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Speaker 1: Native Lameing Pot is a production of iHeart Radio and

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Speaker 1: partnership with Reason Choice Media.

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Speaker 2: Welcome Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, welcome.

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Speaker 1: Welcome home. Y'all. This is episode eighty one, count them

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Speaker 1: eighty one of Native Lame Pie, where we give you

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Speaker 1: our breakdown of all things politics and culture. Yo yo

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Speaker 1: yo yo, yeah, hey hey, hey, hey, hey hey hey.

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Speaker 1: Somebody in the building, somebody on the field is y'all.

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Speaker 1: They're making fun of me because I always interrupt. I

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Speaker 1: get excited when they say, wal come home. I'll be like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 3: Let us just get through the aral and right. I

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Speaker 3: get to see it on our face.

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Speaker 4: I know.

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Speaker 3: Sorry.

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Speaker 1: We are your hosts. They've introduced themselves already, Angela Rye,

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Speaker 1: Tiffany Kraus, and a man. You yell them what's going on?

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Speaker 5: Ladies?

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Speaker 3: Hi guys, where.

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Speaker 1: Y'all at what you're doing?

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Speaker 3: I'm in New York?

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Speaker 5: There.

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Speaker 3: My handle isn't her wall of flowers?

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Speaker 1: And yep, she is on the wall looking good girl. No,

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Speaker 1: I mean you're off the wall. You're off the wallflower. Yes,

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Speaker 1: you cut that, you cut that, Pick that up, Pick

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Speaker 1: that up. Before we get into things, y'all, because we

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Speaker 1: crazy it's a good day. We want to remind you

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Speaker 1: that if you like this show. In fact, if you

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Speaker 1: love this show or like it, we asked that you please,

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Speaker 1: please please please go leave a comment, great review and

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Speaker 1: tell your best friends and your friends friends. I'm sure

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Speaker 1: I did that wrong, Angela, you got a correction for me.

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Speaker 6: I listen. I don't know what you do it, but

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Speaker 6: let's keep great.

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Speaker 3: I know we're basically just telling people spread the love.

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Speaker 7: If you like to subscribe, like, tell a friend, tell

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Speaker 7: your mom and them, tell your cousin and them.

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Speaker 1: There it is, there, it is there it is. And

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Speaker 1: tell me what's on your mind today.

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Speaker 3: Okay, I got something on my mind.

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Speaker 1: Please.

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Speaker 7: I really appreciate that our viewers are very vested in

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Speaker 7: this show and have strong opinions, and so we got

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Speaker 7: some great viewer feedback. I saw one of the questions

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Speaker 7: as I was traveling in So I'm eager to continue

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Speaker 7: the conversation about what we're doing right now, what solutions

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Speaker 7: are should we be out, you know, in advocacy and

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Speaker 7: solidarity with other communities of color. People had a lot

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Speaker 7: of strong opinions about it, and so yeah, I'm eager

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Speaker 7: to get to some of the thoughts that folks had.

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Speaker 1: And because you're so eager, friend, we actually going to

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Speaker 1: start with the question I.

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Speaker 3: Think, well, Angela might have had something.

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Speaker 1: We're not there now, I said, We're going to start,

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Speaker 1: okay with the question I think got you excited this morning? Yeah, Angela,

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Speaker 1: what do you have today?

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Speaker 6: Well?

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Speaker 8: Uh, you know, there's a lot to be said about democracy,

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Speaker 8: So I want to talk about that. We've been doing

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Speaker 8: this tour, stay to the people Power tour. Jane Nelson

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Speaker 8: said on a panel recently that I moderated in uh Selma.

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Speaker 8: She talked about democracy being people power and so as

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Speaker 8: we watch people power crumble, what is our reasonable service?

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Speaker 6: And what the hell happened? Why is it crumbling?

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Speaker 4: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, did we ever have it? A good question? All

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Speaker 1: of that to be litigated in today's show, Not quite litigated,

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Speaker 1: but definitely debated. In today's litigated and debated, no hesitated.

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Speaker 1: We're going to talk about the fall of democracy, if

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Speaker 1: we ever had that thing? And if you agree that

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Speaker 1: democracy has fallen at least what we were promised of democracy,

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Speaker 1: what do you think the contributing factors are what helped

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Speaker 1: to get us to this point? And then we can

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Speaker 1: get beyond this point, hopefully after we start to name

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Speaker 1: what the factors are that have gotten us so deeply

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Speaker 1: in this thing. So let's get it started, all let's

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Speaker 1: get it started, all right? If I could have this wrong,

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Speaker 1: but I think this might be the question that we

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Speaker 1: were referring to just a few moments ago.

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Speaker 4: Oh so what I'm neighboring is two thirty am and mimbistendency,

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Speaker 4: fin the grade to go to work, and a still plant.

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Speaker 4: And I'm telling y'all, y'all missing a lot of perspective

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Speaker 4: for when Tiffany do not run to no rural South.

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Speaker 4: I don't know what you're on, but it's nothing down here.

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Speaker 4: I don't know what type of utopia you're thinking of building,

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Speaker 4: but most people down here are working seventy to eighty

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Speaker 4: hours a week to barely straight by and feed themselves.

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Speaker 5: So there is no utopia.

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Speaker 4: Y'all gotta bothal up and start advising black people to

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Speaker 4: care about themselves and their finances. The only thing that

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Speaker 4: will get us through this recession that's probably gonna turn

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Speaker 4: into a depression and the devaluation of this American dollar

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Speaker 4: is work.

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Speaker 5: Gotta go to work, and it's not in the streets.

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Speaker 5: It's not protesting.

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Speaker 4: That's any type of job that you can hold, any

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Speaker 4: type of hours that you can get, any type of

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Speaker 4: finances you can bring in for yourself, your family.

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Speaker 5: That's what you focus on.

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Speaker 4: All this other stuff immigrants, immigration, foreign politics.

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Speaker 5: It don't matter for black people. I don't know what, y'all.

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Speaker 5: I'll steal stuff on that, but I was going to work.

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Speaker 4: I just hope y'all get out of the community and

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Speaker 4: see that black people.

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Speaker 5: There's a reason your conference look the way they do.

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Speaker 5: Right now.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I had it right after the relation forget all

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Speaker 4: this youth folks and our money in our capital.

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Speaker 5: Let's it peace, m all right.

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Speaker 3: So I have to yes, I actually love the question.

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Speaker 3: He said.

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Speaker 6: I'm welcome home for real.

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Speaker 1: He said in the morning, y'all.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, we're gonna say, like, honestly, shout out to him,

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Speaker 7: because you know, working that third shift at at two

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Speaker 7: thirty in the morning is a lot. But I one,

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Speaker 7: I just want to thank everybody for weighing in with

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Speaker 7: their thoughts and comments across YouTube, Instagram, and I can

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Speaker 7: definitely a special shout out to the people who actually

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Speaker 7: watched the show and not just the clips and you

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Speaker 7: know had a full comprehensive understanding of what we were saying,

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Speaker 7: and still disagreed, still passionately disagreed with my perspective. And

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Speaker 7: I think it is a very small person who cannot

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Speaker 7: engage in intellectual debate, who will become so offended by

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Speaker 7: another take that you can't take it. So I actually

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Speaker 7: enjoyed reading the comments. I responded to a few, As

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Speaker 7: you all saw, I asked questions of people, especially people

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Speaker 7: were like, I'm done, you know, and I was curious, like, well,

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Speaker 7: what is being done look like to you? So I

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Speaker 7: just wanted to clarify and and a few mistakes that

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Speaker 7: I made. One a lot of people were saying, please

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Speaker 7: cite your sources from where are you getting these numbers,

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Speaker 7: which is very fair and normally I always try to

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Speaker 7: do that, and my apologies for not doing that, But

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Speaker 7: just so you all know, I am never doing a

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Speaker 7: thirty second Google search while we're on the air and

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Speaker 7: presenting that to you as facts. These are things that

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Speaker 7: I have read about research, crosstabs, talk to people, talk

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Speaker 7: to experts. Really dug into it out of respect for

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Speaker 7: having this platform and out of respect for the people

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Speaker 7: who tune in every week. And so I went to

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Speaker 7: the community pages AAPI vote, the Arab League of Voters,

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Speaker 7: I may have that wrong, the Latino vote Undo, us

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Speaker 7: AP vote cast, talk to social scientists, and just something

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Speaker 7: I want to caution people on those numbers is exit

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Speaker 7: polling is notoriously unreliable. And so that's why you have

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Speaker 7: to have multiple sources when you're looking at who voted

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Speaker 7: and how they voted, because that often changes. And so

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Speaker 7: when this data was coming out among a lot of

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Speaker 7: the curious folks, we were all looking at it and

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Speaker 7: side chatting and talking about it. So thank you guys

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Speaker 7: for asking for being curious enough to know.

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Speaker 3: Well, where did you get these numbers?

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Speaker 7: The utopia that he's referencing, I want to let him

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Speaker 7: know I'm not talking about my imagination. I'm talking about

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Speaker 7: what I've seen, what I've experienced, what I've gone to

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Speaker 7: bear witness to, and out of respect for those communities

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Speaker 7: because of our bloody, violent history with whiteness in this country.

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Speaker 7: I don't want to name them or say exactly where

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Speaker 7: there are where they are, but there are numerous communities

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Speaker 7: across the Bible Belt of the South that are building

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Speaker 7: community that exists. They work, you know, and they're black

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Speaker 7: towns with black mayors, black city council, black gowned grocery stores.

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Speaker 3: So these things do exist.

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Speaker 7: I do take his point about, you know, people are

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Speaker 7: working seventy eighty hours a week, and so that's some

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Speaker 7: of the things that I've been talking about, Well, how

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Speaker 7: do we construct something like that? And I don't have

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Speaker 7: all the answers, but I do have some. I do

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Speaker 7: have some ideas that I'm exploring. And I would just

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Speaker 7: say this about being in south because he was like,

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Speaker 7: y'all talk about you know, he said foreign politics. I

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Speaker 7: think he meant foreign policy and the immigration issue. And

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Speaker 7: I just want to clarify that it is not my

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Speaker 7: ministry ever to work with people who.

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Speaker 3: Are anti black.

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Speaker 7: There may be somebody out there to do that, and

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Speaker 7: is work for you if you got it to give.

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Speaker 7: So I was not saying for all the people who

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Speaker 7: voted for Trump and thesee communities, let's gather them and

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Speaker 7: try to convince them. That's not what I do. I

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Speaker 7: don't enjoy convincing, but I'm saying for the people who

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Speaker 7: did not.

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Speaker 3: I thought, first, it's just important that we.

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Speaker 7: Know actual facts, well researched, documented facts matter even in

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Speaker 7: some of the comments, I saw a lot of misinformation

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Speaker 7: that I would try to correct. And so it was

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Speaker 7: important because the media narrative and some people were dropping

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Speaker 7: links like no, this is wrong because look at this article.

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Speaker 7: And I actually would so thank you guys for actually,

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Speaker 7: you know, doing research and saying but look at this article.

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Speaker 7: When you do that, I would advise articles often take

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Speaker 7: on a narrative. So for example, if I'm looking at polling,

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Speaker 7: I'm not going to just look at the article that

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Speaker 7: qualifies the polling. I'm going to look at what they hyperlinked.

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Speaker 7: Where did they get this information from. So if they

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Speaker 7: say something like, well, I'm just making this up, this

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Speaker 7: is not a real number. If they say something like

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Speaker 7: nine out of ten people in aero community voted for

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Speaker 7: that's not a real number. I'm making that up. But

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Speaker 7: I'm gonna look at this with some intellectual curiosity. What

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Speaker 7: are you basing this on? If this is an exit poll,

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Speaker 7: who are you considering in the Arab community? Who are

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Speaker 7: these people? Was it specific to a region or when

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Speaker 7: you say this, did your polling Because not all poles

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Speaker 7: are created equal. When you say this, are you including

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Speaker 7: people under eighteen? Undocumented migrants who can't vote, and sometimes

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Speaker 7: you will find that the data does include that. I'm

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Speaker 7: not a social scientist, so I often have to lean

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Speaker 7: on people who are. I talk for hours to the

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Speaker 7: Phernana Mandhi, Terrence from Hit Strategies, who Angela knows, Cornell Belcher,

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Speaker 7: Slinda Lake, you know people who can understand these things better.

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Speaker 7: So just combing through that data is really important. White

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Speaker 7: run newsrooms will say something and then when you look

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Speaker 7: into it, often there's a nuance that they miss. My

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Speaker 7: only ask of people is that we care. I'm not

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Speaker 7: even saying go out and do anything right now, because

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Speaker 7: I don't know what that is. Andrew, I would love

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Speaker 7: for you to address what he said about protesting is

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Speaker 7: to be honest, I don't I don't know that I'm

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Speaker 7: in a protest state of mind. I don't know that

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Speaker 7: I'm in a state of mind of I don't think

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Speaker 7: that my position has changed since the election. I think

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Speaker 7: I still feel the same way. I think I'm still

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Speaker 7: feeling like is this a democracy that we even want

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Speaker 7: to uphold?

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Speaker 3: I'm choking. Sorry, I'm getting choked up. I don't even

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Speaker 3: know if.

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Speaker 6: We can come back to you, So you commute it and.

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Speaker 7: Sorry, guys, Well, she don't like coughing if you're near her.

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Speaker 7: She's a germophobe, and I feel the same way. But

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Speaker 7: I I just wanted I'll I'll wrap this up because

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Speaker 7: I do probably need a cough but I would just

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Speaker 7: say the only thing I'm suggesting is to ally with

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Speaker 7: the people who are our allies, who are people. Yes,

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Speaker 7: I've gone into these communities and talked about anti black work.

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Speaker 7: I'm not a policy person though, thank you to my

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Speaker 7: co host who tell me I I am. But I've

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Speaker 7: never worked on policy. But I have gone into communities

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Speaker 7: and done anti black work in the era of community,

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Speaker 7: in the API community, in the Latino community. I've helped

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Speaker 7: with research, I've set on panels. I'm not a researcher,

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Speaker 7: but I've been interviewed. I offer some black perspective to

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Speaker 7: these communities and organizing work that I've done across all

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Speaker 7: communities of color, including the indigenous communities. Phil I just

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Speaker 7: want you all to understand when I bring something to you,

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Speaker 7: it is thought out. You don't have to agree, and

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Speaker 7: I definitely appreciate people's perspectives, but at fourteen percent of

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Speaker 7: the population, I just don't know that this is a

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Speaker 7: war that we can go at alone. I think we

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Speaker 7: do have to have soldiers. And if you know, forty

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Speaker 7: eight percent of Latino men voted for Trump. Of course

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Speaker 7: that number is too high. Of course there's anti black sentiment,

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Speaker 7: but that could also mean that there's fifty two percent

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Speaker 7: of people that we may be able to reach and

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Speaker 7: lock arms with. Even if you disagree with that, I

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Speaker 7: think when it comes to having a man yanked out

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Speaker 7: of his home and sent to an offshore torture camp,

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Speaker 7: I think we have to dig in our humanity a

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Speaker 7: little bit just to care, because if we don't think

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Speaker 7: we're in the same path of destruction, we're misguided. So anyway,

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Speaker 7: I want to hear what you guys have to say,

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Speaker 7: because I think what his point also was, like all

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Speaker 7: that protests and and f all this kind of gets

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Speaker 7: to what Angela was saying that she wants to talk about.

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Speaker 7: And I don't know that I disagree with that, Like

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Speaker 7: I don't know that I feel differently from f all this.

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Speaker 7: I can say f all this and still have the

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Speaker 7: heart to care about fellow human beings.

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Speaker 2: Hear.

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Speaker 8: You know, one I want to shout out is do

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Speaker 8: rag I really do? I just think that it's dope

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Speaker 8: that he felt that at home to come on just well,

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Speaker 8: I love it. You know. The other thing that I

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Speaker 8: really that's present for me is, and I feel like

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Speaker 8: I say this all the time, the number of black

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Speaker 8: folks who have changed how we see the world, who

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Speaker 8: impacted our access to civil rights, who impacted how incredible

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Speaker 8: we see ourselves. So many of them were either children

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Speaker 8: of immigrants or immigrants themselves. Marcus Garvey comes to mind,

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Speaker 8: a child of an immigrant, Malcolm X comes to mind.

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Speaker 8: And I think the other thing that is bothering me,

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Speaker 8: as you know we do this tour is one of

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Speaker 8: our partners is the Black Alliance for Just Immigration, and

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Speaker 8: they released the paper recently, right after Trump's one hundred

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Speaker 8: first one hundred days, and they are talking about the

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Speaker 8: number of black migrants who are being impacted by what's

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Speaker 8: going on.

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Speaker 6: And I think that's another thing.

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Speaker 8: For whatever reason, in our minds, and I'm saying, our collective,

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Speaker 8: our minds, we see immigration as a brown problem and

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Speaker 8: that just couldn't be further from the truth. So with

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Speaker 8: the for example, the cut to temporary protected status, which

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Speaker 8: was set to expire on August third, twenty twenty five,

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Speaker 8: is set to expire on August third, twenty five hundred

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Speaker 8: thousand Haitian people will be impacted by that. There are

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Speaker 8: five hundred and fifty two nine hundred and fifty seven

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Speaker 8: black immigrants who are eligible for TPS from six other

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Speaker 8: countries who will be impacted by that. There is a

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Speaker 8: whole research paper about that. I'll make sure that Nick

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Speaker 8: on our production team gets a link to that so

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Speaker 8: you can see that. I implore you, even if you

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Speaker 8: just read the executive summary, to look at how many

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Speaker 8: black people are impacted by this. So the very bottom

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Speaker 8: line the TIF just reference around us being twelve, some

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Speaker 8: people argue thirteen fourteen percent of the population that includes

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Speaker 8: black migrants fam so your numbers get real low after that.

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Speaker 6: I live in Seattle.

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Speaker 8: Our Black Port Commissioner, who I hope we have on

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Speaker 8: this show soon, is a Somali woman who is so

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Speaker 8: down for the cause and fighting for folks who are

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Speaker 8: both migrants and folks who are from here for multiple generations.

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Speaker 8: So I just think that we really have to thread

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Speaker 8: this needle a little better. And I'm not saying that

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Speaker 8: my sentiment has changed much from the election either, But

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Speaker 8: what I'm not about to do is let the error

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Speaker 8: of somebody else's ways hang all of us out to dry.

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Speaker 8: So I am going to fight to protect whatever protections

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Speaker 8: we have left.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, y'all, I sort of thought that when

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Speaker 1: we had this conversation, we weren't asking people to abandon

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Speaker 1: their care for us, for our community, for black folks.

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Speaker 1: I kind of had the conversation. I assume we were

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Speaker 1: having the conversation and the light of if this is

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Speaker 1: happening to those adjacent right next to us, could be

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Speaker 1: you know, cousins down the road right probably are in

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Speaker 1: some in some shape or form. If we were to

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Speaker 1: really trace back right that if this happening there, can

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Speaker 1: you imagine what it's going to look like when it

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Speaker 1: hits us. That almost as a cautionary note that these

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Speaker 1: folks aren't playing and they're not discriminating. They won't all

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Speaker 1: to like and brown folks wrangled up and shipped out

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Speaker 1: and off to some place. I would, obviously, I'd love

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Speaker 1: to appeal to the humanity of all of us to

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Speaker 1: care about one another. In fact, I was my my

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Speaker 1: my twins graduated from fifth grade last week, now going

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Speaker 1: into middle school. Got to help us all.

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Speaker 3: Congratulations.

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Speaker 1: One of the thank you one of the one of

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Speaker 1: the songs that they sang at their graduation was we

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Speaker 1: Are the World. And I remember looking at the Netflix

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Speaker 1: documentary of Like the Greatest Night, which was the recording

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Speaker 1: of that, and of course that song was about ending

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Speaker 1: the tremendous hunger deficit that had hit various parts of Africa,

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Speaker 1: but in South Africa, and then those those entertainers traveled

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Speaker 1: the world to bring attention funding food. These were black

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Speaker 1: folks in America doing what they could for folks on

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Speaker 1: the continent, largely black folks on the continent, but people

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Speaker 1: on the continent who wouldn't necessarily relate to us as

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Speaker 1: African Americans, right, but rather as descendants of various parts

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Speaker 1: of the continent that we have to be bigger, we

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Speaker 1: have to. In fact, it'd be a pretty damn depressed

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Speaker 1: place to live if all we ever did was concentrate

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Speaker 1: on the me me, me, me, me of it all,

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Speaker 1: largely because we are likely then going to miss the

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Speaker 1: next attack, the next you know, onslaught that's coming our way,

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Speaker 1: because we're so bareled in. So you know, I don't

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Speaker 1: think this is lecture season. I just think I just want,

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Speaker 1: you know, to join you all and clarifying I wasn't

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Speaker 1: necessarily really appealing to the greater humanity, but rather cautionary note.

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Speaker 1: All over the place, we're seeing it happen everywhere and

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Speaker 1: when it hits your block. And I still maintain people

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Speaker 1: plug in when you're not just on their street, but

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Speaker 1: you got to be up to drive, and damn they're

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Speaker 1: coming in the house before we recognize the severity of

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Speaker 1: the threat. Otherwise it's kind of just it's kind of

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Speaker 1: white noise in the space.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: The other the only other thing I would say, y'all,

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Speaker 1: and i'd love to get y'all's feedback. Here is this

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Speaker 1: idea of you know, you described Tiffany a utopia, and

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Speaker 1: I feel you, and I felt you while you were

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Speaker 1: describing that, even without the real lived examples of where

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Speaker 1: it's happening. But it brings me back to our conversation

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Speaker 1: in your house, on your couch and on your floor

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Speaker 1: a couple of years ago, where we were talking about imagination,

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Speaker 1: Like if we had a whiteboard and we were in

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Speaker 1: control of the pen and we could we could we

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Speaker 1: could write this thing however we wanted it. What we

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Speaker 1: would look like, how our families would look, what marriage

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Speaker 1: is for us would look like, Uh, what a success

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Speaker 1: redefine this time by us look like. But it really

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Speaker 1: does reemphasize it's a luxury, y'all to dream. It's a

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Speaker 1: luxury to pull back and say, man, if we could

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Speaker 1: do it all over again. And by the way, this

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Speaker 1: doesn't mean you can't be you can't be poor and

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Speaker 1: not have imagination. You can be any strike. But it

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Speaker 1: just does require us lifting above our circumstances to say, man,

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Speaker 1: if I had my dreathers, this is what it would

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Speaker 1: look like out of anybody's box. There are no boxes,

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Speaker 1: there are no walls, there's no ceiling, there's no floor.

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Speaker 1: It's just whatever I think and I wish for our people.

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Speaker 1: And I mean it's from the bottom of my heart

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Speaker 1: that we could really collectively, individually dream cast and then

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Speaker 1: start to take the steps that might help us actual

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Speaker 1: lives what those dreams might be.

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Speaker 7: That's a good exercise, I think for the audience. Just

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Speaker 7: as we get into this conversation about democracy, if you

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Speaker 7: were its agent, if you were and I almost don't

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Speaker 7: want to use the word democracy. I want to use

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Speaker 7: the word constructing of society because we're so entrenched in

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Speaker 7: what colonialism placed in our heads about what democracy even is.

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Speaker 7: So throw out that word and just you have a

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Speaker 7: blank slate. What does the construction of a society that's

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Speaker 7: equitable look like? You know, at least that's tapping into

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Speaker 7: the imagination. You know, I have to tell you Andrew

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Speaker 7: that conversation we had. As you know, I'm Andrew is

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Speaker 7: kind enough to let me read to him some of

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Speaker 7: the things that I've been writing, and so he knows

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Speaker 7: that I've written about that. And as you were saying that,

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Speaker 7: there are so many conversations I'm having lately that I

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Speaker 7: carry with me and I want to offer this to

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Speaker 7: the audience. I'll get more to it in my CTA.

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Speaker 7: But I've been having breakfast and coffee or just sitting

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Speaker 7: with the thinkers, the intellectual what I would call intellectuals,

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Speaker 7: the elders, the seers, some and one person who has

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Speaker 7: been so kind to oblige me with his time. I

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Speaker 7: have to beg him for weeks and then all the

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Speaker 7: blue he'll say, okay, I can meet for you know,

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Speaker 7: breakfast now. But every time it was like five hours.

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Speaker 7: And that's doctor Greg Carr, who is just a visionary.

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Speaker 7: And I get to just worship and sit from his

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Speaker 7: fountain as he talks me through things. Sometimes it's not

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Speaker 7: a name you would know, you know. Sometimes it's just

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Speaker 7: miss Pauline, who's eighty six years old living in one

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Speaker 7: of these communities, black communities, who lets me sit on

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Speaker 7: her porch with her for hours.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 7: Sometimes it's the uber driver and it's not just talking

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Speaker 7: to me about what's happening in America. But you know,

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Speaker 7: I read a book on the Armenian genocide, you know,

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Speaker 7: something we never even knew about, and it just feels

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Speaker 7: for me like a time of listening. Like sometimes and

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Speaker 7: you have to believe this, but sometimes I just want

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Speaker 7: to say, shut the fuck up, like stop talking and listen,

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Speaker 7: close your mouth and stop trying to debate and learn,

437
00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:17,480
Speaker 7: be quiet in your stillness. And even in some of

438
00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:20,520
Speaker 7: the comments that were a bit more combative, it is like, yeah,

439
00:23:20,560 --> 00:23:22,480
Speaker 7: you want to debate with me all day and I'm

440
00:23:22,480 --> 00:23:25,760
Speaker 7: not even thinking about you, Like I'm like, thin, debate

441
00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:27,280
Speaker 7: with yourself. And I don't even say that in an

442
00:23:27,359 --> 00:23:29,920
Speaker 7: ugly way. I mean debate with yourself in terms of

443
00:23:30,000 --> 00:23:34,480
Speaker 7: challenging your own notions, have some curiosity for yourself about

444
00:23:35,040 --> 00:23:37,359
Speaker 7: what does this all mean? And I think when we

445
00:23:37,520 --> 00:23:41,160
Speaker 7: think about like conversations like this, and when I get

446
00:23:41,160 --> 00:23:42,960
Speaker 7: to just sit and listen to people and I can

447
00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:45,480
Speaker 7: ask my questions because I'm not asking questions in debate.

448
00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:49,160
Speaker 7: I'm asking questions from a place of thirst for knowledge.

449
00:23:49,240 --> 00:23:53,840
Speaker 7: You know from your wise decades spent in these years

450
00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:56,400
Speaker 7: that nothing but days on this earth can afford you,

451
00:23:56,440 --> 00:23:57,640
Speaker 7: Like what have you witnessed?

452
00:23:57,640 --> 00:23:58,520
Speaker 3: What have you learned?

453
00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:01,560
Speaker 7: And in the silk linings of your hands, can you

454
00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:04,120
Speaker 7: pass some of that on to me? And I will

455
00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:08,480
Speaker 7: tell you I really feel resigned to I don't know

456
00:24:08,520 --> 00:24:11,679
Speaker 7: that we survived this as a species, and listening and

457
00:24:11,720 --> 00:24:13,640
Speaker 7: talking to the elders and trying to think about that

458
00:24:13,760 --> 00:24:16,119
Speaker 7: so in it does feel to me very much like

459
00:24:16,280 --> 00:24:18,800
Speaker 7: the beginning of the end of times. It may not

460
00:24:18,800 --> 00:24:20,800
Speaker 7: be in our lifetime, but it does feel like that.

461
00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:22,639
Speaker 7: I don't know how we go this far and go back.

462
00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:26,840
Speaker 7: So as we think about democracy and moving to that conversation,

463
00:24:27,040 --> 00:24:32,159
Speaker 7: I would just invite us to think about not just

464
00:24:32,240 --> 00:24:35,480
Speaker 7: what happened here, but what's happened here one hundred times

465
00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:39,120
Speaker 7: before this moment happened. Because these moments have happened, it's time.

466
00:24:39,119 --> 00:24:43,359
Speaker 7: It is a flat circle on repeat repeatedly, again and again.

467
00:24:43,400 --> 00:24:46,040
Speaker 7: One hundred years ago, this happened, five hundred years ago,

468
00:24:46,200 --> 00:24:48,760
Speaker 7: this happened a thousand years ago, has happened. And that's

469
00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:52,119
Speaker 7: what reading affords you, That's what listening and learning with

470
00:24:52,160 --> 00:24:54,120
Speaker 7: curiosity affords you, a.

471
00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:55,919
Speaker 3: Knowledge base of what has happened.

472
00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:58,399
Speaker 7: We are not new here, you know, we're not so

473
00:24:58,600 --> 00:25:00,639
Speaker 7: arrogant to think we're the first people to face this.

474
00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:01,639
Speaker 3: So I don't know.

475
00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:04,160
Speaker 7: I'm struggling with a lot of this, particlarly, what about

476
00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:06,879
Speaker 7: the protest piece. I'm not protesting. I do kind of

477
00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:09,960
Speaker 7: still feel like all this, But how can we protect

478
00:25:09,960 --> 00:25:13,480
Speaker 7: those of us who have a desire to live comfortably

479
00:25:13,520 --> 00:25:15,440
Speaker 7: and safely while we're remaining here.

480
00:25:15,560 --> 00:25:19,159
Speaker 3: I know that sounds morbid. No, No, I mean you're taking.

481
00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:22,320
Speaker 1: Me back to my Kojak upbringing, when my every Sunday

482
00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:24,440
Speaker 1: is we living in our last days. I swear to God,

483
00:25:24,480 --> 00:25:26,400
Speaker 1: I was gonna die before we made it home for church.

484
00:25:27,600 --> 00:25:32,520
Speaker 1: I mean, I was terrified, But in all seriousness, my

485
00:25:33,040 --> 00:25:36,159
Speaker 1: agree up was my grandmother who would say, and I

486
00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:38,280
Speaker 1: said this to y'all after we had cut last week,

487
00:25:38,320 --> 00:25:40,880
Speaker 1: there ain't nothing new under the sun, right. I would

488
00:25:40,880 --> 00:25:44,880
Speaker 1: come home thinking I had the greatest new revelation, and

489
00:25:45,359 --> 00:25:50,920
Speaker 1: you know, just in her sober sold Southern country specialized way,

490
00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:54,600
Speaker 1: like there ain't nothing new under the sun. We've seen

491
00:25:54,680 --> 00:25:58,679
Speaker 1: this before, and I actually think that that's part of

492
00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:04,560
Speaker 1: the superpower of our people. A lot of times those

493
00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:07,800
Speaker 1: voices are the sobering ones when we think the train

494
00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:13,240
Speaker 1: is over the cliff, and it sometimes takes those folks

495
00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:15,760
Speaker 1: who have been here a little while seen able something

496
00:26:16,359 --> 00:26:19,919
Speaker 1: to just remind us, like we've survived this, We're going

497
00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:22,240
Speaker 1: to survive it. You know. Again, we will have to

498
00:26:22,280 --> 00:26:25,320
Speaker 1: dig into your fatalist view of you know, the things.

499
00:26:25,359 --> 00:26:28,080
Speaker 1: But Angela, what you got on this before we transition

500
00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:29,240
Speaker 1: to your topic.

501
00:26:29,359 --> 00:26:30,720
Speaker 3: I feel like we transition in.

502
00:26:31,480 --> 00:26:32,439
Speaker 1: Well then there it is.

503
00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:34,480
Speaker 6: No I'm saying.

504
00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:36,520
Speaker 7: Everything we've been saying, I think is talking about like

505
00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:39,040
Speaker 7: what has gone wrong, which is so.

506
00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:44,040
Speaker 1: We I think we have all individually challenged this notion

507
00:26:44,119 --> 00:26:46,680
Speaker 1: of whether or not we actually live in a democracy,

508
00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:50,320
Speaker 1: if it ever truly was, And of course, the founders

509
00:26:50,359 --> 00:26:55,320
Speaker 1: of this country, when establishing its its foundational documents, you know,

510
00:26:56,200 --> 00:27:01,840
Speaker 1: very clearly described this as a republicmocratic republic, which is,

511
00:27:02,280 --> 00:27:05,040
Speaker 1: you know, in the way that they shaped and formed

512
00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:09,359
Speaker 1: this thing that we would basically send a certain class

513
00:27:09,359 --> 00:27:14,280
Speaker 1: a person to act in our best interest and on

514
00:27:14,359 --> 00:27:19,800
Speaker 1: our behalf. Basically this notion of a trustee over us

515
00:27:20,520 --> 00:27:23,720
Speaker 1: rather than a delegate, and these were people who would

516
00:27:23,760 --> 00:27:26,679
Speaker 1: then take in information and decide based off their worldview

517
00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:30,280
Speaker 1: what should be what. I don't know that that is

518
00:27:30,320 --> 00:27:33,560
Speaker 1: the truest reflection of what we might understand a democracy

519
00:27:33,600 --> 00:27:35,800
Speaker 1: to be, but it's certainly what the founders pass on

520
00:27:36,800 --> 00:27:40,359
Speaker 1: to us. So before we get too deep into the

521
00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:43,200
Speaker 1: question of whether or not this thing has been lost

522
00:27:43,720 --> 00:27:46,960
Speaker 1: and what led to it being lost, I'd love to

523
00:27:46,960 --> 00:27:50,679
Speaker 1: hear y'alls thoughts on whether or not you how would you,

524
00:27:50,920 --> 00:27:55,080
Speaker 1: in your own description describe democracy, if that's the thing

525
00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:57,679
Speaker 1: that you want us to strive toward. What would be

526
00:27:57,760 --> 00:28:02,960
Speaker 1: your definition of what democracy is? Doesn't have to do websters,

527
00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:05,240
Speaker 1: but just what's you? You know, what's out of the heart?

528
00:28:05,800 --> 00:28:06,840
Speaker 6: I can tell you what it's not.

529
00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:09,280
Speaker 8: But before I get into my definition, and maybe we

530
00:28:09,359 --> 00:28:10,919
Speaker 8: take a quick break, and then when we get on

531
00:28:10,920 --> 00:28:12,800
Speaker 8: the other side of the break, we can hear from

532
00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:15,600
Speaker 8: Scott Pelley from sixty Minutes Get It.

533
00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:32,960
Speaker 6: Last Role This clip from Scott Pelly, but.

534
00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:38,600
Speaker 9: In this moment, this moment, this morning, our sacred rule

535
00:28:38,800 --> 00:28:47,800
Speaker 9: of law is underattack. Journalism is underattack, universities are underattack.

536
00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:58,160
Speaker 9: Freedom of speech is underattack. And insidious fear is reaching

537
00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:06,880
Speaker 9: through our schools, our businesses, our homes, and into our

538
00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:11,960
Speaker 9: private thoughts the fear to speak.

539
00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:16,480
Speaker 1: In America.

540
00:29:17,320 --> 00:29:25,240
Speaker 9: Power can rewrite history with grotesque, false narratives. They can

541
00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:32,800
Speaker 9: make criminals heroes and heroes criminals. Power can change the

542
00:29:33,040 --> 00:29:40,680
Speaker 9: definition of the words we use to describe reality. Diversity

543
00:29:41,560 --> 00:29:47,040
Speaker 9: is now described as illegal, Equity is to be shunned.

544
00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:55,440
Speaker 9: Inclusion is a dirty word. This is an old playbook,

545
00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:56,000
Speaker 9: my friends.

546
00:29:57,120 --> 00:30:01,600
Speaker 1: There's nothing new in this as.

547
00:30:02,480 --> 00:30:05,680
Speaker 6: Yep, last than evil days for four hundred years. So

548
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:09,520
Speaker 6: I think there are a couple things. The first thing

549
00:30:09,560 --> 00:30:11,040
Speaker 6: that comes to mind is.

550
00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:16,840
Speaker 8: A chicken's coming home to roost moment where I'm feeling like,

551
00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:20,840
Speaker 8: welcome to the America that many of our people have

552
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:25,000
Speaker 8: always seen. They've never seen the other America that these

553
00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:29,240
Speaker 8: folks regularly described, They've never seen it. There are people

554
00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:33,360
Speaker 8: in our communities that have never seen the promise, the dream,

555
00:30:33,480 --> 00:30:36,480
Speaker 8: or the hope of America. We're hearing that in more

556
00:30:36,520 --> 00:30:40,120
Speaker 8: stops than that, and the other thing that I'm feeling

557
00:30:40,440 --> 00:30:44,479
Speaker 8: is we're really about to all die. It is it

558
00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:48,680
Speaker 8: is like the convergence. Yeah, it's the convergence of both,

559
00:30:48,920 --> 00:30:55,040
Speaker 8: like it is. I feel frustrated that it took all

560
00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:58,880
Speaker 8: of this for people to understand how on the brink

561
00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:02,320
Speaker 8: we've been for many year years. Some people would argue

562
00:31:02,480 --> 00:31:06,800
Speaker 8: that the brink was Citizens United. Some people would argue

563
00:31:07,160 --> 00:31:12,160
Speaker 8: that the brink was Mitch McConnell not confirming Barack Obama's

564
00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:13,680
Speaker 8: pick for the Supreme Court.

565
00:31:14,080 --> 00:31:16,880
Speaker 6: Some people would argue that it came, you.

566
00:31:16,840 --> 00:31:19,560
Speaker 8: Know, the moment that the Supreme Court said, you know,

567
00:31:20,160 --> 00:31:22,360
Speaker 8: in the Shelby versus Holder case, that we're going to

568
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:24,520
Speaker 8: actually gut the Voting Rights Act. Some would argue that

569
00:31:24,560 --> 00:31:27,480
Speaker 8: it became the moment that the Voting Rights Act became

570
00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:30,400
Speaker 8: a partisan measure. Some would argue it came as soon

571
00:31:30,440 --> 00:31:32,880
Speaker 8: as this black man say yes we can. Some would

572
00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:36,760
Speaker 8: argue that it became an issue in sixteen nineteen. And

573
00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:39,800
Speaker 8: I think regardless of when you make the argument, the

574
00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:42,640
Speaker 8: fact remains that there are people who have cautioned us,

575
00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:45,640
Speaker 8: like John the Baptist in the Bible, for many years

576
00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:48,640
Speaker 8: that this has been problematic, and we have not taken

577
00:31:48,720 --> 00:31:51,520
Speaker 8: heed to any of the caution We didn't take heed

578
00:31:51,640 --> 00:31:55,520
Speaker 8: when the person by the side of the road said

579
00:31:55,760 --> 00:31:59,600
Speaker 8: I'm hungry and there's no refuge for me. We didn't

580
00:31:59,640 --> 00:32:03,240
Speaker 8: take it as a cautionary measure. When kids couldn't work

581
00:32:03,240 --> 00:32:05,240
Speaker 8: in the summer. We didn't take it as a cautionary

582
00:32:05,280 --> 00:32:07,520
Speaker 8: measure when people couldn't afford healthcare.

583
00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:12,240
Speaker 6: And at some point, the way that you treat the poorest,

584
00:32:12,320 --> 00:32:15,520
Speaker 6: the most vulnerable among you becomes the truth for all

585
00:32:15,560 --> 00:32:17,600
Speaker 6: of us. And that is where we are right now.

586
00:32:17,800 --> 00:32:22,680
Speaker 8: So now we're all crying out help, relief is needed, sos, sos,

587
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,920
Speaker 8: But now it's too late. Arguably it's too late, Like

588
00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:28,120
Speaker 8: there has to be quite the shift in order for

589
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:30,520
Speaker 8: it to be different. I don't know that a midterm

590
00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:34,320
Speaker 8: election could save us, particularly where everybody's votes won't count,

591
00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:38,200
Speaker 8: because everybody's votes haven't counted for over a decade forever,

592
00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:42,360
Speaker 8: right yeah, well, I'm saying in modern history, for over

593
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:47,239
Speaker 8: a decade, right like we have we I don't know.

594
00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:50,560
Speaker 7: I saw that guy, Well, I can I just give

595
00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:52,240
Speaker 7: the audience a little bit of contact from the Scott

596
00:32:52,280 --> 00:32:55,240
Speaker 7: Pelly speech, because the reason why that speech was such

597
00:32:55,280 --> 00:32:58,000
Speaker 7: a big deal, so many people talked about it. It went

598
00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:02,000
Speaker 7: viral is because it was a spiece that he gave

599
00:33:02,000 --> 00:33:04,120
Speaker 7: at Wake Forest. And as you all know, Scott Pelly

600
00:33:04,280 --> 00:33:07,200
Speaker 7: is one of the longest correspondents with sixty minutes. This

601
00:33:07,320 --> 00:33:10,440
Speaker 7: is why it matters, and we'll see if he returns

602
00:33:11,000 --> 00:33:15,960
Speaker 7: because everything he said in that speech was truth. However,

603
00:33:16,560 --> 00:33:19,720
Speaker 7: sixty minutes is of course on CBS, which is under Paramount.

604
00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:27,600
Speaker 7: Paramount is trying to Shehrry Redstone, who is the majority

605
00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:31,360
Speaker 7: shareholder of Paramount. Some of the Redstone's daughter is trying

606
00:33:31,400 --> 00:33:36,000
Speaker 7: to sell Paramount to sky Dance. Now, when you're trying

607
00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:39,200
Speaker 7: to sell something that big, you've got a right which

608
00:33:39,280 --> 00:33:44,240
Speaker 7: involves the FTC and the DLJ. Now, because the Trump

609
00:33:44,280 --> 00:33:50,040
Speaker 7: administration is they made a big deal and essentially lied

610
00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:55,840
Speaker 7: because they've they've been attacking media. I won't get into

611
00:33:55,960 --> 00:33:58,680
Speaker 7: the all the minutia, but they've been attacking media, and

612
00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:02,280
Speaker 7: so sixty minutes have come under fire because they said

613
00:34:02,280 --> 00:34:05,479
Speaker 7: that they're claimed falsely and incorrectly that they were partial

614
00:34:05,480 --> 00:34:09,960
Speaker 7: to Kamala Harris during the election. And so as a result,

615
00:34:10,120 --> 00:34:14,120
Speaker 7: the executives at Paramount say to sixty minutes, they start

616
00:34:14,200 --> 00:34:16,239
Speaker 7: trying to filter some of their stories, and they say

617
00:34:16,280 --> 00:34:19,200
Speaker 7: to them, we want to see everything you're doing for

618
00:34:19,280 --> 00:34:21,600
Speaker 7: the rest of the season that has anything to do

619
00:34:21,760 --> 00:34:25,160
Speaker 7: with Trump. Sixty minutes has always been the gold standard

620
00:34:25,160 --> 00:34:27,799
Speaker 7: in journalism. So for them to say something like that,

621
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:31,640
Speaker 7: your news division always operates independent of any business dealings.

622
00:34:31,880 --> 00:34:33,960
Speaker 7: For them to say that to the gold standard to

623
00:34:34,000 --> 00:34:38,200
Speaker 7: sixty minutes, it was so jarring that the executive producer quit,

624
00:34:38,760 --> 00:34:42,440
Speaker 7: Don Hewett quit, and so then you had Scott Pelley

625
00:34:43,320 --> 00:34:45,600
Speaker 7: come out and close the show and kind of say

626
00:34:45,600 --> 00:34:48,560
Speaker 7: at the end, it is a sad day for this broadcast,

627
00:34:48,680 --> 00:34:51,160
Speaker 7: like I cannot believe that they're asking us to do this.

628
00:34:51,200 --> 00:34:54,600
Speaker 7: And he gave this, you know, very glowing farewell to

629
00:34:54,640 --> 00:34:57,279
Speaker 7: the executive producer who left. So for him to come

630
00:34:57,320 --> 00:35:01,239
Speaker 7: out at wake Forest University and say declared, this is

631
00:35:01,280 --> 00:35:05,080
Speaker 7: a problem in our society, I just wonder how that's

632
00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:09,920
Speaker 7: going to play within the halls of paramount, particularly at CBS.

633
00:35:09,920 --> 00:35:10,960
Speaker 3: So just kudos to him.

634
00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:13,319
Speaker 7: And I think this is a prime example of what

635
00:35:13,360 --> 00:35:15,719
Speaker 7: you have to do to hold the line, because not

636
00:35:15,760 --> 00:35:17,680
Speaker 7: too many people have been holding the line in any

637
00:35:17,680 --> 00:35:19,720
Speaker 7: part of this democracy, at least of all the media.

638
00:35:20,200 --> 00:35:22,200
Speaker 7: And I would argue Congress, I would all all the

639
00:35:22,360 --> 00:35:27,000
Speaker 7: branches of government, all of our our core principles around

640
00:35:27,040 --> 00:35:29,560
Speaker 7: what holds the society. No one has been holding the line.

641
00:35:29,600 --> 00:35:32,640
Speaker 7: So I love Scott Pelly for that. I'm happy he

642
00:35:32,719 --> 00:35:35,280
Speaker 7: said something I've you know, had some criticisms of CBS

643
00:35:35,280 --> 00:35:38,640
Speaker 7: over the years, but they have done solid reporting, solid journalism.

644
00:35:38,680 --> 00:35:40,640
Speaker 7: So I'm happy that he said that, and it punctuated

645
00:35:40,640 --> 00:35:42,120
Speaker 7: all the points that I, Angela made.

646
00:35:43,200 --> 00:35:49,759
Speaker 1: I love it. If what what what does democracy look

647
00:35:49,840 --> 00:35:54,840
Speaker 1: like to each of you? If we can recognize that

648
00:35:54,880 --> 00:35:58,880
Speaker 1: it doesn't, that what we have right now doesn't resemble

649
00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:03,680
Speaker 1: what we think democras's supposed to be. Angela, you mentioned

650
00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:07,919
Speaker 1: in your comments that you on this tour are interfacing

651
00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:11,520
Speaker 1: with folks who have never been on the beneficiary side

652
00:36:11,640 --> 00:36:15,239
Speaker 1: of the American dream. They've only known the horror to

653
00:36:15,320 --> 00:36:19,399
Speaker 1: the story, only lived the horrors of the story, and

654
00:36:19,440 --> 00:36:23,359
Speaker 1: in fact that many instances have had the institutions weaponized

655
00:36:23,400 --> 00:36:26,880
Speaker 1: and turned against them for as long as memory serves.

656
00:36:28,280 --> 00:36:31,040
Speaker 1: So we know what it isn't, But what is it?

657
00:36:32,000 --> 00:36:34,640
Speaker 8: I think it's the antithesis of everything we see crumbling

658
00:36:35,160 --> 00:36:37,759
Speaker 8: right like I think that in order for us to

659
00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:41,279
Speaker 8: construct something different. I think Tiff has been saying on

660
00:36:41,320 --> 00:36:46,400
Speaker 8: the show almost weekly that she doesn't think that this

661
00:36:46,560 --> 00:36:50,000
Speaker 8: is salvageable. And I think in order for us to determine,

662
00:36:51,239 --> 00:36:56,040
Speaker 8: you know what, where the where the trouble lies? Where

663
00:36:56,080 --> 00:36:58,000
Speaker 8: are all of the issues, we have to talk about

664
00:36:58,080 --> 00:37:03,320
Speaker 8: what is broken, So from the legislature, to the judiciary,

665
00:37:03,800 --> 00:37:09,240
Speaker 8: to the media, the responsible of the media. You talked

666
00:37:09,239 --> 00:37:13,520
Speaker 8: earlier on this call about campaign finance issues, the access

667
00:37:13,560 --> 00:37:17,440
Speaker 8: to the voting booth. You know, we're in a society

668
00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:21,279
Speaker 8: where as he just talked about in the excerpt of

669
00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:28,719
Speaker 8: the speech we played, where diversity and difference is called illegal, right, Like,

670
00:37:28,840 --> 00:37:30,920
Speaker 8: I don't know what else you can't which you can

671
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:33,359
Speaker 8: say about that? And then the construct of a two

672
00:37:33,360 --> 00:37:35,560
Speaker 8: party system where you have to figure out a way

673
00:37:36,000 --> 00:37:39,600
Speaker 8: to force yourself into a space that may or may

674
00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:43,080
Speaker 8: not really represent your interests. There are a bunch of issues,

675
00:37:43,120 --> 00:37:46,280
Speaker 8: and I think that it would do our podcast good,

676
00:37:46,480 --> 00:37:49,480
Speaker 8: on our community good to even engage around this about

677
00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:52,840
Speaker 8: what are all the broken pieces. There are focus groups

678
00:37:52,840 --> 00:37:57,600
Speaker 8: that were done over the last several weeks and then

679
00:37:57,640 --> 00:38:01,960
Speaker 8: this Catalyst report that came out. But in these focus groups,

680
00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:05,239
Speaker 8: they go and they talk to black folks who've traditionally

681
00:38:05,239 --> 00:38:07,880
Speaker 8: been Democratic voters about all the issues they see with

682
00:38:07,920 --> 00:38:10,080
Speaker 8: the party. Well, the issues that they see with the

683
00:38:10,120 --> 00:38:13,520
Speaker 8: party are also the things being reflected back in society

684
00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:19,279
Speaker 8: right The party, the Democratic Party, is seeing itself as

685
00:38:19,280 --> 00:38:22,000
Speaker 8: the thing that should be the protector of a system

686
00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:25,319
Speaker 8: that in so many ways isn't affront to us, has

687
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:27,839
Speaker 8: been disrespectful to us, has not seen us, has not

688
00:38:27,960 --> 00:38:31,640
Speaker 8: valued us, and has treated many of us as a transaction.

689
00:38:32,480 --> 00:38:34,480
Speaker 8: I'm not suggesting that we go to the other party.

690
00:38:34,520 --> 00:38:38,520
Speaker 8: I'm suggesting that we find ourselves homeless, you know. And

691
00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:42,200
Speaker 8: I think that that is another real issue. So we

692
00:38:42,280 --> 00:38:47,680
Speaker 8: are wrestling with a crisis that we saw play out

693
00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:51,200
Speaker 8: in an election in this past fall. We are seeing

694
00:38:51,320 --> 00:38:54,840
Speaker 8: one that played out in election in twenty sixteen, on

695
00:38:54,880 --> 00:38:58,000
Speaker 8: the other side of a pandemic in twenty twenty where

696
00:38:58,160 --> 00:38:58,920
Speaker 8: people can.

697
00:38:58,840 --> 00:39:01,080
Speaker 6: Question damn cience, you know.

698
00:39:01,120 --> 00:39:03,719
Speaker 8: I mean that I think is their erosion of democracy too,

699
00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:07,240
Speaker 8: Like climate change is a thing, and they are arguing

700
00:39:07,280 --> 00:39:09,080
Speaker 8: that it's not a thing, and then going to double

701
00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:12,400
Speaker 8: down in the things that cause the greatest harm, against

702
00:39:12,400 --> 00:39:15,280
Speaker 8: clean drinking water, against access to anyway.

703
00:39:15,719 --> 00:39:17,640
Speaker 1: I'll camp out here because I think you yet there

704
00:39:17,680 --> 00:39:23,560
Speaker 1: are a lot. I would just say two things. One

705
00:39:23,880 --> 00:39:25,560
Speaker 1: when when we got to the point and I would

706
00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:27,759
Speaker 1: I would make the argument that Fox News is the

707
00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:34,080
Speaker 1: is probably the largest, if not singletary, contributed to this,

708
00:39:34,480 --> 00:39:39,680
Speaker 1: except that they are regulated through the FCC and then

709
00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:43,760
Speaker 1: within the the broadcast and the news and journalism community,

710
00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:47,279
Speaker 1: it's supposed to be another check on it, which I

711
00:39:47,320 --> 00:39:51,759
Speaker 1: would argue has completely failed. But when Fox News got

712
00:39:51,800 --> 00:39:58,960
Speaker 1: in the position where they could disconnect facts from basically

713
00:39:59,239 --> 00:40:03,680
Speaker 1: that there would be o true arbiter of what is

714
00:40:04,239 --> 00:40:09,000
Speaker 1: real and what isn't. So they eroded the lines, They

715
00:40:09,040 --> 00:40:12,279
Speaker 1: confused the facts and came up with alternative facts, and

716
00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:15,440
Speaker 1: then made alternative facts a thing, right, when really an

717
00:40:15,480 --> 00:40:19,840
Speaker 1: alternative fact is a lie and an alternative fact is false.

718
00:40:20,840 --> 00:40:25,880
Speaker 1: But they were able to blur the lines between what

719
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:29,680
Speaker 1: is somebody's opinion and then what is a fact. Everybody's

720
00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:32,120
Speaker 1: entitled to their own opinions, but you're not entitled to

721
00:40:32,120 --> 00:40:34,840
Speaker 1: your own fact. The facts are what they are, and

722
00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:39,719
Speaker 1: you can derive from them whatever opinion you may wish.

723
00:40:40,120 --> 00:40:43,600
Speaker 1: But there are some agreed upon foundational things that if

724
00:40:43,600 --> 00:40:46,560
Speaker 1: we're both looking at this goddamn paper and we see

725
00:40:46,600 --> 00:40:49,319
Speaker 1: twelve and twelve is the only number on there. You

726
00:40:49,360 --> 00:40:54,000
Speaker 1: can't say thirty two. And unfortunately they got away with that.

727
00:40:54,080 --> 00:40:57,200
Speaker 1: And there's that genie has not been put back in

728
00:40:57,239 --> 00:41:01,080
Speaker 1: a bottle at all. In fact, it's running rampant all

729
00:41:01,080 --> 00:41:06,360
Speaker 1: throughout the society. And our failure at the regulatory place

730
00:41:07,239 --> 00:41:17,920
Speaker 1: to enforce some some dictums, some some regulatory consequence for

731
00:41:18,000 --> 00:41:21,279
Speaker 1: that erosion is the fault of a democracy, is the

732
00:41:21,320 --> 00:41:24,560
Speaker 1: fault of the institution's failing largely due to cowardice, I

733
00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:30,040
Speaker 1: would submit. The other thing I would say is democracy

734
00:41:30,080 --> 00:41:33,880
Speaker 1: to me doesn't and shouldn't equal a two party system.

735
00:41:35,120 --> 00:41:38,719
Speaker 1: In fact, I think I think I would like to

736
00:41:38,760 --> 00:41:43,120
Speaker 1: imagine a place where parties different than what they do today,

737
00:41:43,160 --> 00:41:48,960
Speaker 1: where they have statutory significance and presence. There are that

738
00:41:49,080 --> 00:41:53,319
Speaker 1: there are lines and laws that describe how Democrats and

739
00:41:53,360 --> 00:41:59,120
Speaker 1: Republicans are to then extract power or assume their power.

740
00:42:00,280 --> 00:42:04,320
Speaker 1: Our democracy, and it gives no regard to other minor parties,

741
00:42:04,880 --> 00:42:09,319
Speaker 1: none of any significance. So what if everybody at the

742
00:42:09,360 --> 00:42:12,160
Speaker 1: age of eighteen or sixteen were able to vote without registering.

743
00:42:13,200 --> 00:42:15,080
Speaker 1: What if, by right of the fact that you were

744
00:42:15,120 --> 00:42:18,360
Speaker 1: a US citizen that you can go in any ballot

745
00:42:18,400 --> 00:42:21,920
Speaker 1: box wherever it is that you call yourself home and

746
00:42:22,080 --> 00:42:27,919
Speaker 1: vote on any election. And why is it that if

747
00:42:27,960 --> 00:42:30,280
Speaker 1: you are a Democrat or a Republican, you're the only

748
00:42:30,320 --> 00:42:34,319
Speaker 1: ones who participate in a primary and everybody else has

749
00:42:34,360 --> 00:42:37,400
Speaker 1: to wait to the very end before people even know

750
00:42:37,440 --> 00:42:40,840
Speaker 1: that there's a race to be considered. An election has happened,

751
00:42:40,880 --> 00:42:42,800
Speaker 1: and they haven't even been able to consume the information

752
00:42:42,920 --> 00:42:45,120
Speaker 1: because they're not a part of the Democratic or the

753
00:42:45,160 --> 00:42:48,640
Speaker 1: Republican party. In fact, in many states, no party affiliate

754
00:42:48,719 --> 00:42:53,279
Speaker 1: and independent is the majority registration. So if we were

755
00:42:53,280 --> 00:42:55,040
Speaker 1: to abolish the fact that you didn't have to be

756
00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:57,680
Speaker 1: a Democrat or a Republican and that the systems and

757
00:42:57,760 --> 00:43:03,360
Speaker 1: laws were not constructed to to value you above everybody else,

758
00:43:04,840 --> 00:43:10,600
Speaker 1: what if in a democratic society we had branches of

759
00:43:10,719 --> 00:43:14,560
Speaker 1: government that were actually accountable to the people that put

760
00:43:14,600 --> 00:43:18,400
Speaker 1: them there, meaning the voters, rather than the moneyed interests

761
00:43:18,960 --> 00:43:25,120
Speaker 1: that runs roughshod over everything, regulatory, governance, you name it,

762
00:43:25,200 --> 00:43:30,040
Speaker 1: they got it. I think in a democracy, your history

763
00:43:30,400 --> 00:43:33,879
Speaker 1: as a former felon should be of no consequence once

764
00:43:33,880 --> 00:43:36,760
Speaker 1: you've repaid your debt to society. Meaning you served your time,

765
00:43:38,120 --> 00:43:41,000
Speaker 1: and if you don't have a felony and you're incarcerated,

766
00:43:41,760 --> 00:43:45,000
Speaker 1: you should be gift wrapped your ballot box because you

767
00:43:45,120 --> 00:43:47,600
Speaker 1: still have the right to vote. Yet many of people

768
00:43:47,600 --> 00:43:51,279
Speaker 1: who are sitting in jail yet waiting a trial are

769
00:43:51,360 --> 00:43:53,279
Speaker 1: never ever reminded of the fact that they still have

770
00:43:53,400 --> 00:43:57,680
Speaker 1: their constitutional and legal rights to vote. So, from top

771
00:43:57,719 --> 00:44:01,880
Speaker 1: to bottom, the system is designed for the powerful to

772
00:44:02,040 --> 00:44:06,400
Speaker 1: keep power, and that's Democrat or Republican, for those in

773
00:44:06,480 --> 00:44:09,920
Speaker 1: power to keep power, and everybody else to hell with you.

774
00:44:10,320 --> 00:44:13,080
Speaker 1: They could care less. And then we wonder why people

775
00:44:13,120 --> 00:44:16,719
Speaker 1: complain about never having their streets paved. No libraries, no

776
00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:21,800
Speaker 1: fresh food markets, no no recreation that includes trees and

777
00:44:22,480 --> 00:44:25,200
Speaker 1: paved parking, bike lanes and so on and so forth.

778
00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:28,680
Speaker 1: They've already told us that we don't matter. And then

779
00:44:28,719 --> 00:44:30,960
Speaker 1: we try to do this exercise of get out to vote,

780
00:44:30,960 --> 00:44:33,399
Speaker 1: get out the vote, get out to vote, and folks

781
00:44:33,400 --> 00:44:34,480
Speaker 1: are like, vote for fucking what.

782
00:44:35,680 --> 00:44:38,480
Speaker 6: I just want to say, bike lanes are for terrorist activity,

783
00:44:38,840 --> 00:44:39,560
Speaker 6: They stress me.

784
00:44:41,239 --> 00:44:45,279
Speaker 1: You sound like my mama bound roundabouts anyway. But that's

785
00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:48,399
Speaker 1: the point, right The needs, the basic needs and stuff

786
00:44:48,440 --> 00:44:53,920
Speaker 1: that's so essential is a is a dream to people,

787
00:44:54,760 --> 00:45:01,799
Speaker 1: because that's how bad the system fails us. I'm done

788
00:45:01,800 --> 00:45:02,040
Speaker 1: on it.

789
00:45:03,040 --> 00:45:07,480
Speaker 7: I feel like I am in a different state of

790
00:45:07,520 --> 00:45:11,600
Speaker 7: mind than you and Angela, maybe because what you guys

791
00:45:11,600 --> 00:45:13,759
Speaker 7: are talking about all makes sense. You know, I don't

792
00:45:13,800 --> 00:45:16,439
Speaker 7: disagree with anything you said. That is how you can

793
00:45:16,560 --> 00:45:18,480
Speaker 7: fix this broken system that exists.

794
00:45:18,480 --> 00:45:18,760
Speaker 3: Now.

795
00:45:19,360 --> 00:45:23,440
Speaker 7: I think my perspective is still which is still developing,

796
00:45:23,600 --> 00:45:25,880
Speaker 7: you know, So y'all give me some grace to the

797
00:45:25,920 --> 00:45:26,840
Speaker 7: audience as I'm.

798
00:45:26,680 --> 00:45:29,520
Speaker 3: Figuring out what.

799
00:45:28,560 --> 00:45:30,279
Speaker 7: What makes sense? Right, I just want to make it

800
00:45:30,320 --> 00:45:33,319
Speaker 7: clearer to the audience. Like I'm like, y'all, I'm trying

801
00:45:33,360 --> 00:45:36,520
Speaker 7: to figure this shit out myself. I don't know that

802
00:45:36,600 --> 00:45:38,520
Speaker 7: this is a system like even what you all are

803
00:45:38,520 --> 00:45:40,640
Speaker 7: talking about. If we tap into our imagination, it talks

804
00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:45,560
Speaker 7: about the system itself, and even an idea of voting,

805
00:45:46,040 --> 00:45:48,359
Speaker 7: the idea of even having prisons.

806
00:45:48,680 --> 00:45:49,560
Speaker 3: You know, these are.

807
00:45:49,480 --> 00:45:53,719
Speaker 7: Things that I don't know that I connect with anymore.

808
00:45:54,920 --> 00:45:58,000
Speaker 7: As soon as I realize that this is all just

809
00:45:58,080 --> 00:46:02,400
Speaker 7: a set of uns folk in guidelines that are not

810
00:46:02,719 --> 00:46:06,879
Speaker 7: truly enforceable, then it just became well, then what are

811
00:46:06,880 --> 00:46:09,759
Speaker 7: we even doing here? Enough people just decided, well, this

812
00:46:09,880 --> 00:46:12,839
Speaker 7: constitution like what a monument's clause. We don't care about that.

813
00:46:13,080 --> 00:46:15,800
Speaker 7: You know, who cares about this fourteenth Amendment? Who cares?

814
00:46:16,160 --> 00:46:18,720
Speaker 7: If they can tap into their imagine on that level,

815
00:46:19,000 --> 00:46:21,759
Speaker 7: then we can go a lot further. So I don't

816
00:46:21,800 --> 00:46:23,640
Speaker 7: even know, like when we talk about the party, I

817
00:46:23,680 --> 00:46:26,920
Speaker 7: gotta be honest, I don't really care about the Democratic

818
00:46:26,960 --> 00:46:29,240
Speaker 7: Party right now. That's not you know, I don't feel

819
00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:31,560
Speaker 7: a line now that is not to say that we

820
00:46:31,600 --> 00:46:34,680
Speaker 7: should not vote and we should not hold them accountable.

821
00:46:34,880 --> 00:46:38,640
Speaker 7: You know, like we gave them power. And I mean

822
00:46:38,719 --> 00:46:42,399
Speaker 7: that specifically we gave them power. We are the voting base,

823
00:46:42,640 --> 00:46:44,799
Speaker 7: but I mean if we look at the macro and

824
00:46:44,800 --> 00:46:49,840
Speaker 7: not the micro. I just even this idea of capitalism,

825
00:46:50,120 --> 00:46:54,719
Speaker 7: you know that that was born out of the plantation

826
00:46:55,000 --> 00:46:55,719
Speaker 7: and slavery.

827
00:46:56,040 --> 00:46:57,640
Speaker 3: Even this idea of how far.

828
00:46:57,560 --> 00:47:00,719
Speaker 7: We've come, well, you know, in reading it will show

829
00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:03,560
Speaker 7: you if we start with slavery, then everything we done

830
00:47:03,640 --> 00:47:06,239
Speaker 7: look like progress. But if you go before that, we

831
00:47:06,360 --> 00:47:08,680
Speaker 7: still in debt, we are still having those problems. So

832
00:47:08,719 --> 00:47:11,400
Speaker 7: I just when we ask the question, what does democracy

833
00:47:11,440 --> 00:47:13,320
Speaker 7: look like to us? So I say, I kind of

834
00:47:13,360 --> 00:47:16,880
Speaker 7: got to strike the term democracy. I talked about this

835
00:47:16,920 --> 00:47:20,719
Speaker 7: before the book The Poison with Bible, where they you know,

836
00:47:20,840 --> 00:47:22,719
Speaker 7: historical fiction where they talk about the reign of La

837
00:47:22,760 --> 00:47:27,040
Speaker 7: Mumba and the you know, local savages as the white

838
00:47:27,040 --> 00:47:30,040
Speaker 7: people looked at them, talked about how the American democracy

839
00:47:30,040 --> 00:47:32,680
Speaker 7: makes no sense. You telling me this eighteen year old

840
00:47:32,719 --> 00:47:34,720
Speaker 7: boy got as much power as me, and I'm a chief,

841
00:47:35,040 --> 00:47:37,240
Speaker 7: and his opinion counts the same as mine. You telling

842
00:47:37,280 --> 00:47:39,600
Speaker 7: me because forty nine percent of your people can be

843
00:47:39,719 --> 00:47:42,440
Speaker 7: unhappy just because fifty one percent of your people like it,

844
00:47:42,480 --> 00:47:43,880
Speaker 7: that makes sense to y'all in America?

845
00:47:44,000 --> 00:47:46,320
Speaker 3: Then this is my point.

846
00:47:46,640 --> 00:47:48,759
Speaker 7: When you look at the founders, when you look this

847
00:47:48,800 --> 00:47:51,319
Speaker 7: is why I say reading right now is the time

848
00:47:51,320 --> 00:47:54,960
Speaker 7: for reading, listening and learning. I wonder when Abraham Lincoln said,

849
00:47:55,360 --> 00:47:58,080
Speaker 7: you know what, when he called the black folks and said,

850
00:47:58,440 --> 00:48:00,759
Speaker 7: I don't want to live with y'all because y'all ain't

851
00:48:00,800 --> 00:48:03,600
Speaker 7: never gonna let us for your slavery, and we don't

852
00:48:03,600 --> 00:48:05,400
Speaker 7: want to be reminded of that shit. Y'all gonna always be

853
00:48:05,440 --> 00:48:07,200
Speaker 7: mad at us, We're gonna be mad at y'all. I

854
00:48:07,239 --> 00:48:10,520
Speaker 7: think y'all should just get the fuck out. I'm wondering now,

855
00:48:10,600 --> 00:48:13,520
Speaker 7: like you know what, he might have had a point,

856
00:48:14,160 --> 00:48:18,319
Speaker 7: because if we are still fighting these same battles, and

857
00:48:18,400 --> 00:48:21,759
Speaker 7: it's true, we have never confronted that history, so if

858
00:48:21,760 --> 00:48:24,000
Speaker 7: we're still fighting that, I just don't know that trying

859
00:48:24,040 --> 00:48:27,799
Speaker 7: to save, repair, or build a system within this construct

860
00:48:28,120 --> 00:48:31,440
Speaker 7: of whiteness and white power and a ruling class that

861
00:48:31,520 --> 00:48:35,759
Speaker 7: has been overwhelmingly white makes sense for us. So I

862
00:48:35,880 --> 00:48:38,239
Speaker 7: just again, I don't know that we can serve. Even

863
00:48:38,280 --> 00:48:40,560
Speaker 7: if I thought it was salvageable, I don't know that

864
00:48:40,640 --> 00:48:45,520
Speaker 7: it's possible to save it. When looking at a multi racial,

865
00:48:45,840 --> 00:48:50,680
Speaker 7: multi ethnic society where everyone arrives to participate on equal footing,

866
00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:53,480
Speaker 7: I think they will worship their true God, and that

867
00:48:53,640 --> 00:48:56,080
Speaker 7: is power, and they will destroy everything in its path

868
00:48:56,800 --> 00:48:58,160
Speaker 7: before they allow that to happen.

869
00:48:58,920 --> 00:49:01,400
Speaker 1: I actually think in the I don't think there's a

870
00:49:01,480 --> 00:49:04,320
Speaker 1: race to power right now. We can associate a race

871
00:49:04,600 --> 00:49:06,759
Speaker 1: to power right because it's been the same ones in

872
00:49:06,880 --> 00:49:11,399
Speaker 1: charge for a long time. But I think we're all

873
00:49:11,440 --> 00:49:15,719
Speaker 1: black people in charge. We would still have a problem

874
00:49:16,520 --> 00:49:24,240
Speaker 1: with the corrosive effects of power. We gave the example

875
00:49:24,280 --> 00:49:31,600
Speaker 1: of es Well. I think power inevitably leads to abuse.

876
00:49:33,680 --> 00:49:37,520
Speaker 1: I don't know that there is a model of a

877
00:49:37,680 --> 00:49:41,239
Speaker 1: ruling class of a powerful class that doesn't act to

878
00:49:41,320 --> 00:49:46,120
Speaker 1: protect itself, y'all. I know we are hitting this topic

879
00:49:46,360 --> 00:49:49,359
Speaker 1: at a lot of different levels, but stick with us

880
00:49:49,480 --> 00:49:51,920
Speaker 1: on the other side of this break.

881
00:50:00,400 --> 00:50:04,000
Speaker 8: I think a ruling class is exactly the point. Like,

882
00:50:04,040 --> 00:50:07,480
Speaker 8: if you are constructing a society based on there being

883
00:50:08,000 --> 00:50:10,560
Speaker 8: a ruling class, the folks at the bottom will always

884
00:50:10,880 --> 00:50:13,000
Speaker 8: strive to get to the top, and the folks at

885
00:50:13,040 --> 00:50:15,799
Speaker 8: the top will always strive to protect their status. But

886
00:50:15,960 --> 00:50:18,520
Speaker 8: if you construct a different type of society, which is

887
00:50:18,520 --> 00:50:20,759
Speaker 8: where I was going to go to, I don't think

888
00:50:20,760 --> 00:50:23,200
Speaker 8: that any of my remarks are about fixing the system.

889
00:50:23,600 --> 00:50:27,239
Speaker 8: I think I was trying to bring us into a

890
00:50:27,280 --> 00:50:30,759
Speaker 8: conversation that deepens us into where the problems are, but

891
00:50:30,880 --> 00:50:33,880
Speaker 8: not to rebuild it as is. I think it's about

892
00:50:34,160 --> 00:50:37,320
Speaker 8: trying to ensure that we don't rebuild the same broken system.

893
00:50:37,640 --> 00:50:42,719
Speaker 8: And I also I don't support having a ruling class,

894
00:50:42,800 --> 00:50:48,680
Speaker 8: like I think that there has to be something that

895
00:50:48,719 --> 00:50:52,920
Speaker 8: feels a little more democratic, something that feels a little

896
00:50:52,960 --> 00:50:57,200
Speaker 8: more power or for all people. I'm sure when the

897
00:50:58,800 --> 00:51:03,840
Speaker 8: Fox News types and all of their supporters and they're

898
00:51:03,880 --> 00:51:07,000
Speaker 8: they're the people that boost their content. The Republican talking

899
00:51:07,040 --> 00:51:09,800
Speaker 8: heads get hold of this. We're gonna sound like socialist

900
00:51:09,880 --> 00:51:14,440
Speaker 8: socialist Marxists, I'm sure. But I do think that the

901
00:51:14,480 --> 00:51:18,160
Speaker 8: reality of it is is when you have some a few,

902
00:51:18,680 --> 00:51:22,200
Speaker 8: the top one percent, which by the way, economically we're

903
00:51:22,200 --> 00:51:26,399
Speaker 8: in the one percent in this country, when you try

904
00:51:26,440 --> 00:51:29,160
Speaker 8: to protect the one percent or the point one percent,

905
00:51:32,239 --> 00:51:34,239
Speaker 8: you're always going to have a challenge, You're always going

906
00:51:34,320 --> 00:51:35,960
Speaker 8: to have a problem. I don't think that that's the

907
00:51:36,040 --> 00:51:38,000
Speaker 8: right structure for us to develop or for us to

908
00:51:38,040 --> 00:51:41,840
Speaker 8: be a part of. There are societies, especially on the

909
00:51:41,920 --> 00:51:45,200
Speaker 8: Content and in other places that exist that are not.

910
00:51:46,760 --> 00:51:49,160
Speaker 6: This combative and this troubled and this oppressive.

911
00:51:50,400 --> 00:51:55,520
Speaker 1: Most of them are autocratic. It's it's you know, looking

912
00:51:55,560 --> 00:51:59,759
Speaker 1: to a singular person and or a person in their

913
00:51:59,760 --> 00:52:04,880
Speaker 1: fans the derivatives thereof as the leaders. There is a

914
00:52:04,920 --> 00:52:10,720
Speaker 1: reason why that style of governance has lasted so long

915
00:52:11,040 --> 00:52:14,040
Speaker 1: and so many places across these continents.

916
00:52:14,480 --> 00:52:16,920
Speaker 3: But can you say what you said again, Andrew about power.

917
00:52:17,040 --> 00:52:19,120
Speaker 3: You were saying it lives to protect.

918
00:52:18,800 --> 00:52:26,160
Speaker 1: Itself, for sure. You name a powerful person, powerful person

919
00:52:26,239 --> 00:52:30,600
Speaker 1: or powerful institution that is prepared to walk away from

920
00:52:30,640 --> 00:52:36,560
Speaker 1: that power, decentralize it down for others. That's cannibalism. Nobody

921
00:52:36,640 --> 00:52:42,920
Speaker 1: is or suicide. I mean to put it differently, Okay,

922
00:52:43,000 --> 00:52:45,719
Speaker 1: think of a doctor and when the doctor explains to you, well,

923
00:52:45,760 --> 00:52:48,799
Speaker 1: the reason why your wrists swole up the way that

924
00:52:48,880 --> 00:52:54,239
Speaker 1: it did is because your body perceived an invasion and

925
00:52:54,280 --> 00:52:59,120
Speaker 1: it believed that that invasion was intended to destroy you,

926
00:52:59,280 --> 00:53:03,480
Speaker 1: to kill you. So the body sends all of this

927
00:53:03,760 --> 00:53:07,880
Speaker 1: resources to that space of penetration to make sure that

928
00:53:07,920 --> 00:53:10,600
Speaker 1: we don't die. The body, I don't care how you

929
00:53:10,600 --> 00:53:13,320
Speaker 1: put it. If you try to drown yourself, your body

930
00:53:13,360 --> 00:53:16,600
Speaker 1: reflexively is going to want to survive. It is going

931
00:53:16,640 --> 00:53:20,200
Speaker 1: to want to live. I compare that the same way

932
00:53:21,600 --> 00:53:24,759
Speaker 1: as I would to a ruling class. Regardless of what

933
00:53:24,840 --> 00:53:30,840
Speaker 1: your better higher angels are, your body means to remain

934
00:53:30,960 --> 00:53:35,239
Speaker 1: in control your status of People mean to have it

935
00:53:35,320 --> 00:53:38,520
Speaker 1: their way. They can look as gratuitous as they want to.

936
00:53:38,960 --> 00:53:41,840
Speaker 1: They can talk as graciously and gratuitously as they want to,

937
00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:45,200
Speaker 1: including the billionaires who want to give away half their

938
00:53:45,200 --> 00:53:47,480
Speaker 1: wealth or more than half their wealth. Give away half

939
00:53:47,480 --> 00:53:52,680
Speaker 1: your wealth, your children's children's children's children's children plus plus

940
00:53:52,680 --> 00:53:58,680
Speaker 1: plus will still be filthy wealthy. So they're not they're

941
00:53:58,680 --> 00:54:02,439
Speaker 1: not nihilistic about it, right, They're not saying I don't

942
00:54:02,480 --> 00:54:05,040
Speaker 1: want nothing to go to my children's children and childrens children, No, no, no,

943
00:54:05,040 --> 00:54:07,920
Speaker 1: no no. They weren't their children's children's children to enjoy

944
00:54:08,000 --> 00:54:11,120
Speaker 1: the same privilege that they do walk in this earth today.

945
00:54:11,640 --> 00:54:14,040
Speaker 1: So then they just don't mean they just don't mean

946
00:54:14,080 --> 00:54:16,520
Speaker 1: to be inglorious about it. That's a version of capitalism,

947
00:54:16,520 --> 00:54:19,879
Speaker 1: but it's also capitalism as a as a route to power.

948
00:54:19,920 --> 00:54:22,400
Speaker 7: Right right, So that's I think that's what Angel was describing.

949
00:54:22,440 --> 00:54:24,319
Speaker 7: Like in the ruling class, you'll have the top trying

950
00:54:24,360 --> 00:54:26,840
Speaker 7: to protect itself. You'll have the bottom trying, you know,

951
00:54:27,000 --> 00:54:30,640
Speaker 7: being astrational. Right, that is the system of capitalism. So

952
00:54:30,719 --> 00:54:33,160
Speaker 7: every to me, everything you all are saying is like,

953
00:54:34,960 --> 00:54:36,960
Speaker 7: you know it challenges with this take away.

954
00:54:36,719 --> 00:54:37,480
Speaker 3: The money system.

955
00:54:37,800 --> 00:54:40,680
Speaker 1: Take away the money. Take away the money then and

956
00:54:40,760 --> 00:54:46,240
Speaker 1: then just deal with the people in charge who gets

957
00:54:46,280 --> 00:54:49,960
Speaker 1: to make the decisions. Everybody still wants to be the decider.

958
00:54:50,080 --> 00:54:52,760
Speaker 1: Everybody can't be the decider, and the deciders of today

959
00:54:53,120 --> 00:54:55,760
Speaker 1: want to stay the deciders. And if they're not the ones,

960
00:54:55,920 --> 00:55:00,000
Speaker 1: they want their parrogeny to be the deciders because they

961
00:55:00,000 --> 00:55:02,080
Speaker 1: I never want their kids disadvantage.

962
00:55:02,440 --> 00:55:05,120
Speaker 7: But I so this I think gets to the other

963
00:55:05,160 --> 00:55:09,160
Speaker 7: point we were making, Like the power, as we know,

964
00:55:09,280 --> 00:55:12,400
Speaker 7: concedes nothing. And if you're saying power, you know feeds itself,

965
00:55:12,440 --> 00:55:17,759
Speaker 7: which is true, Like it is a cannibalistic entity that

966
00:55:17,840 --> 00:55:20,759
Speaker 7: people desire, people chase it. I think we saw some

967
00:55:20,800 --> 00:55:22,520
Speaker 7: of that and some of the voting trends that we

968
00:55:22,920 --> 00:55:24,600
Speaker 7: have seen over the past few decades.

969
00:55:24,840 --> 00:55:28,239
Speaker 1: We see in some of the attitudes around immigrants from immigrants.

970
00:55:28,280 --> 00:55:31,520
Speaker 7: You jumped and took my point, but you're sorry, no, no, no,

971
00:55:31,680 --> 00:55:34,200
Speaker 7: I'm happy you did. You were in my mind because

972
00:55:34,200 --> 00:55:37,920
Speaker 7: that's where I was going. Even we on some level

973
00:55:37,960 --> 00:55:40,400
Speaker 7: have some power, we don't have, you know what the

974
00:55:40,520 --> 00:55:43,120
Speaker 7: ruling class as we have some power, and our attitude

975
00:55:43,160 --> 00:55:47,560
Speaker 7: has been hands off, you know, forget them, not ours collectively,

976
00:55:47,600 --> 00:55:50,759
Speaker 7: but a few people in community have been in isolation

977
00:55:51,080 --> 00:55:53,680
Speaker 7: like no, this is that's what's gonna happen there. And

978
00:55:53,760 --> 00:55:56,960
Speaker 7: I just wonder in that society where you have that

979
00:55:57,080 --> 00:56:01,879
Speaker 7: kind of attitude, how do we win? And I and

980
00:56:01,920 --> 00:56:04,200
Speaker 7: I guess that's why I'm trying. My thoughts are just

981
00:56:05,960 --> 00:56:08,480
Speaker 7: I don't want to say elevated as in higher, but

982
00:56:08,600 --> 00:56:11,880
Speaker 7: elevated as in I'm looking down at what's happening, trying

983
00:56:11,920 --> 00:56:15,160
Speaker 7: to understand it all, and trying to under look backwards

984
00:56:15,280 --> 00:56:17,400
Speaker 7: what happened a million years ago, what happened a thousand

985
00:56:17,480 --> 00:56:20,560
Speaker 7: years ago, what's happening right now, and what's coming? And

986
00:56:20,640 --> 00:56:25,160
Speaker 7: with that, I have to say, all empires fall. There

987
00:56:25,280 --> 00:56:28,200
Speaker 7: has not been one in history that hasn't. So this definitely,

988
00:56:28,360 --> 00:56:31,360
Speaker 7: very much feels like this is the fall of this empire,

989
00:56:31,680 --> 00:56:34,200
Speaker 7: and then what does that mean for humanity writ large?

990
00:56:34,200 --> 00:56:36,480
Speaker 7: When you look at the populist movements across the globe,

991
00:56:36,480 --> 00:56:38,839
Speaker 7: when you look at the genocides that we've only heard

992
00:56:38,840 --> 00:56:40,799
Speaker 7: about a few, but there have been many, many, many,

993
00:56:40,840 --> 00:56:43,520
Speaker 7: and there are still many happening. I'm reading this book,

994
00:56:44,080 --> 00:56:46,080
Speaker 7: sky Full of Elephants. It happens to be fiction. I'm

995
00:56:46,080 --> 00:56:48,160
Speaker 7: reading two books, but this is my fiction that I'm reading,

996
00:56:48,800 --> 00:56:50,960
Speaker 7: and Sky Full of Elephants is a work of fiction,

997
00:56:51,040 --> 00:56:54,440
Speaker 7: but it definitely taps into the mind. And the premise is,

998
00:56:54,520 --> 00:57:00,319
Speaker 7: one day, every white person walks into the ocean. They

999
00:57:00,360 --> 00:57:02,160
Speaker 7: just are in the trans and they walk into the

1000
00:57:02,160 --> 00:57:05,960
Speaker 7: ocean and they're gone. And then you have a society

1001
00:57:05,960 --> 00:57:08,560
Speaker 7: that's left, and what does that society look like? You

1002
00:57:08,600 --> 00:57:12,000
Speaker 7: have Biracials kids whose moms are white who are devastated

1003
00:57:12,040 --> 00:57:14,440
Speaker 7: they grew up in a white world. You know, they're sad.

1004
00:57:14,560 --> 00:57:17,520
Speaker 7: You have you know, black people trying to figure out

1005
00:57:17,560 --> 00:57:20,040
Speaker 7: how to maneuver. And there's a rumor like, don't go

1006
00:57:20,120 --> 00:57:22,360
Speaker 7: to the South, to stay out the South. It's awful,

1007
00:57:22,720 --> 00:57:24,480
Speaker 7: but that's where all the black people are. And you

1008
00:57:24,560 --> 00:57:28,320
Speaker 7: get down there and it is peace. It is an oasis,

1009
00:57:28,440 --> 00:57:30,360
Speaker 7: you know. But they've been telling everybody don't go down

1010
00:57:30,360 --> 00:57:32,880
Speaker 7: there because it is something to protect and know.

1011
00:57:32,960 --> 00:57:33,800
Speaker 3: It's a work of fiction.

1012
00:57:33,920 --> 00:57:35,760
Speaker 7: It pulls on It has a lot of history in

1013
00:57:35,800 --> 00:57:37,520
Speaker 7: it and pulls on a lot of things that happen,

1014
00:57:38,320 --> 00:57:40,360
Speaker 7: like their original Madi Garad I think was in Mobile,

1015
00:57:40,400 --> 00:57:42,480
Speaker 7: which I never knew. So it gives a lot of history.

1016
00:57:42,680 --> 00:57:45,160
Speaker 7: But it has been tappening into my imagination about, yeah,

1017
00:57:45,160 --> 00:57:47,760
Speaker 7: what does that look like? You know, because we're not

1018
00:57:47,800 --> 00:57:49,840
Speaker 7: going to have that society, but by twenty forty four

1019
00:57:49,880 --> 00:57:52,440
Speaker 7: we will be a society where there is no racial majority.

1020
00:57:52,760 --> 00:57:55,360
Speaker 7: So in that sense, what might that look like? And

1021
00:57:55,480 --> 00:57:58,640
Speaker 7: is that leading us further into this civil war that

1022
00:57:58,680 --> 00:58:01,920
Speaker 7: exists right now? And in that case, they outarm us,

1023
00:58:01,960 --> 00:58:04,280
Speaker 7: they outnumber us, We got a lot of people on

1024
00:58:04,320 --> 00:58:06,400
Speaker 7: our size say nope, we know that, and we still

1025
00:58:06,440 --> 00:58:07,160
Speaker 7: not trying to ally.

1026
00:58:07,200 --> 00:58:08,080
Speaker 3: We'll go it alone.

1027
00:58:08,400 --> 00:58:11,160
Speaker 7: Got the twelve percent and has got me questioning even

1028
00:58:11,200 --> 00:58:15,480
Speaker 7: our population. Angela, you said, you know, twelve percent, thirteen

1029
00:58:15,640 --> 00:58:19,840
Speaker 7: some maybe fourteen percent. There are some people who surmise

1030
00:58:20,120 --> 00:58:23,800
Speaker 7: that the census is a hypothesis. It's a guest because

1031
00:58:23,800 --> 00:58:25,760
Speaker 7: you know, they do overhead, they do skilling, they do

1032
00:58:25,960 --> 00:58:29,760
Speaker 7: right and so you know, which got me thinking when

1033
00:58:29,760 --> 00:58:32,120
Speaker 7: you look at places like Jackson, Mississippi, where we'll be this.

1034
00:58:32,080 --> 00:58:35,680
Speaker 3: Week, I hope to see y'all there. Yeah, in Mississippi?

1035
00:58:36,360 --> 00:58:39,160
Speaker 7: Are are we thirty nine percent of the population or

1036
00:58:39,240 --> 00:58:40,080
Speaker 7: might we be half?

1037
00:58:40,800 --> 00:58:42,240
Speaker 3: Or might we be sixty percent?

1038
00:58:42,640 --> 00:58:45,320
Speaker 7: Like there might be some interest in saying that we

1039
00:58:45,480 --> 00:58:47,200
Speaker 7: are a minority in that space.

1040
00:58:47,560 --> 00:58:49,640
Speaker 3: And if that's the case, I got a question everything.

1041
00:58:50,240 --> 00:58:54,400
Speaker 8: We also don't all voluntarily participate in the census. Folks

1042
00:58:54,440 --> 00:58:56,880
Speaker 8: have said for years like that we need to encourage

1043
00:58:56,920 --> 00:58:59,880
Speaker 8: greater census participation. There are a lot of folks that,

1044
00:59:00,200 --> 00:59:02,800
Speaker 8: because of the system that you're talking about challenging right now,

1045
00:59:02,880 --> 00:59:03,640
Speaker 8: don't trust the.

1046
00:59:03,560 --> 00:59:06,440
Speaker 6: Government, don't want them to know where they live, don't want.

1047
00:59:06,320 --> 00:59:09,880
Speaker 8: To, like, even if they have a whole mortgage, then's searchable. Yes,

1048
00:59:10,960 --> 00:59:13,200
Speaker 8: but this far right here, I don't want to do

1049
00:59:13,880 --> 00:59:16,960
Speaker 8: So there's that too. The other thing is now, since

1050
00:59:17,120 --> 00:59:19,960
Speaker 8: the census data, the way that the federal government is

1051
00:59:20,000 --> 00:59:22,480
Speaker 8: collecting research information.

1052
00:59:22,160 --> 00:59:23,960
Speaker 6: On race is changing.

1053
00:59:24,040 --> 00:59:26,960
Speaker 8: Yes, that is so people are about to be collapsed

1054
00:59:27,000 --> 00:59:28,520
Speaker 8: in one category or the other.

1055
00:59:28,920 --> 00:59:29,200
Speaker 6: Yes.

1056
00:59:29,240 --> 00:59:34,040
Speaker 7: With the indigenous community specifically, like the twenty twenty cents,

1057
00:59:34,200 --> 00:59:38,200
Speaker 7: you might think, oh, the Indigenous population just explodeed, but

1058
00:59:38,240 --> 00:59:42,520
Speaker 7: that's not true. It was people claiming an Indigenous heritage

1059
00:59:42,520 --> 00:59:46,160
Speaker 7: that were not necessarily acknowledged by tribal communities. And so

1060
00:59:46,320 --> 00:59:49,680
Speaker 7: now if you look at that, how does that inform resources?

1061
00:59:50,080 --> 00:59:52,600
Speaker 7: And then will that be a battle you know, over

1062
00:59:52,680 --> 00:59:54,720
Speaker 7: who tribal communities determined?

1063
00:59:55,520 --> 00:59:58,800
Speaker 1: Always been a tool, yeah, powerful, I mean it's always

1064
00:59:58,800 --> 01:00:01,600
Speaker 1: been a tool, right, And they they've always projected, they've

1065
01:00:01,640 --> 01:00:04,800
Speaker 1: never had actual lie like person to person count.

1066
01:00:05,040 --> 01:00:07,680
Speaker 6: I can't remember today count people who are incarcerated.

1067
01:00:07,800 --> 01:00:14,360
Speaker 1: Yes, yes they do. For aggregation of congressional districts where

1068
01:00:14,360 --> 01:00:17,000
Speaker 1: a bunch of Republicans are representing you know, fifty thousand

1069
01:00:17,040 --> 01:00:19,400
Speaker 1: people outside of jail and the other two hundred thousand

1070
01:00:20,040 --> 01:00:23,720
Speaker 1: are incarcerated in their districts. Yes, they count them, they

1071
01:00:23,800 --> 01:00:27,720
Speaker 1: just don't appropriate for them fully, but they do count

1072
01:00:27,720 --> 01:00:30,520
Speaker 1: them in those districts to create congression diship. But and

1073
01:00:30,760 --> 01:00:32,440
Speaker 1: I mean, Tiff, you made a point that I just

1074
01:00:32,480 --> 01:00:34,720
Speaker 1: want to because you and I have privately talked about this.

1075
01:00:35,560 --> 01:00:38,200
Speaker 1: A lot of folks celebrate the browning of America, and

1076
01:00:38,280 --> 01:00:41,320
Speaker 1: I'm not one who doesn't celebrate it. I just don't

1077
01:00:41,320 --> 01:00:49,320
Speaker 1: believe that it it it leads to a specific political outcome.

1078
01:00:50,040 --> 01:00:52,800
Speaker 1: I don't think that it means that all black and

1079
01:00:52,840 --> 01:00:56,360
Speaker 1: brown people then get together, harmonized and are like, we're

1080
01:00:56,360 --> 01:00:58,880
Speaker 1: the majority now. I don't think that's what happens.

1081
01:00:58,880 --> 01:01:00,920
Speaker 3: Global majority now, and it's not happening.

1082
01:01:01,040 --> 01:01:06,440
Speaker 1: So get back to my original hypotheses around power, is

1083
01:01:06,480 --> 01:01:10,040
Speaker 1: that these alliances are going to come together around how

1084
01:01:10,080 --> 01:01:13,320
Speaker 1: you piece together enough people to make the ruling class.

1085
01:01:13,440 --> 01:01:18,960
Speaker 7: Yeah, and then it will act just as the pavious

1086
01:01:19,240 --> 01:01:20,520
Speaker 7: ruling class.

1087
01:01:20,560 --> 01:01:23,600
Speaker 1: It will act to protect itself, and it will not

1088
01:01:23,640 --> 01:01:27,120
Speaker 1: only act to protect itself, it will act to ensure

1089
01:01:27,240 --> 01:01:30,440
Speaker 1: that you're never going to threaten it. So then the

1090
01:01:30,440 --> 01:01:38,040
Speaker 1: tools of the weapons of government, governance and everything that

1091
01:01:37,600 --> 01:01:41,280
Speaker 1: is that that that descends from it will be weaponized

1092
01:01:41,800 --> 01:01:45,760
Speaker 1: for their purposes to keep them in charge. And yes,

1093
01:01:45,840 --> 01:01:48,800
Speaker 1: all empires fall, very few of those empires that have

1094
01:01:48,920 --> 01:01:50,680
Speaker 1: fallen have predicted their fall.

1095
01:01:51,200 --> 01:01:51,920
Speaker 3: Right it.

1096
01:01:52,600 --> 01:01:55,600
Speaker 1: And my guess is, and I hate to think this way,

1097
01:01:55,640 --> 01:01:59,120
Speaker 1: but I believe it to be true that when this

1098
01:01:59,200 --> 01:02:04,240
Speaker 1: empower fall, the empires that will rise will be helmed

1099
01:02:04,280 --> 01:02:08,040
Speaker 1: by autocratic leaders. I think it is the simplest form

1100
01:02:08,080 --> 01:02:11,000
Speaker 1: of government. It is the most understood form of government,

1101
01:02:11,280 --> 01:02:14,960
Speaker 1: is the longest lasting form of government. Remember, democracy and

1102
01:02:15,000 --> 01:02:16,920
Speaker 1: the way we do it here in the US is

1103
01:02:16,960 --> 01:02:21,280
Speaker 1: an experiment, right, a minority amongst the community of the

1104
01:02:21,280 --> 01:02:26,400
Speaker 1: American It's an experiment. And there are people high and

1105
01:02:26,440 --> 01:02:30,480
Speaker 1: low in every hemisphere, on every continent that are championing

1106
01:02:30,760 --> 01:02:34,920
Speaker 1: the failure of this experiment because it threatens the longest

1107
01:02:34,960 --> 01:02:40,080
Speaker 1: standing tradition of governance, which is of autocratic leaders monarchies

1108
01:02:41,120 --> 01:02:45,920
Speaker 1: or autocrats who take power and they helmet for themselves.

1109
01:02:46,080 --> 01:02:48,800
Speaker 1: When we think radically about what democracy looks like, or

1110
01:02:48,800 --> 01:02:50,320
Speaker 1: really what power looks like, because I want to get

1111
01:02:50,360 --> 01:02:55,439
Speaker 1: outside of the construct there, I think differently than I think.

1112
01:02:55,440 --> 01:02:58,800
Speaker 1: How most people think of power is to be hoarded,

1113
01:02:59,280 --> 01:03:02,160
Speaker 1: to be kept. You know to be held sacred amongst

1114
01:03:02,160 --> 01:03:07,880
Speaker 1: a few selected people. I believe power is the gift

1115
01:03:07,880 --> 01:03:12,760
Speaker 1: that keeps giving. That the more you empower, frankly, the

1116
01:03:12,760 --> 01:03:15,080
Speaker 1: more power that is inured to you. You are then

1117
01:03:15,800 --> 01:03:20,560
Speaker 1: magnanimous by extending power to your neighbor, and then your

1118
01:03:20,560 --> 01:03:22,680
Speaker 1: neighbor to their neighbor and their neighbor, and so on

1119
01:03:22,720 --> 01:03:26,160
Speaker 1: and so forth. But most people don't think about power

1120
01:03:26,880 --> 01:03:29,200
Speaker 1: that way. That the more you spread it, the more

1121
01:03:29,240 --> 01:03:33,480
Speaker 1: you actually get it, the more respect, the more deference

1122
01:03:34,320 --> 01:03:36,240
Speaker 1: comes your way. If that's what you're in pursuit of

1123
01:03:37,200 --> 01:03:39,680
Speaker 1: the hoarders of it? Which is the which is? I

1124
01:03:39,680 --> 01:03:46,240
Speaker 1: think a very Eurocentric model of of of of defining

1125
01:03:46,320 --> 01:03:50,640
Speaker 1: power says that it must be tightly held between a

1126
01:03:51,280 --> 01:03:55,800
Speaker 1: small selective group of people or institutions, not to be

1127
01:03:55,880 --> 01:04:00,400
Speaker 1: shared democratically. And I think that that is what's going

1128
01:04:00,440 --> 01:04:02,960
Speaker 1: to help lead to our collapse, not just as a nation,

1129
01:04:03,600 --> 01:04:06,440
Speaker 1: I think as a people period. I don't mean to

1130
01:04:06,480 --> 01:04:09,240
Speaker 1: be going to ending days and ended times, but I

1131
01:04:09,280 --> 01:04:14,400
Speaker 1: think that that's our collapse. We're we're I'm off, I'm

1132
01:04:14,440 --> 01:04:16,200
Speaker 1: probably going down a rabbit hole here.

1133
01:04:16,240 --> 01:04:20,080
Speaker 8: It's just right in prison numbers. I started looking it

1134
01:04:20,160 --> 01:04:22,840
Speaker 8: up This is fascinating. If you if you if you're

1135
01:04:22,920 --> 01:04:25,400
Speaker 8: waiting a trial, you don't count, You're supposed to be

1136
01:04:25,440 --> 01:04:30,240
Speaker 8: counted in your residence, Like I didn't even really anyway, fascinating, unbelievable.

1137
01:04:30,760 --> 01:04:33,880
Speaker 7: I think the whole notion of power feeding off itself

1138
01:04:33,960 --> 01:04:36,520
Speaker 7: is like such a philosophical point that I have to

1139
01:04:36,520 --> 01:04:39,439
Speaker 7: sit with, like, I don't even I hadn't thought about that,

1140
01:04:39,560 --> 01:04:42,640
Speaker 7: you know, uh, until you said that, which again feeds

1141
01:04:42,640 --> 01:04:45,320
Speaker 7: into this question, what does a construction of society? Because

1142
01:04:45,360 --> 01:04:48,200
Speaker 7: note I'm not using the term democracy, what does a construction.

1143
01:04:47,840 --> 01:04:48,840
Speaker 3: Of society look like?

1144
01:04:49,240 --> 01:04:50,640
Speaker 1: Yeah? And that.

1145
01:04:52,080 --> 01:04:52,760
Speaker 3: I don't know.

1146
01:04:52,840 --> 01:04:55,560
Speaker 7: And I can picture the audience saying, well, y'all are

1147
01:04:55,600 --> 01:04:57,760
Speaker 7: saying all this, but what are we supposed to do?

1148
01:04:57,840 --> 01:05:00,760
Speaker 3: People are looking to be led and people.

1149
01:05:00,520 --> 01:05:04,080
Speaker 1: Should right everybody.

1150
01:05:04,120 --> 01:05:06,400
Speaker 7: And people were asking that in the comments, like okay, Tiffany,

1151
01:05:06,440 --> 01:05:07,840
Speaker 7: what would you have us to do? And I was

1152
01:05:07,840 --> 01:05:09,920
Speaker 7: trying to be really clear, All I'm asking is that

1153
01:05:10,000 --> 01:05:13,080
Speaker 7: you care. I'm just saying that you care that the

1154
01:05:13,120 --> 01:05:17,000
Speaker 7: government is disappearing people and sending them the offshore torture

1155
01:05:17,040 --> 01:05:19,560
Speaker 7: camps because we are in that same path of destruction.

1156
01:05:19,840 --> 01:05:22,080
Speaker 7: I don't know what to do, Andree you were the

1157
01:05:22,120 --> 01:05:25,320
Speaker 7: one to you know, suggest protests. I don't know if

1158
01:05:25,400 --> 01:05:28,040
Speaker 7: that's the answer, you know, I think I think it takes.

1159
01:05:27,920 --> 01:05:31,600
Speaker 1: A lot of forms. I hope didn't immediately think that

1160
01:05:31,600 --> 01:05:33,480
Speaker 1: to just me and go stand on the street corner

1161
01:05:33,840 --> 01:05:36,880
Speaker 1: with a sign that we're protesting right now on target.

1162
01:05:36,920 --> 01:05:40,440
Speaker 1: I'm just keeping my money, yeah, or spending it directly

1163
01:05:40,480 --> 01:05:44,440
Speaker 1: with black and brown vendors or whatever. But but I

1164
01:05:45,320 --> 01:05:50,720
Speaker 1: actually don't think that the three of us are in

1165
01:05:50,760 --> 01:05:53,480
Speaker 1: any way delusion enough to think that we can produce

1166
01:05:53,520 --> 01:05:56,960
Speaker 1: the answer right here. I think that if we're truly

1167
01:05:57,000 --> 01:06:04,440
Speaker 1: talking about spreading decision making and power amongst people, a

1168
01:06:04,520 --> 01:06:07,680
Speaker 1: diverse range of people, then let's be in the practice

1169
01:06:07,720 --> 01:06:10,360
Speaker 1: of it. In fact, as we move to CTA's I'm sorry,

1170
01:06:10,440 --> 01:06:13,840
Speaker 1: I'll start first. I'm sorry, lady, right, but I want

1171
01:06:13,880 --> 01:06:17,960
Speaker 1: to invite our listeners to offer up what their radical views,

1172
01:06:18,640 --> 01:06:21,280
Speaker 1: and only radical by virtue of the fact that either

1173
01:06:21,320 --> 01:06:23,480
Speaker 1: hasn't been thought of, or maybe it was thought of

1174
01:06:23,520 --> 01:06:27,000
Speaker 1: the once practice and then abandoned, or you know what,

1175
01:06:27,040 --> 01:06:29,560
Speaker 1: you just sitting on another cloud like Tiffany and I'll

1176
01:06:29,600 --> 01:06:35,160
Speaker 1: be doing sometimes when they take walks, you know, philosophizing. Yeah, yeah,

1177
01:06:35,280 --> 01:06:37,800
Speaker 1: making it worse here, but I want it. That's my invitation.

1178
01:06:37,880 --> 01:06:39,920
Speaker 1: I want to be clear about it. I want to

1179
01:06:39,920 --> 01:06:43,280
Speaker 1: invite our listeners to offer up. If you think the

1180
01:06:43,320 --> 01:06:48,440
Speaker 1: system we have right now is broken, tell me, you know,

1181
01:06:48,560 --> 01:06:53,160
Speaker 1: tell us how would you redesign this thing? Maybe you

1182
01:06:53,200 --> 01:06:55,200
Speaker 1: scraped the whole thing, and maybe you just offer up

1183
01:06:55,240 --> 01:06:58,320
Speaker 1: your notion of what what does a beloved community for

1184
01:06:58,360 --> 01:07:00,800
Speaker 1: you look like? Maybe it is top down with a

1185
01:07:00,840 --> 01:07:04,760
Speaker 1: singular leader. Maybe it is democracy size, where we come

1186
01:07:04,800 --> 01:07:09,240
Speaker 1: to consensus as a group. I don't know, but I'd

1187
01:07:09,280 --> 01:07:10,520
Speaker 1: love to hear your thoughts on it.

1188
01:07:11,000 --> 01:07:13,720
Speaker 3: I love that. I'm looking forward to reading those comments.

1189
01:07:13,800 --> 01:07:16,040
Speaker 7: And if we get videos and still want to remind people,

1190
01:07:16,080 --> 01:07:18,920
Speaker 7: please send in your videos if you want to give

1191
01:07:19,000 --> 01:07:21,600
Speaker 7: us sixty seconds worth of thought. And as you're doing that,

1192
01:07:21,600 --> 01:07:24,560
Speaker 7: don't forget to click like and subscribe and tell a

1193
01:07:24,600 --> 01:07:27,400
Speaker 7: friend if you like this conversation. And again, this is

1194
01:07:27,440 --> 01:07:30,280
Speaker 7: a conversation between us, but it's a conversation between.

1195
01:07:30,040 --> 01:07:31,760
Speaker 3: All of us, not just the three of us.

1196
01:07:32,480 --> 01:07:35,480
Speaker 7: And as you see, we definitely look read engage with

1197
01:07:35,600 --> 01:07:38,680
Speaker 7: you all because we say welcome home intentionally. All right,

1198
01:07:38,720 --> 01:07:40,400
Speaker 7: we got to pay some bills, but don't go anywhere.

1199
01:07:40,440 --> 01:07:42,080
Speaker 7: We'll be right back on the other side of the break.

1200
01:07:51,480 --> 01:07:57,280
Speaker 7: My cta I'll be quick is in my time, I'm

1201
01:07:57,320 --> 01:08:03,080
Speaker 7: in a space of study and observation. I'm reading, writing, listening.

1202
01:08:03,160 --> 01:08:03,480
Speaker 3: That's all.

1203
01:08:03,640 --> 01:08:05,920
Speaker 7: Anything that's taken me away from that is an inconvenience,

1204
01:08:06,000 --> 01:08:09,200
Speaker 7: Like from seven to seven. That is what I'm doing

1205
01:08:10,240 --> 01:08:13,040
Speaker 7: in a space of learning. And I've always been in

1206
01:08:13,080 --> 01:08:15,280
Speaker 7: that way, but this is even more radical. I'm not

1207
01:08:15,320 --> 01:08:18,080
Speaker 7: watching a lot of TV these days, you know, like

1208
01:08:18,160 --> 01:08:21,240
Speaker 7: I am in these books, in all my computer writing

1209
01:08:21,280 --> 01:08:25,240
Speaker 7: and listening to people, and it has really elevated my

1210
01:08:25,320 --> 01:08:28,720
Speaker 7: way of thinking, elevated the way I interact harness my

1211
01:08:28,880 --> 01:08:31,679
Speaker 7: energy in a way. And one thing I thought about

1212
01:08:31,720 --> 01:08:35,080
Speaker 7: is as we are all getting older, we're losing a

1213
01:08:35,120 --> 01:08:38,280
Speaker 7: lot of our history. And so my CTA for people

1214
01:08:38,560 --> 01:08:40,840
Speaker 7: is for those of you who are still blessed to

1215
01:08:40,880 --> 01:08:44,840
Speaker 7: have your grandmother, your great grandmother, the elders in your life.

1216
01:08:44,720 --> 01:08:46,240
Speaker 3: Capture that oral history.

1217
01:08:46,560 --> 01:08:49,639
Speaker 7: Fit with them, listen to them, talk to them, get

1218
01:08:49,640 --> 01:08:52,160
Speaker 7: them on video, because as they're erasing our history, I

1219
01:08:52,200 --> 01:08:54,960
Speaker 7: think it's important for us to capture ours and know

1220
01:08:55,040 --> 01:08:58,559
Speaker 7: it and be shamans to the next generation. Tell them

1221
01:08:58,560 --> 01:09:01,720
Speaker 7: what happened during Jim, Tell them what happened in enslavement.

1222
01:09:01,800 --> 01:09:05,080
Speaker 7: Tell them in the Pan Africanism way, what we brought

1223
01:09:05,120 --> 01:09:07,439
Speaker 7: with us on the boat, what life existed like us

1224
01:09:07,479 --> 01:09:12,639
Speaker 7: before then. And I hope that people take advantage of

1225
01:09:12,680 --> 01:09:16,720
Speaker 7: that time to listen and learn, because even if you're

1226
01:09:16,720 --> 01:09:18,200
Speaker 7: in the if you if you don't have those people

1227
01:09:18,200 --> 01:09:20,439
Speaker 7: when you're in Uber like instead of being on your

1228
01:09:20,479 --> 01:09:22,840
Speaker 7: phone like talk to I spend so many time asking

1229
01:09:22,920 --> 01:09:25,000
Speaker 7: Uber drivers, Oh, you're from India, what do the people

1230
01:09:25,000 --> 01:09:28,479
Speaker 7: there feel about Modi? Like, tell me what? Because I

1231
01:09:28,479 --> 01:09:30,760
Speaker 7: can read in the paper all day, but you live there.

1232
01:09:30,920 --> 01:09:33,160
Speaker 7: Tell me what are your thoughts about Modi? What is

1233
01:09:33,200 --> 01:09:36,680
Speaker 7: your family's thoughts about Modi? People who live in Pakistan,

1234
01:09:36,760 --> 01:09:39,120
Speaker 7: I'm like, oh, what is your thoughts about India? You know,

1235
01:09:39,160 --> 01:09:41,000
Speaker 7: you guys are kind of in a war right now,

1236
01:09:41,040 --> 01:09:43,840
Speaker 7: and I get so much information from people, So I

1237
01:09:44,000 --> 01:09:48,000
Speaker 7: just would encourage other folks be in a space of quiet,

1238
01:09:48,200 --> 01:09:51,280
Speaker 7: listening and learning. I don't enjoy jumping out there giving

1239
01:09:51,280 --> 01:09:54,960
Speaker 7: my thoughts and opinions on everything. Every five seconds, CNN

1240
01:09:55,000 --> 01:09:56,519
Speaker 7: will ask me to come on and do stuff, and.

1241
01:09:56,880 --> 01:09:58,719
Speaker 3: I just want to be quiet and listen.

1242
01:09:58,760 --> 01:10:01,759
Speaker 7: Sometimes I don't need to jump and give a SoundBite

1243
01:10:01,760 --> 01:10:02,280
Speaker 7: on everything.

1244
01:10:02,560 --> 01:10:04,240
Speaker 3: So that's my CTA.

1245
01:10:04,520 --> 01:10:06,400
Speaker 7: And if you do capture some of that oral history

1246
01:10:06,479 --> 01:10:08,280
Speaker 7: and you got sixty seconds of some good stuff from

1247
01:10:08,280 --> 01:10:09,559
Speaker 7: your grandma, we'll play that too.

1248
01:10:09,600 --> 01:10:10,320
Speaker 3: We want to hear it.

1249
01:10:11,040 --> 01:10:16,240
Speaker 1: That's your sound bus is so good. It's just so Angela.

1250
01:10:16,800 --> 01:10:19,839
Speaker 8: Speaking of soundbites, I am really tired of us talking

1251
01:10:19,880 --> 01:10:22,080
Speaker 8: to each other, So I want y'all to send in

1252
01:10:22,120 --> 01:10:26,000
Speaker 8: your guest recommendations. We want to hear from other voices

1253
01:10:26,840 --> 01:10:30,519
Speaker 8: to me. In our recent history, some of our favorite

1254
01:10:30,560 --> 01:10:33,960
Speaker 8: shows have been with guests on air because it gives

1255
01:10:34,040 --> 01:10:37,040
Speaker 8: us an opportunity to engage in different ways, with different voices,

1256
01:10:37,760 --> 01:10:41,400
Speaker 8: different perspectives. We also are going to continue I think

1257
01:10:41,479 --> 01:10:44,519
Speaker 8: this series at least as a segment around democracy being

1258
01:10:44,560 --> 01:10:48,160
Speaker 8: broken in the different pieces that are fragmented. So we

1259
01:10:48,280 --> 01:10:51,000
Speaker 8: definitely want to hear from y'all on that as well,

1260
01:10:51,320 --> 01:10:54,080
Speaker 8: whether you're seeing it on the local level, the state

1261
01:10:54,160 --> 01:10:56,200
Speaker 8: level in your communities, or on the federal level or

1262
01:10:56,200 --> 01:10:58,519
Speaker 8: even internationally. We want to hear that from y'all too.

1263
01:10:59,400 --> 01:11:01,800
Speaker 8: And last tip already shouted out, but we will be

1264
01:11:01,960 --> 01:11:05,519
Speaker 8: in Jackson this weekend, and we hope to see y'all

1265
01:11:05,520 --> 01:11:08,760
Speaker 8: live at Tugalu College at one pm and of course

1266
01:11:08,800 --> 01:11:11,320
Speaker 8: supports State of the People Friday there as well as

1267
01:11:11,320 --> 01:11:14,240
Speaker 8: on Saturday, and we want to have guests on in

1268
01:11:14,640 --> 01:11:18,679
Speaker 8: Jackson as well. I'm sad won't be there, but hopefully

1269
01:11:18,760 --> 01:11:20,839
Speaker 8: we'll be able to see some of our other friends

1270
01:11:20,880 --> 01:11:22,240
Speaker 8: and have them on with us.

1271
01:11:22,240 --> 01:11:25,519
Speaker 6: So we'll see y'all there. We look forward to catching

1272
01:11:25,640 --> 01:11:26,280
Speaker 6: up with our.

1273
01:11:28,160 --> 01:11:29,559
Speaker 1: He's next visit.

1274
01:11:29,960 --> 01:11:31,479
Speaker 6: I don't know why you want to go to the

1275
01:11:31,560 --> 01:11:35,599
Speaker 6: rural south. Diff what utopia? Ukre said, I got one already,

1276
01:11:35,640 --> 01:11:39,760
Speaker 6: she said, that's name.

1277
01:11:40,360 --> 01:11:44,200
Speaker 7: Well, I appreciate his thoughts and Mayor of Jackson, and

1278
01:11:44,240 --> 01:11:45,559
Speaker 7: I didn't know that he wasn't going to be there,

1279
01:11:45,640 --> 01:11:48,720
Speaker 7: so I'm sorry to miss him because he's doing some

1280
01:11:48,760 --> 01:11:49,479
Speaker 7: great work there.

1281
01:11:49,840 --> 01:11:51,640
Speaker 1: And there's your favorite food spots.

1282
01:11:51,920 --> 01:11:55,759
Speaker 7: Yes we like to eat, Yes, definitely for sure looking

1283
01:11:55,800 --> 01:11:56,880
Speaker 7: forward to and.

1284
01:11:56,840 --> 01:12:00,439
Speaker 1: Jackson did o dido diddo. And we want to thank

1285
01:12:00,439 --> 01:12:02,880
Speaker 1: you again for just bearing with us. I think today

1286
01:12:03,000 --> 01:12:04,720
Speaker 1: was we haven't done this in a long time, but

1287
01:12:04,760 --> 01:12:08,439
Speaker 1: the just the thinking out loud, the recognizing that we

1288
01:12:08,479 --> 01:12:11,599
Speaker 1: don't have the monopoly on right answers, actually rarely do we,

1289
01:12:12,720 --> 01:12:16,040
Speaker 1: but but in good company with good intention, I think

1290
01:12:16,040 --> 01:12:18,760
Speaker 1: we can explore all kinds of things, certainly in a

1291
01:12:18,760 --> 01:12:20,760
Speaker 1: space of trust, and we want to invite you in there,

1292
01:12:20,800 --> 01:12:24,800
Speaker 1: so don't forget to send your ideas. We'll be doing

1293
01:12:24,840 --> 01:12:28,360
Speaker 1: a live show, as it has already been mentioned. State

1294
01:12:28,479 --> 01:12:32,160
Speaker 1: of the People tour in Jackson said hey, this Saturday,

1295
01:12:32,160 --> 01:12:35,080
Speaker 1: May thirty. First, y'all be there. If you're in Jackson,

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01:12:35,160 --> 01:12:38,759
Speaker 1: visit State of Thepeople dot com to get a ticket.

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01:12:39,280 --> 01:12:42,640
Speaker 1: I'm so sorry State.

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01:12:41,600 --> 01:12:45,240
Speaker 8: The State of THEPPL dot com and you don't get tickets,

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01:12:45,280 --> 01:12:46,160
Speaker 8: you just register.

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01:12:47,720 --> 01:12:49,120
Speaker 6: I don't want people to think I was.

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01:12:49,120 --> 01:12:51,479
Speaker 1: Just reading my note. My bad, but listen to her.

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01:12:51,640 --> 01:12:57,040
Speaker 1: She is in charge. It's no no, no fee. You

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01:12:57,080 --> 01:13:01,200
Speaker 1: just come as reparations. That's it. We'll be live streaming

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01:13:01,240 --> 01:13:04,640
Speaker 1: on YouTube, by the way, on Saturday, so if you

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01:13:04,680 --> 01:13:06,960
Speaker 1: can't be there with us in person, check us out

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01:13:06,960 --> 01:13:09,720
Speaker 1: on YouTube and you'll be able to join in the conversation.

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01:13:11,120 --> 01:13:14,639
Speaker 1: Will also be of course uploading the feed in case

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01:13:14,680 --> 01:13:16,479
Speaker 1: you can't catch us live, so you'll get to see

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01:13:16,479 --> 01:13:20,320
Speaker 1: it too. Angela Tiffany, I'm looking forward to being a

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01:13:20,360 --> 01:13:22,799
Speaker 1: good company and good trouble with you all this weekend.

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01:13:23,400 --> 01:13:26,599
Speaker 1: As always, we want to remind everyone to leave a review,

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01:13:26,920 --> 01:13:31,040
Speaker 1: subscribe to Native lanmdpod, and also tell a friend. We're

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01:13:31,080 --> 01:13:35,160
Speaker 1: available on all platforms and of course YouTube. New episodes

1314
01:13:35,240 --> 01:13:38,800
Speaker 1: drop Thursday and Friday, with solo pods Monday and Tuesday.

1315
01:13:39,320 --> 01:13:44,200
Speaker 1: If you want more, check Outpolitics and Off the Cups

1316
01:13:44,240 --> 01:13:49,400
Speaker 1: see upp the other shows that are on Reason Choice Media.

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01:13:49,439 --> 01:13:53,160
Speaker 1: I don't have the ppe that was just cup and

1318
01:13:53,200 --> 01:13:55,519
Speaker 1: don't forget to follow us on social media and subscribe

1319
01:13:55,560 --> 01:13:58,160
Speaker 1: to our text or email lists on our website Native

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01:13:58,240 --> 01:14:02,800
Speaker 1: landpod dot com. We are are That's a rye, that's

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01:14:02,880 --> 01:14:05,680
Speaker 1: ta Cross and a man yelling welcome home y'all. There

1322
01:14:05,680 --> 01:14:09,200
Speaker 1: are five hundred and twenty three days until midterm elections.

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01:14:10,040 --> 01:14:11,679
Speaker 1: We outran.

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01:14:12,080 --> 01:14:14,600
Speaker 2: Thank you for joining the Natives intention of what the

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01:14:14,680 --> 01:14:17,519
Speaker 2: info and all of the latest Roy Gilim and Cross

1326
01:14:17,520 --> 01:14:20,560
Speaker 2: connected to the statements that you leave on our socials.

1327
01:14:20,600 --> 01:14:23,800
Speaker 2: Thank you, sincerely for the faces. Reason for your choice

1328
01:14:23,920 --> 01:14:27,559
Speaker 2: is clear, so grateful it took to execute roads. Thank

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01:14:27,560 --> 01:14:29,639
Speaker 2: you for serve, defend and protect the truth.

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01:14:29,479 --> 01:14:30,160
Speaker 3: You've been in past.

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01:14:30,520 --> 01:14:32,160
Speaker 2: Walkome home to all of the natives.

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01:14:32,200 --> 01:14:32,479
Speaker 1: Wait.

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01:14:32,520 --> 01:14:33,440
Speaker 3: Thank you.

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Speaker 1: Native Lampard is a production of iHeartRadio in partnership with

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01:14:48,120 --> 01:14:51,679
Speaker 1: Reason Choice Media. For more podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit

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01:14:51,960 --> 01:14:55,800
Speaker 1: the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen

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Speaker 1: to your favorite shows.