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Speaker 1: And let's not forget that. You know how creative Christian

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Speaker 1: Polisic is. He's so creative that he he doesn't know

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Speaker 1: what he's gonna do next. And because of that, and

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Speaker 1: this is totally normal for creative players, and because of that,

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Speaker 1: you need, I believe a player like Baligan who understands

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Speaker 1: that type of player, who's playing at that type of

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Speaker 1: level with players who are also like that.

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Speaker 2: Greetings, folks, and welcome to Inside American Soccer. I'm Matt Doyle,

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Speaker 2: the armchair analyst, and I'll be filling in for new

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Speaker 2: dad Tom Bogert for a couple more weeks. And I

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Speaker 2: am joined as always by my friend and yours, one

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Speaker 2: of the greatest soccer players in US men's history, a

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Speaker 2: veteran of three World Cups. Tab Ramos Todd, How.

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Speaker 3: You do pretty good?

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Speaker 1: I mean, you know, I was just thinking, is the

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Speaker 1: snow ever gonna stop here on these cuz I mean

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Speaker 1: I feel like I haven't seen grass in two months.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, but spring is right around the corner.

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Speaker 2: The MLS season kicks off this weekend, Like I think

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Speaker 2: we're gonna be seeing it, at least on our TV screens.

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Speaker 4: I threw my back out shoveling last month.

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Speaker 2: I hadn't shoveled shoveled in twenty five years, so like

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Speaker 2: I'm out of I'm out of the habit, I'm out

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Speaker 2: of practice.

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Speaker 4: It's been pretty rough, dude.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it certainly has been because I've had some back

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Speaker 1: issues myself.

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Speaker 3: With all the snow.

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Speaker 1: I usually shovel everything myself, and I'm okay with it,

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Speaker 1: by the way, because I'm you know, obviously, I'm an

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Speaker 1: go to the gym guy every day. So the day

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Speaker 1: it snows, I skip the gym and I use the

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Speaker 1: uh sort of the snow shoveling for to take over.

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Speaker 1: But unfortunately it's been rough.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I prefer the gym to shoveling, and I prefer talking

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Speaker 2: soccer to talking about shoveling.

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Speaker 3: So let's do that.

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Speaker 2: We have some topics today that I think are of

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Speaker 2: real interest to US national team fans as we close

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Speaker 2: in on the World Cup it's just four months away.

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Speaker 4: Now there's some, honestly, some real discussion.

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Speaker 2: Had about what's going to happen up top. Pat Agimon

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Speaker 2: scored another goal in the Championship. Haji Wright finally getting

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Speaker 2: back on the board with a hat trick for Coventry City.

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Speaker 2: Then I'm gonna give my starting eleven for the men

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Speaker 2: for this summer, and we'll debut a new segment called

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Speaker 2: Tactics Time, where we'll get into the details of how

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Speaker 2: the US could and should play coming into the March Friendlies.

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Speaker 2: We talked about this a couple of weeks ago when

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Speaker 2: Marcello was here. He's the one who really opened the

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Speaker 2: box on this, talking about how the three four two

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Speaker 2: one becomes a four to four to two, and I

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Speaker 2: think that's an important thing for us, for US and

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Speaker 2: for fans to understand. Plus, we're going to go into

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Speaker 2: the locker room with Tab talking about that twenty nineteen

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Speaker 2: US U twenty national team, which produced so many great players,

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Speaker 2: guys like Chris Richards, Erginio Desk, Tim Waya for the

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Speaker 2: US and Richieldesmo for l Tree. So there's a couple

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Speaker 2: of different pathways to this summer's World Cup out of

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Speaker 2: that team, which I have to admit was my favorite

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Speaker 2: of the four twenty teams you coached. But let's get

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Speaker 2: into the US national team news first. Hoagi Wright had

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Speaker 2: that hat trick to take Coventry to the top of

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Speaker 2: the championship. He has had a really streaky, really up

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Speaker 2: and down season. But now he's on thirteen goals, which

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Speaker 2: is second place in the championship. It's tough to figure

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Speaker 2: out where he fits in Pascha's eyes. But you keep

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Speaker 2: scoring goals, you're going to be on the ross.

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Speaker 1: Well, I mean, and this is this is unfortunately where

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Speaker 1: we all are in terms of the forwards, right, because

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Speaker 1: we go week to week, we go from saying one week, well,

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Speaker 1: you know it was by the way, I blame myself

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Speaker 1: for saying last week, well, you know what, Hodgi's really

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Speaker 1: falling behind. He's only scored two goals in about two months.

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Speaker 1: How is that going to take him on the team?

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Speaker 1: And after yesterday, I'm thinking I think he's fighting for

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Speaker 1: a starting spot. So that's kind of where we are.

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Speaker 1: But you know, this is this is all great to say,

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Speaker 1: and it goes to show that, you know, in that

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Speaker 1: forward spot, I think we're going to be likely waiting

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Speaker 1: until the last couple of weeks before we can actually

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Speaker 1: say Marisa Buchetino is going to pick these guys because

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Speaker 1: I think there's legitimately four guys that have a chance

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Speaker 1: to go maybe even five.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and right, if he keeps scoring, is one of them.

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Speaker 2: But he's not really a traditional number nine. If you

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Speaker 2: look at the way he scores his goals, he almost

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Speaker 2: seems more comfortable coming in from the wing, working off

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Speaker 2: of the movement of maybe a more traditional center forward.

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Speaker 2: Now that would lead you to say, well, maybe you

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Speaker 2: know a two forward setup, but it's not going to

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Speaker 2: be like that. So I guess my question is, if

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Speaker 2: you were coaching him and using Pascha's system, are you

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Speaker 2: comfortable with how Haji fits?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: You know that that's interesting what you're saying, because you know,

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Speaker 1: I look back at all of the the the pre

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Speaker 1: the youth national teams of a few years back, in

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Speaker 1: all the depth charts and every depth chart where I

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Speaker 1: see Hajji right, I see him on the left right,

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Speaker 1: So he was sort of like a left winger coming inside.

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Speaker 3: And that's what you're saying.

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Speaker 1: So but with our national team, you know, and every team,

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Speaker 1: you always have to consider the talent that you have.

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Speaker 1: That's how you build a team because what you have

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Speaker 1: is what you have, regardless of.

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Speaker 3: How you want to play.

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Speaker 1: If we were ever going to play a two forward system,

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Speaker 1: it's likely that it's going to be. At this point, again,

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Speaker 1: speaking today, it's likely that it's going to be Balligan

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Speaker 1: with a Christian polistic playing that second forward type of position.

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Speaker 1: So to answer your question, would I see Hajji playing

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Speaker 1: that nine role, I have to tell you. I have

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Speaker 1: to see in the goals he scored this just yesterday

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Speaker 1: or you know, a couple of days ago. I think

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Speaker 1: he can. I think he can. I think he can

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Speaker 1: be that nine because he scored the goals he scored.

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Speaker 1: Obviously one was a penalty, but the other two goals

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Speaker 1: are number nine goals. You know, just see the way

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Speaker 1: he handled you know that long bow that I think

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Speaker 1: game it might have come from the goalkeeper, that long

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Speaker 1: bowl where he pushes the player off with one hand

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Speaker 1: like nothing, And yeah, I mean these are number nine goals.

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Speaker 1: Obviously the header he hits the post about a couple

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Speaker 1: of minutes into the game with a header. So to

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Speaker 1: answer your question, I think he can do either. He

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Speaker 1: could be wide, he could be a second forwarded, he

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Speaker 1: could potentially be the nine.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, it's good to see from him.

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Speaker 2: I think it's one of the has to be one

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Speaker 2: of the priority things that Punch looks at in next

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Speaker 2: month's friendlies. The final camp before the World Cup is

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Speaker 2: to get Hodgi a run in that true number nine spot,

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Speaker 2: because the guy it feels like everybody is chasing is

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Speaker 2: follering Balligan, who I think is still the starter. And

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Speaker 2: if you look back at the last half dozen friendlies

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Speaker 2: that the US played, the last five, I guess you

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Speaker 2: know he started three of those games. He scored in

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Speaker 2: every one of those games. Meanwhile, he's gone ice cold

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Speaker 2: I for Monica. At the club level, how do you

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Speaker 2: balance that if you're the coach a guy that you

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Speaker 2: rely upon, like I think Brian McBride is famously like

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Speaker 2: this for Bruce Arena back in the two thousand and

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Speaker 2: two cycle. He went twenty odd games without scoring for

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Speaker 2: his club. Bruce obviously took him and started him anyway,

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Speaker 2: and that paid off with a couple of goals.

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Speaker 1: So I would say this so a couple of different ways.

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Speaker 1: Looking at it from the outside, I would say, first

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Speaker 1: of all, Baligan, you know his next game is against

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Speaker 1: PSG in the Champions League, right, So no disrespect to

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Speaker 1: Middlesbrough in the Championship, but you're playing against PSG in

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Speaker 1: the Champions League. You're playing you're fighting for a Champions

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Speaker 1: League spot in your own league, and you're playing games

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Speaker 1: at the absolute top level that you can play, So

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Speaker 1: I think we couldn't avoid measuring using that as a

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Speaker 1: measuring stick. The next thing, looking from the outside would

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Speaker 1: be for me is his coach is still playing in them.

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Speaker 1: So as long as your coach is playing you, that

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Speaker 1: means that the is just not going in, but he

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Speaker 1: has confidence in you. I'd be worried if Baligan was

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Speaker 1: not scoring and now all of a sudden he's not

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Speaker 1: playing much, that's a concern rate, But as long as

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Speaker 1: he's on the field, I'm not concerned with that because

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Speaker 1: I'm measuring him by the quality of the games he

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Speaker 1: participates in.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Balligan, I think, unquestion, is playing against the toughest

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Speaker 2: competition of anyone in the center forward pool. And you

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Speaker 2: make a good point, he's still playing even though he's

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Speaker 2: not putting the ball in the back of the net.

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Speaker 2: And it's because he adds so much value off the ball.

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Speaker 2: And it's not just the threat of his speed and

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Speaker 2: he's not the fastest player in the world, but he

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Speaker 2: has good pays.

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Speaker 4: But it's how he is.

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Speaker 2: Constantly making those sort of penetrating off ball runs, attacking

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Speaker 2: the space behind the opposing defense, and that always gives

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Speaker 2: opposing center backs something else to think about, so they

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Speaker 2: can't just sort of focus on the play in front

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Speaker 2: of them. They have to always be calculating what's happening

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Speaker 2: in behind them. It's how a good forward comes a

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Speaker 2: playmaker without even touching the ball. You just give space

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Speaker 2: to the guys around you. And you played as a playmaker.

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Speaker 2: You played sometimes outside, sometimes inside, and sometimes he had

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Speaker 2: forwards like that, and sometimes he did sometimes he had

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Speaker 2: guys who would attack the space and behind and sometimes

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Speaker 2: you didn't talk about the difference. How it impacts the

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Speaker 2: game when you have a forward who is always going

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Speaker 2: to be unselfish with those off ball runs trying to

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Speaker 2: get in behind, and how it makes life easier for

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Speaker 2: the midfielders.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, you know this is this is a

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Speaker 1: good point to look at because for the players behind,

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Speaker 1: and this is why teams require time to develop. You

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Speaker 1: need to obviously get to know everyone and their their

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Speaker 1: strengths within the team. When you have a forward who

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Speaker 1: can stretch the field the way Baligan can stretch the field,

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Speaker 1: it gives everyone behind them a lot more room because

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Speaker 1: number one, you know, teams.

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Speaker 3: Are are a lot more.

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Speaker 1: Uh, let's i don't want to say scared, but there

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Speaker 1: are a lot more apprehensive in terms of playing that

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Speaker 1: high line, right, so they they're a little bit more careful.

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Speaker 1: By being a little bit more careful, they do take

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Speaker 1: those three or four steps behind, and by taking those

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Speaker 1: three or four steps back, it creates a little bit

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Speaker 1: more room in that in that spot between what.

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Speaker 3: Would be the the.

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Speaker 1: Ford defenders and the defensive midfield area, and that's areas

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Speaker 1: where you create. So I think players like Balligan can

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Speaker 1: do all of that. But let's not let's not forget

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Speaker 1: that ballogn He can stretch the field, but he can

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Speaker 1: also come back and receive. He's a good connector and

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Speaker 1: that's something that is difficult to find those type of forwards.

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Speaker 1: Let's say, like you know, reminds me a little bit

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Speaker 1: of like a McBride. So McBride could come in, knew

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Speaker 1: his exact role, he knew how to hang around the box,

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Speaker 1: he could come back and receive, defeat, play it off

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Speaker 1: and get into the box. And he's a little bit

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Speaker 1: similar to the way McBride used to play. And McBride

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Speaker 1: obviously was to me one of the perfect nines that

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Speaker 1: we had. So it does as as a playmaker. It

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Speaker 1: gives you a lot of different possibilities and it makes

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Speaker 1: it really difficult for the two center backs.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, in those sacrificial runs.

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Speaker 2: A guy that we saw in MLS five years ago

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Speaker 2: doing them all the time was Tati Castianos, and he

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Speaker 2: was a guy who would go hot and cold in

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Speaker 2: terms of his goal scoring, but he did everything else

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Speaker 2: so well. He got that move to Lazio. Now he's

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Speaker 2: scoring goals for West Ham in the Premiership. Twenty five

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Speaker 2: million dollar player. There's a lot of similarities I see

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Speaker 2: between him.

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Speaker 4: And flow Ball.

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Speaker 2: Again, he plays selflessly, which is not a word you

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Speaker 2: usually associate with the center forward. These guys are supposed

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Speaker 2: to be goal hungry all the time, which is not

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Speaker 2: to say he isn't, but he does think about it,

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Speaker 2: or he does play the position in a way that

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Speaker 2: sort of works for the team. Honestly, I see that

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Speaker 2: in Patagimon as well. His movement is not as refined,

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Speaker 2: but he has physical gifts that he brings to bear

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Speaker 2: and is willing to use for the good of the team.

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Speaker 2: And he scored another header this weekend for Derby County.

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Speaker 2: Of Derby County ten on the season. He was, of

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Speaker 2: course the starting center forwards for the US last summer.

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Speaker 4: At the Gold Cup.

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Speaker 2: I thought he did some good work there. He was rugged,

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Speaker 2: his hold up play was useful. He also played through

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Speaker 2: a pretty significant injury, which I think scores in points

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Speaker 2: in Mauricio Pochettino's book It's for Me, he is number

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Speaker 2: two on the depth chart. I think that he has

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Speaker 2: proved his toughness. I think he's now showing goal scoring chops.

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Speaker 2: His movement has become more refined, and those are all

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Speaker 2: things that I think are going to matter to this team.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think you know you're not wrong there. I

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Speaker 1: think he's certainly. I think, regardless of what happens over

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Speaker 1: the next few months, it seems like Agimon is gonna

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Speaker 1: end up being number two. I don't know who number

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Speaker 1: one will be, but it seems like he will be

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Speaker 1: number too. Right, it looks like Baaligan would be number one.

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Speaker 1: But if Haji Right keeps doing what he you know,

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Speaker 1: what he did over the last couple of days, I

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Speaker 1: think you know, maybekji right move, but I you know

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Speaker 1: that with with what Aljiemn has done so far, And I.

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Speaker 3: Think you're right about a lot of the things that

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Speaker 3: you say.

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Speaker 1: Although I tend to disagree a little bit on the

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Speaker 1: on the hold up play part of his game. I

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Speaker 1: I think that he's not sort of the perfect match

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Speaker 1: for for like a Polisic to play off of.

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Speaker 3: But I do think that his.

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Speaker 1: Play is certainly coming along and I and I do

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Speaker 1: think that he will be a key part of the

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Speaker 1: World Cup team.

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Speaker 2: Let's let's tease out those thoughts on the hold up play, because,

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Speaker 2: like if I think back to last summer the US,

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Speaker 2: by the end of that tournament, the only way we

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Speaker 2: had to progress the ball was long bolster to Pat Ajimon,

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Speaker 2: like there was nothing happening through central midfield. But obviously

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Speaker 2: that was a team that did not have Christian Poulisic

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Speaker 2: on it. That was a team that was missing a

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Speaker 2: lot of the other top attackers. So what did you

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Speaker 2: see from Azimon there that makes you a little wary

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Speaker 2: of the potential fit with Polistic and presumably the rest

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Speaker 2: of the A squad.

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Speaker 1: I think, you know, if I were to look at

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Speaker 1: Azimon and compare him to Baalogan, I see Baligan as

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Speaker 1: as someone who understands the game a little bit better.

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Speaker 1: I see Azimond a little bit behind. And I think

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Speaker 1: for a player like Christian Polisic who comes inside and

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Speaker 1: let's not forget that. You know how creative Christian Polisic is.

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Speaker 1: He's so creative that he he doesn't know what he's

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Speaker 1: going to do next. And because of that, and this

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Speaker 1: is totally normal for creative players, and because of that,

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Speaker 1: you need, I believe, a player like Baligan who understands

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Speaker 1: that type of player, who's playing at that type of

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Speaker 1: level with players who are also like that.

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Speaker 3: And so this is why.

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Speaker 1: And by the way, take nothing away from Azimon because

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Speaker 1: even though if we look at last summer, he's a

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Speaker 1: different player today than he was last summer. I mean,

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Speaker 1: he's he's likely made more strides than any player on

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Speaker 1: the team. I mean you could argue that, you know,

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Speaker 1: you look at every single player we have in our

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Speaker 1: roster and look at and compare him to Azimund in

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Speaker 1: his progress over the last you know, eight or nine months,

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Speaker 1: and it's hard to argue that he hasn't come along

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Speaker 1: more than everyone else. And so that's positive, and let's

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Speaker 1: see where he is going into the summer. But having

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Speaker 1: said that, I still think that he is still a

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Speaker 1: little bit behind in terms of game understanding and giving

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Speaker 1: Christian Polisic different options, and by the way, some of

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Speaker 1: the options sometimes are just getting out of the way

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Speaker 1: and so and so. I think this is something that

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Speaker 1: Baligan at this point still understands a little bit better.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, faster processor, I don't think there's any doubt about that.

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Speaker 2: But I just I love Agimon's upside. I love the

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Speaker 2: way he's willing to use his body. And we saw

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Speaker 2: it again this weekend with the way he scored that goal.

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Speaker 2: I think that is going to make for the US certainly.

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Speaker 4: You know, if the US.

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Speaker 2: End up trailing late in a game, there is like

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Speaker 2: he is the a one obvious attacking sub to bring

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Speaker 2: on if they're just launching it into the box because

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Speaker 2: he's so good at winning those balls in the air.

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Speaker 2: A guy who's been really good at winning balls in

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Speaker 2: the air. On the other side of the field, nineteen

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Speaker 2: year old Nogai Banks, playing really well in the Bundesliga,

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Speaker 2: could end up maybe being a starter in the World Cup.

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Speaker 2: He's been brought to a couple of camps, hasn't played

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Speaker 2: a ton for the US, but he is fully committed

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Speaker 2: to the group by all accounts, and he has really

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Speaker 2: turned a corner. This nineteen year old kid frankly type

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Speaker 2: at a position of neat because I don't think any

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Speaker 2: of the potential partners for Chris Richards have stood out

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Speaker 2: to the point where it's like the partnership is unassailable,

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Speaker 2: Like this job seems open to me.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, there's no question.

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Speaker 1: I'll give Tom Boger a lot of credit for that,

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Speaker 1: because a couple of months ago we put our prediction

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Speaker 1: of our teams together, and he put them on the

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Speaker 1: team and I did not.

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Speaker 3: I do believe at this.

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Speaker 1: Point, if I had to pick a team, I can't

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Speaker 1: imagine not picking him because if he's not you know,

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Speaker 1: and I don't think he will be a starter this summer,

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Speaker 1: and I know that other people are starting to believe that.

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Speaker 1: I don't think he will have enough experience by this

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Speaker 1: summer to be a starter for a team. But I

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Speaker 1: do believe that for many reasons, one of them being

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Speaker 1: that he would likely be the center back of the

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Speaker 1: future for the team. I think he needs to be

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Speaker 1: on this World Cup team. You know that every time

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Speaker 1: I watch him play, he impresses me a little bit more.

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Speaker 1: He's calm on the ball, he's calm using his He's

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Speaker 1: a big boy. I mean He's pushes people around, he

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Speaker 1: wins everything in the air, and you know, and he

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Speaker 1: knows how to use his body well, which for a

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Speaker 1: center back sometimes being that toll is difficult because forwards

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Speaker 1: can man. You know, it's difficult sometimes for a six

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Speaker 1: foot I think he's almost six foot four. For a

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Speaker 1: player that big, to play against forwards that are much

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Speaker 1: smaller is very difficult. And he's handling that really well.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So it would be nineteen years old this summer, he

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Speaker 2: which would make him the youngest center back I think

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Speaker 2: the US has ever brought to a World Cup. Landon

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Speaker 2: Donovan on his show, penciled him in as a starter

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Speaker 2: last week. Landon was twenty. Landon and DeMarcus both we're

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Speaker 2: twenty years old back in two thousand and two and they,

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Speaker 2: you know, they were starters part time, and well, I

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Speaker 2: think Landon actually started every game, DeMarcus started a couple.

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Speaker 4: It's different.

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Speaker 2: For attackers, it's I'm not gonna say less responsibility, but

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Speaker 2: it's responsibility comes I think in waves as an attacker,

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Speaker 2: whereas for center backs, you are you have to be

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Speaker 2: responsible for the whole ninety minutes. I mean, it's it's

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Speaker 2: the famous saying like you could have eighty nine great

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Speaker 2: minutes as a center back, if you have one bad one,

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Speaker 2: you hat a terrible game. Whereas for a striker especially,

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Speaker 2: you could have eighty nine terrible you have one good one,

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Speaker 2: you got a great game.

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Speaker 4: So it's a.

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Speaker 2: Different sort of mental and emotional skill set. We're seeing

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Speaker 2: this kid do it every single week in the Bundesliga.

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Speaker 2: What would he have to do between let's say the

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Speaker 2: March friendlies and the rest of this Bundesliga season for

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Speaker 2: you to come back on June first on this show

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Speaker 2: and say, you know what he actually should be the starter?

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Speaker 1: Well, I think there's not much more, not much different

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Speaker 1: than what he's doing now. So he's doing all the

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Speaker 1: things he has to do. He plays all the time,

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Speaker 1: he plays well all the time, he's consistent.

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Speaker 3: Of course, we're going to see some mistakes.

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Speaker 1: Between now and May, because that's normal for every defender,

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Speaker 1: in particular when you're that young.

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Speaker 3: And I think he needs to continue to play.

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Speaker 1: I think the issue is going to be, even if

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Speaker 1: he's playing every game, is a little bit of that

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Speaker 1: lack of experience, you know, when it comes to those big,

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Speaker 1: big moments at the World Cup, you're representing your country

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Speaker 1: at home, there's going to be a lot of pressure

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Speaker 1: on the guys to do that. Let's not forget he's

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Speaker 1: playing for Augsburg right now, which the pressure is really

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Speaker 1: let's you know, not to get relegated. You know, it's

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Speaker 1: it's it's a much different scenario. I do find it

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Speaker 1: difficult to think that he's going to be a starter

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Speaker 1: by by June because of all of those things, and

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Speaker 1: by the way, not because he's not one of the

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Speaker 1: best defenders that we will have at that point. So

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Speaker 1: I think that even if he is one of the

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Speaker 1: best defenders, I find it hard to believe that Musio

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Speaker 1: Pochettino is gonna go to a nineteen year old to

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Speaker 1: start the World Cup.

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Speaker 3: But it may happen.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's definitely on the board. At this point, we

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Speaker 2: will see. It's gonna be tough. You know, he's as says,

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Speaker 2: he's just nineteen year old kid. You don't see a

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Speaker 2: lot of center backs anywhere at that age starting games

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Speaker 2: at the World Cup four months away at this point,

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Speaker 2: and for us, it's time.

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Speaker 4: For a break.

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Speaker 2: We'll be back with my World Cup starting eleven for

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Speaker 2: the US men's national team and a deep dive into

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Speaker 2: the tactics we expect to see from Mauricio Pochettino. Please rate, review,

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00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:02,000
Speaker 2: and subscribe to Side American Soccer with Tom Boger and

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00:21:02,080 --> 00:21:03,080
Speaker 2: tab Ramos.

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Speaker 4: Wherever you get your podcast.

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Speaker 2: Okay, welcome back to Inside American Soccer. Mettal here with

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Speaker 2: tab Ramos and tab I'm calling it an audible supposed

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Speaker 2: to give you the World Cup starting eleven, and I'm

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Speaker 2: not gonna do that. I'm going to give the March

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Speaker 2: Camp starting eleven because I like, I can't stop focusing

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Speaker 2: on this, because it is the last time for Mauricio

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Speaker 2: Pochettino to really learn something about the guys on this roster,

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Speaker 2: the guys like Noahai Banks who could be pushing into

438
00:21:41,840 --> 00:21:45,040
Speaker 2: a starting role, the guys like Pat Agimon who you know,

439
00:21:45,119 --> 00:21:48,480
Speaker 2: might be pushing into the second role, or you know,

440
00:21:48,520 --> 00:21:52,600
Speaker 2: the backup striker role, and the balance in the midfield.

441
00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:54,600
Speaker 2: Because we've had guys on the past couple of weeks

442
00:21:54,640 --> 00:21:56,440
Speaker 2: and some people want to use Weston mckenniy a little

443
00:21:56,440 --> 00:21:58,720
Speaker 2: bit deeper. Some guys want to use him pushed up

444
00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:01,040
Speaker 2: a little bit more. We've seen him both spots. We've

445
00:22:01,040 --> 00:22:03,119
Speaker 2: seen the team play without him, so I think this

446
00:22:03,160 --> 00:22:06,760
Speaker 2: is a chance for Pachaccino to get what is potentially

447
00:22:07,160 --> 00:22:10,439
Speaker 2: his best eleven onto the field while conducting some I

448
00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:14,040
Speaker 2: think targeted experiments that can tell us a little bit

449
00:22:14,119 --> 00:22:17,600
Speaker 2: more about the team. So I'm gonna start at the back,

450
00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:22,880
Speaker 2: Matt Freeze in goal, We're going to go Jedi Robinson

451
00:22:22,880 --> 00:22:27,000
Speaker 2: at left back. We're gonna use Chris Richards and Noahkai

452
00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:30,560
Speaker 2: Banks in central defense together, and we're going to use

453
00:22:30,880 --> 00:22:36,480
Speaker 2: Alex Freeman as my overlapping right back. Then across midfield

454
00:22:36,760 --> 00:22:40,000
Speaker 2: left to right, we're gonna have Christian poolisic, We're going

455
00:22:40,040 --> 00:22:46,720
Speaker 2: to have Tanner Tessaman and Tyler Adams, and then we're

456
00:22:46,720 --> 00:22:49,480
Speaker 2: gonna have Weston McKenny at the ten, which is what

457
00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:52,520
Speaker 2: he's been playing for Juventus. And then I want to

458
00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:55,680
Speaker 2: see Tim Weya at right midfield for at least one

459
00:22:55,720 --> 00:22:57,919
Speaker 2: of the games, right on the right wing, because he

460
00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:02,080
Speaker 2: does provide a good final ball and can come in,

461
00:23:02,200 --> 00:23:06,200
Speaker 2: he can pinch inside as Alex Freeman overlaps. And then

462
00:23:06,280 --> 00:23:08,639
Speaker 2: I want to see pat Azimon with the first team.

463
00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:11,760
Speaker 2: So I want pat Ajimon to be the starter for

464
00:23:11,840 --> 00:23:14,240
Speaker 2: this camp. So let's let's rip it apart.

465
00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:17,440
Speaker 1: Bud Well I mean, you know, I have to start

466
00:23:17,480 --> 00:23:19,880
Speaker 1: with the obvious that you went to four in the back,

467
00:23:19,920 --> 00:23:24,040
Speaker 1: and we can get into that conversation that when Muricio

468
00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:26,760
Speaker 1: Bortisino still says that you're four in the he's four

469
00:23:26,800 --> 00:23:30,399
Speaker 1: in the back anyway, right, So yep, But I would

470
00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:34,080
Speaker 1: I would answer that with okay, where's the ball? And

471
00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:38,040
Speaker 1: because it could be seven in the back, right, So yeah,

472
00:23:38,080 --> 00:23:42,159
Speaker 1: I would say four in the back. You know, obviously

473
00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:44,400
Speaker 1: Freeman can play that right back role and do well,

474
00:23:44,440 --> 00:23:46,560
Speaker 1: and I think he and Waa together would be a

475
00:23:46,600 --> 00:23:49,919
Speaker 1: handful for any team, right and in particular, you know,

476
00:23:50,200 --> 00:23:53,399
Speaker 1: I'm I mean, you're putting this together for the March camp.

477
00:23:53,600 --> 00:23:56,800
Speaker 1: But if I'm projecting a little bit more towards the

478
00:23:56,800 --> 00:23:59,040
Speaker 1: World Cup, I would like this a little bit better

479
00:23:59,040 --> 00:24:00,680
Speaker 1: in the World Cup. And we're likely going to have

480
00:24:00,720 --> 00:24:02,840
Speaker 1: the ball more, you know, with the friendlies that we

481
00:24:02,920 --> 00:24:05,040
Speaker 1: have coming up in March. I don't I don't know

482
00:24:05,080 --> 00:24:07,280
Speaker 1: how much more how much of the ball we will have,

483
00:24:07,600 --> 00:24:09,639
Speaker 1: And if we're going to be falling into a defensive

484
00:24:09,640 --> 00:24:12,240
Speaker 1: shape anyway, it's likely that he's gonna go with a

485
00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:15,040
Speaker 1: five back then then with a three. But this is

486
00:24:15,040 --> 00:24:17,359
Speaker 1: what you have you have Polistic all the way on

487
00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:22,359
Speaker 1: the left side right with Testament and Adams in the middle.

488
00:24:22,840 --> 00:24:25,800
Speaker 1: You know, in this situation, obviously Polisic would be free

489
00:24:25,840 --> 00:24:29,639
Speaker 1: to to to go forward and he'd have McKenny getting

490
00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:32,439
Speaker 1: into the box, and you have Algiemond being hold up

491
00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:35,199
Speaker 1: play getting into the box, you know, being the you know,

492
00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:38,160
Speaker 1: the one that will receive the crosses from the other

493
00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:43,440
Speaker 1: side coming from Weea or Freeman potentially, and then Testament

494
00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:46,679
Speaker 1: and and and Adams just really holding because that's what

495
00:24:46,760 --> 00:24:49,000
Speaker 1: we have right because you have everybody else will likely

496
00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:51,800
Speaker 1: be going forward. You have Robinson on the left side too,

497
00:24:51,840 --> 00:24:55,600
Speaker 1: who as we know, goes forward really well, yeah, this

498
00:24:55,640 --> 00:24:58,400
Speaker 1: could potentially work. I I'm not I'm not a fan

499
00:24:58,440 --> 00:25:01,879
Speaker 1: of this lineup for March camps, considering the strength of

500
00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:04,000
Speaker 1: the opponents that we have and I think and how

501
00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:06,800
Speaker 1: much they're going to have the ball. But it certainly

502
00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:10,399
Speaker 1: will be It certainly will be a test, and it

503
00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:13,520
Speaker 1: will be another experiment. If this is what happens in

504
00:25:13,600 --> 00:25:16,040
Speaker 1: terms of, you know, what the team could look like

505
00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:18,320
Speaker 1: in the summer, it could answer likely a lot of

506
00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:21,000
Speaker 1: questions that I think. I think it's what you're trying

507
00:25:21,000 --> 00:25:23,400
Speaker 1: to do I think you're trying to answer some questions

508
00:25:23,400 --> 00:25:24,720
Speaker 1: with this lineup people together?

509
00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:28,960
Speaker 2: Absolutely, yeah, I'm concerned about about center back. I'm concerned

510
00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:31,399
Speaker 2: about the balance on that back line. And so the

511
00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:35,159
Speaker 2: way I'm seeing it is sort of the classic in

512
00:25:35,200 --> 00:25:40,480
Speaker 2: this case, two fullbacks taking turns overlapping, and that's something

513
00:25:40,520 --> 00:25:43,640
Speaker 2: we've seen less and less of, both for the US

514
00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:47,760
Speaker 2: national team and in the in the world of soccer

515
00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:52,040
Speaker 2: in general. More often it's been one fullback gets licensed

516
00:25:52,040 --> 00:25:55,280
Speaker 2: to push forward and overlap on the attack, while the

517
00:25:55,359 --> 00:25:59,640
Speaker 2: other fullback sort of slides inside and becomes a back three.

518
00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:05,040
Speaker 2: It's what Pachettino started doing. I think about halftime of

519
00:26:05,080 --> 00:26:08,320
Speaker 2: that South Korea friendly back in September, where it's like

520
00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:13,159
Speaker 2: it's just asymmetrical. They defend against the ball, you know,

521
00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:15,639
Speaker 2: you know banks of four, but then when they have

522
00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:18,320
Speaker 2: their foot on the ball, it looks more like a

523
00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:21,840
Speaker 2: three four two one or you know three two five

524
00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:24,000
Speaker 2: if you want to call it. There, and it's it's

525
00:26:24,240 --> 00:26:27,840
Speaker 2: influenced strongly by positional play by Pep Guardiola and the

526
00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:32,439
Speaker 2: way he always has certain players in certain positions in

527
00:26:32,560 --> 00:26:35,960
Speaker 2: order to spread out the opposing back line and create

528
00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:40,159
Speaker 2: attacking balance. In this instance, though, I do think the

529
00:26:40,240 --> 00:26:42,880
Speaker 2: US should try going away from that and going back

530
00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:46,160
Speaker 2: to kind of a Pulley system where Okay, Freeman overlaps,

531
00:26:46,600 --> 00:26:50,719
Speaker 2: then Jedi is going to stay deep. If Jedi overlaps,

532
00:26:50,800 --> 00:26:53,920
Speaker 2: then Freeman has to stay deep. And that chemistry between

533
00:26:54,119 --> 00:26:57,440
Speaker 2: the fullbacks is as important in its way as the

534
00:26:57,480 --> 00:27:00,640
Speaker 2: chemistry between the center backs, because tab if they get

535
00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:03,840
Speaker 2: that wrong and then suddenly it's two center backs defending

536
00:27:03,840 --> 00:27:04,439
Speaker 2: on an island.

537
00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:06,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's and you know, to be fair, it's

538
00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:08,760
Speaker 1: an easy concept, right that I think all these players

539
00:27:08,800 --> 00:27:11,560
Speaker 1: have they've played and I'm sure for coaches who have

540
00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:13,960
Speaker 1: done that in the past. You know, when full bet goes,

541
00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:16,280
Speaker 1: the other one stays, it's pretty you know, in general,

542
00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:18,439
Speaker 1: it's a pretty it's a pretty easy concept that I

543
00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:21,399
Speaker 1: think that I think they'll get and easy to accomplish.

544
00:27:21,560 --> 00:27:24,360
Speaker 1: I'd be a little bit more concerned on Jedi's side

545
00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:28,199
Speaker 1: when you know it's likely a both way and Freeman

546
00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:31,200
Speaker 1: will attack on one side and and don't forget, Polisic

547
00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:33,200
Speaker 1: will likely be in the box at the time when

548
00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:36,679
Speaker 1: those guys are attacking. And I'm you know, so our

549
00:27:36,800 --> 00:27:38,960
Speaker 1: defensive left side of the field there's going to be

550
00:27:38,960 --> 00:27:43,880
Speaker 1: some huge holes for for potentially testament uh or or

551
00:27:43,920 --> 00:27:46,400
Speaker 1: atoms to try to cover when there's a turnover right,

552
00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:48,639
Speaker 1: So I'd be concerned a little bit about the defensive

553
00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:52,080
Speaker 1: transition and the shape our team will be in when

554
00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:53,920
Speaker 1: the bolt turns over more than anything else.

555
00:27:55,040 --> 00:27:57,800
Speaker 2: So how do you fix that in this roster? Do

556
00:27:57,840 --> 00:27:59,879
Speaker 2: you do you go back? Like do you go to

557
00:28:01,320 --> 00:28:04,959
Speaker 2: having Jedi as a left back but never overlapping? And

558
00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:07,280
Speaker 2: then if you're going to do that, where do you

559
00:28:07,800 --> 00:28:11,600
Speaker 2: do you use a more two way sort of left midfielder,

560
00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:13,359
Speaker 2: Because I think one thing we can all agree on

561
00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:16,920
Speaker 2: is like, we don't want Christian Polistic to have too

562
00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:20,560
Speaker 2: many defensive responsibilities. We want him in a position where

563
00:28:20,560 --> 00:28:23,080
Speaker 2: he doesn't have to worry about what's behind him. He

564
00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:26,000
Speaker 2: could be free to attack. So what is your fix

565
00:28:26,040 --> 00:28:26,600
Speaker 2: for it with this?

566
00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:28,720
Speaker 1: Well, I think where you need to get help from

567
00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:31,320
Speaker 1: is in this case you're using McKinney as your ten

568
00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:34,240
Speaker 1: right and McKinney also gets into the box. So I

569
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:36,760
Speaker 1: think you don't necessarily want to be in this situation

570
00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:39,200
Speaker 1: where you have as an example, and this may be

571
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:43,320
Speaker 1: an exaggeration, but something that could potentially happen. Happen according

572
00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:45,560
Speaker 1: to the qualities that the players that you have on

573
00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:49,000
Speaker 1: the field right now. So you have potentially Way and

574
00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:53,840
Speaker 1: Freeman gone on that right side, you have McKinny getting

575
00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:56,520
Speaker 1: into the box, Pullicit getting into the box, and you

576
00:28:56,560 --> 00:29:00,280
Speaker 1: have Auguman obviously in the boxes. He's your nine lot

577
00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:02,680
Speaker 1: of field to cover for two guys that are in

578
00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:05,200
Speaker 1: the middle for recovery, right, that's the concern. So I

579
00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:08,240
Speaker 1: think you're asking how do you fix that? You fix

580
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:12,840
Speaker 1: that likely by having you're using, you know, McKinney as

581
00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:15,960
Speaker 1: at ten, by having that third player being a little

582
00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:19,680
Speaker 1: bit more conservative and watching the play develop and sort

583
00:29:19,680 --> 00:29:21,960
Speaker 1: of getting in the box a little bit later rather

584
00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:24,200
Speaker 1: than early like McKinny likes to do.

585
00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:29,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, he has been really dynamic off the ball with

586
00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:32,400
Speaker 2: those sorts of runs for Juventus over the past month.

587
00:29:32,440 --> 00:29:35,840
Speaker 2: He's in the best form of his life. One of

588
00:29:35,920 --> 00:29:39,560
Speaker 2: the things that we talk about with managers is you

589
00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:43,240
Speaker 2: kind of build the team around your star a little bit,

590
00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:45,760
Speaker 2: not entirely, but you want to make sure that your

591
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:51,120
Speaker 2: best players are in the right spots to win you games.

592
00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:56,720
Speaker 2: At this point, does that mean building around Weston mckennie's

593
00:29:56,680 --> 00:29:59,320
Speaker 2: strengths or Christian Polistics or is there a way to

594
00:29:59,320 --> 00:29:59,680
Speaker 2: do both.

595
00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:01,320
Speaker 3: Well.

596
00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:03,680
Speaker 1: You know, this is a tough choice for Maricio Porsatino

597
00:30:03,760 --> 00:30:06,240
Speaker 1: because we haven't seen the best of Polisic on the

598
00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:10,840
Speaker 1: national team, but we have seen it at AC Milan,

599
00:30:11,400 --> 00:30:14,920
Speaker 1: and i'd like to see us. If we're gonna build

600
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:18,240
Speaker 1: around someone, I'd like for us to build it around

601
00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:21,160
Speaker 1: Christian Polisic. And what is the best way to do that.

602
00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:23,560
Speaker 1: The best way to do that is by using Polisic.

603
00:30:23,600 --> 00:30:25,760
Speaker 1: It's sort of like a second forward, which is where

604
00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:30,080
Speaker 1: he seems to be most comfortable, you know, playing in Italy,

605
00:30:30,120 --> 00:30:33,400
Speaker 1: and where he gets you know, he gets on the

606
00:30:33,480 --> 00:30:35,920
Speaker 1: end of plays all the time, he creates, he scores,

607
00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:38,400
Speaker 1: He makes a big difference for his team. So I

608
00:30:38,680 --> 00:30:42,760
Speaker 1: would say you build around Christian Polisic because also we

609
00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:46,720
Speaker 1: have to remember that McKinney is much more adaptable. I mean,

610
00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:49,400
Speaker 1: he can do anything, so you could you know, you

611
00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:51,800
Speaker 1: don't have to build around McKinney. He will adapt to

612
00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:54,840
Speaker 1: however you build a team. And I think that would

613
00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:56,600
Speaker 1: that would potentially be a good combination.

614
00:30:57,800 --> 00:31:00,160
Speaker 2: So if we go for a two up top of

615
00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:03,800
Speaker 2: Agiman and Polistic, because I do want to see Agimon

616
00:31:03,840 --> 00:31:06,280
Speaker 2: and Polistic together in this camp, so you're not gonna

617
00:31:06,280 --> 00:31:08,760
Speaker 2: break me on that one. But we drop Weston into

618
00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:11,240
Speaker 2: a three man midfield. It's the same three man midfield

619
00:31:11,320 --> 00:31:17,200
Speaker 2: with Adams, Tessaman and Weston, but Christian just playing is

620
00:31:17,240 --> 00:31:20,400
Speaker 2: more of a true forward. Then we put Max Arpsten

621
00:31:20,560 --> 00:31:24,400
Speaker 2: back in at left wing back. Right wing back. Will

622
00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:29,320
Speaker 2: make it Tim Weaia and then a back three of

623
00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:32,720
Speaker 2: Jedi Robinson as a left center back. I want to

624
00:31:32,760 --> 00:31:37,200
Speaker 2: see that, Chris Richards and Noahkai Banks. It's in a

625
00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:40,240
Speaker 2: lot of ways, it's almost the same exact lineup. We're

626
00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:43,440
Speaker 2: just dropping one wing back in Alex Freeman for another

627
00:31:43,840 --> 00:31:47,040
Speaker 2: in in Max Arpsten and Arsten we've seen over the

628
00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:50,360
Speaker 2: past year can handle himself as a two way player

629
00:31:50,640 --> 00:31:51,560
Speaker 2: on that left side.

630
00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:54,959
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean I think on paper that look that

631
00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:57,000
Speaker 1: looks good, you know.

632
00:31:57,080 --> 00:31:57,720
Speaker 3: I like that.

633
00:31:57,920 --> 00:32:01,680
Speaker 1: I think the issue is that, I would say, is

634
00:32:01,720 --> 00:32:04,280
Speaker 1: the same issue that you have when you're a coach

635
00:32:04,280 --> 00:32:06,360
Speaker 1: and you're on the sideline and you want to make

636
00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:09,840
Speaker 1: a substitution. How can you make a substitution without affecting

637
00:32:09,920 --> 00:32:11,520
Speaker 1: too many people? So what you don't want to do

638
00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:14,040
Speaker 1: is okay, let's let's bring in a left back so

639
00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:16,320
Speaker 1: that I can move my left back into the left

640
00:32:16,360 --> 00:32:18,400
Speaker 1: center back position, and then my left center back goes

641
00:32:18,400 --> 00:32:21,200
Speaker 1: into the right center back and so on. And now

642
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:23,920
Speaker 1: you're affecting the team in so many ways and having

643
00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:26,560
Speaker 1: guys in a way play at a position. Can they

644
00:32:26,600 --> 00:32:28,680
Speaker 1: do that, Yeah, of course they can do that, but

645
00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:30,600
Speaker 1: it's not where they're most comfortable.

646
00:32:30,640 --> 00:32:32,360
Speaker 3: It's not what they do all of the time.

647
00:32:32,680 --> 00:32:35,480
Speaker 1: And so I would be a little bit concerned with

648
00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:40,280
Speaker 1: having Jedi played that third center back role only because

649
00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:42,240
Speaker 1: that's not what he normally does.

650
00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:43,600
Speaker 3: Not that he couldn't do it.

651
00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:46,280
Speaker 1: I think he can, and I think again, I see

652
00:32:46,320 --> 00:32:48,800
Speaker 1: it on paper, and if you gave him Recio Pogatino

653
00:32:48,840 --> 00:32:50,880
Speaker 1: a couple of months to train with him there, I

654
00:32:50,920 --> 00:32:53,160
Speaker 1: think he would be great because he has all of

655
00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:54,479
Speaker 1: the tools to be able to do that.

656
00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:56,040
Speaker 3: But I'd be concerned.

657
00:32:56,200 --> 00:32:57,960
Speaker 1: You know, in the national team, sometimes you don't have

658
00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:01,600
Speaker 1: a lot of time to train to put someone in

659
00:33:01,640 --> 00:33:03,560
Speaker 1: a position where they're usually not playing.

660
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:08,760
Speaker 2: The last one hundred and eighty minutes to train coming

661
00:33:08,840 --> 00:33:12,120
Speaker 2: up next month for the US men's national team at

662
00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:15,080
Speaker 2: the end of March, they'll be playing against Belgium and

663
00:33:15,120 --> 00:33:20,280
Speaker 2: then against Portugal in a couple of very big Friendly

664
00:33:20,400 --> 00:33:22,120
Speaker 2: is going to learn a lot from those two, both

665
00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:23,600
Speaker 2: in terms of how the US are going to play

666
00:33:23,720 --> 00:33:26,880
Speaker 2: and who is going to be playing this summer in

667
00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:28,480
Speaker 2: the World Cup for US.

668
00:33:28,560 --> 00:33:29,720
Speaker 4: It's time for one more break.

669
00:33:29,760 --> 00:33:32,080
Speaker 2: We'll be right back to talk about Tabs twenty nineteen

670
00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:35,920
Speaker 2: U twenty World Cup team, one that has put a

671
00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:39,720
Speaker 2: lot of players into this current roster. Thanks for listening

672
00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:54,600
Speaker 2: to Inside American Soccer. Please rate, review and subscribe. All right, folks,

673
00:33:54,640 --> 00:33:57,719
Speaker 2: welcome back to Inside American Soccer. I meant to all

674
00:33:57,760 --> 00:34:00,240
Speaker 2: here with Tab Ramos as always, and we're going to

675
00:34:00,280 --> 00:34:05,280
Speaker 2: take advantage of Tab's intimate knowledge of this current US

676
00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:09,680
Speaker 2: or the current US player pool, because, as you probably know,

677
00:34:10,120 --> 00:34:12,560
Speaker 2: he was the head coach for the USU twenty national

678
00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:16,440
Speaker 2: team for most of the twenty tens, four straight cycles.

679
00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:20,400
Speaker 2: I think it was three straight quarter final appearances for

680
00:34:20,600 --> 00:34:24,160
Speaker 2: you guys time. Some great players came through that program.

681
00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:28,320
Speaker 2: My favorite of those U twenty groups was the twenty

682
00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:32,040
Speaker 2: nineteen group had that incredible win over for I thought

683
00:34:32,040 --> 00:34:35,160
Speaker 2: the world was at our feet when you guys beat

684
00:34:35,239 --> 00:34:37,920
Speaker 2: Friends in that game. That was the round of sixteen,

685
00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:41,520
Speaker 2: if I remember correctly, and that team has produced a

686
00:34:41,560 --> 00:34:45,200
Speaker 2: lot of players for this group. Chris Richards was huge

687
00:34:45,200 --> 00:34:48,640
Speaker 2: in that tournament. Sir Genio Desk had a breakout tournament

688
00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:51,520
Speaker 2: for the US. Mark McKenzie I think wore the armband.

689
00:34:52,040 --> 00:34:56,279
Speaker 2: We saw Tim Weaya scored a stunner, and Richieldesma, who

690
00:34:56,680 --> 00:34:59,360
Speaker 2: was a backup number ten for that US team and

691
00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:03,839
Speaker 2: is now in attacking fullback for L three. Tap take

692
00:35:03,920 --> 00:35:07,600
Speaker 2: us inside that locker room, because these guys are the

693
00:35:07,640 --> 00:35:11,080
Speaker 2: age now or the age then that Noakhai Banks is now.

694
00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:15,920
Speaker 2: And there's some elements of you were talking earlier about

695
00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:18,840
Speaker 2: like who's ready, who's not? What did you see in

696
00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:22,279
Speaker 2: those young guys at that particular time, and what has

697
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:23,760
Speaker 2: surprised you when the year six.

698
00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:25,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, and first of all, thanks for picking

699
00:35:25,960 --> 00:35:29,000
Speaker 1: this team because this this was truly a fun team

700
00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:32,359
Speaker 1: to coach. You know, I believe that on this team,

701
00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:34,960
Speaker 1: and you talked about the France win in the second round,

702
00:35:35,480 --> 00:35:37,640
Speaker 1: I truly believe we were gonna win the World Cup

703
00:35:37,640 --> 00:35:41,080
Speaker 1: with this team. You know, we started that World Cup

704
00:35:41,080 --> 00:35:43,759
Speaker 1: by losing two to one two Ukraine. You know they

705
00:35:43,760 --> 00:35:47,400
Speaker 1: were the eventual World Cup champions, and I remember telling

706
00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:50,719
Speaker 1: the team after the game in the locker room, we're

707
00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:52,919
Speaker 1: gonna meet those guys again in the final. We're gonna

708
00:35:52,960 --> 00:35:57,160
Speaker 1: beat them, because I remember the game. We dominated the game.

709
00:35:57,719 --> 00:36:01,120
Speaker 1: Ukraine beat us on a corner head in the second

710
00:36:01,160 --> 00:36:04,600
Speaker 1: half on a game that you know, obviously we we

711
00:36:04,600 --> 00:36:07,160
Speaker 1: were better. And I really had all the trust in

712
00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:10,160
Speaker 1: this team that we were gonna be okay regardless. I

713
00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:13,040
Speaker 1: can start by saying that, you know, it was Uh,

714
00:36:13,840 --> 00:36:16,160
Speaker 1: these were fun guys. I felt like I had a

715
00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:18,560
Speaker 1: lot of captains on the team, a lot of guys

716
00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:22,560
Speaker 1: who felt like they wanted the responsibility to be winners

717
00:36:22,600 --> 00:36:26,280
Speaker 1: and to take this US team somewhere had never been before.

718
00:36:26,760 --> 00:36:29,000
Speaker 1: And uh, and I really felt like we we had

719
00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:29,799
Speaker 1: a chance to do it.

720
00:36:29,840 --> 00:36:31,080
Speaker 3: You know, you go player by player.

721
00:36:31,160 --> 00:36:35,759
Speaker 1: You mentioned Mark McKenzie had the captain's band. You know,

722
00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:39,440
Speaker 1: Mark is one of the most professional people that I

723
00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:42,160
Speaker 1: have ever met. First of all, he's a He's a

724
00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:46,239
Speaker 1: wonderful person and and that's a great quality to have

725
00:36:46,920 --> 00:36:49,160
Speaker 1: because Mark is one of those guys, you know. I

726
00:36:49,160 --> 00:36:51,800
Speaker 1: remember Jurgen Klinsman used to say, you know, on teams,

727
00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:54,839
Speaker 1: there are givers and there are takers and and Mark

728
00:36:54,920 --> 00:36:59,240
Speaker 1: is certainly a giver. Being around Mark McKenzie, Mark McKenzie

729
00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:03,000
Speaker 1: makes other players better. That's the type of person that

730
00:37:03,040 --> 00:37:05,279
Speaker 1: he is, and that's the type of player that he is.

731
00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:07,960
Speaker 1: And of course as a player, he does have some limitations,

732
00:37:07,960 --> 00:37:11,080
Speaker 1: but he understands them and plays around them, which is

733
00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:13,239
Speaker 1: nice to know that a player is smart enough to

734
00:37:13,320 --> 00:37:17,160
Speaker 1: know what he's good at. Then we had obviously Chris

735
00:37:17,239 --> 00:37:20,440
Speaker 1: Richards and Chris Richards. It's you know, it's interesting because

736
00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:24,200
Speaker 1: Chris Richards. I had people from FIFA come to me

737
00:37:24,719 --> 00:37:28,400
Speaker 1: after games and ask me who is that player? Because

738
00:37:28,440 --> 00:37:32,040
Speaker 1: they thought that was the absolute best center back at

739
00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:35,200
Speaker 1: the World Cup at the time, So he was getting

740
00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:36,040
Speaker 1: a lot of attention.

741
00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:39,200
Speaker 3: Again. You know, if you know Chris Richards, he's.

742
00:37:39,080 --> 00:37:41,560
Speaker 1: From Alabama, super nice.

743
00:37:41,840 --> 00:37:42,840
Speaker 3: I mean, you would never know.

744
00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:45,080
Speaker 1: I'm sure he's still the same today, although I haven't

745
00:37:45,080 --> 00:37:48,040
Speaker 1: seen him in a few years. But but he he

746
00:37:48,200 --> 00:37:51,960
Speaker 1: is also a giver, also cares about his teammates, He

747
00:37:52,040 --> 00:37:55,080
Speaker 1: cares about how people treat each other. And I'm telling

748
00:37:55,120 --> 00:37:57,279
Speaker 1: you these little things because I think these are the

749
00:37:57,280 --> 00:38:00,000
Speaker 1: things that people don't see, uh and these are these

750
00:38:00,320 --> 00:38:03,720
Speaker 1: how this is how these personalities have become so big

751
00:38:03,800 --> 00:38:07,000
Speaker 1: because they truly are great people. And then obviously he

752
00:38:07,040 --> 00:38:10,240
Speaker 1: was a great player. You know, physically he was a beast.

753
00:38:10,239 --> 00:38:12,200
Speaker 1: He would win every bowl in the air. He has

754
00:38:12,239 --> 00:38:15,000
Speaker 1: good feed, he was fast, he had all of those qualities.

755
00:38:15,200 --> 00:38:17,680
Speaker 1: But I think the fact that you know, having Mark

756
00:38:17,760 --> 00:38:21,600
Speaker 1: McKenzie and Chris Richards in the back sort of securing

757
00:38:21,640 --> 00:38:25,319
Speaker 1: the back with with the type of effect that they

758
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:26,799
Speaker 1: had on the rest of the guys.

759
00:38:26,520 --> 00:38:28,200
Speaker 3: On the team, was absolutely huge.

760
00:38:28,440 --> 00:38:30,600
Speaker 1: And then other guys you mentioned, obviously Tim Way. I

761
00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:33,359
Speaker 1: was already playing at Celtic at the time and this

762
00:38:33,440 --> 00:38:35,000
Speaker 1: is you know, and I hate to use the word

763
00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:37,640
Speaker 1: the word interesting so much, but this was interesting at

764
00:38:37,640 --> 00:38:40,600
Speaker 1: the time. You know, Celtic was getting ready to go

765
00:38:40,760 --> 00:38:44,399
Speaker 1: play their Cup final at the time when when Tim

766
00:38:44,480 --> 00:38:46,920
Speaker 1: was supposed to come to US. I called Tim and

767
00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:49,239
Speaker 1: I said, Tim, look, I understand you have your Cup

768
00:38:49,280 --> 00:38:51,920
Speaker 1: final and I think that you know your coach is

769
00:38:51,960 --> 00:38:54,040
Speaker 1: obviously going to want you there, so I understand if

770
00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:55,640
Speaker 1: you have to come in late for the World Cup,

771
00:38:56,160 --> 00:38:58,160
Speaker 1: as long as you come for the second game. I

772
00:38:58,239 --> 00:39:01,480
Speaker 1: was okay with that. Tim said, absolutely not, I'm coming

773
00:39:01,480 --> 00:39:02,720
Speaker 1: in from the beginning.

774
00:39:02,640 --> 00:39:05,719
Speaker 3: And his coach. I actually spoke to his coach. I

775
00:39:05,800 --> 00:39:06,520
Speaker 3: forgot who it was.

776
00:39:06,640 --> 00:39:08,960
Speaker 1: It was a big personality at the time, but the

777
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:11,879
Speaker 1: coach was really upset. But Tim didn't want to say

778
00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:13,600
Speaker 1: that was the end of it. He left Celtic to

779
00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:16,120
Speaker 1: come play for US. So it was a big, big commitment.

780
00:39:16,400 --> 00:39:19,839
Speaker 1: Missed the Cup final in Scotland to come play for US.

781
00:39:19,880 --> 00:39:22,439
Speaker 1: And obviously you know the respect that all the guys

782
00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:24,520
Speaker 1: already had for Tim Way at the time, he had

783
00:39:24,520 --> 00:39:27,480
Speaker 1: already been a PSG, so he's already he was already

784
00:39:27,480 --> 00:39:30,560
Speaker 1: a big player. And then there were interesting situations like

785
00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:34,560
Speaker 1: you're mentioning Richie Ledesma and we can speak about Richie,

786
00:39:34,600 --> 00:39:37,560
Speaker 1: but also let's not forget Io Quino lot right, because

787
00:39:37,600 --> 00:39:39,399
Speaker 1: Io ended up going to play for.

788
00:39:39,320 --> 00:39:40,840
Speaker 3: Canada eventually Canada.

789
00:39:40,960 --> 00:39:44,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, so Io played for Canada and Richie Ledesma ended

790
00:39:44,120 --> 00:39:45,040
Speaker 1: up playing for Mexico.

791
00:39:46,320 --> 00:39:46,520
Speaker 4: Yeah.

792
00:39:46,920 --> 00:39:49,520
Speaker 2: So the way you described a lot of those guys,

793
00:39:49,880 --> 00:39:53,919
Speaker 2: nice guys, nice guys, nice guys. Was there too much

794
00:39:53,960 --> 00:39:58,360
Speaker 2: of that in that group? And does US Soccer the

795
00:39:58,400 --> 00:40:02,040
Speaker 2: production line of players coming through now a lot of

796
00:40:02,080 --> 00:40:05,600
Speaker 2: skillful guys. Are there too many nice guys coming through

797
00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:07,160
Speaker 2: the academy system?

798
00:40:07,440 --> 00:40:08,800
Speaker 3: No, but you guys didn't.

799
00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:11,800
Speaker 2: You guys didn't make the World Cup in nineteen ninety

800
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:12,879
Speaker 2: because you were a.

801
00:40:12,840 --> 00:40:13,920
Speaker 4: Bunch of nice guys.

802
00:40:14,320 --> 00:40:17,440
Speaker 2: You know, you guys broke that forty year streak because

803
00:40:17,840 --> 00:40:20,840
Speaker 2: you were sobs on the field to play against.

804
00:40:20,880 --> 00:40:21,080
Speaker 4: Right.

805
00:40:21,120 --> 00:40:23,040
Speaker 1: No, And this is why I mentioned, as I said

806
00:40:23,480 --> 00:40:26,719
Speaker 1: nice guys. I mentioned that that the other guys on

807
00:40:26,760 --> 00:40:29,120
Speaker 1: the team looked looked at them as guys who wanted

808
00:40:29,160 --> 00:40:32,800
Speaker 1: to win. So although they were great guys off the field,

809
00:40:33,120 --> 00:40:36,480
Speaker 1: on the field, they wanted nothing but to win and

810
00:40:36,520 --> 00:40:38,560
Speaker 1: they would do anything to win the game. So I think,

811
00:40:38,760 --> 00:40:41,000
Speaker 1: I think this is this is where that line is course,

812
00:40:41,040 --> 00:40:44,440
Speaker 1: and this is why, honestly, Matt, I had been surprised

813
00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:46,319
Speaker 1: with our national team over the last four or five

814
00:40:46,400 --> 00:40:49,719
Speaker 1: years and the lack of desire that we saw on

815
00:40:49,800 --> 00:40:52,600
Speaker 1: the field over that period of time, because I felt like,

816
00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:54,840
Speaker 1: these are not these are not the guys I coach.

817
00:40:55,120 --> 00:40:57,520
Speaker 1: You know, if there was anything, and I will, I

818
00:40:57,600 --> 00:40:59,960
Speaker 1: won't limit it to only these guys. But if there's

819
00:41:00,000 --> 00:41:02,399
Speaker 1: there's one thing I can tell you from having coach

820
00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:05,520
Speaker 1: in four World Cups and in four qualifying events with

821
00:41:05,600 --> 00:41:10,200
Speaker 1: you twenties, American players will run through the wall for you.

822
00:41:09,920 --> 00:41:12,799
Speaker 1: If you're the coach and you stay and you put

823
00:41:12,840 --> 00:41:15,360
Speaker 1: your arm around an American player and you say things

824
00:41:15,360 --> 00:41:18,560
Speaker 1: the right well the right way, they will run through

825
00:41:18,600 --> 00:41:20,400
Speaker 1: the wall for you. And I always felt like that

826
00:41:20,480 --> 00:41:23,480
Speaker 1: was an advantage for us. These players will do anything,

827
00:41:23,760 --> 00:41:25,960
Speaker 1: and that was surprising to me. But I think these

828
00:41:26,000 --> 00:41:29,200
Speaker 1: guys that we mentioned on this particular team, they're true

829
00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:32,400
Speaker 1: leaders of that philosophy.

830
00:41:32,920 --> 00:41:35,480
Speaker 2: A guy that we mentioned both of us, Richard Ledesma.

831
00:41:35,560 --> 00:41:37,760
Speaker 2: He was one of my favorite players for that team,

832
00:41:39,400 --> 00:41:43,319
Speaker 2: number ten, who had what I called easy speed. I

833
00:41:43,360 --> 00:41:46,080
Speaker 2: remember his ability to just like turn away from pressure

834
00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:49,399
Speaker 2: and get out within one stride. He was near top

835
00:41:49,440 --> 00:41:52,240
Speaker 2: speed carrying the ball and then able to play runners

836
00:41:52,239 --> 00:41:55,360
Speaker 2: through and hit the final ball while at a sprint.

837
00:41:55,800 --> 00:41:58,760
Speaker 2: It's a skill set you don't see come around.

838
00:41:58,840 --> 00:41:59,160
Speaker 4: Often.

839
00:41:59,800 --> 00:42:02,840
Speaker 2: Had some ups and downs on his career path. He

840
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:05,839
Speaker 2: is now the starting right wing back for achiev US

841
00:42:06,120 --> 00:42:08,239
Speaker 2: down in League Amaki's. He has filed a one time

842
00:42:08,280 --> 00:42:11,640
Speaker 2: switch to El Tree. It looks very likely he's going

843
00:42:11,719 --> 00:42:17,000
Speaker 2: to be on that team this summer. It is not

844
00:42:17,200 --> 00:42:21,280
Speaker 2: something that career path that I think anybody saw tam.

845
00:42:21,800 --> 00:42:25,160
Speaker 1: Nos certainly not because you know Richie was a great

846
00:42:25,200 --> 00:42:27,319
Speaker 1: player always. You know, there were guys that I like

847
00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:29,560
Speaker 1: to call slippery in the middle of the field, so

848
00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:31,960
Speaker 1: you play him a ball and regardless of where they are,

849
00:42:32,040 --> 00:42:34,799
Speaker 1: they're slipping out and they're getting out. And on that

850
00:42:34,840 --> 00:42:38,279
Speaker 1: team we had three so we had Richie Ledesma, we

851
00:42:38,320 --> 00:42:41,520
Speaker 1: have we had packs and Pomacoll at his best before

852
00:42:41,600 --> 00:42:44,880
Speaker 1: all his injuries, and we had Alex Mendez. These guys

853
00:42:44,920 --> 00:42:47,840
Speaker 1: just would not lose the ball. And there's nothing better

854
00:42:47,880 --> 00:42:50,719
Speaker 1: than you being able to play the ball inside. Let's

855
00:42:50,960 --> 00:42:55,319
Speaker 1: let's recognize that those inside positions, that number six, number eight,

856
00:42:55,600 --> 00:42:58,320
Speaker 1: number ten role on the field, they are the most

857
00:42:58,360 --> 00:43:01,279
Speaker 1: difficult position to play on the field bar none. I

858
00:43:01,280 --> 00:43:04,360
Speaker 1: don't care what anybody says. It's really difficult to play

859
00:43:04,520 --> 00:43:07,480
Speaker 1: when you have people coming from every which way to

860
00:43:07,560 --> 00:43:10,839
Speaker 1: pressure you. And those guys were slippery and would never

861
00:43:10,920 --> 00:43:13,799
Speaker 1: lose the ball. And I'm surprised to see Richie now

862
00:43:13,840 --> 00:43:16,200
Speaker 1: play on the right side because I think, you know,

863
00:43:16,239 --> 00:43:18,000
Speaker 1: for me, he was going to be a great player

864
00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:21,440
Speaker 1: inside for the rest of until he was thirty six, and.

865
00:43:21,640 --> 00:43:22,839
Speaker 3: So I'm surprised to see him there.

866
00:43:22,840 --> 00:43:25,600
Speaker 1: But you know, in the end, he's he's still playing,

867
00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:28,040
Speaker 1: and he found a position at right back, which I'm

868
00:43:28,040 --> 00:43:31,319
Speaker 1: sure it's incredibly easy for him to play there after

869
00:43:31,400 --> 00:43:35,399
Speaker 1: having played inside, and I'm not surprised he's having success there.

870
00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:41,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's shown some real fortitude a kid who was

871
00:43:41,160 --> 00:43:45,759
Speaker 2: never really given a chance to play inside, but PSV

872
00:43:45,920 --> 00:43:49,400
Speaker 2: moved him outside. I think under Ernie Stewart a year

873
00:43:49,440 --> 00:43:51,680
Speaker 2: and a half ago, was a pure attacking right back

874
00:43:51,719 --> 00:43:54,840
Speaker 2: and he's parleyed that into a big future at the

875
00:43:54,840 --> 00:43:59,080
Speaker 2: club level down in Liga MCKIS and with l Tree.

876
00:43:59,160 --> 00:44:02,240
Speaker 2: It's one of those tab where with all the Mexican

877
00:44:02,239 --> 00:44:07,800
Speaker 2: Americans now so many of them choosing to represent Mexico,

878
00:44:08,520 --> 00:44:11,560
Speaker 2: I have almost a little bit of American pride about

879
00:44:11,719 --> 00:44:14,600
Speaker 2: watching the team in green. It's it's something that if

880
00:44:14,600 --> 00:44:16,359
Speaker 2: you had told me this twenty years ago, I would

881
00:44:16,360 --> 00:44:17,600
Speaker 2: have said, you're absolutely crazy.

882
00:44:18,000 --> 00:44:20,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, because I and I live that, because I lived

883
00:44:20,760 --> 00:44:24,480
Speaker 1: having to fight recruiting, you know, our American players with

884
00:44:24,600 --> 00:44:27,360
Speaker 1: Mexican background to stay with us to justin you know,

885
00:44:27,400 --> 00:44:29,839
Speaker 1: we had to we had to go to homes to

886
00:44:29,880 --> 00:44:32,960
Speaker 1: do that. You know, I've been to Uli Yanya's home,

887
00:44:33,280 --> 00:44:35,799
Speaker 1: I've been to you know, Alex Mende's home, to meet

888
00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:37,920
Speaker 1: with his mom, like I, you know, these are all

889
00:44:38,000 --> 00:44:40,160
Speaker 1: players that we were fighting to keep on our youth

890
00:44:40,239 --> 00:44:43,000
Speaker 1: national teams, and it seems like the tables are turned now,

891
00:44:43,120 --> 00:44:46,200
Speaker 1: right they It seems like it's the other way around.

892
00:44:47,120 --> 00:44:49,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, it seems like we're helping them out, which is

893
00:44:50,160 --> 00:44:52,680
Speaker 2: I think a good thing for Conca CAF as a whole,

894
00:44:52,719 --> 00:44:55,040
Speaker 2: and I think it's probably a good thing for US

895
00:44:55,040 --> 00:44:56,879
Speaker 2: soccer as a whole. It means that there's a lot

896
00:44:56,960 --> 00:45:01,120
Speaker 2: of talent suddenly coming through the ranks. Tab obviously played

897
00:45:01,160 --> 00:45:03,480
Speaker 2: a huge part of that as the face of the

898
00:45:03,560 --> 00:45:08,560
Speaker 2: U twenty program for a long time last decade. And

899
00:45:08,600 --> 00:45:12,080
Speaker 2: we'll be back next week to talk much more about that,

900
00:45:12,239 --> 00:45:14,960
Speaker 2: much more about the March friendlies. I think we'll probably

901
00:45:14,960 --> 00:45:18,040
Speaker 2: pick apart some performances around the world, maybe a little

902
00:45:18,080 --> 00:45:22,320
Speaker 2: bit about the first weekend of MLS action as well,

903
00:45:22,800 --> 00:45:25,280
Speaker 2: and I hope you'll join us. So thank you for

904
00:45:25,440 --> 00:45:29,440
Speaker 2: listening to Inside American Soccer. Please rate, review and subscribe,

905
00:45:29,440 --> 00:45:33,200
Speaker 2: and please continue to leave your questions and comments on

906
00:45:33,239 --> 00:45:37,440
Speaker 2: all our platforms, Twitter, Instagram, TikTok, and YouTube.

907
00:45:37,560 --> 00:45:38,600
Speaker 4: We'll see you all next week.