WEBVTT - Episode 5 - Warrior Spirit 0:00:01.480 --> 0:00:02.440 BBCD. 0:00:06.800 --> 0:00:10.840 Hey, I'm Maggie. Just a quick heads up before we start. 0:00:10.880 --> 0:00:14.440 The series does contain some descriptions of violence and deals 0:00:14.440 --> 0:00:24.920 with adult themes. How many tattoos do you have a lot? 0:00:26.079 --> 0:00:28.760 I have a physics equation tramp stamp. 0:00:29.040 --> 0:00:34.240 I thought that would be funny, funny. I love a 0:00:34.360 --> 0:00:37.960 physics tramp stapp. High brow lowbrow. 0:00:37.760 --> 0:00:41.240 Is my love language, and that is the epitome of 0:00:41.360 --> 0:00:42.239 hy braw lowbrow. 0:00:42.400 --> 0:00:43.879 That would be kind of ironic. 0:00:44.000 --> 0:00:46.880 So what's the physics equations? 0:00:47.159 --> 0:00:50.840 The Dirac equation. It kind of brings like quantum physics 0:00:51.000 --> 0:00:56.520 and relativity together. It just like explains everything, and it 0:00:56.680 --> 0:00:59.760 kind of talks about like dark matter and I don't 0:00:59.800 --> 0:01:02.720 know antimatter. I can't even remember. It's been so long. 0:01:04.520 --> 0:01:07.960 I'm sitting next to Liz on her oversized, well loved 0:01:08.120 --> 0:01:12.240 teal colored couch in London, nodding my head, pretending I 0:01:12.319 --> 0:01:16.000 know exactly what the Dorac equation is. I have no 0:01:16.080 --> 0:01:17.720 idea what the Dorac equation is. 0:01:19.000 --> 0:01:19.319 I love. 0:01:19.480 --> 0:01:22.119 Liz starts to roll up her sleeve, showing me her 0:01:22.120 --> 0:01:25.679 other tattoos, her mood changing as she does. 0:01:26.840 --> 0:01:28.120 This is beautiful. 0:01:28.360 --> 0:01:31.600 It's just got touched up. But most of this was 0:01:31.680 --> 0:01:36.640 done by a Mexican toutoo artist, and it's hard to see. 0:01:37.000 --> 0:01:40.880 Liz pivots her body further, lifting the fabric up and 0:01:40.959 --> 0:01:45.720 revealing a kaleidoscope of colorful flowers inked on her arm. 0:01:46.240 --> 0:01:48.360 So there was like a rose up here for their 0:01:48.520 --> 0:01:49.080 last name. 0:01:49.840 --> 0:01:53.880 She's now Liz Melgar Rose, taking the name Rose from 0:01:53.920 --> 0:01:59.880 her husband Anthony. And there are others, each flower representing 0:02:00.080 --> 0:02:01.840 a different member of her family. 0:02:02.280 --> 0:02:03.480 And then these. 0:02:03.280 --> 0:02:06.840 Are for my parents and stergazer Lily's. This is my 0:02:07.400 --> 0:02:12.160 mom's birth flower. This is the sacred mind flower. 0:02:12.400 --> 0:02:17.040 This one, yeah, a deep purple aster with its brilliant 0:02:17.160 --> 0:02:21.919 yellow center. There's a violet a sunflower. 0:02:23.360 --> 0:02:25.400 This is my daughter's birth flower. 0:02:26.200 --> 0:02:29.640 My son's a chrysanthemum. 0:02:29.120 --> 0:02:34.160 And the poppies are my dad's. And then this is 0:02:34.680 --> 0:02:38.680 a simplest cheese or a miracle and those are used 0:02:38.720 --> 0:02:42.400 young Day of the Dead. So that's like me wearing 0:02:42.440 --> 0:02:43.920 my altar all the time. 0:02:45.280 --> 0:02:49.720 Her tattoos her altar are not just devotions to her dad, 0:02:49.760 --> 0:02:54.080 but to their shared my inheritage. Something she says, Jim 0:02:54.160 --> 0:02:56.919 was deeply proud of having grown up in Guatemala. 0:02:58.160 --> 0:03:00.799 When I was a kid, He was always trying to 0:03:00.840 --> 0:03:03.480 teach me about our culture and tell me I should 0:03:03.520 --> 0:03:05.800 be proud of where we've come from, and you know 0:03:05.840 --> 0:03:08.000 that we've come from nothing and look at where we are. 0:03:08.080 --> 0:03:11.160 And I really didn't appreciate it at the time. I 0:03:11.240 --> 0:03:14.080 really didn't. I was just oh, my god, Okay, I 0:03:14.120 --> 0:03:18.720 get it. I've heard the story a hundred times. 0:03:19.720 --> 0:03:22.000 What would he tell you about living in Guatemala. 0:03:22.120 --> 0:03:24.639 He would just talk about like the absolute poverty. He 0:03:24.680 --> 0:03:26.480 would always tell me that, you know, you don't know 0:03:26.520 --> 0:03:28.760 how good you have it or how lucky you are. 0:03:30.919 --> 0:03:33.320 My grandmother she used to live in like straw and 0:03:33.480 --> 0:03:36.880 mud houses that they would have to rebuild every year. 0:03:37.440 --> 0:03:41.600 Her first language was a Mayan dialect called Kikichi, and 0:03:41.640 --> 0:03:45.000 then she learned Spanish later on once she got older. 0:03:45.520 --> 0:03:50.080 But they were very, very poor. So when I was six, 0:03:50.200 --> 0:03:54.960 we went for six weeks and I remember that trip vividly. 0:03:55.760 --> 0:03:56.880 Yeah, tell me about it. 0:03:57.040 --> 0:03:59.920 Yeah, I mean, we get there and in the middle 0:03:59.960 --> 0:04:02.600 of the courtyard there's like this shit and that's where 0:04:02.680 --> 0:04:06.040 everyone showers. But you know, I was like, there's no 0:04:06.160 --> 0:04:08.440 hot water. How am I going to take a bath? 0:04:09.040 --> 0:04:13.320 So my grandma got like one of those metal clothes, 0:04:13.480 --> 0:04:18.359 washing bins, and heated hot water on the stove so 0:04:18.400 --> 0:04:22.680 I could have a warm bath. And my dad said 0:04:22.720 --> 0:04:25.120 that as soon as we got there, I said, there's 0:04:25.160 --> 0:04:27.359 nothing cool to drink. I'm ready to go home. 0:04:28.240 --> 0:04:32.080 I mean understandable. I think I would feel the same 0:04:32.120 --> 0:04:37.039 way at age six. But as Liz gets older, her 0:04:37.080 --> 0:04:41.000 interest in her indigenous roots continued to grow, and after 0:04:41.040 --> 0:04:45.240 her dad's murder, that interest becomes a passion. 0:04:46.400 --> 0:04:50.680 I guess I'm trying to get to know the culture 0:04:50.920 --> 0:04:54.039 because I don't know. I guess it makes me feel 0:04:54.080 --> 0:04:56.960 more connected to my dad and my family. 0:04:58.200 --> 0:05:01.960 Liz is planning another test you to honor her kek 0:05:02.200 --> 0:05:03.200 Chi spirit. 0:05:04.200 --> 0:05:05.960 Do you know what you're going to get? Just a 0:05:06.040 --> 0:05:07.320 red band on your wrist? 0:05:07.520 --> 0:05:08.320 Yeah. 0:05:08.360 --> 0:05:12.279 Cool. It's supposed to signify the blood that's been shed 0:05:13.160 --> 0:05:16.520 from the genocide of the Mayan people. 0:05:18.120 --> 0:05:20.520 A symbol to mark the oppression of the mind people, 0:05:21.320 --> 0:05:24.680 which is no doubt an incredibly heavy thing to have 0:05:24.720 --> 0:05:28.720 inked on your body. But this red band also symbolizes 0:05:28.760 --> 0:05:33.760 a message of resilience and survival against acts of cruelty, 0:05:33.839 --> 0:05:36.160 And if you've been through what Liz has, I can 0:05:36.160 --> 0:05:41.080 see why this message would resonate so deeply. She's already 0:05:41.120 --> 0:05:45.159 lost one parent, and to rewind back to the summer 0:05:45.200 --> 0:05:49.040 of twenty fourteen, she feels like she's about to lose another. 0:05:52.960 --> 0:05:56.640 It's been eighteen months since Jim's death. Liz is at 0:05:56.680 --> 0:05:59.160 the new home she shares with her mom and husband, 0:05:59.600 --> 0:06:02.880 a high of flyers from various lawyers in her hands, 0:06:03.440 --> 0:06:05.360 all offering to represent Sandy. 0:06:06.920 --> 0:06:08.920 I can't imagine what Liz is feeling. 0:06:09.880 --> 0:06:11.640 She's trying to come to terms with the loss of 0:06:11.640 --> 0:06:15.479 her dad and now this all while just becoming a 0:06:15.560 --> 0:06:16.480 mother herself. 0:06:17.400 --> 0:06:20.320 I just had my daughter, so I was kind of 0:06:20.360 --> 0:06:21.200 all over the place. 0:06:23.160 --> 0:06:26.200 Liz is likely sleep deprived adjusting to her new life 0:06:26.200 --> 0:06:29.880 as a mom. Maybe this is all a mistake. Could 0:06:29.880 --> 0:06:33.520 this really be happening. She keeps checking the records on 0:06:33.560 --> 0:06:36.080 the district attorney's website. 0:06:35.960 --> 0:06:38.120 Clearing the page and then searching for her name, like 0:06:38.440 --> 0:06:41.240 this has to be a mistake, and like doing the 0:06:41.320 --> 0:06:43.719 search a couple of different ways just to be sure 0:06:43.760 --> 0:06:45.360 that I had the right information. 0:06:46.640 --> 0:06:47.800 But it's no mistake. 0:06:48.600 --> 0:06:51.840 Sandy had been indicted for Jim's murder, and right now 0:06:52.320 --> 0:06:55.560 Liz is going to need every fiber of her keck 0:06:55.839 --> 0:07:02.760 che Warrior Spirit to keep her mom out of jail. 0:07:04.839 --> 0:07:09.840 I'm Maggie Robinson Katz and from BBC Studios and iHeart Podcasts. 0:07:10.400 --> 0:07:23.360 This is Hands Tied Episode five Warrior Spirit. Liz has 0:07:23.480 --> 0:07:27.120 entered what feels like a parallel universe. Her mom is 0:07:27.160 --> 0:07:32.400 no longer Sandy Melgar, but the defendant accused of first 0:07:32.520 --> 0:07:36.640 degree murder and things are about to get even worse. 0:07:39.160 --> 0:07:42.800 We all served to Houston together so that she could 0:07:42.880 --> 0:07:47.320 turn herself in and be processed. My mom was in tears, 0:07:47.440 --> 0:07:51.560 and she's never been rested before, She's never gotten in trouble. 0:07:52.160 --> 0:07:53.360 I was terrifying for her. 0:07:55.200 --> 0:07:59.600 At nine am on July twenty ninth, twenty fourteen, in Houston, Texas, 0:08:00.480 --> 0:08:03.520 Sandy is arrested and the formal indictment is read out. 0:08:04.880 --> 0:08:10.200 Sandra Melgar is accused of unlawfully, intentionally and knowingly causing 0:08:10.240 --> 0:08:14.080 the death of I may by and I quote, stabbing 0:08:14.120 --> 0:08:19.280 the complainant with the deadly weapon, namely a knife. Sandy 0:08:19.360 --> 0:08:20.200 is granted bail. 0:08:21.360 --> 0:08:22.880 You don't know what's going to happen. You don't know 0:08:22.920 --> 0:08:24.480 how to prepare for that. There is no one you 0:08:24.480 --> 0:08:27.560 can really talk to you because not everybody goes through that. 0:08:28.200 --> 0:08:31.960 You know, it's very isolating, it's very it's it's hard. 0:08:33.520 --> 0:08:36.080 I think we all have expectations of how justice moves 0:08:36.080 --> 0:08:39.640 from what we've seen on movies or on TV. You're indicted, 0:08:39.800 --> 0:08:43.840 then it's straight to court. But the truth is the 0:08:43.920 --> 0:08:46.760 legal system often moves really slowly. 0:08:47.600 --> 0:08:50.760 You're on hold, you can't do anything, You're just in 0:08:50.800 --> 0:08:51.640 a holding pattern. 0:08:53.160 --> 0:08:56.640 Weeks turn into months, months turn into years. 0:08:57.679 --> 0:08:59.440 It never gets easier, but you learn to live with 0:08:59.480 --> 0:09:03.160 it and you learn how did you know? Yeah, have 0:09:03.280 --> 0:09:04.599 it be part of your life. 0:09:05.679 --> 0:09:17.520 In life, no matter how difficult March is. On the 0:09:17.640 --> 0:09:20.839 following summer in twenty fifteen, Liz and her daughter move 0:09:20.920 --> 0:09:25.199 out of Texas, thousands of miles away to Seattle after 0:09:25.240 --> 0:09:27.480 her husband, Anthony, lands a job there. 0:09:28.400 --> 0:09:31.480 I just tried to focus on my daughter really and 0:09:31.920 --> 0:09:33.800 I just felt like I didn't have a bandwidth to 0:09:33.960 --> 0:09:38.160 really deal with everything. I was just like, Okay, well 0:09:38.280 --> 0:09:41.440 this is how it's going to go. Now, like one 0:09:41.480 --> 0:09:42.920 foot in front of the other, what do we do? 0:09:44.040 --> 0:09:47.280 Sandy stays in Houston but tries to see Liz and 0:09:47.320 --> 0:09:49.280 her grandchild as often as she can. 0:09:50.520 --> 0:09:54.880 We actually spent a lot of time together. She spent 0:09:54.960 --> 0:09:57.559 a lot of time with my daughter, and I think that. 0:09:57.520 --> 0:09:58.320 Helped her a lot. 0:09:59.360 --> 0:10:03.800 And sixteen, four years after Jim's death and two years 0:10:03.840 --> 0:10:07.400 after Sandy's indictment, Liz is pregnant again. 0:10:07.640 --> 0:10:10.480 And my son was born, and she came and helped. 0:10:11.480 --> 0:10:13.040 She came and stayed with my daughter while I had 0:10:13.080 --> 0:10:13.960 him in the hospital. 0:10:15.320 --> 0:10:18.360 On the surface, Sandy's doing remarkably well. 0:10:19.200 --> 0:10:23.360 My mom is really good at like compartmentalizing, I guess, 0:10:23.440 --> 0:10:26.920 just pretending like that's not guess being in denial. I 0:10:26.920 --> 0:10:28.600 don't know, I don't know what you want to call it. 0:10:28.640 --> 0:10:31.640 But she's just good. I'm like, everything's fine. 0:10:34.400 --> 0:10:39.000 But everything's not fine. And Liz can see right through. 0:10:38.800 --> 0:10:42.480 It, obviously, like she was still under a ton of 0:10:42.480 --> 0:10:46.960 stress and still trying to process everything that happened and 0:10:47.520 --> 0:10:51.760 dealing with her own health not doing well, and stress 0:10:51.800 --> 0:10:55.319 also makes things worse, both the lupas and the epilepsy. 0:10:55.920 --> 0:10:57.240 So she struggled a lot. 0:10:58.679 --> 0:10:59.680 And what about Liz. 0:11:00.679 --> 0:11:05.679 She's filled with anxiety about the future. There might be 0:11:05.760 --> 0:11:11.000 some people who are listening who feel like accepting. 0:11:10.520 --> 0:11:15.600 The murder of your dad is horrible. That to accept 0:11:15.640 --> 0:11:19.200 that your mom killed your dad is way too horrible 0:11:19.240 --> 0:11:25.360 to entertain. So you can even like think about that possibility. 0:11:24.840 --> 0:11:27.760 But you have to, like, how can you not? You 0:11:27.880 --> 0:11:30.560 have to because it is a possibility, right, There's a 0:11:30.559 --> 0:11:48.680 ton of possibilities. Unfortunately, that is one. She's just a 0:11:48.800 --> 0:11:52.000 very warm and loving person. She's a mom. Like when 0:11:52.040 --> 0:11:55.480 you picture a mom, at least, I picture someone who 0:11:55.520 --> 0:11:58.280 gives you hugs and who's affectionate and who you can 0:11:58.320 --> 0:12:00.160 talk to and who you feel comfortable with. 0:12:01.920 --> 0:12:06.520 According to Liz, Sandy was always nurturing, constantly doting on 0:12:06.600 --> 0:12:07.480 her only daughter. 0:12:08.240 --> 0:12:10.440 You know, they're making you food, and they're feeding you, 0:12:10.640 --> 0:12:13.840 and they're making sure you're okay, and you know, it's 0:12:13.880 --> 0:12:14.880 just someone you can trust. 0:12:16.440 --> 0:12:16.880 Liz says. 0:12:16.960 --> 0:12:21.520 Sandy was the peacemaker of the family, especially during shall 0:12:21.600 --> 0:12:26.200 we say Liz's more rebellious years. She was always the. 0:12:26.160 --> 0:12:28.520 Buffer between me and my dad, and she was always 0:12:28.679 --> 0:12:31.600 telling my dad to just you know, it's okay, just 0:12:31.640 --> 0:12:35.160 give her some space. It'll be fine. I felt like 0:12:35.200 --> 0:12:38.680 my mother was somebody I could genuinely talk to, not 0:12:38.800 --> 0:12:40.920 about everything, but about most things. 0:12:42.280 --> 0:12:44.200 I think a lot of daughters feel that way about 0:12:44.240 --> 0:12:47.400 their mothers. They don't need to know everything like, you know, 0:12:47.679 --> 0:12:50.440 maybe the time you flirted with shoplifting when you were a. 0:12:50.440 --> 0:12:51.840 Little too old to be doing that. 0:12:53.080 --> 0:12:53.320 Just me. 0:12:54.720 --> 0:12:59.520 My mom is an incredibly calmon, easy going She never complains. 0:13:00.400 --> 0:13:03.360 It was always about other people, and you know, she 0:13:03.480 --> 0:13:06.280 just wanted everyone else to be okay. And I think 0:13:06.320 --> 0:13:09.320 she came last a lot at the time. But I 0:13:09.320 --> 0:13:10.679 think that's a lot of moms. 0:13:13.320 --> 0:13:15.720 I feel like throughout this podcast, we've talked a lot 0:13:15.760 --> 0:13:21.520 about Sandy's situation, but who she is, what she likes, dislikes, 0:13:21.559 --> 0:13:26.079 her favorite foods, you know, the things that make us us. 0:13:27.000 --> 0:13:30.520 All of that feels a little fuzzy to me. I 0:13:30.559 --> 0:13:32.440 want to see if I can understand her a bit 0:13:32.520 --> 0:13:36.080 more where she comes from, so I seek out some 0:13:36.200 --> 0:13:36.920 of her family. 0:13:38.720 --> 0:13:43.840 The age difference between Sandy and I is about thirteen 0:13:43.960 --> 0:13:49.960 fourteen years. We grew up together, so she was raised 0:13:50.040 --> 0:13:54.360 by my grandmother, as was I, So Sandy has always 0:13:54.400 --> 0:13:55.840 been in my life. 0:13:56.160 --> 0:13:57.920 Diana is Sandy's cousin. 0:13:58.679 --> 0:14:01.080 Her mom and. 0:14:00.920 --> 0:14:05.720 My dad were siblings, but in reality they're more like sisters, 0:14:06.559 --> 0:14:10.240 just like Sandy. Diana says she was abandoned by her parents, 0:14:10.800 --> 0:14:13.200 so they both grew up in Laredo, a town in 0:14:13.240 --> 0:14:14.880 Texas near the Mexican border. 0:14:16.520 --> 0:14:21.040 At any given point, that could be like seven kids 0:14:21.520 --> 0:14:24.840 in a tiny house. It was just fun for me 0:14:24.960 --> 0:14:28.440 having so many people around, so much love around. 0:14:28.560 --> 0:14:30.600 But it was difficult. 0:14:31.080 --> 0:14:34.400 We were poor and we struggled for food, and you know, 0:14:34.440 --> 0:14:37.600 we would go hungry. I could see pictures and look 0:14:37.680 --> 0:14:40.440 back on it now and see the conditions we were 0:14:40.440 --> 0:14:43.880 living in, how I was dressed, how malnursed I look. 0:14:45.200 --> 0:14:51.600 Sandy was Diana's role model, caring, reliable, sensible. She even 0:14:51.640 --> 0:14:52.880 taught Diana to drive. 0:14:53.960 --> 0:14:55.920 She was such a goodie two shoes, like I don't 0:14:55.920 --> 0:14:58.520 know how else to put it. She wasn't a rule breaker, 0:14:59.440 --> 0:15:03.320 you know. She we followed the law. She barely had 0:15:03.320 --> 0:15:04.320 a speeding ticket. 0:15:05.640 --> 0:15:09.800 Diana followed Sandy from Laredo to Houston and lived with 0:15:09.840 --> 0:15:10.720 her in Jim for a. 0:15:10.680 --> 0:15:11.560 Couple of years. 0:15:12.320 --> 0:15:14.880 She says it was her first experience of living in 0:15:14.920 --> 0:15:16.080 a peaceful home. 0:15:16.840 --> 0:15:20.720 Sandy and Jim, they had a good life, like they 0:15:20.760 --> 0:15:23.480 had made it, you know, out of the whole family, 0:15:23.680 --> 0:15:26.400 she was the first one to have a nice home 0:15:27.280 --> 0:15:30.640 and a good marriage, like we didn't grow up with, 0:15:30.960 --> 0:15:34.840 you know, examples of a good marriage. Besides my aunt. 0:15:35.360 --> 0:15:38.440 Everyone else was broken home. You know, my dad, his 0:15:38.520 --> 0:15:41.360 marriage didn't work out. Her mom, you know, their marriage 0:15:41.400 --> 0:15:46.720 didn't work out. So they were a perfect example of 0:15:47.440 --> 0:15:51.240 what we all strive to achieve one day, you know, 0:15:51.360 --> 0:15:57.320 the financial stability, the good marriage, you know. I it's 0:15:57.480 --> 0:16:00.440 just still so crazy that out of all of us, 0:16:01.160 --> 0:16:04.720 she is the one that ended up in this situation. 0:16:07.960 --> 0:16:12.920 Maybe it's unsurprising considering how much Diana revered Sandy, but 0:16:12.960 --> 0:16:16.240 you can't think of anyone less likely to murder their husband. 0:16:17.200 --> 0:16:21.840 It was devastating that anyone could think that she was 0:16:21.920 --> 0:16:24.680 capable of that, and that she would do something like 0:16:24.760 --> 0:16:28.680 that to Jim. And I think maybe she was afraid that, 0:16:29.000 --> 0:16:30.600 you know, we were going to think the same thing, 0:16:31.600 --> 0:16:36.680 But it just it never entered my mind that Sandy 0:16:36.680 --> 0:16:38.120 could be capable of that. 0:16:40.040 --> 0:16:43.480 But in the summer of twenty seventeen, Sandy's murder trial 0:16:43.600 --> 0:16:47.760 is finally scheduled, and Diana braces herself for what might 0:16:47.800 --> 0:16:48.720 come out in court. 0:16:49.720 --> 0:16:51.000 What if she got it all wrong? 0:16:52.200 --> 0:16:56.320 You know, I believe in science, I believe in evidence, 0:16:56.640 --> 0:17:00.840 I believe in law enforcement. And so before the how started, 0:17:01.440 --> 0:17:05.320 I prepared myself. I prepared myself for the possibility of 0:17:06.000 --> 0:17:10.760 Sandy actually doing this crime, Like I was not blind 0:17:10.840 --> 0:17:14.760 to the fact that it is possible, you know, And 0:17:14.800 --> 0:17:18.480 so I prepared myself that I'm going to be sitting there, 0:17:18.640 --> 0:17:22.480 you know, during the trial and I could find out 0:17:23.040 --> 0:17:26.080 Sandy is guilty. That's how I looked at it, because 0:17:26.119 --> 0:17:29.879 I was prepared to see the evidence, you know. I 0:17:29.960 --> 0:17:35.199 believe that if they charge someone that they have the 0:17:35.240 --> 0:17:38.639 evidence to back it up. And I thought, well, what 0:17:38.760 --> 0:17:42.119 am I going to do if she's guilty, Like, what 0:17:42.240 --> 0:17:46.400 am I going to do? And I knew that, Okay, 0:17:46.480 --> 0:17:49.800 if she's guilty, then she deserves to be in prison, 0:17:50.040 --> 0:17:52.760 and I'm not going to turn my back on her. 0:17:53.280 --> 0:17:55.879 You know, She's been there my whole life, so I 0:17:56.000 --> 0:18:01.120 will support her however I can. But she definitely deserves 0:18:01.160 --> 0:18:03.760 to be in prison if that's what she did, if 0:18:03.760 --> 0:18:07.560 she's guilty of this. So that's how I went into 0:18:07.600 --> 0:18:11.960 the trial, knowing that I could get some devastating news. 0:18:25.160 --> 0:18:29.600 Mac and I wholeheartedly, without a doubt, believe in Sandra's innocence. 0:18:30.480 --> 0:18:33.359 This is, no doubt a helpful sentiment if you're going 0:18:33.440 --> 0:18:37.080 to defend someone against the murder charge, and Sandy's lucky 0:18:37.119 --> 0:18:41.560 She's got Allison Seacrest, who, along with her uncle Mac Seacrest, 0:18:41.760 --> 0:18:43.879 will be representing her in court. 0:18:44.359 --> 0:18:48.240 I was honored and delighted to step in and represent 0:18:48.480 --> 0:18:49.960 Sandy at trial. 0:18:51.359 --> 0:18:54.080 Mac is my uncle and like a second father. 0:18:55.080 --> 0:18:58.640 She lived with me and studied the law and learned 0:18:58.680 --> 0:18:59.280 to have a cook. 0:19:00.000 --> 0:19:03.320 I had a cook, Oh gosh, amazing salads, you know, 0:19:03.400 --> 0:19:07.000 lovely fish, all kinds of things. He's an amazing chef 0:19:07.040 --> 0:19:09.840 and more importantly, a great friend and excellent mentor. 0:19:11.720 --> 0:19:15.560 George McCall c Chris Junior, or Mac as he prefers 0:19:15.560 --> 0:19:19.160 to be called as in his late seventies. Now, he's 0:19:19.200 --> 0:19:22.439 one of the big guns of the Texas legal world. 0:19:22.880 --> 0:19:26.280 He's been practicing since nineteen seventy seven, and he wrote 0:19:26.320 --> 0:19:30.399 the book on law. No really, he's the author of 0:19:30.560 --> 0:19:36.400 O'Connor's Texas Criminal Codes plus a kind of Texan legal bible. 0:19:37.160 --> 0:19:40.760 And Alison is not only his niece but his protege. 0:19:41.520 --> 0:19:43.440 I had the opportunity to go to court with him 0:19:43.440 --> 0:19:47.080 when I was gosh, probably fourth grade or so, and 0:19:47.720 --> 0:19:50.679 just thought it was really fascinating seeing him interacting with 0:19:50.800 --> 0:19:53.480 judges and lawyers and his client. 0:19:54.080 --> 0:19:56.480 Alison cut her teeth as a prosecutor in the Harris 0:19:56.520 --> 0:20:01.240 County DA's office before going into private practice. After taking 0:20:01.280 --> 0:20:04.760 on Sandy's case, they request the Melgar police files and 0:20:04.800 --> 0:20:08.080 began acquainting themselves with the various details. 0:20:09.280 --> 0:20:13.560 We spent hours and hours with Sandy, hours and hours 0:20:13.600 --> 0:20:17.240 with her daughter and with other witnesses and family friends 0:20:17.280 --> 0:20:20.800 that we called, you know, as a young defense attorney, 0:20:21.480 --> 0:20:25.480 not the experience that my uncle had. Obviously, it was 0:20:25.600 --> 0:20:29.159 hard not to get involved. You know. I think a 0:20:29.200 --> 0:20:32.200 lot of doctors and lawyers and probably some other professions 0:20:32.720 --> 0:20:35.960 have to learn to compartmentalize and not become attached. But 0:20:36.760 --> 0:20:39.360 I like Sandy. We did a deep dive into all 0:20:39.400 --> 0:20:45.719 of her text messages and understanding what their relationship was like, 0:20:45.840 --> 0:20:50.600 what a sweet, loving family, and it wasn't possible for 0:20:50.680 --> 0:20:52.879 us to not get emotionally involved. 0:20:55.080 --> 0:21:00.760 But soon mac Alison, Liz and Diana, we'll see how 0:21:00.800 --> 0:21:02.960 this will all play out in court. 0:21:04.640 --> 0:21:05.840 A local mark case. 0:21:05.720 --> 0:21:08.000 That grabbed national attention is headed. 0:21:07.720 --> 0:21:10.479 To trial Jerry's selection starting today in the trial of 0:21:10.560 --> 0:21:14.119 Sandra Melgar, who's accused of murdering her longtime husband then 0:21:14.200 --> 0:21:15.200 trying to cover it up. 0:21:15.760 --> 0:21:19.760 The media circus picks into high gear and presents viewers 0:21:19.760 --> 0:21:23.840 with a familiar setup of a lurid them fatale murder trial. 0:21:24.320 --> 0:21:27.440 This is a case that began in twenty twelve and 0:21:27.680 --> 0:21:31.560 Sandra Melgar stands accused of murdering her husband, hi May Melgar, 0:21:31.640 --> 0:21:34.280 then staging a home invasion as a cover up. It 0:21:34.320 --> 0:21:37.639 happened on December twenty third in northwest Harris County. Sandra 0:21:37.680 --> 0:21:40.119 and her husband were both found tied up. He was 0:21:40.200 --> 0:21:43.199 found dead, stabbed thirty one times in a closet. She 0:21:43.520 --> 0:21:45.240 was found bound in a bathroom. 0:21:45.640 --> 0:21:48.440 Melgar originally had told investigators that she blacked out in 0:21:48.520 --> 0:21:51.440 a bathroom and woke up tied up in a closet, 0:21:51.640 --> 0:21:54.680 but nearly two years later she was arrested and charged 0:21:54.760 --> 0:21:57.439 with murder. Now Melgar has been free on a fifty 0:21:57.520 --> 0:22:01.000 thousand dollars bond. If convicted of murder, she faces up 0:22:01.040 --> 0:22:02.480 to like in prison. 0:22:09.200 --> 0:22:14.119 On Thursday, August twenty seventeen, the State of Texas Versus 0:22:14.119 --> 0:22:25.880 Sandra Jean Melgar begins Harris County Criminal Justice Center, Franklin Street, 0:22:26.040 --> 0:22:32.560 Downtown Houston. A busker greets the study flow of people 0:22:32.640 --> 0:22:35.159 as they climb the stone steps and pass through the 0:22:35.160 --> 0:22:42.440 glass doors of the imposing twenty one story building. Attorneys, 0:22:42.680 --> 0:22:47.320 journalists Jim and Sandy's family including Liz, Anthony and Diana, 0:22:47.920 --> 0:22:50.280 and members of the public all wait in line at 0:22:50.320 --> 0:22:55.280 the airport style security. Laptops are laid neatly in trays, 0:22:55.680 --> 0:23:02.000 pockets emptied. Today the line is longer than usual. A 0:23:02.080 --> 0:23:05.399 noisy knot of law students join the line. They've just 0:23:05.440 --> 0:23:08.359 finished their bar exams and for the first time in months, 0:23:08.400 --> 0:23:11.840 they've got some downtime. What better way to spend it 0:23:11.880 --> 0:23:14.520 than setting in on the opening day of what promises 0:23:14.600 --> 0:23:16.639 to be an extraordinary case. 0:23:19.480 --> 0:23:21.640 It was just like one of the most surreal moments 0:23:21.680 --> 0:23:24.280 of my life. It just felt like this, like a 0:23:24.560 --> 0:23:28.680 snowball that just was gathering momentum. 0:23:28.840 --> 0:23:32.479 Liz attempts to navigate the swirling frenzy of the media. 0:23:33.400 --> 0:23:37.360 Cameras aren't allowed inside the courtroom, so the TV crews linger. 0:23:37.160 --> 0:23:41.880 In the hallway, and there's just this camera guy from 0:23:41.880 --> 0:23:44.439 one of the news stations and he's just like he 0:23:44.520 --> 0:23:47.240 hits somebody in the head of his camera. My husband 0:23:47.560 --> 0:23:50.000 is trying to get him the way to block him. 0:23:50.680 --> 0:23:53.120 The guy's walking backwards and my husband's like in front 0:23:53.119 --> 0:23:55.520 of us I'm trying not to trip over my crutches. 0:23:57.119 --> 0:24:01.520 As if things aren't complicated enough covering from surgery and 0:24:01.600 --> 0:24:03.119 hobbling around on crutches. 0:24:04.840 --> 0:24:07.679 I mean, there's just like it's just pure chaos in 0:24:07.720 --> 0:24:11.600 this whole way. And I mean I'd never experienced anything 0:24:11.640 --> 0:24:12.480 like that before. 0:24:14.400 --> 0:24:17.640 But Liz isn't allowed to watch the trial because she's 0:24:17.680 --> 0:24:19.240 going to be called as a witness. 0:24:19.760 --> 0:24:21.520 Well, yeah, they put you in a witness room and 0:24:21.560 --> 0:24:22.960 you just have to sit in there all day, every 0:24:23.000 --> 0:24:24.399 day and wait because you don't know when you're going 0:24:24.480 --> 0:24:25.000 to be called. 0:24:26.280 --> 0:24:28.280 Liz is going to miss the moment she's been waiting 0:24:28.560 --> 0:24:32.879 years for when the detectives finally reveal their evidence against 0:24:32.920 --> 0:24:37.680 her mom, why they think Sandy killed her dad, even 0:24:37.720 --> 0:24:38.360 though she was. 0:24:38.359 --> 0:24:39.919 Found with her hands tied. 0:24:41.320 --> 0:24:44.600 It's the same for Sandy's cousin Diana, who's also being 0:24:44.600 --> 0:24:45.520 called as a witness. 0:24:46.920 --> 0:24:52.360 That devastated me because I wanted to hear the evidence firsthand. 0:24:52.840 --> 0:24:55.040 I wanted to see it. I didn't want to read it. 0:24:55.640 --> 0:24:58.160 I wanted to see what the jury was going to 0:24:58.160 --> 0:25:00.879 see and hear. I wanted to exp experience it just 0:25:00.960 --> 0:25:02.600