah, yeah, honestly, I feel

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Speaker 4: like my brain is constantly on a spiral at all times.

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Speaker 4: And I know you sometimes feel like that.

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Speaker 2: You said you're a senior. Yeah, for those of you

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Speaker 2: that don't know, she's in her senior year of high school.

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Speaker 2: And so I think during a senior year for teenagers,

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Speaker 2: there is a lot more stress all of a sudden,

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Speaker 2: and it comes fast and it comes hard, and you're like,

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Speaker 2: wait what.

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Speaker 4: Yeah. I remember the first day of senior year. I

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Speaker 4: was like so overwhelmed because I had all these college

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Speaker 4: applications that I hadn't even started thinking about. But yeah,

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Speaker 4: it's been a lot. Even though it's over the college applications,

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Speaker 4: I still feel myself like always feelings I have something

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Speaker 4: I need to be doing.

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Speaker 2: So college preparing is a stressor for you, it makes

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Speaker 2: you overthink what else?

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Speaker 4: Hm, I feel like just life and future, I beyond college,

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Speaker 4: just what I'm gonna do, and every day just where

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Speaker 4: you're gonna live, Yeah, where I'm gonna live, Where I'm

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Speaker 4: How'm gonna make money.

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Speaker 1: Who's gonna do your laundry?

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Speaker 3: Exactly? I feel like a lot is just hitting me.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, what about like social media?

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Speaker 3: Social media for sure.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I feel like it's just constantly stressing me out,

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Speaker 4: especially TikTok. I feel like recently just scrolling and there's

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Speaker 4: always something new that I'm seeing, and sometimes it can

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Speaker 4: be really scary, and sometimes it's like just very stressful.

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Speaker 4: It feels like there's something always on my mind.

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Speaker 1: M hm, how did this?

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Speaker 2: I don't know how the TikToker works. Do you like

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Speaker 2: pick who you're gonna follow and that's all you see

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Speaker 2: or do you get random stuff all the day? No?

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Speaker 4: Well, yes, you can follow certain people, but there's also

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Speaker 4: like a for you page, which isn't really for me

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Speaker 4: anymore because I feel like my algorithm is so weird recently,

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Speaker 4: and like it'll just show me random videos of like

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Speaker 4: stressful things and it's like I got hooked to them,

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Speaker 4: you know.

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Speaker 2: And before you know it, you're yeah, yeah, it's like.

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Speaker 4: Ten minutes long, and I just keep watching, keep watching,

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Speaker 4: and I feel like I just think about that all day.

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Speaker 2: And well, for example, like, what's an example of something

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Speaker 2: you saw that made you think about it all day?

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Speaker 5: Well, the other day I saw the saddest edit of

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Speaker 5: like just the state of the world right now and

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Speaker 5: all that stuff, and it just kind of got me

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Speaker 5: thinking and stressing about these greater things than I am,

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Speaker 5: and you know, climate changed.

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Speaker 4: And all these things that I shouldn't really have to

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Speaker 4: be worrying about, but like I am, And I feel

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Speaker 4: like it just escalates it so much on TikTok, because

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Speaker 4: it's once you watch one video, then there's another video

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Speaker 4: about it, and the amount of times you're watching the

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Speaker 4: video then gives you more videos like that, and it's

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Speaker 4: just it's a lot.

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Speaker 3: It's very stressful.

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Speaker 2: So your algorithm isn't just puppies anymore.

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Speaker 1: No, it's not.

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Speaker 4: I mean I thought it was. And then you watch

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Speaker 4: one video about World war and then there's ten videos

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Speaker 4: about World war and then it's like I don't even

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Speaker 4: know how that got there, but.

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Speaker 1: Oh man, yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 2: I Mean when I was younger, I didn't have those

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Speaker 2: kind of stressors. I didn't have that access to all

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Speaker 2: the bad things happening all across the world. Yeah, my

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Speaker 2: fingertips exactly.

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Speaker 4: There's like a lot of news channels on tichnokal news

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Speaker 4: accounts that just.

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Speaker 3: Kind of update.

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Speaker 4: I remember when the were happening in California, every single

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Speaker 4: video my for you page was about the fires and

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Speaker 4: how they're getting worse. And it can be really stressful

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Speaker 4: because not only does it set you into thinking about that,

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Speaker 4: but then when you turn off TikTok, that's also all

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Speaker 4: you can think about, and then you're you know, spiraling

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Speaker 4: and just going off in your head about it.

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Speaker 2: So I'm sure that can be really hard on a person,

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Speaker 2: especially a young person's nervous system. Yeah, yeah, that doesn't

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Speaker 2: I remember when you know, social media started for you,

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Speaker 2: and I think my biggest concerns were like, oh no,

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Speaker 2: she's gonna see naked people or like poorn or something

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Speaker 2: like that was my biggest concern. But I think just

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Speaker 2: the state of the world and politics and everything right

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Speaker 2: now is more concerning than that. Okay, that's so true.

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Speaker 2: As a mother and a daughter, let's talk about what

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Speaker 2: causes each of us to get stressed with each other.

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Speaker 2: Because you're the baby of the family. I was the

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Speaker 2: baby of the family, so we have a lot in

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Speaker 2: common you. I think you know that we're very similar.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if you like that. It's good, right,

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Speaker 2: but what do you think? I'll just tell you what

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Speaker 2: are some of the things that I get stressed about

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Speaker 2: with you?

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Speaker 1: Okay, okay, here we go.

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Speaker 2: How about for the Super Bowl, you decided to go

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Speaker 2: into your stepdad's closet and take out one of his

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Speaker 2: vintage Eagles shirts from when he was a child, and

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Speaker 2: you decided to be a good idea to cut it

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Speaker 2: into a tummy show. Yeah, who's cute.

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Speaker 1: That stressed me out.

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Speaker 2: You look really cute, but he did not look so cute.

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Speaker 1: I mean no, okay.

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Speaker 3: It was at the bottom of his dresser.

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Speaker 2: And yes, that's where you keep things that are important

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Speaker 2: to you.

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Speaker 1: Probably just moving forward.

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Speaker 4: It says something like, what did it say? It's just

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Speaker 4: it doesn't matter, he said, I manage what it said,

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Speaker 4: because it said like you want a piece of this,

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Speaker 4: get in line or.

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Speaker 2: Some Oh you like the slogan. Okay, well you can

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Speaker 2: explain that to him further. One of the other things

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Speaker 2: that stresses me out is when you drive. Every time

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Speaker 2: you walk out the door. I stress out until you

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Speaker 2: walk back in the door. That's not your fault, that's

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Speaker 2: just being a mom. Yeah. I stress about your stress

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Speaker 2: level honestly, Like I worry that you have too many

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Speaker 2: things to deal with at such a young age. I

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Speaker 2: stress also about just your experience. I stress so much

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Speaker 2: about you being on the social media because I see

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Speaker 2: you in the morning, you're on it, and right before

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Speaker 2: you go to sleep, you're on it like you're going

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Speaker 2: to sleep with some maybe not so great imagery and messaging.

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Speaker 4: I feel like I try to do a good job

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Speaker 4: of you did trying, but it can be.

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Speaker 3: A lot sometimes.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, what do you stress out when with regard to me?

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Speaker 4: I mean, I don't even know. I feel like it's

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Speaker 4: just a constant stress sometimes with like you know, making

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Speaker 4: you proud and all that, and I mean, I don't

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Speaker 4: really know what I stress about with you.

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Speaker 2: What do you mean making me proud? Like you stress

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Speaker 2: about making me proud?

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Speaker 1: Grades I want to.

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Speaker 3: Make you proud, but you do.

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Speaker 4: Sometimes the way I act can be I have a

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Speaker 4: lot in my head and a lot I'm overthinking about.

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Speaker 4: Sometimes I lash out at you or you know, I

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Speaker 4: can get irritable and stuff like that, and I and

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Speaker 4: I stress about how you think of me and stuff

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Speaker 4: like that. So I do I stress about when you're stressed.

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Speaker 4: I can feel it by the way I know when

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Speaker 4: you're stressed.

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Speaker 1: These are both It makes me stress. So, yeah, we're

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Speaker 1: gonna have to talk to the doctor about that.

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Speaker 3: I do want to know how to deal with that.

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Speaker 2: H Do you stress about the way you look? Do

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Speaker 2: you stress about things like that?

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Speaker 4: Yeah? I think that's always a stress in a lot

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Speaker 4: of people's minds, absolutely, especially with social media and all that.

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Speaker 4: I think like it's very heightened the way the girls

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Speaker 4: see each other like themselves right now in comparison to others,

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Speaker 4: comparing yourself. I stress about like what people think of

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Speaker 4: me all the time, even though I try to not

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Speaker 4: so is you know high school too has been really

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Speaker 4: hard for me. I know, like I know other people

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Speaker 4: have had hard times too, but it's very stressful. A

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Speaker 4: lot of girls pitted against each other, a lot of

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Speaker 4: conflict and drama, and that just make someone stress about

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Speaker 4: who they are though.

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Speaker 2: That that whole competition with girls your age or just

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Speaker 2: other girls in general, is so damaging. Yeah, And you

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Speaker 2: can you know if you start that in high school

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Speaker 2: you carry that around with you for a while, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: until someday you're just free of it and it's the

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Speaker 2: best feeling ever. But I remember that feeling as a

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Speaker 2: young adult, certainly a young girl working as an actress.

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Speaker 2: That made me feel like I was against other girls times,

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Speaker 2: and I hated that feeling.

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Speaker 4: It stresses you out because you know that that's not

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Speaker 4: who you are and that's not what you want to do.

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Speaker 4: But then it feels in the moment that that's what's happening,

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Speaker 4: you know, And it also causes you to overthink. I

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Speaker 4: know it causes me to overthink a lot, just kind

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Speaker 4: of going on in your head down this spiral of

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Speaker 4: like am I good enough? What? You know?

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Speaker 3: All those thoughts that come up?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so all the thoughts that's the ruminating. I think

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Speaker 2: that's the like obsessing on one thought and then it

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Speaker 2: sort of just spirals and you start thinking about all

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Speaker 2: the other bad thoughts that can.

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Speaker 1: Go with it.

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Speaker 2: How do you stop yourself from doing that? Before we

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Speaker 2: talk to the doctor and find out, Like, I'd love

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Speaker 2: to know.

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Speaker 4: How she stulls it, But I think sometimes for me

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Speaker 4: is I do have a really hard time stopping you

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Speaker 4: when I start to like go down that hole. I

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Speaker 4: want to ask the doctor this. But I did see

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Speaker 4: something where like if you say a certain word out loud,

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Speaker 4: it kind of stops.

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Speaker 3: The thought cycle.

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Speaker 4: I don't know if that's accurate information, but I want

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Speaker 4: to know how, like psychologically you can really stop yourself

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Speaker 4: from ruminating, because I feel like when I start it,

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Speaker 4: just I'm thinking about something and it starts into something else,

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Speaker 4: and before I know what, I'm spend forty five minutes

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Speaker 4: of just spiraling in my head.

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Speaker 2: And I don't even what if you, like, say you're

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Speaker 2: ruminating on the way to school about something. When you

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Speaker 2: get to school and your body's doing something different and

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Speaker 2: you're seeing different things, do you do those thoughts end

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Speaker 2: or Yeah?

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Speaker 3: I can get distracted.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, distraction especially I heard one thing naming just like

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Speaker 4: pointing out five things you see and like smell and hear,

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Speaker 4: and you know, stuff like that can help you make

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Speaker 4: your mind think in a different pattern. But yeah, I

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Speaker 4: do get distracted when I start thinking about certain.

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Speaker 2: How how do you feel in your body when you're

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Speaker 2: at your most stressed? Like where does it show up

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Speaker 2: in your body?

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Speaker 3: I actually was thinking.

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Speaker 4: About that the other day because I don't know if

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Speaker 4: I you. But I tend to get really sweaty. That's normady, Okay,

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Speaker 4: I really have a problem with that. All my friends

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Speaker 4: like nowhere where like sweatywear.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to get into that.

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Speaker 2: But armpit, sweat, hands, sweat, yes, okay, okay, do your

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Speaker 2: feet sweat us?

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Speaker 4: You know? But I think I don't know what that

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Speaker 4: is about. But definitely very tense.

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Speaker 2: I feel tense overall. Do you feel like your shoulders

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Speaker 2: are up here?

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Speaker 3: Sometimes? Oh? Me too.

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Speaker 4: I also genuinely like my head starts to her. I

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Speaker 4: don't know, like it's just what I'm thinking so hard

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Speaker 4: about something for a long time. It's like I feel

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Speaker 4: like I start to get like physically sick about it.

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Speaker 2: So you remember when you used to go on airplanes.

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Speaker 2: You were eight seven six in those years, and we

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Speaker 2: traveled a lot, and you used to get so worked up,

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Speaker 2: whether it was f four in the morning when we

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Speaker 2: were getting on the way to the airport the night

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Speaker 2: before you knew we were taking an airplane, you would

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Speaker 2: work yourself up so much, stress about it so much

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Speaker 2: that you would oftentimes make yourself sick, like physic I

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Speaker 2: can remember physically sick, actually running through the airport to

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Speaker 2: catch a flight, and just trying to get back and

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Speaker 2: forth to new garbage cans for you to throw up

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Speaker 2: in on the way to the gate.

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Speaker 4: I definitely think that was thought induced, like fear paralyzing fear,

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Speaker 4: Like I was really anxious when I was little. You were, Yeah,

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Speaker 4: I know. It was like a bunch of different things.

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Speaker 4: And I had those I don't know what that was,

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Speaker 4: those ticks I had where I would like have to

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Speaker 4: touch the car ceiling when when we were passing a

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Speaker 4: red light or else.

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Speaker 3: My whole family was gonna die.

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Speaker 4: And that was because I was like overthinking, huh so much.

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Speaker 2: You have a massively powerful brain. You're so smart, and

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Speaker 2: you are so in tune to people's emotions. I think

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Speaker 2: that that might make it even harder for a person

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Speaker 2: to get control of it. Yeah, so I think it's

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Speaker 2: really important that you get control of it. I think

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Speaker 2: now would be a really good time to bring in

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Speaker 2: doctor Jenny.

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Speaker 1: What do you think.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I'd love to hear what she has to say.

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Speaker 3: I'm really excited to me. Let's do it.

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Speaker 6: Hi, Hi Jenny, Hi Fiona.

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Speaker 3: Hi.

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Speaker 2: Fiona was just telling me earlier that she's a big

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Speaker 2: fan of yours.

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Speaker 4: Yes, I watched you on call her daddy.

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Speaker 6: Oh thank you, that was why I got up. Thank you.

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Speaker 2: Yes, well, you were listening into our conversation, right I was.

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Speaker 6: I was listening in and I firstly like applaud your

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Speaker 6: courage and vulnerability, and I also totally relate. I was

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Speaker 6: like a professional ruminator until realized that it was a

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Speaker 6: toxic habit and that there were ways to free yourself

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Speaker 6: from this habit.

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Speaker 2: I like that a professional ruminator.

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Speaker 6: Sign me up, professional X ruminator.

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Speaker 2: I'm hopefully after this episode, I want to be an

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Speaker 2: official X ruminator. Do you I think that as parents,

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Speaker 2: we kind of disregard our our especially our teenagers stress levels,

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Speaker 2: like what maybe not taking the time to fully hear

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Speaker 2: them out, or you know, we ourselves as parents are

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Speaker 2: so stressed out and spread so thin.

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Speaker 3: It seems like.

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Speaker 6: There's so much variability between different parents. I think some

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Speaker 6: parents can really empathize, and for some parents it's too

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Speaker 6: painful and they don't want to hear it and they

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Speaker 6: want to try to change the channel or they and

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Speaker 6: there's there's like a dance, like you want to be

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Speaker 6: empathic and validating, but you don't want to fall into

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Speaker 6: co ruminating or like removing together in a way that's

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Speaker 6: not helpful. And so I think it really depends. But

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Speaker 6: I think the first place that's important to start is

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Speaker 6: kind of what do we make of our thinking habits.

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Speaker 6: A lot of people think that the conscientious, like responsible

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Speaker 6: thing to do is if there's a problem that you

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Speaker 6: are trying to figure out, like where you're going to

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Speaker 6: go to college or climate change, that keeping it top

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Speaker 6: of mind all the time, especially if you're smart, is

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Speaker 6: going to somehow lead to some sort of solution or breakthrough.

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Speaker 6: Or we have a lot of positive beliefs about worry

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Speaker 6: that like if I worry about this, then I'll get

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Speaker 6: into my choice school, or I'll keep my family safe.

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Speaker 6: But we really need to take a step back and

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Speaker 6: kind of see or is kind of overthinking in this

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Speaker 6: way actually empowering us or depleting us? And is there

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Speaker 6: like a sweet spot where we can like literally schedule ruminating,

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Speaker 6: like schedule time to worry, like cap it at twenty minutes,

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Speaker 6: like you get twenty minutes to really think about, like

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Speaker 6: where do I want to be next fall?

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Speaker 2: Is that term you use worry time?

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Speaker 6: You could call it worry time, you could call it

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Speaker 6: like I call it in stress, resets, reschedule, ruminating. Because

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Speaker 6: the problem is is we know, we're really clear that

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Speaker 6: the more present in the moment you are, the happier

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Speaker 6: you are. And fifty percent of the time we're not

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Speaker 6: in the present moment. For the course of the day,

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Speaker 6: you could have anywhere between like twelve thousand and sixty

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Speaker 6: thousand thoughts. So often we're worrying about things that will

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Speaker 6: never happen, and we're anticipating things that are just totally painful.

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Speaker 6: But if we can like move worry or overthinking from

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Speaker 6: like a news ticker that's like sucking energy and joy

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Speaker 6: out of you, or like Fiona so really and courageously

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Speaker 6: talked about like causing physical symptoms sweating, nausea, if we

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Speaker 6: can sort of see, oh my gosh, I'm doing the thing.

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Speaker 6: And there's a lot of different techniques that work for

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Speaker 6: different people. I go through, like you know, so many

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Speaker 6: tools to break free in this habit and happy to

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Speaker 6: go through a bunch.

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Speaker 1: Yes, yes, give us the tools.

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Speaker 4: I'm wondering when you're starting to get into that ruminating

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Speaker 4: spiral and you can't even get to yourself to the

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Speaker 4: point to be like I need to put this away

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Speaker 4: I'm gonna worry about this later. What are some tools

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Speaker 4: you could do in that moment that you would give?

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Speaker 6: Yeah, and there's so many and different again, like different

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Speaker 6: things work for different people. I think this is so

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Speaker 6: person specific, Like if like, first, the first thing I

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Speaker 6: think is really knowing your triggers, like if you went

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Speaker 6: to a high stakes social thing or a college interview

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Speaker 6: or you had a stressful conversation with someone, Like knowing

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Speaker 6: your triggers like when am I going to be most triggered,

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Speaker 6: and then having a game plan for them, like, Okay,

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Speaker 6: if I go on a date, prime time for ruminating

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Speaker 6: is going to be afterwards, I'm going to be replaying

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Speaker 6: what I said and wondering what the person thought. I'm

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Speaker 6: going to get into all that. What can I do

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Speaker 6: in those moments? And so maybe it's like this seems

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Speaker 6: so silly, but like I have little kids and I

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Speaker 6: do paint by sticker with them a lot. It's kind

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Speaker 6: of like paint by number, but with stickers. Do you

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Speaker 6: know what I.

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Speaker 2: Mean?

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Speaker 6: How can you possibly be like let me perfectly align

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Speaker 6: number twelve into this thing and also be so having

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Speaker 6: like some sort of compelling I mean, again, there's a

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Speaker 6: lot of different tools. But for some people, having a

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Speaker 6: activity that requires your full folks that totally blocks you

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Speaker 6: from doing something else, whether that's doing the paint by stick,

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Speaker 6: or whether that's reading a book that really captivates you,

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Speaker 6: whether that's really listening to a friend, baking, whatever. The

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Speaker 6: thing is having a specific plan for you of something,

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Speaker 6: and like knowing at a time, like I'm doing this thing,

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Speaker 6: there's a really good chance afterwards I'm going to be

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Speaker 6: tempted to fall into like the tar pits of torturing myself.

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Speaker 6: Here's what I can do instead, and something that I

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Speaker 6: think works across the board regardless. And I want to

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Speaker 6: hear I Fiona and Jennie, what are some of your

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Speaker 6: thoughts on what would be kind of a thing that

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Speaker 6: would distract you. But one other thing I'll say before

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Speaker 6: I get to that is there's a tool that I

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Speaker 6: teach in stress resets, which I love. It's called TIP

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Speaker 6: and it's an acronym for changing your temperature. This sounds

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Speaker 6: so cooky, but like if you took a salad bowl

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Speaker 6: with ice water and you hold your breath instet a

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Speaker 6: timer for thirty seconds. If you submerge your face in

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Speaker 6: the ice water, you so totally transform your nervous system.

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Speaker 6: We all have a lot of us think that solutions

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Speaker 6: are outside of ourselves, but we have this incredible pharmacy

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Speaker 6: within us, Like your body is a walking pharmacy.

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Speaker 3: That's so interesting.

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Speaker 6: Literally, put your face in a salad wole full of ice.

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Speaker 6: Your current weight will slow down. You won't be thinking

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Speaker 6: about the same thing. I mean, if you've ever jumped

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Speaker 6: in a cold pool, like you're not thinking about anything except.

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Speaker 4: Is it the same with like baths and hot water?

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Speaker 4: Is it only cold water?

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Speaker 6: So my response is like a special like evolutionary thing

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Speaker 6: that our bodies do. We're like drowning. So it's with

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Speaker 6: cold water and specifically like holding your breath and getting

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Speaker 6: your nose submerged.

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Speaker 2: That's a problem for me. I can't do that, but

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Speaker 2: I don't like the water.

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Speaker 6: Cold, Okay, So that's cold water. The rest of the

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Speaker 6: acronym of tip is intense exercise. And that's like ninety

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Speaker 6: seconds not ninety minutes. If you start doing burpies, like

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Speaker 6: you cannot be doing burpies and like replaying a conversation

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Speaker 6: that you think badly, and so ninety seconds of burpies, paste,

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Speaker 6: breathing breathing in for five five again very cognitively like sorbing,

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Speaker 6: Like you can't be counting your breath. And we could

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Speaker 6: even do this together, like breathing in for five with

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Speaker 6: our nose and out for five with our nose.

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Speaker 2: It always resets you so nicely, right the breathing.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, And then progressive muscle relaxation. That tip is two peas,

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Speaker 6: tensing and relaxing your muscles, like from head to toe.

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Speaker 6: These are like quick things in the moment, but bigger picture,

439
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Speaker 6: we also really need to work on accepting uncertainty, like

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Speaker 6: we need to drop the rope and know that we'll

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Speaker 6: never know like what other people totally think of us,

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Speaker 6: or what's going to happen tomorrow, or what climate change

443
00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:46,520
Speaker 6: is going to do in fifteen years. But I think

444
00:21:46,520 --> 00:21:48,440
Speaker 6: we need tools for the moment and tools make picture.

445
00:21:48,480 --> 00:21:50,080
Speaker 6: But I'm so curious, Jennie, and if you wona, what

446
00:21:50,160 --> 00:21:54,280
Speaker 6: are some things that would help you get really present

447
00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:58,320
Speaker 6: even if you feel like you're on the cusp of

448
00:21:58,520 --> 00:22:01,479
Speaker 6: spiraling and once you it's stuck, it's hard to stop.

449
00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:05,480
Speaker 2: You go first me. Yeah, I know you like to

450
00:22:05,520 --> 00:22:06,040
Speaker 2: take baths.

451
00:22:06,080 --> 00:22:08,920
Speaker 4: I read I'm a big bath taker. I love taking

452
00:22:08,960 --> 00:22:10,040
Speaker 4: baths I also love.

453
00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:11,919
Speaker 2: But do you ever sit in the bathtub and just

454
00:22:11,920 --> 00:22:13,240
Speaker 2: think about your problems more so?

455
00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:17,120
Speaker 4: Yes, that's usually how they go. But recently I've been

456
00:22:17,160 --> 00:22:20,760
Speaker 4: trying to. I've been taking a lot of my books

457
00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:23,320
Speaker 4: with me in the bath and honestly reading. I think,

458
00:22:23,640 --> 00:22:26,560
Speaker 4: especially with social media and phone time and all that stuff,

459
00:22:26,680 --> 00:22:31,040
Speaker 4: being a teenager brings. I think, the books and reading

460
00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:34,080
Speaker 4: and really slowing down and thinking about something else that's

461
00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:37,520
Speaker 4: helping me and stuff like that helps a lot for me.

462
00:22:37,720 --> 00:22:40,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's something right, doctor Jenny about the reading and

463
00:22:40,520 --> 00:22:43,160
Speaker 2: the eyes going back and forth. It like does something

464
00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:44,359
Speaker 2: to your brain, right.

465
00:22:44,840 --> 00:22:46,840
Speaker 6: I think even what you just said was so brilliant,

466
00:22:46,840 --> 00:22:48,680
Speaker 6: Like leaving the phone, I mean again, like the phone

467
00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:51,119
Speaker 6: and I know you guys were talking about that the

468
00:22:51,119 --> 00:22:54,199
Speaker 6: phone is like training me to jump and red like

469
00:22:54,280 --> 00:22:56,280
Speaker 6: you can't. I mean you don't want to. You need

470
00:22:56,280 --> 00:22:58,160
Speaker 6: to pay attention. You need to like use your full

471
00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:00,719
Speaker 6: brain to like remember who is this carricter? Or what

472
00:23:00,760 --> 00:23:03,640
Speaker 6: do they say? And so I love what you're saying

473
00:23:03,680 --> 00:23:05,720
Speaker 6: for you, and I like stacking things like it's not

474
00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:07,560
Speaker 6: just the bath, it's getting rid of the phone plus

475
00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:10,919
Speaker 6: the bath. Plus maybe there's a pleasant smell. Plus the book,

476
00:23:12,040 --> 00:23:14,760
Speaker 6: we have like a whole plan of the things that

477
00:23:14,800 --> 00:23:17,239
Speaker 6: will really center you in this moment, Jenny, What are

478
00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:18,159
Speaker 6: some of the things.

479
00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:24,119
Speaker 2: That I find nature to be really helpful for me

480
00:23:25,160 --> 00:23:29,879
Speaker 2: with any kind of stress reduction? And I feel like

481
00:23:30,840 --> 00:23:33,359
Speaker 2: playing with my dogs, like looking into the eyes of

482
00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:37,120
Speaker 2: my dogs and connecting with them and taking care of them.

483
00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:40,800
Speaker 2: I've always, my whole life been a person that loves

484
00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:43,639
Speaker 2: to take care of other people or things, or the

485
00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:46,960
Speaker 2: house or whatever it is. I'm just wired to do

486
00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:50,320
Speaker 2: things like that. So I will sometimes submerge myself in

487
00:23:50,359 --> 00:23:55,040
Speaker 2: a task like cleaning out the sink or you know,

488
00:23:55,160 --> 00:23:59,320
Speaker 2: doing something gardening, something that keeps my mind and my

489
00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:04,040
Speaker 2: hands busy and focused on something else fantastic.

490
00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:07,560
Speaker 6: And I mean, the thing that I found so surprising

491
00:24:07,640 --> 00:24:11,480
Speaker 6: and also like hopeful in my research from writing this

492
00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:14,359
Speaker 6: book was a study where people were asked in a

493
00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:18,080
Speaker 6: lab setting about something really upsetting that happened to them,

494
00:24:18,560 --> 00:24:21,560
Speaker 6: and like fifty percent of the people had the option

495
00:24:21,680 --> 00:24:25,480
Speaker 6: to like eavesdrop on research assistance chatting outside, so just

496
00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:29,000
Speaker 6: people were like having a conversation outside and ninety percent

497
00:24:29,040 --> 00:24:31,399
Speaker 6: of the people who had the chance to eavesdrop, and

498
00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:35,280
Speaker 6: these are strangers. This is not juicy like celebrity you know,

499
00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:39,960
Speaker 6: high school gossip. This is total you know, lab assistant gossip.

500
00:24:40,880 --> 00:24:44,000
Speaker 6: Those people immediately stopped ruminating, but the people that didn't

501
00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:48,920
Speaker 6: have the option to distract continued. And we don't want

502
00:24:48,960 --> 00:24:52,200
Speaker 6: to live a life that's distracting. But by really learning

503
00:24:52,400 --> 00:24:56,159
Speaker 6: it's actually the ruination becomes a distraction before really present

504
00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:59,480
Speaker 6: with our puppies or with reading, then we can get

505
00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:01,560
Speaker 6: more present. And the whole point of all of it

506
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:03,679
Speaker 6: is to live a life that's angered in the present,

507
00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:08,439
Speaker 6: not having like you know, our minds. That can be

508
00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:09,160
Speaker 6: really tricky.

509
00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:12,600
Speaker 4: Yeah, I find that most times I'm ruminating, it's either

510
00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:15,520
Speaker 4: about the past or the future. It's never about where

511
00:25:15,560 --> 00:25:18,600
Speaker 4: I am in the moment. And I think sometimes when

512
00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:21,520
Speaker 4: I'm getting into those patterns, I do think what do

513
00:25:21,560 --> 00:25:23,800
Speaker 4: I see right now? Like what is happening right now?

514
00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:26,600
Speaker 4: And think about that moment because that kind of anchers

515
00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:28,800
Speaker 4: me down, like you were saying, so that's very helpful.

516
00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:31,840
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean a few others. I want to make

517
00:25:31,880 --> 00:25:34,639
Speaker 6: sure that I cover like a whole range of different things.

518
00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:37,560
Speaker 6: So distraction can be helpful if you know that there's

519
00:25:37,560 --> 00:25:41,159
Speaker 6: like a particular window of time, like seven pm to

520
00:25:41,560 --> 00:25:46,919
Speaker 6: nine fifteen at night, or after a high stakes situation,

521
00:25:47,520 --> 00:25:50,800
Speaker 6: having a specific plan of something you could do. But

522
00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:53,600
Speaker 6: if there's something that I've upset you, someone betrayed you,

523
00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:57,159
Speaker 6: or you face some sort of loss, I don't want

524
00:25:57,200 --> 00:26:00,560
Speaker 6: to encourage you to just be distracting and distracting for

525
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:05,159
Speaker 6: those situations being able to write, you know, expressive writing,

526
00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:09,040
Speaker 6: writing for twenty minutes, and research where people wrote about

527
00:26:09,040 --> 00:26:12,520
Speaker 6: something for twenty minutes the same topic over three days.

528
00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:16,280
Speaker 6: Six months later, they were significantly less depressed and less

529
00:26:16,359 --> 00:26:19,760
Speaker 6: prone to ruminating. So there's something about like actually going

530
00:26:19,800 --> 00:26:22,800
Speaker 6: through something with a beginning, middle and an end, and

531
00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:27,320
Speaker 6: like slowing down and actually letting yourself feel because ruminating

532
00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:31,159
Speaker 6: is just like touching the surface and like a not

533
00:26:31,920 --> 00:26:37,360
Speaker 6: structured way, and so actually like feeling your feelings and

534
00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:39,600
Speaker 6: going through taking the time rather than just kind of

535
00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:41,280
Speaker 6: like you know, playing whack a mole.

536
00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:45,679
Speaker 2: Wait, you said feeling your feelings. I know that in

537
00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:49,800
Speaker 2: your book you suggest giving yourself a panic attack so

538
00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:51,040
Speaker 2: you're less afraid of them.

539
00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:52,800
Speaker 1: And I don't know how to give myself.

540
00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:54,680
Speaker 2: I mean, I guess if I really put my mind

541
00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:56,919
Speaker 2: to it, I could give myself a panic attack.

542
00:26:57,280 --> 00:26:58,360
Speaker 1: But what do you mean by that?

543
00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:03,120
Speaker 6: A lot of people, if they have had panic, are

544
00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:06,560
Speaker 6: totally terrified of the sensations that resemble panic. If you

545
00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:09,960
Speaker 6: have felt short of breath, out of the blue, even

546
00:27:10,040 --> 00:27:13,240
Speaker 6: the like a touch of like breathlessness can lead to

547
00:27:13,280 --> 00:27:16,359
Speaker 6: thoughts of oh no, it's back, what is happening to me?

548
00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:18,919
Speaker 6: How is this happening again? And then your mind and

549
00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:23,200
Speaker 6: your body are doing this like tortuous tango, where your

550
00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:25,399
Speaker 6: thoughts aren't helping your body, and your body is not

551
00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:27,840
Speaker 6: helping your thoughts. It's you know, even if you start

552
00:27:27,880 --> 00:27:30,560
Speaker 6: to sweat, if you like are mentally sweating about sweating,

553
00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:34,600
Speaker 6: that's going to lead to more sweat. Yeah sure, yeah,

554
00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:39,080
Speaker 6: But what happens if you break down exactly what do

555
00:27:39,160 --> 00:27:41,399
Speaker 6: I feel when I'm really stressed? You know, if I

556
00:27:41,560 --> 00:27:44,919
Speaker 6: start to feel really stressed, I feel short of breath,

557
00:27:45,600 --> 00:27:48,920
Speaker 6: I feel a little dizzy, my body feels a little

558
00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:52,439
Speaker 6: bit shaky. Okay, great, we can help you. You know,

559
00:27:52,560 --> 00:27:54,520
Speaker 6: this is not in the peak moment of panic. This

560
00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:58,920
Speaker 6: is preemptively. Let's practice, like, let's set a timer for

561
00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:03,200
Speaker 6: sixty seconds. We can hyperventilate for sixty seconds, we can

562
00:28:03,240 --> 00:28:06,400
Speaker 6: spin in a chair for sixty seconds, we could hold

563
00:28:06,440 --> 00:28:09,240
Speaker 6: a plank. And then once you come to realize that,

564
00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:11,920
Speaker 6: like your body runs itself, you don't need to police it,

565
00:28:12,400 --> 00:28:14,600
Speaker 6: you don't need to judge it. If you like literally

566
00:28:14,680 --> 00:28:16,919
Speaker 6: say oh yeah, been there, done that, I know what

567
00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:21,360
Speaker 6: this is, it loses its bite and the next time

568
00:28:21,359 --> 00:28:25,040
Speaker 6: it shows up, you stop propelling your body with these

569
00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:27,840
Speaker 6: negative thoughts in a bad way. And so this again

570
00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:29,879
Speaker 6: is not like a random idea that I thought of

571
00:28:30,119 --> 00:28:34,320
Speaker 6: in the shower, but this is something that is really

572
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:39,720
Speaker 6: powerful and across all anxiety conditions, whether social anxiety or

573
00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:45,440
Speaker 6: anxiety about flying, or driving anxiety or panic attacks where

574
00:28:45,480 --> 00:28:47,560
Speaker 6: you're afraid of a specific bodily response.

575
00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:51,360
Speaker 2: So you're saying, let your body have the response, allow

576
00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:53,440
Speaker 2: it to run its course, so you can kind of

577
00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:56,480
Speaker 2: observe it and realize that it's not the end of

578
00:28:56,480 --> 00:28:56,920
Speaker 2: the world.

579
00:28:57,120 --> 00:28:58,440
Speaker 1: It's going to stop eventually.

580
00:28:59,080 --> 00:29:02,560
Speaker 6: Exactly the same some people are afraid of elevators or heights,

581
00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:04,920
Speaker 6: and they need to like face that few you can

582
00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:07,040
Speaker 6: face the view that you can feel short of breath

583
00:29:07,160 --> 00:29:10,760
Speaker 6: and that actually doesn't mean you're dying. That means you're

584
00:29:10,800 --> 00:29:13,240
Speaker 6: short of breath and that will pass and your breath

585
00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:17,400
Speaker 6: will also breathe itself when you stop like hovering over

586
00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:21,200
Speaker 6: it and trying to micromanage it. And this is something

587
00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:22,960
Speaker 6: that a lot of people find can be helpful with

588
00:29:23,040 --> 00:29:28,080
Speaker 6: a therapist. But if you allow yourself to practice like

589
00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:31,040
Speaker 6: sweating and like you know, purposefully putting on a warm

590
00:29:31,080 --> 00:29:34,480
Speaker 6: coat and not sweating about sweating, do you think when

591
00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:37,280
Speaker 6: it came on it would feel less stressful or.

592
00:29:37,560 --> 00:29:41,440
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean usually it's just it's not even that

593
00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:44,520
Speaker 4: I realize that I'm sweating. It just happens, and then

594
00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:46,000
Speaker 4: that makes causes me to overthink.

595
00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:48,000
Speaker 3: I do feel like kind.

596
00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:51,600
Speaker 4: Of preparing myself more would stop the scare, like you said,

597
00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:53,760
Speaker 4: because sometimes I like, oh no, I'm sweating, and that

598
00:29:53,760 --> 00:29:56,320
Speaker 4: means I'm overthinking, and then I overthink about overthinking, and

599
00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:59,400
Speaker 4: then you know, I don't even know, But yeah, I

600
00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:00,160
Speaker 4: do think that would help.

601
00:30:01,040 --> 00:30:03,080
Speaker 6: Yeah, maybe it's even when it comes on to not

602
00:30:03,160 --> 00:30:05,400
Speaker 6: judge it, because a huge part of not judging it,

603
00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:08,440
Speaker 6: I mean can't but I imagine if you went to hot

604
00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:13,280
Speaker 6: yoga and you were sweating. I love hot yoga, and

605
00:30:13,360 --> 00:30:15,840
Speaker 6: so you could generalize that, like, okay, sweating is great.

606
00:30:15,960 --> 00:30:20,280
Speaker 6: Sweating is healthy, It is good for you.

607
00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:31,080
Speaker 2: Actually, it's so interesting you said before, you know, when

608
00:30:31,120 --> 00:30:34,760
Speaker 2: you're looking at your social media and stuff, that you

609
00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:38,960
Speaker 2: start to think that you have symptoms of a certain illness, yeah,

610
00:30:39,160 --> 00:30:41,160
Speaker 2: or even like oh, when I get a sore throat,

611
00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:44,600
Speaker 2: then you start this is something you do. You start

612
00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:47,080
Speaker 2: worrying about your sore throat and thinking, oh, no, something's

613
00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:49,440
Speaker 2: really wrong with me. I have the sore throat and

614
00:30:49,680 --> 00:30:52,840
Speaker 2: it never it doesn't seem to go away because you're

615
00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:54,520
Speaker 2: just focusing on it so much.

616
00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:57,280
Speaker 4: And every time I look up a new symptom online

617
00:30:57,320 --> 00:31:01,200
Speaker 4: on Google, on TikTok especially, tell me a new thing.

618
00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:03,280
Speaker 4: So I'm like, okay, I have this now, and then

619
00:31:03,320 --> 00:31:05,800
Speaker 4: I also have this disease and all these things, and

620
00:31:06,240 --> 00:31:10,200
Speaker 4: in reality I'm fine. But it's just I just have

621
00:31:10,280 --> 00:31:13,680
Speaker 4: this constant worrying fear of health for some reason, and

622
00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:17,840
Speaker 4: I don't really know why or how to.

623
00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:20,200
Speaker 1: What do you think, doctor.

624
00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:24,280
Speaker 6: That like we have to accept some amount of uncertainty,

625
00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:26,840
Speaker 6: like we don't know if it is itchy because it's

626
00:31:26,880 --> 00:31:29,080
Speaker 6: dry in our house or because we might be getting

627
00:31:29,080 --> 00:31:32,240
Speaker 6: strap or something else. I mean, And so I think

628
00:31:32,280 --> 00:31:35,400
Speaker 6: accepting in this moment, it's okay. It's okay because we

629
00:31:35,440 --> 00:31:38,320
Speaker 6: can just watch like thinking those thoughts can lead to

630
00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:41,200
Speaker 6: more symptoms and then maybe you're losing time to do

631
00:31:41,280 --> 00:31:44,920
Speaker 6: something that is, you know, writing a report or calling

632
00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:48,239
Speaker 6: a friend back. And so a lot of people think

633
00:31:48,280 --> 00:31:51,760
Speaker 6: it's helpful to like Google, but Google is really accepting

634
00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:56,240
Speaker 6: it in a situation where you have recurrent fears that

635
00:31:56,280 --> 00:31:58,400
Speaker 6: like you're almost like nine times out of ten, it's like, oh,

636
00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:00,880
Speaker 6: this is just help anxiety. I know that I have this,

637
00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:03,320
Speaker 6: and I do this. I talk about something else in

638
00:32:03,360 --> 00:32:05,280
Speaker 6: the book that a lot of people find fun is

639
00:32:06,040 --> 00:32:08,840
Speaker 6: if you have a recurrent like stressful thought that never

640
00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:11,160
Speaker 6: helps you, like I'm making something up, but like I'm

641
00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:13,560
Speaker 6: going to die, and when you're not, you know, it's

642
00:32:13,600 --> 00:32:16,280
Speaker 6: like you have you know, an itchy throat does not

643
00:32:16,320 --> 00:32:18,920
Speaker 6: mean you're going to die. If you can sing that

644
00:32:19,240 --> 00:32:21,920
Speaker 6: I'm going to die to like an upbeat tune, it

645
00:32:22,040 --> 00:32:24,680
Speaker 6: automatically is like, oh, yeah, this is what you know,

646
00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:27,360
Speaker 6: This is what I do in these situations. I tell myself.

647
00:32:27,400 --> 00:32:29,520
Speaker 6: It's like almost like if you don't have plans on

648
00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:32,120
Speaker 6: a Friday night and you tell yourself you're a loser

649
00:32:32,200 --> 00:32:35,920
Speaker 6: instead of really believing that and like syncing into that,

650
00:32:36,120 --> 00:32:39,040
Speaker 6: and then then spending the night on social media and

651
00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:41,120
Speaker 6: seeing what other people are doing, and then it really

652
00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:43,920
Speaker 6: feels even more real. What if you sing I'm a

653
00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:47,360
Speaker 6: loser for like a second to a fun song.

654
00:32:47,400 --> 00:32:53,280
Speaker 1: You know, I'm a loser, Like, yeah, it's the same thing.

655
00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:54,960
Speaker 6: With it, I'm going to die. It's like, okay, you're

656
00:32:55,000 --> 00:32:56,920
Speaker 6: not going to die. Like the second you sing the song,

657
00:32:57,080 --> 00:33:01,360
Speaker 6: it loses it's sting. And do you have some perspective

658
00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:04,560
Speaker 6: because it Another huge way to change your relationship with

659
00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:08,320
Speaker 6: ruminating is even just seeing like thoughts are mental events.

660
00:33:08,360 --> 00:33:10,600
Speaker 6: Like thoughts are mental events, we can get above them.

661
00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:13,920
Speaker 6: We can see our thoughts the same way we see

662
00:33:13,920 --> 00:33:17,800
Speaker 6: clouds in the sky or but they also create very

663
00:33:17,800 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 6: real feelings. If I ask you to think about biting

664
00:33:20,560 --> 00:33:23,080
Speaker 6: into a lemon, and your mouth will start to water.

665
00:33:23,560 --> 00:33:25,160
Speaker 6: But if you can get above that and just see

666
00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:27,160
Speaker 6: this is just a mental event, I don't need to

667
00:33:28,160 --> 00:33:30,400
Speaker 6: get sucked in. Just because I thought about alignment doesn't

668
00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:31,800
Speaker 6: mean that there's a limen in my mouth.

669
00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:33,960
Speaker 3: Yeah.

670
00:33:34,040 --> 00:33:37,840
Speaker 2: Sometimes when I will have a thought that doesn't make

671
00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:41,480
Speaker 2: me feel great, I'll just say that's interesting. I wonder

672
00:33:41,480 --> 00:33:44,320
Speaker 2: what that's about, you know, and then it kind of

673
00:33:44,360 --> 00:33:48,400
Speaker 2: just without judgment, thinking yeah yeah, and then say we'll

674
00:33:48,440 --> 00:33:49,520
Speaker 2: see what happens with that.

675
00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:50,240
Speaker 3: Yeah.

676
00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:52,840
Speaker 6: Yeah, I love that so much. I was at a conference,

677
00:33:52,840 --> 00:33:56,080
Speaker 6: a psychology conference, and a colleague he was like an

678
00:33:56,120 --> 00:33:59,239
Speaker 6: older senior person when I was in grad school, and

679
00:33:59,280 --> 00:34:00,920
Speaker 6: I had gone to his workshop and so we sort

680
00:34:00,920 --> 00:34:03,680
Speaker 6: of knew each other. And he came up to me

681
00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:05,040
Speaker 6: at the conference and he was like, oh, are you

682
00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:07,720
Speaker 6: giving a talk? And I said, oh, no, I'm not

683
00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:09,680
Speaker 6: giving a talk. You said why not? And I said, oh,

684
00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:13,560
Speaker 6: I'm not very good at giving talks. And he looks

685
00:34:13,560 --> 00:34:15,239
Speaker 6: at me and he was like, did you thank your

686
00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:18,239
Speaker 6: mind for that thought? And it was like such a

687
00:34:18,360 --> 00:34:21,560
Speaker 6: light bulb moment, like do you mind that thought? Like wow?

688
00:34:21,680 --> 00:34:23,800
Speaker 6: Like me me, I'm not good at giving talks. It

689
00:34:23,880 --> 00:34:25,960
Speaker 6: is like a story my mind.

690
00:34:26,000 --> 00:34:27,879
Speaker 1: You're telling yourself. Yeah, And I.

691
00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:29,359
Speaker 6: Can think of my mind for that thought, like thank

692
00:34:29,400 --> 00:34:30,239
Speaker 6: you mind, you know.

693
00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:32,879
Speaker 2: Yeah, but you can then you can say oh, thank

694
00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:35,279
Speaker 2: you very much for coming, but no, thank you not

695
00:34:35,400 --> 00:34:35,799
Speaker 2: right now?

696
00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:37,879
Speaker 6: Yeah, Or you could play with it like I joke

697
00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:39,680
Speaker 6: with my clients like what if your thoughts are like

698
00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:43,800
Speaker 6: Susie from Curb Your Enthusiasm. You know you automatically. I

699
00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:45,719
Speaker 6: don't know if you want to get the reference. Maybe

700
00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:50,480
Speaker 6: we look like that we need to figure out some

701
00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:55,839
Speaker 6: like annoying, complaining kind of character. Yeah, it's because again

702
00:34:55,880 --> 00:34:58,759
Speaker 6: we get sucked into ruminating because we think that we're

703
00:34:58,800 --> 00:35:00,160
Speaker 6: somehow helping ourselves.

704
00:35:00,600 --> 00:35:03,479
Speaker 2: We're going to figure it out if we think about

705
00:35:03,480 --> 00:35:05,080
Speaker 2: it more and more, we're going to figure it out.

706
00:35:05,560 --> 00:35:07,920
Speaker 6: Let's think about it in a structured way, or let's

707
00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:10,560
Speaker 6: see it with distance and humor and perspective.

708
00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:18,359
Speaker 2: What about when, like we as mother and daughter, we

709
00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:22,279
Speaker 2: have stress over a topic or a situation, how can

710
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:24,680
Speaker 2: we handle that better in a way that's good for

711
00:35:24,840 --> 00:35:26,680
Speaker 2: our relationship at the end of the day.

712
00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:32,319
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean so I think talking about things in

713
00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:35,080
Speaker 6: a constructive way. And so if there's something that happened

714
00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:38,440
Speaker 6: like the Eagles T shirt or something like if you

715
00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:41,560
Speaker 6: can have a timestamp like okay, let's talk about this

716
00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:45,000
Speaker 6: for fifteen minutes and then let's get really present and

717
00:35:45,200 --> 00:35:48,239
Speaker 6: do what we would do on a normal Sunday night.

718
00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:51,040
Speaker 6: Because I think a lot of people think the more

719
00:35:51,040 --> 00:35:53,320
Speaker 6: they turn it over, they're more they're again like gonna

720
00:35:53,719 --> 00:35:57,239
Speaker 6: prevent it from happening again or create some sort of

721
00:35:57,280 --> 00:36:01,359
Speaker 6: brand new insight. But can we try to understand this

722
00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:04,719
Speaker 6: with compassion and kindness, will validate one another At the

723
00:36:04,840 --> 00:36:06,399
Speaker 6: end of the day, all we want is to feel

724
00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:09,320
Speaker 6: understood and see and if you and I can totally

725
00:36:09,320 --> 00:36:11,239
Speaker 6: see how you would like this is the perfect shirt,

726
00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:14,319
Speaker 6: Like no one could, guys, sure better than this. Oh,

727
00:36:14,400 --> 00:36:19,160
Speaker 6: this shirt really means a lot to to your stepdad

728
00:36:19,239 --> 00:36:22,719
Speaker 6: and what may be a way to repair this with him?

729
00:36:23,200 --> 00:36:25,000
Speaker 6: So again, like, if we can contain it, because I

730
00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:27,799
Speaker 6: think we get into it. It's fine to talk to

731
00:36:27,840 --> 00:36:29,840
Speaker 6: your friends about something that's stressing you out, or to

732
00:36:29,880 --> 00:36:33,600
Speaker 6: complain to someone about something, but can we you know,

733
00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:35,760
Speaker 6: make it ten minutes not two hours?

734
00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:38,319
Speaker 3: That's good, that's a good.

735
00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:39,080
Speaker 1: Yeah.

736
00:36:39,120 --> 00:36:41,600
Speaker 2: I think sometimes when you're in the heat of the moment,

737
00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:46,120
Speaker 2: we're you know, butting heads about something, we don't ever

738
00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:49,160
Speaker 2: really have a conversation about it. We just kind of

739
00:36:49,239 --> 00:36:50,600
Speaker 2: vent and pop off about it.

740
00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:53,040
Speaker 4: And that also causes me to ruminate about it more

741
00:36:53,120 --> 00:36:54,120
Speaker 4: when we stop talking.

742
00:36:55,040 --> 00:36:57,000
Speaker 2: So it's better to just sort of sit down, give

743
00:36:57,040 --> 00:36:59,279
Speaker 2: us that two minutes or three minutes or five minutes,

744
00:36:59,280 --> 00:37:03,360
Speaker 2: whatever we need. Yeah, I like that. It's a great tip.

745
00:37:03,880 --> 00:37:06,800
Speaker 6: The problem solving. Problem solving is a good alternative to

746
00:37:06,880 --> 00:37:08,200
Speaker 6: ruminating instead of like what if?

747
00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:08,480
Speaker 4: What if?

748
00:37:08,520 --> 00:37:11,880
Speaker 6: What if? Can know? Problem solve? This?

749
00:37:13,160 --> 00:37:17,160
Speaker 2: Problem solving that's something we don't think about enough. We

750
00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:19,959
Speaker 2: just think about the problem. Yeah, I think I taught

751
00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:22,320
Speaker 2: you this before. One of the things that my best

752
00:37:22,320 --> 00:37:26,160
Speaker 2: friend Adele, who's a therapist, taught me was when I'm

753
00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:29,239
Speaker 2: spiraling or ruminating or like feel like I'm gonna lose

754
00:37:29,280 --> 00:37:32,600
Speaker 2: it because I can't stop thinking about something, to envision

755
00:37:32,760 --> 00:37:36,359
Speaker 2: a stop sign. To see the stop sign in my mind,

756
00:37:36,400 --> 00:37:40,280
Speaker 2: the octagonal shapes, the edges, the white line around the border,

757
00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:42,760
Speaker 2: the color of the sign, the way that the letters

758
00:37:42,760 --> 00:37:46,520
Speaker 2: are white within the red and follow each letter in

759
00:37:46,600 --> 00:37:49,359
Speaker 2: my mind. And then by the end of it, I've

760
00:37:49,400 --> 00:37:52,080
Speaker 2: stopped thinking about whatever I was thinking about. And it's

761
00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:56,520
Speaker 2: just ironic that it's the stop sign. It's just a bonus.

762
00:37:57,719 --> 00:37:59,839
Speaker 6: Yeah, And there's a skill that we teach. I teach

763
00:38:00,120 --> 00:38:05,480
Speaker 6: as part of dialectical behavior therapy. Stop, slow down, take

764
00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:09,120
Speaker 6: a step back, observe, and proceed mindfully.

765
00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:13,279
Speaker 2: Would like that Stop, take a step back, step back,

766
00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:22,560
Speaker 2: slow down, Yeah, observe pndfully Already Oh my gosh, this

767
00:38:22,560 --> 00:38:25,240
Speaker 2: has been such a great conversation. Thank you, doctor Jenny.

768
00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:27,719
Speaker 2: I know that Fiona, you've loved it too.

769
00:38:27,800 --> 00:38:29,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, this is really helpful for me.

770
00:38:30,080 --> 00:38:32,200
Speaker 2: Uh, Before I let you go, I have to ask

771
00:38:32,239 --> 00:38:35,840
Speaker 2: you a question that I always ask my guests, Doctor Jenny,

772
00:38:35,880 --> 00:38:38,520
Speaker 2: What was the last I Choose me moment you had?

773
00:38:39,400 --> 00:38:39,640
Speaker 6: One?

774
00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:40,080
Speaker 5: Is?

775
00:38:40,200 --> 00:38:43,600
Speaker 6: I find like people find social media so distracting. I

776
00:38:43,600 --> 00:38:49,319
Speaker 6: find texting is so distracting. And I just yesterday someone

777
00:38:49,360 --> 00:38:52,440
Speaker 6: asked me to join a WhatsApp and I very proudly

778
00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:55,840
Speaker 6: told them that I don't use WhatsApp because it's like this.

779
00:38:56,760 --> 00:38:59,719
Speaker 6: I love like I Choose Me moments that are just

780
00:38:59,800 --> 00:39:04,000
Speaker 6: in distances but dramatically overhaul your quality of life. And

781
00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:07,240
Speaker 6: so much like ruminating takes us out of this moment,

782
00:39:07,280 --> 00:39:12,399
Speaker 6: constantly texting and messaging, of being really present and so not.

783
00:39:12,520 --> 00:39:15,880
Speaker 1: Having what's upp was your voment?

784
00:39:15,920 --> 00:39:19,040
Speaker 6: I love that group texts. Yeah, this constant noise and

785
00:39:19,080 --> 00:39:22,200
Speaker 6: pining and overthinking. And then the second one is even

786
00:39:22,200 --> 00:39:25,280
Speaker 6: in this moment, I think I'm all about removing negatives

787
00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:28,279
Speaker 6: and adding positives and even just taking a moment to

788
00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:31,440
Speaker 6: really savor this moment. I you know, it's crazy. I

789
00:39:31,560 --> 00:39:34,000
Speaker 6: used to watch Nina Tuna when I was Fiona's age.

790
00:39:34,840 --> 00:39:37,200
Speaker 6: It is surreal. I never would have thought when I

791
00:39:37,239 --> 00:39:40,480
Speaker 6: was an adolescent struggling with self doubt that I would

792
00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:42,040
Speaker 6: be sitting across from you today.

793
00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:45,520
Speaker 2: Well, I'm so glad you are because you're helping so

794
00:39:45,600 --> 00:39:48,160
Speaker 2: many people. So thank you. I know you helped us.

795
00:39:48,440 --> 00:39:49,319
Speaker 3: Yes, thank you.

796
00:39:50,160 --> 00:39:54,800
Speaker 2: I'm savoring this moment too, me too. Thank you, doctor Jenny.

797
00:39:55,320 --> 00:39:57,160
Speaker 6: Nice to see you, guys, Please stay in touch.

798
00:39:57,680 --> 00:40:03,359
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, nice to see you too. Oh my gosh,

799
00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:04,600
Speaker 2: didn't you love that conversation?

800
00:40:04,840 --> 00:40:06,800
Speaker 3: I loved it. It was really helpful.

801
00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:10,319
Speaker 2: You know what always amazes me about you. You have

802
00:40:11,760 --> 00:40:16,600
Speaker 2: a great self awareness about you, Like you know the

803
00:40:16,680 --> 00:40:19,239
Speaker 2: things that you would like to do differently. I think

804
00:40:19,360 --> 00:40:21,560
Speaker 2: you know, you know areas of your life that you're like,

805
00:40:21,600 --> 00:40:23,360
Speaker 2: I need to improve that a little bit or I

806
00:40:23,840 --> 00:40:26,720
Speaker 2: kind of don't want to be stuck in my thoughts

807
00:40:26,760 --> 00:40:29,520
Speaker 2: it doesn't feel good, and like you seek out ways

808
00:40:30,000 --> 00:40:33,120
Speaker 2: to make changes in your life. And I respect that

809
00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:36,040
Speaker 2: so much about you. Because you're just eighteen years old.

810
00:40:36,120 --> 00:40:40,759
Speaker 2: I wasn't doing any of that kind of helpful, you know,

811
00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:45,480
Speaker 2: thinking about thinking, Yeah, at my age.

812
00:40:45,239 --> 00:40:46,440
Speaker 3: You know, yeah.

813
00:40:46,520 --> 00:40:49,680
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, you're just so ahead of where I was.

814
00:40:49,719 --> 00:40:53,680
Speaker 2: I'm proud of being so much. Okay, but before I

815
00:40:53,760 --> 00:40:58,799
Speaker 2: let you go, Fiona Vatchinelle, what was your last I

816
00:40:58,920 --> 00:40:59,840
Speaker 2: choose me moment?

817
00:41:00,880 --> 00:41:06,600
Speaker 4: Okay, let me think. You know, I feel like I've

818
00:41:06,640 --> 00:41:08,279
Speaker 4: been doing this a lot recently. I don't know if

819
00:41:08,320 --> 00:41:10,560
Speaker 4: you've noticed, but I've been taking a lot of baths,

820
00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:12,799
Speaker 4: like I said earlier, and I feel like it just

821
00:41:13,200 --> 00:41:15,640
Speaker 4: is kind of a time for me to unwind from

822
00:41:15,680 --> 00:41:18,080
Speaker 4: my day. And I know sometimes I want to bring

823
00:41:18,120 --> 00:41:20,960
Speaker 4: my computer with me, like on my little like, you know,

824
00:41:21,480 --> 00:41:22,960
Speaker 4: prop it up some more and watch my show while

825
00:41:22,960 --> 00:41:25,880
Speaker 4: I'm in the bath. But like two nights ago, instead

826
00:41:25,880 --> 00:41:29,160
Speaker 4: of doing that, I actually read like literally half of

827
00:41:29,200 --> 00:41:31,000
Speaker 4: my new book that I got, And I think that

828
00:41:31,080 --> 00:41:33,680
Speaker 4: was just a really good moment where I put myself

829
00:41:33,680 --> 00:41:36,239
Speaker 4: first and I was in a ruminating spiral, so it

830
00:41:36,280 --> 00:41:40,560
Speaker 4: did help me. And yeah, I think reading and taking

831
00:41:40,600 --> 00:41:42,840
Speaker 4: time for myself away from the phone is really just

832
00:41:43,160 --> 00:41:45,719
Speaker 4: recently what I've been feeling like, I'm choosing myself more.

833
00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:46,839
Speaker 1: That's so good.

834
00:41:46,840 --> 00:41:49,600
Speaker 2: I'm glad you're getting that now because I've been telling

835
00:41:49,640 --> 00:41:51,040
Speaker 2: you to get off that damn phone.

836
00:41:52,160 --> 00:41:52,840
Speaker 1: It's happening.

837
00:41:53,360 --> 00:41:53,880
Speaker 3: I'm trying.

838
00:41:54,120 --> 00:41:56,000
Speaker 1: Wait, what book did you take in the bath.

839
00:41:55,800 --> 00:41:58,640
Speaker 4: With the Actually you got it for me for Christmas.

840
00:41:58,800 --> 00:41:59,359
Speaker 3: It was the one.

841
00:41:59,400 --> 00:42:03,919
Speaker 4: It's called Choosing Myself. I don't know the author. It's

842
00:42:03,920 --> 00:42:07,600
Speaker 4: called Choosing Me, and it's all about how to choose yourself.

843
00:42:07,600 --> 00:42:08,360
Speaker 1: Of that great.

844
00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:10,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's really good. Also.

845
00:42:10,080 --> 00:42:13,239
Speaker 4: Another one is one hundred and one Essays That'll Change

846
00:42:13,239 --> 00:42:16,279
Speaker 4: the Way You Think. Best book ever. I reread it

847
00:42:16,320 --> 00:42:18,720
Speaker 4: all the time. Brianna West I think is the author.

848
00:42:18,800 --> 00:42:19,360
Speaker 3: It's great.

849
00:42:20,680 --> 00:42:23,920
Speaker 2: Good hot tip yep from the eighteen year old you guys,

850
00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:27,960
Speaker 2: You're welcome. Thanks babe, thank you for having me.

851
00:42:28,040 --> 00:42:29,359
Speaker 4: It's so much fun and learned a lot